The MeatEater Podcast - Ep. 171: Let Them Wear Pink

Episode Date: June 3, 2019

Steven Rinella talks with Land Tawney, Ben O'Brien, Matt Rinella, Ryan Callaghan, and Janis Putelis at Backcountry Hunters and Anglers North American Rendezvous in Boise, ID.Subjects discussed: Seeing through the bullshit; BHA’s insidious plot to destroy America; tying a tuna to the back of your girlfriend's car; missing fingers, biting tongues, and man-eating house cats; the perils of getting your wildlife news from ABC news; Appalachian confit; gender neutral hunting terms; jaguar recovery in the United States; hunting for mountain lions; Latvian folklore; blaze pink; and more. Connect with Steve and MeatEaterSteve on Instagram and TwitterMeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and YoutubeShop MeatEater Merch    Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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without cell phone service as a special offer. You can get a free three months to try out OnX if you visit onxmaps.com slash meet. This is the Meat Eater Podcast coming at you shirtless, severely bug-bitten, and in my case, underwearless. We hunt the Meat Eater Podcast coming at you shirtless, severely bug-bitten, and in my case, underwearless. The Meat Eater Podcast. You can't predict anything. All right, everybody. Thanks for coming out.

Ben's the man. I'm the man. I'm the man. Yeah, I figured that was either the start or the end of my career. Yeah, of what? Oh, go ahead. I want to get started by just clearing the air. I'm on to everyone here.

I know the truth, man. You're just tree-hugging, rock-kissing, green decoys. Yeah. There's some of you that might be here and you don't know what you are. And I'm going to tell you about what you are and how I've learned to see through it. First, I want to make sure everyone's clear on what you are. Ben? You want me to give it to them? You want to take a stab at it? Yeah.

Tell them what they are. There's a lot of you. BHA, Bad Country Hunters and Anglers, is green decoys. You're a bunch of environmentalists, left-wing snobs. Liberals. Liberals. Liberals. Masquerading as sportsmen

shame on you yanni you got anything to add tumble what they are actors they act like they like guns they act like they like to hunt act like they like to kill fish they act like they just want to be left alone to hunt. That's right. But what's the truth? They're like a Trojan horse. They're sneaking into the far right to eventually take down all hunting. It's green. I've seen the website. When I first saw it, I it I'm like dude how did I not see it man I felt so naive it was like because I always thought I was looking at I was like BHA you know I've been supporting BHA for a long time and I always thought I was like seemed to me like the hardest

hitting hunting and fishing dudes I knew about and I used to look at it, man, if I had to think like, if you were going to take a membership and tally up hours spent per year out in the woods or in the mountains or in the swamps, there's no conservation group that would log the hours spent a field per member that this one does. That was when I was stupid and naive, but then I started thinking about it, looking at it more carefully. And I got to looking at some of the members, you know, looking at what they do.

Got to reading about this person. She might even be here, Cindy Stites. No, don't. No, you got to know the truth. Don't. You don't know the truth about her. You don't know the truth about her. The buck stops here, Cindy.

She's a, first off, certified arborist. When I hear arborist, I know we're already talking about an elitist. We're talking about, when I hear arborist, you know. Tree hugger. That's what we're talking about. Postally, literally out hugging trees. Yep. You used to be an arborist, correct's why i know that world man yeah so i knew i was like okay you know maybe there is something

to this green decoy business someone out running chainsaws and then uh you know i started to smell a fish turns out she got to she started to pretend got a question. Do you think like she carries a whole bunch of Kleenex because when she's up in that tree cutting those limbs, she, there must be tears with every single one. That's how she started to hone her ability to live a lie. She's like, she, she started to infiltrate and learn how to live a lie. So she's like cutting trees, but she actually loves trees. And she's like, well, I can do this. So I'm going to get into this thing and pretend how I like hunting. So she goes hunting. She goes hunting six years ago. I got some details here. She goes hunting six years ago, gets super into it, you know, and she's so sadistic. She's so sadistic that she starts helping other people

who want to get involved in hunting. She becomes a hunting ed instructor, which is like, if you think about it, some shrewd shit, right? Because she's like Donnie Brasco, man. She's destroying it from the inside. So she becomes the hunting ed instructor. And the play there is that you help other people start hunting, right? And you make more and more hunters. And then she gets really smart and starts going into schools to teach archery. And she goes to 4-H to teach archery.

Because imagine the elaborate play here yeah because you guys know general Patton was fighting for the Germans I don't know if you know this so that's like how this kind of stuff works and I get there's another dude I started reading about and I've emailed a little bit and I started getting suspicious because he's a hunting guide so the first thing that goes off my head this guy Adam Gall like hunts down in Colorado he's got a hunting guide. So the first thing that goes off my head, this guy Adam Gall, like hunts down in Colorado. He's got a hunting guide business that specializes in taking, it's called Timber to Table Guide Service, where they specialize in taking out clients

who want to learn about hunting, butchering, cooking, ground up, full on, blood on your hands, shit, right? Because that's how you win that war against hunting. It's like it's just became so obvious. He gets all involved in like a partnership with the Boone and Crockett Club where they go to colleges to help college kids learn about hunting and get involved in the conservation movement. Duh.

It's called the long con. You can see where it's going. I know. It's like, how did I not see that this is the end of hunting? Connect the dots, people. And then it gets bad. The reason I'm bringing it up today gets bad because it turns out that BHA,

Backcountry Hunters and Anglers, wound up somehow my brother, and here's the weird deal where it gets real weird because me and my brother started trapping muskrats when I was 10 to know that he was like working for the dedication to know at that age that he's like here's how I'm gonna unravel hunting as here's how I'm gonna destroy American hunting and fishing at at 9 10 10, whatever years of age, you shot your first deer with a bow when you were 12? How did you know that you were going to? I had to establish

my hunting bona fides if I was going to have any chance. So to know, to have the clarity of mind that at 12 years of age, you knew you were going to grow up and betray hunters and gun owners. And to live, how old are you now? 48. You still haven't broke cover. He's still, Tonight's my coming out. He still hasn't broke cover. And like, you might look and be like, okay, here's this guy,

this elaborate lifelong ruse, all pretending he's a hardcore hunter, lives on wild game meat, wanders around the mountains by himself with llamas. It's like, he's so, he's such a character actor and plays the role so well that he plays it by himself out in the damn mountains. It's like he's tricking gray jays into thinking he likes to hunt.

But there's people watching on those ridges. Yeah. And they get suspicious, and they come out, and they're like, well, let's just see. And sure enough, he comes by, and they're like, by God, he does like to hunt. And here's the little kind of shrewd move that he does. Near him, there's a federal agency that manages this chunk of land, right? And they got a boat launch that cuts through this property. And a guy comes in and vandalizes the area.

And so the guy in charge of managing the land, not out of any kind of ruthlessness or not out of being a bad guy, but it just, he has to make a decision where he's going to have to shut down the boat launch because of the vandalism problem. And so this is where my brother springs the trap and destroys hunting and fishing in America.

Is he proposes this idea where why don't I get with BHA, why don't I get with Bad Country Hunters and Anglers, and we'll raise up some money and buy a gate with a key code on it, so that when people do want to launch their boat to go hunt and fish, they'll just get a number and enter their number, and then we'll know who's been there, and the person in charge that administrates this land is like, well, you know what, that seems like a pretty reasonable thing. I don't have the budget for it.

He's like, well, I'll tell you what, I'll work with BHA. We'll raise the money to pay for an electronic gate and a key code system. So they do that, and now all these people that like to hunt and fish can go do it. And that's how you get them. It's like... You change the key code. It's just the green decoy. It's just so insidious, man.

I was blind and stupid, but now I see the truth I'm still going to carry on tonight like a normal show but I just don't want anyone to have any confusion about what this group is actually about so land we're going to do we're going to do a couple things

we're going to cover some news and feedback we're going to talk about other stuff that's not that we're going to do a couple things. We're going to cover some news and feedback. We're going to talk about other stuff that's not that. We're going to play a game, see him through the bullshit, where you get to win something really cool. There was a game I wanted to play. Four of us are all staying in the same house. And we've been showering with French lavender soap.

I know, because I was in there, and that's what's in there. That's what I smell. And I wanted to play a game where someone wears a blindfold and has to identify the two people who aren't staying in that house. But I don't want to play that game. I thought about it. We need to have a talk with a guy named Seth Trokey. Is he here? Okay, we're going to talk to him.

Got to talk to him real bad. We're going to do birthday giveaways. We've got other business to take care of, but first we're going to do introductions. And I think the first introduction I want to do is, Land, can you tell us how bad the BHA situation has gotten? Like the insidious plot. Like how many people have you got sucked into the insidious plot to destroy America? I mean, it's so bad.

It's so bad. We got like 1,200 people here right now. Yeah. That's terrible. And we got 36,000 across the country. It is horrible. It's getting bad. It is horrible.

It's like the Red Scare, man. It is. Every day we're getting members every single day. We had 30,000 at the start of the year and all of a sudden 36. It sends shivers up my spine to think you got 36,000 people out there fighting for America's public lands. Freedom. We're fighting for freedom. Yeah. Seriously, tell people a little bit about what goes on here and who's all here and totally so this is the biggest group of badass hunters in the country and anglers that come together right

and like the traditional rendezvous they come together once a year and they come together to share stories come together to have a lot of fun and come together to learn how to infiltrate even better. Yeah. Yeah. So basically, we've been here since Tuesday, many of us. Chapter training. We've been learning how to infiltrate even better. And then today, we have a little elk calling contest outside.

We had a brew fest last night with like, what, 4,000, 5,000 people there? Yes, sir. Now here's how bad it gets. Is that elk calling? That's like a Pied Piper thing where you lure children away? Absolutely. That's our siren song.

