The McShay Show - What Todd’s Hearing: Is Mendoza Worth It? Plus, the Draft’s Best Edge, WR Rankings, and More.

Episode Date: February 12, 2026

Welcome to The McShay Show! Todd’s been working the phone and is ready to share what he’s hearing about the 2026 NFL draft class from sources around the NFL.0:00 Welcome to The McShay Show!2:00 Conversations that NFL teams are having right now5:00 Is Fernando Mendoza THE guy or A guy?30:30 Better prospect: David Bailey or Arvell Reese?36:55 Who's WR1?50:10 Better LB value: Jacob Rodriguez or CJ Allen? 52:10 Who's TE2?57:15 Better CB value: Avieon Terrell or D'Angelo Ponds?59:50 Conversations that NFL teams are having right now Learn more and join the waitlist at ScoutMotors.com.The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit ⁠www.rg-help.com⁠ to learn more about the resources and helplines available.Host: Todd McShayGuest: Steve MuenchProducers: Tucker Tashjian, Conor Nevins, and Daniel ComerSocial: Jon Roemer Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

It's hard to do the manufactured draft talk when you're actually talking to NFL decision makers. So if you're looking for real insight on real conversations that are already taking place around the NFL and draft rooms right now, you found the right show. Just 70 days until the NFL draft. Mench, you good? I'm good, man. Roll that beat, tuck. I've had some really good conversations this week, Munch. It's a good time to have those.

Yeah. It is because it's not like. No one's... First of all, I'm surprised at how far along teams are at this point. And how the conversations are switching to like, is it this value in this round versus that value in this round with this group, you know, position group and all of that. Man, we're excited about this new partnership.

This episode is presented by Scout Motors. Every new year, we do a lot of forward thinking and planning for what's to come. Just like the all new Scout Terra and Scout Traveler, they're being revamped for what comes next, taking that classic 70s design and improving it with modern engineering, including plans for advanced four-wheel drive. So look ahead.

Join the wait list at Scout Motors.com, just like I just did. Concept vehicles, not available for sale, features and performance specifications are preliminary and subject to change. Joining the wait list does not guarantee purchase. Visit Scout Motors. dot com for details.

And secondly, it's kind of refreshing to talk to people, I think pre-combine, you know? Yeah. Because they're about to button up right now. It's going to get real tight. They'll talk at the combine and then they'll go back and start to set boards and then the coaches get involved and then it gets like, you know what I mean? And it starts to tighten up. And these conversations are actual football conversations, right?

And you're just talking like, kind of like, yeah, this is what I'm seeing. and you've talked to a scout who's like, I enjoy when like an area scout says, well, you know, I'm done with my area. I'm working on cross-check. I've got defensive linemen or I've got wide receivers or whatever it is. And they're like, yeah, I haven't gotten to this player, but I know we're as a team high on them or I kind,

you know, I really like this player, but I don't think, you know, it's going to be hard to push him through. So just like, and then talking to general managers and they're just kind of getting a feel. and we're talking things through, and it's just open football conversations, right? Whereas you get after the combine,

you start into like the pro days, and they start to button up that room and things get a little tighter. I feel like my best intel comes from questions, I'm being asked, you know, kind of putting pieces of the puzzle together. So anyway, appreciate everyone who's here. Glad you're watching us on Netflix. If you're not there, you're watching us on Spotify.

If not, if you're only listening, that's great. We appreciate that too and on Apple. I am annoyed a little bit. Can you hit a subscribe and a like button? I know that's not the best way to endear our audience. But I got a report the other day. It's like how many people are watching and absorbing this content that we're actually working really hard on and not like taking two seconds?

Just press a couple buttons, man. It like matters. It matters for us. So I appreciate you doing that. Mench does it better and he's sweeter. He's more thoughtful about it. I'm like, what, like, come on. I get those reports.

I'm like, gosh. And I don't really care outside of like, you know, we've got families and we're trying to build this thing and let's go. It matters to some people, yeah. Yeah, it's just some people to make decisions. It's the reality of the business. Yeah, it is. All right.

Anyway, mock draft was fun earlier in the week. Got a lot of traction fired up about it. But honestly, this is more fun to me. This is what I love. when I'm watching tape and Mentch is watching his tape and we're having those conversations and then I'm talking to guys in the league who are either making the decision or are part of the decision making, right? I'm going to throw a bunch of stuff out at you.

These are actual conversations I'm having where I'm not going to give like, I'm certainly not going to give sources and I'm certainly not going to, I don't even need to give, you know, what their takes are. But I'm going to have, I'm going to bring to you. you, Steve, and I want you and I to have some of the conversations that I've been having recently, okay? And I think it's going to make for a fun show. I want to start with this one.

And we kind of touched on it last week or earlier in this week. I had this conversation with a couple different people that it was brought to my plate. What if Mendoza is a guy, but isn't the guy? It's a really, because there's a lot of people in the way. You took a lot of heat for this, by the way. A lot. You know it's mock draft season when you look at some of these these comments on X about how click bait this and that. Going one to.

You did. And you said, let's flesh us out. Let's have the argument. Would you consider doing it? And the fact that you talked about considering doing it was a no, no. You just can't do it. Well, then I'm really going to piss people off because. And listen, yeah, it's good TV.

It's good content to like start with the hot button Mendoza. but it was surprising to me because these are teams I'm talking to that aren't the Raiders, right? That aren't. And I didn't talk to anyone from the Raiders about it. Certainly didn't talk to anyone of the Jets about it. I'm just asking the question to you now, and I'm bringing this up for us, because it was brought to my lap a couple of times. What do you think of Mendoza back and forth? Really like him.

Don't think he's Caleb. Don't think he's Jaden. don't think he's Drake, don't think he's Cam. So I'm not saying everyone in the league thinks like this, but now this is like, I told you I talked to a head coach in the NFL who had this conversation with, and kind of looking at the quarterbacks and other positions. We talked about tackles, receivers, defensive linemen,

a bunch of different positions. Just want to get my take because now he's getting more into it, but he started watching. And now I'm talking to some decision makers in the league, and they're just kind of, everyone's curious, you know? So if I'm the Raiders, right? And I'm going to throw this to you. And I don't even know if it's, I don't have a question formulated in my head.

