The Megyn Kelly Show - DeSantis vs. Trump Fight Heats Up, and the Demise of Black Lives Matter, with Dave Rubin and Hotep Jesus | Ep. 559

Episode Date: May 26, 2023

Megyn Kelly is joined by Dave Rubin, host of Rumble's Rubin Report, to talk about Gov. Ron DeSantis now attacking former President Donald Trump directly from the right, the different campaign directions, DeSantis' fight with Disney, DeSantis' media strategy and whether he'll take tough questions, whether Trump's supporters would support DeSantis if he won the nomination, Biden's horrific poll numbers and the Democratic race ahead, and more. Then Hotep Jesus, host of "The Grift Report," joins to talk about the boycotts against Bud Light and Target, how the demise of Black Lives Matter relates to the "queer" agenda, the difference between black conservatism culturally and politically, the truth about "banned books" in Florida and the racism accusations against DeSantis, how GOP messaging could change to attract more of the Black vote, and more.Rubin: https://rumble.com/c/RubinReportJesus: https://hotepjesus.comFollow The Megyn Kelly Show on all social platforms: YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/MegynKellyTwitter: http://Twitter.com/MegynKellyShowInstagram: http://Instagram.com/MegynKellyShowFacebook: http://Facebook.com/MegynKellyShow Find out more information at: https://www.devilmaycaremedia.com/megynkellyshow

Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations. Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show and happy Friday. We made it. Yippee! The left is now using boycott calls against corporations like Target to say conservatives are calling for violence. What? What? So, you know, the pushback against Target for holding the, you know, bathing suits out as talkable spaces. They're getting all sorts of crap and we'll get into the financial penalties that they appear to be suffering. And now the left is saying this is conservatives calling for violence. This is straight out of their playbook. This is what they do. They punish any corporation that doesn't toe the line on their far left agenda. Finally, conservatives have figured out how to fight back and it's violent. It's a it's a call for violence. his campaign in earnest and is directly attacking former President Donald Trump, now accusing Trump of, quote, running to the left and not being, quote,

moored to conservative principles. Oh, it's getting interesting. Joining me now to discuss it all, Dave Rubin, host of The Rubin Report and author of the book, Don't Burn This Country, Surviving and Thriving in Our Woke Dystopia. Dave, my friend, good to see you. How are you? Megan, it's good to see you as always. Can I say before we begin that you are looking vivacious? I was looking for the right adjective. Something's going on with the hair today. I'm looking at you like this chick's got it. That's courtesy of Sarah. She comes and does it on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays. That's when I look the best. Can we send Sarah down to Miami?

I don't have as much to work with, but maybe she could help me out. There's not a person she cannot help. She's a master. Master. Okay. And by the way, when you hear something funny we were just talking about, she actually trolls the comments on YouTube looking for comments about my hair. So don't say anything nasty about my hair on YouTube.

She starts spiraling. She goes, I spiraled. Isn't it funny? You could do politics all day long and like people can say all the mean things that they want about you and oh, she's a sellout and she doesn't know what she's talking about and blah, blah, blah. But it's like, if they say something about your hair, it's like a whole different situation, you know? It's okay with me, but Sarah, she doesn't deserve to have her feelings hurt like that that so yeah be nice to sarah in the comments she's got talent because my hair does not look like this normally um okay i think this is fascinating it had to happen it has to happen there has to be daylight between the two men otherwise there's no reason you know to to vote for desantis over trump given trump's poll numbers and the fact that he was a former president

you gotta create some sort of a policy difference other than I don't tweet the way he does. Right. And he's starting to do it. So now and this is an interesting way in. So he DeSantis, that is, goes on. He's doing sort of like a he's doing an interesting media tour, and it is including some local radio hosts and so on in some key locations, including in Tennessee, a conservative radio host, Matt Murphy.

He said it, I think, just this morning. Here is the latest messaging. It seems like he's running to the left. And I have always been somebody that's just been more than conservative principles. And these will be interesting debates to have. But I can tell you, you don't win nationally by moving to the left. You win nationally by standing for bold policies. We showed that in Florida. I never watered down anything I did. I don't know what happened to Donald Trump. This is a different guy today than when he was running in 2015 and 2016. And I think I think the direction that he's going with his campaign is the wrong direction. Hmm. So, you know, he's not wrong that thus far

DeSantis is kind of positioning himself to the right of Trump and Trump isn't totally disputing that in some areas. What do you make of it? Yeah, it's kind of interesting. I mean, what DeSantis said there is true. Whether it works in an election is a different thing. I mean, look, first, let's do the abortion one, because you know how happy I am here in Florida. And it was in large part, moving here was in large part because of DeSantis and his policies. And I not only moved my family, but two companies and other family members and a whole bunch more. On the abortion one specifically, you know, Florida had 15 week abortion ban. Now, we're a very red state, obviously. 15 weeks, it's basically three and a half months, which is far longer than

most pro-life or conservative people want. Generally, they don't want any abortion. But I can tell you in a year and a half in Florida, I've been to plenty of Republican events and conservative events and events with DeSantis. I never heard anyone talking about abortion because everyone sort of felt, you know what, we don't love 15 weeks, but let's just kind of let it be. It's not what we love, but it's really what most Democrats would have said was fair, say, 20 years ago. Joe Biden would have said, you know, safe and rare 15 weeks, 20 years ago. Now, now the Democrats, you know, want eight month abortions, which most of us can agree is completely insane. So on a personal note, I actually disagree with what DeSantis did. I happen to be more pro-choice myself. I think

15 weeks was just fine. I think it probably does help him in the primaries because yeah, now he can run more to the right of Trump in the primaries. But I do think in the general, it's going to become a problem because we know that the Republicans did not get that red wave in large part because of the Roe v. Wade situation. Now, the part that's like, just like you have to be politically nuanced about it is that it's not like the president sets the agenda on abortion. The whole point of the reversal of Roe v. Wade is that it is now left up to the states. So it is irrelevant to someone living in California, what Florida does on abortion. But at an optics level, if, if the average woman out there who tends to be more pro

choice, if she sees that and as an attack on her, that could create a problem for him. Uh, so I can give you some on the border and some of the other stuff, but, but I'd love to hear your thoughts on that. Well, he's got to get past Trump. He can deal with the general election later, I think is the thinking. And I know this is an longstanding debate of like, do you go so far right in the primary to make yourself unelectable in the general? You have to be careful of that on both sides. You have to worry about going too far to the extremes. But I mean, I do see a viable way for DeSantis to get to the right of Trump on abortion. And then if he manages to get

the nomination to then say to the general electorate, I'm out. These are my personal views. These are the views of Floridians. I'm not going to do a federal abortion law and I'm not going to interfere in the states that are passing state by state legislation. So don't worry about me. I, that is plausible. Yeah, I think that's legit. And that actually is the truth, right? And by the way, you know, I was at an event with him about three months ago, I think, when, or maybe it was even a little bit more when the Roe v. Wade thing was really hot and people kept asking him about his feelings on it. And he was very honest. He said, you know, I, through my faith, I'm a Catholic.

I am pro-life. He said, sorry, Florida has the 15 week abortion ban. We'll see about that as we get through the legislative session. But he was making it clear that he has his own pro-life feelings about this. And he was elected governor of Florida. So he is allowed to do what he wants. And if the people are not happy with it, well, he's a two-term governor now.

So this would be his last time anyway. But the point is, you do what you think is right, hopefully as a politician. That's what we want out of politicians. Now, you may not agree with it, but I do believe it's an honest assessment by him. I don't think it was purely political, but I'm not inside his brain, obviously. Let's talk immigration because, of course, Trump, I mean, one of the main reasons he was elected was build the wall. That was the biggest applause line forever at all of his rallies. In the end, just ask Ann Coul was build the wall. That was the biggest applause line forever at all of his rallies. In the end, just ask Ann Coulter, the wall was not built. And though the

immigration policy certainly got a lot tougher under Trump, just ask Stephen Miller, who we've been who've had on the show many times. So there's no question that Trump cracked down on the border, but didn't fulfill all the promises he made about it. And now DeSantis is using the W word as well, building the wall and cracking down on the southern border and sort of making the point that whatever Trump did or didn't do, it didn't work because look where we are now. Now, of course, that kind of sort of discounts what happened after Trump, which was Biden. All right. You opened the door and said, come on in. So how do you see the distinction there of him getting to the right on Trump? Yeah. Well, let's first just drive home your your latter point there, which is that you have to just go on the knowledge that Biden has

completely wrecked this thing. Mayorkas is completely in negligence of his job as Homeland Security and the Democrats have completely wrecked it. That's regardless of whether Trump or DeSantis is right on this. On the actual facts of this whole thing, you know, Trump was going after DeSantis for not voting for the wall a couple years ago. DeSantis actually is making a good case on this. What was happening was the bill that was put up was that you were going to get a wall, but it was also going to give 2 million illegals amnesty. DeSantis made it clear, I am not just going to sign something that's going to allow 2 million illegals just to be here. Now, again, anyone watching this can have their own feelings on whether we should have amnesty, whether a wall is effective or

anything else. But DeSantis is being very clear in why he did not vote for that funding of the wall. It wasn't that he was against the wall. It was that if he voted for the bill, then two million people were immediately going to get citizenship. So we can have a debate about that. But that's really what's going on here. It was $25 billion to build the wall. So I mean, I think DeSantis referred to this as like a pittance or something like that.

