The MeatEater Podcast - Ep. 201: What Exactly Is the Problem?

Episode Date: December 30, 2019

Steven Rinella talks with Kylee Archer, Samantha Bates, Maggie Smith, Tracy Crane, Brody Henderson, Kevin Harlander, and Janis Putelis. Topics discussed: Brody's elk and trout-infested house is for sale; Kevin's hog-fattening business; Pfeilstorch, which is German for a stork with an arrow stuck in it; crying after butchering; bring the scope to your eye and not the other way around; Cal's bowel movements; how to be a good hunting mentor; hot tips on making jerky; and more. Connect with Steve and MeatEaterSteve on Instagram and TwitterMeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and YoutubeShop MeatEater Merch Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Download the Hunt app from the iTunes or Google Play Store. Know where you stand with OnX. Alright, let's probably... I know Yanni's going to want to do it this way. Yanni's going to want to start with introductions. He's always worried about getting his credit, I think. We'll start with Yanni.

No, I've told you why I'm worried about it. I'm worried about it really... Because your dad gets confused. Seriously, yeah. He really vicariously. Because your dad gets confused. He really appreciates that. Like 30 minutes in, he's like, okay, I know who's talking. He likes that. So for Giannis Sr.,

as though dealing poker, Brody. Brody Henderson? A little more. A little more? Meat Eater Sr. Editor. That's what I Brody Henderson. A little more. A little more. Meat eater senior editor. That's what I'm talking about. A little more. A little headache this morning.

Oh, Brody's selling his house. Everybody needs a house. Tell them about your house, Brody. Oh, great fishing property. Dude, you want to talk about. Great hunting. Yeah, he's got red fox in his yard. He can hunt elk basically in his backyard.

He can walk down the hill and fish giant northerns and catch crayfish and trout. What else? How many waypoints does the property come with? Like in surrounding public land? It depends how much you want to pay for the place, I guess. Oh, yeah.

Tell them where it is. It's south of Steamboat Springs. Off the grid. Yes, but not like Unboat Springs. Off the grid. Yes, but not like that conjures an image. Unabomber off the grid. It's like there's an actual neighborhood with actual houses and you know.

So just the annoying parts of being off the grid. Yeah. Solar. It's not bad. No, but for the people that want to feel like they're living in the mountains, but then have the... Oh, you're in the mountains, man. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I got a 40,000 acre wilderness area half a mile from my house.

Yeah, but you also have a lot of the conveniences that modern day people like to have around. It's the best of both worlds, ladies and gentlemen. I'd say all the conveniences, yeah. Give me your Zillow deal. Everybody can look up your Zestimate. Man, I don't know if I want... Yeah, I agree. It's for sale.

All right. No, no, don't tell them. I don't care. Don't sell your house. Just look up... Rich Pounder was trying to sell his car on this program, and I think he got a good offer. 31440 Shoshone Way, Stagecoach, Colorado. 314 what?

31440 Shoshone Way. Stagecoach, Colorado. 3-1 what? 3-1-4-4-0 Shoshone Way. Sam's out of here. Let's look at some pictures, though. Sam's quitting. She's going to go buy Brody's house. Spring?

That's right. It'll come up. Don't do it. I mean, come on. It's like asking somebody how many acres they have and how many cows they got on it.

I learned that was a major faux pas the other week, but you're the one who started this conversation. I haven't looked up Brody's estimate. That's it. Brody, should we edit all this out, or do you think you want to keep it

in there for the selling? Keep it in there. Maybe it'll sell faster. Brody, I think your asking price is a little low. I agree. Jeez, Brody, that is a really phenomenal deal. I mean, that's a buyer's market. We're looking to sell fast.

That's a buyer's market right there. I hope you don't have a broker because you just basically took over the broker's job. Well, that's alright as long as it sells. She'll still get her commission, right? Okay, moving along. We have the hog farmer, Kevin Harlander her commission, right? Okay, moving along. We have the hog farmer, Kevin Harlander.

That's right, Kevin from First Light. Glad to be here. What's your hog business called? Is there a name? No name. Harlander Hogs? No, we don't really have a name. How many did you do this year?

We did four. We're going to do like 30 next year, though. Oh, I've been telling people you were just going incremental. No, we're going to go big. You're going whole hog? Oh, yeah. We're partnering with some folks back there. It's going to be awesome. You're doing 30 hogs next year?. Oh, I've been telling people you were just going incremental. No, we're going to go big. You're going whole hog? Oh yeah. We're partnering with some folks back there. It's going to be awesome.

You're doing 30 hogs next year? I think so, yeah. Bringing in partners. Oh yeah. We're getting serious. So then you need a name and you need to brand it. Highlander Hogs.

Yeah, I can help with that. Yeah, we can do that I guess. We should brand it probably. I like this kind of this like sort of under the table friends and family you know we could do 30 I think at some point under the table

with selling meat it's not going to be no but friends and family you know so it's sort of like off sale so to speak if I was with the USDA I'd be looking up your situation right now man yep I probably would be too very tasty hog I've been really enjoying my half.

Yeah, you guys been eating on it a little bit? Dude, yeah. But it's like, you got to spread it out, man. Yeah. Yeah, it's a treat. Dude, it's like, because if you eat a lot of lean game meat and you get into one of them pork chops, the first bite is like, my God, is that good. Yeah, exactly.

We probably, we mix it up. We eat a lot of elk at our house. Well, I've been grinding mine. I've been grinding my fat and whatnot into my beer burger. That's kind of the main thing I wanted. Yeah. But then, you know, I didn't do that. I haven't eaten any of it.

I just froze it. I froze it. Nice, yeah. But we got another pig. We got a pig, the fat, a little bit of fat off a pig called Beans the Pig. Yep. Pork and beans. Well, you guys got beans, yeah.

Beans the hog. So I did some burger with Beans the Hog,. So I did some burger with beans the hog, and I did some burger with, what was the name of the one I bought from you? Pork. You don't name them. Oh, it was pork and beans. Oh, it's weird we had two pigs named beans. So 30.

I think so. You got that many friends? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Plenty of people in Eastern Oregon. You know what a question I kept wanting to ask ask you i didn't know the answer to it is um are you you know how uh um trigonosis has been eliminated from i mean you know for all intents and purposes has been eliminated from uh closed system pork right are you how how cocky are you about eating harlander hogs rare

yeah we eat them probably medium rare i'm pretty confident in that yeah so you don't feel they've been eating all kind of bear meat and rats no because they're they're in a controlled environment still you know they're pasture raised but that pasture's clean for sure and then they're getting that um grain in in the form of barley um so. So the stuff that they're eating is basically pasture-grazed, like hogs and then a little bit of barley. And that's the barley that comes from making beer, right? Yeah, same barley, but it's different. It's two-row barley, which that's what they make into beer. And then there's different kinds of barley that's made for animal feed and other kinds of things too. Oh, have I been lying when I've been telling people that you were getting some kind of

byproduct of beer production? Yeah, yeah, that's true. Oh, I wasn't lying. Yeah, that's right. When we worked at the brewery. 50 people that. Yeah, yeah. And that's actually a nice filler and it's good grain too.

But it is a different kind of barley between beer and stuff that they're putting back into feed. In my first book, I wrote about a guy that, an old neighbor of mine in Miles City, Montana, that used to fatten hogs on horse meat. Yeah. And he said that they would take the horses into the hog pen and shoot them. And then he would do all the skinning cuts on the horse and tie it's head to a post and pull the hide with a tractor because you could sell the hides for, I don't know, three, four bucks.

And then he said a couple of days later, you need to go in there and throw all the bones out of there because the hogs start to crush those, and they'd gag on the bone shards. And he said he never wanted to send them to market with a belly full of horse flesh. So he said he would finish them on barley, because he was always scared of what they'd think if they opened them up and they had meat in them. And he said that their condition would deteriorate on barley. He said their tail would lose some of the—it had a real nice, tight corkscrew. Interesting. And he said that corkscrew

would start to loosen and he said the luster on their fur would start to fade when he put them on barley. And that's how he knew though that it was time to take them to market. And this guy too would he was telling me they used to raise in the 30s they would raise turkeys

and they would send, they would raise turkeys for Thanksgiving and all their tur they would raise turkeys. And they would send, they would raise turkeys for Thanksgiving. And all their turkeys would go to Minneapolis. Okay. And to keep the turkeys from rotting, they'd send them in barrels. And you didn't want to make any gutting cuts on the turkey. Because you just, it allows bacteria to get in there. Yeah, yeah.

They would, before it came time to slaughter them, they would stop feeding the turkeys for a couple days and just give them water. Because they wanted their whole digestive system to flush. And then you could kill them, pluck them, and put them in barrels, and they wouldn't rot because no one had opened up the gutting cavity on them. No kidding. Yeah. Huh. He had a lot of, I've told this story a thousand times, but his, they would jack up a truck and use the, and pull a tire off and use it to drive a belt to cut.

Can I tell you what he had? Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know about his thumb? Didn't you tell, didn't you? I tell the story all the time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, every week. Cut his thumb off and his brother flicked it into the hog pen.

That's right. Yeah. So he'd come over and he'd do stuff but he'd always have to instead of pinching it between his finger and his thumb he'd always pinch everything between his finger and what would be like the meat at the base yeah thumb he could peel he could peel sweetbreads like that that's crazy yeah pinching it like that man this is working hand he had a wife named Agnes. Nice. When he died, somehow my brother inherited cases of Slim Fast that were in his garage. Ew. And my brother would walk around.

That was like whenever he went hunting, he'd just fill his backpack full of Slim Fast. No. Just go away. Hey, that's a good idea for a white elephant gift for next year. Just like a pallet of Slim Fast. A dead man of Slim Fast. A dead man's Slim Fast. We were out hunting one time and our buddy Pooter

was there and Matt was drinking all the Slim Fast and I remember Pooter saying, man, you're going to be nothing but skin and bones if you keep living on Slim Fast. Maggie. Hello. Maggie. Hello. Maggie's got a mechanic suit on.

Maggie looks awesome. I think you look great, Maggie. I agree. I commented. So cute. Thank you. Anything else? That doesn't take away from the fact that it's a mechanic suit.

I don't know what to say about it. I just like it. How did you find that mechanic suit um from Madewell yeah I bought it new yeah it's Madewell and Dickies did a collab so that women can have good-looking but like also you know durable clothing so yeah it's great thank you I like it too did you have to pay full price for it? No, I got it on Black Friday. I've been stocking. If they had half a brain

that'd get a hold of you, Maggie Smith, they'd get a hold of you and send you a stack of those suits. That's my old team. Please do, Madewell. Yeah.

Maggie's got a mechanic suit. Phil, he's just, you know. He's down there with his switchboard. Wow. Go on, Phil. Nothing.

I thought you were commenting on my, you were disappointed by my shirt since it's not as, you know. Phil just looks like everybody else. He's got a t-shirt on. No zippy suits. Phil the engineer. I think Phil's going to start skateboarding this year because of that haircut. I was going to say, it's getting a little punk rock.

I like it. It gets like that, then he gets a haircut. I've got one scheduled for Monday. Darn. I wanted to see how far we could take this. I don't mean this to be offensive, but it kind of has got the Justin Bieber, young Justin Bieber look to it. Yeah, the swing. The swing.

This is my hair for all of high school. Yeah. Oh, man. You must have been real popular. With the ladies. No. Because the intros are taking so long. I just want to interrupt the intros and say that what we're doing is we have four. No, no. You're going to go hardcore long I just want to interrupt the intros

And say that what we're doing Is we have four No, no, you're going to go Hardcore I just want to tease I want to tease what's to come We have four Brand new

Brand new successful First time big game hunters So we're here to talk about That set of experiences Go ahead, Yanni I actually was just going to say Yes, we should hurry up With the introductions.

So I'll just say good morning and pass on my turn. Well, we have four newsy tidbits to hit, too. Yeah. Sam? Hi, I'm Sam. Give a little more. Oh, I sit upstairs in production in a corner. It's pretty dark.

But I love it up there because people leave me alone. All right. Good deal. Here you go. I'm Kylie. This is Kylie's first time on the show. Yep. Sitting next to Phil.

Phil very lucky to be with Phil in that little corner there. Kylie's one of our brand new first time big game hunters. Yep. First time successful big game hunter. Yep. Yep. And then like a game hunter. Yep. Yep. And then like a regular Tracy. A regular?

A regular hunter now? No, you've been on the show how many times? It's only my second time on the show. Oh, look into your mic. Better? Yeah. Well, I'm glad I'm a regular, but it's only my second time on the show, but now I guess I'm a regular hunter too.

Yep. And you've been on our television program. That is true. So if you watch, if you go into our season eight on Netflix and watch, I can't remember what it's called. Turkey Trouble. Turkey Trouble. Yeah, the names of the shows are, man. And there were a lot of troubles.

That's an accurate name. I'm never real pleased with the names of the television programs. Great episode, though. Great episode. Horrible title. If you go look up, you'll see both Maggie and Tracy. And Maggie's been on the show. This show a couple times, and the television program.

Okay, that's introductions. Now we've got to talk about a couple things. Have you guys ever heard... My brother sent this to me this morning. If you guys ever heard... It's a German word. Feilstorch. Are you sure you're saying that?

No, I'm not sure I'm saying it right. Who hears Harlander? That's not German. Oh, yeah. Oh, it is? Oh, yeah. What do you think about that word? I don't know.

Don't speak German. It sounds German for air. You're blowing the whole deal. What do you want to do on pronunciation? Feilstorch. Yeah, I think that P is definitely silent, right? Or creates the P. Yeah, it's not P pronunciation? Pfeilstorch. Yeah, I think that P is definitely silent, right? Or creates the Pfe. Yeah, it's not Pfe.

Yeah. Pfeilstorch. My dad, I taught those four too, but his distaste for the Germans never waned after fighting in World War II. When demonstrating why he disliked Germans so much, he learned how to say I love you in a bunch of different languages. And he'd say it and he'd always put like a little regional flair on all the different languages, how you say I love you. Then he'd get to prove his point about Germans, he would get to how they like to say it,

which is, he'd be like, ak libydik. He goes, even I love you sounds horrible. To be fair, I'm half Polish. Oh, good. Yeah, he liked Poles. He thought you guys drank too much and liked accordions too much.

Big fan. Polka. So a file stork is a thing called an arrow stork. I'm going to throw in there real quick. I think that the CH on the end, I haven't even looked at it. I'm guessing there's a CH on the end. Yes, sir. I'm guessing it's going to be a K sound.

File stork. Yeah. Okay, that's good because it translates to arrow stork. And my brother sent this to me, and I'm like, that can't be true. But then we had a big back and forth, and he proved out the veracity of it. There's a thing called an arrow stork, and it's a name in Germany given to storks that were injured by arrows in Africa. And before people understood migrations, there was all these theories about where this species of stork went. And people had ideas that it went and lived in the water.

It went to the bottom of the ocean. No matter where it went and lived in the water. It went to the bottom of the ocean. No matter where it went. But over the years, 25 of these storks were found alive carrying arrows from African hunters. Wow. Wow. And there's a picture on Wikipedia, which is doing a very aggressive fundraiser right now. P-F-E-I-L-S-T-O-R-C-H. right now pf i saw that pf e i l s t o r c h and you'll see a uh it's sitting this specimen is sitting it was found in 1822 and it's uh mounted somewhere they got it on display but

it's sitting there and it's like a it's mounted but it's a bird carrying around this crazy arrow stuck in his neck and over the, 25 of these turned up, and it started to help explain migrations. Isn't that wild? That is insane. Enough of them to have their own name. There it is right there. Did you dig in deep enough to know?

