The Megyn Kelly Show - Glenn Greenwald and Emily Jashinsky - "Megyn Kelly Live" from San Antonio, on No Team Jerseys, Israel, and the Left's Obsession with Race | Ep. 1180

Episode Date: October 27, 2025

Megyn Kelly begins her "Megyn Kelly Live" tour stop in San Antonio with an audience Q&A where she answers questions about Pam Bondi, Lindsey Halligan, retribution in the Trump Era, Israel and Ukraine, men in women's sports, and more. Then Emily Jashinsky, host of "After Party with Emily Jashinsky," joins to talk about the fight on the right, the rise of Zohran Mamdani and Marjorie Taylor Greene, how she knew she was a conservative, the nuances of the Israel issue, the difference between critiquing the government of Israel and the state of Israel or Jews overall, the need to be skeptical of all political propaganda, and more. Then Glenn Greenwald, host of "System Update," to talk about the way journalism should work, the need to speak truth to power no matter the party, his reporting on Edward Snowden's documents kept him from coming to America over threats from the Obama White House, being forced to leave the publication he started "The Intercept" over his Biden reporting, how 2016 and Trump changed everything in newsrooms, and more. Then the two guests talk Karine Jean-Pierre's historically terrible book, the Democrats' obsession with race and credentials, the elitism of Rachel Maddow and more.Subscribe now to Emily's "After Party":Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/after-party-with-emily-jashinsky/id1821493726Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0szVa30NjGYsyIzzBoBCtJYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@AfterPartyEmily?sub_confirmation=1Birch Gold: Text MK to 989898 and get your free info kit on goldByrna: Go to https://Byrna.com  or your local Sportsman's Warehouse today.All Family Pharmacy: In honor of Breast Cancer Awareness Month, save 40% on Mebendazole. Visit https://allfamilypharmacy.com/MEGYN — offer ends October 31st.Chapter: For Free and unbiased Medicare help dial 27-MEDICARE (276-334-2273) or go to https://askchapter.org/kellyDisclaimer: Chapter and its affiliates are not connected with or endorsed by any government entity or the federal Medicare program. Chapter Advisory, LLC represents Medicare Advantage HMO, PPO, and PFFS organizations and standalone prescription drug plans that have a Medicare contract. Enrollment depends on the plan’s contract renewal. While we have a database of every Medicare plan nationwide and can help you to search among all plans, we have contracts with many but not all plans. As a result, we do not offer every plan available in your area. Currently we represent 50 organizations which offer 18,160 products nationwide. We search and recommend all plans, even those we don't directly offer. You can contact a licensed Chapter agent to find out the number of products available in your specific area. Please contact Medicare.gov, 1-800-Medicare, or your local State Health Insurance Program (SHIP) to get information on all your options. Follow The Megyn Kelly Show on all social platforms:YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/MegynKellyTwitter: http://Twitter.com/MegynKellyShowInstagram: http://Instagram.com/MegynKellyShowFacebook: http://Facebook.com/MegynKellyShow Find out more information at:https://www.devilmaycaremedia.com/megynkellyshow Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Welcome to the Megan Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east. Thank you so much for showing up tonight, you guys. Please sit. Wow. What a great crowd, a beautiful, beautiful setting. It's been 30 years since I've been to San Antonio. I came as a young lawyer. Back in the day, we had a retreat here, and we went, we wrangled cattle. That was fun. Doug was like, like, with a lasso? You had, like, I was like, no, but I did a lot of this.

Felt like a real cowgirl. So it's great to be back. And I said to my team, we got to go see the Riverwalk. We did that today. What a beautiful city. So glad it brought us together. You know, I was saying this last night, and it's true that I spent most of my time, like at my house and in my studio, you know, I don't do a lot of red carpet

events and things like that. It's just not my thing. And in my real life, even though I have this very outward-facing job, I'm a little bit more introverted than you would think, listening to the show, watching the highlight reel there. So every once in a while, God will sort of tap you on the shoulder and say, I have something for you, and you feel the inspiration to go out, to go out into this world and do something. And that's really why I did this tour. I got the tap from God telling me it was time to go out, and I didn't know why.

Like, what is it he thinks I need? Let's go and find out. And eventually, like, the signs will become clear, and you'll figure it out. And honestly, like, this happens throughout your life. Like, we went down to the Bahamas on vacation with our kids not long ago, and I'm in a swimming pool at the hotel, and a nice woman's talking. me. We're chit-chatting, and I've got my young guy Thatcher. He's 12 with me. And we're making

small talk with this woman. And in the middle of it, she's kind of looking at me. And, you know, we're in the pool. I'm on my bathing suit. Whatever. I don't look like this. And she goes, has anyone ever told you that you look exactly like Megan Kelly, except much better looking? And my son, Thatcher, goes, that's literally impossible. So you never know how to take those messages, right? Like, is that a compliment or is that not a compliment? Unclear. But you parents out there know that your kids keep you humble, right?

And sometimes God will deliver that to you too. When Fatcher wasn't even born yet, but when I was pregnant with him, and my older two were watching me grow and watching what was happening. And you could see the stomach expanding. and our eldest, who's now 16, he kind of put his hand in my stomach at one point, and he goes, wow. And I said, it's getting bigger, right? And he goes, yeah, and your bottom's getting bigger, too.

Okay, I don't feel like I needed that one, actually, to be perfectly honest. Anyway, I'm very grateful to you for showing up, just as I showed up as well. I think maybe you got the tap on the shoulder, too. Because right now, Right now, showing up is not actually all that easy for conservatives. Not that everybody here is conservative. I know we have mixed ideologies, but people who lean right now and are on team sanity right now

are literally under attack. And it's gone from us getting attacked in our K-12 education and in our colleges and at our workplace and online, if we say anything that's right-leaning, to like literally getting attacked, you know, whether it's as an ICE agent out there trying to do your job or it's somebody who shows up at the wrong no-kings protest or it's somebody who goes onto a college campus

and just tries to say what he thinks about the world. So I appreciate the fact that you guys got up off your couches, you bought tickets for this thing, you waited in line, you went through the mags, and you came and showed up for this event. I really think it speaks to your courage. And courage has been in short supply these days, not on the right wing, but we need to find our voices more than ever, right? I think right now the solution, the only possible solution to what we're seeing in the wake of Charlie and just the ramping up of political rhetoric and violent rhetoric from the left, hi Jay Jones looking at you, is that all of us who are on team sanity need to say all the things as much as humanly possible so that they can't shout us down. They can't stop us. You know, I mean, we talked at length about whether we should still do the tour.

We announced it on a Monday, and then Charlie was killed that Wednesday. And we had serious talks about, should we do this, right? Should we keep going? And my husband, Doug, felt very strongly one way. He's on board now. But I said, honey, I've got to do it. And then we had to talk about whether you guys would come. Like, will people feel comfortable?

Will they feel unsafe? And can I tell you, after we came out and said, we are doing this. We're going to keep rolling. The ticket sales, whosh. I was amazed. Truly, like, the courage, the bravery, like, the strength that takes for you guys. Like, I'm a public figure, so I'm used to putting myself in front of it. But, like, that was an extraordinary thing. And you guys actually do need that strength and that courage, because let me tell you something. News consumers are the answer to our problems. It really, like, most people do not take in news the way you do if you're here.

Like they got stuff going on, they don't want to get involved, they find it depressing, whatever. It takes a certain mental constitution to be able to have a hefty news diet and to stay on top of what's happening in this country. You have to have a pretty steel stomach and spine. And it takes effort. It takes effort to figure out what's real, what's true, and all of that. And so I feel like your neighbors, your communities are going to rely on you. You actually have to be the ones who go out there and say, there's a local school board vote. You got to go. Come on. I know you don't want to do it, but you have to. We have to save our children. Like, there's a local race. There's a, whatever, the statehouse race. All these things

actually really matter. If you don't pay attention, you wind up with Jasmine Crockett. Poor Texas. It's very sad. It's very sad. So you guys got to be the ones to lead the way because you are super informed. And it's not that your neighbors who aren't following news are uninformed, but they don't know it the way you know it. And they don't understand the media bias the way you do. Anybody who watches our show or listens to our show understands media bias. Most conservatives do. We've hated the media for a very long time. It's something we wear like a badge of honor. Yes, it's true our credit. You see those polls are only like 27% of the people out there still trust the media. Not one is conservative.

It's all leftists who are like, what? The media tells it CNN. It's news. In any event, so you have the same responsibility that I have. I've got to deliver it, and you've got to deliver it, too. You've got to reach out to the neighbors and make sure that they take all this great information you've gotten and do something useful with it. Buy gold and get free silver. That's right, for every $5,000 purchased from Birch Gold Group this month in advance of Veterans Day, they will send you a free patriotic silver round that commemorates the Gadsden and American flags. Look, gold is up over 40% since the beginning of this year, and Birch Gold can help you own it by converting an existing IRA or

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Again, text MK to the number 9-8-9-8-98. Message and data rates may apply. We are going on the road. Megan Kelly Live, 10 stops across the country. Join me for no BS, no agenda, and no fear live. I'll be joined by Tucker Carlson, Ben Shapiro, Glenn Beck, Adam Rola, Charlie Sheen, Here's Morgan, Donald Trump,

Eric Trump, and Erica Kirk. And I cannot. wait to see all of you. Please go and please if you can sign up for the VIP meet and greet so that you can meet me in person and the guest as well. I would just love to hear from you guys on what's on your mind, what you like about the show, what you would like to change, and just for us to connect in what's been a difficult time to send a message that we will not be silenced. It's Megan Kelly Live, presented by YREFI and SiriusXM. Go to Megan Kelly.com to get your tickets now. Okay. With that, we're going to take a couple of Q&A from you guys. We're going to switch the order of things up. And I'll be on the receiving end of the questions for a little bit before we get started. And you are going to be so thrilled with tonight's. You know who they are, right? You know who's coming. Emily Jisinski and Glenn Greenwald.

Two smarter, more dynamic people you could not ask for. I'm thrilled to bring that to you. So let's just, let's cue it up and we'll just get as many questions as we can in a few minutes. Hi. Thank you so much. My question is actually about the DOJ and Pam Bondi, our current Attorney General. Do you think that she's doing a good job? And also, what do you think the DOJ should be focusing on that they aren't right now? Thank you for that. I was very harsh on Pam Bondi after the Epstein situation, and I do not think that was handled well. Okay. So, and I stand by that. It wasn't handled well. Why it wasn't handled well, we still don't know. It certainly seemed to be President Trump's wish that Pam Bondi handled it. the way it was handled. So query how much of it you can put on her, but that didn't need, she didn't need to go on Fox News and do all those titillating wait until you see the files and then come out with, oh, there's nothing. So that was bad. But I have to say she's been doing a very good job since then. I mean, she's taken on some really bold things. She's very loyal to the president, but she's pretty fearless. You know, I mean, she's been going after

like these people who are attacking our ICE agents and Homeland Security. She's got her hands full with some of these cases against, it's not her, but it's DOJ, against, say, for example, John Bolton and Letitia James. All of that is, it takes guts. So I think Pam Bondi actually, I'm more open-minded to her than I was over the summer when the Epstein thing was botched. And I think we should give her some grace, because the more the left hates somebody, the more it's a tell that we should like them, and they really hate her. so hi megan what i'm so proud of our current administration but what do we all need to do to make sure that they follow through with the prosecution of these crooks that they've currently indicted and it

just doesn't fade away it happens we want to see them in jail thank you yes i think they will see it through i think president trump is determined this poor lindsay halligan is getting just completely smeared by the media, the new U.S. attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia. I think she's great. She's very courageous. She's got monster balls.

And you need that. If you're going to work for Trump, you're going to start indicting his enemies. And look, let's see it people are like, I think it's retribution. I think it might be retribution. Of course it's retribution. That's obvious.