This is how bad it gets. Last night we had our brew fest. We had a Democratic mayor, Mayor Beater, introduce a Republican governor. And guess what? They were agreeing on stuff that was called public lands. That's how good we're getting. Oh, man.

You've even got the politicians to buy in, man. We got the politicians to buy in. We're having a lot of fun. That's what we're doing, Steve. Nah, dude, I'm going to save Cal's introduction for last. We got to talk about something. Ben O'Brien from the Hunting Collective. Hey, I'm the man.

I'm the man. We're only calling that THC from here on out. THC. That's what I'm handing out, boys. THC. Every week. It's a lot of THC. That's what I'm handing out, boys. THC. Every week. That's how we fool these green decoys. That's your new intro.

They're all... Your weekly dose of THC. That's right. My older brother, Matt Rinella. And then the lovely, laughing eagle, Giannis Poutelis. And then Ryan Cowell, Ryan O'Cowell Callahan. So here's something we need to do. Normally when you go to a show, it's bad form to pull out your phone.

But in this case, it's perfectly accepted to pull out your phone and go to Google Play or go to iTunes and download and subscribe to Cal's new show, Cal's Week in Review, which is your weekly roundup of shit you ought to know about. It's a new show called Cal's Week in Review. Tell them, Cal. He's not kidding. Pull out your phones because I need a job. Get your phones out. Go to iTunes. Go to Google Play. Subscribe and download Cal's Week in Review. Think of this as your conservation cliff notes. Okay, you're going to get everything you need to know from last week and this week. And you're going to be able to regurgitate that stuff on demand.

Yeah, so when you fake hunters are talking to real hunters and you hit them with this shit, you're going to sound legit. And they're just going to be like, just take my gun. And then you should have it. You obviously know this world better than I do. All right, when you're done, hold your phone up so we can see that you've done it. We're going to check your work. Yeah, look at all those phones. It's spelled C-A-L, apostrophe S. Cal's Week in

Review, a weekly roundup of everything you need to know about and a lot of stuff, things you might even wish you didn't know about. Now on the show, we're going to get into some other stuff. On the show, we have a little bit of a habit of something will come up, and then we kind of beat it to death. And then eventually we've beaten it so to death that we eventually decide to let it die. And there's a couple of those things that I want to touch on for the last time, and then we'll take our oath and not talk about it anymore. Some of these are too funny.

We had a podcast where we were talking about how excruciating it is to, there's a lot of Western hunters here, so I know what we're talking about, how excruciating it is to, like, you see a deer way off. I thought you were going to talk about chap ass. Oh, no. We retired chap ass. We've seen it come down to... Wait, we've got to bring it up. Cal has flip-flop chap.

He's got chap foot. That's thong chap foot. It's first run out of the gate, man. It's not flip-flop season in Montana yet. Yeah. I'm coming around, though. It's okay. The two chap ass Kears, in the end, it seems like like the unanimous almost unanimous decision

was um a product called body glide oh so you guys have covered this oh yeah oh no dude we covered it most people that wrote in like if you're going to tally it up there's a product called body glide but one guy uh and i've mentioned this three times now, suggested that he once had it so bad he took his sandwich apart and wedged a slice of bologna between his buttocks. Between his buttocks is how bad it got for him. But there's a consensus around products such as Body Glide. I had some firefighters just two hours ago tell me about that they trust body glide. And if a firefighter can trust it, so can you. But the thing we were talking about is we're talking about when you're telling someone where a deer is and they're like, well, where's the deer?

And you kind of have this like, oh, and you do the, you know, well, you see that rock and then there's a tree, you know, and you talk someone into it or talk someone onto it. And I was taught, and then on a later show, I got to talk about how a guy who's, he does, he's JTAG. So he calls airstrikes for a living in war zones. And he's like, when you're calling airstrikes for a living from the ground, and you're trying to direct firepower from the heavens, I like to establish a unit of measurement. So I would say, okay, go to the skyline, and you see that prominent spruce tree at the highest point. Okay, everybody agrees on that spruce tree. That spruce tree, the width of that or the height of that spruce tree will now become a unit of measurement.

Go down five. And he says, that's how you talk someone in on something out in the mountains. And I thought that was the final word. And then we get an email from a pilot. The pilot says, I heard Mr. Rinella say he was going to take the tip of using the, quote, unit of measure technique from JTAC. Now, being a pilot from a squadron that conducted close air support, this made my blood boil. I had a genuine emotional reaction to it. Nothing kills tempo more in the close air support environment when you hear the JTAC come over the net and say, the distance between X and Y will be used as a unit of measure.

The frustration that the air crew have in the time after those words is enormous. So understand that there is some contention about establishing unit of measure. Another thing I want to touch on that we talked about, we spent a lot of time, say something if you've heard of us talk about the guy that got in trouble for killing the 400-pound tuna and dumping it in the woods. Okay. It's good because the word gets out and the arresting officer listens to our description of what happened and writes in to say, you guys did a great job explaining what happened. And, and Wright's starting to say, you guys did a great job explaining what happened. Here's a couple of fun details for you that you don't know about. One, the guy that caught the tuna that he, sorry, back up. Is it legal for him to be sharing this

information? I don't know. He sent it to me. A, I think it's, bluefin tuna season ends in Massachusetts, and a guy catches a tuna and boats it, which is illegal, and then he's got a plan to sell the tuna, but instead drags the tuna, gets wind that they're after him or onto him, and drags the tuna out in the woods, and gets a $15,000 fine for killing the tuna out of season. And then for fun, they add on dump fines for dumping shit in the woods. And the best detail that comes out of it is that when he dragged it away, he actually tied it to his girlfriend's car. And it's like, there's a, there's a rule in comedy about specificity and tying a tuna to your car and dragging it away is funny. But it's not as funny as tying a tuna to your girlfriend's car and dragging it away.

It's just like, it's just a rule of comedy. But the guy, this guy's a glutton for punishment, so he gets in all this trouble. But then he gets out and he's on probation. And what does he do on probation? He goes out to get vengeance on people who testified against him. So he goes to one of them and steals a bunch of his lobster pots and dumps them in the woods, apparently. So now he's in jail for tampering with lobster gear in his second defense of illegal dumping. The first.

The first being a tuna. I asked Matt earlier if he could work up a moral to the story, and he really couldn't. No, I just thought it was, you can't compete with the truth on this. I mean, it's the moral so clear that you can't make up a moral

because it's already just so clear. What do you tell the girlfriend when you're like, hey? I'll be back in a minute. Can I borrow your car? No, nothing's wrong with mine. No, that's not a 400-pound tuna tied to the back of the car. No. Another thing, we recently shared a story.

We recently shared an old story about a Wyoming man who caught a lake trout with a dude's finger in it. This happened in Idaho too. It's a better story because the characters in the story are better. This is back in 2012 on Priest Lake, Priest Lake, Idaho. There's a wake boarder who notices a curlicue form in the line, and what does he do but try to straighten the curlicue out as the boat takes off? There they all go, all four of them. Then some dudes are fishing. One of these dudes' names is Calvin, and Calvin and his buddy catch a four-pound trout,

and they're cleaning it, and there's something in the stomach, and they were using crayfish, and they think, oh, it must be a crayfish, but it's not. Calvin's buddy catches a fish, but Calvin has all the good quotes. One of his quotes is, it was as fresh as if it was on my finger. Then he goes, in the story I read, he goes on to say, I've caught a zillion fish, but never one with a human finger. And he points out that they felt so apparently lucky would be the word that they went out and bought lottery tickets that day.

There must be something about that shape that Lake Trout really liked. Yeah. Flathead Lake, they fish for them with Johnsonville brats. Well, they do. Which is superficially. But after reading about, yeah, after reading about all these fingers and trout, if I saw a Johnsonville brat and a fish, I would like assume it was trout. At the time the article I was looking at was written,

there was a lot of uncertainty swirling around this whole thing because the guy, they fingerprint the finger. They like turn, they no joke, they turn the fish into the cops. The cops pull the finger out and fingerprint it and run it through their database. And it turns up the dude's name. I don't know why he'd been fingerprinted, but it belongs to this guy. They go find him. Sure enough, it's his finger.

He says he initially doesn't want it back. But then he starts to rethink it. Meanwhile, the police learned he doesn't want it back, but they keep it in their evidence freezer in case he changes his mind. At the time the article is written, the man who owns the finger had called his doctor to ask his opinion, but was awaiting a call back. So they caught these people in this brief moment of uncertainty, which makes the news story more interesting. So here's my question. Is it his finger? That's why I got the email. Is it his finger? Because there's a thing. I would mount that. That's the reason someone brought these finger stories to my attention, because we were talking too much about Steve Kendrott's deer antler. There's a deer. Oh, my God. We've talked about this too many times.

There's a guy that shot a buck that was missing a tine. His buddy shot a buck and the tine is stuck in it. So the buddy kept the tine. We ridiculed the buddy and the buddy gave the tine back to Steve. So now Steve has the head and the tine. And he says, if that's justice, whose finger is the fish carrying around? Yeah. Does the guy with the fish, you know, is he like, screw you, it's my finger. I caught it. It's like my fish. If you caught a fish that had a crayfish in it, you don't go find who owned the crayfish. And it's not wildlife.

You could sell it to them. Yeah. The give them the finger jokes are just easy to write. Yeah. They write themselves. Give them the finger. Your wife might be glad we found that. I can only imagine.

That's not what I meant. I think it was taken out of context. Speaking of that, Idaho story. This is something that came into us. We're breaking this story. An ambulance, a guy who, he works on an ambulance. I don't know what exactly he does in an ambulance. Up in Pocatello.

