The Mindset Mentor - Healing The Relationship with Your Parents w/ Anahata Ananda

Episode Date: March 24, 2020

You are the way that you are because of your parents, good or bad. In this episode, Anahata and I will talk about how to improve the relationships with your parents and mend any issues that there may be in the relationship between the two of you.Listen to Ananhata's podcast at Shamangelic Healing PodcastFollow me on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/robdialjr/ Want to learn more about Mindset Mentor+? For nearly nine years, the Mindset Mentor Podcast has guided you through life's ups and downs. Now, you can dive even deeper with Mindset Mentor Plus. Turn every podcast lesson into real-world results with detailed worksheets, journaling prompts, and a supportive community of like-minded people. Enjoy monthly live Q&A sessions with me, and all this for less than a dollar a day. If you’re committed to real, lasting change, this is for you.Join here 👉 www.mindsetmentor.com My first book that I’ve ever written is now available. It’s called LEVEL UP and It’s a step-by-step guide to go from where you are now, to where you want to be as fast as possible.📚If you want to order yours today, you can just head over to robdial.com/bookHere are some useful links for you… If you want access to a multitude of life advice, self development tips, and exclusive content daily that will help you improve your life, then you can follow me around the web at these links here:Instagram TikTokFacebookYoutube

Welcome to today's episode. I'm so excited to be here in Sedona, Arizona. I'm here for the next month and I'm with Anahata Ananda, which is amazing because I'm excited. Anahata Ananda, which is amazing because I'm excited. You're about to leave for Austin. I just got back from Austin. Now you're leaving to go to Austin from Sedona. But I'm excited. We got connected through my friend CT. I came over here and did a session with you. And then last night, my girlfriend and I did a breathwork session with you, which was amazing. And I want to talk about that. But I also want to talk about about because you have really unique perspectives of thousands of people that you've worked with over the past 20 years now and I want to talk about the one thing that we dove into that I thought was really good in the conversation was the parent-child relationship which I know from my

audience in the thousands of people that I've coached from my audience, that usually is the main thing that's either propelling somebody forward or holding them back. And when we had our conversation, you talked really deeply about the parent relationship, because obviously you have your own parents, but then also you help people with their parent relationships, but you also have your own children. So there's a lot that's in there. also have your own children. So there's a lot that's in there. So the first thing I want to dive into is who are you? Where'd you come from? How'd you get into this? And give us a background of how you got to where you are before we dive in and you can give your incredible lessons. Thank you. First of all, it's an honor. It's a privilege. There's this beautiful soul connection

we have and I appreciate that. Thanks for coming back to Sedona. It's always privilege. There's this beautiful soul connection we have, and I appreciate that. Thanks for coming back to Sedona. It's always my pleasure to support your and also Lauren's core healing, spiritual expansion, and personal empowerment. And I run a shamanjelic healing center here in Sedona, and this is my dharma, my soul's mission and calling is to support people through reclaiming their life, turning it around, living a thriving, impactful life. And I started this because I was going through my own dark night of the soul and didn't really have the tools to navigate it and wish that I had better resources. I felt very much alone in my own silo, ill-equipped to navigate being a mother of twins. And although I checked off all the boxes, Rob, of, okay, this career and

this big house and this marriage and two kids, it really wasn't soulful. The way I was living life was really not in alignment with my soul's mission and, um, a lot of depression, anxiety, and I wasn't really equipped to have the communication tools to be in, in, in, in marriage and, and navigating the challenges of parenting two at a time. And I, I think that, um, in that, that, you know, my life melted down and I was in the process of rebuilding it and traditional therapies were falling short for me personally. And so I kind of dove into shamanism, spirituality, meditation, yoga, healing foods, cleansing, fasting, sweat lodges. I dove into all kinds of things because I was just so hungry for real solutions. And it kept getting at the core stuff. When I was trying therapy,

it was talking about the little tip of the iceberg. And I was so frustrated. We're like, we're not going deep enough. The deeper issues are way, way little tip of the iceberg. And I was so frustrated. We're like, we're not going deep enough. The deeper issues are way, way, way under the surface. And I needed core healing. And going on the shamanic route was really powerful and impactful. And I fell in love with it. And it kind of brought me home to a place of remembering who I am and what's possible. And it just became a mission to learn that kind of work and acquire lots of tools to be able to bring those back to people that are going

through core life shifts, whether they're going through a breakup or a health challenge, or just stepping into a career shift or stepping into a better, bigger version of themselves and navigating their own spiritual awakening journey. And for the last two decades, I've just been acquiring all of these tools and thousands of clients had the opportunity to support people through their journey. And I just love it. I love to go deep into the core issues, as you know, and life has been also a great teacher. Good. Well, one thing that I really, like I said, want to dive into is the parent relationship with the child, what you've seen with clients and what you've seen. We were talking about codependent relationships. We were talking about the parents overstepping their boundaries, because I know a

lot of people that I've heard, they still have parents that overpping their boundaries. Because I know a lot of people that I've heard, they still have parents that overstep their boundaries. They always want to know where they are, what's going on, even at 30, 40, 50 years old. It's always worry, worry, worry, worry, worry. I can specifically think of people that I know that are in their 50s and 60s and their parents still have to call them every day. They still have to check in on them. They have to know everything about them. Whenever something bad happens in the news, they have to call them every day. They still have to check in on them. They have to know everything about them. Whenever something bad happens in the news, they have to call them and tell them about it and warn them about it. But then I also know there's people out there that are parents that want to raise the best children that they possibly can. And they don't want to overstep their

boundaries, but some of them probably do overstep their boundaries. So let's dive into talking about that. I mean, we could talk for probably 10 hours about that. But give us a quick overview of that, and we can pick apart certain pieces of what you've had in your own life from your parent relationship, but also with your own children as well. Thanks for this. This is a juicy topic because everyone can relate because everybody is a son or a daughter. Everybody is a son or a daughter. And whether you're in the parenting relationship, whether or not you are on that path to have your own children right now, the same dynamics apply as to whether or not you have individuated yet from your parents. Right. And this is a process that starts when you start asserting your own individuality, which starts at a young age.

