The Mismatch - Nick Wright on James Harden, the Clippers, MVP Picks, and More

Episode Date: December 18, 2020

After Verno attends his first live basketball game in person since March, the boys get into the Grizzlies-Hawks game (0:47) and the Twitter kerfuffle last night about Ben Simmons potentially being available in a trade for James Harden (6:50). Then Nick Wright of ‘First Things First’ joins Verno and KOC to talk about how he got into the industry (20:19), the Harden situation (42:22), the Clippers' demise (50:43), the best teams in the Western Conference (57:46), and the bets he’s put down for the 2020-21 season (1:22:58). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Guest: Nick Wright Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

On today's episode of the mismatch, Chris Vernon and I talked about the latest James Harden Rumors. And we got it in his first experience. He went to an NBA game on Thursday night to watch the Grizzlies and the Hawks play. So we talked about that. We talked about those two teams. And then we had on a guest, my good friend, you know Nick Wright from First Things First on FS1. Nick was awesome. He's a listener of the show.

And he brought it to me and Chris. He challenged us on some of our takes that we've had over the years. I love that conversation. That'll be midway through the show. All that next. Welcome to the mismatch. I'm Chris Vernon and joining me as he does every Friday from the ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor, aka Kevin O'Bomber, Kevin O'Colimer, Kevin O'Clymer, Kevin O'Candiland, Kevin O'Conflict, Kevin O'Kindness.

Kevin! Vernon, what's up this morning? How you doing? Well, it is an odd morning because for the first time since March, it is the morning after I went to a basketball game in person. It felt so bizarre to be in an arena watching an NBA game with so few people. Now, there were not many people in the building.

It was not open to fans per se. They didn't sell tickets. But it was like family and friends, that kind of stuff. And obviously, a very, very low crowd. Like, broadcasters are up at the top of the stands. It was just odd. And the other thing that I noticed was, you know, in the bubble, they did such a good job of like almost putting it on as a production.

And one of the things that people missed is you didn't hear the players as much. There was no stopping it in an empty arena if a guy yells, right? There was no, there is no TV broadcast that can mute that out. And if you're in the arena, you can really hear. ear these guys. Like at one point, John Moran blocked Trey Young and he got whistled and you could hear him like, oh, hell no, you know what I mean? Like, and there's, and guys yelling at each other. At one point, Dylan Brooks got so mad at Cam Reddish that guys that were lower than me were

saying, you could hear him saying, me me outside after the game. Me me outside after the game. Like, I mean, you could hear guys yelling at each other. in a way that you couldn't before. It's a very, very, very different experience. Obviously, I've seen the Grizzlies many times. The Hawks, first time I saw them in person, and I was one of those that really liked those moves, Kevin. But I will tell you, my impression was

they are going to have a very tough road to hoe defensively still. Those guys, they added, it was very Sacramento King's teams of the past-esque, right? That yes, they have some dynamite offensive players, but the hiding Trey Young thing is a thing that they have a very difficult time doing because with the way NBA offenses work now, when they play against anybody that's any good, you can just get into the lane.

You can, and their defense has to break down. and these teams, it's whip, whip, shoot an open three. Like, that's so many of the offenses in the NBA now and what they're trying to get to and spreading the court out and having the shooters that he's got to stay in front of people or else it's going to be a big problem. Because obviously, Morant was just able to get wherever he wanted on the court at all times.

And it stands out as you're watching a team that really made what I thought were some pretty good moves. moves, they're still going to have some big time problems defensively. It might be good enough to compete for the 8C in the Eastern Conference, but they've got some, they got talent, but they still got some holes. Yeah, it is good enough to get into the plan. And ultimately, that might be all Atlanta's hoping for this season. You're not getting a lot of money to get into the play-in game, though, you know?

Yeah, sure. You absolutely are. And for them, I mean, the Trey Young issue with his defense, I mean, we, we, talked about it a bunch over the years. This is why I was too low on him in the draft. I had him right too low. I had him, I think 10th or 11th. It's silly. I underrated his offense

and with his defense, that's one reason why I had him that low. Because I think we're going to see it, the better the hawks get. The better the hawks get, the more he's going to get attacked. That's because the more teams are going to game plan against them. That's the more games are going to matter in a playoff setting

or a big game setting towards the end of the season. And that's where teams are just going to relentlessly attack Trey Young and it's going to show his number one weakness that he needs to solve himself. And hopefully, if you're Atlanta with the surrounding pieces you have, like you have other guys who can handle the ball and alleviate some of the pressure and the demand on him offensively, hopefully, hopefully once that happens, Tray's able to just invest more energy into his defense. Because sometimes, even though he's small, you can be small and still be a problem on the defensive end because of your effort and the heart you play with,

Treong has zero of that right now. And that needs a change for the Hawks to ever be anything more than just like a nice six, seven or eight seed. One of the things that happened like that. So that game was a bloodbath. Morant was amazing again. Brooks was too. Yeah, yeah.

Brooks was good too because Cam Reddish pissed him off. Yeah. And it was funny. John looks awesome, dude. He looks out of control, Kevin. Like, I mean, I hope people are, and I know a lot of people around the country are paying attention to this, but he, this year, he is absolutely, even in the preseason, you can see it, he feels like he's the best player on the floor. There's no more feeling it out. There's no more,

I don't, like, you know, where do I fit in in an NBA game or trying to get everybody involved? Like, it's immediately noticeable. And he's got the, he's got the opportunity. And it's certainly looks to me like he's going to take a huge leap. And beyond the scoring, like he's got, like maybe he's got less of five, maybe three turnovers in three games. And he's probably got 20-something assist. I mean, it's bananas, bananas. Were you at the game while Shams, Sharani, and Adrian Woodruff.

I was reporting the Ben Simmons stuff. I was there. And I was, you know what, the two things that I got texts about last night, you're going to laugh about this. number one, the Wode Shams thing. A bunch of people were texting me about that. And the second thing was, you better give KOC credit on Christian Wood tomorrow.