Oh, it says Central Africa. Yeah. Wow. 25 of them. And that one, you can tell the dude was shooting at it flying overhead. Yeah. Because the arrow like enters, you know, kind of like enters its, basically enters its throat and emerges, you know, kind of below its chin or at the base of its head. But you're assuming that the taxidermist put it back

to get it the exact way it was found. Well, no, I'm not assuming that, in fact. You're not? I don't think that that bird was standing on the ground when it got an arrow like that. Oh! Yeah. Feeding? No, you're right. You're right. You're right. I'm just saying. The arrow could be upside down

from the way it was found. We don't know. Someone put it in there. We don't know. Hold on. You're suggesting. Someone put it in there. He's suggesting maybe that the taxidermist took the arrow out, forgot how it was in there, and put it back in the wrong way.

Or a different way. What year do you think this happened? I know what year it happened. It happened in 1822. Okay. So the bird was found or killed somehow, and it had this arrow in it. Then it had to travel and make it to a taxidermist, right? He wasn't the guy that just happened to be standing there,

and the thing falls out of the sky, and he's like, oh, my God, look at this, right? Okay. So I'm just saying that some things could have happened in travel, transport, where he got this thing, and they're like, yeah, we found this bird, had an arrow stuck in its neck. Can you taxidermy it for us? So you think that the archer was in a hot air balloon and shot it? Like the angle, you know, could have been different.

No. It's hard to say. I agree with you that the bird could have been with its neck down eating. I mean, it would have been nice if we could have seen all 25 and see where all those arrows were in those birds. It'd be interesting to see. When we retire, maybe we make that, you know, Larry Todd had that whole retirement thing

he did up in the mountains, the anthropologist. Yes. Yeah. Well, maybe this will be like when we retire, we'll pick this up. We'll call it the- Get on it, guys. The file stork. The file stork studies.

Another quick thing. Brody, you go with your quick thing. Oh, I'll hit another one real quick. They just found two. This is great. They unearthed two infants that were buried more than 2,000 years ago wearing helmets made from the skulls of older children. Ooh. And the way the bones were held together, they feel that this flesh, that the skin and flesh on the older children's head was still intact when they made the helmets for the young kids.

That's some Cormac McCarthy shit right there, man. Oh, that's up your alley. Oh, yeah. That's so far up my alley I can feel it tickling my tonsils. Any conclusion to why they did that? No one,

nothing I read is taking a stab at it. We always joke like everything in anthropology you see something weird you're like must have been ceremonial

but on this I would be like that has to have been some yeah yeah that's very bizarre dude

that's hardcore unless the kids were skateboarders they're very near a half pipe uh you go Brody you want me to talk about the yeah yeah um the asshole of the year award yes i i'm not even gonna call him a gentleman um but uh

a uh and yeah you can't call him a hunter either, apparently. This guy shot a giant bear, black bear, in Minnesota at a garbage dump on an Indian reservation. Trespassing. That he trespassed to get into. And then, of course, went on to brag about his kills, a 700-pound bear. Cut its head off. Didn't take all the meat. Cut the paws off. Put on Instagram that I got it done last night.

Got it done last night. Absolute giant, over 700 pounds. So he's, like, obviously posing himself as a hunter. He wants people to think he's a hunter. But he's got a long list. I mean, the dude's like a career poacher. Yeah, career poacher and career criminal outside of poaching. Wow.

So how is he allowed to... That's just so weird. Like, he got in trouble. He's a felon. He's bow hunting. Not that all. I mean, hardly. But he's bow hunting.

Well, bows are quiet. He's a felon. So one time he got in trouble for having a gun because he's not supposed to have a gun. And then he gets caught with a gun, and it's his girlfriend's ex-boyfriend's gun. And that's kind of the most interesting character to emerge out of this article. The girlfriend's ex-boyfriend? Yeah. That's like...

I'll tell you about why I think he's the most interesting character to emerge out of the article. I can see if you and your girlfriend break up that like, whatever, you left some books, some underwear. Like, how is it you leave your 30-06 over there? You leave your 30-06 over there and never go get it. Maybe she wouldn't let him come get it. Maybe she took it from him. Why was it at her house? Who knows? You got to think that the people, these characters that we're talking about, right?

Like the circles that they run in that they got. Maybe he just forgot all about his 30-06. That could be as plausible as anything. Or he just couldn't get close to her. Yeah. The girl with the boy with the boy. Yeah. It's like, you know what? boiling yeah so go on

about this guy well I mean like we said he's just done everything wrong and the thing that strikes me about

this kind of article when they pop up is you always see it like hunter like they call the guy

a hunter and they shouldn't be calling the guy a hunter right they should be calling him calling the guy a hunter, right? They should be calling him a criminal or a poacher. Douchebag would work, too. Yeah, whatever. Yeah, that's the thing that I don't like about it is be like, hunters, and then people are like, oh, those hunters.

But then you look, like, who did the enforcement on the investigation to get in trouble? He's getting in trouble. Like, he's in violation of game laws. Yeah, a couple federal. Like, game wardens. The federal charges, I don't think we're even involved with the actual hunting part of it. That'll be taken care of later. What did he get charged with?

Yeah. Okay. He transported wildlife in violation of tribal law, and he trespassed on Indian land to hunt. So those are the federal charges. State charges will come later. It's amazing the way people a lot so many poachers um can't they still have to go on to social media they can't help them so it's like but that's the whole thing

is for yeah I agree I feel like it's part of the intention or the motivation is the celebration game wardens down in Kentucky like why all of this right they were talking about like rings and families of You know poachers poacher gangs, and it's like so I'm thinking like well. There must be like money involved, right? That's why you would do all this and risk getting in trouble and lose your hunting rights because like in the end you're selling a trophy head for $30,000 No, it's pure back bragging rights Yeah, but you'd think word would have gotten out by now that that's how you're gonna get caught trophy head for $30,000. No, it's pure bragging rights. Yeah, but you'd think Word would have gotten out by now

that that's how you're going to get caught. You know? I don't even think Word needs to get out. That's just common sense. Anyway. Again, the types of people that we're talking about here. Yeah, I know.

How do you resolve that situation? Somebody who has a track record like that, who continues to have the same thing happen over and over and over again, how do you resolve that? I would say punish them harder because, you know, a lot of these people just aren't getting the book thrown at them. Right. I'd send them out to Harlander Hogs. Slop some hog stables for a while. Work every day. Tie them up to the hog fence.

No, no, Steve was thinking it. Eat them. Yeah, I got it. I was at a game warden conference one time, and I was talking to a warden who was there to present on a was there to present on a theory he had about what he was calling like super violators where he feels that 90 of poaching um is being done by 10 of poachers and he had a he had this he was presenting this kind of like composite view of, this composite view of the most rampant poachers. And they're, you know, obviously like, it was like white males.

I can't remember the age bracket. 40 to 55. Kind of like what their worldview is, what their political view is. And he feels, he was talking about that there's sociopathy and sociopathy and people who are like particularly sociopathic, um, it manifests in certain ways. And he was saying what the super poachers that they don't brag about it. These are guys where you catch them and then you go to their house and they have

like a pole barn that has you know 80 deer racks laying in it in disarray and it's this kind of like and the way he described it's like they're sticking it to the they're they're sticking it to the man they're sticking it to society these are things that people value i have all them and i'm sure there's a part of it that's especially with an instance like that where they're doing it in a repeated manner and not getting caught, that's got to play into the obsession in some way.

He was saying that his argument was that if you really, to be really impactful on poaching, it would be working hard to identify these, and he talked about these areas where you have the same way you hear people figuring out there there's a serial killer where you have these clusters of crimes that seem similar and at some point someone will look and be like why are there six unsolved murders kind

of around a particular train station over the course of 10 years and they all have a thing and so his what he was working on was looking at these places where there is like this area where for 20 years there's like headless deer in ditches. Wow. You know? And then realizing that

a thing starts to make sense. The heads were all cut off the same way. Right? It's typically happening around whatever circumstances. And like I said, he was there, he was presenting this whole deal.

That's super interesting. I'm going to save my other thing. It has to do with the guy cutting his finger off and then keeping it in a jar of rum. Did I save that now? Kind of just told it, didn't I? A little bit.

A guy rode in, him and his buddy, they were messing around with the airplane's landing gear and his finger come off. How? It just got cut off by the landing gear. And he keeps it in rum and now and then people come over, they'll get to drinking and they'll like to have a little shot of rum

out of that jar. No. Do they know that they're having a shot of rum out of the jar with a finger in it? He says sometimes they're unsuspecting. Does he say which finger? No, he just says a finger. He says it was a violent mishap

with some airplane landing gear. He wanted to get it reattached. They couldn't do it. He says the moral of the story is if you lose your finger hang on to it they make great conversation starters flavors up your rum makes a nice cocktail makes a nice cocktail okay uh okay when talking so people a lot of times people write in they want hot hunting tips the hottest hunting tip is the work here, right?

Because you guys all got a job here and everybody's... And that's what everybody comments on social media. It's already a demand in the larger meat eater community. You guys got your first deer. Didn't Maggie... Maggie, you and Tracy got your first deer the same night. I think so. Which I think is so ironic, considering we went on our first turkey hunt together.

Yeah. And then what date... So I want to go in order who got their deer first. I think so. Which I think is so ironic, considering we went on our first turkey hunt together. Yeah. And then what date? So I want to go in order who got their deer first. Sam, did you get yours first? Last? No, I got mine, no, third. Yeah.

Because I got mine the Tuesday after they got theirs. I think that Maggie got hers earlier in the day. She did, yeah. That's correct. Because we had already gotten the photo of Maggie's and Steve's response was, well, let me send back a picture of yours. We go one on one.

Did not like the idea that perhaps the thought could be that we were unsuccessful. I didn't even know Joe was doing this. Joe was more excited about sharing the photo. He was just sending it to everybody. I talked with Joe about this last night, and he expressed that he was wondering what was, you know, like when someone's not shooting.

Yes. Oh. He kept, he was like, he was telling the story kind of like where he was wondering, like, what exactly is the problem? You want me to go into that? Yeah. I mean,

first, uh, retouch, we talked about this with Turkey, but just give people a quick crash course in your, like how you became interested

in getting a deer. Um, well, obviously not getting a turkey. And then I was on the podcast with you guys where we did like a recap and you were kind of gave me a little bit of guff yeah um but no joe approached me and asked if i had an interest and i did have interest i mean why not and uh so i decided to

go yeah i don't know there's not really a backstory to it yeah it's kind of talking about joe farigno joe farinato do you feel that he wanted to take you because he had filled his tag and wasn't done hunting yet? Maybe. No way. No way. Wait, but did his... No, I'm just kidding. Did his fiance get a deer?

Yes. Oh, she had. She had filled hers. Oh, okay. So Joe's like, he's like, I got to find someone. That is... I need a warm body with a deer tag. No, Joe was actually out there hunting too.

We were going to stay another night. Oh, so he was still hunting. Yeah, yeah. He was still hunting. But we'd ended up not staying another night. The conditions were just horrible out there. Oh, you know what just occurred to me? Kevin, did you?

Yeah. You had a first time hunting this year. Yeah, I did. Yep. My girlfriend Celia killed her first buck with a bow time hunting this year. Yeah, I did. Yep. My girlfriend Celia killed her first buck with a bow. Nice.

Nice. Her first buck with a bow? Yeah, first animal ever. With a bow? Yeah. Wow. Yeah, that's pretty awesome. So why isn't she here?

Yeah. We love you. Man, yeah, I wasn't even thinking about that. Yeah, I know. We should have brought her on. But yeah, she had a great hunt, too.

That was fun. We did that back in eastern Oregon. She practiced for well over a year with a bow and arrow and got it done on the final hour. Got it done. Got it done on the final, final hour, the 11th hour. Really? Yeah. Nice.

It was awesome. That's super cool. Nice. You kind of hunted your ass off this year. Yeah, a little bit. I took some time, for sure. We got actually, let's see, we got three elk in our office, I think. Two bighorns.

Yeah, we got two bighorns. A doll sheep. Doll sheep. What else? Yeah, we had a good year in the office, for sure. But, yeah, I got some time out there. We just got off a whitetail tour with a few folks, which is pretty cool. Yeah, two dudes that work at First Light drew

bighorn tags. Sitting next to each other, no less, in the office. No way. Look at that. Yeah. And they were hunting like I pretty much... Can you imagine me and Yanni all of a sudden drew bighorn tags sitting next to each other? That really puts it into perspective for me. Yeah, we never hear the end of it. Yeah, these guys haven't either. And they both

filled them too, which is pretty... The hunt that Paul and Nate both went on was incredibly difficult. Yeah, that's not like a gimme. No, no. It's in the Frank Church, and it was the real deal. So, yeah. That's pretty exciting. And then Bridget at first light got a doll sheep.

She shot a doll sheep up in the Northwest Territories. And we're still rolling, Ross. Our VP of sales and marketing has an elk tag still to fill with a muzzleloader. So we're going out Sunday. Oh, really? Yeah. It's going to be difficult, though. We've got a lot of snow.

Those elk are still pretty high. Do you guys do any work over there ever? No. Try not to. No. Try not to. Try not to. Yeah, we had a good year.

So there's a lot of success in the office, for sure. Does your girlfriend like eating that deer? Yeah. She cut it in with the Harlander hog? Yeah, we actually did. A friend of ours made this stuff called Landjager. You ever heard of that? It's like a pressed sausage, but they smoke it.

Landjager, land hunter. Yeah. So I guess it's like this old German sort of processed sausage that they press and then smoke and you eat it like jerky. That's really good. We did that with something. Oh, that's cool. I don't imagine you've ever heard of Jägermeister. I have heard of it. Not a fan. Not a fan.

That means hunt master. It does. I wish they made it. It should have made it taste better. I told someone that the other night that didn't. No, like, Jäger's just meant for kids to drink, but when you're drinking it, you don't feel like you're drinking

a kid's drink. No. That's gross. I don't think grown-ups drink Jäger. Oh, definitely. I have been at the Murray

and Place Dowd-Livingston where people at, like, 3 p.m., grown adults are ordering Jäger shots. That sounds like for kids. No, absolutely not. It's like when you

want to hit it hard. You want to feel that burn as it goes down. When we used you want to hit it hard. You want to feel that burn as it goes down. When we used to want to hit it hard, like if you went to the bar and you felt like you had to catch up with everybody because they were already kind of wasted. Oh, yeah. We'd order Long Island iced tea.

Oh, yeah. Hold on a minute. I'll be more fun in about five seconds. Okay, Maggie, so there you were. You were shamed turkey hunting. Yes. And you got an invite from Joe Farinato. Yep.

He's had little quick cameos here. Yeah, yeah. And I was excited to go out with Joe and his fiance. It was fun to have a woman out there with me. Why? Why? Why? Who cares? I don't know. Just like the conversation.

She made me comfortable. It was just like. You guys talk about different stuff than what we talk about? Yeah. Totally. I think Joe. She wouldn't be like, so you got a mechanic suit. Yeah.

No, she would be like, oh, that's a really nice style. You look so cute. Yeah. Yeah. I think Joe kind of zoned out half the time because her and I were just chat, chat, chat, chat, chat, chat, chat. And then he'd be like, shh. We're trying to sneak up on this deer. Yeah.