But if I'm the Raiders and I'm John Spine. It's a conversation. And I'm Tom Brady who very clearly has talked about, he wants a veteran there to help. He doesn't think quarterbacks coming out of college are prepared right away for the NFL. They're just not being developed. It's not their fault. They're just not. But then you get this Mendoza cat who's kind of built similar to Tom.

as energy on the ball, probably more than Tom did coming out of Michigan, certainly more mobile, not the pinpoint accuracy that Tom had. But there's a similarity in terms of the process, the mental aspect of it, the dedication to the obsessiveness, all of those things, okay? There will be a point in the process, and maybe it's already here, but there will be a point in the process where they have to kind of, as a small group, I don't know who those, you know, it will be Brady certainly. It will be SpyTech as part of that.

And I'm not sure who else will constitute a true needle mover in that room. But there will be a moment, Steve, where they, the Raiders, have to make a decision. Is he the guy? Or is he a guy who could be really good in this league if we could put things there? And then there's also this aspect of it. if he's not the guy and if they don't believe or they're not sold or certain that he's a

transcendent type player or a player who even though he might struggle as a rookie he's going to be great. He's so skilled and so mentally adept. They've got to look at their self-scouting of are we ready to plug a quarterback in or are we better off trading out of this pick?

Taking advantage of maybe an organization like the Jets or Browns or I don't think the Rams would make this move at this point. I think they're trying to win it again next year, where you say, are we ready? And if we could get, if we could move back and get more capital, and maybe that capital includes something next year, Jets,

we're better off getting some more players this year, progressing and be in a better position to draft Arch. Dante Moore, Sorsby, saying it, like, whoever it is, you know? It's a game of chicken, and I was a little naive. Sellers, sorry, sellers. I know sellers is your got. Sellers. Whoever it is, right?

Yeah. I was a little naive in saying that you could, because I, first of all, I do believe that he is a guy. I'm not sure he's the guy. I'm in that camp. I really like Fernando Mendoza. He is the best quarterback in this class. I think he could be a really good starter in the league. I see him as more of a Jared Gough than anything else. and I think Jared Goff is an excellent quarterback.

That's not a knock. I was a little naive in saying that the Raiders should consider trading out and then get enough to trade back up next year. Because here's the reality. Let's say they end up with the 12th pick next year. That may not be in another first. That may not be enough because teams who are picking in that early with those quarterbacks or picking ahead of them

might just say, we're going to stand pat no matter what you offer us because we want this quarterback. There's no guarantee that, one, the quarterback class is going to pan out like we hope and think it will. And two, that no matter, regardless of what they have for firepower, there's no guarantee that they'll be able to move up. So it is, I mean, I want to make sure that the stakes are clear when I say this. I still think they should consider doing it. I still think they should consider doing it because, again, he's not Caleb. He would have been the fourth quarterback taken in that class, I think.

I think it would have been taken behind Drake May. I really believe that. I'm sure Indiana fans are going to hate that. Mendoza fans are going to hate that. I understand. Again, I think he's very much like a Jared Gough type quarterback who could be very good in the league, but he's not a generational guy like an Andrew Luck.

And I know that Trevor Lawrence hasn't really played up to what we thought coming out. Trevor Lawrence was a better prospect coming out than Mendoza is right now. That's just the reality of it. We'll see what happens when they get in the league, who they end up with, how they develop all of those things. So, yeah, I think you have to consider it. I think you have to consider it. And we're also seeing that the Seattle Seahawks just won a Super Bowl

with a guy that a lot of people thought was never going to be the guy, despite getting drafted fourth overall by the Jets. You know, it has to go through San Francisco, goes to Minnesota, doesn't end there well. And Sam Darnold, who I think I got the name right today, which is great. But we're seeing that you can do it that way too. So there's more than one way to get this done. And I think you have to consider all.

of those options and look at as a holistically how are you going to build your roster now if i if the raiders stay and they pick for nana minosa i think it's an excellent pick i i have no i have no qualms about that but i don't know what they're being offered if you're telling me they're being offered x amount versus mendoza then i can make a clearer a clearer decision about what you should do the other thing that's really fascinating to me is i think mendoza is going to do really well in this pre-draft lead up, but it's fascinating to me that there's no real competition here, it seems. Are we going to see a Ty Simpson kind of creep into that? Oh, maybe a Ty Simpson's the guy. I don't think so. And how's that going to affect how people see Mendoza? I think he'll be fine,

but it's an interesting aspect of how this process unfolds. You mentioned Sam Darnold, and I'm glad you called him Darnold, not Bradford this time, as I do with certain names as well. So I'm not, I'm not throwing stuff. stones in this glass house. I do want to take a second to reiterate my congratulations to Sam and what he's been through. And I do want to give a kind bleep you to everyone. And I got a little shot in on cowherd. Yes, two days ago.

Oh, I missed it. I got to go back and look for that. But I'm still waiting for like my fruit baskets or my letters in the mail or even like a quick text from everyone in the media. I don't expect the fans, but like, how about, you know, McShay might have, might not be as big and imbecile as we thought, you know? That was a tough few years, man.

I would, I pounded the table for Sam. And guess what? Josh Allen's an awesome quarterback. Lamar Jackson's an awesome quarterback. Josh Rosen was a disaster. Baker Mayfield, really, really damn good quarterback. But only one of them is won a Super Bowl. Only one of them's been to a Super Bowl.

I hear you. I'm surprised it's not a five-minute speech, but my mind's already jumping to. We do have a clearer picture now of the Raiders, like, leadership group, and there's a tie here. Yeah, and so I. The Raiders have hired Clint Kubiak to be their head.

