The Mismatch - A Loaded NBA Night, the Hot Jazz, and a Pelicans Debate

Episode Date: November 8, 2022

Verno and KOC open up the show discussing the Celtics-Grizzlies game and Jayson Tatum’s hot start to the season (02:42). After praising last night’s staggered start times in the NBA, they discuss the special bond that’s forming in Portland and dive into the Warriors' struggles. Despite not being given any chance to compete, Utah is in first place in the West—the guys discuss how the Jazz are winning and why they are not a fluke (30:29). Also, they discuss the Hawks after they took down the Bucks and debate the Pelicans' future (46:24). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Producer: Jessie Lopez Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey everyone, it's Kevin O'Connor, aka Kevin O'Bomber, aka Kevin O'Connor. Wait a minute, you're not Chris Vernon. No, Kevin, sadly, I'm not as cherubic or as raspy as Verno, but it is I, Jay Kyle, man. And folks, basketball has been and continues to be so very good. That's exactly why Kyle and I are hosting a brand new basketball show on a brand new podcast feed, the ringers NBA draft show. We're going to have you covered every week as we go in-depth and deep dive in hopes of answering an ever-important question in the NBA. Who's got next?

Whether it's an international phenom like Victor Winbenyama or the G-League Scoot Henderson. Or stars from Overtime Elite like A. Amen Thompson, as well as a full-blown swarm of talented prospects from the promising 2023 NBA draft class. For sure, Kyle. And we're also going to get into players from the college ranks because this is a loaded class. for us to discuss prospects rising and falling, and we're going to revisit and redraft recent draft classes and get into how the league's evolution

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Welcome to the Miss. match. I'm Chris Vernon and joining me as he does every Tuesday from the ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor aka Kevin O'Bomber, Kevin O'Candekin'O'Candyland, Kevin O'Blessarian, Kevin O'Connor Kevin O'Candervis, Kevin O'Conflict, Kevin O'Conflict. Kevin O'Neal! How you doing, man? I'm doing great. I saw a really good basketball game last night. I went to Grizzly

Celtics. It was the first time I'd seen the Celtics in person this year. And it was a welcome respite after the two games I had been prior to, I saw Charlotte and I saw Washington. And I saw Charlotte without Gordon Hayward, Terry Rozier, Cody Martin, and LaMello Ball. And I saw Washington without Bradley Beale. So you couldn't combine the Charlotte and Washington rosters that I saw. You couldn't combine both of the rosters and make a good team.

It's how bad it was. And so I just, I desperately wanted to see some competitive basketball. And Boston's gotten off to a very good start this year. I had not seen the Joe Missoula incarnation of that team. End up being a three-point game. I got to see the absolute best of Jason Tatum. Tatum was amazing. I mean, he's been freakish this year.

And just watching him in person, they threw all manner of different players at him, defenses at him, and it doesn't matter if he's 30 feet, away from the basket or if he's two feet away from the basket or he's 14 feet away from the basket like he can score on every single level of the court and it was the I've seen him have like good scoring games it was the first time that I've seen him and was like that's a superstar I mean he is 39 last night like you said Chris gets anywhere he wants on the floor

drawing files getting to the free throw line that's what he's gotten way better at this year, continuing to improve around the rim. I also thought against the Grizzlies last night, he showed why right now he should be on an all defense team. You know, this season, Joe Missoula has been using him without Time Lord, no Robert Williams. He's been occasionally in that roaming role, defending off ball. Last night they have him defending Brennan Clark spotting up in the corner a lot of the time. So he's setting off, helping in the paint. But also, he holds John Moran to O. 4 in their matchups together, blogging. him twice. He has that first one when Jawa's going 150 miles per hour down the court and Tatum just

calmly flipped his hips and the paint turning from one side to the other to block his shot. And then the second one in the fourth quarter, I believe Jod brought him to the perimeter on a switch. And then he crossed over left to right. It looked like he was going to step back from the right elbow. And then Jod did that crazy move. He always does where he leans into the paint. But again, Tatum just calmly reacted, swats him away. and I just think overall here, Tatum's been one of the five best players in all the basketball so far this season.

He belongs in that MVP discussion, but he also, I thought in last sense, game showed off ball and on ball why he should clearly be on one of the all defense teams early on this season. He's been absolutely unbelievable on both ends. What a player. Yeah, he's been fantastic.

He was a treat to get to see him in person. And the only thing I'll say is just from watching the Boston team, it is different. They do so much driving a kick. didn't take 53s last night, but they still took almost half of their shots from three point range. 37 out of 82. Yeah, one thing I will say is that Williams thing is something to really watch because just seeing them, because I saw them with Williams, obviously last year in the year that they made the finals.

Yeah, they have to have him. Like, they need him. And if they don't have him, they have to find a replacement for him. him because look when you're having to go up against Philly and you're having to go up against Miami and you're having to go up against Milwaukee and you're having to go against these other teams once it gets to the highest level in the in the playoffs and hopefully he can be himself and be able to be available um you can't walk into that with Grant Williams Al Horford and Noah Von right like that's not it's not going to be good enough like you are

going to have to have someone else. And Williams, Williams is the thing that takes them to that championship possibility level. And again, it doesn't necessarily have to be Robert Williams, but there needs to be somebody that can replace a lot of what Robert Williams brings to the table, especially in terms of rim protection. Now, it's a standing team, for sure. But just thinking forward, I was watching them going, boy, they're really going to need him. They're really going to need him once it gets to playoff time, once it gets to, you know, when those games slow down.

And there's so many great interior players in the Eastern conference that the pace and space thing is fine. And there's going to be a lot of variance on the nights that you make threes versus misthrees. but we know that playoff basketball is a little bit different, and here's hoping that his rehab goes okay and that they can get a large percentage of what Robert Williams brought to the table last year. I think that's a fair statement, Chris. I mean, like he takes them up another level playing that role.

We just talked about how Tatum is filling that gap sometimes for Boston and that Romer role, but Robert Williams is one of the best in the NBA at doing that. The value in Tatum is the fact you can plug and play him into a myriad of different defensive roles, including that one. But Robert Williams is the guy you want in that role as much as possible, considering how impactful he is helping inside, on ball against some bigs, or even switching outside on the perimeter too.

And then also you mentioned Grant Williams. He has a good game last night. You know, Marcus Smart has a good defensive game last night. Bill Simmons said on his pot on Sunday how Smart's gotten off to a slower start, more up and down on defense. That's true. I thought last night he looked good against Jha, good against Bain. one of his better defensive games overall.

So by adding Robert Williams to that equation, everybody else falls into their proper roles. They all enhance each other. And I think ultimately, having him is just, it's critical in a Philly or Milwaukee series, especially Milwaukee. You've got to have time, Lord. Well, and it's just such a huge difference this year

because their defense was absolutely devastating last year. and I think it's, I think it's like 25th or it was, it was certainly, it was towards the bottom of the league so far, but they're offensively been number one. Like they've been able to do this with offense so far while the defensive numbers have not nearly been, I mean, last year it was just downright staggering. 20th now for what it's worth. Okay, so they moved up to 20th after last night. It changes so much. Sure. Yeah, number one last year.

Yep. But yeah, it was good to get to see them in person. And Tatum, he continues to get better and better and better and better and better. And we talk about these guys that are able to lead teams to championships. And we talked about it going into the finals last year. There's a typical age range for these guys that that's when they're ready to win. Even the greatest of all players, they're usually around that 20. You know, Janus was a little on the younger side of 26, but they're usually 27 or up, you know, when they're the man leading a team to a title.

