The Megyn Kelly Show - Intermittent Fasting - What You Need To Know, with Cynthia Thurlow | Ep. 136

Episode Date: July 28, 2021

Megyn Kelly is joined by Cynthia Thurlow, nurse practitioner and nutrition expert, to talk about all things intermittent fasting, including the basics, what the various plans and options are, how it can help besides losing weight, what benefits intermittent fasting brings to aging, what you can eat on intermittent fasting, the benefits and myths of exercise, the importance of sleep, and more.Follow The Megyn Kelly Show on all social platforms:Twitter: http://Twitter.com/MegynKellyShowInstagram: http://Instagram.com/MegynKellyShowFacebook: http://Facebook.com/MegynKellyShowFind out more information at:https://www.devilmaycaremedia.com/megynkellyshow

Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations. Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show. Today on the program, intermittent fasting. Should you be trying this? I highly recommend it and I absolutely love it. For my body, it has been transformational. And Cynthia Thurlow feels the same. She's a nurse practitioner. She's an expert in intermittent fasting, and she's a nutrition expert as well. And she will walk you through what it is, how you do it, how you prepare for it, and what happens if you falter. And when you do it, and then you're in your eating window, what should you eat? Can you eat normally? I do. And we'll sort of get into

who shouldn't, who might, and sort of what the benefits of it are, because it's not just your shape. It's really been impactful in my own life. And what I love about it is you don't feel like you're dieting when you're eating. It's not like you can go totally nuts, but you can have big meals and you can leave your table feeling totally sated. And that's not always the case, you know, when you're watching your weight or when you're trying to lose weight in particular. Anyway, we're going to get into all of it and some extra sort of health tips for all of us as we sit here midsummer. Women, men could help your sex life too. There's a lot to go over and we'll do that with Cynthia in one minute.

Cynthia, hi, how are you? Good. How are you? So nice to connect with you. Likewise. I'm so excited for this discussion. I have been doing this intermittent fasting for a few years now and I absolutely love it. And I did see your viral TED talk. And I was like, this woman knows what she's talking about. You're a very effective communicator and advocate for this method. So there's so much I want to get into. But can we start with what brought you personally to intermittent fasting? That's a great question. You know, I think on so many levels, I have always been really interested in, you know, health and wellness, you know, trained as a nurse practitioner working in cardiology,

I was able to see what was not working for many, many people. And I think it was probably close to the time that I was in my early 40s. And I started to see changes in my own body, that definitely impacted my ability to maintain body composition and just be healthy in my own skin. And so on many levels, I think I really came to it out of curiosity initially. I read Jason Fung's book and felt that if there are other Western medicine trained providers that are really advocating for a strategy that's been around since biblical times, that it's probably something that I can consider myself.

And so initially the foray was really selfish. It was to, you know, kind of feel like I had some control over some of the changes that were happening in my early forties. And then I felt so good. I intrinsically felt more energetic. I had much more mental clarity. And then I started thinking that this might be a great strategy to use with patients and then with my own clients. And so that's initially how I started, but really it was happenstance. And, you know, prior to that, you know, I certainly, you know, living in a very, you

know, diverse area of the country, I certainly had lots of patients who practice fasting as part of their religious rituals. And so it was something that was not, you know, uncommon for us to discuss, but it was certainly not something I thought I would be doing on a daily basis moving forward. But I'm so delighted that I found the strategy and obviously I'm a huge proponent of it. That's a good point. You know, I, I live on the Upper West Side of Manhattan and I live in a building that's most, mostly Orthodox Jewish people and they fast all the time. And in my religion, Catholicism, we never have to fast. At least I don't think so. I don't know all the rules perfectly, but I've never been told that I

need to fast as a Catholic. So I never even thought I could do it. I'm like, why would you do that to yourself? But like you, um, as I got into my late forties, I went to my doctor and I said, you know, it used to be that if I were two or three pounds up, I would just watch what I ate for a week or two and it'd be gone. And I'm noticing that's no longer the case. And he said, yeah, he said, how old are you now? And I think at the time I was 46 or 47 and he goes, yeah, you're actually going to have to try now. I'm like, oh, okay. You know, and he's like, he goes, and then once you get into your fifties, you won't be able to eat at all. He was joking, right? But he's, he's talking about what naturally happens, especially to women, but to women and men,

as we get older, our metabolism slows and it's much harder to keep off the pounds, even though you're not necessarily eating more. Yeah, it is a sad fact of nature that there are lots of physiologic things that change in our bodies. As we're getting older, I always think about the fact that we become more likely to become insulin resistant as we get closer to menopause. Certainly, we start losing lean muscle mass, and that is a normal function of aging unless we work against it.

And so on so many levels, your doctor is right. And unfortunately, the game changes, if you will. What I could do in my 20s and 30s, I definitely can't do in my 40s. And as I get creeping closer to 50, same, same situation. So it's nice to know that there are opportunities where we feel like we have some control over things that we otherwise have no control over. Well, and he was saying to me what you've said too, which is in, in your fifties and sixties, the average woman gains one and a half pounds a year, right? A year, which in one year, that may not be a big

deal, but over the course of 20 years, that's a major change in your body weight and your appearance and the way you feel. So his point was you got to stay on top of it. Don't, you know, like that one and a half pounds in one year actually does matter because it, it adds up. And that's really when I started to take a look at this. I'm like, okay, I don't want to diet. I don't really want to diet. So what, what can I do? And intermittent fasting, it wasn't as hard as I thought it was going to be. I really thought it was going to be torture, but I, and I follow the 16, eight method, which we'll get to. And I think that's totally doable for people who, even for people who are like, I couldn't possibly fast. Um, but there's all sorts of ways that you can go about it. All right. So let's just talk about before we get to how you do it, the benefits, um, for men and women, like what, what will it do other

than watch your weight, right? And control weight. You can use it for weight loss or just weight, maintenance, but there's a lot of other benefits. I agree. So body composition, I always say that that's what brings people to intermittent fasting is they want to lose weight, but they stay for all the other benefits. So we know that we get improved mental clarity because we have lowered insulin levels. For many people, they're surprised at how much more productive their mornings are. So improvement. What do you mean lowered insulin levels? And before you said we can get insulin resistant as we get older. So can you just talk about insulin for as we get older. So can you just talk about insulin for a second? Yeah. So insulin is a hormone. It's not a bad hormone,

but it's a hormone that we want to master. And we want to ensure that we're not secreting insulin all day long, which is kind of aligned with this methodology slash dogma that many of us were raised with that you want to eat many meals and snacks, and that's how you are able to keep your metabolic fire going. It couldn't be farther from the truth. And so what happens when we're eating frequently throughout the day, whether it's sugar sweetened beverages, whether it is snacks and mini meals, what we are doing is we are secreting insulin more frequently. And with secreting insulin more frequently, what we're essentially doing is we shut off fat burning. And so what happens with intermittent fasting is you're eating less frequently. So you are using less insulin.

And when you keep insulin low, it allows your body to use fat as a form of energy. And that is a really important principle for people to understand in a metabolically unhealthy population like we have. I think the latest statistic was 88% of Americans are metabolically unhealthy, which means they're either insulin resistant or obese or overweight. You really want to kind of embrace strategies that will try to keep your insulin levels better balanced. And one of those is just decreasing meal frequency and not snacking. So

each one of those Starbucks, you know, people think of, and I don't mean to call out on Starbucks, but you know, those sugary coffee beverages that are more like desserts. If you're having a couple of those a day in between meals, you're really setting yourself up for not being able to support, you know, support your body the way that it's designed to thrive. I didn't realize that. So you're saying not only should we be doing the intermittent fasting where you go a certain number of hours without eating anything, but you're saying even when you're in your eating window, you should not be snacking in between meals. No, because really, if you get your meals properly put together, meaning, you know, a certain amount of animal protein or plant-based

protein, depending on who you are with some healthy fats, you should be satiated from lunch to dinner. You shouldn't be getting hungry in between. And if you are, it just means that you need to increase your protein portion at your next meal. And so a lot of what I talk about is just helping people understand what macronutrients are, which is protein, fat, and carbs, so that they can structure their meals properly so they're not getting hungry in between meals. And I feel on many levels, we've done ourselves a disservice telling people snacks and mini meals are the way to go because that just contributes to that degree of metabolic inflexibility because your insulin levels aren't being managed properly.

