The MeatEater Podcast - Ep. 648: MeatEater Radio Live! Hunting for a Mount, Show and Tell, and an Unlucky Buck

Episode Date: January 10, 2025

Welcome to MeatEater Radio Live! Join Steve Rinella and the rest of the crew as they go LIVE from MeatEater HQ every Thursday at 11am MT! They’ll have segments, call-in guests, and real-time interaction with the audience. You can watch the stream on the MeatEater Podcast Network YouTube channel, or catch the audio version of the show on Fridays. Today's episode is hosted by Spencer Neuharth, Janis Putelis, Brody Henderson, and Phil Taylor.  Connect with The MeatEater Podcast Network MeatEater on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and YoutubeSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Welcome to Meat Eater Radio it's 11am Mountain Time. On January 9th and we're live from Mead Eater HQ in Boisman, Montana. I'm your host Spencer Newarth joined today by Brody Henderson and Giannis Poutelis. On today's show, we'll interview Matt Daniels about a 7 year quest to track down the mount of his dad's record book, Deer. Then we've got Show and Tell, followed by a Hot Tip Off, and finally, we'll talk to Ben Dedimonte about an elk hunt where four arrows wind up in the same bowl. Four of them. We're going to get to the whole thing at the end. It's a wild over-the-counter experience that I

think few have had, but most have probably had nightmares about. How'd you boys spend Christmas break? Eating, drinking, hanging out with fun people, getting outside, living the life. Oh, okay. It's pretty much, yeah, it's the best. You probably describe yourself that way anytime, not just Christmas break, right? Yeah, I feel like I'm pretty lucky, pretty fortunate, as I think everybody in this room should feel the same way.

Good on you, Yanni. How about you, bro? Are you doing anything exciting when we get next to coming to the office? Same thing. Got a lot of bird hunting, which is nice. Kind of a bittersweet time of year, because it's like the end of hunting season.

At least for those of us that aren't Yannis that just get to hunt all year long. Yeah, this is a time of year when I get very motivated about finding my next permission, about finding my next permission about finding my next Yeah, you got tag. I want to get yeah. Yeah, and I'm like, I'm just thirsty for more of that and I can't do it It'll be turkey season before you know it. Mm-hmm. Yanni You just had a successful haunt though yesterday as we sit here talking about not haunting anymore. I did

Mingus my buddy Jake and Pip and Helen. I actually went up one canyon and walked this track for a half a mile. I keep looking at it. I'm like, some bitch, it's gotta be a fox. But I'm like, I'm not seeing the claws, which would tell me it's a fox or a coyote, you know?

But at the same time, I can't catch a leading toe to really tell me that it's a bobcat Mm-hmm. I keep looking at it. You had it narrowed down to those three things though I was thinking Fox or Bobcat. Okay, cuz it was pretty small the deep snow making it like hard to tell No, it was on the trail and sometimes you know when you're out not under trees It was a couple inches, but just under the trees it might have been just a skiff so I got all versions of this track cuz I walked he was on the trail for a half a mile turns out it was a she and Luckily I took a picture and sent it to Jake's we hadn't hooked up yet and I'm like, what do you think Fox? You know, but the picture doesn't go through and he keeps text me back

I didn't get the picture. I didn't get the picture. I'm like, I think it's a Fox But the picture doesn't go through and he keeps texting me back. I didn't get the picture. I didn't get the picture I'm like adding it's a Fox So I like check another canyon and then I drive to meet him in a separate Canyon right when I get there The picture finally goes through and he's like dude Bobcat. Let's go back to there. All right. Let's go Do they have the same kind of gate? Box and Bobcat. No, it's more like a lion, you know where they direct register right where they place each pad in the next pad Are there any other clues besides a track that you could come across like what if you found? Some crap would that give you any clues or no?

Mmm, not me maybe maybe some other expert Yeah, but no it's all in the track and the gate and the maybe the Yeah, the length of the gate the stride. So you guys go back? but yeah, we go back there and to cut the dogs loose on it and They run it for I don't know Not far 400 yards and they actually went back towards the truck and they were basically 300 yards above the above the truck and they treat it all together which I explained in the post yesterday put on the Instagram that Mingus has hasn't caught a bobcat yet on his own and

It's a big deal they're a lot harder to catch than a lion. Okay. Much, much harder. I can explain if you like. But, so that hasn't happened yet. Last time we caught a bobcat, it was again with Jake and these same dogs. And I've talked about this before, they're superstars. I mean, it's like when you go out with them, you're getting to play, you know, pickup ball on your team, you've got LeBron and MJ. LeBron and MJ. And last time Mingus was five to ten minutes late getting to the tree. Okay. In a way it was good because he instead of me twoing and hearing the dogs bark and treat and picking up his head and running over there and going yeah! You gotta find a better term for that than me twoing. Carry on. You know what I mean though. Uh-huh. He keeps to the track and works the track

all the way to the tree and then goes, all right, yeah, sweet, I'm here too. Well, yesterday, they, according to the GPS, they all got there together, they all treed together. And so I feel like I could give Mingus credit for like a legit bobcat catch. Yeah, let's officially award that one to Mingus. Yeah.

And then you shot it I shot it. Okay, about a 15 pound female beautiful and yeah, they're gonna come overnight Help me to skin it. How often are you passing on Bobcats when you treat one never I had we haven't treated one Okay. Now Jake who wants a lot more than I do. I don't know how many he's treed He said he's only killed one this winter, but I'm guessing he's probably treed ten others, and he's let them all go because they were probably either females or too small. He's looking to kill mature male. And Phil has now pulled up the video of the end of the hunt. No, this is the mount lion hunt from the week prior. Oh, sorry, Yannis. No, that's okay.

Do you ever get a bobcat or anything up a tree and you just can't find it up there because it's well from view funny you say that especially with bobcats and I found that out with Like three weeks ago when my wife and I went we treat a mountain lion a female and her kitten the kitten was a couple hundred yards away in a different tree and and her kitten, the kitten was a couple hundred yards away in a different tree. And a thing they have, it's a problem with Mingus because he trees them on the scent, right? He's like, I know they went to this tree,

track goes up this tree, but I can't see him. He trees hard for about an hour just on that scent. And then when he can't find it, he starts to lose confidence and he wants to be treeing or wants to be running a track or something, so he starts running the track back out and searching, coming back to the track. So when we went to the kitten's tree, I'm walking up to it going, man, he slick treed me, which is the term meaning that your dog is barking tree, but there's nothing in it.

I had to get all the way around the tree and get eye level with that kitten until I could find it. But I was able to do that and only be 15 feet from it. This bobcat yesterday, it took Jake and I walking around in circles for probably 15, 20 minutes. No way. Until we finally spotted it. Did the dogs see it the whole time? They never saw it.

Okay. And so they kind of had done, before we got there, they had left the tree, tried to think that there must be a different out. So they ran back on the same trail, kind of searched around for a little bit, a hundred yards away, and then said, nope, it's this way.

