The Mismatch - Draft Night Winners and Losers. Plus: The Grizzlies Get Their Guy, and Masai Ujiri Out in Toronto.

Episode Date: June 27, 2025

Verno and Jacoby recap the NBA draft by discussing their biggest winners and losers from the two-day event, as well as Verno’s excitement for the Grizzlies, who drafted Cedric Coward from Washington State; the odd timing of Masai Ujiri’s departure from the Raptors; and their favorite prospect from the second round. (0:00) Welcome to The Mismatch!(0:28) NBA Draft Recap(2:25) Pick of Destiny: Cedric Coward to the Grizzlies(6:45) Our Draft Winners & Losers(10:45) Masai Ujiri Out As President of Raptors(14:30) Verno's Draft Winner: WINGSPAN(18:40) Jacoby's Draft Winner: Brooklyn Nets(22:08) Verno's Draft Winner: Atlanta Hawks(24:55) Jacoby's Draft Winner: American White Guys(26:20) Verno's Draft Winner: Spike Lee(30:20) Jacoby's Draft Winner: Moms(31:15) Verno's Draft Loser: Ace Bailey(37:05) Jacoby's Draft Loser: Joe Dumars(39:33) Verno's Draft Loser: Milwaukee Bucks(42:35) Jacoby's Draft Loser: Portland Trail Blazers(47:33) Verno's Draft Loser: Girlfriends(51:17) Jacoby's Draft Loser: ME(56:17) Jacoby's Draft Loser: Clarity(59:27) Favorite 2nd Rounder: Alijah Martin (Raptors)(1:01:20) Favorite 2nd Rounder: Johni Broome (76ers) Leave us a message on our Mismatch voicemail line! [phone] Visit creditkarma.com or download the app today. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Hosts: Chris Vernon and David JacobyProducers: Jessie Lopez and Tucker TashjianSocial: Keith Fujimoto Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome to the mismatch. I'm Chris Vernon and joining me as he does every week from the ringer.com is Dave Jacoby. Jacoby. What a draft night for the Grizzlies, for Chris Vernon, for that guy at Target, and for the mismatch podcast. What are the chances? Seriously. I was shocked. So was I. I don't know. So this morning, after we record this, I am going to. to meet Cedric Coward and get him on my local show for the first time. And it all seems like absolute destiny.

Thank you to all of the mismatch fans that reached out via social media. Anybody that listens to this show notes. I mean, I was thinking about this all draft night. I was like, let's say the guy in Target told me that Colin Murray Boyles is going to be the best player in this draft. or just whoever. It could have been anybody. It could have been literally anybody. Instead, it feels like divine intervention took place.

The reason it really feels like divine intervention, Memphis is not a huge city, right? I went to Target and a guy recognized me and started talking basketball with me, right? Like, that happens a lot. And you're in the basketball card section too, nerd. And I'm in the basketball card section. either this guy does not have social media

doesn't like maybe he watches like Grizzly game so like sees a commercial for the show or something it's so bizarre of course people immediately were like you have got to get Target guy on I have no idea where this guy is not one person has ever said like hey man I was the guy at Target

so I don't know where this human is like Moonlight Graham in Field of Dreams he doesn't exist He was an angel brought down to basketball heaven. People talk about the basketball gods. He's one of the basketball gods. It's like Greek mythology where the gods would come down from Manalippus and like meddle with the humans. That is what this man is doing with you and the Grizzlies,

and I love it so much. So, all right, for anybody that is, this is their first episode listening to the misbeck. They have no idea what we're talking about. Quick little rundown. Two months ago, I'm in Target buying basketball cards. A guy comes up to me and says, hey, everybody's trying to get these Cooper flag cards.

The best player in this draft is going to be Cedric Coward. I didn't know what he was talking about. Then about a week ago, after the Desmond Bain trade. So I was in the mode of, I'm going to take a cursory look at the draft, but I don't have to focus in, certainly on the local team, because they had traded the first round pick for Marcus Smart. Memphis did not have a first round pick. Then by virtue of the Desmond Bain trade, ended up with the 16th pick.

Now it's crash course time. Rosa comes up with the list. Here are the wings that have been drafted in the first round that have seven, two wings fans. And the list was crazy impressive. And then he says, and there's this guy, Cedric Coward. And I said, oh, my God. I was told that this guy was the best guy in the entire draft. Then it became, then what happened as follows is all these mock drafts start having Cedric

Coward going to Memphis. So now we're all in. And of course, on the mismatch with you, after I told you that story a few weeks ago, we became all in. It's like, what are the chances? Like, what, honestly, this is just so bizarre that all of this lines up. And then you get to draft night and Memphis has the 16th pick in the draft. They trade up to 11 to Portland in order to draft Cedric Howard. They were not going to let Cedric Howard slip.

Memphis was like, we need coward. We'll pay the price because we've targeted the target and hit the target. It's meant to be. It was meant to be. He's guaranteed to be a 10-year grizzly and his number will hang in the rafters. And his nickname is the target. You better tell him this afternoon that he is now the target. It's unbelievable.

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I mean, seriously. What are the, honestly, I kept thinking to myself, what are the chances that this plays out the way it does? And I cannot tell you how many people tweeted me or sent me messages on Instagram and were like, I am watching the draft. And all I could think about was this storyline. This is the craziest storyline ever. And then for it to have that ending, like again, he could have gone to any team. Instead, he's going to be sitting in my studio in Memphis, Tennessee today. When your team picks four.

you kind of get your guy. Sure. When you're at 16, like the chances of you getting like the guy that you think your team should get or whatever are so low,

either gets drafted before it gets to you or your team just doesn't pick them. But for this to play out like this is, not only do they get Cedric Coward, they moved up just to get Cedric Howard. And not only that, Malika calls her Colin Coward on the broadcast. And I love Malika.

She's a great hang on and off camera. She's a great host. I mess up on live TV. constantly. And I, when I Googled him after our show, when you brought him up,

I wrote Cedric Howard, like Howard Johnson. And then when the results came up as Cedric Coward, I was like, oh, his name is Coward, like Colin Coward.

And that's what Malika did in her head. She was like, oh, Colin Coward, which makes even funnier, because not only is he going, is the target guy right? Is your target,

the target? Nailed the target. It gets funnier because Colin Coward is involved. I love everything about it. It was a highlight of draft night for me personally. Absolutely unbelievable.

