The Megyn Kelly Show - Jews Shelter From NYC Anti-Israel Protesters, and Biden's Middle East Failures, with the Fifth Column Hosts | Ep. 656

Episode Date: October 26, 2023

Megyn Kelly is joined by Kmele Foster, Michael Moynihan, and Matt Welch of The Fifth Column podcast join to talk about the horrible mass shooting in Maine, guns and mental health conversations after shootings, actual solutions to the problem, how mental health facilities could be used effectively, the horrifying video of Jewish students sheltering in a New York City library while anti-Israel protesters banged on the locked doors, the need for Jews and gentiles alike to help and fight back, the media spinning the story of these anti-Semitic kids and faculty, the statement from Cooper Union President Laura Sparks that barely addressed the fears of Jewish students, an emotional CNN report about one of the young men Hamas took hostage from Israel on October 7, the true scope of Hamas' atrocities, the Biden administration's failures in the Middle East, National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan's column that needed to be updated after October 7, the stupid and ignorant college students who are pushing anti-Semitic talking points and tropes, protesters who claim to support Palestinians actually calling for the destruction of Israel, the refusal by many to condemn Hamas, a viral social media post featuring a woman telling men all the places she refuses to go on a first date, tips on her suggestions, and moreMore from The Fifth Column: https://wethefifth.substack.com/ Follow The Megyn Kelly Show on all social platforms: YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/MegynKellyTwitter: http://Twitter.com/MegynKellyShowInstagram: http://Instagram.com/MegynKellyShowFacebook: http://Facebook.com/MegynKellyShow Find out more information at: https://www.devilmaycaremedia.com/megynkellyshow 

Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east. Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show. My God, this news cycle is showing no signs of slowing down from the situation in Israel to the anti-Semitism rampant here at home, political insanity, and now another mass shooting. It's unbelievable. Our goal is to bring you the news, whatever it may be, and that we will do today. First, a manhunt is underway right now. Schools and businesses are closed. People are being told to shelter in place in the area after a lunatic opened fire on a restaurant and a bowling alley in Lewiston, Maine last night. That's Maine's second largest city, we're told. 18 people are dead. More are hurt. The numbers

are still coming in. Think about it. 18 people are dead. This is unfathomable for a state where 29 people were murdered in the entirety of 2022. The person of interest in this case, and we will name him because there is a manhunt underway, normally we do not name mass shooters on this show, is 40-year-old Robert Card. He is said to be a certified firearms instructor and reportedly a member of the U.S. Army Reserve. It's also been reported that he recently made threats to carry out a shooting at a National Guard facility. And this guy had documented mental health issues. Just a short time ago, law enforcement gave an update and issued warnings to the public as follows. Our reality for today is that this suspect is still that large. And we want to provide

community support for the victims, for the families in the communities across the state. But we also have an incredibly strong laser like focus on bringing this suspect into custody and ultimately to justice. I do ask the public to continue to be mindful of their own personal safety. He should be considered armed and dangerous. Based on our investigation, we believe this is someone that should not be approached. Police say the first calls for help came in just before 7 p.m. yesterday evening when the gunman unleashed hell on unsuspecting families at a bowling alley. Reports indicate it was youth night.

Look at these pictures. This is a photo of him taken from a surveillance camera put out by cops. This looks absolutely terrifying, you guys. If you're not watching this on YouTube, please go back later. I can't imagine seeing this come at you. I cannot imagine seeing this come at you. And you would be so thankful if you happen to be armed yourself. It would be the only way to actually feel like you could live through this man coming into your bowling alley on youth night. The shots sending people running for their lives. You see here an older man running with a small child. Inside, people used anything and everything to block themselves from the bullets.

Listen as one man named Brandon describes what he did. Snowman might have blown and out of nowhere, he just came in and there was a loud pop. That was a balloon. I had my back turned to the door. And as soon as I turned and saw that it was not a balloon, he was holding a weapon I just booked it down the lane and I slid basically into where the pins are and climbed up in the machine and was on top of the machines

for about 10 minutes until the cops got there you know, just to vote by myself and yeah I wasn't even there 10 minutes Imagine it one little girl named Zoe was grazed by a bullet. She spoke to affiliate WMTW. She's not on camera, but listen to her words. I mean, it's, it's scary. I never thought I'd grow up and get a bullet in my leg. And it's just like why like why do people do this like i don't really

know what to say like i just never thought someone would walk in and just start shooting and taking people's lives away people have families and they they're they're young people who still have long lives ahead of them. And people shouldn't be coming in and doing that. That's not okay. Sweet girl. I'm 40 years older than this little girl, and I don't have any better answers than she does. Do you?

We go through this so often. We live in a free country. There are 330 million people. It's very hard to stop a lunatic from doing something like this, though in this case, he was a designated mental health risk. And we'll get into the facts on that in a minute. Poor girl, thank God she's okay. 18 others are not. 13 wounded in addition. The gunman then opened fire on a nearby bar and restaurant. He went to two different locations, as I mentioned. A Facebook post, now on the restaurant's page, saying, quote, how can we make any sense of this? We can't. We can't. We can't. There's no sense to be made. How many of these do we have to suffer? Do we have to leave the United States? Getting the guns isn't going to do it. We won't crack down on civil liberties of potential shooters. We just have to live with it, Zoe.

At the same time, we're also following a terrifying story, less terrifying, but also really disturbing in its own way, that happened to several Jewish students at Cooper Union College in New York City. This is a big college popular for the sciences. According to the students, they were forced to hide in the university's library after anti-Israel protesters entered the college to head toward the president's office to make demands. They wanted her to issue some sort of a statement. They didn't like her statement that condemned the Hamas terrorists. They wanted her to do better. Well, it seems like they thought the president's statements weren't the only thing they were upset with because according to a New York City councilwoman, classes were canceled. Students were encouraged to participate

in this protest. And if they did, they would get extra credit, of course. And what they really wanted to talk about wasn't exactly, as it turns out, the president's statement, but those annoying Jews hiding in the library. Here's the moment the protesters decided to storm past a security guard who screamed at them, no. The protesters, for some reason, made a detour to the library and began violently banging on the doors to the library. Inside the library, several Jewish students. Think about it. Listen to that. Those bangs are them banging on the locked door. The librarians locked the door and these lunatics are outside banging on it, trying to get in at those Jews, all the Jews inside. The librarians locked the door and these lunatics are outside banging on

it, trying to get in at those Jews, all the Jews inside. That's how they think of them, those Jews. We've seen these signs after sign saying, take out the trash, throwing Israeli flags in those dirty Jews. This is disgusting. It's disgusting. They're disgusting. According to the New York City Councilwoman, while the Jewish students stayed inside the library, the president of the school, she hightailed it out the back of the building through a safe backdoor exit escorted by campus security. What a coward. You're a coward, madam. She said the students told her they were terrified, this is the councilwoman,

and believed that they could be, might be physically assaulted and injured if that door got opened. Despite all that, no arrests have been made, no statement from the school, apparently no discipline whatsoever. The president's safe though, don't worry, she's good. If all that's not enough, we're now learning that President Biden's primetime speech that he delivered from the Oval Office last week, where he took the time, remember, to chastise Americans about Islamophobia, which was weird. We talked about this on the show. It was like, wait a minute, there are 1,500 dead Israelis at the hands of Hamas. That's the story. Why are you talking about Islamophobia? All he came up with was this one horrific case, but it was clearly at the hands of a lunatic in Chicago or in Illinois who murdered a young boy, citing his own Islamophobia in the process.

That was one instance that was terrible, condemned by all sides. And he elevated that one incident as like, you know, both sides do it in In his speech about what happened by Hamas to Israel, it was inappropriate. And now we know most likely why that reference was in there, because he was meeting, he sent his chief speechwriter to meet with and receive the approval of, that was the goal, and they got it, Arab and Muslim officials before it was delivered. So they had to make sure they were going to have some Muslim backlash to their condemnation of the terror attack in Israel. So they went and bent the knee to some Muslim people in the administration, making sure that they would still get the pat on the head they so desire. Joining me now are friends from

the fifth column, Matt Welsh, Michael Moynihan, and Camille Foster. Matt's actually going to be here momentarily. He's getting his stuff together. Guys, welcome back to the show. Thanks for having me. There's so much to go over. It's like, I don't even, let's start with the school shooting because, not school, this time it's not a school, it's a bowling alley in a bar and grill. I don't have any answers for Zoe.

