The Megyn Kelly Show - Michelle Obama's Bitterness, and Bombshell Matthew Perry Allegations, with Jason Whitlock, Evita Duffy, Will Witt, and Will Folks | Ep. 701

Episode Date: January 12, 2024

Megyn Kelly is joined by Jason Whitlock, host of BlazeTV's "Fearless," to discuss ESPN host Steven A Smith’s “tantrum” about Whitlock's book review, the feuds within the sports media world, Smith’s claim about white supremacy and using race to defend himself, Michelle Obama claiming America is "not fair" to her and other black people, her comment that Trump wouldn't be able to run for president again if he was black, the response to Melania Trump vs. Michelle Obama as First Ladies, Michelle Obama’s “bitterness” despite her privilege, our culture trying to take away men's swagger,  the brewing Jimmy Kimmel vs. Aaron Rodgers feud over the Jeffrey Epstein list, Kimmel playing the victim and misstating what Rodgers actually said, and more. Then Evita Duffy-Alfonso, The Federalist contributor, and Will Witt, author of "Do Not Comply, join to discuss the sad new details of Mathew Perry’s alleged continued drug use and abuse, celebrities who do acts of service for attention, Gypsy Rose making the rounds in the media after leaving jail, the oddity that she's become a celebrity after having her mother killed, the cultural obsession with true crime and murder mysteries, a Golden Globes sketch making fun of "white people's roles," celebrating "FatCon," and more. Then Will Folks, editor of FITS News, joins to talk court clerk Becky Hill’s alleged potential jury tampering and other allegations that may lead to a new Alex Murdaugh trial, Hill admitting she plagiarized in her memoir about the case, the law enforcement investigation about Hill and her son who was arrested for wiretapping, and more.Whitlock- https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fearless-with-jason-whitlock/id1569056584 Witt- https://www.amazon.com/Do-Not-Comply-Americas-Corrupt/dp/B0BXTCLY8D/Duffy-Alfonso- https://thefederalist.com/author/evitaduffy/Folks- https://www.fitsnews.com/ Follow The Megyn Kelly Show on all social platforms: YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/MegynKellyTwitter: http://Twitter.com/MegynKellyShowInstagram: http://Instagram.com/MegynKellyShowFacebook: http://Facebook.com/MegynKellyShow Find out more information at: https://www.devilmaycaremedia.com/megynkellyshow

Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM Channel 111 every weekday at noon east. Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show and happy Friday. We made it and we've got a packed show for you today, including an update in the crazy, crazy Alec Murdoch case from a reporter who's been covering it closely. You know how he's pushing for a new trial? I'm telling you, he's really well positioned to get it. New developments on that court clerk who you may recall was accused of improperly trying to influence a juror. It's gotten so much worse, so much worse. The stuff that came out about her while we were all celebrating Christmas and the holidays. Okay, stand by. We'll get to it. Plus, some sad and disturbing new

details about Matthew Perry. But we're going to start today with a man who always seems to find himself at the center of our cultural conversation. And this time, it's a feud that is blowing up the internet and has a bit of a backstory. Jason Whitlock is the host of the Blaze TV's Fearless. And he is. And we always love it when he joins us. Jason, welcome back to the show. Megan, awesome to be here.

Thanks for inviting me. I love how you upset people. I can relate to it to some extent, but it kind of amuses me because I think they think they're going to upset you when they strike back at you. And I think I know you well enough to realize not it. No, that's not what's going to happen, but boy, okay. I confess. I don't really understand Stephen A. Smith. I don't really know Stephen A. Smith, you know, me in sports, but I know he's like a sports guy at ESPN. I've heard you describe him as the face of ESPN. So just set the table for us on how this death feud got unleashed because, oh, he's mad. He's very mad at you.

Yeah. So let's say for lack of a better comparison, Stephen A. Smith is what Bill O'Reilly was to Fox News, whatever, 10, 15 years ago. You know, biggest star, you know, the guy they lean into the most. They for a long time paid the most. Right now, he's not the highest paid guy there. But he's kind of the face of the sports media for ESPN. And he's written a memoir called Straight Shooter. And at some point, three, four or five months ago, I decided to read the memoir because we got a little small scrap four or five months ago he and shannon sharp a hall of fame football player who have teamed up on uh stephen a's morning talk show uh took some took some shots at someone that i didn't feel like they were being fair and taking those shots and so i kind of called him out and and stephen a went

on his podcast and and called me fat bastard and know, said that he couldn't stand me. And at some point he was going to come after me. And at that point, I was like, well, man. Stephen A.'s got this book out. Let me do a little homework on Stephen A. to make sure that, you know, if when he comes after me, I'm just more prepared. And so I read his memoir and his memoir is farcical. And my initial thoughts were after reading it, it was like, man, this this is kind of like Barack Obama's dreams of my father, that he's planning these little false fake narratives and making these points that are trying to set him up for a political career.

And then as I read deeper and deeper into the book and then I started like trying to fact check some of the things he was saying in the book, I was like, oh, my God. I mean, there's a lot of fiction in this guy's memoir. There's a lot of things he wrote and said about himself that just don't pass the smell test. And the way he, again, he's the face of sports media. He's the highest profile guy, highest profile sports pundit in America. And he writes and talks about himself and his former athletic career as a high school player and college player in such a farcical way that you're sitting there like he doesn't even know sports at all and and and it's like how can a guy that doesn't understand sports on an elementary level be the face of sports punditry and the biggest voice at ESPN. And so at some point I wrote a column in the last week or two about reviewing

his book. And then I did a show reviewing his book and put together highlight clips of just outright lies he's told on air about his narrative growing up and as an athlete. And then he'd literally say one thing on ESPN's air, and then he'd go on his podcast and completely contradict himself. And so I just started raising questions about the facts and the truth of his memoir, and that triggered him this week to put together 45 minutes. To put it mildly, he was triggered. So he launched in his diatribe against you.

He teased that he was going to do it. He was enjoying the feud, I think. And we pulled just a little bit of his response together here in SOT2. He's a no good individual. Probably the worst individual I've ever had the displeasure of ever being associated with in any capacity. I even took the liberty of calling my pastor to apologize in advance for what I'm going to say about that no good bastard. As a black man, knowing our history, anything worse than a white supremacist. That is until Jason Whitlock came along.

I hate this bastard. Not even, far more than a little bit. He is the worst human being any of you will ever meet. You get within a mile of his presence. Wrap your arms around yourself to protect your soul. He is Cain. He is a devil. The worst.

That's a lot. So he's a maybe. He's a maybe on you. He's a lot. He's a maybe. He's a maybe on you. He's still making up his mind. I was wrapping my arms around myself, Jason, to protect myself from the evil you. Megan, I watched it and people on my team watched it. And I just want to, again, you've been in the media for nearly as long as I have been. I've never seen anybody this high profile in the media that represents their network in that way.

Take something that unprofessional and air it. The profanity. Totally agree. I just take something so personally. If I wanted to show you some of the nastiest hit pieces that have been written about me, personal hit pieces, lie after lie, I don't respond to this nonsense. If you're a public figure, sadly, but it's part of it. Some people are going to hate you. That's how it goes. If you're a true pro, you brush it off and you move on. He's pulling a Meghan Markle, right? He's like, I can't believe how outrageous and like the ad hominem, you know,

attacks on you seems to be his defense. Like Jason's a liar. None of what he says is true. Oh, and also he's got, he's, I'll put it charitably, has a weight issue and isn't a nice man, but in much more colorful terms. The other thing or what frustrates Stephen A. and a lot of people in the sports media is that I, when I'm critical, and again, my entire career, I have criticized people in the sports media, my peers in the sports media. There's no reason for you to know this, but, you know, Mitch Albon, in the 90s, early 2000s, he was the biggest name in sports writing. And he works out of Detroit, Michigan. And for a time, I worked in Ann Arbor, Michigan.

We covered the same college basketball team, the Michigan Fab Five. He wrote a book about the Fab Five that was farcical. He put in there that Chris Webber, the biggest star on the team, couldn't afford McDonald's. And this was back before athletes did this name, image, and likeness. And he was saying Chris Webber couldn't afford a McDonald's. And I remember reviewing the book saying, Hey man, you know, are you kidding me? These guys drive up to the arena every night in brand new SUVs.

I've been to Chris Webber's apartment. It's plush. It's laid out far better than mine. How can you tell these farcical, you know, to promote some narrative that they're being exploited when anybody with a brain can see like these guys were well compensated and well taken care of. Trash this five five book. Mitch Albom doesn't like me, but he didn't throw a baby like tantrum because I was critical of his book. You know, Joe Posnanski wrote a book, again, probably a name you're not familiar with. We wrote a book about Joe Paterno in the middle of the Joe Paterno controversy at Penn State.