So as we know, in many cases, can be goofy to analyze all the winner. The best thing about going back to drafts is seeing all the grades of the winners and the losers. And we can very well look at whether it is the NBA finals or, frankly, any other, you can look at the all NBA teams. You can look at the all-star teams, whatever. And you go, whoa now, where were these guys? drafted the all defensive teams on it on right this is i don't want to say a total crap shoot but certainly what happens on draft night is nowhere near indicative of how it plays out it is not as if the NBA all uh all star teams all NBA teams all defensive teams are littered with lottery

picks in fact the opposite is true and many of the best players in our league have been drafted 15 or below. I mean, you're watching the NBA finals. Alex Crusoe undrafted. Halley goes down, who's in charge? Andrew Nemhart. Was he 55th pick? Like, you know, who knows? Louort.

Yeah, all of this stuff. Yeah, the finals are littered with guys that aren't lottery picks. Isaiah Hartinstein was the second round pick. Shea Gildjus Alexander is on another team than the one that drafted him. I mean, I was thinking about this the other day. You have three of the guys that were

massive guys in the NBA playoffs that started out, and my buddy David Thorpe was the one that brought this up to me. He goes, sometimes it, you know, as a rookie, you are called to come in and you're fitting it, right? You're not the star immediately. Ace Bailey's wishes notwithstanding. You're not the star immediately. And so you have to kind of fit in. And then you may grow into, right, you may, and it may take going to another team to reach your full form.

And he talked about James Harden, but then just recently, you think about Tyrese Halliburton, Jalen Brunson, Shea Gildjus Alexander. All three of those guys are on their second teams, right? Moved off of the team that they were fitting into and then went to a team that they were the guy. and now look at what has taken place, right, with those three guys. And so sometimes it might not even be the team that you ended up with on draft night, where you reach what you are actually going to become. And frankly, we know that even three years into the league, it's ridiculous. We make decisions on guys after their first three years and what their destiny or ceiling is going to be.

And those three are even a greater example of, if I would have told you that Jalen Brunson and Shea Gillers Alexander are going to have chance at MVP of the league in their first three years in the league, you would have thought that is ridiculous, ridiculous that those guys could have been, you know, possible MVP's of the NBA. But here we are. So that all being said, we tried to instead of just say, this was a great pick. This was a great pick. We tried to pick winners and losers from the draft coverage that we just watched over the course of the last two days. By the way, second round last night, why did it take like 20 minutes for it to start? Like, at 7 o'clock, I tuned it in. I'm like, I got to listen to them for 20 minutes before we're going to.

I got nothing to start it. The second round is, I understand the first round with the sort of pageantry. We don't need that for the second round. The first round was in top. entirely too long. Entirely too long. Me and my wife wanted to watch Love Island. I was like,

oh yeah, I'll be in there. I was like, yeah, hold on. I get into her bedroom. She's asleep. So we're going to,

all right, we're going to give our winners and losers from draft night. Now that we've had a couple of days and all the dust is settled with the tapes and the grades. Let's just acknowledge Messiah jury being out at the Raptors first. I mean, it's brand new information.

I have no idea. It just just happened right before we taped. how do I explain it's it's Larry Byrd you know he coached the Pacers for like four years and he famously said like sometimes like you just like

lose your voice as a coach which is sort of like over the course of four years it's hard to sort of like maintain your voice in the locker rooms and sort of like it runs its course and it just sort of feels like the relationship between your jury and the Raptors and their plan

post championship they've sort of kind of flatlined and I imagine it's just kind of time for them both to move on. It's mutually decided to move on. No, I want to hear that there was like a massive yelling match about the second round of the draft. Well, you know, all these executives, they're all together.

Your whole basketball ops is in a room on draft night. Oh, I like this. For two nights in a row, they were all together. And then, like, what happened in that row? I hope he beat somebody's ass or something. I like this real housewives of Toronto Rafters. I like this, just throwing drinks, screaming at people. I like this.

Oh, Bruno, that's a much better story than my. Well, all the basketball ops guys are together in one room in the, quote, war room for two straight nights. Did something happen in the war room that led to this? Was this always? Because this did come completely out of nowhere. Right after the draft. If you're going to move on from your front office, you do so before the draft. Right.

Because why would you bring in a new president of basketball operations sort of like, you know, the Parcell's thing? Like, if I don't do the grocery shopping, how do you want me to cook the food? I like your theory. Let's just go with that. Yeah. We're reporting that there was a fifth. We're not reporting. It's just odd timing for sure.

Especially when no, the reason it is particularly odd timing is because so it makes you, when something like this is so crazy, it makes you wonder if something happened. Like this reminds me a little bit like the Udoca thing. And I'm not saying because I, you Jerry did anything. But it's like, wait, what? Like, why? This doesn't make any sense. And how come nobody in the media saw this coming?

This was not been even talked about as far as I know. Not just speculated on it. It reminds me of a, I believe I'm right here when Nate McMillan signed an extension with the Pacers and they got fired like three weeks later. Yeah. It's like something happened. You know what I mean? Like how do you go from signing the extension to getting fired three weeks later?

Like in those three weeks, something happened. I don't know what, but something happened. That's what reminds me of. Yeah. So we will find out. I'm sure the stories will all come out. Maybe it is nothing. Maybe it's just, hey, we are reporting officially.

There's a brawl in the war room. There's a royal rumble in the war room. Police were called. Ambulance for outside. All right. So now that there's been a couple of days, all the dust is settled and takes in the grades. Everybody's written all of their articles.

We're going to do our winners and our losers. We got three each. My first winner. So you always wonder how the eventual champion is going to impact the draft. We just saw a few nights ago the Oklahoma City Thunder were the team that won the NBA championship. And then, of course, you saw the Indiana Pacers on the other side. We're there for a game seven. And I have told you that building with a team in mind might be a fool's errand.