And I think that going through that experience last year and struggling, frankly, in the finals will serve him really well. You're interested to see how a guy like that comes back. And it looks to me like he's come back even better, even stronger. And certainly he's going to be, he's going to be in that MVP. race the whole year long, I bet. A question about the Grizzlies. I mean, last night's game, how much of a difference does Steve and Adams make in a game like that for them

last night? Lose by three? Yeah, it just depends. I mean, you know, the toughness, the clearing the way for Jha on screens is immense. They play a lot of five out. So, I mean, he might not have been... I'm just curious. Like, against a five out like Boston. Yeah, it might not have been as effective as,

typically would be, but you can't have no Adams and no Jared Jackson, Jr. Yeah, really hurts your front court. I mean, they started Brandon Clark. Yeah, Boston Saganoff Clark all night. Aldemoth, even though he's two or six from three, they're open to him taking that shot.

Yeah, so the whole league was in action yesterday. I happened to be at that game. I was keeping up with all the other games as they're going on and went back and check some of it out this morning. You kind of missed out on those staggered start times. I know. You didn't get to experience that because you were at one of them. I didn't get to experience it.

I thought it was really cool. I was super into it. I thought like the ending is kind of stacked up perfectly where you have to tune in for the last four or five minutes of a game. To me, this is something the NBA should 100% do in the years to come in. If anything, make it like a regular thing. Once a month maybe, once every other week. I thought it was just great nonstop. action last night and it was as a fan consuming the game if the NBA is able to have some type

of you know have crunch time you know streaming on the NBA app with Greenberg you know hosting that with Channing Fry which is very cool but whether it's on NBA TV or someday if Amazon has the rights like this should be a regular thing for the league it's so easy to watch the game as a fan you go from game to game game and it's always up the end it's a good time I love you guys you guys got to experience what I experience every night in my heart house with having my son who just sits there. He is my red zone. He just sits there with the phone on the, he's got the app up. And every time it gets to a close game of the fourth quarter, he tells me to turn the channel. So we, I see the end of a million games. But it's a lot more fun

when there's a lot of them that are, uh, that have good endings. Best ending last night for sure was the buzzer beating Blazers who have now done it twice in the last week. Now, is this going to be like an ongoing thing where we do this like the, okay, Chris, do you think the Celtics can make the NBA finals thing? Am I going to have to do this with the Blazers in you? Or are we like, all right, maybe they're pretty good.

Maybe they're not going to have to trade Dame, tank for one by yama. Like, they got a bunch of good players and they got guys that can score, you know, because they've had guys out like, you know, Simons will be in, then Simons will be out. Lillard will be in and then Lillard will be out. Jeremy Grant hits a game winner. Josh Hart, hits a game winner. They've been pretty fun so far.

I think they've been one of the surprises at least through the first 10 games of the season. And that buzzer-beater, the end of that game was just, absolute chaos with Shrews hitting the three and then no time no time out flying down Josh Hart three guys looking at

three guys and then Josh Hart just opening the corner because it's game time yeah I mean I think I think Hart hitting that shot Grant hitting that other one the other night it shows the amount of contributions they're getting from different guys

on the roster so last night they beat the heat by three points Bruno do you know who had a team high plus minus for the Blazers Winslow? Winslow did. Winslow had a team high plus 15 and 29 minutes.

Well, and how about this? They did the old Spolster trick. So the first time that I fell in love with Winslow as an NBA player was a hundred years ago when they had that playoff series against Toronto and they put him at center. Exactly. And that's what he's doing. Yes. He's defending.

He played him in center last night. He's defending post-entries against BAM, but then he's also chasing Duncan Robinson around. He's defending Jimmy Butler one-on-one, active off ball in the passing lanes. Like, they're playing him at the five-some nights where he's doing that. But then he had a nine-assist game. No, he actually should do, like, you know, we always are trying to make guys do the Dremont thing. He is doing the Dremont thing, essentially. No, I know, but Dremont is like a one-of-one, but he is because he's tough, he can rebound, he's got these big strong hands and he gets. He can pass. He can set the-

table for his teammates. And he can't shoot for shit. He can screen. He can roll low. He's smart. He's intelligent. He hustles. I mean,

this is the role that I wrote about on the ringer years ago when he clearly wasn't the score or anybody could have hoped for. But it's like, well, hey, Miami's using him in this Dremont-like role. And as you said, like that's where he showed it. But then he just fell off. Injuries, lack of production, lack of opportunity. But this Renaissance, Aaron, in Portland, you know, he's playing point, he's playing center,

he's doing everything in between. Justice Winslow has been one of the NBA's best role players early on this season. Yeah, and that Portland team, they keep on getting these wins, and you're like, geez, we! Like, you don't know. And the other thing is I pay attention to this a lot. Man, they got these mobs in those post-game interviews. Oh, yeah.

Their chemistry off the charts. I see it all the time because obviously that's every, every Grizzlies walkoff interview is absolute mayhem, right? These guys are all mobbing each other all the time. That's a team filled with veterans who has obviously taken a real liking to each other and is doing the all for one, one for all, right? We don't care who gets the credit. Like we're happy and building up each other all the time and dumping water out each other. you know, rubbing their hand while they're trying to do the interview or whatever else. I mean, it's actually made me feel differently about that team because it does stand out.

You don't see that level of joy and camaraderie when you're watching these games and these walk-off interviews. Like, they've got a bond and they clearly like each other there. and I do think that that can absolutely filter on the court play. Oh, no doubt about them. You see that with Portland, like you said, you see that with Memphis. You know what team you don't see that with a lot right now is to go and stay warriors. Their bench used to be with Kent Bazemore going wild, constant celebrations, as Stead or Clay or whoever was going off on the court, their bench seems dead.

It just lacks the enthusiasm and energy that the Portland Trailways have, as we're just talking about right now. Look, that Draymond thing has been a cloud for sure. It has to be. Also, the bench struggling, too. Like, they're just not good. Like, if you're not playing well, it doesn't help. And look, while the starting lineup has been good, it's not just a bench.

Pool has sucked. Oh, it's terrible. And Thompson is shooting under 40%, I believe, from the field. Like, they needed all of Curry's 47 last night. You know, they're doing the serve two masters thing. where, and they tried this a couple of years ago. You remember, and they end up just having it like, all right, let's just go get some fucking veterans that are smart guys

that know how to play basketball. And so, well, go get Auto Porter. Your guy, Otto Porter, Chris. Yeah, but it's just this, like, find legitimate veteran basketball players that can play within this and move the ball around, like they're not going to make the mistakes. I don't think it's an easy,

system to develop in is what I would say. It's all hovering around these guys, right? Like you are not one of the, you're not going to be the top option, and this is kind of the way they play basketball. It's very unique as compared to, you know, many other teams. Like you can't just, I think there's a bunch of teams

where you're running high pick and roll, side pick and roll, you're playing off of that, a lot of driving kick, you know, and you can plug and play on a lot of different teams. The Warriors are not, one of those teams where it's just like, all right, now you go in there. Because, like, you'll see where Steph Curry bring it up. You throw it to James Wiseman, you know, if you throw it to him at, like, the free throw

line extended, like the elbow, you know, that's where Draymond catches it because there's two dedicated to Steph. You're playing three on two on the way in, and he's an amazing passer. He's making those kicks. Well, Wiseman's the kind of guy that should just be good. going and setting a high screen and then flying towards a basket trying to finish it. More like the, you know, the Capella type. But that's not how they play, right?

