The MeatEater Podcast - Ep. 442: Comedy Isn't Easy with Dan Ahdoot

Episode Date: May 22, 2023

Steve Rinella talks with Dan Ahdoot, Janis Putelis, Ryan Callaghan, Brody Henderson, Phil Taylor, and Corinne Schneider. Topics include: Get your wild cow milking "Gnome on the Range" shirt; well wishes for Dan's broken ankle; we know Mo; why Dan's first appearance on The MeatEater Podcast led to his hilarious and heartfelt first book, "Undercooked"; freewriting; when fly fishing guides lie; the Arkansas episode of "Buck Truck" from The Element as being the best reason for why hunting whitetail might just be better; more pet deer stories; a mutually concussed man and grouse; an update on direwolves from The OG of Archaeology; the best and worst arguments for reintroduction; letting nature do its thing; Dan's Food Network show, "Raid the Fridge," and his podcast, "Green Eggs and Dan"; when you're coastal-elite-adjacent-comedian-hunter-foodie; how hunters are the real foodies; a shit tent, a cigar, and a mini forest fire; getting out of speeding tickets because you're the Cobra Kai guy; and more.  Connect with Steve and MeatEater Steve on Instagram and Twitter MeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and Youtube Shop MeatEater MerchSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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It's a rodeo event. He reached out to us to sponsor his wild cow milking team. So Meat Eater is a sponsor of Tommy's wild cow milking team, where you got to milk a bottle of milk off a wild cow or a mean cow maybe and then for our sponsorship money he's given us all of our all of his winnings back for for conservation efforts but he needed a wild cow milk and t-shirt for his team so our guy hunter spencer made up the Wild Cow Milking Team shirt. It's got our gnome friend riding a cow who's bucking, big old udder, and he's holding up a big old jug of milk like the old days when they put milk in those glass jars. And it says gnome on the range.

Tommy needed six, I think, for his team, but we made extras if you want to buy one. I like mine a lot. Well, I haven't worn it yet. Cause I always like to wash them first. So go to the, go to the meat eater store.

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I got mine. Suckers. This is the Meat Eater Podcast coming at you shirtless, severely bug-bitten, and in my case, underwear-less. The Meat Eater Podcast. You can't predict anything. coming at you shirtless, severely bug-bitten, and in my case, underwearless. We hunt. The Meteor Podcast. You can't predict anything. Presented by First Light, creating proven, versatile hunting apparel

from merino base layers to technical outerwear for every hunt. First Light. Go farther, stay longer. All right, Dan Aduit is back. Aduit. Aduit in a boot. What do you got a boot on? I broke my ankle, man.

Rollerblading? No. No, but the next best thing, Steve. Yeah, skiing. Oh, really? Yeah, I know. I get no pity or sympathy when I say that I broke my ankle skiing. No.

It's like. What do you think is going to happen? Did you get to ride the cart down the mountain in shame? Yes, I did. Yep. It was, my arms were crossed. I was laying down and someone was holding the sled and taking me down. You had to feel like such a candy ass.

It's like, how humiliating, man. Yeah, because they lock your arms and you're like you're like a little burrito oh yeah they're like all their training is coming into action I don't even think

Gwyneth Paltrow had to take the cart down you wanna hear the craziest thing it was the same mountain as Gwyneth Paltrow and the guy that brought me down

was involved in that court case so did you ask him what he thought about the whole thing I mean he was team

hashtag team Gwyneth. You guys are going to have to fill me in. I'm not up on Gwyneth's scheme. She had a collision. She hit an old man or an old man hit her and I think some accusations were that he groped her too.

I didn't hear that part. During the impact? That's the fan fiction version of the case. I don't know that that's actually true. Old guy's falling real slow. He tried to sue her. No, no, no.

She initially thought she was being groped, but then she realized she was being crashed into. Yeah. He sued her for a bunch of money, then she countersued him for a dollar. And won. I think she won. It was the same day that Trump got arrested or whatever.

So it kind of got washed out of the news. I wouldn't say that he got arrested. No, yeah. That's why I'm trying to frame it differently. Was your injury due to an unforeseen collision or just your own bad scheme? You didn't grope anybody on the way down, did you? Yes, I was. And it's harder to do that and ski than you think.

Because I'll cancel your ass right now if you did. Or did you just start with this show? Just fall of your own accord. You know what's really annoying? It was not at all. So I was skiing with my brother. And my brother, I'm going to say objectively, I'm an amazing skier. Objectively.

My brother is a pretty good skier. But why do you think you're such a good skier? I just know. I bet you're not better than Yanni. I mean. We pretty good skier. But why do you think you're such a good skier? I just know. I bet you're not better than Yanni. I mean. We've never skied together. How would we know? Well, maybe he rates Yannis as amazing plus.

Yeah. Yeah. Go on. Could be. You're so good. So good. My brother, not as good. Pretty good.

Not as good. But he was going really fast. And it was like very reckless the way he was skiing. So I wanted to show him as the older brother, hey, it's a sign of mastery when you can ski very controlled on a steep run. Let me show you. So we were on a steep run, and I started skiing very controlled. And there was one of those, you know those little tiny water bottles, like that you get on the plane? It was one of those without the label on it, so you couldn't see it.

And I went right on top of it and flipped right over and something snapped in my ankle. And, uh, next thing you know, I was, uh, being, you know, taken down the mountain, emasculated in one of those little sleds. Yeah, great skier, weak ankles. Sure. Another reason not to, uh to use disposable water bottles.

The whole no plastics thing cost you that freaking ankle, man. It got me. Describe this run that you were skiing. I'm going to get an idea of how good of a skier you are. Okay, so it was like. Where were you? Maybe I skied it. It was a double green.

It wasn't a single green. It was a double green. Is that worse than black? You already lost Giannis's. Is that worse than black? He's making a joke. No, I'm making a joke um that uh no it was a it was a challenging run at deer valley it was not it wasn't it was the problem

was this they got so much snow this season that their season is going a lot longer than it normally does because they just have so much packed snow so it's a lot hotter. So by 1 p.m., everything is slush, and slush is very dangerous to ski in. Why are you talking to Yanni like he doesn't know this stuff? I'll give you that. I don't know. Did you know that? I don't know what they do in Latvia.

There's no mountains in Latvia. No, I went to the tallest point in Latvia when I went and visited last fall. 300 meters. You know how many feet that is? Yeah. Yeah, not many. We parked, and literally we were still chatting,

and all of a sudden we stopped. I'm like, I look around. This is it. I mean, it was a molehill. It was incredible. Makes Michigan's little, southern Michigan's little ski hills look big. So you hit a little teething water bottle

and it knocked you over. It took me out. It took me out. And then I went to... Did you fingerprint that bottle? Yeah, do you think Gwyneth's people had it? Watch this same guy

that you fingerprinted and it comes back as that same... He was like some kind of physician, wasn't he? He was an eye doctor of some sort. The same eye doctor

as that. Or when he blasted Gwyneth Paltrow, blasted her so hard that came out of her pocket. I would consult Gwyneth's people. I feel awkward. Did it say goop on it? I will counter sue the water company. We're going to say it was a goop water bottle. Goop.

I, yeah, but then the nurse thought that it was just bruised. She was like, it's bruised. You're fine. Just go home. You'll be okay. And then I called my buddy Moe, who's an orthopedic surgeon on the way home. He's like, no, dude. Moe, we know Moe. He's like, dude, I think it's broken.

Let me give you one second. Yeah. He's like, dude, I think it's broken. Give me one second. Danadute is a comedian, actor, podcaster, food network show host, now author. His new book is called Undercooked. He was on a long time ago in an episode called Eating With Your Enemy. The enemy being his friend Moe, where a Jew and a Muslim go hunting. All we got to do is write the rest of that joke. I finally tell, I tell my kids that I was gonna teach them all the dirty

the Dirty Dan jokes once they got their learner's permits. Seemed like a good age for driving. But I told them the don't mess with Uncle Jimmy when he's drinking the other night. That went over real well.

What is it again? So, okay. I don't know any dirty jokes. I'm going to tell you about it. Steve doesn't tell jokes. He just tells you about the joke. I'm going to tell you about the joke. Okay, Dirty Dan.

He sets it up and then sounds just exasperated when you want to. I don't believe you're asking me this. Okay. Dirty Dan is, he gets believe you're asking me this. Okay. Dirty Dan is a, he gets in a lot of trouble at school for his foul mouth and his, you know, and so Dirty Dan's and the day's lesson in Dirty Dan's class is you have to tell a story that has a moral. So, you know, little Susie gets up and she's like like my dad tore his seam on his jacket a little bit it was too lazy to sew it up and then she caught it on a he caught it on a branch and it now it's a huge hole and she's like what's the moral of that story it's like well stitching time saves nine okay and then you do one like um my dad uh we were collecting the eggs and we put them all in one

basket and my brother knocked the basket over so don't put all your eggs and they all broke don't put all your eggs in one basket and dirty dan gets up and tells this horrific story about his uncle in vietnam and it involves his uncle getting extraordinarily drunk and uh imagine like just then you describe sort of the worst war crimes you could fit into a joke tailored to your particular audience and then it ends with just like the most horrific scene of carnage and depravity and the teacher like, what in the world is the moral of that? He's like, you don't f*** with Uncle Jimmy when he's drinking. It's good. Can you beep that out, Phil?

Sure thing. Don't f*** with me while he's drinking. But it's a long joke joke it's a very long joke when you tell the whole thing yes yes what we're trying to say here guys is comedy is not easy the moral of the story

the moral of the story so when Phil said when Phil said we know Mo it's cause when Dan a dude was on the show before we spent a lot of time talking about his Muslim hunting buddy, Moe. Yeah, that was a great story. And how they have, and how the Israelis and the, whoever around the world could find a lot of inspiration from this story.

Yeah. And I mean, I don't know if uh if you're aware i think i probably did tell you but you that episode is the whole reason that this book happened wouldn't have happened you tell me that yeah 100 so what blurb this book you did blurb this book every time someone asked me to blurb a book i always think i'm gonna write them i think i'm gonna like spend weeks on it and write the most amazing like where the blurb is better than the book yeah a new york times best-selling blurb yeah like yeah like people will buy it to read the blurb yep and then in the end i i wrote i just kind of put it in chat gpt um yeah so i did the episode and my manager listened to it, and she was like, this is a crazy story.

You should write a movie about your friend Moe. You and your friend Moe do like a buddy comedy. So I wrote an outline for a movie, and it was really crappy. And she was like, why don't you just do some free writing, write about why you love food so much. Who told you to do this? My manager. Your manager told you to do some free writing? She said, do some free writing.

Like I was in sixth grade. Yeah, you could go down and do that at my kid's school. Those guys. Yeah. Free writing? Do some free writing. Daydream for 10 minutes beforehand,

then do some free writing. Free writing meaning you don't get the best thing that happened to you this summer. Did you free write about that? Free writing meaning you don't get paid for it. Exactly. She did not get free write about that free writing meaning you don't get paid for it exactly she did not get 10 of that free writing um and i wrote this whole story that about you know growing up and my relationship with my dad and uh why i got into food and all this stuff she's like this is cool but it doesn't feel like a movie it could be like a chapter of a book can you write do you have two more chapters in you? So I wrote two more chapters. God, your manager

is like motherly. She's awesome. She's killer. Erin Brown, shout out. And so one chapter was my relationship with my dad. The second one was about returning a dish at the number one restaurant in the world the day that it was crowned the number

one restaurant in the world, which was true story. Still needs to be hot, you know? Yeah. And then the third one was about buying a gun in a gun store, and what you have to go through is for someone who doesn't know anything about guns, being in a gun store. It's like the worst experience ever.