That being said, certainly. best practices of those teams are taken into consideration. And I do think for my first winner, wingspan. Oh, oh. Yes. Wait, what's such a, what's that your coward's wingspan? I forgot. Seven, two and a half. Oh, that's right. Okay. But I will say this. If you go look up and down, one of the things, and a lot of people have written about this in the past, that the, I don't want to say it's money ball, but that the Oklahoma City Thunder, on many different occasions, have guys that are in a very high percentile of wingspan. In fact, the best three players for their positions. Sheigild is Alexander, J. La Williams, and Chet Holmgren all apply. In fact, to wit, Oklahoma City

Thunder, guess who they drafted? Thomas Sorbort, who is 6-9 with a 7-6 wingspan, and then Brooks Barnheiser, who is 6-6 with a 6-11 wingspan. By the way, white guy, Brooks Barnheiser, when you look him up, the first video that comes up on YouTube is, in all caps, gritty as it gets, Brooks Barnheiser mixtape. So here's the deal. I think that this year, for so many years, we have been focused all on what a guy can do on offense. This year, unlike many years in the past, and I do believe this is a direct effect of the Oklahoma City Thunder, people focused less on what a guy can do offensively than almost

any time I can remember in the draft. You can go up and down the list and you will find guys, and they'll say, yeah, but he's not that great of a shooter or he can't do this or can't do that. But what we learn from Oklahoma City, I think one of the lessons, and this might be, again, This might be silly to do this because in years past, people looked at the warriors and they said, oh, we need the, you know, the Draymond Green type and, oh, we need guys that can shoot. And it's like, you can't replicate Steph Curry, Draymond Green, and Clay Thompson. You're trying to, but you're just doing it with worse players, right? Like that's special.

So it might be silly to not care as much about. So the shooting thing, everybody has to be able to shoot. That was a big thing. and we went through that wave, right? I think the wave right now is link and defense, because what the thunder told us was that 25% of your points can possibly come easily, where offense is not. Your offense becomes easy if your defense is amazing.

And so I think teams, I think what they did was help guys with. With wingspan and defensive acumen get higher on board this year than ever before. That's what I would say. And so the winner becomes guys that have, because you can also go down. And if you just click on wingspan, you'll find a bunch of names in there. And even some guys that went higher in the first round, guys that went higher in the second round, on down the line. And then go down and you'll find shorter wingspans.

and you'll find some guys that you thought we're going to go higher and we're higher in those mock drafts. And so it's not the end-all be-all. Some guys with long wingspans fell. Some guys with short wingspans rose. But I do think that it mattered more this year. Your ability to defend and your ability to have length mattered more this year than in years past because of who the champion was.

So the winner is wingspan and defense. I like that. I mean, there is a direct correlation between sort of, as you said, the Thunderwin the championship, because I remember when the Warriors read their peak, it was, oh, I know he only shot 33% from three, but he shot 85% from the free throw line. Oh, if you were a good free throw shooter, you're rising up the boards. So I like that because we've all listened to and read all the stuff about the first round analysis. So I want to provide something different, as you did right there.

My winner, just for like the out-of-the-box zag thinking, Brooklyn Nets. They have five first round picks. And when you see that, you're just like, you're just like, they're obviously going to package some of these together and trade up.

Like there's no chance they draft five first rounders. And that's exactly what they did. And not only they draft five first rounders, like I like to gamble sometimes. And last time I was in Detroit, I was gambling. I was getting killed on the blackjack table.

I was like, let me try roulette. And when I go to roulette, I'm pretty dumb and simple. I bet like red or black, basically. and this guy comes over and just starts peppering the numbers, just peppering the numbers,

and ends up winning like $3,000. And I feel like that's what the Nets did. They're like, we're going to draft five high upside, completely flawed prospects. Like not one of them is like a con con connoissell. It's like that guy's going to play for seven years in the league. He's going to be great at least seven years.

Like they, everybody they drafted can't shoot. Everybody they drafted cannot shoot. Literally every single one. And I'll go through quickly. they got Yeager Demand who's like great passer, the BYU guy, Russian, you know, there's a great, just a huge Russian community in Brooklyn, good for

them. And then they got... Can I, can I say, I mean, I liked him way more when I thought it was Igor. I thought it was Igor for a long time too. Igor's way better than Yeager. I've already got a nickname for him. Call me Yeagerge's. Just let that stick. Nolan Traori,

again, rose up the French league ranks. I don't know what that means. Can't shoot. Drake Powell, I kind of like this guy. Apparently, like, he was like a big combine measurements here or whatever. Hey, guess what? What? Drake Powell?

Big wingspan. Big wingspan? Yes. Wingspan pick. Ben Serf. And then my favorite pick is here's my question for you is one of my favorite things about this draft was just all the tears and like the impact and the families and blah, blah, blah. We've all seen it before. The Danny Wolf, they cut to him crying.

No, no, no, his brother was the star. I mean, that was like, but here's a question. I guess Steel Magnolia is a dated reference. What is a, like a Marley and me? Like the guy, that guy just walked out of Marley and me. That's what I looked like. I love that.

You're like Steel MacNollies is too old of a reference. I know with Marley and me. When did that come on in 1993? I all, look, all I remember is walking out of Marling at me. And I walked, I remember, walking out of the theater and walking in the bathroom and there were like 20 grown men, all of which are hyperventilating. Oh, it's the worst thing we ever saw in our life.

I hated that. I mean, I hated it. Just a secret packed and unspoken bond like to say nothing about this. Yes. But Danny Wolf, here's my question for you. And we can move on because this is not that interesting. Was he crying because he hadn't been picked yet, which is how the broadcast was treating it? Or was he crying because someone got in his ear and was like, you're about to get picked?

because I'm about to get picked. That's what I thought, too. Yes. But the broadcast was treating it like, like it was like an Aaron Rogers situation. And I'm sitting there being like, no, no,

like he's crying because he's about to walk across the stage. But anyway, I thought in Brooklyn, Brooklyn, to me is a winner because it's just like an insane tax. Just to be like, I'm a pick, I'm going to take five home run swings.

And if I go one for five, that's a great draft for us. That's one of my winner. Your next one. Okay. My next winner, the Atlanta Hawks. So a few weeks,

ago we were doing the mismatch. And you asked me about Trey Young and the thoughts there. And we had talked about how they had blown out their front office. They brought one guy from the 76ers. They brought one guy from the Pelicans. They've got the new guy that's stepping

up. And so what are you going to do? And I said, look, I think you've kind of got the bones of something here. I wouldn't bail on this. Like, you're not getting a player better than Trey Young back. So, like, I don't know why people are talking about moving off of Tray Young. In fact, I would try to build out around because I've got him. I've got Dyson Daniels,

who is one of the best defenders in the entire NBA. I've got Risa Shea who came along. And the world would have been different for Atlanta last year if Jalen Johnson wouldn't have gotten hurt. And so I'm like, I got four. I got four. And so now I got to kind of build out around this. So they swing the deal and they get poor Zingas. So now they got another guy that could be on the front lines with them alongside Johnson. And then they make this trade with New Orleans where they moved down 10 spots in the draft, but they still got a lot of people predicted as being a potential lottery pick in A. Anul who you know they had incredible familiarity with because he played at the University of Georgia.

