The MeatEater Podcast - Ep. 235: Sex, Guns, and Bluegrass with Dave Simonett

Episode Date: August 24, 2020

Steven Rinella talks with Dave Simonett of Trampled By Turtles, Ryan Callaghan, Maggie Smith, Sam Lungren, Phil Taylor, and Janis Putelis.Topics discussed: An elderly woman’s plea to American men: carry heavy shit and buy a tool kit; hound dog training with live vs. dead raccoons; Dave's first fly fishing experience with the MeatEater crew; Steve is forced to reckon with a stand-up paddleboard; the proper way to grill trout in a campground; Dave’s adult onset pheasant hunting; unleashing the word “poverty”; does bluegrass have too many notes?; art and creation as something not to be defined and categorized; needing nature to write music and songs growing out of the dirt; the intersection between the music world and the hunting world; Steve's ladder rule on trapping, hunting, and fishing; Dave doing his online gun safety course in the green room; imposing your will on your garden; and more. Connect with Steve and MeatEaterSteve on Instagram and TwitterMeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and YoutubeShop MeatEater Merch Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Download the Hunt app from the iTunes or Google Play Store. Know where you stand with Onyx. Okay, we're joined today by Dave Simonet. You prefer Simonet. I prefer Simonet, yeah. Among many other things, you have your own solo stuff. Right. Then you have your kind of solo stuff called Dead Man Winter. Yeah.

And then you have your not nearly as solo stuff, Undertrampled by yeah that's about sums it up really yeah let's say you did it you were going to sum it up how do you like to when you're like sitting there talking to someone they're like what do you do yeah i mean i i guess i would just say that i'm a songwriter and then i have those different vehicles for doing it you know but trampled by turtles is you know my main gig that's what i spend most of my time with. Yeah. And then, you know, all of us in that band have other side projects or other ways to do whatever we do.

So we give each other time to do this and it gives me time to make music with other people and music on my own. But most of it's Trampled by Turtles. I got a cautionary tale for you. Okay. It has nothing to do with what we're talking about right now. But I just wanted to do that intro and then we're going to do a couple of things

and then we'll come back. Sure. We're going to talk about your fishing trip this weekend. All right, great. And like why you're in town and stuff. I was at the gym the other day and there's this elderly woman there. What?

And you outlifted her? I already heard the story, which is why I'm laughing it's greatest story in the world it's a great story she's uh she works her ass off down at this gym and i heard her complaining overheard her complaining to her trainer she said um she goes you know men have gotten so sedentary and she, do you know there are men who cannot carry a sack of fertilizer? And then she goes, you need to know this. And then she said, there are men with no toolkit.

So it's like, watch out. Right. If you're a dude. That's a very Montana conversation. This could happen to you that you find yourself incapable of carrying sacks of fertilizer. I wanted to break in and be like, well, how big? If it's like a 100-pound sack, I mean, you're being harsh.

25-pound sack? I mean, come on. Oh, man, that's great. You're going to show up to your next Tinder date, and there's just going to be a sack of fertilizer next to the front door? Say what? Every time I walk in that gym, I'm coming in there with a sack of fertilizer and a toolkit, though. One on each shoulder.

What else am I going to talk about? Giannis, you wanted to update us on your – how do you spell your dog's name? M-I-N-G-U-S. I want to hear about what's going on with you and this dog and the raccoons. Yeah, well, our buddy finally got some raccoons. They've been tough raccoon trapping, even for somebody that had a whole bunch of raccoons on his place. But he finally got one.

The first one, though, it didn't turn out very well for him. I thought I had been advised that you could leave a raccoon in a trap for a day or so. Clarify that you're talking about a live trap. A live trap, yeah. Havahart. Basically just a long rectangular box. Yeah, with a name like Havahart. Yeah.

And so anyways, this first raccoon, kind of small, smallish raccoon. By the time I got to him, he had perished. Or she. We should clarify, the guy that's catching the raccoons does a lot of waterfowl nesting stuff on his place that's right and is controlling raccoons he believes that this will

increase waterfowl reproduction that's right which by no means like uh makes any better what I'm doing to these raccoons. It's real like a, I don't want to say moral dilemma, but it definitely tugs at my heart both directions, training Mingus with these live raccoons. Well, this one was dead. So with the dead one, we did a little trail, 50 yards or so, and then put the dead one up in a tree, let Mingus follow it. He went to the tree, saw the raccoon, barked at it for 15 minutes.

We urged him on. The girls were there, my kids, seven to nine, and they cheered him on. He did well. Got a call the next morning, another raccoon in the trap. So I went and picked it up the next evening. We did the same thing, except now we had a live raccoon in a trap, and we dragged the whole trap up a different trail, hung it up in the tree,

and then repeated the process. Well, why not just let the raccoon run off, and then he can track the raccoon? Well, because this is only his second time with a raccoon, right? So we're just trying to make the connection and make sure that there is that connection. So we actually started with our raccoon in the trap

on the ground at the base of the tree. And he sat there and barked and she snarled back and forth for five minutes and then I hoisted it into the tree and we continued. So he's supposed to get the idea that this animal is going to go to a tree and then go up into a tree.

So the next morning, we went out to Jake's farm And cut the raccoon loose Why'd you go way the hell out there? Just because you needed a big open field With a You know, with some big trees nearby

So you drove all that way to do that? Yeah I mean, I can't do it in your backyard Or my backyard It's like the world's divided into Jake's farm and my backyard. No, I know. But I mean, just, I don't know. Try to think.

Jake, you got your farm and I own everything else. It's my backyard. Think of a good spot around here that that would have been good for. It's just a perfect setup. A thousand places. It's a dog safety thing too. A thousand places. You got one off the top of your head?

Okay. Okay. All fishing access sites okay well they might not have a nice mode field where you can like see where the raccoon is running right and so you can sort of control the situation okay remember where we did where we did our company river access site cleanup oh i didn't make it to that i played hooky oh he went uh we had a company cleanup where the whole damn company showed up to clean up a river access site and yannis decided to fish that day i think that's bad fishing karma

oh dude all right so anyways you drive hours away. One hour. Okay. Exactly. It's pretty common here in Montana to go for an hour-long drive. Anyways, we started off with the raccoon in the trap again, Mingus there barking at it, and we let the raccoon run, and we thought it was just going to run across the field and right up into this cottonwood. That's what we were expecting, but we didn't see in our mind's eye or just the way we were perceiving the place and the situation, we didn't see in our mind's eye or just the way we were perceiving this the place and the situation we didn't see this like the part that

hadn't been cut yet just all this tall grass where there's like a ditch running through it and whatever in the middle of this field you know what i'm talking about basically right there in front of the house and uh so the raccoon's going towards the tree and then decides to hook a left into the grass because he's going to get away so we just just cut Mangus loose at that point. And he did a good job, caught right up to it. And Jake was happy because he didn't really bark on the trail much at all. He only started barking once he got face to face with it. And so we repeated that maybe three times. They'd be face to face for, I don't know, a couple, three minutes. We'd pull Mangus off, let the raccoon get out, you know, three, four minutes, cut Mingus loose again and take him a little bit to figure out which way it went. Cause again, the grass is tall and thick. You can't see

which way it went. And, um, at one point the raccoon was actually attached to Mingus's head, which as, as the dog owner, it definitely kind of scares you a little bit. You know, you're like, is that okay? And again, like I'm lucky to have a good mentor and he's like, yeah, it definitely kind of scares you a little bit. You're like, is that okay? And again, I'm lucky to have a good mentor, and he's like, yeah, it's all good. If it comes to it, your dog will kill that raccoon. Yeah, but raccoons kill dogs. They do. The only thing he was worried about, which I've heard often, is the deep water.

Yeah. If there's deep water nearby, then they can actually get on the head like that and drown a dog. So eventually the raccoon did tree, took Mingus a little bit, but eventually he got that, he got to that tree and actually tried to climb the tree, came back to the tree multiple times, but never just sat there and barked at the tree,

which would be what they call treed, right? So we could see the raccoon in the tree, which would be what they called treed, right? So we could see the raccoon in the tree, and he went around it a few times smelling it, but eventually it was like, I can't put two and two together, that that's where the raccoon is now. I've lost its trail, and he sort of like faded away. Then we shot the raccoon out of the tree,

and what was interesting is I thought there'd be this big like dead raccoon mingus on top of it just craziness and there wasn't he like went up to it saw that it was dead barked like two more times and then pretty much turned around was like all right what are we doing now once the raccoon was dead is like no interest because jake doesn't want raccoons either what do you mean he doesn't want a lot of raccoons on his foot. No, he doesn't want any. We try to trap him there first. But yeah, so he's doing good. It's been fun. When you get all, when this dog is a great raccoon hunter and you start, what are you

going to do with all your raccoon hides? Because they're only worth a few bucks a piece right now. I have to figure out what I'm going to make out of them and then give everybody raccoon hats for Christmas. You're going to go against, try to go up against them and then give everybody raccoon hats for Christmas. You're going to go against, try to go up against me and Seth as the providers of fur garments around the office. Perhaps you'd like one of these raccoon hats instead. I'm guessing there's going to be quite a few that get treed and don't get shot.

You want to watch how easily I could bring something full circle, but I'm not going to yet. Watch this. Dave, our guest, was born in Germany. That's right. And you know what they do in Germany when they're training dogs? I don't. What they used to do is they would make a raccoon go into like a barrel or a cage in Germany, I think. This outfit, this used to be a way you'd test the metal of a dog. like a barrel or a cage in Germany. I think this,

this outfit, this like used to be a way you'd test the metal of a dog is you'd have to have a dog and a raccoon, like German wire hairs and whatnot. You make the dog and the raccoon fight it to the death in a enclosed area. It's like UFC for hunting. They'd fight it.

They'd fight to the death inside of thing. And that was like a thing. You'd go get a raccoon and your dog wasn't like a real dog till you, till it did that. But there's a certain brutality to it, man. Like you've crossed over into a really dangerous territory with what you're up to right now. Yes.

I don't know if it's dangerous, but it's, it's different. You just crossed into like some questionable stuff. feel what's questionable about it yeah i just i think it's questionable with dealing with the with the live raccoons i just feel like you could rile up someone's sensitivities oh no doubt about it listen listen the, the, I mean, just the conversations that have been going on in my house

over the last three days while this all has been going on, you know, it's interesting too with how the kids reacted differently between the,

when we trained with the dead coon and then the live one, the dead one, like gloves off, just like, yeah,

man, just get in there and good boy, good boy, this, that, and the other. And then when it was a live coon, it's like, well, Mangus, get in there. Good boy, good boy, this, that, and the other. And then when it was a live coon, it's like, well, we've named her Beatrice.