But unlike what they did to Trump, there actually are grounds to do it. No one promised them a free pass for life. They're the ones who change the rules. They're the ones who said you can go after your political enemies. We can both play that game. You better be squeaky clean if you're going to make those the new rules, and they're not. So I'm fine with what they're doing, and I love this, Lindsay Halegan.

Go ahead. Hey, Megan. Hi. So as you know, there's a big split on the right right now between the pro-Israel crowd, the anti-Israel crowd and all that. I'm not asking you to pick a side in that discussion, but it goes to the point about just four and eight in general and who we, build allieships with and stuff like that.

We've given, oh, Joe Biden gave $200 billion to Ukraine since the start of the war. And overall, we just send money left, right and center all throughout the world. And how do we build allieships without, like, being taken advantage of? Like, America's not the world's mommy. And we're having an issue with Canada right now. I got it. I think it's a great question, first of all. And I think you're putting your finger on the pulse of what a lot of Republicans

are feeling, right? Like, what about us? Like, how much, we don't have a bottomless pocket for Ukraine. There are a lot of American cities that are hurting right now. And I think, you know, President Trump is feeling that. I think the Republican Party getting loud on it has helped. I know J.D. Vance is hearing us. The big guy has got his own strong feelings on foreign policy, and he's coming to those in good faith. And I think, you know, Trump, he had to learn firsthand on how to deal with Putin, right? He wanted to be friendly with him. He thought he could get it settled quickly. He's realizing that Putin is not an honest actor. Now I think Trump's probably going to ramp up a little support for Ukraine and we're not going

to like it. But I think it's a method to bring it to a close. I don't think Trump has any desire to have a forever war there that we're supporting. And I think on the Israel front, look, they took the lead on virtually everything. The thing about Israel that I think is dividing the Republican Party is that we're so supportive of them. We're getting a little close to the sun, like on the Iran bombing and so on. So like some factional. the Republican Party that's just had it with the wars, you know, obviously we came to that decision honestly over the past 20 years. They're feeling like our friend is getting us a little too close to the fire, but thank God that seems to be coming to a close now. So yeah, and just

wanted to follow up on that real quick. I don't know if you followed the thing with Canada the past couple days, but they were taking out like $75 million worth of ads kind of like propagating, like anti-tariff messaging and stuff like that. And then it kind of ties in with like APAC as well, two sides of the same coin where, like, overall, how does America avoid, like, it's the focal point of the world, how does it avoid being the merry-go-round where people are, like, playing manipulative games with the world. Well, we don't. We're the world's superpower, so they're going to do that to us.

They're going to try to manipulate us, but we have a strong leader, so we don't have to worry about it, right? I mean, like, good luck trying to play hardball with Donald Trump. It doesn't tend to go well. Thank you. Hello, Megan. Hi. Thank you for being who you are.

You're amazing. Thank you for being this woman. After 50, like we are. And outspoken and amazing and beautiful. You are an example. Part of the we do not care club, right? Princess Melanie? Yes.

We simply do not care. Go ahead. So I'm a legal immigrant. Very proud. Right not. Legal immigrants. My husband and I decided to move to the U.S. after I'm 50, so it's a huge shift.

But we praised the United States. We moved here because we thought for our kids it would be the best path. So we gave up an amazing life in Brazil. I have to talk to Glenn about it. Oh, yeah, you do. So anyway, we gave up that life to come here and start a new life and a new chapter.

So my question is, since everything that is happening and we are very much siding with the government and everything that is happening to the illegal immigrants because we understand first of all the origin of these people what's your question I'm sorry about that

no problem I'm seeing the line behind you I just want to make sure we get as many people up as we can I'm just worried about our positioning as immigrants here how Americans are going to look at us because somehow there might be prejudice. Oh, I don't think you have to worry about that at all. I think Americans are the most tolerant, accepting, loving people in the world. Even with the illegals, Americans aren't being cruel to them or treating them as, you know, bad people.

But it's like if you're an illegal who's here and you've committed an additional crime, you're out. And there's zero empathy. And if you're an illegal who's here and you haven't committed an additional crime, you're probably also out as like a policy matter, but whether Trump can actually effectuate that in the next four years, that's more up to question. But I haven't seen like a hint of American citizens treating immigrants badly.

That is just not a U.S. thing. Hi. Hi, how are you? Great. Thank you. Where should young conservatives stand on modern day Israel with, you know, certain sources like Tucker Carlson saying that,

there could potentially be, you know, bad things going on there and other conservatives saying that we have the biblical duty to protect them. This is a good question. So I'm going to disappoint you because I don't have the answer to it, but I'll tell you my own approach. I'm very pro-Israel and I'm a Zionist. I do believe they have the right to exist. And I think they're an extraordinary democracy in the middle of a very rough neighborhood, which has got very different values than we do. The neighbors around Israel, whereas they share a lot of our values. But in the beginning of this conflict, we were told repeatedly, you can criticize the Israeli government. Just don't be anti-Semitic. Don't support,

you know, harassing college students here in America because they're Jewish. Don't harass kids trying to go across the quad because they have, you know, the Yama Khan. Yes, I agree with all that. But then when this thing went on for two years and some of us started to say like, you know, going on a long time, taking out Hezbollah, you've devastated Hamas, you've taken out the Houthis, you've taken out the Iranian nuclear program, kind of seems like it's time now, it's time. You're an anti-Semite. What? And I think Americans really resented that. And I think there's too many people who are like sort of pro-Israel as like a lobbyist or a spokesperson or very active on X that don't reflect well on regular American pro-Israelites or Jews, what have

you. And you always have to remind yourself that sometimes the loudest advocates are really not the best representatives of the actual cause. I think Israel and we are very close friends for very good reasons. They actually don't ask that much of us. They take the lead on most of these conflicts and we're there in a more of a supportive role, like just in case they need us, as we saw with Iran. And I think they're a super important ally of ours. And I hope people, even if you're feeling angry with where things are with Israel now, don't completely abandon the cause. Hi, Megan. Hi. I respect you tremendously and I listen to you for cogent and thoughtful arguments. What I'm confused about is why you've begun to resort to

personal attacks like calling people fat and ugly. Why resort to add hominence on the person? Yeah, why resort to add hominem attacks when you're so pretty? It's like a mean girl. Why are you resorting to that when you have cogent arguments? Because I want them to come over to the other side. And the number one thing they need to do to get out of their ugliness is drop their Trump derangement syndrome. their lives will be better and they'll be happier. Sorry, but it's true. I don't think it's any accident that the number of people we see out at the No King's protest are homely people.

I don't. I don't think it's any accident. I look out here and I see all beautiful people. I happen to believe that conservatism makes you gorgeous. I don't know what it is. It's like a fountain of youth. It just makes you. I mean, you get asked out more.

You start having more action. You get better job opportunities. People are selling conservatism all wrong. Hi. Okay. Hi, Mrs. Kelly. I get it. My question is, what advice would you give to my generation

about finding your voice and standing firm in what we believe while growing up in such a divided and hostile world? Yes. Practice. Practice at every opportunity. never say no to an opportunity to get up in front of people and say how you really feel never hide your true viewpoint

because you think the professor's not going to like it or a potential employer's not going to like it you don't have to go into a job interview and start talking about how you feel an abortion but if this issue comes up at the water cooler or you're asked by a professor to write a certain thing that you don't agree with or you're in class and everyone feels a certain way

stand up for what you believe in big courageous decisions don't have they don't happen in a vacuum You make tiny little courageous decisions that make sure when you get to the big moment where you have to make a big one, you've exercised that muscle. But you will not make the big courageous decision if you didn't exercise it. So you have to start in the little moments of your life. Those are all the building blocks to who you're going to be.

And when it comes to articulating your ideals, do it as often as humanly possible. Do it looking into your iPhone if you have to, if you don't have an audience. But do it, do it daily if you can. Talk about it with your friends. Talk about it with your teachers. talk about it with everybody you can where it's an appropriate setting, and don't back down from what you feel, not even one iota, not even if you're wrong. It's great to be wrong.

You'll be proven wrong, and then tomorrow you'll be less wrong than you were the day before. So don't be afraid of that, right? Take risks, put yourself out there, and just keep practicing. Keep practicing. Hi. Hi, Megan. My name is Jacob. This one's going to be a little rough.

Okay. I have two Naval Academy grad children. I have one Air Force Academy grad children. Awesome. Thank you for your family service. My youngest, she starts pilot school at the end of next month. So we've been very blessed. Now, on September the 8th, Donald Trump on his truth social,

he posted a video about how. how dangerous flu shots are and tetanosh shots are. And the ingredient is called thermicerole. It's got lead in it, mercury. Yeah, thimerosol. Yes. And RFK Jr., he's also aware of it. And having my children, along with the other 2.1 million people

that are serving in our military right now, how is it that they do not have informed consent for vaccinations regarding the flu shot I wrote my congressman Tony Gonzalez here in Texas okay completely ignored I know you're close with Peter Hegsef I have the letter in my hand that I gave Tony Gonzalez would you please give this to Peter Hexsseff Please. Give it to that good man holding the microphone. I will make sure he gets it. We love you. Thank you. I'm going to give you three copies. Okay, good. Right on, because I'm with you on the informed consent. If we've learned nothing from the COVID vaccine, we've learned we need that. Thank you. Right on. And good luck to your daughter. Yeah, go ahead. We've got time for like maybe two more. Okay. Hi, Megan. I'm so excited to have you here. I listen to you every morning at 5 a.m. on my way to the gym.

Thank you very much. I really appreciate your perspective, your no-b-s perspective that you provide. So I'm curious, what's your strategy for maintaining credibility in an era of media mistrust? And how does being named one of times 100 most influential people shape your, sense of responsibility in that effort. Oh. Well, I guess I'll take them in reverse order. Not at all. And my approach to, you know, the news and facts and my credibility are, it's, they're everything.

Like, I think if there's one thing I'm known for, it's being hyperfactual. Like, I do believe people understand facts are first with me, and then we can talk about my opinions and your opinions and other people's opinions, but I considered a cardinal sin to get the facts wrong on my newscast. Either my actual show or my morning show now, the AM update, it's a true cardinal sin to get the facts wrong because I respect you too much. And I also think that I was talking about you guys being news consumers and how that does require some sharp elbows. It's not just, you're not just any news consumers, but if I may, you've tuned into this show, which means you don't just want the sweet nothing's whispered in your ears. You would go someplace else if that's what you wanted.

You must be in the market for true, hard facts. and some opinion, too. And that's, so that's what I feel I owe you. And how do I do it? With a lot of help. It takes a lot of effort in today's day and age to cut through all the BS and all the spin and figure out what is real.

Every single story is so hard to figure out what is real. And I know you must feel that as news consumers. I feel it as a news producer and reporter. But it's doable. It's doable. And so, you know, I think in today's day and age you need to find a provider, a news provider, or two or three,

and put your trust in them to go through. You have a busy life. You guys have things that you need to do. You don't need to do news 24-7. We're doing that for you. But make sure you choose well, because if you don't choose well, you walk around thinking, Russia, Russia, Russia is real. The steel dossier is absolutely horrible

and that no one's ever renovated the White House before. Right? Be careful. Thank you. Yeah, we'll do one more. Sorry to the people standing in the line. Yeah. Love you.

Hi, Megan. My name's Millie. And recently, I received an injury from a male competing in my sport. It was a coach at my high school, and I received a minor concussion. I got hit in the head. And I was wondering how I can help keep my voice strong about wanting to protect my rights as a young female athlete. Oh, I'm so sorry that happened to you. That's horrifying.