Anyway, so I wrote those three. She sent it to a lit agent. Lit agent was like, these are good chapters. And a month later, pitched it to Crown Publishing. And there was like a bidding war with two different publishers. And they ended up buying it. And a month later, I had to start writing a book. And I'm not a freaking book writer.

Nothing's free there. I think they're called authors. Yeah. I'm not a book writer. And yeah, then I spent the whole year writing this book. All because of your podcast. So how did your manager and the agent split the cut? She didn't pull 10 and the agent pulled 15.

Hold on, Steve. Before we get into that, I feel like you need to get better at accepting praise. Okay. Is this something that happens a lot in your life? Oh, what were you praising? I was thanking you oh I'm sorry for and then you're like what's the cut what is the agent and the manager get let's get down

to brass tacks I'm thanking you for creating this platform which created the space to create this book so thank you oh you're welcome yeah alright now agent gets 10% manager gets another 10% lawyer gets 5%.

I ended up walking with like 3% of the money after all is said and done. You called. Are you sure I'm only supposed to get three? She's like, well, remember when I told you free writing? You know what I uncovered recently, and you'll appreciate this. All three of you so not you but yanni callahan and brody all have spent time as um trout guides trout fishing guides i have just in the last two weeks met two people who i had to have legal arguments with where they're out of staters fishing guided

trout trips in Montana and the guides are telling them their preferences as though it's codified by law. I had the longest argument with someone telling me you are not allowed to kill a trout on the gallatin river illegal um it's not illegal that was your guide telling you that i had another person that said on the big hole river no uh not only can't you kill a trout on the big hole, you cannot use a barb on a hook on the entirety of the big hole river. I'm like, that was just someone's, that's how someone is making you do it. No, no, no. That's the law, they told me. How are you running into these fly fisher folks?

One I was talking to on the phone and their name is tracy ey who's the other one tell me the other thing the other thing was a a well-known very well-known sportscaster who's even done the olympics you trust everything on the teleprompter you ask him that no i didn't ask him that you guys i thought you guys had more to say about this well i have something to say about it i do have something to say you started this whole thing by saying something that you three guys have in common but dan doesn't is that well... Well, did you say guide trout fishermen? That's your assumption, is that I did not guide trout fishermen. Well, because I just read all the stuff

you do. Well... Comedian, actor, podcaster, Food Network show host, and author. I don't know. Corinne, did you leave off fly fishing guide? Corinne? For sure, if you had spent time as a fly fishing guide, it would be top of the list. Well, I don't like to lead with it, okay?

My bad. I didn't interview you thoroughly. I was given a word count that I had to, you know, I got to the end of it. We didn't have room for it. He once broke his ankle while he was guiding. I did. There was a little pebble. But going back, Steve, you just don appreciate the uh subterfuge there i just feel like it's a

little bit to to take impressionable people who you're introducing to something and can and create and taking like your personal preferences and acting like your personal preferences are codified by law just to save yourself any argument. They're like, well, why can't I keep a fish? The easy way out. It's so shitty. Because I just don't want you to. I don't like the sight of blood. I don't want to get all slimy. I need to catch this fish tomorrow.

Right. That's the man, right? You can't. It's against the law. All those trout are little $5 and $10 bills swimming around the river, so I need them to stay there. Instead of saying that that they're going, it's against the law. And they don't have to hear about it all day. That's just a lie though.

That's yeah. It is just a lie. That's like how people talk to their kids, right? Like it's illegal. You can't do that. Yeah. Cause God will strike you down. Right.

Now granted there are places where those things are true. Just not on those rivers. I know, but yes, I'll tell but... You know what? I'll save it for the next group of people on another episode, and I'll bring it up then. No, listen, I was going to ask... You just keep bringing it up.

I'm going to bring it up with some people who are like, well, that won't stand. That's what I'd like to hear here. Tell me, who are they fishing with? I'm going to call this fly shop. That's what I was looking for hear here. I got the wrong crowd. Tell me, who are they fishing with? I'm going to call this fly shop. No, I remember. That's what I was looking for. Brody.

I was looking for some outreach. When I was a young guy working at Fly Fishing Outfitters, or even before I was working there, I took the guide class. I remember there were several discussions within that week of learning. This is how you address, deal with a client that says I would like to eat trout for lunch you tell them it's illegal they say they want to be there's a long way but a lot of it was made up well yeah number one would be they don't taste good why would you want to kill

this poor animal it doesn't taste good? No, no, I know that I would like them. It's illegal. Well, if it's illegal, why would you lead with it doesn't taste good? I sing on the cake. I sing on the cake, just so you know. Towards the end of my guiding career, I let people bonk one now and then. Because you knew you were getting out of it.

You just wasn't worried about it. You didn't, it wasn't. Yep. Just wasn't worried about it. You were in a rape and pillage on your way out. I, I selected

species where I'm like, if we catch this or this, absolutely. And it'd be like, you know, rainbow trout or lake trout.

Tom K. Sucker. On cutthroat, cutthroat water, cold water. I remember one time, I remember Rob Waters. Yeah. He wasn't quite, he wasn't on the fly fishing train yet.

He would have been a rafting guide, but would also take some fishing clients. If the rafting company had fishing clients or people interested in fishing, oh yeah, I got a couple of spin rods in the truck and we'll bring them along. Can you start that story over again? Sure.

I got confused. This fishing guide, Rob Waters. Not Roger Waters. the truck and you know we'll bring them along can you start that story over again sure i got confused this fishing guide rob waters that we later roger waters that we later worked with a lot who became a was at some point was probably the number one guide at that fly shop for for quite a few years which just means you're like you're into it you're gonna work a lot okay but i had already started as a fly fishing guide he was was a rafting guide. I see. But would, if they had interested fishing clients or people interested in fishing, coming rafting, he said, oh yeah, I got some rods. Oh, so someone books a rafting trip. Sure. And they're like, hey, is there any chance we could catch a trout?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or they just happen to call the rafting company instead of the fly shop because it would be half price for a fishing trip. And Rob would say, sure, I'll take them out. That's a sharp thinker right there. You call for a float trip to fish and they're like, how much did they say? It's probably not going to work out the way you want it to most of the time.

Yeah, you're not going to do a lot of catching. Oh, I got what you're saying. Yeah, yeah. I have a question. You might get for half his month, half the money, you might get half the experience. Yeah. Yeah.

If you're lucky. Brody's trying to protect the industry down there. Go ahead, Dan. You want to interrupt him too? Yeah, thank you. This is your show now, huh? Thank you so much. Thanks for having me. You guys have been great so far. What? Okay, call me an ignoramus.

Are you curious about where his story's going? Well, I had... Yes, I am curious about it. But wait, I thought we got there already. I can pick it back up. Did you get there? I thought we got there. No punchline yet.

I'm curious about it, but not in a way that I want to hear the end. Comedy is challenging, folks. Yes, yes, yes. I befriended Rob, and he was asking about becoming a fly fishing guide, and one day, he's eddied out, and I'm, which you know what that means, right? He's pulled off on the side of the river in some circulating water, and I'm floating by towards the end of the day, and we give the, hey, how was the fishing today, whatever?

And Rob reaches down between his legs and pulls up a stringer, and there's a couple dandies. And my clients just are like, hold on, what? And I'm supposed to act, you know, as a fly fishing guy, just like, oh, that dirty bastard, you know? How could he do such a thing? How could he do such a thing? And it was so funny that for me, I forgot about it an hour later.

Rob, for years, would just be, I can't believe I ever did that, and that was me back then. I showed those fish like that to you, and I'm so sorry, and it was the wrong thing to do. But yeah, I'll never forget. How was your day? That was just something that you never would look at a guy in a drift boat and

expect that, right? He's in a raft. How was your day? And he reaches between his legs and just pulls up a string a white truck so what okay so what is I'm assuming it would be illegal to catch these trout is that what no no what what is the no but then why is it's crazy for someone to be like i want to have trout for lunch because of it's not the culture and the uh perception and oftentimes just what your your guide of the day wants to do right it's like well yeah we're not going to do that we're going to fish this way and i don't want to deal with your fish in my cooler or the idea that you may want to catch it. Or I could pay a lot of money to catch these fish.

I don't want anyone killing them because then I can't catch them. There's a culture of catch and release associated with trout. Okay, got it. Why fishing for trout. Got it. In a recent episode, 434, named My Mule Deer Can Kick Your Whitetail's Ass. That was a great title. It's a great title.

I argue with Tony Peterson about whether hunting mule deer is better than hunting whitetail. Apparently, I didn't know this until the other day. People have taken... Are you sure that this is the quote they're talking about? I know that I said some stuff on rogan show it modes i i know exactly what this people are doing it all over the place because i took that little clip from rogan yep followed it up with a picture of a big mule deer buck that i shot that thing has like a million views and never and a lot of other people started doing it. Oh, so you mean it's a quote that you said in his show versus our show?

It wasn't from when I was talking to Tony Peterson. I think it was something from when I was talking about why I like Mule Deer. Okay. They may have mistaken that. What was the clip? What is it? Just talking about why I like Mule Deer. For some reason, if I said to you, if you said, you know chocolate ice cream better than vanilla ice cream

you know because i don't know tastes chocolatey okay no one's gonna get pissed but for some reason if you say that you like mule deer a lot better than whitetails people it's like people get mad about it i don't understand it so casey uh and tyler from the, they said it was a real punch below the belt in the Midwest and down south. They're like them whitetail deer. As do I. It's not as much. So, point being, the best argument, we have a show with The Element guys

called Buck Truck, which you can go watch on YouTube and they got a Kansas episode up which is maybe the best argument in favor of Whitetail. So if you're cruising around on YouTube looking for stuff you know what, when you watch YouTube these days I know it's like personalized

do you always get the guy who's like carbs burn fat, right? Yes. Wrong. Yes. Sweets burn fat. Or whatever he's talking about. I wonder how much money they've spent on advertising.

Not only that, but if you now realize that there are ads that are basically what you just said. There's a dude now that does't add that starts off with hey Are you on YouTube and you're always getting ads from the guy that can tell you this that brother? Well guess what his shits real. He like he's selling it for that guy. They're just very Down it's very meta. They're doubling down Your head sits on your body right wrong They haven't got I still can't tell you what they're selling or what the what no one day he's like one day he's on there bananas are

good right uh-uh yeah he's got Laura's to stop yeah he's like got five seconds yeah what one of these five foods is tanking your testosterone I haven't watched it to the end but I watched't watched it to the end, but I watched about a minute and a half in, which I never do because I'm like, let me see where this goes. And he doesn't pitch anything. A product? An idea? He just keeps going on about carbs and stuff. I was like, okay, what are you trying to sell me?