And you're not tapping into your fat reserves the way you could be that that could be fueling your walk around town. Instead, you're using that insulin that you got from your little snack. Okay, so keep going with the with the benefits, sharper mental acuity, which I can say I have experienced that on intermittent fasting, I thought it would be the opposite. I thought, you know how if you go too long, without eating, they say, oh, your blood sugar drops and then you get a little cloudy. That's happened to me. But on intermittent fasting, I have the opposite. It's almost like a fight or flight feeling with your brain where it gets extra tuned in. Yeah. And that's absolutely related to the ketones that are produced in

our, in across the blood brain barrier, which we can dive into. But in terms of other benefits, we know that you get improved by a physical marker. So while you're fasted, you're going to be improving your blood sugar levels. You're going to be improving your blood pressure. You have the ability to ultimately improve lab values that are done through your private primary care provider's office or specialist's office. We know that it helps reduce our likelihood of developing things like neurodegenerative disorders, could be Parkinson's, type 3 diabetes, which is Alzheimer's, and another thing that we are more at risk for as we make that midlife transition. We know on many levels that for many people, it helps keep their hormones better balanced. So for many people, it helps keep their hormones better

balanced. So for many women or men that are going through these middle age changes, it helps with balancing, I touched on insulin already, but it helps balancing sex hormones. It can be very, very beneficial in helping people sleep better. I find that a lot of people that are experiencing sleep disorders when they start fasting, that can be improved upon because they're not eating so close to bedtime. Their insulin and blood sugar are better balanced, so they're not waking up in the middle of the night. I mean, those are some of the key things that we like to focus on. And one of the kind of nerdy science terms that I think everyone that fast should really be familiar with is autophagy. And so this is this waste and

recycling process that goes on when we are in a fasted state and our bodies, when we start eating, it kind of down regulates, kind of stops that autophagy process. So when you think about the fact, by the time we hit the age of 40, we have plenty of, you know, it's kind of like tires on a car over a period of time, the tires get worn out, and we replace the tires. And so when we're not eating, our body is able to go in and scavenge up disease and disordered cells that we need to get rid of. It's an efficiency process. But if we're eating more frequently, our body isn't able to go in and do that cleanup. It's almost like it takes out the garbage, but we can't take out the garbage if we're eating too

frequently. So autophagy is a really key principle that I think is really important for people to understand and sometimes can help reinforce why eating less often really is something of tremendous benefit for our health. Well, that's the thing is like you, you think of fasting as something that would be painful and potentially bad for you, uncomfortable. And the more I looked at it, the more I read articles and other thoughts saying, look, this is how our ancestors used to live. You know, they didn't have pantries full of food and refrigerators full of food. They might go two days between meals. And that was OK. And if you try to reframe the thought of fasting in your mind as not this painful, punishing thing, but something that is totally natural that you can get through and that the feeling

of hunger doesn't have to be a bad feeling, it's more manageable. And I'm trying to, but I want to be careful because I certainly don't want to encourage eating disorders, right? That's something I don't want to sort of get into the messaging that anorexics give to themselves. But I do think as a healthy person of a healthy body weight, that mind shift has helped me. So I don't want to be encouraging people to lean into that. I'm not going to eat mindset, but, but that's, that's different than looking than reframing

fasting. Well, and I think it's important for people to understand that fasting just means you're eating less often. You're still eating. I do think that there's definitely, and I see it on social media, there are certainly women that hide their eating disorder under the guise of intermittent fasting. So when I talk to people about fasting, being very clear about who it's appropriate for and who it is not, but also making people understand that you are eventually going to

break the fast, eat a good meal, probably eat a second meal, depending on the schedule that you embrace. But we are not suggesting that people starve themselves, that they not provide their bodies with sufficient nutrients. That's not what this is about. And much to your point, when we look at the ancestral health perspective, this is how our bodies are designed to thrive because food scarcity was a real issue. You know, before there were supermarkets and grocery stores and convenience stores and ordering things on Amazon prime that show up at your house the same day prior to that, um, you know, 150 plus years ago or even longer, sometimes people, if if they had a if they had a kill, maybe they they shot a deer and they had meat. And then they went through a period of time where they

might have just had, you know, twigs and berries. And I'm not exaggerating that, you know, food scarcity was a real issue. So if our bodies weren't designed to be able to be fat adapted, if you will tap into fat stores for energy, we would not have sustained, we would not have been able to survive. So on many levels, we've gotten, yeah, we've gotten very comfortable as a society because we have, you know, quick access to food all the time, but that doesn't mean that we should be eating all the time. So I'm going to get to the plans that are available and like how you do it in one second. But I do want to ask you about metabolism because you know, we've all, we've all been told you can't, you can't go long periods without eating because it will slow down your metabolism. You'll have to have breakfast every day because

that's what jumpstarts your metabolism for the day. Otherwise your body thinks it's starving and it goes into starvation preservation mode where it lowers the number of calories it's going to burn and starts to protect you as though you're in the Arctic with zero access to food for the next two weeks. I believed that for a long, long time. And it wasn't until I started to do intermittent fasting that I was like, I don't understand the science, but that turns out to be BS because I can see the pounds coming off. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's unfortunate that even as a healthcare professional, there are many of us that are still touting bad information and we've really counseled our patients improperly with regard to meal frequency. And so I think one of the things that's really

interesting is that when people start fasting as it pertains to metabolism is that we get these secretion of counter-regulatory hormones that will help suppress that hunger cue. So you're not going to feel like you're starving. And much to your point, you said, you know, I didn't think I would be able to do this at first. And I actually started to feel really good. And that's done for a number of reasons. You know, we know that, you know, one of the other things that happens while we're fasted is we get secretion of a hormone called growth hormone. And, you know, that really is potentiated when we are fasting. And so on many levels, I like growth hormone, which, you know, helps us maintain muscle.

So the more muscle mass we have, the more calories we're able to actually consume or macros, depending on how you want to look at it. And that in and of itself helps with our metabolism. So I always like to remind people that our body is very smart and, you know, has the, has the ability to flex in and out, meaning that if we're eating less frequently, but we're still getting a proper amount of macronutrients and during our feeding window, we're actually making our body more efficient, more fuel efficient. We're actually supporting that metabolism as opposed to making it harder to work. It's almost like we put more fuel efficient gas in our car. And on many levels,

I think that a lot of people until they actually practice intermittent fasting, they don't fully understand that. But the mechanics of our body really get gunked up if we're eating too frequently. And that can make the metabolism piece have to work a whole lot harder, be a whole lot less efficient. And if you're getting closer to 40s and beyond, you'll start to realize that things are not working as efficiently as they once did.

All right, up next, what are the plans that are available to you? How can you do intermittent fasting and what are the most popular ways? That's right after this. Let's say I do intermittent fasting five days of the week and two days of the week. I don't do it. I have breakfast. I'm eating during what would not be considered an eating window.