I mean, what she said is exactly right. This shouldn't happen. This shouldn't happen. But in this guy's case, there were red flags. That's how I'm going to put it. There were red flags. He had been in a mental health facility recently. He had made threats to carry out a shooting, as we said in the intro,

and he reported hearing voices. He had been committed to a mental health facility for two weeks over the summer, but was released. Why? What they concluded, why they thought that he would be okay to walk amongst us. I don't know. It's part of, I'm sure what's going to be the investigation, but in my view, and I've been saying this, you know, after a lot of these shootings, we were very quick to release people like this from these mental health facilities. We don't have the inclination or the funding to keep them or the resources. And in most instances, somebody like this hasn't even been through the system. They just go untreated with mental health issues that a parent would notice or a teacher might notice, but very little is done to stop it. And I realize again, back to the 330 million and

it's a free country, but what's going to happen now is, look at that gun. That's a big gun, and it's not going to stop the next killer from getting a gun, no matter what we do. And we wind up shrugging our shoulders and saying, oh, oh, and then we move on to the next story. Camille, what do you think of it? Well, you know, Megan, I have some personal experience with a situation not exactly like this, but that could have been like this. A close family member of mine who was suffering from some pretty severe mental issues, who managed to get a hold of a gun, and having been behaving erratically for some period of time before that, was perpetrating, unbeknownst to most of our family, well, unbeknownst to anyone in our family, really, perpetrating a string of

shootings. And there were rumors and some discussion amongst family members as to whether or not he might have been involved. And there is, I think, a rather profound degree of people having an ability to not want to believe that someone in their family might be in a position where they are a threat to other people, a danger to themselves, where you have to ask questions, well, do they even have a handgun? I mean, they're making dangerous threats, they're behaving in violent ways, but could they really do something that dastardly? Yeah, they probably could. And the urgent need for us to do something about our national mental health crisis, but our own inability in many of our own families to actually deal with

family members who we know who are in severe distress, who might be a danger to others. I urge you to speak up if you see something happening that seems a bit unusual. I think so often, as you mentioned, Megan, we tend to lurch towards the gun debate. And really, it's people who are interested in trying to do something impractical, like confiscate all the guns, who spend most of their time in the wake of a tragedy like this talking about confiscating guns. sober conversations about what we do for people who are in distress, who are in our midst, who could in fact end up becoming a mass shooter or doing something else dramatically harmful to lots of other people. There is something that has to be done, but there is no shortcuts there. I think it requires a lot of hard work and sober, serious conversations in moments like these, as opposed to the kind of political mud wrestling that takes place

with people preening and essentially imagining that they could do something impossible to eradicate this sort of problem forever. But I think it's much better to focus on the difficult, the practical things that we need to do here. Well, that's an extraordinary story, Camille. I agree with every word you said. And we can spend more time on the gun debate. There are over 400 million guns in America. They're not going away. In no world are the semi-automatic guns ever going away and they can do as much damage as the AR-15s. It's like, it's pointless to spend time on the gun debate. They're not going away in no world. So we do have to spend time in the mental health problem. And I'll tell you, Moynihan, I've said this before after other school shootings,

other shootings that involve schools, but it could be any mass shooting. I really firmly believe what we need is a mental health facility to which a loving parent would send her son. We need a facility that is jail-like. It's a secure facility, but it is one to which a loving family member would feel comfortable committing his or her son, daughter, uncle, cousin. And one in which civil liberties are going to have to be bent a bit. They're going to have to be protected, but they can't be the concern number one. Mine and yours and our kids, those civil liberties are the ones that are going to have to matter. Not those of the guy who's hearing voices and is threatening to shoot places up and was just on a mental health hold inside a facility over the summer. That guy's going to lose a little. But we could set up a panel where we had multi-disciplined doctors who review this

person's mental health history and decide for the rest of us whether this person's a threat or a danger to society or not, and we could continue extending the holds. Something needs to change. It's not a gun grab. Something needs to change in the way we approach people we know have mental health issues. And, of course, yes, their access to guns. I mean, you're right on one thing in particular, when you talk about mental health professionals. I did a story maybe four or five years ago when a red flag law was about to be passed in Washington state. And I talked to the people who objected to this and they were civil libertarians. A lot of people like the ACLU was not on board with this and not the type of group you would suspect is going to be like, well, you know, let people have access to guns. The issue was, is that a judge was the person that was supposed to be qualified to determine whether somebody was mentally fit to exercise a constitutional right.

That is a hard position to put a judge in. It was also who gets to bring somebody before a court. Can it be a girlfriend or an ex or a boyfriend, whoever, who is angry about something and wants to bring them in front of a court to kind of take their guns away for whatever reason? So there has to be all those checks in it. And to what Camille just said, I just wanted to add something, is that when that was actually happening in Camille's life, Camille and I talked about it. So while it was ongoing, and when Camille says it's a difficult thing to do, I had that conversation with him. And I remember how difficult that process was like, this could be somebody in my family, what do I do? There's no easy path here. And you know, I'll say one final thing about this is, you know, I have a lot of European friends who say just do something, you have to do something. And there's ups and downs, goods and

bads about the system that we have. I think it's mostly good that, you know, when you tweet something in the UK, you can go to jail because there's no free speech rights. The constitution is a pretty, thankfully, rigid document that doesn't allow somebody to separate somebody from a constitutional right on a hunch. So it puts us in very difficult situations like this. You're right, Megan, also that, you know, gun grabbing, I mean, there's more guns than there are people in this country. It's an impossibility. There is a liberal journalist who used to work for the New York Times, who read a really interesting book that I recommend your listeners pick up called Living with Guns. He's a liberal New York guy. I don't think he's

a gun owner. But he said, look, we have to live with this and figure out how to live with it and what is the most practical thing. And for me, one of the things that has made me drift away over time from a rigidity in my libertarianism is going to San Francisco. And the connection there is that when you walk around San Francisco, you see this is the result of what libertarians loved in the past, which was deinstitutionalization. You cannot force a person who has their own sovereign rights to be on the street if they don't want to. Wrong, because that person is abridging the rights of everybody else in their society. And so that was the first kind of moment where I was like, I think maybe libertarians on this are off in that kind of balance between taking away somebody's rights or institutionalizing them for public safety

is something that I do not in any way pretend is an easy thing to ascertain or to figure out the correct balance. Yes, I know it's not going to be easy because I know, you know, there are a lot of gun owners out there who your point about can the girlfriend do it? They're worried some upset ex is going to somehow get them committed or get their gun taken away. That can't happen either. It has to be set up such that there are multi layers before somebody would get committed or would have the red flag put on such that they can't have the access. But we need to do it. I'm sick of these mass murders where we just have the same dumbass debates every time. Literally nothing changes. And even if we banned all these guns,

and of course you're not supposed to have access to a gun if you have the mental health history of this guy anyway. But guess what? They figure out how to get it. Of course, of course they do. It's not hard to get a gun. What I'm thinking in response to this, and by the way, welcome Matt, Matt's feet is up now. What I'm thinking in response to this horrific shooting, you know, you're at the bowling alley for God's sake, you're at a bar and grill

with your family, it's a youth night, or we'll get to the Cooper Union college students is, I've said this before, I'm not like a big gun person, but in these moments, I want to call my friends, Dana and Chris Lash, who live in Texas and they are huge second amendment people. And I want to spend the next year in training with them. I want the same arsenal they have in their home. I want to be as comfortable with the guns. I mean, they got guns everywhere. I would love to see somebody try to, not really, but invade their home. That guy would get it right where he deserves it. Not really. Please don't do that. But I'm just saying like this, the, in these instances, those of us who don't walk around with guns all the time are feeling like we need them. I mean, I'm talking to Jewish families right now who I know who are

for the first time in their lives, getting guns. You know, there, there was an incident in LA just two days ago where somebody invaded somebody's house with a knife trying to attack the family because they were Jewish, right? That's probably going to be elevated to President Biden's next speech, I'm sure, because it was a Jewish family. Yeah, right, I'll wait. Anyway, I really do think in these instances, the answer to a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun if we're not going to start institutionalizing these people. Matt Welsh, what do you think? Yeah, as you say, every single time this happens, there's this scramble that we all do internally and that everyone does externally of what's the magic button that I can push to make this not

happen. And there really isn't one in a country that has 350 to 400 million guns already there. You can't confiscate them. You have a Second Amendment right to individual firearms, and you have a country with a history of violence. We're just a little bit more violent country than most other places. You know, New England and that weird part of the country up north and to the east that Moynihan is from is a pretty heavily armed and pretty gun-free, meaning like you're free to have guns type of place. It's sort of like Canada in that regard. There's a lot of guns and there isn't a lot of restrictions. How about the South?