Yeah. Right. So they only move seven spots down, not even 10. Oh, seven spots. So they end up with A. Newell, they end up with Christavs Porzengis, like, you look at the Hawks now, and you're going

in a Eastern Conference that is going to be without Jason Tatum, without Tyrese Halliburton, without Damien Lillard. Watch out now. Like, within a week span, Atlanta looks like a team that could take the biggest jump

in the Eastern Conference next year. So I would say they are a huge winner. They're a big winner, and I was strong on Instagram, and they did one of those graphics, like Hawks projected starting five and had the rotation guys underneath it. I was like, huh.

Yeah. I was like, huh, this makes a lot of sense. Like if Chris Staps gets over, you know, the Porzingus flu, like this starting five makes a lot of sense. You've got Trey Young, what's his weakness? Defense.

Who's in the back court with him? One of the best perimeter defenses in league, least top five. And then, and also got rim protection in Chris Daps. spread the floor. I'd love to see Chris Taps as a better sort of lob catcher because Trey is so good at throwing that. Right.

But I agree. And obviously, it's been well covered that that picked they're going to get next year is going to be nice. My next winner. And this to me is, you know, I never shy away from talking about race. American white guys. Huge win. I'm watching the first round and they all line up.

When they all line up. And I was just like, well, There's a lot of white guys. You thought that's a lot of Hornets. But it's like, dude, they took, they took Concanipple, Liam McNeely from Fugan, and Ryan Colchbrer from Great. I was like, hold on. Is there an edict in Charlotte?

Yeah. I love concanipal for the Hornets. And I also just love the idea that like lamello ball and con canipal are going to go out to dinner. It just like just to be a fly on the wall. for sure, not going to dinner. But the, it's like, they're not only where there's so many, like there's four American white guys drafted in the first round, Cooper flag, Concanipple, Danny Wolf and Lee McNally.

But like, these are like white, white guys. You know, and this isn't like Tyler Hero or like Grady Dick and some crazy suit. They're all just wearing, like, interview suits, like a blue suit with a black tie. Like, they're going to like their first job interview. It was just like, they're just like down the middle white guys and they have game. And I was just, you know, big winners. Big winners. It's been rare.

It didn't happen that much. Usually won, two, before in the first round, I loved it. Shouts of the American Wake guys. All right. My next winner, Spike Lee. All right. So you may be like, what? How did that make any sense?

So Spike Lee has long been, a long-suffering Knicks fan, who got this moment in the sun with this team winning this year. And it was obviously a huge part of the Knicks celebrity role. and has been for many, many years. What happened this year was Celebrity Row started getting huge. Even when I came to visit you for the Memphis and New York game, they at a timeout did a celebrity row. And this was on a lazy Monday night.

And there were 15 people they had to name off. I mean, that night it was like Judd Apatow and Adam Sandler and Michael J. Fox. And it was like all kinds of people that I was like, what? On a Monday night, they're at the Knicks and the Grizzlies. So anyways, and then when we got to the playoffs, oh, it was Salome. Salome here. Salome's there with Jenner. Salome's traveling.

Ben Stiller, right? It's obviously getting a lot of love. And Ben Stiller's been a long-suffering fan, so I want to leave him out of this. But Salome was like a big, like, oh, he's all in on the New York Knicks. And then you started to see even more celebrities and more celebrities. Bad Bunny is showing up. Jason Sudecas. Bad bunny showing up.

Jason Sadecas, a bunch of them. And so this is the reason I'm giving Spike Lee a winner. There I am. Tuned in to the second round of the NBA draft last night. And sitting in the crowd, not like away from the people amongst the people in Barclay Center for the second round of the NBA draft is Spokanex. Spike Lee in his Knicks gear.

Crazy. This is a man that established his bona fides already. We knew when you think about the Knicks Celebrity Row, you think about Spikeley. He's the first name that you think of. But I feel like that took a hit. I feel like everybody started talking about Chalabay or Stiller or anybody else, right? Spike Lee's been the guy. He's been there since a Reggie Miller choke.

He's been there for both two different Pacers. 20 years distance, both doing joke sides, right? And so it's like, you know what? Everybody keeps talking. And all these Knicks fans came out of the woodwork as soon as they got good, right? Soon as they got good. Now, it's easy to be a Knicks fan right now. Well, maybe not with the coaching thing.

But that notwithstanding. James Borago. They're good, right? They're good. And then this dude shows up at the second round of the NBA draft is like, Oh, you're a Knicks fan? Oh, let me say this. Watch this.

It's not like they had 31 or 32. They had like 50. 50. Muhammad Diwara, I have no idea who this person. I am a hardcore NBA fan. I would never sit in the Parkley Center for the second round of the NBA track. If they had 31, 35, and 50, it could be happening in my living room and I would be in the kitchen. Spike Lee, you get your bona fides.

That's when you, hey, okay, you win. You're the biggest NBA fan. You're the biggest Knicks fan in the world. It's not even close. You have buried all possible opponents. You showing up in Nick's gear to the second round of the NBA draft is totally preposterous. I love, Verno, I just want to celebrate you. When you put on the tech, Spike Lee,

I had to break back like, what are you talking about? I think this is great. That was a great one. I'm jealous. You know, when people do things that, like, they're so good, I get jealous. I'm jealous of that one. It was great take. My man.

My final winner is just moms. I love my mom. Moms are the best. Just like, they're just, the biggest winner is just like, these moms are the best. They have, like, the story. Like, who was it? Edgecombe was like, we had to, we had to, you know, we had generators outside the house. Mom's crying everywhere.

Just like, just, just great night. for moms. Moms are winning. Why are you looking at me like that? I'm not even going to mention, you want me to say Dylan Harper's mom. That's what you want me to say. I'm trying to go to the emotional tax here.