Like, they're read and react. They're making decisions very cerebral. And I think it's very hard for young guys to get in there and be able to contribute or it just not look like a mess. And so I don't really know if they're going to be able to pull it off, Kev. where they can... One thing on Wiseman real quick, Chris. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You want to hear the most amazing stat that adds like a number behind what you're saying about him screening and rolling. And I don't know if this works against it, you know, in terms of who he is or more so the role. But Second Spectrum

tracks something called contact on screens. And out of 145 players who qualify, Wiseman makes contact the 13th least on screens. 13th least. Meaning that he doesn't screen anybody?

Yeah, like he's just not making contact. So he makes contact on 52.8% of the screens that he sets. And the only big man, you know, big man in quotations, you know, around a seven feet tall that makes less contact. is Alexei Pocchevsky, who's 75 pounds lighter than James Wiseman. What in the heck? Just for a point of reference,

because this is like an odd stat. It's an odd stat, yes. No one's ever heard of. Who is like number one? Who do people, like, in terms of like they die on the screens? So the top five. It's almost not surprising at all, Chris. Stephen Adams,

Janus, Rudy Gobert, Nicola Yokic Zubats That's your top five And then it's Horford Jared Vanderbilt Jock Landale Nick Richards

Caban Looney Draymond Green Over 70% So I guess a lot of unsurprising names Near the top of the list But Wiseman being Near the bottom is

So is he avoiding the contact Does he just suck at setting screens Like I don't understand Sucks at setting screens Not not taking the right angles be a learned thing. It can be a learned thing. Yes, exactly.

You know what I'm saying? It's just like he, it's just like he, he doesn't do the thing well that he needs to do best. Yeah, right. And that I think puts into perspective, you know, he theoretically, like you're saying, could be that guy who's rolling down the rim, rolling down towards the basket, throwing down lob finishes, but he can't even screen well. Yeah. On top of like everything else, bad hands, lack of passing vision, inability to be in the right

position on defense. It's like, it's amazing. That's why he had a DNP in that game last night. Curr's like, okay, I'm done with this guy. Let's focus on somebody else. So here's the point. You wonder if they can run on dual tracks, which is developing these guys and having them become a part of this, you know, for the future, but also winning now. or are they going to just say we need to look we got to make the most of these years you know we may not have this may be the last run with draymond clay and in curry in fact probably is and so do we just and we got wiggins and we got looney they're they're starting lineup murders people oh it's unbelievable

murder's people it's still like tops in the league or right at the very top of the league in terms of five-man units. Okay. So it's everything after that that screws it up for them. But do they just add some solid veteran role player some way or another? You know, because it's win now. Like they're trying to win now. I can't, are you going to be able to win now playing Cominga and Moody and Wiseman?

and you know, they, you lose some of those, you know, when you win like they won, other guys are going to get paid. And so you end up having to lose Auto Porter, who was big for them, Gary Payton, who was big for them, like just solid-ass players on that team that if you need to just carve it down to eight or nine, you know, we trust everybody. And we're not counting on young guys to contribute. or to even play, much less play big minutes. And so I wonder, do you think that they'll just develop as the year goes on?

Or do you think they'll just punt on that and say, all right, let's just try to find some guys that can play within this system and let's make the most of this trying to win, you know, again this year? Because, I mean, this season started all pretty rocky. I mean, it's also important to remember here that it's only November 8. right now. And I think for Golden State, it's worthy investing in these young guys at least

until mid-January. I think that's worth the investment to see what shakes out here. Do I think Wiseman is any good? No, I don't think he's good. Do I think Moody can be good? Yes, I do. Do I think Jonathan Kaminga could be good? Maybe. I'm not sure there. You know, I think there's some challenges with his

feel for the game, the shooting, but the defense, you know, the cutting, the at-room finishing, that that's there. I want I see them give Moody more consistent minutes personally. If you're Steve Kerr, I think that's a worthy investment. But Wiseman, Cominga, I don't know there. Even Jordan Poole, like the lack of improvement on defense to slow start,

you would have liked to see him take a bit of a leap, especially with Clay off the slow start he's having. He was near the bottom of the league and like plus minus. Yeah. Cool. I know. And that's what highlights the rest of them. If Poole is a killer that's coming off your bed,

bench, now it's not as big a deal. But he's not, he's just not killing anything right now. No. He's killing their chances of winning. Yeah. So, I mean, if you're the goal and say Warriors, like, let's assume the bench doesn't get better, Chris. What type of player do they need to be targeting here? Is it like a shot maker, shot creator, playmaking type?

Is there a name you have in mind that they should be going after with some of these young guys and future picks? Or does Iguodala have? help? Like when he comes back pretty soon, how much can he at his old age solve some of their issues? Yeah, I mean, look, they don't need guys that are going to spend the fortune on. Okay. What they need is for Clay to snap out of it, which he will. He's too good of a shooter. He should. No kidding. He's too good of a shooter. Even if he's never the same guy he was on defense, by the way, he had some great defensive possessions of the finals. And we've seen this from him before.

And then he snaps out of it. Yes. It's not the first time he's at a bad struggle, struggle. And then what he hit? Like 14 in that one game. Yeah. And he like snapped out of it completely. So he'll snap out of it.

The pool thing, it just worries me because A, they paid him and B, he got punched in the head at the beginning of the season. And so that way, we were going to be paying attention to, you know, kind of what kind of season he had anyway. And it started off pretty bleak. you know, to who much is given, much is expected, and he is not delivered on that. All the while, there's been this dark cloud hanging over them

because of what happened in the preseason that we all saw the video of. Just there. Yeah. I mean, I think with them, they deserve time. I think playing it patiently is wise for them. but at the same time I think Steve Kerr is making the right decision

here to say screw it with Wiseman, we're not playing him, he's hurting our chances of winning. I do think playing coming is important, playing Moody is important, and giving Jordan Poole some more time and opportunity and reps running that bench unit could be worth the investment, but at the same time, they need to be

ready to make a move because you can't just bank on these guys ever turning into anything by the end of the season when you have a potentials finals roster. They're like you said, their starting lineup is still unbelievable. They have to be ready to make a move. I mean, so whether it's a team

that's willing to, you know, trade off on a playoff push, you know, like maybe the Wizards decide we're going to bottom out. Maybe it's a team like that, or maybe it's a team that's already at the bottom, you know? I mean, like a Charlotte, Detroit, I mean,

I don't know what the target is exactly. You know who I'd really love for them though. It was like a Kusma. If Washington did decide, you know, we're not going to push for the playoffs. But it seems like they do want to push for the playoffs. So I don't know who the target is for Golden State, but they have to be ready to make a move. And we'll see how

all that shakes out over the coming months, because it's still kind of, it's still a little early here to know which teams are going to decide to be trading away talent. We all thought Utah would be doing that right now and they're at the top of the Western Conference. So I don't know what to expect here. The NBA season is

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In West Virginia, visit 1-800-gambler. A couple weeks ago, we came on here. Kevin, I told you, I said, they got to break up the jazz. They're too good. They're too good. How are they doing it, Chris? It's just a buzz saw. It's a bus song. Because it's this weird, I told you, a bunch of guys that can do the, I was cast off,

somebody discarded me, chip on my shoulder, getting an opportunity, playing for the greater good. And their assist numbers every night is unbelievable. For a group of guys that, like, has never played with each other. You got Kelly O'Linnick, Malik Beasley, Mike Conley, Lori Markening, and who was the fifth starter? Was it Clarkson last night? You said Clarkson already? Yeah. Yeah, okay, so that's a fifth starter.