Thank you for standing up and asking the question. first of all, you have the advantage. It is a big advantage of living in Texas. God bless, Texas. Look at all these people. They'll all have your back. Like, if this is your community, you're already ahead of the game because they're going to have your back. These guys are not going to tolerate that bullshit. But you, you have an opportunity to sit in the front row of your life. And in terms you might understand down here, take the bull by the horns. And you handle it. You know, I mean, I'll give you this example. So we have three kids, as I mentioned, and of course, I could go in and I could fight every battle for them.

Doug, my husband could go in and fight all the battles for them, but it's much more useful if we tell them good luck with it, you know. And we don't even give them advice, just like, what do you think? How are you going to do it? Then if they ask us, what would you think about this? Well, we'll give them the advice. But they have to fight the battle because we're not going to be with them forever. Soon they're going to leave the house. They're going to go to college.

They need the skills. It's fine to have me as their mom, but I'm not going to go with them to college. I've tried, but they've told me they don't want me. So you should take this opportunity, which is a big challenge, to start developing yourself. It's a gift that you've been given. So how will you handle it? Will you go to your principal and say, here is why I object to this? Will you go to the coach and say, here is why I am not going to play when you are out there anymore?

and see it as an opportunity for growth for you, right? Because they don't come along that often. And truly, the difference between somebody who is sort of ordinary and someone who is extraordinary is they've had the gift of something really tough coming their way and they've handled it. You don't have to handle it perfectly. You don't have to be the picture of grace.

You might fall. You might misstep. All that's fine. That's all great ingredients into the cake. But you must handle it. You, no one else. And you'll have to figure out how. And if it's the wrong way, that's great.

The next time something comes your way, you're going to handle it better. And if it's the right way, then great. You've solved this problem, but there's literally no downside. Even if you get blowback, even if somebody calls your names, that's all great stuff. You're going to use all of it. Anything bad that happens to you is actually a positive as long as you use it. So something bad has happened to you, and now you have a huge opportunity to grow. I mean, you can hit womanhood, basically, in about a week.

If you handle this in a strong way, it doesn't have to be the right way. just a strong way, and to where you think about yourself in 30 years and you say, will I be proud of what I did? That should be your guidepost. Good luck. And if they don't do the right thing, call me, and I'll publicly humiliate them. All right, let's get this party started. Thank you all for your questions. All right, so the way we're going to do this is we're going to bring out Emily in a minute, and we're going to talk to Emily. And then we're going to bring out Glenn after that. I'm going to talk to Glenn. And then we're going to have them both sit together for a little while and have a little coffee talk, the three of us. So I want to tell you

about Emily Jashinsky. So Emily is, like, to me, about 17 years old. She's so young. She's extraordinarily talented. Right? She's great. So I first found Emily myself. She had been working for the Washington Examiner, and she had been with YAF, a conservative group for young people. But I first discovered her when she was working at the Federalist. You know, Molly Hemingway, She was working at the Federalist, and she was their culture editor, and she had such different and unique takes on everything, and I love culture commentators. I do a little bit of it myself, but I'm much more into listening to other great people do it, like Maureen Callahan. And Emily is one of those people, but she's so young. It's like, she has so many great insights where somebody's so, anyway, but she's always got a different way into the story.

She is never predictable, which is one of the reasons why I absolutely adore her. And so we've thankfully been able to fold her more and more into the Megan Kelly show and to our MK Media Network. Now she hosts AfterParty with Emily Jashinsky, which is killing it, by the way. She's crushing it. You could download that pod. Yeah. And she's in full flourish. And I can only sort of imagine of where Emily Jishinsky is going to be in 20 years.

I think she's going to be the queen of all media. So you will see her tonight while she's just the princess, but well on her. away. Take a look at this sizzle reel and then we'll bring her out. This is Real Housewives level of drama. Fannie Willis, I was like on tape talking about how she was going to crack down on corruption and nobody would be sleeping with other people in the day. He's off of those. Andrew Cuomo shouldn't be able to show his face in polite society without apologizing, groveling, and saying what you did wrong. I like it all. He's not trying to pretend the guy.

actually really loved McDonald's. Any other politician would be fearfully sticking to their script. The rapid response choir. I don't want to sound racist, but I sometimes really hate white people, Mike. It's so ineffective. And it's why they ended up losing the culture, which was unthinkable for the right 10 years ago. Yeah, Emily Jasinski. Let's give it up for Emily. Yeah. Hey, girl. I like that you brought me out on the stage. Me being racist against white people.

Here I am. Setting the stage. I'm sure our friends in Texas will understand. In fact, we should start as an acknowledgement to Karene-Jean-Pierre by stating that we are white and we are women. Yeah. Heterosexual. Don't forget that.

Yeah, totally straight, and cis. Yes. Yeah. That's the one I always forget. Yeah, the cis. It's easy to forget. Yeah, I hope we forget it forever. Yeah.

Around the cusp. So I actually didn't know, I'm preparing for this, I did not know that you were a Midwestern girl, which explains so much about you, right? People from Texas make sense, and people from the Midwest make sense. People from the northeast where I am from do not make sense. You guys are bad.

Yeah, it's a miracle. I grew up in upstate New York, which is not the same as New York. Upstate, we're sensible people. So tell me about your family. Was it very conservative? I mean, not super political even. My parents are both great, and they're both from Wisconsin, so just grew up. Oh, amazing. I just grew up about an hour west of Milwaukee. So my mom worked in Milwaukee. My mom is super, like the most amazing person you could imagine. Her career. I mean, this woman worked like 70-hour weeks, traveling to China and Germany. And my dad's a civil engineer. He worked for the state in the same job. basically for 40 years, and they're retired now. I have a younger brother.

He lives in D.C., so it's amazing. Did you always think you were going to get in the news? Megan, actually, no, I loved, when I graduated high school, I wanted to be a stand-up comedian. It's so embarrassing. But when I loved TV. And so this is where, for me, it's especially special to even know you because I don't know if I've told you this story before.

I feel like I have said it once before, but I'm obsessed with TV. TV and media, especially news. So I watched a ton of news growing up because there's something just sort of very romantic about it to me. I don't know why, but it just is. And I had a summer job one year. She's talking about Chuck Todd. Yeah, it's sleepy eyes.

That's my favorite Trump nickname of all time. Sleepy eyes. Sleepy eyes, because it's so specific. And it's something you didn't know was accurate until he said it. Like so many of Trump's nicknames. Yeah, you're like, oh. But I would watch your show during my lunch break and I just have these memories of sitting on the floor

and watching and just, I loved you specifically. So it's very, very special. I feel like we were meant to be together. Apparently. I too. Like, I actually did not think I was going to go into news. I thought I was going to practice law for the rest of my life. But, you know, in 10th grade, I took an aptitude test,

one of those things that tells you, like, what you should do. And you know what it said? I should become a political journalist. You're kidding. Yeah. You believe that? At age 14 or 15, it said you should be a political journalist. journalist. I wound up, you know, becoming a lawyer. And then when I was thinking about, well,

what else could I do? This seemed like an obvious choice, but I had forgotten all about that. Did you remember it when you decided to go into news? Yes. And I did do like a two-day internship for the Albany Times Union when I was, I'm from Albany, New York. And it was very cool. I followed around this reporter and I listened to him and make his calls. And it was like, yeah, seemed like very hard-nosed, you know, shoe leather reporter. And it was great. Because by the time I finally got my job at Fox, which was not my first job in news, and my second job, but I was roomed with, um, roomed, office mates with Major Garrett. You guys know Major Garrett, right? Remember him? It's with CBS now, but he truly

was a shoe leather reporter who was like, he loves when I tell the story, but when I first walked into our office, I knocked over a huge pile of Maxim magazines. Then I kind of bumped into a file cabinet in his desk and there was a big bottle of bourbon in there. I'm like, I'm home. That's a newsroom. Yeah. Yep. So I love it too. It is. There's something romantic about it. But you, you're, you know, I know that this word gets overused, but you are heterodox. So you came from a family that might lean right a bit, like a little. Well, no, so this is actually really interesting, at least from my perspective, it's interesting.

I don't need to bore everyone with the details, but my dad is a union guy because he worked for the state of Wisconsin. And my mom is in, I'm sorry, Mom, I'm exposing you here, but she is in human resources. So she's a very, I know I said she was a great person earlier, but she's obviously a very bad person. So, you know, they had their own. My dad was raised Catholic. My mom is sort of evangelical. And so I got that clash. You know, they didn't talk about politics all the time.

But when they did, you know, when I was a senior in high school, it was Scott Walker's Act 10 protests. My teachers were, like, leaving the classroom and calling out sick. Yeah, I remember that. But my parents were sort of on different sides of that one. Well, YAAF is that Scott Walker's organization for young people, young Americans, Foundation. So that's why I just assumed you were conservative. I mean, you don't track conservative now. You track like, I never know where you're going to land on an issue, which I like. Interesting. So I still, I mean, for me, the most important thing is just being a Christian.

And I feel like everything else follows from that. And so it's, you know, I identify. Like, people always ask, what kind of conservative are you, libertarian, moderate, whatever? I just feel like I'm normal conservative. But the Trump era has been, it's tested, I think, my politics in all kinds of different ways. Yes, all of us. Yeah. But you will surprise, like, that's kind of the theme of our evening, because you and Glenn, like, there's so much on which we overlap, but then there's a whole other, you know, realm where we don't overlap. And, but I like that about you.

I mean, I love that. And people, like, people who are really, really pro-Israel will say, like, why do you have Glenn on? I'm like, because I fucking love him. Yeah, man. Why wouldn't I have Glenn on? Yeah. You know, like, we've gotten to this place where now, even within the conservative circles, people are like, no, you can't platform that person because they have views that I object to or they've said. things I object to. It's like, no, I don't, I don't care about views some people may find

objectionable. Now, if you've lost your ever-loving mind, I'm probably not going to have you on the show because I want my audience not to be misled. But different views from my own, of course. So how are you looking at what's happening right now on the right? Yeah, I mean, so I had this experience when I was probably 26 or something of starting to host a show with someone who's a Democratic socialist, basically, Ryan Grimm. And Ryan is a wonderful human being. and I learned from that the labels because people would apply labels to Ryan, even things that I would have thought of Ryan

before I knew him. And they just all dissolve when you're forced to be in close proximity with someone having challenging conversations and you see how they are as a dad and a husband, and you realize it's so easy to jump to labels because politics is so personal. And I mean, the Israel stuff obviously looms over

so much of what we talk about on the right now, which I find it to get, very boring, to be honest, but it's just the labels that I was told to apply to people who thought one way, I just saw up close and personal that they weren't right. And for me, I think it's just amazing that I'm forced to challenge myself all the time to talk to the guests that Ryan wants to bring on, or Crystal Ball wants to bring on. And I love Crystal Ball. She's a leftist. She's kind of a democratic socialist a little bit, but she's totally brilliant and very cool and a beautiful person inside now. But it is, it does require you to spend time with people who are of that ilk

to realize, right, okay, we disagree ardently, but I have love for this person. Right. And we need that now more than ever. I know. Right? I know. And that's like, it just people, this is, I think we're seeing this happen a lot right now is that someone gets categorized as, as bad, because you believe their politics will lead to something bad, which is totally fair. It doesn't make the person bad. for coming to a different side on that question. They had a different background experience. And I think they're so wrong.

And I think their wrongness, like Zeramamam Dani, I think his wrongness is going to lead to a lot of misery in New York City. I don't think my friends who feel like the status quo in New York City has emiserated them are wrong to be like, hey, maybe I want to give this guy a chance. I don't think it makes them a bad person. I think it makes them wrong, but not wrong as people, not wrong morally. They'll be living under Sharia law soon. I got to say that the Zora Mamdami does scare me. He scares me. It's not even the socialism, which does scare me too. But the fact that he went down and embraced that imam. Did you see the story? He loves this imam in Manhattan. This guy literally testified for the defense when the blind shake was tried for bombing the World Trade Center the first time. He testified for the defense. Wasn't he a character witness?