The former offense corner of the Seahawks will be the head coach of the Raiders. Yes. Do you feel better about Mendoza having early success with Kubiak there? I do. I mean, I love Pete Carroll as a head coach. I do, too. He's built to have a more veteran quarterback.

That's just who Carol is. Whereas Kubiak, I think. think is going to get the most out of Mendoza if that's who they choose to take. Yeah, I mean, Kubiak's, we're talking, you know, it was a lot of like RPO and play act, but he was very effective Mendoza was play action was. Kubiak is, he's the 2025,

2026 version of the old Shanahan offense, the outside zone, heavy emphasis on running the football. They've got their running. I love that offense. Yeah. Oh, it's fantastic. They've got their. running back. They've got to upgrade their offensive line. But as a quarterback in that system,

you've got to excel off the play action and you've got to be able to like the bootlegs and kind of on the move, that sort of stuff. But Kubiak will kind of tailor it. You know, like I thought he did some really good things with Derek Carr a couple years ago. And in New Orleans. Yeah. Before things started like early in that season. So he, he'll massage that thing to fit. I want to go back to this, and we can move on for Mendoza in a minute, but for some reason I was looking up the 2023 draft. I think there's going to be a lot of parallels to last year's draft,

one quarterback at the top, and then maybe, like, you know, Jackson Dart, this year's dart is Ty Simpson, right? But then there's just not that quality of quarterback at the top. I look at 2023, not because of the quarterbacks. But I look at that draft because of what I started this conversation with and the conversations that I had with people in the league of, is he a guy that can be successful? Everything put around him.

And I think he's definitely a guy. But is he the guy? Like Caleb was considered the guy. And Jaden and Drake and even Cam last year. For many, not all. Okay? I say all of this because 2023, I felt like we had a bunch of A guys.

You know, like Bryce Young was a guy. Yeah. Liked a lot of things about him, but he's pint-sized. Doesn't have a massive arm. Like, he has to be, there's got to be a system and everything in place. And we've seen progress from him, and I'm hopeful that he'll continue to just take off. C.J. Stroud, A guy, not the guy.

Great. rookie season. Thought he might be the guy. Since then, regression. Not certain everything that's going on there, but hopeful that they turn the corner and kind of reshift the momentum there. Anthony Richardson, phenomenal talent, but just inexperienced and immature and all those things that came to fruition real fast.

Why do I say 2023? Because it doesn't sound at all, Todd, like that's the quarterback class. It's not the quarterback class. But I want to remind you, now Houston, Nick Casario, because of the aggressiveness and the way he managed it, he was able to get a guy at quarterback and get the guy in the draft, Will Anderson, who's been an absolute menace, right? And I'm just looking down at this draft class, Will Anderson, Devin Witherspoon, Christian Gonzalez, who fell out of 17, by the way. Don't start. Bejanne Robinson, Jalen Carter,

Jamir Gibbs, right? Like, it's a bunch of damn good football players. Like elite, elite dudes in the NFL. Yeah, those are difference makers. Those are difference makers, yeah. Now, I'm not saying there's, but like there's, there's Arvel Reese, there's David Bailey. There's, there's, like, Francis Maui Noah,

depending on what grade you have on him. Spencer Fano, who you have a higher grade on, but talking to guys in the league, there's back and forth on that. There's a Bijan Robinson here. His name's Jeremiah Love. You know what I mean? Yeah, I hear you. I feel like that class was a little bit more talented up top than this one,

but we'll see. It's going to be an interesting few weeks here about how all of this unfolds. And the more tape I watch, I mean, I'll tell you right now, I'm falling in love with the offensive tackle class. I mean, absolutely in love with the offensive tackle class. So the more I watch, the more I get excited about this group, then everyone keeps calling us a bad draft. And I just,

I think there's some real good players in here. So I get your point. I get your point. I don't watch a lot of shows, but I have it on the background a lot. And if something comes on and it's, it's like very specific about draft stuff, I might turn it up or something about the league

and just, you know, try to stay on top of things. And it's just, it's this foregone conclusion. And it probably is. I'm not here to stir the pot. I'm just saying it's interesting what's on the television right now compared to the conversations I'm having with guys

who are either one of 32 or they're in a group that part of the decision making of the 32. They're different conversations, man. Everyone in the media is like absolutely, he's number one overall pick. He could be a generational guy. He's the season he's coming off of Joe Burrow. And like I can I can really, really, really like and borderline love Fernando Mendoza.

Yes. And also be a realist about it and then have conversations with people in the league and say, it's not the same conversation in the league that I'm watching on all of these shows. And that's why we're having this conversation right now. And if Brady comes in and if SpyTec comes in and now with Kubiak in place, as you brought up aptly. And they really, really, really like this guy, but they're looking at their roster and saying,

our line's not good enough. What hell are we going to do about this Max Crosby situation? Because that's a mess. We've got to get better on defense, even though we'll be better, be healthier and better next year. But we've got some spots we've got to fill on this roster. Is the phone ringing?

Do the Jets want this guy? You know what I mean? it should be. There are teams that should be interested in going up for Mendoza. I do believe that too. And to put a point on this because I'm guilty. Let me say this.

Let me say this. Sorry, I'm cutting you off. I'm very sorry. No, go. I have not talked to one person in the National Football League, not one, who has said definitively

Fernando Mendoza is transcendent. This guy is, I've got the same grade I have on him as Caleb Williams, or Jaden Daniels, or Drake May, or even Cam Ward. I haven't talked to one.

I haven't talked to all 32 teams. I haven't talked to all 32 general managers, and I won't before the draft. But I'll talk to a bunch of them. So I'm curious as we sit here on, you know, in early mid-February, with a couple months, two and a half months left until the draft,

if the narrative changes in the league. That's my whole point. Why am I not talking to, because normally we can talk about any player. We'll get to a bunch of, guys in a couple minutes. Any player, some guys love David Bailey. Some guys think Arvel Reese is going to be the better edge. Some guys love this tight end. Some guys think the other guy's going to be a lot better. Some guys love these wide receivers, Tate and Lemon and Tyson, but I'd rather get Malachi

Fields in the second round. But I haven't talked to anyone in the National Football League who they spend their full-time job on this. They're the best in the world because that's what they do. put in these positions. I haven't talked to one yet who said Mendoza's the guy. They all like him. They all think he's a guy. But I haven't talked to one guy in the league who said Mendoza's it. I would trade away.