So, I mean, those are the five guys that you throw out there. And right off the bat, what they scored 40 plus. in two consecutive games against the Lakers, right? Like it came out the gate, just flying. They end up these games with 30 assists. So they are just sharing the ball. The good shot gets passed up for a great shot. And this playing unselfishly,

then they bring guys off the bench. They can get your buckets where Sexton comes off the bench and he'll get just some buckets. And it's like, and then they have different guys, like, every night. And it has been, you know, outside of Cleveland, I think, in the east. It's been the best story in the NBA, for sure, because you couldn't have a lower expectations than everybody did for Utah. This was a... Horn Tucker last night even, right?

Yeah, right. Everybody. Yeah, he had the big dunk. And... felt symbolic. Well, you know he loved that. Oh, yeah. With them discarding him in L.A.

You know Horton Tucker love that. No doubt about it. Revenge game. But, I mean, nobody expected anything out of them. And at some point, you're watching it because it's not like, sometimes this stuff can get really fluky and it's like, yeah, well, it's just the first 10 games of the season, whatever. It's the stuff they're doing. It's the

When you are a team that can regularly be getting High 20s, 30-something assists in games Like that's real They're moving the ball They're taking care of the ball And they're scoring at a super high rate And they've played all manner of different types of teams And they've been able to pull it off

With nobody expects them to do anything It's crazy even if they fall off, like you said, Chris, it's the way they're doing it that offers encouragement for what the team is today as a competitive young team

with some young talent that's up and coming and for the foundation that they're building for the future with what Hardy, their new head coach, is building there. It's not just the results. It's the way they're playing.

And so I think even if their record were reversed, if they were three and nine instead of nine and three, we wouldn't be talking about them as one of the best stories of basketball and all that. But I think we'd at least be looking at them like, oh yeah, they're building something really good there. So even removing the results from the equation,

I think you're still going to feel good about what they are, even their first round pick, Walker Kessler. He looks really good coming off the bench for them. And I'm telling you, just like they, the same way we were talking earlier about how, like, somebody like Portland stands out because of the way they all mob each other when they're doing the walk-off interviews. You watch that Utah team and you watch the way they make the extra pass and they play together.

You're not seeing that in other games. You watch these other teams. Like I went and saw, like I just told you, I saw Charlotte and Washington. Like those are two sorry teams. Washington's a little better. And I know they were without Biel. But like, those teams are. don't share the ball like that. They don't, they don't keep you on your heels. They don't make you

make the extra rotation to get to, you know, where you're trying to cover up, uh, to get to an open shot. Like they, they don't play like that. They play like a good team plays. Oh yeah. They play, you know what I mean? Like where it's like, all right, we ain't got a superstar, but we're going to keep popping this ball around and make you chase it until we get an open, until we get a good look. And we don't take a bunch of contested shots. And we, I've been, I've been so impressed. They play a fun brand of basketball.

And I do think that if he doesn't break up, like, the teams that they're going to win games. I do. I think this currently constructed team is going to win a lot more games than people would think it would. We've had these types of teams before. you know, where it's like the team that nobody expected to be any good turns out to be just because they find something. And they're really playing together. They got good chemistry.

A big test coming up, seven of their next 10 on the road. Yeah. If they get through this 10-game stretch, you know, they have at Atlanta, at Philly, versus Phoenix at Portland at the Warriors, at the Suns. Like there's some tough games

coming up for them. If they get through this stretch and they're still like in that top six in the West or even top three, I mean, I think this is really what's going to show who this team really is for the duration of the full season but already 12 games through

as we're just talking about. Like they, there's a lot of good happening there, regardless of where they end up in the standings. Plus they got these like, They got these pimples. They bring it off the bench. The next thing you know,

just mentioned Kessler, you know, Rudy Gay coming off the bench and a revising. No, but Vanderbilting, Sexton? I mean, these guys are like,

Chihuahua. They're frothing at the mouth trying to get off that bench. They want at your neck. And Vanderbilt didn't even play the last two games because it's out right now, but like even without him,

I mean, they're still, they still get back, man, they get guys. Those are the kind of guys that come out at the bench and you're like, damn, like there's no let up.

there's no let up with them. Yeah, I mean, in Florida, it's where Jared Randarold's been starting, but only 25 minutes per game. So it's like, he's not playing 35 minutes as a starter. He's,

you know, they're sharing, like this is the, I think that goes to show how many guys are contributing this year. Walker Cowster's been good as a rookie for that, man.

I think they might miss old Vanderbilt in Minnesota a little bit. Yeah, they do, man. Their defense, despite adding Rudy, still does not look good. You see that play?

of Anthony Edwards did I see it kind of went viral where he just kind of had his hands to his side the entire possession don't like to see that type of body language oh I saw it all right

and the quotes after the game never get better no no they don't seem you're talking about not seeming happy not seeming on the same page that was a team where

you know last we saw them last season Pat Bev's about get buck naked on the scorers table because they want to play in game and they're all celebrating them pouring champagne on each other. Next time you got Anthony Edwards

standing with his hands on his side and everybody walk in separate directions. Cat, you know, having people take dead aim at him at Delo taking whatever the hell shot he wants to take. It's not, it's not a joyous feeling watching them. There's been 10 lineups that have played 100 plus minutes so far this season.

You mentioned it earlier. The Warriors of those 10 teams have the best five-man lineup plus 26 net rating with Steph, Clay, Draymond, Wiggins, Loney. The worst of those 10 is Minnesota with Rudy Gobert, Russell, Cat, Ants, and McDaniels, minus 11.6. You know, I'm not shocked by that because they suck. One of the ones I was shocked with, because we certainly need to talk about the historic run that Donchich is on. He's got nine straight games with 30 plus points. He's got the biggest amount of pressure on him of probably any player in the NBA

because the usage rate is astronomical. Yeah. Like the whole team. But to that point, I guess it's their starting lineup, right? Did they've been running out there? It's been pitiful. Yeah, with McGee, it's been really, really bad. Like minus 15 or 16 or something?

So with McGee, Bullock, Denwitty, Finney Smith, and Luca, there are minus 18.6 and 62 minutes. That's crazy to overcome that. But you replace McGee with Powell or a plus 28 and, you know, the Christian Woodline. really good too. I mean, it's crazy to overcome that. Yeah.

Literally, the lineup they've played the most gets slaughtered. It's crazy. Like, not even, it's not even like, oh,

well, you could argue about it. It's not reaping great benefits, but some nights, it's, you know, it's still early in the season,

sample size of small, like, bro, they're getting killed. Killed with that lineup. And they have a winning record. And they've got a guy who is on the most historic consecutive 30 point. Look, when the other name in the mix is Wilk Chamberlain,

you know you're doing something freaky. That says all you got to know is Will. Dude average is like 50 and 20. The first is Wilk Chamberlain. Now, do you think that it is, sustainable. One of the things that, and Rasillo's done a lot of talk about this over the years,

where going back and looking at teams with one guy with crazy high usage rate. And the lack of playoff success that they've been able to have or the fact that they can't get to the highest level, that typically teams that are that one player centric have a ceiling because they're one, they're so dependent upon one. And now you are seeing this at a rate that we've never seen it before. I mean, I believe right now his stats are freaky,

but I believe he has the highest usage rate like ever. Seriously, like ever. The amount of possessions that he uses is just, it's crazy. And by the way, he's not even hitting threes yet. His three point percentage isn't good. What happens when he starts hitting threes? He starts hitting threes. This dude could average 40 points a game.