Yes. For the blind shake. And he said a lot of terror-loving things, this imam, who Zora Mamdami is embracing and called a pillar of our community. Like last week, it's not like all three years ago, some random rope line where he had a picture. That guy scares me. He's very focused on Palestine. He's very focused on Muslim. What mosque did you visit? Did you see that in the New York debate?

That was his test for Andrew Quill. What mosque did you? No, no mosque. That's why Andrew Quill was so weak. He should have said, I didn't visit any mosque. This is a Judeo-Christian country. This is a Judeo-Christian city. Muslims make up 9%

and I didn't visit their mosque. And I don't need to visit their mosque. Maybe the worst candidate in the history of bad candidates is Andrew Cuomo. Post-COVID. They've been like, yeah, let's do it. Let's do it.

Let's put our money behind that guy. I'm interesting, like, can you shout out if you care about the New York mayoral race? You do, okay. So I never know whether people, you know, obviously we live in the area. My family and I live in the area,

so we care. But I think I'd care even if I lived in San Francisco because New York is our crown jewel. I mean, it's an amazing, amazing American city. And I think it's the greatest city in the world, bar none. And we're about to hand it over to a lunatic who doesn't know what he's doing. That's our only saving grace is that he doesn't know what he's doing. So maybe he'll just be so incompetent. But I am also interested in how we got here. Like how did New Yorkers, who are not fools, get so desperate that they would consider this guy? That is such an interesting question. And even just for asking it, you know,

if you don't ask it the right way or whatever, people pile on. And it makes it so hard to get, first of all, it makes it hard for both parties to cede good candidates because they don't want anybody who, like, Marjorie Taylor Green is a really good example of someone who I think, you know, growing up in Wisconsin, Marjorie Taylor Green, I know she's from Georgia, but like that is a person that you know, and the political system is trying to make it impossible for her to exist as a normal non-political robot. She is, like, the top small dollar fundraising Republican in Congress. And they are trying to make it impossible because she just colors outside the lines.

And coloring outside the lines sometimes means having uncomfortable conversations. Like, what on earth happen that Democrats in New York looked at Andrew Cuomo and said, this guy, he's been around a long time, we are going with the 33-year-old Democratic socialist. That's a huge problem. And now if he wins the race, which he probably will. Again, the level of desperation that has to be behind people going with that, unbelievable. I know.

The economic problems are not getting addressed on the right or the left. People are still suffering. This is actually a big threat to Trump come the midterms, right? Because he's still not scoring well in the polls on people's economic issues. And while he's doing everything he can, I mean, Trump would say his tariff plan is actually to help on the economic issues. he gets so much guff over it. But so far, I feel like it's actually going pretty well. I'm a tariff person, so.

But that's another thing on which people were not open-minded. They were knee-jerk criticism of Trump. And so far, he's brought in quite a bit of revenue on it. And it's helped us, like, get Mexico to crack down on its fentanyl labs. It's helped us with Canada. I don't know. I'm very open-minded on the terrace, but it's another thing you're not allowed to touch. No, you can't talk about it.

No, and before Trump came along, nobody would ever suggest, like, a, tariff anywhere near what some of his tariffs have been. Oh, no Republican. No, no Republican. Yeah, exactly. It was like Bernie, basically. But what he's doing, I don't know how the tariff war is going to end. But I do know that he has scared the hell out of all of these countries who were getting a much better deal than we were and now realize supply chains are going to shift. They have to adjust because the U.S. isn't going back.

I mean, Biden kept a significant part of Trump 1.0 tariffs because that is where the country has, I mean, it's clearly where the country has to go. So I don't know what happens with the tariffs at the end of the day, but the idea that we couldn't talk about this? Yeah. Insane. What do you think of the question one of the audience members asked about where we should stand on Israel? Come on, Megan. It's fine.

I know you've got different views on this, but that's fine. I think people want to hear that. They want to hear the different views. Well, no, no. I think it's, I mean, so I have one particular story that started to change the way that I thought about is. rule as someone who grew up. Again, I grew up like Missouri Synod Lutherans, maybe L-CMS, but very like low church evangelical culture. And so left behind books, the rapture, all of that fun stuff. And never

questioned it that much, never questioned that sort of dispensationalist reading of scripture. And the story of a Christian-American journalist named Shereen Abu Akla, who was killed in, I think it was the West Bank. And she was, this was like 2021. That story really piqued my interest. You know, I used to have a rule with Ryan that for, I shouldn't say this, but I'm going to, for every one story we covered about Israel, I would make him cover a story about trans athletes. Did we win him over on that issue? I don't know, actually. That's a good question. We don't talk about that much because after October 7th, we did so much Israel coverage. And when she was killed, I started asking some

people I really trusted on the right, because I had to cover the story. What's going on here? Like, this seems weird. It looks like she was targeted. What's happening? And what I heard made a lot of sense to me, which is the IDF has no reason to do this. Why would the IDF do this? And I saw the Biden administration basically taking the Israeli government's propaganda and and I really didn't like being lied to about a American, about a Christian, and about a journalist's death. And eventually, the IDF came out and said, you know, this was our mistake, but it took weeks and they pretty clearly knew it right away. I mean, it's almost impossible to imagine they didn't know it right away. You could actually see the bullet pattern behind the tree that she was shot in front of.

and after that it just sort of the paradigm shifted for me as to how I evaluated these stories and I still think it's you know this better than anyone right now you just said you're pro Israel I too am pro Israel and even saying that isn't enough sometimes so I think people underestimate the degree to which just that in and of itself has created skepticism because people really don't like our government regurgitating foreign propaganda and then being told you can't question it. Yeah. No, I mean, look at how much we rip on our own government. We rip on our own government all the time.

We'd rip on it, whether Trump's in there, we certainly ripped on it a lot when Biden was in there. You can rip on our government, and we do all the time. Israel's certainly fair game. Oh, yeah. They're not even our government. Why can't we rip on Israel? We absolutely can rip on Israel. Ripping on Israel is a fine thing to do.

It doesn't mean, in my view, you don't go so far as to say, I'm an anti-Zionist and they can't exist. like that's a that's crazy town um but i really strongly reject the attempts to stifle the criticism against them because they they spent a long time trying to tell us you can criticize israel at the beginning of this war just don't be anti-semitic okay got it and then as soon as many of us started to get more critical of israel it was you're an anti-semi well no we're not going to play that game oh my gosh and and the the Israeli media is more critical of israel than sometimes the american media is like it's incredible like following the Israeli media after october 7th has been like

very eye-opening as well, because their conversations are actually much more, like, big picture and broad and include a more diverse array of voices. Yes. Well, I mean, look, it's not like our media has figured out the perfect formula either. No, that's for sure. And speaking of that, I want to ask you about what's happening at the White House and the Renaud. Ooh.

The media has lost its ever-loving mind. I actually have my notes here because I wanted to read exactly what they're saying. Okay. Maria Shriver, you know her, she's Kennedy. it breaks my heart and infuriates me. The addition of a ballroom. Why is she so worked up? Hillary Rodham Clinton.

It's not his house. It's our house. And he's destroying it. And what does she do? She starts selling hats with that on it to make money off of the White House yet again. Not such a grifter. The bulwark, which exists only to bring down. Trump. As soon as the Democrat gets in there, the addition must be raised, R-A-Z-E-D, must be

completely demolished, and any sign of Trump's ballroom must be gotten rid of. The media doesn't talk about all the reno that has been done by so many other presidents in the past, and by Obama's nearly $400 million renno, which is less than what Trump is doing, or the fact that we didn't have an adequate space for, like, dignitaries to gather and have a celebration inside the White House. And then I'll give you one more, Gretchen Carlson. who I used to work with at Fox She gets out there She was like

I was there When they signed the sexual harassment Whatever In the East Room And now it's been demolished Indelible in the hippocampus The East Room is part of the main White House

Like when you walk in the front door The Northern Entry It's one of those rooms Where they still hold ceremonies all the time Not to be confused with the East Wing Which only has a couple of offices Supposed to be used by the First Lady They are two entirely different things, but these are the people who are supposed to be our media

betters educating us about how bad Trump is and why it's terrible what he's doing. The New York Times had an amazing story on this where they tried to cite examples of the history that the East Wing means to the country, all of the history that's taken place in the East Wing, which was built, I think, in 1902 under Teddy Roosevelt. So it's, I mean, people in general, I think the White House is much older than it is. A lot of it is pretty new. but the Times story I tell you this is true

the three examples they cite first they say the East Wing where Bill Clinton used to meet with Dick Morris without his staff knowing oh the White House's latest additions to his website you're saying no no this is actually that

is incredible too but the New York Times really was like God rest the East Wing this is where Bill Clinton used to meet with Dick Morris without his staff noting their second example is that this is where Dick Cheney was rushed away on 9-11, and their third example is it's where Donald Trump was taken during 2020 protests. These are the three examples you could come up with

of the reverent sacred East Wing history. Dick fucking Morris? Are you kidding me? I believe it's Dick Morris.com. Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Wait, so that actually reminds me, this is also on my notes, which I laughed at it, because the White House added something to its website today

because they wanted to underscore the historic nature of the White House and here it is, hold on, you've got to hear this. So they put up a major events timeline on the White House website and it now includes sections detailing all the renovations over the decades and also the following.

1998, Bill Clinton's affair with intern Monica Lewinsky. It's on whitehouse.com, but you can look it up. President Bill Clinton's affair with intern Monica Lewinsky was exposed leading to White House perjury investigations the Oval Office Trist's fueled impeachment for obstruction.

2012, Obama hosting members of the Muslim Brotherhood. 2003, Hunter Biden losing his cocaine in the White House. So good. There's nobody better at trolling than the Trump White House. Nobody. You want to talk history? Let's talk history. We love the historic nature of the White House.

You missed the best entry on the timeline, which is the trans day of visibility. Yes. Did you see that one? Yes, that training showing off his boobs on the front of the White House lawn. And they put that on Whitehouse.gov as part of the tour of historical moments. It can never be disturbed. No, no, no, no, no.

But honestly, this all goes back to the media and how if it weren't for people like you in independent media, people wouldn't know these facts. The media is not telling you any of that stuff about the prior renovations of the White House or how this is actually not a big deal and how Obama spent a lot more on his rent. I know that Trump did on his for something that no one really cared about. And it is thanks to independent media that you already know a lot of this. You came in knowing a lot of this. And so it's the antidote, you know, that the media has driven people crazy.

I think it's had a big role in radicalizing the left and causing this tendency towards political violence. And the antidote, yes, is what we're doing here tonight and what you guys are doing by listening to these shows and what we're doing in independent media to counteract all the lives. Okay, I couldn't agree with that more. It's the experience, let's just take this East Wing example, of somebody Googling to try and figure out whether Donald Trump is actually destroying sacred American history. They Google, they read a New York Times story, they look on NBC.com or whatever, and they come away thinking, okay, so this is really serious. And then they decide, but these are fairly left, let me just go and see what other people are saying. And they're like, these things are completely opposed to one of us.

like these two points completely opposed to one another and so just like for the good of the country like that experience we have all had it we probably all have it like once a week it is so hard to vote to make decisions about your own life i mean during covid to make decisions about your personal health about your kids about schools how are people supposed to share any truth any like you can't do it so it's desperately needed all right we are going to pause it here with emily we're going to bring out Glenn, and then Emily's coming all back on the back end. Thank you so much, my friend. Thank you, Megan. Love you. All right, Emily Chisinski, everybody. So let me tell you something about Glenn Greenwald, okay? I met Glenn years ago, but before we actually met each other, Glenn had

been saying nice things about me in the media, even though I was at Fox News, and he was at the Guardian. Now, it's never happened before or since that somebody at The Guardian would say something nice about a Fox News person. So he kind of came to my attention and I apparently came to his. And from that moment forward, a beautiful friendship was born.