No, but we spotted the deer at like 9.30 in the morning. And by 11.30, he was on the ground. Dang. 11.30 in the morning. Yeah. Well, tell me. I need to know a little more on that. Oh, my heart.

I feel like we should teach Maggie how to tell a story like I'm trying to think of how I mean not that I like how you're doing it but I'm trying to think

of how like what would how that conversation normally went it took two hours and it's done so there I was did you gut him

I was did you gut him I did gut him we're getting way we're getting way okay go ahead Brody pursue your line of questioning I just want it was you know Did you gut him? There I was. Did you gut him? I did gut him. How was that? We're getting way, way. Okay, go ahead, Brody. Pursue your line of questioning.

It was your first time doing that? I told Joe from the very beginning, I think there's a lot of things you can't control going into a hunt. I've learned that from the turkey situation, both from your experience and then my personal experience. And there's little you can control. But communication was one thing that Joe was like, this is something that we can control and have dialed. And that made me feel very comfortable. What does that mean?

I don't know. We talked a lot about my feelings going into it and wanting to be ethical with how I went about things. And I don't know. It was just very open dialogue, and that made me feel very comfortable going into the situation. I think that's a really interesting and good point.

And also I feel like you guys had good dialogue at every step along the journey. Every step. He kept turning around and being like, are you comfortable right now? Is this okay? Like, you know? Sounds a little different than Steve's tactics. Did Joe use the word communication? Not necessarily,

no. I'm using that word. Can you talk about word communication? Not necessarily, no. I'm using that word. Can you talk about your communication? Let's listen. At least you know what I was getting myself into the second time. But to me, that was important. I don't know, have that open dialogue. I don't know Joe. Joe wasn't like... You guys were camped out.

Yeah. Okay. And when you went up to find... what were you doing when you found the deer? What was I doing? What do you mean? How did I react when I saw him? No, no, no. Go ahead, Janice. Like when you first spotted the deer in the distance.

First spotted him. Yeah. Like what was going on? Like were you guys just walking and someone goes, oh, look at that. We were just walking and Joe was showing me how to not like, when you come up to like a little like crest in a ridge, how you don't want to like silhouette yourself. Oh, wow. And he was like. Joe just went up a couple of notches in my book.

Yeah, he was demonstrating that. And as he was demonstrating it, he was like, oh, my God, there's a big buck right there. And then it was perfect. What sort of land were you on? Were you on block management, National Forest, BLM? We did a little bit of block management, but then we were in the breaks. So then. You were on BLM.

BLM, yeah. Okay, so go on. So then we spotted him and started tracking him. Way off. Yeah, way off. And you're tracking him. Well, like. Like how far off?

How far away was he? He was 400 yards from us. And you tracked him. Why didn't you just. Because you know where he is. why did you have to track him? Well, like get in a better position. I don't know. Was he following a lady?

He was following a lady. He was moving. They were grazing. Oh, but you weren't tracking him. The term is stalk. Stalking him. Okay. Excuse me.

My lingo. Creeping. You don't cut corn. No, because I'm mostly, if I learned that you guys spotted one and then it got away and then you tracked it down, that's interesting to me. Well, yes. So then we started a stalk. We ended up spooking them somehow.

They took off and just ran. Oh, really? And then we ended up tracking them because Joe could see him bed down way, way, way off in the distance. That's not tracking. That's stalking. Well's then we stocked him again okay what is tracking tracking would be that you are tracking would be that you are looking for signs on the ground prints whatever paw marks in the snow but when you see them you're stalking yeah yeah you wouldn't be you be like, I tracked it with my eyes,

but no one would say that. No one would say that. Okay. Well, then we saw him bed down, and then we. So he spooked and then went and bed down, like a million miles away. Yep. What was your goal as far as the range you wanted to get into? We practiced at 200 yards, but I was like, if we could be closer.

Yeah. I would like to be closer. And you practiced shooting off of or off your pack or? Practiced sitting. Over your knee? Yeah. You did a lot of that? Yeah, but that was not how the shot went down.

Ended up being prone, so that was. But you weren't prepared to take a 200-yard shot off your knee. Probably. I mean, we had practiced that, but this is the second time i held a rifle so i was a little nervous about that i was like we can be closer and i can lay down i'd feel better about that position do you like joe or yannis better wait let's put that on the board you don't have to answer that, Maggie. Just two totally different situations. So then it beds way down, and then you guys started creeping in on it. Well, we saw a little forky, and Joe goes, do you want that little guy?

And I was like, no. You were like trophy hunting at that point. Well, Joe was like, for me, this would be a big deer. And I was like, well, then I want that deer. I want the big deer. And I was like, well, then I want that deer. I want the big deer. Yeah. So. So then what happened?

You guys, how long did it take to creep in on it? Like maybe 40 minutes. Okay. To creep in. And then he was bedded down and he was doing one of those, like, he was so tired sleeping things where he was like sleeping and then he'd jerk awake. Oh, really? Was it warm out? Yeah.

It was warm out. And it was really windy where we were, but he was kind of in this little like. Got out of the wind. Yeah, got out of the wind, bedded down. He was sleeping. He was sleeping so hard. Joe was like, he's huge. Joe's like seven or almost six, seven.

Yeah, I would say around there, six, five. Joe? Big guy. So I'm calling Joe Frigno. Yeah. And he was just like so impatient. So he's like moving around, like standing up, sitting. And he's like, I just want to get in a better spot.

And the deer did not care at all. It was aware of you? I don't think so. But like could see us. I mean, if he was awake, I mean. Oh, I see. Could have totally seen us. Oh, had he perked up.

Yeah. But Joe was just like so impatient moving around. And I was like, you're going to spook him. I was like nervous about that. Did Joe maybe want it to stand up? No, he was trying to get in a better position for me to see, and we kept creeping in. We got into 84 yards. Wow.

So we got in really, really close. And then what happened? And then I moved, and the deer stood up. Joe was like, you spooked him. I could do whatever I wanted to. Yeah, Joe knows how to move like he's one with the earth, man. I wouldn't say it looked like that.

Yeah, no. Yeah, and then he stood up and Joe was like, this is this is it. It's gonna happen. And he stood up and we looked at each other through the scope and Joe leaned in and was like, if you're going to shoot, shoot now. Now is the shooting time.

Yes. So you were like actually, you dialed up your scope and then had a little eye-to-eye contact with the block through the scope? That was like a very like reckoning moment. Did you purposely do that or did it just happen that your scope landed and you're pointing at his head?

Well, I knew where he was when he was sleeping, you know? So like when he stood up, I was felt very prepared as opposed to like turkey hunting, where it was such a surprise. I felt like I was like, not like the turkey doesn't bed down and then stand up.

Like this was a very different scenario. I got to get very comfortable and feel very comfortable. So. Yeah. It's nice when you get time. Yeah. We had like an, I think we sat on him for like an hour, maybe a little longer while he was sleeping.

So all of a sudden, boosh. Yes. Then what happened? Well, then we walked over. Did he just keel over? Yeah. He went down immediately. You got a good hit on him.

Yes. And Joe said the shot could have been more perfect. Nice. Nice work. Yeah. Where did you hit it? Right through the lungs. Okay. And it didn't go anywhere? Mm-mm. He just went right down. He broke his nose.

Hit the ground so hard it broke his nose. Deader than a doornail when he got up there. Yep. Wow. Why do people say that? Why did you just say it? I don't know. Where did it come from? Deader than a doornail. Like, why is a doornail so dead?

Maybe because of the use of alliteration? I don't know. Well, then we're just personifying doornails. That's you. You guys know what an onomatopoeia is? Yes. Yes. Okay, so it went down and then and joe's all excited and i was just

like i don't know it was weird it was a totally different than my reaction to sneaky pete granted i didn't get sneaky pete but i thought it was going to be more of that like adrenaline release and emotion and it was actually more like just a void of emotion really so you didn't you didn't feel emotional no i didn't feel emotional? No, I didn't cry. I just felt very like an out-of-body, almost like a little bit of experience walking up. I just didn't. That's right.

You said that you were like watching yourself. Yeah, that's what it felt like. It was just a very weird experience. I thought it was going to be more like a city scene. You had a near-death experience. You rose out of your body. Yes, and looked down at myself. Yeah, no.

What did you see? What do myself yeah no what did you see what do you mean what did i see so i dead deared me yeah no but walking up i was almost like i didn't know how to like react either but my my instinct was like i feel weird saying this but i like petted him like a dog like i went like right down behind the ears and pet him. And Joe has this really awesome photo. I didn't know he took it in my hands on my heart and I'm like petting him. And I thanked him.

And that was a very powerful moment for me. I didn't end up crying until I processed the meat. Oh, really? I was at Seth's. They did this whole like meat processing party, which I was so grateful for. It's so weird no one told me about this. I knew this. I didn't tell anybody about it. You was at Seth's. They did this whole meat processing party, which I was so grateful for. It's so weird. No one told me about this. I didn't tell anybody about it. You had a big party. Well, they did have a big party.

Is that right? None of us were invited. I wasn't invited either. Really? Big party? There was a lot of people there. Whiskey bottles, music, a bunch of meat. Big party. It looked like a good time from the pictures I saw. It was a good time.

On Instagram. It's fine. You don't say. You know, I must have been having a big party for all my friends that night. Must have been where I was. I didn't know it was going to be a party. I was probably having a big party for all my good friends. Joe and Seth told me they were going to help me process my deer and I show up. There's pizza.

There's beer. There was like three other deer there. Rick Smith was there. Yeah, Rick Smith was there. Oh, I know about this. Yeah. It was good. I wasn't invited though. No one told me about it. Sorry, Steve. Yeah, no, it's good. It's not your fault. Sorry. It wasn't my house. I'll talk to Seth about it.

Kind of. So, you got emotional then. Yeah. It wasn't my house. I'll talk to Seth about it. Kind of. So you got emotional then? Yeah. Like in what way? I like bawled. Really? Yeah.

Like delayed like that? No, like we like brought the meat out. It was all packaged and put it in my car. Joe drove away and I just sat there and cried. No. Yeah. I've never heard of that. What were you feeling?

Like what was, what emotions were you processing? I was finally, I think, processing the emotion because that was like, finally I went full circle, right? It was like the realization of like, I was very grateful, like tears of somewhat joy too. But like, he is now meat in my freezer. And that was like the emotion of taking a life. It was like I actually saw him as food, which was, you know, I'm happy about that too. But that was the, I don't know.

You maybe hadn't had time up to that point to go through that. Maybe because it's a big party of Seths. Yeah, well, and maybe these other women can share this too. Like, I was so worried going into it because of the way Sneaky Pete went down about just, like, getting a shot. I was like, I want to, like i want to like do this right i was like kept telling joe i want this to

be sneaky pete is the uh turkey that uh maggie hunted for four days yeah and uh got very close but did not realize no but i was like i wanted to be clean quick and safe and i was so worried about getting those three things done that I totally forgot about what happens afterwards. Like, I didn't even, like, I knew, like, I was going to have to process and gut and all this. And I was like, minute, though, like, that shot was done and he was on the ground. I had my moment.

I was like, I'm so overwhelmed. Like, what do I do now? And I was, like, so grateful for Joe being there, obviously through the shot, but more so afterwards because I was like, I would have been just at complete loss of what to do. Did you gut it? Yes, I did. I told Joe, I was like, I want to do all of this, like help me, but I want to, I want to cut the butthole. I want to get up in there and to the vitals and have the blood rush over me. Like I, yeah, I was very bloody. They call me bloodydy Marge. That's my nickname.

Does your boyfriend like eating the deer meat? He does. He did not like the heart. I told him I was going to cook that and surprise him and just make him, like, eat it, like, random time. And that bothered him. Does he hunt? No. I mean, he's gotten shotguns, but he's not gotten a hunt yet. Is he enough of a man where he doesn't feel emasculated by his...

Oh, I like to remind him. I'm like, I'm the provider. You see the freezer. And he's like, yeah, right on, great. He's not all jealous of being passive-aggressive. No, that's not in Ed Bow's nature. He had a great way of describing the heart.

Yeah. He said it was like an octopus. Oh, tell him how he felt about eating it. He said it was like an octopus. Like the... Octopus-like. Oh, the springiness? The springiness and just the density. He's like, it's tender, but it's just weird to eat red meat when it has that, like, denseness to it.

And it doesn't have the texture of what you're used to, red meat. Yeah, the grain is not... Yes. It's like... There almost is no grain. There is the grainless. Yeah. And so I think that for him was just like, it's weird.

You know what the grain's like? Is if you look at paper through a magnifying glass, where it's just like a weave. Yeah. That's what the heart. The grain's like, yeah, it's like, you know. I mean, I actually got to, what was cool is like, I got to use the videos that I shot and edited with Danielle

to now do my heart. And I was like, wow, this is so informative. That's great. Did you make any realizations about your work? It was great. I was like, this is very instructive. Phenomenally well done video. So go check it out.

Tell people what videos you found most useful. I did How to Clean a heart 101 with you and danielle yeah and then i made her heart bulgogi recipe fire meat and edbo didn't like it he loved the veggies and he was like you know i'd like the flavor i just need to get used to that and it was the texture thing it was the first or second thing i fed him from the deer. What was first? I made stew. Okay. Nice. Did you guys do the liver? No. I did not do the liver.

Okay. Joe and I had a lot of discussion about this, about when is taking enough meat out the ethical dilemma, right? He's like, when have you taken enough? And debating that. And it was just, he was a big deer. It was a lot. And we did not take the liver. It was very muddy and nasty. What did you end up doing with the hide? You said you kept that, right?

Yep. You did? Packed out the hide. You didn't get it turned into buckskin? Yeah. Like a buckskin mechanic suit. That would be badass. I should. Save up a few hides. My dad saved a bunch of deer hides and his business coat was made out of his own deer hides. Really?

Yeah. That's cool. This is cool. But it was like real 70s. It had the lower pockets and the big belt and shit like that. Oh, that's a nice look. You wouldn't wear it now. Yeah, I would.

I would wear it. It's definitely back in. Gianna says it's like working with a 70s superstar upstairs to me. Superstar. Nice. So what do you do with your hide? I just wanted a throw for the back of the couch. You wanted hair on?

Yeah, I wanted hair on. I advise against it too. They never work out. They don't work out. Why? Because the hair is brittle and it comes... Get it made in the box kit. Is it like fallout? The box kit looks just as cool on the back of the couch. The hair doesn't... They don't take any abuse.

I had that bear rug on my couch. You could use like a blanket. That's 20 years old. If you had a deer hide with the hair on and you look at it funny, the hair comes out. Yeah. Because they got like a hair, not a fur. Yeah. Hollow hairs.

Yeah, totally. And they, people do it. They do it, they do it and like nothing looks better for like, it's kind of like tattoos, right? Nothing looks better

than a brand new tattoo. Nothing looks worse than an old one. It's like, it just doesn't work out. It just doesn't work out. I don't have any tattoos, Steve,

so I don't have So that one doesn't ring true to me either. It just doesn't work. If you get buckskin, it's like the rest of your life, man. You could do something with it whenever.

Giannis did advise me on that. You get gloves. You can get awesome gloves made from buckskin. That would be super cool. That would be really, really cool. You can make some great things. Well, I'll call and change. Yeah, don't get the hair on.