That doesn't come back on me. I have noticed like if I'm not trying to lose weight, if I'm just trying to maintain, I can do that. I can not intermittent fast a couple days of the week. And it's not like my body's like, whoa, I had a breakfast and suddenly you see that pound on the scale. It seems like you make your body more efficient in dealing with food overall. Okay. So let's get to the plans. Let's go through maybe the top three meal a day. And that seems to be popular for a variety of reasons. And I have some concerns about that long-term, but I would say those are probably the two most popular, I think because they're accessible. I think it's harder for people to wrap their heads around doing every other day fasting per se, or doing a 5-2, which

generally means people are consuming a normal meal frequency over five days. And then two days they have what I refer to as a subcaloric deficit, a significant one for men, it's less than 600 calories per day and women less than 500. So I think that the 16-8 or 18-6 and the OMAD seem to be what's most popular, certainly with my own clients and, you know, people that I interact with online. So I do the 16-8 and I really like it because I stop eating at 8 p.m. and then I can eat again at noon. And for me and my own lifestyle, that works perfectly. It's not hard to not eat after eight. You know, you can have whatever, you can have a bunch of tea, you can have water, you can have seltzer or whatever. Sometimes I will have a glass of wine. We'll get to that. But,

but, um, so it's not always hardcore zero calories for me, but then I can make it the morning. I would say between 10 and 12 is, is the toughest time, but you can get, you know, you can wake up, you can have coffee, you can have tea, and then you're kind of through the morning. And then it's just that last two hours like that. So you're really, I almost feel like the whole challenge of intermittent fasting for me, just comes down to those two hours. And you can suck that up. Like anybody can suck that up. Especially if you get out of the house, you go for a bike ride or you go do something, you get yourself away from the food before you know it it's noon and you're done. Right. And I think, you know, there's a couple of things in there, you know,

giving ourselves grace because you may have a day where you break your fast earlier, and that's totally okay. You may also have a day that's a little busier, and you may realize it's 1.30 and you haven't eaten. And that's okay as well. You know, one of the key things with fasting that I think is important for people to understand, we want to be flexible, you know, give ourselves grace, acknowledge our schedule may not look the same day to day, and that is totally okay. Your schedule 12 to eight works really well with your lifestyle. And for someone else, they may break their fast at 10 and they're closed their feeding window earlier. And that's okay as well. I have quite a few people who prefer to do like a two, um, you know, they'll, they'll, they actually do ship work a lot of healthcare professionals. And so they, they want to adjust

their, their fasting and feeding windows. And the beautiful thing is you can flex that every single day if you choose to, you know, it doesn't have to be rigid and in stone. Some people prefer to have things be rigid and in stone and that's okay. But there are many people who like to have a little bit of flexibility day to day. That's certainly the way that I now practice. And I encourage people to, you know, once you're fat adapted, once you're fuel efficient, once your metabolism is really boring, to really play around with those feeding and fasting windows and get, you know, get creative because sometimes you'll find whether it's around and as an example, special celebration, vacation, you may just have overeaten. And the next day you say to yourself,

I'm not very hungry. Well, if you're not hungry, you don't have to break your fast. You might just have one meal. That's where I love OMAD. Like around a celebration, you've overeaten, you have one meal, close your window and go about your day. And the next day you get back on track. But as a general rule, I think, you know, giving yourself the ability to be flexible with the scheduling and to acknowledge that sometimes life happens and you just need to adjust things accordingly. And that's totally okay. Exactly. It's like, if you look at it over a 30 day window, as opposed to just the seven day window of the week, it's easier.

It's like over 30 days, I'll be doing this enough times, you know, adherently, because that's not a word, but I will adhere to the program enough days that this will work for me. And I'm not going to beat myself up about the days that it doesn't. Like last night, I went out to dinner with friends. By the way, for our listeners, I went back to the friend's house who made me the enormous martini. And he has since gotten smaller martini glasses since I shamed him on the program. Andrew Schroeder, looking at you. And it was much better. It was, it was much more palatable, but you know, you go out to dinner with friends. You're not going to stop eating at 8 PM, right? It's like, that's not how dinners out work. So today I'm going to try to go a little longer before I start,

um, before I eat at noon. But here's a question I have for you. So what qualifies as fasting? Because I know I've read your stuff that you don't think we should have cream in our coffee and obviously sugar. I will say I do have cream in my coffee. And as I said, sometimes I'll have a little something after my eating window. Not often, but sometimes I will. Or sometimes in the morning, I don't know why, but I'll have a couple of Ritz crackers. I know it's not the right thing to do, but I will.

And it still works. So I'm like, I don't understand why it's still working, even though I'm not totally fasting. Well, it goes back to giving yourself grace because we're all human and we're not robots. And that's a perfect example of, you know, you wanted to have a couple of crackers, you had a couple of crackers, you had some cream in your coffee. I think it's important to define what your goals are, because if someone is really struggling with weight loss, they've hit a plateau, they come to intermittent fasting, those additional calories might make a difference for them that may, you know, that may push them out of a position where they're maximizing, you know, fat burning. And I would imagine that you, because you've been doing this for a while,

your body's very efficient. So those couple crackers or the cream in your coffee doesn't make a difference. So really focusing on what your goals are. And then, you know, differentiating between what is clean fasting and what is not and it does, there's no judgment here. It's just differentiating that, you know, cream, although it does not secrete, uh, is not going to impact your blood sugar. It does. It is insulinemic, meaning it will secrete insulin. And that, and that is a by-product of dairy products. Um, and that's just a scientific fact.

So when people are dealing with nuances and there's a lot of nuances to fasting, I want to be really clear about that, you know, defining like what your goals are, whether it's a bullet proof coffee. And there are a lot of people goals are, whether it's a bulletproof coffee. And there are a lot of people that come to me that are having bulletproof coffees. I'm like, Hey, you know, that's absolutely fine. You know, it's something that Dave Asprey kind of created, but is very big within the fitness world. And so essentially what it is, is coffee typically with MCT oil and then butter. And so it's a fatty coffee for a lot of people. Yeah. So for a lot of people that if they're coming from being a couch potato and on a standard

American diet, it can be what I refer to affectionately as a crutch that can help them get to a point where they can fast for longer. And so again, there's no judgment. I always like people just to understand MCT oil is processed a little differently in our bodies than butter and cream and things like that. So it's always coming from a place of education. But, you know, for many people, those little incidentals can, you know, differentiate between clean fasting, which is water, unflavored electrolytes, bitter teas, coffee, plain coffee, and dirty fasting, which is kind of this muddied area where, you know, people will sometimes take protein powder or collagen peptides or different types of fats in their coffees or their teas. And I'm like, as long as you understand, you know,

what your goals are, what your focus is, you know, I'm a total realist, but clean fasting is really just the, you know, plain coffee, bitter teas, water with no sweeteners and electrolytes and differentiators, bitter teas. So really like black tea, green tea, they're really bitter. And so the differentiators, I think most Americans probably prefer sweeter teas. And so, you know, when you look at Celestial Seasonings side box of their apple spice, so it's got apple in it, which is going to break your fast. It probably has some sweeteners in it, which will break your fast. And so just explaining to people that when I'm talking about bitter teas, I'm really talking about teas that are not going to be sweet

and they're certainly not going to be sweet on your tongue. What about like peppermint tea? That's what I drink. You know, technically, you know, when you're looking at like research, there's again, a lot of nuances. So things like cinnamon will not break a fast that actually there's actually evidence to show it kind of boosts insulin sensitivity. You know, certain types of mushrooms, and I'm not referring to wacky mushrooms, I'm referring to medicinal mushrooms like reishi and shaga, lion's mane, can be consumed while fasting and technically won't break your fast. Peppermint is, it's my understanding that peppermint technically is like a gray area. I mean, the way that I look at it is, what does the side of the

