The Mismatch - All-Star Starters, NBA Rivals Week, and Absurd Trade Values

Episode Date: January 27, 2023

Verno and KOC debate whether the Knicks and Celtics are actual rivals before discussing Thursday night's fun game between two on TNT (02:00). The NBA All-Star starters have been announced, and the guys discuss Joel Embiid not making the cut and debate how the league could change the voting process in the future (10:42). Also, how do you think the NBA will handle the All-Star Game draft? The guys then get into James Dolan’s interview discussing Madison Square Garden’s use of facial recognition (30:11). The 76ers are on a roll, winners of six straight and trailing only the Celtics in the East (38:42). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Producer: Jessie Lopez Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's popping, everybody? This is Logan Murdoch from Real On I have some big news to share. On Saturday, February 18th, the Ringer NBA show will be hitting the road for All-Star weekend for a live show in Salt Lake City. You heard that right. We are taping the pod in front of a live audience in Salt Lake next month and we want you to join us. Pull up on us at the Stateroom in the heart of downtown Salt Lake. You can grab your tickets now at thestateroom.com. That's thestateroom. Doors open at 9 o'clock. Show is at 10. It's going to be a 21 and up event. come hang with the gang and chat midseason updates draft preview and even have a Q&A with us space is limited so grab your tickets while they last at the stateroom room dot combe hope to see y'all in there welcome to the mismatch i'm chris vernon and joining me see does every friday from the ringer dot combs

k Kevin o'connor a kovna governor Kevin obamber cover cover cover no comfit Kevin O'Killy and Kevin O'Kandiland Kevin O'clock burdo! How's your Thursday night going right now? Yes we are recording this on Thursday evening I'll tell you a very good night of basketball because we are recording before the late games right after the conclusion of the Boston Knicks game. So leading into this game on TNT, they were promoting Rivalry Week.

And Shaq and Kenny and Charles and Adam, all were kind of goofing about it. And it made me think, Kevin, you are younger than I. when you see rivalry week and the Celtics and the Knicks can only imagine all of those games and all of those memories it conjures up for you thinking back to all those huge

Knicks Celtics games I mean does this now when you're trying to concoct like rivalry week and I get it. It's the oldest rivalry. They did a good job at attempting to explain. It's kind of like, say, like Packers Bears,

though the Packers have dominated it. They've played the longest. They've played against each other for an amount of time. But one of the things that we have bemoaned over the years is the lack of rivalries and real, like, deep-seated feelings towards each other. Part of that is because the names, the faces, the jerseys are interchangeable all too regularly. That seems to be changing a little bit with a lot of the guys that are the great players in the league being in the uniforms that they are in. And there's been a course correction on that where you feel like a lot of guys are in the same uniforms,

especially the franchise guys for a long, long time. but when you're trying to think around like, hey, what are the real rivalries that we have in the NBA right now? I guess that's just what you end up with. Like, hey, these teams have played against each other for 75 years. So let's just put that on. Yeah, I know. Like referencing, you know, battles in the 70s and the 80s. And of course, you know, back in the early days, the NBA in the 50s and 60s.

But, you know, in my childhood, you know, growing up for the Celtics, there was no rivalry. I mean, none at all. There was the, they faced each other in the first round twice in the early 2010s. Boston swept the first one. The Knicks won the other one in like five or six games. I mean, there's just a first round matchup against teams that hadn't really had much of a history because the Celtics sucked in the 90s when the Knicks were good. And the Knicks have not been really much of anything ever since then.

So there's been no rivalry for really 30 years now between the Knicks and the Celtics, which is a real shame considering, you know, that long history. When we think about the rich history of the NBA, it has not continued at all. Well, maybe just maybe we might end up getting a playoff series between these two. It's in the cards. It could happen. It could really happen with the way that the standings are. And this was, I thought, a great basketball game to watch.

Up and down, up and down. Yeah, up and down, lots of action. It wasn't stopped all the time with the reps getting too grossly involved and pretty good flow to it. Guys making plays. Guys taking good shots. Guys taking goofy shots. And then, you know, as it gets to the fourth quarter and you've got this big Knicks lead with about five minutes to go, I'm watching my Knicks fans that I follow saying, here we go again. Tom Tibido, stagnant off.

No answer. They could feel it coming. They could feel it coming. Oh, no. And it ends up going to overtime, and they're able to pull away. And it's one of those that honestly, in the moment, would have felt like that, I feel like it would have been extraordinarily crushing to lose that game. Because I thought the Knicks played so well in that game. And then you get to about five minutes left to go.

and it flips on them completely. And they're able to get the win in overtime, thanks to some Jalen Brown miss free throws. And I don't want to just put it all on him, but that's the biggest ones, right? I mean, he had the chance to flip it there at the end. And the outcome remains with the Knicks winning that thing. And I don't know, I was wildly entertained. If that's what the games would be like, I certainly would sign up to watch a bunch of those when we get to the postseason.

Yeah, it'd be fun if we end up getting that. And with Randall playing at the past all-NBA level, once again, the last couple months now, the last month plus, and Jaylen Brunson looking like such a critical building block for the Knicks, playing at an all-star level on his own right, he may

not, you know, he probably doesn't make the team, but he's playing as an all-star caliber point guard. He could. He could. He very well could. I mean, it's a deep, deep class. I mean, we'll talk about All-Star soon. But, I mean, like, the Knicks had a lot of quality talent. Emmanuel Quickly, who we talked about on Tuesday with how great he's been defensively this year for the Knicks.

He had a huge night off the bench for them tonight. And Obie Topping, it's been up and down with him in terms of getting consistent minutes. And that's a tough part for Knicks fans that have to deal with because you see the flashes of him when he gets regular minutes and opportunity. Tonight was one of those big moments. He had a big shot down the stretch of the game. You know, only plays 16 minutes. but they mix have a lot of talent, man,

up and down their roster. You know, a lot of good building lots, a lot of good pieces. But what they really need is, is all those Knicks fans jumping on you about IQ. Oh, yeah, I mean, jumping on us. I didn't say anything about building blocks.

I don't even use that phrase. I don't think I didn't think I did either. You're killing a building block. Until I listen. I listened back to the podcast. I was like, really? I didn't know I used that phrase. Nick's fans love

their young players, love their role players. I listened back to that and I'm like, we were really like he brazen it quickly. We like really were giving him love. But anyway, yeah, the Knicks have a lot of good talent. And I mean, I think for Tibbs, the final stretch of that game, man,

when Boston was trapping or doubling Brunson when he was bringing the ball up the floor, getting it out of his hands. It felt like Tibbs was making zero adjustments at all. Nobody else was initiating offense. There was no answer to it. It was just so stagnant. And it's almost shocking.