We're a free season game, but I don't care. No, evidently, Christian Wood was killing it to the point where my friends were like, yo, Christian Wood is killing it. And I was like, what? He was fantastic. That's what they said. So, hey, you'll be proud, right?

We got enough of my buddies out there that were like, yo. Thank you to your buddy. Yeah, this Christian Wood guy's killing it. You better get KOC a little love tomorrow because this guy looks unbelievable tonight. That's what's interesting with Houston because just to give some background. Last night, Adrian Ward Zanowski and Sham Sharani had somewhat different reporting on Philadelphia's willingness to include Ben Simmons and trade conversations with James Harden, right? Yep.

There's one that came out that basically said they're talking about this, you know, talks aren't ongoing right now, but basically it's known that Houston is willing to include Ben Simmons in that kind of a trade. And then you have Woj saying these talks are going nowhere, whatever. And then I guess Darryl Maure called Sham Sharaniah because it was like, Darry says basically Ben Simmons

isn't getting traded and so that led to all kinds of people that are NBA fans and part of NBA

Twitter being like okay so hold hold on here is this damage control like what's what here is this damage control

like we know look you'd be a fool not to think they talked about this in the past they talked about it and for whatever reason it's not going

anywhere maybe feel doesn't want to include what Houston wants them to include. But, you know, when you got a season about to start, the last thing on Earth, Darryl wants out there is, hey, I've been talking to Houston. I'm willing to get rid of one of my two best players. Like, that's because if that trade doesn't happen,

now you've got a guy that feels this grand amount of mistrust towards the entire situation. Sure. You know, it's kind of funny because, like, It's all happened within minutes. Woj reported 624 that the Rockets expanded their conversations to other teams, aside from Philly and Brooklyn. 629 Eastern.

You got Schaim saying they've made Ben Simmons available flat out. Though Woj had within that report as he tweeted one minute later, they've expressed a willingness, but those talks have come nowhere close to being done, as you just stated. Right. The worry quote to Shams an hour later was, we are not trading Ben Simmons.

He is an important part of our future, which is consistent with what he was saying before about saying he likes the future, but he's never outright said, we are not trading Ben Simmons. And it's fascinating here because, you know, they've had conversations. Teams talk all the time. But what's interesting to me is you have Maury going on the record,

calling a reporter who just an hour prior said that they're making him available and trade packages with the rockets. when it comes to people who are sources who are leaking this out, I was thinking about this this morning. Obviously Houston has reason to leak out. You know, they're talking about Ben Simmons packages. Obviously Houston hasn't sent it to do that.

And I was just thinking, who else could have that? Obviously not Philly. Not Philly. No. What about Clutch? Is there, could there be any reason for Ben Simmons's team clutch? to want him out of Philly or with John Wall and Houston to really run that team.

Because like just think about imagine Ben Simmons with Houston with Christian Wood by his side in the front court, a big who can shoot threes, attack closeouts, switch screens, make plays off the dribble and John Wall on the back court with all the other pieces they have on there. To me, I look at that Rockets team and I'm like, that's Ben's team. John Wall's there, but that's Ben's team. And with Philly, it's not Ben's team. It's, it's, it's Joel and Beets team. And I don't know.

I was just thinking about that this morning as like a, as an alternate theory for like, who wants what? Houston obviously wants to get everything they can. And there's reason for them to do that. But who else? Who else might? I wonder. I wonder. Yeah.

I mean, look, what if it's Ben Simmons? What if it's been himself? You know, me? Could be. We're just speculating here. It's possible. we're just speculating. No, it's possible.

Yeah, it's possible. Ultimately, it's a type of thing where, you know, there's been those rumblings for years. And I don't think it's a lot shorter flight to L.A. And he likes the TMZ stuff. I don't think it's unreasonable to think or consider that that's a possibility. That would be a really good team. And with what they got,

the other surrounding pieces there, I think Ben Simmons, you would see a higher level of Ben Simmons. Christian Wood is the perfect front court fit with him on a team. I'm just saying that's interesting to me. And would you want that if you're Ben Simmons and if you're like his representation? Maybe. I think that Philly team's going to win big.

Well, that's the thing. It's like, why would you want to leave Philly? Because that team is really, really good. I'm just playing devil's advocate here. But ultimately, I already got my contract. I'd want to stay in Philly at least to start. I definitely want to stay in Philly. But it's intriguing.

Yeah. So you think that's dead? I don't think anything's ever dead. We've heard about trade packages, you know, falling apart before. And then, whoop, they come to life. They come to life. That happens all the time. So I think honestly, though, we've talked about this a lot for the last several weeks.

I think most of us have had the inclination to believe that those players, that that, that was the most logical trade that is the best return, the best player that Houston could get in return in a deal, right? Not a package of picks. If we're just talking about you've got a cornerstone, a guy that's an all NBA talent at his age, getting that back would be a tremendous return. And I don't know if anybody can, nobody can do better than that, in my opinion. it's just a matter of what kind of package you want.

I don't think that they can get a better player in return for James Harden. Well, this is why, this is why like when I said to you and Bill, like, what about other teams? What about Minnesota? Yeah. And why I was shocked by the response you guys gave because I think you got to look for those other teams. Like what are the other teams that are going to be like, you know what?

We got to make a move here. I mean, or they're in a position like Toronto was. with a like, oh, this is a pretty good price to Rosen and Pertil when a 2019 first job pick. Yes,

please for a year of Kaui Leonard, despite the injury concerns, despite the short-term contract. Like, there's got to be a team out there like a Minnesota that's like, you know what? Screw it.

This is a MVP caliber talent, one of the greatest, most talent of players that's ever been available in a trade. And I think you're going to see, I would almost guarantee. I would, I'm going to say, I'm going to guarantee that you're going to see another team pop up and trade rumors in the coming months ahead of the deadline.