If I were in this position, we got a quarterback, but if I, I would give away a bunch to go get him. Remember last year, Daibol, the Giants trying to desperate. I love Jackson Dart. We told you, we chronicled that for months in advance for you. I told you I talked to Dayball at the Senior Bowl, and we started talking Jackson Dart then. And they loved Jackson Dart,

but they really wanted Cam Ward. Where's Dayball now? I know. Okay? Turn down other jobs to go, if I desperately wanted to work with Jackson Dart for the rest of his career. Didn't pan out. I got a shot to go work with Cam.

Poo, yeah. So we knew the Giants wanted to move up. We knew there was interested in that pick from multiple organizations. Cleveland and the Giants, it's factual information now. They wanted that number one overall pick. Tennessee wouldn't part ways with it. I'll be very curious as we get closer, if we'll have the same intel about the Jets,

maybe the Browns, maybe the Arizona, willing to give up to go get. That's it. I hear you. I will say this. I like Mendoza more than I liked Ward last year, I think. I think Mendoza is a better, I think Ward has a higher ceiling,

but I would have felt more comfortable taking Mendoza first overall than Ward. And I'm always, it's so hard not to compare it to that class, the Williams, Daniels, May class, because, I mean, the class is so awesome. It was just so much fun. And then I always fall back on that.

And those three guys were just elite. They're different. So let's be like, let's do it with Mendoza and Ward. And I think the very least, I think that's more of a conversation. That's a lot closer. So I have a high opinion of Mendoza. But if you put Mendoza and Ward in the same exact circumstances, same coaches, same team, drop them in.

I think you got a better chance to win more games as a rookie with Mendoza than Ward. Right. However, I think it's undeniable that, the upside. If Daibald does what he envisioned pre-draft doing now that he's with him as offensive coordinator and if they

continue to upgrade around that position, I personally think Ward's ceiling is higher. It's higher. Yeah. I think Ward could be a dude. I think he could be one of those guys. I'm not convinced you. I think there's

some things that have to be in place. And I certainly, if you gave, if you threw those four into a pot. Caleb, Jaden, Drake, and Cam, Cam's four. We said that last year. The conversation would start at the fourth quarterback in the 2024 draft, right?

But here, and this is to your point, Dan, I know we're killing this. I know Dan's like, all right, let's go. I know we're going to get the 20 minute mark in a second here. But I just want to say this. This is to your point. Cam didn't do well last year, you know, in part because of the

supporting cast. And now they're behind the Now you're year two of this potentially five-year contract with Cam Ward, and you're still not there. And you better kill the draft and you better you better do well in frequency. And now you got table there, which is encouraging and all of these things that are encouraging. But would you rather have the clock starting on your franchise quarterback on that rookie contract after all that's in place? And it's hard for a fan base, I think, to see that and say, yeah, that's the way to go when we need a quarterback, when we don't have a quarterback. but I think it pays off to be patient. If you build the team and then you bring in the guy

and your clock starts then, you're a much better chance to compete, in my mind. The interesting dichotomy of Tom Brady being a part of these decisions, right? Is he doesn't, there is no contract. He's not a GM that signed a five-year deal or a coach to sign to whatever Kubiak just signed. he's part owner and what he's signed up for is to be a part of these things right

I say dichotomy because he's also and I don't know a single one whether it's MJ Kobe Roger Clements like I don't know a single one of I'm glad you're going here yeah I don't know a single one of these and I've been very fortunate to actually be around a good handful. I'm not saying the greatest of all times, but like some of them, where their compete level doesn't blind them in some areas. Patience isn't a thing for guys like this.

They're not patient. They don't understand. Look at Michael Jordan as a GM. Yeah. And say whatever you want about Mendoza. don't tell me he's not a winner. Don't tell me that Fernando Mendoza is not a winner. And I think if you're Tom Brady,

you're looking at that and saying, I want the guy, the stories about Brady competing against teammates and whether it's video games early on in his career or whether or not they could make the quicker reads in terms of what the offense was supposed to do and how pissed off he would get if he lost and how he would just come back and just until he won.

I mean, that's who he is. And if he thinks he's a guy like that. He would, he would like, whatever, whatever it took. And they're all like that, man. And that's why. All of them. I promise. If you think you have a guy like that in Mendoza, it's going to be hard for them to pass.

Oh, they won't. That's my point. If they think they have that. But will it be blinding because of you're so eager and hungry that's so blinding that this, this campaign he went on last year with the cowherd and some of the other interviews, like truly, like it was. he was planting a flag. It was almost like a,

it was almost like a charity that he was donating to. Like this was going to be part of his post-career mission statement or whatever it is. Legacy. Legacy that he is going to help show how to better develop and put these young quarterbacks in a position to succeed and not force them into something that they're not ready for. But now you're an owner and you're trying, like, I'm saying there's a little bit of like, you know, it's going to be interesting. We live in a different world now, yeah.

This episode is brought to you by Scout Motors. This past Super Bowl really made me look back on all the great championship moments we've had over the years. Remember David Tyree's helmet catch? Remember the Patriots coming back against the Falcons? I got your back, Patriots fans. Oh, man, you know what else is iconic in the past? Scout. And now the brand is coming back with the all-new Scout Terra and Scout Travel.

with plans for four-wheel drive, available locking differentials, and more. They're built for the seasons ahead. Join the wait list at scout motors.com. Concept vehicles, not available for sale. Features and performance specifications are preliminary and subject to change. Joining the wait list does not guarantee purchase. Visit scout motors.com for details. All right, let's move on.