Like when you watch the game, like just in that, you know, three, four minutes stretch, you think there's no way New York wins this game. No way. And it even is kind of surprising men ended up pulling that out. But that speaks to the way, you know, the players performed in overtime. They deserve all the credit for that victory, I'd say.

Well, and you always got to get guys that could step up, and we thought this is going to be really tough for them without Mitchell Robinson. We knew how essentially was to what they did. And Jericho Sims, with the 14 rebounds in the game. Sims is fun. Might be a building block. I mean, I don't know. I was texting with a source.

a couple weeks back about Sims. After Mitchell Robinson went out, and he's like, yo, you know, Sims, like we had talked about him prior, Sims has been good. Like when he ever gets opportunities, he's shooting over 80% from the field this season. 70% last year is a rookie.

He does not miss around the basket. He had the big block at the end of the game. I mean, Sims has some talent, dude. He does. Like, he's a high-flying athlete, active hustles. And, you know, I think we're seeing a lot of him, you know, showing what he can do for the Knicks in that game tonight against Boston.

He played big minutes, man. Yeah, 14 rebounds of big night and four offensive rebounds. He has not missed a shot since January 18th. So that's in four straight games. He's shooting 100%. Well, all he don'ts it every time. I know, but I know, but guys who are at the rim don't always shoot at that higher percentage is all I'm saying. It's like the shots he takes.

Well, hell, I hope he'd make 100%. He is literally, like, we use the phrase above the rim. He is literally an above the rim guy. He might be an above the backboard guy. Did that not feel like we were about to get a Jason Tatum game winner, though? Oh, it did, yeah. It just felt like it was all set up, especially after he was named an All-Star Star Star starter before the game, and they're talking about how awesome he is,

and this guy and this guy's just a killer. And after they'd gotten the thing to overtime, it really felt like Tatum's going to pull up and they're going to win this game. And that's going to be the story of this game. And instead, the Knicks get the win. So I mentioned that he was named an All-Star starter. Right after the All-Star starters were announced.

And in the Eastern Conference, you had Donovan Mitchell and Kyrie Irving is the backcourt. and then the front court being Janice Antecunpo, who is going to be a captain for the game, along with Jason Tatum and who am I missing? It wasn't M.B. Kevin Durant. Yeah, Durant.

Because M.B. got left out. And the reaction was like really strong, I thought, immediately about Mb not being an All-Star starter. His numbers are crazy. he should be. I had him as a starter on my ballot. I left Durant off because of games missed. That's it. I'm a bit surprised. I mean, the media last year really drove, you know, the Marcus Smart defensive player of the year trained. Like that was hard at the end of the season. It's a lot of Tatum for MVP stuff. And I'm not saying that's wrong, but I was surprised, you know, I am saying it's wrong. I wouldn't vote Tatum as MVP right now. But like it's too early to say whether that's going to end up being the choice or not. But I was surprised. I was surprised, you know, I am saying it's wrong. I was surprised, you know, I am saying it's was surprised that Tatum led the media vote for the East Front Court. He had 82 media votes. Yannas had 80.

Durant had 67, and then Embedd had 68. So Embed actually had one more in the media vote. But Tatum was fourth in the player vote, third in the fan vote. It's just very interesting how it seems like the media is higher on Tatum than fans and players. Well, I think that – here, let's just say this about the – about the games played thing. You know, Durant,

I want to give him credit because he doesn't sit. He does not at all. No. He doesn't sit. He's out for injury. He has actually, weirdly,

played more games than Joel M. I know. Isn't that crazy? Ford to forth, I was kind of voting, like, in advance. Like,

by All-Star weekend, you know, he will have more games. But you're right. He's played more still, which is insane. Yeah, right now,

Mb has played, 35 of 47 games. Yeah. So he's missed, you know, what? Almost, well, I mean, almost a quarter of his team's games. Yep. Which is crazy to think about because you don't, I mean, you don't think of this being an injury play season by any means for him.

And I went through and looked at all of them because I know this has been a huge subject recently about guys sitting out and load management and everything else. And I thought Richard Jefferson very good on the, SPN today with his impassioned speech about it and growing up as a kid going to games and how he always thought of that. And so I went and looked it up. Kyrie has played 36 of 47. These are the All-Star starters. Donovan Mitchell has played 41 of 49. Tatum as of tonight, that was 50 games. He's played 47 of the 50. Durant 39 of 47, Janus 37 of 48. So Tatum by a wide margin

Has played the highest percentage And then I do think you got to give Mitchell A little bit of a break Simply because his aren't rest His are injury When he hasn't been able to play This year It's not like Donovan Mitchell is regularly taking rest nights

And Mee still He's played less games than Kyrie It is kind of crazy to think Like, I get it. And Embed is having this unbelievable season. And if somebody wants to argue he should be in the All-Star starters and somebody else shouldn't, then by all means, I'm not going to fight. I just think that he is one heck of an example of what we talk about all the time, all time,

which is that like, you don't know, you know, one out every four games, if you had tickets to see him, you didn't see. him this year. On the other side, it was Luca, Curry, Zion, Yokic, and LeBron. LeBron's played 39 of 49.

Yokic has played 42 of 49. Curry's played 33 of 48. Lucas played 44 of 49. And Zion has played 29 of 49. So, look, Yokage, Luca, Tatum, there's your highest percentage guys. That on average, you were more than likely you were going to get to see them play in person if you had tickets to a game.

Or if you tuned them in, for that matter. And, you know, I mentioned a couple of those guys. Injury is injury is injury. You're going to miss games because you're injured. It's not just taking nights off here and there. you know what stood out the most to me of everything on all the ballots Trey young 12th in player vote for guards only 13 votes equal to Tyler Hero

less than Zach Levine Drew Holiday Jalen Brunson lamello ball I would have expected Trey to get more love from players but he didn't get it 12th in the player vote shocking. And he's like, you know, very popular with fans. Fifth and fan vote is a highest selling jersey and all that. Well, I mean, there are a lot of those.

Players don't see it the same way because they're going against them when he's on defense. Yep, but on the other side, look at, say, Kyrie and Reid is all. Yeah, number one in player rank, number one in fan rank, number four in Meteor rank. So what does that tell you? The media doesn't feel like the players or the fans. Yeah. About Kyrie Irvin. They've got a, and look, let's be fair, there's a lot of media that are, you know,

stand down a moral high ground when it comes to stuff or they, you know, they're dug in on their opinions. Like in the end, I think players have always thought Kyrie Irving is amazing. And fans love watching him play. Yeah. And he's famous. He's super famous. He's a recognizable name, and that inevitably helps you on a ballot.