Can we try feeding her? And I'm like, yeah, you can. But just remember, Beatrice's life is she's got about 12 more hours, you know. And so it was interesting seeing that. They still cheered him on when we did the training with the coon in the trap, but they definitely weren't quite just like, yeah, in there. They started to make a connection with that raccoon. It was interesting.

My wife, she only joined in on the first session. Second session, she's like, nah, I had enough of that. I went out running raccoons a bit growing up and i thought it was pretty interesting but it was all that night so it was hard to see what was going on yeah but i enjoyed going out with certain guys this dude carl i used to hang out with random yeah it's interesting to watch that you know watch the dogs work for sure so dave tell me about, tell me about your fishing trip this weekend. Yeah, yesterday.

It was your first? First fly fishing experience, right? I've fished, I grew up fishing in Minnesota on lakes and have recently discovered trout fishing there in the last few years, but have just been using spinners and that's pretty common in that area, right? So I was pretty excited to have the opportunity to finally try a fly rod

because I've always wanted to do it. And we went out on the Yellowstone with, I don't know, how many of us were there? There were three boats. I think there was eight of us. Yeah. And it was a perfect day. It was beautiful. I had a wonderful teacher, Sam, who showed me how to, you know, almost how to not get stuck on everything I threw my fly at and ended up catching a few fish.

And I think I'm, you know, when I get home, I'm going to go get a ride now, man. Oh, really? Yeah. It's a cool experience. You think, like, rate Sam, like, act like he's not here. Yeah. One to ten. Ten being great.

Great guide. Great guide. Phenomenal guide's not here. Yeah. One to ten. Ten being great. Great guide. Great guide. Phenomenal guide. One being just awful. One being awful. Even if he wasn't here, I think I'd still say a ten. Really? Just a ten?

Yeah. I needed a lot of, you know, you pick up one of those rods, and I don't know if any of you can remember before you did that, but it's a whole different motion. It's a whole different everything, feeling everything. So it was nice to have somebody who was pretty adamant about making sure I at least had a good chance of catching a fish. Did he bust out the metronome analogy for you?

And did that work as a musician for you? I felt like it was a little scripted, you know. Sam, you feel like you gave him a scripted like 10-2, 10-2. I wasn't the first person who got that speech. Well, you know, I go against the 10-2. I tell people 11-1 if you're going to think about it that way. I think that's a more useful frame because it makes you keep the rod higher behind you. But, I mean, I've taught probably over 100 people how to fly fish in my life.

I've been teaching fly fishing since I was 14, I think. So it is a little scripted. I have certain things I like to say and I think certain things that are helpful and some things that aren't. But I still think Dave's sandbagging me. I still think he's secretly fly fished before and is, like, acting like this is his first time. Because he picked it up faster than literally anyone I've ever seen. It's like a fly fishing shark. Yeah.

I don't know what you gain from this. How many instruments do you play? Really just one, just the guitar. I mean, I can kind of play a few other ones, but I wouldn't say. If you said like a whole bunch, I was maybe just like really good. You just had enough training to figure stuff out quick. Good at stuff real fast. Good at like figuring things out.

No, I'm generally not one of those people, I don't think. Well, you took instruction well. Like you was doing it very well, like pretty much right off the bat. And then it ended up sticking to really nice trout that literally anybody who fishes the Yellowstone regularly would be like over the moon about catching. How did you have them rigged up? We were fishing grasshoppers, just single dry all day. Really? No little, little teasers, stingers?

No, no. Droppers? No, it certainly doesn't make you any less snag prone to have all that stuff on there. And with two, two folks who are relatively new to fly fishing and they were, they were eating the grasshopper right off the bat. And I mean, that's kind of one of the pinnacles of the fishing experience in my mind. So I'm like, let's go whole hog on that.

We stopped a few times and I nymphed. I think I caught like one whitefish doing that. So they were just coming up and smacking that grasshopper. Yeah, they were. Yeah. Did you catch any fish, Maggie? Yeah, I caught one 20 yards from the takeout. Big brown trout.

Yeah, nice brown. That's a beautiful fish. Probably the biggest fish I have caught. To date? Mm-hmm. What were we talking about the other day when we were fishing? Having your PB? Oh, my PR.

My PR. Personal record. No, not personal. PB. Personal best. PB is peanut butter and jelly, Steve. I didn't know this was a thing. Just say like my PR. My PR. People say PB.

A lot of fishermen use that. I heard it a few acronyms yesterday. I guess I've never heard that. PR is for runners. Maggie's been saying it since she was 14 years old. Yeah, running. Yeah, for running. That's where I get it. Not for fishing. Yeah, and you used an acronym yesterday that I hadn't heard in quite a while.

Was it LDR? Yeah. And I was like, damn it, I know this one. It was long distance release. yeah and you used an acronym yesterday that i hadn't heard in quite a while was it l ldr yeah and i was like damn it i know it's long distance really i did have one of those i was just being polite you know letting them get off very sporting of you yeah um i uh we fished this weekend where we went camping with our kids and our neighbors and their kids. And I had my first, I had sworn, I had vowed to never ride on a SUP. SUP, man. SUP, dude. SUP, dude. To ever ride on a SUP stand-up paddleboard.

But we were a little slow getting out the door on Friday, and I didn't bring my, and at the last minute, it was like, didn't bring my canoe. My kids have these little mini, these little mini old town kayaks. I shoved two of those in the back of the truck and my neighbor put in two subs and, and we wind up at these,

and we wind up at these lakes. And you could see, like, there's no way to get around the lake. You can't, like, walk the edge of the lake. I mean, you could, but it'd be just the worst thing on the planet. And there's an inlet coming in the far side of this lake. And my kids wanted their little kayaks, and they were being really selfish and rude. And so me and my neighbor had to get on his sup and rode it over to the inlet. And Holy smokes that we catch fish.

He was like, had his fly rod and was swinging this little nymph through there and catching them. But I had a, a, a Ziploc bag full of rotten nightcrawlers. Ooh, I heard about those. I heard about what those came from. No, it wasn't even those ones. Oh, it wasn't?

No. When they start to get all mushy and yellow. And then you put them in a bag and it's like 80. Oh, my God. It's just horrible. You had to position yourself so the sack was downwind, but my God, was I getting them. I just had to bleach my cooler to get some of those out from a trip last weekend.

My strategy, I just had a six-pound fluoro tippet, and I put the half of a rotten crawler on there in one split shot. It would basically cast up into the creek and let it just wash down all natural into the lake. Yeah, we grilled a stack of trout that night. So when you promised. They were all exactly the same size, which made me suspicious of that. When you swore you'd never use a sub. We grilled like eight that were this long. Did you alter that because you were doing it with another gut on there?

Does that make it better or does that make it worse? No, I had to weigh out what's worse, to not fish where you think you should be or to ride on a SUP. How do you rate the SUP now after you've done it? They don't handle the wind very well. Because then a hurricane force wind kicked up and I had to come back over by myself to go get my sinkers. It is extremely challenging to fish off one of those because you make a cast and then it spins

180 and you're fishing over your back all the time. You guys fish off sups? We have nine paddle boards. There's only two of you. Well, you need them for all different sorts of situations, Steve. You know at campgrounds they have those racks, those welded racks that sit on that U and

basically they're like gravity supported, like gravity lock. So you can control the height. Um, my neighbor had this giant tote full of hardwood scraps from his shop. And we just burned all those hardwood scraps down and filled one of those campground rings and then put that rack down there. And just covered that rack and cause we're fishing with the kids and everything just covered that rack and those trout it was good what kind of trout were they rainbows and we let some cuts go and then uh there's this old dude can't buy us by himself and i got to feeling bad for him and i went over invited him for dinner and he told me that he's got gout and don't eat seafood really not where i saw that going no i kept telling my kids go talk to that old man see if he wants to come to dinner and they

wouldn't do it so i was like i'll go over there um you're gonna when you leave here you're on a road trip right now yeah dave yeah playing concerts to 25 audience yeah if that uh i had a i had two shows one with another member of trampled by turtles we did a duo thing in cheyenne a few nights ago and then uh the one here down in pine creek um and that was it but i I had some time around it, so I kind of decided to make it a little solo road trip, camping around. Drove out through the Sandhills in Nebraska, which I'd never seen before, so that was a really cool experience to drive through that. And kind of made my way down to Cheyenne and then up through Shoshone

and camped up there, National Forest, and still trying to figure out my route home, which starts today. What percent, as a musician in this day and age where selling albums isn't really a thing anymore, what percent of your income do you have to pull from touring? I'd say about 90. So right now now you're just getting like brutalized by covid yeah yeah the whole music business for sure because everybody that's you know there's the ones of us that play but there's also the managers and booking agents

and um even to a certain extent the people that distribute recorded music all really depend on touring. That's the biggest way you publicize a release. It's where we make our money. It's where everybody that works for us, our crew and all that, make their money. It's a lot of people that are trying to figure out what to do depending on how long this lasts. How long has it been that you were curious about wanting to take up hunting? Do you view that this fall might be a great opportunity for you since you can't work? Well, it wasn't really that long.

I mean, so two years ago now, this fall will be two years, I went pheasant hunting for my first time. And that came about because there's this outdoor radio program on the Sports Talk radio station in Minneapolis. It's called Fan Outdoors on every Saturday. And Saturday mornings at my house, I always just had it on and become kind of a fan. And at one episode, they played some of our music. And they subsequently reached out to me and asked if I'd ever want to be on the show. And so I did that. they subsequently reached out to me and asked if I'd ever want to be on the show. I did that. During that process, they asked if I'd ever want to give pheasant hunting a try.

I grew up fishing and that was about it and camping, but I never thought one way or the other of hunting. I agreed to do it. It was the two gentlemen that took me out. It was Bob St. Pierre, who's one of the guys at Pheasants. Oh, yeah. No, I know him well. He's one of the hosts of the radio show.

And Billy Hildebrand, who's a retired tournament bass fisherman and teacher or whatever. But they took me up to Billy's cabin in central western Minnesota, kind of on the eastern edge of the prairie a little bit, and had an amazing first pheasant hunt. You know, we had birds everywhere. I was able to take a couple shots, and I was completely hooked after that first one. So since then... Did you get one? I did, yeah.