And I trashed his book because it was farcical. Joe Posnanski was a colleague of mine for a long time at the Kansas City Star, someone I've known for a long time. He was upset with me. He didn't throw this baby-like tantrum that Stephen A. Smith did, but where Stephen A. Smith, he wraps himself in this, in a lot of his conversations, as a black man, because of too many people in the black

journalism industry, and just overall, if they get criticized, they love to say, well, the only reason why you're criticized is because you're racist. And I take that away. They can't argue that, you know, I'm a racist for criticizing Stephen A. Smith. So he came up with a new category. You know, I'm worse than a white supremacist. How I criticize Stephen A. Smith. That's worse than a white supremacist. That's worse than being in the KKK. Criticizing Stephen A. Smith is is a crime beyond the pale and proves that I'm a devil. And, you know, I'm a soul snatcher. Yeah, this is what he said. He said he said about you, he's the one who puts himself in front of white folks, not all white folks, not most white folks, but the white folk that dare we say may have a problem with black folks. Adding, I cannot imagine as a black man knowing our history, anything worse than a white supremacist. That is until Jason Whitlock came along.

He's worse. He's the worst and the most despicable lying, no good, et cetera. So worse than a white supremacist. It is amazing to see that term busted out against a black man who is criticized. You're saying, I don't believe some of these claims you're making in this memoir. My opinion is you're lying. And that, how does that make you a white supremacist? I don't even follow the argument. I'm holding Stephen A. Smith to the same standards that I held Mitch Albom to. Again, great sports writer in the 80s, 90s, 2000. White guy, Jewish.

Joe Posnanski, white guy, Polish. Terrific. Had a great reputation as a sports writer. I'm holding Stephen A. Smith to the same standard as them. That's racist. And again, it's like when you become accustomed to preferential treatment, equal treatment feels like oppression. That's what's going on with Stephen A. Smith.

And a lot of black people in the media, these black elites, they don't want equal treatment. They want preferential treatment. And if you don't give them preferential treatment and if I don't give them preferential treatment, we're evil and wicked. And actually, it's just like a compliment. In my view, it's like I'm holding you to the same standard as everybody else. I'm not I think you're the equal of a white person. And so there would be no complaints when I've, because again, I'm not going to coddle you. Yeah.

And because I wasn't coddled and I'm not coddled, you know, I get criticized a lot and you know, I don't think it's a byproduct of racism or whatever. Some of the criticism is legit. Some of it I just blow off. But I'm not going to whine and cry. It's the price of leadership. It's the price of a high profile position.

Criticism is the background noise of success. I've said that for years. If no one's criticizing you, you're not having very much success. You're not having much of an impact. even if you feel personally attacked. I said this before. I think what Stephen should see is you're not attacking Stephen A. Smith, the man, even though it's a memoir about his personal life. It's more Stephen A. Smith, the brand. He's put himself out there. He's become a brand, and he wants that brand to be associated with truth-telling. He said even in his response, I don't tell lies. And you're saying, I got questions about whether you do. And as a public figure,

if you can divide those two things, you can forgive and forget and not obsess over somebody's personal slights toward you. But all of this leads me, Jason, to a, it's a perfect segue to something Michelle Obama said. And my team watched this whole interview she gave to this popular podcast host. And some of it we played the day after it hit. And this quote, I said, I knew you were coming on on Friday. I said, let's save that. I'd love to hear what Jason thinks about this. So the question to her from Jay Shetty, who was interviewing her was, you've said the White House doesn't change you. It reveals more of who you are. What did it reveal to you about yourself?

And then a couple of minutes into her answer was this part. Listen. I mean, the bars are different for people in life. That I've learned. This is the thing about being another. You learn how to be excellent all the time because you can't be less than. Other people can. Other people can be indicted a bunch of times and still run for office. Black man can't. You just learn to be good. And in the end, you benefit from that extra resilience. You know, you could be mad about it,

but it also makes you more equipped, right? But it's still not fair. That's what she learned from her husband becoming president of the United States and her serving eight years as first lady, becoming literally one of, if not the most popular figure in America. It's just not fair.

It's not fair being a Black person in America. A lot of people, leftists, global elites, for Black people, they've set it up that you don't have to take on the responsibility, all the burdens and the responsibilities that come along with leadership. And you're immune to that. And so in Michelle Obama's mind,

she has so little perspective outside of herself. It's like. I listen to this and go, does she not understand politics? Does she not understand the history of American politics? Does she not understand that Abraham Lincoln was assassinated for decisions he made in the presidency? Did she not JFK assassinated for the he made in the presidency? Did she, JFK assassinated for the decisions he made as president? And so politics is a contact sport that sometimes spills over into violence. And take her friends, to some degree, the Clintons. There are people that say really nasty, vicious things about the Clinton, accuse them of having assassinated a bunch of people.

It's like, did they know the endeavor they were getting into? And again, I'm not, I don't know what the truth is about the Clintons, but I'm just saying Barack Obama was not treated any more harshly than any of the previous presidents. I mean, to the contrary, wouldn't you say to the contrary? She says the bars are just different for people in life. Right. The bar was very different for your husband. Very different. And I'm sure he got into Harvard just based purely on his intellect, right? And Harvard law school. And he was ushered into the presidency with about two minutes of

public service behind him, right? Like a stint, short stint in the U.S. Senate after being a local Illinois lawmaker. And he was lauded like he was the second coming, as was she. But she's still bitter. She's still bitter about her circumstances, those of her husband and this country. Take an example just for her as a woman. And I don't want to come off as sexist, but just just her as a woman. What woman wouldn't want to spend eight years on the cover of virtually every magazine being portrayed as one of the most glamorous, sexy, you know, most beautiful women in the world? And and I'm just sorry, objectively, you know, there's a standard lowering for us to sell that myth that like this is one of the 20 most beautiful women on the planet. Really? And then compare. Her treatment to Melania Trump. Who? And so I don't care what your taste is. Maybe you prefer Michelle. Maybe you like the taller woman or, you know, a woman with broad shoulders or whatever.

I'm just maybe she's your cup of tea. But Melania Trump, I don't think, was on the cover of any magazine. It wasn't allowed for her to be celebrated, her beauty to be celebrated. And so who's what standards were lowered for Melania Trump and what standards were elevated for Michelle Obama? I mean, I just as a woman and I just I just don't know many women, particularly heterosexual women who wouldn't want to be celebrated the way Michelle Obama has been celebrated since 2007, 2008, when they went into office. And I think you can objectively say, as it relates to beauty and traditional standards of beauty, they lowered the standards to sell this woman as one of the most beautiful first ladies and one of the most beautiful women on the planet. She lives off in a fantasy world. She thinks every difficulty she's had in her life is attributable to race. She just has no appreciation for the fact that many of us

grew up without a silver spoon and had some real challenges in getting ahead. And just thank God that we were born in a country where it's even possible. It doesn't have to be easy. It's not easy, even for those of us with white skin, Michelle. It's not. But she cannot get past it. And by the way, her comment about other people can be indicted and still run for office, but black men can't tell it to Marion Barry. He served time for it was a crack or cocaine, and then they reelected him as mayor of D.C. It's possible no matter what your race, especially in Trump's case where everyone knows these are political persecutions. This person may come out and run for president.

I mean, there's a lot of speculation she gave this interview as a toe in the water. Like, I'm thinking about it. I see the weakness of this guy we've chosen right now. Is there any chance you think she's doing that, Jason? And if she did, could she win? I certainly think she's running for the presidency and has been for a long time. Could she win? Yes. Anything's possible. Joe Biden won and got some 80 million votes. And when you basically, you know, this whole mail-in voting system that they've instituted

allows anything to be a possibility. So, yeah, I think she's running for president. I think that her life and the narrative she's bought into, I think she feels like she's entitled to that power. You know, I've watched some documentaries and I've read some books about her and Barack and just, you know, what did she go to Yale or Harvard as well? Yeah, she went to Harvard to Princeton undergrad and Harvard Law School. Yeah, there you go. And they lowered some standards to let her in. You know, she had some classmates who went to that predominantly white high school. She went to in the Chicago area who couldn't get into Ivy League schools. schools and and she got into some and and then struggled at princeton and switched up to a sociology major and all this other stuff because she just couldn't handle it uh she's lived such a life of entitlement and privilege herself and again she loves to talk

about white privilege sometimes though megan i i go back and forth. Does she really believe it? Or is it just an overall political strategy adopted by the left? She mentions it all the time. I think it's truly heartfelt. Here's another one where she talked about how people in power, unspecified people, but I think we're talking about Trump here. We're definitely not talking about Barack and Democrats divide us. They divide us unfairly, unjustly. Take a listen. We're all human. We're so alike. I don't care about skin color or how we pray or who, how we love. We're all the same. What keeps us from seeing that is fear, right? I don't know you, you're different. So I got to be afraid of you. And I can't, I have to make sure you don't come into my space. And then we live in a culture where people with power prey on fear to get more power.

I want to make you all afraid of each other. And then I can come in and rule it all. I'm sorry, but her husband was the one, I mean, more than any other prior to him, I grant that Trump has been divisive in some ways. But her husband was the first one to cross lines we hadn't seen crossed from the Oval Office while sitting there. If I had a son, he would look like Trayvon weighing in on legal cases involving always a black alleged victim. I mean, and then, you know, a white alleged perpetrator and stoking, stoking those racial fires. And the Democrats, too, the Democrats haven't missed a chance to exploit this narrative. You know, race relations were doing a lot better.

