The Mello Millionaire with Tommy Mello - Marketing Like a Billionaire: Inside the Mind of Russell Brunson

Episode Date: July 25, 2025

Russell Brunson is the co-founder of ClickFunnels and a driving force behind the online marketing revolution. From hustling potato gun DVDs in college to building a $100 million software company, he��s proof that big ideas and relentless execution can change everything. With ClickFunnels, he’s empowered over a million entrepreneurs to launch, scale, and automate their businesses without needing a tech team. He’s also a best-selling author of DotCom Secrets, Expert Secrets, and Traffic Secrets — books that have become the go-to playbooks for digital marketers worldwide. Known for his electrifying stage presence and practical, no-fluff strategies, Russell doesn’t just talk funnels — he builds empires with them. His mission? To help everyday people turn their passion into profit, and their message into a movement.00:00 The Birth of a Digital Empire02:59 The Journey of a Funnel Hacker06:06 Lessons from Wrestling: Embracing Failure08:48 The Power of Storytelling in Marketing12:05 Balancing Life and Business14:48 The Importance of Team and Collaboration17:54 Navigating the Future: AI and Business21:05 Crafting Compelling Offers23:57 The Value of Sharing Knowledge26:48 Final Thoughts: The Power of ObsessionMeet me at Home Service Freedom 2025 ⟶ https://homeservicefreedom.com/Check Out My Social Media:Tiktok  ⟶ https://www.tiktok.com/@officialtommymelloInstagram ⟶ https://www.instagram.com/officialtommymello/Facebook ⟶https://www.facebook.com/thomasmello/My other podcast:Home Service Expert ⟶ https://open.spotify.com/show/4WHQ3ldGThHsP1cfzNF33GLive Q&A submission form:https://homeserviceexpert.com/questionsLearn more about Russell Brunson: Website ⟶ https://www.clickfunnels.com/Key Topics:Russell Brunson, ClickFunnels, digital marketing, sales funnels, entrepreneurship, storytelling, failure, AI, business strategy, online salesTMM Director / Series Creator - Elaina SlaytonExecutive Producer - Jim Leslie Producer - Bianca Zhou Editor - Paul McAleavey Camera - Cullen Fleming

we built an industry based on this thing that nobody even knew before. We built, you know, ClickFunnes we've done over a billion dollars in sales on our platform ourselves. Our clients have done like 14, 15 million dollars in sales on the platform. It's just like, because I was obsessed

with this nerdy thing that no one cared about. Like, be obsessed and be okay with it and become the best of the world of what you're doing. Innovative, magnetic, strategic. Our guest today is a digital pioneer who transformed the way entrepreneurs sell online. ClickFunnels' mission is to liberate

and educate the world. Russell Brunson is the co-founder of ClickFunnels. Instead of creating a software, we wanted to create a movement. A $360 million platform that revolutionized internet marketing. The concept of like, you're one funnel way for being rich. And he empowered over 100,000 businesses to scale with ease. Strive for the impossible, the unheard of the absurd dreams you've always had. At the age of 15, Russell was launched into the world of online marketing,

where he found viral success making videos about selling potato guns. Now, Russell is a new thing. New York Times bestselling author. Whose writings have become a go-to-playbook for marketers, creators, and CEOs around the world? I started my very first book, which is dot-com secrets. His books.com secrets, expert secrets, and traffic secrets have sold millions of copies and reshaped the world of online entrepreneurship. He shared stages and strategies with legends like Tony Robbins and Dean Graziosi. Through his connections, he's built a loyal community of funnel hackers who follow his every move. Greatest motivation in business, it comes

from seeing the results of the people you're trying to help. He also hosts top business podcasts such as marketing secrets and the Russell Brunson show. Commanding an audience of millions across platforms, Russell believes that the right message delivered to the right people can change lives. And ClickFunnels, his unique marketing system is the most powerful tool for making that happen. Get ready. This conversation will change the way you think about sales, marketing, and storytelling. Yeah!

All right, guys, welcome back to the Mello Millionaire. day is a great day. It's been a fantastic day. I got Russell Brunson in the house. This dude is fantastic. Like if you don't know who Russell Brunson is, you don't understand the marketing side of your business. Marketing is more important than sales. It's more important than anything. You've got to get the phones ringing. You've got to get the clicks. Russell has built a global empire by mastering the art of the sales funnel. So how did you become so fascinated with funnels? and I know a lot of people that work on funnel hacking and just figuring out how to make the phone ring.