I mean, there's a lot of places with a lot of guns and people, you know, gun violence is oftentimes more concentrated in places where there are the heaviest gun restrictions, you restrictions, in places like Chicago and Washington, D.C., New York City, to some degree. All that's gone down over the years. There isn't a magic button. We have to respect rights, and we have to acknowledge that something is deeply broken, either just broadly in mental health or in the nexus between where people have obvious mental health problems and proximity to guns. It's infuriating and sad making. And it's one of the craziest things about this is you wonder in the wake of so much other news happening right now,

are people going to be talking about this two days from now? I'm not so sure. No, they're not because it happens so often. I will tell you that my brother lives down in Georgia and we were talking about, we were on the phone the other day and somebody cut him off and he was pissed off. And he was saying down there, like, people don't, they don't give the finger that much. They don't like honk or get on, you know, like do something obnoxious because you never know. Somebody can have a gun in the next car and the next thing you know, this thing has turned like deadly. It's not like when we were growing up where maybe you get a finger in response, like, OK, that's that's justice. I give you the finger. Give me the finger. We move on our merry way. Somehow you feel like

you've gotten your revenge. It's a different story. So, yes, guns are everywhere in America. That's our country. Get used to it. It's not changing anytime soon. What were you going to say, Camille? I was just going to defend libertarians a little bit. I mean, the reality is that state-run mental institutions have a pretty bad track record. They've been terrible places. And someone said earlier, I think it was you, Megan, that what we need are establishments that people would feel comfortable sending their family members to. And I can say in my own situation, I was the one who ended up getting law enforcement involved. And that was a very difficult call to make. But I was

also involved all throughout the kind of prosecutorial, the judicial process. And when it became obvious that the only two options were incarceration with actual hardened criminals and maybe placement in a really terrible state-run facility, I mean, I didn't feel great about either one of those options. I was happy to have avoided a situation where anyone died or where my loved one themselves were injured, but I certainly didn't feel great about those options. So we do need far better options than we had before. The whole one flu over the cuckoo's nest mental health infrastructure is simply not sufficient to actually address these problems. This is kind of a trade-off. It's a different kind of calamity. And then there needs to be some monitoring of the meds. If this guy's schizophrenic,

which he certainly sounds like he is, he's hearing voices, there needs to be some monitoring of the meds. You know, like if you, there are like alcohol monitoring programs where people are asked to blow in a breathalyzer over the phone. You know, I don't know how they work, but there are all sorts of ways of these, you know, loving supportive groups to monitor somebody's rehab through a situation like that. What do we have in place to monitor somebody's continuation on lithium? You're making sure that they're taking their meds to protect the rest of society. I guarantee you this facility that let him go had nothing. I bet there was absolutely no more contact. You're on your own. And the same family members that let him get into the first position where he was schizophrenic and hearing voices and threatening to shoot people and went into a facility probably wasn't so great on the outcome either. You know, the other side, I just, we need a serious look

at it. And it's actually not even going to be that much money. It would be expensive, but I'll bet you people would donate on this. I bet you people would donate to create such a facility. There'd have to be a liability shield for the people running it. Otherwise, everybody would sue them if that person came out of the facility and then went on to commit a mass shooting. So there has to be some sort of a liability shield where it's like, we're not making any promises. We're going to do our best here. But we need something different. We need different thinking. So everyone can F off if they go back to their same solutions that aren't solutions at all. I'm not engaging in those debates anymore. Come to me with a new and innovative idea or goodbye. This guy, meanwhile, you guys, is still on the loose.

They said they last saw his car. He drove away in a small white SUV with a front bumper that they believe was painted black. They found that vehicle late last night in Lisbon, Maine, about eight miles from Lewiston near a boat dock. So it's believed he potentially used a boat launch and got on a boat somehow, but we have no idea. It's very scary that they haven't caught this guy. And the police are saying they believe he's armed and dangerous. I don't know, you guys, if he's this mentally unstable, they will catch him, right? I mean, they're going to catch him. I think that's probably right. And Maine is obviously a very large wooded state, not hugely populated. It's very easy to disappear in a place like Maine. I used to spend a lot of time

there in the summers. But I would say the other thing to the mental health facility issue, people always point out that this happens almost uniquely in America. Not entirely. You see it happen here and there in other countries, but there are also other countries that do have lots of guns, high concentrations of guns,

and even places like Canada, Finland, Switzerland, where I used to live in Sweden. And I think that one of the difference is, I mean, people access to guns is obviously an issue. I mean, you cannot pretend that that's not an issue. But I think one of the differences is, I mean, people access to guns is obviously an issue, and you cannot pretend that that's not an issue. But I think one of the other issues is mental health facilities and availability. And what you said, Megan, people raise money for this. It's not terribly expensive. That is true. And I was at a fundraiser last week for a charity that raises

money for mental health issues for veterans. And at the end, there was an auction, and I was absolutely blown away about how much money they raised in about 45 minutes. I know that's for veterans, but in general, I think that it's a problem that could be solved, but I think partisan squabbling, particularly on the gun issue, is one that prevents any forward motion on a solution. Yeah, you could set it up such that there was a

children's wing because there are, I mean, I've interviewed the mothers, I've mentioned this before. There are children who the mothers have and the dads have identified as sociopaths, future sociopaths. They can tell. They're the kids who torture the family cat or dog. That shit is real. And you could have an adult wing and there would obviously have to be extremely careful screening procedures for any weapons, et cetera, so that the patients were safe from one another and the caregivers were safe from the patients. But this can be done. We're smart enough and we're rich enough as a people to find an alternate solution to this problem. And it won't be foolproof for all the reasons we've discussed, but it could help. Right now, we're not trying. We just tread water every

time and say, oh, so sorry, Zoe. So sorry. Anywho, and then we move on. It's just, I fucking can't stand it, to be honest. I just can't stand it. And I feel like people like us who are reasonable, who are not anti-gun, but maybe not like the biggest gun people ever, right? And not really pro-government control over our lives, right? But understand, like you were saying, Moynihan, like in some circumstances, I see that those, we are the solution. We're the ones who are going to have to find the solution because the other side just dig in on their intractable positions. All right, let's talk about Cooper Union because this is dark. This is crazy. Let me ask you a question. This may not be an appropriate question as so many of mine are not.

Where are the Jewish groups fighting back? Why are we not seeing Jewish groups in the streets in New York, all over the country to show a force, you know, like a counter protest to what we're seeing with these pro-Palestinian groups who all I hear is from the river to the sea. I'm sick of their from the river to the sea. They can take their from the river to the sea and shove it. I understand Jewish people are understandably feeling afraid right now. There was a massacre of Jews in Israel two weeks ago. But I was looking at it when I saw these poor Jewish kids inside this library. What I wanted in my imaginary world was for them to open the doors of the library, get in the faces of these protesters and say, I don't use the P word, but you absolute P words.

Bring it. What is it? What are you? They're not going to shoot them. They're just trying to scare them. Fuck off. That's kind of what I wanted to say, but easy for me to say. I'm sitting here in the comfort of my studio, well protected. I don't know what the answer is here, but I don't want to see more instances of Jews having to hide in the school library or elsewhere. In fairness, Megan, one of the students told us, the Jewish students inside the library told CBS News that if it was up to him,

he would have taken off the barricade and the door and got straight into their faces, but they were told not to. Yes, my man. I wouldn't ask your question, which I think is appropriate, but I think the most appropriate question is, why aren't we, you know, those of us who aren't Jewish, so I don't really know about where Moynihan is on this on any given day, or on any given day, but like, why aren't the Gentiles out

in force? I mean, right tomorrow, there's going to be a huge pro-Palestinian demonstration, I believe in Crown Heights, over by the Brooklyn Museum. Dear God. And so this is a perfectly apt time for counter protests and also just acts of public empathy and sympathy for our Jewish friends who are traumatized. I'm in a neighborhood which is not full of yahoos, despite our local city council woman who was arrested in Bryant Park for blocking traffic and chanting to the river by the sea. But the old Brooklyn Italian neighborhood, and they have the posters up, the flyers on the trees and on some of the street lamps showing the hostages that have been kidnapped in Gaza and people, small minority people, but are they tearing them down? They have to put them higher and higher in the trees, including right across the street

from the Jewish school that's right across the street from my house. Imagine that. You're just walking around. You're dropping off your kid. You're feeling a little bit, a lot of it, uncertain, terrible about what's happened. And here's your picture on the trees. Yeah, it's my picture. Thanks, guys. You can look on the trees and see where people have been ripping them down. How does that make you feel? I mean, how do you even visualize the mentality of the person who does that? So yes,

Megan, I think there should be counter demonstrations, but I think they should be led by Gentiles because right now there's all of these phrases and slogans that have been sort of allowed to hang there and almost be stated as facts, including from the river to the sea, that need to be challenged. And they also need to be sort of vociferously countered at a moment when, especially in a city like New York, where we have more than 1 million Jews who live here, our people are hurting. Yes, I would go out. Honestly, I feel like I'm happy to go out. I understand some Jewish people right now are telling their kids not to wear their Star of David, not to wear the yarmulke, to be careful. Bethany Mandel was saying she had to have an active shooter discussion with her kids on the way to Temple last week. I get the fear, but I also get, we have to remember here in particular, this is America. We don't cower. F these people.

Nine times out of 10, these snot-nosed college assholes are just spewing a bunch of BS they don't even understand. They're not actually going to harm anybody. And somebody needs to get in their face and make them understand there's no backing down. There's another side. The majority of this country supports Israel, recognizes this was a terrorist attack. And you can spew your nonsense all you want, but there's a much louder voice in this country, much louder. I personally want to see it on the street. I'm happy to be part of it. It's just jarring to me to hear stories about Jews having to lock themselves in the library.