box say? If it's just peppermint, probably okay. But if it has artificial, when it says like natural flavors, I never know what that means. And it's, it's a way that these food manufacturers are able to hide, um, the, the real ingredients. They don't have to disclose it if they use natural flavors. So, so even if it doesn't have calories, but you have to be concerned if it has something in there, other than, I don't know, just pure peppermint? Well, I think what it comes down to is, you know, what are your goals? Because, you know, we can make the argument that diet sodas technically have no calories, but we know that they do have, depending on the artificial sweetener that's used, has a negative net impact

on the gut microbiome and potentially insulin. So there's a lot of nuances here and we can certainly unpack that, but it's really just what are your goals? And I think for you, what I'm hearing is that you're at a healthy weight and you are doing really well with fasting. And so like a peppermint tea, I wouldn't worry about. If you were struggling, if you were saying, hey, Cynthia, I've got five to 10 pounds I can't get rid of. I would say the Ritz cracker and the cream probably need to go. The peppermint tea is probably enough. I will say if I, if I really want it, like, let's say I go up a few pounds after a vacation or something. And then if I come back and just do it hardcore and eliminate everything, you do see a difference. I mean, the body responds,

the weight comes off. I it's funny. Cause I'll I'm here in New Jersey for the summer at the shore and I'll see women overweight, trying to clearly trying to lose the weight, you know, running in the hot, hot weather, sweating. They look so uncomfortable. And I keep thinking to myself, you don't have to do that. I have something that can help you because we were so focused on cardio, cardio, cardio, cardio, cardio, and cutting back all of our calories. And I don't find this to be a calorie cutting kind of situation. The meals I eat when I'm eating, it's not like I have a Big Mac, but you can eat, you can eat good portion sizes. And you do not, I mean, I will confess, I have not been exercising for a long while now. And you wouldn't know it to look at me. I'm not saying you should get rid of exercise, but you don't have to do all that

cardio. Well, and I think unfortunately, this is what we have conditioned patients to believe exercise more, eat less car, chronic cardio is the way to go. And I would argue for anyone that's over the age of 35, if you want to, you know, maintain and stay lean, um, you know, through middle age and beyond kind of lift weights, like I would say, there's nothing wrong with walking. And I would never discourage people from, you know, doing types of physical activity that bring them joy, whether it's bar or Pilates or yoga, or, you know, doing Tai Chi, but the chronic cardio bunnies, oh, I feel I feel for them, because they're probably miserable. They probably think constantly

about being hungry. They're probably counting every calorie they put in their mouths. And there's just a better way. I agree with you so much. I agree with you so wholeheartedly. In fact, every time I see a new potion or pill or powder or junk that's touted on social media, I'm like, save your money. You could embrace the strategy, even if you do it a couple of days a week, my goodness, and you can do it for free. You don't have to buy a hundred dollar powder. You don't have to pay for a class. You could just eat less often. And that would have a huge net impact on your health in very beneficial ways. And I have to say that- Well, it's like you don't even have to take our word for it, right? Because you just look at the soul cycle class, right? How many

women in there who do soul cycle two hours a day still are a little overweight. Now, why is that? They're, they're working out way more than I work out. That's for sure. But all that cardio tends to drive up your appetite and you overcompensate with your calories. And I think your body, you tell me if it seems like your body gets used to it and it no longer produces results for you, you've just sort of raised the floor of what you need to do in a day to not gain weight as opposed to you're actually losing weight. Well, I think it's a couple of things. Um, I used to think affectionately about friends of mine that just ran constantly. You know, they always looked haggard by the time they were meeting their mid forties. And I think, you know, we know that a lot

of that chronic cardio drives the cortisol. And as we are getting closer to menopause and beyond, our bodies just don't utilize, it doesn't respond to stress as readily as it, as it did before. And so I would argue for anyone who wants to lose weight, you should be doing strength training because the more muscle mass you have, the more caloric burn you have, the more glucose reservoirs you have for what you're eating. And, you know, save the time that you're spending two hours, if you're doing two hours of soul cycle, my goodness, unless you're training for a race, there's really, there's really nothing that's a benefit to that. I'm not suggesting people be sedentary. I like everyone to be active and to walk and to move every day, but you'd be better served lifting weights so that you are maintaining muscle mass

as you get older. I mean, that's critically important. You know, if you look at marbled meat, I always remind people of this when you're looking at young, I'm thinking of tenderloin, if you look at a tenderloin, there's very little fat or marbling in it. But if you look at a fattier cut of steak, you know, like a porterhouse, and there's a lot of marbling in there. And that's the muscle loss, you're replacing it with fat. And that's what happens to our muscles as we get older. So less muscle mass, less calories you burn, the more you're going to struggle to lose weight. And that's why those strategies of being a chronic cardio bunnies are not going to get you anywhere. And this really applies to men and women. I see just people who are-

It's such a time shock too. It's like, my God, who's got the hours in the day? Now here's, so if you do OMAD, right? Is that what you said? OMAD? One meal a day to compensate for a day of eating too much, or let's just say you're in your eating window. Our executive producer, Steve, is asking, this is a quote, can you really have a Whopper and fries and go crazy in your OMAD? A lot of people want to know that. Is it, is it a free day? Can you go nuts? No, no. In fact, I would, I would argue that the amount of seed oils and high fructose corn syrup you consume with that big Mac is probably going to undo any good that you would be doing for your body. So, um, I, I'm not a big fan of like the concept of a free for all. I think everyone has celebrations and we have fun times and whether it's alcohol or dessert or too many carbs or whatever it is that people have indulged in, it's like, enjoy it and let it go. But I would not want to look at OMAD as an opportunity to eat something like super unhealthy because you probably A, won't feel all that great and B, what you're doing to your body on the other side is just so inflammatory.

So OMAD typically, and I see a lot of men doing this, they seem to be able to consume quite a bit of calories in one sitting, whereas I find most women just don't have the ability to do that. So a man could sit down and maybe they have a 2,500 calorie meal. Maybe they're having a big steak. Maybe they're having an appetizer. Maybe they have a glass of wine. I mean, they have a good size meal and then they close their feeding window. Whereas I find women really struggle to be able to get enough macros in, in a very short, tight feeding window, whether it's two or three hours compressed. So no, unfortunately, Steve, I'm sorry to say, I would not recommend that you have a big, a big Mac and a bunch of fries. I would probably

have a steak, have like a nice baked potato and have like sour cream and butter and whatever else you like in it, have, you know, salad and vegetables, maybe a glass of wine. I would rather you consume more whole food sources than that big Mac. Cause I don't think you're going to feel very well afterwards. But, but to your point, you also don't have to just have a salad filled with vegetables with just a small amount of oil and vinegar. Like I can't eat like that. I don't, I'm Italian. I need some substantive food in my life. And this is another thing I like about intermittent fasting is it's not like I can have pasta every day. Of course I know woman in her fifties can, but as I keep trying to explain to my dog thunder, I'm like, let me explain to you what it's like to be a female Thunder.

You can't have the loaf of bread off of the counter and still maintain your girlish figure. So she doesn't seem to care. So but you can, you know, I cook for my kids and I'm not a chef. So I make very basic things. And if I want to have a little bowl of pasta, even pasta with, you know, meatballs or whatever, I can do it. It's not necessarily prescribed, but I can do it without it coming back to haunt me. I don't have to have salad every day. Right, right.