But it's not a pittance. $25 billion is a good amount of dough. But his point is it wasn't going to actually get the job done and we were going to have to grant amnesty to a whole bunch of people we don't want to do. So yeah, I see that how that's going to play out in a debate stage. It's sort of neutral. What else? Because to me, as somebody who's very fired up about the gender ideology,

it seems to me like DeSantis is to the right on Trump on this, though I've been pointing out too, we haven't heard from Trump on this issue in a while. We've kind of heard maybe a little bit more from Don jr. I'm not sure if we can say he speaks for Trump, uh, especially on this issue, who doesn't want, I think the Republican party going too far to the right on it. And DeSantis is firmly where I am, which is a man can't become a woman, a woman can't become a man, and pretending otherwise is silly and certainly isn't for boys and girls sports or any of the other nonsense we've been seeing. Yeah, I mean, I'm with you, Megan. DeSantis has done this thing right. There are things that should not be debated anymore. You know my feelings on what an adult is allowed to do with their life.

You wanna dress up however you wanna dress up. You wanna marry whoever you wanna marry. All of those things, I'm completely fine with. What DeSantis has done is get this woke nonsense out of our schools. You know, for you, Megan, living in New York, I mean, it's literally why you moved because of the gender stuff that was going on

with your own kids. Nobody, it's just the simple truth. Nobody has more effectively taken wokeness when it comes to gender ideology and this crazy neo-racism. No one has more effectively taken it out of schools and institutions than Ron DeSantis, period. Like full stop, period. Now, I agree that Junior,

I don't think he can fully speak for his dad. I'm friends with Junior. I like him a lot. He's a good dude. He really is. He was sort of pushing that Republicans shouldn't boycott Anheuser-Busch as much because they've given some money to Republicans. I think that this boycott against Anheuser-Busch and now what we're seeing with Target, I think it's great. I think we've been trying to figure out for these last couple of years of cancel culture, like how do we effectively fight this? Well, you know how you effectively fight it?

You fight it by joining up with other people who see the world as you see it. And if a company is going to push a trans woman or man or whatever Dylan Mulvaney is on a Bud Light, when you know that they're not marketing it to the people that drink it, and they're going to spit in your face. The executive who pushed that campaign literally said, in essence, we don't like the people who are buying our beer. Yeah. Well, you know what?

People, people are pushing back. So yeah, I think that Trump has a real problem here because as he's come out sort of for Disney, because DeSantis has been anti-Disney. It's like, wait a minute. He's the guy. He's completing the work. Trump, you get credit for being anti-woke. Of course, you woke a lot of us up to this. No pun intended. But he's the guy that is actually doing the thing. And, you know, the proof is in the pudding, regardless of how many fingers you eat it with. That's a weird rumor. Do you think there's any truth to that? I mean, truly. It just seems like it must have some basis.

In fact, it seems so bizarre to be made up of out of whole cloth. Whatever. It's just one of those things. It's not whatever. Did he stick his fingers in that pudding and eat it or didn't he? It's important. What do you think on that front? I think there's always a nugget of truth in these things.

Maybe it was like the last bit of the pudding and you can't get it out with the spoons. We just did like a one-finger deal. I actually meant on the Disney DeSantis thing, not the pudding thing, but that's good to know. I have thoughts on that too. So I'm torn on it, to be perfectly honest with you, Dave, because I like the fact that DeSantis is fighting, you know, I am 100% with him on the fight against woke and I love the Florida's where woke goes to die thing. And he's lived up to it. It's not just rhetoric, but I see massive dangers in governments punishing corporations for their privately held

views. Um, I don't want that. And if we go down that road, guess who's going to lose? We are. Because the Democrats control virtually all the corporations. They have a way bigger hold on them than our side does, the side of reason. So we're going down a slippery slope there. If we say that this is fine and you can punish corporations for challenging legislation or saying this legislation sucks, that's how Disney feels.

Why can't they feel that way? Well, well, okay. So that's good because I think we have a little difference of opinion there. So look, I am completely fine with the government using power when it is appropriate to be used. Disney, as you know, they had special laws related to their properties. I realize they had special tax exemptions. Let's not pretend this wasn't a punishment. This was a punishment, though.

There's no question. No, no, but that's fine. Why should why should Disney? Why should Disney have special exemptions and tax benefits that say SeaWorld and Universal Studios, which are basically in the same business, also in Orlando, that they don't have? So all he did was even the playing field. He got rid of crony capitalism and gave us the even playing field that we all want. Now, I get your point, though. I like it. I love seeing the people I hate punched in the face.

I really do. I can't stand Disney. I hate what they're doing to my children and everybody else's. However, I care more about America and our fundamental ideals, like the First Amendment, like government shouldn't be infringing on the free speech of individuals or corporations. And I still happen to believe that a corporation has the right to feel the way it feels about legislation, whether it's Republicans or Dems, and deserves not to be punished for said beliefs by a politician, which is what, yeah, it's fine that they just lowered them back down to regular status. It's still a punishment from where they were to where they are now. And you would not be singing this tune if it were Citibank doing this to conservatives who objected to some woke agenda inside of the bank.

Well, no, no. The difference would be if they had special privileges. I don't want any corporation to have any special privileges, right? Like my companies don't deserve special privileges. But the fact that they're lowering it from special to normal doesn't erase the fact that it's a punishment. No, but the fact that it's lowering them from special status back down to normal status does not, which I agree, that's what happened, does not change the fact that it is a punishment being exacted on the company by a governor, by somebody who we elected. It's a slippery slope. You don't think this is going to not going to happen by democratic governors now that like the turnabout will be fair play.

Well, but I would be okay if, if there are situations in Democrat run states where certain corporations have special privileges, and then those companies got into fights with those Democrats, regardless of what the fight was about. If the end result is what we now have in Florida, which will be an even playing field for Disney, I would be okay with it. I get philosophically, I actually, I completely understand what you're saying. You want to make sure that government is not weaponized, but the simple truth is it would be weaponized if they had, if it was even to begin with. And then he started saying, okay, we're going to throw extra taxes or extra regulations on Disney. That would be a true weaponization of government. If anything, he took some of the weapon weaponization away because you could absolutely argue that the weaponization of government was being used against Universal

and SeaWorld because they didn't, they had more strict guidelines to play. Nice try. Nice try. No, not persuaded. But I appreciate your support of him and his policy. And that's fine. And like I say, I like to see Disney suffer. Don't get me wrong. I just this is as a lawyer, as a citizen. I know this is not the way to do it. I go out there and convince people to boycott Disney, you know, through third party groups, not as a, not as a governor, uh, let the people have their say, let the people exact the punishment the way we did with Bud Light, but government should stay the hell out of it. I don't like government. It's not up to Ron DeSantis to punish Disney for its views. It's up to you and me and the people listening to this show government. He's the Joe Biden unleashed on Republicans to

do this kind of thing is going to cause far more damage than Ron DeSantis ever will to Disney. Yeah, I can agree to disagree on one. That's all right. Yeah, that's fine. I mean, look, these are interesting issues to debate and I appreciate having it and I appreciate that he's trying new things. Usually what we see is these, you know, Republican leaders roll over, you know, they do nothing. Now I don't like the tactic here, but I appreciate the willingness to engage. And he has been, he has been losing, uh, in the courts on some of his agenda because he's been stepping on the first amendment. Like that's one of my concerns about DeSantis is he's a little, he's a little, there's a little too much swagger for government for me. I'm,

I got a healthy libertarian strain in me. And he's like, you, you can't tell the colleges how they're supposed to feel about an issue. You can't punish corporations with these DEI, you know, initiatives or punishments of their DEI thing, because you don't like it as the state it's up to the citizenry to stand up and fight it. You can't have the government legislate a corporation's viewpoint. Yeah. Again, we just have a disagreement here, which is, which is, well, the courts are siding with me. So yeah, no, it's, it's, it, well, no, because they've removed DEI from a lot of the schools here in Florida and it's been perfectly legal and everything else. I mean, look, the schools are different. The schools are different. Don't

conflate. Corporations are a different situation. The schools are different. Government can always legislate the schools at 100%. We have a right from our government bodies to legislate what's being taught in K through 12. That's different from telling a corporation that it may not do business in the state of Florida or receive certain funds in Florida. If they have certain viewpoints, he's lost in the courts on this. He tried. No, no. But again, they've removed the special status that Disney had. That's why Disney is upset. I'm talking about other corporations, Dave. All right, never mind. This is a legal

dispute, but trust me, he's losing in the courts on this issue. It was something that was universally praised by conservatives last August. And then I said, this is not going to be upheld. It promptly went into court and DeSantis lost. This is my only like, this is my substantive criticism of his policies. It's not to say he shouldn't be innovative in his crackdown because the left is way more innovative than the right is there at every turn, trying new ways of infecting our lives with this crazed woke ideology. So we need to be creative in getting it out as well. To try and fail is better than to not try at all. But I wish he would be a little bit more careful about wielding government power because it's going to be used the other way.