And story after story, we've heard, there's some crazy pieces of that Cooper Union story about they had to be escorted out through the tunnels. I mean, think about being a Jewish person in the wake of the Hamas attack, where they still have Jewish prisoners in tunnels right now in Gaza, and you're walking through a tunnel to exit your own school for your own safety. It's effed up in New York City. I mean, one of the amazing things to me, Matt pointed out that there is going to be yet another one of these rallies, these pro-Hamas rallies, I don't know what other way to describe them, either tomorrow in New York City or Saturday that starts in Crown Heights. People of any historical memory will be jarred by that. In 1980, there was quite a furor within the media when Ronald Reagan launched his campaign in Mississippi after he won the nomination.

And he launched it from a town in which there was a famous lynching. The Reagan campaign claimed they didn't know this, but it's still I saw it in a book like two months ago that I was reading that this comes up. Crown Heights in 1991 was the scene of those who are from the area and remember Crown Heights. Before I moved to New York in 2001, I knew Crown Heights as the scene of an anti-Semitic riot in 1991 where Orthodox Jews were attacked and their stores were looted and set on fire. It's astonishing to me that this is going to be launched in Crown Heights. One would imagine that there would be somebody pointing this out. As of yet, I haven't heard anyone point this out. But the Cooper Union thing is pretty astonishing, too. My favorite thing, and I wanted to read you something, because I got up this morning and I looked at the newspaper

and I saw a story about this on the New York Times. The New York Times had a story about this that had this sentence in it, which I want to say, I don't know what happened to Cooper Union. I was not there. I've seen little bits of video and I'm holding off. But this is what the New York Times said. There was no indication that the protesters intended to harm the Jewish students or anyone else in the library. But the student who was there was nonetheless scared that the protesters might break down the doors. Now, take that sentence and rewrite it. There was no indication that the MAGA protesters were intending to harm the black students in the library.

But I don't suspect that that would happen. I appreciate that the New York Times, after screwing up the hospital coverage, is now trying to, you know, just say, we'll be a little safe about this. But it's interesting and curious that they're being safe now on this issue. And I will quote the British comedian David Baddiel, who himself is Jewish and has a book which says it all the title that says it all Jews don't count. They don't count as minorities. You're people who oppose racism, you're anti-racist, and you're out protesting on behalf of a group that killed Jews because they were Jewish. What does one call that? One would presumably call that racism, but as Badil says, Jews don't count. They were chanting all these same slogans, intifada from Israel to Gaza, however it was, you know, the stupid things that they've been saying. And obviously the president felt threatened enough that she got escorted out the back and left her students suffering and to fend for themselves.

The security guard, we played the tape, couldn't stop them saying, no, no, you saw them overcome the security guard. The protest was supposed to be outside and not on campus. That's why the campus is saying we didn't beef up police presence. But they came on campus. The one security guard couldn't handle them. They overtook the guy. They went to the library. How did they know that the Jews were going to be in the library? I don't know. I don't know how they knew or what they understood, but there they went. And while the president was scurrying out the back, the Jews were stuck inside the library afraid. And this councilwoman I mentioned, this is how she described it. The protesters stormed the school building. There were no consequences. No one was arrested. The faculty members canceled

class for the walkout, encouraging the students to go. They offered them extra credit to do so. So the school was well aware it was going to happen. Faculty members themselves participated in the walkout. They participated. And yet they didn't beef up campus security. There were only about 12 campus security guards total on site at any given time, nevermind yesterday. And then the NYPD did not show up right away, even though they were getting called 911 calls from the library. So yes, New York Times, the students did feel threatened. And then the NYPD told the students later that Cooper Union did not allow the NYPD onto school grounds. It's a private institution and they say they were turned away by the same university that was ferreting its president out the back so that she could stay safe. The dean of the school, yeah, I mentioned this, escorted out through a safe back door.

And yeah, globalize the Intifada from New York to Gaza. That's what they were chanting, globalize the Intifada from New York to Gaza. And to this hour, the school has not issued any statement addressing this or ensuring the students that they would be safe to come to school today. Of course, they're worried about it. And then here's a statement that we just got from the pro-Palestinian protesters. Listen to this. We planned a peaceful protest in response to the school's one-sided stance and participation in the occupation of Palestine. Oh, the schools? The schools participating in the occupation of Palestine? Are they? Weird. Okay. This is all because they're pissed off

that their school president issued a good statement. It took her a few days, but finally she issued a good statement in support of Israel in the wake of the terror attack. You know, we stand against the atrocities and the murder of civilians. We plan to peacefully protest outside the building before walking in and continuing our protest inside the president's office. Well plan to peacefully protest outside the building before walking in

and continuing our protest inside the president's office. Well, why'd you do that? You're skipping over some key points. Yes, you planned the one thing, but then you did the other, which became the issue. Hello? When we reached the library, again, why were you at the library? You're skipping over some key motivations and facts. We were told that it was closed. So we continued chanting. Again, half the story, folks. We know you were chanting about the Intifada, globalize the Intifada from New York to Gaza. Our protest was not targeting any individual students or faculty.

We know it was just Jews, but the institution itself. Well, it's weird how you didn't stay outside the institution. You went right to the library where the Jewish students were. We do not condone anti-Semitism. Now, this is a lie. When we reached the library, we were told it was closed, so we just continued chanting. Watch. I'll play the tape again. They're banging on the locked door where the Jewish students are huddled. So they can fuck off, sorry, a lot of F-bombs today with their stupid, dishonest statement. It isn't true. What they did is disgusting. If I were the dean of students at this, they would be expelled. I would figure out who banged, who was there, they would is disgusting. If I were the dean of students at this, they would be expelled. I would figure out who banged, who was there. They would be expelled. No questions asked. That's me.

There are plenty of things that are happening and have happened in the last couple of weeks that have left me kind of reeling. I am astonished by the levels and the frequency of outright open anti-Semitism that I've seen in the streets of American cities. It is deeply, deeply disconcerting. I'm also very frustrated that we're still in the business of policing people who are talking open and honestly about things. And to the extent you can't describe a psychopathic murderous cult going into civilian areas and murdering and kidnapping people wholesale as terrorism. Again, I don't really know what universe that we're living in, but there is a real sense in which we have at least seen things that should have prepared me for this. You know, the insanity of 2020, of that summer,

where we're seeing people who are having their meals interrupted by these demonstrators who are filled with all of this energy and who believe that they have the just cause and who believe it is their right to not only confront you while you're eating your meal and disturbing you, but insist that you take some sort of pledge, that you profess your fealty with their particular position, is something that happened that a lot of media organizations described at the time as mostly

peaceful. It was despicable then, and I think much of the euphemism that's being employed now to describe what we are seeing on display is similarly despicable. I don't know what would happen if there had been robust counter demonstrations in the summer of 2020. I do know that there were plenty of people who were insufficiently courageous at that time, who said things that they didn't mean in order to try and avoid the mob coming for them, hoping that things would blow over at some point. But this is a time for people to be thoughtful and courageous. I don't want to see university presidents sneaking away through the back door when something like this is taking place on campus.

These institutions, you are responsible for them. You're responsible for the students who attend these institutions. You should be there on the front lines, engaging your students. You should be there offering warnings when you know that these demonstrations are going to have decorum, pluralism. These are our values. The preposterous obsession with diversity, equity, and inclusion, these places are supposed to be bastions of tolerance, and they have completely, completely removed the mask at this point. They are anything but what they have been for a very long time, are indoctrination facilities devoted entirely to promoting some kind of fundamentalist vision of the world. And it is a kind of intolerance that

is insidious and that is empty and hollow. And my only silver lining in all of this is I presume that most of these kids are too stupid to actually know what the intifada is. So when they chant things like this, perhaps they don't know exactly what they mean, but the fervor is enough to guide people to a place where they can do all manner of dastardly things. So we're at a very dangerous place, and it is a time for some kind of courageous engagement on the part of leadership in these institutions in particular. We need clear statements from you with respect to the expectations about conduct. And I mean that even more than I would like to see statements from them about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict in particular. We've adopted this thing

where we now expect every institution to have a political statement of some sort when any incident happens. What I would prefer is a little bit of focus on your own values and your own mission. Maybe just be an academic institution for a change. And to the extent you're that, then again, a genuine commitment to pluralism is what's necessary. A genuine commitment to not this kind of preposterous notion of like petty diversity of appearance, but diversity of perspectives, meaningful, a meaningful commitment to that, a demonstrated commitment to that, and a complete zero tolerance policy for anyone who runs afoul of those principles on your campus. I think you're so right. Yeah. Yeah. Let me just make one point. We're just now getting a statement from her, from the president of Cooper Union. What's her name, Deb? Again, I have it written

down here someplace. Oh, Laura Sparks. Laura Sparks. She's the one who hightailed it out the back. She should have been on the opposite side of that door. She should have been at the door protecting the Jewish students inside that library, not being ferreted out the back. Uh, oh, we got to squeeze in a quick break because I don't know what's going to happen to us if we don't. Um, but something bad says Steve Krakauer. So wait, quick break. When we come back, I'll have her, I'll have her statement and hopefully we'll all be fine. More with the fifth column. They're here with us for the whole show. This woman's I'm sorry, but this is disgraceful.