Some of the other conversations. Here's one that's interesting. Okay. David Bailey, and I'll frame it in a second. David, let's say Mendoza goes one. David Bailey or Rvel Reese. And I'm framing it this way. Some people I've talked to in the league think that David Bailey is an absolute star.

And I don't disagree, but maybe have even a higher opinion. Not all of them, but some. Couple. Think that he's actually like being underval. valued or under appreciated in terms of his value because of his ability to get to the quarterback. Reese is a more phenomenal talent. They're both phenomenal talent. Reese, it's obvious.

Reese is something special. Reese is different. But Reese is a projection. What was the quote I wrote down? I wrote it somewhere in the notes. Guys in the league don't make decisions on hope. when it's your paycheck, it's your fan. No, no, I know.

I'm just sharing with you the conversation. The conversation was guys in the league don't make decisions on hope. I've got a contract. I've got a family. And this came into play, like even talking about other, like, he's a 25-year-old, King Messador. Great. But I won't be here if he doesn't pan out.

So, like, and I'll, I'll, worry about the second contract. It's a great problem to have in four or five years if I really want this guy back and now he's turning 30, right? Correct. That's when I don't get about the mess with. Miami, who's 25 years old. Guys in the league are like, hey, you guys in the media can talk about it all you want.

I ain't worried about your five. No. I'm trying to win, to compete, build, and, and, you know, right or wrong. Like, I need this to happen faster than five years, right? So back to Bailey versus If you're drafting him at two, part of your plan is, maybe not the entirety.

But part of your plan is whether it's an arc like like Micah Parsons, where the first year it was majority off the ball, but then injuries happen. He moves the edge and they can't afford to move him back. He's so damn good. Or it's something more like structured on purpose, like 6040, 70, 30, whatever it is.

part of it is, and a good part of him, being honest, is his ability to rush off the edge. I'm hoping he can become that guy, because the tape with him at edge is a projection. There's a lot of enticing stuff there, man. But Bailey, I see it. Yeah, I think enticing stuff is an understatement when you look at his edge tape.

I think, I mean, I'm excited to see what this kid could do. And we often, this is, is a him, you know, player A versus player B. And I get that. That's just the way it goes. Bailey's awesome. Bailey's awesome. He is a, he's an instinctive guy that, you know, one of the things I was, I was watching the Utah offensive tackles who I love. One of the things he knows is how to get guys off balance into his just his pass rush plan in the middle of it. He will sense you doing something and then take advantage. What I mean by that is I've seen him get guys to change directions and then he'll notice their feet. And I don't know if he, notices it or he just he just does it. Or instinctive, yeah.

But a guy's feet get close together as he's changing directions and he's like, oh, I'm going to get vertical now. I see that you are now, you do not have that wide base that you had a second ago when I couldn't run through you. But now that you've tried to change directions on me and the feet are coming together, I'm going to go right through you. I love that about Bailey. I love that he works off contact.

I love that he closed as well, all of that. Arville Reese is a different human being with rare upside. and if you think there's even a chance, and I meant to look this up, I wish I'd looked at it, but if you think there's even a chance that he turns into Mikea Parsons, what did Green Bay just trade for Michael Parsons?

Like two, what was it, two firsts? I mean, that's the kind of player. Does he get there? I don't know. I don't know. But I think if you're, you're betting on that upside, and it's not like when you watch his edge tape,

when you watch Reese's edge tape right now, you're like, oh, I'm just not seeing it. He can run through the face of college offensive tackles right now. He's long. He bends. He can close well. I've, I've said to you for months,

I'm just going to pat myself on the back now that I thought he was going to be more of an edge than an off the ball linebacker in the NFL. I think his upside there is unique. And I'm betting on that. And Bailey's going to go not long after. And someone's going to be happy that they get him because he's a great player too.

But give me Reese, if I got to, if it's, you know, if it's about me keeping my job and building the best team, I'm taking Reese. Yeah, I don't disagree. I'm just, I actually don't disagree because of the absolute worst case I'm getting Devin Lloyd. Yeah.

I think, yeah. The floor is pretty good too, right? Yeah. That's the floor. And, you know, I think he's going to be a menace coming off the edge. I think he's going to be an absolute problem. And is it Micah Parsons? I don't know.

I mean, it was Kenny it's such enough. Kenny Clark and two, 2027 first round. It's, I mean, there's Miles Garrett, then there's Michael Parsons. And then it feels like there's everyone else, right? I mean, maybe I'm wrong about that, but that's kind of how I see it. Um, and you think you might get that guy. And it's such an unfair comp for a player coming out because these are unique players in the league. but man, when I watch him, I'm just like, that's his path. That's his trajectory. All right.

Next one. What we got? Tate versus Lemon versus Tyson. And then there's kind of a follow-up to this. But go ahead. Who do I have? It's a real conversation. Here's how those conversations are going.

Tate, you know, Tate was only the star, but wasn't even the star. Nope. for one year, and it wasn't even one full year. He missed three games in there. And when he came back with that calf injury, I watched,

I actually went back and watched a tape last night after another conversation. It wasn't like he was, didn't play, like his targets, he looked fine, you know? But it wasn't the same like confidence, juice, roll it, you know what I mean? it's almost like he was allowed a few spurts per game when he came back. Michigan and the two college football playoff games.

And he clearly wasn't 100%, right? So I give him credit for even being out there and grinding through it and probably shouldn't have been on the field against Michigan, but it was Michigan and he cares that much and all that. I think the feeling is that Tate might be the most complete, but we don't have this maybe the body of work. And is he going to be the guy or is he like a number two? You know what I mean?

But Tate is kind of the play, if you will. Then you get Tyson Lemon. Really, Tate's number one in these conversations. I'm not necessarily saying he's going to be number one for everyone. I'm not saying that. I'm saying like, like, yeah, the Zen diagram of all this stuff. And he's kind of. I get six three, 200, Ohio State.