And then they saw an opportunity. I just think like the tone deaf nature of those comments is apparent. That's why I go back to I'm not I'm I'm not sure she believes any of this. I just think she understands the political power that can be won from promoting what she's promoting, because it is what she's saying is laughable. Joe Biden is is from his bully pulpit presidency is promoting the biggest threat to America's white supremacy. Yes. And Trump, the way they talk about Trump and Trump supporters. And she says her line is, oh, these guys, I want to make you all afraid of each other. That's literally what the sitting president United States does all the time. Going to put you back in chains. If I'm not voted president, you'll be back in chains and they'll reinstitute slavery.

If that's not fear telling you all and the entire strategy. But it's even more than just fear in terms of taking the brand conservative or right wing. They've changed those into buzzwords that basically equate to evil and racist. That's what they, when they say conservative or right wing, they're calling you evil and racist. And they programmed everyone to think that. And so if you say MAGA supporter, if you support Donald Trump, now all of a sudden you're a member of the KKK and you're racist and you want to put black people down. There's just no proof of that. That and, you know, moving here to Tennessee, as I did three years ago,

I have a lot more exposure to people that are out of the closet, Trump supporters. And I'm just sorry they're not racist. And I can remember one of the first weekends I was here, when I moved here in 2020, a buddy of mine owns several nightclubs in the socializing districts of Nashville. And one of them is right across the street from my apartment or whatever. And his doorman had a Confederate flag tattoo. And, you know, first time I walk over, I'm like, man, Confederate flag tattoo. The guy didn't know me from Adam,

but he and I had one of the greatest conversations about sports and other things. And it's one of those deals where, and again, I'm not sitting here defending the Confederate flag, but the Confederate flag for people down here in the South, I've just had the experience. It just doesn't mean what you think it means. And it's, but again, they've branded people from the South and everybody. They've put up all these. If you vote for Trump, if you're Republican, if you're conservative, and now they've been going for if you're Christian, you're a white supremacist. You're a white nationalist. You're a Christian.

Yes, that's what they're saying. They've just demonized everything and told everybody to be afraid of those people. And and I'm just sorry. I sit here and see it with my own eyes. Black people and white people getting along with each other, despite whatever political differences they may have. But they sell it and some people buy it. It's amazing. What did you learn from your time in the White House? OK, I don't care about skin color or how we pray or how we love. We're all the same. What keeps us from seeing that is fear, right? I don't know you. You're different. She's very clearly talking about how white people view black people. She's not talking about how black people view white people here. So I got to be, if you look at the larger context of her

remarks, so I've got to be afraid of you and I have to make sure you don't come into my space. Okay. If anything, what we're seeing on college campuses and elsewhere right now are black affinity groups or Hispanic affinity groups into which whites are not welcome. Just talk to the mayor of Boston on her holiday party. And then we live in a culture where people with power prey on fear to get more power. Again, she's talking about very clearly demonization of black people by white people so they can get more power. She's talking about Trump. That's what she's clearly referring to. I want to make you all afraid of each other. How does he do that? How?

How? She really needs to take a hard look at the Democratic Party, which is obsessed with skin color, obsessed right now. And to your point about the white supremacy, there literally was just we have it. That's in a different packet. But Johns Hopkins just tweeted out their head of diversity. The vice president of diversity just tweeted out this thing defining white supremacy. I have it here and saying here it is, their diversity word of the month, Johns Hopkins Hospital, one of, if not the most respected hospital in the nation, it's Hopkins and Cleveland Clinic and maybe one or two others. Their diversity word of the month is privilege. Privilege is a set of unearned benefits given to people who are in a specific social

group. In the United States, privilege is granted to people who have membership in one or more of these social identity groups. Just have to have membership in one of them to have privilege. Okay. And they're talking about white privilege. If you're white. Okay. But you have it too, even though you're black, because you're a man, because if you're man parts, you have privilege. If you're Christian, double, double. You got double. So do I, because I'm white and I'm Christian.

Both of us have double privilege. Wait for the next one. This encompasses us too. Middle-aged people. if you hit 40, you have privilege, unearned benefits given to you because you're in a specific social group. If you're able-bodied, if you're middle or quote owning class. So I guess if you have a home, if you've worked hard, you made enough to own something, a car, a home, you're privileged according to the Johns Hopkins Hospital. And of course, if you speak English, this got so much backlash after Sherita Hill Golden tweeted it out that she was forced to take it down. Johns Hopkins took it down.

And she said on reflection, I regret this. It was overly simplistic and poorly worded. Poorly worded? As in every word was nonsense and offensive and racist and sexist? Yeah, it was poorly worded in that way. Her entire job, the diversity, whatever, director, chair, whatever, vice president, or whoever, whoever would take that job is basically raising their hand and saying, hey, I'm so stupid, I'm unqualified to do anything else. And so I'm going to elect myself or take this position that I'm supposed to manage how everybody else sees the world. And and I'm going to manage how white people feel about themselves. What an arrogance and incompetence you would have to have to even want that job.

Look, they are it's it's a mind F-U giving speeches every day about the proper diet to make you think I'm a dietitian. And everybody would be looking at me like this dude's a dietitian. Are you sure? I just saw him leave McDonald's. Are you sure he's a dietitian? But if I keep saying it, you go, yeah, he's a dietitian. Him and Ronald McDonald's are best friends, but he's a dietician? But if I keep saying it, you go, yeah, he's a dietician. Him and Ronald McDonald are best friends, but he's a dietician. And that's what they're basically doing and saying. They're mind screwing all of us. And they're instilling in everybody, everybody, a sense of entitlement.

You've been wrong. Oh, my God. You know, you don't have two parents in your home. You've been wrong. Oh, my God. You know, you don't have two parents in your home. You've been wrong. And so you don't have that privilege. And so the government and the world owes you something. And it's they're instilling a mindset that lays the foundation for communism and more government dependency to take over. Everybody's running around saying, I got screwed. And I'm not a man.

I'm not a Christian. I'm not this. I'm not that. I'm not white. I'm not, I got screwed. This world owes me something. They've, I keep saying this. I talked about it at Charlie Kirk's event out in Phoenix. Turning point about like men, we have to stop apologizing for America's history and all of racial history.

Quit apologizing for as it relates to gender and this whole sexism thing. Quit apologizing for it, because America's history as relates to racism and sexism, I'll stack our history of improvement and of granting freedom up against any country on the planet, the history of the planet. Quit apologizing. Our history should inspire gratitude, not shame, if you fully understand it and if it's unpacked properly. But they've used all this to convince men that, man, your history is terrible and you better bend over backwards and surrender leadership, surrender everything to correct the mistakes from the past. Because, you know, if it wasn't for the past, Michelle Obama would probably be the biggest star in the NBA and she'd be making 40 million dollars a year. But, you know, the past that that's why women aren't great basketball players like men, because of all the sexism. And it's the whole argument is just stupid. And if we quit apologizing and really understand our history. So you have the knowledge. So you don't even bat an eye when they start telling you about what you owe because of the past.

This entire people that didn't do the suffering are old because 100 years ago, someone suffered. And, you know, I even disagree with the whole suffering part, particularly as it relates to, you know, sexism or whatever. It's like, hey, man, you know, things were different in the 17 and 1800s. You know how much work it took to clean a house and except before a vacuum cleaner and all this stuff we got you know that was a real job i mean and not that it's not a real job now but it's like man it took a lot to keep a house clean and and and kids were seen as a gift and a blessing because it's like man the more kids we got, the more fun we're going to have, the more people that can help our family work together and benefit from having more kids.

We'll have more people to be farmhands, more people to help clean the house. And now we see kids as a burden. And it's like, oh, man, you get knocked up. You should consider an abortion because that kid's a burden. Or once they're here, they just stick them in front of the iPad and don't actually do the parenting. I agree with you. And especially on the stuff that you said about what we're doing to men, I agree with because we're trying to rob men of their swagger. And that's a sin. We need men with swagger. It's attractive. It's kind of necessary for the continuation of the human race. And we shouldn't be trying to ruin their swagger. Men are risk takers. And that's and again, not to say that women aren't, but take the Wright brothers that invented flying.

They were risking their lives. And you go to that, the Aviation Museum down in Washington and actually just look at the right exhibit. It's stunning. These were ballsy dudes. Yes. And that's our role. And we used to understand, like, man, we're going to do some things that may cost us our lives, may shorten our lives. But it's going to advance the country, make things better for my wife, kids, the whole nation, the next generation of people. Again, I try to explain like these people in the civil war, they knew they were potentially very likely going to die or be seriously injured, but they were doing it for other people to benefit, black people to benefit black people to benefit and all these roughnecks that help build skyscrapers and the injury rate and death rate for roughnecks was astronomical. And women weren't saying, hey, I want to be a roughneck because that's they got to protect their womb. They got to protect their children. They're just they're wired differently. And it's not their role to go out and be a roughneck and risk your life to invent airplanes and risk your life doing that.