Okay. You can dye the buckskin, so you can do black. You can do black gloves with your deer. Cool. Okay. You can make probably akin, so you can do black. You can do black gloves with your deer. Cool. Okay. You can make probably a couple pairs out of your deer. I'm going to start packing mine next year. I'm making the business coat.

You're making the business coat. By the time I'm 45. Hey, who's that dude? You know that dude? I might just do a collar of hair. Yeah, there you go. Oh, gosh. You know Tim Wells?

Yeah. That's right, yeah. I was talking to him one day, and he had a real nice jacket that was from his own hides. Yeah, I remember that. Hey, folks, exciting news for those who live or hunt in Canada. And boy, my goodness, do we hear from the Canadians whenever we do a raffle or a sweepstakes. And our raffle and sweepstakes law makes it that they can't join our northern brothers get irritated well if you're sick of you know sucking high and titty there

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All right, so then seconds later, Tracy got'all. Alright, so then seconds later, Tracy got a deer. Well, hold on. It wasn't quite. Did we skip over Tracy's pronghorn hunt, or did we talk about that? Oh, should we talk about that or the deer? Oh my goodness. That's true. Oh my goodness. You know what? We're way out of order.

I tried to interrupt earlier, but gosh, sometimes it's difficult to around here. I hadn't thought of that. I'm going to leave it up to, it's difficult to around here. That's a good point. I hadn't thought of that. I'm going to leave it up to, it's going to be like chef's choice. Do you want to talk about a combo of the two? A combo of the two.

Because I think they were both very unique in different ways. Okay, go ahead. Okay. Who do you like better? I knew that question was coming. It is not about better. Is it better to hunt with me or Yanni? It's different. It's different. I would

totally agree with that. It's just different. It's different. That's all I'm going to say. I don't need to make this about me. So talk about your hunts. You and Yanni did a pronghorn hunt. Which was very cool. That was I guess technically my first big game hunt. We hunted in Wyoming the the end of September, I want to say.

Yeah, it was. Interestingly enough, I felt like, I mean, we had had a good amount of practice. So I was starting to feel comfortable shooting, which was, like, hugely important. Like, we practiced two pretty extensive times leading up to the hunt, which kind of gave me a good sense of confidence. Especially coming out of the turkey hunt, I was a little bit, I felt a little insecure about my shooting capabilities, given the fact that I had taken that one shot that didn't work out so perfectly. Very different kinds of shooting, though. Okay, that's fair. But without much experience, they didn't feel different so perfectly. Very different kinds of shooting, though. Okay, that's fair. But without much experience, they didn't feel different in my mind, right?

Like, I just felt like I was still in a situation with a gun with the intention of taking a life, and I wanted to be able to do so effectively, lethally, smoothly, and without any sort of negative outcome. Like, that was the intent. So it didn't feel different, even though, yes, now I understand that they are different shooting. And I feel like the pronghorn hunt was nice because, similar it sounds like to Maggie, like we had time.

We got set up in a situation where we were able to, for like 20 or 25 minutes, stalk two antelope. It was a buck and a doe. Playing grab ass, bad. two antelope. It was a buck and a doe. Plain grab ass, bad. Pretty much, yeah. And the difference, though, is that your antelope was totally unaware of your being there. Completely unaware. Completely unaware.

They bedded down for a little while, and so we were able to, like, and this is where I kind of resonated with your communication comment, because throughout this entire experience, I was, like, asking you asking you like 5 million questions. Well, what happens if this happens? What happens if this happens? Like I felt we had a lot of time to kind of work through a lot of scenarios. I tend to be a little type A controlling. And so I like to play out all the different potential outcomes and know what I'm going to do at every single potential outcome.

And that makes me feel more empowered and comfortable. Give me an example of what you might have asked Janice about. Like, okay, like one of the challenges we had was there was a pivot. So we were hunting in a cornfield and there was a pivot. And the two antelope kind of continued to come in and out of the pivot. Can you explain a pivot just so everybody listening knows exactly what we're dealing with? Sure, sure. So it's farmland.

And so it's how they irrigate. So it's like a big irrigation water pivot with huge tires. And so the antelope were kind of in front and back and forth around the pivot. And so I was very apprehensive about getting set up at a place where I felt comfortable being able to take the shot where the tire wasn't exactly behind me. And then when they went on the other side of the pivot, there was kind of a drop off. So then obviously. The horizon was behind it. That's what you mean by drop off. Horizon.

Like not taking the shot because you can't see enough directly behind it. Can you hold up one sec? When you're flying in an airplane and you look down and you see a square of ground with a circle in the square and the edges of the circle touch the four flat sides of the square, you're looking down at a center pivot. Okay. Just telling people. Oh, cool. That's how they spin it around.

Yeah. But I don't think that was a center pivot, was it? Those are long pivots. I don't think there's a lot of center pivots. Well, no, they'll sometimes make a pivot that only cuts 45 degrees. You don't think those are center pivots. I don't think there's a lot of center pivots. Well, no, they'll sometimes make a pivot that only cuts 45 degrees. You don't think those are center pivots? No. You're saying that instead the whole pivot moves

perfectly. It just moves. It goes like this. That's a wheel line. Oh, good. She's blowing me out of the water on ag here. That's probably a wheel line, right? It's not. Center pivots. Okay, I'll back out. You don't see a out. Center pivots are not. You don't see a lot of center pivots in Montana. Possibly Wyoming since we were in Wyoming.

It's more of those. Line. What do you call them? Line? Well, we always call them wheel lines. Wheel lines. Yeah, because the old versions look like wheels. They're a lot lower, like a wagon wheel.

Like a wagon wheel. Yeah, they're only four feet tall. Edit out all the stuff that makes me look like I don't know what I'm talking about. Phil, do that for me too. Me too. Do that for me too. Make me sound good. Put in me saying something that was cool from another time.

Yeah. You should have said those Yanni comments. And then I saw the farmer come out and cut that corn. Okay, so the pivot. But you used the word pivot. I used the word pivot. It wasn't pivoting. But it's still called a pivot.

Okay, go on. I believe, anyways. I'm not an agriculture expert by any means. Big-ass tires. Yeah, big-ass tires, the horizon. And so I was asking a lot of questions specifically relating to that. In addition to the fact that I was comfortable enough, we were able to set up in prone position, which was my desired position. Like I really, we had been on a couple of antelope the day before,

but it was a seated position. I really wasn't as comfortable shooting, sitting up. Like I still need to work on my shooting, sitting up. There was a major difference in my accuracy between being in prone and being seated. So we were able to lie down. And the other thing that was still kind of a struggle, which also was a struggle a little bit on my deer hunt with you, Steve, is I still haven't mastered being able to like quickly and efficiently get set up on my gun with like total perfect vision in my scope. It takes me a good amount of time to feel comfortable in my scope where I'm like, okay, now I have a lay of the land. Now I feel like I

directly have the view that I need to have and I'm comfortable in it. I can't just hop right on and get it. That's the thing. We point out to people... Go ahead. No, I was going to say that you guys all have been, I don't know, Kylie maybe not so much, but I think you, Maggie and Sam and Tracy have been on very accelerated sort of hunting programs here with us.

And that I've said it before, when you guys all got done with these successful hunts, I'm like, now you got to go back and go hunt squirrels and rabbits for a couple of years. Yeah. Because that's where you get that practice of doing that not shooting one antelope or one deer a year how to define stuff we're always talking about like oh when you go on a hunt man it's like super important breaking your boots or whatever getting

good shape for hill climbing but new hunters a lot of stuff gives them a slip because they can't find it in the scope i can totally relate to that i can relate to that, too. I think you wind up, it's not true when you have it resting on a backpack, but just like freehanding, I think one of the things that makes it easy is I'm looking at it and I bring the scope to my eye. Instead of moving down. I don't really think of myself as losing sight of it. So you're moving your scope instead of moving your eye and body. If I'm just looking at something and I want to look at my scope, I want to look at it. The other day we did a quick little bit of squirrel hunting, and so you're just kind of freehanding. It's like I don't put it up and then look through the scope and then go searching for the thing.

It's like my eye's on it, and the scope just comes to it, and there it is. I see. I'm conforming the scope to where I already know I'm looking. Okay, I'm not. Another good thing people do is they know it's out there, then they get where they're looking through the scope, and then they start this whole search process. Oh, 100%.

Rather than being like, I know my eye needs to be doing like this. Yep, yep. Like this is where it is. Yep. Line that thing up to it. Yep. But that's not how you're doing it. Like when you got to lay it on your backpack,

your eye is going to the scope, not the scope going to your eye. We were on a bipod. Yeah. Which was also awesome and like super stable and really clean setup. So it was a strong level of stability. The Spartan bipod that clicks to your...

Yeah, it was great. I kept it in my pocket. It was easy to put on. That actually ended up being a huge asset for that hunt, especially since when we finally got set up, we were on this little knoll and we had literally a clean look directly at the antelope. The other thing that I think is interesting too, and this was different than the turkey hunt, something that was always on my mind was if you are in a scenario where there's multiple animals, ensuring that you are finding the correct animal was something that was anxiety producing for me.

A little less so on the pronghorn because it was just two and it was very clear you know who the buck was and and which one was the doe less so i had more of that challenge when we went deer hunting together steve because there were there were a lot there were more deer and it was hard for me to like actually find the buck in that group yeah that was like a should have been here yesterday but we were there yesterday. What do you mean? Do you mean... Just deer running all over the place, man. Like bucks being like,

ah, bottom of my mind, the bottom of my mind. Yeah, it was just like, like just going insane. Steve brought his kids on that hunt and obviously Jimmy was super excited about it and Steve said to me afterwards I really wish that maybe I hadn't brought him because he he shouldn't see hunting situations where there's

this many deer and that you don't have to work as hard as you need to work he didn't like the fact that on the on the way out he starts like trying to hit Tracy up for permission for the opening day of youth season. That's well trained, though. I like that. Oh, that's great. Oh, he did so well. That deer was down on the ground

about five seconds. He was angling in on, so next youth season. Yeah, exactly. That's great. That's great. That was hysterical. It was hysterical.

Holy moly, that apple is not falling far. I know. So, how far away was the antelope? Just, I think, a little shy of 300. Really? Wow, Tracy.

Seriously? I wouldn't lie about it. Yeah, but, you know, we had been in the field together practicing, you know, prone position. I think just like a couple days earlier we've been at my house and i think the gong of my house is at like 220 and we had done when we were all doing some practicing together um i had shot one time at 300 and hit the gong so i felt like i had clearly had the ability to do it and the fact that we had been set up for like, what was it? Probably 25, 30 minutes or so. I felt comfortable.

I was able to like take a lot of deep breaths. I was able to like relax into the ground. Oh, proof's in the pudding. You double lunged him. Yeah. It wasn't bad. It wasn't bad. I mean, he didn't even make it to the other side of the tire.

No, it was like, no. Of the pivot. No, but like you'd seen, you you'd almost not just only visualize, but actually bend through physically. Like the scope itself, right? We had it zeroed at 100. And you had hit the gong with the first hash mark at my house, first try a couple days earlier.

And then using the next hash mark down, which we knew was 300. It's like there's really no difference. You're just going to use that second hash mark down, dead center, and you felt comfortable. No, my surprise wasn't that you shouldn't have. It was just like having seen the spot, I didn't realize it was that far away. Oh, I see. Yeah, that's all.

I see. Right. Not shocked that Tracy was able to do that. No, not at all. And also, you're not impulsive. No, we weren't. You're the opposite of impulsive when it comes to shooting. I mean, I'm not saying in life.

I don't know. But when it comes to shooting, you're not like a, like, you're not like just let's get the lead flying and sort it out later kind of person. No, that's not really, no. I'm not comfortable with that. And I even have experience with you that my pace at times can create some frustration. Yes, it does. On your end. But not Yanni.

Like, for example, when we were hunting deer together, I'm set up. I didn't feel, like, perfectly comfortable in that situation because I was sitting up. I was trying to get in a place where— Can we set the mood? Okay, yeah, set the mood. Lay it out, lay it out.

Tracy has a little horse property. Yep. Has some horses. And then has some friendly relations with her neighbors. Yep. And it's a little bit of a patchwork of land ownership. Yep. And we just left her house and went on a little stroll on the neighbor's place.

And it was like unbelievable. Yeah. It was like the night. What was the date? Saturday, November 16th. Just like the night. But I don't think it was just the night though, Steve. I mean, I had been sending you pictures like leading up to it because that one piece of

property like obviously doesn't get really any pressure and the deer are there in high volumes all the time. But it's not. Yeah. There's that. And it wasn't just, but it was the behavior. Okay. And you guys were.

There was a lot of them, but it was like. Whitetail. Yeah. Whitetail. Whitetail. There's a lot of them, but it was like the behavior. Those bucks were just like you think they were leaving, but then you realize they're not. They're just like going over to like check something and coming back and zinging and like, here's one I didn't even know about.

Yeah, totally. And there's another one we didn't know about. Just chaos. Yeah, just like in no sort of concerted movement in any direction. They're just like zigzag and crossing. Tongues hanging out. Yeah, it was just like we just kind of waded into it. And all of a sudden I was like, I still don't know how many little bucks.

Like dinkers, but just bunches of them. Yeah, there were a lot of them. Very true. Couldn't keep them straight. Totally, because the first kind of deer that we tried to get set up on, we then spooked a little bit, and then we moved in a little bit, immediately found another buck, had to move in a little bit more to kind of get some grass out of the way to be able to actually sit and have a clear shot.

I got all three of my kids. True, which added incremental pressure, because from the moment they showed up, Jimmy was like, you're going to break our record, right? You're going to break our record of how quickly we shoot a deer, right? I'm like, I am the wrong girl to break your record. There's a record in the Rinella household? He and I, last

year, this didn't happen, it was this year. So, last year, around Thanksgiving, um, like, yeah, so we were hunting whitetails tails and we went out and we're hunting on an open access area like a black management area and we went and there's a fence there's like a safety zone and there's public hunting on the other side of the fence and we basically got to the fence

and sat down or like back to the fence and had hot chocolate with us and everything it's two in the afternoon and i like rattle like a 20 second rattle session and i know sooner i'm putting him down and he's like here's a buck and i'm and i keep i always laugh about because i was kind of like thinking like shut up kid i'm trying to hunt you know but look and like sure enough here's a buck running at us. You know, we hadn't even done like, like I said, we hadn't even talked about the hot chocolate yet. I mean, it was over and we were done hunting in three minutes.

So that was in his mind, like, that's how you do a deer hunt. So high standards, high expectations. I was like, let's change your perspective. That's not going to happen. But not only do I have, obviously, the pressure of, you know, Steve, because there is pressure when you're not with Steve. I was held back. I was back with my daughter and my little boy. Okay. And you were up with my older boy.

I understand that, but I'm just saying. He was impatient. Absolutely. As Yana said, any ADC was also impatient. But you're like, okay, I want to succeed. There is high expectations. I'm still very new and novice at this. And then you add that all three kids are like, come on, get it, get it.

I was like, no, it's quadrupled. But you were hunting with the flip-flop flasher. Oh, thank God for the flip-flop flasher. Once again, this is the second time the flip-flop flasher has come through for me. And he was real relaxed and was not putting pressure on and was helping me get it set up and get comfortable and not taking the shot if I wasn't comfortable. So I took my first shot. But at one point, I't have to crawl forward oh my gosh I told my kids to stay put so I could crawl forward at one point because I'm like talking to

Seth what's the problem no you didn't say it like that it's like a horror story no no no so it's like I'm I'm like on my god my's like, what is she doing? Of course. I mean, this is just insane. And my six-year-old, like, what is that lady up to? So, and literally I'm like adjusting my gun, and then I hear, what's the problem? And I'm like in my right ear, like behind, what's the problem? What's taking so long? I literally look back.