Yep, and I've been a few other times since and then have now gone out for grouse and woodcock a couple times each. And all through pretty much the generosity of these guys, using their dogs and showing me the ropes. But generally in a normal year, I don't have a lot of time at home between touring to do it. So last year I got out twice, I think, and this year is definitely looking a lot of time at home between touring to do it so you know last year i got out twice i think

and um this year is definitely looking a lot better for that does uh do yanni's coon dog training story speak to you as a as a person born in germany or is it there's a deep deep american as american as american who appreciates a good hunting dog. Watching those dogs work in a pheasant hunt was, obviously, I'd never seen that before. And it was really one of my favorite parts. I wouldn't say I'm in the market, but I'm leaning that way. Do you know the, I was in a, oh man, I was going to tell you something. I realize I'm not supposed to tell it.

Damn it. No, I can tell you. I don't see why you can't. I have a way I can tell it. Okay. I have reason to believe that our show, the TV show we do, that the highest viewer per capita

we get is in our own state. Okay. It's not surprising. No, I don't think so. Maggie's a big fan of yours. Is it because she's from Minnesota?

Well, it probably does. You're asking me or you're asking Matt? No, I'm asking Maggie. I turned my attention. I turned my gaze. I turned my gaze slightly rightward to Maggie. Follow the eyes. I got it probably does. You're asking me or you're asking Matt? No, I'm asking Meg. I turned my attention. I turned my gaze slightly rightward to Meg. Follow the eyes. I got it. Yeah, I think so.

I mean, that was my first exposure, right? So is it like, it's not like state pride because these guys are international or is it? I think it's become state pride for sure. So you associate? Of course. I mean, you sing a lot about Minnesota. There's a lot of things in there that I don't know, speak to me

How long have you been a fan? I think I found you guys in my senior year of high school Going into college That makes me feel old So, you want me to put a year on that? No, just roughly How did it come to be? How did it come to be? You saw him play?

No, I had a really good friend that was a huge, huge fan. He's going to be jealous of him. Oh, really? Got to hang out with you and fish and stuff. But, yeah, he introduced me to the music. And then, yeah, I just fell in love. And then we saw, first time we saw you was on the shores of Lake Superior. Atmosphere opened.

In Duluth. Another Minnesota band. Really? In Duluth. And then it was trampled. It was a fun mix of rap fans. And then. What year was that? That was...

What year was that? I graduated college. 15, 16? I think 14, yeah. Somewhere around there. Do you hate, as a musician, do you hate Spotify? No. No, I mean it's kind of a complicated relationship. Sure, that's how I

became a fan of yours. Really? It was just served to me on, it was served to me on just like the Discover Weekly function. That's the thing is that it's so great for exposure that it's hard to really be mad at them. You know, there's, well, right now what's really being highlighted, at least in my world, is the lack of, you know, what a lot of people consider adequate payment for what they do to the musicians and to the songwriters. But it's just how people, I mean, I listen to it all the time, you know, that's how I listen to music now. And I think for somebody who bases their income on touring, it's a really helpful tool because that's so many more people would hear your music than would have if they had to go to a store and buy a record or a cd you know like how often do you take a chance on

something you've never heard of in that way but now that touring is gone uh there is a lot of uh people kind of bringing up the fact that they don't they say that they seem to make a lot of money by paying musicians very little, I guess. But I don't know. It's one of those things. It's the way it is now, and it's a hard thing to change. It's hard to ask a company to say, okay, we'll make less money and pay you better, when they don't really have to.

There's nothing forcing them to do that. Your old man was in the military? He was, yeah. Was he tripped out that you became a musician? Did he want you to be a military man? No, he was actually very supportive. He didn't. No, he actually specifically told me he didn't want me to do that.

Not that it was up to him, you know, but he was active for, I don't know, most of my childhood. He was an officer? He was in counterintelligence. So he would be gone for, I remember one one year i think i was three or something he lived in korea for a whole entire year and he got kind of sick of that life so he went in the reserves for a while and then i mean that's why i was born in germany right because he was stationed there for a bit um and then got out and uh no i don't think he totally enjoyed his experience there so it never really he never promoted it anyway so he was fine to see you become a musician yeah i mean you know

i'm sure everybody was a little concerned at first when when you know i didn't know what the hell i was gonna do but i i tried to go to college for a year and that didn't work out and then started playing in bands and i was living in Duluth, Minnesota at the time and realized that's what I, I mean, that's, that's all I could think about doing. I couldn't think about another job or another career that sounded, uh, good to me at the time. So I decided to go for it and no, but I had the, I definitely had the support of my family and I'm sure they were worried about it, but none of them ever had any money either. So when, uh, when you're growing up trying to not grown up, but trying to break into becoming a musician, this all happened in Minnesota. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I started playing

there, but it didn't really become a full-time opportunity for me until we started touring around. So I wouldn't have been able to just, you know, quit my other job like I was able to if we would have just stayed and playing there. But it was definitely the long way to do it. I mean, we just started touring on our own. We had no infrastructure, no booking agent, nothing. We just call people and beg for work pretty much. And, you know, go to a town and there'd be five people there and hopefully six months later when we came back there'd be 20 people and um eventually got to the point where we could sustain it corinne sent me an article that was i think in this article you

had said something to the effect of and and the music scene in duluth like people would already people would start to resent you yeah if you could get to a position where you could charge a three dollar cover charge yeah they were already mad very rock and roll very rock and roll kind of punky you know do-it-yourself like it sold out right absolutely oh man the first time we did charge charge a cover it was you know I mean this is a small-scale incident, but we got so much slack for it. But there's part of that that I really love about that place where it's, at least in the music scene in Duluth,

from what I remember and from what I assume still goes on, has that mentality that you have to be this art-for-art's-sake kind of creator, which a lot of places don't, has that mentality that you have to be this art for art's sake kind of creator, which a lot of places don't, and a lot of spaces in working in music is just so far apart from that, that I like that there's that little pocket where it's kind of like that. Everybody brings their own sound gear to the show.

Everybody makes their own flyers. Everybody does their own thing like that, and it's cool. What is the... Did you write Winners? Yeah. Like, I've listened to that song a thousand times. But, like, I kind of understand what it's about, but I don't understand what it's about. Yeah.

Is it about what we're talking about? Yeah. Can you explain it a little bit? Actually, that's pretty accurate, I think. You know, I was talking to Sam about this on the river yesterday where we were talking about songwriting. And for me, I've always had a hard time thinking of a specific concept and writing a song literally about it. And for me, I feel like it works more where when I write,

it's just kind of distilling maybe a certain time period of experience into this thing and then maybe make the connection of the reason behind it after the fact a little bit. And so sometimes songs are maybe one verse is referencing one period of time and another different. But for that song in particular, that was pretty specifically about my time living in Duluth. Yeah, because you say in there, and you know how we feel about winters. Yeah. But there's a lot, there's parts I don't understand.

It's a loving, it's a loving relationship. Why does it say like nothing in the, but a hammer, nothing in the cabinet? What is it? Nothing but a hammer and a saw? Oh, you know, it rhymed with the other. And a nail to drive it home? Well, you know, there was this part in that song

where I talk about sleeping on a couch, which I was. I was living on my friend's couch for this little period of time. But you weren't studying law. No. It says you were. Yeah, well, that also rhymed. Were you lying to impress your mother? I think there's a difference between lying and not telling the truth.

No, I'm joking. I wouldn't hold you to that. I just thought maybe you were trying to impress your mom. Your mom would hear that song and she'd be like, I didn't know he was studying law. Yeah, I was working real hard at that time. You got to throw in health insurance and a steady paycheck. Man, I got health insurance.

There's nothing more rock and roll than health insurance and a steady paycheck. I got a good question for you. Just on the topic of cover charges. Yeah, but can you weave in your question, my question, because I'm still not satisfied with the answer. Oh, please go ahead then, Stephen. But what's it about? Nothing.

I don't care. I know what it's about. I know what it's about in my heart. That's what I like to hear, man. But was there a thing you said, you sat down and you said, damn it, I'm going to write a song about... No.

Okay. No, I didn't. I never write songs on purpose anyway. It's just, it's kind of an abstract process for me. But it was a lot, you know, once that one started to take form, I realized it was really about this like early 20s of my life, living in that town and deciding that I wanted to, you know,

make a go at playing music for my career, I guess, if you want to call it that. And just some instances from that time that stuck out, I guess, if you want to call it that. And just some instances from that time that stuck out, you know. If that's maybe about as specific as I can get. No, that's great. Okay. Like I said, I know what it's about in my heart. Well, that's the goal there.

And it's funny you hit on it, because it's like, there's a lot of uncertainty. You know, do you ever listen to the band Arcade Fire? Sure. Like, I like those guys. I do too.

Yeah. I don't know that I agree. I probably wouldn't agree with them on politically. No? At all. But I like them. Yeah. And I feel that they have,

when I'm trying to describe what I like about them, is I feel that they are, like this sort of infectious, it's like exhilaration, but tinged with some very serious apprehension. Okay. And the winner's tune has a lot to do with being uncertain at an uncertain part of your life in a town. Sure.

In a town that's aware of itself. Yeah, and looking back at it from about 15 years later, too. Because that was some harrowing shit. I get what you're saying. Being in your 20s, man. Your late 20s is harrowing. Yeah, it was also some of the best times of my life in a really exciting way. When we started to tour, there were four of four of us in a van and I hadn't

really not traveled much outside of the Midwest at all. And so coming to see the mountains for the first time and see the ocean for the first time and all of that, I mean, every day it's, it's long and boring a lot of the times, but it was also this kind of in retrospect and through a romantic lens now is this kind of grand adventure that I was able to have at that time. We were sleeping on people's floors. There was no internet, so it was still like this mysterious process. And playing music with some of my best friends are still some of my best friends.

So it was pretty great. Gil? I feel like you kind of tiptoed around, I think, one of your favorite arguments, which is Okie from Muskogee. That's like, well, what did you mean when you wrote Okie from Muskogee? What were you trying to say? There's been some drama over that, hasn't there? Right, exactly.

Oh, tell me more. I'm an old song, and I'm proud to be. One half of the country is like It is a conservative theme song Anthem Oh it's not? It just rhymed man No It's like we don't smoke marijuana

From a dude who smoked a lot of marijuana From his From whatever That's a good point Lived on a houseboat in Lake Shasta Well I thought he was kind of who smoked a lot of marijuana from his, from whatever. That's a good point. Lived on a houseboat and lived on a houseboat in Lake Shasta. Well,

I thought he was kind of making, like, tongue-in-cheek in it a little bit, right? Yes. Oh,

he was? Well, how many people have screwed up, how many people have screwed up Springsteen's Born in the USA?

