The Megyn Kelly Show - Media Pushes Vibes Over Reality, and Walz "Stolen Valor" Questions, with Mark Halperin, Drew Holden, Stephen L. Miller, and Tom Behrends | Ep. 857

Episode Date: August 7, 2024

Megyn Kelly is joined by Mark Halperin, editor-in-chief and host of 2WAY, to discuss the real reason Kamala Harris picked Gov. Tim Walz as her VP, how the meeting with Gov Josh Shapiro Sunday raised red flags, why Walz was the "easy" pick, how Walz is a great and compelling public speaker but also a radical in his policies, Harris refusing to do any interviews, her strategy behind it and the broader press refusing to pressure her to do so, Walz attacking Vance using a false smear about couches, and more. Then veteran Tom Behrends joins to discuss his personal military experience serving with VP pick Gov. Walz in the National Guard, the controversy over Walz leaving the military rather than serving in Iraq, questions of leadership that it shows, whether Walz is a traitor and deserted the men in his unit, Walz' comments about being "in war" could be considered “stolen valor,” the way he describes himself and has other describe him related to military service, and more. Then Stephen L. Miller, host of the "Versus Media" podcast, and Drew Holden, author of the "Holden Court" Substack, join to discuss what Walz was doing during the height of the Black Lives Matter protests and riots in Minnesota, his lack of action while his state burned, the truth about his policy record vs. the "vibes" focus about his background, the corporate media's fawning coverage of "cool dad" Walz, the left's focus on "vibes" over reality, the embarrassing coverage of Harris and Walz, Cori Bush losing her Democratic primary, and more.Halperin- https://www.youtube.com/@2WayTVAppHolden- https://drewholden.substack.com/Miller- https://millerversusmedia.substack.com/Birch Gold: Text MEGYN to 989898 & get your free info kit on goldFollow The Megyn Kelly Show on all social platforms:YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/MegynKellyTwitter: http://Twitter.com/MegynKellyShowInstagram: http://Instagram.com/MegynKellyShowFacebook: http://Facebook.com/MegynKellyShow Find out more information at: https://www.devilmaycaremedia.com/megynkellyshow

Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east. Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show. 24 hours in and the love fest with the new Democratic ticket is on full display. Some comparing Vice President Kamala Harris's search for her running mate to the reality show The Bachelorette. Indeed, NBC News reports that those close to Ms. Harris say her choice came down to trusting her gut, with one aide comparing it to finding a husband. Okay, then. Last night, the new pair's chemistry was on display for the first time as they held a rally in Pennsylvania, the same state that is home to the VP, also ran now, Governor Josh Shapiro. Kind of awkward.

Her choice, of course, was Minnesota Governor Tim Walz. He came out firing. We're going to get into his performance in a minute, and we'll take a deep dive into his background. And we begin today with Mark Halperin, editor-in-chief and host of Two-Way, a new live streaming video experience. In these crazy times, and boy, oh boy, they are crazy. You should listen up to this one today. Security for our country, security for our leaders and security for our families can bring peace of mind if you have it. But think about this. Are you financially secure if all of your eggs are in one basket like the stock market right now? Gold and silver can be an excellent way to diversify your savings. We've been telling you this as a hedge against inflation in some of these market events. They're a physical asset that's in high demand globally. And through Birch Gold Group,

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as I mentioned, top, top, top A-plus rating. Better Business Bureau not to mention thousands of happy customers. Text MK to 989898. Today might be a good day for that. Message and data rates may apply. Welcome back, Mark. Great to see you. So have we learned anything more about how she chose Walls over Shapiro? Well, the totality, Megan, of what I know suggests she chose him because he didn't come with him in much trouble beyond his very liberal record as governor. And while she was headed down a path to choosing Josh Shapiro, there's a bunch of things, some issue oriented, some personality, some based on her meeting with him that made it clear that on deadline, because she didn't have a very long runway here, one guy was easy and the other guy was hard. One guy had vast, almost universal popularity within the party. The other guy,

turns out, has some enemies within the party. And she went with the path of least resistance, taking the risk on those liberal issue positions, but avoiding a lot of landmines that picking Shapiro would have brought. There is still a lot of speculation that the thing that did Shapiro in was effectively his last name, that he's a Jewish man, because Walls has been pretty pro-Israel, as has Shapiro. One of them is Jewish. One of them isn't. And while Shapiro may have had his detractors in the Democratic Party, like John Fetterman, senator from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, it's Pennsylvania, which is far more important on this electoral map and in question than Minnesota. So she's still going to have to deal with that. I don't know that there's going

to be an open backlash to her amongst Jewish liberals who consider themselves Democrats. But have we learned anything more about that factor? I think it was a factor, but again, it was a piece of this umbrella notion that Shapiro had a lot of issues. I believe she was on track to pick him as recently as a week ago. But what happened in that intervening week? It was disclosed by Fetterman almost publicly through AIDS into a Politico story that he thought he was too ambitious. That's a view held by a lot of senators and governors who know Josh Shapiro. He's you know, he's a very ambitious guy. And like a lot of ambitious people in politics, he's rubbed some people the wrong way.

Would that preclude him from being picked? No. Would his position on Israel or his religion preclude him from being picked? No. But what happened was you saw over the last week, negative stories of Adam in the press. I call those turtles on a fence post. They didn't get there by themselves. And it demonstrated to the vice president's people that the guy had a lot of enemies and he had a lot of issues that would have been factors, including his position on Israel, had he been picked. And then we get to the meeting on Sunday where she meets face to face with those two. And then Mark Kelly, who I don't think was really nearly as in serious consideration as Waltz and Shapiro. And it's a tale of two prospects. One, who does what a normal, ambitious, potential vice presidential candidate does. Let's talk about this. What's the campaign going to be like? How many of my people can I bring in?

If I'm on, if we do win, what's my role as vice president? These are questions people like John Edwards and Al Gore, when they were up to be on our ticket, they asked. You know, there's this famous thing now that if you're vice president, you demand that you're the last person in the room with the president. When a decision is being made, the staff clears out and you and the president talk about it. What did what was Walt's position? Walt's position was, hey, you want me to be the last person in the room? Great. If you don't, all good. And so on deadline, when she needs a united party headed into the convention in the fall. One guy divides the party on Israel, but also on personality, on school choice, on a bunch of issues. And the other guy was endorsed by Bernie Sanders and Joe Manchin. Ivan's heard a single Democrat express anything but enthusiasm

about the pick. And so his liberal positions are at issue. There's no perfect candidates, as I said. But on deadline, she could pick the guy where it's like, let's go. Integrated into the campaign, no enemies, no threat of disrupting the convention. And the other guy, a long list of potential problems, one of which was his last name, one of which was his image on Israel. But I don't believe those were dominant. I believe those were part of this umbrella notion. One guy's easy, one guy's hard. I've been thinking about Walls since yesterday, and he's the most radical they could find on the trans issue. I mean, as I said yesterday, he's another Gavin Newsom. There's just almost no daylight between those two,

if any at all, which is an issue very important to me personally and my audience as well. And all I could think, Mark, and here's a spoiler for the people who have not seen the movie, The Usual Suspects. If you have not seen that movie, you should turn down the sound for the next two minutes because there's a big spoiler.

In that movie, Kevin Spacey plays this kind of sweet, maybe slightly off character who is part of, finds himself part of this gang of ne'er-do-well criminals. And the whole movie, you know, that there is a big boogeyman lurking named Kaiser Soze. And Kevin Spacey's character gets dragged into the police station early on, and they are really tough on him. They start questioning him. Chaz Palminteri does a great job of cross-examining him. And he seems kind of slightly duncey and kind of walks him through some facts around the alleged crimes, but tries to avoid becoming the center of attention.

And at the end of the movie, you find out that this guy doesn't have the limp he pretended to have, doesn't have like a bent hand that he pretended to have, that he's perfectly fine. He struts off into the sunset and we learn he was the bad guy all along. And I have to tell you, Mark, that is how I'm feeling today about Tim Walz. This guy scares me. He scares me because he actually could become the vice president and potentially the president. And I'm going to be honest with you in the audience. I watched him last night and I thought he was amazing. He is a spectacular speaker. He was charming. He had that rally in the palm of his hand. He's way more effective than she is or Joe Biden is. And I genuinely feel like for the first time

that I can remember, had like a feeling of fear rise up in my throat because I know what he's permitting in Minnesota when it comes to children, which, you know, we talk about one of the defining issues of our time is that the way we treat our animals for, you know, our livestock, the way we kill them because we're going to eat them, that nothing compares to what we are doing to minor children. I get emotional over it. This isn't going to happen to my kids. My kids are good. This isn't about a personal thing for me. It's about everybody else's kids. I care about children and I'm really in horror at what we're doing in this country to them. England has rolled back these puberty blockers into cross-sex hormones, Scandinavia,

all of these experimental laboratories for what he's pushing have all said we were wrong. We were wrong. And he is pedal to the metal, full steam ahead on all of it. And so when I watched him dazzle last night and I felt it, I understood I'm not going to vote for him. I've been honest about that, but I recoiled. Here's a little bit of what I'm talking about when he was at the Philadelphia rally last night. Now, Donald Trump sees the world a little differently than us. First of all, he doesn't know the first thing about service. He doesn't have time for it because he's too busy serving himself.