And that's not diminishing them. But we're you know, men are supposed to take bullets, to be quite honest with you, in protection of freedom, in protection of fairness and justice. You know, we need to be willing to sacrifice our lives. I'm not asking women to do that because I don't think it's their role. And so the reason why men have dominated inventions and all this other stuff is because, you know, that's what we're supposed to do. And that's not that does not diminish women, because I'm just telling you, y'all's womb is so incredibly valuable. I try to explain to people the only and I'm sorry for speaking this rawly, but you only need one penis to replenish the earth. You need a lot of wounds. And we used to recognize that. That's why men would go off to war and we'd be like, ah, there's a bunch of them that's going to die. But at least we'll have these wounds back here and our kids will be safe. But we don't have a priority. We're so mentally ill,

we don't prioritize our kids. You're right about that. I mean, I'll say, look, obviously I'm a working woman and I love it. And I love the chance that I have to do it. And I look up to people like Marie Curie and what she did and invented these brilliant women who have come before me, especially at a time when it was tougher to, to be, you know, recognized or ascend in one's field. But what we've done now is overcorrected like we always do. And we've, we've gotten this place where we demonize. I actually said to my daughter's school, I said, you know what you should do in addition to like the career night where you parade in all these Harvard grads and have them say, you know, these women, because she goes to an all-girls

school, um, and have them say, look, this is what I, you should have a night where you bring in stay-at-home moms who talk about that life choice and how much they love it and how well it's worked out and why they chose it and make sure these girls see that that's a totally great choice. It depends on the person. That's it. It depends on what we've gotten to this place where we think that's sort of anti-feminist now, or there's some sort of diminishment in the women who choose to stay at home, which is, it's a lie. It's yet another lie that's being sold to young women. And I said, also bring in the C students, bring in the people who went to the third tier and fourth tier colleges who wound up doing great at their life. You don't have to go

to freaking Harvard where they want to make you into an anti-Semite for four years and $400,000. Like do something else. All right, I got to squeeze in a quick break because my team's yelling at me. And then we're going to come right back with Jason Whitlock. Don't go away. All right. So I haven't touched the Aaron Rodgers, Jimmy Kimmel feud in detail since it got updated. So I thought you'd be a good person to ask about this is this is this sports person. Now he's QB for the Jets, except he only played for like two minutes before he got hurt. That was sad. And he's got some blood feud going on with Jimmy Kimmel. They have the same relationship as you and Stephen A. And Aaron Rodgers went on, is it McAfee, the Pat McAfee

show? And he's a sports guy. And Aaron Rodgers goes on this show, I guess, or was at least going on weekly and said about Kimmel that Kimmel was among those really hoping the Epstein list did not come out. Kimmel went on his show this past Monday and said the following in response, not for. And it did come out. And of course, my name wasn't on it and isn't on it and won't ever be on. I don't know Jeffrey Epstein. I've never met Jeffrey Epstein. I'm not on a list. I was not on a plane or an island or anything ever. And I suggested that if Aaron wanted to make false and very damaging statements like that, that we should do it in court. He believes himself to be an extraordinary being. He genuinely thinks that because God gave him the ability to

throw a ball, he's smarter than everyone else. We learned during COVID, somehow he knows more about science than scientists. A guy who went to community college, then got into Cal on a football scholarship and didn't graduate, someone who never spent a minute studying the human body is an expert in the field of immunology. Aaron got two A's on his report card. They were both in the word Aaron. And when I do get something wrong, which happens on rare occasions, you know what I do? I apologize for it, which is what Aaron Rogers should do, which is what a decent person would do. But I bet he won't. OK, here's the last piece of sound. Aaron Rogers then goes back on the McAfee show on Tuesday, the night after that, and responded as follows. In the end, to sum this up, listen, I still haven't popped a bottle because there hasn't

been any list that's come out. And I'm glad that Jimmy is not on the list. I really am. And I don't think he's the P word. And, you know, I think it's impressive that a man who went to Arizona State and has 10 joke writers can read off a prompter. So, you know, my education at JUCO and my three semesters at Cal that I'm very proud of has worked out for me. And I'm glad to see it's worked out for him as well. So I wish him the best. Again, I don't give a shit what he says about me.

But as long as he understands what I actually said and that I'm not accusing him of being on a list, then I'm off from moving forward. What's happening here? Well, Jimmy Kimmel has moved the goalpost and moved the conversation to a place that's dishonest. If you watch Aaron Rodgers' full explanation and if you understand the background, he was not the joke that he told on the Pat McAfee show originally. It wasn't about Jimmyimmel being a pedophile it was about jimmy kimmel rooting for and hoping the epstein list never came out and that there's a backstory that that jimmy kimmel and aaron rogers or kimmel had cracked some jokes about

aaron rogers even having an interest in the Epstein list because let's say six seven months ago maybe even as long ago as a year ago Aaron Rodgers speculated that hey the Epstein list is going to come out and blah blah blah and Jimmy Kimmel at that time started cracking jokes about Aaron Rodgers being a tinfoil hat guy about this Epstein list. And so Rodgers original comment or joke that started this latest round of a feud was about, yeah, Jimmy, he was basically saying, I told you the Epstein list was going to come out. And, and, you know, Jimmy Kimmel was hoping that it didn't. Jimmy Kimmel then goes and does a monologue and says, oh, he's he's saying that I was going to be on the Epstein list. He knows that's untrue, but he knows if he can get everyone talking about that and he can play the victim,

then he can put some pressure on ESPN and Aaron Rodgers. Because, again, Kimmel, ABC, ESPN, they're both owned by Disney. They're all in the same family. And Jimmy Kimmel sitting there saying, why is some NFL player on a Disney platform taking shots at me? Well, I got a way to shut him up. I got a way to force ESPN's hand. I'll pretend like the guy called me a pedophile.

And so the next thing you know, Pat McAfee, the next day announces Aaron Rodgers isn't going to be on the show anymore. And he puts out a statement saying that it's I made this decision and I don't want to be in these controversies or whatever. And then Pat McAfee took so much heat for making that announcement that yesterday he had Aaron Rodgers on the show just to talk sports. The day after he said he's never coming back. It was ridiculous.

All right, I got to ask you quickly. ESPN is in the news today for getting Emmy Awards that were attained under false pretenses. Apparently the rule is if you work on a show like SportsCenter and you're just your talent on SportsCenter, you can't get the individual Emmy if the show SportsCenter is getting one. You could get an individual Emmy in some other categories, but you can't get it for like best show, even if you're one of the anchors of it. And so ESPN decided that it'd be a great idea if like Megan Kelly were an anchor of sports center to submit a fake, like Michael Kelly, um, name, get the award with my initials and then like

scrub the trophy and then give it to me, Megan Kelly, so I could say I won an Emmy. And it's not even clear whether the talent knew they were being given fake Emmys. But this, to me, Jason, underscores how pathetic and feeble-minded the people who would submit, like these executives at ESPN are. How pathetic that you're that obsessed with those stupid little fake gold trophies that you would jump through these hoops in order to give fake rewards to your talent. I mean, that was one of the things that was great about Roger in the entire time Fox News from when it was born to when he died. I'm sure to present day he never submitted it or anybody for a for an award because he knew it's a bullshit, corrupt industry. We don't want any part of it.

Roger Ailes was a brilliant, smart man ahead of his time in the newspaper industry. When I started in the 1990s and all the way through probably about 2010, there was an obsession in the sports world with these APSE awards and there's obsessions with Pulitzer Prizes and all this other stuff. And it actually works to corrupt journalism. You start editors start planning all year how we can win a Pulitzer, how we can win an APSE. That's the Associated Press Sports Editors Awards. And so you put out these bogus narrative driven stories to win these awards. And many of these stories avoided truth. They avoided hard truths that were off narrative. That's how you won those awards. And that's how

people got bonuses and how you got to promote the right people as the best in the business, rather than promoting the people who actually were the best in the business. And Roger L is smart enough to see like, man, if I get into this awards culture, it's baiting my talent to avoid truth and to say what's popular. And he knew we didn't want to be a club, a member of the clubs that would have as his members. He knew it. He was right. Washington Post and New York Times both won Pulitzer Prizes for their fake Russia gate reporting that tells you everything you need to know. Jason Whitlock, you're the best. Let's talk again soon. All the best to you. Thank you, Megan.