And the left controls way more than the right does. Let's talk. Let's shift for one second, though, because I want to ask you, he said, have it written down. DeSantis said yesterday that he believes Republicans will rally around him if he wins the Republican nomination. He says, it's not like I'm taking policy positions that are alienating massive segments of Republicans. Um, now I think that's probably true. I think that's right. I think most Republicans actually liked DeSantis a lot. They just diehard Trumpkins get upset when he's like that he's threatening Trump's next run. Right. Like that's what they don't like how DeSantis could ever get past the 800 pound gorilla. And, you know, I was saying Trump is not going to go quietly into the night if DeSantis were to do it. You know, I don't really see how DeSantis can do it with so many people in the field, head to head, perhaps. But if DeSantis were to do it, he's right that Republicans,

his positions are not alienating to massive segments of them. But look at what Trump did on the Senate in Georgia. He is not a good loser. And he wants this nomination. So if DeSantis gets it somehow, do we really think Trump's going to be like, the best man won. All the best to you, Ron. Rob. He's calling him Rob now. Take care. Congratulations, Rob DeSantis. You did beat me. We're very excited. Well, look, Megan, I would say this. That's where the train stops. Right. So I've said this on my show a couple of times. Look, there is a very nice ending to this story. I do not know that it is the ending

we are going to get, but the ending to this story to me is that DeSantis is going to win the nomination. He's the best candidate. I think he's the guy that not only can get the base for reasons we just laid out, but he can get all of the disaffected liberals. I think people like you and I, or the people that maybe when we were there four years ago, seeing some of this nonsense, there's a whole slew of those people. You have to remember, there aren't many segments of American society that don't know which way they're going to vote, but there are a lot of disaffected liberals who might vote Republican. And by the way, that's not, I'm not just making that up. They're all moving to Florida. I meet them every day, lifelong Democrats from New York and Cali and Illinois who are now down here,

who are the most hardcore Republicans because they've lived through the onslaught. So I think that the nice ending is that DeSantis gets the nomination, that Trump realizes what time it is. And he says, you know what? It's my ego is actually less important than what's right for the country. And I'll back the guy and I'll do. No, it may not be. It may not be the ending. I'm just telling you. Part of your comedy routine. You do stand up comedy. This seems like a bit because there's zero chance that's happening. Megan, Megan, you know what Trump likes to be liked. Don't forget that. And don't over, don't underestimate that because if he sees the writing on the wall, the Senate, Dave, what he cost Republicans, the Senate, Trump, he spoiled.

I'm just telling you. So now I can make people like it. So I didn't get two shits about being liked. Yeah. Okay. So I gave you the nice version. The negative version, the negative version would be that he's like, all right, I'm just going to burn it all down. It was me or nobody. And I'm going to take the base with me. And I'm either going to run third party or I'm going to demand that all my people don't. But if he's going to do that, then then it's like, all right, then in essence, you are a Democrat because you'll usher in Joe Biden or Kamala Harris or Gavin Newsom or whoever it's going to be. So you can make art. He would rather Trump would rather see Biden win again. Trump would rather see Biden win again than DeSantis win. I'm going to say you might be right. And that's that's really depressing. And I think that that should make the

most ardent Trump supporter wonder why they're voting for Trump if he would really be willing to do that. What what more proof do we need than the Senate? What more proof do we need? No. So I'll go with you on that. He goes home. If you really believe that and you lose well, if you really believe that and you might be right on that, then I think anyone supporting Trump who would gladly destroy DeSantis in the name of their blaze of glory with Trump to then end up with Biden as president,

you really should think about why you're voting for this guy. Well, I think their feeling is, like Trump says, he's a Paul Ryan shill, right? He's another, he's a globalist. You know, they're buying some of them, not all of them, but they're buying this Trump argument about him. And it's the old, like, I'd rather see the Republican Party implode and suffer and rebuild from the ground up than just yet another Mitt Romney type, which I realize, I don't think that's true of Ron DeSantis, but a lot of people do because that's what Trump's saying.

Well, they believe that. A certain segment of the base believes that because Trump keeps saying it. It has nothing to do with the truth. DeSantis is not a globalist. No one has done more conservative stuff effectively than Ron DeSantis, far more at this point than even Donald Trump. Ron DeSantis is not backed by Soros. And I'm sure you've seen the clips on Twitter, Megan, of the gajillion times that Donald Trump was praising Paul Ryan as his good friend and everything else and Mitch McConnell and Mitt Romney and all of the other guys. And he brought in Christopher Wray and all of that stuff. So it's like it's not true. But yes, he has convinced a certain segment of the, I would say, very online base

that somehow Ron DeSantis is a globalist. But it's just not true. So there it is. Well, but I mean, we're just talking about we're not even really talking about truth or falsity right now. We're talking about what will the base do if Trump says I lost in the 100 percent he's going to say it was unfair and he's going to say he stole it. Like history. Right. But there's zero chance of him being a good loser if he loses. And, you know, you look at these polls and I realize DeSantis is out there. I assume you were at his little conservative like briefing where he got everybody his talking points on these issues yesterday. I was not part of that. I read what happened.

But there's like he's he's out there sort of trying to shore people up on these issues because he knows that they're coming at him. And right now he's saying, OK, look, I'm more I have better favorability ratings in places like Iowa, New Hampshire. OK. All right. True. But first of all, the media is going to drive his favorability ratings right through the floor just as soon as he actually stands a chance. He's just declared yesterday or two days ago. They're going to it's going to be an all out assault on him now that he's actually in the game. And if he starts to gain ground, oh, you watch. And second of all, that that ignores the actual polling where he's getting crushed. He's getting crushed by Trump. And unless he can manage to convince Tim Scott and Nikki Haley and Mike Pence, who's probably going to get in, and Vivek and all these others to get out,

he's in the same position of 61% Trump, 16% DeSantis. Yeah, I just don't think that polling really is right. And I also don't think that any of those guys, I happen to like a lot of them. I personally like Nikki a lot. I've had Vivek on a couple of times. I like Tim Scott. I think this is a good crop of people. It's significantly better than what the Democrats put out last time.

But the truth is none of them have any momentum. Like they don't, they just don't. Everyone knows this is a two man race. And yes, I suppose that for the 1% that they're all gonna get, it does whittle it from DeSantis rather than Trump. But I can tell you this, and this is totally anecdotal, but I think it actually strikes a chord that'll make sense to you. About two months ago, so this is well before DeSantis

announced, I did an event at University of Wisconsin, Green Bay. I did a poll, it was about 400 people in the crowd. And I did a poll, I said, how many of you voted for Trump last time? I think literally every hand in the room went up, literally every hand in the room. I said, how many of you would prefer DeSantis this time? It was everybody except about seven people. Now I get it. It's an audience that came there for me. So is what it is, but it was a cross section of students and faculty and donors, et cetera, et cetera. And I started asking them, asking them why. And then I did a little cocktail thing after. So I was individually one-on-one chatting with people. And everybody

was saying the exact same thing. We like Trump. We appreciate Trump. We thank Trump for what he did. He woke us up. I used to be a Democrat, blah, blah, blah. But DeSantis is doing it right. And it doesn't have the drama. And's younger and he's more effective and we know about Florida with covet and all that and we're just tired of the thing and I think what what DeSantis really has the magic of what he has under the policy is that I think people are starting to realize it doesn't have to be this way and I don't think people want it to be this way anymore I I think that's really what's going on here well I, I mean, that's an interesting point. I hope you're right that it doesn't have to be this way, like that we can- But we have to make that decision ourselves,

right? It only doesn't have to be this way if we force it to not be this way. We're not giving Trump enough credit though, because look, Chris Ruffo participated in this event with DeSantis the other day about CRTs, worked with DeSantis and CRT in Florida. Guess who made Chris Ruffo a household name? Trump. He was on Tucker show. Trump then worked with Chris Ruffo to get rid of CRT in these federal administrative agencies. So it's, it's not like Trump did nothing on CRT. It started to explode during the course of his administration. And he did start battling this and who underestimates Trump's willingness to fight the woke? Hello. This is like his signature bread and butter brand, you know, being politically incorrect and not standing up for this nonsense. They just have different tactics in it. But I'll tell you this, Dave, like and I'm listen, I've said yesterday, this is not I'm taking the opposite side because I know you're very pro DeSantis and I have a lot of viewers on both sides. So as do I, by the way, I'm just telling people what I think, but I know I have a certain segment of my audience pissed at me, but you know, you know this, you can only say what you believe.

It's as simple as that. Oh, it's fine. I mean, listen, either one of these guys could get my vote, but, but I will say this, I'm on the show every day and we take callers all the time and I hear from them and I hear from them in my emails and so on. And I can give you exactly the opposite argument when it comes to DeSantis and Trump, the people who say, well, I like DeSantis a lot. I can't wait for him to run next time. It's not his turn. Trump got screwed off out of his first term and we're not going to let him get screwed out of, and he got screwed out of his second term. And we're not going to let him get screwed out of this go at getting elected again. The Durham report confirms how unfair he was treated, how unfairly he was treated, how his first term was stolen from him. And that DeSantis, you know,

right now he doesn't have all the baggage, but he'll get it. The mainstream media will put it on him like that. And that Trump deserves another go at it. They also point out the charisma differential. And I don't think you can argue that. Like Trump oozes it out of his pores and DeSantis seems pretty wooden. Yeah, look, on the charisma side, I mean, Trump's a reality TV host. He loves impromptu stuff and going off the cuff and all that stuff.