25 years ago before Facebook, Instagram, before MySpace, like we were trying to figure out how to make money online while I was in college. And it was weird because, like, there was not all these people teaching this. It was a different world, right? And so we just tried a lot of things, and some things worked and some things didn't. And one of my first businesses I had was teaching people

how to make potato guns. That was my first thing. Like, I had a DVD teaching people to make potato guns. And so I set up a landing page, we drove traffic to it, started making sales. And then that's where all began. And then from there, it's like, well, how do we make this thing make more money? What does that look like? And then one of my friends was one of the first people ever do an upsell.

And he's like, he calls me one day. He's like, I had an upsell. And he's like, one out of three people are buying the next thing. I'm like, what? I'm like, how should I do that? He's like, well, you're selling the DVD. Like, what's the next thing somebody needs after they buy the potato gun DVD? I'm like, well, they got to go home Depot and buy the pipes and the glue and all that kind of stuff.

He's like, sell him the kit. And I was like, all right, so I threw up a page. They buy the DVD, the next page, like, for $200, buy kit and all the ship you all this stuff, and you can make it. And sure enough, one out of three people bought that. And I was like, holy crap. And then we just started testing little things and little things. And so the next decade in my life, it was like, we'll learn something. I would try it.

And then my income would go up. And so for 10 years, like, that's what I was doing in a whole bunch of my own businesses, other people's businesses. And then about that time, I wrote my first book, dot com secrets, which is like, here's what we learned last 10 years. Like, this is the playbook. And about the same time as we built ClickFunnels, which made it easy. We have a whole company with 400 employees that do stuff. But my job is I'm in charge of the funnels. And that's still all I geek out on every day.

I'm obsessed with it. I get all your ads. I use ClickFunnels for several businesses. It's amazing. It makes it so easy. That's the idea is the ease. What is it like for you? Because you're the guy.

Like, you're the ClickFunnel guy. Like, you, how do you feel? Is it a good feeling of like a little bit of fame? Is it weird? What is the feeling you get? It's definitely weird, especially starting out because I was trying to figure out how to make money because it's, you know, I was a student athlete,

I was wrestling, I'd just gotten married. I was doing the funnels behind the scenes. It was fun, but then, like, people started asking me, and then I would share stuff. And then that's when the guys like that are like, hey, come speak at our event, tell people what you're doing. I'm like, ah. And then you see, you go, you know,

you see someone who get excited, I understood it. When we launched ClickFunnels is when my whole world shifted. Like, it blew up. I mean, that company went from zero to $100 million, three years and it was just like, you know, we were everywhere. We were speaking every. It was just, it was chaos. And I enjoy it, but I love watching the people we train, like, go and do cool stuff.

Like, that's more rewarding for me at this point, you know? No, 100%. And I love it too when the light bulb turns on. I did yesterday. I just did a virtual event. There was 150 people. Then I did another one. There was 500 people.

And the questions were, I could, like, you couldn't keep up, but the, and I'm like, I get very excited. just, I'm like this one little thing when somebody walks up to you and says, dude, I listen to one podcaster did this one thing. And that to me is like why I keep doing it because it's hard to be on the road. But I asked you earlier that you, you've not necessarily building to sell this business. When is enough enough? Yeah, we had an offer four years ago we could have sold. I remember Tony Robbins actually told me he's like, so if you were to, if you were to sell it, what would you do next? And I was like, I don't have something I like more than this.

I would rather do. So if I sell it, then it's gone. I came to serve. And this is the best vehicle I can serve people with. You know what I mean? Yeah. I mean, I'm sure you're saying to me like, we're not kind of guys that are going to retire someday. No, no, I'm 402.

A lot of people like, we're going to sell out and we're going to retire. It's like, and then what? And it's like, then I'm going to build the next thing. And the next thing. So it's like, I love the thing we built. I want to talk about, you know, I wrestled. Oh, yeah? Yeah, I was a wrestler.