That's not even what I was thinking about. That's what you were thinking about. I saw you give me that look. I saw you give me that look. Big night for moms. I just loved it. The hugs, the tears, the stories, big, like the outfits,

the dresses, the hair. She's a huge night for moms. I loved it. Shouts all the moms. All right, dude. And Dylan Harper's mom. What's so funny? Losers!

Ace Bailey! Woof! So all we talked about leading up to this was what's going to happen with Ace Bailey? Like, he's been projected to be number three forever. As Philadelphia is just going to take him and forget about it. But then all the odds told us they were going to take BJ Edgecombe. And then all the odds told us that Concanipple was going to go number four. And so then it was like, okay, well, I guess five.

But most people had them taking like Jeremiah Fiers or Trayorke. Johnson to the jazz. And then all of a sudden it pops up. Number five, the Utah Jazz select Ace Bailey. And everybody's like, oh, is he going to hate that? And so then people talk. And then, of course, you know, you've got the intensely awkward moment of now Ace Bailey is being drafted by the Utah Jazz, a team that, according to all the reports, was told

don't draft him. Now, the reason I am calling him a loser is because you've got to be rich Paul. You've got to be Mark Bartolstein. You've got to be one of these guys with mega juice in the league to call Danny Aange and say, don't do this. You can't be Omar Cooper saying, don't draft ace. Bailey because a guy like Danny Aange is of course

very reasonably going to be like or what? Or what, bro? Or what? Because if Chris Paul, I'm sorry Chris Paul. If Rich Paul calls you and says, don't draft Ace Bailey,

you'll never get a clutch guy again. You're like, oh shit. I can't draft this guy. You don't mean? This is going to hurt my, this is going to hurt my organization for 20 years. Right? Like, instead, this threat that falls obviously completely flat.

And now Walter Clayton Jr., who by all accounts, had like a promise from Miami and was going to go 20th. He's probably not all that thrilled. I mean, there's a video. I don't know if you've seen it, but it was going around and like, I'm paraphrasing, but it was basically like, hey, who's the best? player of all time. The guy's like, LeBron James, who's, who, if you could go to dinner, who would you go out to dinner with? And he's like, uh, Eric's Polstra, Pat Riley and, you know, bam out of bio. His, his, and, and the story goes, he worked out for the heat

and then canceled, like, everything after it. So, like, Walter Clayne Jr. But Walter Clayne, Jr. got on a plane yesterday and flew to Utah. Ace Bailey. He did the same, right? He did the same, right? He did not. He's not even there. So, like, what are you going to do? Hold out, like, it reminds me of, two players that I have had at Memphis in the past, Tony Allen and Marcus Smart, both will tell you the same story that when they played for Boston, they would like go into practice and they'd be in practice and Danny Aange would like show up to practice. He'd like walk by and he'd be like, hey, what's up guys? And they'd be like, hey, Danny, how's it going? He'd be like, just trying to find somebody better than you. And like that was like their existence. That was their existence.

everybody to play with the Celtics Danny H would constantly be saying to them I just if I can find a player better than you're gone tomorrow right like former players can get away with that only former players can get away with that you have to be a former player to do that but I'm not I'm saying not only did he actually treat them like assets

he treated them like assets to their face right so if you think he gives a crap about Omar Cooper and Ace Bailey threatening him you got the wrong ray as they say And so I can't help but make him an astonishing loser because he said, according to report, he wanted to play for the pelicans, the Nets, or the wizard. And the top five teams were told, don't draft me.

And then the team drafted him. And then he doesn't even show up with the guy that got drafted later, Walter Clayton. And so now it's a wait and see. Is Ace Bailey actually going to show up in Utah? Like, what are we doing here? He'll be there. Well, a couple things I want to add to the Ace Bailey thing is. One is he wanted to go to the Wizards, the Nets or the Pelicans because he felt like he had the best opportunity to sort of be like a primary ball handler there.

I feel like there's an opportunity in Utah to do that too. Of course there is. Like it's like whatever you saw as an opportunity for the Wizards or the Nets, you had that same opportunity with the Jazz. and in the broadcast, they were trying to use his personality. Do you remember they did an interview with him and Dylan Harper talking about their suits or whatever? Like Ace Bailey, like such a big personality. Like, you know, the man's a star in the making. And then like his interview when he gets off the stage, he's like, uh, yeah, great, great night.

It's just like, he was so deflated. All that personality was just out of his body. Is this going to be the first, is this guy, is this going to be the first guy to fire his representation that is not actually? representation. He's going to show up. He's going to play for Utah. And this is all whatever. He'll be probably in Utah right now as we record this. But why would he not have flown there already? They're saying maybe Monday or the weekend. It's bizarre. We're making too much of this. He's going to play. He's going to Utah. No, it's a protest. He's going to Utah, dude. Like, he's protesting. Something tells me that he'll be playing

for the Utah jazz this year. Okay. My biggest loser is Joe, not my biggest. One of my loses is Joe Dumas. Because, man, the last 24 hours, like, he's just getting dragged for this trade. And I understand it, but I just want to put this out there that there's a world. He,

here, I see what he is trying to do with this. Oh, no, don't defend this. No, I'm not trying to, no, I'm not trying to defend this. I'm saying like, if this is, I believe Derek Queen is an absolute star, and I'm going to trade Zion Williamson, then I see the vision. If it's like, I'm going to trade Zion Williamson and I'm going to get my first round pick next year,

five first round picks, I'm going to get a couple of salary matching players, and I believe Derek Queen is going to be the future Pelican that's going to take us to the promised land. Because Zion and Derek Queen don't make sense on the same team. So I think that there might be more clarity to this decision

than he's been than it looks like on the surface. But if he does not trade, Zion, You think, okay, you think drafting queen means that we should keep an eye out for a Zion trade. Yes. And a reboot there. Otherwise, this makes as little sense as everybody thinks it does. Honestly.

I can't make sense of it otherwise. Because if he's going to, in a Zion package, you'll get a pick back. All right. Okay. If you say in a Zion package, he would get a pick back from somebody. therefore, losing next year's pick is not. But the fact that next year's pick has no protections on it. I mean, I'm not defending the trade.

It was a dumbass trade to me. No, no, no. If you are, well, you are the one that said that Joe Dumas is getting, like you almost made it sound like it was unfairly ripped. I mean, this is insane. He, if they trade Zion and suck, now what? we're thinking the number one pick of the draft next year. I'm calling him a loser because he deserves it.