While we've spent a lot of time discussing politics this week, there were a lot of cultural headlines that we've been wanting to dive into, including new accusations against the late Matthew Perry that shed a very different light on the man we thought we knew. Joining me now, Will Witt, author of the recently released book, Do Not Comply, and Evita Duffy Alfonso. She's a writer for The Federalist. Will and Evita, great to have you both back. So this, this is very sad to me, and I really don't have any wish to disparage the man's legacy, but facts are facts and we should know exactly who it is we're lauding. And since we did laud him on the show, I felt the need to round back to this. One of the things he said was that he wanted more than anything, his legacy to not be friends, but to be the fact that he got sober and helped other people get sober. And the reporting that has now come out us weekly is one thing, um, with all due respect to us weekly, but they have a bombshell cover report this week, but daily mail, I'm telling you daily

mail. They're, they're pretty vigorous about their fact checking. They're more salacious in the topics they choose, but they do not want to get sued. And they're pretty careful about their fact reporting, irrespective of the spin they may put on it. And there is a woman over there, a reporter, an intrepid gal named Alison Boshoff, who is reporting woman after woman coming forward to say that he was, that he violently assaulted them, that he was never sober, that we were sold a bill of goods in his memoir in which he claimed he was sober. And all he did was spend his later years helping people get sober. That, um, as Maureen Callahan wrote up in a great piece that's posted now, his greatest performance was not on friends. It was as a newly sober, good guy who just wanted to help others get clean reporting by the daily mail that, um, he cheated on his,

his fiance with young women, as long as, as young as 19, that his, quote, sober coach, a woman he described in his memoir as Aaron, and friend and assistant, and who he praised, wound up allegedly being shoved by him into a wall, thrown onto a bed. She cut off all contact with him, that she had a coffee table hurled at her. That was the ex-fiance, sorry, after she dared to break up with him. I mean, we could keep going. And, um, they're basically saying it was a lie and this, you know, addicted guy never did conquer that beast and really just did what he did best in that memoir and in his interview with Diane Sawyer, which was act. What do you make of it, Will? I'm always a little bit torn after someone dies and then allegations start coming out about someone. You're like, what do you really believe? The person isn't

even there to defend themselves. But in this situation, I would say that I would look at these women and it seems pretty, I guess you could say airtight, especially with the Daily Mail coming and reporting on it and saying these things. And I would say that is probably true. And what it goes to show me in all of this more than anything is that Hollywood is an evil place with people who are all liars, with people who don't really care about actually being good people. They care about selling an image of being a good person. And that's why it's like, why are we putting so much credence and talking about these people and and saying like oh this celebrity this a-list person who lives in this mansion who has no ties to what a normal person

goes through why am i taking even life advice from this type of person and in these types of things like to me it just the way that this is and how we're viewing it is so much more of a a lack of good priorities on the normal amer Americans part that we are heralding these people up, putting them up so high on a pedestal. And then when they fall down, being shocked and surprised that they weren't actually these good people. These people are in Hollywood. These are the worst people in America, really, you know, other than maybe some of the big pharma people. But these are the people who care really nothing about us and are doing it all for vanity. Why would you expect them to be telling the truth about these things? It is an industry that corrupts, there's no question. Evita, it's

interesting. In his memoir, he described this so-called Erin, that was a pseudonym. She's come out and we know her name is Morgan Moses now. Again, that's from Boshoff's reporting. He talked about her in the memoir. Here's some audio in which he described her. I met her two years earlier at another rehab where she had been working at the time. I didn't get sober back then, but I saw how wonderful she was in every way and promptly stole her from the sober living rehab and made her my assistant. And she became my best friend. She too understood the nature of addiction and would come to know my struggles better than any doctor I'd ever seen. Despite the comfort that Aaron brought to the situation, I still spent many sleepless nights

in Southern California. Sleep is a real issue for me, especially when I'm in one of those places. That said, I don't think I've ever slept more than four hours straight in my entire life. It didn't help that we'd been watching nothing but prison documentaries and I was coming off so much Xanax, my brain had fried to the point where I was convinced that I was an actual prisoner and that this sober living place was an actual jail. You tell me, Evita, I feel like we, to Will's point, we have a thing as Americans and it's to our credit, but it's not always right. We need to build people back up after they've fallen. Like we need to root for people's redemption chapter. I think we never really know what's going on

behind the scenes when it comes to celebrities, when it comes to politicians. There's a, it was a great Elon Musk quote from just a short while ago where he said, we have so many people who care about looking good while doing evil. And so obviously this, this audio, this audio book and this projection that he wanted to make about his friend and his life and the way that he's just raising awareness was not the full picture. And I'll say I know really genuinely good people in my life. And when they do good things, they do them quietly. They don't need – They don't tell you about them.

Exactly. The little old ladies who are knitting clothing for the babies in the NICU, people who are volunteering at your church, the moms who are making snacks and meals at the end of the day for their families. I mean, these are people who do good things and are good people, and they don't need to parade it around and to brag about it. And to me, any time we have a celebrity or a politician who is acting in the way that Matthew Perry did before he died, it's a red flag for me. You know, it is so true because I can tell you one thing for sure. Whenever you see a celebrity, Meghan Markle or anyone else, in a soup kitchen or a battered women's shelter, domestic violence shelter, there are no cameras in those places. The celebrity has brought in the camera because she or he wants attention on themselves. They want attention on their own good deed. It's like there are a lot of people who go out there and do great things for people who are

hurting and they don't do it because they want credit or to burnish their image. Not saying that was Matthew Perry, but to your point, Will, you know, the Friends cast, they knew this guy was an addict. You know, like why didn't Friends or the producers say, you know what, Matthew Perry, you need to take a year off. You need to go with Chandler is going to go on sabbatical someplace and you got to get yourself some help. We've heard about those things happening on other shows. Instead, you know, they definitely knew. Here he was talking to Diane Sawyer, describing his behavior on the set. Here's Sot 14. You had no trouble with the lines. You had no trouble with the timing. You had no trouble

showing up every day. Early on, yes. And I made a rule that I would never drink or take anything at work. So I would never do that. But I would never drink or take anything at work. So I would never do that, but I would show up blindly hungover, like shaking and crazy hungover. So you tell me why somebody didn't intervene and insist that their, quote, friend get some help. Well, I don't think these people really want to intervene,

I guess you could say. I mean, the producers and the directors and all of these types of people getting into these positions, I feel like this is the norm for many of these types of people. So they wanna come and step in or be a good person when reality, all the people around them

are doing similar things. Maybe not to the exact same extent as someone like this, but people are doing all sorts of sinful behavior and living immorally and kind of presenting that image of virtue. I think I said it on your show last time I was on that we live in a post-virtue world, but really we live in a post-virtue world where people show that they are virtuous fakely more now than ever before. And that's what it really seems to come down to. Nailed it. Well, look, I share your concern about disparaging him with the Me Too stories post-mortem, but I do think it's relevant. The reason we went into this is because if he was never actually sober, as these women who are, I mean, again, these aren't attributable directly

to them. The mail is outing these reports about these women, but if these women's stories are coming forward from them or from people who know them, and it's about Matthew Perry, never having been sober, it's saying that he was meeting young women on dating sites, and then he would hit them up for drugs. This is all during his alleged sobriety. It's just, it's a different story, right? If that's how he was treating the people who are most important to him, his fiance, his young assistant, his sober coach. I don't know what to say. I, it just, the whole thing makes me sad. Evita on the story of Americans need the redemption chapter, whether somebody deserves it or not. This young woman, gypsy Rose is all over the news.

And now I understand what the mother did to her. I followed this story. The mother had what we used to call Munchausen's by proxy and hurt this poor girl every turn and raised her like she had about 25,000 illnesses. She was in a wheelchair, alleged infections. The mother was making it all happen because the mother needed attention. She was a sick, sick person. And Gypsy Rose wound up dating. That may be too strong a term for the relationship she had with this young man who was of low IQ, who was on the autism spectrum and got him to kill her mother, to stab her mother almost a couple dozen times to death. The mother did die. Gypsy Rose went to prison. She got, I think, a 10-year sentence.

The boy got sentenced to life in prison. And now she's out, Gypsy Rose, and she's making the rounds in the media. Here's just a bit of how it went for her when she appeared on The View in Sat 16. And I think you're very brave for being here. Thank you. Thank you for telling your story. I think it will help a for being here. Thank you. Thank you. For telling your story.

I think it will help a lot of people. Thank you. The question, though, that I think a lot of people have, I don't have it, is this. Why didn't you try telling a family member or the police, maybe, that you weren't sick? Why resort to murder? Well, you know, I did try to run away, and I talk about this in the documentary. I talk about the first time that I tried to run away from home within four hours.

I got as far as that's outside of town, and within four hours, she brought me back to the home, chained me to the bed, left me there for two weeks, two weeks without a lot of food, water. I had to urinate on myself or in a bucket as she, you know, held the chain. So, you know, I was in the mindset of, I'm so afraid of her. I'm so afraid that if I reach out for help another time, it will be worse for me. What do you make of it, Evita?

I mean, first of all, I'll just say that it's been bizarre that she's now become a celebrity. This is a woman who orchestrated the murder of her mother. And now she's making the media rounds, like you said. She has high profile TV appearances, a book deal. This is her current husband. Yeah, I mean, this is she orchestrated the murder of her mother. I'm not sure how she's going to help people. I'm not sure how she's she's brave.

I think she's tragic. I think she's tragic. I think she needs psychological help. I do not understand why now we are creating a celebrity out of her. And I'll also say I have a lot of sympathy for for good a John, the boy who she who she had murder her mother. He the view also asked her about whether she cared about his life sentence. We have that. We all play it.

And then you take it. Stop 17. You were sentenced to 10 years. He was sentenced to life in prison. I love in the documentary, you take responsibility. You talk about, you know, you were doing the time that you were given. But he will spend the rest of his life in jail. How do you feel about that?

How do you kind of reconcile that? You know, I know that we both probably have a lot of regrets. I know I have regrets. I can't speak for him, so I really don't know his side of things. All I know is, you know, I did my time. He's doing his time. That's all the best that I can do at this point. Like, for me, I have to focus on myself right now. I can't look in the past and worry about him or anything else going on. I have to prioritize myself in this moment. Go ahead.