And I really like to hire wrestlers. Yeah. They take the ownership. They're just like, and then I like to hire team players. So they kind of grow into this team player. What did wrestling teach you? Like, because you're obviously super competitive if you wrestle. Yeah.

Wrestling taught me, I mean, taught me everything. I was looking at you and you either win or you lose right in front of everyone, you know. One of the biggest fears most entrepreneurs have is like they're scared to, especially first time entrepreneurs. They're scared to try something because they failed and they're a failure. And so for me, what wrestling, what sports taught me is that like, if I fail, I'm not a failure. One of one of my favorite stories about this, my junior year in high school, I started the year, I made goal to be state champ.

It's the first match of the season, I wrestle this guy, and he beats me. And I was just devastating. Because in my mind, I'm going to be state champ, and I just lost first match of the entire season. And I'm so lucky because my dad, my dad was awesome. He filmed the match. And then I remember going home that night, and I went to bed just, like, feeling depressed and sat sorry for myself and everything. And my dad watched it over, like, all night long, my dad slept the entire night.

I wake up next morning, about to go to school. He said, Russell, come here. And we spent an hour drilling. And we did that every single day for the entire four-month season. My dad would show up. We drill it. We drill it. We drill it.

We drill it again. We go out on this match. And I wrestled this guy who, you know, four months earlier beat me. And we had the same match. And this time, I beat him. Win the state title. It's like, you know, one greatest moments of my life. And I remember driving home in the car that night.

And I had the thought of just like, oh, my gosh. Like, when I lost four months ago, I thought it was a failure. And I was like, no. We came back. We drill it, we fix it, we fine-tune things. I think that's what I try to instill my entrepreneurs. It's just like, okay, when you're creating a business or funnel or whatever, like throw it out there.

But the problem with most entrepreneurs is they don't do the first version because they're so scared of failing. I think that athletics and sports taught me just like, like you lose all the time in sports, right? And it's okay because like you go through that process, you learn it a bunch and then it's the tweaks and the changes, the iterations that make it things win. Like our business now, like we roll out a new offer. And we roll out a lot of offers and we roll out really, really fast.

And it's like testing the market. like see what happens. And then sometimes it's like, ah, it's not going to, it's probably not going to go to where. Other times it's like, okay, something's there. It didn't work the way we're supposed to, but now we know. And then we'll sit there and we'll tweak and we'll change and we'll tweak and we'll change. And our goal anytime we have new offers, like, how do we get the spot where we can spend a million dollars a month and ads profitably on this offer? Like that's, that's like a winner for us, right? And so for us, it's like, okay, we did it. And it's like, there's numbers in there tweaking, changing, tweaking, changing until we get to the spot where that's, that's the numbers

coming in, you know. And so I don't know, that's what athletics taught me. I think for those who haven't been athletes that's like learning that like if you fail you're not a failure. Failure is a good thing. Fail forward. I mean, look, I get on stages all the time and I'm like, I'm the largest failure in this room. Guaranteed. But by the time you're trying to load the gun, I've already missed the target 18 times. And now I'm hitting the bullseye every time because I jump right in. And I jump in and I'm like, and everybody goes, dude, that's not going to work. I'm like, you're right. It's not going to work. But we're going to get it to work because it's hard. Yeah. There's something in my DNA. I've got ADHD. I don't care about failing. I don't care about embarrassing myself. I'd stop caring about

what other people think. To a certain extent, I care a lot about my fiance and my family. But you think some people are born entrepreneurs? There's a book I read a while, driven. I don't know if you read that book. It talks about there's like a gene. There's a gene. The people actually have more driven. Yeah. And I think somebody can learn to be entrepreneurial, but I definitely think that like there's some people are born with that as a tendency and some people aren't. One of my first mentors told me is like there's two type of people in this world. There's starters and there's finishers. They figure out who you are and surround yourself with the others. And so I'm, I think I'm one of the greatest starters of all time and I've got like 400

finishers. Well, someone told me it was like, it's like, we're like kites. But there's got to be like the integrator on the ground holding the string to like to make sure that we can like fly the wise. We just like go off and, you know, like we're gone. That's a really good analogy. I was like, that's how I feel sometimes. It wasn't for all the people around me that are holding the strings. I'd be a wreck. I'd be a nightmare. It's so true, man. I can't agree more. What I've learned to do is write things down,

have systems that get really, really organized people around me. Yeah. So your digital marketing book trilogy has sold more than half a million copies worldwide. Or it's a million now. It's over a million. Yeah, two and three books sold a million copies, so yeah. What's your thought on when you write a book, what's the main reasoning behind it?