This is a recent, this is like an Idaho man I don't know what exactly he does in the ambulance. Up in Pocatello. This is a recent, this is like an Idaho man breaking news here on Meteor Podcast. They get a call. Two brothers got in a big fight on New Year's Eve. And apparently, like, according to witnesses, as he learns the story, during the fight, one of them goes up

like he's going to kiss the other one. One of the brothers, somehow, I don't want to get into too much detail because it's a other one. One of the brothers, somehow, I don't want to get into too much detail because it's a little bit hazy in the email, but it just so happens that one of the brothers bites off the tongue of the other brother.

And the brother that bites it off spits it onto the ground. The police come out. The ambulance has come out. Everybody's going off to the hospital. They go in to recover the tongue and a cat ate the tongue. This is a firsthand report out of Pocatello.

Can I say, like, he gave him the tongue, and we just move on? There's tongue jokes. There's tongue jokes I'll not make. What kind of kiss, man? Yeah, I got you. I'm just telling you. The man wrote in to talk about it. Quick hit from Matt.

You don't remember growing up how there's a type of fence that we call a cyclone fence? That word is not widely used. They call them other stuff. Like what? Chain link. Chain link. Okay. We got to talking the other day about how I heard another person use cyclone fence. they call them other stuff. Like what? Chain link. Chain link, okay.

We got to talking the other day about how I heard another person use cyclone fence. And I was like, interesting that you just said cyclone fence. A guy from Louisiana wrote in, he goes, I never heard the word cyclone fence, but what we call a chain link fence is a hurricane fence. My guess being that someone had one and a hurricane came and it was still there. And he names it that.

And he said when a Cajun gets wind of something that can still be standing after a hurricane, it moves to the top of the list of shit he wants to buy. So he feels that that's how it achieved that name. We also had a recent conversation where we talked about the developing offensiveness of terms like sportsman, fisherman, what else do we have? Outdoorsman, and struggling for a gender-neutral term. And a guy wrote in a question that I haven't even begun to grapple with, and it's a really interesting point.

I'm just going to say it, and I'm not going to comment on it because I haven't even untangled it in my head. But he spells out four words. Sportsman, fisherman, outdoorsman, woman. He's like, I don't get it It's good I haven't thought of like I don't know yet A Canadian woman

Named Chloe Came down to the US To visit And there's a bunch of turkeys hanging around in a house she's renting. And she was thinking about how we're always talking about things that'll make turkeys gobble. And she walked over on the porch of the house she's renting and rang a dinner bell. And they gobbled. And the irony of that was not lost on her. So add that to the list. Dinner bells. Bring them running. A guy wrote in, we made a shirt

that has all the things that'll make a turkey shot gobble on it. Some of the things, sonic booms, the more interesting sounds will make a turkey shot gobble. And a guy wrote in to complain about the shirt saying it was like a graphic grip and grin photo because it says it makes it seem that turkey hunting is so easy that people will think that turkey hunting is bad and they'll turn against turkey hunting. But there's a big difference between the number of turkeys you hear gobble and the number of turkeys you hear that you shoot, it would be like how many people you can get to say hi to you and how many people have sex with you are like really different. It's how you destroy a turkey hunt. Um, what else?

Oh, a couple more newsy things. Speaking of turkeys, a couple of guys wrote in about what is happening when turkeys spit and drum. Yanni, anyone? Yeah, because I was wrong about this. I was, no, I was, I actually didn't, I didn't know until you told me me and it's funny that we also got emails about it do you know matt what the noise is well i'm just i know now but i'm asking if you know okay i'll take a crack at it but this could be completely wrong i thought the the spit was actually a spit like him going yep and the drum is when he's fluffing up his feathers not correct on neither front no first one first one you know how hot it was in that suit And the drum is when he's fluffing up his feathers. Not correct. On either front?

No, first one. First one. You know how hot it was in that suit? Hot in that suit, man. I just want you guys to know that. It was Texas. It was hot. That's where you were dusting, right?

Yeah, that's where I was dusting. I think someone that wrote in is here tonight that wrote in to ask this question. He wanted us to do our best spitting drum, which is my favorite thing to do. But Yanni, explain. It was a she. It was a she. I didn't even look at the name. It was a woman.

That's how neutral I am. I don't even read the names. Fisherman. It was a she that wrote in about what's going on there. Tell them. Spitting and drumming. It's all. It's a vocalization.

It is a vocalization. Oh. Who knew? A person. A person wrote in to ask, and they said they just started turkey hunting and they said when I'm close to a turkey I don't understand but I swear I'm hearing low thunder

oh a couple years ago I tracked a turkey through the woods for a half hour and shot him just based on that sound it was his demise. It did sound like that. That was a gross bastardization

of what he was doing. It's, uh, it's... But he must be fanning out when he's doing that because it's always lined up with the... Yeah, but he's not fanning out when he's doing that because yo it's always he's got his wings yeah but he's not you know he's just rubbing his wings on the ground rubbing his wings on the ground which you can hear sometimes yeah you can hear those wings dragging you hear that a lot hey you guys this is is it all right if i put it a little aside in here

oh please so um my turkey season hasn't been going great. Like, I've got two, but I had a lot of hubris going into it. I was going to try to get five. Can you explain hubris? Like false confidence, you know. But I think that it's more than that, right? A little machismo throwing confidence. Isn't it based on incomplete knowledge of the situation,

like you're just ignorant of? But I think in Greek tragedy, I think it's your hubris that leads to your downfall. Oh. Maybe I don't have five because I was so cocky. But anyway. I'd like to add that it's like a critical element of turkey hunting, I think. But if you don't have some hubris during your hunt,

then it wouldn't be turkey hunting. Do you not experience that? I had it the other morning. This is a major aside on my aside. When I had just slipped in there, and I'd been there for five minutes in the dark, and my gun was set up right where I knew he was going to fly down, and I'm already thinking about the text and the Instagram story

and then about two hours later I'm just you know red-faced and just wanted to dig a hole and call it out into and bury myself yeah that's turkey's turkey hunting. Go ahead. Go on. I shot the king. Did you hear about this? I did not. You saw it. This dude had three strands in his left in his beard.

And the rest of them were all like, it's like he had a mohawk or something. They're all shaved off. Like, I don't know if he got like it burned on the tank heater last winter or like just fighting.

I watched him for an hour straight. He never un-puffed. Not once. And he was immune to my seduction. And he's out in the middle of antelope country, like a quarter mile from the nearest tree. So I was able to intuit which patch of trees he was going to go to. And when he came in to roost, he had four or five hens. He had three gobblers with him. He didn't give a shit. They were just like his little...

A lot of gobblers would get defensive and stuff. Oh, yeah. They'd get all nervous. They were his little errand boys, man. His little wise guys. They'd send them off for corn, you know. And I freaking whack him, and then I whack one of his buddies.

Can you do, when you tell, I would suggest like a more robust report. I didn't want to overstate it, man. I'm trying to, you know. But that dude, I opened both those birds up. His little buddy was plugged with green feed. He was completely empty. And this was like when he's going into roost for the night.

He's going in empty stomach because all he cares about is locks. Like just locks strut. Locks strut all day long, never a bite to eat. This thing has spurs on it like that. I promised Steve's daughter, Rosie, but I'm kind of reconsidering because I'd kind of like to glue them. Six-year-old child. I'd kind of want to, yeah, it gets sicker.

I have this fantasy about gluing them to the end of like popsicle sticks and then flicking people with them. Bring that elbow, you know. Yeah! Landon, you got anything you need to add there? What am I going to add to that? No. Speaking for all turkeys, man.

I'm flicking. I'm thinking I'm flicking. We've been talking a lot. You're good, Matt? Yeah. Sorry about that. No, no, no. It was great.

Quick side point. It's the best thing to happen. We've been talking a lot about cat-human, mountain lion-human, cat-human conflicts. And there's even an article, like there's an ABC News article about the increase in cat-human conflicts. Now, if you go to ABC News for wildlife reporting, it's like going to Michael Moore's website for gun reviews. But I, big story on cat-human conflicts. And it goes into this deep history of how we came to have, like why do we have these burgeoning, like growing populations, mountain lions expanding in the new terrain all the time,

and more and more mountain lions. And the story starts out on a kind of a factual note where it says that in the 40s and 50s, we were running these bounty programs for mountain lions and paying people year-round to kill mountain lions. And then we curtailed those systems, started regulating mountain lions as a big game species and introduced harvest quotas, closed seasons, all kinds of regulations around it. And we started doing a lot of conservation work to recover deer and elk populations. And as we improved deer and elk populations and stopped paying people to kill cats without any consideration of seasonality or bag limits,

we basically, through this thing we call the North American model of wildlife conservation, started growing mountain lion numbers. But here's the rub. It's like a positive article about how great it is that we have a bunch of cats around. But then they're like, you can see the writers start to sweat. We're like, how can I turn this into an anti-hunting article? Because I kind of dug a hole for myself. Like regulated hunting, we got all these mountain lions, they kind of, these hunters like kind of recovered deer and elk, and there's all this food on the landscape now. And so then they get to getting crafty, and they go on to say that, in fact, they kind of forgot that they were saying how good it is that we got so many

mountain lions. And then they're like, ah, it's kind of a bummer that we have all these mountain lions. The reason we have all these mountain lions is because hunters kill old, mature mountain lions. And everyone knows that an old, mature mountain lion will kill all the other mountain lions around. So now that we kill the old, mature mountain lions, the little ones live, and they go and spread around, and they're young, and they go to strike out and colonize new areas. And that leads to conflicts to humans. And that just goes to show you how bad hunters are. And you start getting lost in the logic of it a little bit. And then the real zinger in the end,

they point out that, you know, California banned mountain lion hunting and they now have the lowest per capita rate of human mountain lion conflicts. And I got to thinking to myself, they now have the lowest per capita rate of human mountain lion conflicts. And I got to thinking to myself, they also have the lowest per capita rate of people who've never encountered a tree. So excavators in southern Indiana found mastodon bones. Whoa, whoa, before we leave the mountain lion thing. You guys probably talked about this because it was all over the news about this guy that killed the mountain lion, right? Yeah, but you know what? Yeah, I know it was a small one and all that. He never went out. He was not like, I'm the great man's, the world's greatest man. He was very, very matter of fact.