I wound up having him on my show and when I got in an independent media, he was the first guest on my show and he's been on my show more than any other guest. Glenn Greenwald. A leftist, former Guardian reporter who happens to be a Pulitzer Prize winner and an Oscar winner. Did you know that? Glenn Greenwald has an Oscar. He'll tell us what he won an Oscar for. But he is one of the ballsiest, most fearless, most honest, most principled reporter you will ever have the privilege of meeting.

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Call chapter today at 27 Medicare. That's 27 Medicare to talk to a trusted advisor today. Take a look at Glenn Greenwald's show here. There's no wonder that the country hates the media no longer. trust it. These people in the media are held in complete contempt. It just has a stench of like cover-up in a way that's very dangerous and deceitful to lie to the public for so many years

about the person who has the nukewarm codes and what their mental state is. There is not a thing that comes to mind. I don't know. I never thought about that before. I'll get back to you right now and nothing's coming to mind. That is stunning. This is real contempt and hatred in a marriage. The way you're chewing

makes me want to smack you upside the head. The only time I haven't ever seen a Michelle Obama is when you forced me to see them. That's why you think you're the Megan Kelly Show Godfather. The Godfather of the Megan Kelly Show, exactly. The Godfather himself. Glenn Greenwald, everybody. This is the first time we've ever met first.

You believe that? Bizarre. Today is the first time. We talked about that on your, the last time it was on your show, because in this world, you can not meet someone physically and know them so well. We're talking about we're very good friends. It was bizarre. How do we have a very good friendship and never have met before? So we've rectified that now. So it is funny, though, how it began, right? Like, has it ever happened before or since? A Guardian reporter saying something nice about a Fox News reporter. But in that moment, a beautiful friendship was born. We just didn't know it yet. We didn't. It took a few years for us to allow the walls to erode. But no, I remember it was very kind of serendipitous. I was watching Fox, and in that era I didn't do that much. I was constantly

on MSNBC and CNN. And you had your Fox show. And I remember you started interviewing Republican senators and it was adversarial, even a little mean, but very professional, but mean. And for me, as someone who was always on MSNBC where Democratic senators are treated like high priests, like the paragon's of virtue, never asked a hard question. I said, wait a minute, I kept hearing on Fox that it's this deeply partisan network that only feeds people what they want to hear, and yet here's a 9 o'clock PM host, Prime Time, with big ratings, who's beloved by conservatives, pounding Republican politicians with hard questions the way she's supposed to as a journalist. And yeah, I remember Politico called me when they were doing a profile

on you and said, hey, you've been praising Megan Kelly. That's really weird. You're on the left. He's a conservative. And I said, you know, for me, journalism is, way higher for a journalist than partisan affiliation. And she does the sort of thing that I think we need more of and respected. I remember people on the left were horrified. How can you praise Megan Kelly? She's a Nazi. I was like, what? Megan Kelly? She's a Nazi? I was a Nazi before it was cool. Exactly. You were. You were. You were. But yeah, that's what, you know, I think that's one of the things we share that, again, took a while for us to realize. That's exactly right. So the first thing I remember you, you reached out to me on or you said something publicly on was an exchange I had

with then Vice President Dick Cheney. And actually we have the soundbite. I don't know. Let's see if this works. We haven't played a site yet at one of these. Let's see. This is the moment. Rarely have you been so wrong about so much at the expense of so many. But time and time again, history has proven that you got it wrong as well in Iraq, sir.

You said there was no doubt Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. You said we would be greeted as liberators. You said the Iraq insurgency was in the last throes back in 2000. And you said that after our intervention, extremists would have to, quote, rethink their strategy of jihad. Now, with almost a trillion dollars spent there, with 4,500 American lives lost there, what do you say to those who say you were so wrong about so much at the expense of so many? No, I just fundamentally disagree, Reagan. You've got to go back and look at the track record.

We inherited a situation where there was no doubt in anybody. everybody's mind. All right, you get the hint. You see how it goes. But if you heard it, he called me Reagan. So he got rattled. And let me tell you something. I was a little scared to ask that question, too, because Dick Cheney is scary.

He's scary. He has all the number of Halliburton and, yeah, he was called Darth Cheney, which is a very appropriate nickname. But they were, they were rattled. You saw them there. Because I don't think people, that, by the way, this is called journalism. And this is, I think, it's. It's so important, you know, you were talking before about how unpopular media is, and it is.

Our profession is held in extremely low esteem, deservedly so. In fact, I think 27% is too high. I mean, it's barely above, you know, like syphilis and Congress, and it's deservous. It's below cockroaches, below. Yeah, exactly. And I, but I think it's so important to realize that when you hate the media and you know you should because they're so dishonest and deceitful and destructive, journalism remains really important.

We need journalism. It's not that we're against journalism. It's we're against people who pretend to be journalists, but who would never do anything like that. And I think that's such an important value to affirm. That's what so galling to me is it's like, now I'm in sort of a different business. I'm still a journalist, but now I'm doing a lot more commentary too.

And I have nothing but disdain for the people who won't do that. It's not that hard. You don't want to do it. You're kind of hitting your own side. You know that. I mean, I'm on Fox News. I'm well aware of how, like, Roger Ayles at the time feels about Dick Cheney. And, but you have to force yourself to because you have, you know, integrity.

It's the job that you signed up to do. And you just never see it. It's not toot my own horn, but I'm just saying you don't watch MSNBC and ever see them give their side, any sort of guff. And we've really suffered as a result because, like, in my lane, I don't have access to people on the left. Leftist politicians won't come on my show. They would never subject themselves to that kind of tough questioning.

And the left that does have access won't do it. Yeah, you know, it was funny. I was talking to Emily before, before he came on, and we were both talking about how, and I was describing to her, trying to describe to her my worldview. You know, people are always trying to discover, is he on the left, is he on the right? And I think people have hard time

knowing your ideology with precision either. And for me, you know, I decided to become a journalist, not a politician. I'm not a party operative. I could have been that. I'm not a spokesperson for a politician. and I could have been that too, as you could do. I decided to become a journalist, and for me, that entails obligations. And I think the primary view, world view, that I have being journalist,

is that it's always dangerous for human beings to have lots of power and lots of money with no pushback, no scrutiny, no journalistic examination. And so whoever has the most power, that's what I'm going to be adversarial to, not because I dislike them, not because I hate them, not because I want to destroy the reputation, but because our society needs people with power. to be accountable, to have to answer hard questions no matter who it is. It's very hard to do, I have to say, because it's like, I'm so relieved that Trump got elected that I'm completely rooting for him, but you have to be honest about, you know, his pitfalls

too. And so the way I've handled that on our show is I'll bring on somebody like you who will be very critical of, you know, Kilmar-Abrego-Garcia and how that was handled, for example. And I want the audience to hear your point of view, you know, and I can easily defend Trump on it as I have with you, but I want them to know this actually, is controversial, and there's a very robust set of criticisms of Trump here, and let the audience hear them. But that, too, it's just so rare. Like, if you want to hear an actual debate that's substantive between smart people on any place on cable news or broadcast, you can't. First of all, the format doesn't permit it. You know, you have to speak for eight minutes

in between commercial breaks. Nobody can have a real debate. People have to speak in cliches. I mean, it's very difficult with that little time. Independent media allows a lot more time. I think we argued about that or about, you know, the student protesters for 20 minutes. I mean, argued in a very, you know, civil sense. And we were able to, you know, immediately after, move on to something where we agreed on and not have it affect our friendship in any way. And I think that is what we're missing. But the only reason that works is because, you know, I think I have credibility to do it.

I'm somebody who defended Donald Trump when I was very much associated with the lap. New Russia Gate was bullshit from the start, just journalistically false. I thought it was a dangerous scandal. And I went around, you know, saying that everywhere. I mean, I was virtually Tucker's co-host. I was on that show so much, you know? And you're like, wait a minute.

What's going on here, Tucker, Glenn Girl? But, you know, and I've defended him on his views on Ukraine. So I think when I'm criticizing him, people understand it's not coming from a place of partisanship or a reflexive, you know, desire to attack Trump. It's just, and I think this debate inside the Magna movement inside the right about Ukraine, about Israel, these things are really healthy. You don't want a mindlessly unified. population behind a leader. You want people saying, wait a minute, you campaigned on this.

I supported you on that. When is this going to happen? And I think the conservative movement has done that as well as anybody. You know, wait, where are the Epstein files? Why is this war still going on? And that is really healthy and important. That's exactly right. And I think Republicans are very good at infighting. I mean, they're excellent infighting, much better than the left, which the left sticks together. I have to say, it's like, they get their people in line, that Nancy Pelosi, she rules with an iron 200-year-old fist. There's something to be admired there. With a very healthy stock portfolio.

Very healthy. That always increases as she stays in contract. It's amazing how they've called the stocks. Almost like an NBA basketball player at a poker table. Very timely. Okay. So tell us a little bit about your background, because you have a very interesting background, Glenn. Tell us how you got into this line of work,

because it started with a blog. Yeah. I mean, I was, you know, a lawyer. lawyer litigating constitutional cases in New York. I wasn't really that interested politically in the 90s. It seemed a little bit low stakes. You know, the Cold War was over. Like the election in 1986 was Bill Clinton versus Bob Dole. I'm not saying it's unimportant, but who gets excited about that? And, you know, the big scandal was the Monica Lewinsky scandal. It just, I wasn't, I didn't find it nourishing. And I focused a lot on the Constitution, which I revered and still do.

But then after 9-11, you know, I was living in New York, I was in Manhattan on 9-11, and it was, you know, had all the same emotions as everybody else, rage and sadness and thirst for vengeance. And then very quickly, I began to believe that this was being exploited by people who had pre-existing agendas to do things like introduce the Patriot Act and warrantless spying on Americans and arresting Americans on. How did you see that? Like, what was it in your recent past that led you just your love of the Constitution? Because a lot of us saw that and then, we're quick to defend it because we were scared. Right. And like I said, I understood that I shared those emotions. I'm human. I was in New York. You know, I remember walking around for a week and smelling the debris in the World Trade Center and seeing on the lamppost, you know, these desperate families putting up pictures of their loved ones saying missing, please call a few, and they knew, you know, obviously everybody knew that they were deceased.

It was horrific. So I shared those emotions. It wasn't like those were alien to me. But at the same time, I also did believe, and I still do, in this, all the things we're taught to believe as Americans, what makes our country great. It's not that we have this landmass. It's not that, you know, we have a pretty flag. It's that the founders of our country designed this brilliant system designed to avoid the pitfalls of tyranny and authoritarianism that they had just fought an extremely dangerous war against the most powerful empire on the planet to liberate themselves from. They were eager not to replicate it. And I studied these tax, like the Constitution, the Federalist Papers and these debates, and I believed in them. And so

when I saw our government spying on people without warrants and empowering detention with no due process of American citizens on American soil, these were the kind of things I was taught to expect never going to happen in the United States. And yes, I understood people who were afraid, but I also knew that authoritarianism resides where governments and people in power can put the population in fear and then tell them acquiesce to everything we demand because that's the only way you're going to stay safe. And if you dissent at all or you question us, you're going to be endangered and so is your family. It's a very dangerous but powerful form of propaganda.