I mean, I just found that answer so selfish, Megan. I mean, I think he to look at the situation from his perspective, he has a low IQ of 82. His psychologist said that he has the mind of a child. He was deeply lonely. His parents said he had no friends. So Gypsy was really the first person that he ever felt like loved him outside of his own parents. She asked him to kill her parents. She bought the murder weapon. She bought his bus ticket from Wisconsin to her hometown. She really was the mastermind behind this. And I think he did something evil. I think she's done something evil, but to say that she's out, she's presumably making a lot of money and that she doesn't even care to think about him. She has

to focus on herself right now was really gross. And I thought it was gross that the view didn't push back on that at all. The whole story is so, it's just terrible because you do, if you watch the story, so they've made a bunch of documentaries about it and Netflix shows and Hulu, I think you grow to loathe this mother. I mean, this mother, mental ill, yes, gypsy probably is from all the torture. The mother tortured her. The mother was a sick, sick person. You do sort of get to the point where you realize you feel she felt she had no choice, right? She felt like there was no way out. She couldn't run away. I'm not justifying murder, but you know, I, I, my view is they went too hard on the kid who

actually did the crime. He was like you say, like very low IQ on the autism spectrum. He just wrote an email, the Post reported about New York Post. It was all smileys. He called himself Mr. Smiley. He's never going to see air again. He thought he was helping somebody out. The whole thing is like so freaking tragic. But I don't know that there are any heroes in it. Yeah, I mean, for myself, I don't see any heroes in it whatsoever. I mean, definitely not these people in the media who are parading this poor woman around who obviously has mental issues and pushing her out to make a quick buck and to get headlines. I mean, this is the real horrible thing of it. And I think part of it comes from this whole

obsession that so many people have nowadays with this true crime stuff and these types of murder mystery. Like these type of things, the Ted Bundy and the other people that are on Netflix shows and things like that, all these podcasts and stuff. Like people are obsessed with this stuff now. And to me, I find that so weird how obsessed our age of people have become with listening and looking at murder types of things. I'm one of them. I'm guilty. You're them. Okay. Not of murder, but of watching and liking true crime. I do think it's interesting just, I mean, I was a lawyer for 10 years and so I'm very like attracted to the legal system stories, like cases, crimes, whatever they are, they can be civil or criminal. I'm into them. But I know a ton of people who have no connection

as a legal background who are very into true crime. I'll tell you, this may sound sick, but I do think it's a bit of an escape from your own life. And it's just like, you're listening to these stories and they unravel as a mystery. So there's that piece of it where you're like, okay, I get to sort of try to solve it and figure it out. So that's, you know, left brain, right? And the right brain is more creative. I always forget. I think that's interesting. But I also think in the way the crossword puzzle doesn't allow you to think about any problems in your own life, neither do these stories. Like you're thinking about somebody else's very, very big problem. So it's an escape. Yeah, I think people have, for the most part, at least in the Western America,

people around my generation have very boring lives and very meaningless lives in a lot of ways. So then these true crime documentaries come on with some excitement about someone who got absolutely brutally murdered. And that's what gives them excitement in their life is hearing about these people dying. You know, maybe I'm armchair psychologist right now doing this. But to me, it seems like people with not much meaning in the sense of like, having a lot of excitement going on their lives, love these kinds of things because it gives them something to, to bring that to them. And it's weird that we just have so many people obsessing over it, in my opinion. All right. If it is meaning that you are looking for, right. Or the people who you refer to, if it is meaning they are, have I got the convention for them? It is called fat con. Now in order to go,

they need to be a little, a heavy set or perhaps extremely heavy set. This gal, Jalyn Chaney, was out there on social media this week promoting it. I think it just happened earlier this week. Here's just a taste of her message. FatCon is a three-day fat liberation celebration, y'all. We will be celebrating fat liberation, body acceptance, and the power of being in fat community. With over 60 hours of programming spanning from policy, legislation, healthcare, community, and visual arts, plus a ton more, this is sure to be something you don't want to miss. The vibes are going to be immaculate. With a fat brunch, a fat fashion show, and a fat vendor marketplace, there is so much to do. So Jayla is very upset that people aren't being more

accommodating of fat people. Okay. Her word. I never liked the fat word. It's not a nice word, but she's going to embrace it. So I'm going to use it here. She, she wrote an article in 2022 for allure. It's still impossibly hard to be a fat content creator online. For example, she's mad that brands don't carry above a size 3XL Evita because she thinks that's discriminatory. And that's why it's hard to be an online creator because I guess you can't look your best in the clothing of choice. And she is the one who wrote that article or was featured in that article in Travel and Leisure, where she had drafted a petition to the FAA, got a lot of attention, proposing a comprehensive customer of size policy, prioritizing the comfort and wellbeing of all passengers, including a free second airplane seat

for those who are, quote, fat like Jayyn and saying, you know, the airline and thus the rest of us should have to pay for her second seat. So I this these stories, they always, you know, make me take a pause, right, because I do think that people, no matter what size they are, right, they still have value. They're still human beings. We should treat everybody the same. But but the fat liberation movement has taken it really to a new level. They used to say on magazines, this is beautiful, right? That was the first thing. And they would have a plus size model. Now they say, this is healthy and it's not healthy. And we can't deny objective truth just to help somebody's feelings. And I think really it does so much damage to our society, to our culture. Gluttony is a sin. It creates an unhealthy society. I also think that it's

wrapped up in Marxism, right? Person of size. Also think person of color. These are all the same words. That's why in universities they have black studies, they have Native American studies, they have lesbian dance theory, and they also have fat studies. They have put this under the umbrella of, oh yes, they do fat studies. It's a victimhood, it's under the victimhood umbrella. And so it's been wrapped up now in politics, which I think really does a disservice to people who are struggling with their weight because it really, it comes down to people who are struggling with their weight, because it really, it comes down to whether you want to have a long life and a thriving life. Like this one, I really don't get, I'm all for not shaming people who are plus size. Like I realize it's very hard and I've had plenty of them in my family. I get it. It's hard,

but this is like next. There's, there's no question. It's terrible for you. You are on your way to an early death and that's for you to worry about. I don't like, it's fine. I'm like, I'm going to live my life a different way, but I certainly don't want you promoting it the same way. I wouldn't want you promoting go for two packs a day. It's a wonderful thing. It's really like, let's get behind, you know, mine not make it three, a full carton of cigarettes a day, lean in, right? Like as a member of society, Will, you feel like, no, we have a right to speak out and say, this is not a healthy choice. This isn't just like an equal choice among others. This is an unfortunate circumstance that you found yourself in or you've chosen or whatever, but I will not get on board promoting it as a great option for others.

Oh, of course not. Look, they all need to be drinking raw milk. You always know I have the raw milk on the show, Megan. That would help them out a lot. But in reality, all of this stuff is just complete nonsense. Right now, I'm probably working on my next book, which is going to be all about health and the big pharma industry and what they are doing to people and how they push people into this overweight state, this obese state, and they're doing it as a means of control, I think, just like Avita said. I think that as concerned citizens of what we're seeing in this country right now, we have a duty to speak out against things that we see are unhealthy and wrong. I mean, just as Jesus

tells us to be evangelical with our faith, to go and talk to people about our faith. It's one of the greatest gifts we have. When it comes to the truth on what we know to be true, what will help people, we should be doing the same thing in all aspects of our life. We should be going and talking to people about all of the things that are true, but people right now are too lazy to go and say something because it's too much work, or they're too scared of what other people are going to think about them for saying that being fat is unhealthy. Of course it's unhealthy.

It's terrible the things that we do to our body, the things we inject ourselves with and everything we do. But people don't want to talk about that stuff because they might hurt someone's feelings. And people not having their feelings hurt is how the West is going to die when it comes to health. Unless you're a white person, in which case it's totally fine to hurt your feelings all day long.

You were born evil. You're bad right from birth. And that brings me to the Golden Globes. So we covered the Golden Globes when Maureen Callahan came on the show on Monday, but we didn't get to this particular clip, which is just, I mean, you tell me, watch this clip and imagine if they were talking at the end, it starts off fine, but the controversial part comes about halfway through. Imagine if they were talking like this about any other group of people, especially any other so-called oppressed race or, you know, social category.

Listen. Good evening, everyone. Issa and I recently had the privilege of playing Barbie and Ken in the Barbie movie, which is pretty impactful for people who look like us. Yeah, we may not have been what first popped up in people's minds when they thought of Barbie or Ken, but that's changed, and we're hoping to continue to push the boundaries of the roles we can play. By that, of course, we mean white people roles. Oh, my God, I love to play white people roles.

Me too. White people roles are the best. I mean, an alcoholic divorced single father fighting for custody. Oh yeah, an alcoholic housewife whose husband's affair drives her deeper into alcohol. How about this, how about this? An alcoholic school teacher who must put their love of alcohol aside

to inspire their class of inner city youths. White people roles. Oh yeah. It's not funny. It's deeply offensive. That's what whites are. And honestly, like, half those movies

have probably actually been made in Hollywood because that's what Hollywood thinks of whites, too. Right? They're divorced. They're alcoholic. They're cheating on their spouses.