Like, yeah, there's not a debate on that one. I actually think DeSantis is totally friendly and interesting and all of those things. But is on that, if we're measuring whether you want a guy to just like hang out with and get stupid and, and play, you know, trade memes with, yes, Trump is better. If you want an executive, who's a president, who's going to write the ship and do the right thing and has a track record of literally doing everything he said, well, then it seems like it's DeSantis. But, but I want to back up to

something you said, because I agree, Trump deserves all of the credit for waking up that stuff, waking people up about the woke and everything else. But I would say, you know, when we're worried, let's say about the media going after DeSantis the same way they went after Trump, you have to remember, this is not 2016 anymore. The mainstream media is in absolute freefall, and it's a very slim amount of people, not none, but it's a much smaller amount of people who believe the lies of the mainstream media, some of which you just laid out, than did back in 2016. So I think regardless of whether it's Trump or DeSantis, more people with a skeptical eye will not be swallowing all of them. Oh, now DeSantis raped this person and like all the nonsense that they're going to make up. I don't think people will fall for it the way they did against Trump. And by the way, that's partly credit to Trump for breaking through that thing.

Well, and I'll give you this point. The thing about the thing about Trump. Some people loved, but it also leads to that fatigue factor you were just discussing, was mostly self-generated. The weird tweets, some of the weird comments, the weird behavior, the strange comments about Elaine Chao. It's like, what? He would say something and then it would drive the news cycle for three days opposed to like just getting along or getting onto the people's agenda. And so Trump is just erratic. He's erratic. And you know, I understand it's part of the package, but I also understand the fatigue factor that leads people to be like, oh, for the love of Jane, like what's like, we need something that's more normal. We're used to the mainstream demonizing people like Romney, McCain, who are not really controversial.

We know what we're going to get. Same thing with DeSantis. We know how to prepare for that. With Trump, it's just so much of it. It's like, OK, there's a porn star who he paid off. Now there may be a bookkeeping thing. And then there's the Mar-a-Lago documents. And then there's an FBI raid. And then there may be like it's just like the drama tends to follow him.

But Megan, I'll give you a bonus with that one, which is that he's also feeding the beast that we all want destroyed, which is the mainstream media. There's a reason you're doing this show independently the way that you are, which is so freaking awesome and allows you to be your boss, right? And there is nothing that you can't say. And if you say something that gets you in trouble, you're the one that's ultimately responsible for that. Trump, unfortunately, he was right about CNN, CNN fake news, right? That's Trump's credit, except he just did a town hall with them

so he keeps them alive and they need him for clicks. So it becomes this very twisted game that these guys are playing. The New York Times, he'll tell you they're the failing New York Times and then who does he give access to more than anyone else? Maggie Haberman at the New York Times. DeSantis is doing the workaround that we've all been asking for. He's going to Twitter spaces. He's not being interviewed by NBC because they keep lying about him. Or me. Seriously, it's not about me, but he's got to grow a pair. Like, come on for an

adversarial. Go with somebody who's going to ask you some tough questions. Be a man. I'm sick of like the duck and cover drill that he's doing only with friendly media. Would you grow up? I'm not adverse to DeSantis, but he is going to get some tough questions. What? Who has he done? Who has he done that's asked him tough questions? Well, first has he done? Who has he done? That's asked him tough questions. Well, first off, I a hundred percent would be for DeSantis doing your show. He absolutely should. I'm why is he not on the list? We've asked again this round. He's too chicken. Go ahead. Yeah, no, no, no. I think you're in touch with them. So he absolutely should. I 100% I'm in touch with him, but I haven't gotten a yes. I mean, literally, with all due respect to the local radio host in Tennessee, which he's going, he doesn't need to worry about. Why wouldn't he?

Our show is literally one of the biggest shows in the country. I mean, we've got way more viewers than anything he could do on most of Fox News other than a couple of the primetime shows. All of CNN, all of MSNBC. It's insanity. There's only one reason. There's only one reason, Dave. He's afraid of being asked tough questions. That's absurd, first of all, because he can handle adversarial media. We've seen him do that in the local Florida level. And it's bad for him. It's one thing to give the middle finger to MSNBC. Right on, Ron. I agree with him and not the vague on that. Right.

There's no gettable viewers over there, though. You could make the argument you have a Carrie Lake type moment that leads to a viral campaign situation. We're taking on the truly leftist hating media is good for him. But there's no excuse not to do just challenging people who are not sick of fans of his. So it's not about me. I don't need. Let me just say this. I don't need DeSantis. My show's crushing it. I don't need him. And there's some liberty in not having him on because yeah, I can say whatever the hell I want. Like what's true for me. I don't need to suck up to get him on the program, but I do see this as a problem. You can't be so insulated.

You never subject yourself to the tough questions. And then what? You're on the debate stage and suddenly you're looking at Anderson Cooper and it's like, oh, wait,Santis, or if any of your people are watching the Megyn Kelly show right now, this is Dave Rubin, you know me, and you should absolutely sit down with Megyn. You are 100% right on that. I can't speak to what's going on there behind the scenes. I have literally no idea, but of course you're right. Megyn Kelly needed Dave Rubin's endorsement. If you would have told me that 10 years ago. Well, you're a power broker now, Dave. And it's a pleasure to have you on. Up next, we're going to discuss the Biden disastrous poll numbers. My God, my God, these numbers are absolutely dreadful. I mean, I'm actually starting to wonder whether RFK Jr. can somehow get this nomination. We'll talk about it. Stand by. We've talked about the inter-GOP war. Let's talk about what's happening over on the Dem side. It's not good. CNN has a new poll out among Democrats. Biden has 60% support to become the second term president. RFK Jr. has 20 percent, 20 percent. Marianne Williamson has eight

and anyone else has eight. So you've got 36 percent of the Democratic Party saying, for the love of God, give us somebody else. We don't want this old man. That's terrible. And then you look at the independent support. Biden gets 40 percent of the independents. These are important. These are the ones who win or lose elections for the candidates on both sides. Biden has 40% of them. Kennedy has 32%. Williamson has nine. Someone else has 14. So 32, 42, 46 plus nine is 55. The vast majority of Democrats want the independence want someone other than Biden. You go down the favorability nationwide. Biden has 35 percent favorable, 57 percent unfavorable. By the way, that's basically how Trump's numbers look as well. And you look deep into these numbers and what it shows is that most of Biden's decline is occurring among independents.

He's down at least nine points in the past just few months. It doesn't get better from there. Everyone thinks it would be a disaster, a disaster or a setback. 67% of the electorate says for Biden to be reelected would be a disaster or a setback. Similar numbers for Trump. So, my God, what the Democrats have a massive problem and his name is Joe Biden. Well, first off, on 8% of the Democrats supporting Marianne Williamson, the woman is completely

bananas. So let's just, let me tell you one thing about Marianne Williamson real quick, just like purely to show you what politics is all about or what this game is often all about. I had Marianne Williamson real quick, just like purely to show you what politics is all about or what this game is often all about. I had Marianne Williamson on my show. I really try not to badmouth any of the guests that I've ever had on, but she did something that you'll appreciate what happened. I had her on and she gives me all of her sort of lefty, progressive, socialist, everyone's a racist, all the stuff. I treat her with the exact same respect as I treated everybody else. Of course, it's what I always do. The second the camera went off, she was like, I mean, I mean this literally, the second it went off, she was like, you know, I'm mostly a libertarian.

And actually I've never gotten as much hate from the right as I have from the left. They're really just so awful. And I was like, I said, I was like, Marianne, why didn't you say that on camera? So that sort of tells you everything you need to know about her. But let's just move on from her. The RFK thing is super interesting because 20% is not nothing. He's making a lot of sense, especially on the COVID stuff and some security state stuff and intelligence agencies and all that. But I will bet you my entire life's fortune that Joe Biden will never step on a debate

stage with that people. What RFK is about to find out if he does not know it already is that the deep corruption of the Democrat party, just ask Bernie Sanders, is so deep. It is so ingrained that they will do everything they can to destroy him. And I haven't had RFK on yet. We've been trying to get him. So we'll see what happens. But what I would I haven't had RFK on yet. We we've been trying to get him. So, uh, we'll see what happens. Uh, but what I would like to know from RFK really is what makes you a Democrat at this point. And now I get you're a Kennedy. So it's, it's, this is, you know, intertwined. That's fine. Uh, but I think by the time the Democrat machine is done with him and won't put him on stage, he should leave the party, say he's a Republican. And guess what? The

Republicans will put him on the debate stage, but I don't what I maybe, you know, the answer to that. What do you think makes him a Democrat? I've asked him that a few times. Like, why are you still a Democrat? And I think on social issues, he's still more liberal. You know, I'm sure he's pro choice. He's he's made his whole fortune, his not a fortune, but he's made his whole bones as an environmental lawyer. So he's very, you know, pro cleaning up the environment, which I realize Republicans would like to clean up the environment, too. But there's a big diversion on how to do it. Sure. You can go back and look at the list. But he he I've tested that just like within the past six or seven months.