And they came back to the tree. Eventually what happens if they're long enough, and if you have the right wind, scent, thermal conditions, the scent from that animal will drop down. And he's 30 yards up there. I mean, he's 90 feet up in a tree, way up there, but that scent drops down and all of a sudden it hits him. So they'll be kind of searching around on the ground

a little bit like, I don't know, I don't know. And then all of a sudden that scent will hit him and all three of them, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, just blow up on it and then they'll tree hard for 15 minutes but if again if this if the wind changes a little bit they don't but yeah I did and it was snowing I realized to the scope I had it it was it wouldn't focus close enough like it wasn't a rim

fire scope and so I couldn't get the the parallax to focus at like 30 yards yeah so that made it a little bit difficult but ended up with a good shot and one shot killed it okay working your way up to being not MJ or LeBron but Nicole Jokic maybe Mingus yeah yeah he's doing good someday soon all right joining us on the line first is Matt Daniels who went on a seven year quest to track down the mount of his dad's record book whitetail. Matt, welcome to the show. How's it going guys?

What's up Matt? First thing, tell us about your dad killing this deer. Well, so my dad started bow hunting back in the early 90s and never was much of a trophy hunter. Didn't really care about the size of the antlers or anything to provide for the family. And he happened to go into a property one day and climbed up in a cedar tree with just sitting on a cedar limb with his bow in his lap. That thing came walking through.

That's amazing. And this happened in what 1995 correct? 95 that's correct. Okay so your dad he recognizes this is a big buck but maybe doesn't understand the full scope of what just happened so he does get the deer mounted right? Yeah he did. Okay so he has it mounted kills it in 1995 and then tell us what happens in 2000 Yeah, so somewhere in 2000 before I was born he ended up selling it selling them out to a

collector and then Before you were born at what point do you find out that this deer ever existed and that your dad killed this thing? I Think it was 20 When do you find out that this deer ever existed and that your dad killed this thing? I think it was 2017. He pulled a Polaroid picture out of his dresser drawer and was showing it to me. That was the first time I'd ever seen any pictures of it. I started asking him, like, man, what did that thing score?

Because you can tell from the picture, that's just a giant deer. And he had never had it scored until the person that he sold it to came and scored it. And he remembered it being 200 inches in that. And I was like, there's no way. Like that's a state record if that's the case, you know. So I took that picture, posted it on a Facebook and a Kansas hunting and fishing group, just asking, you know, does anybody know about this deer? And, uh,

within 24 hours I was in contact with the person who owned it. And so 24 hours later you're talking to the current owner of the Mount. What happened then? Yeah. So from there I reached out to him, um, to him a copy of that picture to prove that it was the same deer. And from there we actually mailed handwritten letters back and forth for a little while, kind of discussing if he would ever think about selling it.

And he finally got back with me on that and told me he'd sell it back to us, but the price was right at $40,000. And do you know how he acquired the buck? What was the chain of events that wound up with this Antler collector? I think he was in Maine, right? How did it wind up that he ever had this thing? Yeah. So as far as I know, it had been sold over the years years a couple different times And he ended up buying it from another collector

Okay, so he offers to sell it to you for forty thousand dollars when he said forty thousand dollars Did you expect that to be the price and did he sort of act like? I'm doing you guys a favor by offering to sell it to you for 40,000 or was that what he would have sold it to Me or Yanni as well. I Mean he made it seem like he was only gonna sell to us because he believed you know it belonged to us since my dad was the person harvested it but That price at that time it was a heart shock, you know, I I was only 16 years old at that time So forty thousand dollars to me just sounded completely impossible.

Yeah, but you do manage to scrape a little bit of money together, right? Yeah, so I kind of kept everybody up to date on the post on Facebook, because there was a lot of people following along with the story. And a lot of guys were telling me, you know, they were willing to, I went 20 bucks, 50 bucks,

and they're like, why don't you start a GoFundMe or something? And I was like, there ain't no way, there's no point, but they talked me into doing it and I ended up raising about $15,000 towards it. So 15,000, do you make a $15,000 offer at that point? No, I mean, the guy at the time that owned it he told me he wasn't gonna budge on that price so after after a month or so of the go fund me being up and Everything kind of went stale. I came to the realization that that price wasn't gonna work out for me Okay, and at that point Matt it gets sold a second time while you're tracking this to you, right? Yeah, so when I reached back out to the current owner at that time and told him you know that I wasn't gonna be able to come up with the money he went ahead and

sold it to another collector. And what was it like dealing with that collector because you sort of went through the same process again of trying to buy it or trying to get a replica right? Yeah so I reached out to the new owner that just purchased it and he's a pretty well known handler, click bio. Um, and he, he didn't really want to work with me too much. He, uh, confirmed that he did own it. Send me a bunch of current pictures of it, which it was just

the school cap at that time. Um, and then I talked to him about getting a replica. He kind of said it wasn't going to be a possibility and I kind of messaged him back and forth for a couple of years and he didn't ever really want to help out too much. So it feels like again, Matt has hit a dead end and you guys should watch this episode of Media to Radio on YouTube because here's a spoiler. We can see the mount in the background of Matt. So this antler collector in Ohio now has it, but not for long. And it gets sold a third time during your pursuit.

Yeah. So after about two or three years of talking to this, he finally messaged me back one day and pretty much I don't own any, Bass Pro has it. So from there, I think, well, maybe I'll at least be able to see it every track in my life at this time. So I started to try to reach out to Bass Pro and that was a task on it And so when bass pro has it um, do you know what they were doing with it at that point like where were they displaying it? So I was under I was told it was supposed to be on display at the wonders of wildlife At their springfield, missouri headquarters Um, and I called that location They said they couldn't really release

any information of what antlers were on display there so I had a couple buddies that ended up going there and they kind of FaceTimed me through the whole thing and it was not on display this is probably about six months after I was told that it was supposed to be so at this point I'm like does Vast Pro even actually have this rack? You know is the guy just lying to me what not? How did you end up even tracking down the right person to talk to at Bass Pro? Yeah so pretty much another year and a half or so.

Calling locations emails, voice mails, and I never got a response back. I pretty much spent a few minutes on work, every month just calling and leaving a voice mail, sending another email, and then just randomly this September I got an email back and I honestly thought it was a scam email There was an email from a person with Bass Pro Regarding information on this dude. Okay, and it must have been good news because again This mount is sitting right behind you. What what did they have to say? yeah, they so at first they just confirmed that they did own it and

Yeah, they so at first they just confirmed that they did own it and That the antlers were not on display and the real rack not planned to be on display I don't really know behind that But they told me I was able to get a replica and I would have to work with Plars by Klaus They used a replica of the handlers by Klaus. So they got me in contact with that company. And then from there, I just worked with them on getting a replica made. And shortly thereafter,

the thing showed up at your front door. Yeah, yeah, they definitely worked with me. I think the average time for the replica is around three months to four months. And I had it at my door in five. Okay, so five weeks later, he gets the rack. Um, what is the hide on the deer? You've, you've obviously found some other skin to wrap around this Mount. What is,

what is that? So once I found out that I was going to get, get a replica made, when I found out when I was going to get it, now I was on a mission to find a cape for the mount. And I thought it'd be really cool to use a cape from a deer that I harvested on my dad's deer, just sentimental reasons. So now I was out on a mission to harvest a good mature deer

to get a cape for it. And that's what I did. There you go. Well, it looks magnificent. Now at some point along the way, Matt, this deer gets entered in the Boone and Crockett record books, right? Yep, yep.