And I think it's really important for people to understand like, where's your sweet spot? Meaning, you know, for me, I eat a very protein heavy, every meal I eat, very protein heavy. That's the bulk of what you'll see on my plate. And I do enjoy vegetables, but I too don't want to just eat salads. I am not sitting back in a calorie fixated state. I just allow my hunger to kind of guide me. And I agree with you when I go on vacation, when I have a celebration, when I have a birthday, when I'm out with my husband and we have date night, I am not sitting back and just sitting there eating a salad at my dinner. So I think it's really important for people to understand, like we are eating real food. Uh, we are not feeling like we're very restricted. And I have a thing for dark chocolate. Anyone that follows me on social media, I always say like my, my big

vice in life is dark chocolate. Um, I have a little bit of dark chocolate every day. And I think that's important. There's a lot of health benefits to high quality dark chocolate. But the point being that I don't sit back and eat like a nun-like existence. I mean, I do eat real food and I do enjoy real food. I do occasionally have some wine, although not very often anymore. But it's one of those things where you have to find something that's sustainable. And that's the key. I think when we're talking about dieting, like a dieting culture is, oh, this is short term. I like to think of fasting as a long game. It's a long term strategy for men and women. It's a way to live a lifestyle and to be able to be flexible and enjoy your life, but also allow yourself to really kind of get

intrinsically connected with hunger to get really intrinsically connected with hunger, to get really intrinsically connected with how your body works. I know a lot of people are very disconnected from their bodies. And I think it's just important for people to understand that there's more to living than counting calories and doing chronic cardio. I remember when I was at Fox, there was an anchor there who I loved and she was always so thin. She had all these children. I'm like, how, how are you doing it? Like, how can you have all those kids and be that thin? And her approach was, she says, I, I eat whatever I want the whole day. Like I, I have whatever I want for breakfast, dinner and lunch, but I only take three bites of it. So I was like, okay, I'll try it. You know, you'll try anything. And, um, I'm like, I'm going to try it. So I was like, okay, I'll try it. You know, you'll try anything. And I'm like,

I'm going to try it. So flash forward to, you know, day two. And I was taking the most obnoxious, like the biggest bites of everything. It was disgusting. The amount of food I tried to shove in my mouth. So people, most people will try anything. That one I abandoned probably day two. Up next, the 24 hour fast. I tried it. How'd that go? We'll talk about it next. But before we get to that, I want to bring you a segment we have here, a feature on the MK show called From the Archives. And this is our feature where we look back in our growing library now of episodes and bring you something that we feel you need to hear. We want to draw your attention to it if you've missed it.

Or you might want to listen to it again because it's become particularly relevant. Today we're going to December of last year and episode 33. I can't believe Andrew Sullivan was on on episode 33 and now we're up at like 130 something. That's crazy. Andrew Sullivan is fascinating. He is so brilliant. And he had just launched his new Substack publication at the time, which has been great recently, particularly his piece earlier this month, What Happened to You? You remember I

recommended this when we had our critical race theory debate. If you haven't gone back and read that on his Substack, please do it. Google Andrew Sullivan, What Happened to You? You will thank me. Well, shortly after the election in 2020, Sullivan was on and the conversation that we had was going to be a great preview of the year in which we now find ourselves. Take a listen. Liberals, moderates, conservatives, they're all being silenced. Most people don't feel comfortable expressing their views. The only ones who do are the progressives. I know you've pointed that out and like sort of the left left progressives. But I know you pointed that out. And like sort of the left left progressives. But I know you think that you wrote that you felt they were dealt an astonishing rebuke in the last election. How so? The striking thing for me, Megan, I don't know whether this is true for you,

but the election results really surprised me in the way that they seem to have surprised the president, which is that we were expecting a big wave of some sort. That's what the polling suggested. An eight-point lead for Biden in most cases, which ended up being something like four. But what was also interesting was that the Republicans did pretty well, actually. I mean, they gained in the House. They're probably almost certainly going to retain the Senate. that people turned out to be actually quite supportive of the police, not least minorities who need the police to be protected. chaotic, amazing, diverse place is somehow the equivalent of a KKK-run white supremacy, which is now literally the words used by people to describe America in 2020. Most people don't buy it. And when they were actually given a chance to affirm some of those left ideas, such as in California, where there was a proposal to enable

the government to discriminate on the basis of race, it went down in flames. You saw after four years of what we were told was white supremacy, that non-white votes for Republicans actually increased. What you found was that people, believe it or not, despite their or whatever their identity, have ideas of their own and they have views and they're not all identical. The Latinos as a bloc is a kind of dumb idea. It's fact, very diverse, rather like the old immigrants from Italy or Ireland or Poland or Germany. Yes, they have similarities, but they're also extremely different in their backgrounds. And we see in many Latino voters a wide variety of opinions,

including those who really don't like illegal immigration, including those who want to assimilate, want to integrate, want to succeed in America, and have quite traditional American ideas, want to actually be part of this melting pot, as I want to be. And so there was really, you realize that a lot of this notion that we live in this oppressive, racist society is entirely something concocted in the heads of very wealthy left liberals. And in reality, although obviously in every society, prejudice exists, bias exists, racism exists, but America actually is a story of overcoming of that rather than the entrenchment of it.

Sullivan is certainly no conservative, and yet he and I see eye to eye on so much these days, while the woke progressive left takes more and more power in our culture. It's really disturbing. We've got to fight back. And a preview, Andrew Sullivan's going to be back with us next month. And in the meantime, we will keep bringing you clips to listen to from the archives. And now back to Cynthia right after this. Okay. Let's talk about the other options. If you don't want to do, um, 16, eight or 18, six, um, what's the next most popular. I would probably say when people are dipping their toe into the proverbial intermittent fasting pond, uh, people will try to do a 24 hour fast. They'll just say, I'm going to fast one day a week. And this is what I'm going to do. And I think for a lot of people, they're surprised

much to your point about when you get to the end of your, you know, your 16 hour fasted window, they do really well until they get to about 20 to 22 hours, and then it becomes a mental game. And then you know, they'll go take a walk, they'll distract themselves. But I would say one 24 hour fast a week appears to be quite popular or an every other day fast. Now, I don't recommend every other day fast for people that are already at a goal weight, but the bulk of the population, that's not what we're talking about. And so they actually will do really well. You know, they'll have three meals on Monday and then they fast for 24 hours and they, you know, they'll have two meals on Wednesday or then they fast for 24 hours. And they'll have two meals on Wednesday or whatever ends up working in their schedule and then they'll fast the following day.

And I find for a lot of people- You say fast for 24 hours. Do you mean the whole day of Tuesday, they eat nothing? Right. They obviously stay hydrated. They can have coffee or tea. And I find for some people that that suits their personality or what you'll see is some people will do five days a week of their normal two to three meals, and then they'll fast two days, two non-consecutive days. And it may be that the five-two can be looked at a couple different ways, but I oftentimes see that that is quite popular. People feel like they'll fast during the week when it's a workday, when they're distracted, they're not home, they're not near the refrigerator anymore. It's not, you know, calling to them. Um, that can be hugely impactful, but really kind of figuring out. So my doctor, I, a year into my

intermittent fasting, I went to see my doctor for my annual physical and he noticed that I had, I had lost weight and he said, what are you doing? And I said, uh, you know, I probably should have run this by you, but I've been doing intermittent fasting. What do you think of that? And I didn't know what he'd say. And he said, I love it. He goes, I've got almost all of my patients on it. And he asked me which one I was doing. I told him 16, eight. And then he told me the one that he recommends. He said, 16, eight is fine. If it works for you, he said, but something for you to try is one day a week fasting where he, and he said his overweight, his obese patients, he makes them do it two days a week. But, um, he said, this is how it works.