That's just a white person problem, you see? Can you imagine doing this about black people or Hispanic people? That was an Asian man and a black woman for the listening audience. What do you make of it, Will? Yeah, well, the thing is, you know, you're talking about imagine that it's this other group and these kind of things. But the thing is,

is that these people don't care. You know, we can call out their hypocrisy all we want and say, well, what if they said it about Jews or black people or gay people? Like, it's not about that. It is about power because these people know that they have the power. They know they're actors making millions and millions of dollars. They know that they control the entertainment industry and all these other things. So why does it matter if they're hypocrites for the things that they're saying if they have the power? And that's what it really comes down to, is that these people do not care about you.

They do not care about actually saying something funny or creating something beautiful. They care about having power over you and turning you into a slave. And yeah, that might sound a little hyperbolic when it comes to like, all these people are just making a joke on the golden globes. It's not all that serious, but in reality it is because there are people out there who live in Los Angeles and New York city and Chicago who see those things and laugh at them and think how much white people suck. And that this is just a fine thing to do and then worship these people who say these things and talk about them in the magazines and on the TV shows. And that's their life. I mean, it's so sad and disappointing. And when are white people going

to say like enough is enough? Like there's going to be some white person probably who keeps seeing these things over and over again and might commit some sort of horrible act because of how these people are treating them in the media, which is a sad and scary thing to say. But they're just getting treated and thrown around every single day. It's really terrible. They're trying to make it cool to hate the evil or in this case, weakened white people, you know, ha ha ha, you losers who have who are alcoholics. Ha ha. So fun. You know, you people who have been cheated on, that's a white thing. This is absurd. It's not true. And as Glenn Lowry of Vita has been saying for a long time, brilliant commentator, he was at Harvard economics professor. Now he's at Brown

and his commentary is always worth reading and watching. He, and he's black. Uh, he, he says he worries about this kind of rhetoric, not this in particular, but in general, because what's going to happen is going to get turned around on black people. And he says black people aren't going to like that very much. You know, we start to talk about crime stats in the black community and so on, like they're playing a very dangerous game with this so-called humor. They are playing a dangerous game. I think any sort of of of racism, whether it's wrapped up in a joke or whether it's much more overt, is a huge problem for any country. We've seen it in the history of this country with the way that Blacks used to be treated in the past. And then we're seeing it right now in South Africa, and

it's getting very bloody there. Listen, I'll say that the normalization of anti-white racism is not actually necessarily coming from Hollywood. They are repeating what they are getting from our universities. And Megan, you've been talking about this a lot on the show, but DEI is rotten. That's why we are allowed to discriminate against white students in the admissions process. It's why we have black-only dorms, black-only convocations, Black-only study spaces at elite universities. That is normal. We have Indian-only science groups, Hispanic-only math groups. There is no white-only anything. And I'm not saying there should be. I think it should be colorblind. We should go back to looking at somebody based off of the content of their character, or in the case of a university,

what's your IQ? How good were you in high school? What are your merits? And they're not. And that is where a lot of this is coming from. It is rooted in the universities and it's spreading out into the rest of the workplace and into every institution that we have in America. And it is literally poison. It is. It's cancer and it's metastasized and we need to cut it out, radiate it, chemotherapize it, and do all the things, which is a form of poison, to get rid of the poison. I mean, that's what, you kill poison with poison. That's the only way forward.

This has got to be eradicated. Otherwise, it's going to fester even more, and it's dangerous. It's not the way any of us wants to live. Evita and Will, so great to see you both. Thanks for being here. Will, when your book comes out, come on, talk about it. Oh, I'd love to. There'll be a little bit of time, but definitely. All right, well, wait, to see you both. Thanks for being here. And Will, when your book comes out, come on, talk about it. It sounds interesting. Oh, I'd love to. There'll be a little bit of

time, but definitely. All right. Well, wait, we'll be patient. We'll talk in the meantime too. Thank you. Thanks, Megan. Okay. So up next, I could not believe when I started digging deep into what's happening in the Alex Murdoch case down in South Carolina, you know, he's seeking a new trial. He may very well get it, but you don't even know the half of what that court clerk has done. That's now come back to haunt her as we move into the hearing. He's about to get his hearing on whether he should get a new trial. And it could be a he said, she said on this juror's credibility about whether this court

clerk interfered with the verdict and the jury versus this court clerk's Becky's Becky Hill, her testimony about whether we can believe her. And let me tell you, her credibility, it's taken some hits. That's next. I'm Megyn Kelly, host of The Megyn Kelly Show on Sirius XM. It's your home for open, honest, and provocative conversations with the most interesting and important political, legal, and cultural figures today. You can catch The Megyn Kelly Show on Triumph,

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free. Go to SiriusXM.com slash MK show to subscribe and get three months free. That's SiriusXM.com slash MK show and get three months free. Offer details apply. Now we finish up the week with the latest on the Alec Murdoch case. Becky Hill, the embattled Colleton County clerk of court and her adult son, who also works for the court, are in some very big trouble right now. And all of it could very much benefit Alec Murdoch, who's seeking a new trial. And there's a hearing to see whether he'll get it at the end of January. Will Fulks is the founding editor of Fitz News. They've been breaking all sorts of news in this case, both recently and while the trial was going on and while Alec Marduk was getting outed as a potential and now we know convicted murderer is with us now. Will,

thank you so much for being here. So this is we knew that the defense was accusing Becky Hill, the court clerk, of allegedly tampering with the jury. And as I understand it, they have at least one juror who is saying under oath, she said to us before Alec testified, watch his body language and something to the effect of be skeptical. And now you have other jurors who say, no, we didn't see that. That's not what we heard or saw. And I think you have two other jurors who say we heard her say the thing about the body language, but not that second part. Now, all of this could be very problematic for the prosecution. The way I understand it is if this judge says the judge is going to have to find one of two things. There was interference with the jury and he gets a new trial or the

standard is there's interference and it affected the outcome. And if that's the legal standard, you have to prove it affected the outcome. Alec Murdoch is in a worse position. So the legal standard may decide how this comes down. But either way, what Becky Hill did or didn't do is at the heart of the case. And she and the juror are going to be facing off because she denies the charges. So what what have we learned about Becky in the past couple of months that may negatively affect her going into this battle? Well, we've learned quite a bit, Megan, and thank you for having me, by the way. Appreciate you having me on. And I would point out, in addition to those allegations of jury tampering, there's also an allegation that's been put forward that Becky Hill conspired to have a juror that she believed to be favorable to Alec Murdoch

thrown off of the panel. And in fact, there was a juror removed. Yeah, that's correct. Egg lady removed the day of the verdict. So it's a little more than just tampering. There's actually allegations of a conspiracy to manipulate the composition of the jury. But yeah, you outlined the standards very well. The state has to prove, or the state's alleging that Murdoch has to prove not only that there was tampering, but that it changed people's minds, that it impacted the verdict. Whereas the defense is saying, hey, all we've got to prove is that there was tampering. And what's really interesting about this case is, at least in South Carolina, there is no case law. There is no precedent that relates to the specific set of circumstances that we're dealing with. So former Chief Justice Jean Toll, who has been tasked with deciding whether or not Alec Murdoch gets a new trial, she's going to have a lot of discretion.

All right. So they're going to go in there at the end of the month, and they're going to have testimony about what Becky Hill did or didn't do. In the meantime. So let's just start with the book, because that's interesting. She wrote a memoir, which is very unusual to have a court clerk read a memoir about the case. And she had a co-author on it and whatever they self-published. OK, it was weird. But now it comes out. She plagiarized. And it's OK to use that word because she's admitted it. Tell us about that. That's correct. She admitted plagiarizing excerpts of a story that was printed. I think it was a BBC reporter that she lifted some copy from and included it in the book. And as you acknowledge, she's admitted it. This is not up for debate. But this is just really the tip of the iceberg when it comes to the bad news that Becky Hill has been dealing with over the last few months. And Megan, I think it's important to point out, Becky Hill is somebody that during this trial really stood out. All the media who

covered this story, she had great relationships with everyone. She was someone that everyone really loved, got to know very well. And so to have all this come out, it's been very difficult for a lot of folks who really got to know her very well during the process. But the facts are- They're basically alleging in these, and we'll get to it, that she's almost a serial criminal. I mean, that she's done many illegal acts.