He blocks, runs the routes. I mean, he does some, I mean, his tape, man. He's a no-brainer first round receiver. Like, let's get that out of the way. Like, I mean, he's a talented dude. I get it. Is he, is he Devante Adams? Is the question?

No, he's not. Well, Devante Adams wasn't Devante Adams. I remember sitting out in the shade hotel in Manhattan Beach watching with Kevin Whitehall and being like, this guy's an absolute dog. I don't care if he's going to run a four, five, six, which he was projected to do. And I don't even remember what he ran when it was all. and done. But he was a second round pick. Crazy. That's only because he played at Fresno State, I think.

That's, I really believe that. And he didn't have speed. Yeah, it was competition and didn't have the speed, all that stuff. I guess it's more of a question and it's not necessarily saying Tate will be the first receiver. Because I don't know if he will. These are just initial conversations and all that. But with him, it's like, man, his tape is, it's complete. That's the word. I'm looking for it's the most complete but it's limited and he wasn't always he wasn't

he was never the guy you know and then with Lemon versus Tyson I'm getting the sense people that it's neck and neck right some people like Lemon a little bit more some people like Tyson a little bit more but they're

kind of neck and neck and quite honestly my personal opinion and my conversation what I shared with people I actually like Tyson's tape a little bit better. Yeah. And I freaking love Lemon. Yep.

But eight games missed, a season missed in 20, 23. For whatever reason, not all guys are like this, right? Some guys have a few injuries, have eight injuries over three seasons and miss a season while transferring from Colorado. This is Jordan Tyson, Arizona Statewide Receiver, started his career, Colorado. had like 22 catches. Average is like 21, 22 per catch in his freshman year at Colorado, transferred with a knee injury, sat out,

and then played two seasons at Arizona State, okay? At Arizona State, he missed, I think it was like five or six more games. He had missed like two or three his first year, whatever it was. Missed eight games in the three seasons he actually played and didn't play in 2020. Right. People, he's a dog. You can see that on tape. He's...

Caught the ball better this year, right? Great. Not better. Great. Honestly, here's my comp for him. He's an inch and a half taller, Stefan Dix. He isn't a yak guy. He kind of goes down sometimes,

and not even run out of bounds because he saw it. But it's like, it's not about the after the catch for him. He is so, like he worked at Heinz Ward there at Arizona State. You can see it in his routes. He attacks the ball like a rabid. animal, like in hunting season, like just, like, and there's Stefan's the same way. The routes, the, like, the, like, the precision, but also like the Tasmanian devil type field, all of it, just attacking, attacking, attacking.

And then Lemons got this after the catch, and he's, and he corners, like, he's on rails, and he's like, I don't know. So there's a lot of debate between those two. The real debate and the real discussion I want to have here is, while you love those guys, can I get another player in that slot in the first round at a different position, a defensive lineman, a corner, an offensive tackle.

And because of the depth of this class, I'm talking to people, I know I'm bouncing around here, but it's all at wide receiver. People love Denzel Boston, but think maybe we're a little too high. And I started with Boston's tape, and then I went to the other guys. And quite frankly, I went back to Boston again, as much as I do love him and nothing of that changes.

I do worry about against man-to-man coverage, NFL cornerbacks. His gearing down, getting in and out of breaks, is kind of what takes him away from that elite tier in this class. There are conversations in the league going on of, do I want to take those receivers where I have to take him, maybe in the top 15, top 20? or would I rather get Malachi Fields in round two? Chris Brazzell in round two.

I tell you who's got a lot of love in round, if you can get him in round two, Zachariah Branch. Not just a gimmick guy, not just a gadget guy like they used him in Georgia. Georgia kind of is the place where receivers don't go to die, but they don't go to like flourish. Think he can be more.

Don't forget about his time at USC. All those notes talking to guys. can I get a, so a branch, a brazzle, a Fields in round two, a Ted Hurst in round three. Already this early in the, me too, already this Georgia State stand out at the Senior Bowl, already this early in the process, you see Ted Hurst right there, big, just tall, physical receiver, vertical guy who was making plays and not neck and neck with Malachi Fields, who I'm in love with. I'm going to die on the fields hill, by the way. But that's a separate conversation for a separate day. I just finished this tape literally 45 minutes before we started the tape.

But can I get a Ted Hurst, who you're looking at at the senior bowl in round three, or a brazel or a branch, if I'm looking more in the smaller guy, you know what I mean, versus where I have to take him and what I could get at that spot. Already in February, guys in the league are talking about those combo picks at some of these positions. Of course they are. They should be. All right, can I talk now? Can I say something? I'm sorry. I'm going to go with your top three.

We're going to talk about them. They all have questions. You kind of hinted at it. Jordan Tyson, I think, is the best prospect if he's healthy. But he's had a lot of problems staying healthy, and that scares me. I think that's going to be a problem for him. I really like Carnell Tate. I just don't feel like he's that.

I think he's excellent, but not elite. We'll have that debate. I actually think he actually might be elite. But go ahead. Is McKay Lemon 5'10? he's listed 511 let's call him I think he's going to be right around 511

if he's 511 I'm going to be I'm going to be pumping him up like nobody else if he's the same if he's in the same range as St. Brown as Amman Ross St. Brown I'm not convinced he is I think he's smaller and if he it's a there's a red line for everyone

it's like Mickey Loomis said when we talk to him down on Mobile you don't want to make the Saints general manager you don't want make a habit of drafting outliers. And if McCoy Lemon is as short as I think or as small as I think he might be, uh-oh, that's going to be concerned. So those are the questions, right?

Tate, you know, great offense, great team. I thought he was really good this past year. Is he elite? Tyson, can he stay healthy, lemon, his size? Give me Denzel Boston all day. I don't care. I've heard so much about big receivers and about their ability to get in on a break

so much over the course of like just doing this. that it's, I think it's just an overrated thing. You know, and I mean, it is if you run fast. I remember when, what did DeAndre Hopkins run? He didn't run like a 4-4. I remember when he came out. Oh, I don't know if he's going to be able to get off the line that well.