I would be shocked if you don't see a random team that gets reported as having interest in a James Hardin trade. Shot because it's inevitable. Of course there will be. But like we're so focused on Philly and Brooklyn. I don't feel like we're doing enough looking around the league. Because we've spent three years saying this MB Simmons thing is not. a great fit. Yeah, of course. That's why. Of course. I mean, obviously, like Ben Simmons for James Hardin deserves a lot of

attention, but like I still feel like we're not, you know, collectively as a NBA media, or even fans for that matter, looking at other options. There's got to be like, like we got to be like trade machine Picasso's here like Bill Simmons is and find some other deals that makes sense because that's what's happening in the league right now. They're front offices debating within should we go all in on James Harden. or what is the price that we're willing to meet if it comes to that where we could try to exceed that or try to get him.

That's what front offices are talking about now. But be fair, but be fair, Kevin. I only think we are at this point because they, now this is conjecture on my point of view, okay? I only think we're at this point because those calls went, no, give us more than Ben Simmons. Yes, I agree.

And Philly said, no, we are giving you nothing more. That's it. That's it. That's why these have gone the way that they have. And Houston may come back and say, hey, we still give us Ben Simmons because we'd rather, right? You know what I mean? We'd rather have that than, you know, these other things that are out there. But at this point, Philly, life is leverage. And they've got the leverage. They don't have to do it. They don't have to. They have Simmons locked up long term. Yeah, they say, go do better. Go do better.

Yep. Go try to find. Go get your 25 cents on the dollar. Go get you a bunch of players that aren't going to win you anything and some draft picks. Fine. Also, like, I think this guys are all NBA player. Like,

you don't get other, you don't get that and crap. Yes. Like, that's what you get. And by the way, I think for Philly, there,

I think you should, you know, ideally wait in an ideal world, if you're Philly, you wait to see how it looks early in the season. I want to see how this looks with Ben Simmons and Joel and Bede. with all these new surrounding pieces.

And if you're Mori, I would imagine you want to see that too. I mean, look, Ben and Joel have their flaws together. They are not a perfect fit. But there's no denying the amount of success those guys have still had. They've still had a lot of success. Even if it hasn't resulted in a championship, those guys can work with the right pieces. So it may be unnecessary to give first round draft fix with Ben Simmons,

if that's what it takes, to actually make a deal. It may be unnecessary to make a deal, period because Ben Simmons, despite his flaws, despite the fact he shoots with the wrong hand, despite the fact he's unwilling to shoot at all. He's still a top 15, top 20, 25 guy in the league. He is one of the game's best defensive players in the league, one of the game's most ferocious players in the break in the open floor, one of the game's best playmakers. He may not shoot threes, but he creates a lot of three-pointers for everybody else because

of his ability to get into the paint and dish out accurate passes. He's awesome. So if you're feeling, it's like, let's wait and see. Do you see that? Wait and see. You know what? Let me see if I could pull this up. There was a stat floating around last week that I pulled off of one of the social media outlet.

I can't recall which. Maybe it was Twitter. But it was about three point, three point assists throughout the year. Simmons led, I believe, ever since he entered the league or the last couple of years. it has been dominated. Here it was. Three point assist players in the regular season. Now, the last couple of seasons have been dominated by

Ben Simmons and Yonis Ante Cumpo. But now their guess who is elevated above them? It is Luca Donchich. Wow. And then LeBron James and then Ben Simmons and then Russell Westbrook stands to reason with the way they should.

shoot three. The shocking one was fifth was DeMarter Rosen. How about that? I mean, that many assists for three-pointers. Damar's underrated. He went from overrated to underrated. But to your point about the whole Ben Simmons thing, look, man,

if you're that high in, it's one thing to be that high in three-point assist when you're playing with JJ Reddick and you know, the guys that they had that were spreading the court a couple years ago, they don't have anybody that was shooting last year. Do you know what I mean? And you still like now like that's the whole gig.

Like we talked about this so many times just surround it with shooting. Like if you're Ben Simmons, now you're kicking out to a guy that can hit a shot. Like you, he already was great in that category playing with a bunch of non-shooters. What happens when you put some shooting around him? You know, and that's the way it can have a profound effect. I'm telling me that's where Houston's pretty appealing. But ultimately, though, I'm still. of the belief that Houston should also wait because you got to try to make this work with James Harding. You don't just trade an MVP caliber player. It's stupid. It'd be dumb if they do that way too soon unless it's an outrageous return like Ben Simmons. Yeah. In first round draft picks.

If you're Houston, how could James Harder not like playing with Christian Wood? Anybody who watched that game last night, anybody who watched that got to be like, oh, this is the most talented big he's ever had on his team. It just is. Like, what is that good of a player that James Hardin's going to be thinking, you're telling me, I have a big man who can roll to the room and throw down dunks like Clint Capella and he can pick and pop for threes and attack closeouts and he can switch on defense. I just have a hard time believing that at some point, James Hardin's not going to wake up in the morning and be like, it's not so bad. It's not so bad. This is a pretty good team. I feel like we're doing something good here.

And will he want to stay? I don't know if we'll get to that point. Maybe he wants to leave for other reasons too. But ultimately, I look at the Houston roster and if this James Harden drama didn't exist, I'd be really, really high on them. I'd be really high on the Rockets if the

drama didn't exist. But it does. But it does. But it does exist. And it's probably not going to end well. I know you keep holding out hope. I know you keep holding out hope that he's going to wake up. Why wouldn't you, though? Why wouldn't you though?

Like this, like we, over the years, like we've talked about blow it up, blow it up, teams that should blow it up. Houston, we said earlier this year that they're probably the next team, the next team that's going to be in that conversation. We're right there right now. But I'm not ready to press detonate until it's at a point where there's no return. There's no chance of getting hardened to buy in. I still think you've got to give this time,

especially because of the flashes Christian Wood just showed. Part of the reason you have to show James Harden that Houston's the best place for him to compete for a championship. That's what you have to show him. And if you can't show that, if the team struggles, if, you know, maybe John Wall and James Hardin don't get along and then maybe make a trade. Make a trade. You don't have a choice. And there's going to be good offers out there. But you get to give it time.

You get to give it time with the player of Hardin's caliber. I hope he gets traded this afternoon and we have to go back and record this. That would be quite funny. It's happened to us before, this kind of stuff. It happened with Yonis on our Tuesday show. That's right. Yeah, I did the open. You wanted him to wait too.