It's entered as a bath pro as the owner and my dad, Albert. Tell us about the details of this buck, some of the measurements that would make a whitetail hunter's jaw drop. Yeah, well, I mean it's Yeah, he's uh, he is the perfect deer He's the type of deer that when a wildlife artist is like drawing a scene that has a whitetail buck in buck in it

They always make a whitetail buck That's just too perfect and too big. And what they're modeling that after, you would think, is this deer that Matt's dad killed. Yeah, even though when they draw them, I think they're even maybe 80% smaller. Or 20% smaller. Sorry, they're only 80% of that is that joker. That thing's amazing. Hey, has your dad told you that spot? Have you been to the spot where this deer was harvested? Yeah, it's actually only about 15 miles from where he still lives But he's taking me out there and at the time of the hunt. It was a big cedar farm just thick cedars everywhere

It's all just row crop now, unfortunately mmm And what's your dad's attitude been like throughout this seven-year quest of trying to track this thing down? Has he been super interested or has he just been like totally disinterested? I mean, he thought it was cool. He never really cared that much about getting the replica or getting the rack back. Like I said, he didn't even know it was a record or how significant of a deer it was until I kind of started getting myself into the story of it. But we surprised him with it Christmas Eve and he couldn't believe it, man.

He was just blown away. Can you move your camera, Matt, to show us some of the details of this buck? We want to get a real good look at this thing's rack. My goodness. Just perfect all around. Enormous G2s and G3s that are the same length. I imagine like the only deductions on this thing were maybe on the Brow Tides, is that right?

Yeah, it's got, so it grows scores 212 and 3 8 So it's got about 12 inches of deductions and a lot of it is the g5 here Okay, so he's got like an inch and a half g5 on that side and this side's about five or six inches Amazing deer We're happy that you were able to track this thing down and that your story had a happy ending. How did your fall go this year, Matt? When I talked to you yesterday trying to line up this interview, you said you needed to

wait a few hours before you could call me because you were deer hunting. Yeah, I was just going out to get a doe last evening and didn't end up getting one. Seen a few deer across the field but didn't end up making a shot. Alright Matt, well congrats on tracking down that deer and good luck with what's left of your whitetail season. Thank you. Thanks for joining us. Thanks Matt. Seven year quest. I just spent the rest of my life trying to find that buck if I was Matt. I'm glad that it worked out for him. Yeah, I'm glad he has that. I was Matt, I'm glad that it worked out for him. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I'm glad he has that I was gonna I was gonna ask him and just didn't get around to it, but how Real are those replica antlers? Like if you don't know that the replica antlers will you be fooled?

Well, were you not there when Dustin Huff brought in? Yeah, moose his buck Yeah, brought it to the live show in Cleveland. Yeah, I think it was a picture You have no idea that you were looking at a replica I think they're so good now that they would they would fool you even if you knew you had a 50% chance of Guessing whether or not that thing was real or fake I don't think but what if you just had like the skull capped antlers and it was a replica and you're holding it like Did they do the weight? I? Imagined it's it's got to be pretty dang similar. I can't I can't I mean I know on my on that sheet mount that

John Hayes did mm-hmm for me. I mean you can't tell The weight and everything I mean it's spot-on. Yeah You can see that buck it sounds like at the wonders of Wildlife Museum from Bass Pro I don't think we specifically touched on it there, but in one of the articles that was written about Matt's story, Bass Pro told Matt that the real antlers will never be on display anywhere. They're always going to be hidden away in some storage room. If you go and try to look at that book of Matt's dads,

which is now officially the Kansas state record for typical whitetails, you're always looking at a replica. That's sad. That is sad. I think so too. I'd just rather not know at that point. Yeah. All right. Moving on. Our next segment is Show and Tell. Me neither, show him down Me neither, show him down Me neither, show him down

Spencer brought a rock What else did you expect? What another fine jingle from Phil Yanni, let's start with you What did you bring for the classroom? Let's just listen to Phil's jingles for a with you. What did you bring for the class? Phil's jingles few more minutes. I'm trying to show the classroom. Well since we're on the Theme of Bobcats. Oh, yeah, that is that is the theme, huh? Yanni has a live Bobcat in the studio. I've never I've never properly

the studio. I've never I've never properly like done a post about this this guy. A lot of people maybe you can watch the episode where Jake and I go and kill this bobcat. It's in Montana. Mingus was not in on the on the the catch but it was such a fine specimen Jake said that I should definitely kill it and get it mounted. How heavy was that thing? 25 pounds. Oh, I'm gonna guess 28 on the nose. That's like upper end. That's beefy. Oh, yeah monster I think they get bigger in the Midwest, but what they don't have in the Midwest is a belly like that Yeah, you can see that But that that that is what makes a high dollar Bobcat is when you have that big wide white belly with those beautiful Black spots. I've seen three bobcats in real life out in nature while I was doing something else

They were all half of this size. This this thing looks enormous to me Oh, it's yeah, the one I killed yesterday was well, we guessed it at 15 pounds So 10 pounds less and it seemed like it was half the size. But yeah, John Hayes did the taxidermy. It's actually a pillow mount. Clay was up there and did a little video on a coyote that John had that he was doing a pillow mount of, and I thought, man, it'd be great to do a pillow mount

because it's hands-on, right? And you can change its body positioning because it's got a kneeled wire. Yanni is working this thing around. I mean, you can totally just, you know. My goodness. That doesn't look normal when you do that. He's making it do the YMCA now.

Yeah. Most taxidermy is look and don't touch, but not this thing. Totally. No, I figure even if the kids that come over to my house rub the hair off of this thing, it'll have served its purpose, you know? Which is hopefully to get kids interested in wildlife and bobcats and whatnot.

Those pillow mounts are becoming more and more common. Yeah, but you can't do them, John says you can't do them on animals much bigger than this, yeah, it just gets harder and harder. And he said that especially for some reason it's very difficult to get a cat to look good in a pillow mount. It's much easier to do a canine for some reason just because of the body structure.

What's that thing filled with to give it that like pillowy sensation? You know, I don't know exactly. I know it's got a kneeled wire running through as the skeleton, but I don't know what the actual pillow stuffing is. It's almost like memory foam or something. Yeah, I mean it bounces right back. Yeah, it's satisfying to squeeze. The thing I've always been impressed with with that one is its face, its head, because it's just like so, like, so lifelike. Listen, one of my favorite things to do, I'm trying to position him so that folks can look right into his can we go to a full camera just on on them? Phil we can't it's not gonna make it any bigger though, okay? Um

But I will My for my favorite things to do this it used to always sit on top of a bookshelf So it's about eye level it was cool up there But now what I do my wife loves plants there's a lot of plants in the house each that thing towards the camera to give It a better view. This camera here, Yanni. Keep going, tell your story. But I will hide it.

This is a hard multitask that you're asking me, Spencer. Well, I'll fill in here for a second. You hit it in the studio today. Yeah, so I'll- I just caught a glance of it coming in through our window, and for half a second it startled me I it was it was curled up under the table when I walked in and staring right at the door And I walked in and I my heart skipped a beat for a second. It was it was not fun. So yeah, I'll place it

Kind of conspicuously, you know near under a plant, right? It's only half of its body showing and you just get so it looks like a cat hiding and staring at you We had a house sitter while we were in Latvia. Oh come by People checking on chickens and getting eggs and whatnot it startled her so bad that she left the fridge door open and Damn near killed my fridge because she just ran out of the house she didn't want anything to do with this thing but yeah it's amazing like it gets people every time like Phil just saw it

underneath the table did she think it was real real I don't know what she thought but she didn't want to find out I wrote an article a few years ago it was specific to deer taxidermy and shoulder mounts. And like, what should you look for if you're visiting a taxidermist or looking at a taxidermist's work and you want to be confident that they're good at their job? And they had mentioned a handful of things.