Yeah. At a very young age, we start asserting like, I don't want to do that. Or I don't like that thing. Or I want this. And it depends on at the beginning, how our parents are raising us to either honor our opinions, our freedom, or are trying to oppress that and say, no, that's not right. Or you can't do that. Or this is how we do it. And so the, the parent child dynamic starts creating itself about whether or not we allow a child to become who they are or whether or not the parent is shaping who they want the child to be. And if as a parent, as a person, if I'm not really centered in who I am, then how my children behave are an extension of me.

And so we have a lot of codependent dynamics about my children need to make me proud because I am, I'm using that to gain leverage and respect from my peers in my society. So a lot of, a lot of adults that haven't yet really stepped into their own individuality are leaning in a codependent relationship on their children's behavior, their successes being a feather in their cap. And, um, and that doesn't mean you can't be a proud parent, but it's, it's that, uh, it's an extension of self is where it becomes unhealthy. And we also want to give space for our children to fall, to fly, to make mistakes and not shame them for being imperfect. And so a lot of my clients land here in my healing practice because they have perfectionism-itis, you know, and that comes from a parent imposing, you have to be perfect. You have to get straight A's. You have to make me proud.

You have to do this way. You can't do that. You can't ever make a mistake. And it doesn't allow a child to breathe, to fall, to fail, to wander off the path that a parent has already predetermined. And I have a lot of clients that are in their adult life that are still living for their approval, for the approval of their parents, whether they've chose a career path, whether, well, my parents wouldn't like this partner, or I have to see what they think, whether or not I should take this job or not. And so my question to them is how exactly old are you? And it's not that we can't seek advice from our parents, but we also want to individuate and follow our own path and make mistakes and try things and, you know, stop leaning on our parents to

determine, is this path right for me? Because no one, whether it's your partner, whether it's your best friend, whether it's your parents can truly answer that for you because you are you. And they're answering from a whole different generation, from their own programming and from their own limitations. And so no matter what good intentions they have, they'll be answering that question of what the choices you should make through their filter and through their programming and through their agenda of whether or not it makes them look good or not. So some parents are more evolved with that than others. And so as grown adults, a lot of us are still working with our solar plexus or identity in some ways being in a codependent dynamic, seeking approval and validation from someone, whether it's parents, partner, friends, society, Facebook fans, for approval and acknowledgement outside of self, which means I actually haven't individuated yet. So it's almost like they haven't even cut the umbilical cord yet at 30, 40 years old sometimes. And it's interesting that you brought up, you know, the parents using the children as, you know, like a feather in their hat, where

I think that's very common with a lot of people where I would say that, you know, not even just parents, just most people that I've ever come across have some sort of lack of self-worth. That usually comes from their parents or it comes from society or it comes from advertisements, comes from whatever it is. They have some form of lack of self-worth. So a lot of parents are actually using their children to try to acquire, to try to fill a void where this self-worth isn't. Right. And they're vicariously living through their children. Sometimes people, if I never had my dream, well, then I'm going to place it on your shoulders. Right.

And if I never went to college, well, then, damn it, you're going to go to college. Right. And if I didn't have a good marriage, well, then you're going to fix the mistakes. Or I came to America and I didn't have the opportunities that you have. So now you're, damn it, you're going to, you're going to have to become a doctor or go through all of this stuff because I worked so hard for you that you have to do it. Right. And so we have, we see this a lot with different cultures, with different cultures and, um, that are imposing an expectation of you marry this, you know, this within our culture, or you stay within this religion, or if we're attorneys, then you have to be attorneys,

or we esteem only these career choices. And if you want to go be some podcasting entrepreneur, we're not getting behind that. And guess what? We're going to withhold love. We're going to withhold finances. And so we get to see a lot of conditional love here that I, you know, where parents are extending. I only love you when you are dating somebody that I approve of or going to college or a job that I approve of. And it, it, it really narrows the field of possibilities. And so, and especially if, like you said, a parent is saying, Hey, you're going to do this. If they're using manipulation and oppression and guilt and shame to try to get a child or a young adult to make those decisions. Now I'm being motivated from a low vibrational place

rather than from authentically wanting to do this. I'm doing it for my parents. And I've had a lot of clients that one example would be medical school, you know, third year into medical school. And it was never her choice to go to medical school. It was her parents' choice. And so by her third year, she's manifesting massive depression, a lot of, you know, unhealthy habits and starting to develop another personality that is rebellious because, because she never had the courage to express her truth. And in her culture, it was not allowed. You don't have an opinion. Your opinion isn't welcome here and it doesn't matter.

And we're buying your future. And since we support you financially, you don't have the options since you don't have a job, we're paying for everything. And so it's, there's an incredible amount of manipulation with money, love, and acceptance that people barter that kind of support financially. They're bought in essence, it's a form of prostitution. And so of course, we're going to experience some depression and rebellion. And so that was her situation is that she hadn't yet individuated and didn't feel like she could because then how is she going to be supported financially if she steps away from her parents' support. Yeah. I think there's a lot in there. Holy crap. All right. So the first thing that I think of when you say that is I'm glad

that my mom never withheld love. My mom never told me I couldn't do anything, which is what's great. She always just told me she was proud. She's the one who told me that I should drop out of college when I had the feeling. She was always there, supportive, and she never said, oh, you shouldn't start a podcast. You shouldn't start putting videos out. She never said that once. But if I were to have a parent that did that, knowing how I am, how strong-willed I am, how hardcore I am with something, if I was stuck in a job that I had to be at, I would have extreme levels of depression right now.