But the reason I would bring this up is I want to give you an opportunity to apologize to me publicly. Okay. Because as you recall. That's very gracious of you. Very brotherly. I took a lot of shit from you and Dan, our other brother, and all our friends growing up because I had a firm, heartfelt belief. I wasn't too worried about predators because I always felt like I could just grab them by the juggler and choke them out. No.

That's not your plan. And it turns out. That wasn't your plan. That wasn't your plan. You're lying. No. Your plan. No.

No. Your plan. Your plan in. No, your plan. No. No, your plan. Your plan in the event of a grizzly attack. I'll remind you of your plan. Your plan was that what you do. This might be my plan B. What you do is, he explained to me, is you get him by the bottom teeth and by the top teeth. And hold his mouth agape until he's tired and worn out. And then you walk away. I feel that was what was explained. That was the, that was the pepper spray equivalent.

Your plan is to give him a draw. Dude, I'm out of this podcast. I can't. There might be some truth to that because there's a old Latvian folklore story called Lachplasis and literally

you translate... Tell me again the name. Lachplasis and latis is bear. To plast is the verb to rip. Yeah, you told me about this. So, lach pleasis is the bear ripper. And aside from spri dietus, which is another story, I won't get into all the Latvian folklore stories I know about and characters,

but lach pleasis is like, he's the man from Latvian folklore stories I know about and characters, but Lodge Places is like, he's the man from Latvian folklore, and he saved his mother from a bear by doing just that. I think he continued to pull the actually- Until he ripped them. Until he ripped, yeah. That gives me an idea for my popsicle stick. Just flick them in there. So what's his name?

Lodge Places. And they would tell stories about him yes they always end the same way i think you just there's just one story they're like about you know what he did to that bear well what did you do to that bear, Dad? Well, let me tell you. Hey, folks, exciting news for those who live or hunt in Canada. And boy, my goodness, do we hear from the Canadians whenever we do a raffle or a sweepstakes. And our raffle and sweepstakes law makes it that they can't join. Whew, our northern brothers get irritated.

Well, if you're sick of, you know know sucking high and titty there on x is now in canada the great features that you love in on x are available for your hunts this season the hunt app is a fully functioning gps with hunting maps that include public and crown land hunting zones aerial imagery 24k topo maps, waypoints, and tracking. That's right, we're always talking about OnX here on the MeatEater podcast. Now you guys in the Great White North can be part of it, be part of the excitement. You can even use offline maps to see where you are without cell phone service. That's a sweet function.

As part of your membership, you'll gain access to exclusive pricing on products and services handpicked by the OnX Hunt team. Some of our favorites are First Light, Schnee's, Vortex Federal, and more. As a special offer, you can get a free three months to try OnX out if you visit onXMaps.com slash meet. OnXMaps.com slash meet. Welcome to the OnX club, y'all. Excavators in southern Indiana found mastodon bones on an old family farm. I was reading about this this and in the article, the farmer cited the discovery as an example of just how much things have changed around here.

Minnesota's governor, Minnesota's governor, I always like to point out, in the office once occupied by Jesse Ventura, Governor Tim Walz just did an out-about face to announce his opposition to wolf hunting. And to paint his opposition to wolf hunting, he's taken to calling it sport hunting. Meanwhile, he just went out on the governor's turkey hunt, which is kind of a symbolic turkey hunt, and then turns around and expresses his disapproval around wolf hunting. And sport hunt's a little thing you use when you want something to look bad. But I wonder if he felt that his governor's turkey hunt is subsistence hunting. I don't know.

Another governor's story. Your neighbor, he state over in Washington just legalized Hunter's Pink which you know we all know that this is going to bring in legions of new hunters who you know I know hundreds of people that weren't participating due to the available

palette of safety clothing but in Washington to change the law they had to bring it for the governor's signature. And I just like have this image in my mind, like a governor, like running this big state, you know, and all these like huge companies are there and things going on. And then one day a guy's like, ah, you know, I hate to do this to you, but you're going to have to sign this bill here. And he's like, what is this? Well, what this does is allows people to wear pink

while hunting. And he's like, oh, wonderful. Let's get this executed. It's always like a bunch of old guys that are standing there, right? Yeah. Let's execute. That's a great idea.

This will be made law now. If you guys had to rate, and I know it's not fair because I'm just talking to a bunch of guys right now. What do you think, like, how effective is, I think nine states, Washington, I think is the ninth state to allow blaze pink? If you had, you can just like, what do you think about it?

And you can, and stuff like this where I don't really care, I kind of have this thing where you can be like, yeah. Or you could be like, meh. Or you could be like, meh, right? That would be sort of the range of my... You just took all my answers, man.

So I'd be like, yeah, yeah, yeah. How do you feel? Do you feel it's going to have an impact? No. No. I want to poll the women in the audience. What do you think? Pink out there?

Give me a woo for pink if you're a woman. If you want more in pink than you would in orange. Oh, you can in nine states. I don't have a problem with it. No, you're taking me wrong. I don't have a problem with it. I don't care. I should say I don't care what color.

Because I think in a lot of states, Hunter's Orange rules are necessary. I just feel like it's a, I just feel like it's talking about something that isn't really going to do anything. That's all. Yeah. Wear what color you want, but I just don like it's talking about something that it isn't really going to do anything. That's all. Yeah, wear what color you want, but I just don't think,

if they're passing the bill thinking this is going to grow 100 numbers, I think that's just... Like, we got to lick now. We got them. I mean, with all the barriers, I don't think that's the one we should be working on, right?

You don't know that that's the one. Yeah, there's been any other ones. You could have taken that same time and energy and just simplified a page or two in the big game regulations, and that probably would have gotten more jail. They could have taken a pink highlighter and highlighted all the bullshit

that would have done better. Or you would take that energy and clarify once and for all, if you're in a state where you have to have on an orange vest and you put a backpack on, are you now legal or illegal? That would be helpful to know. Speaking of big cats, U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service just put out their jaguar recovery plan, which is super interesting. And it's great that this is happening. And part of the jaguar recovery plan which is super interesting and it's it's great that they're

it's great that this is happening and part of the jaguar recovery plan comes down to identifying habitat in the u.s and the trouble was they assembled this thing is they're limiting their definition of the recovery unit to places that only had observations where observations have been made since 1962. So the recovery unit winds up having this arbitrary northern border of I-10, which for the U.S. just gives you like a fingernail clipping of the U.S. as being Jaguar area. And they're ruling out hard evidence that's pre-1962,

hard evidence of Jaguar habitation in New Mexico, western Texas, central and northern Arizona. And then, of course, they're ruling out anecdotal evidence of Jaguars in California and Louisiana. So I think it's great that they're thinking about this, and I would love to see Jaguar recovery going on. I mean, it's kind of like Jaguars in the U.S. We sometimes have one, maybe, sometimes two for lucky, probably never any more than that. Speaking of distractions, right, of all the stuff that needs to be done and to think that like we're making laws about what, like, you know, making the color palette bigger for safety

clothing. What do you guys feel? Is Jaguar recovery, is it just too far out there and too radical that it's a distraction from other stuff we should be working on? Or do you think it's okay to sit around thinking about this every day like I do? I think all parts matter, man. All parts matter. Like caribou. What are we going to do about caribou? I think all parts matter.

And if they were here, I think we should try. Yeah. That's the thing. You get into this bait, like, like if you're going to base good enough on present, you know what I mean? If you're going to say like, okay, environmentally, ecologically, wildlife, habitat, hunting opportunities, baseline is right now. That's cool. Like to hold the line. But if they had said that in 1940, that they were going to hold the line but if they had said that in 1940 that they were going to hold the line we wouldn't be doing a third of the things that we're doing now hunting and fishing is that much

better now than it was in 1940 and we've learned a lot since then right like we're better at it so that's where the struggle with me becomes because some people are so offended by the idea of thinking about jaguar recovery but then it's like you're saying he's like how do you decide like when we look at like the landscape and go like what are we striving for here um is it 1962 what is 1862 i don't really know the answer man the opportunity is so so huge because the jaguar issue is an international issue. Yeah. And Mexico is so diverse in wildlife. Like, if we can use the jaguar as a Trojan horse, like our green decoys, to make some serious back and forth with old Mexico, we could have a lot, a lot of positive effects on our side

of the border as well yeah i get what you're saying like the apex thing where if you're looking at connectivity for jaguars there's a real trickle down yeah absolutely trickle down benefits i i like ryan's point another'd make, though, about things like this, that it always is kind of interesting to me that we stipulate these time points as like reference conditions, and we want to return, it like return to that time or that reference state, you know? Yeah.

And it kind of, I think it kind of ignores how, to some extent, the way population dynamics work. I mean, those sorts of things, the spatial distributions of animals and plants are always in flux. So to try to take some static point and make it that that's going to be the benchmark seems a little misdirected to me well yeah i mean i think it becomes especially misdirected when you

look at people like climate change the rewilding movement of people who when they set their clock they set their clock to the pleistocene holocene transition to the point where they were like, well, let's repopulate North America with camels, horses, the African lion, because that's the closest approximation to the American lion that we had, and bring in pachyderms, elephants to try to replicate the... I mean, I look at that, and I think it's silly. But I look at someone saying that we should recover Jaguars. It doesn't feel silly. Like, I don't know how to find the date, and I don't know that it is a date thing.