I don't know if he's going to separate that well. Devonte Adams, same thing, man. I give me, give me Boston. I'm really starting. I went back and watched his tape, and I've seen the other guys. I think Boston's as good as anyone else in this class. And I like Malachi Fields,

but I'm going to flip the question on you a little bit. 4-57 at the combat. Yeah. Ran a 4-4-1 at Clemson-Pro. I mean, yeah, well, that's interesting. 2013. That was DeAndre Hopkins. I'm going to flip the script on you.

If you told me, and I like Fields better than Hearst, but if I could get Hearst in the third or Fields in the second, I'm taking Hurst and the third. I think did. I'm not. I know. I know. I know.

I'm taking Malachi Fields. late in the first. Really? His tape is so good. Here's the difference with him as you're watching him right now. He doesn't, he doesn't have to gear it. His stop start for 6-4-218. It's pretty remarkable. You know what else is remarkable about him?

His adjust to the football in the air and like the way he tracks it and adjust to the ball in the air. I saw like Texas A&M saw it down the wrong. right rail who was at Miami first game just adjusting to the football brazil's different brasel doesn't have that suddenness like like there's not gear down he's more of just a smooth glider at tennessee awesome like 74 75 percent of his receiving yards production came to get zone so like son of an NFL point like he just understands it and feels it he's got more suddenness to him but not twitch. He's,

but he's smooth and kind of light for a big tall guy. Boston's the power forward, man. There's a little bit of Titanic, like, I don't, man, I think he moves,

I love him. I love him. I think he moves way better. I think he's, he's after the catch. He's really good. I, man,

I don't know. It's a good. We're all talking, we're talking about really good players here, but I like Boston. The point of all this is there's already conversations in the league about I really like him. But I also really like that tackle.

I really like that corner. Yeah. There's not. Here, this is one thing I heard. There's not a lot of interior defensive linemen this year. So if you don't get one of these guys. So I, and I, we'll get to tight end in a second. I think there's going to be,

um, I think there's going to be kind of a whole, like the running backs a little bit last year after Gentie. Like, I think there's going to be a little bit of a weight, but I think when they start to go, there's going to be a race for them. But I think that that's going to be late first, second round. There's going to be just a bunch of guys, you know? A receiver.

Teams really want to get their offensive tackle. They watched the Super Bowl, too, you know? It was like the Jackson Smith and Jigla year when, like, I think it was like he was the first one off, maybe the second, but it was in the 20s, and then they started flying off. That was, I think that was 20, 2020. 23, right?

If they got that right? Yeah, he was the 20th pick. Yeah, and then they started to, I feel like... Yeah, I didn't even get that far down on the list of the really good players. Yeah, and then it was in Jigma, at Jigba at 20, and then Quentin Johnson, you're right, 2020, Quentin Johnson to the Chargers at 21, Zay Flowers, 22, Jordan Addison, 23. Four right in a row, yeah, boom, boom, boom. Four right in a row, yeah.

All right. All right, sorry, I held you up. Go, let's move. Rodriguez in round two or C.J. Allen in round one. Love CJ Allen. I'm taking Rodriguez, round three, round two. I will tell you this also. This one's kind of tough. I would take Allen, I would take the field on day two versus Allen in the first round round because I think this off the linebacker class is really deep and talented and you can

find players. But specifically, I know that's not the game we're playing. It's Rodriguez in round two versus Allen in round one. Love Allen. I think he is a better prospect, but I'm taking Rodriguez in round two. I threw this out to a couple different people, and I got full agreement from one and like, yeah,

I think you might be right with two. I think something to table, but we can come back to it. We have plenty of time for the next two and a half months. I think maybe the Georgia defensive players were scouting the helmet a little bit this year. I don't think Christian. I don't think Christian Miller's as good as every.

seems to think. And I don't think C.J. Allen is as good. He's a thumper. He's tough. He's physical. He's a great leader. Great. Like all those things. But where's the special? Right. And I think. And it's a good class, man. There's a lot of good linebackers. And you're looking at Kyle Lewis in certain schemes from Pittsburgh. You're looking at Jacob Rodriguez from Texas Tech and taking the ball away. And this linebacker class is really good. It'll be interesting to see if a team just falls in love with C.J. Allen and takes them. You know who else is? I have to go back and watch the tape, and I said this to one of the guys I talked to.

Anthony Hill Jr. is getting more love than I suspected. Because he's talented and versatile, and someone's going to fall in love there. Jake Lade, the guy from Cincinnati is the same way. Versatile, talent. There's some guys in this class, man. That inside lineback class is good. The consensus is it's Kenyon Sadiq at tight end and then and then everybody else, but there's a lot of everybody else. It feels like it's wide open.

27 guys invited to the combine the most that we've seen in a long, long time. The most we've seen the previous four years was 21. 16 was just a couple years ago. So it's a really deep group of tight end. and this is the golden age of tight ends, as much as is screaming and all the Netflix promos. But no one seems pumped about tight end too or in a race to go get them.

Who you got? Who do you think it is right now? Do you want me to tell you who I think it is? Yeah, I feel like you've spent more work, more time on it. Stowers is intriguing to me. I did his tape. I left a little bit underwhelming, underwhelmed. I like injuries, but I don't think he's great.

Not there. Yeah. I like Ohio State. Yep. Good player. Obviously, but wasn't really the, like, the focal point with those two receivers on the outside and the run game that they developed. But was at Purdue and was highly productive. And I think he catches the ball real well and gets up the field and transitions and all that stuff.

you know my feeling on Sam Rouse, but he's like a mid-round guy at best, and I know exactly what he is. He's a number two. He's a Y tight end, and I think he's going to be better in the league than everyone seems to think. But I think there's a bunch of guys, like,

I think there's four in the running to be tied-in to, in my opinion. And one of them is Stowers, and one of them is Max Claire, the tight-in from Ohio State you were talking about. Stowers is tough for me to put up there. I do think he's going to be a day-two guy, but I look at what the Chargers got.

and Ronda Gadsden in the fifth round, and that's kind of what you're going to get with Stowers, a really good receiving tight-in. And Ronda Gadsden, and Ronda Gadsden had an outstanding rookie year. So I just don't think teams are going to want to pay too much for that kind of player. So I think as much as I like Stowers as a receiver,

I don't see him going as the number two tight-in. And that really leaves it to Claire out of Ohio State and the other two names that I think are really important to keep an eye on who I think of leapfrogged Claire at this point, Joe Royer from Cincinnati, and Dallin Bentley from Utah. interesting thing about these guys was Royer was not productive this year, as productive this year as he was last year.