Addiction. It would just be hard. And this is an indication of a lot of, uh, you know, what is happening so much in society is depression, anxiety, and, um, a lot of addiction because we're in the wrong career for the wrong reason, um, to live a life that doesn't fit us. And I get so much of that in my healing practice. And because, well, this is the path that I had to take. And that's a very disempowered choice that I didn't have a choice. It's like, well, you always have a choice. And so I want to acknowledge for those people that are listening, it's very different if you were raised with a parent like you were, that is like, hey, go, shine, go for it. You can do anything versus a parent that says, here are your options. Here's what's

possible. This is, this is the only option that you have available to you. And I remember experiencing, um, I remember experiencing with my father one time when I was just starting to, you know, go to go to call, you know, out of college looking for my first kind of job out of college. And he's like, Hey, here's the sales job. You got to, you got to call this sale. You know, it says six figure job, you know, you got to do this thing. And I'm like, it was just not my jam. Like just not my personality, not my desire at all. And he kept pushing on it. Hey, did you call?

Did you call? Did you call? And I'm like, dad, I had to, I had to individuate in that moment and say, hey, thank you so much. First of all, we want to be grateful because underneath it, your parents care. Hey, thanks for caring about me. And this is where most people mess up. Most people go, damn it, mom, like get off my ass. You've been doing this for so long, but then they can't figure out why the relationship has issues is they have 30 years of anger built up to this one moment where your you know, your dad says this to you, you could have been like,

dad, fuck off. Like people... I was close to that. Right? And that's where it really turns into a lot of issues, but the correct way of doing it is... You know, first we want to say thank you because underneath it, they care. And, you know, as a parent, and I'm a parent, I understand that we're only doing the same thing that we did the day before. But the child is growing and maturing, and they need to go try some things. Do we want them to suffer? No. Do we want to give them the answers?

Yes. Do we want them to be successful? You bet. Do we possibly have some advice that might make the path a little bit easier? Maybe, possibly, maybe not. But the desire to help and love is there. And so the first thing to do when you're wanting to individuate from parents is say, hey, thanks. Thanks, Dad, for looking out for me.

I appreciate that you care. If I decide to call, I'm going to do that, but you don't have to tell me again to call. It's not really for me, but if I changed my mind, thank you so much for bringing it to my attention. I will take it from here. And if I need support, if I need your advice on something like, Hey, when I bought my first car, when I bought my first house, you bet. I'm like, hey, I've never done this before. To be humble enough to ask for advice in areas where they have the expertise. But I wasn't going to take business advice from somebody that I didn't respect in business.

And I knew that that didn't respect in business. And I, I knew that that wasn't my path. And then what was, what was a kicker was then my mom started to call. Oh, you know, did you make that call? And I'm like, mom, don't you dare let you do dad's dirty work. Thank you both. I love you. Drop it. Drop it. And, you know, we need to find our voice. And a lot of times if we're not coming with emotional maturity, then our voice is rage and anger and we get pissy and we create conflict or we just shut down our voice. Because usually when it's time to individuate, which starts as early as 13, 15, 18 and on, is that we actually don't have the conscious tools. We either know shut down or get aggressive. We actually, and I certainly didn't learn until much later in life, how to consciously

set a clear boundary that let, you know, into my life, the gratitude, with gratitude, the gift of love and support that my parents were sending my way, but also stop at the gate, the fear, the worry, the control, the manipulation, and the do it this way kind of advice where I'm like, I'm going to leave that at the fence, but we do want to let through that they care. And it's our responsibility to evolve our communication from fuck you, or I'm not going to say anything. And I'm just going to passively aggressively ignore this, which a lot of us do because we don't yet have those in-between tools to consciously set a clear boundary and hold a space for our parent to throw a tantrum about it. what they know how to do. And they may not change how they parent you well into your adulthood. What you get to evolve as an adult is to change your response so that it doesn't work anymore. Your parents' guilt, shame, manipulation, control. You can say, hey, thanks for caring.

I appreciate the insight. I'll take it from here. I'll let you know if I need help. Yeah. So the best way that I'm thinking of this, you know, cause I think of everything and I see everything visually. So it's like, you know, let's say I'm going through this, I'm 34 years old and I'm going through this whole thing. Um, in a sense, I haven't taught my parents how to speak to me as an adult because, you know, for instance, say, and I don't have to deal with this, but if I'm putting myself in a position where if I had to, if I was two years old, if you've ever seen a two-year-old, like their life is at danger almost all of the time.

Sometimes it's like their stuff, they can hit their head, they can fall off something, they can jump, they can break something. And if you don't set the clear boundaries with love, some parents are still parenting you as if you're two years old because they haven't learned that they should change or there's been no catalyst for change because you haven't as an adult come to them and be like, hey, listen, I love you and I appreciate you for caring as much as you care, but I'm an adult and it's time for you to let me start acting like an adult. I'm going to make my own decisions. Like we were talking about the other day where there's a lot of parents that are very like in their business.

I have clients that tell me their parents text them every hour. They call them every hour. They have to check in on them and they're always there all the time because the parents, at two years old, you can quote unquote control a child. Right. At 34, right. But at 34, when they're not in your sight, then they're sitting at home, they're out of the nest and they're like, oh my God, what do I do? I feel this anxiousness because I can't, I can't control them anymore. So they have to try to feel these feelings of control. And then what she said, which I really have to try to feel these feelings of control. And then what she said, which I really want to dive into,

is they will withhold love, which is probably the most dangerous tool in the world. It's the most hurtful thing that we can do to another person is to withhold love. Especially a parent to a child, you know? Because what that says is you're unworthy. Right. That conveys that there is such disappointment that you're not behaving in a way and I don't

love you anymore. Right. And it's the most hurtful thing that we can do. And yet when as a, and what a parent is doing in that, in that way is they're throwing an adult tantrum. Right. And they're using the lowest frequency motivation, guilt and shame possible and withholding love. And so if I don't feel worthy, then I'm really not motivated to pick