Right, yeah. To me, it's more of a plausibility. I would err on the side of them being able to habitate where they're capable of habitating, I guess. Suitable habitat. Yeah. But, like, the reference condition thing, maybe I got skin in the game.

Like if that was applied to turkeys, I wouldn't have shot the king. King! That's a good point, man. If you said we're going to set things back to 1974, you just lost every turkey hunter in Michigan. And well, definitely every turkey hunter here. Because there were zero turkeys at that point.

So I'm saying, toying with dates, you're right. That's a good point. Toying with dates is dangerous. Whatever the hell 1962 came from, I don't know. And the myriad of conditions, right? It's like, well, this is the one thing. And that's just never the case that I don't know. And the myriad of conditions, right? And it's like, well, this is the one thing. And that's just never the case that I'm aware of. But if you've ever seen a photo of a jaguar standing on the snow, I would pay a lot of money to see that for real life. I just think it's like,

it's the biggest, baddest thing in the Western hemisphere. That's the opportunity, right? That's the dream. Yeah. That's still, like, we can actually reach that, which I think is pretty awesome. Yeah, I would like to get them up to the point where there's a tag draw. Yeah.

Oh, now we see your decoy. You're like, oh, we need more jaguars. You guys are missing the point. You guys are missing the point, the big dream here. More predators eat more game animals. The less game animals are out there, the less hunters we need. Less opportunity. That's right.

Fine. Land Tawny was telling us this thing about jaguars earlier in the green room. That's right. Secret plot. Less hunting through predation. What's the point of having that gun? There's nothing to shoot. Jaguars got them all.

No, but it is. it's like you're asking for something tricky. And I realized that it's like the thing, like the thing that I'm asking for and the thing that I'm sort of after in life is hard for a lot of people to understand because, because you look at it and you'd be like, oh, you know, we want Mount, we want mountain lions. We want huntable numbers of mountain lions and opening people's access to the resource and you look at something like jaguars and i think a lot of hunters would be like why would i want to invite the competition why would we want to have another animal on the landscape that consumes game but i would just look at it as like sort of increasing just the like increasing the the species abundance.

It's biodiversity, man. That's what you're talking about. I'm curious. I don't know this, so maybe some other people here don't either, but how long would you have to go back before it was a common occurrence to see them in the U.S.? I think if you went back to the 1950s, it wasn't onesies't just onesies. It wasn't onesies, twosies.

If you go back to the 1800s, were they like, you'd see one a week? No, very, I don't know if you'd see one a week, but they were very definitely here and probably in much wider distribution. Yeah. And what you want too, right?

Like some of the best advocates for mountain lions are mountain lion hunters. Yeah. So, you know, at some point you can hunt them like Jaguars, right? Like you could have like the Jaguar unlimited or whatever, you know? I mean, maybe not on the Jaguar foundation, but you know, but really, I mean, you know, I mean, that's like, that's the way this thing works. Jaguar limited. Sure. But that's the, we've talked about that a lot. And that's the hard part for people to understand is like the people that wound up really pushing to get the mountain lion thing right

was mountain lion hunters. Absolutely. They're like, we want them here. We want huntable numbers here. We don't want this to go away. We're going to ensure our access to the resource, and we're going to guarantee the resource in perpetuity. And they kind of drew up what the plan would look like.

And they have a ton of respect for those animals. Yeah. Like nobody knows them better than those lion hunters. Jaguar hunters. and they kind of drew up what the plan would look like. And they have a ton of respect for those animals. Like nobody knows them better than those lion hunters. It's like that Monty Python bit. I love animals. That's why I like to shoot them. Here's a good one for you guys. How big is a spot?

Meaning, you take someone out to a spot. Oh, this is a good one. When you, okay, you, okay. Yeah. Right? You take someone. I want to talk about this. You take someone.

Listen, it's a great one. I recently just had a buddy who took someone to a spot and then just recently found out that they just hunted one crick over. Cricker, yeah. Cricker, crick. Listen, I was there. It's a crick. There was tires all over the place, man.

It's like, yeah, if like we said, like Patrick or Manis, if there's a tire in it, it's a crick. It's a crick. It's a crick. Like if you, I know Callahan recently said to me that a lot of times I'd rather someone just didn't, I'd rather not go with someone somewhere. Were you telling me this or was this Remy telling me this? No, I think this was me. I'd rather not have somebody take me someplace. Yeah, that was you.

Because it might be a freaking sweet place, and in a few years I might discover it on my own, and now I have to cross it off the map because somebody showed it to me. Yeah, it's like, don't even show me because I'll eventually find it, and when I find it, I'm going to dominate it. Or if he gets drunk and slips up and tells you where it is, it's fair game. Yeah. So like, don't take me there, but would you like to go get a beer? So what about the rule? What about the rule? Like if you don't take anybody else there,

you can go there by yourself. Like, is that different? That does exist. Yeah. I use that. Yeah. So, okay. So, so that's what I want to get to here. We're talking about the buffer zone. Yeah, like, okay, so let's say that here's a table, and this table is whatever we want to imagine it as. This table could be, it's a mile wide, it's 10 miles wide, it's an 80-acre state game area. And someone takes you and you explore that over there,

and then you say, like, hey, we're going to have a great day. We shoot some ducks. And you're like, listen, I don't want you to go back to my spot. What does that mean? You don't ever actually say that, do you? Yes. Yeah. But you establish that before you go to the spot.

You shouldn't even have to say it. It would be like, it's very understood. It's the great unsaid. Right, it's very understood. I feel like you're hunting with the wrong dudes. If at the end of the day, you're like, love you, brother. That was awesome. High five, by the way.

You know you can't come back here, right? Yeah. Well, no, I don't think you put it that way. I think you put it like, you're like, you know what, man, it's a sweet little spot. It's kind of, it can get burned out pretty bad. Um, I'd love to hunt it again, but we should just be really careful. We should be real careful and not kind of blow it up. Cause it's not good for anybody when you blow it up, we should just sit tight on it. Oh, if you put it like that, I'd be right back in there the next day. You should have told me not to go back in there, dude.

You're like... I asked Yanni for some turkey hunting. I just got to remember to kind of hunt it gentle. I asked Yanni for some turkey hunting spots recently, and it's like thousands of acres of national forest where I was headed to. And I said, Yanni, is there any spots? And it's thousands of acres, and he goes, Yanni, is there any spots in this thousands of acres? And he goes, and it's between two towns.

And he goes, well somewhere between these two towns you'll find something. And when I first read the text I wrote back like, thanks man, you're such a good friend. And then I got there, I'm like, oh yeah, oh yeah. Somewhere between the two towns, which means the entire national forest. Thanks Yanni.

And what happened when you went there to my spot? I found turkeys right away. Right in between the two towns where you said they'd be. Listen, I had a situation where I would hunt this spot for turkeys here in Idaho. Just to help out my actual question, get tighter. There's no turkeys in Idaho. And it is a a singular spot and we would hunt this spot and i'd always ask about this other place that you can see that means though i want you to really because i because i wanted

to get so people so people can understand yeah people ask about this there's a road and the road forks and we would always go to the right fork, and I would always ask about the left fork. And it was said that I do not hunt over there, but I know there's birds over there. Okay, now I'm getting a clear picture. So now the next season, everybody's schedule's all jazzed up. I'm like, hey, are we hunting opening morning?

Nope, I can't hunt opening morning i already made commitments to go over here and i was like all right well is it cool if i go try that left fork it's like yep have at it i brought somebody from work under like i was like hey boo now yeah oh yeah yeah you're getting the right fork and he's like you ever go down there and you're like no but i know there's birds down there and it was immediately apparent that this was a very poor decision. And then it was then hammered home upon me for, let's say, a decade that that was a very poor decision and to just basically stay the fuck out of this county.

Gotcha. By going, who's that poet? It was like you. Comes with a fork in the road. Two roads diverge in the woods. Yeah. Comes with a fork in the road. Two roads diverge in the woods. Yeah, two roads diverge in the woods. And Ryan Callahan took me.

Ryan Callahan killed the bird. And the right fork man was mad that you went to the left fork or that you took someone to the left fork? Took someone to the left fork. He's like, you don't, he's like you don't he's like but do not ever and i'm gonna go ahead and remind you this for every turkey season in perpetuity from here on out take anybody else anywhere near here meaning this i'm holding my hands very wide apart. This region of the world. I'm like, well, Turkey's eight hours north of here, so I guess I'll go there.

Yeah, it's really hard. There's no way to explain it. Spot dynamics. I mean, probably the best way to avoid hurt feelings is just get very explicit. You get out the map, and you circle, and you go,

if I take, well, at first you have to agree ahead of time. It's like, I'm about to put a circle on the map. And if I, I'm not going to tell you where the circle's going to be, but if you really want to go hunting with me in my spot, then you won't go inside this circle without me. Yeah. It's almost like friendships. It's so weird. That you just frickin.

You're like, the circle is going to roughly resemble the outline of the state of Montana. It's like friendships would be, there's some things that are awkward, but it would really be helpful in friendships. Like if someone took you to a spot and then you're driving home, you're like, by God, would I like to go back there again? If you could just be like,

you know, you just took me to a spot, it's great. I'm sitting here really kind of plotting and figuring about like what i could get away with before you felt that i screwed you would you mind telling me like like can we get out the map and talk about your feelings should you see me here, your feelings should you see me with my buddy. You could draw up one of those heat maps. Like what exactly are we talking about here? You know the heat maps where it goes from like blue to blaze red?