Yeah, it's Merle Haggard. Lived on a houseboat in Lake Shasta. Yeah, it's Born in the USA, that anti-Vietnam song. Yeah.

You know, a Vietnam War song. He's like, but wait a minute. That's the song. It's like saying like, hold on, but wait a minute,

man. That's Born in the USA. It's not supposed to happen. Well, maybe that goes back to you know what it means in your heart, you know?

I like, as a songwriter, and that's what hits me about songs that I love is the fact that I can relate something in that, like I get a feeling that I understand what's happening in there, the song. And a lot of times it's, man, that person went through this experience and they wrote about it in this way

that I would never think of doing. And that's, you know, like Bob Dylan's blown my mind that way so many times and a lot of other writers. But to have somebody kind of take their own narrative and their own understanding of a song and leave it at that, that's my favorite. If they're, you know, sometimes when you find out

what a certain line is actually about, it's kind of a letdown. I don't know if this is true. I've heard, I feel like from my brother, this would be a good one for Spencer's fact checker. I heard that Sammy Hagar once said that his lyrics came from misunderstanding other people's lyrics. And then when you find out what they're actually saying, you're like, oh shit, that's not what I thought it was. I'm going to write a song with what I thought it was in it that's even better yeah but i don't know what he was listening to that

made him think of i can't drive 55 like what song did he think they were saying i can't drive 55 yeah he's just got really bad hearing or something but i'll tell you i'll give you a hot tip if you want a good line for a song it's what i used to think they were saying in a U2 song. I used to think there was a U2 song where he said the line, a few broken bones and some loose change. Uh-huh. But it's not what he's saying. What song is that? I don't know what that is. Carry the cry.

Fuck. It's, um. Exactly. How does it go? You should write a song with the line, a few broken bones and some loose change, because that's rich. That is pretty good. You probably never had anything approaching that. So I got to give you like a producer credit.

Yeah, I don't see you writing that down, Dave. We can wait. It's all up here. A few broken bones. Think of the image that sets. Yeah, it's dark. I like it. Hey, folks. Hey folks, exciting news for those who live or hunt in Canada.

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on x maps.com slash meet welcome to the to the on x club y'all i do i like uh your kind of origin story, your line of, you know, didn't sort of matter if there was money in it because nobody else in the family had money anyway. Yeah. I feel like there's more pressure on kids to earn a high level of income if their parents are doing it. Oh, you mean when you meant family,

you mean like you didn't come, like you grew up not wealthy. Yeah, right. I thought you meant family, like family musicians. No. There's a great line from just Todd Schneider, favorite singer-songwriter.

Yeah, Doug Duren. Oh, Doug loves him. I don't know what Todd Schneider looks like, but when I close my eyes, I see Doug Duren. Oh, Doug loves him. I don't know what Todd Schneider looks like, but when I close my eyes, I see Doug Duren. Todd Schneider is a long-haired leaping gnome. He is just this lanky... Looks like he could walk forever,

but I don't get the impression he does. So he doesn't look... Doug Duren's built basically like Bigfoot. Shave a lot of weight and keep the height. Okay. Yeah, but he's got this line that says, having nothing is almost like having it all. And I just find it very fitting a lot of times.

Yeah. It's like, well, I don't have anything to lose, so why not try? Or I could see that as kind of a simple life metaphor right like i look back for instance at the time we were just talking about in my life when there was no money there was no house or kids or all the stuff wonderful and otherwise that's come since then but it's an easier way it's probably easier on your head that way too you know we touched on it we were talking about sleeping in the back of the truck yesterday yeah it's like it's just simple and because of the simplicity it gets you out more or it gets you going more man i know it's fun to sit around

romanticizing being broke and like there's a lot of good stuff that comes out of being broke and i was broke a long time like broke to the point where you were deathly afraid of going to the hospital right like i remember waking up one time with paramedics standing over me, and I woke up with paramedics standing over me and ran off into the night. The only thing in my mind being, this isn't going to be cheap. Yeah, man, we laugh, but that's not even that funny. So, but, like, my dad had a quote he liked. I think he made it up.

He said, I've been rich and I've been poor. It's better being rich. Well, that's the thing now is I wouldn't choose to go back right now. I think if it happens at the right time in your life, there might be some lessons learned in there. I think everybody maybe would probably benefit for at least one year of poverty in their life. Oh, I think so. But I don't think poverty counts. Like, I don't think that people who don't have children should be allowed to use the word poverty.

Right, right, right. Yeah, I agree with that. It's not. It's just something different. Yeah. It's like, you're broke. Like, you're broke. Yeah.

But some people never even get that. Because I lived many years, like, below the federal poverty limit. But I would never, as a magazine writer, I would never have described myself. No. Because a lot of it's self-inflicted. Unless you're worried about feeding your kids. Yeah. It's like, mostly self-inflicted. Unless you're worried about feeding your kids. Yeah, it's like mostly self-inflicted.

It's like you also drink all the time. Yeah. And you also like are always like doing like two-week backpacking trips, hunting in Alaska. Right. So it's like it just doesn't jibe with poverty. Like you just don't have any money because you have chosen not to. Right.

But kids is different. Kids is different. Then I'm like, okay, unleash not to. Right. But kids is different. Kids is different. Then I'm like, okay, unleash the word. Yeah. I got to tell you my cover story. It's not really a scam because I felt like it was very beneficial. But growing up in Missoula,

there's always a lot of music around. And we also chose not to have a lot of money at that point and um so what i would do is i'd go up to you know typically somebody in the band or of the band is sitting there working the door on the on the cover side of things like like taking cash. And so I would figure out if the cover was going to the house or getting split by the house, and if it would be better off for the band, in their best interest. To sneak in. If we bought, like, two t-shirts.

Oh, right. We'd figure out something, right? We'd be like, well, what is the band getting? And then I'd be like, cool, I'm going to have five people here. We're going to buy two t-shirts. You put five people on the guest list. And they'd be like, done, half the time. That's amazing.

Yeah, it was great. Yeah, I would have said yes to that. Yeah, I mean, do you think those people... That's a lot of thought put into that. It's really sweet. I appreciate it. I could have been thinking about just making honest living and forking over my three bucks, but instead...

Well, that's amazing. Yeah, that's a heartwarming tale. Yeah, does that work for you? It does, yeah. It would still work, probably. Good, because I kept thinking about that, i was like oh man could i just ask on that note what is the best way to support artists and musicians right now is it merch is it physical media like boy that is a great question uh yeah it's it's merch really uh Physical media included, but most artists out there have a website,

and most of those websites have a store. And so every T-shirt or sticker, record, or whatever you buy off there, it all helps. Do you like that band Typhoon? I don't know the band Typhoon. They had a T-shirt that I really want, and it's out of stock, and I always try to go buy it, and I can never buy it. It's out of stock.

It's $30. Oh, man. I can't get one. I'm half-bought ready to write buy it, and I can never buy it. It's out of stock. It's $30. Oh, man. I can't get one. I'm half-bought ready to write them in and see if I can buy his. Trying to jack up the price, maybe. You know all the band Typhoon? Uh-uh. I could be right up your alley, man.

Really? Yeah, I'll check them out. Todd Schneider's got a sticker that says, Todd Schneider rules, and it hasn't been in stock for like five years, I keep checking. You know, my older brother, he doesn't like bluegrass and you guys have a strong bluegrass influence sure you know what his criticism of bluegrass is

what that it has too many notes I agree with that at full hearted I feel like and I listen to it and I'm like yeah there's a lot of notes

yeah I do think that and you think that too yeah I do I'm definitely more of like I feel like maybe it's because I do. I'm definitely more of, I feel like maybe it's because I've never been schooled in my instrument or whatever, but I prefer a bit more space

and maybe more well-placed notes than more notes just for having more notes, if that makes sense. Do you know the musician Robert Earl Keene? Yeah, I do. His song Bluegrass Widow, where he made a bluegrass song by stringing together all the titles of bluegrass songs.

That's a great bluegrass song. Do you, where, where does Trampled by Turtle sit in like the bluegrass genre? Cause it, I would imagine, uh, your guys' style is probably like poo-pooed by some people in the bluegrass scene. It's like, oh, there's too much electric stuff or it's too fast or it's too much on the rock and roll spectrum. It absolutely is, yeah.

They get pissed because you guys win best bluegrass album. And it's really not, I mean, I don't care what people call this band, right? If you want to call them, if you want to call us bluegrass or not, I don't care. it doesn't matter but to a lot of people the word bluegrass is this very holy and specific thing and it's uh in that circle um and i got a lot of friends in there we do a lot of festivals in that world and um a lot of friends playing in bands in that world but and it's not even the musicians themselves it it's the fans. And they have this thing where there's very tight parameters and it's very rule-based kind of songs,

and it's really heavily focused on incredible technical skill. And that's not really my vibe in anything musically. I don't really care how great somebody is at their instrument if they can't play something that really evokes some kind of emotional reaction. So I think, yeah, in that traditional bluegrass world, I think a lot of them wouldn't even consider us a part of it, which is fine.

We dabble in it sometimes. We're lucky enough where we can go, we'll play a bluegrass festival like a bluegrass festival, you know, in Appalachia or something. But then we're also able to play other things like, you know, we play Coachella and like rockier things as well, which I'd much rather be in that kind of muddy water than have to clearly define something that, by its very nature, should grow and change as it goes along, I think. Seems like to some bluegrass fans,'s almost like bourbon, where if it didn't come from Kentucky, it doesn't matter. I live in Missoula for

a long time. There's a lot of people that are really snobby about bluegrass. It's funny to see how things get defined and legitimized sometimes when it's still great music. None of the musicians that I know, even in the traditional bluegrass world, really share any of that perspective.

It's people that have this thing that they believe is theirs, which is fine. They're allowed to have it, you know, and they're allowed to like whatever they like. But to ask, you know, to like expect a band because they have a banjo in it to do this way, this thing a certain way, excuse me, to me is just kind of silly. To have rules about who gets to have a banjo yeah or how they're supposed to play it you know like our banjo player for instance is this is maybe too far into this hole but plays with a like a guitar pick which i mean is simple enough he just learned how to play it that way and he's really good at it that way um but in for instance like in the bluegrass community that's super taboo to do that,

which we didn't know when we started. We were in Duluth, you know, like there's no bluegrass there. And we were like trying, we were trying to pretend we were from Appalachia or anything. We were just writing our own songs and using those instruments, you know? And so we'd show up to play and he'd get so much shit for that pick that it was like, what is this? What do the traditionalists use? Fingers. Just their fingers? Or fingers, like finger picks.