Right? I mean, he's got the ball every possession. What do you think of it? Do you think it's sustainable over the course of the season? Can it lead to winning the finals? No. I mean, first thing I ever wrote in the ringer was about how Rust needs to tone down his usage. I forget the numbers.

This was six years ago, but I know it was like 17 or 18 or 19 players in league history had a usage as high as rusted at the time. And it was like only one of them went to the finals, Alan Iverson in 2001 with the Sixers and like most others flamed out in the first or second round. I mean, granted the games changed in the six years since then. you know, if you got, if you got like 06 Kobe level usage, I mean, you're going to put up monster numbers, you're going to compete for MVP's, but is your team going to make a deep playoff front? I think Luca needs some help.

I think that's where you would hope Christian Wood is able to grow and get more minutes and get a higher usage and more consistent touches. You hope, you know, some of the guards on that team can continue to excel, especially Spencer Dinwiddie. But I think he needs a second guy. But with that said, Luca is an all-time talent, and all-time talents are able to do the remarkable.

And what he's done so far, I thought Eric Shapiro, who does some NBA content on Twitter, he tweeted out a video that was really, really well done, how Luca faced 11 defensive coverages in their win against the Toronto Raptors. And that's true.

like every night, Luca dissects defenses at the highest level, no matter what you throw at him, when you're mixing it up on defense, it does not matter. He has a way of scoring or creating a shot for somebody else or drawing a file for himself. It doesn't matter. So I think with Luca, it's sustainable on an individual level to answer your question. But from a team perspective, I think if you're a Mavericks fan, you want to, you want another guy. You always want your team to be better

to alleviate the pressure off of Luca, yes. Feels very James Hardin-Rockets-y, where it's one guy and four role players. Which is fine. Dallas fans probably don't want to hear that because everybody was annoyed by that. Hardin went, I mean, I know, like, you don't like James Harder, but Harder went to a game seven

against one of the best teams ever built. He led the Rockets, you know, right, you know, toe-for-toe against the Golden State Warriors, multiple times. And Luca is better than James Hardin. So that formula worked a great success in the postseason and in the regular season for Houston for many years. So it can work with Luca,

considering he's better than that guy. Yeah. Well, some would say that he petered out by the time it got to the playoffs, whether that's because of the moment or, you know, I guess the first 10 times that happened, everybody said he was tired. But at some point, I think everybody came to terms of the fact that he's, some guys are built for it, some guys aren't.

I'm not going to get it to heart it right now. I mean, it's really not fair. It's not at all. I know he's had some choke jobs. He's also had plenty of clutch moments. He's an all-time playoff vominer. The dude averaged like 30 points per game in the postseason for Houston over eight years and carried the offense as a facilitator.

Now let's do the games that mattered most. Okay. We'll save it for another day when we talk Sixers playoff. yeah well they had playoff hopes last year too he he he wasn't anywhere near what he is I know and he wasn't but now he's hurt again so now you never know maybe he falls off it's worrisome

Luca has been absolutely out of his mind though and we have had these crazy individual performances throughout the year whether it's Janus who's been great they finally lost the game they were the last undefeated team they lost the game to the atlal Atlanta Hawks who, you know, early returns on that back quarter really good. Really good.

I didn't love it with Dejante and Trey. But the early returns have been good. They haven't been like off the charts great, but I mean, that was obviously a great win for them last night. And the Dejante numbers have been fantastic so far this year. But they're right there. behind. I mean, there's only, I guess, they would be, what, three or four right now? Yeah, because they're seven to three. For what it's worth that lineup with Trey and Murray, Collins, Capella, Hunter, they're starting five plus ten net rating this year. So there's third of those 10 lineups we

mentioned that played over 100 minutes. That's one Warriors, two nuggets, three Hawks. Kind of surprised by the Nuggets one. Yeah. Right? Doesn't feel that way. It doesn't feel that way yet, watch. Okay, because Murray's not, you know, his full self yet. But, you know, with Atlanta, though, I mean, Trey and DeJante are figuring it out. You know, I wrote about that on the ringer a couple weeks ago. You're seeing Trey move more off ball.

You know, you want to see that increase over the course of the year, but he's pretty much doubled the amount of screens he's runoff this season compared to any other season. And Clint's Capella. Capella is looking like an all-defense guy this season. He's been absolutely fabulous for them protecting the rim. looks like his prime self on defense. So I think overall right now

the mix there's looking really nice for Atlanta. And winning last night without Trey Young, that goes to show what the importance of having. We're talking about Dallas right now, right? The need for having another shot creator. Well, they don't have Trey. Then DeJante Murray goes out. He racks up 11 assists, 24 shots,

dominates the ball, and his team still wins because he can be your source of shot creation. Well, and you might say that it wasn't a bad thing to have Trey Young out of the light up. I know no one ever wants to say. I mean, so far this year, he's like the only guy that plays minutes for them that's shot terribly. He's under 40% from the field,

and he's 30% from three. Now, we know we've got a sample size on Trey Young that he's an all-NBA caliber performer, and he'll hit shots. But he has not so far this year. His number is 38% from the field, and he's 30% from, three. Meanwhile, virtually everybody on their team is shooting over 45% from the field.

It's nuts. So, I mean, there's no bad option. Like, you're just got a bunch of guys that all are making, if you can make 45, 50% of your shots. And that's what everybody else except for Trey Young on that team does. I mean, look at this. Murray 46, Hunter, 47, Collins, 52, Capella, 55, Ocongwu, 67, Griffin, 59. And then there's one of the holidays, Justin. But Aaron holiday's 47. You mentioned AJ Griffin there, man. You see AJ Griffin dropping 24 last night.

Yeah. Looking good, dude. Yeah. And Jela Johnson, who, I mean, everybody was, I remember last year, going into the year, people like my phone was blowing up during summer league and then that joker might have been in wisdom protection last year i mean he never saw it ever and now they got two of them they got two of those like young wings from duke right because johnson was a duke kid wouldn't he yeah so johnson ain't agree i mean he did he didn't play though i mean like he was on the team he got

he got the he got the he got he he played what he played what 12 games something like that at Duke. He didn't play a lot. He didn't play for Atlanta either. Yeah. You guys just racking up on free clothes. Adrian Griffin looked great last night, man. They had him running off a bunch of pin down screens,

getting to the middle of the floor or flaring out the three. It's just nice to see him, you know, get some buckets, because he didn't have a great year at Duke. I think he was solid. But he's one of those, Kev, that, like, did four-minute YouTube, highlight package will make you just be like, holy, like there's some guys whose highlight packages, you're like, okay, that's like the 10 best plays of his life.

Like, so many of his things look like repeatable things. Like that's just kind of the player he is because he's got this length about him. Oh, yeah. And he can shoot too. He shot 48% from Duke last year. Like that's what he did well. I mean, he did score. I don't want to diminish what he did last year.