The three that stuck out to me were all regarding the face. And it was about the eyes, the nose, and the ears. And those three things on this pillow just look fabulous. Oh, it's amazing That's why it makes people's heart skip a beat when they see the damn thing Yeah, you just are you getting a yesterday's cat just tanned. Yeah, I'm just gonna tube skin it Yeah, and hang it up somewhere in the house and then when Bobcat fur prices get real high. I'm gonna cash in That

That was a good item bring in for show-and-tell Brody. What do you got with you today? Oh Spencer? I'm gonna take you back to a time when people didn't waste their time watching Yellowstone and squid game and they read books big books That is an enormous book. Wow. Yeah The the Bobcats kind of in the way there Yeah, what yes one Wow. Yeah. The Bobcat's kind of in the way there. Yeah. What, this one? Brody has two enormous books with him today, stacked on top of each other.

I inherited these from my dad. They gotta be about 10 inches tall. Yeah. Both of these were published in the mid-60s. This is the new Hunter's Encyclopedia. Both of these were published in the mid 60s. This is the new Hunter's Encyclopedia. Oh, wow. Not new anymore. But I used to have the dust jacket for it, but it fell apart.

Have you read this thing? Oh yeah, man, that's why I brought them. When I was a kid, I spent countless hours reading both of these. This one is McLean's standard fishing encyclopedia and it's like extensive man and the cool thing about looking through these now is the stuff that has changed immensely and the stuff that hasn't changed at all it's like because they have everything

like in here from like guns and cartridges You know and a lot of that stuff's like obsolete now But yeah, they're awesome and the the fishing encyclopedia that thing looks old But then you put it next to your hunting encyclopedia and it makes it look new Yeah, I don't know. I mean, maybe this one just got read more. What year are they from? Do you know mid 60s? Well your dad I like how he labeled the inside of the cover with his name and the and the year that he got it Yeah, it was like an old school label maker. Yeah, it's like a piece of Tupperware that you take to potluck Yeah, I wanted to make sure when that thing was making the rounds. Yeah, these are 60 year old books

Was making the rounds that yeah, these are 60 year old books You can still get them on Amazon. They're not that they're not that they're not Thousand dollar collector items you can still find them. Mm-hmm. So yeah Every now and then I pull them out. Take a look. It's very cool You know, you're gonna have your sons thumb through those someday. Yeah hunting and fishing Yeah, I mean the older one has looked through both of them a little bit but it's you know it's a challenge these days. You got a lot of competition. All right last thing for show and tell is what I brought today and this is one of my favorite whitetails that I have ever killed because he has a super unique rack. I killed this buck on opening day of

South Dakota's rifle season in 2016. It was the last like five minutes of shooting light. It was a blizzard and this buck was at like 100 yards, just showed up on the edge of this cornfield I was hunting. And I didn't have a great look at him. I was like, man, there is something weird with this deer. And I had to decide kind of right then if I was gonna shoot him or not. I could see one side. On one side, he has just a perfect standard five-point antler

that looks like millions of deer walking around North America right now. That was the side I had a very good look at. And I was trying to pick up what was happening on his other side And I didn't have a great idea until after I had actually shot him and got up to him And then I still didn't fully understand it until I had skinned him just what was going on here So one side the standard five-point side the other side

He has this mutant little four-point antler and then underneath that he has What I would consider to probably be an extra main beam. It's a 12 inch dagger that came that comes out of the same pedicle and then he's got another 4 inch antler that is crawling across his skull towards his other normal antler and this just this thing is just super goofy. I've showed it to some biologists about like what do you think happened here? And there's some common answers that they'll give you. One of them is that deer will have, not just deer but elk as well, moose. They'll have abnormal antler growth if they have an injury to one of

their legs because it restricts some blood flow or it messes with their blood vessels. And usually then the other antler opposite of that leg injury will grow something funky. This deer didn't have anything like that. He was totally normal. I've shot deer with limps and gaits and injuries before. This buck seemed quite healthy. So then the other answers that they'll give you is they had an injury

to their pedicle down here. And that could have happened while he was in velvet that year. And then the other answers that they'll give you is they had an injury to their pedicle down here. And that could have happened while he was in velvet that year and this might've been just a one time thing that he threw this rack, or it could have been permanent damage. I'll never know, I didn't have any history with this buck. But maybe my favorite thing about this deer

is that I don't remember when I scored him. I scored him after I had skinned him out. He was in the 140s Uh, but this antler it was like 60 some inches of of antler when you're scoring him The other antler was only one inch difference. They they almost scored the exact same thing I was just gonna say like it's interesting how on that what would be his right side You know, you got you got these like dinky little times here it's like this careful that one is kind of loose he was fighting oh this one yeah

yeah that one um like this thing suck the energy out of this thing totally you know what I mean and I asked a biologist I was like so was he just destined to throw the same amount of antlers no matter how it came out what shape he was gonna grow and they said no that was just a coincidence more than likely but this is this is one of my favorite white tails that I've ever killed because did you know he existed before you saw him had no history with this deer he and actually my dad had a tag that year as well he was hunting about a half mile away and this buck had walked by him

That evening and it was through September and he didn't have a good look at it either and he was with my brother who did Not have a tag and and they both Also had a conversation like what was up with that deer there was something goofy going on or like was there another smaller buck next To him that we just like couldn't get a good look at his antlers, but this is one of my favorite deer I've ever killed that we just like couldn't get a good look at his antlers, but this is one of my favorite deer I've ever killed. All right, that is it for show and tell today. Let's take a break for some listener feedback. Phil, what's the chat have to say? Yeah, before we get to that though, I mentioned this once before, but for those of you who are listening in podcast version now or watching it later, you can get a notification every time we go live on Thursday if you'd like, and it won't give you

notifications for everything else we post So only when the meat eater podcast network YouTube channel goes live it'll ding so you'll only get it once a week. That's not bad You can go to your if you're subscribed to the meat eater podcast network YouTube channel You should have like a little bell option somewhere if you go to the page and that's sort of like your notification button If you click that you'll get a notification for the whole network, but then you can go into your settings And then just just switch it so that you only get a notification for live streams So if you don't want to miss the episode every Thursday, I recommend doing that you can also click

When I usually post this episode the day before Sometime in the afternoon or evening so it pops up in your subscription feed. There's a separate button if you just want to get a notification for a single episode of something that's going to be live streamed. There's a little button that says notify me in your subscriptions. Yeah, so if you can't remember that we go live every Thursday at noon central time, follow Phil's directions there. Sure thing, we have a question from a woman named Linda She says to ask Spencer about his very first hunt when he fell asleep. Oh That's Linda Newhart. Yeah, what's this story? That is my mom. I Had a youth tag. I was probably 14 years old. I was on a deer hunt

Everything it was around Christmas. We had to go to church that night I was on a deer hunt. I think it was around Christmas. We had to go to church that night. And I fell asleep while my dad and I were sitting there. And I didn't know this until later. I woke up because a raccoon was walking by at some point, didn't kill anything. But later on, my dad had told my mom,

I don't think Spencer's gonna be a hunter. Just don't. I don't think this is for him. So that was my first ever deer hunt. But I proved him wrong. Great. We have a question from Rashad who is asking for tips on identifying critter burrows.