up the phone and talk to my mom. If all I'm getting is you didn't call me and you should have done this. And, and this whole downward spiral of a whole lot of judgment and, well, I was worried about you and I'm not going to want to pick up the phone. I'm not going to want to have those conversations. And what is happening there is that the parent has not yet evolved out of the fear vibration. And believe me, as a parent, I had two going twins. You said, oh, you can control the environment. Like not true. Even at two, because, you know, my son's climbing on something in a, in a split second, he's on the second story. Um, and my daughter's tripping

over a sprinkler and I can't stop both of them from falling. Yeah. Tell me, tell me that story. Cause we talked about that last night and I thought that was an incredible analogy for life. Uh, whether you're a parent or even just, you know, somebody. So, so take, take me back to that story. Cause that was incredible. Okay. So, you know, I've got twin toddlers and they're just learning to walk, you know, they're not great at it. They're fumbling all over the place and you can't put a safety cage around every single environment. And so we were just outside and, um, you know, my daughter, I can see her, she's just outside of my reach and I can see her little red sneakers to this day. Um, just gonna not clear the sprinkler that was on the lawn and in the trajectory that she was

going that her little red sneaker with the white, the white, uh, you know, toe guard on the lawn and in the trajectory that she was going that her little red sneaker with the white, the white, uh, you know, toe guard on the front. And I know that where she's going to land isn't on the grass. It's going to be the cement and it's going to be, I know she's going to hit hard and there's nothing I can do about it as a mother. I can't, she's too far away to do like the superhero dive and save her from that. As a parent, do I want her to fall? No. Do I want her to be in pain? No. And yet this is part of the human experience is that we're all learning how to walk, whether it's with relationships, whether it's we're learning to walk with money or like how to manage our own money, how to communicate with a partner, how to find a career we love and to find a life that we enjoy. We are adults learning how to walk

and there are minefields, there are sprinklers, there are stairs that we don't see all over the place. And my daughter tripped and fell and it was like slow-mo. I'm like, no. And she hit her head so hard and she had a little black eye there. And I'm like, child protective service is going to come after me. Like I'm really not beating my kid. She's just learning to walk. And, and, you know, I, of course I don't want her to be in pain. Of course I don't want her first love to break her heart. Of course I don't want her to get in a car accident and have to pay, you know, like, you know, stock up $2,000 a deductible or, or land in the hospital. Of course, I don't want any of that for her, but you know what? She's learning life. And what was wild is that the very next day we were outside, I was a lot closer to her this time. But one of the

things that she did, which was brilliant, which we are all capable of doing. And if my daughter can do this at whatever, 13 months, she saw the sprinkler this time. And she did this shimmy move, Rob, the cutest little shimmy move where her eyes were as big as saucers. And she did this shimmy move around the sprinkler because even at 13 months old, she learned to avoid that minefield.

And of course, it takes a broken heart for us to say, hey, maybe I didn't choose the right person. Or maybe I lost myself in that relationship. Or maybe I spent too much of that money and I'm not learning how to manage money properly. And sometimes a bankruptcy, a divorce, a disease is the painful experience that we or a loved one or a dance with addiction may be going through that is teaching them to pay attention to their environment. And they're in a classroom that their soul has created to get them to pay attention, to evolve and grow. And I had that same, you know, I had to apply that same thing with my brother and addiction. Oh, it's a sprinkler he's tripping over and I can't stop him. I can't make him go to rehab. I can't shame him into sobriety, but I can hold space that he will, when it's time, navigate around that sprinkler in his life.

If he chooses, if he keeps tripping over it, it's because he's not ready to see it. And you and I are tripping over all kinds of things that we're not quite ready to see. And they, my kids were and continue to be wonderful teachers of allowing somebody the space to fail, to fall. Because I also see that I didn't have to teach or rescue my daughter ever again. She pays attention to where she's walking from 13 months on, she pays attention. And, um, my son, who's a rock climber, I learned early on, he likes to climb things. And so instead of being a smother and saying, don't climb or you're going to fall. I was like, okay, let me get him in, in environments where he can climb as high as he

wants. And I'm going to have the rope so that he can climb in an environment and learn to fall with safety. And I realized that from a young age, my responsibility as a parent is to back up and give them space. That doesn't mean I don't care. That doesn't mean I'm not there. My heart and my love and my support is there. My worry, my shaming, my perfectionism, my worry, my shaming, my perfectionism, control, manipulation, you shouldn't have, I told you so, has created like a blue, like my tongue have bit it so many times. I really don't need to say that. Life is teaching them the lessons they need. And I'm just here to hold a support when they fall or need some guidance or a reminder to get back up again. And I think like if you were to go to any parent and you were to say,

do you want your child to live a restricted life or the fullest expression of life they possibly could? They'd always say, oh my gosh, I want my child to live the fullest expression of life they possibly could. That comes with a lot of times you having to back off. Because if you're trying to help them avoid all the sprinklers in life, they're either going to develop this codependent relationship with you, like we've spoken about, or they're not going to take the chances that they need to in life because there wasn't any lessons of pain

in the past. And that's the thing is that the lesson for your daughter came from the pain. And if anybody listening thinks back their entire life, most of your best lessons in life come from really terrible pain. And it's like, you don't, as you're going through it, someone could come up to you and be like, well, you'll learn something from this someday. And you're like, screw off. Like that's not what you want to hear at that moment. But now if you're three, four years, five years down the road, you can look back and go, wow, I'm so glad that I went through that.