Is it like a trip wire or whatever? Kind of, but for me it's like I believe every great movement throughout time, started with the book, right? And so it's like the, it's like giving people the playbook to understand how to play in your world, right? What Tony Robbins, like the books he's rolled out over the last decade, right? Like, he wrote money master the game.

It was his first book he'd written in 20 years. But the goal was he had a big fund that he was trying to raise money for, right? So writes the book, teaching the strategies, launches the book, and I don't know the numbers. It's like, I think it's like six or $10 billion. Readers are leaders, dude. And taking the time, Jim Quick,

I was on a podcast with him recently, blew my mind because I'm like, dude, I must be lazy. But what I've noticed is it's hard to be everything. There's 168 hours in a week. You could spend 50 sleeping, 50 working, 10 working out, still have 60 hours left for family. If you watch Netflix, whatever. But how do you maintain?

Because I know you're a strong believer, you're a family man, you're excited about business, you're taking care of your fitness, you're learning all the time. How do you find yourself handling those? Yeah. It's a good question. And first off, I do agree with you.

Like, it's hard to be well-rounded most of the time is impossible, right? Everything great in my life came during times of radical imbalance, right? When we launched ClickFunnels, it was radical imbalance for season. But then you can snap back to something more balanced. And so for me, it's just very much, it's like, I had to learn how to become very present in the thing that I'm doing right now. So like, literally when I get to my house, I drive in my garage at night, I come in the door, like I stop for a second before the door, and I'm just like, okay, like Russell Brunson,

I'm leaving him here and Russell's coming in the door. Like, it's two different people, right? I come in and now I'm a husband. Yep, if I'm husband, I'm a father, this is where I'm at. We had, one of our, my mentors had, had, he wanted me and my team to do a time, a time study for. Yeah. And for me, it was like, like, I got a lot done today. And everyone else, my team was like, yeah, I only, I'm only working like an hour a day.

I'm like, what? Like, I couldn't, I couldn't fathom in there like, yeah, like, between all this stuff, like, I'm only actually getting an hour. And for me, it's like, I was the opposite. Like, I was like, you look at my day. Like, it is jam packed. There's, there's not, there's not time. I'm just, like. Yeah, there's no breaks.

I mean, the calendar's lit up. Yeah. And so I think that's what a lot of people understand. It's just like it's like compartmentalizing the environments. And then when you're in there, like you've got to be. And that's how, at least for me, how I get lost up then. Now, 100%. And my let has talked about he's built a workday in a six hours and he's got three work days to year one.

And as much as I love the guy, I think he's so amazing. I'm like, you know what? I don't want to outwork anybody anymore. I've served my time. I want to out delegate and I want to trust people, but I hold them to the highest standard of what I hold myself to. And I'm like, I'm not being tough on you. I'm way harder on myself.

I got three repeat questions and we'll jump back into some more. These are what I ask everybody. So what's one game-changing piece of advice you wish you knew in your 20s? This is actually something you mentioned earlier. It's based on what I've been in Hardy's books, but the who, not the how. for the first deck in my business, like I thought I had to be the guy who did everything. And it wasn't until one of my now business partners, Todd Dickerson, he was an employee of mine working on stuff.

And then when we had the idea for ClickFunnels, he was like, I want to do this with you, but I don't want to do it as an employee. I want to do it as your partner. And I was like, but I'm the guy. Like I do everything. I'd never had a partner. Like, no, this is like, and it was funny because like he lives in Atlanta. I live in Boise.

up in Boisey for a week as we're planning the next thing we're going to create, you know, and we figured we had the idea for click funnels, we mapped it out. And I'm driving back to the airport as what he tells me. He's just like, I don't want to do this as your employee. I'm doing it as your partner. And it was all the, you know, I'm literally dropping off the airport, stay by to him. And it's just like, uh, what do I say, what I say? And in that moment, I literally was the second best decision of my life outside

of Mary and my wife was like saying yes to him. And I was like, oh my gosh, like I realized now, like seeing now decade later, like what we were able to create because he had ownership because he was. you know, all that stuff, it's like step number one now for me is like, who are the, who's the dream team we're assembling to be able to do the thing. And being okay, giving away a lot of what we're doing, as opposed to trying to keep it hoard it all myself. Yeah.