It's just the usage and the volume wasn't there. Right. It was inconsistent. Well, they had a bunch of good players. Yeah. Right? They had a bunch of good players that all got drafted. And a couple of that didn't get drafted.

But, yeah, Atlanta, so far so good on the, on the Trey Young, DeJante Murray backcourt. You wrote an article about the Pelicans, and now you've got to apologize to all Pelicans fans. because they lost to the Lakers, and then you publish the article and they lose to the damn Pacers. So, I guess first things first, please don't write about the Grizzlies. And secondly,

are you going to apologize to the city of New Orleans and all Pelicans fans for writing this love letter to the Pelicans about how amazing they are, and then they get beat by Miles Turner. It's pretty clear. Pretty clearly they didn't read it if you think it was a love letter.

It was like David Robinson. I did read it. I mean, it wasn't a love letter. It was this is why they're awesome. This is why they're awesome. It was a team with an uncertain future. No, there was no uncertainty. It was like, oh, and then they got a million drafts.

The last line of the article is the loss is a reminder, though, that nothing is guaranteed and that they're only at the beginning of their journey. It's about how this team is in a good position and has clear ups and, has clear upside, but has a lot of questions about who they are today and hurdles to, you know, jump. But even the questions are answered. Even the questions in the article are answered with, I'll challenge you on this, are answered with they're not nearly as bad at defense as you think they are. And Zion's not nearly as bad at defense as you think he is.

No, it's not, what are you talking about? It's not, it's like this guy, it's like this guy is not good. He needs to get better. there could be chemistry issues with this team when you have Heron Gomez already liking tweets about how he's not getting minutes. Yeah, but then you followed that up with those just like basically get rid of him.

I mean, come on, when Hernan Gomez liking tweets is the most negative thing. Come on. I read up, I mean, Michael Pina already wrote a whole piece about Zion's poor defense. I'm not going to redo that. It's like a 5,000 worst word piece anyway.

No, the, what's it called? Look, just so, too much depth could be a problem thing. Talking about the need for trade. Was in there. The injury concerns with Zion and Ingraham. It says their defense, albeit flawed, has real potential. It does.

So, I mean, I know, but it's couched with the good. I'm saying, Zion. What am I supposed to say? Oh, their defense is terrible. It doesn't have potential, even though they have Herb Jones. the guy you didn't even know who he was last year? I invented Herb Jones. I literally invented him.

I never heard of him. Bitch, you never heard of him. I had him on a list of second round players to draft. And you're like, who? Who is that? Wait a minute. Who am I mixing up Herb Jones with where you said they're not even the best defensive player on the team?

That was him. That was Herb. No, you tried to make Herb Jones, the wing defender, the point guard defender and the center defender. Oh, that's who he is. It was when they lost Josh Hart. That's what it was. So when they lost Josh Hart.

And so their defense is not doing. So even the guy who discovered Herb Jones that undervalued him. Yeah. There we know. I'm glad we corrected that. Thank you. Their defense is a thing. And I think the other thing is, you know, on the whole.

And by the way, their defense is like 14th or 15th in the league right now. It's not like they're 30th. they're they're solid despite having guys in and out of the lineup all year long and they're they very clearly have potential i don't i don't know what the issue is with that would there are all the personnel that they have no i you're you're reacting to me saying it's a love letter but everything that's negative has a positive behind it is all i'm saying no no i don't i think it's a very balanced piece that's what i think it is and then they have like it's a small market we have no if ownership

is going to keep the whole thing together. That's like the real thing. The journey has just begun. But what happens when Zion's contract kicks in? It's a question to every small market. A hundred percent. Everybody in Memphis has it, right? And the owner came out and said,

we're not losing any players because of money. If it means going in the luxury tax, we'll go in the luxury tax. You wonder if New Orleans is going to be able to keep their guys together. No, they won't be able to. They won't. So one has to be sacrificed.

They're going to eventually have to break up, you know, like when it comes time to pay, you know, Dyson Daniels and Herb Jones and all these talented young players, somebody's going to have to go at some point. No, but even next year, like when you've got McCollum's contract and Zion's contract and Ingram, Ingram will be what, like $32 million? I think next year they'll be okay. I know the cap's going to be going up, but I mean, it starts to, you know, the bills start coming in.

Yeah, next year they'll be okay. It's just, it's a matter of, I think, that year after 24, 25. But that's the point of the article. It's a balanced, not a love letter. It's a balanced article about this is a team in a very good position right now with a ton of upside, quite obviously. But there's still some questions about how they're going to reach their full potential. I think probably NBA finals. I think they're probably holding up the trophy.

Thank you. They're probably holding up the trope. I mean, that's their upside, but I think it would be nuts. As I say in the article, it'd be nuts to think they will do that. I think that's their upside, though. It depends. They have all these picks, right? Well, let me ask you this question, Chris.

Let's say the nets implode. They implode, and Kevin Durant demands another trade. If you're the Pelicans, would you put together the four or five players in salary that you need to put together with like six or seven first round draft picks to cash in now and go for it all this season. If you're the Pelicans, would you do that if you're their GM?

Or are you playing a little bit more conservative and waiting? Because you and I agree that even though they're young, considering they won't pay the luxury tax multiple years in a row for the repeater, considering the injury concerns with Zion and Ingram, would you go all in this year with the roster that you have on a Kevin Durant?

And what am I giving up? Like, let's just say you're giving up. Six first round draft picks, Dyson Daniels, and salary fill, like DeVonte Graham, Garrett, Jackson Hayes. You're not losing Ingram in this situation.

I'm talking like picks heavy package for the Nets, including that Lakers pick in 20203. Like it is the best offer. The Pelicans can make the best offer if they want to. I would not. You wouldn't. No, and here's why. Because I look at their team, and even as it's currently constructed,

I don't think, I think it's pie in the sky to think that their starting lineup, as it's currently constructed, is going to be what a starting lineup looks like come playoff time. You have to have stars and role players. They don't have a problem with scoring. They don't have a problem with scoring. They're going to be fine. They got enough guys that can score on any given night. They got enough guys that can lead you in scoring.

All manner of them. You know, Zion can be the best player on the team. McCollum can be the best player on the team. Ingram can be the best player on the team. Like, what do I need another? What do I need more scoring for? What am I trying to do here? You know what I mean?

In terms of figuring that out, I'm trying to balance it all out. Because, yeah, they do have Herb, they do have Nance. It's a good role player. Dyson Daniels will be getting to play. you highlighted him, Alvarado. You know, they've got some guys, but like figuring that all out and how it all works together,

I'm not so sure that, you know, and you don't see, you see Valantunus, he's not closing a lot of these games. It just depends on what the other team is doing. But, you know, with Zion and Ingram and Valentunists and McCollum, and, you know, they got one real, like, hardcore defender out there.

And that's Herb, who has to guard literally every player on the team and does, according to Kevin O'Connor. So they got one guy that can guard, like really goal. Lance is good. I mean, like Herb's a lockdown all the guy. Nance is good. Ingram can be good. Murphy's solid.

Nagy Marshall's solid. But granted, he's a role player. He's, you know, eighth, ninth, tenth guy. And it's weird because we have not really seen them. Alvarado, obviously, is unbelievable in his own right. but he's smaller to your point. And we haven't seen them like all together, like all together playing a tremendous amount of minutes

because this guy's been out, this guy's been out, this guy's been out, Zion, I got hurt, like, immediately into the season. Like, I believe they all were together last night, right? I didn't get to see this Indiana game, but I believe the starting five started, like the Bacallam, Herb, Ingram, Valentunus, and Zaya. Right. They got beat by the damn Pacers.