I'll give a dollar to whoever can watch long enough to find out which of those foods is killing my T. My testosterone. It's like bananas or avocados. Do you i from him because i eat all the foods he's like these your head sits on your body right wrong it's probably it's probably like the longer you keep that running like some hacker somewhere gets all your information maybe it's just making money on the ad revenue and there actually

isn't anything. You don't make money on ads. You spend money. It's like having the repetitive video that doesn't actually go anywhere and you just type in wait till the end. And then finally you're like

well it doesn't matter. It's like an old sign in bars to say free beer tomorrow yeah well i'm sure i'm sure there's gonna be a few folks that write in so we have some answer he does the thing now i don't know if they're real or not but a lot of his ads now i'm just bringing this all up because when you go i'm just preparing you for when you go watch the buck truck by the element you want to watch some sweet whitetail videos you're gonna have to wait long enough. How many seconds? You got to wait five seconds before you can skip it? So I always get five seconds of this guy.

And a lot of times he's on the way they do it, it's like are they real podcasts? He's like a podcast guest. So he'll be sitting there with headphones on, talking to some other guy who's got headphones on and he's like, one of these five superfoods isn't a superfood.

It's lowering your testosterone. Yeah, and it's clickbaity. And I'm like, damn, which one is it? It's Whitetails. But then the skip ad comes up, and I skip. I never find out what the hell's going on. Then I'm sitting there chilling with the watching buck truck. And wondering the whole time, what was that one food?

And I'm like, man, that's a sweet buck. But which of those five foods is killing me? Same dude with the cup of coffee, and he's like, at the gym, somebody's like, what the hell is in your coffee cup? And he's like slinging some kind of, who knows. But I always think at that point, point i'm like never in a million years would i ever turn to somebody at the gym and be like what the hell's in your cup i'm like i give a shit what's in your coffee cup don't talk to me you know it worked look at how much free advertising we're giving this guy yeah i'm unclear on what is i'm unclear on what is being sold we don't know anyhow go to YouTube type in the element buck truck the

guy will come on about whatever he's going on about and then uh you'll you'll get a little bit mildly curious and then skip ad will come up you'll skip the ad watch buck truck and then later you can lay in bed at night wondering what was it what you're eating that you shouldn't be think mule deers are better than white tail and yeah and the element will make you fall in love with white tails all over again uh speaking of white tails clay had an amazing story about his pet deer and it prompted prompted someone to write in about, they had a pet deer. I mean, they got this deer. It's got a collar on.

Got a dog harness on. It's got a dog harness on. One of those tuxedo t-shirts. They collect all of its sheds over the years. It ate its button buck sheds. But the thing I like about the, the thing I, the deer ate its own buttonbuck sheds It's like a rabbit Eating his own pellets

It looks like an awesome place to grow up I like the picture with him He says it's his sister But she must be a lot older That's gotta be his ma Well there's three turkeys behind him in that one picture This guy had a great Great childhood

It was a very loving pet deer he goes on on to say, and would like to snuggle. But if it was the rut, it did not want to snuggle men. Hmm. Why wouldn't they chop the balls off of the deer? Well, I'll tell you why. Yeah. When he was going bow hunting for deer, he would snuggle that deer as cover scent. Oh.

You weren't here when Clay. Clay is pet deer. One time he's sitting in the woods and here comes his pet deer with another buck, which Clay killed. And then his deer came up and actually put nuzzled Clay. It like was a judas deer wow it's like his new hunting buddy this is the buddy comedy of the year about yeah yeah guy and his deer it would lure in it would lure it back that deer would go out and find bucks and bring bucks back to clay for clay to kill like bro come on like, bro, come on, let's hang. Bro, you got to come hang out here. Yeah, that is some, that's some like Rosendale.

What was that family? Which family? The people we executed, the husband and wife. Oh, Lindbergh baby? That one? No. The Sacco and Vanzetti? Yeah, no.

Oh, the Rosenbergs or something? Rosenbergs, yeah. Something like that. Rosenberg. They were like communistsanzetti? Yeah, no. Oh, the Rosenbergs or something? Rosenbergs, yeah. Something like that. Rosenberg. They were like communists or something? Yeah. Here's an interesting article. And I like the story, but then it goes the direction I'm not crazy.

But where is this? This is, oh, CBC? What's that mean? Yeah, Canadian Broadcasting. Oh. British Columbia. A Prince George British Columbia man driving down the road and got concussed

by a roughed grouse that came blasting through his partially open window. Knocked him senseless. Knocked the driver so senseless that when he comes to, he can't figure out why there's a grouse in his truck. Because the grouse is also knocked.

It concussed the grouse too. They were mutually concussed. The grouse resuscitates. He resuscitates. He films the grouse, opens the door, and the grouse gets away. Here's where the story takes a strange turn. They actually went to an ornithologist to learn this that it's odd that the grouse could have gotten through a cracked window and hit the man in the

head incredibly lucky they're doing some real background journalism they went to an ornithologist to say um what's your take on this? I don't believe it was intentional that the... To which he said, wow, if the window was only open four inches, that seems like unlikely. Does he have a... That's hard-hitting journalism. Associate's degree in physics also?

Like, come on. Yeah, they went Like the ornithologist. Like come on. Yeah they went to an ornithologist. Wait a minute. How fast were you going exactly? The ornithologist said it was a one in a million shot. Which I don't believe. And how is he qualified? He's an ornithologist.

In the ornithology community. That is something that's studied. It's like the third year of ornithology school that's right train a leaves chicago with a window this individual this individual that was concussed by the grouse is an elected official okay the plot in tribal politics and they said that they feel they're the only they feel that they're the only elected official, this individual that was struck said, I can 100% guarantee, this is a quote,

I can 100% guarantee that I'm the only elected official in Canada to ever get hit in the face by a grouse while driving. CBC News has not been able to verify this claim. They should ask the ornithologist he knows he's got all the weird knowledge as of publication time they had contacted uh 72 percent of all elected officials to ever serve in canada and have and so far but has not been able to absolutely verify his claim. The good folks at the CBC are going to stick with this one, see it through. This is a new take on trail cam problems.

I have shared that I had a trail cam at my fish shack and one of my buddy's wives went back to pee by the camera and I still haven't gotten my card back. That one's just gone now. This guy, he writes in to say this. I'm not going to give his name. Does he give his name? Nope.

Oh, he didn't even give his name. He just signs it a loyal fan. I have a slightly embarrassing trail cam story. I'd prefer not to use my name for reasons that will become obvious. I'm a divorced dad. Last summer started dating an amazing divorced woman. This sounds like a match made in heaven. They have seven kids between them.

His gal is a dairy farmer. You following? Yeah. I'm in. You got it. Yeah. Seven kids between them. It's hard to find alone time.

So they go back to a meadow back behind the dairy farm to do what he has put in quotes to picnic. He's using picnic as a euphemism because it's in quotes. That's so wholesome. Some neighbors approached later to say, heads up, we have a trail cam back in that meadow. FYI. Oh, no. They approached one of their teenage sons who is driving a tractor in that field. Oh, that's right. Would you mind telling your mom we have a trail cam pointed at that meadow?

He says, well, sure, but why? Don't worry. Just tell her. Savage. I don't know why he's embarrassed. Who? The guy writing the email? The guy that got caught on a trail cam

making sweet love to his son. I don't know that. I mean, I know he was picnicking. He was picnicking. You do not want to see someone picnicking on your trail cam. You think he should be proud of that? I mean, I don't think there's any reason for embarrassment.

I think the fact that they would go to the 17 year old Child and tell him Rather than going to the adults They should be the ones Who are embarrassed the trail cam people Yeah man life on the farm Is different though like there's a lot of Love making there's a lot of dying going on

Around you all the time Yeah Doug says life and death on the farm He should start saying love and death on the farm. Yeah. A lot of confusion around dire wolves and a lot of fighting. Seth Morris has even waded into this fight, and he's not here today. We had an episode called Archaeology OG. That's what it was called?

The OG of Archaeology. The OG. Why'd you change it around? I don't know. It was just shorthand. The OG of Archaeology, and. Why'd you change it around? I don't know. It was just shorthand. The OG of archaeology. And we had a debate about dire wolves. Were dire wolves ever in Alaska?

Mike Cunz followed up. The body of research on dire wolves indicates they evolved in the western hemisphere, probably North America, and spread into Central and South America during the late Pleistocene. They first appear in the paleontological record about a quarter million years ago, becoming extinct at the end of the Pleistocene about 13,000 years ago. They appear to have been a creature of the temperate, geographical, and climatic zones.

Only five records of dire wolves come from areas north of 42 degrees latitude which is chicago like a warm weather southern wolf the furthest north example 50 degrees comes from medicine hat alberta if you want to get a sense of like furthest north and what that means is an outlier i mean a mountain lion once turned up where the mackenzie river flows into you know the mackenzie delta where the mackenzie river flows into the arctic ocean its ears had been frozen off and part of its tail was frozen off but that's like a northern extreme uh where where seth weighs into this is seth's taking to watch and listening to the guy

that's a guy a gold miner that's been pulling a lot of bones out of the ground in alaska and sounds like he this guy's saying he can't turn around without there being a dire wolf laying there but i don't know if he's having genetic lines extracted from those or what, what, I don't know how he knows what he's looking at. I mean, no, don't disrespect. That covered that pretty well, huh? Yeah. Have you watched any of that? Uh, it like for folks who like picking stuff up

off the ground, like everybody in this room does, like it's, it's fascinating. What is? Because your jealousy is so high. Like watching that dude dig in the dirt all day. Oh yeah. Yeah. I like sneaking there at night.

Oh yeah. And it's like they hide, they can hydrologically mine, right? So they can hit high pressure hose, this hillside you just like watch like mammoth tusk have out of it and you're just like what have i been doing with my life this is terrible have you ever seen uh clint eastwood's pale rider yeah oh yeah yeah one man yeah he's like a preacher and in the end he gets so pissed he goes and puts his little preacher collar in a lock box and takes his two pistols out. Oh, I love that.

There's a lot of hydraulic mining in that movie. It's pretty interesting. Yeah. That was, they used some extras out of Missoula. Did they? For that. The Pale Rider? Yep.

Yep. So it must have been filmed somewhere out here. Hey, folks. Exciting news for those who live or hunt in Canada. And boy, my goodness do we hear from the Canadians whenever we do a raffle or a sweepstakes. And our raffle and sweepstakes law makes it that they can't join. Whew, our northern brothers get irritated. Well, if you're sick of, you know, sucking high and titty there, OnX is now in Canada. The great features that you love in OnX are available for your hunts this season.

The Hunt app is a fully functioning GPS with hunting maps that include public and crown land, hunting zones, aerial imagery, 24K topo maps, waypoints, and tracking. That's right. We're always talking about OnX here on the Meat Eater Podcast. Now you guys in the Great White North can be part of it, be part of the excitement. You can even use offline maps to see where you are without cell phone service. That's a sweet function.

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three months to try OnX out if you visit onxmaps.com slash meet on X maps.com slash meet. Welcome to the, to the on X club. Y'all. You ever seen a very similar plot line? Have you seen Willie Nelson's redheaded stranger?

No, I never have never have oh god it's a good movie and such a good album shot her another preacher yeah shot her so quick yeah no time to warn her is there hydraulic mining in that redheaded stranger no pale rider a lot of it yeah you guys are very good on going off on tangents. Like, fantastically good. This is all, like, lockstep, dude. Well, okay, we went with hydraulic mining, went to hydraulic mining, and Priest Collar. Priest Collar brought us to Willie Nelson's song. Oh, no.