On the book, I'll just put a period at the end of that story. The co-author has since pulled the book and said he never wants to work with her or have anything more to do with her again. And we find out that one of my favorite pieces of the story is how did Becky only had to write like the prologue to the book that the co-author did all the labor on the book. So she had one thing to do. And it turns out the way she plagiarized was a BBC reporter had inadvertently sent a draft of an article the BBC reporter was working on about the Murdoch case to Becky because the reporter's

editor was named Becky, too. And so we've all been there. And then you just say, hey, sorry, could you disregard that? Didn't mean to send that to you. Apparently, Becky Hill was like, yeah, no problem. I got you, girl. And she stole it and made it her problem. Can't make this up. But and again, these are the least of her problems, really, which is why this is all so fascinating. Get to the law enforcement investigation into her and her son, which it turns out we do believe is related. Absolutely related. And all this started back in November. Our news outlet reported exclusively that Becky Hill's son, Colt Hill, had been arrested for one count of wire tapping. At the time, it was not revealed what that count of wire tapping was related to. We

have since learned that it was part of an effort to keep Becky Hill abreast of two state ethics commission investigations that have been underway for the past few months into the book. There have been allegations that she abused her position of public trust to enrich herself, gaining access to materials for the book. There's also an investigation and allegations that she misappropriated taxpayer money and then lied about it to members of the county council down there in Collin. So those are the two ethics complaints she's facing. But this week, we reported earlier this week, state law enforcement division has confirmed a criminal investigation into those allegations of abusing her office for personal

gain. And again, why does this matter? Well, Megan, those are at the very heart of the defense's motion for a new trial, the allegation that she rigged the jury to benefit herself to sell copies of this book. Oh my gosh. I mean, this is, when you first heard it from the defense, you're like, no way, this is a desperate defense measure to try to undo this massive, terrible jury verdict against their client. But they've got it. I mean, they are they are very well positioned going into this thing. My my feeling is the the only way they lose this is if the judge chooses the legal standard that says and you have to show that it affected the outcome, in which case they might lose and Alec could stay in jail. If not, he's

going to get a new trial. So the thing about the son is, as I understand, the son was like the chief tech guy for the court system and how it looks. And you tell me is she was being investigated for some of these ethical breaches that were suspected. And she said to the son, or he said to her, let's wiretap the investigator who's looking at so that the son would find out all that they knew and then report it back to the mom. When it's actually, excuse me, Megan, it's actually a little worse than that. The individual they were wiretapping is the county administrator or the deputy administrator, rather, who was on the phone with the investigators. And so one of the things that we've uncovered is in the weeks

since all this started breaking, since Becky Hill was first aware that she was being investigated, we've also been able to confirm that in addition to her son being arrested, we're now dealing with the potential obstruction of justice related to this case because we've got two cell phones that he has allegedly destroyed. We've got two that were factory reset before they were turned over to investigators in an attempt to, I guess, scrub data off of them. And the cell phone that Becky Hill used during the trial that could have all sorts of evidence on it, all sorts of information is missing. It's missing.

She turned in a cell phone to investigators that was different than the one they specifically requested in their search warrant. So, you know, we're not only looking at these jury tampering allegations, corruption allegations, but now we've got potential obstruction of justice tied to this as well. That is very convenient that that cell phone has gone missing. And yeah, so I read your report and you guys should check out Fitz News if you want to read because the details are all there. Will lays them out very well. They had county issued cell phones because they work for the county and they transferred their phone numbers over to from their Samsung county issued phones to new iPhones. But then they still had the old

phones and those phones have been scrubbed of all data. Some have been scrubbed, some have been destroyed. And again, the most important one, Becky Hill's cell phone, we don't know where it is. And the timing of it, Will, the timing of when they did the scrubbing is also suspicious, no? It's very suspicious. The two cell phones that were destroyed, this took place when Becky Hill's son was first approached by law enforcement and asked to come in for questioning. So he gets the call, hey, we want to question you. He destroys those two cell phones allegedly.

And Becky Hill's cell phone goes missing the day that the jury tampering allegations were first leveled against her last September by Alec Murdoch's attorney. So, yeah, it's not only what's happened, but it's the timing of what's happened that could be very significant moving forward. This is way far afield, and I have no evidence for this. It's just a thought that occurred to me I wanted to ask you about. Is there any chance, given how connected Alec Murdoch was to this courthouse, you know, his dad was the prosecutor and the granddad was the prosecutor and he has, was the prominent guy at this big law firm. Is there any chance that like, this was a side deal between the Murdoch's and Becky Hill, like do something so egregious it could get a bad

verdict from me thrown out? We have heard that theory. We've done some digging into it. I think the only way that that theory works though, is that though, is that Becky Hill would have to be a very smooth criminal. And I think from what we've seen, she is not. For example, conducting all of the business for her book on a government email, literally using taxpayer time and taxpayer resources to write her book, to arrange interviews for her book, to promote and sell her book, again, all on government time and using government resources. So I don't know if that's quite the criminal mastermind that could pull something like that off. But Megan, I do want to make a point.

You raised something there about the influence of the Murdochs. And what is so disappointing about all of this is, as I'm sure you know, South Carolina is not a state that has a reputation, a sterling reputation for dispensing justice, whether historically or in recent years, where a state that's had a lot of issues with judicial branch corruption. There's a big push right now in our state legislature for judicial reform. And so this was a trial where we got it right and everyone saw us get it right. And so now to have to go back and revisit all these issues because of a clerk who's accused of these things, it really is disheartening because South Carolina needed this to be a clean trial. And I do think the jury got the right verdict, but now we've got to find out if they did it the right way. And it's increasingly looking as though they didn't.

Oh, my goodness. All right, well, I have a weird way to end our interview because I would be remiss if I didn't ask you about this. I forgive, please forgive me. But you are you happen to have another role in the public eye. And that is you worked for a while for Nikki Haley when she was governor of South Carolina and came out publicly and said that you and she had had, quote, an inappropriate physical relationship, which she's denied back in 2010.

So are you saying that when she was married, she had an extramarital affair with you? Relationship was in 2007. It all came out in 2010. And, you know, that's been a story. There's a great backstory to that. I don't know if this is the time or the place to tell it, but I'll say this, Megan, I do appreciate you asking about it and you're interested in it. It's not just the Laura Loomers of the world that are interested in this

story, but it was a long time ago. I mean, 17 years ago. Since then, I built a very successful business here. I'm raising a family. We have seven kids. My wife and I were expecting our eighth here in April. I'm not the person I was back then. I don't think Nikki Haley's the person she was back then. I understand there's a lot of interest in it. I've said a lot about it in the past. I don't know that I have much to say about it now, other than certainly stand by everything I said.

But I would encourage folks who are considering who to vote for in this upcoming presidential election. I wouldn't look too much at an affair from 17 years ago. I would look at where Nikki Haley is on the issues. I do want to say this. I'm very proud of the way that our media outlet has covered Nikki Haley since she announced her candidacy last February. We have credited her where we thought she was doing good things on entitlements. In fact, not only taking a good position, but pushing the field in the right direction on entitlements. And we've criticized her where we felt she deserved it,

but we've kept it focused on the issues. And I think that's a credit to the way that we're covering this race here in South Carolina. Now, the primary moves to South Carolina and the not too distant future, who are you planning on voting for? It's a very good question. I got to decide if I'm going to vote for a Republican or not, but we'll see. We're looking at the field. And by the way, I was at the debate in Tuscaloosa and got a good look at the candidates. I thought you and your crew did a great job there. So certainly take an inventory of that field. Well, look, all the best to you. I appreciate those things are very dicey, especially involving somebody who's then running for president.

And she's denied it. And Will says it happened. So the viewers can make up their own minds. But more importantly, you've been doing amazing, amazing work at Fitz News. I have to say you're reporting as a former as a recovering lawyer. I really appreciate your attention to detail. You lay out all the facts of the case and let us make up our own minds on this story and the one we ended with. So thank you and all the best to you. You're very welcome.

Thank you. Yeah, we appreciate it. My gosh. The Murdoch story, you guys, is unbelievable. That thing about how she got the BBC reporter's story and wound up allegedly stealing it. Can you imagine? I mean, look, who would have the hubris? Like, what does that show you? It shows that she's a reckless stealer of information. She's not even careful about it. So yeah, I see Will's point about what are the odds then that this reckless person

like had a side deal with Alec Murdoch that she would tank everything after the fact and she would go through this meticulous exercise to do it. But there are all sorts of things that are going to come out about her. He mentioned the egg lady. That's the lady who the one lady who they thought was more predisposed towards voting not guilty. She got bounced off of the trial the day of the verdict. And now and it was all because of things that were being alleged by Becky Hill. And now it turns out that Becky Hill may have been trying to manipulate this verdict for a prosecution verdict all along. Because that's what they're saying, that she was kind of telling the jurors, don't believe him. I can't get enough of this.

I really hope he doesn't get a retrial because I agree with Will, they got the right verdict at the same time. But if he does, we'll see how it goes. Legal experts I've spoken to are saying they think it will go much better for Alec Murdoch this time around because he's, you know, they'll probably won't put him on the stand. He knows that they have this tape recording of him at the kennels. So he's not going to tell the jury I was never at the kennels. I mean, all of these going to tell the jury I was never at the kennels. I mean, now all of these statements are still on camera and the police have them. So query how much misleading he'll be able to do, but they've learned all the prosecution's tricks and their

strategy, I should say, and they'll be sure to litigate around them. Anyway, happens. I think January 29th will be all over for you. So fear not. Okay. I want to say thank you to all of you for joining me today and all week. Do me a favor, go to megankelly.com, sign up for our American News Minute. We send it out once a week. We don't overload your inbox like a lot of other folks do. And it gives you some highlights from the Megyn Kelly show of the week before, all the news you need to know in 60 seconds or less. We always have an update on my sweet Stradwick, which continues to be the most clicked on item.

He's a star. And don't forget that Monday is Iowa Caucus Day. We'll have that fully covered for you. Have a great weekend. Thanks for listening to The Megyn Kelly Show. No BS, no agenda, and no fear.