And almost always the biggest lessons in life come from the hardest and worst pains. And that's hard for us as somebody who loves another. And this is for anyone, whether you're a parent or not, watching somebody we love in pain. It's hard. And we can cross that boundary of trying to fix, trying to rescue. And yet the choices have created that reality. They're in a classroom, they're taking a test. Okay. Fail. Epic fail. Okay. You tripped over the sprinkler, classroom, they're taking a test. Okay. Fail. Epic fail. Okay. You tripped over the sprinkler, right? Or you gave, you threw yourself under the bus for love or you chose a job for money, but you sold your soul. And so these are all lessons that the classroom is giving us these

teachings over and over and over again. How am I doing? And it's not our role to insert ourself between a person and their lesson. We want to be on the sidelines with our heart, completely compassionate with whether it's a partner, a spouse, a child, a sibling, a parent, whatever they're going through, a client, to be on the sidelines of their life, holding a space to allow them to feel the consequences of the lesson of the experience so that if and when they're ready, which may not be within your desired timeline, because now we're talking about me witnessing your pain. If, if I'm making, then, then I can feel the pain. I feel uncomfortable when I'm watching you unhappy. And so now we're learning how to have clearer emotional boundaries so that we can learn how to witness our loved one's experience without taking on the emotional heaviness of a loved one's depression, anxiety, addiction.

And there is a separation between their journey and our journey. And a lot of times people feel like, well, then you're not caring. And that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying when we're not feeling responsible or taking the emotion on, we're actually in a clearer space to hold compassionate support and be a space for inspiration and patience and love, which is a lot better than, I told you not to do that. You should know better by now. lot better than I told you not to do that. You should know better by now. And the judgment and the, you should do it this way, which kind of smothers my process and doesn't allow me to make

the choices because you've told me the answer, which doesn't allow me later in life to ever find the answer. If you've always told me the answer. And I actually had this experience with my kids, and I think it was about second grade. And they're both smart kids. And one was just picking up math a little quicker than the other and like really, really, really good with math. And so I watched them, one kind of lean on the other one to go, hey, can you do that math assignment for me? And I

watched them. I was homeschooling at the time and I'm watching them, you know, can you do this? You know, and I watched one do it for the other one. And the other one's like, cool, I don't have to learn this. And I was like, okay, I'm going to let this happen for a couple weeks that the assignments happen like that. And now let's see what happens when we take the test. And it was like A plus, C minus. Because we can think out of love, one was supporting the other because one sibling did not want the other to be in discomfort, you know, uncomfortable or in pain and very lovingly was, quote, helping them. And that's the thing is, is that most of us are coming from the right place in the heart. But when we rob somebody of the opportunity to learn the lesson and practice it and get better

with their finances or make better career decisions or trip over the sprinklers in life and get back up, then we rob them of the opportunity and then the lessons get worse and the tests get harder and then we keep failing more and more and more. And instead of learning the lesson, we go to somebody to fix it for us. And that's, you know, we've been talking about the parents not individuating, but this is where the individual is not taking accountability and responsible weight. I need to learn this lesson. I need to stand on my own two feet. And so after that, I, we, we together said, why do you think that is that one got a C minus and the other got

an A plus? And it's not just because one is better. One is practicing and one isn't. You know, one is taking the lesson for the other, which is robbing of them the opportunity to learn and grow. And so... They're getting better because they're doing twice as much work. It's twice as much weight they're lifting. So they're actually exponentially improving. Exactly. And this is why I told the sibling that says there is a difference between being a coach and teaching someone how to learn a skill and practice it and become better than somebody who is a pimp and doing it for them, you know, because you're, you're actually not helping

them. You're actually enabling them to get worse at it and so this is the thing we can think so much of the time that it's coming from love but the execution is not and so when we really want our loved ones whether that's a partner or a sibling a friend a colleague a client a parent we want to give them the space to do it their way and to feel the consequences of it. And we don't have to cross the boundary and say, I told you so, you shouldn't have done it like that. Uh, or I, I know better because that also conveys judgment and that you're inadequate and that you're not good enough. Instead of being in this compassionate space of, you'll get it.

You know, I know that it's within you. You'll find, you'll figure it out. And do I have advice? Sure. My kids are still in this place of asking me different questions or not. And I want to be like, hey, I know the answer. You know, I want to be in that position where I know and I want to help you because I love you but then they don't find it for themselves and that's really what I want them to do they're

now 22 figuring out how to be an adult and I want them to find the answers that fit them I had a was this is two days ago. So I was writing, we were writing scripts. My videographer and I were writing scripts for these videos that we do on Facebook, right? These short videos. Thank you. And the one thing I'm trying to help her with is script writing. Because one thing that comes very quickly for me is like, she can come up with a title and I have the entire vision in my head. And we can start putting it together.

Well, she had sent over something. First off, she texts me and she's like, hey, I'm going to need you to write the script. I was like, because I know that the one thing she hates doing the most is the script writing. And that's the one thing that she wants to improve at. And I'm like, not going to happen. I'm too busy today. You're going to have to write it. So I know in her head, she probably didn't want, she probably like, oh, damn it. She got that text. in her head, she probably didn't want, she probably like, oh damn it. She got that text, she got pissed. Right. So she writes the script, she sends it over to me. And, um, and it didn't have the compelling, it didn't have the juice that it needed to. And it ended pretty abruptly. And she's like, well, so, you know, how do you see it ending? And I was like, well,

how do you see it ending? And I can't, because I know that I can do it, but I'm not helping her improve if I just keep giving her the answers. And this is like, this is just another example of everything that you just spoke about in some sort of way where, you know, if 10 years down the road, she wants to do a, you know, literally a movie on the big screens, right?

She's going to need to be able to have certain skills and aspects that I am not going to be there to write certain things for her. She's going to keep coming back. She's going to keep coming back to me. The well, exactly. And so if I'm trying to help her with her skills, the way you're talking about coaching, we're going through certain things and I'm like, okay, this sentence, like this is how deep we go. This sentence isn't very clear. Okay, what can I say to make it more clear is what she's asked me. Well, I don't know. What do you think, what can I say to make it more clear? Is what she's asked me.