You know, Richard Branson does a great job because me and you had to hire bottom up. We had to take the trash out, clean the toilets. We were everything. I had to do inventory. I had to do payroll, which I can't stand. I used to have to do accounting and accounts receivable and I hated it. and all of a sudden I figured out, what if you hire you top down?

You got the best of the best. Yeah. And there's the EIP equity incentive program, Phantom Stock. Hey guys, pausing here to explain what an equity incentive program is. Also known as an EIP, an EIP is a program that allows company employees the option to buy shares in the business. This means that as the company grows in value, so does the value of the employee shares.

And EIP turns employees into parcel owners, not just workers. So when the company does well, they directly benefit financially. Often through stock options, restricted stock units, RSUs, or performance-based equity awards. It's a powerful way to create buy-in and long-term commitment from your team. My company, A1 Garage, in state of this program a while ago, and it's one of the best things we've ever done. It gives company employees a shared purpose and motivation. Leave me a comment down below if you like an episode, where I go into more detail about how I set up my EIP and how exactly it works. All right, back to the episode. This is like saying, what are your dreams?

What do you want? And sometimes it's not money. If you really look and say, look, I'm here to, you could have anything you want in life if you just help enough people get what they want. Yeah. And that's ZigZZZ. It's so true. What millionaire habit sets you apart from the rest of us? I think for me it's like it's obsession in a thing, right? Like, I am not, it's funny, I always joke with my wife. Like, I'm really good at two things and that's it. And I think I go really, really deep on, again, funnels. Like, there's no one on this planet that's gone deeper than me on that.

Like, I know that better than anybody in the world. I think for most people, it's like, they're trying to become super good at all the things. And everyone's like, well, I thought you were the CEO of your company. I'm like, like, yeah, but like, just because. That's like the title, like, I want to be building funnels. And so we built a company around where it's like, I can still be like the thing. But like my day job is in the part that like I'm obsessed with like, I wake up every morning. I get to think about it and talk about it and figure things out and we're creating new things.

And like it gives me the energy. And I think it's the obsession so you can focus on the thing that gives you the most energy. You know, that's so powerful because I walk at people like, why do you work so much? I'm like, I never go to work. Yeah. Are you kidding me? You know what I do all day? Yeah.

I mean, look, I'm doing a podcast now with you. It's phenomenal. Like, this isn't work. If you had to start over with $10 million tomorrow, what would you do with it? Oh, see, I have a bootstrap guy. I've never taken money. I never started with money.

I wouldn't even know what I'd do with $10 million. I would just put it in the bank and build a funnel and then we'd launch it like, you know. Everything we've ever done has been the, like it's all been sustainable up front. So I want you know it to $10 million. Other than maybe use that to hire a dream team. You bring in very specific people for something. I learned bigger lessons through time.

Now I make a decision, and it's like, you're going to spend $3 million. I'm like, I know. But we've already tested it. There's going to be a high probability of a massive return. I see people who start business and they have some startup capital or again, they get an SB loan. And they're buying office equipment, computers, desks. Like, what are you doing? Work out of your house.

Work whatever you have to do. Yeah. Yeah. You, I'm curious because I want to talk a little bit about sales funnels, but I'm a home service, home improvement guy. So I don't know if you can relate to that But obviously You know, there's this idea of building a thought in people's mind To remember who you are

And let them get to know you The Wizard of Ads Roy Williams talks about this a lot He's like they it's can't it needs to be relational So I talk a lot about my mom worked three jobs when I was a kid You know, let them know who I am There's got to be a figure at the top So if you had to think about it more of a home improvement home service Yeah

How would you think about offers and like click funnels in a way that it applies to like a conventional business like this. One of the frameworks I teach all times, hook story offers them. Throwing out a hook to grab their attention so I can, just long enough I can like tell them a story

and the goal of the story is to increase the perceived value of the offer. And then the goal to hook is to get them long enough I can tell them a story and they make them an offer, right? I think about it's all the time, like, especially in the internet world, like people have their controlled environment

where they control the thing. Like they're on their phone, they're on their computer, like they have these controlled environments where they're in charge. And for me to have the ability to persuade and influence, I need to move them out of those environments to a thing where I control the environment, right?