And he said, yeah, no wonder 100 percent Democrat. But here's what's interesting about that run. In addition to just his numbers, Dave, like what if he were to run as a third party? What if he doesn't, you know, not going, he's not going to get the nomination and just completely screwed up the Biden vote. Like that could be really interesting. That would be really interesting. You know, it definitely screws up the Biden vote. I think when it on the Republican side, it would really depend on whether it was Trump or DeSantis. You could probably figure out ways to argue it either way, right? You know, the thing with the third party vote is, well,

first off, there's so many issues related to ballot access and if you can actually get on the ballot. Now, the Libertarian Party is on, I think, pretty much every ballot. They exist as a party as ineffectual and as really ridiculous as they've been for decades at this point. And I would say that, unfortunately, by the way, in 2016, I voted for Gary Johnson, who was the libertarian candidate. He was a terrible candidate. I just couldn't pull the lever for either one of Hillary or Trump at the time. Obviously, I did vote for Trump the second time. But ballot access would be the main thing. I think I think RFK probably has a very bright future influencing things more from the outside after this. But

my guess is I'm telling you that the Democrat, you know, Megan, the Democrat machine is so nasty and corrupt that he will glance like environment is making you a Democrat. OK, I mean, the Republicans, as you said, they don't hate the environment. It's whether the government should do it or private or whether we can do it at all or what energy we should use. As far as the social issues, there's very few Republicans who are trying to reverse gay marriage. It's not a thing anymore. And abortion, you know, it's left up to the state. So it really shouldn't be that much of an issue for presidential politics anyway. You can try to talk them into it. You'll try to talk him into it. But look, these guys have a massive problem here with these numbers because they're not enthusiastic about Joe Biden. And in the

number two position, as you know, God forbid something happens to Joe Biden, we're going to be stuck with this eloquent, inspirational speaker who's going to inspire us to unite and come together and celebrate things like technological achievements, like the semiconductor. Listen to her wax eloquently about that. Without semiconductors, your smartphone would not be a smartphone. It would be a paperweight that occupies a big space in your pocket. I mean, Dave, what's not to love? Megan, that woman is a human paperweight, okay? She's just, I'm shocked she didn't somehow

say something about a Venn diagram there. That's her whole thing. Everything is a Venn diagram. I give you a Venn diagram of Kamala Harris's speeches and sheer stupidity, and we could put those together and it would, it's all so idiotic. But look, the Biden thing is brilliant. You know, the Biden thing is such a disaster right now. I think you really could argue that Biden is the worst president in modern history because Joe Biden is obviously not running the show. There's no confidence in him. You know, I've tweeted this out a couple of times and I would

ask you to do the same thing. Try to get an ardent Biden supporter on your show. We are to believe he got 81 million votes and people still love him and think he's great and all of that stuff. But you can't get anyone to really defend him. Get get his biggest supporter to come on your show and ask them, do you think Joe Biden is mentally capable of being president at this point? And they will either lie to you or not give you the answer or realistically they're not showing up. He's more of a construct at this point to just keep the Frankenstein machine going than actually president. There is simply, do you think for one day he could be assistant manager at McDonald's?

The guy's not right. That's very sad. I want a president who's competent, whether I agree with his policies or not. But they have a major problem because she's obviously the one right behind him. I have, look, and also, did you see the video? What was it? About a week ago when he was in Japan and he fell down the stairs. And it's like, he usually falls up the stairs. This time he fell

down the stairs, but we're a broken hip away from Kamala. So everybody better be worried about this. And we're six years away from the end of his second term. If he were to be reelected, try to picture him as president of the United States, six years from where he is right now. It's really scary. I mean, it's almost like a, forgive me, but it's like a taxidermied president, you know, like there's nothing there anymore. And yet he's in charge of the nuclear codes and how we all live because he's been, you know, very aggressive about interfering on things like codes and how we all live because he's been, you know, very aggressive about interfering on things like education and how our children are and how we're supposed to behave. And it's terrifying because we'd have no idea who was actually in control. All right. My friend,

Dave Rubin, it's always a pleasure, my friend. Check him out on the Rubin Report on Rumble. Love Rumble. And we'll do it again soon. See you, Megan. All right. And don't forget folks, you can find the Megan Kelly show live on Sirius XM triumph channel one 11 every weekday at noon East, the full video show and clips by subscribing to our YouTube channel. That's youtube.com slash Megan Kelly. If you prefer an audio podcast,

go ahead and download and follow us wherever you get your podcast for free. You go on over to Apple, you can leave a, like a comment and I will read it and you get your podcasts for free. If you go on over to Apple, you can leave a comment and I will read it and you'll get our full archives, more than 550 shows. Also want to tell you, go ahead now to megankelly.com. You can sign up for the American News Minute. It's my Friday email to you. It's got all sorts of fun updates on what we cover during the week, all the news you need to know in 60 seconds or less, and an update on my little buddy, Strudwick Brunt. He is the littlest Brunt, but also the biggest pain in the ass. Joining us now for the first time is Brian Sharp, better known to the world as Hotep Jesus.

Hotep is the host of the Grift Report on YouTube, and he has a unique perspective on what's been going on with so many subjects from BLM's potential bankruptcy, the latest with the machete-wielding professor out of New York City, much, much more. Hotep, welcome to the show. Nice to meet you. Megan, thank you so, so much. It's an absolute pleasure to be here. I had a friend call me this morning. She's like, oh my God, you're going to be on Megan Kelly's show. I can't believe it. I like her. She sounds smart. All right. So for those of thes in the black community. So in a black community, it's pretty much bifurcated, just like the white community where you have your conservative side and you have your liberal side. Right. So in a black community, we were using this term HOTEP, which means peace, you know, say hi or goodbye, et cetera, et cetera. But when Black Lives Matter came into prominence, HOTEP turned into a pejorative, basically a way to hurl invective

comments at Black conservative minds. And I said, not on my watch. So we took it, we exalted the term, and here we are today. I'm HOTEP Jesus. We run HOTEP Nation, which is a nonprofit organization that supports the homeschooling community. but it was just basically to reclaim something that had greatness attached to it while the black left tried to throw it in the mud. It's very cool. I like it. It took me a while to pronounce it correctly. So I practiced hotep. At first I thought it was hotep. No, not it. Not it. Hotep. One time I was hanging out with Charlie Kirk one time and he called me hotstep. That's good, too. I didn't correct him because, you know, I'm black.

So obviously he thought it had some sort of hip hop connotation to it. So when he called me hot step, I was like, you know what? I'll let it slide. It kind of works, too. You could go either way with it. Now, so you grew up and I understand you were not always more of a conservative commentator. You were more kind of firmly on the left and more pro BLM and like pro the narrative on guys like Michael Brown and Trayvon Martin. That's interesting.

So how did you sort of have this journey from there to here? Okay, so that is half correct. I was raised conservative. I wouldn't say, you know, technically politically conservative, but the Black community for most part is very conservative. I wouldn't say technically politically conservative, but the Black community, for the most part, is very conservative. And I was on the Black conservative end of things. And I was never a supporter of BLM, the organization. In fact, I was one of the first people to call them out in 2014 and 2015. You can go look at the receipts. You know, the I've done videos and think 2015, my video was on BLM, the rainbow agenda or the Bud Light agenda. So I've been on top of that and trying to expose it for a really long time.

And I was part of the reason why I got labeled HOTEP, because I didn't like that I was exposing that situation. But as far as Mike Brown was concerned, I really didn't care about the case or anything that much. My problem was seeing my peers. I felt the pain of my peers and how they viewed that case and how they viewed those events and how it turned out. And I felt bad that their emotions were being manipulated. And then there was the Darren Seals situation. Okay. Now, Darren Seals was on the ground in Ferguson with Mike Brown's mom, et cetera, et cetera. And he was the one that really exposed BLM. And he was talking about how these people know, these people were coming in,

they were co-opted in the Ferguson demonstration because at first it was organic on the ground. And then all of a sudden the BLM types came in and co-opted it. Antifa types came in and started becoming provocateurs. So then once the cameras started coming in, you have the BLM infiltrators coming in and he was talking about all this money was coming in.

He even talks about there's a clip out there of him saying he was going to he smacked DeRay McKesson. So, yeah, he you know, I was definitely on on his side of things. And we were trying to, you know, alert people to the dangers of BLM. Hmm. I'm I'm just reading like my producer said, I think you used to call yourself a Black nationalist. And so what did that mean to you? Yeah. So I'm still kind of a Black nationalist, but what does that even mean? And it has a term in that, nationalist know, nationalist, right? So you think of nationalists and you think, you know, for example, if you say white nationalist, you think of Patriot Front in some white hate group. So when you say black nationalist, you think of some black hate group. And there was a time in my life where, you know, I did not like white people. I had animosity

towards white people. And then I had this spiritual awakening and, you know, I found resolve within myself and I got away from that, you know, toxic mentality. Um, I'm still very pro black. Um, however, it's definitely from a different point of view. Um, you know, when I say black nationalists, like some people were calling me radical back in the day, but the only thing radical about me, I was calling for things like, you know, boycott Nike and boycott the NFL and all these things that black people gave their energy to. And, you know, focus on your health and focus on economics, focus on capitalism. And that stuff just didn't it didn't fit too well with the community. Obviously, the black community has been monopolized by Nike. They love sports. And, you know, when I brought up, what was the other one I just said? It's the sports, Nike. And what was the other one I mentioned, Megan? Help me out here. I'm not sure which one you mean. But anyway, but anyway, yeah. So, oh, oh yeah. Capitalism. So that's when I realized that the black liberals were very much socialist. And then I started having to dive into all of the studies of Russia and

Germany and understanding how socialism and communism came about and then how it proliferated through the Black community, et cetera, et cetera. So when they realized I was a capitalist, I was basically canceled. And I was like, no, capitalism is definitely the way. And then that's when I got into Thomas Sowell's work, Walter Williams' work, Milton Friedman. Then I wrote my book, The Patriot Report. So I'm a capitalist through and through. And I thought that capitalism was the way for Black people to get out of the, you know, the struggle that they're in and reduce regulation. And they were like, no, we need more government, you know, between Candace Owens' Blexit and, you know, Larry Elder and his films. And it just seems like there's a bit of a sea change now through Trump, too, given the I realize it's nothing to like. It's not exactly a huge groundswell of black support, but he certainly increased his numbers amongst the black voters.