Let's say Sunday night, you eat, you eat normally on Sunday. And then Sunday evening, he said for dinner have only carbs. He said, you could have five watermelons and two baked potatoes, but you can't have butter. You can't have any oils or protein at all. And then you're done. He's like, then, then you go to bed. You don't eat anything on Monday. He said, and I quote, not even a tic-tac. So you can't have anything just to your point, the black coffee, the black teas and so on. And then you go to sleep Monday night and you, when you wake up on

Tuesday, you eat. So you haven't eaten at all on Monday. You haven't eaten after your dinner on Sunday night. And he thinks if you do all carbs for that last meal on Sunday, it puts your body into the fasting state faster because I guess your body holds onto proteins and fats longer. It takes longer to digest, right? It's like your system clears out those carbs more quickly than the other two. Now, not to put you in a position of going against my doctor, but do you agree with that? That's interesting, because I'm generally not a fan of people eating carbs by themselves, but carbs are going to provoke an insulin response more,

more strongly than protein and certainly a stronger response than what you get with fats. Typically when I'm recommending that people do a 24 hour fast, I usually say, make sure you have a good dinner with protein and healthy fats, because it's going to be more satiating because I feel like when you, when you give someone carbohydrates and, and watermelon's going to be more satiating. Because I feel like when you when you give someone carbohydrates, and watermelons, good example, watermelons, delicious, especially this time of the year. But if you give someone a lot of, you know, simple carbohydrates, they're going to digest them really quickly. Yes, potentially. But you also think about that the net, you know, and it really depends on the individual. Some people are able to, their body's able to secrete enough blood, enough insulin to bring their blood sugar

down, you know, fairly quickly. But I would not recommend that strategy, given the fact that I typically counsel doing protein and fats, because that's going to keep you satiated. And I find a lot of people do better when they're doing as they're, as they're preceding a longer fast, making sure that they've gotten their macros, really macros, again, protein, fat, and carbs really dialed in so that they head into that next day and they're not feeling so hungry. I would suspect that if I ate a bunch of watermelon and slid into a 24 hour fast, I would be very, very hungry by morning. And that's as a seasoned faster. Well, for sure. I mean, I'll tell you, I've tried it and I was hungry. I've done it actually a few times. I would say I've done it maybe 10 times in my, you know, the past

few years and I hate it and I am very hungry, but I'll tell you the worst part of it. And it's not based on that last meal. It's based on the 24 hour fast. That fast, unlike the 16, eight eating window makes me feel entitled to eat whatever the hell I want for the rest of the week. Even though, you know, intellectually, I know I can't do that. I know it's not a pass to eat. I can't help it. Like on some sort of emotional level, I'm like, I went, it's not just 24 hours. It's longer than that. It's like more like 30 plus hours without eating. I can, I'm having three slices of pizza. I'm having Haagen-Dazs. I'm having brownies. I'm going to have cereal.

And then by the end of that week, I have gained weight. And so I've sworn off of it. Well, and I mean, here's the thing. You know, there is a part of our brain called the amygdala and it's our lizard brain. It is the primordial brain. It's the, you know, fear. It's the part of our brain that governs reactions, visceral emotions, et cetera. And when we're stressed, it'll override the prefrontal cortex. And this is important because what happens for some people when they fasted too long, that loser brain says, I'm starving. I need as much food as possible. And so what that speaks

to for me, and this is a great indication of why bio-individuality is so important, Megan, this would be a great example of why I would not encourage you to push to a 24 hour fast because your body is reacting to the fact that it believes food is scarce. And therefore it's going to do everything it can to bring in a surplus of food to make sure that this doesn't happen again. So when someone says to me, I tried to do a longer fast, but I overate that first meal, or I felt like I binged the entire week. I just ate things I didn't normally crave or eat, et cetera. I was like, well, maybe next time you just do a 20-hour fast, or maybe next time you

do a 19-hour fast or an 18-hour fast. Because I look at that kind of behavior and it just speaks to the fact that understanding that our brains have these very primitive mechanisms and your brain was screaming, I'm paranoid. I'm not going to have access to food. Like food scarcity is a problem. And I need to eat as much calories as I can, as quickly as I can to make sure this doesn't happen. So, you know, that really lingers throughout the week too. In my case, it's more like if I break the fast on Tuesday morning and I, and I overeat there, I just keep overeating. I just keep like, I get I didn't eat on Monday, I can have what I want. It's for me, that one's no good. No bueno. Okay, let's get to a couple of things that people need to know, like preparing for intermittent fasting. So people who have listened

to this, they're like, I'm gonna give it a try. What are like the top three or four things they should do to prepare? I would say first and foremost, stop snacking. That's number one, because you want to get to a point where your body can go more than two or three hours without food. And you have to kind of it's kind of dipping your toe in the pond. Number two, you really need to think about putting your meals together strategically, meaning the most satiating macronutrient that we have is protein. So you have to make sure that when you are no longer snacking, that you make sure each meal, breakfast, lunch, and dinner has sufficient amount of protein. And if you want a guide on how much protein, I would imagine most, if not all of us are not consuming enough. It's really based on

the concept of muscle centric medicine. And that is one gram per pound of ideal body weight, which means most of us, if not all of us are not consuming enough protein. So more protein than what you think you initially need. It will keep you stationed. The size of your palm, like just the size of your palm of chicken. And I'm always like, that's too small. I want more. No, that's great. That's exactly. And I say to people, you know, push the envelope, like make sure that piece of steak or bison or chicken or fish, et cetera, make sure that it's a good size portion, because that is what's going to keep you full. And we want to focus on, you know, maintaining muscle that's super critical.

So protein and healthy fats, and sometimes they're together, like you've got a piece of salmon, there's already healthy fats in there. So don't go add in like five cups of macadamia nuts. That's number two. And I think the other piece is making sure you understand what you can consume during the day in between meals or while you're fasted. So we kind of touched on the water piece. Water and electrolytes are like, you have to put them together. Electrolytes are important because as you move to fasting longer, you are going to lose it.

Especially if you're mindful of your carbohydrate intake, you are going to lose electrolytes, things like salt, potassium, magnesium in your urine. And so you want to make sure you're replacing electrolytes. So this is a best practice strategy. You want to make sure that you understand you can have water with electrolytes. So this is a best practice strategy. You want to make sure that you understand you can have water with electrolytes. You can have those bitter teas and coffee during a fasted state, and that will keep you in a fasted state. That's completely fine. Wait, what is water with electrolytes? What is that?

Yeah. So filtered water. Yeah. So drinking water is really important. Electrolytes are the things I was kind of mentioning. So these are, you know, sodium, you probably have heard some of these magnesium, potassium chloride, and we will lose these while we're like a vitamin. Not well, so electrolytes are things that provide communication between cells. So every cell in our body has gradients that control the influx of these electrolytes. So when we don't have enough of them going around, and for a lot of people that are new to fasting, they will develop symptoms like headache, nausea, muscle aches, they'll feel like they have the flu, it's called keto flu. And what it is, in essence, is that they are not replacing the electrolytes they're losing. So

to me, a best practice strategy when we're talking about fasting is electrolytes. And there are lots of clean options that don't have sugar in them that you can consume in a fasted state. And I'm happy to share those with you. Um, so I like brands like Redmond's and element. Uh, they have unflavored options. You can also consume electrolytes during your fasting when you're feeding window as well, but I still don't get it. I don't mean to be dense, but I don't understand what, I understand if to eat food, you, certain foods would bring them to you, but are you saying this is like a supplement you put in your tea or you get a specific kind of tea that has electrolytes in it? Yep. And it's really important. It is a differentiator for people that are fasting, especially newbies, because they are probably making some changes to their nutrition program

at the same time. And they will lose these electrolytes in their urine. And if they're not replacing them, that can be problematic. That can provoke some of the symptoms that I kind of alluded to. And I find even experienced fasters are not using electrolytes. And that can be the differentiator. For example, for you, when you try to do that longer fast and your body was just like, whoa, wait a minute, this is not working for me. That can be a huge differentiator. So making sure that the newbies stop snacking, restructure your meals. The next best practice thing would be make sure you're having electrolytes with your water.