Yeah, and everybody's like, if I saw you here, I'd be curious, not mad, curious. Are you a blaze pink or a blaze orange? Tell me. So it's like a hunting prenup. Yeah. If I saw you here, I'd be really pissed. It should be like a layer that you could download in Onyx. It should be.

That would be great. That is a good Onyx piece, man. That is a thing like a buffer zone app, part of the app or whatever. I'd be like, that layer is going to cost you $250, but I strongly suggest you download it. We had a guy just recently write in a thing, you're commenting about OnX, you remind me. He wrote in, you know when you're reading history books about, you know, like, explorers? And you're dying to kind of know, like, where they went and how their route, like if you're reading about John Coulter and where he went in his big walkabout.

He opens, when he's reading history, Western history, he opens up on X. So he can get a better sense of, like, well, they went through this pass, and they went down that river, and he can get a better sense of like, well, they went through this pass, and they went down that river, and he can kind of follow, and it really brings history alive to be able to see those routes. Oh, yeah, I bet. Finagling through.

Well, Dirt Myth, who's running around here tonight, he's got a great story about he and his brother on a motorcycle trip through Chile, I believe. Cambodia. That's what I said, Cambodia. Starts with a C. They get lost, and he and his bro are talking with some folks

in this tiny little town, village, and they lay a map out. A map of where was it? Cambodia. Someplace in Cambodia. village and they lay a map out a map of where it wasn't cambodia someplace in cambodia and uh they're blown away because they've never seen their area contextualized on a map and they were kind of like we're that close to there yeah yeah the whole puddle was stacked in there, yeah. That was my favorite story about, we went to hunt Doug Duren. We were hunting down in Wisconsin, not on Doug Duren's place, but we were over and hunting with some other dudes, and Doug was kind

of burned up that we'd go all that way and hunt with another crew. And we're hunting this town called Elroy. And Doug's talking about Elroy like it's like, oh my God, over in Elroy, you know, and like Elroy is like this other part of the state. It kind of like, it'd be like people, you know, from Mile City thinking about Bozeman or something, right? It's like, oh my God, those people over there in Elroy and going on and on. And one day we decided to drive over and see Doug. It's like, we drive like a mile down the road and we're at Doug's house hey hey um I need you to help me with this but um I some of the details but uh we haven't talked about the most cynical approach to hunting somebody's spot,

not having them get mad at you because of a technicality, involves Danny, our brother, in Fairbanks, and involves grouse hunting. Yep. We'll leave some of the names out. Leave the names out. Leave the names out. It's my understanding.

There was, my brother was going to take, my brother and his buddy are taking another guy hunting grouse. People are always surprised. You can hunt rough, people hunt rough grouse in Alaska. So they're going to hunt rough grouse. And there's a guy that's kind of a, he's a little bit of a snake in the grass.

And I've seen this firsthand. I've seen this firsthand with him. But they drive to the spot. And all of a sudden, he changes his mind. Once they get to the spot. And doesn't want to hunt anymore. Oh, something came up. Something came up and goes home.

And then he starts hunting that spot. Yeah, The next day they saw his car parked there. Cause he's like, well, you never took me to the spot. Remember we got there, we got there and I had to go home. And then he took it and then made it his spot, which is a low blow. It's like that Seinfeld episode where he's like, no, you owe me dinner, but I only had soup. Doesn't count. Here's one. Why does it seem, this is me thinking this, why does it seem less wrong to slip across someone's fence, say, and pick a morel, than it does to slip across their fence

and kill a deer. You know what I'm saying? Like, there's like a sort of like, if you gotta like duck over onto someone's land real quick, it's kind of like what you're doing feels like it makes it more or less wrong. This is from back when I was younger and we just went wherever we wanted. There's degrees there.

If you slip across the fence and steal his car, it's even worse. Yeah. Exactly, yeah. It's like, you're right. Now that you put it that way, I realize it's just like a value. I went across the fence, came back with his wife. That was a problem. You're right.

It's just a value. It's not like a wildlife thing it's like what was the value of what yeah you go and get a deer is this like a ranella family thing like oh there's a mushroom oh no it came up a couple things oh i'll fight i'll forge the line for morel yeah because my in my mind i feel like a mushroom is ephemeral and so if i see let's just say you look and there's like a beautiful oyster mushroom or like a chicken in the woods and it's just across the line you're driving on a road and it's ephemeral it's not going to be there and it's already been there no one's picked it yet and you just picture it's just going to be there. And it's already been there. No one's picked it yet. And you just picture it

is just going to rot. It just seems different to scoot over and grab it. I would never in a million years cross a fence and go like take game off someone else's property. But I would slip a little ways over perhaps to grab a mushroom. And if we're speaking in the context of now, when we were younger, you're basically saying, well, somebody would notice the deer. And that's why I wouldn't take the deer. Yeah, it's probably a little bit of that thrown in. Yeah.

But I mean, we're speaking. I was just saying that you're weighing the severity of the punishment as you slip or jump or don't. Yeah. Now I don't. Like, I just don't. I've gotten to the point where you sort of have this, like, what's there to lose kind of thing.

Yeah, man, I can't get you to trespass at all anymore i want to um it makes turkey hunting extra tough the good old days. I had, the other day I was hunting with a new turkey hunter, and, you know, first time hunter, and we're hunting, and we were standing on a fence line. We're on National Forest, and I'm explaining how we're trying to bring up birds off, call birds off private property on National Forest. And that's not intuitive for some people.

And I had to be like, this isn't even shady. Like, this isn't like a weird thing. This is just how the world works, man. This is like, if the owner was standing right there, I wouldn't like act like I was doing something else. I mean, this is just like, we're just playing ball, man. We're calling birds off that dude's property. And the reaction of the new hunter was like, what, that fence? That little fence? No, it was, it was, it was more that that was sketchy. Yeah, it was more like, well, the minute their car, like I want to steal that car, the minute they drive off their property, I'll grab it. That's how she felt we were being.

She didn't realize this is just how, and I explained to her, the thing that wound up being an effective thing that I explained to her is I was like, here's the thing. Right now, as residents of this state, we actually own that turkey. That landowner owns access to it and can control access to it, but right now our turkey is over there.

Which is true. Which is true. So we just need to get it back over to the area where we have access to pick our thing that we own up. The thing I want to get into real quick. If we talk about things that a lot of times I like to ask people, like, what's the thing you're most hot on right now, cooking-wise? What's the dish you're most hot on? But I wanted to change it up because there's a couple things that I've heard about that I've been wanting to make, so I'm inviting you, in whatever order, to talk about, like, what is the wild game dish you most want to make but haven't gotten around to yet?

If you need to think about it, I'll start. Please. A guy explained to me recently, you know when you make confit? He said there's a thing called Appalachian. When you make confit, take goose thighs or duck thighs or even beaver thigh and cure it with a dry rub, and then clean the dry rub off, and then you just simmer it in fat until it's tender, just like the same way if you sintered something in water in a crock pot. It'll eventually get tender when you simmer it in fat,

and then you store it in the fat. And he was saying that when he was a kid, his grandpa would make venison meatballs, and then he would cook the meatballs all the way done, or sorry, like sausage, breakfast sausage balls that he'd cook. Venison breakfast sausage. He'd cook all the balls and then he'd get them all done and you pack them in a jar. And then he would pour lard over it and just store it like that. And he called it Appalachian confit and store breakfast sausages. And he said it was the perfect camp food because they're all cooked and you just dredge them out of there, throw them on a pan, reheat them. I've been wanting to make Appalachian confit. And the

other thing I want to make is, have you heard of a duck press? Yeah. Like it's the thing you do where you cook a duck. You cook it away until the meat's perfect, a whole duck. You cook it until the meat's perfect on the breast. And then they'll cut the breast off. So you cut the breast off so they're still rare. And then they cook the duck the rest of the way. And then a duck press is a contraption that just comes down. It's like this giant hand crank on it.

And it squishes that to squeeze every last God forsaken drip of fat and blood and goo and anything that'll ever come out of there, out of there. And that is the sauce with which you serve the duck. That seems pretty damn interesting, man. Yeah. So Appalachian confit and a duck press are two things I'd like to be more involved

with. Mine would be like a redo of something I screwed up a few years ago. I pit roasted a bunch of antelope hams. Like how you do a pit roasted hog? Yep. Dug a hole with a skid steer

and burned cottonwood in it all night and then put that antelope in. I think we wrapped them in tinfoil, the hams, and then put wet, wired, wet burlap rum and buried them.

And I should have known that that was not a good idea because... Because what reason is that not a good idea? Oh, it's just so freaking dry, man. Like there's just no... Oh, yeah.

People were... We had a big party. people were eating it and like if they were inhaled as they were taking a bite they'd like get antelope dust and start choking like they had antelope silicosis it's like i would love to do that again but just lard the shit out of that. Because I think it would be delicious if you did that. You remember we smoked some fish with cottonwood and how metallic it tasted? But I think it's when you put it in the ground. Are you really smoking it or it's more just like a heat source?

Who else would like to share? So I'm in, you talked duck. So I shoot a lot of ducks. Last night, Ryan Buss, he's just sitting right over here. He made this like duck crackling. So like pork, you know, pork. Like chicharrones? Exactly.