Yeah. Movie. I mean, that's pretty amazing. Well, no, I was more on preachers who... It was a time of the preacher. You can play a little clip of that maybe, Phil. It was a time of the preacher when the story

began. The scene where he goes and pulls his guns out of the lockbox because he has to go to a bank or maybe it's a post office. I assume it's a bank. I can't remember where he goes to get them. And he has to

stand in line, pull his box out. Get his six shooters and go raise some hell. And then he takes the time to pull his preacher's collar off and put it in there like, well, that'll be there when I need it. There's a harrowing scene in that where some old-timer drunk, he gets this huge nugget.

Yeah. Like a huge, like he's like carrying it in two hands and brings it to the bad guys. And they, first they shoot his nugget all to pieces and then blow them all to hell. Right. Because the bad guys. That makes you really hate the bad guys. Have the big operation. And these guys are all placer miners that are sticking to their claims. But the big operation is buying out their claims. And this guy strikes this nugget of untold wealth.

That means he will never give up his claim. And he's in town living it up. And he's got a couple of boys too, a couple of sons. And he's basically sticking it in the nose of the owner of the big height the big mine and uh and uh yeah it's a great scene rubbing it in the face you want to hear a tangent but i'm not gonna do it um you know uh that album redheaded stranger and the movie um there's a great line in that album now the preaching is over and the killing's begun oh that's a great one i thought you're gonna go western someday

where maybe i'm a bad guy and you're a preacher or vice versa i thought you're gonna go uh sergio leone so i would have gone sergio leone over to Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. You follow that? Yeah. That's good stuff. Wow. You guys ever watch that? I don't like it, but it's a kid's show, Octonauts.

I think my kids watched it back in, that's the one where they go around underwater. Yep. Investigating different critters. And they changed it recently where now they can do land animals too. But there's a song in the old one that goes creature report. Creature report. I remember that. And in the middle it's like dance break.

And they dance. Brody's going to do a creature report. Oh yeah. This is a funny one. I thought Chester was going to cover that. Creature report. Creature report. Creature report. No, this one's great.

Dance break. This is awesome. We've talked about the, well, it's not proposed, the planned wolf reintroduction in Colorado bunch. Even though there's already wolves moving in there on their own, they're going to go forward with this plan and uh turns out they're having a real struggle getting wolves to reintroduce which i think is is kind of funny no one wants to give them any um we are working hard to make

this happen they say we're on schedule to meet our obligation to restore and manage gray wolves. That's Dan Gibbs, executive director of the Colorado DNR. To meet the deadline, Colorado needs wolves. And their main sources that they states are not willing to cooperate, even though Colorado is saying, you know, this is where they're going to get the wolves. Greg Lemon from MFWP says, we have not been and are not in conversations about moving wolves to another state. To be clear, we have not talked to and are not talking to Colorado about moving wolves. An Idaho spokesperson said the states have not had any formal conversations. And Wyoming says Wyoming is opposed to sending wolves to Colorado. So their three main sources don't seem to be willing to support the reintroduction, which I think is pretty interesting.

Why, why can't they get some of those same bad mother liquors they sent down from Canada when they did the, um, the super wolves? Yeah, that, that guy, you know, that, well, the, the guy that he knows, knows the guy who trapped him. That they poked him with a stick, found the meanest ones, and sent them to Yellowstone. I'm not sure. They might have to go back to that source, but Colorado goes on to say they've had conversations with Washington and Oregon also. But a Washington spokesperson said they aren't sure what Colorado means

about exploring an agreement. That could be on their end where they've just done some research. We've had zero formal discussion. Oregon has a similar response. And so for some reason, Colorado also listed Utah as a possible source when Utah doesn't even have any established packs. And they're very against Colorado reintroducing wolves because those wolves would just wander over into Utah.

So we'll see if Colorado gets it done by the deadline, which is, I think, the end of this year. Inadvertently, or unintentionally, Wyoming has... Already stocked some. They have. There has been natural migration of wolves into Colorado. Yep. And just to revisit this from the start, it was kind of a strange irony is that at the same time that this ballot initiative in Colorado, which the wording is a little bit complicated, but basically a ballot initiative calling for a wolf reintroduction in Colorado.

At the same time that that was making its way through the process, nature accomplished the goal. Yep. And they had natural migration of wolves into Colorado, which I thought negated the whole conversation. But now certain key advocates for this is saying oh that won't happen nearly fast enough right even though which i which i don't i haven't understood the logic of it where why you'd want to do something where you foist yeah

why like why do something so controversial when what you want is happening in such a subtle natural uncontroversial way and that yep the end result in 20 years time 30 years time you're gonna land in the same place yep exactly it's been it's been like a puzzling um it's been a a puzzling move just let nature do its thing this is all about nature but we need it on our timeline right yeah it makes zero sense it's the approval under this administration is what's what's driving it yeah right and it's like well the law says that we have to follow through on this citizens initiative um and that has to happen on our timeline or else it won't get done and we'll be in violation of whatever the Colorado state constitution, I imagine, on citizen's initiatives. Yeah. What puzzles me about the citizen's initiative is says like, you have to do exploration and move toward the goal of restoring wolves in Colorado.

Find suitable areas to put them. And yeah. So how would you not, how would the plan not be? And, and I'll clarify, like I have no animosity toward wolves. I have no animosity toward any native wildlife.

Um, uh, but just looking at it in a social management scenario, why would the plan not be just to not, why would the plan not be just to manage the wolves that are now in Colorado getting a toehold? How does that, I don't understand how,

like I'd have to have like a legal person explain why does that not satisfy the question? I think it might be that there was a timeline attached to that, that ballot initiative. Like they needed to be on the ground by X. There needed to be X number of wolves by X date was, was part of the original plan. Yeah. Well, like what, what was the, there is a number I've, I've read it.

I know it exists. Like 250 or something like what reintroduction means and what satisfies like the population and there's still i think there's still questions regarding how these wolves will be managed whether they'll fall under the esa or whether they'll be an experimental population which will have big impacts on how they can be well if they managed if they didn't put them in, they wouldn't be under experimental. Right, exactly.

But if they're introduced, they may very well fall under that category. I want to touch on this real quick. This is like a little gamble people make when they're doing endangered species recovery. There was for a long time a debate about whether or not you would reintroduce grizzly bears into the Bitterroot Mountains in Montana. And the deal they struck was if they did a reintroduction of grizzly bears into the Bitterroots, they would carry with them a non-essential experimental designation meaning um it'd be much easier to there'd be it'd be it'd be much easier for livestock owners to kill them

the the the self-defense cases wouldn't be as strictly enforced. Like, you, you know, you wouldn't need to be like prove that you were down to, um, a life or death situation. Right. Just totally different management principle. Or you just don't do that and trust that they get there on their own. Because the minute one walks into that mountain range on its own, it doesn't carry experimental designation. So you could be like, okay, we'll go with the sure thing and put some in and they have experimental non-essential or bide our time and wait a decade.

Hasn't, didn't they, didn't one turn up there recently I thought, or am I wrong? In the Bitter Roots? Yeah, there's, there's been a bear that, that's cruised through there. Um, I think the Idaho fishing game, you know, this is a frustrating thing for a lot of people who are like, yeah, I saw a grizzly bear. That's a grizzly bear track. There's pictures, there's everything.

Well, the state agency can't be like, yep, you're right. Right. They have to prove it if they're going to make a positive statement. And so they, they were able to get a DNA, um, at, at that site and get it verified as grizzly DNA. So Idaho fishing game probably two summers ago said like, yes, we know for a fact that there is a grizzly bear, um, in this general zone. And it was actually more on like the, the Clearwater side. So, you know, much more on the Idaho side than the Montana side of the, the Bitterroot, uh, range there, but we know that bears have traveled

successfully, like across the I-90 corridor, which is seen as, as a huge, uh, break in, in migration because it is so massive there, daunting, um, cutting through the panhandle of Idaho. So, uh, but I, I mean, I, I will tell you like from personal experience in the early 2000s, we cut grizzly bear tracks in the Sapphire range. Um, during, it would have been like the height

of this conversation on putting like physically moving grizzly into the Bitterroots. Which is effectively the Bitterroots. I mean, it's like an easy little stroll. You had to cross 93 or something, right? Yeah. Well, across the valley, across the Bitterroot Valley. Um, but that was really wild, you know, and you're like, yeah, much more

hospitable range than the Bitterroots are for sure, as far as like finding food and stuff, but yeah, that was, and then, so the rock Creek drainage is right there. Um, as we know from meat eater trivia, the U S largest forest that we have in Montana, the Beaverhead national forest is, uh, you know, grizzly bear tracks right in the middle of it. So, uh, speaking of grizzly bears i think there's going

to be a renewed push like the u.s fish and wildlife service i think will again request that grizzly bears delist get delisted soon um i don't think that will go anywhere there it gets held up on the idea that they're not recovered across the entirety of their range, so you can't recover, you can't declare them recovered in certain areas. Following that logic would be that elk would be listed as an ESA species. The elk would be protected by the Endangered Species Act. Bighorn sheep. Bighorn sheep would be protected by the Endangered Species Act. Wolves would be protected by the Endangered Species Act. Bighorn sheep. Bighorn sheep would be protected by the Endangered Species Act. Wolves would be protected by the Endangered Species Act.

Black bears would be protected by the Endangered Species Act. What am I missing? Oh, I mean. Coyotes. That's a weird one. Mule deer, maybe. Mule deer, yeah, perhaps. Black tail,

I'm sure. Would be protected by the Endangered Species Act. Yeah. So the logic that you can't delist something in one place because it's not recovered in another, I don't know that Golden Gate Park will ever have a sustainable population of grizzly bears. Yeah. Though that damn sure

was grizzly country. Grizzly bear steaks on menus in San Francisco. Is that right? Yeah. Really? Yeah. In what years?

All that gold rush era. Burt Wright about the time they made Pale Rider. Can I ask something? Oh, please. First of all, I want to apologize for zoning out. I was just trying to figure out what the one food was that's lowering my testosterone. Did you watch the thing? You might tell you.

I did. I was watching the video while you guys were talking about that. That's why I was not a part of the conversation. I'm back. And I just wanted to say

sesame seeds. Oh, thank you. But also, what is the best argument for reintroducing wolves and the worst argument or the best argument for this one best argument for and best argument against in you know just just like in in 30 seconds for each the best argument

for reintroducing wolves in my view we can go around the table as much as people want to speak to it the best argument for reintroducing wolves is it was human activities that eliminated them from much of their historic range. In particular, it was an activity that we now find to be deplorable, which was indiscriminately spreading poison that certain species that were placed here on the earth should be eliminated because they're inconvenient to us. Okay. And it's a sin against nature to go and eliminate things from planet earth because they're inconvenient the argument against restoring them in colorado is it will have and they all try to dodge this but it's true it will have catastrophic impacts on big game populations in colorado but hunters are naughty to say, it's like naughty for a hunter to say, I don't really like this because it's going to affect elk and deer hunting so negatively.