You're big one, Kevin O. Waiter. You love, Kevin O. Patient. You love waiting on stuff. All right. Lastly, before we get out of here, ask me some of the big ones. And I say, get out of here. We are going to be joined by a very special guest in Nick Wright from FS1 today. We told you that with the new feedback over.

Be bringing over some guests. Yeah. It really is a Nick Wright takeover. I mean, now it was... We're recording this conversation right here after talking with Nick Wright. That's right. We recorded with him on Thursday evening. It was great.

I love the conversation with Nick. I love... Yes, it was great. And I think our listeners are really going to like it. Nick is a listener of the show, too. That's true. That's fun as well. Nick has listened to the show for years now.

He couldn't wait to call me out on things. And so you'll get to hear about that. He was a lot harder on you than me. because it's easier to be harder on me. Come on me. I'm more bombastic, we would say, of the two of us. That being said, while we've been on the air, I understand the GM survey has dropped. So just hit the big ones. I fancy myself as smarter than general managers. And so one day, I will probably be part of the GM survey. and I will have to give my answers when I am general manager of a team.

We have the worst team in the league. The worst team in the league. All right. No doubt about it. All right. I will tell you what my answers would be. Roll off some of the big questions. So Chris has not looked at the NBA.com.

I have not looked at it at it all. GM survey. Who's going to win the finals? The Lakers. What percentage of GM said it? 85. 81%. Boy, you're smart.

We talked about this later. in today's show with Nick Wright about MVP. Nick talks about his gambling, you know, with who he bet on, who's going to win MVP? I think they say Luca. They say Yannis, 32%. Lucas second 21%.

Oh, no, there will be voter fatigue on Yonahis. This is a good question. Which player forces opposing coaches to make the most adjustments? Oh, the player that causes the other team to make the most adjustments. Hmm.

I'll say Luca for that. James Hardin. Is that right? Is that right? Yeah, James Hardin last year was 48% so that numbers drop. And it's LeBron, 29%, staff 11%.

That's a stupid answer. What are you talking about? Well, then you get Janus, Luca, and Yoko. He'd say you can stay in there and dribble the ball into the ground for half an hour. We get a nice, hard in conversation with Nick Wright coming up. Oh, guys, we really got to adjust our defense. That guy with the ball, he dribbles it, and then he takes it, takes the shot.

You are so disrespectful to James Hard. And it's unbelievable how we're going to defend this, guys. It's unbelievable. He's standing there, just dribbling the ball into the ground. He dribbling the cover off the thing. It's really disgusting. Who's going to win rookie of the year, according to the GMs? Lamello?

39% Lamello, correct? Then Wiseman, then Top, and then Edwards. All right. Which rookie will be the best player in five years? Oh, that's a good one. It's a different answer than, I don't know. That's for you to guess.

You're the other one. I'm going to say that I'm going to say the listeners who are guessing this quiz. I'll say they will also say LaBella. James Wiseman. Wiseman. Yeah. Five years. Yeah.

Five years for, uh, this coach was the answer to multiple questions. Who's the best head coach? Who's the best manager motivator of people? Who's the best at end game adjustments? Multiple answers. This coach. Nick Nurse. Eric Spolstra.

Oh, that's fair. Yeah. And last year, it was different. for all three of them. Doesn't it feel like it's really changed with Spoh? Yeah, I mean, last year, lot more credit. Last season,

best head coach was pop. Best manager was pop. Best in-game adjustments was Carlisle. And now it's Spolster for all of them. Wow. Wow. Which this is, this one will touch close to home for you.

Which team has the most promising young core? I bet they're going to say Pelicans. Yeah, they said Pelicans because they're right. talking about they're right they're right who took this survey GMs or trainers and this is the last one

because it touches on part of our conversation with Nick Wright which player would you want taking a shot with the game on the line me personally I guess I guess at the time I have to answer it I'm not. All right. I am not. Well, what do you think the GMs answered? I don't know what their answer is, but my answer would be Duran.

Okay. Durant was third. That would be my answer. Okay. I think he is the best offensive player. I mean, maybe ever. I was going through it the other day, Kevin. He's played whatever it is, 11, 12 years in the league, 12 years. Outside of his rookie year, he has averaged over 25 points per game. every single season, every single season. You think he averages over 25 a game this year? That's a hell of a streak. That is a hell of a streak to do that every single year. So, Durant would be my answer.

I think they will probably say Lillard? Bingo. Damien Lillard, then Seth Curry. He said a lot of big shots. Then Katie, then Luca, then Chris Paul, also receiving votes. Devin Booker, Jamal Mari. Yeah. One guy was missing.

We talk about. Luca? No, no, no. Luca was fourth. Oh, he was. Luke was fourth. James Hardin, I'm thinking of vote for that question.

You don't say. Yeah, yeah. Wow. Because Damian Lillard has 200 playoff moments and James Harden has zero. With Nick Wright, we talked about a little, we talked a little bit about this, but we opened up our conversation with Nick about some, you know, his story and media advice, his career. And then after that, we got into the basketball. Really fun conversation.

I love to have Nick on. I did too. conversation with Nick Wright. We're going to let you hear that after these words. All right. So we said we're going to be bringing in guests on the mismatch now with the new feed. And who better to bring in the Nick Wright? You see him all the time on FS1. And now you hear him on our show. Nick Wright, thanks for coming on with us. I'm not the first. Like, Simmons doesn't count, obviously. Am I the first non-ringer employee or owner, megalo millionaire guest? Am I the first one?

Yes. Oh, my God. Can I say something honestly, honest to God? And this is the first time Bruno and I have ever talked. Can I call you, Bruno? You call him Kevin O'bomber, Kevin O, Conman, Kevin O, hate, all these things. Oh, con man, hold on. I got to write that one, dad.