Just like Zion. Zion has absolutely no business being an all-star starter. We all freely admit that. When you've played 29 to 49 games, you should not be a starter instead of, say, Demont de Sabonis, who's got, who is leading his team this year to the, what, third best record in the Western Conference at this point? and has been incredibly available all year long for that team. But he does, he's not nearly as famous.

And so, I mean, he's going to, you know, the fan vote got him. Actually, media vote, I think, did good for Sabonis. So you could tell media voters thought more highly of Sabonis than the other two. Well, how about, like the other side of that Subonis trade, Tyrese Halliburton. He was third in Meteor rank behind Jalen Brown and Donovan Mitchell. I had Halliburton as a starter. I was surprised that he didn't get the nod. I mean, Halliburton is the Pacers.

He is their system. He's the engine of everything and the success that team has had this season. He's 20 and 10 elite efficiency, doesn't turn the ball over, good on defense. Halliburton wasn't voted a starter, but he damn well deserves to make the team. Oh, for sure. And I thought Gildes-Alexander is voting, you know, I think he's even more deserving. He's having even a better season than maybe, but he's obviously going to be an all-star. And if you want to say he should be an all-star starter, you know, I mean, the problem is in the Western Conference for any of those guys,

whether it's Gildes-Elexander or Morant or anybody else, you're kicking out either Luke or a Curry. And that's not happening. Yeah. Do you think, what's your take on the positions? I mean, like, you got Luca listed as a guard, you got LeBron listed as front court, like you get Brown listed as a guard, but Tatum listed as front court.

Like, for some of those guys, it's really tough to distinguish with what they actually do and what slot they belong in. Like, do you think maybe, I don't know, how would you handle it in the future? I guess this is one of those things that comes up dependent upon who is in the league, right? So Shaq gave this.

passion speech about how M.B. should be there and there should be the center position. You just eliminated the big man position. So there's going to be that opinion, at least from, I don't know. But he's wrong about that, though, because if they, whether, if they added center, sure, he would have been voted starter, but. That's what you said. But if they've removed positions, he also would have been voted starter.

Like, that's the flip side of it. He would have been a starter. That's fair. He would have been, he would have had more than the guards even. Yeah. It likely, I believe, it probably would have been him over Mitchell or Kyrie. Well, I mean, they've got there like whatever that is. You know, that little point total that's next to it.

So was his point total, his point total was higher? Well, no, because the way the vote was structured because he was in the front court with Yonis and Katie and Tatea. But if it were like total players and all that, you know, total number of votes, if you're voting without positions, then yeah, like he, I would have expected him to be a starter. Like he would have been fourth or fifth instead of, you know, fourth in the front court. Yeah, I don't really get torn up about the whole, like,

how they get there. It also doesn't really matter. It really doesn't matter too much who starts. It's just, it's like you're in all-stars. It's a, it's certainly a feather in your cap. To be an all-star starter? Absolutely. Yeah, but the way the vote is, the way it's structured

when you get, you know, players voting for Quentin Grimes and Luke Cornynett are getting votes. Yeah. Like just to name two players from tonight's game that we were just watching. I mean, I got to be honest. I was kind of impressed with that. It feels to me, just by looking at it, the players took it much more seriously than I would have suspected.

Honestly. I have been, I will tell you, I have been with players when they filled out their ballot back in the day. And they just would not, they refused to give anybody any credit. they would just vote for freaking Luke Ridenauer and whoever. Like, name it. Just to, and their

teammates. If they could, if they, or former teammates. Chad Holmgren, check Holmgren got four votes. I mean, that's funny. I'm not saying everybody across the board. It is funny, but why is he even on the ballot? Like,

why, why is Marcus Morris on the ballot? I have no idea. You know, it's like, well, you know, I just, I don't think, I just, I think, you know, those players all due respect. So Yokic could mockingly vote for them or something, maybe? Yeah, I don't know. It's goofy.

Who knows? But I, yeah, I don't really care how you do it. You know, I mean, ultimately the teams are pretty good. Like, they're pretty close. I'm not stressing too hard about it at all. All right. So the way they announced this, for those that don't know, is that this year, instead of doing the TNT thing, which did end up having some great drama.

This will be better. picking teams. This is going to be even better because the two captains, LeBron and Janice, are going to go out on the court, and it's just like you're playing pickup. The only way this won't work is if they actually did it in advance. That's how that,

that, then it won't be cool. Oh. That won't be cool. They got to do it organically, in my opinion. If they pick in advance, I think that's going to take all the fun out of it. It'll just be lame.

Here's one thing that went through my mind, though, Kevin. You know they're always about the almighty dollar. side, right? Mm-hmm. So I saw somebody posted, like, the jerseys. I don't like it. That's neither here or there. I don't like them.

I think they look cheap again. That's my opinion. I like the old school ones, like the ones that they, you know, I like the retro-looking ones. And I felt like they took a lot more time with the jerseys long ago. Oh, I see.

Okay. I don't like. They look cheap to me. Yeah, yeah, they're all right. They look, whatever. They look like the, something that they give you a gym class to throw on, you know.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know what you mean. The classic ones are super cool. Like a penny. And then what they call, they call them pennies. Be it to put on over your shirt. It kind of does have that look.

It sort of looks. Okay, so here's what I was thinking. So when I go to the All-Star game, my son always wants me to bring him back, All-Star stuff, right? And I don't know why this went through my mind tonight. But if they don't do it, it the way that, if they do it

the way you were talking about it, the way I want to see it too, which is basically here's, here's the case study in. We got all these amazing players. We're going to stand up on a wall like they're about to play a pickup game. And now, Janus and LeBron, they're getting to pick their teams. Then we're going to play the game,

right? How do you do the jerseys then? Well, you have one made for each team. They can't do that. Yeah, why not? Because you won't, because it's because it's not authentic to what happened in the game. Those jerseys are a relic of what happened in the game. Oh, you can, you know.

Who you played for. Is it reversible? It might as well be reversible. It looks like anyway. I mean, they're not going to be able to make these on site. That's what I'm saying. I know, but they can make one for each team. They're not going to make one jersey for each team for every player.