So even the distinction between a piece of metal on your finger or a piece of plastic in your fingers is enough. So I was honestly turned off by that pretty early on and have softened my view on it a bit now as I've gotten older. But I love some of the music, you know. I just, like, finding a place for rules in any kind of creative pursuit just seems counterintuitive to me. The abundance of notes notwithstanding.

Abundance of notes notwithstanding. What bluegrass manages to do, though, is it's earthy. Yeah. It's like the traditional bluegrass music is sort of born of the earth. The old stuff. It like feels. It's very honest. Yeah.

I think that pop, top 40 pop country, whatever you call modern country, top 40 country. Sure. Feigns an earthiness. i agree with that and old country too you know country from the 50s or whatever those were people that lived in the country and wrote about their experience that's the smells of alcohol it's so great and that same thing about the early bluegrass people they were living in those hills and mining and they were writing songs about that and it felt like from the earth, you know, like what you said. Which I really did.

Like it grew out of the dirt, you know. And it's a later interpretation or imitation of that, I think, has kind of less substance maybe. Do you, you grew up around, like hanging around outside at least. Absolutely. Even if you weren't into the real dark arts of yeah hunting and what yeah what was your you know what was your exposure to nature well my my dad and i uh would you know would camp a lot and you know for one thing but um

in minnesota there's this great lake culture, right? And every, uh, not everybody, obviously I don't, but a lot of people, especially back when I was a kid, when it was a little more affordable to do it, have cabins on lakes. And this is pretty like, you got 10,000 of them, right. And a middle-class thing that people were able to do without, um, needing now, now it's a little harder to buy a place like that. But anyway, my grandparents had one. So I grew up fishing on lakes since I could hold a rod, really. And then later in my teenage years, my dad and I kind of got into backpack camping

up in the Superior National Forest and hiking on the Superior Hiking Trail and that kind of stuff up in up in northern minnesota and then ice fishing as well which i haven't done for a while now you grew up around the ice hole a little bit though do you feel that um do you feel that the the the natural world like like give something to music or do you think it's just totally separate i don't think it can be separate at all i don't maybe it depends on the music or the person making the music because you know there's a lot of people in music who don't spend a lot of time doing any of that sure man um but for me yeah absolutely i just it's always been the, just the outdoors and it's such a broad thing, I know to say, but it's always just been where I've gone, you know, whenever I have the opportunity to go somewhere or the, um, the need to get out of town or whatever, it's always, you know, in a tent or the truck or now it's out in the field. Um, and it's kind of where i recharge my batteries it always has been it's interesting i mean you just point out this thing like you don't need nature to make music

i do yeah no i'm just yeah i agree you know you're pointing out one does not because that's like a a little bit of a conundrum um where uh even like in raising kids, I, you know, I would argue that I think it does kids good to have a very extreme version of a relationship to nature. I agree. But I see people raise really wonderful, loving,

generous kids in the middle of giant cities. Right. Who could give a rat's ass about nature yeah so i'm like okay i find it helpful uh-huh is it the way to do it it's one way to do it you know your kids it's one way to do it it is right right and it those kids would probably be able they could grow up anywhere and be fine like you said but maybe that's your way of of showing whatever that thing is that you want to show your kids, your way of doing it is out there. Yeah, I don't have another method. Right. Somebody who's grown up in Paris or something,

their way of doing it has to be different. I'm the same. I have two kids. I have a 9-year-old daughter and a 7-year-old son, and my favorite times with them have been outside. We've been fishing now um they love to camp and it's where it's kind of where everything makes sense to both of us maybe that's where like the venn diagram crosses over that's a good point yeah where where we and they're still young enough where we get along all the time really but i'm hoping that translates into

their teenage years where like for me when my when when I was 16 or 17 and I wanted nothing to do with my parents, I would still love to go camping with my dad. And that was the time when we would actually talk and actually spend time together on more of a level playing field maybe can you think of a actual sort of moment or an actual way or a song or something where an experience outdoors like you know was manifested somehow in the thing you made Or is it all just background? Well, that's a good question. No, I do think it is, I would say, mostly background. But I think that, you know, I definitely have, like, lines or references to it all over the place. But I think a lot of when I'm thinking about writing a song and I'm working on it and I'm missing a line here

or something like that, a lot of the times, like, writing a song and I'm working on it and I'm missing a line here or something like that, a lot of the times references in some way to the outdoors is kind of the first thing that comes up, like describing how the light is or how it sounds or just things that you're a little more hyper-aware of when you're outside. I put a solo record out in March, and I think I noticed more of that stuff a little bit more in the forefront in some of those songs. But I've also been so much more focused on being in the outdoors now. I mean,

for so long with touring full time, I had let a lot of that stuff go. For maybe 10 years, I didn't spend a lot of time out in the woods or on the water or whatever. And it's really in the last three or four years has really been coming back to me really like more powerfully than it really ever has in my life. So I think the references to that are getting a little more literal in there. You know, I was plugging that band Typhoon. There's a song, I think it's called The Lake. If you listen to it real careful, it's like's like this crystalline moment in it where it's fourth

of july and the singer and his sister are playing she's trying to make a loon sound and they go down to a lakeshore and he doesn't realize it but he says a different bug must have bit my leg but i never saw it and it's about lyme disease you never know unless you listen to it like a gazillion times but yeah it's about lyme disease wow but he never says lyme disease in it yeah a different bug must have been from minnesota because it sounds like they're just on the dock no they're from they're in oregon but he talks about but there's like nature references yeah yeah okay you know it's like it's like real nature references that you wouldn't know if you didn't spend time in nature yeah i think when i was talking about top 40 country it's like i sometimes don't buy the

references yeah it'd be like you know it's almost like you know when you watch really if you watch really bad you know like bad writers and they're trying to imagine like what a redneck family is like, they'd be like, oh, have them fix something with duct tape. They like that. Uh-huh. Right. What rhymes with duct tape? And they're like, or, you know, a thing they do is, you know, have like a real, violent parenting style. They like that.

Right? You know what I'm saying? But people, they don't know what they're talking about. Right. They don't know. I was watching a show not long ago, and they had a scene where there was supposed to be some carpenters working.

And you could tell that the writer, nor the director, nor anyone on that set had ever seen a carpenter work in the life there's a whole room of people building a house not one of them was doing anything you would do in the process of building a house they had no idea yeah and i think there's this thing in top 40 country where it's like they're like oh yeah you'd have a truck yeah and i feel like you'd you'd load up your girlfriend, I imagine, and take her to the river in the truck. Probably on a gravel road.

That seems like a thing they would enjoy. Yeah, on a gravel road. Yeah, and it's like, really? Do you really know this? Like, do you know this? Or do you feel that this is a thing? In that world too, a lot of the, most I would say, and not having any statistics in front of me,

but most of those songs are written in office buildings by other people. There's songwriting shops. People go nine to five and write songs based on record sales. And what somebody is telling them sells really well. I remember a couple years ago somebody had put a video together of, I think it was nine of the top ten country songs at that moment and found almost the exact same line in every single one and cut it together.

So different artists all had the same basic chorus and the same basic because at that point somebody knew that connecting with that in somebody is what sells records. And I think what you're saying is right. It's a lot of the like just let's just list off things they like yeah they're supposed to like

but i what i like about it is it's like of all the music right now it's the music that's most references it's the music that most references nature sure it like references agriculture right it references labor in the outdoor like there's all these things that i'd kind of like but the delivery always feels like a little yeah inauthentic too because i like that as well i wish there was more of that and other stuff or maybe that because in rock like in like nickelback or whatever it's just they're not i don't know if they do they reference agriculture? Quick. I don't know, man. That is, I mean, that's country music. It's supposed to be in the country, right?

It's supposed to come from out of town, people that live and work and grow up away from the city. But in reality, most of it comes from downtown Nashville, you know? Yeah. And from people that live in Nashvilleashville and don't farm you know so that's where it came from but now it's now it's a style that you kind of sculpt yourself to fit you know some of it starts to feel like a caricature of of the rural lifestyle i mean there's the old joke like you play a country song backwards and you get the farm back and you get

your dog back and your truck back and your girlfriend back. But yeah, that, that's why I like stuff like you guys do. It just feels a lot more, a lot more authentic and you can tell people actually, actually get out and get out and do it. It's not just based on demographics. I will say when we started,

you know, this band started as a, as a, as a side project. Well, we were all playing in rock bands. I'd never played in anything acoustic-based or folk music or bluegrass or whatever.

I mean, my first band was a punk band when I was 18. What was the name of it? Simple Junction. Simple Junction? Yeah, I don't know. Obviously, band names aren't my strong suit. My same brother that doesn't like bluegrass, he has a hobby where he just comes up with great band names.

Let me know if you need one. Are they great? Great. Repeat Offender. That's a cover band. Yeah, it is. Steve, we did this in post-production.

Carl Hansi and I have a list of band names up there. Oh, you do? I've come up with great ones. From things that we've heard. Editing. Whenever when it counts.

Ginger Snapper. I know what the hell that means. They all sound like bands that play at like the VFW on Tuesday nights or something. Yeah. But when I was doing that, when we started this band, it was just something to explore. Simple Junction.

Yeah. What does that even mean? There's no proof that it ever existed, I don't think, either. Which is one of the nice things about being that age before Spotify or before YouTube or anything. But we were copying stuff. You know, like, I'd never played a bluegrass song before. Our mandolin player had just bought a mandolin at a garage sale. And we were like, well, and I've never even heard the music before.

So we, at that time, right at the end of the time where you do this, we found music. We found, like found CDs of bluegrass music. And we learned a few songs. It was just this kind of fun thing we did maybe once a month at a little bar. Because there was nothing like that in Duluth that we knew of anyway. So we started. And then I think any time you do that, at least for me, I should say, the first thing you do is kind of copy somebody else. When I started writing songs, I wanted to be Bob Dylan or something.

So you write like that and then maybe use the same chord structure and make it sound like it, maybe even outright steel stuff. And we would do that with Trampled. And then when we decided, we got a little bit older and decided that we wanted, this was going to be our band, then we tried to go reel that back and you know make our own music just with these instruments instead of the ones that we were used to the mimicry thing that you're mentioning like i like how you're almost like matter of fact about it i think everybody does it yeah i agree yeah and watching uh when i was going through school and watching so many

aspiring writers um learn their learn their groove sure everybody's trying to copy someone the good writers are just people like everyone tries to copy and no one can get it right the good ones are just that their facsimile that the facsimile they're trying to produce is misses the mark but hits something interesting. Right. It'd be like you're shooting at a buck, you know, like a forky, and you miss it but hit like a booner.