I'm like, I'm getting comfortable and set up. That's what's taking so long. And you're interrupting that. Go back. Go back to your seat. Leave. And then my first shot, I just still have such, that moment leading up to pulling the trigger is such a overwhelmingly emotional feeling. Leading up to.

It's like the anticipation. It's like, okay, he's clear in my scope. This is the right time to take the shot. But the anticipation of my mind going, what's going to happen? Is it going to be a good enough shot? What's the feeling going to feel like? The angst of not knowing is still something that like really like takes over for me. My brother talks about that.

He thinks that that feeling, that question is what throws him when he throws an archery shot. Oh, interesting. It's like the wanting to know what will happen. Yep. And the question about what will happen is what gets in his head and messes up his system. I 100% experience that same thing. There's no negative you'll suffer. Right, exactly.

Exactly. 100%. It's like, I don't want a negative to happen. I don't want a negative to happen. I don't want a negative to happen. I don't want a negative to happen. A negative! As a result, I think of thinking that your entire body must tense up a little bit, because obviously there's such a connection

between mind and physical body, that I feel like when you're tense like that and you take your shot, I feel like those were the moments practicing where I'd throw to the right or something, because I would feel worked up about like what was going to happen and was I going to make a good shot and then you'd end up throwing it a little bit don't you think that speaks to like the confidence that you're feeling in that moment and like should you not take that shot then because like I like there's definitely those times where it's like I set up for a shot

and I thought that but then when I actually killed my deer yeah I did not have any of those feelings like none of that went through my brain interesting seems like the best shooters are the people that go from a to b to c without getting too far ahead of the line you know they're like compartmentalizing I do this yeah I do this and and when you throw in d and in front of b yeah you know I'm saying Yes. That's a very good way of thinking about it. I try to come up with, for archery, I try to come up with,

mantra's not the right word. It's like a series of steps or like checkpoints. Yeah. And I still, and Mark Kenyon talks a little bit about this too. He's got a little thing

he repeats. Yeah. But then, you just forget to repeat it. Yeah. Well, then you just see there's a 330 bull in front of you and everything goes black. Yeah. You're not like, oh, yeah, here's the part where I, you know.

I anchor here. As it's coming, I'm like, oh, yeah, I'm going to do my little deal. Oh, I'm going to do that deal like nice and slow. And then all of a sudden you pull your bull back and just like you don't do the deal. No, no. But there are shooters that can do the deal and they're the ones that kill giants. Yeah.

I'd like to get better at that because that I feel like in of itself is like a reason why I still feel like nervous and a little bit intimidated. So you touch one off and what happens? It freaking didn't go anywhere. Like my first shot

I was like, you know, after you take your shot you're like, what happened? What happened? How many did I get? Seth is like you didn't touch anything. And that's like top excitement level for Seth.

The first shot I hit diddly shit. I don't know what happened. Then I was like, oh, no. Because I was like, now Steve. And he wasn't that far. He wasn't that far off. How far was he? I can't remember.

He was 200 yards or something. Sub 2, I'd say. Yeah, it's not something. I didn't feel uncomfortable with the distance. Not a chip shot, but not like a way as far off. I think it was like that shot was very close after you had crawled up, and I was like, I got to get going. No, this is not.

You can say that. It was starting to get a little dark. I was starting to play through too much in my crazy head. You know? I thought maybe something had happened and something was wrong with you. Were you rattled afterwards? After that one shot? After the miss.

So I wasn't rattled, but I was like, okay, something is a little amiss here. I need to like recenter and regroup and like get my stuff together before taking this next shot. And he didn't move. The deer did not move. Like he like looked up. He was like, what? No, like I said, they were just out of their minds.

So I was like, okay, well, now I have the same situation. Let me recalibrate everything and get organized and try again. Yeah, I've had it

where you miss and then on that second shot, you're like, okay, now I know what I need to do. Yeah, that's an interesting point.

Totally. Like, you kind of get focused. I had a client that said this, I'll never forget, because he, I think, had like two years in a row killed on his second shot after whiffing the first one. And when he would retell the story,

he would like to remind everybody at the table that, you know, like any hunter, good average hunter can kill on the first shot, but it really takes a great hunter to recompose yourself after a miss and then make a great second shot. I don't know about that. I think so. I mean, there's some truth to that. A little bit of truth to that. But then, so my second shot, I hit him, and he went right down.

The other element that I find I really struggle with, too, and this happened with my antelope hunt, is I have not mastered staying in my scope after the shot to be able to keep a close look at what actually has happened. Like my antelope hunt, I saw, I couldn't tell if it was the buck or the doe that was still in my scope. And I had to like look up and it was Giannis who was like, great shot. He's down. And same with the deer. I'm like, where is he? What happened? Like, I feel like I have not, like, mastered staying in my scope

and being able to fully evaluate kind of what has transpired. On those light recoil rifles, you have a 6.5 Creedmoor. On those light recoil rifles, they tend to kind of settle right back in. I know. There's no reason. Depending on your body posture, they might jump right or left, but if you're square to them, they tend to settle back in, but so few people I don't do it.

I have follow-through because I just know I can shoot fairly accurately, but I lift my head up to see what's going on because I want to see what's going on. It's kind of human nature to come out of that scope. But like really like technical shooters. Will stay in it, right? Yeah.

And they like it. Like real technical shooters serve a mark of their shooting skill and process and positioning is that that thing settles right back where it was. Yeah. Like you should be like, recoil, wham, it drops back down and you're looking at it. Totally. Like, I would love to be able to fine-tune that because I feel like if I were ever in a situation, which I feel like is a common situation, where you're not able to get a shot that is, you know, clean and lethal or, you know, that the animal drops, to be able to be in a situation where you're calm and organized and collected and know exactly where the animal is to be able to take a second shot. That's something that I've thought a lot about, and I'm not sure I would be capable of doing that.

Shooting magnum rifles off of backpacks and bushes and cactuses and whatnot, it just doesn't. I just lift my head up to see what's going on. I want to know what's going on because sometimes you need to know what's going on. Totally. You know what I mean? I had a great buddy, James Nash, that told me when I had a flinch or something like that, when I'd pop up, he said, you got to go shoot 500 rounds for a.22 and just get comfortable with a small caliber rifle.

And then your body sort of mechanically becomes- Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like you train your body. You settle. Exactly. Interesting. So you go shoot ground squirrels or something, you know, or targets with a.22, and there's no impact to your shoulder at all. Yeah.

Yeah, like, military shooters, man, it's all through the scope. Oh, sure. They just look, that's where they're looking, and that's where they stay looking. The other thing I learned, too, or I realized was the, at least for me, the importance of having done some practice in a close time period to actually going out. Because I remember reflecting and thinking about the difference of like, on the antelope hunt, we had had a couple practice days. I was like, okay, it's recent. My capability within this realm is recent.

And we didn't practice before we went out because it wasn't like it was that much time period. But I definitely felt like I was worried about being rusty. So, like, the importance of practice of, like, just getting that comfort level and, like, quieting your mind, I think is hugely beneficial. So, now what happened? You shot again. Well, yeah. The second shot, I hit the deer. The deer went down.

And so, then you came running up with the kids and said okay we gotta go we've gotta you know we've gotta get over there to make sure everything is okay to look at you know we don't know what the current state of the deer is which wasn't really something that i had been thinking about so on that conversation on that walk over i definitely started to become a little bit worked up because i was pretty excited to get over there oh man well i had seen some i had seen some oh i had a reason to believe told me that i had a reason to believe we should probably get over there you never told me that well i told you get over there what did you see i'm curious what did you see that made you feel as though that perhaps

the deer was not dead just the way i mean it's like very just very telltale the way like it hits and then what it does after it goes down i see like any sort of um any sort of like actual concerted effort to get something like any kind of like logical movement like with turkeys right like turkeys assume they just flop yep but all of a sudden you realize that a turkey is kind of like very definitely flopping away from you yeah yeah yeah and you're like that's not good that's like that's not him flopping that's things going wrong you know you know what i'm saying uh-huh yeah so i i don't know i just saw like i felt like we should probably scoot yeah i mean i know what I'm saying? Uh-huh. Yeah. So I don't know. I just saw like I felt like we should probably scoot.

Yeah. I mean, I know what I saw. I mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep. So we scooted over there. It wasn't immediately mortally wounded. Correct.

Yeah. And so that was a whole nother kind of first time experience in the sense of we got over there and the deer was not dead. And that is something. That's very hard for me. That was like I had a moment where I was like, I don't want to do this. I like how my kids immediately start trying to make you feel better. Oh. Like it happens.

Oh, I didn't know that. That's sweet. Totally. It's very sweet. Totally. That's very sweet. Totally. Yeah. All three of them. What happened?

They were not, like, I don't know why, but they were not upset. But I remember which ones were like, oh, don't worry. Both. Both Rosie and Jimmy were like that. I mean, Jimmy was way more like that. That boy is so sensitive and so reflective and so endearing and like so connected he's just so sophisticated for his age that he like I think could read my feelings and emotions and inevitably like gut instinctually is like wanting to make me feel better and to like

to help help um help me understand that this is a common situation but um I definitely had an immediate reaction of like, no, I don't want to do it. I can't do it. I can't do it. Can't do it, Steve. Can't do it. Oh, I remember we had to tell you you have to. We can't legally do it. Yes.

But that was my immediate gut reaction. I was like, I can't. Because you begin to like humanize the situation. You begin to humanize. I don't know how to not do this. You see this magnificent animal lying there, and you immediately start thinking about, is this animal suffering? What have I done to this animal? Now you're up close to it.

It's still alive. It clearly had paralyzed it to some degree. And you make it like a human interaction experience that now you have to be intimately connected with it to take its life. Something in that vein, that something within that vein was kind of the experience that I was feeling. You close enough distance at that point where it becomes very, very real. Very real. And you just, you put yourself in that situation and I don't know, you just think about all these various aspects of it. And Seth had to shoot it again. Seth had me shoot it again. So instead of Steve telling me where to shoot it, because that was not the most productive, Seth was like, just do this.

And I was like, okay. And then I shot him again. While he was laying there? Yes. It's a very raw experience, that part. Yeah. Does your boyfriend like eating that deer?

He freaking loves it. Are you kidding? He's so envious, I think, in so many ways. And he would probably tell you this if you asked him

this question. So not only is he envious of the fact that I've had this magnificent opportunity to learn from like the very best within this space, but he's envious that I've like this magnificent opportunity to learn from like the very best within this space.

But he's envious that I've like pushed myself outside my comfort zone and that I've learned a new skill set and that I've challenged myself. Like he loves those types of experiences in life. And like fundamentally, he loves, especially I think the hunt that we did kind of near our home, like he loves that land so much. Um, and we spend so much time there that the beauty of like being able to connect with an animal that has spent time living on that land and now us being fortunate enough to be able to harvest that animal and not only eat it ourselves, but we shared a little bit of it with our neighbors and just like, they loved it. And,

and, and my neighbor, um, especially, um, uh, the wife is not like typically a big venison fan, um, historically. And she was raving about how delicious it was. And she made some for her grandkids and just, that's something that is like just magnificently special. So will, um, do you guys, do you still call me boyfriend you call me fiance i mean whatever it's all one and the same life partner oh you got a ring yeah i realize that oh yeah um um the guy you're getting married to does he will he initiate will he like come home let's say you're getting married to, does he, will he initiate? Will he like come home?

Let's say you're gone or whatever. Would he come home, like thaw some out? Oh, absolutely. So he's in there. Oh yeah, totally. He,

he said to me like today, he was like, I'm going to take some meat out. I think I'm going to do this with it. I want to make some chili this weekend. Oh, he's super into it. Got it.

Yeah. He loves it. So he'll go dig around the freezer and look what everything says on it. Totally. Well, and, and it was, we haven it. Got it. Yeah, he loves it. So he'll go dig around the freezer and look what everything says on it. Totally. Well, and it was- We haven't ground up, though. No, we need to do that because I'd love to have some ground. But he was very grateful to have the experience with you guys in terms of being a part of butchering and being a part of that whole process versus me coming home and telling him about it.

He enjoyed that a lot. Well, you got to grind your ground up, though. Yeah. I got to do that, too. We do got to grind your ground up, though. Yeah. I got to do that, too. We can have a grind. It's so fast. I run it through. We grind it.

We got a grinder that does like six pounds a minute. No joke. I mean, it just grinds. Oh, my gosh. And then to fill the bags, I put it in a sausage stuffer. And we put it in those poly bags. Okay. It's just like, I used to dread we used to

have a hand crank grinder this is like oh you know i was like yeah gotta grind the meat now it's like wow now it's like it takes longer to clean the grinder than the grinder yeah you know what it's true man the clean you're like the cleanup is more arduous than the actual process it's more like it's like a thing where you got to have some stuff you have to clean up is what it feels like it's very fast we just do it and stuff you have to clean up is what it feels like. It's very fast. We just do it. And then we got the Harlander hog and beans the pig. I still got a little bit of beans. No, I don't have any more beans the pig.

What was, I don't know, beans the pig? It's just a whole story. Wait, is this the Colorado one? Yeah. That's right. I'll tell you what. I had a moment. We're getting ready.

We're with a guy that raised a pig. And we had some camera guys with us. And we're getting ready to kill the pig. And I said, you know, don't film killing the pig. Because it had to be present for the killing of a farm hog. And then I said to him, in fact, set those cameras down on the ground. Yeah, it was good that I did that. That's good. Yeah. That's good.

Killing farm animals is not an easy thing. They're resilient. It's just different. I guess I've never seen one. They just don't have any chances of getting away. Beans almost got away, though. Yeah, I know.

Beans almost got away. Good. Nice job, Tracy yes and then sam proud of you sam was hunting with ocal it was uh that was our second hunt actually how did it come how did it come about that you and ocal became like hunting partners um i i think i just i don't even remember honestly i think what happened was like i approached him and was just like I need a better understanding of like what these guys are doing like I'm sending these guys out you know you all out on these meat eater hunts and I'm helping with the preparations and everything and I was like I just I just want to know I want to know and also I kind of have this goal for myself like every year I want to learn something new what would be can you provide

another example uh last year was mountain biking like learning something new is Can you provide another example? Last year was mountain biking. Learning something new. Is that what you mean? Yeah. And this year was hunting. Also just shooting a gun in general. Do you have your eyeball on next year? Oh, yeah. What is it? Can you share? What I want to do for next year? I think I want to learn how to hunt waterfowl.

Because, man, duck are tasty. Dang right. Okay, so you was, you had to look, okay, go on. Yeah. And you wanted to learn just to understand it because of work. Yeah, exactly. And I mean, it fit into your personal plan. Totally. Yeah. And then I also just, I have this whole like life goal of just kind of like reducing my waste and ideally like providing things more for myself and like, you know, just not having to go to the grocery store as much for me and whatever. So that's been a plan, too. So it was kind of a natural progression.