This is, I don't know if you guys have any of these, but I thought I'd ask you. His New Year's resolution is to catch a red fox, but he'll settle for a coyote. I don't have any tips. Anytime I look at something like, oh, that's a badger or a coyote or a fox. I never, uh, I never have.

Yeah. And a lot of them, I think. Well, like change it up, move into someone else's spot and like different speed. I think tracks, you know, find tracks at the mouth to see who's using it. Yeah. Set up a camera right next to it. Who knows? Or see the damn thing because they go in and out of them often.

It's not like they go down there and just, you know, don't come back out for three days. This is a follow up to Brody's show and tell segment, but Free Crank is asking, what piece of literature should a hunter or outdoorsmen own? You guys have some essential reading tips. Brody, what do you guys those two right there? Um No, the whole meat eater library. That's right. There you go. It's a good place to start. Yeah the entire media library I like to tell Steve this sometimes because it makes him feel old but I read his first book when I was in college Hmm, so that's that's like scavengers guide

No, it was the well. It was the Volume one of the hunt and fishing yeah small small game volume one or big game I can't remember, but those two big game. I mean the literature literature is like There's literature, and then there's like guidebooks. You know not that they're You know what I'm saying. Yeah, yeah, I'm with you like if you want some cool like Sand County Almanac yeah, that's definitely a good place to start. What's his name cool adventure stories capstick? Yeah, those are capstick Robert ru art spell like chapstick which is weird right no no no no no no oh man. I'm thinking something else. Yeah

Yeah, Robert Rue arts good arts good Zane Grey. Yep. He's got some good Thomas McQuain has some good fish and stuff. He's even got a couple good haunting stories What else you got Phil? Jared is asking for some for a pertinent tip here. He's a North Alabama is expecting snow and ice starting tomorrow around 6 a.m He's asking if he should hunt this evening or focus on a morning hunt after a possible storm. Hunt both! So this the snow storm is coming at 6 a.m. Should I hunt this evening or focus the morning hunt? I feel like a lot of big buck killers would tell you that white

tails know when there is a front coming and they will act on that and they'll be on their feet more. It would take, you know, a lot of tracking and journaling to actually prove that out. But like I said, common white tail hunting knowledge would say that they're really going to be moving this evening because they also know what the forecast is. Mm-hmm I found that to be true and then like during this storm sure you can go and find them but it can just be kind of miserable and they're not on their feet doesn't seem like quite as much they can be huddled in

some hole somewhere but right when it breaks. It's gonna be good Yeah, anything else Phil? Yeah, we got a couple more, but let's just do one for now I guess this is a question for Janice or anybody but Nate's asking if there's a price difference if for a pillow mount I don't know what the price difference is but that pillow mount in my mind was not cheap. It was about $1,400 In my mind was not cheap. It was about fourteen hundred dollars Okay, gotcha, which is probably what you'd pay for like an elk shoulder mount something like that. Yeah, you know spend well We did I've only shoulder mounted one critter in my life But I would know because we had a trivia question one time about the average price of a shoulder mount I think I looked at like 20 different

taxidermists all across the country, and I don't remember the exact number but it was like $687 something like that was the average price so you get You know a couple big old whitetail shoulder mounted or one bobcat pillow. I think I'd go with the bobcat pillow Those are significantly more rare Yeah, and much easier to move around Life-size more rare. Yeah, and much easier to move around. Yeah, like if you got a life size amount of that thing, like in some habitat, it'd be at least as much. But you wouldn't have it'd be like, yeah, you put it there.

It's there forever. Yeah. To answer one of the questions we had about books that outdoorsmen should read, this is something we've written a lot about on themeateater.com. I'm gonna read you some headlines here. You can just go to our website, type in books, and you're gonna get all these results. Four books every whitetail hunter should read. Six more books every whitetail hunter should read.

Those were Mark Canyon, the best books for outdoor kids. Eight books every hunter should read. That was Steve. Five must-read fly fishing read. That was Steve, five must read fly fishing books. That was Mark Canyon. Brody a couple times wrote, what are your, ask me Dieter, what are your book recommendations? Part one and two, we had Mark do another article,

the ultimate recommended reading list for hunters. So that'll answer your question much more thorough than we just did. Nice. Alright, our next segment is Hot Tip Off. H-O-T-T-I-P-Off, turn your head and give cough. What's that face? Don't you cough? There aren't any words that rhyme with cough. H-O-T-T-I-P-Off, let's all do a hot tip-off. H-O-T-T-I-P-Op.

Let's all do a hot tip-off. Wow, never did I think, uh, Chappell Rhone would get a shout out on, uh, the MeatEater Airwaves. What's your name? Chappell Rhone. She is the one who sings the song that Phil was doing a spoof on there. Oh. H-O-T-T-O-G-O. That's one of my more modern jingles I've done. Phil, I feel like you've got the potential to really get a weird Al Yankovic career going.

Oh, that's so kind of you, Brody. I think it might be you're giving me a lot more credit than I could give. Oh, no. I don't think Brody's wrong at all. I think you're honestly, you're like, I mean, we love having you here But you're not using your talent You go home and you ask your daughters who chaperone is okay See what kind of answer you get hot tip off is where two members of the crew go head to head with competing pieces of advice And after we hear each tip will declare which one is hotter in the chat we're gonna listen to you guys as well you let us know which hot tip you like better take it away Phil.

Corey Kalkins. This is Corey Kalkins and I got another hot tip for you. I just killed a bull elk a couple days ago and I got him hanging in my garage along with my mule deer buck that I shot a couple days before that. Perfect temp, it's like 38, 39 degrees in my garage. Humble fellow that Cory. I had the deer hanging for about five days, the elk for three days now.

Probably work on the deer first. By the time I'm done with my elk, it'll probably have hung for just about a week. But there's a little bit of hair residue left on this animal. It's so hard to keep all the hair off those animals in the field. So you could do this for hours and still not get all the hair off. Some of it's kind of stuck on there from the blood. But if you use a torch, which I know a lot of people use for waterfowl, getting some of those fine feathers off of ducks and geese works really well for your red meat too. So hit it with a little heat, singe off some of these.

some of these hair what hair You can hear it sizzle and I like that. Satisfying. I can smell it too. Save a little bit of knife work. Works so well. Maggie Hudlow. Welcome! Do another Hot Tip Off on Media to Radio Live. I'm Maggie Hudlow and I'm joined by Bill here.

We are talking about Bill's feet today and my tip is how you protect hairy dogs feet in the winter. So Bill has got some hairy Grinch paws on him and they collect ice balls like son of a gun in the winter so the best thing that I've found because booties aren't working and I'm not I'm not doing that I'm not putting them in those silly little overall things either. I'm not doing that to my dog. Best thing I've found is this. It's called Mushers Secret and it's a salve you gotta put on. And you just make sure you get it up in this part of their paw, in between their toes, in all those places where the ice sticks and then when they're out running around in the snow they're not stopping all the time

to you know chew ice balls out of their feet you don't have to pick it out of their feet and it's a better time for everyone so hope that helps for somebody and go on get your dog outside they need it and you do too. Sit. Sit. Go on get your dog outside. They need it and you do too All right, we're about halfway through our walk tonight is 15 degrees and the temp is dropping so let's check out Bill's feet Hey, big horse You can tell there's some snow in there, but it's not ice ball. So it's not hurting him. He's not getting sores. It's pretty much just loose snow, which sticks all over him anyway.