And then you go there, you're like, yeah, yeah, that's what I... Meant to do that the whole time. Yeah. So I was like, yeah, yeah, that's what I, meant to do that the whole time. Yeah. So I was like, I was like, I was like, I'm going to be like John McPhee and Ian Frazier.

That's how I'll write. Yeah. Well, I think a little Joan Didion tossed in, right? I think everybody starts that way. Right. Anything like any of those people.

Right. But you gotta, I think everybody in any creative field starts with that. Cause you all, the reason you do it is because this stuff has had such an effect on you. At least for me. I wanted to play music because that was the most important thing in my life. That's the thing that had made

me, you know, it had changed my life by listening to it. And so there's no other way to start, I don't think, rather than copying somebody else. And then eventually I think you kind of mix all those little influences in and find your own style. I'm sure you did as a writer as well. And then it becomes your thing. And then eventually, I think you kind of mix all those little influences in and find your own style.

I'm sure you did as a writer as well. And then it becomes your thing. And I think that every artist is just their distillation of all that stuff that's in them, all those experiences, all the people they read or listened to, and it boils down into this little goo that's just their own thing. It's very continuous, I think. So Trampled by Turtles was coming on the scene, like, as I had kind of made another life transition to, like, guiding, like, whitewater and fly fishing outside a glacier national park.

Okay. Right? And, like, national parks, you get a bunch of people from all over the country and all over the world to come in and work. And then plus the visitors and everything. And, um, this was, uh, as a lot of outfits are, there's kind of like a communal living situation too, uh, with, with guides. And, uh, and then there's all the park employees and stuff that are in the exact same thing. So you get exposed to a lot of music. And then certain music like really takes off. Right.

And everybody's listening to the same thing. Right. And so Trampled by Turtles had this amazing run in these circles. And you could hear Trampled by Turtles all the time. And I'm always the guy who's like, who sings that? Who sings that? Hey, who sings that again? I just thought like when you start thinking about legacies, right?

Sure. Where you can have this thing that exists and means like polar can have absolute opposite meaning to like the same groups of people where, um, you have a bunch of young folks out for the first time away from mom and dad. Um, there's a lot of partying going on. Uh, people are drinking too much. They got a lot of freedom. Uh, there's a lot of sex going on there's drugs there's uh rock and roll just listening to trampled by turtles and um like your legacy of like writing you have produced this this content that means the entire emotional spectrum to people.

Where it's like, I broke up to this song. I fell in love to this song. I made a child to this song. You know? That's, yeah, I don't know what to say to that, but that's great. I hope so, I guess. But I guess I have that from music for me. That's why I get attached to some stuff as well. But have you ever run into somebody

who's like, I'm going to punch that Dave Simonette right in the head next... My girlfriend ran off. Yeah, that's happened. I did have a guy jump on stage in Seattle once and choke me while I was playing. But I don't know if that was from... Oh, my God. What was his problem? I don't know.

I never found out. You didn't get the context. No, I didn't. I really... First thing that came to my mind, too, was like, why? Why did you choose now? Help me understand this. No, I never saw him again and if you're

out there shoot me an email in the music world is it uh yeah you just adjusted your mic were you fixing to say something i got a question but i can ask later it's not uh please don't Please. Don't make me beg for it. Do you have a guess at how many shows you've played? No. I don't. No. Like annually during your busiest times? Do you know? I do know that. I mean, during our busiest couple years, which was probably 2010 to 2012, maybe, something like that. About 150, 160 a year. And now we're at a pretty solid 70-ish, maybe, which still feels really busy. I don't know when we fit all the other ones in,

but we were just kind of on the road all the time. That was before I had kids. Another guy in our band's got a couple kids, and definitely the urge to be home. The older I get, the urge to be home is a lot stronger. What's the drug scene like in bluegrass music? With the old bluegrass guys. Are they like alcoholics or what are they?

Like the old guys. The old classic bluegrass guys. I think a lot of those guys. Are they in the pharmaceuticals and stuff? You know, the ones that are so alive you're talking about? Like the legit bluegrass player. Like a legit bluegrass player. There's not many of those guys around you know don't i can

dell mccurry is probably the only person from that period of time who actually played in like some of the original bluegrass bands and he's 82 or something like that he's he's a wonderful man and who has had us play with his band before he throws a great festival in maryland and from what i've seen of him and his kids are his band you know it's a real traditional thing um and they're really great um but i you know they're all pretty at least on the outside pretty stand-up church going yeah you know well mom's here put the beer away kind of kind of crowd because you got that song about codeine here, put the beer away, kind of crowd. Because you got that song

about codeine. Yeah, well, I didn't grow up in that crowd, you know. Yeah. Yeah. It's like a country song about codeine.

What's that one about? There's drugs in things. That's finally an easy question. There's drugs in every scene. I mean, and every,

you know, probably every office you go into. I don't think that's just a music thing anymore. You think so? Yeah. When, in the music world, when you get like, oh, you know, you're getting interested in hunting. I want to go hunting. Was there a temptation to be closeted about it because you'd get in trouble? No, not at all.

I've actually really enjoyed that conversation. But I will say that it might be a little different if I was, you know, I don't know, maybe if it were a more urban band. You know, we have a lot of pretty outdoor active, that's probably not the right way to say that, but people, fans who are active in the outdoors. So I don't think it was a huge leap for me to start talking publicly about hunting, right? Oh, like it wasn't totally unexpected.

Yeah, it wasn't like, what? But yeah, in the music world, it's not, I wouldn't say in my experience in the music world, it's not a very common activity for people to do. It's been interesting conversations I've had with other musicians from bands much different than ours. Honestly, most of the response that I've gotten is curiosity. A lot of people want to give it a shot. They want to give it a shot they want to try it out i mean i've kind of gotten a few a few friends that are going to come out this year um that had never done it or families have never

done it you know they've maybe never even slept in a tent kind of kind of friends you know but the when i talk about the activity to them um i mean you guys know more than anybody probably the different conceptions of hunting that exist in the public eye, right? And which is something I'm new to. But I had my own preconceptions about it before. And now that I've done it. What was that? I was definitely on the side of things that saw it as, you know, I mean, you know, kind of like this redneck-y activity.

Chasing raccoons all around. Driving raccoons way off to a field. It turns out I was right. No, but, you know, I don't think I was never like anti-hunting or whatever. I have uncles and family members that hunt and, you know, whatever. It's great. But it wasn't something that I was interested in until I had the offer to go. And so I took that as a lesson.

But there must have been. That can't be it. It can't be like you never thought about it, had no interest, but then got invited to go and went. Yeah, pretty much. Really? Yeah. I would never do that. It never really crossed my mind, you know, until I started talking to Bob St. Pierre.

And, you know, he brought it up. But you said you started to like his radio show oh yeah I listen to it all the time so then that caught you

in a lie I don't know if that's a lie you must have been interested why the hell are you listening to the show

it's good radio and it's a lot of it's a lot of fishing talk and uh yeah oh because you liked fishing

and yeah but fishing and hunting are like very close cousins they are really close

close close cousins I agree. But yeah, I don't know, man. There's like a rule I made. I need to name it. Everyone who traps knows how to hunt and fish. Everyone who hunts knows how to fish.

Everyone who fishes, I don't know what they know how to do. Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah, I don't know what they know how to do. Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah, I do. So they're like, you weren't going like down the ladder. You were going like up the ladder. Sure. Yeah, I'd say that. I mean, it does need a name.

So you listen to a morning show because you like the fish talk. No, I also, honestly, you like the fish talk no i also i also honestly i like the outdoors talk these guys are very um you know they this is my first experience with people that are that are hunters right and when they talk about hunting they talk about the walk and the dogs and the weather and like the um maybe a bit more the romantic side of it that i had never really had a exposure to before and it resonated with me because that's the same a lot more the romantic side of it that i had never really had a exposure to before and it resonated with me because that's the same a lot of the stuff they were talking about is a lot of the things that i felt when i was taking a walk or whatever but without the same goal in mind and

they were really just you know there's kind of the steward of the land conservationist perspective of hunting and then the the the part of getting your own food, which I mean, obviously I knew that's what happened when you hunt, but I'd never really made that connection of how nice it would be to do that. Even though I fished and ate fish, you know, but maybe an extension of that or something. So, I mean, that's the stuff to me that drew me in when I started, when I went that first time.

I was out with this group of guys who had spent their whole lives doing this, and then I got to see it from their perspective, which then just made sense to me. It made complete sense to me once I did it. And it was also fun as hell. When birds popped up out of the— I'd never experienced anything like that before. It wasn't like anything I had done. When a pheasant jumped up out of the cover

that a dog had just pointed, and I saw the first guy shoot one, it's like, this, I'm in. This is so great. Wait till you see your coon dog face it. Doesn't get any better than that. Boy, when you open up that half a heart and that raccoon comes screaming out of there,

boy, that gets the blood pumping. Oh, half a heart. Yeah, well, I have room to explore now. It's just a couple years of firsts right now, so it's been pretty great. And you went woodcock hunting. I did. Well, we were grouse hunting,

but they were legal at the same time and in the same woods. And did you find some? Yeah. That's something I'm, I'm real interested in checking out. Yeah. I want to, want to find some. Yeah. I, that, you know, I'd been pheasant hunting twice and then I went in the grouse woods and, uh, I was, I thought I was like, there's no way in hell I'm going to shoot something in these trees except trees, you know, like seeing, watching a bird fly up in that cover is so thick. Well, when you do shoot, it looks like you hit a bunch of trees. Oh, yeah, that's all it has is like leaves.

No matter what, there's a bunch of leaves going everywhere. I definitely have shot a lot of trees now. But I was able to get a couple grouse and a couple wilcock. Oh, really? Yeah. Oh, so you're like proficient. Well, I don't know about that, but. Hitting rough grouse is not, I mean, anybody can, I shouldn't say anybody.

Hitting a rough grouse, but hitting two rough grouse is good. Thanks. I, it took me maybe. Scares the shit out of you. Scares the shit out of you. Especially when it's right at your feet. And it always is, right? And the only time I've ever seen him come up has been right in front.

And then, you know, somebody who didn't i'm still in that phase right where walking through the woods and lifting a gun to my shoulder and getting all that stuff right is brand new even you know so i still i still a lot of it's conscious movement for me still so it's you know i'm a little behind the behind the jump on that but uh i also don't want to want to shoot my buddy, you know? So I'm still in, like, the conscious gun safety mode as well because I've just, I mean, I took my gun safety, Minnesota gun safety course while I was on tour, you know,

in green rooms. I was on the computer doing my gun safety course. So it's pretty brand new. For those who want to know what happens in the green room, it doesn't get any more rock and roll than that. And in this green room, Dave Simonetta is taking his online gun safety. I like that you just switched it to Simonetta. Well, that's what I feel like it ought to be.