He sows chaos and division. And that's to say nothing of his record as president. He froze in the face of the COVID crisis. He drove our economy into the ground. And make no mistake, violent crime was up under Donald Trump. That's not even counting the crimes he committed. In Minnesota, we respect our neighbors and their personal choices that they make. Even if we wouldn't make the same choice for ourselves, there's a golden rule.

Mind your own damn business. Vice President and I talk about freedom. We mean the freedom to make your own healthcare decisions and for our children to be free to go to school without worrying they'll be shot dead in their classrooms. He's, I see why she chose him. He's great. And he's better than she is in his in his rhetoric. So, Megan, you raise so many issues there, including his performance, what we can talk about. But I want to start with the issue you raised first, something I've heard from other parents. I'm a parent, too. And I I the depth of emotion that you feel is something I've heard from others and anyone who doesn't respect that and anyone who's not eager to understand it, if they don't understand it on the face of it, should be eager.

This is a guy who was chosen in part because he has a record and a reputation for caring about reaching out to Trump voters and people who disagree with him on issues, I would hope that he would make himself available to try to explain this position and related positions related to kids that maybe are misunderstood. Maybe he's changed his mind on things as the vice president has started to do on a range of issues. But if he really is legitimately concerned about being vice president for all the people and legitimately concerned about clearing up president for all the people and legitimately concerned about clearing up any misconceptions about where he stands on issues where he has

past positions that are deeply upsetting to folks, he should speak out about it. Because right now, he's allowing himself to be thought of as having positions that are not only offensive and troubling to people, but out of step with the majority of the American people. Yeah, exactly. Allowing children to be taken away from the custody of their parents because the parents don't want to give them so-called gender affirming care, which is really sterilization and cutting off body parts. That's what that is. It's crazy. He's not the only one, but he's as radical as they come. Go ahead, Mark. But now that he's put himself on a national ticket, and now that he's got a pass that's being scrutinized, my preference is to not put you and others in a position of wondering what he really believes, wondering if he understands,

at a minimum, the other side of these these difficult issues and is willing to address them, not just because it's upsetting to people, but because he's new to the national stage. He's asking to be a heartbeat away from the presidency. And we don't really have a clarity about where he is. We know in looking at his record that he's got some positions on issues related to kids that people want to know more about. And it would be a shame if the dominant media's attempt to sequester these two away from any serious questions on any topic for the duration of the campaign won the day, because I think it's in everybody's interest, including his, really. I have to be honest.

I don't have questions about it. I totally understand where he stands. Every single piece of legislation he has signed has been in one direction. Yeah, I agree. But I'd like to hear him address your concerns and at least express an intellectual and emotional and a parental sympathy for them. If that's his position, let him enunciate it. But let's have a dialogue. So because his position on this issue, again, it's not the majority view, and it's deeply upsetting to a lot of parents. And if he'd like to have the possibility of winning their vote,

it'd be great if he explained it. He can disagree. Take the issue of abortion. Lots of Americans disagree with his position on abortion. Lots agree. But I'd like to know, when does he think life begins? What does he think about third trimester abortions? What does he think about the rights of the unborn? I'd like to hear him discuss that in a context of putting himself forward for the job. Even if he ends up disagreeing with a lot of Americans on some of these positions, whether he's taking the popular position or not. Right now, it's just a matter, as you said,

of familiarizing yourself with the record. But he needs to talk about it in the national context because he's upsetting a lot of people. And I'd say the same thing about the three other people on the national tickets. They should do the same thing as well. Yeah, I mean, but you have to give it to J.D. and Trump. They'll talk to anybody.

Trump showed up at the NABJ. They do put themselves out there. And she and he, not at anybody. Trump showed up at the NABJ. They do put themselves out there. And she and he, not at all. I won't hold it against him yet. He's only been the nominee for 24 hours. But here we are more than two weeks into her campaign, Mark. I said this on the air the other day. If you go to her website, there's not a single policy position on there. You have no idea. I don't I actually don't know where Kamala Harris stands on virtually anything. The trans stuff, I assume, because she's been vice president for four years. So I'm going to attach her to what Joe Biden did, which is just

about as radical as you can get, though. There's one step further you could go. And Gavin and Tim Walz have gone there, but she doesn't put out anything like there's no policy positions. There's just a bunch of Kamala Harris photos in pride gear. That's literally what she's running on at the moment. And the so-called vibes, that's kind of more we heard last night. How much longer can she go without sitting down? Look, MSNBC is not going to do it. Going over to super friendly territory. They're not going to ask questions that the world wants answered. They're only going to cater to hardcore Dems. That's probably the only step she'll do, though. Am I wrong? No, look, she's got working for her people who are geniuses at understanding the biorhythms and rhythms of the press and of the public. Brian Fallon, for instance, is one of her

communications people. They know what the traffic will bear. They know exactly how to measure every day. Do we need to put her out and where do we need to put her out? It's like a very careful calibration. So can we put her on a friendly podcast with a celebrity and then go to the press and say, hey, she's doing interviews. She's just not doing interviews with you, the political media. Do we need to do anything at all? Or do we need to put her on 60 Minutes, where you can typically get a pretty friendly interview if you give them the first exclusive? So they're measuring it every day. And the clock is running. And it's not really in their interest to have a policy debate. This election to me now is pretty simple. The Democrats want it to be about personality, vibes, momentum. And Donald Trump's a bad guy. And the Republicans want it to be about policy differentials.

Right. They want it to be about the Biden-Harris record on immigration, inflation, crime. And so for her to do interviews or put policy positions on the Web site is to play right into the hands of what the Republicans want the race to be about. So you say she can't she can't do it. I think she can unless the press decides, you know, that she has to. And right now the press is back to rooting for her. Yeah, they're they're in on it in a way, you know, not openly conspiratorial, but they're totally fine with running cover for her. So now this will be the third election of Kamala and or Joe Biden, where we've been prevented from really hearing from and seeing them and seeing them pressed on their policy positions. He was the basement campaign in 2020, thanks to COVID. And now we know other issues. Then he ran again in 24 and he was hidden from us until he wasn't. And the campaign fell apart. And now she takes over and is the stealth candidate. Once again, the American people

are electing what we don't know. We don't elect vibes. We need somebody who we trust, who we understand, who we can get behind their policies or we can't. It's I don't know what this says about us, Mark, that we seem to be ready to allow this. Well, every every election is different. Why would we, quote, we be, quote, ready to allow it? Part of it is because the other candidates, Donald Trump and all the press and a very high percentage of the American people will take any steps, including ignoring the mental and physical decline of the incumbent president to make sure Donald Trump is beaten. That's just a reality of the mindset of the Democratic Party and its allies in the dominant media. Right now, as I said, they know exactly

how to calibrate whether she needs to answer any questions and whether there'll be debates or not, whether she'll do debates or not, whether she'll do interviews or not, press conferences. Now, I will say if she does those things, don't assume it's going to cause her political damage. She's always been underrated because of the public image she's developed as vice president. But leaving aside the questions of whether it would hurt her political chances, obviously, as you've suggested, it'd be great to know where she stands on, say, China or tax cuts or anything else beyond just saying, well, she's got the same positions as Joe Biden. But I'm not optimistic about it because it's not in her interest at this point and may not be till

after the election for her to talk and answer questions. We're going to get to November 5th. We'll have no idea what the policies are. We at best, we've had a campaign spokesman issue a paper statement saying she disavows this position from 19 and that position for 19, all of which she could get out of and say the person was confused that she didn't speak for me. I never said, I mean, we have no idea what we're looking to elect. Let me go back to Tim Walz for a second, because one of the roles of the vice presidential candidate is to be the attack dog. And he was including some very low blows. There have been low blows on the other side as well. Very aware of that, including from the top of the ticket. But here's how he sounded last night.

Like all regular people I grew up with in the heartland, J.D. studied at Yale, had his career funded by Silicon Valley billionaires, and then wrote a bestseller trashing that community. Come on. That's not what middle America is. And I got to tell you, I can't wait to debate the guy. That is if he's willing to get off the couch and show up. So. See what I did there. See what I did there. Repeating the smear, totally false and debunked lie. The guy who started the

lie has already given interviews talking about how he lied about JD with some couch just to besmirch the man. And now you have the vice presidential candidate repeating it. Listen, before I get too high on my horse here, I lived through Donald Trump suggesting Ted Cruz's father had assassinated JFK, another lie. So I'm not claiming that there's any high ground there. But as a citizen, I get the right to object. And by the way, I haven't seen J.D. Vance be engaged in this kind of behavior. I mean, they are so threatened by his background, Mark, that what kind of a guy from the heartland goes to Yale? That's so dishonest. If you read his memoir or know anything about the guy, it's a miracle he wound up at Yale. He was a child of abuse. No dad,

drug addled mom, man after man in the house, including very abusive domestic violence, things he witnessed and was potentially part of. And somehow after joining the Marines, found himself at Ohio State and managed to do so well because he was a smart kid, he got a break and got into Yale where Amy Chua took him under her wing. That is so gross. I guess I shouldn't be grossed out

because politics are gross. Well, again, lots to unpack. I'd say I want to make two statements that are makes people clear where I come from. I'm not here for rooting for either side or rooting against either side. I'm for the American people. So when I make analytical statements about where I think things are, they're not because I want one side of the other when I just want the American people to win. And there's a difference between what is and what ought to be. What is, is I don't think Governor Walz will make that joke again. I think it's way off brand for him. He'll continue to make little jives about the Republican ticket,