And it's one of those things where it's awful. It's like the Pelicans did what? Who's in charge of the Pelicans now? And then you're like, oh, Joe Dumars. It's a terrible job, terrible job. I don't understand it. It doesn't make sense. I'm not defending the trade at all.

Speaking of possible trade candidates this off season, the next one for me, the loser, the bucks. Okay. that bro? Because at what point, you know what it reminds me of? It reminds me of like, if you're trying to piss a guy off, like it felt like for so many years

that the Packers, sometimes it would feel like they are intentionally trying to piss off Aaron Rogers, right? You know what I mean? Like not taking any receiver. And they pick a receiver in the first, on the second he's gone. And then they take Jordan Love. You know what I mean? And then like, but

if, here's what I'll say, If I were trying to piss off Janus, I would conduct myself in the draft like the Bucks do for his entire tenure. I went back and looked because Rosa sent it to me and he goes, you're not going to believe this. Look back at this. So let's say 2013 is the beginning, right? So in 2014, they drafted Jabari Parker and that obviously turned out heinously horrible. Okay. Since that time.

since that time. I just want to say about Parker, at the time that pick seemed like a good pick. Like when I was sitting there watching my television I was like, oh, that's going to work.

Yeah. For sure. Okay. If you want to give them a break on that one, you can. Since that time, 2016, in the second round,

they took Malcolm Brogden. Their first round pick, which was 10th overall, was Thon Maker. That was a disaster. Again, I love Thon Maker going into that draft. And in 2018,

they took Dante DiVincenzo. Okay, that, is the entire list of guys the bucks have drafted that have been worth a crap since they drafted Yonnas. That is unbelievable. And they always take these like high upside guys that never pan out. So here we fast forward and we get to the draft the other night and I'm like, there is no way they took a son of a bitch with braces. There's no way.

The orthotist. It's like Bogo? His name's Bogo? I'm like, this is crazy. Just get somebody that can play at some point. Bogo with braces. Now, look, you're going to be able to, if this guy turns out to be the next Yonis, this is going to be the funniest clip ever for somebody to go back to.

But they took Bogo with braces. Remember last year, they took A.J. Johnson, who by the way, they've already, he traded. But AJ Johnson, everybody was like, yeah, you get to wait four or five years to find out of a piece. Yeah, they're like the Nets. The Nets take these big swings because they're the Brooklyn Nets and they're rebuilding and they want to hit on one of these

big swings. But if you're the Bucks, you're like a championship contender, then you draft singles. Just hit a single. Have somebody who can play 10 minutes a game. That's all you need to do. Bocao with braces. Unbelievable. Truly. You never cease to amaze me

with your drafts, Bucks. Bogo. It's a tough one. Tough up for the Milwaukee Bucks fans. This is my loser. And again, like I like zags. I like big swings. I like, I like, you know,

ballsy moves on draft night. But the Blazers, what are you doing? What are you doing? The Chinese Yokic, Hansen Yang, Yang, Hansen? Like, I was like, okay, because I do,

I, you know, I brush up before the draft. This guy was not on my radar. So I click on YouTube. I'm like, all right, let me see some highlight. this guy moves like he's underwater. Like you know when you try to sprint in a pool? You're like playing pool basketball.

They're trying to like sprint to get the ball, but you're going at like, you know, like one tenth speed. I mean, sure, in the highlights he makes the baskets, but he can't move.

He's so slow. He's playing against too. Yeah, it's like it's like, I remember watching Robert Parrish when I was a kid. And, um, he would take the ball out and give to the,

to Dennis Johnson or whatever. And then they would show the, like the other half of the court, the offensive half of the court, and Parrish would come into the frame like when there's like 10 seconds left in the shock clock, because it took him that long

to run halfway down the court. Young Hanson, Hanson, Yang, the Hanson brother, my God, this man cannot move his feet. Like, this is not going to work. I'm going to go out, you know what? I'm going to go on a limb right now and say, he's not the Chinese yokich.

I'm going to limb, not Yokic, this guy. Two things. Number one, huge wingspan winner. Okay. If we go back to my number one winner, right? Huge wingspan winner, Yon Hanson. I think that's why he got drafted is his wingspan.

Number two, going back, this is a good callback to the very beginning of the show. So one of the things, I will tell you a quick little story. So years ago, we're at the trade deadline, and I report, I get a tip, and I report that the Memphis Grizzlies have traded O.J. Mayo for Josh McRoberts and the Indiana Pacer's first round pick. And they go downstairs and they tell O.J. Mayo and the whole thing. And then they come back and the NBA says, this trade is invalid. The facts did not come in in time. The facts came through at 302 or whatever.

Therefore, the trade doesn't happen. They've already told the guy he's getting traded, whatever. you fast forward and you look back and you go well i wonder what would have happened like again things never play out the way you think they're going to play out and you go what was that indiana first round pick and then you go and track it and you go i'll be damn they traded it to san antonio for george hill who'd they take clark yes and so that pick you can look at it you go damn it Like not for sure they would not have drafted Kauai Leonard, but that's what that ends up being, right? A couple of years ago.

Memphis makes a draft day trade. It's Stephen Adams in the 10th pick, Jonas Valchunis and the 17th pick. Memphis takes Zaire Williams, who has already been traded to Brooklyn. The 17th pick, I believe it's 17th. Trey Murphy. And it's like, oh my God, we're going to regret this forever. So those are all little tiny backstories for we're sitting there going, please God, don't let

16 become one that we look back forever and it's got the little stupid grizzly symbol next to it. I like that. When they drafted Yonge Hansen, we were like, yes, there's no chance. We regret this till the rest of the time. At the MVP presentation ceremony, you never want to see

have a grizzly's hat on. I don't think you're worried about that. But shout to him. He was like in the upper deck of the arena too. Like he was in the stands. Nothing was, by the way, also to the, if we call back to the Ace Bailey thing, you want to know why Young Hanson, Hanson Young got drafted as high as he did? Who does he meet at the staircase? No idea.

Rich Paul! Oh. Oh my God. You didn't see that? No, Rich Paul was all over the place. When he walked down the staircase, he's walking up with Rich. Paul, I'm like, gee, oh my God. How?