I got that one down. I am a hoops, take snob. Like, I don't actually like listening to a lot of people's basketball opinions because they just make me mad. you guys have a you guys have been doing a great job for a long time i've really enjoyed your show and when c o c i don't know i'm supposed to say this i got an early sneak preview that this might be coming when it's that you guys are getting your own little feed you can edit this out if that's not supposed to be public if cos is going to get in trouble i knew about two weeks earlier than maybe the general public i was so happy it's great and it's one of the only things i listen to all the time

and so you guys you guys are awesome so i'm happy and i'm glad to be on here and to be able to tell both you guys how in the last 12 months how often you've been wrong about things. That means great show. Hey, all right. You will a bad argument. Hey, so first things first, no pun intended.

Before we get into basketball, Kevin and I both, I'm sure, much like you, get inundated with people, younger people that are asking about getting into the industry. I've known about you since you a radio host in Kansas City. I know you went from

Kansas City to Houston. And obviously there comes a point where most people know Nick Wright as Nick Wright, the guy that's on TV, right? But there was a path in order to get there. And I think one of the things that I struggle with, even with answering people, and I think Kevin feels the same, is this whole media job has changed so rapidly. Even in the last five to 10 years that the trek I took to get to where I am right now, the trek you took to get to where you are, is not the same trek that young people. people will take. And so if you can, just kind of take us through how you got to where you are right now. And then also how you answer those questions. Because we have a young audience that asks us quite a bit that are fans of the show and they want to be able to get in sports media one day too.

And I struggle, honestly, to give a good answer. So listen, I'm going to kind of answer it in reverse order and I'm going to bounce around and feel free to cut me off. I'm going on too long. First question, you have to ask yourself, is this something you want to do or is this something you have to do? Because if it's only something you want to do, it's not going to work out. And that's going to sound harsh. But there's too many people at the beginning, the funnels way too wide with so many people that want to do it that if it's not something like, if I'm not able to do this, I'm going to feel. unhole almost. You know what I mean? Like there's a void. You're not going to be able to

climb the ladder early on. So that's a question because I think some people, the people that are like, hey, man, you got the greatest job in the world. You just watch sports and then talk about it. Like, I think I'd love to do that. No shot. And I know that's because that's not the path. The path has to be, it is, this is something that I want so badly that I am going to deal with all of the stuff that goes along with it in the beginning that's going to make you want to quit. So like that's the first, so before you even, if you want to do this like as a hobby, it's a side gig, is whatever, then more power to anyone and everyone that wants to. But if you're like, this is what I want to do for a life, then you have to really make sure

it is what you want to do and that you are able and willing potentially to move around. My first job. So now my path. I'll answer that part of it. Went to Syracuse. Going into my senior year, I was a finalist for what is probably, not probably, it was like one person got it. It's the best radio internship in the country. They pay you 12 grand.

They give you an apartment in New York City. you work for WABC. 100 people are semi-finalists. I'm that. Eight people are next round. I'm in that. Three people get brought to New York. And again, first place gets that.

Second place gets not even the steak knives. And I come in second. And because I'm me, I was so convinced that I was going to get it. I had no alternative. I had no fallback. So now I'm going into my senior, some of my senior year. I have no internship. I have no plan.

I stay in Syracuse. and I create a show called What's Right with Nick Wright that I board opt, call screened, and hosted simultaneously by myself in the summer. And not getting that internship was the single-west thing that ever happened to me. So all summer long, I'm doing this solo talk show at Syracuse. Six months later, I'm applying jobs. I had an offer to be a producer full-time with benefits in New York City at ESPN Radio. I had an offer to be. be a part-time morning news producer on a conservative talk station in Kansas City. But if I did that, on Saturdays I could host What's Right with Nick Ray. Eight dollars and ten cents an hour.

I did that. And the point of that, moral of that angle is, if you want to be on the air, you got to be on the air. The idea of like, I'm KOC, not KOC, but a young version of KOC. all I want to do is talk about, I'm a kid from Boston. I want to talk about my hometown teams. I want to one day be on WEEI. Okay, you're not starting off there. And if you do like, if you try to start off there and it's like I'm going to climb the ladder in one market, it can be done.

But the market's too big for them to put someone on the air without experience. So you've got to like, you've got to be willing to be mobile and move. And because of technology now, just do it on your own. The advice I give young people right now, you want to, you want to, you want to talk. talk sports for a living, start right now. And oh, but nobody's going to listen to my podcast. That's awesome because guess what? We are all horrifyingly bad in the beginning. Like shockingly aggressively, like I dare KOC or Verno to listen to any content they had in their first six months on the job. If you can get through more than five minutes, you're better than me.

Because if I listen to old tapes of what's right and Nick Wright, I want to cry. I want to crawl into a hole. And at the time, I thought it was good, but I wasn't. So you just got to do it. You just got to to do it, you got to do it, you got to do it. Start a podcast, start a YouTube channel, because internships and connections and this and that are great, and they get you in the door, but in the door, then the question is, can this person do it? And then you got to be able to show them you can do it.

So that's why I tell people, do it. Like, Kevin, you got discovered on Celtics blog, right? Yeah, yep, Celtics blog. And my NBA draft guide too, yeah. Before Berno was on the ringer, I don't even know why, but I knew two people in Memphis. My wife's best friend in the world. Shout out Nicole Brown and Chris Vernon.

And I don't know why I knew Chris Vernon, but Vernon had done enough in the basketball and sports radio world that if I thought Memphis, I was like Chris Vernon. And so Gary Parrish was another guy. Yeah, Gary. Gary Parrish, it was for college basketball there. Who's my best buddy. Internet made the world a small place.

It just did. You know what I mean? Because I was going to mean. A lot of memes of me this week. Geez, guys. I was going to do the let's move to this market, let's move to this market. And I started to realize people are going to find me here. They're going to find me.