Yeah, why not? They won't do that. I'm saying I'm worried it's going to be like yours. where it is done in advance. And that will not be cool. Because when we're walking in the team store, you know how much money they make off those things? When you walk in the team store in Utah,

they're going to have all those All-Star jerseys up there. And they ain't going to have two for each guy. Hell, they hardly have one for each guy. It's a good point. It's a good point. So how are they going to do the jersey? Here's the thing. How much money are they making from those sales in the arena

compared to online? Because if they're making money from it online, you could theoretically say, go to NBA.com store now. Right after the game's about to start? You don't know what jersey they're wearing until they pick their teams, is what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying.

That could drive a lot of height towards the site for online jersey sales. Like, it just launched online now. Yeah, they sell them in advance, though. They'll start selling those things tomorrow. Well, you could sell them in advance. You just don't know which one it's going to look like. until they pick it.

Maybe it's reversible. Well, here's the thing. Here's the thing, though, Chris, like to all the concerns we're talking about with the way they're going to do that, I hope they don't pick in advance. Whatever way they have to do to make it work, it won't be cool unless it's authentic

where they're picking the team on the court live and you see the immediate reactions from the players. You see the disgust on the faces of the bonus when he's left to, you know, last. like that's what I want to see. If these guys know which team they're going to go to and it's just about walking into where you already know, like that's not cool.

That's not like it is at the park. Yeah, and they're also, yeah, the humiliation of it all. Well, that's what it should be like. Yeah. And then that player goes out and has a big game. That's what it should be. Could you imagine if they would have gotten out of the end and James Hardin and Rudy Gobert are standing there

and there's that image for the rest of time? I know, right. Yeah. I mean, well, Go Bear won't have to worry about it this year. He's not making the team. Yeah, that's fair.

But those two guys are just standing there. I don't know. I mean, look, it was bad enough on TV. I know, I know, but like that image doesn't have to be a negative. That image could be,

oh, remember when he was picked last in the first live All-Star draft and then he went out and scored 25 points and won an all-star game MVP? That's what it could be. Yeah, because in your way of doing it

with the way you're talking about, there is going to be like a last pick. Yes. Well, there always is the last pick. It was just done on camera, a split screen style before. And it feels, well, and it was just their name on a,

on a board. And that means nothing. The actual walking across the court to your team. Yes. I know. They won't let that happen. They had better.

I know that's what we want. They better let it happen. I know that's what we want. I know. I don't think they, I think you're probably on to something. They're going to do this. teams, they'll pick the teams in advance, and then they stage this thing.

Because that's the only way they would be able to make the jerseys. And that's worse than the way it used to be. Yeah, you're right. I agree. And by the way, if they do, do it that way, maybe I'll stay corrected. But if they do it that way, we at least need to see the video footage afterwards. Just like with the NBA draft lottery, where they show the bouncing balls in the private

room, they release that on YouTube and NBA.com after the live. drawing where they, you know, they bring out the image of the team logo on the, out of the envelope, right? Yeah. Like, we get at least see what really happened when the vote happened or the lottery balls were bouncing around, you know? You want to see, said Trey Young. No, it's, I want to see the drama.

I want to hear the ooze and eyes of the crowd and the players. I want to see the players kind of whispering in the air of LeBron or Yanna saying, well, pick this guy, pick that. guy. That's what it's like when you're at the park and you're picking teams together. It's like a strategy. Like, okay, who should I pick? You're looking down. You're making it. I know they're, I don't think they're going to either,

but they should. That's all I'm saying. They should. If they don't, they're missing a big opportunity. I agree. I agree with you. Anyways, all right, we started with this Boston, New York. By the way, Chris, if you're a last, you're an All-Star. Absolutely.

Deal with it. That's right. I mean, I don't know. it's all relative, Kevin. You could say that. You could say, hey, you're the first girl that got kicked off that dating show, but you were on the show. You know what I mean? Like, it's still, it is. Yeah, but that's not the All-Star game.

It's all relative. You're still, come on, these guys all have pride. I know. Well, right? Sometimes you're going to swallow it. Fair enough. We started with that Boston New York game. The day.

kind of began with a New York story. For people that have not watched this, that listen to us, you've got to go watch any NBA fan or non-NBA fan. You got to go watch this thing that took place on Good Day, New York, with James Dolan, the owner of the Knicks, going on there and talking about Madison Square Garden, their use of facial recognition technology.

Kicking out fans at Madison Square Garden, Radio City Music Hall. There's been a couple. Ethan Strauss on Substack, there's a story weeks prior to that about a woman and being pulled away from her family and friends because she works for like an attorney's office

or something like that. And that was with a Girl Scout troop at Radio City Music Hall, which is owned by the same group because she is part of a law firm that has a lawsuit against MSG. And so anyways,

this wild-ass interview on Good Day New York includes James Dolan like just acting like the facial recognition thing is absolutely no big deal. Basically said, who cares? Like, you're at the game. You don't care about these random people. And for those that don't know the backstory on this,

people that have even, like, commented online about James Dolan or posted something on Facebook, like there's a guy who is routinely stopped when he goes into Madison Square Garden. This was in Ethan's article. Because he commented sell the team. On James Dolan's bands Facebook. page. J.D. and the straight shots. So somewhat, so, so, so he found the guy that commented on his

band's Facebook page and got the facial recognition technology to go off and alert security, basically, when that guy walks in the arena. And then they don't kick him out, but they talk to him and let him know, we know you're here. We're monitoring. It's all just so. And so this idea that the guy is using this technology to exact revenge against his enemies. And meanwhile, you know, there's all this New York state law stuff that goes on with it and whether they can use it or not. And so he just blows that off completely.

And then goes into this whole idea that they are threatening because he's using this stuff. his liquor license, and he says, we'll just do away with liquor for a night. And we'll post the picture of the CEO that's in charge of this and say, oh, you wish you had a drink? Well, call this guy. And like, on Good Day, New York holds up a picture of the guy with the email, the phone number. I'm like, oh, my God, this is bananas. And he just, honestly, it struck me as a guy that has absolutely no idea how he is perceived. Like, I've always thought that he like kind of knows he's not liked.

I think he knows he's not liked, Chris. He knows. That's why he's doing all of this. You think so? I feel like he, when he talks, it feels like he's like kind of on the fan side, and I'm doing it for Knicks and Rangers fans. And kind of like, we're all in this together, fighting the good fight against these bureaucrats that just want to get clicks

and attention and everything else. And it's like it almost like comes out, you know, as to, he tries to talk like, like, I'm on your side type of stuff. To me, that's how it kind of comes off. And that's what I'm saying. Like, and obviously, guys like that are surrounded by people

that refuse to tell them the truth of how this looks. It's bananas, man. I couldn't believe it. Honestly. It's like one of those, like, the stories you hear about,

like, these, like, you want to believe, like, everything you read, right? This guy's awful. This guy's evil.