but I don't think he'll make that joke again, would be my guess. Other people will. As you said, the Republican Party under Donald Trump is in no position to be on their fainting couches over personal attacks from the Democrats. Just zero credibility to do that. I will say this. I think it's not a purposeful Democratic plan, but the Republicans are burning up days on social media and from the Trump campaign going after Governor Walz. I don't believe they'll win the election after Governor Walz. There's no history of'll win the election after Governor Walz. There's no history of that. Most Republican strategists I know with records of winning would like every remaining day the message from Donald Trump on down to be the record of Harris

and Biden on the economy, inflation, immigration. And so as a political matter, a lot of people are upset about that lame joke from last night. But a lot of Republicans tell me we got to avoid getting caught going after the little shiny object every day, particularly from the bottom of the ticket, as opposed to the top of the ticket. Right, right. Last question. Not over the fact that Trump went to Georgia and ripped on Brian Kemp, who's this incredibly popular Republican governor in a state Trump must win. Yeah, I don't get it, Mark. I don't purport to understand all of Trump's decisions. Was it like ego just needs to do it because he doesn't like Kemp and Kemp doesn't like him and he just needs to express his loathing

for the man and his wife, who's also said something negative about Trump. But I mean, it's not surprising given all the things she's he said about her husband. Is it ego? Is there is there something because I think like the comment about is Kamala really black to the NABJ? I think that was calculated. The thing about Kemp, I think, was emotional. Yeah. Well, that's a three day story so far. And it's really annoyed a lot of people in the Republican Party who, like Governor Kemp and think, as your question suggested, that they'd probably be better off working in tandem rather than in opposition. Three days of 90 days. I'm not great at math, but that's a pretty high percentage of the days remaining. And again, most Republican strategists I know, including the ones working for Donald Trump, say every day we're not talking

about the Biden-Harris record on crime, inflation, and immigration and America's role in the world. We're wasting time. If Kamala Harris can skate through with the media's help and get to election day and early voting and voters say she can be a good steward of a good economy and she can be a tough and intimidating commander in chief. I think she'll win. The only way to undermine that is to talk about the record and to kind of smoke her out on it and talking about Brian Kemp. Is it ego? Is it sensitivity? No, I've been told that he was told Kemp had been invited and hadn't shown and was angry about that, which is not true. He hadn't been invited, I'm told. But even if true, even if they'd invited him and said, you know, you were the former president

would like you to be his personal guest. It is just madness to waste the news cycle, plus two additional ones going after the guy and his wife. So I can't explain it. I long ago learned, unlike some of our colleagues, to stop looking for the new Trump. The new Trump's never coming. The old Trump. There was a bunch of nonsense after the assassination attempt that he changed. I never said that. And I didn't believe that. And he hasn't. But but I will say I will say all that notwithstanding, he still has more electoral college paths today and a better chance of winning Georgia than Vice President Harris does. So he's still got a better a better positioning than she does.

But he's not helping himself. And I don't know. His interview on Fox and Friends this morning was just a classic sprawling mess where he talked about a million different things and barely talked about what the campaign thinks he should be talking about. He has a high incentive not just to win the presidency, but to stay out of prison. And yet he's he's not he's not currently on top of this game. Now, maybe there'll be debates and they'll do well. Maybe he'll find a way to start being on message. But but the experience of I agree with you about the black journalist's event. I think he purposely wanted to change the topic and it worked. But there's no upside that anyone in the world could invent. Even Ivanka and and Don Jr. and and Eric, there's nothing you can invent to say attacking the Republican governor of Georgia, who's popular, is a good idea. There's just no upside to it. I mean, I don't see it. I realize Kemp is more establishment, you know,

so maybe it's Trump again, like it's me versus the establishment. But he's beloved. The main point is he's beloved in a state Trump must win and Trump owes his fans and supporters better than to F with Georgia yet again. This feud has already cost Republicans in Georgia enough. Exactly. They've got two Democratic senators, thanks to this exact same dynamic and pretty liberal Democratic senators. And and yet he doesn't. And and and no one was surprised he did it. People were angry in the party that he did, but no one was surprised. And and it's going to be a challenge to get him to focus on policy. It's not what he likes. He likes personality contests because when he ran against Hillary Clinton, that served him well. A personality contest against Kamala Harris.

And as you yourself acknowledge, this this very talented communicator on the ticket with him, with her, it's going to be difficult to win that personality contest. In fact, probably I think he can win against her, but she needs to be fronted. Not this version, not this version of her, not the version of her that the press is now, you know, I mean, the profiles version too, but I agree the press is creating a false caricature. Can I, can I read you one thing that goes in the New York times that I just find so hilarious. So all this coverage of her is so fawning about her cooking and her going to restaurants. And, but so this is from the New York times story about the buddy-buddy

relationship between her and the vice president. Ms. Harris, a Black woman in the unrelenting spotlight of national politics, wears broad-shouldered suits, pearls, and heels, sometimes crisp chucks. She marshals an arched brow, a studied hand flip, carefully curated sentences. Her wave is controlled, her eyes always fixed on a distant point her movement smooth that's like from a poetry contest sponsored by the dnc about why do you love vice president harris that's in the new york times they have never written a paragraph like that about donald trump and so i say again carefully curated sentences carefully curated sentences, carefully curated sentences. Her wave is controlled. I don't even know what that means. Her wave is controlled.

Like her eyes always fixed. Exactly. Her eyes always fixed on a distant point. Again, don't know what that means. Her movement smooth. So when you say she can't win a personality contest against her, he can't win a personality contest against the Julia Louise Dreyfus Veep, real life Veep version of her. But the version of her who's performed exceedingly well, again, not a partisan statement, a factual one in a controlled settings where she's the candidate of the future who now has rallies that rival his in terms of enthusiasm and crowd size and that they've become cultural events, transcending political events.

That version of her, I don't know that he can win a personality contest because if you ask Trump supporters, why don't you like him? It's his personality. Even his own voters don't like it. And the 50 percent plus people in the country. Yeah. And the 50 percent plus people in the country who don't like him, they hate his personality. So I do think she can he can't win a personality contest against this version of Kamala Harris. You know, it occurs to me, Mark, that. After Trump was almost assassinated and then we went to the RNC. Republicans were jubilant for many reasons, but one of them was. They had just had a near death experience their candidate had, and as a result, they had. It was scary.

They were relieved he was OK. They were relieved the country was not going to go through whatever would have followed. And they were feeling good in the polls, of course, too. Well, the Democrat Party had its own near-death experience as a result of that debate. And Joe Biden falling precipitously in the polls in places like Rhode Island, places like New Mexico, places like Minnesota. And they knew it, that they were on the brink. And now they're back. They're back from the dead. And they're having that same exaltation, the exuberation that comes with having dodged a bullet. And that's one of the things we're seeing

at the Kamala Harris rallies now. Not necessarily about her, the woman, but their chances. I'll give you the last one. Totally agree. Totally agree, Megan. You felt it in the halls in Milwaukee, right? Relief, unity, and excitement about a unified future.

You're going to feel that in Chicago, I'm quite certain, at least in the hall. Relief, as you said, same kind of feeling. Phew, we dodged a bullet, a figurative bullet that Joe Biden is no longer heading a doom ticket. A sense of unity fostered in part by the party, a historic top of the ticket, and a new vice president who's universally popular within the Democratic Party's elite level. And then again, a sense of purpose of we can win this thing. In Milwaukee, they were sure they were going to win. Now Republicans are less confident than Democrats. She's taken two things away from Donald Trump. She's taken it from his party, confidence and excitement. And he's going to have

to figure out how to get those back because she's probably going to have that this week with all that she eventually is going to do. Cookie cutter from last night in the battleground states and then during the week of the convention. So he needs to figure out how to take it back the end of August into September. Confidence and enthusiasm have been Donald Trump's hallmarks. And I'm sure he's more than a little bit confused and frustrated that those have been taken away from him by someone who even Joe Biden and Barack Obama wouldn't have said a few months ago had any chance of being the confident and enthusiasm candidate. Even they underestimated this media and what it will do. Mark, great to see you. Good to see you. Thank you, Megan. Okay. Back with a very interesting guest on Tim Walz's military history. At the rally last night in Philadelphia, Governor Tim Walz also spoke about his military career

and how he, quote, proudly wore the uniform of this nation. Governor Walz joined the National Guard when he was 17 years old and served for 24 years. But some veterans who served with Mr. Walz say when the nation and his fellow soldiers needed him most, Mr. Walz retired instead of being deployed to Iraq. Effectively, that he dodged it. He saw it coming. And instead of fulfilling his obligation, he left early and ran for office. One of the service members publicly criticizing Mr. Walls is Tom Behrens, and he joins me now. Tom, thank you so much for being here. So you served with Mr. Walls in the same unit.

Is that right? I was in the same battalion in 2004, and then I got promoted into the division, division artillery, actually, the Vardy. Then he stayed in the one of the 125 and was selected to be the acting command sergeant major at that time. So we were together in the Europe deployment that we did in 03 and 04. Okay, right. together in the in the europe deployment that we did in 03 and 04 okay right you both of you were overseas in europe not in uh iraq or afghanistan as of that time but then in early 2005 my understanding is your unit got notified that it was going to be deployed to iraq correct it got a warning order which basically gets everybody prepared that, hey, this is coming. Get your will in order. Let your family know. Pack your bags. All that type of stuff. We're going to be training. Just kind of prepares you to get in the mindset that, yep, you're going to be going to war or wherever you're going in your deployment. And he, at that time, was the command sergeant major of the unit?