You want to stay hydrated. It is really, really important. It's summertime. It's hot outside. People are perspiring left and right. Got to add in electrolytes because every time we, so think about it this way, our body just through perspiration, defecation, urination, breathing, we lose electrolytes, but it's even exacerbated more while we're in a fasted state. So really important that people are being mindful about these things. Is that clear? I know one of the things you say is, is work on sleeping better before you start intermittent fasting and be mindful of your sleep while you're in intermittent fasting. I have to say that is so true. I'm sure everyone listening to this can

relate. If you get a bad night's sleep, you are going to overeat the next day. I mean, it is like, you can take it to the bank. So how do you do that? Great question. So it's all about hormones. What I would say is probably, I know you have children as I do, but when they were toddlers and babies, we had a sleep ritual. There was a ritual that we kind of went through that told them it was time for their bodies to go to sleep. And as adults, it is the same thing. We're in this sympathetic overdrive. We're overstimulated 24 seven. We're under, you know, blue, we're in front of blue lights all day long. So it's important that we are thinking about sleep way before we are getting into bed. One of the easiest things you can do is get sunlight exposure first thing in the morning, five to 10 minutes without sunglasses. It will help. We have receptors in our retina that communicate with our internal body clock.

It's got a long name. It's the SDN. It kind of reminds our bodies it is time to get up. It helps support cortisol, which is that hormone that tells our bodies it's time to get up. We secrete the bulk of it in the morning and then it ebbs and flows throughout the day. So sunlight exposure in the morning. That's huge. I didn't know that. And I can tell you, even just being at the beach, I sleep so much better here in New Jersey than when we're at our high rise in Manhattan, which does not have a lot of natural light, especially back in the bedrooms. And it's depressing. First of all, it is depressing to not be without, you know,

to not be with natural light. All New Yorkers suffer from this problem, but I'm just, it's just now dawning on me that it's related to the sleep ritual. Yeah, no. So, so it's that. And I also think about things like, um, you know, right now it's summertime, so it really doesn't get dark until after eight o'clock, but as we start hitting dusk time, as we're getting closer to when the sun will fully set, you want to be thinking about blue blockers. And so these are special lenses. There's lots of price points. They will help mitigate the exposure to blue light that's emanating from electronics.

And I don't know any adults or even teens or probably kids that aren't on TV, a device, their computer in the evenings. And so this will help, you know, also kind of prime the body. We want to make sure that we're not suppressing melatonin, which is that key hormone secreted in the brain that kind of reminds our bodies it's time to go to bed. I think something that's also- What do you mean? Blue blockers, like the thing I put on my computer screen to make it less glowy, like something you put on your clock or are you talking about glasses? Glasses, I think sometimes are easy, because then you can wear them anywhere. And I've found, you know, some of the, you know,

if you turn down the glare, the brightness on your tablet or on your computer, it may not be enough. And so this is part of that process. I think it's also, you know, if we're looking at chronobiology, really thinking about, you know, not eating close to bedtime. I think that kind of goes without saying, you know, none of us sleep well when we, you know, have a big meal and then try to go to bed two hours later. Obviously, hugely dependent on your lifestyle. But if we're looking again at chronobiology, eating earlier during the day or not eating very close to bedtime can be hugely beneficial. I think for a lot of people who feel like wired and tired having a ritual, you mentioned you enjoy having tea, but there's lots of herbal teas that you could have at the end of your feeding window that would not, you know, break your fast. I think about, you know, like dandelion and chamomile. I mean, some of those things are completely fine and they're herbal, so there's no caffeine that's in them. But thinking about magnesium, this is certainly, it's another one of those electrolytes, but either in supplement form

or even topically there are magnesium based lotions. We did a lot of this in cardiology, trying to get people's magnesium levels up, but you know, there are certain brands that make really good quality products. You can rub them on your skin at night. So they get really good. And there's specific ones. There's's specific ones. Um, there's specific formulations. Some there's lots of formulations of magnesium. A lot of them you don't absorb, but like magnesium three and eight actually crosses the blood brain barrier, which is what you want. Um, cause that's very, you know, brain supportive. And so topical magnesium, oral magnesium can be very helpful. And even specific herbs,

adaptogenic herbs, I'm going to use one as an example, rhodiola. So this is something that's naturally occurring. It's a plant-based compound and we know it can help buffer cortisol. So if someone's feeling a little anxious or wired, adaptogenic herbs are another really nice example. And those are all- So as you tick these off, Cynthia, I'm thinking is wondering, like, where can they go to get a list of this stuff? Do you have a website that they can, you know, this is all written down, or they can follow up? Yes, my website is www.cynthiatherlo.com. And we have lots of blogs and podcasts on these topics. It's something that I feel all those years of cardiology as an MT really do come of benefit as it pertains to sleep and electrolytes, because I've learned a lot of tricks on how

to help people dial in on sleep quality. Now, let's let's jump to the opposite end. So that's that's what you do to prepare. Then you do the IF and, you know, whatever pattern works for you, you can experiment. And then let's say you overeat. You've got sort of a list of things you should not do and you should do if you overeat, drinking the water with the electrolytes, maybe OMAD, you say. And another thing that I know you've said is do not get on the scale. So why? Because sometimes, you know, sometimes getting on the scale can be like, oh, my God, look at the problem. I've got I've really got to stop eating. I guess it could work the other way and just being self-defeating too.

Yeah. Well, and that's more of what I'm referring to because there are people who live and die by those numbers every day. It impacts their mood and their emotional wellbeing. But we know that if you've overeaten, had too much alcohol, had too many sweets, et cetera, whatever it is that you've done overindulged, uh, there's going to be a certain degree of acute inflammation in the body and that will show up on the scale. And so I remind people, I usually say, give yourself a couple of days. If you are fixated on the scale to begin with, give yourself a couple of days to kind of clean things up, adjust your diet, make some improvements, see where things go. I just think that the scale in many ways can serve as large of an impediment to your mental health as a lot of other things. And the scale can be a lot. Yeah. Like the non-scale

victories are what we want to focus on, but you know, maybe put on that pair of pants. That's like your tell, you know, the, the pants that you can tell if you've maybe got a little bit more, there's, there's some adjustments that need to be made. You can be honest with yourself. I think we all certainly women, we all have that pair of pants that if you want to really know if you need to scale back on what you're doing, put that pair of pants on those evil pants. We're back with the end of our show in less than one minute. All right. Now let's, let's finish up with the three exercises you say we all need to do daily. And then you've got to talk to us about 15 minute cold showers. Yeah, no, no, it's, it's oftentimes life-changing. So three exercises,

I think, you know, just the, the general walking piece I think is hugely impactful. You know, I always say like the benefit of having an Apple watch is that I know how much I've walked during the day. So just walking is helpful, but doing even body weight exercises, doing squats or lunges, which are fairly easy to do, you know, compound exercises, being able to do a plank is a good indicator of how strong your core is. I also think about, you know, when we're looking at things that are, you know, helpful, you know, even just doing like an overhead press, very, very helpful. I think those kinds of things, are we talking about physical exercise? Are we talking about exercises as in, you know, things that are helpful for us

to incorporate into our daily schedule as an overall theme. Well, I know you like you like meditation, too. I know that and getting the good sleep and all that. But yeah, squats, planks and walking. I've heard you say, I think one of the key themes about whether it's sleep or stress management is really getting us out of this, you know, sympathetic dominant state that most of us are in. We're like, go, go, go, go, go all the time. And so things that put us in the parasympathetic, you know, sympathetic dominant state that most of us are in. We're like, go, go, go, go, go all the time. And so things that put us in the parasympathetic, you know, you mentioned meditation. I think about gratitude journaling. I think about, um, I have lots of biohacking devices and this is something I completely nerd out over and it's not suggesting everyone has to do this, but I think it's very, very important to get yourself out of that rat race brain mindset. And so I also think about, you know,

when we're talking about things that can get us out of that sympathetic, dominant state, I also think about exposure to cold therapies. And it could be that at the tail end of your shower, you do 15 seconds to start of cold water, like you take it from the hot water, and you take it all the way to the cold water. And what you it from the hot water and you take it all the way to the cold water. And what you're doing is you're building resiliency. You're giving your body a little bit of a hormetic stressor, much like intermittent fasting, but it's helping making you more resilient and it'll get you into that parasympathetic rest and repose side of the brain. And that's really what we want to do. We want to provide our bodies with opportunities to not be as stressed.