This guy's malicious. This guy's out to get people. You have the opportunity. to like, I don't really have some, I haven't watched a million James Dolan interviews. I know what happened with Charles Oakley. I know with this facial recognition. I know all the stories about him. But even then, you see the guy get interviewed and you can be like, ah, no, I don't

believe that. He's a faking it. He's really a dirtbag deep down. But like, he doesn't come off likable in the least. That's what I'm saying. Like usually guys could like fake it Even if they're bad guys You know what I mean like you

Trying to think of Well it's not gonna look Even if I don't know if you ever saw And I didn't watch the whole thing But I saw part of it Where like Oliver Stone Did that whole bit with Vladimir Putin Like

Vladimir Putin might be the worst person ever But you wouldn't know from watching that Like you know what I mean He knows how to comport himself in an interview to where you wouldn't sit there and watch and go, oh my God, this is the worst person ever. Like, he's doing this interview. Whereas James Dolan, it's quite clear he is a petty tyrant.

It's so incredibly clear that this guy's the worst dude ever. He's a tyrant's owner who is trying to stop selling alcohol at his events just so he could continue making a point about spying on the paying fans that go to those, arenas. And so what I'm trying to say, just so I'm clear, he's worse, publicly doing an interview

than Vladimir Putin was when I saw him. I didn't, I didn't watch that immediately and be like, this is the worst person in the world. I'm like, you know, made some sense when he said that, you know. It's like, this guy, I'm watching it.

And I'm like, is this thing serious? Like, this guy is. This guy is. ridiculous. Ridiculous. I can't believe

how he's acting and then just defending these actions. Crazy. It's all so goofy, all of it. Oh, man. I mean,

I wonder with the NBA because they would not say anything publicly. When Ethan wrote that story on his substack, House of Stroutes a couple weeks back,

he asked for comments on the story that was about to be released. And Michael Bass said, them. There's no league-wide prohibition on facial recognition security technology unless its use conflicts with local laws. So that was the stance the NBA League office took on it. I wonder how they privately actually feel about Dolan's actions over the last year or so with that technology. And I wonder if also they have concerns about how, if this spreads to all 30 teams and what it

could mean for fans and what they're going to be able to do with games. who knows. Yeah. I'm sure. Hey, hey, look, we're never going to be allowed there. We just, we spoke his name. Well, I'm sure at some point, like, inevitably, Adam Silver will get asked about it. Like, at one of those, whether it's All-Star Weekend or the NBA finals,

I would assume at some point Silver gets asked about it. And, you know. Look, and let me just say this, so I'm not taking out of context. I ain't saying this guy's a horrible dictator murderer. He's not. I'm saying he interviews worse than one. Yeah. Anybody who listens to this

knows exactly what you meant. I'm sure, I'm sure. Like, it's very possible I can get taken out of context. But anybody who actually listens to the show knows what you meant. We got some stuff to talk about. So we talked about Joe L.M.B. Snubbed from All-Star starting. Well, his team has been great recently.

That Philly team has caught a wave, Kevin. And now you look up, and it is, Boston in one and Philly in two. And it does feel like one of those. You and I were both very, very high on them, loved their roster turnover that they had pulled off in the off season. And it seemed like now they've gotten everybody healthy. They figured out how to play together.

Boy, if they've got Maxie as a Super 6th, that is just such a huge card to be able to play nightly. I mean, like, he is, you know I love Maxie. Maxie is good enough to be starting on, Lord knows how many teams. I get it, the back court pairing with him and Hardin is not one that is tenable defensively. And so there are better options or better mixes for that. That being said, the luxury of being able to bring that guy off and you're

many cases. I mean, he could just destroy second units by himself. And they've got to figure it out. They figured out, you know, a good mix. They figured out how to play together. And, you know, the team that we thought they were going to be, that's what they look like now. I've been mega impressed with them. What do you think about the evolution of James Hardin, Chris? You know, you've been the anti-harden for many years now. What do you think about his role and really fueling their success as a point guard for this team. There is nothing you can say, I mean the guy's shooting 45%

from the field, he's 39% from three, and he's 11, 11 assists the game, I think it is right now. He's been absolutely awesome, and he's clearly taken a backseat to MP. That was one of the things at the beginning of the season. It was like, is it a big James night, or is it a big

impede night? Like, I will give him credit because he is clearly second banana. That thing's going to ride or die with M.B. We'll see in the playoffs. And, you know, because M.B. has had some flameouts. Hardin obviously is known for flameouts, but, like, there's no question who the number one guy on that team is.

And that was one of the things that we didn't know, especially when they're trying to, like, figure it all out. last year, then he went out, and then he was hurt. And then this year, at the beginning of the season, it was like you'd have a big James game, then you'd have a big Embed game, and then it's Embedd's team. And Hardin just fell in line on that.

I've been super impressed, super impressed. He's been playmaking. You know, he's still not a plus defender by any means, but just for a guy that has been a number one, you know, we saw glimpses of it for a minute where he was taking a backseat to the guys in Brooklyn, certainly Durant in Brooklyn, but then he seemed unhappy with his plight there.

And I, you know, I can't, I don't know what his level of happiness is right now, but I imagine as long as they keep on winning games. Allswell, that ends well, you know, with him being second banana on the team and averaging 21 points, but getting the 11 assist every night. I think he's been very good, very good.

Yeah, I mean, he's been excellent and the supporting cast around him as well. Like you mentioned Tyrese Maxie coming off the bench, but whether it's George's Niyang, shake Milton, you get Thiebel out there getting some minutes, De Anthony Melton, former Grizzly, who you saw really shine in Memphis, 19 points the other night against Brooklyn.

Shotmaker, active defensively. versatile, you know, the supporting cast around Hardin and Bede and Maxi is, you know, it checks basically every box you could ask for from this team. And I think for them, like the Hardin and Bid pick and roll, that's really the foundation of their

half court offense. Hardin and Bede, pair up for the pick and roll more than any other combination than the whole NBA, according to tracking data on Second Spectrum. They dominate the way teams typically defend them with drop coverage, sometimes up to touch, you know, icing those pick and roles, what's going to have to change for them in the postseason is when teams switch.

And that's going to really answer the question of whether the Philadelphia 76ers are going to be an NBA finals team or whether they're going to be a team that flames out in the second round or the conference finals or whatever they face a team like Milwaukee or Boston that is going to switch every single pick and roll between Harden and End and Bede. Right now, if you look statistically, they are not performing significantly better against switches than they did last season when they were just developing chemistry with each other. However, though, it's still early. Teams aren't switching a lot against them right now.