He was, yep, acting is kind of what we call it. You're conditionally promoted at that point. You're aware, you know, when you receive the rank, if you don't have the sergeant major's academy completed, then you are conditionally promoted on the condition that you pass those requirements, which number one is attending and passing the United States Army Sergeant Majors Academy, which is in Fort Bliss, Texas. And then the other one is staying in the military for two years after they've invested all that money in your in your education. And for the record, he did neither of those things. But no, let's start. Let's start with the Iraq deployment, because the unit, including Mr. Walls, gets the notification that you're

about to be deployed to Iraq in 2005 when it was it was rough over there. And he had, we know from the reporting by alpha news, he had in 2001 signed a commitment to stay for another six years. He reenlisted for another six years, which would have put his departure date at 2007 from the national guard. Instead he left, he retired before your unit got deployed. And when this controversy came up, when he first ran for office, he tried to say, I only reenlisted for four years, which would have taken him to 2005 and still would have not excused him leaving before the deployment. It still was too early. But the truth is it was six years. He should have been there through 2007, according to Alpha News, which got its hands on the National Guard documents.

In particular, his report of separation and military service form showing he reenlisted for six years with his service obligation being complete on September 18th, 2007. Want to tell the audience when Alpha News reached out to Walsh to clarify the inconsistencies between his story and the official documents they had obtained, the campaign, quote, would not answer questions on the duration of Walsh's re-enlistment. So let's go back to you. It's 2005. Instead of going with the unit and being the command sergeant major in Iraq, he quits.

And what happens next to you and the other guys you're serving with? Well, in the fall of 04, just stepping back a little bit, when the selection process was done, I was selected to a position in Daivari, which is division artillery, which is Division Artillery, which is, you know, he was selected into one of the 125 Field Artillery Battalion, which I was a member. We were both First Sergeants together. So, you know, I went

one way. I went to Divardi, to Division. He stayed in the 125, and then when the warning order came out, the 125 ended up being part of the First Brigade, so they were the ones that were active or notified that they were going to war. And I was at division and division wasn't notified. So I was kind of like, well, it must not be my time. I'm in division. I'm here. I'm just going

to keep working. And division gets activated, I'll go, but that's what happened with that at that point. So I wasn't in the 125 at that point, one of the 125 field artillery, and he was. So when 05 rolled around, he got notified. I mean, they all knew what was going to happen. I mean, it was right on the documents. It was going to be Iraq. The warning order was out there from March until May, and then May rolled around, and the rumor came out across the state that he had quit, turned his stuff in,

and slithered down the steps out of the armory and had quit and retired. And everybody was in shock because senior NCOs don't do that. I mean, you basically train for years and years. You're with your soldiers. Your soldiers are literally like your kids almost. I mean, you've watched them grow up. You've helped them shoot guns and learn how to do the radio stuff and, you know, fix wounds if you can and different things and then all of a sudden when it's time to go go do your thing with that you quit i mean that just absolutely was just it was just disgusting

it was people were like well what is he a coward whatever nobody knew what the answer was and then and i pretty much knew well i'm all pretty good oh a call because I'm a 13 Bravo artillery guy and you know and then I got the call about a not quite a month later I mean it was a few weeks and then they you know they my colonel called and you know it was just weird I was out in one of my farm fields and I'm talking to him and he's like well you know you're we're asking you to go and then there was a horseshoe laid on the ground. And I always call it my lucky horseshoe. But other people said, how can you say that's lucky you went to war?

And I was like, oh, I got to serve my country in a greater capacity. And I got to help protect my soldiers and do whatever I could to make the deployment as good as it could be. Because it was, like you said, it was a tough time in the country then. So you went, and how long was the unit deployed for? We were gone all the way until July of 2007. So when we started in, it was 22 months total. We had a six-month train up at Camp Shelby, Mississippi, and then we ended up, we're supposed to be a year in country.

We're supposed to be an 18-month deployment, but then all the sectarian violence started in, you know, in 06, late 06, and then January of 7, and we got extended to help out. We were involved in the surge, basically, but we were already in country. So they just kept us in place and, and move more soldiers in to, to try to call the violence. Can you, can you just give us a feel for how rough that time was? I remember covering it as a reporter in 2006 was when the beheadings started. It just started to get very, very dark, even darker than you'd expect for war. You were there. So were the men who had served under him. He was supposed to be there,

according to these documents. What was it like for you guys? Well, when I got home, I kind of looked at some of our ground squirrels running around and, you know, they're always on the alert they're looking for a hawk to fly down or a badger to dig them out of the hole i mean you're all you're always think you're gonna die and oh what a boil's down i mean i didn't we didn't even we didn't know really that we were going to get out of there until we got on the last chinook to fly out and even then there was stuff flying in the air at us, chasing us out of country almost. I mean, it was really a trying time.

And, you know, it was, they are a thinking enemy. I mean, Iran was behind all of the crap that was shot at us. I mean, it was from the explosive-formed projectiles to the mortars to the Katyusha rockets to the training of the people that went across the border and then came back and then used all those tactics, techniques, and procedures against us. I mean, they literally were the people behind the scenes in our area. We were Shiite area. So they were the people killing us were the proxies of Iran. And when Donald Trump got rid of Salami or whatever his name was, he was the architect of all the people in my area that died. I mean, he has 3,000 people on his head, I think.

But, yeah, it was a rough time. I mean, we did what we could and kept everybody safe as much as we could. We drug out some old 120 millimeter mortars and shot them back at them and kind of got them. They didn't like getting shot. I'll tell you that much. That kind of put them on their toes. I'll bet. I know that you wrote in October of 18 on Facebook, you've been trying

to raise this issue. I should point out, you've been trying to raise this issue since he first ran for Congress. But once he ran for governor, you, you tried to tell the media in Minnesota, you need to know the truth about him, that he left us, he quit and almost nobody picked up the story. The papers that you sent your letter to wound up endorsing him like the Star Tribune and ignoring you. And so this is the first he ran for governor along with two others, with another retired Army Command Sergeant Major who is named Paul Herr. And before posting the letter, you wrote a message on why you wanted to bring this story out. It reads in part as follows. On 9-11, as I lowered the flags to half-staff at the Brewster Veterans Memorial, I gazed at the bronze likeness of Sergeant Kyle Miller, who was killed in action

in Iraq on June 29, 2006, at age 19 while serving in the 125th Field Artillery Battalion. I wondered what that patriot thought that day in 2001, a teenager in school, and I wondered what all the other patriots who had joined the service after 9-11 thought on that day. When they joined, we were at war, which we still are, and getting the call to go is probably going to happen. What if everybody said, sorry, I've got better things to do. We are the land of the free because of the brave. We are not the land of the free because of those who ran. The citizens of the state of Minnesota deserve to hear this side of the story, not just a slithery politician's version of what he wants people to hear. Do you feel, Tom, that he cut and ran, that he abandoned the unit. Absolutely. I look back on what took place then.

I mean, it wasn't like, oh, I just happened to get out. And then a week later, the paper came out and the warning order came out. And I just happened to time it just right. And I knew that was going to happen. I mean, the warning order was already out. Everybody knew they were going. And I don't know if he's never responded why to anybody really, except that, well, I had to quit to run for Congress, which is a lie, like a lot of the other ones, a lot of the lies he tells. But he basically said that. But I don't know if he was a coward when he originally did it or if he felt, well, I'm in over my head.

If I go there, I'm going to get people killed or I'm, you know, maybe deep down he felt I'm incompetent. You know, I mean, you can't talk your way out of somebody shooting at you in a scenario like that. And, you know, he's very good at talking and, you know, doing that. I mean, I got to give him credit there. He loves hearing himself talk. But I don't know, you know, and on the end of it, I think the reason he quit was political because it was, you know, back then one side was kind of it was George Bush's war

and it was an unjust war. Why were we there and all this stuff you know when it was like you know I think I think the bottom line is maybe it's all of the above maybe you know maybe there is some cowardice in there too but you know that was the thing it was like we were there and I was at a huge bunker complex where there was bunkers that were blown all the pieces but then there were some that were locked yet. And I told the EOD, the Explosive Ordnance Disposal guy, I said, well, maybe there's weapons of mass destruction in there. And he said, well, I ain't open up. He said, I got enough work to do cleaning all these rounds that are laying all over the desert out there.

And it was like, well, where's the media when it comes to this? I mean, they didn't show any of that. There was all kinds of possibilities that there was more there than anybody said. But, you know, everything got skewed then. And, you know, it was just it was like an unjust thing. And I think that's the bottom line. But, yeah, he he literally, you know, when I when I looked into, you know, the Star Tribune reporter I talked to way back when he actually said, well, isn't that treason? And I said, well well treason is probably one

level over and above what he did i said because that's selling the country out to another nation you know if you're a double agent spy or something i mean that that's one thing you know he is a traitor because a traitor is basically a person who betrays a country and that is what he did and then then I got thinking about him, about that Bergdahl guy that just walked away from his UN in Afghanistan. And I was like, you know, that literally is what Tim Walz

did. He is a deserter, too. It's a different version of it, but a soldier who leaves or runs away from service or duty with the intention of never returning. That is exactly what he did. He had no intention of ever coming back in the Guard or filling out one more day in combat boots.