Ain't no way. Ain't no way, Rich Paul pulled this off. So he was great at the combine. Like, okay. What's a great measurable? Like, oh, okay. You're not buying Chinese Yokic? I watched the highlights. I didn't even get to the end of the video.

It was like five minutes. I was like, I'm out. I'm out on Chinese Yokic. If these are the best clips that he has on tape, like the best ones, he looks like he's playing in my reclid. My last. Loser. Girlfriends.

What happened to girlfriends? Where are they? How does? What happened to girlfriends? Trying to think. Walter Clayton Jr.'s girlfriend got invited because of his daughter. Where are? South Carolina, South Carolina kid.

Who was that? But he had, but she, she plays. She plays. Yeah, yeah. And that was as Colmarie. That's a basketball girlfriend. Yeah, yeah. I mean, you, you highlighted moms.

Moms got crazy screen time. They're a great thing for moms. Because there were no girlfriends. Where are the girlfriends? These guys, I guess, I guess they're just married to the game. We should feel good about guys that are excited about becoming NBA players because evidently, they play so much basketball. They have no time for chicks. Where are the girlfriend?

Last episode, last episode we established young people don't drink. This episode now they don't date. They just play basketball. That's it. That's what they do. That's it. Well, I think there's some foresight because when you have that college girlfriend, you think you're going to get married and stay together forever.

That's not how it works out. So maybe some of the uncles got in their ear and they're like, I know you love Sarah right now. You think you're going to be with Sarah forever. But you know it's going to be forever? These pictures of you tonight. And maybe Sarah shouldn't be at the table. Well, and also there have been like,

there have been two different ways that it has gone for the girlfriends in the past, right? There's like Will Levis's Gia Duddy who becomes a star from it. Who wasn't the guy that the Wizards drafted? Oh, Yon Vesley. Yon Vesley. Right. Or there's star of the night. And there's some of these that become stars.

And then there's the other ones like, you know, the girl that took the phone from C.D. Lamb, it like ruined her life. Oh, yeah. Like, seriously. It's a great clip. He put up a message last year. Like, basically leave her alone. Jesus.

Like, it still comes up to, it's like her nightmare is that people still replay that till the end of time, her taking his phone and him snatching it away. I mean, it's a hilarious clip. It is. But, like, so I guess it, right, again, but they're like not together and didn't end up together. And so, like you say, maybe it's now, maybe there's a wisdom to. even the current girlfriend not being there because that is that's forever right that draft night thing is forever and so this better be the chick you're going to marry or else exactly ever

you're going to be hugging some hot chick that you just brought to the draft i think the lack of girlfriends is is uh is actually the presence of of good guidance it means it means you've got some some uncles in your life some older brothers someone that pulls you to the side we're just doing family kid you know what man you're i know you're 19 like when i was 19 you're you couldn't tell me I wasn't going to marry Susan Lee. You know what I mean? She broke up with me. Broke my heart. That was extremely specific. Shot shot to Susan Lee.

Now our listeners are going to be trying to look her up on the internet. Oh, I've tried that. There's a lot of Susan Lee's in the world. I can't find her. So if you do find her, send me a profile. He said, I've tried that. I've tried. I love it. I got specific information I can't even find her.

She's probably trying to hide from me. She knows she'll show up in her house. Your last listener. Me. I agree. I agree. The best part is there's no chance this gets to my wife because she does not listen to the mismatch. She's never listened to a single second of the mismatch.

She doesn't even follow me on. She doesn't even watch the clips on social. Mine doesn't either. In fact, when we went to New York and we all went out to eat, that's the first time my wife has ever seen you. We're going to New York. We're going to meet Jacob. She's like, who's Jacoby?

And likewise, the first time your wife ever saw me. Yeah. It was an actual introduction. Today I'm going to go home and be like, oh, yeah, well, you know, Chris Vernon's coming back to town later. Just to see if she knows who Chris Vernon is. I'm going to, I'll text you after I do it. I'm going to do it for real.

I'm like, you know, Chris Vernon might be in town next weekend. I swear to God, she's like, who is Chris Vernon? No, she's not. No, she's not. Because of the care package I sent for the birth of your kid. Oh, don't you'll remember me forever. Those are some high quality, high quality goods. Your wife went out of her way to send me the nicest message, so she'll remember me.

She will. She will. A quick personal story aside, we, first time ever I sent my three bigger kids to sleepaway camp, so they're not in the house anymore. you like that's awesome so i just have it's like literally i have like i have a newborn baby which everyone says is like the hardest thing in the world i'm breeze it we have two adults in one newborn baby easy peasy lemon squeezy there's nothing takes two naps a day yeah please i'll wake up at one and feed you a bottle and go back to bed watch a little love island yeah i watched that karen read trial

stuff yesterday it was amazing all right um you talking about the max one yeah i've just binged it all yesterday. Okay, so here's the deal. I am, so I watch the other one too, the gone girl chick. Sherry Pippini. What is going to? Max is now getting in the business of like, letting the victims tell their story. This is becoming a thing. Like you remember, and this is what's happening on those, the Netflix ones too, the untolds. They let like, they let the, they let the the guy that stole the signs from the sideline tell his story and they let Javaris Crittenden tell his so they get cooperation from the person you're not supposed to believe. I told my wife.

And then they get to tell their story and you're like, hey, you know what? I'm kind of on their side. It's very strange what's happening right now. I told my wife, I was like, it's a Karen Reed story. Like, I have no idea who did it. You're going to fluctuate back and forth about whether she's innocent or guilty. But just before you watch it, because she makes documentaries for a living. She's a documentary director.

I was like, before you watch it, I just want to fluctuate it. want you to know, this is completely one-sided. You are literally getting dressed with Karen Reid in the morning and you're in the war room with her lawyers. This is not an objective, unbiased, journalistic endeavor. It's not that. They've got one interview with a friend of the victim and has the one person that represents the whole entire side of it.

And they've got 45 people on Karen Reid's side. She did it. Anyway, moving on. My last loser. You really think so. I have no idea. I go back and forth. Yeah, I think.

I don't know, dude. I just, I don't know. Okay. Yeah, she did it. And so did, um, Adnan's Said. Um, moving on. Last loser. Damn.