And with the supporting cast, I think they still have the upside to become a deadly team if teams end up switching against them. So it's just something to monitor because teams aren't doing that a heck of a lot against them right now. But that's going to be the key for postseason success. But as of now, everything's clicking. And then we'll also see, in addition to that when you're talking about them switching, there's going to be the extra attention and the clampdown,

making life harder for those two. Can these guys live up to the averages that they're shooting now? Because the three-point numbers, you get a lot of open threes playing with Hardin and Embed. And the three-point numbers are unbelievable. Maxi, 40%. Harris, 38%, Melton, 39%. Milton, 38%,

George Nying, 42%, you even go down to Tucker, he's 39%, like a house, 35%, like they don't even have, these guys are all shooting

pretty good percentages. And it's like, that's the trick. When you get to the playoffs, you know, those open threes, are those guys going to be as reliable as their percentages

have been thus far? Because we've seen that happen a lot, where it's like, well, that guy, man, it's crazy. That guy hadn't, he didn't been making any threes during this playoff series. And he shot 40% throughout the year. And he just can't find, you know, it's a different, it's a different level. And they got a bunch of guys that have been knocking it down with tremendous consistency. For sure.

I mean, they're fourth in the NBA and three point percentage right now. And like they're, they shoot near the middle of the league in terms of volume and in terms of attempts. You know, for Philadelphia, they, they get quality. shots and they make a heck of a lot of them. Well, that's how you open those guys up. Mm-hmm. You know what I mean? And it actually, it's a perfect segue because it leads into

what we watched last night between the Warriors and the Grizzles. And one of the things that I have talked about a lot with the Memphis team is these are the kind of games that are incredibly revealing. Much like what the Knicks went through tonight in that Boston game, they had a

12-point lead, I think it was, with five minutes left to go. Memphis has a nine-point lead with five minutes left to go. And then they get outscored like whatever it was, 20 to 9 in the last five minutes of the game. And it's here's, that's what playoff basketball looks like. You're going to have to be able to score. You're going to be able to score in the half court.

And when John Morant drives in and three guys can collapse on him and his choice is either throw a lob to Brandon Clark or try to finish against three guys because the only guy on the team that you can throw it out to and reliably count on a shot being made from long range is Desmond Bain and he's being face guarded.

It's like that then becomes revealing. What do you need? Because that's the exact kind of thing that happens in the playoffs. And it's just like what we were just talking about with Philadelphia, right? when they're inevitably going to collapse on an MBE or a Hardin, is George Niyang going to make them pay for doing that?

Is D. Anthony Melton going to make them pay for doing that? Is name the guy, right? The others. Because those are the guys that get open shots. And that's where the Grizzlies have a deficiency. Because when you get into the half cord and a team is sells out on Morant and now it's like we're going to, we're staying home on. who are the other ones

that are going to make you pay for doing that? And it's not Zaire Williams and it's not the group of a bunch of young players on the team. Hopefully Danny Green can help that situation. But it's very instructive. That was a great...

The Grizzlies have the 26th ranked half-court offensive rating. That's worrisome. It's because they don't have shooting. You know, that's one of the remake of this Philly team is that they got these guys are all shooting and they're making shots they make open shots they don't have anybody except for Desmond Bain how much of it is shooting versus

like there's a possession in that game against gold say where Jah dribbled the ball for 15 seconds without initiating a play for sure how much of it is just on Jha with his management down the end of the end of the clock with those games no he's still work in progress and and I am a fan of playing in these close games because they honestly have had it too they've had it very easy they've killed people all year long i mean i can't tell i bet i went a month and a half without seeing a close game truly like there was at least a six-week stretch where there might have been like a game that went down to like because those are the revealings that's when you find out what you really got and if you want to be able to beat a golden state which is a you

is obviously what Memphis wants to do, and Golden State wants not to happen. Like, to make every excuse in the world, you just saw what it takes in order to beat them. And you had them down nine, five minutes a lot to go, and you still couldn't do it. So something is, something's got to give. And I do think that it will be an agent for change. I mean, I don't think you, I've said from the very beginning, I thought they were going to make a move. And I don't think that they will, when it comes playoff time, I don't think they're going to be going in with the wing rotation you see now. I think there's a collection of assets,

a bunch of good young players. Those aren't win now players. If you're trying to win now, or even last night for that matter, you've got to have a different selection than that. So about a couple weeks ago, maybe a month ago, I argued with you about Pascal Ciacom or O.G. and Obie being a target for Memphis. How much do you think they state? So look, I, from at the beginning of the season, Kevin, I said I've coveted O.G. and O'G. I know.

I know. I know. I'm just saying. I know. The Seahom stuff, I don't know why. Okay, fine. All right. Okay, but it was the price.

You said you wouldn't give up three firsts or whatever for O.G. No, three first round draft picks. I'm just saying. Why not? I, because I don't think that's the price. That's not role player price, bro. and you can say what if you want. He's a role player.

He's a pretty high-end role player. But he's a role player. OG is a true building block. He's the fourth leading shot taker on the team if he's on Memphis. He's not taking more shots of Moran, Bain, or Jackson over the course of the next five. Yeah, I know, but he's an elite defensive player. He's a 37% shooter from a three. He can make plays off the balance, attack, and closeouts,

in the smart pass. Absolute perfect fit. I love it. Yeah. So why not give three firsts for 25-year-old O'GN and Obie, who fits the timeline of your young squad that has championship upside? Like, why do you want to lose in the second round? Again, we've got a league to worry about.

And I'm not trying to be Rudy Gobert trading. You don't give up three first rounders for role players, bro. You don't. All right, so let Gold's stake in for Wiseman, Kamiga, and two firsts. And watch them win another title. For goodness sate. I'm not kidding for Wiseman Kaminga and two first. What do you think you're going to get OG for then?

Oh my God. What are we talking about here? So the Grizzlies shouldn't give up three first. We're not talking about Kevin Durant. We're talking about OG and Ninobe, who I love. But it's just gotten extreme. Like, bro. And maybe it is.

And maybe I'm crazy. What? I'm speaking from this. standpoint of this is what people around the league are saying the Raptors are expecting. There's a Toronto Star said there was three first round picks from a mystery team reported, reportedly offered for Oji and Novi. Whether that's just, you know, public negotiating, leverage play by the Raptors front office, or whether it's three crappy picks, who knows the actual truth there behind it.