When he pulled the plug and was gone, he basically said, tough crap, United States. I'm getting the heck out of here. And, yeah, I'm not ashamed to call him a traitor or a deserter. You did your duty and served the country honorably. So did Kyle Miller, who was killed in that same unit, 19 years old from Wilmar, Minnesota, when an IED hit his convoy on June 29th, 2006. He was among the 2,600 Minnesotans deployed in March, 2005 and the largest overseas deployment of the Minnesota National Guard since World War

II. Tim Walz wasn't there. He was running for Congress two years short of the time in which his deployment or his service was supposed to end. And unfortunately, that's not the entire story, because there's the question in Governor Walz's case of stolen valor. And it relates to that title, Command Sergeant Major, that Tom and I just mentioned. We'll take a dive into what he's doing with that as Tom stays with us through the break. Don't go away. Really bothers me about Tim Waltz as a Marine who served his country in uniform. When the United States Marine Corps, when the United States of America asked me to go to Iraq to serve my country, I did it. I did what they asked me to do it and I did it honorably and I'm

very proud of that service. When Tim Waltz was asked by his country to go to Iraq, you know what he did? He dropped out of the army and allowed his unit to go without him, a fact that he's been criticized for aggressively by a lot of the people that he served with. I think it's shameful to prepare your unit to go to Iraq, to make a promise that you're going to follow through, and then to drop out. And the thing is, welcome back to The Megyn Kelly Show, back with me now, military veteran Tom Behrens. The thing is, Tom, he was the commander. I mean, he was in a position of command.

And so this wasn't just like losing someone who is low down on the food chain and in a lateral position as the enlisted guys. He was responsible for these men. You are correct. And I would say amen to Mr. Vance there, because to do all that and then to drop out, it's just absolutely disgusting. He's the senior enlisted advisor to the battalion commander, and you're attached at the hip. The two of you would lead 500 to 600 soldiers, and they all rely on you to make good decisions. They rely on you to keep them safe, fed, housed well.

But, I mean, you know, it's just absolutely amazing that somebody—I'm just absolutely disgusted in that. That's why it's just such a mission of mine to make sure the public knows the character of this person, because it's just not, it's horrible leadership. It ain't even leadership. It shouldn't even be in that category. It is not just you, as I pointed out to our audience, Paul Herr, another retired command sergeant major has spoken out about this. Tony Wenzel, retired platoon sergeant for the Minnesota army, army national guard said to alpha news that he could never vote for Tim Wallace as our governor. When he abandoned his fellow soldiers, as he did quote, it sickens me to realize that Tim Wallace in the face of being deployed to Iraq would quit when the going looked tough. He bolted good soldiers. Don't do that.

And there have been many others who have spoken out about what they consider a dereliction of duty. I do want to point out just yesterday, the Harris campaign tweeted out a soundbite from him from 2018, where he seems to be suggesting he was, quote, in war, in war. Take a listen to this. Hope will come like many of you did five weeks ago and said, Dad, you're the only person I know who's an elected office. You need to stop what's happening with this. I'll take my kick in the butt for the NRA. I spent 25 years in the army and I hunt and I gave the money back. And I'll tell you what I have been doing. I've been voting for common sense legislation that protects the second amendment,

but we can do background checks. We can do CDC research. We can make sure we don't have reciprocal carry among states. And we can make sure that those weapons of war that I carried in war is the only place where those weapons are. Now, Tom, he did go to Italy in 2003. Afghanistan was underway at that time. Not yet Iraq. Memory serves. I'm trying to remember the exact date. But he was in Italy.

So could that arguably be, quote, in war? Well, maybe it felt like war to him. I guess it's not technically war. That's not a combat zone. You're not getting combat pay in there and you are not in war. That is just absolutely just another Tim Walz lie out there. And the people Italy and supporting troops that went to Afghanistan or some BS story. And yeah, there's, that's, I think, you know, I guess I'm pretty sure Iraq was starting and going on at that time to a certain point. It started in 03.

I just don't know when, you know. Yeah, we were there. So I'm pretty sure when we were there, we got the notification that Saddam had been captured. You know, because he was on, you know, they were hunting him basically, you know, whatever time. I'm pretty confident it was like December of three when they caught him. And I know, you know, everybody was elated, you know, that we finally caught that dirty dictator that had done horrible things to his people and his country for years and years you know and maybe things will finally change that that was uh yeah he that is just amazing i can't believe you think a lightning bolt was struck right there well can you

can you help us understand why that's such a big deal right because i think there might be some people at home saying like eh you know war, he was kind of war adjacent. He was in Italy helping support the guys who were, quote, in war. Is it a big deal to say you were in war when you weren't actually in combat? It's a huge deal for veterans, and it should be a huge deal for the general public out there, because basically it's proof that you're a liar. And if you're just lying for political gain or you're lying just because you think that's

what the people you're talking to want to hear, that's not good as a leader of a country. I mean, to me, that's just indescribable how somebody can do that as far as the soldiers out there there's an awful lot of them before 2000 I had never been to war I'd been overseas training

here and there we were in a cold war which technically was a war we didn't fire a shot but we built things up to the point where we broke the Soviet Union without having to be in a hot war with them, which was good. But for somebody to say they've been in war and they're not, that is like the saying has been, stolen valor. You're basically out there acting like you're something that you're not, and that's

that's not a good thing. That's bold faced lying. I think every soldier knows that. I mean, I just think every soldier knows there's a distinction between being in war and being in a position to support the guys who are actually in the war. And most soldiers would never dream of saying they fought in it when they hadn't, though Senator Richard Blumenthal of Connecticut certainly did and was nonetheless elected to senator as a Democrat, notwithstanding. There's another question of stolen valor, which I teased before the break, and that is this position of command sergeant major, which he held for a short time conditionally, as you outlined before.

He needed to complete some other things in order to actually have the title, which he didn't. But now, repeatedly since he left, he's referred to himself as a retired command sergeant major, and he's allowed others to introduce him and call him that. Here's just an example. I'm a retired Command Sergeant Major. I spent 24 years in the Army National Guard. So when you first came to Washington, you were a retired Command Sergeant Major in the Army National Guard. So you were drawn immediately. As a 24-year veteran of the National Guard and the Red Bull Division and a retired command sergeant major.

So why do you think that's not true? Why do you have an issue with him doing that? Because it is not true. He is not a retired command sergeant major. He's a retired master sergeant. When he failed, when he dropped out of the Sergeant Major's Academy and when he quit, the obligations were not fulfilled for his conditional promotion, so he ended up being reduced to Master Sergeant. So his retirement, which he's 60 now, which he is probably drawing, is EA Master Sergeant.

He is not a retired Command Sergeant Major. The state of Minnesota even brought it out here. Well, he can't call himself a retired Command Sergeant major, but he can say he served as one, which, you know, technically, he was an acting command sergeant major for a few months, and then he didn't fulfill responsibilities and the conditions, and he was reduced. So, well, they kind of came around to the hee-e haw that, well, yeah, he can say he served as one, but he's right there on video and audio that he says he is a retired command sergeant major, and he's not. That's part of the reason that I brought this whole thing out in 2016,

I believe, was when he came down to a memorial here in Heron Lake, Minnesota, and he spoke, and he did the same thing to them. He was in the first district of Congress, the House of Representatives, and he basically said that he was a retired command sergeant major. It was right up in the paper, and it was in there six, seven times. And he tooted his horn, how he was the highest ranking, whatever. And one of my neighbors said well I you know he knew why I went to Iraq and he was like I got to meet a fellow command sergeant major of yours and I said he is not one I said he didn't fulfill the obligations and his son-in-law

is in the military in South Dakota and he was like we don't know that who's gonna you need to get this out there and I'm like why do i gotta do this i just want to be back here in southwest minnesota and live my life you know and and he's like well somebody's got to bring it out there and i was like okay i guess i guess i'm the one chosen man so i i wrote a letter to mr walsh and i basically said you know this is a lie can you just please correct the record if somebody calls you a retired command sergeant major, can you please just tell them that that is not true and just come clean? I gave him the opportunity. He didn't say a damn word to me.

And so I sent it to the other departments in Washington that he was on the committees with. And I told them all. I said, he's not a retired command sergeant major. I'd appreciate it. And everybody else out there that is an actual command sergeant major would appreciate it if he would cease and desist lying to everyone. And, you know, then he started losing in the first district and he ran for governor. And then, you know, our state, you know, they had a great Minnesota cover up with them basically where they didn't want this to get out too much. So they kind of, kind of hit it. But you know, now, now that he's on the national stage, I think people need to, they absolutely need to know the truth before he gets in any more trouble. How about all those actual sergeant command sergeant majors who went

through the two-year training, did their duty, served the country for that additional time, earned the title. Why should he be running around saying he's retired with that rank when he didn't actually earn it? It was a conditional title that he didn't actually earn, uh, earn it out. And now it is stolen valor. I agree with you. You've convinced me. I didn't totally understand it, I confess, before we chatted, Tom. But that's just wrong. I mean, the titles in the military service matter. They show that you've been elevated for a reason. You've done some extra work. You've done some extra things of honor in some cases. But the medals, the titles, they're there for a reason. They are. And that's part of the part of the reason the stolen valor stuff came out when it did because you had people out there that were wearing a combat infantry badge or a or a silver star or a

bronze star or a combat action badge or they had service stripes that showed they were overseas for two years and you know and then they came out with it. And I think they actually said that, well, yeah, that's kind of a weird way to have a freedom of speech thing. But, you know, this whole command sergeant major thing is, you know, there's thousands of people that have went through the academy and have served honorably all the way up to the United States, you know, United States Army command sergeant major, you know, the top dog of all of them. And, you know, everybody put in their time and their devotion to duty and their loyalty and their integrity and respect for others and their selfless service. And you got this guy out.