She's really going to have to do better. Laura Sparks, Cooper Union president, releases a very long statement, which I'm not going to be able to get all of it to say, I don't feel that she has, I don't see that she has in any way commented on whether she ran to save her own ass out the back door while she left all those students in the library exposed. That does not appear to be on here. Um, she does say some of the highlights students convene in front of the building at one. It was a peaceful protest. However, we want to make clear that language displayed on the protest signs may have suggested the students were speaking on behalf of the college. They were not. Okay. Not really the issue, but okay. The protest moved inside the building around three, three 45 to maintain a safe space. The library was closed for approximately 20 minutes while some student protesters moved through the building. We know the librarians had

to do that because the security was overwhelmed because you didn't beef them up knowing that this protest was taking place and knowing that it was unsafe as you ran. We're aware it was the librarians. You didn't say that. They were the only brave ones other than the poor, the Jewish students inside who didn't panic, held it together and made a thoughtful, sound decision about what to do. You not so much. Um, they were to maintain a safe space, the library was closed, passively,

for approximately 20 minutes while some students' protesters moved through the building, some chanting protest slogans and banging on the library doors and windows. Some students not at all involved in the protest were in the library, some but they stayed in the library during this time. They were accompanied by library staff and chose to stay in the library until the protest was over. This is such a whitewash of what actually happened. You're disgusting, madam. Get it together. Do better. Lead. And if you can't, get out of the way. In the coming days, we'll review reports and decide any necessary actions. Why don't you call me? I'll help you. I've got some thoughts. We'll be right back.

Earlier this month, we brought you the story of an American hostage, We'll be right back. him that morning one that read i love you followed by another i'm sorry do you guys remember this story his mother came out and she wrote this piece saying she knew his arm had been shot and she was saying i i hope that there's a mother in gaza who will take care of my son she said i think i would take care of someone else's son if i saw that. It's just absolutely heartbreaking. Well, her son, Hirsch, again, an American, has not been heard or seen since. Anderson Cooper sat down with Hirsch's parents last week, where they shared what few details they had of Hirsch, including that story of their son's arm being blown off by a grenade terrorists threw into a shelter where he and other festival goers were hiding for their lives. After hearing their story,

Cooper discovered that he may have seen footage of their son through an Israeli soldier. After the interview, his parents were able to confirm that that tape was of their son, Hirsch. In the video we're about to show you, which we warn you is disturbing, you will see Hirsch moments after his arm is blown off, as he and several other wounded hostages are forced into the bed of a truck by Hamas terrorists. Take a listen to Anderson Cooper's report. God is great, the gunman shouts, recording on his phone. He checks a car, looking for anyone else hiding.

Other gunmen shout as they bring survivors from the shelter. Come, come, they yell. Load them. That's Hirsch on the right with another hostage. His left hand and part of his arm is blown off. The bone sticks out. The other hostage appears wounded as well. Another wounded hostage is dragged by his hair and tossed into the truck. A fourth man is thrown on top of them. These barbarians. Hirsch's parents, John and Rachel,

said they have no proof of life from their son. They spoke of the pain of waiting, of not knowing, but still sending messages to their son. How were you able to get through each day? I personally feel like we have to keep running to the end of the earth to save him. And we have to try to go

believing that somehow he got treatment and he's there and he's in pain and he's suffering, but he's alive and he's there. And there are also the moments in this universe that we now live where you say maybe he died on the truck maybe he bled out in that truck maybe he died yesterday maybe he died five minutes ago we have a porch that's facing south and i went out friday night and i was like screaming to him i'm hoping just because friday night you know we bless our children traditionally and so i was screaming the blessing to him. Because Friday night, you know, we bless our children traditionally. And so I was screaming the blessing to him with my hands up. I usually put my hands on his head when he's home. What does the blessing say? It says, may God bless you and keep you. May God's face shine upon you. Absolutely unimaginable.

Back with us now, host of the fifth column, Matt Welsh, Michael Moynihan and Camille Foster. So, so heartbreaking and so hard to talk about. But, you know, I got to the point the other day, guys, where I was like, I can't I can't take any more of this. Like, I cannot take any more of the Twitter feeds with just such horrific violence casually fed to me as I'm scrolling on X or even on our show, you know, doing a deep dive in and out of a story like the one we just did. It's too much, you know, it's like overwhelming, but I, we have to, like we, you could do more than we do. I I'm doing what I'm capable of doing as a human who still has to report the news. And the reason I think we have to is because of these assholes pulling down the posters of the hostages, the people who automatically are trying to change this into the same priors that we've, that we've always seen on like, well, Palestine, Israel, it's

complicated, you know, as opposed to like actually understanding the nature of a terrorist attack that just happened by one side against the other. And I think those stories remind us of what the Israelis are dealing with as we listen to, I mean, everyone, including the president say two state solution, two state solution to, okay, that's, that's not going to happen. It's just, they've been offered it a million times, Hamas. They don't want it. They don't accept it. If they were going to go for it, it would have happened already. Here he is, the latest version. Back to that. It's Sat 9. Israelis and Palestinians equally deserve to live side by side in safety, dignity and peace.

And there's no going back to the status quo as it stood on October the 6th. That means ensuring Hamas can no longer terrorize Israel and use Palestinian civilians as human shields. It also means that when this crisis is over, there has to be a vision of what comes next. And in our view, it has to be a two-state solution. You know, that'd be great, but it doesn't look like it's going to happen. And what needs to happen right now, as far as I can tell, is Hamas needs to go away. And he made a reference to it.

I mean, Hamas can no longer exist. It's a terrorist organization. They tried living in peace. There was a ceasefire on October 6th that the Israelis tried and Hamas blew it up and they blew up Hersh's arm and God knows what else. What do you guys think? Let's be clear about one thing. And one thing that I've heard ad infinitum from incredibly stupid people who have seemed to crawl out from under their rocks in the past two weeks to annoy and disgust me with their kind of moral idiocy when it comes to this conflict. A ceasefire is asking for Israel to surrender. A ceasefire requires two people to agree to ceasefire. This is not something that has happened. Hamas is not saying, okay, well, let's just do this. And you guys stay there and we stay here and there's some sort of solution. all the presidents since 1948 who have said everybody deserves to live in peace. Correct. But the parties involved need to agree to this. And the party of Hamas in their charter is an anti-Semitic charter, which calls for the

expulsion of every Jew from the river to the sea. That is what that means. If these people out there yelling this don't understand this, get a fucking book and figure it out. The second thing about this, using the phrase intifada. I mean, we have I had people say, you know, you can't use the word black mark on reputation because it is racist, because it has the word black in it. We can't say picnic. We can't say master of a house at Harvard because there were masters, masters bedrooms, because there were masters that owned slaves. Intifada means something. In 2000, the second intifada, I recommend

eight days into the second intifada, there was a lynching of two IDF reservists who mistakenly drove into Ramallah, were beaten by a mob, then pulled into a police station, and the Palestinian Authority police let them out to be murdered. Their eyes were gouged out. They were cut into almost beheaded. And very famously, a scene where people who know this story very well, one of the murderers came to the window of the police station with his hands covered in blood and held them up to a cheering crowd. That is the intifada. Is that what you're calling for? We have to be careful about every bit of language, but not that language from the river to the sea.