I've checked them with league sources about it. A lot of mixed opinions there. But the reality is, is that the Raptors are saying they're not going to make. a move until deadline week and that their price is as high as many people have reported. Three picks, three young players, they want a lot to move OG and an Obie or Pascal Ciacum. So if they stand by that, if they dig their heels in the ground and say, no, we're not BSing here. We're just not going to make a trade unless we get that.

What I'm saying is, would you meet that demand to get an OG and and OB and OB, if the answer is no, then it's no. I agree. I would rather not give up three first round picks for OG and and OBB. but if that is indeed the price, would you do? With the way they draft? The Grizzlies, that is.

It's insane. I know, I know, Chris, but at the same time, Windows can shut sooner than you ever expect. And I'm not saying that, like, I'm saying that because we've seen Jha has some scares. Let's just be honest.

I know he's only 23, but he's had some scares, okay? Everybody thought Derek Rose was going to last forever, too, and he didn't. It's not how you could play. That's not how you can plan, though. Okay, I know. But the Grizzlies are knocking on the door of a championship right now, Chris.

They have a guy that you say should be the defensive player of the year and Jared Jackson Jr. They have a guy who's a clear All-Star and John Morant. They have good role players. You should be all in in trying to win a title now. Why would you not? I don't think that it's going to be an issue. I think that they're going to make moves. Okay.

You're asking me about a very specific, which is do you, if I'm giving up three first round, picks in any deal, I'm getting a star. Who do you want them to get that? That's the price of a star. I would love to get Ananovi. But who's your top target besides Ananovi? Is there a guy that you have in mind?

You're like, I want the Grizzlies to get this guy, and I feel good about our title chances. Don't tell me, Jay Crowder. If it's true, if it's true that Bogdanovitz can be had for an unprotected first, I would do that in two seconds. Okay. I'm with you. Totally.

Two seconds. And I would do that before. Like I would even, I would take me literally two seconds to do that deep. I would have done it yesterday. All right. Now let's say theoretically, the Pistons get three separate offers from three different teams. One of them is offering a first and like three feature seconds. Would you be willing to do that?

Sure. Okay. All right. I mean, just asking. But they've got seven second round picks. So those are like, I know. Just asking. Not a big.

Yes. I mean, so you wanted another name. There's another name. That is a bang, knockdown shooter. Throw it out to him, a veteran guy, can guard his position, knock down. And that's the knock against O.G. He's a 37% three-point shooter, but he's not... He's not knocked down.

He's not 40 plus percent on a higher volume like Boyon Bogdanovich. So it's very possible the best fit for Memphis might not be the guys who's most expensive. I want any of those guys I could throw it out to. I'm just talking about space on the floor in crunch time. Anybody I could throw the ball out to, and I would be, bro, I'd pull up the best shooters in the NBA and I'd go through them. And I'd say, could I get this guy? Can I get this guy?

And I'm not talking talking, Duncan Robinson and his years remaining $19 million contract. That's dead. I'd give you a, and this is going to be a crazy, because he doesn't play all that much. but like the Luke Conards of the world, those kind of guys, you just need guys that can, you throw it out to him, you don't want that dude shooting an open three.

You don't want it happen. Like that kind of, I mean, I want shooters. I got to be able to, I mean, yes, I want them to be able to guard their position. But they need some more shooting. And hopefully Danny Green,

who has been a great three-point shooter on a catch-and-shoote guy for the length of his career, can help them dramatically. come back next week. But you can't put it all on daddy free. No, of course not. He's coming off a major...

He's 40 years old. He's 30... He's actually 35. Yeah, I know. I'm kidding. I'm exaggerate. No, he's younger than I thought he was. I feel like he's been around

for a hundred years. But somebody else, too. But yeah, I love OG. I love Bogdanovich. I like, you know, I said, I think you could throw the ball out too, and I would feel like, Oh, right, that's going in.

Well, I'm rooting for you to make a move, the Grizzlers to make a move. I'm rooting for somebody to make a big move. I want to see somebody go all in. The window's open. I think you're going to see a lot of teams try to go in because it's open, because it feels open.

I think this is going to be, I think this is going to be a much better trade deadline than people think it's going to be. It's very possible. One of those that we got a little hint on is the Phoenix thing. Because it's Matt Ishpa, Ishpia?

Ishpia. He was taking over. He's going to take over before the trade deadline. So that gives a little bit of clarity to the direction that Phoenix is going to go, knowing that that's going to take place and there's going to be a, you know, the power is going to change over.

Now, you know, there's not that weirdness of, are we doing this because of the owner we have now who's not supposed to be running the team, but obviously he still has power and all his people are kind of still employed, or are we making these moves, or are we just kind of in a holding pattern until the changeover of power?

Now that Ishvi is going to take over, wouldn't you imagine a new owner who's got his new prize possession? He's going to be super aggressive and allow James Jones to make the moves that he wants to make. You know he doesn't, look, first order of business is the crowder thing.

I ain't trying to pay a luxury tax for $10 million that ain't playing for me. So that's going to get resolved. And it'll get resolved probably sooner than later now that the changeover of power is coming soon. And then we'll see. But I would not be surprised that Phoenix is very aggressive because of that. You know, new owners always want. He's going to want to win. You're not going to be a 500 team.

You're trying to spend that kind of money for a 500 team. and so I think you probably encourage them to be more aggressive than if it had stayed the same way. How about Jay Crowder, Dario Sarich for OG Inanobie, and you send them three first round picks if you're the sons. Would you do that for Phoenix? Chris? Would you do it if you're the sons? I don't, I mean, I would be worried about backup. You'd be sweating balls as a Grizzlies fans.

If the son's got OG and an OB Or if the Mavs If the Mavs got Ogy and Oby You'd be so scared The Ananoby stuff is gone bananas now I think you're underrating OG Personally I was like I was like a fan

Of him Before and somehow People talk about him It's become Why he's not Jailin Brown bro I know but I know he's I know he's not, but I think you talk about him like, I wouldn't have me sweating bullets if somebody got him.

Like, this is just fucking stupid. I wouldn't be telling you, oh, you're winning a title if the grizzly's got him. I wouldn't be sweating bullets if someone else got it. He's one of the best defensive players in basketball. He's versatile. He's a guard stopper. He's a wing stopper. Why aren't they good?

Because they're not good for a lot of different reasons. Because if somebody gets fed family, you'll be. That's such a about response. You'll be jerking off if somebody gets Fred Van Vlee. You'll be jerking off if somebody gets Seacom. You'll be jerking off if somebody got Scotty Barnes. You'll be jerking off to get any of these other guys. This is a lot of jerking.

But somehow, altogether, they're not any good. They got all these awesome players that have value to the moon. But they can't win. Figure that out. The Raptors roster. Okay. According to the media is worth 700,000 first round picks. All right.