It worked like a charm. Perfectly, yeah. Like a charm. So you start this blog and you start writing about these issues and let's just go through the time. It was 2013. Was that the day of Snowden? Yeah. So the day I started my blog was late 2005 and I got kind of lucky. It was about three weeks. The New York Times

broke this big story that they didn't actually even want to publish but one of the reporters was going to break in the book so they published it and then won a Pulitzer and patted themselves on the back for their courage. But it was about how right after 9-11 the U.S. government authorized the NSA to spy on Americans without warrant. And that became an issue that I wrote about constantly. I was able to build a very big audience that way, just because it was a perfect confluence of my interest and passion and expertise as a constitutional lawyer. And, you know, that became sort of what my specialty was, was critiquing U.S. foreign policy. I was very critical of Bush-S. foreign policy, many of the ones

that you brought up there. And then Obama got into office campaigning to undo all them, but instead extending many of them, strengthening and expanding many of them. And I started criticizing Obama on the same grounds that I was criticizing Bush and Cheney when they were doing the same things. And a bunch of liberals were saying, we're talking me. I was like, wait, four seconds ago, you also thought these things were bad. But now it had it transformed at the hands of this benevolent, kind, you know, intellect, Barack Obama. You know, I started having getting disillusion. And at the time, one of my readers was, Edward Snowden, and he was working inside the CIA and the NSA, and became convinced that

there was a lot going on inside the U.S. government about how these agencies were violating their core mission, which was never to turn their machinery inward on the American people. It was supposed to be directed at our adversaries and our enemies. Right. And there were several war and terror whistleblowers who, you know, said I worked at the CIA, worked at the NSA. I was always told this is what we're never going to do because it will destroy the fabric of our country, and Edward Snowden was inside the NSA and saw that they were converting the internet, which was supposed to be this tool of liberation and democratization and empowerment of individuals into the most repressive and omnipotent system of coercion

and surveillance ever in human history. And he contacted journalists in late 2012. He contacted me and then my colleague Laura Poitris, who directed Citizen Four that won the Oscar. She did a film on our work together. That's a film for which he went an Oscar. yeah we flew to Hong Kong we flew to Hong Kong and met him and the minute we got there she who's a brilliant filmmaker she had been nominated for Academy Awards before she turned the camera on and started filming my work

with Snowden and it became a documentary that was filmed in real time not with talking heads talking retroactively and that you know story I think changed the way a lot of people thought not just about privacy and surveillance but about democracy you know how do we have these unaccountable agencies

off in the dark making some of the most consequential decisions ever with No one even in Congress knew, let alone the population. And how do we have democracy if you have these deep state that operates with no accountability? How did the Pulitzer Prize change your life? To be honest, you know, I... Oh, that's nice. That's nice. Thank you.

Not easy to win one. It's even tougher to win a Nobel Prize. I was very divided because it's given to you by the media. And I hated the media. And I was like, wait a minute. it. Why are they bestowing me with awards? But I actually heard and was very happy about the fact that there was a big internal war because they didn't want to give that to me, but kind of had to. So that made me feel better about getting this, like, shameful, dirty awards. At least I'm upset

everyone. Yeah, and it's just something nobody can ever take away from you. You know, it's very difficult for journalists to try and deny. You know, I just know they do this to you too. Oh, you're not really a journalist. Yeah. And I'm like, look over here. You know, every journalism award that exists is on the shelf. And I just, that's the only real thing it does for me is, yeah. So there was a time when you were out of the country and you couldn't come back? Well, the Obama administration got very threatening, you know, about the Snowden reporting. They, I don't know if you remember, but when the president of Bolivia, Eva Morales, went to Russia where Snowden was, but they only went for a state meeting, you know, just like a standard state meeting between heads of sovereign countries. the U.S. just had like an inkling that maybe his presidential plane was picking up Snowden

to bring him back to Bolivia and they downed the plane forcibly. I remember I went to the Russian consulate. I needed a Russian visa. I was going to Russia to see Snowden. And these Russians came out and they were like, look, I know why your government hates Snowden. We can't, we wouldn't allow, you know, leaking of our secret information too, but downing the plane of our president, even to the Russians that, they were like, I don't understand that. You're kind of in a glass house there. Yeah, they were, but I mean, it was. Really, you know, it's really a step too far. And they, you know, James Clapper and some Republican senators and Democratic members of Congress started openly talking about not just prosecuting Snowden, but also the journalist who worked with him, namely myself and Laura. And, you know, we would call up the Justice Department. Our lawyers wouldn't say, is it safe for them to come back? And they would say we can't guarantee that safety. So Laura was in Germany, working on Citizen 4 and the rest of the stories. She wouldn't leave Germany and I couldn't leave Brazil because the U.S. government was being very menacing. And we only came back once the Pulitzer's happened. And we figured the U.S. government doesn't want the black eye publicity putting in prison two people who just won the Pulitzer's for reporting.

Wow. It's incredible. So flash forward now, that's 2013. Seven years later, you've left The Guardian, you've started your own outlet called The Intercept. It's your concoction, your creation, your vision, and you're making it happen, you're publishing news the way you want it done. And there comes a clash that leads to you leaving. the very journalistic organization you founded because they wouldn't let you report honestly

on Hunter Biden and Joe Biden. Yeah, I mean, the reason why it was so amazing was when we started The Intercept, and it was myself and Laura Poitrist and other investigative journalist Jeremy Scahill, all of whom had done battle with the deep state and done reporting of that kind. The idea was we want to start

a completely nonpartisan media outlet that is adversarial to people in power, especially to the agencies that don't get nearly enough journalistic attention and scrutiny. I think a lot of corporate media outlets were very captive to these agencies, subservient to them, and they exercised great power. And so the idea was we're going to start a media outlet that has no ideology or partisan affiliation. And it worked for a while, and then Donald Trump came in 2016, and we did a lot of reporting on the emails that were released from Hillary Clinton through WikiLeaks, because it revealed a lot of incriminating information about this very powerful politician who was the frontrunner for the 2016 election. And I think our editors who were all kind of liberals. We hired editors.

I wanted to do the journalism, not sit in HR meetings and budget meetings. I wanted to do journalism. They were all liberals in Brooklyn, but they figured I'll let them go, you know, reporting on Hillary. She's going to win anyway. And then Trump won. And all their friends said, what is wrong with you? You helped Trump win. You did negative reporting on Hillary.

And I remember the night of the election, you know, we had these, like, virtual newsrooms where everyone gathered. And someone said, our coverage, everybody was crying. People were crying. These were journalists crying. I mean, like sad tears. And somebody came and said, our coverage was very misogynistic, and we need to publicly apologize. Oh, wow. And I was like, go work for the Democratic Party. We're not apologizing for anything. This is our job. You know, this is our role. And then in 2020, I knew the Hunter Biden laptop documents were authentic from the beginning because I had a lot of experience working on big archives. You know, the Snowden Archive, WikiLeaks had a big reporting in Brazil that involved a large archive.

Also, the pictures made it pretty clear. The way journalists authenticate archives, yes, the pictures were pretty authentic and pretty good proof. But, you know, the archive has emails written to five people, and you go to one of the people on the email chain and you say, show me in your phone this email that you got in real time and they show it to you and it matches word for word what's in the archive. That's how journalists authenticate. So I knew for sure this archive and I wanted to report on it. I wanted to get the documents right about it because Joe Biden was a major presidential candidate. And my editors, when they realized that I was working on, it came and said, according to the FBI, this is Russian disinformation. And remember,

this was a news outlet founded to be adversarial to these security state agencies. And they were telling me, according to the FBI, as though that's gospel, the Biden FBI, this is Russian disinformation. I said, it's so obvious these materials are real. But I knew, they said, there's no way we can allow you to publish this because the material isn't verified. The government claims it's fake. And I didn't start a media outlet to be told what I can and can't report. And I knew their motives were not journalistic, but political. Political. And I left. You left your own organization. Yeah, I had to quit my own organization because if I can't report on major political candidates

because editors want to manipulate the outcome of our politics in one way or another, why would I stay? I can't do what I want to do, much is my job. And that became a reflection of the media writ large. They were so, they renounced completely their journalistic function, would have said or done anything to get Donald Trump defeated. That's what Ressigate was. and then that's what the lie about the Hunter Biden laptop was.

They were petrified about what it showed about Joe Biden, so they were willing to lie about it. These are journalists. And they're still lying about it to this day. To this day, they don't admit that. They can't admit it because they were all so invested in it. Well, it's like watching, you know, first Kamala, now Karin Jampere on these book tours,

and the dishonest media, letting them get away with, you know, I only saw him for a brief time. I barely saw him on the plane over the way of the debate, so I didn't know he wasn't feeling well that night. Like every word of him, that is a lie. She was the White House Press Secretary. Yes, you were in the White House

with him daily for years. You knew he was infirm. You covered it up. It wasn't about the plane ride over to the debate. But these same journalists were in on the whole thing, so they have to give her a pass. It's a dishonest setup. I'm sure you remember, and this was, you know, there's so many different events that made me

realize the depth of depravity and just deceit within our profession. And we watched Joe Biden on these videos, even before that debate night in France and then having to be got off the stage by Obama. And I remember to this day the Washington Post, the New York Times published story saying the American right or conservatives are using, and they invented this new term. It was cheap fakes. Sheep fakes, yeah, where it was

supposed to be defined as the video is real, but the context is somehow distorted. And one of the things they said that about was the night when Obama led Obama Biden off the stage because he was completely, you didn't know where he was. Yeah, you guys remember that video, right? They're at that fundraiser, and Biden was kind of wandering, and Obama, like, grabbed him by the hand, like, put his hand around his back and kind of shepherded him off. He had those vacant eyes that he always had, like, where am I? Yes.

And, you know, the whole media said, oh, you're lying. He was totally present. All the Democrats said he was president. And it turns out, George Clooney, of course, after the election is over, admitted that when he wrote that New York Times opad calling for Biden to withdraw from the race, it was because on that night, even before that thing happened, he saw that there was no more jail Biden that it was just, you know, a vacant. But he kept it to himself until after the debate. And let the media call everybody who

saw it liars. Yes. George Clooney is a dishonest hack who's like a pretend want to be journalist who's not even really very good acting, never mind a journalist at journalism anymore. But you know, exactly. They kept the secret amongst themselves until it was outed by Joe Biden himself. And I have to tell you, I've been thinking about the Joe Biden mental infirmity lately because I think so much of what we're dealing with right now as a country is directly linked to that. I mean, I am very much in favor of, like, the full-fledged investigation into exactly how it went down. Because Joe Biden, he was a leftist, of course, but he wasn't one of these far, far leftists. He was always a little bit more moderate. He had

been close to a blue dog Democrat. The real left hated Joe Biden. They hated Joe Biden. Exactly right. But he was tough on crime. He wasn't pro-an open border. Very pro-Israel. Wasn't woke. No, not woke, very pro-corporation. So that's hated Joe Biden. So the behavior that Joe Biden brought into office from day one was anomalous to the man that we had come to know as a legislator, you know, as a U.S. Senator. And I, I firmly believe the reason we have now an extra 11 million illegals is because of his mental infirmity. Someone in that White House had an agenda that did not match his. And that's, who made those decisions? We still don't know the answer to that. It's the, it's, you know, you look at so many media lies,

Reschagate, under Biden laptop, all the lies about COVID. But to me, this is by far the biggest scandal because you have somebody who is in charge of the nuclear codes, someone who can start wars or end wars, somebody who makes decisions that affect the lives of hundreds of millions of Americans, billions of people on the planet, the world economy, and he was incapable of making those decisions. And I remember saying in real time all the time,

yes, it's the political scandal that people are lying about Joe Biden's mental state, but the bigger question is, who's running the government? Who is in charge? Who's making these very consequential decisions? And I say person after person taking the fifth in the context of this investigation in them, like including his own personal doctor. It's very sketchy.