And one other piece of advice for young people, whether they want to do media or not, just sports fans listening. Now, listen, I had kids young. I started family young. So there's obviously a lot of paths. If you can finish college. I just honest advice If you can finish college

With a clean criminal record No children And as little dead as possible You can do literally anything you want in your 20s Literally anything you want You can go be a bartender on the beach In Cozumel Nobody cares. It's fine

And by the way, you want to grind at a dream job Be an artist, be a talk to host, whatever. Guess what? In college you ate ramen noodles and drink water out of the sink. You can do it. It's fine. You don't need a lot of money. You only need a lot of money once you have the responsibilities. So like I made eight bucks an hour for a long time, for a long time. People like, oh, Nick, you're on who wants to be a millionaire, which I was. But I have a crippling gambling problem. So that money didn't lack. So like, so the lack of responsibilities can be helpful. Kevin, I got to be honest. I am so tired of hearing

Nick Wright talk about how successful he is. If you're just asking. about basketball. No, no, no, I do want to follow up on one thing, though. Your point, Nick, about it has to be something, whether it's on camera or, you know, on air or behind the scenes, producing, you know, on the video side or the audio side or in the field. I had somebody asked me recently, you know, they're thinking about trying to get into sports. And I said, well, before that, I would ask, like, can you envision yourself being happy working late nights or would you rather, you know, experience a big game at a bar with your friends, you know, or someone's house? Like, you know, how would you deal with late hours? Do you want a

normal nine to five? Or is that something you feel like if you put yourself mentally in that place, do you feel like you would miss the normal side of things being with friends rather than coworkers? Um, because I found that I loved the, like when I worked behind the scenes at Comcast Sports in New England now, NBC Sports Boston, when I worked, you know, freelance a bunch of places. I loved all that. I enjoyed it. But some people don't. And I think that's an important thing that someone could figure out even before they're in it. No, you really have to. Look, yeah. I'm the one going to Grizzlies Hawks preseason games. Right. You know what I mean? Like you got to, you got to love watching. You got to do it. And you got to and like, and I, the other,

the only other thing I'll say is this. What we do for a living is the least. The least, physically taxing job in the world, right? That part's true. Like, I sit and watch, and then I sit and talk. Like, but this industry in the beginning, it's emotionally taxing because there is so much unknown, and it is so, like, it is so, whatever the opposite of lucrative is, right?

And so, like, in the beginning, you're stressed about money and you're stressed about moving up and whatever you're going to do. And then if you are fortunate to like succeed, you know what I mean, and get to any level where at least you have some financial stability, then what replaces that stress of like the physical stuff is the constant, you said the internet made the world a small place, the constant scrutiny of,

hey man, no matter what the take is, there are going to be people that bleeping hate you. Like hate you and want to see your demise. And for some people, it's not a healthy way to live. You folks can make all the memes of me they want where my nose is a penis. I'll deal with it.

Like that's not a problem. But for some folks, that's not the life they want to live. I get that. I mean, come on. The nose, the penis nose is a bit extreme. Well, well, you know, tell Bill's fans that. They've done everything but spray painted on my house. I do.

I do. I hope you guys actually follow through with that bet. I really do. Oh, what do you mean actually follow through? It's happening. Yeah, but sometimes, like, especially with rich and famous guys, they make the bed, it's great for TV, but

now when it really comes condiment time, I actually could see, I think you will say, spray me with the condiments. I will be very impressed if Colin allows you to dump condiments all over him if he loses the bed. All right, so can I, can I, even though it's your guys

podcast, can I pivot for a moment? Is that okay? This has been very nice and cordial, and you guys have let me do my favorite thing in the world, talk about myself. Can we talk about how wrong Chris Vernon is about the Rockets and James Harder? What? Thank you. Is that okay?

Thank you. How wrong I am about what. Do you see that fat ass the other night? Okay. Let me ask you a question, Bruno. What a winner. Let me ask you a question. It's honest question.

Yeah. I'm with it. Kevin Durant. Yep. You know what? I'm removing Kevin Durant, actually. Steph Curry with the. I'm going to phrase a different way.

James Hardin's tenure with the Rockets. Yep. 2012 to right now. Tell me the player and team that had a more successful run other than Stephen Curry with the Rockets and then Kevin Durant joining up with him. Tell me.

That would be the team that had a more successful run. Okay, but that's it. So if James Hardin and the Rockets were total failures, then think about the 2018 beneath them on that list. Well, I didn't say he was a total failure. Hold on now. Come on.

I didn't say this guy was a total failure. I said he vomited on himself when it mattered most, which he did a thousand times. Okay. And by the way, Nick, on his home court without Kauai got beat 110 to 78, then went out to a strip club so they could all chant MVP for him. That's your winner. That's your leader. That's your franchise guy. Okay, so here's my problem with the critiques of the strip clubs and the nightlife and the culture and Tim McMahon's article that I, that everybody that follows the NBA, none of that was news, right?

The anecdote in there that one of them that people are jumping to is, and in the bubble, there was a film session. And Russell Westbrook was so angry. And it's like, start the film. Like we're not waiting for him. like Russell Westbrook, the antithesis of Hardin as far as professionalism and attention to detail. How's that worked out for Russ? Like, oh, they have the same postseason resume. In fact, Hardin is a little bit better.

So this idea that, like, we are, Hardin has a better postseason resume than Janus. Nobody thinks Janus is like partying too much. Thing is this, there's like three guys, I guess if we want to include Kauai, but then all of a sudden it's like, hey, Kauai. Remember that he was like the consummate? pro in Toronto. And then it's like, hey, he's making everybody wait for him on planes and the loss of clippers. And he was a big part of the culture problem. It's like three guys in the whole league who we can be like, oh, okay, they check every single box. And it just frustrates me with a guy

like Hardin who is, I don't know, the 26th greatest player in the history of basketball who were like, eh, you know what? He's the problem. He's not really the problem. He's not better than Stepp or Durant or LeBron. And that's where you have to be better than to win titles. But this is what happens with franchise guys. This is what happens with quarterbacks. This is what happens in sports. That's what we do.

I ask you this. If it's a game seven, your season's on the line. Do you trust him? Of course you don't. Of course you don't. Well, the answer's no. Okay, all right. But then let me ask the different questions.