I mean, I met, you know, a couple E-9s and a couple colonels, you know, air base one time. We were just waiting for a flight. And I found out later that their helicopter got shot down. There were seven of them on there. And there was a female CSM from Iowa. And they all got killed. And they're buried in Arlington. And it's like, you know, somebody needs to speak for them to keep somebody like this from being able to hang on their coattails and say, yeah, I was a CSL.

I was a command sergeant major. I was in. We got to stop these weapons of war. I was in war. I mean, what is going on with this guy? I think he's lived the lie so long he believes in himself. Tom, we reached out to him to get a reaction to what we anticipated you would be saying. No response. He did give a response back in October 2022 to the Star Tribune and said, quote, I don't know if Tom just disagrees with my politics or whatever, but my record speaks for itself and my accomplishments in uniform speak for itself. So is there just a political disagreement between you? He's suggesting this is just political. I responded to him back then, too.

I said, this is not political. This is patriotic. And I mentioned this the other day, too, to somebody. I said, it doesn't matter if you're red and yellow, red or yellow, black or white, Republican or Democrat, or whatever you are. If you abandon your post when you should be there and quit, then you are nothing to me. And you are nothing to a lot of soldiers out there. There might be a few that say, well, yeah, he had over 20 years and he could get out. Well, yeah, technically that is true. But should he have gotten out? Absolutely not. He was the head, one of the head people up

there. For him to do that was just absolute desertion and traitorism. If he'd have done that back when the first Minnesota marched off to war, when President Lincoln asked our governor for troops, if Tim Walz would have been in back then, what would he have done? Walk back to Nebraska and said, well, I've got better things to do than go fight the Civil War? I don't know. I mean, I don't know if it was cowardism or don't want to get shot or whatever. Nobody wants to get shot. Somebody's got to take the bullet. I mean, that's what the heck happens in war. It's just absolutely disgusting. God bless those of you who take those risks for the country. I should say, to the point you just raised, there are some who have defended him in when the Star Tribune eventually wrote

about this, which was twenty twenty two. You had raised it years earlier. Joseph Eustace, who served 32 years in the National Guard, told them he was a great soldier. When he chose to leave, he had every right to and that the attacks on Walls's record may have been made by disgruntled soldiers who were passed up for promotions. Another man, Al Bonifield, who served under Walls, talked to Minnesota Public Radio and said he weighed the decision to run for Congress for a long time. He loved the military, the guard and the soldiers he worked with that he'd been eyeing a run for Congress earlier than 2005. Any response to that, Tom, that really these are just all those of you who I've mentioned are just disgruntled guys who are passed up for promotions? Well, it's a it's a nice take on it. And I wrote a letter to the paper where Joe Eustace

was at too. Joe took my position after I retired and he actually deployed to Kuwait in 2011 when the drawdown hit. And I responded to him. I said, do you write that because you're disgruntled that Walls got picked over you at that time? I mean, that was just a, you know, it's another one of those things. I don't know what Joe was thinking himself, CSM Walls, or not CSM Eustace, but it had absolutely nothing to do with that. You know, I mean, the selection was made at that time. You know, there was a board of all the senior MACOM CSMs, they call them, and they selected who they did. I got selected for SGM before he got selected for CSM. So there's no, there's no disgruntling on my side because I literally, my data rank, if he'd have stayed in and had that rank legitimately, I would have had days on him

because I was selected first for the SGM position. And then the CSM position opened up later. So, I mean, for him to say that, I mean, he can say whatever he wants. It's not true. I mean, I, I don't feel that myself. I mean, okay. Let me ask one last question. Cause we're almost out of time. Uh, it's very possible that if Tim Wallace and Kamala Harris win this election, he could eventually become president of the United States. God forbid something happens to her or just if, and when she passes the baton to her vice president. Could you vote for this guy to be potential commander in chief? Absolutely not. I mean, I'm not. You know, I guess I'm I'm in the moderate to right leading person. I mean, I'm not. Well, there's never been anybody out on that side that I vote for, and especially him.

I mean, just with his policies that have happened in Minnesota, he doesn't give a dang about the 49 percent that lost the vote. I mean, it's all about who the 51 percent were, and he rams all of his radical policies down that side, everybody's throat, which is a sad thing. I mean, if you're going to be a leader, you got to lead for everybody. You can't just lead for the side that you're on. And no, there's no way I could vote for it. Cause I don't, I, they're like the party of chameleons, right? I mean, if they, if they go to Georgia and they want to talk like a Georgia person, and if they, if they come and talk to,

if Tim comes and talks to veterans of Minnesota, to talk like a Georgia person. And if they come and talk, if Tim comes and talks to veterans of Minnesota, he acts like, well, I'm doing everything for the veterans. And when the vote comes down, then he slams the door on them. And wherever they stick, you know, that's the color they change. And then all of a sudden, they, you know, they go to the next one. And then they jump on them and they say what they want to hear there. Well, listen, it takes some courage to tell this story publicly so many times as you have trying to make sure it gets out there, not to mention that to pick up the gun and actually go into combat as you did and lost fellow servicemen. Thanks so much, Tom, for all of it. We respect you. We appreciate you. Thank you. Wow. What a story. I know we have a lot of military watching this show

and I would love to get your reaction. You can email me, you know, it's Megan at Megan Kelly.com M E G Y N. I do read all the emails. Um, sometimes there are hundreds and hundreds, but I read them. Um, my gal Meg storm puts them together and sends them to me and they all, they make me laugh. A lot of them say, I know you're not going to read this. I'm reading them. So please send me your thoughts. Boy, oh boy, that's, that's disturbing. And it's, you know, trying to maintain my objectivity because I'm definitely not going to vote for this man, but those are disturbing allegations. And we certainly hope that he will respond to our request for comment, especially on why his story of having a four-year re-enlistment

does not jive at all with his actual documents as obtained by Alpha News. We'll follow up on it if and when they get back to us. Up next, two of the best follows on X, Red Steez, Stephen Miller, and Receipt Master, Drew Holden. Don't go away. I'm Megan Kelly, host of the Megan Kelly show on Sirius XM. It's your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations with the most interesting and important political, legal, and cultural figures today. You can catch the Megan Kelly show on Triumph, a Sirius XM channel featuring lots of hosts you may know and probably love. Great people like Dr. Laura, Glenn Beck, Nancy Grace, Dave Ramsey, and yours truly, Megyn Kelly. You can stream The Megyn Kelly Show on SiriusXM

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That's SiriusXM.com slash MKShow and get three months free. Offer details apply. Joining me now, Stephen L. Miller, contributing editor at The Spectator and host of the Versus Media podcast. And Drew Holden, author of Holden Court Substack. They are a must follow, each of them on X. I love these accounts. Red Steez and Drew Holden 360. Guys, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me back, Megan. Thanks for having me back,

Megan. Thanks for having me. The pleasure is all mine. All right. So there's a lot to get through. I don't even know where to start, but let's just start with where we just left off. So Governor Walz is accused of stolen valor, stealing a title that he did not earn and running around saying he's a retired command sergeant major when he's not saying that he fought in war. We had guns in war, which he never fought in war. He was in Italy in a supporting role, never went to Afghanistan or Iraq in a combat role, abandoned his unit apparently two years earlier than his enlistment date was, and then appears to have lied about it publicly. At least that's the allegation. He won't respond no to us and he wouldn't respond to Alpha News when they found the actual documentation and then has the nerve to go out on the stump and attack J.D. Vance, who actually did serve as a Marine and deployed to Iraq. I do think it's interesting in light of the heat that's

already coming down on him for what happened in Minnesota during the BLM riots, guys, where that's another situation in which, let's face it, he was out to lunch as Minneapolis burned. Jacob Fry, the mayor, says he's on record like I kept calling the guy. He said he'd send help. The National Guard never came. A police precinct burned down. And once again, it appears Tim Walz did not answer the 3 a.m. phone call very effectively, Drew. Yeah, that's unfortunately right, Megan. I mean, you know, it's it's interesting to me because in a normal universe, I think this would be a really valuable role for the mainstream media to play to fact check these sorts of things. Right. As you mentioned, the comments from the mayor are on the record. You could very easily go back and look and say,

hey, this guy who's now been nominated for vice president, he doesn't actually pass muster on a lot of these things he said. And instead we have a media who's focused on his vibes, right? He's passed the vibe check. And so somehow it's no longer interesting what he had done before

and whether or not what he had done before is actually consistent with what he's saying now. Our connection is a little wobbly there. Let me let me ask you, Stephen, because the mayor of Minneapolis at the time, Jacob Fry, is all over the record on just how bad he thought Governor Walz did in handling this nightmare and deploying the National Guard. And we've put together a soundbite of some of that from the time. Listen. At 628 Wednesday afternoon, Mayor Jacob Fry's communication director, Michael Vlatkovich, will text a small circle of advisors. Mayor just came out and said the chief wants him to call in the National Guard for help at Third Precinct. Mayor appears intent on doing. Word on the ground is it's really crazy and escalating, texted back a senior advisor. But a couple hours later, at 8.08, Vlatkovich will relay a message from the mayor. Quote, he said Walls was hesitating.