And I truly think, like, we need answers on that because look at the number of people who have died as a result of those illegals coming across the border. That he just welcomed in for no apparent discernible reason other than it's humane. That's what he said. And encouraging, you mentioned legal immigration, okay technically legal immigration

immigration from Haiti to the tune of tens of thousands who were led in it's not like the Joe Biden who we knew and someone who made that decision other than him I'm convinced of it and that's why the media is so guilty the original sin as Jake Tapper put it in the name of his book the media was in on it they are complicit

they are equally to blame and they're still misleading to the day right stand by because now that we're getting into the media we've got to talk about what was in Korean Jean-Pier's book I've got to read you the latest Matt Taibi outed it he read it so we don't have to and for this, I'm going to have Emily rejoin us because I know she wants in on this. Emily Jishinsky, get on back here.

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Offer details apply. you guys are not going to believe what is in this book okay hi glenn hello emily all right the gang's all here so carine jean pierre you know not not content to just let comel look like the dumbest one in the administration writes her own book or someone wrote her book and you know we've been talking on the show about how literally to every promotional appearance she makes what is she telling people I'm black. I have black. And queer. We're too. Don't forget my queerness. And in fact, we have that cued up, just for those of you who have missed it. Here's a little tasting. This is just a pro-mo tour. This is not like going back in the archives. This is like literally in the last seven days. Watch. As a black woman, as a person who's also LGBTQ. As a black woman, as a black woman, I am a black woman, I am a queer woman. I'm an immigrant, being a black woman as a black woman myself,

that is the thing that I understood as a black woman is that I meant a lot to people because of the communities that I represented, whether it was women of color, black women, queer community, LGBTQ community, immigrant, and as a black woman, and I have my queerness too. It's like talking to Glenn. She's got her queerness. Glenn also has his queerness.

He never talks about it. Fine. You know her race, by the way? Corrine Jampier's race? She never talks about it. She's very shy about it. She doesn't like attention call to it. She's Italian.

You're not going to believe this. Okay. This is the great Matt Taibi exposed to this. A few pages later after this other part, Jean-Pier described her feelings after Trump won re-election, saying she wasn't surprised at all

because America was too racist and sexist. to elect Kamala Harris. Finally, these are quotes. About 1 a.m., I tumbled into bed. When I woke up, it was over. Harris had lost. I received calls from friends who were distraught or numb with disbelief.

But I wasn't surprised by the outcome. The truth was, I never really believed Harris could win. Well, I mean, none of us did, but she had different reasons. But I, I wasn't surprised. Okay. I never believed she could win. I'd been in the body of a black woman all my life She's changing it

I'm not just black I've been in the body of a black woman Which sounds a little dirty I like that sounds a little naughty doesn't it Sounds like something a husband would say She doesn't have a husband because of her queerness I stood at the podium in the White House briefing room Traveled in my chocolate skin Through rural areas

And all my experiences of blistering stairs and racist assumptions left me unable to see this country electing a president who looked like me. Black women are tired of being used and overlooked and taken for granted that we will take on the extra tasks at work without pay, assume the lion's share of labor in our communities without fanfare, and do it all without complaint. Indeed, we are leader. in our cities and households, matriarchs who fight for rights and policies

that benefit the whole of society. In 2024, the nation could have finally begun to repay what it owes us. What? And benefited itself by giving the top leadership role to Harris, who could bring the talents embodied by so many black women to the nation's highest office.

That's her latest. basically in a sum of the substance. Her chocolate skin and she's been in the body of a black woman forever. And the reason Kamala lost is because we did not want to be in her black chocolate body. I don't know. This is lunacy. We knew she was dumb, but did we know she was this far gone? Truly. Go ahead. I love that in her mind, the repayment for the treatment that American blacks have received is Kamala Harris. We deserve

Kamala Harris. You owe us Kamala Harris. Oh no. That's some debt. I remember Trump during the campaign went to speak at the Association of Black Journalists, and they brought up the historic occasion of Kamala's candidacy as a black woman, and Trump said, what, Kamala's black?

I didn't know she was black. Remember that? And this was supposed to be super offensive. Like, we were all supposed to be horrified, even though everybody had the same thought. And then what happened was CNN the next day went to, like, a barbershop in Philadelphia, which is like this white liberal media stereotype of where you go to talk to real black people. We call that Harris Country. Yeah, exactly.

And they walk in and there's like eight black guys sitting, you know, on chairs in the barbershop, like working class guys. And the reporter comes in, he's white, and he says, hey, Donald Trump yesterday said he doesn't think Kamala is black. Do you think Kamala is black? Of course, expecting it to be like, and they were all like, and this is the kind of idiotic politics that Democrats think the country is thinking about that we relate to each other this way

with these divisive categories everybody has to immediately declare themselves in. And this is such a degraded and primitive way of thinking about humanity and how we relate to one another and the things we care about it have in common. And also, isn't this the same country that elected,

Obama twice? And, like, made this idiot, the White House press secretary. And made Kamala Harris who technically is black, our vice president? Yeah. I mean, if anything, you can make the opposite argument that the people inside the black woman's bodies are actually benefiting by virtue of that rather than being impeded. But it's just, I think people are just so tired of being told that we have to judge each other with constant reference to that. That's exactly right. She didn't get the memo, right? The fever broke with Trump's reelection. And she didn't get the memo that we're done doing that shit. Like we are done obsessing over skin color, whether we're black or white, we're brown, whatever it does it. We're done. We're done. The fevers have broken.

That stuff's not going to work anymore. But it seems to be what she's saying is the reason she left the Democrat Party. She's mad, allegedly, that they were too mean to Joe Biden. But she also is, the whole book is full of grievance about how the Democrats aren't good to black women. So she's leaving, but she's not going to, she doesn't recommend voting for any party other than Democrats, but she's going to stand outside as an independent just to shame them for how they treat black women, but still totally vote Democrat, which sounds right exactly at the intellect level that I would expect from Corrine Jean-Pierre as a strategy. I mean, I will say something controversial, but truly, if you look at the people that the

Biden administration elevated to check the identity boxes from Kananji Brown Jackson to Kamala Harris to Karin-John-Pierre, this is why people. have problems with affirmative action. It's because you actually, when you're elevating people purely on the basis of identity, and I say that as a cis hetero white woman, Megan. Cis hetero. It's bad. It's, I mean, it produces bad results. It's a disaster. And it's sadly what people now have to look back as the legacy of the Biden administration. Well, the other problem we have is that, you know, they're obsessed with like their academic pedigree over on the left. We've seen that, right? It's like, I mean, speaking of a firm of that,

action and pedigree. Michelle Obama went to Princeton. Okay. Sheila Jackson Lee, she went to Harvard. Joy Reed went to Harvard. I mean, right? Don't laugh, Glenn. Need I say more? Joy Reed. And then there's another class of leftists that went to these schools and probably actually got in on their own merit, but they are so elitist and such snobs in their coverage, and that brings me to Rachel Maddow. So she, I mean, we could spend all night talking about when Alita snob she is, but just this week she was talking about the White House and the renovations. Okay, and you can say a lot about the renovations, and I've already read to you some of what people

are saying. But listen to this one, okay? Trump is literally destroying the people's house. He's literally physically tearing down the White House. And now here's my favorite part. This is right on brand for her. He took up parts of the White House lawn to put up huge. flagpole so he could fly novelty-size American flags to make it look like it's an RV

dealership. Hell yeah. That's Rachel Maddow, like, oh, who would be caught dead at an RV dealership? And she speaks for everyone. There isn't a person consuming her show, which she does once a week, for which she makes $30 million a year still, that had any reaction. to that other than yeah, ew, gross, an RV. And that's half the problem, right? Well, and also, like, what made it so gross in her mind was that there are so many American flags

there, too. Like, only, like, really tacky, lowbrow people would fly American flags. And this is the thing, like, you may, people, the ordinary people, like, who just go about their lives, like you were saying, most people are really busy. When I was a lawyer, I barely had paid attention to politics, only when I had full time to kind of look at everything I said. But you don't have to know every detail, but people understand when they're being condescended to, people understand when they're being insulted, when they're being judged. And the Democratic Party, which did use to have a lot of working class representation, they were very close with unions, that was the kind of ethos of the Democratic Party in the

middle of the 20th century, became very subconsciously and very explicitly the party of corporations, the party of Ivy League schools. And as a result, they now look down upon, you know, people in car dealerships. And, you know, most of the country feels condescended to and patronized and can just, like, spewed contempt at by liberal elites. And they're getting back what they deserve. They have created that. Yes. Let me ask you a question. He used to go on MSNBC all the time. I was on Rachel Maddo's show all the time. I, you know, had a personal friendship with her. Has she lost her relevance? Well, let's remember. I just, things is so important, is that, first of all, cable news in general as a medium is dying.

Yes. The number of people who watch cable news, Fox still pulls in several million people. They tend to be an old demographic. But MSNBC and CNN, I mean, they're irrelevant. You have mid-sized YouTube shows with bigger audiences than they do. And not only that, but you can imagine the only people who watch MSNBC are already drooling rabid Democratic Party partisans. So even the people that are attracting, they're not convincing.

of anything. She went on every night and perpetrated a gigantic hoax. She was, she was ratified the steel dossier. She thought Putin had a pee-p-tape about Trump that he was using to blackmail Trump. She was all in on all the bullshit about Russiagate, like the whole hoax, the whole fraud. She went on a news network ostensibly every night and lied and got rewarded for it. You know, she said people who questioned the origin of the lab leak, but it came from it. from a lab are racist. Like the whole litany of lies that people hate the media, she was kind of the avatar of. And you're right, she got a reward for it, which was a $30 million contract

for lying incessantly for partisan reasons as low as you get for a journalist. And honestly, I think it's possible to make a lot of money and still be in touch with regular people, but she's not on the list of people who are. I think she's just gotten so detached from reality from how real people live, what real people care about. She's ensconced in this liberal bubble. And she's relegated herself down to this one hour a week, which I think is good, because there's not really a standard bearer at MSNBC now who they all revere and look up to. And, you know, it'll be interesting

to see whether they can even cultivate that now, because they're starting to realize that the relevant lane is digital. They're starting to try to cultivate their own Joe Rogan. The irony, of course, he was of the left. He was a Bernie row. And now they're desperate to create their own sort of presence in the digital lane. But I, for one, I applaud her downfall. And she did it to herself. She sacrificed her credibility. You know it was. lies because she never owned it. She didn't ever come out and say I was wrong. Let me tell you the truth about Russia Gate. She was actively lying and she was caught. And she still insists that the conspiracy theory she proffered for years is real. I mean, she's, and actually even worse than

all of that, she stole Glenn's haircut. She did. I'm thinking about suing her. My lawyers have a very good case. I mean, not for nothing. And other questions, I mean, she's another person who really could stand to be more attractive. I would appreciate if she would try harder to make herself more attractive. Do you know, though, there's a, a photo of her, a yearbook photo. Oh, her yearbook picture. Yeah, she was beautiful. She was a very, she has deliberately uglified herself. Yes. And there's this thing in liberal culture where it's almost like the objective is to not be

attractive. Yes. They're nailing it. There are still a few, very few, but some, a few. They purposely, like, make themselves doubier. Yeah. And dirtier. It's like an ethos. Let me ask you something. If you, if you wanted to go, just say, you know, just hypothetically, on Halloween as somebody who was at a no-kings protest. I mean, like, a certain image comes to mind. You'd have to get, like, the size 10x shirt. You'd have to get, like, a blue wig.

Maybe a nose ring. Right? It's like, there's certain, like, a uniform. And all I can think of is the one woman who came to the Trump White House recently on the Antifa hearings, and forgive me, I can't remember her name. But she talked about how she suffered from severe TDS, Trump's Arrangement Syndrome. and how somehow she managed to get herself out of it. And she talked about how her life got better.

She said, dare I say, I even got more attractive. And there's some truth to that because when you're consumed by hatred, you know, because that's what TDS is. It's like a crazed hatred. Of course you're going to become less attractive. You're angry all the time. You're not like effusing positivity. You're not warm when you see people in the street.