Yep. Turner, Miles Turner goes off for 37. Yeah, I mean. Another guy that you could argue that New Orleans should be targeting. Because as good as Jonas Valanchunis is, he's not the, we're talking defense. Turner is the better defender over Valentunus. He has more offensive upside. He's a better shooter, better handler.

Rim protection. Yeah, he's a better shop locker. I mean, I think, I mean, look, if I'm playing in, the deal that I'd be going for is a three-way with Brooklyn and Indiana where I get Miles Turner I get Kevin Durant after he demands a trade net and I give up as many first-round draft picks as necessary and I go into the playoffs with Turner KD C.J. Ingram, Zion, Nance, Murphy, Herb Jones, Jose Alvarado. I mean, that's a finals team. I, to me, I think if you're in New Orleans, you should be going on considering your murky future. It's bright. It

looks good. Like on paper, best case scenario, Zion gets better, Ingram gets better. CJ continues to sustain success, but there's no guarantees. There's a Zion, Zion can flame out in two years. That could happen. Are those Lakers, the Lakers, right? They've got their pick in perpetuity, right? So they have the Lakers pick in 2023 and 24 or 2025.

Okay, so not next year. Not, not. Oh, next year. Yeah. So is it unprotected? Yeah. Yes, it's a swap. So the Pelicans will give their pick to the Lakers.

You may not want to be in the trading picks deal here, Kev. Because what if I told you that pick ends up being your guy? Victor Wembagammer. Yeah, I'm not, then you wouldn't do any trade. How sure are we, the Lakers are going to continue to be bottom five bad? They suck. How sure are we, though? They suck.

I mean, bottom five, I don't know if they're bottom five. I don't know if they're bottom five. But again, you don't necessarily have to be bottom five to win the lottery. You know, you could be like eight or nine. I mean, it's a tough situation there. Well, I mean, maybe you can still have the best offer without putting that on the table. Can you? I mean, like, what is, what else could a team offer?

I just don't know. Why would they need more offense? It's not about more offense necessarily. It's just about having a better team. How are you better? with Kevin Durant he's Kevin Durant he's Kevin Durant I get it

he's on the Brooklyn Nets you know they stink yeah but even even the Nets and we didn't talk about them on the other side of that Dallas game like they looked like a more competent team for the first time with Carrie Irving

yeah I mean it's kind of been the thing if he doesn't play teams look good I mean without Karee but with Joe Harris with Seth Curry they just they just look like a more you know

complete team. I mean, Ben Simmons back last night. Granted, he wasn't good in the 16 minutes. Yo. Got crossed up like crazy by Luca. Yo. Yeah, I mean, was there ever that was like a before

and after. Yeah. A couple years ago, he was like that guy. I know. Like, lockdown Luca guy. And next thing you know, he's like falling on himself like Daniel Gafford. You know, it was so crazy about that place,

how, you know, Luca misses the scoring opportunity, but then Josh Green ends up with the ball, and he drives down the lane and it has this ferocious dunk, and it becomes the highlight of the game, even though Luca missed the shot. Because Josh Green had an awesome night. Made threes, attack closeouts,

made good passes after attacking closeouts, crashed the boards, played great defense, and that dunk was awesome. And he flopped or took contact from KD on a screen, he said, and saw John at him in the Mavs bench, Haiti gets a tactical like it. It was just funny.

Like that highlight turned into a Josh Green highlight. Yeah. And it was kind of cool he got that moment because he had an awesome game and he's been so much better this season after your guy, Desmond Bain. He kind of trashed him last year. Yeah.

Desmond will never forget Dallas drafting him instead of him. He will not. Yeah, look, I've always been on the other side of this. Talking about a perfect second guy for Luca. It would have been Desmond Bain, average of 25 this year. Or, you know what? You know who would have been good for them? Is that, what's that guy that's playing point card in New York?

Yeah, Jalen Brunson. Oh, yeah, that guy. That's pretty good. But, yeah, I don't know why. Like, you've had, you've had this thing about KD and the Pelicans. We just shouldn't forget that Brian Winhorse. Where do you want Zion Williamson in the pecking order? Like, seriously.

Like, is that not? You say that Ingram could be the best player. on the team. Zion Williams it could be a top 5 to 10 player in the NBA and we know what McCollum is and it's like oh okay well go trade all your future shit for

KD like for what? I mean because you want to win a championship that's the goal. Bro you just told me that they've got a guy who's one of the 15 best players in the league and he's not the best player on his own team. Could be. Could be one of the best players in the game but he's also one of the most

injury prone players in the game Zion is. Look, that's, you're counting on that, though. You gave them $180 million or $200, whatever million. Yeah, but what are you going to do with all these picks? You have two options. You either build around the edges, right? Like you trade one here and there when it comes to making a move that you feel like

it improves you. You keep them and you draft young players that can fill in for the guys who have to leave, right? Because you can't pay them, you can't go out of luxury tax. That's your other option. The other option is to say, you know what, we got. something potentially special here right now. Let's cash in half of them,

still have a whole bunch left over, and we can do both. I'm not saying that this is necessarily the right thing to do. It can be argued, but it should be debated within that front office. By the way, Brian Windhorst reported it back earlier in the year that Willie Green, their head coach, wanted the opportunity to sit down and chat with Kevin Durant to tell him the vision of the Pelicans in that franchise on what they want.

So we know, assuming Windhorst was right, about that, that they have interest in Kevin Durant. We know that. So if Katie were to demand another trade, if that's continued to implode, to me, like they should at least be strongly thinking about cashing in some of those picks because they can still have plenty left over

and still have youth and still have a future and increase their chances of winning right now while they have this team healthy at this current moment. I mean, at some point people are going to stop trying to put together fantasy teams. the results have not been good. Not recently, no. You know, we got the one bubble title for LeBron at AD.

Kevin O'Rant would be embraced there, though, I think. Like you watch Pelicans games, their crowds are really good right now. Sure. They love that team. I think he'd be, I think he'd be welcoming with open arms there. I think it's an awesome 2K idea. It is a great 2K idea. But in terms of...

Real life idea, I mean, who knows? I'd be building with Zion in mind. In the end, you can do the whole, he might, he's not healthy guy, but I mean, your franchise banking on that. You know what I mean? How Zion goes? And I think Zion can be best player on title team, for sure. For sure he can be the best player on a title team.

So I don't know why, like, I would be going to try to go win right now because the results of that. And regarding the picks, why not, you can cash some stuff. You could cash some stuff in with some of the picks, but also in a small market,

what you want to do is draft really well, which they have recently. Because once everybody's bill comes up and you're going to want to pay them, well, then you're going to need to have that flanked by a bunch of guys that don't make a lot of money. And that's what you use those draft picks for. You can also package multiple

of those draft picks to get up to get you the eighth pick in the draft. But Chris, why not go forth though? Like in all seriousness, though, like, I understand your point, but the Warriors, we just got done talking about some of their weaknesses right now. The sons, Chris

Paul's out, Cam Johnson just had surgery on his meniscus. The Blazers are good, not great. The Nuggets, Jamal Murray, is not the same guy right now, yet Michael Porter Jr., we know his injury history. The Mavs we just got done talking about their lack of depth. The Grizzlies are great. We know that. The Clippers, who knows what's going to

happen with Kauai? He's out indefinitely now. The window is open. So why not go for it right now if that opportunity were on the table? Why not go for it? There's a chance. You've got to go for it. If you have an art, if Kevin Durant demands a trade. If Kevin Durant demands a trade, I think it'd be foolish not to at least strongly consider making the best offer. Like, at a minimum, to not make an offer, I think that would be foolish

personally. All right. The windows open. I mean, you think this team can make the finals? Yeah, but like I don't... You think this one can. I don't think they will. No. But you think they can.