Do you feel like there's any sort of change underway? The change has all been done by the Biden administration. When you go to the grocery store, when you go to the gas station, these are the things that are changing people's minds. This is what I understood about the Black community is they're very much about the mighty green dollar. And once you affect that mighty green dollar, you know, that's when they're going to start to question things. So, you know, Larry Elder, Candace Owens, they've done great work. I can't say it's touched the black community, but business in general, small business was hurt by the pandemic. So, you know, these lockdowns that most Democratic governors coveted and enforced, a lot of that stuff has them questioning Democratic policies. But the truth of the matter is there's not much voter participation in the black community. I mean, less than half of the Black community actually votes. So when we're talking about who's actually voting, it's mostly skewed Black women,

and many of them work for the Democratic Party. They do the door knocking, they do the phone calls, et cetera, et cetera. And they're really held hostage by this notion that Republicans are racist. And also, I think they've been held hostage from an education point of view and from a fake stream media point of view to where they only get one side of the story. Also, Hollywood has done a great job. For example, you see the movie The Color Purple. They keep the Black community suspended in a certain time period and from a certain viewpoint of that time period, which points to stories of struggle and oppression where the white man had his foot on your neck. So they're not seeing the full picture. They're not seeing, you know, the first legal case won by a slave owner was a black man. They're not looking at the side of things where there was black bankers and they're not looking at the fact that black Wall Street was destroyed,

but was also rebuilt. And the only thing that destroyed it was integration, something that was pushed by the NAACP. They're not seeing how the NAACP isn't doing a great job for the black community. They've got a few small cases where they've done some great things for individuals. But for the most level, the university level and the media level, both in the news and Hollywood. So, you know, they don't have a holistic view of how this world works or how this country works and how things came to be. And when you don't have both sides of those, you know, you're not going to make the best decisions. Do you do just listening to you talk? I know you've talked many times about the fact that you did not go to college, but you are self-educated. You've read a ton on so many

different interesting subjects, starting with Orwell, like everything he's written. And I know the Russian revolution and so on. This seems like an advantage, right? Because you didn't go through four years of that indoctrination. They didn't get their claws into you with some of the stuff they're pushing. I mean, especially today. That seems like an advantage in staving off that ideological hold. Yeah. Well, they wouldn't have got their tentacles on me anyway. I mean, if you looked at some of the books my dad had me reading, I'm talking about like, I remember probably maybe 10, 12 years old, some conspiracy theory books about how AIDS was developed in a lab and was spread on the African continent through vaccines, all this stuff that I was reading some really based material when I was really young. So they weren't going to get their tentacles on me anyway. Yeah. And I think

many of my professors, when I did go to college, they picked up on these things. Like I remember one time I went to college or a class and I showed up late and he said to me, you know, Brian, you're late. And I said, well, I pay to go here. I'll let you know when you're late. And the whole class was like, oh, so I always had this like different view of life and things. But, you know, I think self-educ you know, the leftist media wants to wants to keep black people suspended in like, you know, Republicans are bad. And, you know, I wasn't the person that would say, OK, Republicans are bad. I have to stay away. I was like, Republicans are bad. OK, why? Tell me why. And I never got those answers. So I just went and started speaking to Republicans and checking them out. And then they started educating me because I was asking things like, you know, what should I read on communism, for example? And they gave me a litany of different documents and books or well, you know, I was speaking to I think it was Carpe Duncum at at an event. And he said to me, you know, the turnaround, the turnover in this industry is like two years or something like that.

And I've been around a lot longer. And I told him, I think that's because when the Trump Hillary election came around, I didn't spend time grifting. I spent time educating myself. And then I wrote my dissertation, The Patriot Report, Unmasked the Conspiracy of Money and War. I studied, I educated myself and I used Republicans or conservatives, I would say, to to help educate me. And that's how I devoured all the soul content. I devoured all the Walter Williams content, Milton Friedman, some of the Mises stuff. I just used the time to really educate myself because I didn't want to be a LARPer. I remember one time I used the term 1984 and Orwell. And I'm like, wait, I never even read the book. So I sat down, I read that and I read Animal Farm that I read some of his letters and his writings. And, you know, I just think that, you know, if you're going to really do battle on this playing field, self-education is going to be the key. And it's really easy to destroy the liberals because everything they have is just pure emotions. Do you get, you know, the same sort of blowback on these positions as we've seen this week for Tim Scott

or for Clarence Thomas? Any conservative Black man or woman gets horrendously attacked and diminished and they get a total pass for it in the media. Have you experienced that? No, no. I'm Teflon now because I warned the black

community about BLM so, so early and so many people blocked me. And so people, so many people lambasted me, but now like the black community is like, yo, we have to give Hotep Jesus his flowers because he warned us about this scam years ago and we would not listen. So now I think the black community see me, you know, like Candace Owens, she did her documentary like a year or two ago. Okay. So when Candace Owens was a Democrat, I was exposing BLM, right? So they view us very differently because I was in the trenches. I came from black nationalism, so to speak. I came from the Hotep community. And also when I speak, they know I know my stuff. It's really hard to pin me. And I've had so many great interviews.

I had great interviews with Scott Adams and so many other people, Joe Rogan. So I've spoken to so many people. And I think it's because, for example, Fox Soul. Fox Soul had me on one time, and then the next time I came back on, they pulled some shim-sham when I pulled up to the Zoom about, you know, I didn't have some paperwork signed or something like that. Well, we already settled that, but Fox Soul won't even speak to me. So the thing is, I think they're afraid to even highlight me. I had an argument today with Ebro from Hot 97. I said, Ebro, why won't you bring me up to Hot 97 and have a discussion and speak to the Black community?

So they don't attack me. They just try to avoid me and ignore me because I think if they put the spotlight on me, I might start changing more minds. And that's really what they're scared of. Mm-hmm. Right. That's a problem that Republicans have of all colors in dealing with the mainstream. So what about the BLM collapse? It's been pretty brutal. They're not bankrupt, but they're facing a possible bankruptcy. The latest reports are just they've lost tens and tens of millions of dollars. They've wasted tens of millions of dollars on lavish homes for the founder.

Patrice Cullors was forced out in 2021 amidst a scandal. And it seems like the giving well has dried up, certainly versus 2020. So do you see a future for BLM, the organization, in the wake of all this? BLM's job is done. BLM is no longer needed. So if they're going to get money, it's going to be from big donors. It's going to be from big corp. They've lost all support from the Black community. There's very, very few people in the Black community who still support BLM. There's blmchapterstatement.com, which have the different chapters of BLM. There's BLM chapter statement dot com, which have the different chapters of BLM, which have accused the Black Lives Matter Global Network Foundation of some funny money schemes happening. They're not getting support. Hundreds of million dollars have poured into the coffers of the BLM mothership and nothing has gone to her children chapters. So you even have BLM, the organization's, you know, mutiny against the mothership.