You take this all on as your own personal battle. You know, you've got a fight. He said they've got evil madman in the White House. And like, at my worst of hating whatever president, I never let it consume me personally because remaining attractive was too important to me. I mean, counterpoint, Rosie O'Donnell.

Never looked better. Never looked better. The cold sore? Oh. You know about her cold sore. right? She now says she got herpes from Trump. That the stress of hating Donald Trump somehow gave her a herpes outbreak.

I don't think tracks. I'm not sure. Does it sound right? That's actually how you get it. I have a tip for your Halloween costume. Let me know. Oxygen tank, Walker. I think that nails the No King's look. Yes. I think this is going to be very common. You know, we mentioned it last night, and I think it is on my mind. you know very well sadly we're going to get some disgusting costumes around charlie's murder right like we're already seeing that at the no king's rally you saw some people there was a man

who had like fake blood on his face and like a fake neck wound and the freedom shirt yes i mean what kind of depraved person right and like it's good to laugh it's wonderful to be together and be doing this but like we actually are suffering from a really serious problem right now in this country and it's coming from the left, no matter what they want to say, that it's both sides, it's not both sides, it's leftist violence. And people who come out and speak at these events, it's a new paradigm. You know, I'm talking about that with security in the same way that Columbine created a new paradigm where, like, a new method of killing people was put on display and put in people's heads and changed, sadly, the way kids go to school now, the Charlie assassination has.

done that too for public speakers and in particular for people in the right and it's not just people you know i know you're not of the right but like people like us who are in the right wing ecosphere or in the independent ecosphere unfortunately it's for everybody you know everybody has to worry like three people at that trump rally got shot one died so it's not just it's also civilians it's not just people yeah i think if i can just like give us what i think is a little insight into this which is i mean first of all one of the main reasons i came here people i know i live very far away i live in brazil now there's a lot of travel is precisely because i do think And I know you had talked about after Charlie's death, like being a little concerned.

And I know any of us who do work that's polarizing, that's political, that produces anger, has to think about that. Wait a minute. Are we know our country where, you know, we had assassinations in the 60s, but not very much political violence since. Are we now back to being a country or even worse being a country where even just you don't have political power, you just have opinions that people dislike, that you can be easily killed, that it's not actually surprised. anymore when something like that happens. And I think the only solution is to say we're not going to give into that fear. We're going to come and be in as many places as possible. And I know that's why you did your tour. We're going to flood the field. But I do think, look, the thing is every political faction produces violence. And we talked about this like in the 90s, there were

abortions, murders of abortion doctors that people tried to blame Bill O'Reilly because he was pointing out abortion doctors, including one who was killed. I do think we have to be careful not to say certain ideology inspires that. But it is nonetheless true, and this is something it came from the Trump era, is that on the left, people started insisting and then believing that not only Donald Trump, but all of his followers are fascists and white supremacist and racist and Nazis. And along with that, there was an accompanying discourse that said, it's good to kill Nazis, by which they now mean conservatives. And, you know, if some left-wing figure dies, you'll be able to find a few scattered people on the right, you know, making fun of it or celebrating it.

But this was way more than that. This is, you know, now the predominant sentiment among a lot of people on the left that the world is better off when conservatives die or people who like Trump die or Trump himself dies, even if they're being slaughtered in the most horrific way, a 31-year-old man, a husband, a white, father of two young children. They look at that and there's no humanity. There's no soul. They've been feeding on this discourse of hatred so intensively and consistently, social media, pours it into their head that it is scary to watch so many people, such a major part of a political movement, be so dehumanized that they deny people's humanity. Down that road lies very dark things. I mean, so what do we do about that?

Truly, like, if you gave me a magic wand and say, you can, you can just remake the country with this magic wand, the first thing I'd have everybody do is go to church. Get them all back to church. Get religion back into the public square. In the way, it was when this country was founded but they're so lost they don't they don't believe in a higher power they only believe in themselves like the power of their own id which is a very damaging

dangerous place to be so I don't know how to reach them you know the right tends to be more religious tends to be more of a group of faith especially the modern day right versus the modern day left how do we reach these people who are not only let's say born into families that are all about like transing my three year old because he's had made some

errant comment but TDSing them and getting them to the possibility of a presidential Trump death, a President Trump death. But then they send him to schools with the likes of Lucy Martinez, Big Chungus, as Jesse called her last night, who's like the one who is pretending at the No King's Rally, like celebrating Charlie's death. So the whole thing is this indoctrination faction that the factory that's meant to radicalize them. How do we reach them? How do we, are we supposed to stop that? I think one of the most powerful

thing, and it's a hard question, but I think one of the most powerful things is just, just people who aren't of that ilk, who haven't lost their minds yet, going into places, we were talking about this backstage gun, going into places where people have lost their minds and showing the contrast between what it looks like to be an, and Charlie was very good at this, what it looks like to be an absolutely insane person who is not coping well with reality. And then Jack supposed that was someone like Charlie who is a man of faith, who is normal, who is happy, who actually approached a lot of those conversations joyfully and with compassion. And that to me is really, really powerful, at least in my experience, like, that

just going into those spaces so people can see light and dark. That's amazing. I mean, that's very powerful. Yes. I have to say, I also think something that we've been talking about, we talk about all the time when you guys come on the show, we talk about on your own shows, and we're talking about tonight, I have to say, I do blame, in large part, the media, right? Absolutely. I really think they have unclean hands when it comes even to Charlie's death

because what did you hear from all those No King's protesters over the weekend? You heard Charlie was terrible. He said terrible things. He was a racist. He was a Nazi. We heard that from so many of those little clips that we played on our show and elsewhere.

Where did they get that idea from? Not from listening to Charlie. They got that idea from the media which tried to paint him with that brush. And so I almost feel like the part of a huge part of the antidote to this madness is what we're doing now. It has to be a long game that we're not going to solve that overnight, even though Arlene is so powerful and we're taking down the mainstream bit by bit easily with MS and CNN, but they're still there. But until they are destroyed, until they're destroyed as networks of propaganda and misinformation and our lane of truth-telling and of individuals, right? Like, you can go, you can get a Jesse Kelly

whose show is called I'm right, you know? He's a moderate man. Yeah, but you can get somebody's more moderate. You can get somebody who's of the left but has got more heterodox views like you or of the right but more heterodox views for righty. And I'm sort of all over the place, but you can get that in this lane,

you can get real facts. That's the only antidote to where like the disinformers are gone. Of course, I do not mean dead. I mean off the air. and no longer able to spin these lies about our people, right? Like our words will stand for themselves. They'll speak for themselves.

The clips will speak for themselves. There won't be this act of manipulation and attempt to stir up hate around us all the time with very vulnerable, unwell people. Yeah, I think that's the key is this last part. I mean, I do think, and this may sound naive, but I don't think it is, that Americans are fundamentally decent. I don't think people go off on this psychotic. like dehumanized path on their own.

And I think one of the things that has happened is, and we see this indicia all throughout our society, you know, suicide rates are way up, addiction is way up, alcoholism, depression, you know, mental health problems. And I think it's because of this spiritual disconnect. People don't have spirituality in their lives. They don't have connection.

They don't have community. All the things that used to make America connected, you know, churches, religion, union halls, gatherings in small towns, these things are largely gone. We live in this very digitalized age. COVID exacerbated it greatly, isolated people even more. And in that, you know, without spirituality, emerges nihilism.

And nihilism is very easily exploited. You know, you don't have to, you, we always have disagreed with each other vehemently. That's America. You know, that person has terrible idea. But we still see them as human beings. That's what's being lost. And it's a deliberate campaign to encourage people to lose their humanity. And I think there's a lot of deep-seated,

problems in our country that enables that kind of thing to fester. And I think it's important that we think about that as well. I do think, because I've heard this said of the right, I've said it as well, you know, to your point, we had a guy like that and they killed him. You know, we had a guy who went into the spots and into the spaces and said the things and was reasonable and talked to the other side and showed the example of what faith can do for you, how it can save you, how God never rejects any of his children, and he still believes in all of us. And they killed him, but just because Charlie was murdered does not mean all of the left wants to murder us, and it doesn't mean that they're not reachable. And I feel like we owe it to Charlie to recognize

that the youth in particular, who are very misguided right now, very lost, and in some cases dangerous, are getable. That was his fundamental belief, that the right had ceded the fight for their hearts and minds and that that was a mistake. And so he went in there to fight to to win them. And I think we have to do the same. We have to not say they're all crazy. They all want to kill us. No, they're getable. They're winnable. And we have to continue reaching out to them and not demonize all of them with the same broad brush as the one we use on the Lucy Martinez's of the world. Yeah, I mean, one of the things that Charlie tapped into and Ben Shapiro does this too

is this moral relativism has left young people starving and they know that they're hungry. They know that they're starving. They know they're looking for something and that can be directed in some really bad ways and some

really good ways and they've exported so much of their lives onto the internet thanks to some really bad people who actually encouraged us to reshape our society by exporting our lives onto the internet. And then incentives there are towards rage. The incentives there are towards, like, categorizing people in one direction or the other, and you get sucked into part of this, like, computer program

and our politics gets sucked into it, too. And the more you just get off the internet and talk to normal people, the more that you realize it's okay to not categorize someone who has really, what you think are really bad ideas, but they just talk to them, talking to them about baseball, talking about something else, and it sounds so cheesy. Non-politics. Yeah, it's It's not so cheesy, but, like, people are really gullible because they are starving for moral clarity. And if you can provide that, people's discontent can be channeled very productively. I just want to end with this story, because I told it on the show one day, but a lot of people haven't heard this. You speaking up for what you believe in, you saying the things that we've been saying tonight and that we talk about on the show and these.

truths that are hard truths, but we all believe them, right? Like a man can't become a woman. Like, we are not, we refuse to be boiled down to our skin color. Like, we have way more in common than we do that separates us, despite whatever our melanin is, to take a couple, for an example. You just saying those things, being honest about those things, like the young woman who came up, like, yes, say what's real. Like, stand up for yourself, even though they're trying to make you play or face off against a male, we'll make a difference. And even though you might not always hear about it. You might not always know. You might feel like you're, you know, screaming into the wind. You might feel like this is causing you hatred. Like people are coming to loathe you

or think terrible things about you. You can think all that. But, you know, our minds tell us these negative stories. Remember this. I got an extraordinary message from someone who has not given me permission to say where he works, but it is at a very anti-Trump organization. And this person gave me a very heartfelt multiple paragraph message about his child who was saying that they are trans and how this person of the left secretly has been listening to my show and to our guests saying what is real and what's really going on with these children and how this issue ought to be handled and what is possible and what's not possible and what's happened in the medical community with the capture and so on and so forth and has been saying to themselves

oh my God, I'm on the wrong side. This woman and the people who come on her show are fighting for my kid and I can't because I'm with this organization that's on the other side. I need to pay my bills and continue getting this check. But I can see and I can hear

that these people who my organization demonizes for a living are in the right and are going to save my kid. And think of how brave it was for this person to save. that to me, right? And I wrote them back a very long note too, but it was a reminder that even if you don't get snaps, you don't get pats on the back, some people are going to say nasty things

about you on the internet, whatever, you are helping people if you stick to what's real, to what's true, whether it's your family, the truth, freedoms, or your faith, right? Because there is such a thing as the silent majority, and what the study show is that if the one person in the room will stand up, raise his hand, or raise her hand, and say what's real, so many other people in the room feel the same. They're so glad you said the thing. So, as I said to the one woman, sit in the front row of your life. Be the person who says something. The fact that you're here shows me you can and will do it. And God bless you all for that. Thank you so much for having us, San Antonio. We love you. We hope to see you again soon. God bless you.

Thank Emily. Thank you, Glenn. Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.