But then it just kind of happened. Like Cal was like, OK, or like Yanni showed up. He's like, here's a gun. And Cal's like, OK, we're going out this weekend. And I was like, what? OK, fine. I was like, I don't even know how to pack for this type of stuff. So Yanni showed up and here's a gun. Yes. That's how he does it for this type of stuff Maggie showed up and here's a gun

yes that's how he does it that's literally he's like here's a gun and I was like what is this for he's like the bullet comes out this end good luck but like I turned to Maggie Maggie let me all of her first light gear because I was like I don't have anything

I don't even know what to wear. I'm afraid I don't have the right layers. Great plug. So you were out there and borrowed something blue. Exactly. I was happy to share. But that was my first hunt, I should say. My first hunt with Cal, I didn't even, like, I practiced just hiking with the gun.

Like, I didn't even bother thinking I was going to shoot something. Like, I went out there, and I was just like, I just want to know what this is about. And it was great. I mean, it was a great experience because I got to, you know, set my sights on some young bull elk. We just saw a ton of them out where we were and just practiced sneaking. Yeah, this was, like, in like in a very like limited draw unit yeah and cal's buddy was trying to find a smoker yeah well which he eventually did oh he did yeah not that trip but at the end of november so he wound up getting one yeah he did um and you know

it was just that first trip was just a learning experience and just trying to get out there and i was just i i don't know i was i just i came, I came back and I was like, okay, when, when can we go again? And you were doing some dry firing, Cal was saying. Dry firing. Yeah. I mean, he had me setting up on tree limbs. He had me setting up on rocks, on backpacks. Like he put me in every situation probably.

That's really cool. Yeah. I mean, in the second trip, even more, like I was literally looking at a buck that was downhill of me and like my face was down in my head or my head. My feet were up on the like above me, you know, like he had me everywhere. But, yeah, I just I loved it so much. And so I was like, when can we go again? And we, you know, made it work right before Thanksgiving because that was the only other time that we could do it.

You almost came with me. I almost came with you guys. And I was like, I don't really think i want to hunt four days in a row but yet quite yet two days is enough for me cal talked about on cal's week in review cal touched on hunting with you and cal had a comment where um he's talking about the importance of mentoring people. Yeah. And he mentioned that he doesn't like when people say like, oh, I got him his first deer. Yeah, he doesn't like that. I got her her first deer.

Because I think I said that to him and he just ignored it. Yeah, he goes, you should probably be trying to create a scenario where someone feels like they got it. Which is true, though, because you need to take full responsibility for that thing that you just shot. So you should always, like, I think that's the right approach. Like, I want to take full responsibility for it. 100%. Totally. Anyway, so we went on that second hunt in mid-November.

And we went over to, like, I know honestly where we were but we're on some blm and state land it's like put a blindfold on me and take me the middle of nowhere it might have been montana could have been in canada we were somewhere in montana even if you know exactly i like that approach yeah right people are like where are you hunting I'm like yeah I really don't know that's what I just kept telling people

even if I wanted to tell you I couldn't but I mean it was it was a great area I mean that so we like woke up whatever at five in the morning I guess

whatever you're supposed to do when you go hunting it was dark out it was dark out I never actually ever saw the view from the truck because we were either waking up super early or getting back super late so it was gorgeous there but i don't know what the view from the truck looked like you get that like so that's what this place looks like

i was like man i bet that's pretty up there from the truck you mean at camp yeah i can't you're only in camp in the dark. Uh-huh. Yeah, every day, which was only two days. And yeah, so we just got up. I mean, it was pretty windy, but then once we got down in the valley, it was fine. At one point, Cal was like, hand me your gun. And I was like, okay.

And it's like dark, you know, and he's like, figure out how to get up this cliff. And I was like, what are you talking about? Like, I can't even see what we're looking at. And so I'm like feeling around blindly. And I finally find some sort of like stick thing and I get myself up there. And I was like, okay, now you can get up here with both the guns. Bye. But yeah, we were just, you know, hiking up and down everywhere.

I don't know. And that first day, we saw, I mean, we saw a ton of deer, first of all. Like, so many deer. A lot of bucks, a lot of forkeys. And we were kind of watching this one specific bull, but he was on private. And I don't know why we just watched him for a while. A bull or a buck? I'm sorry, a buck, yeah. I don't know why we watched him for so long.

Cal was interested in it. He was, well, yeah. well yeah so cal like left me to watch these two bucks he went to go poop and then he comes back and he was like oh my god we gotta go find this guy and i was like okay and so like we go and watch this guy he's like telling me to like guy this buck sorry this male mule deer and um so we're looking at him and the worst part though is cal's cal's like okay now you gotta go down there and you gotta find a better position to go watch him so like i go and do this and then he follows me like you know 10 minutes later he's like you did that all wrong i'm like yeah i yeah, I know. Like, I am horrible at sneaking. I don't understand it. It's not in my blood. I just like, I'm just kind of like, this is really like, I feel like this is like role playing right now.

I'm just like not good at it. But, you know, eventually, I mean, we end up calling that guy dickhead because he just did not get off private land. He was like obsessed with this one lady who was just doing whatever she felt like doing. I don't know. She had her own game plan. She wasn't putting out. She was not putting out. She did not. Cal

kind of wandered off for a while. Was he having stomach problems? I think he was fine. I don't know. Very regular out there. Did you guys have Taco Bell like we did the night before we went out? Joe was driving and pulling over and throwing up as we were driving. Oh, Joe got sick? He did?

Yeah. He got poisoned by Taco Bell? Yeah. Not surprised. That sucks. Won't be the first guy. Yeah, won't be the last. I honestly don't even remember what we ate.

But he was fine. He's just going off doing little errands, looking around. He was very healthy, very regular anyways. Yeah, and then he came back and was like, oh, let's go this way. I don't know why I'm whispering. Let's go this way. There's a bunch of deer. You're back in the moment.

I'm back in the moment. Yeah. There's a bunch of deer out in this one, I don't know, some other area behind us. And so we left all our bags and everything. Like we literally left everything. Never leave your bag. Never drop the pack. No apocalypse now.

Never leave the boat. You can just blame this on Cal, okay? Never. And I'm just telling you. I don't care what he does. Never leave your bag. Okay. Moving on.

But the rationale for that. One thing leads to another. No, it's very true. The moment you leave your bag, like, I left my bag and I didn't have everything that I needed. Then one thing leads to another. Yeah. Then like, oh, in fact, the buck moved again. Yeah, totally.

And then you don't get a good hit on it. Yeah. And then later you're like, gah. Oh, here comes a little rain squall. I wish I had my rain jacket. Or it's like two in the morning and you finally find it. No, that's totally accurate.

I think it was by some grass. I didn't have my Spartan bipod with me. So it was just like once. But like I said, it was kind of fun though because we went to this one area. There's like tons of juniper around and we were like in the

trees and we were sneaking up on, just like I said, tons of deer, tons of does and a few forkeys. And so we're looking at them through the trees and he's like, okay, like I want you to look at that forkey and, you know, see if you can get a good position. And so we practice a lot of different positions, like prone on a tree limb again, on some juniper, which is not amazing. And I just never felt comfortable in any of the positions at all. And he was just like, yeah, that's good. Just like you are just kind of learning and knowing that this isn't the right time or moment, whatever. He didn't say what's the problem at any point?

No, he didn't. He was very patient. Was there ever any impatience? Maybe on my end, but not really on his. I know for a fact that Joe Ferrigno, Joe Ferranato, had feelings of impatience. Lots of them. That was his squirreliness was standing up and moving around. He just fell and didn't

communicate them. He communicated them to me. He also communicated... Last night. He communicated them to me too immediately after. But he didn't say, what's the problem? No, he didn't. He was like, if you're uncomfortable, shoot me. I think I say what exactly is the problem. Yeah, even worse!

That was even worse. Break it down. We know there's a problem. What exactly is the problem? So let me get this straight. You see a forky, and you guys are trophy hunting. So you're just practicing. We're are trophy hunting so you're just practicing your drive we're not trophy hunting we're just hunting at this point because i don't know what i want so

but but why were you not the forky you were looking at you were you had intent to kill the forky yeah okay i'm sorry yeah yeah it's just i just didn't feel comfortable and like he was moving a lot he was following another lady and they were going everywhere and i see i just i just so the intent was to get them. Yes. But you couldn't get it. You couldn't get it done. I didn't feel.

As our bear hunter friend said, you could not get it done. You could not get it done. And that was kind of the end of that day. So then come the next. Were you disappointed? Were you like, oh, bummer. You know, the only reason why I felt a little disappointed is because I wanted Cal to go hunting the next day. Ah.

And the next, because the first day he brought his gun, I think he was, like, on a trip right before that. Oh, yeah. Another, like, BLM trip that he took. And he misfired a couple times. So he was, like, wanting to figure out what was going on. What do you mean he misfired? He. He missed?

He. Oh, sorry. Yeah, sorry. Not misfired? He missed? Oh, sorry. Yeah, sorry. Not misfired. Or is that what it is? Like he shot at whatever deer and he missed like twice. Who?

Cal. When? Ryan Calahan. Oh, not this trip. No, no, no. Yeah, I know about this trip. Yeah. So I wanted,

I was disappointed because I was like, I wanted him to get that stuff figured out. Yeah. And I mean, clearly that's not his worry, but it was like mine. I'm like, like, I wanted him to get that stuff figured out. And I mean, clearly that's not his worry, but it was like mine. I'm like, man, I don't want you to wait for me. Anyways. So yeah, next day, same old thing basically.

And just kind of got up to a point and as the sun rose, we were glassing and saw a bunch of deer again. Are you having fun during all this or are you checking something off your checklist? I hate it all. No, I had an amazing time. You liked it. I loved it all. You liked the minute by minute of it. Yes.

Oh, my gosh. And I really, like, I love watching the animals, learning about their behavior. I didn't understand before going out there, like, when you're hunting bucks, you're hunting does. And you're watching for their reactions and like what they're looking for and i just i learned so much about that and that was my favorite part was like not looking for the buck it was looking for the does yeah i think one of the funnest things is when you're hunting and there's good rutting activity and you see does staring in an almost sort of like agitated way yeah

and you're like I god do I want to know what they're staring at yeah totally that's how I felt and I mean

you seem like tense up and you're looking and you're like what what what is it that was the coolest thing he was like

Cal we were looking at some I don't know some does out in this little opening amongst the trees and he was like they're looking into those trees and And I was like, what?

And he brings out, what are those rack things called? Tripod? No, no. Or rattle pack. Yeah, my kid lost my rattle pack. When the snow melts, I'm making Tracy go find it. I offered to go find it for you. But he brought that out and then like,

I don't know, minutes later, a buck comes out of the trees and I was like, that is the coolest thing I've ever seen. Does Kale have a little rattle pack? The green thing? Yeah. Pack rack. Pack rack. Dude, you can't.

I tried. When my kid lost mine, I couldn't find the sons of bitches anywhere. Huh. Anywhere on Amazon. Well, there are other places besides Amazon. I know. I just ran out of steam. But it's killing me, man.

I ran out of steam. When the snow melts, you're going to find it, my stuff. I offered to I just ran out of steam. But it's killing me, man. I ran out of steam. When the snow melts, you're going to find it, my stuff. I offered to go find it before it snowed, and you said no. Is it the rattle bag, or is it the twist rack? No, the pack rack. I think it's... Dude, things loud. Is it a Carlton, or is it

a Nightingale? I need to find it. I don't know, but it's killing me. Yeah. I bought some other stupid rack. It's like... Anyways, go on. Okay. So he's trying to... He's going to rattle the buck. You're trying to get to take a look.

Was it effective? Yeah, it was effective. He came out and it was really awesome. Yeah, that's my thing. Where'd you find that? Buy it. Google. Yeah, just send that to me.

What's that website? Just send it to me. Just Google. Just Google. Yeah, it was that thing. Found it on the google thing um yeah and i i don't know i'll all i'll say about this day because it could go on forever is that i probably had about two or three shots before i got my buck that i should have taken the shot i think at least definitely two but and one of them... No impatience from Kel.

No impatience. So he's just like, whatever, we'll just let it get away. What happened was like one of them I don't know, it was really cool. I got a kind of set up on this doe that was standing on this mountainside and

that was great. She was standing there for like 10 minutes and I was laying there prone and I was like, okay. Could have shot the dickens out of her. Yeah, I totally could have. I was like, Cal, like, tell me where I need to set my sights. And like, once we did that, I was like, okay, I feel comfortable now. I feel like I can do this like whole shooting thing. And then the buck came out and he was moving and I okay i feel comfortable now i feel like i can i can do this like whole shooting thing

and then the buck came out and he was moving and i didn't feel comfortable but then right behind us was another buck that came out so it's like we whipped around turn around i got ready to shoot that one and i um you know how it's like safety and then there was that middle thing and then it's fire yeah three-way safety. So I thought I had put it all the way up to fire and I only got it up to that middle part because I went to go shoot and nothing happened. I like couldn't. And I was like. You're like, this piece of shit.

What the fuck? And yeah, that one I definitely could have gotten. And that would have been a great one because it was about 10 a.m. Shut up. So at 10 a.m. And it would have been nice if I had gotten that one because then I could have probably done the whole like cutting it up and learned all of that. But that didn't happen. So we kind of had to keep hunting for the rest of the day.

And it wasn't until the very last hour of light. And let me tell you, a lot of other things are going on. A lot of other bucks, a lot of other shooting situations that we tried for. I don't know. We did. We had so much up until this buck last hour of light and um it was because we were following this one buck that was like super nice but um i think cal's friendly way no like he was just handsome okay um like i think he was, as Cal called, a monster buck or whatever. And we were following him, and that took us over onto state land. And I honestly don't – I had to have Cal tell me this whole story again after it all happened. You went black.

Yeah. You're like a blackout. Basically. I was like – once we got in the car and like started driving away, I was like, so what happened? Um, but it was like a night of drinking. Yeah. Like last night. Hey folks, exciting news for those who live or hunt in Canada.

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onxmaps.com slash meet. Welcome to the OnX club, y'all. So he saw a doe, which I never saw. That was also a major theme of the trip is he saw a lot of things that I never saw. I'll take your word for it. And saw the doe. So he was like, we need to sneak up on this doe. And he's like, there's antlers like over this ridge. And like that guy doesn't see us. And he was like, we need to sneak up on this doe. And he's like, there's antlers like over this ridge.

And like that guy doesn't see us. And I was like, okay. And so we're like sneaking, sneaking. And we spooked the doe. But we kind of keep sneaking because the, I guess what happened was the buck drove the doe right in front of us. And it happened so fast. It was just like Cal set his pack down. I put my gun on the pack and I like waited there and Cal goes,

do you see them? And apparently I got snippy and I was like, no, I don't see them. They're only like 40 yards in front of us guys. So they're not far. You got a little snippy. Well, that's common though you're looking farther and then

they can be literally in front of you they were literally in front of us you know you know the games people play

I never read it that's a book I believe so okay there's a thing there's a game people play I think it's explained in this

where it's just about what it's kind of like how horrible people are and the games play but there's a thing that happens where I like I come to Tracy and I'm like Tracy I'm having you know really difficult time hitting my sales quota at work right mm-hmm and she goes well maybe you could try working late a few days or maybe you could try working late a few days. Or maybe you could try a different approach. And then I attack her. That's one of the games.

Oh, yeah. Okay, I see this. What do you know? You'll never understand. Yeah, yeah. It's one of the things we do as humans. Totally. So you were doing that to Cal.