The environment is like half of the game. So it's like I'm pulling somebody from their computer to a webinar, to a three-day challenge, to a live event, to a like, so I'd be trying to get somebody from that, whatever that is, to a spot where I can talk to them long form. So I'm trying to get them out of the environment. They're comfortable so it's an environment that I can actually control, right? So we move them. I love that. Now we have a different environment.

Now sales percentages, conversions, everything shifts because now I can, the reason why we do live events, right? my first event I got a great buddy of mine he's doing 150 million in plumbing in Ohio and he goes on stage and I love the guy but this is his first time he's nervous as hell

he threw up in the back and he's got this story about his son holding his son chase up they were living on his sister's couch and his son would sleep on the couch he'd sleep I kind of get emotional thinking about it but he told this story and he held his son up and said

this is not the life we're going to live And, I mean, I get teary, I think about it just because Chase just graduated, he's going to a master's degree. And everybody in that room was changed by that story of, like, we're going to work, no matter what, we're going to fail. He went bankrupt twice, failed. And I'm like, everybody pull out your phone to look at your Google My Business page. And, like, you know, I'm like, teaching tax.

I'm like, this stuff will work. I promise you, this is going to change your life. Get a review on every job with a picture. and I'm going to still stuff I do. Like, I'm super tactical. I just learned something super important because I always invite those people that will talk about like being happy with yourself. And I just, I love telling stories.

And that's where I wanted to ask you. I mean, I remember stories so well if someone's on stage and they tell me a great story. So I started really talking about stories. Like, I just listened to this the other day. When you should start out any speech, you should start out with once upon a time. And all of a sudden, you're like, you're in that moment. And if you could put your, if you could have people put themselves in your shoes and really apply it to their own life.

So with storytelling, how do you even craft that story and message? Yeah. So that's like my big three events. We literally would talk about, we call it subconscious selling. Because when you're selling to the masses, especially online stuff like that, it's different than one-on-one. One-on-one give the opportunity, like asking questions, get feedback, resolve their concerns.

But you're speaking like one-to-men, you don't have that ability. So what we do when we're crafting a presentation, if it's a webinar or a challenge or a video set, whatever it is, right? The question I'm asking myself is like, what's the false belief they have inside their mind? And the false belief is a subconscious belief, right? And subconscious speaks in stories. So it's like, as soon as you tell them something,

a story pops up in their head that's either positive or negative, that's like controlling whether they're going to listen to what you're saying, if they're going to buy, they're not going to buy. That story just magically pops up as soon as you start saying something, right? No matter what I say, as soon as I start saying it, their subconscious is going to pop up a story about what they already believe. and that subconscious story is against me, I'm going to lose. Yeah.

And if I can tell the story in a more compelling way and I can convince them that my story trumps their story, the subconscious mind will literally take my story and replace their story with it. So I'm like, why do I not have that false belief and say, oh, because this is what happened to me. I'm like, okay, that's the story I'm telling. And now they have a new belief, new story. I love that. And now I own it.

And so for me, it's like, what are the false beliefs? What are the story I have that I can tell that replaces their false belief with the true belief that's empowering, that's the game. So this is a genius. Walk me through, I'm a big whiteboarder, like big, big, big. So the first thing I write down on the whiteboard is, do you write the end goal? But my goal is to sell this and do you reverse it?

Like, if you were to just whiteboard with me. Yeah, great question. How would you start this? I would start with, okay, so what's the result we're trying to get somebody, right? So if they buy my thing, this is the result. And then second thing is like, what are all the other things that people are selling to try to get that result? Like all the other potential options, right? So, for example, like, people in my world come to me because they want to make more money on the internet, right?