Simonetta. Hey, folks. Exciting news for those who live or hunt in canada and boy my goodness do we hear from the canadians whenever we do a raffle or sweepstakes and our raffle and sweepstakes law makes it that they can't join our northern brothers get irritated well if you're sick of you know sucking high and titty there, OnX is now in Canada. The great features that you love in OnX are available for your hunts this season. The Hunt app is a fully functioning GPS with hunting maps

that include public and crown land, hunting zones, aerial imagery, 24K topo maps, waypoints, and tracking. That's right. We're always talking about OnX here on the MeatEater podcast. Now you guys in the Great White North can be part of it. Be part of the excitement. You can even use offline maps

to see where you are without cell phone service. That's a sweet function. As part of your membership, you'll gain access to exclusive pricing on products and services handpicked by the OnX Hunt team. Some of our favorites are First Light, Schnee's, Vortex Federal, and more. As a special offer, you can get a free three months to try OnX out if you visit onxmaps.com slash meet. onxmaps.com slash meet. onxmaps.com slash meet.

Welcome to the OnX Club, y'all. Yanni, can we return something real quick? There's two things I didn't get to up top that I want to still touch on. Because you talking about listening to the radio in Minnesota made me think of this. You found out why I don't like car talk. i already know why i don't like car talk i'm so curious uh refresh us on why you don't like car talk because they they screen people and then they have people on in order to express these old man-y sentiments about what they're doing. So it'd be like, I was driving my boyfriend's car, right?

Your boyfriend's car. And it just goes on and on. Yeah. We did a poll, I think last time we podcasted, and I didn't have anybody on my team. Either they hadn't heard of it or nobody was in it. You love it, but you're from Minnesota, so now Steve's going to say you're out.

Cal? Car Talk's from Massachusetts, though, isn't it? I know, but I think Minnesota people, per capita, listen to more Puppet Radio than anybody on the planet. We can cut all this out, Phil. Yeah, what's the name of the street? What's the street that Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me's on? Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me's in Chicago, I think. Yeah, it's in Chicago.

No, what's the... Downtown Minneapolis. Oh, yeah. On Minnehaha Street or something. You're talking about Prairie Home Companion. Oh, Prairie Home Companion, yeah. That's supposed to take... Lake Wobbegon.

That's a fictional town. There's a street... Never mind. Anyway, I'm absent-minded. Cut all this out. No, we're going the wrong way. I'm going another question. I'm ready for my next question.

I'm going to tell you. It's just because you're not into the subject matter. I am too. If those... Really? You're into cars? Yeah, of course. Hugely into cars.

Just because you drive one every day. And when they're broken, I wish they weren't. And I want to fix it. That doesn't make you into cars. I was working on my car today. Hugely into cars. I find it surprising you don't like car talk. I think if those same two dudes were just talking, trapping,

and fishing, and hunting, you'd be like, that is the best radio show ever. So I borrowed my boyfriend's trash. Your boyfriend's trash. No, I like all kinds of shit. I like all kinds of... I just watched the thing about the Perfs people that use the RICO law

to take down an organized crime ring and how they and how the law came into passage and how they used rico to instead of doing these like individual prosecutions of these various gangsters were able to roll this whole concrete price fixing manipulation ring up and you're not a lawyer or a mafia. You know Steve, he's very interested in concrete bidding process. It's like, no I'm not. But I like that. Has nothing to do with what I like.

I don't know. I just think it's just too out of your space. No. Is it the dynamic in the conversation that you don't enjoy? Like they beat around the bush too much instead of actually getting to the issue. Yeah, I don't learn shit about fixing cars. They'd be like, oh, you better take it

to the mechanic. You know Stuff You Should Know, that podcast? Yeah. I hate that podcast. You just provided me with a great rebuttal. Cut all this out. You provided me with a great rebuttal. It's not actually about fixing cars. No. You don't learn shit. It's about the conversation. Did you check to see if it's on?

Oh, well, take it to a mechanic. Yeah. It's totally about the conversation. I'm arguing. I feel like you guys, you haven't listened closely enough. They do. I mean, stuff you should know,

they eventually tell you what that podcast is about. Same. But it's more about the conversation, the dynamic between the two and the way they go back and forth. Well, that's what makes talking about fixing cars entertaining.

Dave, would you imagine... It's what got Dave into pheasant hunting. Dave, would you imagine... It wasn't the act of loading the shotgun. I'm going to meticulously tell you I take a shell out of the box after I open it, of course. I break open the shotgun

by pushing the lever. Dave, do you imagine... sounds like our how-to videos go ahead no that's all i had to say oh okay um do you imagine that you would get into like would you get into big game hunting or would that be too kind of like too extreme no i totally would be into it I've started to Try to figure out a way to go deer hunting this fall Now that I'm going to be home this fall At home but yeah

I'm into all of it I'll try any of it I guess and just see what sticks you know And there's nothing like you wouldn't do you'd go on a bear hunt I don't know if I have Maybe I'd go on a bear hunt I never thought about it Huh You go on a bear hunt? I've been on a whole pile of them Do you like have. Maybe I'd go on a bear hunt. I never thought about it. Huh. You go on a bear hunt? I've been on a whole pile of them.

Do you like it? Yeah. I'd go. All I meant was I think that there's a way that when someone as a grown-up gets interested in hunting and fishing, there's like, oftentimes, there's these initial things that seem immediately palatable to someone. Yeah, I get that. Birds would be the easy entry point. And there's a lot of people who wouldn't do other stuff, but they're comfortable catching trout and letting them go, and they'll shoot a bird.

Right. But that's about as violent as they want to get yeah i feel like i know people like that yeah but you don't feel that way no i don't think so i guess you know i'd have to i i like to think anyway that i'd have to experience it to see if it's for me or not you know instead of trying to guess if i'd like it or not you know what i mean i don't i don't have a um if you're asking if it'd like it or not. You know what I mean? I don't have a... If you're asking if it's like some kind of moral, you know, I can kill small animals but not big animals

because they're big and furry or something like that, I don't have that, no. That was what I was asking. Yeah. I get that. I understand that, and I know that that exists, but maybe I get out there and I wouldn't want to do it. I don't know.

I've never tried it, you know? But I'm interested in it, and and I like the meat so I'd like to Dave's growing a garden too so I feel like he's just he's now he's just in the first time I've been home all summer the rewards of the land yeah yeah the whole new Dave you've taken up gardening I did new new gardener new gardener what what have gardened before, but it has been a long time. What, uh, what speak, do you feel in your head that there's a connection between gardening and, and fishing and gardening and hunting and stuff? The providing, yeah, as far as providing your own food, making your own food in a certain way. I do see that connection. And I like that activity. I'm not much of a romantic gardener.

I don't spend hours out there. I don't really get a lot of joy from the process of keeping it up. I do like it, but I wouldn't say it's a hobby. For me, it's simply just to get the food out of the ground. That's it. Maybe that's more of a farmer. It's like transactional. Yeah, I think so.

I mean, I get it. I like the process of it, but I feel like the people I think of as gardeners are very much gardeners. Does that make sense? It's like an art form for them. And I don't have that with gardening for me, no. But I do really enjoy growing the food and bringing it inside and eating it.

Boy, I've seen when those two paths cross, though, and boy, did this guy reap some freaking product. It was in Old Town, Fort Collins, Colorado, and the neighbor, there was no yard. He might have had a little side yard where there was some grass, but pretty much the yard was his garden, but it was run like a farm. Yeah, okay. I think he was a son of maybe potato farmers out of Idaho.

Something like, he was definitely came off a farm. But I mean, he's the only guy I've ever seen, or any gardener for that matter, that like when stuff got planted, there was the strings, you know, running down the whole thing. And this thing, I don't know, is maybe 40 by 40 feet or something like that. But I mean, just like everything packed in deep. And people would walk by. They would definitely come and do the loop when they were walking their dog or just going for the neighborhood walk to walk by this guy's garden.

Because when it was going off, it was just so impressive. Yeah. And I feel like that guy, he definitely wasn't like a gardener because that was like his thing. But he did it to such a level that you would have thought he was. Became a gardener. Yeah. Yeah. He just reaped.

Yeah. I think I was thinking about it a lot lately, like why, because I've always gone way out of my way to make sure to have some sort of garden. And I think there's a big part of like forcing your will. I would never tell this to my garden. But there's like a thing about like forcing your will upon something. Like I almost have this sort of advert, like I have like this almost adversarial. Like this land wants to be grass, but I'm going to make it tomatoes. It's like I am waging, yes. Like I am waging a sort of battle.

Never thought about it. It's not always loving. It's like I am waging, yes, like I am waging a sort of battle. Never thought about it. It's not always loving. It's not always loving. Yeah, right. It sometimes is anger and like retribution and like it's not loving. Parts of it are.

Parts of it are like I am the reaper and I am the sower. Playing God. Yeah. Our mornings are starting to, like you can feel they're a little bit cold, right? So I made the decision to impose my will on my tomato plants because I'm starting to fear that the payout that I've been awaiting

patiently until now. Is not going to happen. Is not going to happen. So I went out there with my shears and just cut them way back. So they put all their energy into. That's the theory, right? Like you make me fruit now. Yeah.

And I. Yeah. I am the sower. I am the reaper. I did it in the wrong order earlier. I am the sower and I am the reaper. Yes. And I make the calls here.

You got that little box. You know. You can be that guy. And that make the calls here. You got that little box. You know. You can be that guy in your yard. To contrast that, I have a planter, like above ground planter, and I put a bunch of stuff in there. And no matter how I tried, the squash is taking over. It's like, screw you, Maggie. Like, I'm killing everything else. And I'm happy for the squash, but man, am I sad for everything else.

That's the nature of the squash. So you have like pity in your garden. Oh, yeah. So my spinach is gone. My lettuce is going. And I'm just like every day like, oh. It's everything else? That's the nature of squash. You have like pity in your garden. Oh yeah. So my spinach is gone. My lettuce is going and I'm just like every day like, oh. It's bitter soil. Mine's cucumbers. And I'm kind of like resentful to the squash right now, even though it's like so happy

that I gave it a spot, but I'm like, screw you. As Dave would say, you know how we feel about winters. I was going to ask about Minnesota winter being people like non-residents of Minnesota, right? I always look at Minnesota being like such a polar, terrible place in the winter. And, you know, as being someone from Minnesota, I love winter. I do too. It's like in my, I was going to ask if you liked it because it's like something that I look forward to every year and everyone gets so sad about summer. But man, do I freaking just love wintertime. You know, summer there is, I'm sure, the general favorite.