I did that to Cal. Exactly. I'm not ashamed of it. I was telling him, I was like, when I get comfortable with people, I either get snippy or I don't talk to you. Because there are times where he'd be like, so how are you feeling? I haven't heard from you for a while. And I was just like, I like talk a lot less like when I'm hanging out with people like I love silence, especially when you're outside. But yeah, so it just it all happened really fast. And the doe, I finally saw the doe, and she was staring straight at me like,

hey, you know, this guy is coming after me. I'd love for you to get rid of him. And so I just kind of sat up behind her, and the buck, like, walked right into my sights. Oh, there you go. Yeah, and looked straight at me and um took the shot i was like on my knees and yeah the the um gun was on the backpack so i was upright you were on your knees yeah i was kneeling like oh yeah the backpack standing up yeah the backpack standing up and what kind of hit you get uh through the lungs but it was went through the front shoulder too because there was

a lot of trauma to that so it pileded right up. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So, yeah. Any emotion? Any emotions? Yeah. Did you get, like, emotional? Yes. Yeah. So.

Pete Alonzo got emotional. Oh, no. I'm sure. How can you not, right? Rookie of the year. I was in denial, though. Like, you were denying that it was dead? No, I was in denial that it was my deer.

And you know what? I told Mark Kenyon this. Like you thought someone else got it. Yeah, I was like, oh, no, this is someone else's deer. This isn't my deer. But you're only 40 yards away from it. I don't understand why I felt this way, Steve. I'm not trying to make sense of it.

But no, Mark Kenyon said he felt the same exact thing. He was like, no, it's not my deer. So you guys kind of went like a little bit insane for a minute. No, it's called like the stages of grieving. Denial, I think, is the first stage. You had a feeling of that there must be another explanation. Yes. For this deer laying right by where I just shot at a deer.

Yes. Okay. I don't. I've never heard. Okay, so let me tell you. I've never heard someone, I've never had someone express this to me. So I shot him. I was looking at my scope the whole time

and I don't know why I did this, but I like immediately put another bullet in the chamber. That's great. That's smart. That's super smart. That's next level. I have no idea. That's next year's lesson.

Oh, okay. Yeah, wow. I literally was just like, I shot him and I just stayed in my scope, did another chamber, whatever. I was like, yeah, I'm going to do it. It's like a natural. I was like, I got to get ready to shoot this guy again. Did another chamber.

Did another. I know what I'm talking about here. And then I felt the ice running through my veins. Did another chamber. And then I felt the ice running through my veins. Did another chamber. And then Cal was the one who was like, we need to go find this deer. And he was like, take the bullet out of the chamber. We don't want to walk around with you.

No, we don't want to. Hand me the rifle. I wonder if I did. But yeah, so Cal's like, come on, we... Hand me the rifle. I wonder if I did. But, yeah, so Cal's like, come on, we got to go find it. And I was like, okay, okay. And then we, you know, run up a little bit to where it was. And I'm, of course, just like standing there like, what happened? I don't know.

And then he's like, oh, look that way. And then there was like the deer, my deer, just probably like 20 yards in front of us or something. And just laying there dead. And I was just in shock. I was like, that was there probably the whole time, right? I was just taking a nap. Yeah, he just like laid, like walked over there and just laid down and ended up expiring. But it ended up being my deer. I didn't even so that was the other thing i had seen maggie's photo as i was driving out to

this area with cow and your deer had blood like you saw blood and my deer had no blood so that was another reason why i was like this is not my deer. There's no blood. Like, he just died peacefully. And. Yeah, I got you. Cal basically had to be like, this is your fucking deer. And I'm going to leave you alone for a few minutes so you can be with it. Mainly because I lost his first light prototype jacket. And he had to go find it. Oh, man.

That winds up putting Kevin in a really awkward position. That's tough. Looks like I'm doing some hiking. Keep an eye out for my pack rat. type jacket and he had to go find it. Oh man, that winds up putting Kevin in a really awkward position. Looks like I'm doing some hiking. Keep an eye out for my pack rat. And so the moment that Cal left, I just started crying. And I just started talking to this deer and I was just like, trying to tell him, I was like, so, you know,

we put in a lot of effort, you know, in my opinion. We put in a lot of effort. Like my opinion we put in a lot of effort like you know i just i want to tell you how much i'm grateful for you and all this stuff i don't know i was just very emotional in that moment do you feel that if you were um murdered by another person uh and you're dying yeah and the, you know, I want you to know I feel horrible, but very grateful for you. Do you know what I mean? Would you feel better about it? And I put in a lot of effort.

Would that piss you off more? Well, would it matter? Because then I'd be dead like two seconds later. That's what I'm trying to say. That you had awareness of it. Does it change anything? No, it's not for the deer probably. It's probably I'm saying. I'm trying to like, that you had awareness of it. Like, does it care? Does it change anything? No, it's not for the deer probably.

It's probably more for me. Yeah, for sure. At that point. I don't know how I'd respond if all of a sudden I was walked in woods and then the guy's like,

dude, I've worked so hard. I've worked so hard to find you. Steve, I've got great plans for your forearms and your calves. I'm going to make Ashibuko.

Or would I be like, dude, it doesn't matter. Yeah, no, it probably would be like, I don't care anymore. I'm dying. But yeah, it was, like I said, it was in that last hour of light. And so we had to get going.

Yeah, he mentioned that, but why is that? Was it impending weather? Like, what was the problem? The temperature was dropping. It started sleeting on us. And we were definitely a lot further from the car than I think he had wanted to be. Of course, none of these things I know. I'm just like going on along for this ride. So I'm like, yeah, this is great.

So it's kind of a hard, like a hard out, like. Maybe. I mean, he made it very easy. We stayed for the most part on the flat areas. So we weren't doing a ton of climbing. So he had to help you cut it up? Oh no, he did all the cutting up. I didn't get to learn anything about that.

Because it was dark and rainy and cold. It's when we got that really nasty snowstorm. Right? You guys were coming back. It was Tuesday night. I don't know what was going on in the world. I was out of service. Have you begun eating your deer yet?

Yeah. So I've had a bunch of the back leg and then I had the tongue. Did you bring any of it to the holiday party? No, I brought potatoes. I brought potatoes. Those were good. So you've had the tongue and some of the back leg. Mm-hmm.

Yep. And? When you leave for work in the morning, do you pull some out to thaw it? Yeah, exactly. I just try and plan ahead a little bit. Have you shared it with your friends? No, not yet. I really haven't been around.

So it's like I got that deer. I left town like two days later and then was gone for all the week of thanksgiving came back went to michigan so this is my first week in montana yeah and so i just i haven't had time to really share anything you didn't bring you didn't bring me to thanksgiving dinner i'm gonna bring home some for christmas okay nice yeah what are you gonna bring home the backstrap good Yeah. Nice. And you think you might give some to some friends? Possibly, yeah.

Well, I'd bring something else to give to your friends. Well, I'm going to make jerky. That's my plan this weekend is to make some jerky. I got my brother's dehydrator and... Oh, there you go.

Can I steal that meat slicer in the kitchen for a weekend, do you think? It's not necessary, but sure. Can I slice it super thin, I guess, with my own knives? Yeah, what you want to do is put a partial freeze on it. Yeah, okay. Let it set up and slice away.

You don't need to do that, but you can get some nice slices like that. It makes it easier, yeah. Yeah, it's a lot easier to handle. You going to go with the grain or against the grain? I don't know. What should I do? Depends, man. Traditional jerky's with the grain. Really? Chewy. What should I do? Depends, man. Traditional jerky's with the grain. Really?

Chewy. What do you like? With. What do you like, Yanni? Across the grain. Why? Because it's just easier to chew. I shouldn't say that. I like it all, man. I like it all. It's a very different experience. You're going to have less of a

cud. You have less of a cud when you go across. You can work up a pretty good cud when you go with. Especially if you leave a lot of sinew. Does this make sense to you? Some people like the cud, man. Oh, you don't want cuds? Yeah, like you're eating jerky.

My jaw gets tired. You're eating jerky, and then a while later, you got like a pea-sized hunk of white stuff. It's gum. Yeah, and you open it up and stretch it out, later you got like a pea-sized hunk of white stuff. It's gum. Yeah, and you open it up and stretch it out and it's like a big ball, a piece of thread. Yeah, it's the cud. Yeah, so I'll go across the grain. Yum. Start that drilling emoji.

Yeah, we've had this conversation before. A lot of jerky now in gas stations is there's whole muscle jerky, but there's a lot of jerky now in gas stations is um you know there's whole muscle jerky but there's a lot of jerky that's that's ground yeah you know you remember your brother recently started doing that i thought that stuff was good nothing wrong with it man nothing wrong with it and no cud it's easy to chew but like you know i don't know man like for me if i had like one jerky the rest of my life it's gonna be jerky that's whole muscle with the grain, and there's like a chaw to it.

Chaw. Yeah, you grab it, and you got to dry or moist. I love jerky gum. Moist. Pretty moist. Yeah. I like a good tacky jerky. Yanni doesn't.

Me and Yanni do not see eye to eye on jerky. No, I like a tacky jerky, too. I used used to do like a I think I called him like jerky tidbits And they're more just like chunks, you know, like bacon ends, but jerky Yeah, but maybe a little bit bigger, you know, but you had to be real careful because if you over dried them You know, you just it just wasn't edible at all But then sometimes I'd have them in my pack for like a week and you pull them out and you realize that you didn't actually dry all everything out that needed to come out, you know?

So you'd have like a little, just a little pungent smell in there. The clients would be like, are you sure this is okay to eat? Well, one thing about when you do with grain, a with grain cut and you're drying it, don't dry it so much that it snaps. What you want to do is dry it till when you bend it, you'll see little white filaments. Oh, okay. Yeah. You bend it, there's white filaments and no snap. And that's when it snaps.

That's what you're after. Okay. Thank you. When you do cross grain, I don't know, what's your indicator when you cross grain? It's similar. Oh, yeah. You kind of bend it. It shouldn't go like, if it snaps like a chip, that's not good.

Yeah. And the other thing I find a lot of people screw up is there's jerky and then there's cooked meat. And I've had a lot of guys give me jerky that's not jerky. It's like roasted. It's just different. You know what I'm saying? It's just different, man.

Try this jerky. I've eaten many pounds of it, and I've made many pounds of it, which is like, yeah, you kind of cook little thin pieces of meat. And it stays outside? Yeah, but you'll know what I'm saying. It's just not jerky. Okay. It's cooked. Great. These are all very usefulky. Okay. It's cooked. That's hilarious. Great.

These are all very useful tips. Thanks, guys. Yeah. You get that when you're doing your oven and when you're doing your smoker. You know, I mean, like, am I describing it right? Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's a big difference, and you know it. Dried meat and cooked meat.

Yeah. So is Katie going to go out with Cal? She doesn't want to hunt with me. Which I don't understand. No, I really don't understand. It's insulting to me. We're talking about my wife. It's insulting to me, and I don't really understand it.

I don't think it's a good idea for two people who are in that close of a relationship where you are the expert and the other person is the novice beginner. And it's like a personal relationship. I think that's a personal relationship, I think that's a terrible idea. I don't think it has anything to do with you, Steve. I think it has to do with the fact that that dynamic would be challenging. And patience. I couldn't disagree more.

It's tough because you think that people in a relationship that should be able to overcome whatever it is. We've had three kids. Sure. Married 11 years. What's going to ruin it all is the day we went deer hunting? It's not about ruining it all. It's about having a different level of patience.

I mean, even when I was learning to fly fish and Jeremiah would teach me, there's a block. You don't want to be open-minded to your significant other who's telling you how to do it. I very much know that feeling. So that's what I'm talking about. Yeah. Like, we're married, but in a lot of ways, we're like enemies. That is totally false. Married enemies.

That is baloney. Like, where should we put, like, I recently got that 50-pound block of lard. My 50-pound box of lard.ard okay i didn't know about this like very um real enemy we're real enemies about where i keep that where would she like you to keep it not where i keep it anywhere else on the counter oh she just can't picture it being gone so she suggested i move it to a place I don't want to have it you're like like she's my like like in regards of my block of lard she's I feel I have like a very enemy feeling toward her like is my my adversary about my large challenges because when she approached me about it she approached me as a friend it didn't approach me as a friend.

It wasn't like, hey, buddy. Been thinking about the box of lard. It wasn't like that. I noticed you like to walk by that box of lard and give it a smack every time you walk by it. I do it all the time. You know that plastic stuff you use to tight wrap stuff? Yeah, like to ship stuff? Yeah, the box was compromised compromised and I took that shipping wrap and wrapped that.

It's like tighter than a drum, man. But it's like, yeah. Kylie had a morbid fascination with that box when it showed up. Like 50 pounds of lard! Yeah! Morbid fascination. Kylie didn't,

she didn't like it, but she couldn't keep away from it. And throughout the course of the day, not 10 minutes went by that Kylie didn't come back over to my desk to look into the box. I opened it, come back over to my desk to look into it and express like a level of dismay about it. She's like, this is disgusting.

Then she'd go back to her desk and a couple minutes later, I'd look and she's back looking into the box. And then guess what? He was cooking with it last night. She couldn't understand it. 50 pounds. That's a lot. She's like, that weighs half what I weigh.

That is so much, Lauren. I was like, after a while, I was like, Kylie, we all know you just want to have a scoop. Just have a scoop. Just throw the spoon in there. Yeah. No. Okay. Kylie's deer hunt.

Wind hunting with my my husband but you've been a number of times no you've been around it yeah so i'm uh my husband hunts like i mean all my my friends hunt um but then i i've gone shooting um for many years but then just never actually hunted how long ago had you done the hunter safety? Two years ago. And why'd you do that? Before I turned 30, my goal was to shoot an animal, to go hunting for the first time ever. I'm from Montana. I should be doing this. Went through hunter safety. It was very out of my comfort zone and very much- At hunter safety? Yeah. What didn't you like about it? i think just not knowing like i think

as a woman like and sounds stupid but like kind of going in there hi i don't know exactly what i'm doing per se and then um you know not knowing anyone it feels like a big like swing and dick contest or just kind of like you just don't really know what you're supposed to do and you kind of feel dumb um but but i went through it and then i didn't really tell anyone. Did you feel you were made to feel dumb or was this self-imposed? No, self-imposed. For sure. No, and then I just over time I haven't been able to go.

And then this year I had the opportunity to go and my husband and I went. Is he pretty patient? Super patient. Had he already gotten a deer? No. This was for me. He was like, I'm going to go for you. I'm gonna be your partner I mean he got everything set up he wasn't even like trying to get one too nope this was a me thing and for sure and like he I mean it was very much a um I think I was like when we talk about couples I think it's there is I think sometimes

in a couple that you do want to fight like what are you doing wrong you know but I think it's, there is, I think, sometimes in a couple that you do want to fight. Like, what are you doing wrong? You know, but I think that you, you also, you love that person. So you also understand, like, okay, why, you know, he did at one point, so I will tell you, I choked twice. I couldn't get, I had two bucks, two different bucks, and I couldn't shoot. That's the first time you went? Yeah. The first time I went, got, like, I mean, huge buck. Just staring at it, couldn't do it. I have no, not a clue why. Like, just, I mean, it was just right there. Happened again. And I was, I was super mad at myself that I think the emotional part, I think when they talk about the emotions afterwards, I think my emotion was then. I was frustrated with myself. I think you just don't want to hurt the animal.