Well, I don't know. What do you think? So this is how you develop the muscle to be able to do this. Now, 10 years down the road, she might look at a sentence and go, how can I say this more clear? Well, because she's had to put the reps in over and over and over again. So I think of it that way. And the other way I think of it is, for some reason, a football player popped up in my

head. Football player is a high impact sport, right? Imagine if you have this really good friend and you want them to get to 10 reps and you lift the bar for them at 10 instead of having them struggle, which is where the actual growth comes from, which is exactly what I said to her as we're going through it, where you're basically calling me at the 99th rep out of 100, but the only growth that you're going to come from is that 100th rep. That's when your muscles grow. That's when your body grows. That's when your mindset grows. And I think that people need to be aware that you can lovingly assist somebody without actually interfering.

Right. And this is what the actual most loving thing is to do. Right. And this is what the actual most loving thing is to do. Right. Can you do it? Does it feel good for you to lift it? Sure. It felt good for that sibling to know the answer and to help. It feels good. And what feels even better if I am not attached to you needing me. Right. That's the big caveat. Right. If I'm not attached to your validation and your acknowledgement of how much,

how awesome I am and how you need me. And this is where we get to also step back and see that at a soul level, leadership really is to support another leader so that they don't lean on me anymore. Which is what they say, the best way to tell if you're a great leader is if you develop somebody that's better than you. Great leaders. And the same thing as a parent. I don't want my kids to need me. I want them to want to be around me. I want them to be able to call and share their ideas or let's get together or I want to bounce this idea off you or I've got something to share. I want it to be an equitable relationship where they're not coming to me for the answers in their life.

They're self-sourcing that so that we can have a thriving relationship. And this is where as a parent or as a loved one, as a coach, when that dynamic is that I'm the master and you're the teacher, if I'm not individuated and confident enough, I will want to keep that person leaning on me. And this is where as leaders, as teachers, as parents, as partners, we get to be aware of the fact, am I sourcing them for my validation? To be the smart one, to be the rescuer. And so I had to look at that for sure, that part of me that wants to solve something for somebody and the ego hit that I get from that. And also acknowledging

that when somebody is going through their discomfort and I'm not having clear boundaries, I'm uncomfortable. I don't like it in my space. And I also got to see how much I'm motivated by trying to cross the garden fence into their world to stop their pain and their anxiety and their stress because it's been bugging me. And I got to see that, whoa, I better keep that in check. And I better have clearer boundaries about how can I hold a space for somebody's process and not have it affect me emotionally, whether they're in a depression spiral, an anxiety spiral, a relationship drama. How can I be a neutral, uh, witnesser? Because when I engage in judgment, or as soon as I say it's bad or it's wrong,

or I start moving into, let's see how we can fix your problem. I've now moved myself into their space in an inappropriate way. And as a coach and as a counselor and a guide, it has been many years of practice and continually practices of being able to hold space for somebody without telling them how to fix it and inviting perspective shifts and tools. And whether they use them or not, I'm not in the driver's seat of their life of whether or not they implement those tools. And so that's another piece that I had to look at personally is the ego hit that a lot of people are getting from being the rescuer. And this is where parents still feel valued and needed because they're not finding it other ways in their life. And so they're seeking out sometimes unhealthy dynamics that will require their adult child to keep leaning on them

because it feeds their value and their worth. My best friend's mom said something to me one day, it was probably like 10 years ago. And she said, the moment that I think I became a great parent is when I realized that children are not meant to come. They're meant to come through you, not for you. And it's basically like they were born through you, but they're not meant to come. They're meant to come through you, not for you. And it's basically like they were born through you, but they're not there for you. And I think so many parents, whether it's people that's listening, can identify their own parents or so many parents that have children think that they are there for them. And it's not a mini you. They are absolutely not a mini you. And even though my daughter and I look a lot alike and we have a lot of things in common, people like, oh, she's a mini you. And I'm like, oh no, she is not. Let's be really clear that she is her own person.

there for your validation no she is not here do do does it nourish my soul when I get to see both of them grow and and learn and achieve and struggle and find their dreams and and try to figure something out like I love watching their journey and supporting their journey and witnessing it. And this is the difference between ownership and stewardship. I'm aware that I am stewarding another life, another soul until they can stand on their own two feet. And it's my responsibility if I'm a good parent is to provide them with the tools in the environment and the love in the space to stand on their own two feet and to be okay with

them not needing me anymore and that allow our relationship to evolve in now we're two adults. Yeah. You know, it's not that I'm still mother because I don't have any mothering left to do. I really don't. They're quite capable. Now we're just friends. Now we just go rock climbing and adventuring and what cool, what cool waterfall can we hunt down and jump into? And, and we're just sharing the joys of life now. And, and, and this is the other thing that you were saying earlier is that, that if a parent wants to help their child, well, what happens if my answers are inside this box, but your journey takes you outside of the box. And I sure do hope if we're participating in evolution, that your journey is taking you outside of my box because

otherwise we're just, we're de-evolving as a species. We are meant to evolve beyond the skill set and the capabilities of what our parents and grandparents gave to us. And so I, of course, my intention is that my children, my adult children outgrow the answers that I have. Sure. Because then we're evolving as a species and they're learning new tools and new pathways that never even occurred to me. And if I say that the only answers exist inside this box, then I have oppressed human evolution. That's true.

Look at it. That's true. That it's my responsibility to inspire them to think outside the box that anything is possible. And I wish that for them. Whatever they do or don't do is still not within my control. So I'm unattached to the outcome. It's good. So let's talk about this then. So there's people out there that have these

parental relationships that they're like, damn, I just wish my mom would listen to this, my dad would listen to this. Knowing that somebody's listening to this and they're trying to evolve and become a highly evolved being, but their parents might live in a completely different realm inside of a box and they don't want to get out of that box nor see anything outside of it. They don't want to peek through to see what's outside of the box. best way for someone to, you know, have a great relationship with their parents, but then also be able to grow the way they want to grow, not have to seek their parents' validation. And then also at the same time, um, have this loving relationship where there are boundaries. Great question. First of all, I would stop expecting your parents to see you understand you and validate you. It's not their responsibility. So cut it out. All right. and validate you. It's not their responsibility. So cut it out. All right. That's good. Let's start with there because a lot of times people are like, well, I wish my parents would just see me and they don't validate me and they need to grow.