We have to be careful with expelling all the Jews from an ancestral home. How about you do a statement of indigenous people of a region, the things they supposedly care about. And I just wanna say one final thing to the video that you just showed. And that stuff is more horrible. Every time I see that, and I've seen that before, it churns my stomach. And the problem is, is you see enough of these videos and you have to watch them. And I

tell people, these are not snuff films. These are educational films to realize that the enemy that we're dealing with. And I want to just say something about the other day, the Israelis felt it necessary to get journalists to come into a room, leave their phones, just bring notebooks and watch a video that they had put together from the body cam footage of Hamas terrorists. And they put together a 40 minute video and you couldn't film it. You couldn't get clips of it. You had to walk out and just report on it and report what you saw because enough people are denying this. And I just want to read this one thing from Andrew Neal, the great Scottish journalist who was at the BBC for a long time. And this is a one sentence

of one thing that was seen and it's necessary to hear. In one clip, a Hamas terrorist throws a grenade at a father and son. The blast kills the father while the young boy is covered in his blood. The child is dragged inside and forced to sit next to his brother, whose eye is a bloody mess after being subject to horrific torture. One of the boys sobs, why am I alive? From the river to the sea. Unbelievable. Unbearable. We covered a bit of that. And I noticed in the follow-up days, the Atlantic reporter, Graham Wood, I saw a statement by him saying something to the effect of, I hope I'm not changed forever. I hope I'm not changed forever as a person after taking that in. I mean, as, as grizzled and hardened and cynical as most reporters are, especially war correspondents, certain things just, they, you know, we're still human. I'm not,

I don't count myself as a war reporter, but Anderson Cooper is a legit war reporter. And, you know, so those people who were called into that room, many of them were right. I know what he means. I hope I'm not changed as a human. Grant wrote a book on ISIS. Disposition. Say again. Grant wrote a book on ISIS. He knows what he's talking about. Yeah. And, and yet he's looking at this as the thing that may have changed him, that film that they just showed. I don't, you know, I saw Moynihan, you tweeted about some polls out of

Palestine on how they feel about Israel. And I look at this, I listen to what Alan Dershowitz has told me about the number of offers that Israel has made on two-state solutions that have been rejected. And I just don't feel hopeful about it. But let's see. Yeah. Yeah. OK. No, that's all right. Matt Welsh, Matt Welsh, we're tweeting. Sorry. Yeah. Yeah, the it's not just of Palestinians in Gaza, but also residents of Jordan, right? The number of people in Jordan who believe that the biggest regional problem to security is that Israel

exists. And that's the wording. That's 94% of the Jordanian population. This is pre-October 7th, but of polls over the last 18 months, let's say, to the extent to which we have good polling, public opinion in what is an authoritarian state run by a king who has strict control over the press and who is still blaming Israel, by the way, for the hospital explosion, as is Turkish President Erdogan, who today or yesterday said that Hamas is not a terrorist organization. They're an organization of liberation, says the NATO ally president. The surrounding countries and their authoritarian leaders have been using Israel as a scapegoat and the Palestinian issue as kind of safety valve issue, regardless of what one thinks about the legitimate claims of residents of the West Bank to live a life of more dignity than they currently do. I have a lot of empathy for their plight.

And I also think that when 60 plus percent of Jordanians say that they cheer when Hamas fires rockets into Israel, that we have a problem. And this is from a government that has officially recognized Israel, which their population despises. And this is the reality that Israelis have been telling us about for a really long time and been trying to create their zone, their space of safety within a really hostile territory and neighborhood and have managed a kind of miraculous system there in the desert that is worth thinking about. So what we saw, I mean, the part about Joe Biden's speech that October 6th, that status quo can't be reached. There's a couple of different ways to read that. But I think one of them that is true, whether or not

it's his intention, I think it might even be his intention, is that Israel can no longer take as a status quo having somebody on their border just lobbing rockets and saying that we need to destroy Israel. Israel is going to have a say in the security arrangements of Gaza for a long time, even if they're not going to occupy, which the Biden administration does not want them to do. And I would imagine a lot of Israelis don't want them to do either. It's a big, awful mess. But they are going to have their fingers all up inside whatever security arrangement and lethality is available to Gaza, certainly. And then if there's any possibility of having more autonomy for Palestinians in the West Bank, that is going to be something that the Israeli security forces

are going to be entirely in. And you have to, if you're going to look for a potential diplomatic solution in the future of this very long conflict, that's to be part of it it's not going to be fantasy land where you can just imagine let's just have a quick snap election see who wins and they can do whatever they want that's not how that's going to look like yeah we tried that and it failed the talk of having the un run the new gaza camille is a joke the un they support hamas i mean they're they've made very clear so but very clear. But here's what concerns me right now, among other things. I feel like the pro-Hamas side is making inroads. The polls show the vast majority of Americans support Israel, but in the wake of the bombing campaign, the retaliatory

bombing campaign by Israel, these Hamas groups and their sympathizers are very, very skilled propagandists. And they're everywhere. That's why it's one of the reasons it's bothering me. We don't see, like, the pro-Israel crowd out there on the streets. They're everywhere with these chants. And all over the world we see these protests. So what happens now? Israel goes in there.

It does what it must do for justice and to restore its own safety. It's the ability of its own citizens to live in peace. And that's going to take a while. Whether it's a ground invasion or something else, it's going to take a while and it's going to be very deadly on both sides. And the public sentiment is going to build against Israel because not everybody's doing what we're doing. And the young people in this country on the college campuses are at least 50% against Israel. And so how does it land? You know, so it's over. Israel is likely to win, given its military superiority, of course, barring the meaningful involvement of third parties

on the other side. And then it really will be an occupier of Gaza, which it wasn't. And the groundswell of hate built because now it's killed even more Palestinians. And understandably, I understand why, but I just see this going down a path that is unwinnable. Yeah, the thing about the empty slogans

at this point, like two-state solution, that is so frustrating is that this time is because of the inroads that were being made with respect to trying to normalize relationships between Saudi Arabia and the Israelis. This two-state solution just kind of leaps many, many steps ahead. They need partners in the region that can help them navigate an incredibly difficult, complicated situation in Gaza. And at the moment, those partners essentially, or potential partners, run away from the table, are endorsing what are obvious conspiracy theories about imagined attacks that have happened in one place. And miraculously, they have a detailed accounting of exactly who was killed moments after an attack takes place. And no one is suspicious of this. It is a deeply frustrating situation. We certainly need better reporting on this from a national journalism standpoint. But the reality is that on the ground in the region,

there is simply no, there's no sane accounting of just who the bad actors are in the regions, in Syria, in various other places where plenty of Arab Muslim people are dying as a result of these ongoing conflicts in recent years. And there's been nothing like the outcry that we've seen associated with the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. I don't know how we tamp things down so we can get to a reasonable conversation about what can be done here. But one has to accept that the status quo before these attacks took place in Gaza wasn't tenable, but it certainly wasn't the aspiration of some aggressive, horrible apartheid regime that was simply motivated by contempt and hatred. It is an untenable, very strained national security situation for the Israelis. And someone actually

has to help them resolve this. If the Palestinians are going to elect Hamas, that's not a partner that the Israelis can work with. They're going to need someone to help them navigate the situation. So I do hope someone rises to the occasion, perhaps the Egyptians, but I'm not holding out hope at the moment. And the peace that existed on October 6th was an illusion. It was a mirage. It didn't exist at all. And so, yeah, there's no going back. I do want to spend one minute on some politics here because Jake Sullivan, National Security Advisor, this is unbelievable.

Did you guys see this? Yeah. He dropped a piece in Foreign Affairs magazine. And it's incredible what he wrote. And they allowed him to go back and scrub it for the online version. So the print piece was released. And then they allowed him, this is how we know the differences between the two, to go back and scrub the online version of what he had said prior to the attack on the Israelis. And I'm just going to give you a couple of, um, okay. The dep, uh, the deputy editor of tablet magazine posted all this on X Jeremy Stern, what he calls deleted gems from the original. Okay. This is what Jake Sullivan, our national security adviser, was saying right before the terrorist attack on Israel. Things like the Israeli-Palestinian situation is tense. Yes. OK, good. Particularly in the West Bank. You're close. But in the face

of serious frictions, we have de-escalated crises in Gaza. Jake, wow. OK, it's tense in the West Bank in particular, but in Gaza, things have de-escalated. Wrong, wrong and wrong. And restored direct diplomacy between the parties after years of its absence. My God. He goes on. When Biden became president, U.S. troops were under regular attack in Iraq and Syria. Such attacks, at least for now, have largely stopped. We know from reporting this week, we had two dozen service members hurt by drones that went over our bases in the wake of this terrorist attack in those exact places. Another fail. Biden's disciplined approach frees up resources for other global priorities. It reduces the risk of new Middle Eastern conflicts and ensures the

U.S. interests are protected on a far more sustainable basis. Wrong, wrong, and wrong. And then we have this. We have acted militarily to protect U.S. personnel and we have enhanced deterrence. We have enhanced deterrence combined with diplomacy to discourage further iranian aggression he ends with the region all this deleted the foreign affairs allowed him to delete this from the online version the region is quieter than it has been for decades the progress is fragile to be sure oh jake truer words never spoken there but it is also not an accident. Biden's approach returns discipline to. And the press saying, we'll help you out, brother. We'll just delete, delete, delete, delete backspace. So what do you guys think of it? I mean, if that, by the way, that's just an admission of failure. It said, we,

this is what we're planning on doing. And then, oh, by the way, none of it happened. If these people were halfway honest, which of course they're not, which is why they work in Washington, DC, they would, he would actually go back to this and say, here is where actually we got this totally wrong. I would admire that. Somebody said, this is what it was before, and this is actually what happened. And these are the signs we missed. The Israeli government, the IDF, the Mossad, Shin Bet, they're all having to deal with this now.

And they're saying, we're going to put this aside at the moment and try to go into Gaza and actually do what we need to do. The thing that nobody points out, and these guys don't point out. Can I just say something quickly, Moynihan? He did add an addendum, which doesn't say any of that. It doesn't say that. It only pulls out a couple of those choice phrases like, I said the progress was fragile, that perennial changes, challenges remained. And it says, you know, we're October 7th attacks have cast a shadow over the entire regional picture.