And one other thing that I want to tie into the eating piece, most people don't realize that our brains are the first organ involved in digestion. I think we think of our mouths, we think of our esophagus, we think of our stomach, but really we have to be out of that sympathetic dominant straight because if we're not, we actually, our bodies actually don't digest our food as well. So even if you just for one meal a day, and Megan, I know as a busy mom, this might be tough to do one meal a day that you are not like on email, multitasking, yelling at your kids, sitting in a car, but maybe one meal out a day that you

look out at something beautiful outside, or you just read something that brings you joy. Because when you're not in the parasympathetic, when you're eating, you actually, your bile isn't properly, you know, isn't properly excreted so that it'll help break down and emulsify fats. Your liver doesn't work quite as efficiently. You know, when you're in this sympathetic dominant state, your body just isn't in the right frame of mind, literally to digest your food. I just wanted to make sure I- So when you sit down for a family dinner, when you sit down for a family dinner, we say no electronics, of course, at the table. That's not just good manners. It's good for intermittent fasting and for your overall health. Correct. Which is, my kids know this. Yeah. Wait, so can I ask you about the cold showers? Cause I

actually, a friend of mine got me doing, she made me do a polar plunge for my 50th birthday. And it actually was incredibly invigorating. I did not want to do it, but I did. And I liked it. And then we kind of started doing it a little Doug and I here and there where we'd come down to the beach in the, in November and early December. And, um, that the cold shower I've tried and I, I can do a little bit at the end of my hot shower. It is pretty painful. Um, but I can't even imagine 15 minutes that my team tells me you are working up to a 15 minute cold shower. Now, how is that possible? And why are you doing that? What is 15 minutes better than the, just the minute at the end? Well, I mean, I think it's something it's a, it's like a muscle. I mean, it's something that you work up to. I also do cryotherapy. So if, if like the thought of doing a longer cold shower is totally unappealing doing two minutes and,

or two to three minutes in a cryo tank is a really, really cool experience. I think everyone should do at least once. It's really, again, it's really tapping into that parasympathetic and, you know, it slows your breathing. It's really invigorating when you get out as strange as this sounds. It also, it's good for our bodies to get a little uncomfortable, much like, you know, you're drawn to fasting as, and I'm sure many of the listeners are as well. It's usually important to integrate things into our lives that make us a little uncomfortable, safe, but a little bit uncomfortable, because that is what builds resiliency. And that is what stresses our bodies. Little micro stressors day to day is beneficial,

because largely as a culture, we've just gotten way too comfortable. And it's easy to continue to do that. And let me be very clear, Megan, much easier for me to take a cold shower in the summer than it is in the dead of winter, much, much, much easier. So, okay. So lastly, in, in sort of the health warnings for people who should not be doing this, there's gotta be a population. And we talked about people who are prone to, or have suffered with eating disorders, they should not be doing this, I assume. And who else? Yeah. And I would say that the caveat with those that have binge anorexia, bulimia tendencies or history, they need to be working with a therapist who is very experienced, not only with fasting, if they're going to do it, but also with their eating disorder. I would say any individual that's underweight. So if your BMI is under 18, I don't like fasting for kids. I get messages about that all the time.

If you're frail, it doesn't matter what age you are. If you're frail, not a good thing to do. If you are a brittle diabetic, which means you're not able to differentiate when your blood sugar is low, probably not a safe thing to be doing. And I think anyone that's got like significant chronic health problems, much like you had a conversation with your doctor, I think it's really helpful to make sure that your healthcare professional knows what you're choosing to do. And that can be as simple as you may lose weight and need less blood pressure medicine. You may need less diabetes medication. You may not need to be on your cholesterol medication, but you need to be checking in with them. So if you're taking a lot of medications, have a long medical history, just make sure you're talking with your healthcare professional.

But most other people, oh, and I want to make sure I mention if you're pregnant or breastfeeding, there are a lot of people in the industry, they're fit pros that tout their breastfeeding know, breastfeeding and their intermittent fasting and they're pregnant and they're intermittent fasting. Ladies, this is like the one or two times in our lives that we really need to be super, super focused on ensuring that our body is not missing any nutrients that we need to convey either to a fetus or to our babies. And so I never recommend that people are calorically restricted in any capacity, unless they're under a medical provider supervision. If you're pregnant or breastfeeding, the weight will eventually come off while you're breastfeeding or after pregnancy,

but it's not an excuse to restrict calories. And that's something I've started seeing and bothers me enormously, because I just think it's a very unhealthy practice for them. I've never read a book on intermittent fasting. I didn't know the one that you referenced up top. But if people want to read a book on this, what do you recommend to get started or get informed? Yeah, I mean, I am a huge proponent of Jason Fung and Jimmy Moore's book, The Complete Guide to Fasting. It is really comprehensive, easy to read, very, very clear on the methodologies and research. Of course,

I am in the process of, I'll have a book out in 2022, but it's specific to intermittent fasting. Yeah. Intermittent fasting in women. But I would say Jason Fung, Jimmy Moore's book is excellent. And that is a book that I recommend with tremendous frequency. I would say, and your website, it's Cynthia, Cynthia spelled the normal way with a Y Thurlow, T H U R L O W.com. Is that right? Yes. Uh, and, uh, yeah, yeah. So I think those are two great options if you're a woman. And I remind people all the time that we can't fast the same way that men do, there are definitely some differentiators and things that we have to do a little bit differently. So, um, that, that is a resource that is definitely needed and, uh,

not available. You can live longer, you can improve your mood and your mental sharpness, and you can improve your sex life. We didn't even get to that. Uh, but it will improve your sex life too. So all sorts of goodness awaits in trying intermittent fasting. And there's so many different options depending on your lifestyle. I highly recommend it. It's really been a life changer for me.

It's made me a much happier person because I feel like my meals are better. When I do eat, I get to eat more and I feel more satiated. And when I'm not eating, it's actually pretty easy. It's a lot easier than I thought it would be. So thank you for leading the way and for being so easy to understand. And for that amazing TED Talk, which I recommend everybody, it's got 9 million and counting views

right now on YouTube for a reason. Cynthia, it's a pleasure. Thank you so much. All right, don't miss the show tomorrow, because we're going to get into Simone Biles, among other things. And I've got thoughts and Christina Hoff Summers is going to have thoughts, too. She's so interesting. She says she's a Democrat, but she is with the American Enterprise Institute, right, which is a which is definitely a conservative think tank. She calls herself a feminist, but she says she's the factual feminist. She calls herself a freedom feminist and authored the book The War Against Boys. Right. So she's an interesting person. I love following her on Twitter. And I really wanted to get her take in just a thoughtful take, not just on Simone, but what's going on with what we're doing right now in our society.

You know, and you've heard me talk about Naomi Osaka. And I feel like we are really leaning into victimhood right now. And somehow women are being celebrated for it. We're going to talk to her about that. And then we're going to expand the discussion to what's happening with the cultural left at this moment in 2021. Don't miss that. Go ahead and subscribe, download and give me a rating five stars, please. And a review on Apple podcasts, if you would. Love to hear from you and love your thoughts on today's show as well. We'll talk to you tomorrow. Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show.

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