So he's a happy dog. All right, we're now going to discuss which tip we think is hotter. In the meantime, chat, get your votes in. Let us know if you think you like Corey's hot tip about torching venison hides or if you like Maggie's hot tip about treating dog feet better. I'll go first. To me Cory's feels like it's kind of well known. I feel like most folks who have a deer hanging in their garage probably also know that you

hit that thing with a torch. Now I'm not a Hairy footed dog owner. I'm an aspiring hairy footed dog owner But I don't know if that one is is that's common or not, but I'm gonna give my vote to Maggie What do you guys think? I'm kind of in the same boat. I knew about both of them. Mm-hmm. So I didn't learn too much today, but Yeah, I'm lucky Mingus doesn't need any salve in his feet. Your dog probably does. My dog does and if you're hanging, I love Cory, but if you're

hanging meat in your garage for a week you're gonna, that meat is gonna develop a rind on it, a hard rind and you're just gonna cut it off anyway so like a few hairs on it not gonna hurt anything but you're like not bringing it yes you know say you're bringing into your kitchen you're not bringing that mess into your cutting board maybe what I still did well if you got hairs on there and they're rubbing off and everything else I I feel like I'm always hitting it with the torch it's probably the only reason I own a torch actually. Yeah, I never do So you what are you voting for Brody? Mag? All right. It's unanimous in here Phil. What is the chat?

It's definitely leaning Maggie I gotta say but also we have a we have a private comment from an upcoming guest Who says torch the hair off the dog's feet boom? Okay, I Wouldn't do that don't do that. That's a good lead in. Our last interview is with Ben Dedimanti, but before we talk to him, we're going to show you a crazy video of Ben shooting a bull elk at four yards.

Play the clip, Phil. You can see that video on this YouTube video or you can go to Ben's Instagram at Shed Crazy to watch it. But here's the plot twist. Ben was the second of three guys to shoot that bull that day and he's here now to talk to us about that unusual hunt. Ben, welcome to the show. Thanks. What's going on?

Hey, Ben, start from the very beginning of that hunt on opening morning. Oh yeah, it's Utah over the counter. It's a very low success hunt, low density of elk on the unit. And we had found some bulls kind of in a deserty area that were by themselves. And we were super hopeful that we'd have these bulls to ourselves but it didn't actually turn out that way. We went out to the area to hunt these elk on opening morning and we found the elk where they had been for basically the whole summer. We were watching them from across the

canyon and we sent one buddy in kind of on a stalk to get in the path of the bulls so that he'd be able to get an opportunity at them. And as we're watching these bulls come up onto this little plateau in the glass, I noticed another hunter there. And we'd never seen anybody out there during scouting. And it's not an area where very many people hunt. So I figured we maybe have it to ourselves. Anyway, we kind of sat back and watch it unfold. I threw the phone on the phones on the on the adapter on the all-in and we started watching to see what would go down anyway the elk the way it was headed up

walked right to this other hunter just randomly happened to be on that path and we were able to kind of get it on video we saw him crouch down behind a rock and saw the elk walk in front of him at about 60 or 70 yards And as the bull got kind of past him It started to turn broadside then it ended up kind of facing away and that's the moment he shot I think he thought it was gonna go fully broadside and he ended up hitting the bull Through kind of the army below the shoulder above the knee and the arrow passed through that shoulder and was hanging out by the fletchings. And so obviously we were kind of bummed, you know, thinking here's our bull that we're out here to try to try to hunt today. And he's he's now been shot by this other hunter. So

we watched how far how far were you watching this unfold from Ben? We were probably 1500 yards away on a glassing knob. And so we had the spotters and everything set up and we were just kind of kicked back. And we knew our buddy was somewhere in that area but I didn't know exactly where. So we watched the bull, it runs out maybe a hundred yards, stands around, puts some weight on its leg, starts walking normally.

And it ends up traveling about another 1000 or 1500 yards and dropping into a small canyon. So we kind of sat back and thought, well, we'll just watch this play out see what happens We watched the other hunter and for about four hours He never moved to recover the bull at all and never went anywhere over in that direction And so we sent a friend over just to check with him and see What his plan was there was another bull with it as well And they both kind of went down a little canyon together and you know, these are the only two elk in this whole area so we're thinking like, yeah, we still kind of like

to hunt these elk so we sent a friend to talk to the first hunter and he said he had some people coming out to help him and they were going to go recover this bowl and we let him know that it was hitting the leg and he thought that he had hit it in the body cavity so there's kind of a little moment there where we didn't you know a misunderstanding whatever so During all this the two bulls kind of split up the one bull the other bull was this one horn five point I had one antler and we were totally interested in hunting that elk So we told the other hunter we're gonna go in and try to kill the one horn bull and I guess we'll see what happens so Where the video kind of kicks in is me. I'm moving in to shoot this one horn five point

And as I walk up to the edge of the cliff there I realized the six point that this other hunter is hit is now right below me he's moved back around underneath the ledge and he's just posted up right there by the time I knew he was there I mean he's already 20 yards or less away from me so I just went well here's a bowl he's obviously hit I'm gonna walk in there and I'm gonna finish the deal and then we'll work it out so you see me walk into the edge there. The wind is just absolutely ripping up out of that Canyon. I draw I walk off

shoot that bowl and my fletching is actually kind of contacted the rock and Hit the bowl in the shoulder, but it penetrated through the shoulder The bowl spins and the arrow kind of backs out and then it runs down the canyon. And so I'm kind of hectic. I'm like, oh, I need a follow-up shot for sure on this elk. And he runs down into the bottom of the canyon.

So I start moving around parallel to get another shot at him. I actually took another shot there and just missed him because of the wind. It just blew the arrow clear off. And as I'm moving over towards him, I hear my buddy click on the radio who had, you know, earlier in the day gone on the stock and he says, Hey, that bull just ran

past me and I put a perfect arrow in it. So I'm like, all right, well, this is a, you know, crazy situation. Now we got three people hit this bowl, but I'm super glad that you know, the elk is at least down and this is only just a couple minutes after I had hit it. So I walked to the edge and the bowl is kind of like expiring. I think my friend put one more arrow in it and the whole ordeal was done. So that's kind of the whole story of how that bowl got killed. But insane to have three people. I mean, when I posted on Instagram, I was like, this is standard Utah over the counter stuff because it seems like this is how stuff happens on

these over the counter units. But it did kind of turn into a little bit of a social media debacle after that. The first Hunter he came down and I was I wasn't there for this part. I had gone back to get the truck but had a bit of a confrontation with my friend who was the third shooter in this scenario. And he ended up putting a post on Facebook and it went viral kind of like I guess defaming the third hunter and it turned into this big ugly ordeal. So luckily you know Ben what was his problem with the whole thing? He thought that we should well obviously I think his biggest problem was that I went in there when the bowl was wounded right.? You know, I should have backed out totally