So he's basically saying those couple of phrases I put in there as a CYA. I covered it. I had it. I understood everything. I didn't suspect that when I read that, that fragile would possibly translate to the largest bloodletting in the Jewish state since its existence, but maybe I'm misreading the word fragile. The thing that none of these people are talking about is you hear a phrase all the time, and I doubt the truth of this, but it's broadly true that the population of Gaza, 50%, is under the age of 18. It's a very young population, we'll just put it that way. After World War II, we did something called denazification. And the idea was that people had been so polluted by Nazi

ideology that to get them on the track to democracy was going to be a difficult road. And we actually had to actively engage with democratic concepts when people who had been destroyed, overwhelmed, and accepted fascism. We have a country here where we talk desperately all the time about what kids are reading in school, books are reading in school. Kids, how do people do what we saw them do on video? How do they make a call? And I'm sure, Megan, you heard this, and your listeners have probably heard it, of the guy who used the phone of somebody that they murdered

to call his father and say, Papa, aren't you proud of me? I killed 10 Jews with my bare hands. He's ecstatic. How does that happen? He's jubilant. How does one make peace with a population of people under the age of 18, 50% Hamas has been in power since they took over with a plurality, not even a majority, in 2006, and then never had another election. And if you watch Al-Aqsa TV and see what people are absorbing in schools, it's genocidal anti-Semitism. How does one deal with that, as opposed to these stupid Jake Sullivan platitudes about, well, we're doing this, we're doing that, and then blink, and then you have 1400 people murdered in one of the largest pogroms in the

largest pogrom in the 21st century, for sure. You know, and then there's back at home, guys, right, where we see you mentioned the posters, Welsh, you know, being torn down. We've seen that we've seen the protests as well. We've seen little incidents that which just show disgusting anti-Semitism. There's no other word for what we see time and time again. This is one loser, obviously. But just think about being this woman in this exchange where the guy took over the bike lane that she was in with her kid, her toddler from the look of it. You saw this yesterday on X. We pulled it at SOT 13. All I'm asking you to do is move out of the bike lane. No, of course not. But that's just the law. It's not safe. I don't want to go into the

lane. I understand that. I am, in fact. I knew it. I knew it. I knew it. I knew it. I knew you was a Jew. You people are the devil. Now we're going. I knew it. You are the devil. Now we're going, hey, bro, get your camera. She is trans. This is why you're doing this, because you think you a type. I just feel, I realize there's anti-Semites out there, but like, I don't think this guy would have been like, are you a Jew? Two weeks ago.

It's building. It's like spreading. It's like a contagion right now. I can't believe how loud that laugh was. That felt like a stage laugh. That's not a laugh of a man who is unconfident about his views being at least tolerable out there. This happened to me the other night. I was walking down Fulton Street here in Brooklyn, New York, and these guys on the street doing some kind of preaching. I believe they were black Israelites. And at some point we were walking down, and they're like, hey, Israel, yes, Israel, no.

Israel or Hamas? And we're like, oh, okay. It's not a hard choice. Israel, yes. Israel, no. Israel or Hamas? And we're like, oh, okay. Israel. Hamas, we like Hamas. Just like yelling, laughing, carrying on, having a good time. I tend to look at all of what's happened in addition to the human scale tragedy and everything else that we've talked about. But it's like a margin call on institutions, on individuals, on the media, certainly. But it suddenly will smoke out what has been happening and what kind of concepts have

been sort of bubbling up unchallenged. This also happened in September 11th and elsewhere. And to be clear, that margin call can be answered by people who have the correct moral outrage right now, but then back a bunch of policies that turned out to be really bad, as I think happened after September 11th as well. So this works in a lot of different ways, but on a basic moral way, we are seeing a margin call and discovering that there is some out and proud anti-Semitism in this country to a degree that I think has been surprising to most people, except those who've been obsessing over especially left-wing anti, but not only, anti-Semitism over the last several years. Those people are doing a kind of I told you so these days.

It is shocking to hear. And back to you. Oh, Welsh froze. All right, stand by. We we're gonna go get him back um it's fine because i wanted to ask camille a question anyway matt was getting boring yeah cut him out jk love him let's talk about what's happening on the college campuses camille because the of course we're showing this you know the guy on the bike and we're showing stuff that's happening overseas and we're showing what's happening at the New York University, you know, Cooper Union. But at New York University, NYU, it's a weird kind of ground zero in some of this.

It and UPenn have been embarrassed, along with Harvard, probably more than any other institution. That's saying something. We saw the other day NYU students staging a pro- Hamas walkout. I'll show you a little bit of that before I get to the latest on right now. Workman, here's the walk it. We don't want no Jewish state. We want all of it. I mean, I'm thinking maybe the two state solution is not really what's going to solve it for them, Camille. But the college campuses are out of control, and those are our future leaders. And before I toss it to you, I want to show you Raina Workman. Raina is the woman. She wants me to go by they. It's a no. And she's the one who was the president of the Student Bar Association at NYU Law, whose immediate action, a reaction, as they were still collecting the bodies in Israel,

was to blame Israel entirely for everything, who had then her Winston and Straw associate offer withdrawn. She had been a summer associate. She got an offer. They withdrew it when they saw her horrible statements right on. I support them. And is she humbled? Is she having second thoughts about her positions now that she's lost this opportunity and she's become the scourge of people paying attention? Well, you tell me. Here she is on ABC on Tuesday. Do you condemn Hamas's actions on October 7th? I think what I use my platform for and who I condemn was pretty clear by my message. And I think that I will continue to condemn apartheid and military occupation. And that in this moment, I'm focused on calling for an intergenocide and calling for an immediate ceasefire. She's right. She was clear the first time.

You can give her that point. She was. Wow. We just had a conversation with Greg Lukianoff, the CEO of FIRE, and I'm on the board at FIRE. So he pays very close attention to what's happening here on all sides and has for a very long time been kind of detailing the rot on various college campuses. And I think it is entirely appropriate, perhaps not even appropriate.

It is necessary for us to spend a fair amount of time talking about the rank and anti-Semitism that we're seeing, the degree to which these ideas are being taken on board. But I think it's also really important to pay special attention to the fact that it really does seem that there is something socially, culturally, and even institutionally that has allowed for us to see a generation of young people, perhaps, certainly, I think, wide swaths of the American populace, be conditioned in such a way that they apparently can take any number of really bad ideas on board and suddenly they become the most important and urgent concern of their lives. They don't have any perhaps experience or knowledge of the geopolitical situation in the Middle East, but suddenly after just a little bit of priming, they find themselves able to recite an entire dossier of horrible crimes that have been committed by one side, but certainly that could justify just about anything on the other side. We've seen a pretty

steady increase in the percentage of people who will report to pollsters that they believe that at some point political violence is justified. People who insist that they feel uncomfortable sharing their honest opinions on college campuses. Those conditions have helped to create the circumstance that we find ourselves in today. And the way that we respond to that, I think, is incredibly important. It is worth acknowledging that one of the things that was most egregious about what was happening during 2020 when left-wing protesters were kind of taking over certain areas is that they were kind of fundamentalist, that they were uncompromising, that there was a pretty determined effort to

eviscerate any distinction between people who had genuinely bad ideas and people who, on the margins, just disagreed with something politically or disagreed with something philosophically on very virtuous and noble grounds. And I think respecting that difference is absolutely vital and important. Being wary of sort of blacklist campaigns that have spun up in recent weeks to identify, in some cases, entire groups of people, anyone even tangentially associated with an organization, and say, we won't hire those people. I think that there's a mistake in doing that. But when you see someone who is committed to particular ugly ideas, who is committed

to kind of xenophobic notions, who's committed to the annihilation of a particular nation state, and who knows, the wholesale removal of a population from an area, like that is something that's disconcerting. And if an individual company is making a determination that they don't want people like that working for them, it makes a hell of a lot of sense. But what's imperative is to be very specific and detailed when you are rejecting people on those grounds and not to simply engage in these categorical denunciations that are vague and nonspecific. Someone made an intolerant statement and then you never find out what the intolerant statement is. So I hope that as we are navigating these things and as universities do and as people of good conscience do,

that we'll always make it a point to draw lines, to make the distinctions where other people haven't. Because there's a real risk of falling into a situation where we're just exchanging categorical denunciations and things beget this kind of beginning this kind of reactionary spiral. And I don't I don't want to see that either as much as I am inclined to see us genuinely confront the again, really ugly specter of anti-Semitism in our midst. And I think it's real and it's tangible. But I do think it's possible to maintain concern about both things. I mean, I agree with you that just because you may have been part of a group that signed one of these letters, that doesn't necessarily mean you should never be hired. But the people who actually signed the letters, the people who pushed those letters denouncing Israel and only Israel as they were still counting the number of babies dead, they they can F off. I never I want to know their names. I will never hire them.