Oh. It was absolutely delicious. And so it was something new that I haven't done with duck before. Now this whole press thing, I don't, is there, is it actually a contraption or is it something else that you use? You should go look up duck presses because they're actually really ornate, like brass,

really expensive, antique duck press. I mean, you could also use your truck. But, like two cast iron skillets in a truck. But yeah, like a duck press is a thing,

man. It's like a mechanical thing. But this duck crackling last night was like, it was delicious. So wild duck skin. Absolutely. And they have little teeny pieces, like little teeny pieces. And then putting that on top of something else, you know, like that was, I didn't get to see what you put it on top of. I

just got to see like that little teeny piece. And ever since I had that last night, I can't wait till this next fall. Is that right? Yeah. So eat the duck meat, take the plucked skin, and make cracklings. Absolutely. We took one time a wild pig and made, one thing we did that was interesting is we made our own sausage casings. We took all that big, I don't know, 20 feet of intestine out of there, and you had to turn it inside out and scrape every last square inch of that thing and just scrape it, scrape it, scrape it, scrape it, and eventually get it down to where it's right,

then turn it back inside out and flush it all out, and holy shit, does that make you appreciate. So does it really look like hog gut that you buy? Dude, when we were done with it, when we were done with it, it was no different than any brat you ever had. It was just a labor-intensive process to scrape it down.

When you got it in your hand, it's like an umbilical cord, and you scrape it until it's thin, until it's thin, thin. And it's labor-intensive. I've attempted a lot. But we made the cracklings. Yeah, we made the cracklings. It was really good, but I never thought... I've simulated it a lot.

I'm not ready to drop this. I never thought to try it with... I'm not wanting to let that quite stand the way we... Speaking of all those topics that we've sort of covered numerous times and he's going to let them be. Yeah, this seems like... Yeah, he's always trying to make me look like a eunuch on stage. No, I, no.

It's to my benefit, I realize, and I like you to go your own path in life, it's to my great benefit that you did not have children because you have that much more love to pour upon my kids. Absolutely. I texted you about this the other day, and I was telling you right now in front of everybody that I was very grateful. I was watching videos of you with my kids and just the wonderful dynamic that you've created with them

of just being very much like on equal ground with them in conversation no no i'm not no no you take this the wrong way i'm not dogging on it i'm expressing it the wrong way there's a way that people they got a way they talk to kids and the way they act with kids and it's nice when someone can just be with them yeah and like hang out with them and not be like you know. Relate to them intellectually. No, just like kids listen. I'm right there with you. You know what I'm talking about. Kids pick up on that shit. Yeah.

There's adults that kids just don't want to hang with and whatever and it's because they talk to them in some weird way as opposed to just getting. Oh yeah, they overdo it. I'm the crazy man you know like yeah like oh it's crazy uncle madigan what's this i pulled your nose off look it's between my fingers you know like he's wearing a turkey suit let me get my turkey suit on

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Anyway, I'd like to eat some turkey liver pate, is what I was going to say to you. Yanni just made so you're, we could do this because your thing that you'd like to make, Yanni made it. Oh yeah.

So we could make Yanni. I want to make, Ben's already made. We're making up from that whole spot thing. Turkey cordon bleu. Oh yeah. You're always talking about that shit. Turkey cordon bleu. I got a problem though.

You make wild turkey cordon bleu. I do. I've been thinking I wanted to make that. I got it. It's delicious. I got a big problem though. And I wild turkey cordon bleu? I do. I've been thinking I wanted to make that. It's delicious. I got a big problem, though, and I feel like it's easily solved. But what I do is take wild game, and then I put non-wild game inside the wild game and roll it up. Is that an issue? I feel guilty.

Yeah, you need to get some wild boar ham. Maybe like a deer ham or axis deer ham and cut it real thin. You can do that. It's normally, isn't it normally ham? It'sar ham. Maybe like a deer ham or axis deer ham and cut it real thin. You can do that. It's normally, isn't it normally ham? It's normally ham. Like pork ham. Yeah, that's what I put in it because my kid likes it and my wife likes it. But then I feel guilty.

But I think it's a weight thing. Any smoked salty ham would probably work. When you're eating deer burger that you cut in with 10% pork fat, it's still deer burger that you cut in with 10% pork fat, it's still deer burger. Now, if it was 50% pork, then I'm like, is it wild game or not? I don't know. It's something different now. But 10% I regard as wild game.

If you wait out the turkey and the ham, it's still wild game. It only becomes, I don't know at what point, I think maybe around 40%, 50% that it becomes like you can't tell if it's wild game anymore. Yeah. I felt that you might chide me for this because I was over at your house one time when you weren't there. And your kids were... Was his wife there? His wife was there, yeah.

We were eating dinner. The whole family was eating dinner together. And we were... This is my boss here we were eating dinner and they there was a chicken item in the dinner oh they do that to me and your and your child little Rosie looked at me and goes don't tell dad I was like don't tell dad what. And she just like held the chicken up. So I felt that you might chide me in the way that you would chide them for eating chicken.

No, no, I'm into the cordon bleu deal. It's so funny because I thought about making it and I had the same reluctance and you've made it. Oh, that's good. But like, what about, I i had the same reluctance yeah you've made it that's good ham but like what about i honestly had the same thought but what about like a another option be like some thinly sliced uh smoked bear ham oh and we'll do that yanni and i are gonna kill a bear i call it cordon bruin there you go i like it i like it you know what i'm gonna cook this year for the first time ever oh yeah, yeah. You haven't gone yet.

Real jacked about it. It's just going to be a thick, simple steak, little salt and pepper, a little olive oil, maybe char up a lemon on the grill. Okay. Pitch that on top. And it's going to be bighorn sheep as soon as this Montana draw comes out. You're feeling good about your 0.07% chance of pulling that tag? I was super panicked at the office and then we were at the deadline and I hadn't put any thought into it. So I just kind of shotgunned in some numbers into

the system and paid my money. And for some reason I'm feeling really good about it. Did you do, if you did a U-Tag, if you did a Bighorn U-Tag, you have reason to be optimistic. I'd be pumped. Did you do a U-Tag? I think, I don't, like I said, man, it was just like, I'm in. Yeah, I couldn't figure out where you were going with that. I was like, I do that kind of like every day. So you want to have a steak with some salt?

It'd be like if you were talking about sexual positions and Ryan's like, yeah, there's this one I want to try where the man gets on top and the woman is laying on her back. Okay, Yanni, go ahead. Go ahead. You sound like a man who's been around. Okay, Yanni, go ahead. Go ahead. I win. You sound like a man who's been around. We need to... Go ahead, Yanni.

We need to move on to seeing through the bullshit. Oh, that kind of go ahead. No, no, go on with the thing you want to make. Oh, you already did it. Cordon Bleu. Cordon Bleu. And you want to make the liver, but we just had the turkey liver pate.

Can you walk through Jacques Pepin... Can you walk through your Jacques Pepin liver recipe? Again. Does he have egg yolk in there? No. No? No egg? What do you mean?

When you say that again, you've already done it? Yes, I did it last year, too. Oh. Yep. It was good. Just hit them real fast. You take a turkey liver. Take a turkey liver.

Take a turkey liver. I usually soak it in uh cold water for a few days rinse out the water a bunch it's every time you do that it seems to be some blood that's leaving the turkey liver i trim it up i found that they weigh the recipes for a half pound of livers the turkey liver is usually coming in at right about five ounces so you're just over half of what the recipe calls for by just half the recipe and then you uh bring it up to temp with i think like maybe a half a cup of water there's a bay leaf in there maybe like a pinch of thyme it's real simple there's not much else in there you bring it up to temp as soon as it boils you cover it you turn it off you let it sit for like two or

three minutes you just barely want to cook it um you take it out of there you take it all out of the water you take the Bailey file you put it into a food processor this is like a food processor oh yeah more generally you're just talking dirty to me right now man and you got like basically seasoned liver mush at that point and then i believe for that even halved you go with i want to say it's 10 or 12 tablespoons of butter so at that point again yeah you're kind of you're threading that line but it's so good man is it wild game anymore but yeah you drop them in two tablespoons at a time. You keep going.

And then I think the last thing is like a tablespoon of cognac, brandy, whiskey, whatever you want. Season it with salt and pepper. Put it into a ramekin, cover it, and throw it in the fridge overnight. And the next day you have pate. Oh, it's good. It's good. There, the butter, like the wild game or not thing it's wild game because when you taste it it's like it's turkey liver man yeah it's like a

really good turkey liver yeah and it's also like it's just cool to be able to use the turkey's liver yeah because i think the vast majority turkey livers that come out of turkeys out of wild turkeys in this country are not getting turned into pate or anything else for that matter. No, they're getting turned into magpie or crow poop. I cubed up a turkey liver, like dressed a turkey, cubed up a turkey liver, put it on skewers, salt, pepper, olive oil,

put it over charcoal, and by anyone's account, overcooked it. And that liver was absolutely phenomenal. Oh, you liked it? Yeah, this was a week ago. And I have no idea what happened to that liver during that process, but it was very, very good. Good deal.

Yeah. I'm glad. There was a little creek wash in there, too. Add that to your recipe. Wash at the creek. Yanni, how are we going to determine who's going to come up to play? See them through the bullshit? Yeah.

Should we talk about what they get to win when they come up? Yeah. So, see them through the bullshit is our collaboration with Vortex Optics. That's right. Because they help you see through the bullshit is our collaboration with Vortex Optics. That's right. Because they help you see through the bullshit. Tell them what they're going to win. You may or may not know, Vortex just came out with a revised version of a laser range finder. The new one is called the Razor HD 4000, and it is a bad mofo.

1,000 yards and I believe, I can't quite remember which, I think out to 1,000 you can get up to the, it reads in tenth of a yard increments. Exactly what that's for, like I don't dial my scope to the tenth of a yard, but there might be some people out there that do. That's how precise this thing is.

Top of the eye or bottom of the eye? He's 138 and one tenths yards. All the modes you could ever want. It's super easy to use. Very intuitive piece of equipment. I've ranged a bunch of trees where this turkey that I'm

trying to kill is supposed to walk by, and it's been great for that. I haven't ranged the turkey himself yet, but it's common. So how I'm going to pick the person who's going to get to play is I'm going to have Land give me some numbers, and now I've broken the room kind of into some sections, so can I just go for it and get our person up here? Okay. Did Land already pick his numbers?