You can't just fire off these crazy scorching hot takes and they'd be like, all right, moving on. Do you don't think Adnan Said did it? I've re-listened to this with my son because like I'd listen to this serial in forever. And I'd re-listen to it. I was like, oh, this dude did it, for sure. But what about the cell phone data? What about the cell phone data? I mean, the towers and everything.

I don't know. You don't know what you're talking about, neither do I. I know. I know that one chick in the house at Karen Reed's thing texted how long does it take to die in the cold. Okay. That's a tough one to get past. So I just watched this. I just watched this yesterday.

Here's what happens is she texted that at 2.27 a.m. right? She also misspelled how long to die in the cold at 6.54 and she did it again at 655. and misspelled because when you open up the tab, it's the data tracks back to when you open the tab. So she did those three queries and it's 6.52, 53, 54. But why? But she also deleted that one too. I don't know who did it, man.

I don't know. Why is she Googling that? Who Googles that? The butt dials thing was tough too. The butt dials. I can't get past Googling. How long does it take to die in the? Because they just found a body in the cold.

Come on. I don't know who did it. Okay. My last, my last loser was just clarity. I was so confused when these trades happened. And I'm a, I'm a television producer. Like, I have the easiest thing to do is be like, oh, a trade came in. What are the details?

You're in the truck. You go back to the graphics producer. You say, make a full screen with these details. It takes 35, 40 seconds. right but we got shams who's like reading and he's trying to get the details right but just came into his phone so he's kind of confused about it too and I'm sitting there being like who's drafting for who for what and then like why not if you're the NBA why not if if team a let's like what happened with the target if the trailblazers are picking for the grizzlies put a grizzlies

put a grizzlies hat out there put the put the grizzlies logo up on the stage and then just have a little note that says uh you know Portland pick moving to the Grizzlies. Instead, it's the opposite. It's the Portland hat, the Portland logo, with a tiny little bug that says, this guy's actually going to be on the Grizzlies. It just doesn't make sense.

If we all know he's going to the Grizzlies, we can't even celebrate the Colin Coward pick for the Grizzlies when the target gets targeted by the team we want to target the target. Why not? I just want to get somebody in room and be like, explain to me the benefit of fooling your audience about what players going where. What's the benefit?

The other thing is, if you are watching that draft without audio, it is absolutely impossible. Oh, no way. Again, that's why you need a full screen. No, I'll give you an example. One of my friends was at a bar last night and was just paying attention while the Grizzlies had a late second round pit, right? And it pops up that they drafted Will Richard from the National Championship Florida team. And they are, it's Jenna. Jenna is a Florida graduate.

So Jenna She works with me on the show She's a Florida grad Worked at Florida Loves the Gators Goes crazy Oh But that I had to tell

I had to break her heart And say that pick was been traded That wasn't the Grizzly's pick So Will Richards not going to come to Memphis And she was like Oh my I know It's brutal

But that is the To your point That is the viewing experience But why not She's funny to me why they do it that way. Because it said on the screen, Will Richard drafted by men. And there's a grizzly's logo there.

He's wearing a grizzly's hat. Why do we do it this way? Like, I just don't, I don't understand the benefits. Like, as someone who, like, it's awful. Worked in TV for a quarter century. I know how easy it is to make the change. And so it's like, oh, the information came in too late.

All right, we'll have Malika Phil for 20 seconds while we get the, while we switch the logos on the stage and switch the hats and then make a full screen. Why don't we just do that? I knew ESPN shouldn't have gotten rid of you. No, they probably should have this. They need to win that room. It's kind of like Messiah jury. Like I started a fistfight.

It was bad. It was bad. It was bad. Last thing before we get out of here, a second round pick that we really loved. So the guy that I loved that I was hoping was going to end up in Memphis and then it would have been complete destiny because I would have gotten both guys that I would.

wanted, including Cedric Howard. I wanted, so this guy, Elijah Martin, and this is hysterical. Guess who he was Elijah Martin played for and again, a shorter guy with a big standing

reach, wingspin. He is a dog, a winner, dunks on everybody. He started on the Florida Atlantic team that made it to the final four and then transferred to Florida and started on the Florida team that won the national championship.

I like dogs and I like winners, so I wanted this guy. Elijah Martin, and guess who drafted him last night in the second round? Messiah, Jir. That's what happened. That started the fight.

That's what started the fight. And then his tenure in Toronto ended. But anyway, no, I love guys. Yeah, how about this? Crazy stat. Also, by the way, an amazing high school quarterback in Mississippi. Oh, I love that. So he's a football kid. And he's the only player to ever start on two different final four teams.

That's crazy. Oh, huh. Crazy. Yeah. True story, though. Elijah Martin, I think Toronto got a big one there. I'm not a huge college basketball guy. I'm not a huge like prepare for the draft guy.

I'm an NBA guy. Like I spend most of my mental energy sort of like focusing on NBA basketball. But I do tune in to big college games. It's Saturday afternoon. I'm sitting in the couch. Like I love basketball. I'll tune in. And every time I see Auburn,

Broome is just getting bucket after bucket after bucket. Oh, yeah. I know he's like 35 years old. He's got a receiving airline. But it's like, he looks like the best player on the floor every time I turn on the game. And I'm just like, are we overthinking this? Yeah, it's just, and it's like, I think it was the SEC player of the year, right?

Like, so you know what this reminds me of? This reminds me, because Daryl took him. It reminds me. It reminds me of Daryl taking like Carl Landry, Chuck Hayes. Like these are all those kind of guys. And so it's like, hey, guess what? This guy's going to be able to play a role and be good. I'm sitting on the couch watching this guy, score three straight possessions.

So I'm like looking up his draft like rankings or whatever. And it's like I thought he'd be like a lottery pick. You know, it's like, nope, nope, he's trash. Don't even need him. Not a second round pick. I'm like, I don't know, man. I'm watching him play basketball. He seems like a good basketball player.

I don't know. Call me crazy. Hey, hey, also big wingspan. Big wingspan. Big wingspan. Big wingspan. All right. All right.

There's our winners and losers from the NBA draft. Thank you to our executive producer, Jesse Lopez, as always. Thanks to Tucker on the video. And Jacoby, I'll talk to you next week. Must be 21 and over in present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 over and present in D.C. You got a gambling problem? Call 1-800 gambler or visit RG-Help.com. Call 1-88-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org slash chat in Connecticut or visit MD gambling help.

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