and in hindsight, you know, everything being what it is, I may have done that. Like my intention was to shoot this other bowl and then it just kind of worked out the way that it did. I don't look for being frustrated, but he was able to look to and see where he'd hit the elk. And when we, you know, obviously we're butchering the bull, we saw where my arrow entered, we saw my buddies, and we saw where he had hit it. And there was nothing close to fatal on the shot. Tell us one more time, Ben,

tell us one more time where all three of these arrows wound up in the thing from the first hunter, you, and then the third hunter. So the first hunter hit it below the shoulder and above the knee. So kind of through the arm meat and through through from the back to the front and the arrow was hanging out the front here. Um, I hit the bowl in the shoulder blade and it got through and it

hit for sure it hit the close side lung. I don't know if it got into the offside lung and then my buddy hit it. Just perfect square in the lungs. And so when we all talked about that, when we looked at the bowl, we just decided that, you know, my buddy put the most lethal arrow on it. He was a lack shoot. I didn't feel like I had any claim on the bowl because I'm just the middle guy in this giant cluster.

You know what I mean? So I decided and my buddy decided that he should tag it and him tagging it really upset this kid and they ended up having a bit of a confrontation over it. So it all ended up kind of going bigger than we wanted it to an officer from the fishing game came out and investigated it after that the post went viral on Facebook. And he said there was no wrongdoing and everything got worked out in the end. And what we ended up doing that I

think really solved is just got on the phone with everybody and with the other hunter and made some apologies and everybody kind of just walked away from it and let it be. But it was just like one of those scenarios you hope to never run into and you would never walk into intentionally on public land, but kind of got out of control. And that's kind of why like, I mean, this happened back in August and I haven't shared a ton about it because it's such a wild scenario and it just kind of feels weird.

But anyway, that's the story. Tell us about the messaging of the Facebook post and how Hunter number one had sort of portrayed the events. Yeah. So he basically said, I shot this bowl. I went to blood track it. When I found it, there was somebody else gutting it. That was his story.

He put on Facebook said it. He said it was about an hour later. And so he made it seem like he'd made a fatal shot and that he went to recover the bull and somebody else was there. And so I had footage, you know, from the whole scenario, from him shooting to me shooting to us recovering it with timestamps. And so I had to eventually put together a little YouTube video that I could share for context for the people who were kind of wrapped up in the whole drama situation. And as you guys know, when anything happens and it gets out there on the social media world, it can just spiral so fast.

How much time had passed between hunter number one shooting the elk, and then you wind up going on a stalk and coming upon it? Five hours, so he shot it right around 7 a.m. and I shot it right at noon. And what was his plan to recover this bowl or to get another arrow in it? He just said that he was waiting for his dad and some friends to come out and help him look for it and then they were going to go after it. But I don't know exactly what he was wanting to do.

From his angle he couldn't see the bowl and we could see it up the canyon and we told him, when our friend went over and talked to him, told him it's on its feet. It's not hit bad. It's just acting like an elk. So it turned into this whole ordeal. Did did he like was he optimistic that he was going to recover this thing? Did he think he had put a lethal shot on it? Um, I don't know, because he had video too of the bull after the shot. So I think he was kind of maybe in a spot where I think he told his friends that he'd hit it fatally and hit it good. But then maybe when he reviewed through the footage, he knew that he didn't. So he kind of had to have a moment to

and he looked at the elk and with the officer and everything, they said, well, if you hit this bowl vitally, there'd be a hole right here and there's not so and they basically had to kind of come to an agreement on that. But it was dumb and it was it was kind of ugly. But it's just I mean, the video that I got out of it was was kind of cool. But all in all, hindsight being what it is, I probably would have handled a little bit different and just maybe chilled out a little more and went to him again or something. I don't know.

And what what was the game wardens messaging towards you? Because he had he had talked to you not before they went and looked at the carcass, right? He had talked to you afterwards? Yeah, he called me after they'd done an investigation and he's like, just wanted to let you know, like I've been out there, we looked over the carcass and everything. There was absolutely no wrongdoing that I can find there. There's nothing illegal. There's no legal issue here at all. So it's just kind of something that hunters have to work out in that scenario. As it's been

Figured out in the past in Utah I guess it's not a law but more of a precedent the person who puts a final arrow or finishes off the animal is the one who Supposedly has the right to claim it. That's how it's been decided in the past Okay Yeah, I feel like it all went the right way especially hearing that you guys had a little zoom meeting and everybody Apologized and so everybody's happy or at least like stable now. Yeah. Yeah, we're all on good terms You know and the thing too is I live in a small town. These are local guys So the last thing I want to do is start a big local stink, you know, yeah

So yeah, we're all on good terms with it And I think sure the first shooter is disappointed and you know. So yeah we're all on good terms with it and I think sure the first shooter is disappointed and you know nobody's happy that that post ended up going viral with names in it but it is kind of is what it is at the end of the day. You can't undo it. Yeah and how I came upon your story Ben was I saw that video on Instagram which is an epic stock with just like the wind ripping like it is and you said you would you had you can see your bow moving that's like the wind ripping like it is. And you said you would, you had, you can see your bow moving. That's not the wind doing that.

You're trying to counter the wind to keep your arrow on the rest, right? Yeah, my arrow keeps blowing sideways out of the rest and it almost came out of the cage there even. So I keep shaking it sideways to keep it down in. And it hadn't been that windy all day, but it was just like the last maybe five minutes of that stock.

It just really kicked up out of the canyon. It was wild. Yeah. This is the kind of over the counter experience the guys joke about, but like doesn't ever really happen where three different dudes shoot the same elk. Yeah, well, I mean, sadly around here it does happen and it's not that uncommon.

I think in my years of hunting over-the-counter elk in utah, this is the third bull that multiple groups have Put arrows into Well, no, the other two were rifle. Oh, yeah You know this this is more unique in that fact for sure. Yeah, we hear that down here montana, too Uh, I got a question for you. I know you hit a rock a little bit But it looks like you hit the shoulder blade It's probably what limited your penetration Are you gonna you have to change your arrow because of what you saw there? Are you pretty happy with penetration you got?

well, I don't know if I'm going full like thousand grain ranch fairy status or anything like that, but I definitely know I know that I have a heavy arrow. I have a long draw. I shoot 73 pounds and I'm not worried about my setup at all in that scenario. It was just more, it also did kind of hit that ridge of the shoulder blade, that heavy part of the shoulder blade. To me, it's like most scenarios, that arrow's gonna do the trick,

but I just need to not shoot him in the shoulder. That's the biggest thing. All right, Ben, well, thanks for joining us to share the story and good luck with shedhunting this year. Yeah, thanks, guys. Thanks, Ben. All right. That brings us to the end of this week's show. Phil, let's get some final feedback from the chat. Yeah. Last chance to get questions in. So if you have a question you would like answered, type it in right now into the live chat.

Let's see here. I'll get this one out of the way. Lantern Lab says that they need a clip of me making the jingles. It takes a lot to embarrass me these days. You will never see video footage of me making the jingles. I don't think anyone in the office has seen you making the jingles. No, Randall walked in on me a few weeks ago and I made him leave. Even Dr. Randall cannot see me. Oh, it happens right here, right behind this desk. So, yeah, you'll never witness it. Just have to be in your imagination, which is way better. That could make so much money for this company, Phil.