That's why you get paid $40 million. That's why you get the accolades, the MVP's, the everything. That's great. So I have a question, though. More than four guys. you do trust. Oh, they're going to be there for the fight when the game's on the line? Like, I'm saying going down swinging. I think Jimmy Butler will go down swinging. That's where, like, Hardin is, Hardin in every way, shape, and form is a player you would

rather have than Jimmy Butler in every way. Except when my season's on the line and Hardin would rather go sit in the stands. Okay. So I have, this is where I have issues with your argument, Chris, because those two series where you say he vomited over himself against the war, Warriors, to me, he's the reason why they're even in that position in the first place. Do you think Russell Westbrook is a reason they were in it against them? When they lost, when Westbrook and Durant lost, you don't give Westbrook credit for that. You don't say, you don't look at that the same way. Russ deserves some credit.

Of course he does. Of course he does. But Kevin Moran is the number one guy on those teams. But I guess, so I guess my thing is that there has to be a value to, over, since Hardin got to the Rockets, they're the only franchise, went to the playoffs every year, and they won more games than everybody.

And it's not like there were a bunch of these random teams that won titles. Who won titles? The greatest player ever, and the greatest collection of talent ever, you could argue, or certainly the team with the greatest shooter ever, and a random Toronto team,

the year the greatest collection of talent ever, all got her. Okay, I agree. So you would say, say that Peyton Manning is, the criticisms of Peyton Manning are ridiculous, right? I would say it's clear that he was not his best in the biggest moments, obviously, but that does not change the fact that if we spent, but we didn't spend 60% of the time discussing Peyton Manning talking about his flaws.

Of course we did. To this day. One of the five greatest quarterbacks of all times. I'm with Nick here. I'm with Nick here because I'm with Nick. That's not true. I'm with Nick because I grew up rooting for those Patriots teams that crushed Peyton Manning.

And all I heard, probably were cheating. All I heard was Peyton Manning is better than Tom Brady. The Patriots defense is the only reason why Peyton Manning is losing in the postseason. That's what I heard throughout the early mid-de-thousand. You're the bills fan. Seeking out Nick Wright saying something bad about Josh Allen. I listen to Boston Sports Radio almost every single day of my life growing up.

Nobody. in Boston was saying Peyton Manning was better than Tom Brady. James Hardin is traded today. If James Hardin's traded today, what was a more successful run? Martin in Houston or Damian Lillard in Portland as of right now. I would say that Dame was because of the lack of superstar, I would say I am more impressed about him carrying this franchise. Come on.

They're strapped it and clawing for the playoffs. The bubble road. Hold on now. Hold on now. That's because Narkich got hurt. And you know that as well as I do. Who is the best player Damian Lillard's ever played with? C.J. McCollum. Obviously, Syracuse champion Carmelo-Anne. But I think some people would say C.J. McCollum. Okay. How many All-Star teams is C.J. McClure played. Early in his career. Yeah, yeah, Aldridge. But how many, C.J. McCollollens never even made an All-Star game. So, but, but again, does Dame, like, Dame has those two iconic shows. shots and also some tough postseason moments. But like there's there's a, there's this,

there are certain guys that I would put in like the Clay Thompson bucket, which is I would argue the best, prior to the injuries obviously, the best life to live of NBA player, which is a very, very good to great player that is not great enough for us to crush when they don't do it. And up until recently,

that's the bucket dame was in when the blazers played well everyone loved dame and when they're when 20 games you know out of first even though dame and cj were healthy all year we're like ah sucks for dame man but we can't blame him like what we can't do is say it's like dame should have been better because before they got superstars in houston james arden was carrying that team to the postseason before they got other guys around them and it's not like the dwight howard years dwight howard was a dominant force. And if we're being totally candid, it's not like the second year or the second year with Chris Paul. Well, the Dwight Howard year, he had to be benched in a game seven so that they could come back and win. That was a game six. That was a game six. And I don't know that he was benched. He

started the fourth quarter on the bench and then let the rally go on. I'm not saying he's unimpeachable. I'm just saying that I think there's a little too much flame thrown his way. Now, can I direct something at KOC? Please. Because I'm mad at Kevin O'Connor. He doesn't know this. And Kevin O'Connor, I'm using you as a vessel for all of the media. Oh, but you in particular because you know this and I can't like, I feel like Zach and Wendy and these other guys know it. But I never had, I didn't speak with them personally about it. It makes me really personally wounded, hurt, and angry.

when I hear people talk about last year's clippers and this phrase is attached. Well, everyone thought that was going to be the Western Conference finals. No one saw this coming before the bubble.

We were all shocked. And I'm like, guys, I'm right here. Like, KOC, I had you on my old radio show. And we talked about this. And you were like, you're way too down on the clippers. You were picking the Lakers to win the title, obviously. I talked to Wendy.

I talked to Zach Lowe. And everyone's like, oh, Tim Bontas. I talked to all these people. And they're like, Nick, you're so down on the clippers. I'm like, we'll see. Doesn't seem like they have a point guard or rim protector, and I don't think they like each other. And then they fall apart because they don't have point guard,

room protector, and they like each other. And everyone's like, who's going to see this coming? And I'm like, I'm right here, guys. So you feel, you feel like you have been betrayed in some sense by Kevin O'Connor that at the very least Kevin O'Connor could be out there saying, hey, there was a guy that's a guy that's coming up. It should exactly. Everybody but Nick Wright.

Everyone except Nick Wright, of course. I was shocked by it. I apologize. You're right. But I'll tell you this about about those clippers and these Lakers, the season. Last year when I was on your radio show, like I said, you're down on two down on the clippers, but I'm still picking the Lakers or the favorite. They're going to win it all, which they did.

This season, I feel like the gap is even wider. Of course. We're on the same page there, even wider. Oh, I don't think the clippers address. their problems. It's like, hey, and I love Ty. I love Ty. But it's like, hey, we had a major cultural issue.

So we're promoting the assistant coach. Like, I think Ty would have been a great head coach hire in a lot of places. Maybe Houston. And that's something in Stephen Silas. And I want to get back to the Houston thing. But that strikes me as odd. And they still want the point guard. And I know Montrez-Harrel was awful in the bubble.