So but coming back to my point, like BLM is done, like their role was to Trojan horse. The Bud Light agenda that was that was the whole thing was to turn everybody into a different gender. Let's just call a spade a spade. And they used Black power, Black energy, Black women, Black issues, Black men. Because you got to remember on the website, it said mothers, parents, children. They omitted Black men from the website very early on. And that was one of my first red flags when I saw that on the website. So black men wanted they wanted to erase black men because we're going to protect our community. Men protect women and children. So they erased us. And then they wanted to insert the rainbow agenda. Now, the rainbow agenda is here. You see that with Bud Light, you see that with Target and so many

other things. We got Pride Month next month, which we're co-opting. We're calling it Strong Dad Month, Strong Dad June. So we're co-opting that. But with Target, Bud Light, that was created using Black energy, using Black Lives Matter. So when you look at Black Lives Matter falling apart now, it's because the job's done. Can we just talk about that? Because I think that is an element of BLM that a lot of people don't know about. They did speak about getting rid of the nuclear family, getting rid of the heteronormative default, that there was sort of a, quote, queer agenda associated with Black Lives Matter. And that wasn't publicized as much. I mean, probably because of the reasons you pointed out a minute ago, that the Black community does tend to be a

little bit more conservative on a lot of these social issues. That's why Karl Rove used gay marriage as a wedge to drive out the black vote in 2004 to get George Bush reelected. You know, he understood that and it worked. But this was a piece of BLM. So I see what you're saying when it comes to because the target people might be confused because the target controversy is about them putting weird trans clothing at the front of targets where little children can see women's bathing suit with, quote, extra material for the tuck. And it's not a black issue, but there was a crossover with that group. Yeah, I've seen some of these black leftist panels say things like, if you don't support trans people then you're not for black people so they have them i'm seeing that more and more i'm seeing that more and more in the messaging

hotel like you know they don't we have to boycott this company because they didn't stand up like bud light they didn't stand up for the lgbtq plus and black community it's like wait what wait how did how did race get in there yeah um of fact, if you ever look at, there was a gangster named Bumpy Johnson in Harlem and Bumpy Johnson used to work for, I forget her name, Madam Saint something, but she was a lesbian. The black community had no problem with gay people. In fact, there's also, I want to say the Marchese family. I forget, there's another Italian family who protected the gays in New York City. And really what it was, it was the government that was oppressive against gays. It wasn't people. So we never really had a problem with gay people at all. So this is more of a fabrication. This is more following Hegelian dialectic where they pretend like, okay, there's a huge problem violence, domestic violence is higher amongst same-sex couples than it is for opposite-gender couples. So when they look at the problems, I think the community needs to look inward. When they look at violence with trans people, you have to look at

those cases because they're not being transparent with whoever they're dealing with. They're hiding what they are. And then when there's backlash for you hiding that you have a thang thang between your legs, you know, now all of a sudden you're, you know, you're wondering why you're getting punched in the eye. And I don't believe in violence. I wouldn't condone that, but they, you know, they prey on people and then try to play victim. Um, but again, coming back to, you know, BLM, the BLM website, again, introduced some of these terms like cis heteronormative, all these things. I didn't know what cis was until BLM came about. As a matter of fact, it was funny because when Bruce turned into Caitlyn Jenner, I said

something about that on Twitter. And then I was excoriated by a horde of Twitter accounts. And I went through the line and I clicked on each one. And as I clicked on each one, they all had BLM in the bio. I said, wait a second, what does trans people have to do with black people? And then again, on the website, you saw affirming queer lies, affirming trans lies. And it was like, I just said to myself, what does this have to do with being black? And you got to remember, I come from black nationalism. So it's just, you know, in black nationalism, we teach black first. We don't teach gender first. We teach black first.

And they were putting the queer agenda, the rainbow agenda ahead of blackness. And that, to me, was a huge red flag. I'm like, okay, this isn't BLM. This is Bud Light. Lives matter. So when that stuff started happening and started coming out and, well, I started exposing that and making videos, YouTube videos, warning the community what it is now. But the black community, they totally see it. The the Bud Light situation has been, I think, really encouraging. You know, they really have been taught a lesson. I said the left wanted to boycott them. They do.

It's the right that's boycotting them because the Dylan Mulvaney thing. But the left in response is saying, well, they weren't supportive enough of Dylan Mulvaney in the face of the storm. And therefore we need to boycott. I mean, it's crazy. But something similar is going on now with Target. And Target, as I mentioned, put this clothing up front celebrating Pride Month with the women's bathing suits with the extra material so you can tuck it, which we don't need. Thanks, but no thanks. We don't need it. And people are mad. And so now down in some Southern states in particular, Target has agreed to move the merchandising displays to the back of the store. And in the week since this controversy broke,

this is for the New York Post, Target has lost $9 billion in market value. Now it's not a loss unless they sell their stock, you know, unless they actually have a sale, but it's dramatic with the consumers having their say. A week ago Wednesday, their stock closed at 160.96 a share, giving them market capitalization of 74 billion. Now it's down to 65 billion. A week later, this is the Daily Mail reports that a major conservative investment fund is now boycotting Target because of this problem, the pride collection that they're putting on display. And this it's called American Conservative Values, and they are selling their Target shares, adding them to a refuse to buy list. The founder of this conservative investment fund says not only weren't they smart enough

target to stay apolitical they picked the wrong side so it's getting kind of interesting because the conservatives are learning how to send their own message which we haven't seen in years we haven't seen anything like this It's accelerationism. This LGBT program was accelerated, again, via BLM. But these corporations don't really care about the power of the agenda more than their profits, which is a violation to their shareholders. You know, they're they're supposed to do what's in the best interest of their shareholders. They're playing a very dangerous game. And I think one of the dangerous games they're playing is with their employees in their stores, because people are going to start revolting. People are going to start rejecting some of this stuff, especially when you start inserting kids into these conversations. When we look at DeSantis, Ron DeSantis and what he's doing in Florida, there's been this notion that he's erasing Black history. Now, I saw some bins of some books, and I'm not sure if some of those should have been taken out or not, but I haven't read them, so I don't know. But when I think about critical race

theory, it comes along with critical queer theory, gay theory. There's a whole bunch of critical theories that come along with critical race theory. And again, you know, black people are like needles and inside these needles are, you know, formulations of LGBT ism. So they'll use us to inject it, you know, use us as a Trojan horse. And that's what people are also rejecting. So, you know, when people have said, hey, you know, Rhonda Santis is racist and so on and so forth, I looked at the critical race theory curriculum, the syllabus at some of these universities. I hadn't found anything in there that I would like to teach my children. The only thing I found in there that I would like to teach my children is what to avoid and what to look for in the agenda, in the Marxist agenda, the debauchery and the lechery.

And to be quite frank, this is about children. When we look at the rainbow agenda, it's to come after children. We're starting to see reports of T people sexually assaulting children and so on and so forth. But it's not about adults. It's about targeting children. These people are sickos. These are the people that are hanging out at Epstein Island, et cetera, et cetera, pushing this agenda because they want access to children. And that's why they want to teach your children this stuff. I saw a clip from a cartoon that's teaching people about non-binary and gender and all this stuff. I saw a clip from a cartoon that's teaching people about non-binary and gender

and all this stuff. So there's putting it on YouTube inside children's programs. The other day I was looking and my daughter was three years old and she's on her iPad and she's watching a program and it's a dude in a dress with a beard. And I had to snatch the iPad away and I just started putting restrictions on it because this is the stuff that they're inserting in the children's program. So the people have to understand is I don't care if you want to copulate with another adult. But the real issue here is that they want your children. And you're starting to see that with Target where they're putting this stuff near children and that's the scary part it's like i don't i'm not familiar with a with reports of a trans person uh assaulting a child although i'm sure it's just as possible

as it is for a you know a cis person to assault i mean people do bad things but what they're doing in these hospitals what they're doing in these hospitals to these children is an assault. They're, they're not able to consent. There's no such thing as informed consent for a minor to have his penis chopped off or to have her breasts chopped off. And the more of these companies who partner with hospitals like that, we just saw that too. Um, that's actually, I think, hold on. Yes. The latest on Bud Light is they're sponsoring a pride parade. They're listed as a sponsor on the Cincinnati pride parade website, partnering with Planned Parenthood and the Cincinnati children's hospital. Well, you might think that they're non-controversial, but you would be wrong. They medically transition minors,

uh, per the daily wire. And you need to be careful as a company, especially one as much hot water as a light is about who you hold hands with. Planned Parenthood is controversial enough. Never mind a hospital because they don't all do this. That's performing these procedures on little kids, on young kids who are unable to consent. But I'm encouraged by, you know, the right finding its voice. I'll tell you something that interested me. And that's from the Washington Post, Greg Sargent. I mentioned at the top of the show, here's how he's spinning it. So the left is now looking at the right finding its voice, right? And holding companies like Bud Light and Target accountable for surrendering on these things. And this is, this is, I mean, this takes balls to write about this situation this way. He says, targets surrender. And this is, this is, I mean, this takes balls to write about this situation this way. He says targets surrender. And what he means by surrender is in a couple of Southern states, they're moving the displays to the back. That's it. It's still, you know, the displays are still going to be there. Their surrender, which came after concerted attacks from MAGA media personalities points to a bigger story. The anti-woke right is increasingly wielding heavy handed tactics. Hello, preacher,

heal thyself. The left is the king of the heavy handed tactics. They boycott everybody. Okay. So he says the anti-woke right increasingly wielding heavy handed tactics, including state power and violent threats, violent threats to block corporations from making their own decisions about how to adapt to social change. This to me, Hotep, is like the this is the quintessential example of not understanding. That's you, sir. That's you, Greg Sargent, and your side that's been doing that to corporations who don't submit to your agenda for decades now. Yeah, straight out of Saul Alinsky's playbook, Rules for Radicals, blame your enemy for that which you are guilty of. But this plan has been perfected since the Russian Revolution. What we're looking at today is Trotskyism and Marxism,

mostly through intimidation. Now what we're dealing with is online intimidation. They'll call and get you fired from your job and threaten your life. And I don't mean, you know, threaten your life lethally, but basically trying to dis, you know, unperson you. But this is this is just, you know, genuine Marxist tactics. And then, of course, like you said, you know, they're going to blame the right for that. But it's just weird because they're trying to say that they're there for democracy. Right. Which means that the majority is going to rule. So if the majority of people are saying, hey, we're going to reject what's happening in Target, we're going to reject what's happening in Bud Light, then they should capitulate. I just feel like we should just find a spot on Epstein Island and just send all these people there. They don't belong here in our society.