Do you have to stand up to sing, Phil? Okay, here's the thing. So, for the chapel rhone one today, I tried, because sitting down, I couldn't get the energy out, but the mic wasn't flexible enough, so I had to kind of do like a weird half crouch, which is, so that sounds like terrible and stupid, right? That's, you're not gonna see me half crouching,

shrieking Chappalrone into a microphone, I'm sorry. Oh, that'd be so good. Unless you go to karaoke on Thursday nights. Yeah. Downtown Bozeman. Yeah, after two IPAs at the Eagles, then you can see me shrieking into a microphone. This might be like a, maybe this is just common courtesy stuff

for hunters, but I'm curious. Rashad's asking if you're with a hunting buddy that's trying to shoot a deer and he falls asleep, do you shoot the deer or do you wake your pal up? Oh, man, that's a good Chester. Shoot the deer. Chester question. Shoot the deer. Yeah, I don't know that there's a specific answer. Yeah, it's situational situation dependent unless your buddies narcoleptic

You just shoot that deer a shot Or it depends on how good of a body he is to you. Yeah, depends on what kind of deer you're looking at I think that too if it's the Kansas State record buddy Screw him. I think I'd wake up Janice to tell him. Hey, I'm about to shoot this deer Mm-hmm, but I'm not I'm not letting any talking me to shoot get him in your binos and tell me tell me where I hit Him during and on turkey hunts with my kid, you know naps on turkey hunts. Hmm Oh, yeah, the kids sleep all the time. I tell my son if you're asleep when a goblin comes in I'm shooting it Oh, is that a real them? Is that genuine? Oh, yeah. Okay. Yeah, he's gonna wake up to a gun blast. Yep. Mm-hmm

Learn the hard way that'll teach him Fruit of the mycelium is asking if there's a meat quality difference between a spring or fall black bear for context He'll be in or she will be in the Oregon Cascades. Bears have no access to fish, but lots of berries. They're debating a spring versus fall hunt. Huge difference, I think. Fat, flavor, everything, man. All bears generally going to be better.

Yeah, I don't need anything to add. Nope. Rhodey's got it. Yeah, all about what that thing's been eating for the last month. I think maybe something, at least like, where, you know, down in Colorado with like that thick oak brush and stuff like that, they can be harder to find in the fall.

Yeah, well there you can't hunt them in the spring anyways. That's true, but. But this is Oregon Cascade, but yeah, I would there, I just them in the spring anyways, but but this is Oregon Cascade But yeah, I would I would there. I just think in the spring you're gonna end up with a skinny Skinnier, I mean you kill the spring bear once that was loaded with fat, but on average that's not normal not normal So I would definitely go for a fall hunt if you could Cool. Um, I don't know how detailed you guys wanna get, but Jeff's asking for a show and tell segment of everyone's big game rifle setup.

I don't think that really needs to be a show and tell setup, but if you guys have some basic kits you go out with. Johnny, what have you been shooting this year? Nobody really talks about their hunting rigs. Last couple years, been hunting with the Sig Cross. Both my girls shot their bucks with, or and my daughter shot a Wisconsin doe too with the Sig Cross, which is why I like that gun because it is so modular that you know I can make a few adjustments, I can shoot it and then make it compact. That folding stock man. Yeah

you can pack it away real easy and you know I have two of them one of them's got the whiskey six I believe on it one of them's got the tango scope on it and they're both chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor and yeah I'll even shoot those at an elk as long as it's not too far away. That's the hunting rig right now. Yeah. This year I was shooting the cross magnum sawtooth and a seven PRC.

And this is like my first fall using a magnum caliber on most of my hunts. And it made me realize with that muzzle break on there, I need to get a can. Damn, that thing hits hard. Yeah. I need to get a can Damn, it's hard. Yeah, I shot it's my ears hard. I shot my moose with the sawtooth Magnum and 300 when mag and Three of us couldn't hear for two days after that. Oh man, but um also running an MDT Hunt 26 mm-hmm stock with a tika 65 PRC, and that's a real nice deer hunting rig elk hunting rig Yeah, I think that the common denominator here is we're all shooting guns very confident with which is you know?

What matters most you go out there? You know when you put the crosshairs on something you're gonna kill it dead mm-hmm What else you got, Phil? Yeah, let's do one more, because this one's light. Chris is asking for honeymoon destination ideas in the US. Probably for outdoorsy folks. Do you guys have any tips? Where'd you guys go on your honeymoon?

This guy already looks like he's got two, three, maybe four-year-old kids, man. It's a little late for the honeymoon. Maybe he's asking for someone else. Oh. Yeah, maybe. Maybe he got married duringat and they just had to push Alaska go to Alaska Well depends on the time of year to Max just went to Alaska for his honeymoon. Where'd you go on your honeymoon Brody? I went to Belize. Oh, I went to New Zealand. No Yeah, I went to New York City. There you go

It was mine was definitely a fishing vacation. For sure. I mean, yeah, there's so many places. I mean, same place I'd go take my kids for spring break. You go on honeymoon. I don't know. Go to the desert and go backpack and go to North Carolina and fish the Outer Banks. Go to Maine. Go to some state you've never been. Go there. You go.

I would just say go on an adventure don't go on some cruise yeah save that for when you're an old person yeah go on an adventure with your gal I love a good road trip and I've really taken to the PNW the last few years now that we only live like a 10-hour drive away. Driving up and down the coast, Oregon, Washington, Northern California. Nothing else like it as far as places I've been. Love it. Anything else, Phil? No, let's call it there.

All right. That's the end of the show. But after we say goodbye, Phil is going to play Chester's newest song, which is available on Spotify right now. I've already added it to a bunch of my playlists. Chester didn't even ask for this plug. Didn't even really tell us that it existed. I just saw it on Spotify, listened to it, and I was like, damn it, Chester. That is, that's delightful. Is it a good song?

It's a good song. I can't wait to hear it. And I told Chester, I didn't ask him. I said, we're going to play this at the end of Mediator Radio this week. Phil, you need to cover one of Chester's songs songs Oh, I wouldn't disrespect him in that way. All right, so after we say goodbye in the rock music plays Phil is going to play for you Chester's newest tune. Thanks everybody for tuning in. See you next week The Is this the wrong side of heaven or is it just me? Yeah, this is hell's anxiety She left me in the room alone Took the dog and said let him go Please come back, no, no, no, babe

Well I'm not the man you always thought I'd be, yeah Living on the edge of sanity I haven't had a drink in about six weeks Retrained from the pints with all my might I left the car and took Ike's bike outside So cheers to beers A brand new year Say it toast, I love you the most Shoot some pool with your foes And tell a couple of lies with my guys Well, I took that bike that I stole from Mike Down to the tavern where I just might

Spent three weeks since you called I figure it don't matter anyhow Can't take this sober getting over you So cheers to beers, a brand new year Say a toast, I love you the most Shoot some pool with your fools And tell a couple of lies with my guys Now I'm cruising down this hill on them 18 inch wheels Never got much slack but the night winds got my back Cruise along on this moonlight day Seventh gear trying to keep her straight Tears all dry from going so fast Baby it's a lesson in the past

Going down with the stars tonight Yes I'm going down with the stars tonight