I think the upside is significant. So anybody that that would apply to, I would tell you, you don't need to go try to win now. But that's like saying why don't increase your chances of winning when you have a surplus of future picks where you can increase your chances? Why would you not increase your chances? Oh, you're giving up Brandon Ingram. Come on. No, no, no, you're not giving up. You're not giving up, you're not giving up anger. You're not giving it. No, you're not giving up bank. No, if you're giving up seven future first round picks or whatever the number is, no, you're not giving up pick them. I mean, anybody can give them a bunch of, there'll be a bunch of teams that line up all their picks. No, but nobody can offer that many or high value picks. Nobody.

well, the idea... Unless you taught us. We flirted with that idea a couple weeks ago. The idea that they would want to trade out for picks. I mean, and again, like, the nets of... They may just be without Kyrie Irving, and they may turn to be a pretty good team. You know?

Kevin Durant is still having... He's got really good numbers. They looked a little better last night. Like, they might be okay in the absence of Kyrie. And I don't... Like, we haven't gotten any news as of this afternoon about the Kyrie thing. I know he's going to meet

with Commissioner Silver. Bro. That could be happening as we speak right now. I can't imagine him doing all the six things that he was given to do. It's been interesting

to see the reaction to that list. A lot of people now it's kind of flipped saying, okay, this is a bit much this homework.

It's exactly what you said, though. At some point, he'll turn into the martyr. Yeah. I mean, it's been very, very interesting.

Come on, bro. He's not doing all that. Yeah. Come on. Like, I saw Shannon Sharp had a tweet go viral today saying, you know, I've been critical of Kyrie, but what the Nets are doing is a bit much. And it's, like, you read the quote tweets of that and the responses, it's like, a lot of support. Yeah.

Just it's very interesting to see that change. Well, because I think everybody saw that and was like, what? What? Like, we're so far past, like, apologize and donate money. Like, it's, like, sit down with Joe. sigh who, according to Remota Shelburne, who texts he wouldn't even respond to. Now he's got to sit down with him, and Joe

has got to clear it and make sure that, you know, like, you either believe his contrition and apology or not. Yeah, they want him to go undergo sensitivity training. What is it? Donate 500K,

be with Jewish leaders and the ADL. And publicly apologize, right? And publicly apologize, right? It's like we were talking about, like, you know, obviously it's much different level. But honestly, it felt to me like the, when we covered the server thing. And it was like, they want them gone. Yeah, they want them gone.

Yeah. That's how that felt to me. Didn't feel like, hey, we're trying to rehab a guy because we truly care about him. And we want him to rehabilitate his thoughts on everything. like that felt like we're just going to make him do a million things and hopefully he'll quit. Does he end up on the Lakers? I know Sam Amick reported at the athletic. He said the Lakers have significant concerns about the prospect of adding Irving at any price.

That's what you're going to suck anyway. What does it matter? What's he going to do? Make them suck? They're awful. Seriously, what's he going to do? So let's say he doesn't do it. Like, is he done?

Is he going to retire? Is he not going to play anymore? What's the next step? I don't know. I think by Friday we'll have more to talk about with Kyrie. Because that meeting might be, it's 4 o'clock Eastern right now. You would think that meeting with Silver has already happened or is near resolution and soon enough sometime Tuesday night. You know, maybe a lot around the time we get the election results, we'll get some Kyrie results.

The same time? Yeah. That would be genius by the NBA. Yeah, I know. When polls close, that's when Woj and Shams and whoever get the leak. Oh, my God. What timing for a week? I'm surprised they're not sitting.

I'm surprised they're both not sitting in the corner at the meeting. just transcribing. Whoever can hit tweet first. It's amazing. There's going to be a one-on-one meeting with Adam Silver and Kyrie Irving, and we're going to have two reporters to know everything that was said in the meeting. How fast can you get the tape back to one of the report? I do look forward to saying what leaks from that meeting.

Because it's such a small... Everything. It's such a small group of people that will be in that room. two hopefully yeah hopefully just two yeah and the wire

tap so that we can get the reports on it that's they got Knicks on Wednesday then they travel they got

clippers Lakers Kings Blazers coming up they have a lot of road games tough road trip

yeah then they got one at home versus your grizzlies then on the road Sixers Raptors Pacers A lot of road games coming up for the nets.

Like this is a pivotal stretch here, man, without Kyrie for, and what was it? Like his first game back would be Kings, I think on the road, or Lakers, one of those two, will be five games. He ain't doing those six things. No way. I don't think to. Do you think to?

No way. I don't know. No way. I don't think so either, but he did post that, you know, apology on Instagram right away. I get it,

but after you post the apology, you know that took everything he had to post that apology. He hated, you know what I mean? He's like, fine.

And so then he posted an apology. And then they hit him with the six things and this is a guy that does not like to be told what to do. No.

And he's going to like after he posted apology, they're going to list six things he needs to do. Maybe he'll shock me. Hell, he shocked me with the appal

I didn't think he'd apologize. No. Not that. fast, no. No. But I mean, I guess, you know,

as soon as he got suspended and then he's like, got his Nike deal suspended. Somebody got to him as like, bro, you're going to lose everything. I'd love to know, I mean,

like we flirt with the idea of the KD trade, right? I'm talking about Pelicans. I half jokingly said the jazz idea to you a couple weeks ago. Yep. I wonder if Katie would want out

if Kyrie's gone. Like it's for sure. You don't think so? You don't think he'd want to sit around? What? I mean, oh, Mr. Reliable? You think he's sitting there going, oh, no, Kyrie's not here. Who could I count on now?

I'm sure he's deep down. Kyrie's still his boy, though. They're still friends. He also asked out this summer. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Like, Guy, it wasn't a package deal. He was like, let me get away from this. Let me get out of here.

So, yeah, I think he's going to be fine. without him. He wanted to be without him. So you think he'd want to stay? Yeah. Okay. Do you think the Nets would want to keep him? It's a difference of you. But I think that the short term. Like if you could get, you know, that monster trade package,

young talent, watch something, something, and then, because I think that would give the front office to talking about, you know, staying power. Does Joe side, because what, then that's built this up with a bunch of quality young talent. they made an appealing destination for Katie and Kyrie to go to. They did a hell of a job, adding young talent, Lavert, Allen.

It lists as long. Would they get another opportunity to do that again with a cleaner slate? Maybe that's the path forward. I'm sure Sean Marks would get that opportunity. Maybe whoever comes in. Unless Josiah actually does trust Sean Marks and views this as just an unfortunate series of events that led them to where they are today.

Maybe. They almost beat the bucks. They danced, but they almost did. And then, you know, who knows how maybe they win a title. You can say that about a million teams over the course of NBA history. 100% you can. All right, Kevin, it's going to be a fun week. There's no NBA games going on tonight.

Thank you to our executive producer, Jesse Lopez, as always. And Kevin, I'll talk to you on Friday. Have a good week, everybody.