It's supposed to be that you're not supposed to care about that. But people care about that a lot. What do you mean they're not supposed to care about? Who's saying that? It's supposed to be that like, that that's not a a legitimate that's not a legitimate concern there's one very advocate there's one um all the wolf introductions there's this one guy that plays in all the wolf reintroductions and he refers to hunters as the recreational big game killing um that's that's two yeah the uh loss of uh damaged property livestock uh specifically is uh a big one um wolves definitely get in mess with with domestic flocks of sheep for sure cattle um and

the legalese of like how you navigate that with personal property rights and another animal that's not even yet a game species that can be managed effectively, um, through the game agencies because it's in this limbo of like, well, who manages it? The feds or the state? And does it get such special status that if it's, uh, attacking, uh, your, your property, can you kill it? Can you get rid of it like you would, uh, with a, like a coyote incident or something like that. So there's a lot of things there in the management that people are like, why would we even want to deal with that? And specifically to Colorado, it's like you have wolves that have already walked into the state, which is an area that most people, I feel that get wrapped up in this argument

can agree that like, well, they did it on their own. So now we're in it, whether we want to or not. And, and we can deal with it, uh, because it's been put on the table in front of us. Right. Versus one side saying that we need to drop them in here with the big black helicopters that everybody fear, fears. Got it.

Let me hit you with another one. He said 30 seconds. Well, no, I thought of another one. This is going to sound conspiratorial, but I do think that, I do think it's true. Um, the same way that individual that I just mentioned refers to the recreational big game killing industry. I think that there is that I'm not normally a conspiratorial person.

Right. I think that there are a lot of pro wolf advocates that have, that would like to stick it to big game hunters. Oh, absolutely. That didn't seem like a conspiracy to me. It's not even a conspiracy. It's a sentiment. I think it's like,

it's like they'd like to stick it to big game hunters. Yeah. Okay. I mean, if you're, if you're going out and calling it the industrial. Yeah, whatever. Then yeah, that seems like that's exactly what you're doing. Yeah.

Interesting. They're like, oh, so there's a surplus of deer and elk. I'd rather feed it to wolves than feed it to rednecks. That's, wow. That is so dogmatic. Like, that's so crazy that they're willing to go that far. Their hate for hunters is willing to just kind of upend the whole balance. Yeah, they love wolves.

And they got on 60 Minutes. Wasn't there like a 60 Minutes piece that was showing how amazing this was? I feel like I remember watching that. Oh, the debunked, what's that? Yeah, how the wolves shit rainbows. Something trophism. Trophic casket.

That was a real popular idea for a while. Debunked. Yeah. I got no problem with wolves, man. When I see a wolf, I get real excited. Yeah. But what I do have a problem with is just like mounding so much BS onto it. Right.

We had a woman on Diane Boyd who was very instrumental in like is the the wolf biologist for montana and she even says she advocated for this at the time and in hindsight she still feels that she was correct that they shouldn't have done the yellowstone and frank church reintroductions wolves are coming in from canada and she said i just think from a public perception standpoint and for the sake of how wolves are perceived, just give it time and let them show up. And that's coming from someone who it's their job to think about this and they're pro-wolf. Right. It's like you'd get there anyways. You'd get there anyways and it wouldn't be that you wouldn't turn wolves into the new spotted owl.

Right, right, right. Well, it all comes back around to this citizens initiative and about how none of these actions are based on science or the will of scientists. Yeah, but I don't even know what that means anymore. I know what you're saying, but... No, everybody besides the public that voted for it is saying no. I mean, this proves it right here. There's six other states that are like, let us save you from your own dumbass selves.

And we won't ship you any wolves. Right. You know? Is there, is wolf hunting a thing? Sure. Yeah. Yeah. In where, so they have been delisted in, they delist them in areas.

So there's this idea called distinct population segments. And they've overlaid it. Originally, it was lower 48. Okay. They've then gone on and gotten a little more surgical. And they've created these areas where they look at around the country, what are areas that could feasibly support the animals? So with grizzlies, what there's five or six.

So there's, there's five or six habitat, core habitat areas that could support grizzlies. One doesn't have any. So it's North Cascades, Bitterroot Selway, Northern Continental Divide. Cabinet Yak. Cabinet Yak, Greater Yellowstone. How many is that?

Greater Yellowstone, Northern Continental Divide. Northern Cascade. Northern Cascade, Cabinet Yak. Cabinet Yak, Bitterroot. Selway? Yeah. One doesn't have them. Northern Cascade has, depending on where it's standing at any given time,

has a couple that move back and forth from Canada. So they've gone and said, okay, it's not going to be the lower 48. My joke about Golden Gate Park, it's not going to be Golden Gate Park. Where could it be? It could be in these places. And what they've done is they've enabled it to propose delisting an area. So currently, everyone who has any academic perspective, like anyone who's assigned with, just tell me empirically, are they recovered or not recovered in a sustainable way? Any biologist who looks at this from any federal agency, state agencies are like, greater Yellowstone ecosystem? Yes. Northern continental divide ecosystem?

Yes. Meaning they're not conservation dependent. You could delist those populations of grizzly bears and they're fine. They're fine. With wolves, they've done northern great lakes And it's their back listed It waffles back and forth So much but there was hunting

Off and on there over the last Decade or so so you can't keep track So yeah Michigan's upper peninsula But well beyond Recovery like way Past recovery goals Right and when people say recovery goals is at a time they came in at a time, every, all the different stakeholders got together and they said, what, what does recovery look like?

What's an acceptable recovery? And they came up with, um, uh, I think for, they come up with a pack, like how many packs and different parameters with, with grizzly bears, they came up with how many, how many bears. So they all agreed, 250 bears in the greater Yellowstone ecosystem. We all agree that would be phenomenal. That'd be wonderful. If we could hit that, sure.

We all would sign off that that is recovered. That's phenomenal. Okay, now what do you got? 1,000. Are they recovered? No. Because I said that in order to get what I wanted at the time, but I didn't mean that.

What I meant was they're never going to be recovered. You're never going to pull them off the endangered species list. Cause the minute you do hillbillies and rednecks will be able to kill them. And I don't want that to happen. So the goalpost just moves and moves and moves and it creates tremendous animosity the biggest argument with the dps thing is if you if you how like a person who doesn't believe in any delisting would look and say if you delist grizzlies in the northern continental divide ecosystem and you delist grizzlies in the Northern Continental Divide ecosystem and you delist grizzlies in the Yellowstone ecosystem, how can you guarantee to me that that's not going to impact Cabinet Yak or that that's not going to impact Bitterroot Selway? Because where else would that recovery come from but those two areas?

So if you're going to make it that there's going to be more human-caused mortality in those areas, then I'm going to argue that any surplus of bears you're killing there, you're killing bears that might have been... Migrating to these other areas. Come to these. So don't tell me that it's a distinct population set. This is the argument against it. Right.

Like don't tell me it's distinct because nothing's distinct. Things move around. You can't undo this and not impact that. Connectivity is the, is like the biggest buzzword in this argument. Got it. Like show me the connectivity.

So, because also they, they want to re-examine like what does recovered mean, right? Does it mean right now in our snapshot of time or does it mean forever? And in order for a forever recovered goalpost, there has to be genetic exchange between these groups for the long-term viability of the species, right? Or else you're going to hit this stopping point that does have a name that I can't remember. We talked about it with mountain lions and the Santa Monicas forever ago, where they hit this cliff and all of a sudden that population's gone because it's just bred itself into non-existence, essentially, because it's just swapping the same gene back and forth so connectivity is a big deal which is why when these bears do show up in the clear water on the

opposite side of the bitter roots and wander around that that part of idaho it's a big deal because it does show that a bear from the ncde has traversed these big on paper obstacles of like the I-90 corridor or high human population areas. And then what Steve's saying too is about like this higher human cause mortality that is generally accepted as the case, but it's also, I think what a lot of biologists would tell you is something that we don't really know. Because there is so much human-caused mortality occurring right now while these bears are federally protected. We don't honestly know how that number of vehicle strikes, conflict incidents with livestock, with hikers, people feeling threatened on the trail, etc. A lot of grizzlies get shot by fishing game. A lot.

When they get in trouble. A lot. Um, and oftentimes it's like the people who are actively trying to get to these recovery benchmarks who have to go out and kill the damn bears because somebody didn't lock up their stupid fricking garbage can. Right. And, and literally you're killing this bear that's been put so high up on a pedestal, um, by not locking up your garbage can. And the thing comes and roots through it for leftover watermelon rinds. Right. And it's like, well, that's a learned behavior. We got to get rid of it because eventually it's gonna bump into you in your bathrobe filling up the garbage can.

Right. You might get tickled. So, um, all of these things come together to be like what is recovery and um you know but every year we're addressing more and more of this like protecting migration corridors um the infrastructure act that just went through provided a shitload of funding for like wildlife overpasses and underpasses across these huge obstacles like the i-90 corridor um and you know as we see those things implemented we are removing all these excuses but there's this issue fatigue that we always deal with in the conservation world which is like well we've been we've been doing the thing. We have been funding things in municipalities for bear-proof containers.

We have been eliminating shed hunting seasons on these slopes that are used by wintering big game. And we've been doing all the things because you told us we were going to get this animal delisted and that's where the frustrations just like always keep coming up it's like the goalposts keep getting moved and uh yeah to steve's point there is absolutely a faction out there that's like the bear is so powerful the wolf is so powerful as a tool, a symbol of the ESA, that it is how we are protecting other species that people don't really want to talk about. The charismatic megafauna, right, is the thing on the flag, but it actually is how we're protecting, you know, the freshwater mussels that are super important to our freshwater system, but nobody truly

gives a shit about. I don't think we ever answered your original question though. What I'm realizing is that you guys have no concept of what 30 seconds is. You want to hear a good stat? Wyoming.

So if you look at the greater Yellowstone ecosystem, the official number is 700 or 750 grizzlies but even the but the guy that did that number knows that number is not right and he said on this podcast frank was hugo hugo type in grizzly bear frank USGS. Hugemeier. We had a guest on who, so the USGS isn't a policy organization. They are a fact gathering organization. The facts they gather are then used by policymakers. Frank Van Manen. That's, no.

Is it? Yeah. The guy that headed up the interagency study. Yeah, I'm thinking the wrong name. Frank. What's his name? Frank Van Manen. He says they used a model that he doesn't think is accurate anymore, but it's hard to

change the official number. But he says, so he's like, there's probably a thousand in the greater Yellowstone ecosystem, which is about Indiana. It's a chunk of ground about the size of Indiana that sits in Montana, Idaho, and Wyoming. Whatever portion of those is in Wyoming, there's an interesting statistic where this is years ago. Wyoming was spending two, because of ESA issues, you know, Wyoming spends 2 million bucks a year on the bears and someone once did the math and realized it's an expensive critter for them for the states i went to yellowstone yesterday i took a drive there didn't see any bears did you try to get your money back gosh what was your google review if i could give it half a star, I would.

Don't get it. Alright. So, talk about this Food Network show. Raid the Fridge. It's a goofy show. It's on Discovery Plus now. Is it fun? It's pretty fun. It came from the fact you used to take pictures of people's fridges.

Well, my podcast, Green Eggs and Dan, I interview very, very, very famous celebrities from the fact you used to take pictures of people's fridges. Well, my podcast, Green Eggs and Dan, is... I interview very, very, very famous celebrities. Steve Rinella was a guest. And it's all based on a picture of the inside of your fridge, and then we go down that rabbit hole

of, you know, your relationship to food. But yeah, I took all these... I have all these pictures of celebrities' fridges. It's my kink and the Food Network saw that and they're like we want to turn this into a show

so it became Raid the Fridge which is a it's a food competition show you got three chefs they have three mystery fridges they have no idea

what's in the fridge they can only choose a fridge based on the pictures and the magnets outside once they open that fridge time starts is it fun? I feel like well it is fun but I am also like pictures and the magnets outside. Once they open that fridge, time starts.