We're talking about one. But they can't win. We're talking about one player going into a different. Hey, God forbid, don't let him get him. I'd be, I'd be quaking in my books. We're talking about one player in a completely different context. We're not talking about the Raptors context of their collective. We're talking simply about if the Mavs or the.

Grizzlies or the sons, one of these West teams, were to add one of the... He's helpful! Okay. All right. Fine. He's helpful to them. Okay. All right. But let's step acting like it's...

I think adding one of the best defensive players in the league would be a pretty big deal. I just want to do this when they listen to people talk about Rui Hachamura. Rui Hachamura is not like in the same breath. Oh, well, they do. You wouldn't have known that. he wouldn't have known that

that was I saw it championship peace Rui was really good Are they now the favorite Like Jesus Christ They got Rui Hachamora They didn't get Kevin Durant

I know That's just Lakers media stuff though Like all the Lakers fans And all that That's just Playing to fans That's all I understand

I mean the Lakers Of course Like Wizards fans Are gonna be disgusted Like Rui had a good game For the Lakers he's had good games for the Wizards, but the wizard stuff,

nobody talks about it. But yes, of course they talk about it with his debut when they had this massive front court with Adie LeBron and Rui Hachamura, looks versatile defensively.

They were big. They had shooting on the floor. Rui played really well in his debut. That's undeniable. He shut down the Japanese NBA stream. Yeah. Shut it down. Amazing.

Find me another guy that can do that. we're going to have a lot going on coming up over the course of the next couple of weeks. Just first round picks throwing around everywhere. I hope to God, OG is one of them. Oh, God. I hope so. I mean, for goodness sake. I want to talk about that trade with Chris Vernon.

It might be to Memphis. You don't know. They might not get rid of him. Didn't you just you reported they're not going to get rid of him. Who, OG? No, I sent a report they're not going to get rid of. They're just less likely to get rid of them. Yeah, than Gary Trent and Fred Van Pleet, yeah.

Gary Trent can knock down shots. Yeah. Malik Beasley can knock down shots. There's a lot of guys, I think, that are out there that can, you know what I mean? It's what you need. It's not necessarily always about the individual player, but how that individual player fits. Oh, 100%. That's the reason I've always been high on Enanobes because he fits like a glove with what Memphis has,

as a three. And if I didn't have to watch Dylan Brooks play basketball again, I'd, I mean, there's a bonus to that. Maybe I'd give every first round pick for the rest of my life. I enjoyed your pod with Bill the other day, Bill and House. I'm glad Bill mentioned that we're going to be doing a live show in Memphis. It's exciting. And then they posted on Instagram. I'm like, this is real. I thought for sure that they would not actually come. It's coming, bro. And then you and me are doing a show in L.A. earlier in March. Yep. We'll have more details.

We're taking the show on the row. We're like, who takes the show? Like fish. They still traveling? They still do it stuff? I believe so, yeah. That's what we're going to be like. We're going to be like fish, except you're the only one with drugs.

No, that's not true. I don't have drugs. It's not sure. I have not used any marijuana since August. What? No, you didn't believe me in the tweet? No, Kevin O' Cannabis. It's true.

You've abandoned your name. No. Man. I'm on a long tolerance break. And also it's just the same thing. So then it can be so much better? I'm not doing it because I want to. Well, no, I mean, it's also just a part of like some overall lifestyle change.

I've worked out every single day for 31 straight days. What? You know, whether it's like, you know, I've done the bike. Every day, all those 31 days, sometimes like a 45 minutes, sometimes a 10 minute. But every day working out, doing resistance bands, hit training. You're Peloton, right? Peloton, yeah, I love it. It's awesome.

I love it. Do you have a favorite instructor? I like Dennis Morton. I like Charlotte. Yeah, those are my two favorites. Alex is pretty good as well for like a kind of a harder workout. Do you have Peloton friends? No, but I would be happy to add some.

Are you on Peloton Chris? No, I don't have. Yeah. But I didn't know how it works. You can't see anybody else, can you? I have no. No, you're like you see people on the side when you're, when you're, you know, in a workout, you can see the names of other other, other usernames.

You don't know their real name. And there's no, like, video of you. No. No. No. No. I didn't know if it was like a virtual, you know, like, thing, like, where everybody, feature, you know, was up on a board.

It's pretty good. I mean, I did this awesome workout with Dennis Morton the other day where the last song was crawling by Lincoln Park. You know that song? Yeah, I know. Oh, it's intense. I mean, the ending, my heart was pumping, probably harder than it's ever been. They get the meter on there. Look at this guy. Kevin O cyclist. It feels good. You got them little weird shoes.

Yeah, I know. Yeah. You do? You do? Yeah, they clip on. Yeah, Kevin O'Clip on. I'm with it. All right. All right. Enough jerking off talk. All right.

There's a lot of it this episode. Thankfully, we didn't get to talk to about Killing and Hayes. Oh. Why? You don't want to talk about it? I need him. No, I need him around. I need him around forever.

Yeah. He is the only player in the NBA less efficient than Dylan Brooks. And so Dylan's not number one. He's not number one. Killian is number one. I think Killian will surpass him soon. No, he has.

No, he's number one. No, Dylan is number two. No, I'm saying Killian will move, you know, I guess behind him then, you know. You mean he'll become more efficient? Yeah, Killian is trending up. Oh, I doubt that. He's trending up since early November.

I doubt that. I need Gillian. By the way, I didn't see any of the game tonight. I saw zero of the Nets Pistons game. but the Pistons won. Killian came off the bench. He had 16 points. Six of 12 from the field.

A good game for Killian. He's been trending up, Chris. I saw it was a Sadieke Bay night, though, right? It was, but we don't need to talk about Saddick Bay. Why? You don't like him? I like Saddique Bay, but we're talking about Killian Hayes. I like Killian.

He might be available. I kind of like Saddique Bay. You're a Suddick Bay solid. I like him. Jalen Duren is the guy I really like. But honestly, like, if you get Saddick Bay, you probably got to give up 10 first first. rounders. Ever since your

guy, Marvin Bagley's been out. We've seen Duran play more consistent minutes. He is damn good, dude. Like, already. How many first rounders does it take to get Sadiq Bay? Like 100?

He had a 50-point game last year. Yeah. On Super Bowl Sunday, no longer. O.G. hasn't had 50. No, he certainly has. Kevin, it's always a pleasure. Thanks, our executive producer, Jesse Lopez, as always.

I will talk to you next week. Have a good weekend. I don't know.