Rhino Workman, who is in my former field as a lawyer, good luck. Winston and Strawn's not the only one who's not going to hire you. No one is going to hire you other than those lunatics at the UN Human Rights Council. Maybe they'll want you. But individuals like that who have outed themselves as these, look at her. Here she is. She's doing, she's doing well. She's favorite thing of pulling down the posters here. She's in Brown here for the viewers who are watching this at home. She's pulling down the posters. There she is. She doesn't want you to see or think about the children or the innocence being held hostage in. And I want to know who the girl next door is too. There is zero chance of me hiring these girls. I hope no one hires them.

I am 100% in favor of them suffering when it comes to gainful employment. I am really firm on it. There's a difference between having one side, having more sympathies towards one side and this to you and supporting terror. That's what they're doing. They're supporting terror. You've got to have a screw loose. You're a nutcase if that's what you say in the face of the stories that we're presenting to just say, no, it's all Israel's fault. Go Hamas. That's what they're saying, Moynihan. I'm I mean, it's it's often overlooked, too, that when these people are having job offers withdrawn, that this is framed as a speech issue. OK, I'm willing to to to have that conversation. But the action of pulling people's posters down, by the way,

is itself a speech issue. You're trying to kind of squelch somebody else's. Put a poster next to it. You want to put a Hamas poster up? Fine. You want to look as if a psycho. And by the way, the prevalence of this stuff, the ubiquity of this stuff, Matt saw it the other day. I saw it last week. I was walking down Madison Avenue. I have a witness and the witness is a woman that had to restrain me, which is why I didn't do anything. Seeing a woman tearing these posters down and she looked at me and she said, Michael. And I said, I know I'm going to go to jail. So just let's just get on the subway and just because there's no one else around. It wasn't like a mob. It was just it would have been a bad scene. But I saw this the other

day. Camille can acknowledge the fact that when when i used to live in south williamsburg because i don't just pretend megan i live amongst the hasidim i tried to i am i am the shabbos goy i am there for their protection it's true turn a lot of lights on saturdays i did which by the way i did one time when i was very drunk i was pulled in and they said, are you Jewish? And my response was, I don't know. In certain times, this answer is different. I mean, if it's right now, no. But I was a Shabbos goy.

But Camille left my apartment one night after we had been recording an episode of the fifth column. And he ran into somebody screaming anti-Semitic things at a Hasidic person walking by and was texting me. And he said, I'm down the street. This is happening right now. And it's an incredible thing to me because when you have a handful of complete psycho yahoos at Charlottesville saying Jews will not replace us, that dominated conversation about the American political landscape for many, many years. And that was like, look, I'm sorry to say they're, they're fringe people, people can make the argument that, that, you know, Donald Trump said both sides, he actually did denounce them, which, you know, Camille likes to point out, but he did actually deny he did denounce him. And, you know, after

Trump's election in 2016, it was every story, most of which were not corroborated and a lot of which turned out to be fake of people being attacked because now the climate is such where we can just attack minorities. That is actually happening now. And we're seeing it every day in the glee with which people are doing it on camera and they don't care about the consequences. Well, there are consequences and, you know, I'm here to deliver them. And Megan Kelly is going to absolutely destroy it. No, I'm trying to work for Dan Bongino. Good luck. I know that they were absolutely sending you lots of resumes, Megan, uh, from on the palestinian solidarity committee master they should want to i pay well

and i offer great promotions but hey i'm i could work here no but the thing is is the difference is we see people that have like an nhl contract and somebody goes in offense archaeology sifting through the past and finds a video of them rapping to fucking jay-z sorry my language but rapping to jay-z and then they can't play professional hockey anymore it is rather different to say um we know we have boundaries there are boundaries cancel culture and boundaries are different if you have somebody saying i really hate black people no one's going to hire you and nobody's going to cry for you no one yeah yeah right exactly like if you're out there marching for the KKK being like, there's only one solution. Get rid of them all. You would not be hireable. That's what I see. I'm not hiring those people who I don't care. I'll never have another Jewish employee again if I do. How do I be like, yeah, let's have a company picnic. Let's have a company holiday party. It'll be great. Talk all about our respective beliefs and break bread together.

Okay. Can I just say that night in Williamsburg, I did intervene. I didn't do this all morning. I told the guy, cut that bullshit out, get the hell out of here. And I made sure that he left the scene. He did.

So I did. I actually do what I'm preaching. Yes, he did. This is true. I can confirm this. He did code switch and become very tough. Very tough. I did code switch.

I appreciate it. For whatever reason, I'm a little less articulate. This is not a comment on you, Moynihan. I miss our manly men. It's not a comment on you, Moynihan. But I miss our manly men who will get in there and be like. Megan, I was going to, but there was our manly men who'll get in there and be like megan i was i was going to but there was another manly thing at play i was with a woman who was like i'm gonna leave

if you do this and i'm like well at the same time i mean i have other interests um physical assault it would have been different physical assault range issues we i do those we need you on the street i have notorious rage issues and she knew that so i know i've seen irish rage yes that's also kind of sexy all right stand by i've got something very non-sexy but light-hearted to show you next don't don't go away all right guys so moynihan's making reference to his love life and i got i got some help for you all right so this lovely lady decided to post on x um where you should never take a woman on a first date here's what she said here's the lovely lady she's got a first date. Here's what she said. Here's the lovely lady. She's got a little fur coat. She's trying to show off the round bottom. Here is a list of trying to read

the list. Oh, she's in a bathroom. Debbie Murphy points out as it, but yeah, this is inappropriate. This is how I look in my bathroom. I wear my fur coat, my hat. Here is a list of places women absolutely refused to go on a first date. And thank you to the ladies who reached out to me to help me on my list. I'm not going to do it all, but here's some examples. Cheesecake Factory, Applebee's, Chili's, Chipotle, Olive Garden, The Movies, Your House, that one I get, any fast food chain, Buffalo Wild Wings, Wingstop, Red Lobster, a buffet, IHOP, Denny's, The Gym. gym maybe i will read them all church starbucks coffee dates what's our coffee ice cream dates family functions movie night uh like netflix hulu etc

somewhere that requires a long drive bowling nightclubs nightclubs hook a bar a bar just for drinks you cannot meet this woman if you want to just take her out at a bar just for drinks, Waffle House Sports Events. And to this, I say, you go for high maintenance on date one, you live with high maintenance the rest of your life. Good luck to you, fellas. Matt Welsh is back with us. Your thoughts on that, sir?

Did she nail it? As the great Iowa Hawk on Twitter points out, there's nothing more fun than to watch a generation that can't get a date sit around trying to create rules about the imaginary people who want to have some out on them. I don't know what a date is, thank God, and I don't know which direction you're supposed to swipe, but it just sounds like a nightmare world right now of all kinds of rules. I remember back in the prehistoric era when people like me were single, that one thing is we would meet people and talk to them in a real place. And that's how the thing would happen. Like for coffee or drinks, which she has barred.

Or like a good old hookah. Hookah bar. I don't know. Hookup. Hookup bar. I don't know this one. I was, can I be honest? I was maybe leaving the Upper East Side Buffalo Wild Wings on our way to church. We were going to go to church and pray.

And I was just going to pray that something good was going to happen after we left church. But, you know, that's just me. I don't want to push that anyone. This, by the way, is a list that is so baffling to about, you know, 90% of the people I know. And I know that says a lot about my friends. I don't think I've ever considered taking a date to Chipotle. I mean, like, look, I know if you get like the queso, your might score. I don't know what happens these days. But I usually just go to bars and we get drunk and we argue about Israel and Palestine. And then I go home by myself. Yeah, it's super hot.

Any girls out there, you see the video, you can send me a message. The one I do agree with the wings one because no one looks hot eating wings, right? It's like all over your hands. It's all over your mouth. I just like that's not sexy. But I don't know. Like since when can you not go to a bar just for drinks? I mean, that's what that's more than anything is what tells me she's high maintenance, Camille, because she wants a dinner.

She wants to make sure you spend. I met my wife when she was 15 and I was 16. We started dating when I was 17 and she was 16. I don't understand how any of these things work. We got married. I took her to all those places. Multiple times I've taken her to all those places. And it turned out fine.

I don't know what this young lady wants. You have to be for something, sweetheart. If that's a real picture, she probably doesn't have much this young lady wants. You have to be for something, sweetheart. If that's a real picture, she probably doesn't have much trouble getting a date. But yeah, keeping a man around, like the reason they won't stay, boo-boo, is because of you. It is.

Work on yourself. Introspection. Introspection. You're welcome. You're welcome. A little wisdom from the fifth column. Guys, you're the best. Thanks for being here.

Thank you. Be the fifth. Thank you, man. At subst the fifth column. Guys, you're the best. Thanks for being here. Thank you. Be the fifth. Thank you, Megan. At substack.com. Bye, guys. We'll see you all tomorrow with Jesse Kelly and more. Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.