They are a detriment to our society. They are dragging us down. They are slowing down progress in America. They are killing the black community. I mean, every single policy they put out, you know, it seems to be directly targeted at destroying the black community, starting with minimum wage. There's nothing good that can come from a leftist mind. But I get it, it's like you have a heart you have a heart but you ain't got no brain well unfortunately they're they're in charge and their pressure stays on at maximum at 10 on all these corporations and you know that's not going to stop the more target gives one inch the more the left pressures them. And this guy from this conservative investment fund is exactly right. Like they didn't have this march to just stay apolitical. That's all we're asking. Just stay apolitical. And there was never much conservative backlash, at least not in the past six, seven years or since a Birgefeld, the Supreme Court decision

legalizing gay marriage on on the gay pride thing. You know, it's a little over the top. Gay rights were more controversial 15 years ago. But come on, people aren't objecting to the rainbow flagging in Target. It's the trans thing in our kids' faces and the co-opting of women's garments as some place to put your penis. I mean, that's really that's what's getting them in trouble. Well, the thing is, this isn't political. It's cultural. Going back to what Andrew Breitbart said, politics is downstream from culture and they understand this. They're trying to control the culture. This isn't political. It's become political. The country has been split in two, mostly because of the way mainstream media

portrayed Republicans, conservatives and Trump, you know, from 2015 and on and now how they're portraying DeSantis, you know, they've created the great divide of our nation. But it's it's like everything has become political, but it's just that because of um pressure and and and uh peer pressure and you know it's almost like they're holding people hostage because if you talk against this for example if you don't have your pronouns in your bio your friends are saying to you are you racist it's like wait what does pronouns have to do with you know are you racist? It's like, wait, what does pronouns have to do with, you know, are you a Republican? Are you a Trumper? Like I have common sense. This has nothing to do with politics. It has nothing to do who I'm voting for. I don't want to deal in

your mental illness. So it's not political, it's cultural. And they made it political just to simplify things so that they can keep people in line. Hmm. That's exactly what's happening with the NAACP thing on Florida, right? Like that, just to simplify things so that they can keep people in line. That's exactly what's happening with the NAACP thing on Florida, right? Like that black people shouldn't go to Florida because it's racist. And then some people are dragging in his policies, not only on not teaching critical race theory in K through 12 curriculum, but also not talking about trans ideology or sexual orientation in curriculum in schools. They're linking the two together back to what you were saying before. What do you make of that whole, I mean, there's people aren't going to listen to that. They know

that's a political hit job. Yeah. It's, I mean, it's emotional strong arming. They, they say, I saw an article the other day on the route that said black people should be afraid of DeSantis. And I had to just laugh at that. Right. And I think it was on his website, The Root. But The Root has been purchased by Huffington Post some time ago. Now, all you got to do is go on The Root and type in black immigration hurts the black community. So when the route first started out, it was more it was more black conservative. You'll start to see, you know, what black conservatism look like organically in a black community and not this political black conservatism of, you know, the Candace Owens brand, but more like what it looks like without politics, just

conservatism as a culture. Now, the root was talking about how immigration was hurting black people. But then once the white liberal comes in and purchases the root, then the agenda comes in. You have your, you know, your black liberals that come in and they know what their master wants them to do. The master doesn't have to tell him anymore. They know exactly what the master wants. And it's basically the fear monger. And he want to make black people afraid of republicanism. They want to make black people afraid of the political party that black people started.

Because, as Sonny Johnson says, the Democrats claim to be the party of the poor, but you can't be the party of the poor if there is no poor. So they're basically, they want to keep the black community poor. And how do you do that? You keep them irrational, you keep them in fear, and you don't not allow them to think. It just goes back to the old slave master, slave know, slave dynamic where he said, you know, you can't let them think too much. Don't let them read. Don't educate them. The Democrats are the party of slavery, but they've simply just evolved to where now it's just more mental slavery and they don't want their people thinking. They don't want black people thinking they want to keep them in an emotional state, a state of fear, just like the master. Keep them

in a state of fear. They won't leave the plantation. Keep them in a state of fear. They won't leave the Democratic Party. So now you have DeSantis. He's the new boogeyman. We saw them out there protesting DeSantis in Florida. Why again? Why? Oh, because you want to infiltrate children's minds with your Bud Light agenda. I get it. Can't pull that one over on me. But, you know, they villainized DeSantis more than Trump because of the whole attack on critical race theory. And, you know, he's saying he's erasing black history and whatnot. But the thing is about that, like it's not black history they're teaching. They're teaching white history. You know, when they teach black history, it's always about, you know, what the white man did to the black man, what the white man did to the black man.

OK, what about black people and just black history with the omission of white people? They don't teach that. They can't teach that because if they did, black people might stop voting for socialist policies and start to think that they can do for themselves. But, you know, this whole attack on dissent is just shows how desperate they are. And it's just it's just quite frankly, you know what it is. It's kind of tired because it's the same playbook they ran on Trump. It's intellectually dishonest. One of the things they criticize is that he objected to this AP course in high schools on African-American history. And he reinstated the course once they took out Kendi and the 1619 project as part of the curriculum. He didn't want it to be a politics based, you know, leftist course. He would be happy to have actual history, actual black history

and American history taught in it. They just misrepresent. Last question on this. The Trump vote, Trump got, I think it was 8% of the black vote in 2020, which was an improvement by I think two or three points from where he was the time before. We saw better margins in places like Georgia, where Governor Brian Kemp went from, I think it was 5% to 12% of the black vote. So that's a decent headway, but it's still 12%. So how do you see this going over the next 10, 15 years? Do you think those numbers are going to continue to increase? Or do you think the Democratic Party's control, like their hand on the black vote is just so established that there's not going to be any meaningful shift so like i said before not many black people vote less than half actually vote so there are votes

out there that can be won it's not up to you know the the the black vote is so easily won. It's conservatives that are dropping the ball on this. It's the Republican Party that's dropping the ball on this. The messaging from the Republican Party is terrible. I mean, just like F minus, minus. It's like they don't even want to try and get the Black vote. And you can show them how to do it. But the Black vote is like the easiest vote to get right now because the Black vote is sick of the Democratic Party. The Black community, for the most part, is throwing their hands up and like, yo, I don't want to deal with any of these guys, which means there's an opportunity to sell. And quite frankly, Republicans just suck at selling. They suck at their messaging, suck at marketing. They have the wrong voices. They have the wrong Black voices. I love Candace Owens, but she's not reaching the Black community. She's not turning anybody red. She's not turning the Black community

red. And I love Candace. She's a very attractive woman, very smart woman, very intelligent. I think she does an absolutely amazing job, but I'd like to see Sonny Johnson be in charge of the messaging. But most of the part, white conservatives, their takes on all the events that happen that surround Black people, their messaging around Daniel Penny, their messaging around George Floyd, you know, all these things. It just it just frankly just sucks. And if you just make a few minor tweaks to the messaging, you know, you can easily get the black vote. It's right there on a platter waiting for you. Black men are ready to vote for a viable candidate. You saw what happened to Ice Cube. Ice Cube is a prolific figure in the Black community. And he was excoriated by the media when he went and sat with

Trump. Democrats didn't want to talk to him, but he came up with a plan and he wanted to talk to Trump, et cetera, et cetera. For example, I talk about reparations. Now, I'm neither for nor against reparations. In fact, I'm the Black guy that Now, I'm neither for nor against reparations. In fact, I'm the black guy that goes, I want to make a case for white people to get reparations, and I believe we can do it. But when it comes to the reparations conversation, the messaging from the right is terrible. It's like, oh, black people shouldn't do it. I don't want to pay the taxes, et cetera, et cetera. I'm like, bro, all you got to say is Dems must pay. Democrats are the ones in charge of these communities. Democrats, the DNC, Hillary Clinton, her gang should be coming

out of their pocket for failing the black community. And that is the messaging around reparations. All you got to do is tell black people, hey, listen, you want reparations? It's a damn shame what those Democrats did to you. We should probably help you out, put together some paperwork and sell reparations in a way that Democrats are beholden to making these things happen. Biden, I mean, let's run down the list. Biden and his crime bill, Clinton and his crime bill. Hillary Clinton bill um hillary clinton had slaves she exploited the 13th amendment to have like legal um prison labor on her plantation this is well well this is well documented all you got to do is go on google type in hillary clinton slaves uh at her home i showed this on my show the other day yes okay yes i don't know anything about this, but, uh,

really long time. I feel like the, her GOP opponents would have seized on that one hotel, but, but you're on the messaging. You're not wrong. And I don't think Republicans have even given it much thought to be honest.

I think they just, they couldn't get the vote. They couldn't get the vote. So they focused on sort of their core constituencies, but those have been fractured over the past couple of election cycles, too. And anything's anything's possible now. You know, I mean, the Republicans have obviously a black candidate running. The Democrats have a black vice president. Things are being equalized in a way that we haven't seen in the more recent elections on the GOP side. I mean, the diversity in the GOP field right now is pretty astronomical.

It's great. So we'll see whether they get a little smarter and a little better at the reach out. In the meantime, can we ask you to come back? I would love, love, love to have you back on. Oh, absolutely. Anytime you call me, I'll be there. Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.