They need to evolve. They need to understand who I am. I'm like, bullshit. They don't. That is not their responsibility to see you and to acknowledge you, to understand you. That is not or honorable or respectful for your path. Like it's time to not only free yourself from their expectations and their limitations, but also stop putting your expectations on their shoulders that they evolve and grow and walk by your side. They're on their journey. They have their programming. They're from a whole other generation and they may or may not ever change a damn thing. And it's not your responsibility to drag them kicking and screaming into personal development and spiritual awakening. And I think that that level of releasing expectations on both sides is highly liberating.

And it's unconditional love. It really is unconditional love. And it's also a level of freedom that says, it's my responsibility to know who I am and follow my path. And individuating from their acceptance or their judgment is part of it. Because as you start going on your path, there will be other critics. Your parents might be the first ones training you to individuate and claim your path. And you don't have to do it like an ass. You don't have to be a jerk about it. You don't have to be a bitch about it. Like, this is what I'm doing, mom and dad. Like, do it. Be it. Stop asking for permission. You're a 47-year-old. You're a 52-year-old.

You're a 36-year-old. Walk your journey. You don't need their permission. And let them walk theirs. I know I have just a coaching client this last week that is just in rage over her parents. Well, they're not waking up. They're making stupid decisions. And I'm like, well, they've earned their right to make stupid decisions. And so have you. And they still have sprinklers they got to trip over. Yeah, exactly. And it's not your responsibility to shake them awake. And I think one of the most beautiful things that my dad in particular brought to my classroom, because the sprinkler that I kept tripping over was trying to get him to wake up. And, well, you shouldn't do this and you should do that. And like, who appointed me his spiritual

advisor? It's certainly, or his health coach or his, you know, personal development group, 100% not him. And all that did was create judgment and conflict and dissonance in the space between our hearts. And he has the right to do his journey his way and to respect his right to choose that. Even if I don't respect the choice, this is a real kicker. Like, hey, I may not respect the way he treats this person or the way he treats his body or the choices his make. But as a soul that is individuated, I can respect his right to choose it. And that I don't have to change my path based on whether or not he sees or validates who I am. That's my responsibility. So I think that that's the first step. And to turn around and give that love and acceptance that you wanted from your parents, give that back to them.

If we're participating in evolution, then we, all very important qualities that he modeled. And there's a whole lot of mega things that he modeled for me what not to do. Sure. So I can throw a tantrum as many of my clients and many of the people that cross my path and come to the healing practice do was like, well, they didn't give me this and they didn't do that. And they didn't. Yeah, great. That's the gap that you're supposed to fill. And so if they gave you some puzzle pieces, correct, celebrate that.

Even if it's only 1%, it was never meant to be 100% of the puzzle pieces. Correct. That you got from your parents. Sorry, you're in the illusion that you're supposed to get 100% of the puzzle pieces correct that you got from your parents. Sorry, you're in the illusion that you're supposed to get 100% of the puzzle pieces correct. Then there's going to be some of the puzzle pieces that are flipped upside down and backwards. Maybe they were oppressive. Maybe they were addictive. Maybe they were a control freak. Maybe they were a worrier, whatever, workaholic, whatever it is that they had that puzzle piece flipped backwards or upside down. Well, then they modeled for you

what not to do. And you, our responsibility then as a soul on this journey, participating in the evolution of humanity is to flip that puzzle piece over and over and over again. What is a healthy orientation to work? What is a different money mindset? How can I compassionately treat people? What is another way to take care of my health? And what is a different version of success? So we start to rewrite that and flip the puzzle piece to fit. And we don't hold resentment and anger any longer that they didn't do it right. Because sometimes modeling what not to do is just as important, if not more important, so that you can see what it looks like 25, 30 years down the line and how ugly it looks to motivate you to make a different choice so that you're not following that same path. Now we're participating in evolution. And so I feel like that that's our personal responsibility to improve upon what was given to us the way I was raised, um, with a lot of, you know, my dad was, you know, a heavy hand

and angry and a lot of fear. I'm like, okay, I'm going to flip that puzzle piece because I'm not going to rule my household with anger and fear with my children. I want them to feel safe and comfortable and calm in the space with me. And that was a puzzle piece that I flipped, but I kept the nature, the sense of humor and the family values. And so we have, we evolve. I evolved that which was given to me and I'm sure that my kids are going to evolve what I gave to them. For sure. And that's, that's, that's part of it is, um, forgiving the, the gap of what they gave to you, the part that wasn't quite right, is to forgive, allow, and accept, and also upgrade, re, and, you know, and, and evolve and transform it to something that fits better for you. Love that. Man, we didn't dive into any of the stuff we had written down

we were going to talk about, but I feel like this is so, so impactful for people. So, um, let's talk about what you do. Yeah. And your, because this has been a very, it's interesting because this has been a very mind conversation, a lot of mind conversation in here. But you're also, you know, a shaman-gelic healer. Yeah. So tell us about what you do and what you do here in Sedona and the amazing stuff that you do. So people who, if they come out and visit Sedona and they want to get, cause I know when I came out to Sedona the first time, I was like, damn, like, where's like, where's the spiritual people? Like, I want to hang out and see what's

going on out here and just figure out this, the, uh, get into a little bit of the woo. So, so tell me, tell everybody about what you, what you do. Well, um, yeah, this is a, you know, this is bridging real human experience, which isn't super woo to go into, Hey, what's going on with you? Where are you stuck? What's, what's the story, what patterns keep repeating. And it's very quite practical to be like, Hey, let's start looking at where things are out of balance.