So it's like, there's a lot of ways to make money on the internet. You can sell stuff on eBay. You could do, you know, like, whatever. And I'm trying to convince you the funnel is the best way, right? So, like, that's my, that's my version. So then I break it down to like, there's basically there's three core groups. There's three core false beliefs that somebody will have when you're making a presentation. The first false belief is their false belief about is that vehicle the right vehicle.

vehicle, it's going to get them the result. Second false belief is like, if I believe that's right vehicle, like what's the internal false? Like, I think that's, I think the funnels are great, but I don't know if I could actually, I'm not technically, like, whatever the internal false beliefs. And then third false beliefs, um, if someone believes first off, I do believe that's right vehicle. I believe I could do it, but then their brains looking for some escape route, but I don't know how to do that or I can't do it because of some external reason, right? Those are the three categories. And it's all stories. Pretty much. That's genius. So one of the things my old COO,

really great friend of mine, were still very close. He did very well on the first exit. He's like, dude, you're giving away all of our freaking secrets, man. What are your thoughts about just giving it all away?

But obviously, you charge people to do it for them. Like, it's a done for you package. What's your, like, thought process around that? Yeah, I give it all away. It's, so what my belief is that people will spend more money

for the same information package in different ways. So, like, I give all my stuff, all my stuff will get away for free on my podcast is awesome. If someone wants to buy it in a book, I have a book format. It's 10 bucks for the book. Like, same information package is a different way. But the thing I'm teaching, the same frameworks I'm teaching at every single level, it's just packaged in a different way. So if you want to watch it on a podcast, cool. If you want to read in a book, cool. You want to come and work with me in my office and we're going, figuring out, but it's all the same.

People want to consume it different ways and they're willing to invest and they want proximity. And proximity is, you know, that's what people pay more and more money for. I love it, man. I got a few more. closing questions. All right. So this is the biggest thing on my mind is the future. AI's here. It's not going anywhere. It's actually going to start compounding. I think within two years, it'll start writing its own code better than anybody. But what do you think the next five years look like? It's exciting and scary. I think I'm nervous for, like, I mean, you said half an hour ago about programmers. It's like in two years from now, obviously, I want eBay.

and it'll code eBay. I want ClickFunnels. It'll build ClickFunnels. So if me as a software guy, I'm like, okay, that's scary, right? I think a lot of jobs, it's like people aren't going to need lawyers or accountants or most, those kind of jobs. Because, like, I can have. Or realtors. Yeah.

Yeah, like, all those things start. So it's scary for people who, like, have, who aren't used to change and stuff. It's exciting for those who are just like, oh, my gosh, this is the change, right? So for me, it's like, the place in my mindset is going. Like, where's the opportunity? The opportunity. is in creating and building things that have network effect, right? So for example, like, if every single person on planet,

like, ask Chad's DBT to build them eBay, there's going to be that 10,000 eBay's, but people are still going to go and list their stuff on eBay. Why? eBay's got 100 million people data log. You think there's a phone. That's the, it's the network effect. Like, it's that.

So it's like, it's communities, it's personality, it's connection. And the people who figure that out are the ones who are going to win. And he's why do people buy information? Well, they're buying it because it, it's, in five years now to buy it because they connect with you as a human. They like, no, trust you.

And number two, you've got a cool community they want to be around. Like, the network. Like that's, so for everyone, it's like, if you're building something right now,

realizing the info is going to be less valuable, software's going to be less valuable. Brand, personality, community, network effect is going to be the most valuable. So it's like building stuff in that, through that lens is where things are going.

Yeah, no, it's interesting. I really like that perspective. It's excellent advice. The best I've heard. yet for sure. Give me one book that you didn't write, or two or three, that are game changers that are like,

dude, this will change your life. Obviously, the Bible's important. And we all know, like, the E-Mith revisited. He's been in here before. Oh, yeah. But, like, is there anything that's not, like, mainstream that you are, like, game changer? Oh, man. I love books.

So I have about 18,000 books in the last three years, all first editions, manuscripts. Like, I collect rare books. Yeah, I know that. Yeah. I'm a little bit of a nerd that way. And so Elsie Lincoln Benedict, most of you know who she is. We're actually republishing her book right now, hopefully out of next month or so. But she wrote a book set.

It was a little book. She lived in 1920s. She was speaking in arenas full of women. She spoke over 3 million women in like a couple of year period of time. But she's filling arenas back in the 20s and she would teach personal development. And she would teach different courses and then she'd sell, she'd speak a big room, sell an event small. I mean, just like all of us are doing nowadays.