Is it fun? Well, it is fun, but I am also like, I love doing it, but I'm also like very anti where like food TV has gone. I feel like it's just become these very aggressive competition shows that are aggressive. Like I loved when we were younger and it was just like the Food Network was like,

a nice person inviting you into their kitchen to show you how to cook something. Are you talking on the place where you work right now? Yeah, I am right now. That's bold. But now everything is like, it's like you come back from the commercial break with like heavy metal. It's like, welcome back to Kitchen Genocide Death Battle Royale. Mary just got sent home because her pot pie tasted like sweaty dick. It's like,

what's happening? What happened, Food Network? Leaving our remaining two contestants for your final challenge, you will be given a rabbit,

a hammer, and three sprigs of dill. You've got ten minutes to make dessert. Time starts as soon as I slaughter this lamb. It's like,

what is going on? what yeah it's gotten too aggressive man well my understanding yeah you just created a pretty graphic picture my understanding is food network this blew my mind maybe you can correct me if my understanding is that food network will not allow a head to be on a fish. Really? Ooh. I have no idea if that's true. I just learned that. And I was like, dude, half the restaurants in New York, you can get a fish with a head on it.

Wait, is that true? That's what I heard. You want me to call my buddy who's in charge of all the Food of Food Network? Yeah, please. Call him right now. On speakerphone right now. I heard that you can't use a barb hook on the Bighorn River. It's illegal.

I heard this from a very good source. You will not find a fish's head on that network. You cannot do whole fried Thai fish. I heard at Bon Appetit, you can't have wine and knives present at the same time. Alcohol. Because you're going to get wasted and cut yourself? Ow! As happens in the kitchen. Is this suspense killing you like it's

killing me? I don't think they're going to answer. Because most people don't. You know why? Because you're like, I have a very good friend. Ten times did I try to call my wife? She'll answer one time. Well, that's not a good one-to-one comparison.

Oh, man. no heads on fish no heads on fish i i don't that's crazy if that's true i'm a huge i don't know if you guys know this about listen let's do this head guy let's do this why don't you go to one of these fridges put a fish with a head on it and see what happens. I mean, I feel like we've had some gnarly stuff on there. I can't imagine a fish head being that. No heads on fish. Didn't you get thrown in Instagram jail for showing a picture of a filleted king salmon one time? Yeah, forgot about that.

That's pretty ridiculous. So, okay, tell me about the book. Did you do your own audio book? Yes, the book. Did you do your own audio book? Yes, I did. Did you do your own read? I did, and it was very, it was an awful experience. Plug the book a little bit. Okay, so the book is Undercooked.

You can get it anywhere you get books. It's an Amazon bestseller right now. In what category? In the category of books by Dan Adut. And it is. It's killing it. It is, you know, it's a comedic food memoir, standalone chapters, each of them about food, but they're also funny and there's a lot of heart. And there's also a bunch of hunting chapters, which.

And they tried to come down. The man tried to come down on you about hunting. The man tried to come down. They wanted to. They're like, you need to take out one of these hunting chapters, which... And they tried to come down. The man tried to come down on you about hunting. The man tried to come down and they wanted to... They're like, you need to take out one of these hunting chapters. You've got too much hunting. Well, what's their argument? Because they were like, it's a food book and people want to buy a food book. They don't want to hear about you going hunting.

Because the two are not related. Yeah, exactly. But I fought and I kept... Was it a tense fight? Like where words exchanged? You know, there was... It's very interesting Yeah, exactly. But I fought and I kept, I kept him in. Was it a tense fight? Like where words exchanged? You know, there was, it's very interesting when you write a book, you have to, it's very like pick your battles on what you're going to put in and what you're not going to put in. So, for example, I, there was a line in it about Anthony Bourdain committing suicide.

And they were like, you can't say committing suicide he died by suicide you have to write he died by suicide huh and I was like walk me through that one so the whole thing about that is that suicide is a mental health thing and that it's not in your control that you're actually committing it's happening to you it's sort of it wasn't a question of his commitment right exactly which I I was like that feels weird to me and I but it didn't feel weird enough where I was gonna fight for that so that I wasn't gonna fight for something else so you know I mean so it was a lot of that happening where you had to pick your battles and so the hunting one was where i kind of stood my ground um because it's basically the there's a chapter on elk hunting which is basically two chapters in one and then there's

a chapter on coos deer hunting and then um stuff about uh goose hunting in the beginning. You know it's pronounced cows. Is it really? No, that's not true. It's not true. He's just doing that fishing guy thing. I just looked at Steve like, Dad, that's not true. I'm seeing you.

The gentleman's name was cows. Oh, okay. But yeah, so we kept it in. And look, part of the thing with this book Okay. But yeah, so we kept it in. And look, part of the thing with this book is that I know that a lot of like, let's call it coastal elites will be reading this because it's like a popular food book and they want to read about food. So I think it's exciting to kind of flank them with the hunting stuff when they don't expect it coming. And I've had so many people say to me, never thought about hunting until i i read your chapters and now i could even like entertain going on a hunt which is pretty cool um do you believe in coastal elites yes you do

100 are you one of them um i am adjacent i'm coastal elite adjacent, you know. But, I mean, I live in LA. Meaning that you just don't make quite enough money to be an elite? I mean, I don't know. I'm trying to understand what adjacent means. You're not a DuPont or a Rockefeller or a Roosevelt or a... No. His kids,

the adutes, will be known amongst that crowd. Yeah, you're not an adute. No, I just feel like there is a group think that happens on uh in the big cities and if you're not a part of it you're kind of excommunicated um yeah so even coming on your podcast for the first time was like coming out of the closet for me in a way, just talking about the fact that I'm a hunter or that I own guns was like, I got a lot of crap for that within my community. And I definitely know. Seriously?

Yeah. And I definitely know of people who probably won't say it outright, but you definitely know that's the reason that you're not hanging out as much. I'm telling you, it's a thing. It's a thing in LA and New York. That's a good way to just skim the scum off the top anyway, right? Yeah, I mean, I think so. But it is, especially when you're in entertainment, it's even another level of you've got to watch what you do.

I was very excited and surprised to hear you name drop meat eater on comedy bang bang this week which is one of my favorite podcasts yeah that's probably the first time you guys have been mentioned on comedy bank the most like nerdy comedy uh podcast in in the country um but yeah i look this is but i think this is why this book is interesting is because i'm i've always kind of straddled those two places of like i love fine dining i love good food i love going to great restaurants but then like i love going hunting and i love getting dirty and and doing those things as well so um i can't tell you how many times i've had to explain to people

the fact that hunters give more money to conservation than all conservation environmental groups combined. And this is a fact that I got from you, which I keep... Well, that's a bold statement. I mean, it is... I wouldn't put that that way. Why not? With the... What is that law that the money from the ammo and the money from the...

It's a lot. But you're just using very broad strokes uh you told me to say no no no dude screw those environmental groups we give more money than they ever will no um it's a but here's high five you're using such broad strokes that you get into hard definitional it's easy to poke holes in it yeah okay hard definitional but here's's easy to poke holes in it. Yeah. If you get into hard definitional problems. But here's the thing. Most people wouldn't even know that hunters give a dollar to conservation.

That's very true. So even opening their eyes to that, I think, is that's the best place, I think, to start the conversation. Hey, folks, exciting news for those who live or hunt in Canada. And boy, my goodness, do we hear from the Canadians whenever we do a raffle or a sweepstakes. And our raffle and sweepstakes law makes it that they can't join. Whew, our northern brothers get irritated. Well, if you're sick of, you know,

sucking high and titty there, OnX is now in Canada. The great features that you love in OnX are available for your hunts this season. The Hunt app is a fully functioning GPS with hunting maps that include public and crown land, hunting zones, aerial imagery, 24K topo maps, waypoints, and tracking.

That's right. We're always talking about OnX here on the Meat Eater Podcast. Now, you guys in the Great White North can be part of it, be part of the excitement. You can even use offline maps to see where you are without cell phone service. That's a sweet function. As part of your membership, you'll gain access to exclusive pricing on products and services handpicked by the OnX Hunt team. Some of our favorites are First Light, Schnee's, Vortex Federal, and more as a special offer you can get a free three months to try on x out if you visit on x maps.com slash meet on x maps.com slash meet welcome to the to the on x club y'all

there was recently a op-ed i think it was in the new york times and it was arguing that they don't like the pitman this guy was saying i don't like the pitman robertson money for conservation it shouldn't go to conservation because it's blood money meaning he doesn't want to he doesn't think that gun and ammo money has a place in wildlife conservation because it's wildlife conservation taking blood money. I mean, it's kind of a, that it's that argument about, and correct me if I'm wrong here, but a lot of the big game hunting in Africa, like where you want to kill a lion or something, you have to pay like a couple hundred thousand dollars to do that. And then doesn't most of that money go to conservation? Yeah, we got some guys coming in pretty soon

that are subject matter experts on that. We tried it before with someone. Who's that? Roger Hurt. And Morgan, I don't know his last name. Potter. There you go. They're all super excited about that. Oh no, I said I was having

some Tanzanians over for dinner. No, you didn't tell me that. Didn't invite me. First of all, if you said that to him, how could he ever forget that? Remember I said I'm having some Tanzanians over for dinner. I mean, yeah. So it's like the optics of that I understand for a non-hunter are really awful. Right.

But it still kind of makes sense, especially if in places where they're not going to get anywhere near that amount of conservation money. But you haven't, has your career suffered at all? Like, did you feel like you lost out on jobs or lost out on gigs or anything? Can I use the word gigs? Yes, you can.

Okay. You can. We're back in the 80s, everyone. And refer to it as the biz, please. Let me tell you about the biz. Look, I think that it kind of probably evened out the amount

of fans that I lost because of that I gained on the other side. You know what I mean? I feel like especially with this book book this book is kind of it's something that i don't think anyone else could really write because i do have a weird uh skill set um of i i don't think that there's any comedian hunter foodies who kind of who do all those three things. I think it's like.

I know one guy that's similar. The comedian hunter foodie. Yeah. Who do you got? The one guy that does podcasts too. Pretty, he's got a pretty big one. I don't think,

but the thing is. He doesn't quite qualify as foodie, but he likes to take pictures of his food and post it to Instagram all the time. He does like to take pictures of his food, but I mean, I've interned in, in Michelin star kitchens. You know, like, I've worked in restaurants.

I'm getting wine certification right now. Oh, that's cool. A hoity-toity. Yeah, take that, Rogan. Take that, Rogan. I like it. I like it where you're coming from. But I'm saying, like, I think mixing those three things is something that,

having come out of the closet with hunting is what gave me that special skill set that I think got me a book deal that was able to get. If I was just like, I'm a guy who loves food and I'm funny, I don't think I would have gotten a book deal. I think it was, oh, this is interesting because he's got all these different weird ways of coming about food i i find it very interesting that the people in food circles have such a wild and wide diet whereas if you're coming from like real rural america like deep hunting culture it it's not it's like very meat and potatoes right and it and it's those people who are like oh i'm not sure if i'd eat that whereas uh i you know i just cooked a bunch of canada goose for some folks that are not in the hunting circles at all very removed from it

and there was i i would say far less hesitation to to eating Canada goose on my table as if I would have put even this group of hunters in this room down at the table and be like, really, Canada goose? You'd be like, really? It's like, you know, bringing a bunch of spoonbills to Hawaii. But, you know, like you get questions, right? Did you do that? I did that. Yeah. Twice now.