This was a guard-sized crisis and demanded a guard-sized response. Do you feel like the National Guard was slow-walked into Minneapolis for whatever reason? I recognize that they're coming from all around the state. Pretty much when the very first window broke on a private business, I called the governor and I asked for the National Guard. But state officials have said the city had no detailed plan for the National Guard. And the state argued the National Guard was a poor choice anyway to handle civil unrest. By the next morning, Thursday at 10.55 a.m., Mayor Frey sends a formal request for the Minnesota National Guard. But the Guard was never a major presence in Minneapolis that night.

By 9.36 that night, the 3rd Precinct was surrounded by fire and chaos. Mayor Frey will text Chief Arredondo, calling the governor regarding third precinct now. Arredondo, precinct being evacuated now. Protesters breaching the precinct now. And finally, all officers evacuated. By Friday afternoon, the city still smoldering. The guard was all in. A senior aide sends a text. Main update from state is that they are mobilizing the entire guard and that this is switched from a protest to intentional destruction. A little late to the party. That was a Fox 9 report with an interview with the mayor. Go ahead, Stephen. Fire, but mostly peaceful, Governor, it would seem. I mean, I guess my thing for the mayor is did kneeling not work to help this stuff?

Yeah, I think it's interesting, and it's tough following that veteran's story in his service. But basically, I look at this and say, was Bo Bergdahl busy? Could he not join this ticket? Because it looks like Kamala Harris picked the most radical person and governor she could east of Gavin Newsom. And so Drew kind of touched on that this election is going to be about who Donald Trump is and who Kamala Harris and Tim Walz pretend to be. And they're going to have an entire media infrastructure behind them who's just going to basically not push them for interviews, not push them to answer for record, not push to answer why Tim Walz's wife thought smelling fires and burning bodies was a good thing. I'll play that soundbite that Stephen just referenced. Gwen is the wife of Tim Walz.

And in 2020, she gave an interview about what she was experiencing during the George Floyd riots. Take a listen. I would say those first days, you know, when there were riots, I could smell the burning tires. And that was that was a very real thing. And I kept the windows open for as long as I could because I felt like that was such a touchstone of what was what was happening. I don't know what that, what does that mean, Stephen? She needed to smell the burning tires in order to feel connected to the rioters? Yeah, I guess she needed to remember what burning small businesses down, you know, smelled like. And

this is something that he's going to have to answer for because you have Kamala Harris out here saying, we're not going back. We're not going back. Well, apparently she wants to take us back to the summer of 2020. And so I guess the good news or the bad news for us is if Trump wins, we're going to get riots. And if Kamala wins, we're going to get riots. And it's going to be from the same exact people on both sides on that side. So it struck me as listening to Jacob Fry in the in the in that report from Fox 9 on the number of times the mayor was asking for help and didn't get the help. You had Tim walls come out and speak to this at the time about why he wasn't more responsive. I mean, this was obviously a very big deal. This is not just a 2024 retroactive story and listen to how he described it. I knew what he was asking for. He wanted the national

guard. And what does that mean? I think to the mayor, yes, I think it's a perception. I'm certainly not questioning that. I think the mayor said I requested National Guard. This is great. We're going to have massively trained troops. No, you're going to have 19 year olds who are cooks. So remember, his service was great for good measure. Yeah. Remember, his service was impeccable and there's no blemishes. But here he is insulting 19 year old National Guardsmen who apparently can't handle the job that he says he handled perfectly in his service. I mean we're 90 days out of this election, and Kamala and this guy's problem is neither of them have been through a strong primary. And so the book hasn't even been opened on her yet.

And now you have this guy where there's going to be dozens and dozens of sound clips back there where he's common. You know, he's calling socialism neighborly and things like that. And so. That just happened. Yeah. That was on the white guys for Kamala Zoom. Yeah, it was on or it was like on MSNBC or something like that. So Drew's Drew hit this right that they have to run this vibe election and joy and things great and he's our uncle and everything. Just as they have to run Kamala, not on her record. And so what's interesting to me about her picking this guy is she spent the last two weeks walking back some of these policy proposals of hers. And now she just put a guy on the ticket that believes all of them.

And so now she's back to snapping back to having to defend this stuff. And so putting all of your chips in a debate, Kamala Harris' hubris with come and debate me, coward, is astounding given what happened to Joe Biden in a debate and what happened to Kamala Harris against Tulsi Gabbard. And so they really are writing this kind of razor thin Lady Obama type narrative. The problem is we're not coming off of eight years of Republican president. We're coming off of four years of Joe Biden, record inflation, four conflicts that have started under his presidency and that she has to both explain. Right. And she has to both explain that while trying to tell us she's taking us into the future. Or does she? I mean, the media, we've talked about this a bit with Mark Halperin, has been completely fine with her going underground, but for her prompter-assisted rallies, all two of them. And here's a sample, Drew, of how the media has sounded in covering, as you point out, Lady Obama. That's how she's getting treated.

Watch. Yeah. I'm telling you, there seems to be a lot of, there's something appealing about a guy for people to say, is comfortable talking in a t-shirt and a baseball cap, as he is talking in a suit, as he is talking in a tuxedo. His Midwestern appeal, that plain spoken way of talking that he has, he's a bit folksy. I think you got the hillbilly elegy against the real hillbilly. That's going to be, you know, Yale versus the guy who's, you know, actually spent all of his time on the ground, you know, fixing F-150s. He coined that one word takedown of the Trump Vance team, just calling them weird. That is something that really gained a fair amount of

traction. He's like a walking John Mellencamp song. I know one thing, he won't be talking about childless cat ladies or being racially divisive. That's a step up from the other side. He's joyful when he's on the attack. He almost, you know, like, does it with a wink and a smile and a sense of humor when he is going after these guys.

It was mesmerizing. And you could just sense the power in the hall. And it was the power of joy. And these two people yesterday managed to put a smile on the nation's face. Oh, my God. True, true. First of all, just on the racially divisive charge, your side is literally holding racially segregated Zoom calls in its first week as a rollout for Kamala. But I'll leave it to you to unpack it, Drew. Right. I think that's fair. You know, don't forget, they picked Tim Waltz in part because he is a basic, boring white man, right? That's what they've been saying all along. The idea that somehow that side, right, the boring white man, right? That's what they've been saying all along. The idea that somehow that side, right, the boring white guys for Kamala's side is not the racially divisive party, I think is preposterous, right? I think it's pretty nakedly preposterous.

But I'll tell you, for whatever reason, that doesn't seem to be getting through to the media, who is cribbing all of that language. You know, you heard those couple of quotes about joy and how he's bringing joy to America. He's critical with joy. The Washington Post cribbed that same language in a headline. They said that he's bringing joy. Like it's ridiculous on its face. But I think when it's then refracted back to everyone through the media who should be holding up this, you know, revealing mirror to candidates. And instead, you've got the vibes joy guy. And that's that's not actually doing any due diligence about someone who might be a heartbeat away from the presidency. Yeah, he's the vibes joy guy. And Trump and Vance are weird,

even though, you know, Governor Walz is just fine with chopping your child's penis off, even though he's 14. That's not weird. Yeah, right. Somehow the guy who mandates tampons in boys' bathrooms for high schools is not the weird guy, right? And for fourth grade. Fourth grade. That's when it starts. Elementary school.

It's supposed to start fifth. Fifth. Yeah. And it's one of those things, too, where you've got you've got a framing that relies on what does the average Washington Post or New York Times editor consider weird? I would go so far as to say that perhaps that is not aligned with what most Americans and most voters think is weird. I think people think that's a lot weirder. OK, so can I show this is a perfect place to bring in his lieutenant governor? She's a nut, too. You guys may remember her.

She got she turned herself into a national news story not long ago in March of 23, long before we were thinking about this guy as the potential running mate for Kamala Harris, because she said this insanity when he was signing one of his many crazy trans kids bills. Listen to Peggy Flanagan in March of 2023. Because let's be clear, this is life affirming and life saving health care. When our children tell us who they are, it is our job as grownups to listen and to believe them. That's what it means to be a good parent. Oh, my God.

You remember this? I wanted to be a stegosaur. Yeah, I wanted to be a stegosaurus when I was 12. And, you know, if we want. I would not expect our media to basically suddenly jump in and start covering this stuff. My grand theory of this election is that this is a Hillary Clinton do-over for them. We had Ezra Klein three years ago blaming coverage of Hillary's emails on why Trump won and Gamma not going to the state of Wisconsin for 104 days. And so they really do look at this as a Hillary Clinton do over. We have another historic female candidate.