I think everything that you think about of what Tracy was saying and all the girls, you don't want it to go run off and be hurt or anything. You're running all the negative scenarios. And I think when we were kind of talking about that right when you have an insight

and that trigger, it's just like that's such a different feeling that I've never felt before. Can't put the bullet back in the gun. that right when you have an insight and that trigger, it's just like, that's such a, a different feeling that I've never felt before. Can't put the bullet back in the gun. So that one, that was really frustrating. So at one point my husband did say, he was like, kind of like, what's wrong? Or like, he's like, for you, like, are you not set up right?

You know, what in your head is going on? He made it feel compassionate. Yeah. Like what can we do? That's a good trick. That's a good way of doing it. Yeah. Flip it.

I mean, I'm sure he was frustrated, too. Pursue the same thing, but act like you're more concerned about them. Yeah. Take note. I don't know if acting, but yeah. And then. So do you guys have a little bit, do you know what I'm talking about? A little bit like the enemy-ness about stuff now and then?

Oh, we fight. We used to fight all the time. Good to hear. Good to hear. So. He feels normal. No, and then it was, I was coming up on like, it was that Saturday. Hold on, why do you say you used to?

You quit fighting? You got some trick up your sleeve and all of a sudden you quit fighting? 11 years, I don't know, just kind of. Oh, you just got it out of the way. Hasn't gotten worse? Nothing to fight about anymore. No, nothing to fight about, yeah. You guys fought it all out,

and now you're just like, move down. Yeah, move down, yeah. Everything's resolved. Yeah. The lard goes over there. Yeah. There's something to be said for that. What's that?

My father-in-law recently, it wasn't recent, it was maybe a year ago now, but I remember him telling my daughter, she was asking him, she had somehow noticed something about his lack of anger with people whatever and he was just telling her about how in his age he's sort of just like giving up on fighting this is randy randy newberg peace

not justice yeah but not necessarily with his wife just like with anybody in life he's just like i just don't have time to do that anymore. He's just taking like, oh, is that right? Like that approach. Don't say. Yeah, you don't say. The peace, not justice thing, though, that's, I don't know if he wrote that or made that up, but he introduced me to that idea. Like, obviously sometimes, man, I like want to strangle my wife, you know, and I'll just be like, just snuggle up instead.

Just be like, ah, I mean, who cares, man, I'll strangle my wife, you know, and I'll just be like, just snuggle up instead. Just be like, I mean, who cares, man? I was going to strangle you, but I'll just snuggle you instead. I'll just snuggle you instead. So he's a good dude. Good dude. And then on Saturday night, right before, like, season ended Sunday, Saturday night at 5 o'clock at night, it's dark like Sam had. It's negative degrees. And what do you know?

This is the last day of the season. Yeah. Oh, yeah. It was cold. Talk about the final hour. It was cold, yeah. Across there was a creek, and I looked over, and in the fog, there was a couple different deer. And I saw a doe, and I saw, like, I looked over, and in the fog, there was a couple different deer.

And I saw a doe, and I saw a buck, just a small little buck. And I didn't, like, usually I was, like, really hesitant beforehand, and this was just such a very perfect, like, normal feeling. And then I shot, and I saw some, like, go, like, move, so I didn't think I shot it. And then my husband actually i got lost there so i like i saw them across the creek in the fog and i shot and then okay i need more detail is he is your husband watching too yeah yeah but there was he didn't have any feedback for you no there was oh yeah there was a couple deer like we didn't know behind that. It was all foggy. Okay.

So I just saw the one buck and I shot. But then when we, when I shot, it was like all the other deer ran. Oh, yeah, I know what you're saying. So then it's hard to tell, like, what exactly. Yeah. Yeah, I'm with you. I'm with you. So then he ran over across the creek and then I didn't think I hit it.

And then. He ran over to investigate. Yeah. And then I got it. So right in the lungs, which was perfect of exactly what I wanted to happen. And it hadn't gone far. And then he carried it over. Because he dragged it back across the creek.

Yeah. And I wanted to, same exactly with Sam, like I wanted to be able to gut it and go through that. I watched it. But because it was dark, I mean, he had the light on. I mean, it was, I didn't feel comfortable. Single digit temperatures. Yeah. Yeah. So he had the light on. I mean, I didn't feel comfortable learning that. Single-digit temperatures, yeah. Not a great learning environment. But next time, I would like to learn next time, for sure.

Any emotions? Just before. Just, I think, just when shooting and not being able to, for sure. I think, yeah, I think that first time that you went out, you had... Very frustrated. Like, she texted me, and she was just like, i can't believe

i didn't shoot it and i was like well take that for the next time because you will yeah like you had like later you thought to yourself like that was a great opportunity i blew it and yeah i mean it was literally like i was looking straight at him right in the scope he was huge i mean it was just that he was just staring at me and i couldn't for the life of me do it. No idea why. So did you guys bring it to a processor? Yep. Yep.

So you got to gut it out? Yep. And then so we're just waiting for it to be processed. And you go pick it up. Yep. Do you guys eat a lot of deer meat? Because he hunts. Used to.

Yeah, used to. A lot of elk meat for sure. Oh, okay. Yeah. So game meat. Yep. So your husband likes to hunt elk? I mean, yeah.

He grew up with it for doing all deer, elk, anything. Is he from here? Yep. So he's probably got a long tradition of it. Yeah. And then do you guys think he'll eat it right away or it'll take a year to eat it? I would like to try to eat it right away for sure. You don't need good wild game cookbooks no I mean I think we work at this place I don't know I call me

neither but I don't know yeah well I'll check me your guide to check something like that I come that Hank Shaw cookbook last night oh you did any good recipes in there I didn't open it I don't think I was in the stage of reading last night. You know what book someone left at my house last night that my kid wants so bad, and I told him he could steal it, but my wife wants to track down its rightful owner, is a book called Crap Taxidermy. Oh, I saw that. Cal has that book.

Yeah, it's a book on horrible taxidermy. It's a great book. He took it and wanted to take it to school, and I said, well, go ahead, because if someone left it here, they might not want it. And Katie was like, well, they might have just left it. And then we had to have a parenting moment where I'm like, yeah, your mom's probably right. It's a hilarious book. She'll find out who owns it. Great title, Crap Taxidermy.

He really likes the title. I think he wants to bring it to school because he likes the title so much. Great. So, everybody going to hunt again or no? Definitely. You're in it? What do you think? Yeah, you're going.

Is Jeremiah going to take, your boyfriend going to take hunter safety? Yeah, we need to get him to take hunter safety. Do you think you'll hunt together? I think we would totally hunt together. Your boyfriend? Yep. He'll do hunter safety. Yep, we've talked safety. Do you think you'll hunt together? I think we would totally hunt together. Your boyfriend? Yep. He'll do hunter safety. Yep, we've talked about it.

Do you think you'll hunt again? Yeah, yeah. Or hunt together? Yeah, I do think we would hunt together. I do. I think we figured out how to be productive in those types of situations together. Yeah, because you guys are gathering up rocks to make a chimney. Oh, man.

That's no small job. Oh, it's no small job, man. And every weekend. Okay, it's rock picking time. And it's like five loads later. We're fortunate enough that our neighbors are letting us take as much rock as we need off their land. It's like five loads later. I'm like, are we done for today?

Yeah, and you guys are palletizing the rocks. Yeah, you pick them one by one. You've got to clean them. You've got to make sure they're the right size, the right shape. They have the right amount of lichen on them. It's a very diligent job. And then you put them on pallets by size so that our mason can work with them. Farmer's dream right there.

Do you know about this rock picking, Yanni? No. It's pretty impressive when you look at the collection of palletized stacked rocks. This must be one hell of a chimney. Oh, it sure damn is. Hopefully it'll be the center of the house. No, it's like no joke. Literally blood, sweat, and tears.

When we showed up there, they were just coming back from a rock picking expedition. Yeah, like Kevin said, that's a great way to make a neighbor. Oh, man. You should act like you're just doing it just to be helpful. Oh, totally. But they've already gathered. I mean, they've lived there forever. So all their rock is in different piles across their entire land.

So we go from pile to pile. So you're not picking from the field. No, no, no. It's already stuff that they've gathered. You're picking picked rocks. Yeah. That's not helpful. That's kind of high grading.

It's helpful for me. I'm just kidding. I was thinking that those landowners, let's say they had pasture land. They have pasture land. And you were picking raw rock. Yeah, no. They would love you. Oh, for sure.

But they've already done all that work in the previous decades. Yeah, I got you. Yeah. That's still a good story. I can't. Are you going to invite us all over to see the chimney one day? Hell yeah. I finally have a place where people can sit.

We live in 700 square feet right now. I can't really have anybody over. Yeah, she's got a horse property full of buildings and they live in a little apartment above a barn. I think Steve was horrified. No, not horrified. Just like, everybody looked. There's a building. There are a lot of little units. Yeah, everybody looked. There's a building, but then you guys live in a little A-frame thing

above a barn. It's funny. Yeah. One of those buildings isn't like a living structure. Well, there used to be. Did someone want a building spree and in the end realized they hadn't built a place to sleep. And Steve was like, and you bought that place. Yeah, he's like, duh! I knew I was forgetting something.

Four barns and no place to sleep. And then Steve was like, one day he's like, where do you keep all your clothes? That's a good question. In the barn. In one of the barns. So, Kevin, real quick, what can we look ahead to? What's the next thing to come out cool at first light? Yeah, can you tell me things like that?

What's Cal's prototype jacket? You got one too, Yanni, I think. No, this was the old one. Can I tell people about, I've been wearing a coat. Yeah. And there's a thing about it that you would notice from a ways off yeah we've been we've been sharing that on social a little bit i think a little bit but i think you know tell me what i'm talking about well i don't know if i can yet

the thing that starts with g yeah uh we haven't uh we haven't technically released any of that stuff yet you you know. I think I have. No, it's not by death. No. Yeah. So you're not saying people, oh, there's a... No, it's just, you know, some teasers on social across the internets. Little Easter eggs.

Yeah, exactly. We'll be releasing all that stuff the first part of January. So we're close. Folks got to wait, like, you know. Couple weeks. Couple weeks. No, when they hear this, it'll be out. Oh, so just tell them.

Oh, really? When's this coming out? January sometime? Nah, I think December 30th. Ah. Oh. People will be all drunk. Yeah. They don't remember. That's the next day when everybody gets drunk. Yeah, that's right. We're heading into show season, though, so we're gonna be all over the place.

Repping the wares. Good. Yeah. Oh, you know, we got a thing coming up. What's that? There's a sports show. That's right. In Portland.

Portland, Oregon. Yeah, we'll be there. Yeah, well, we're going and doing a big old gigantic book signing. Mm-hmm. Me, Cal. Sam. Sam, Cal. Sam. Sam, Danielle. Nice.

Yeah, I heard about this. We're going to go to your booth. Are you going to be there? I'll be there. Hell yeah. I'm going to everything, man. I'll be traveling the country. Now you got to pay for all that hunting you do.

I know. I looked at the schedule last week, and it's a little daunting. Shows, man. Yeah, yeah. A lot of shaking hands. I'm into it, though. It'll be fun. Get some hand sanitizer. Yeah, yeah. A lot of Yeah. A lot of shaking hands. I'm into it though. It'd be fun. Get some hand sanitizer. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of airports, a lot of airports. Um, so people can find out

what's happening there then. Yeah. Yeah. We're going to start releasing all this stuff for 2020 and, um, a lot of good things in the works for sure. You guys had a great year, man. Awesome year. Yeah. It's a great year. Firstlight.com. Firstlight.com. Come check us out. Big year. Giant year. That's good, man. That's exciting. I appreciate that.

Enormous year. Yeah. Trying to think of some more. Huge. It's huge. It's a great customer service. Because if you're kind of confused at Firstlight.com, there's a lot to take in there. Lots of layers. You can call and talk to an actual hunter.

Actual human. Oh, yeah. These guys. Human hunter. Hunter human. Yeah. And get some, you know. Yeah.

Those guys are bad. And they're like the awesomest dudes ever. Like, I've been fortunate enough to get to know. They are some badass dudes. And they get after it, too. You know, like, if you're at the office at 5001, it's like the door's swinging and everybody's like, out the door. We got a guy that trails it because they're out hunting.

Oh, I got you now. We got a guy that runs, trail runs, after in Duke. Oh, he does? He'll leave the office in his trail running gear with a bow in hand. Shut up! Swear to God. And he'll run into his own and make it by the time, the golden

hour. It's incredible. He's a machine. Oh yeah. That is awesome. I was privy to some I was privy to some like composite customer feedback stuff about First Light. Someone showed me and people, there's a universal thing of people describing

a aha moment around the customer service. i think that is uh pretty well well spread those guys are dialed and it's interesting too because a lot of in large companies you have 50 60 people customer service these guys are four to six dudes per day that use our stuff every day you know they're they're out in it every day whether it's skiing in the winter elk hunting in the fall, duck hunting, whatever. You name it, they're using it. Yelling at their wife.

Yeah, well, not a lot of married guys. Is that right? All single dudes running the hills. Married to the woods? This doesn't surprise me. So they answer the phone, they're like, what exactly is the problem? Let me. That's right. That's right.

It is good trail running stuff, though, too. Nice. Yeah. Good job, man. That was great trail running stuff, though, too. Nice. Good job, Maggie. That was great. And skiing. Did you give Maggie ten bucks, too? Yeah, Maggie. We come from the same place. We do. Oh, so you help them out.

You're throwing to them because you guys are from the same zone. Yeah, we made the connection. Nice. A lot of Minnesotans. We know people in common. It's great. One last question. Phil, you getting jealous? Yeah, I think looking around this room, I am the only person in here who has yet to shoot a deer or gone hunting at all.

Have you been thinking about doing some hunter safety? Yeah, no. I think Ben and I are going to do some stuff next year. Nice. So when are you going to do the hunter safety? Soon. I think in the next couple of months, hopefully, if we can find a... Okay.

Yep. Awesome. There's a field day component. That sounds like a lot of fun. That's not a requirement. It is. Okay, I did mine all in one day. Oh, no.

There's all different... The field day is not required. It's your other certain age. This isn't as important as I think what I'm gonna throw out on the table right now is should we take bets on if Ben is going to be

a take your time or exactly what's the problem I think you'll be worse than Steve I think you're in trouble you think so

I'm gonna put my money on the most patient I think Ben is like I've hunted with Ben laid back guy. Really? Until it's on. And then he's.

He might have a little bit of a problem like if we're going turkey hunting, he might shoot the turkey that you might want to shoot. Has this happened before? Yeah, this sounds a little too specific. Patient guy. You know, say you're out in his one spot. Anyway. So you'll do hunter safety and you'll get after it in the spring.

Yeah. I think so. I think that's the plan. I think turkeys are an awesome way to immerse yourself into this world. I feel grateful that that was my first introduction. It primes you. Yeah, it's good. You get a lot of encounters.

Yes. All right. Well, when that happens, happens Phil you'll be here anyway cause you're the engineer we don't even have to schedule it okay everyone till next year

probably won't be that good to have a show about everybody's second year we'll have to think of something different first elk oh I think we're going in January actually Who? Me, Cal, and Anna This girl Anna

Are going cow hunting? I think so I want to do the beaver thing I think I'm going to call this episode What exactly is the problem Oh you want to You want to go beaver trapping I would want to go beaver trapping? I would love to go beaver trapping.

Really? Yeah, that interests me. Oh, dude. Don't even worry about it. I'll put you on the calendar. I would love to do that. Yeah, good deal. Okay.

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