She was doing it in the 20s and she didn't eventually did called how to get anything you want and then she made a book series based on that It was these little tiny books and I found a rare first-dition copy. It's been out of print for Forever and so we're bringing it back and that's probably the most fascinating coolest book I've I've found of all these books that I want to buy I'll send you a copy because if you read it it'll it's it's insane that she wrote this 1920s like it's anyway so that's In fact, Napoleon Hill in his... Napoleon Hill and Del Carnegie, same area, yeah. In the growing up...

He's like, there's this woman. She's filling up stadiums. He's talking about her. He was like watching. He's like, how is she doing this? Yeah. And no one's ever heard of her today. So she, like, that book's insane.

And then my favorite Napoleon Hill book, because he's my favorite author. Outwitting the devil is insane. I'm obsessed of it. I actually got the manuscript from that book from the foundation. So I've had a chance to read that like the original pages from his typewriter.

I love it, man. It's so much fun. Last thing I always do is I got to let people know what's the easiest best way to get a whole of you and what's coming up that people should get involved in. Oh, yeah. I mean, you can follow me socially. If you look to search of Brussels, I'm all the places. But in my YouTube channels, I'm actually each week I'm bringing in my old rare books. Like, I spent $1.5 million for this book.

Let me tell you the story. So, like, that's if you get into old books and stuff, it's my YouTube channel. But the best thing we do is I do an event about once a month called Selling Online. Three-day event on SellingOnline.com is the cheapest thing we do. And it's probably the best thing we do. So anything you want the audience to hear that we didn't talk about, final thoughts? I think for most people, it's just most people in the world, they're dabbling, they're not obsessed. I think a lot of times it's looked down upon like, oh, this guy's obsessed with what, you know,

and I think if people find the thing they're passionate about and then just like put on blinders and just become obsessed and become the greatest in the world at that thing, you know, that's where, I look what you do, like garage doors. I have an infinity years if someone came to me like, this is what I'm going to be able to make, it makes no sense. and look what you built. Like, it's an obsession that's deeper. And I think if people will be willing to let themselves do that,

because I think culturally is a stigma about, like, you know, that person's obsessed. It's like a negative thing. It's like, no, like, the greatest things happen to people that are obsessed. Like, pick something you love and just become obsessed. Like, come to the best in the world at. Like, I don't care what you do, but whatever you do, like try to be the best of that thing and, like, read the book, study it.

Like, get to the spot where, like, you understand it deeper than anyone else. And if you do, like, you know, it'll change everything. I mean, the thing that I became obsessed was, was 20 years ago, no one knew what a sales funnel was. Like, it was the dorkiest thing, for some reason, like, I just like, this is the thing. It got me so excited and I just like going down the rabbit hole in. Potato guns.

Yeah, and 20 years later, it's like, we built an industry based on this thing that nobody even knew before. We built, you know, Click phones. We've done over a billion dollars in sales on our platform ourselves. Our clients have done like, I think, $14, 15 million dollars in sales on the platform. It's just like, because I was obsessed with this nerdy thing

that no one cared about. Like, be obsessed and be okay with it, and become the best of the world, what you're doing. I appreciate you being here, brother. It means a lot to me. I'm glad you made it out. And anything I could ever do for you, you let me know. And hopefully the audience took a ton from this. I'm going to get this on the Home Service Expert Podcast as well. And I hope you have a great day. Thanks, man. And a great week. Thank you. All right, guys, thanks so much for listening to this episode. Like always, we're going to close it out with the Tommy Truth, which is a little

slice of wisdom from me to you that can help guide you in whatever you're striving towards right now. In business, I always got upset when somebody made a mistake. I'm like, why didn't you just ask me? And what I've learned is to let them fail. Let them learn. Just don't make the same mistake twice. Every failure is a little lesson. And if you're failing all the time, you're actually going faster through life.

I always say, ready, fire, aim. Because I've made so many mistakes. I didn't hit the target, but you're still loading the gun. This time I'm hitting the bullseye every time. Failure is a great thing. If you embrace failure quickly and move on, so many people are just afraid to get started. Learn to fail quickly so you can succeed quicker. And that's it, guys.

We'll talk to you next week.