I was like, oh, you brought the scrap ducks, huh? But. Cleaned it off the old freezer, huh? That always strikes me as very odd, right? It's like, oh, you'll eat, you know, lamb liver and rabbits and ducks and eels and, you know, over one sitting at some fine dining establishment. Um, and then this idea of only good money, only pure money can go to pure causes, right? When we all know that people are just a bunch of freaks and what they do in their own

homes when people aren't watching like the then being like oh but we can't have your money because of this right it's like it's just i mean it's such a just a bizarre this bizarre thing this expression is so tired now but it's like like, it's virtue signaling, right? It's like, they know that it's hypocritical to say that because the money that goes into,

you know, they're fine to eat a steak at a restaurant that God knows how that poor thing was raised, but then this is blood money going into hunting.

And in fact, I think hunters in a lot of ways are way bigger foodies than pretentious foodies are because, like you're saying, like you guys were just making a joke about knowing the nuances of different species of duck and how they taste. I don't think most people would know like, oh, this lamb that I'm eating was from an older animal or a younger animal or it was, you know, it was killed in this season or they don't know anything about that. You know, maybe you'll have different

grades like a5 wagyu versus you know choice or prime but in terms of this stuff that you guys are like students of i think it's way more interesting and nuanced in terms of like oh i can tell what the diet of this animal was based on how it tastes like that to me seems way more advanced foodie than like oh i just had a 500 meal at the french laundry where you just are like showing you know you're just going and spending a lot of money um and having them talk to you about what farm this animal was was you know what they wouldn't talk about uh we shot a turkey this year in hawaii that its crop was the most full crop I've ever seen. And I take them all out, right?

So it's the top end of the digestive system for a turkey. Yeah, it's got all the rocks and the stuff in it. Well, that's the gizzard. That's the gizzard. That's the next stage. Right, right, right. Sorry. But the crop's like this great little balloon.

It's just a grocery bag, basically. Yeah. And it's always super interesting to see what's in there. Well, we pull this crop out, and it's enormous to begin with, but it is chock full with absolutely nothing but maggots. Oh. Oh. He like hit the maggot.

You know, you'd get, I guarantee you it was a dead rotten hog. No. So, okay. I know, I know exactly what it was because you could smell it and I had asked about it and they, uh, agriculture operation, they had brought in a huge load of fish and they had actually,

they actually have like a giant, um, compost pile that they had stirred up with this fish to make their own awesome super compost. Well, all that fish had been fermenting and the maggots were wriggling out. And so all these birds and mongooses and all this stuff was on top of that compost pile. And unbeknownst to us,

this turkey, of course was there doing the exact same thing, but chock full. Right. And so did it, did the maggots smell like rotten fish? No, I didn't.

I was like, this is unbelievably fascinating. Were they still wriggling around Unbelievably fascinating They were not But your brain wanted Wanted that so badly That you had to look at it multiple times But your maitre d' Or your fancy restaurant guy

Is not going to be like Now this particular turkey Came off the big island No they sit down So what I have today Is this Poached turkey breast Do you mind if I call you Steve?

The maggot stuffed He was on a high protein diet But the blood money thing wasn't necessarily Tied to hunting It was tied to gun violence Sorry if I didn't fully explain that That was the argument Tied to gun violence By the way I was tied to gun violence. Sorry if I didn't fully explain that. That was the argument tied to gun violence.

By the way, I love that I spent all this time trying to tell people about how hunters are the real foodies and they're the ones and then you start

grossing people out with a crop full of mealworms. I ate that bird and it was fantastic. I was going to back you up. I was going to tell you about how that's

a great insight you had. Really? And I wasn't counting a lot of the knowledge that people have as food knowledge. I was counting it as animal knowledge. But if you interpret it as food knowledge and you measure information in bits, as they do, you're right. Hunters have an enormous amount of bits of food knowledge that they think is shit about animals right right meaning that carp right uh have big ribs okay or whatever tastes not always the best um i'd be like well that's stuff about fish you'd be like that's stuff about food yeah because that's a foodie

yeah yeah they when they see a dozen kinds of fish they're seeing all this food information stuff about fish. You'd be like, that's stuff about food. Yeah. Cause that's a foodie. Yeah. Yeah. They, when they see a dozen kinds of fish, they're seeing all this food information. That one's pretty good. That one, you got to fry forever. That one,

you got to get all the fat off. That one, um, is better this time of year than that time of year. No. That one don't eat raw. You'll get sick. Right.

Even do the butchery phase, like how you need to fillet that fish to get the bones Out how you need a word what's edible? What's not that your way more advanced foodie than like anything you could learn in culinary school now? I'm sorry think hunters are all snobs You've landlocked elites Dan likes being grossed out Tell them about those ducks You shot this year

The ones that were Oh that had the rice breast No no no The ones that were Eating in that cow pasture Oh Well There was one in the same

Yeah Rice breast It'll kind of It'll gross you out A little bit But If you don't like scatological talk. Why is this turning into gross out Dan episode?

I don't know. They were just rooting around, as a lot of animals and birds do, they were rooting around in a cow pasture feeding. And every duck that we shot had just a little splotch of cow poop on the top of its beak. Oh, they had been coming from one of those places?

Yeah. Cool. So tell us what else you got going on. Oh, I got another question for you. Yeah. When you're doing, do you do hunting bits? Do you roll hunting bits into your stand-up? I've done hunting bits in my stand-up yeah and it's always

a weird reaction doesn't go it doesn't work well you should do what do one in Billings you'd be fine you know what's crazy by the way so I can't I got to Bozeman and I you know do you guys have a comedy club here and I was like you know what I'm gonna be the cool. comic who comes to the little comedy club. Oh, and looks down on everybody? Pops in. Yeah. Pops in.

Really impresses. You know, they go, oh, wow, we got this big-time L.A. comic coming into town. So I DM them, and I'm like, hey, guys, I'm in Bozeman wondering if I can get up while I'm here. And they're like, who? They go, yeah, Tuesday nights we have our open mic. Oh, no.

Ouch. I was like, oof. I'll just go on a hike instead. Go check out Yellowstone. Oh, man, that would have made my night if I could have gone down and watched you get up and do your business. Maybe they're a little bit behind. What the hell is the comedy club? I don't know.

There's a comedy club in town. Last best place comedy? You know, I think I'm friends with someone that's involved in that outfit. Yeah. But he wouldn't have been the one that got that DM. Oh, I don't know. But, I mean, look, it's fine. They have an open mic night.

I don't want to perform at an open mic. Because then you're just performing for other comics. Dude, I would have had more fun going down there, man. Watching that. We can make it happen. I would have had more fun going down there, man, watching that. I would have said, I'd like an old duels and a big old thing of Bloody Mary mix, man. I would have gone down there and had a hell of a good time. Can you give us a little summary of another chapter, fun chapter that you really enjoyed?

Well, I think the chapter that I'm like, I'm kind of surprised that I haven't gotten called out on. I don't know if I should even talk about it on the air. Go ahead. It's in the book. That'll get me more interested. You're afraid to get into something that you just published in a book?

Well, I'm afraid on this podcast because I kind of like... Because our listeners won't like you. You're being vulnerable about it. I'm being vulnerable. This is my truth. I'm speaking my truth. He whispered to me first because now you got me nervous. What the hell are you going to say? It was like

there's allegedly a small chance that I kind of maybe started a tiny, very small forest fire. Oh, that's fine. Okay,

cool. Get a lot of mushrooms after. Join, join the club. It turns out like doing something dumb with fire. You've been inducted. I don't support it, but I mean,

I don't know many people with a straight face that would tell you they haven't done like some really stupid fire stuff. Oh my God. I feel, uh, I was holding holding that i thought the cops were like just waiting for me outside here i thought this was like a whole big sting operation well as long as it didn't turn into a fire that burned a hundred thousand acres um have you guys heard of paradise uh what is that place paradise city by yeah paradise city Yeah. No, I forget. There was a huge forest fire. I'm making a bad joke. Yeah, I was going to say, wait, hold on. That was me. That was not it.

No. No, I was... No, but I went elk hunting in New Mexico, and I got there, and I went to the... You guys know what a shit tent is. I can tell you what a shit tent is. This is a safe space. It was like a little tiny teepee.

Where you go pot. With a bucket in it. Yeah. Yeah. I don't, I'm not good at that stuff. I don't like it. I was like, I'm just going to hold it in for a week. I'll be fine.

Like a Latvian plug. Yeah. Like a Latvian plug. Mm-hmm. And it was so awfully disgusting. Anyway. Hold on, holding it in that long was? No, I went three.

So I go three days. Held in. Fine. I was proud. Because you don't want to go in a bucket? It was not the bucket. It was like. This is Kostin.

He is a Koso lead after all. This is Kostin and readers. It was not the bucket, guys. It hadn't been changed. It was the stalactites and stalagmites of poop on the bag. They're not swapping bags out. So you weren't allowed just to go out into the woods and dig a hole? I would have been fine with that.

It seemed like that was frowned upon at our elk camp. It was illegal. Okay. Why not? It was illegal. it was illegal um but uh the day that i the the night before i got my elk we were all outside uh and um uh some of my friends went to my buddy mo went to go make a phone call at a at a area called the phone booth which is just like a little piece of land that has reception okay you gotta like hike out to it yeah

and so me and churchy the outfitter he was like let's go play a prank on on mo and my son and we took the car and went to the phone booth so you know haha they could have gotten a ride but instead we drove over there i smoke a cigar up there while I'm on my phone. Can you back up for a second? Sure. They walk to call, make a phone call

and the joke is that you drove there. Listen, not all hunters are funny. Churchy thought it would be hilarious. He's an old man. He's like an old man. He's like, let's go do this joke.

Comedy is hard. I'm like, yeah, comedy is hard, but let's go. So we do that. I smoke a cigar up there and I hand to God, I put this, I put a rock

on top. I squeezed, I made sure it was out when it was out. And next morning we go out, go hunting. I get my elk. Amazing. We get back to camp. I go to take a nap and I wake up to Mo and he's like

dude did you put your cigar out at the phone booth yesterday I was like yeah why he's like that hillside is like on fire right now I was like

what the hell are you talking about he's like there's a hillside on fire exactly where the phone booth was I was like dude I put the cigar out and then like all the other hunters come in. There was, like, five of us.

And they're like, did you smoke a cigar? And I was like, I put it out. I swear to God, I put it out. And then we hear a car coming our way. And, you know, there's no cars at all there. And we hear a car coming our way. And we're freaking out. And I start freaking out.

And suddenly, my insides start turning. And I run to the shit tent to hide in the shit tent. Because I think the cops are coming. And I'm going. And they'd never think to look for you there. He wouldn't be in there. He doesn't like that tent. Your insides turning have nothing to do with the plug?

It was a twofer. I had to go and release myself and also to hide from the cops. So I released myself and I stayed in there. And they know you wouldn't go in there because you don't like it in there. Right, exactly. So I just stayed in there. Because it'll still act tight. You're like, this is my punishment.

Where could he have gone? Guys, I thought I was going to go to jail and I was freaking out. So I was like, I'm going to hide where I would have gotten into that goddamn bucket if I needed to. Then we'd have another, uh, Oh, we're going to have you back on the podcast. A lot of experience.