But man, it's hot and humid and buggy. And it's my least favorite time to be out, you know, in the woods or whatever. But spring and fall and winter, I think winter is great. I'm always ready for it. When it's on its way, I get super excited about it. Me too. And I'm always ready for it. I'm, you know, I've, when it's on its way, I get super excited about it. Me too. And I'm always ready for it to be done when it's done. Same.

I just like, I like the progress of the seasons. I think I'm always really excited about the next one. My grandpa was a pathologist at one point in Minneapolis when he came out of Creighton Medical School and his first job was as a pathologist in Minneapolis. And he described Minneapolis summers as when the old Scandinavians die. Yeah, there's a certain pride there. But, I mean, it's pretty cold out here in the winter too. I would say it's not as cold.

Not as cold? Definitely not. Yeah, it's maybe a different kind of cold too i don't know we're at this dude um there's this guy fished with for this we have this fishing show called das boat and he's just telling me about this and we fished with a guy i know from michigan named grant gully and he took we were at his house where he grew up like his mother he was born in the house like his mother was born in the house maybe his grandma they've been here forever like they got all these wooden crosses where they buried all these dogs over the years yeah it looks like a like a dog armageddon but it was spread out over a long time like a like a big pet cemetery he was showing me this old man across the road who's this lonely old man and the guy had tilled up this patch of ground and planted all flowers in this patch of ground and he expressed to grant that he felt as though um women would stop to admire these flowers and that he would use it as an end

to talk to him did you say if it had worked i don't know if it had worked he had just there was this big patch of flowers and that's what he had expressed wow this the same dude told me these two other like a couple other stories were um he was telling me about these friends of his were down in iowa and in iowa if you hit a deer with your you can't blood track a deer onto someone else's property property okay without permission so his body hits a deer and the deer's bleeding like holy hell but gets over a fence and he goes around to the guy and says like do you mind if I track my deer onto your

property the guy won't let him do it no but he knows the deer's gotta be dead if I track my deer onto your property? And the guy won't let him do it. But he knows the deer's got to be dead because of how good he hit it. So he goes and gets a game warden to come out and help him with the whole situation. And the game warden gets the landowner who won't let him go on his property, and they're having this little conference, and they go over to the fence line where the blood trail vanished. And the game warden says to the landowner, he says, I'm going to follow this blood trail, and this blood trail better end at a dead deer,

and that deer better not be gutted. And the landowner turns to him and says, let's just go to the barn. No. No. be gutted and the landowner turns him and says um let's just go to the barn no already there it was no way yeah a very nice buck dead in the dude's barn wow yeah well the guy got it gutted for him i guess you got to take it back right wow that's amazing and then wow i'm sure that's not even i mean it can't be common but it probably happened that was a good story man he told me he told me he also told me um we're standing and i'm like no shit your mom was born in this house you know and he said the biggest party i have ever been to that i've ever even seen in my entire life was right here and he said uh he said it was the parking at his party when his mom was

out of town he he equated it to the county fair this is the guy in michigan same dude yeah i'm gonna tell you the last story he told me um and then you're gonna have to get out your guitar the last story he told me was there's some dude he knows like i could be i might mess up a part of the story but it's basically a guy had a boat stored at a place okay and he doesn't pay his boat storage fee to the point where he owes four thousand dollars for storing the boat but the boat's more valuable the boat storage owner um decides he's gonna sell the boat but it's to get his money back but the boat storage owner decides he's going to sell the boat to get his money back but the boat's worth a lot more than $4,000

my friend comes in to catch an argument where the owner of the the original owner of the boat is saying if you sell that boat I get every dime over what I owe you. And my buddy's saying the boat's probably worth like $9,000. So the guy's like, sure, sell the boat,

get your four back, but the five's mine. And the argument gets so heated that the guy turns around and sells my buddy the boat for exactly the amount the guy owed him. Sells it for four grand. Yes. Just as a. No way. Yeah.

Just to stick it to him. Whoa. Yeah. And then he fished that boat for years. He catched it. Yeah. Grant. I haven't messed up any of Grant's stories stories but i might have messed that one up but

it's basically the groove of that story that's amazing yeah yeah that's that's great this guy has wonderful you should write songs about all these things i'm telling you should write a book it sounds like you should write a song called um the boat deal the boat the boat and the flower bed the pet cemetery is the whole damn album it's like a beautiful landscape uh okay uh can you get out your guitar now yeah i want people to hear you're gonna sing with me no yeah i'll be kicking uh what you need to do if you're if you're up for it okay how excruciating is this? I mean, I don't care, man,

because this is what you got to do, man. This is music in the time of COVID. I don't mind. You have to first play a little teeny snippet of one of Maggie's favorite tunes. Okay, right now? Have you ever done snippets before? No, I don't. Well, you know what?

I did do snippets once. We got asked to play at a Minnesota Twins baseball game and we would play 38 seconds or whatever whenever they have a pitcher change

or they go to somewhere else. The point of us being there was to sing Take Me Out to the Ball Game. But we did all these little, and there'd be a little, a little speaker

there and a voice would come in and be like, four seconds. And we'd have to figure out how to stop the song in the middle of the song with no rehearsal because we had no idea of the time.

They wouldn't say you're playing for 35 seconds. They'd just say you play until the guy gives you the warning to stop. But the hook was that you were going to do a great version of a great arousing rendition of Take Me Out to the... And it was super fun. I grew up a lifelong Twins fan,

so it was kind of a little kid moment for me. We actually got to do the national anthem at one of the playoffs games there this year, too, which was the scariest thing I've ever done in my life, I think. Maybe you should do that song. Oh, my God. The problem with it is I'm not really physically able to sing that song, but I went for it, and it worked out okay, I think.

But it's a lot of pressure on that song and that environment. You know the band Silver Jews? I do, yeah. Yeah, he's got a great line. He says, all my favorite singers couldn't sing. He was kind of a talky singer. Yeah, I said it when he passed, man. It was a great band.

Yeah, he kind of, he passed, man. It was a great band. Yeah, he kind of, yeah. Just not long. I have only known that band maybe five years or something. A band we were on the road with was playing some of their music backstage, and like, this is great. Oh, American Waters. So good.

American Water, I think, is one of the 20 best albums of all time. A country band like that. Okay, Midnight on the Interstate. Okay, I's cool. 20 best albums of all time. A country band like that. Okay, Midnight on the Interstate. Okay, I'm sorry. You got to say... It's about 20 degrees cooler out in that hallway. Can you say this one goes out to Maggie? All right, this one's for Maggie. Can you say this one goes out to Maggie?

No. No. Late night Midnight on the interstate And I didn't feel so great Until I saw the city And I was younger And open like a child Man, it's been a while Since I felt that way

More and more I hesitate Cause I don't know Does that seem like a snippet? Oh, that was a great snippet. Okay, good. Love it. The medley continues. Thank you.

All right, here's Winners. I don't know if I can remember it. I don't know. There were dreams on a full moon night Black hole in the middle of the light And painless times and we were feeling alright And we were breaking down the walls a dirty little basement and electric guitars the sound of the river and the pines and the stars

we drank a little too much Yeah, we took it too far Well, but most of us survived So much coming out There's nothing going in With your skirt above your knee and your murderous grin Oh

tell me that you're not leaving You were standing there so literal and free Writing pretty poems and ruining me It took a little time but baby now I see That the end is always near And I was sleeping on a couch with a shivering dog Practicing my speeches and studying the law Nothing to cover but a hammer and a saw And some nails to drive it home

So much coming out, there's nothing going in Yeah, I could write it down, but that would be a sin. And you know how I feel about sinning. guitar solo Well, Charlie's on stage and the roof may collapse No one seems to worry about the light in the gaps Of the walls painted yellow And papered with mats That remind us it's time to move on

A pretty little city built on a hillside There's music in the bars And fire in the sky We went to the beach And it was covered in ice And I used to call it home So much coming out, there's nothing going in Yeah, I know that you feel like you're never gonna win

Oh, but the world won't forgive a winner Thank you. all right thank you very much man That was beautiful Okay so you didn't make any jingle off this performance tonight Today, this morning actually Wait what? I said, you know How can people support you?

Everybody just got a free song Everybody just got a free song So how do fans support you right now? If a fan wants to support They can head over to my website at deadmanwinter.com or trampledbyturtles.com. Take a look at the store and see if there's anything you like. And, you know, what we were talking about with streaming before, it helps too.

So whenever you throw that on there, it all adds up, you know? And then what are you most proud of right now? If people wanted to go check you out, to get the most current snippet of what you're up to, what should people go listen to? I put a solo record out just under my name, Dave Simonette, however you want to say it, that I released at the end of March. So I never really got to do anything with it.

The whole tour was canceled. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you I released at the end of March, so I never really got to do anything with it. The whole tour was canceled. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you're right. March didn't happen. It's called Red Tail, and you can check that out if you'd like. Do you figure you'd just wait a few years and try again and re-release it? It's kind of on pause right now, I think. Is that right?

Maybe. I don't know. No, I mean, it's out. You can't take it back. But you can pick it up and tour it when you can tour it. Exactly. I hope to make up the tour, yeah. So Red Tail is a good thing for people to go listen to. If people are interested in Trampled by Turtles,

what's the thing that you'd most eagerly point people to? I usually like the newest thing. So for me, it'd be our latest record, Life is Good on the Open Road, which came out a couple years ago. Okay. So they should check that out. Please do. Are you on social media? Can people find you on social media, Dave? Yeah, at Deadman Winter.

And TBT Duluth for Trampled by Turtles. Are you active on there? Kinda. Do you put hunting pictures on there? Yeah. Oh, you do? Uh-huh. Good for you. Yeah. Thanks again for coming in. Yeah, thanks for having me. I appreciate the song. It was beautiful. I really appreciate all of it. The fishing trip, everything. It's been a great couple days here. Well, thanks for having me. I appreciate the song. It was beautiful. I really appreciate all of it.

The fishing trip, everything. It's been a great couple days here. Well, good. Come back. I will. Thank you. hey folks exciting news for those who live or hunt in canada you might not be able to join our raffles and sweepstakes and all that because of raffle and sweepstakes law, but hear this. OnX Hunt is now in Canada. It is now at your fingertips, you Canadians.

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