No, no. Right now I'm going gonna ask Land to pick a number between one and six. Three. Three okay so we got the seats broken up in sort of sections so one two three section three someone between here and the back row back there. Now pick a number between 1 and 18. 15. 15. So 15 rows back from right here. Okay now a number between 1 and 12. 7. And 7's it. Bring them up. Alright. Oh! Does everybody feel good about that? We're real worried you guys will be like, that's rigged. That's his buddy. We know that guy.

I don't know. This guy's coming up here pretty cocky. It's Giannis' wife. Are you kidding me? Are you kidding me? Oh, no. Yeah, buddy. All right. Come on up.

Okay, so here's how the game works. The game works where we're going to... You guys going to have a big reunion? He's on the board. Oh, he's on the board? North American board. Okay. We're going to tell you,

no help from the audience whatsoever, man. We've had audiences blow our game a bunch. And don't leave after this. We've got more things we've got to take care of. We're going to tell you three things, three stories. One of the stories is true. Okay? You've got to identify the true story.

To win the prize. You win the prize. We'll probably give it. Well, no, let's just wait. Okay? You got to identify the true story. To win the prize. You win the prize. We'll probably give it. Well, no, let's just wait. But maybe first, what's your name, young man? Yeah. Eddie Nickens.

Eddie Nickens? Oh. The writer? Oh, the writer Eddie Nickens. No shit. We never met. Really? This isn't gonna work.

We can't have like a writer. Alright, we'll try it anyway. This is the worst. I could tell you three stories. Oh man, this is never going to work. Go ahead, Yanni, you go first. You want me to go to my story first? Yeah.

All right, Eddie. The government of Sweden may have accidentally just created the next best hunting dog. They, to make a better service dog using, what is it called, CRISPR technology? CRISPR. CRISPR technology decided to splice in some raccoon genes because raccoons are known for the dexterity into a small feist dog to make a dog that could actually use its paws a little better maybe actually open up doors to and open them up to help people get through doors right well Louisiana kennel gets word of this he's

like well service dogs whatever, I'm thinking of hunting applications you know, a dog that could climb trees, pull squirrels off of limbs, run them out of holes, hunt other arboreal animals, I'm gonna try to import them. He's having issues because he has fish and wildlife, he's like no no no you can't import these genetically modified pets. That's the story? That's the story. Okay. Or GMPs.

GMPs. They're calling them. Everyone knows that after Joseph Smith, the founder of the Mormon church, was killed by a mob, hung by a mob that most of his followers followed Brigham Young who took his followers to Zion very few people know that there was actually a power struggle upon Joseph Smith's death and another man with the strange name of James Jesse Strange took some number of followers up to Lake Michigan where they took to pirating. And he would later die in a shootout next to a wood pile on a dock

on Beaver Island in Lake Michigan. Matt? All right, Eddie. I'm so enthralled that the rule is only one of these can be true. Only one. And now that these two jokers are done, I'm going to spit some truth at you.

So, uh... Look him in the eyes, Eddie. Look him right in the eyes. Puff that beard out. So this group of researchers have been, they do like range grass improvement, and they research, and they've been kicking around in the Eurasian steppe, and they found this biotype of orchard grass,

which is a really good pasture grass that's been imported in the U.S. It's used a lot in food plots for deer. And they found this really productive biotype that they want to import into the U.S. And they want to use it in seed mixes and pastures and in food plots. But they had to run through a bunch of APHIS stuff, a bunch of APHIS testing. Well, I'm just trying to get my facts straight, people.

They have to run, so APHIS. Yeah. Plant Health Inspection Service, the regulatory body that governs these introductions, they had to do a bunch of testing first, and they were doing some feeding trials with captive deer, and they found that this biotype causes lethargy in cervids. It was a biotype. Yeah, it causes lethargy in cervids which is it's a biotype yeah it causes lethargy in cervids which is a fancy way of saying it causes deer to be sleepy so now like fish and game in wisconsin

a couple other states are all up in arms and they don't want to be released because these they have this video at this aphIS facility, these deer like walking around with their heads down in a stupor. There's one laying out in the middle of a field in the middle of the frickin' day. And they think it's going to make hunting too easy. Another way to end hunting. So let's get a recap. Yeah, give us a quick recap, Ryan. You got your sleepy deer seed product

going to be available at the Big R near you. You got the first legal battle of its type with a genetically modified pet turned hopeful squirrel dog and you have a religious offshoot woodpile demise. Do you want to use the audience to help you? No. No, he can't. He's Eddie Nickens. He don't need anything. And only one can be true. Unfortunately. Yeah. I'm from the south, proud to say. So North Carolina, right? So I'm not real big on the Mormon knowledge is kind of thin. I'm ruling that out. Welcome to Idaho. Yeah, yeah. I'm intrigued by the biotype story. And I'm going to have to go with that because I think, you know, from the south, if I was going to cross a raccoon with a dog,

I'd be more interested in that forked penis than I would be in its tree climbing ability. So I got no choice but to go with the one that's really I think is a lie too, but it's gonna be number three over here. Sleeper deer story. For the first time ever, we have someone not pick the truth. No, that's happened before. It has? James Jesse Strange. I messed a couple parts up. He was accused of pirating, and it wasn't a shootout.

He was executed. That's right. But that's what threw me. Oh. You know the story, but you know that I... Get him, Eddie. You're a journalist. You're a journalist.

I thought I had all the facts. Well, for playing, Jay, Eddie, you still get a pair of Vortex Rayfinders. Real quick, moving on, moving on. We need to have...

We got something we got to do. It's real important. We need to have... Tell them who's got to come up, Cal. They got a new chapter? Oh, yeah. We had to vote on tell them who's got to come up, Cal. They got a new chapter? Oh, yeah.

We had to vote on new chapters this year. We do every year as a board. And we need a quick review of the Illinois chapter. Seth Trokey. Can you come up? Still in the room. Illinois members. New Illinois members.

Just go ahead and bring your whole chapter up here. Bring the Illinois members up. Still in the room. Illinois members. New Illinois members. He said, just go ahead and bring your whole chapter up here. Bring the Illinois members up. This is the entirety of the Illinois chapter? You're kidding me, really? Wow. Okay. Seth, can you... They're very selective in Illinois.

Do you want to address everyone and say what you got to say there about what you got going on? I just had a quick question for Powell while we're here. This is Powell. Congratulations Well done Congratulations Stay married a long time We got a Chapter, did they make it in? Oh yeah, that was the review

You guys are still in So the only two members of the Illinois chapter Just got engaged On stage here tonight Big congratulations They just told me they're gonna immediately get busy and growing that chapter and we got uh we got a concluder from uh old land tawny okay you got a time for a concluder uh yeah my timer ran out at 99 minutes so we're good now so we got uh we're in id, and so I want to talk about an Idaho son, Ted Trueblood.

You know Ted Trueblood? I don't know the name, but no, unfortunately. So he was an editor of Field and Stream. Oh, okay. So he's a very revered person here in Idaho, and it's somebody that we've named an award after. And actually, Anthony Licata, who's here, has won that award. Anthony Licata, scream your scream your name yeah there you go why are you here tonight then there was like Hal Heron what we do is since he

was like this is it how are you in here how sleeping but like we made this award after Ted Trubel because he was this great writer, and like, it was filled with stream. We give this award out to the greatest communicator in the world for conservation, the person that's like doing the most. And Steve Rinella, we're giving you this award tonight. Absolutely, right here.

Yeah, brother. Hey, man. Thank you very much. This is a great honor. Well played. People got engaged. We got an award. You know, I don't know if I have a speech, man. Try to make a quick speech. I really don't. I've been, yeah, it's been a real blessing to start out, and I had a set of things that I wanted to talk about, and started to talk about them in magazines and books,

and have just been able to, as media has changed and matured, or the opposite of matured, have been fortunate enough to continue talking about a set of ideas and watching my own thoughts about them evolve over time. And it's been nice to, you know, wind up in a situation where I take something that's very fun and funny and full of love and full of great people. And also something that I know brings positive things to the world and brings positive things to other people. And to mix that all up into like, you know,

material, written material or things that you communicate that convey, that I try to like help people realize that they love the things that they love. I grew up, you know, we grew up with all the things that we didn't recognize that we loved them. There's all these things we liked, and we just felt that they fell from outer space, and it was like we were glad they were there, but didn't give a whole lot of thought to how they came to be there. Didn't give a lot of thought to like

thanking that they are there, ensuring that they're there for future people. And that's just a feeling that grew over time. And so I've been able to like work that into my work. And if nothing else, I'd like to encourage, hopefully encourage people to love to be outdoors and to hunt and fish, to recognize that what we're talking about is that you love these things. You need to treat them like something you love. So to have the opportunity to do that again and again through time and then be, get some recognition for it from you guys. It's really special.

So thank you very much, man. Yeah. Thank you. And thank you again for everybody that came out tonight. Thank you everybody. Have a good night. Thank you, everybody. Have a good night. Thank you.

Thank you. Hey folks, exciting news for those who live or hunt in Canada. You might not be able to join our raffles and sweepstakes and all that because of raffle and sweepstakes law, but hear this. On-axe hunt is now in Canada. it is now at your fingertips you canadians the great features that you love and on x are available for your hunts this season now the hunt app is a fully functioning gps with hunting maps that include public and crown land hunting zones aerial imagery 24k, 24K topo maps, waypoints and tracking. You can even use offline maps to see where you are without cell phone service as a special offer. You can get a free three months to try out OnX if you visit onxmaps.com slash meet.