Uh, anyway, it was another hunter. It wasn't the cops, but we ended up, uh, they ended up putting the fire out and then like an idiot who's like, you know,

going to the scene of the crime. I'm like, let's go up there and see, let's see what this fire, let's see what it looked like, what, what this thing was. So we go up there and there's a firefighter there.

And I start talking to him. He's like, yeah, it's not a big deal. We do controlled burns that are bigger than this. I'm like, yeah, so where, what do you think happened? And like, was it a, he's like, oh, and we know exactly what happened. And there was like an X made with axes, like where they thought it started. And he's like, yeah, it was around here. And like, I start walking towards there

and like my phone reception starts coming on and it was like clearly the phone booth area. It was like, I mean- And you're stoked you did it. Well, according to Crown Publishing lawyers, allegedly, we have no evidence of that. But the funny part was I took that chapter and I asked you for a recommendation

for someone to like edit my hunting chapters because I didn't want like, you know, facts in there that were off about like public land hunts or whatever. And this dude who was a great guy called me. He's like, you sure you want to publish this? My buddy. Yeah. Yeah. And I was like, yeah. He's like, all right.

Good luck, buddy. So, but yeah, it was, I learned I'm never going to smoke a cigar when I go hunting ever again. What kind of cigar was it? Backwoods? King Eddie? It was a nice cigar. A Swisher? It was not a Swisher.

It was something called a Rose of Sharon. Are you familiar with a cigar company? You can probably just get that in New York or LA. No, they're made in Texas. It's a Texas cigar. Made by vets. Made by vets. You know what might be worse than going in the shit tent?

What's that? Is going on the can in a jail cell. I am scared. I'm still scared I'm going to go to jail, especially now that I said this on their podcast.

Because I'm sure you've got a bunch of guys who listen to the podcast who have like ham radios who are like. We've got a lot of people involved in

forest firefighting. Yeah. A lot of people involved in law enforcement. Yeah. Sorry, guys. And where those two

areas meet. That intersection of law enforcement and forest firefighting is strongly represented in our listenership. I think you'd get more hate if you had just said, you know what, I couldn't control that. I went out and just took a big old dump on the surface of the woods and left it with my toilet paper. Toilet paper blown in the wind. Yeah. Yep.

I watched a guy with a spotting scope one time. Me and Helen Cho. I was not far. I watched a guy with a spot in scope one time. Me and Helen Cho. That was not far. Watched a guy with a spot in scope one time. Going down a trail. Is that who I was with? Yeah.

Sorry, was I with Brittany? Yeah. Going down a trail. He stops. I'm not kidding you, man. He stops 100 yards shy of his truck and drops a deuce. Stops on the side of the trail. Drops a deuce at the, stops on the side of the trail, drops a deuce,

cleans himself up and proceeds along his way with the wind carrying strands of toilet paper off through the sagebrush. Not even so much as a cat scratch back in the direction. Not so much as even like scratch back in the direction. Not so much as even like flicking a little dirt. Wow.

That's terrible. It sounded very poetic, though, the way that. I wish I had had my all-in camera adapter on there and filmed him and put it up on social media with one of those, like, do you know this guy? Yeah. I mean, even you bury your bury your okay you bury your toilet paper it's still like i feel like it never really biodegrades how many times you've been to campsites and there's just like toilet paper like like uh just like sticking out of the ground always why does that stuff not biodegrade why do people who walk their dogs bag the dog excrement in a plastic bag, tie in a knot, set it next to the trail, and leave it there?

As though that's better. Oh, yeah. They say that that... I had a friend who had a dog. She's like, yeah, it's biodegradable. I'm like, I don't think that plastic bag is biodegradable. They're like, I'm going to get it later, is what they say to themselves. Yeah.

Sons of bitches. I've carried a lot of both of these subject matters out of the, out of the woods. Fucking horrible. Horrible. But it's just, it's my dislike of people in general that fuels my picking up after them. It's very paradoxical. Trying to clean up traces of them. Yeah.

Like they weren't there. Wait, so you'll take other people's toilet paper and take it out of the woods? Oh, yeah. Wow. That's good. That's commitment to the game. Spite is a powerful motivator. It is.

It's like. When they're doing a State of the Union, they should have Cal stand up. You know how people come down there? Yeah. They'll be like, and this man picks up other people's excrement and hauls it out of the woods. And Cal would like stand up. Both chambers would.

They give him a medal If I was president I would absolutely Imagine The only person I name check would be Cal for that Imagine The Situation where You as a hunter would be like

That is a poor representation of hunters Right those situations Or outdoor folks in general. Right. And it's the, and then I'm always traveling around with dogs at this point. And yeah, so I pack out a lot of those dog shit bags where I'm like, this is just not good. What's wrong with leaving dog shit out in the woods? So if it's dispersed, like actually truly dispersed, nothing.

I leave my shit out in the woods. If it's 30 piles at the trailhead, yeah. That's a problem. That's a problem. And there's a lot of interesting studies, too, just like with, you're familiar with like human waste and undigested opioids and pills and stuff like that. Right. Um, there's a lot of studies that show like dog feces in waterways have serious impacts downstream as far as like,

um, sterilization of, of streams or, uh, promotion of like big algae blooms and things like that. Do I need to smear dog shit

all over your little cast boot there to find out why you don't like it? I don't know why this is where the conversation has gone. I do not like... I feel like you're arguing in favor of it. It started with a shit tent. I think wolves should be able to shit

wherever the hell they want and no wolves should be able to shit wherever the hell they want and no one should be able to pick up that shit. No. Wolves do shit wherever they want. They mark their territory that way. And if you're into picking up shit antlers, they will shit on a moose antler,

like a beautiful moose antler. They'll shit right on top of it as if to say, like, I know other things want this. Like, you know, dogs love to chew on them, wolves love to chew on them, coyotes love to chew on them, and they will shit right on top of that moose antler. Danadute, author of

Undercooked, available everywhere books are sold. We're going to play trivia. Okay. Do you feel that at the... At what question do you feel that Phil will inform you that you're out of the game? Oh, I'm actually going to do a lot better than you think I am. So at question eight, you don't think Phil will say Dan's out? I don't think so.

I think that as he just explained with his cross-section of where he's found himself, comedy, hunting, what was the third one? Food, foodie stuff. We should save this conversation for trivia and let Dan plug his book a little bit. Before I plug my book, I just want to say

to all the cops and firefighters listening right now, I am a huge fan of law enforcement. I support you. Back the blue. You know how many tickets I've gotten out of because of Cobra Kai? A lot of cops love Cobra Kai. And I've gotten

out of about eight tickets. Aren't you the guy from Cobra Kai? They'll be like, aren't you the guy from Cobra Kai? They will know, but sometimes in the beginning of the pandemic, you have your mask on. Do you have your Cobra Kai headshot on your dash? It's a picture of me and Ralph.

It's on his ID. Oh, I'm sorry. That's my pass for the Cobra Kai set. Oh, here's my driver's license. A bunch of wallet-sized headshots just pour out of his wallet. Yeah. No, cops love Cobra Kai,

and I love cops so please don't arrest me. Plug the book one more time. Undercooked. How I Let Food Become My Life Navigator and How Maybe That's a Dumb Way to Live.

You can get the book wherever you want your books. The audio book is great. I did the reading of it. It's very fun. Do fun voices. A little more fun with delivery and whatnot. But yeah, people are loving the book.

I hope you do too. Very funny, standalone essays. I'm being called the David Sedaris of food writing. Whoa. By my mother. So yeah, no, I hope you enjoy it. I think, I would love for the hunting community to read this book.

I really think they'd love it. Have I told my funny David Sedaris story? I don't think so. Yeah, I thought we were going to maybe linger on Dan finally. Oh, whatever, I'll tell you some more time. I'll tell you some more time. Wow. It's beautifully done.

It's raw. I laughed so, like, just within the first few pages, I probably laughed two dozen times. He says that footnotes are his love language, which I find hilarious. So it's, like, peppered with little hilarious footnotes. It's surprising. It's beautifully done.

And what's revealed is your original kind of very early connection to food, which is a very sad and touching story. And, yeah, I mean, I just love your book. Thank you, Corinne. The David Sedaris of food writing. Wow. You might be, you know, Steve's reading his own audio books now. You might be able to give him a few pointers on how to spruce things up a bit. Funny voices would be cool.

I will say, with my book, it's like a very vulnerable, raw book. And I'm reading these passages that I should be speaking to a therapist about. But instead, there's just a sound engineer, like some weirdo sound engineer on the other side of the glass who's like, Dan, I think you're crying. Can you stop? Take that again. Why are you crying? We can hear it. We can hear the crying. I'm like, I'm so sorry.

Just give me a minute. But, yeah, I love doing the audiobook. It's a labor of love. Because it's a lot better when you read your own stuff. It's always weird when someone else reads your stuff, I feel. But I feel like Steve's repertoire for voices

is literally just high pitch and low pitch and normal. That's three? That's three? I mean, how many you got? That's what everyone has.

That's what everyone's got. But he's got a killer Christopher Walken, though. Yeah. High pitch, low pitch, normal, and Christopher Walken. Well, congratulations. Thank you. Thank you. And again, walking though yeah high pitch low pitch normal and christopher walking oh well congratulations thank you thank you and again thank you for making this happen well tell people how to go find all

your stuff so if they want to go see you perform they do what you can just find me on uh instagram i post everything at stand up dan twitter at stand up dan you post all your shows there yeah they want to watch you on TV they need to get Netflix or steal a Netflix password from someone you know and watch me on Cobra Kai or on Discovery Plus raid the fridge

I'm in a new movie called The Donor Party that is out now oh that's funny yeah with Malin Ackerman and Rob Corddry yeah and if I'm in your town come see me perform at the That's funny. Yeah. With Malin Ackerman and Rob Corddry. Yeah.

And if I'm in your town, come see me perform at an open mic, apparently. Tuesday night open mic. Tuesday night open mic. I just followed you on Instagram. Oh, thank you. Stand up, Dan. Stand up, Dan. Undercooked.

Undercooked is the book. Anywhere books are sold. Yeah. Anywhere books are sold. Now, if everyone just buys it on Amazon, the New York Times will bone you on the list because they don't... It's a long story. I know.

Save that for another show. But in the category books by Dan and Duke... It'll still kick some ass. Yeah. It will. Thanks for coming on, man. Thanks for having me. I really appreciate it.

You should host a hunting show with the rest of the folks who blurbed your book on the back. Phil Rosenthal, Hasan Minhaj, Jimmy O. Yang. I think that would be an all-star team of hunters in the field. And stay tuned for trivia. On question eight, Phil will say, and Dan's out of the running. Wow. Come on, Steve. Well, hey, I'm knocking you down, dude, because you're like competition.

Zero confidence. Well, no, no. I'm just playing. I'm already playing. Yeah, hey, I'm knocking you down, dude, because you're like competition. Zero confidence. Well, no, no. I'm just playing. I'm already playing. Yeah, ask Steve when he was there. Amazing. Oh, ride on, ride on, little car, don't. I want to see your gray hair shine like silver in the sun

Ride on, ride on my love Sweetheart, we're done beat this damn horse to death So take a new one and ride on. We're done beat this damn horse to death. So take your new one and ride on. Hey, folks. Exciting news. Hey folks, exciting news for those who live or hunt in Canada. You might not be able to join our raffles and sweepstakes and all that because of raffle and sweepstakes law, but hear this. OnX Hunt is now in Canada.

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