We're not going to let this one lose to Donald Trump this time. We're not going to commit any mortal sins of doing our jobs and covering Kamala's past positions. And this whole weird thing really did spawn to kind of neutralize these hysterical laughing moments from Kamala Harris, where she's the only one cackling. She's like candidate Smileyx. And I really do believe that was deployed to neutralize anybody pointing that stuff out. And so like what Drew said, they can pull this. These guys are just weird card all they want. But, you know, these are the guys who are appearing in leather dog masks on segregated Zoom calls. And I guess if you guys want to do this joy election, I don't know how much joy people like me have having to chase down a clerk at a grocery store because laundry

detergent is now locked up. And so these are things that, right, these are things they can't hide from. They can't hide from mass influx of immigrants on street corners with squeegees anymore. And that's not on them. They're just trying to get by. But this is things people do notice. They notice an influx of prices. They notice an influx of groceries being locked up. They notice an influx of homelessness.

And you can run on this, hey, everything's great. Because this kind of was born from like Paul Krugman, the vibe economy. And you guys can run on that. Good luck. I guess we're going to see if that works or not. You're exactly right. Tell it to the family of Lake and Riley, how joyful it is to have this woman in office. Tell it to Chloe Cole, who had her breast chopped off at age 15 by a medical community that's been captured by social craziness, pushing this stuff without any appreciation for the fact that a minor cannot give consent to that kind of a procedure in the name of gender affirming care, which he's on board with one hundred and ten percent. It's it's amazing. But they picked him, Drew, because they think he's going to help with working class Midwesterners, that he's got that, you know, John Mellencamp in, you know, real life, like a song, a John Mellencamp song, which I object to as a John Mellencamp fan.

Here's Steve Kornacki, however, of NBC with a hefty dose of realism for them on exactly how well Tim Walz does when it comes to actual working and middle class voters in Minnesota. Listen, I think that background, the small town background, the military background, Democrats are hoping it's going to help them. This is Stearns County. This is in greater Minnesota. This is similar to a lot of the terrain you see in Wisconsin, Michigan, Pennsylvania. Walls lost this by 23 points. How does that compare to Joe Biden in 2020? Joe Biden lost the same county by 23 points. How does that compare to Hillary Clinton in 2016? Hillary Clinton lost it by 28 points. And now here's the key, because this county, Democrats used to be much more competitive in. Look at this. In 2012, Barack Obama won 43% of the vote in this county. The floor fell out for Democrats here when Trump came

along in that Clinton race in 2016, and they haven't recovered it since. And Walls really owes his victory, that big margin, he got eight points there statewide. He owes it to the Twin Cities area here, the area where Democrats in Minnesota and all these other states are already doing well. And the idea that he's got this automatic appeal with these small town areas in those three key battleground states, you don't see it in what he actually did on the ballot in 2022. Now, that doesn't mean it can't happen. See how this story, once it gets told, how it does it resonate with voters. That's the thing, Drew, he is not some working class whisperer.

Yeah, exactly. I mean, I think it really, to me, what it highlights is how far can this vibes election sentiment actually go? Because the media may think that this guy is, you know, he typifies the working class and he's out there, you know, whatever. But he is a dyed in the blood progressive. Right. The things that he actually believes, which voters are aware of in Minnesota and beyond, are not the sorts of are not these folksy John Mellon campy types of values. Right. And so peeling back the layer, even just a tiny bit on his progressive policies. We've talked about the bathroom stuff, but also look at green energy, right? He's someone who has, by executive order and in his budget, he requires all providers of energy in the state to abandon traditional methods of energy by 2032. He wants 100% green energy by law, mandated by law in Minnesota by 2032. He wants 100% green energy by law, mandated by law in Minnesota by 2032. You know, hopefully there's, there's enough time in there for somebody to come in and fix that. But he's

not, he isn't this like every man sort of guy. He is a radical progressive. And the media might be able to hold him forward as Oh, well, look at him. Doesn't he just look like someone who would be folksy and Midwestern and moderate? But but he's not. He's very obviously not. Here's the other thing we talked about. We showed the lieutenant governor, you know, just do what your child wants. Your child deserves to get whatever they want. You know, you thought you were a stegosaurus. I thought I was a fairy named Taffy. And OK, didn't happen. And so that's his lieutenant governor. He seems just fine with that. Then there was an issue with a Florida teacher down in DeSantis estate where they had passed what the critics called the don't

say gay bill, which just said, you can't discuss sexual orientation and LGBTQ issues in curriculum. Okay. You can't discuss it in curriculum in the younger grades. And then it later got expanded. A Florida teacher defied that and showed a movie that celebrates the gay relationship of some young boys to a group of fifth graders. That's where I got fifth grade from. The other one tampons for fourth grade boys. Fifth grade boys were getting this film down in Florida, which was not okay. That's weird. It's very weird. I have a fifth grade boy. I don't know. Do not show gay movies. The Florida teacher spoke out about her behavior. She got fired. Here's she was on CNN quickly.

Those rights are gone when your child's in the public school system, because there are students talking about these things. It's where they get 90% of their socialization for the day. And we can't shut down every conversation every child has. Parental rights, that's what she was referencing. They're gone when your kid, well, guess why Governor Walz is relevant. He came out publicly and said, come to Minnesota, madam, you and any other Florida teacher, we want that kind of attitude right here in our schools. That messaging cost the Democrats or, yeah, cost the Democrats the last gubernatorial election. That's why we have a Governor Youngkin when he took out, what's his name? The Clinton-loving Democrat. McAuliffe.

McAuliffe. Thank you, Terry McAuliffe. Yeah, Minnesota is in the top five states of people fleeing the state in the last five years. They're one of the top states in bringing in immigrants, and that's both from the southern border and it's also from Ukraine and Russia even. If he's such this great governor, folksy governor, why are people mass fleeing his states? And that's kind of why I said she really did basically say, OK, Gavin's not interested in playing number two. Who can I get that's just like him? And it really I mean, if I'm Trump, it's as simple as if you want to win Wisconsin, just hold up the photo of Tim Walz posing with the Minnesota Vikings. Let's not overthink this stuff here. So this really was a wild choice. And it's going to, they're basically, we're seeing two candidacies that are basing on

their base is they're trying to rev up both of their bases. And here you're going to have a kind of moderate centrist independent voters who are going to sit here and go, okay, what's in this for me? And that's the danger. I can and go, OK, what's in this for me? And that's the danger. I'm scared, though, because he was very effective on the stump. When you watched him last night, I know you were a fan, but couldn't you see his oratory as skillful? And I could see people being fooled by him.

Yeah, they're going to try to sell him off as your happy drunken uncle at Thanksgiving. And again, the problem with only doing one debate, because, you know, as far as I know, we have one presidential debate, maybe one vice president debate, is the media not pressuring Kamala or Tim Walz on these records. That leaves them exposed in one debate. And so Kamala Harris, you're really going to put all of your chips on Kamala Harris having one great performance in a debate where she's never really had a great performance. And the same goes for Waltz. She got decapped. She got decapped.

Well, that's because she kind of just did the Joe Biden barking clown thing where she's not going to be able to do that with Trump. She's not really – she's going to try to do these boss lady moments and stuff. And that takes me to Tim Waltz who, if the media is not going to get this stuff out and pressure his record, J.D. Vance will do it on a stage and he's going to have to account for it. So, yeah, he can do this kind of grandpappy yeehaw act on the porch at Christmas. But again, there's not a lot that's really going to sell. He doesn't – my family is from Wisconsin and I've been been back there tons of times, as Charlie Sykes will once tell you. He does not come off as folksy Minnesota. He comes off as the guy that MSNBC thinks is folksy Minnesota. Yeah.

And so all I can see when I look at him is like a guy with a scalpel coming for children. That's what I see when I look. I got to ask. I got to end with this. I see the drunken neighbor on the ref who played Santa Claus. That's who I see. I gotta end with the fact that Cori Bush went down in flames.

Another member of the squad, first Jamal Bowman, now Cori Bush, gone but not forgotten. Here's a little montage of some of our favorite Cori Bush moments. Just 81 days after his 18th birthday, a Ferguson police officer killed him. In a just world,

Mike Brown would be with his loved ones right now, dreaming of his future as he blows out the candles on his birthday cake. The effect you're capturing on the middle class is less than it is on the rich, correct? But it's not surprising because this is the place where our black and brown staff members repeatedly speak of experiencing racism and sexism, Islamophobia, get pushed off the elevators, xenophobia and more right here in this workplace.

I want to make sure I have security because I know I have had attempts on my life. I get to be here to do the work. So suck it up and defunding the police has to happen. attempts on my life. I get to be here to do the work. So suck it up and defunding the police has to happen. But not my police. We will miss her. Not her police. We'll miss her now that she's going. Yeah. Miss is one way to put it. I hope she is safe wherever she is with a fully staffed police force. I'm sure she will be. She'll find a i would probably make the taxpayer pay for it uh i got 30 seconds even your thoughts her husband's gonna have to get a real job now and so i guess that's

how i look at it here so uh yeah i mean members of the squad are just kind of all dropping and people are kind of you know ian omar has a primary next week so we'll see how that goes please keep aoc in congress she hates her job in Congress so much. Please keep her there. She wanted to be out there tearing down hostage posters and rioting with her comrades. Please don't primary her. Keep her in Congress where she hates. She'll stay until the Kardashians leave their network, and then she can just sub right in

the job she's wanted all along. All right, I got to go. It is interesting, though, that there's been like the backlash against the squad. That tells us something. Guys, so great to have you. Thanks for being here. Anytime. Thank you, Taffy.

It's Taffy-ing to you. When we get to know each other better. Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. No BS, no no agenda and no fear