Bentley came out of nowhere and had a monster year for Utah. I really believe it's going to be one of those two guys. And if I had to say right now, I would go with Royer. I like him a little bit more. I think both of them are going to be really good in the league. 18 is the most tight ends drafted in a single year in the last decade. 19 was 11 years ago back in 2015. I'm looking this all up in the fly.

But this class reminds me a little bit, and I'm not saying that Sadiq is Brock Bowers. I'm not. But in 2024, it was Bowers in the first, Sanat in the second, it picked 53. Tip Ryman in the third, it picked 82. So I was midway through the third. and then the next, the fourth tight end to come off the board that year was Chetavian Sanders,

the Texas, the Texas tight end to the Panthers and pick 101. But in that fourth round, you had one, two, three, four, five, six tight ends going in the fourth round. I'm not saying it's going to be exactly like that, but I do think you're going to see one in the first, maybe one in the second and then I think you'll start to see in the third, we'll have like a run, third, fourth ever run on tight ends.

And it might be the most we've had in over a decade at the tight end position. Yeah, it could be one of those things where this happens with players every year, right? Where you wake up on Saturday and you're looking at the board and saying, how is that guy there?

And it could be a tight end that goes early in the fourth round. Yeah. Some really interesting conversations about banks at tight end. defensive line, Hunter, Grayson Hulton, Parker versus Yakis versus

Kieran Krofford. Man, he's in the rounds. Dog. I know, that's your guy. Gladiator, man. Like, he's just, he's a dude. But yeah, go ahead. No, I think these are

important conversations to have today. I want to have the corner conversation because this one was the toughest one for me. You threw this out. We rarely talk, and we don't talk about what we're going to say, but you threw this out as a potential topic and tell me if I'm off base here.

Clemson Corner Avion Terrell in the first round or Gianjillo Ponds from Indiana on day two or is it the second round? Second round and Ponds all day long. I agree with you, but I have thoughts and concerns. Terrell is wildly inconsistent. He scares the hell out of me. He doesn't support the run. He's not rugged enough to be a nickel.

He's a five, what, five, ten outside cornerback only, but he's super sticky and super talented in coverage. But, yeah, I mean, you're going to have to live with some of the bigger receiver stuff against him. Pons is more physical. Pons is a dog. Pons is more instinctive and consistent. But he's listed at. Torell's a little bigger.

And I'm told Torell's going to. going to run faster. Pons just matters in a 5-9-173. Yeah, 173-175. Hear me out on this, because I have a thought on this. He's, Pons has almost spent, he spent the bulk of his career on the outside. Now, that's not to say, because you love the Mike Sanest shows of the world, and they can play at that frame where they play in the slot.

And I could see Pons doing that, but he hasn't done it yet. So that's a little concerning to me. And the other thing is I actually think, and hear me out, I think the comparison for pawns is Antoine Winfield, who was drafted in 1999, and I know that's dating myself. That was my first draft ever doing this. In terms of the shorter corners, I love Winfield.

I also love Ronde Barber, who played in that Tampa 2, obviously. Tampa 2, yeah. Unbelievable player. Dre Bly, the Panthers corner was a tough dude on the outside and didn't care. I actually think, and this may be counterintuitive for people, I think it's actually harder for smaller corners to compete outside today than when it was when it field came out because they're not allowed to be as physical. And Antoine Winfield would get into you, man, and he would irritate you.

And he would just use that gym rat at the, when you're playing pickup basketball, you're like, this guy just doesn't look like he's going to take over a game and then he would just do it. I don't think it's as easy for corners to do that now. So I love how physical pawns is and how tough he is. but I think it's tough to play outside at that size in today's game. So it's going to be interesting to see how the team that drafts him uses him.

But the tape is freaking awesome. The tape is awesome. Yeah, I've got a whole bunch of notes on, everyone agreed with us. Chris Johnson is just still a really damn good football player, but wasn't his best weekend mobile. Let me leave you with this because you know I'm a nickel corner guy, or a nickel guy.

I think I might have found my nickel this year and he's a nickel safety, if you will. We should do a searching for the nickel series where you don't have to commit to a guy this early. I don't want you to commit to anyone yet, but this guy might be in the right. We'll do a searching for the slot and searching for the nickel.

We have to come up with a name for this, but it's like a contest of who wins the slot or nickel for you. Yeah, go ahead. If you beat me, I'll have a rough off season. Stoops in Arizona. ona. Yeah? Mm-hmm. Just keeping eye on it. All right, time to go.

This is fun. This is like, this is the real stuff versus the manufacturer. How many quarterbacks got on it? Let's talk about draft sleepers. Let's, I don't know. Coming back from break, we're going to talk about who we like is a possible wide receiver in the second. Like, these are actual conversations going on in the league. And I hope everyone enjoyed it. For you, Mensch, five stars.

Thanks, man. Must be 21 plus and present in select states. for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus and present in D.C. Gambling problem? Call 1-800 gambler or visit RG-Help.com. Call 1-88-88-889-7777-7-7 or visit ccpg.org slash chat in Connecticut. Or visit MD gambling help.org in Maryland. Hope is here.

Visit gambling helplinema. m a.org or call 1-800-327-50-50 for 24-7 support in Massachusetts or call 1877-8-8-Hope-N-Y or text Hope N-Y in New York. For Louisiana, call 1877-7-770-8867.