Where are you giving your power away? Where's energy leaking? Where are you disempowered? All of these things. And in my healing practice, we dive into that. And also, who are you at a core level? What are your dreams? How can we unbind your wings and allow you the freedom to live a thriving life and look at what's in the way of that? And so private sessions, you guys did breath work with me. What was a pearl you took away from that?

Let you, you tell people like, Oh my God, it was, well, here's the thing is that it's, it's interesting that, uh, I think that one of the main things that I've really come up to wake in up to is that, uh, there are, there are, I want to say, say it without sounding without, without, I don't even want to like, there are other planes of consciousness that exists in our own consciousness. And there's also for me, I think that, that when I get to that point where I'm able to, to work, to get to the stillness is where all of my answers come from. Uh, and we talked about it as just like, for me is I think my talent and my superpower is, is to be able to, like, some people are like, they can see stuff or they could hear stuff or they get, for me, it's like, I feel like when I get quiet, I get messages and those messages are always right. Like anytime I've gotten quiet,

stop thinking, started just listening. Um, the messages are always right. Like anytime I've gotten quiet, stopped thinking, started just listening, the messages are always right for me. Right. And this is reconnecting you to your own inner divine guidance. Right. And so that's one of the things that we all have the answers. We just don't listen. And sometimes it's a matter of kind of unveiling and peeling back the layers so that you can return back to that listening. Right. So that we're not seeking validation. Okay.

We're not seeking our answers externally. And that we're also not seeking the answers inside the limitations of our mind's programming. But that we're going deep into peeling back the layers of what's in the way so that we can return back to that place of our inner knowing and our personal power and unlock our greatest joys in life. And I just, I love diving into those places as a shamanic healer. I'm happy to go into the darkness and I'm also happy to really deeply shine a light because I'm, I'm, I'm a cheerleader for the soul. I swear. I'm out with it. And, uh, blending shamanismamanism, because we may go out on the land,

we may do breath work, we may do counseling, we may do spiritual expansion work. It's just tailored based on whatever somebody walks in the door with. Sometimes I work with couples or families or individuals. There's retreats, private, tailored healing retreats. We've got a treat today for some big old real estate guru. Yeah. Yeah. I have, I have groups that come here that hire me to, so it's companies that come in and do stuff. So that's cool as well. Companies, uh, you know, a group of like 10 women are like, Hey, we're celebrating this woman's birthday. We really, instead of, instead of going on a booze cruise to Cabo, they want to come and do like a three-day spiritual weekend and really kind of nurture.

And so there's all kinds of different retreats that I do here, group retreats and individual healing sessions. There's all kinds of online courses. And, of course, there's the Shamanjelic Healing Podcast. And you're a guest on my show, so they've got to go listen to that. I'm really just here to inspire millions to shine. And I think the key is though, cause I've seen your schedule is if someone's planning on ever coming to Sedona, they should probably fricking book. Now, because we were looking at April and you're like, well, I don't know. I'm not booked. I'm

completely booked in April. I'm not able to do that. So, so if there are people that are coming out, cause Sedona, I think that you've been here for like 18 years, what you said, right? I've been doing this work for 18 years. I've been doing retreats here for 18, here full time for 10 years. And I'm sure you've seen, I think it's Instagram that's helped this place blow up because people see the pictures and they're like, oh my God, I got to go there. It's the feeling. The healing vortexes

here are powerful facilitators for amplifying the healing experience and the awakening, the soul awakening. And so this is why I moved here is because the land is a powerful co-facilitator for me. And it really helps to awaken that and support that. And so this is a destination for healing and awakening and a great place to get away from the rat race and from your everyday life to just unplug and reconnect to what's really important. Find your soul's heartbeat again and remember who you are and why you're making the choices you're making. And so we question that, Hey, are you happy with life? And my whole, uh, you know, quantum leap coaching is all about that of like, Hey, let's, let's look at the gap between where you are and where you want to be. And let's start providing

the insight tools and support to get you where you want to be in life. And, and so it's a blast and people like you that I love to co-facilitate with, we're going to get out on the land and experience some of the treasures here in Sedona. And it's just been such an honor. Thanks for diving deep. I appreciate the deep conversations. Of course.

I don't know surface level conversations. I am not interested. I'm a dolphin. I like to go into the deep ocean. So if they want to find you, there's Shamanjela Keeling. Shamanjelichealing.com. Okay. Is the website and the podcast is also. Shamanjelic Healing with Anahata. And so that's on lots of platforms. And so that's the Shamanjelic Healing podcast. And so yeah, those are dope places. And I do want to give a free gift and they can just go to the website, shamanjamanjellichealing.com and what'll pop up

is an option. There's a couple of different free gift options and people can choose what fits them guided visualizations and mindset maps. There's all kinds of cool things that they can get there. And of course I'm on Instagram and that's where a lot of people find me. There's inspirational content on Instagram, Anahata Ananda and Facebook. Well, thank you. It's been good. I feel like a lot of people are going to get a lot of healing from this. They'll be able to at least learn how to cope and navigate the relationship with their parents.

Right. Which is amazing because I think that's the biggest thing that's either propelling somebody forward or holding them back. And the relationship that you have with yourself and with your parents is affecting and informing how you show it in relationship and partnership and how you show up in the world with friendships and that really does when you when you have a healthier relationship there even if they're totally asleep if your side of it is clean, then you'll be able to hold a space and have healthier relationships

everywhere in your life. So love it. Thank you so much for being here. Yes, thanks for having me. And there is a conscious relationships course online. So that's another thing that people can go and grab and if they want to dive deeper into this. Thank you, I appreciate it.

Thank you. So grateful for you, brother. I'm looking forward to more magic here in every way. I agree.