But people, he was their third best. player over the course of the year. He was their energizer. He was an energizer. Screw him. We want Serge Abaka. And Abaka, the last two years, has had a resurgence. Because I thought Abaka was kind of on the way down and then, you know what I mean,

bounced back up the last couple of years. But I do think, I don't think Abaka is like a total 100% known quantity. Like, you know, you're going to get, you know, 65 games in the short and regular season and a good playoff run from Abaka. And I don't know what is wrong with Kauai. medically. But I know this. Even when they won the title, he looked like a different player by the finals. They load managed him, right? Does anyone disagree with that? Like, I was in that locker room. He had a serious limp. He had a serious. Everything they could to protect him, right? And they, and still,

and he was, the series he played against the Sixers is an all-time great playoff series by any player in any round. Even without the buzzer beards and all. And then the next round against the bucks, against the Sixers, he was an A triple plus, against the bucks, he was an A. Against the Warriors, he was like a solid B plus. And

Lowry does not get the credit he deserves. Not even close to it. None of the other players do for that matter. Yep, that's true. And it's also the warriors, like, listen, you know what we found out? Going to a bunch of finals in a row, ruined. It ruined the Celtics

in the 80s. I'm not talking about the Celtics now. They don't go to a bunch of finals in a row. Come on. They've won one titles into Berlin Wallfeld. It's a champion title town. Like as a Boston guy, like, are you mad at the Celtics? Because they're pulling you down.

Red Sox went a bunch, ruins one a bunch of Patriots, want a bunch of the Celtics. It's like, hey, I have the one that Mikhail gave us because he and Danny A and Jutts a shower together. Like, I don't know. It just seems weird. But okay, so the, so you go to a bunch of finals in a row,

and it ruined you. Like your bodies break down, except for LeBron somehow. right? Like that's what we've learned. And so the Warriors were broken down by them. But I just, I have real concerns about Kauai. And I think you said this, Verno. I think it was really smart. They signed Paul George. But I think they might have signed Paul George to do to him what they did to Blake. Not this year. But so they don't lose the asset, right? Like so that is at some point a possible trade. But that also has an effect on a locker room. These guys, you know, one of the

things I've learned over the years is they know who got the checks. They know who. got paid. And that does matter. And that dude, he just, he barfed all over himself when it mattered most. And he's hitting the side of the backboard and shit. And guys in that locker room, like, they do know, this guy just got whatever, $100 million. Like, for what? Like, where were you? In fact, we were having to talk you into playing these games. Like, I don't want to get into a mental health discussion. But that happened at the bubble where this guy, like, my heart's just not into it. I'm not feeling it.

To me, what's worse than that, I think guys can, because I don't know what he was going through personally. But I think the lack of accountability. But he didn't say that when he went on with the damn Stephen Jackson. That's what I was about saying. He didn't say I was so depressed. He said Doc Rivers is a bozo.

That's right. I mean, it's crazy. You know what I mean? That's the, his postseason media tour of lack of accountability. And I thought KOC sent a girl. I don't know if it got the credit, it should have. But the tweet KOC sent was such like a precise dart through the heart.

Where Paul George is like, they're playing me like I'm, what did he say? JJ Reddick or something? Yeah. And KORC writes, that's interesting, Paul. Very interesting. Very interesting. Well, actually, you have no idea what you're talking about and it's about yourself. It's so good.

Who's the second best team in the West this year? Well, that was my next question. Because to me, I look at Dallas. I look at Dallas, and that's the team where I look at, I feel like the Josh Richardson edition that they had on draft night got overlooked just because it happened during the NBA draft. But what he adds to that team is a big, versatile defender. In addition to everything else they've done that we've talked about in recent weeks,

you need Chris Stapp's forcing us to stay healthy. If he's healthy at the right time in the playoffs, that to me is the second best team in the Western Conference. better than Denver. Denver's taking a step back, by the way. Jeremy Grant gone, Will Barton not happy being a six man. They're taking a step back. Clippers taking a step back. Dallas is going to move up. I think it's still the Clippers, but the gap is bigger.

That's what I'd say. So I don't think it's, I think it's those two teams, KOC said. I agree with, I agree with Kevin there. Not without Porzengis. You keep saying if they have Porzenghis is going to be the league MVP. is that who you place your bet on for league MVP? He's the favorite. He's the favorite. Listen, for some reason,

I, you know, the NBA doesn't let me vote on anything, okay? That's the, which is one of the reasons I think I'm so angry at people like KOC, not give me credit for the clippers thing, because maybe,

you know, I know Adam Silver listens to the mismatch. And he might be like, oh, Nick Wright, that seems like a smart guy. Maybe I should give him a league vote since, you know, a dude that voted, I think Trey Young,

third team, all, But the benefit to me not having a vote, no, it wasn't, it wasn't Tray Young, but there were some terrible all. Oh, yeah, there was like an Andre Drummond. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, there's a lot of them, yeah. Somebody voted Zion for rookie of the year because he was on TV. Oh, boy, here we go.

Here we go with the Memphis, the Memphis homerism. The, the, the benefit in an hour of vote is I can gamble on it. And so when it comes to, and then I want to talk about Denver for second, but when comes to MVP. The league, LeBron's not going to win it. I don't know if he's going to play enough. And he's just,

they're done letting LeBron win MVPs. He'll win finals. MVP's instead of fine. Anthony, it's very hard for me to see until LeBron is in like year 20 Kareem stage of his career. So that one of LeBron's teammates is ever going to have a chance to win MVP.

Like look at the highest D. Wade or Kyrie or Anthony Davis, this best year. Like it's just hard for voters to be like, like I'm going to vote for league MVP, a guy who I believe in my heart, isn't the most important player on his team. So that's two of your best four players in the league. I,

hold on. Let me, time out. I think you are, I think you're going to be surprised at how many votes LeBron gets because he pitched about it last year. And he might be rightfully so. No,

but he put everybody on notice last year. And so now when it comes time, a lot of these media guys are going to vote him because they're like, you know what? right. He is the best guy in the league. I also don't think, listen, man, he didn't come close to winning it the year

after they came back from 3-1 down and Steph was the unanimous MVP. And that would have been the same logic then. Like, geez, you know what I mean? We screwed up again. And I think, I think LeBron is going to play a fewer percentage of his team's games this year than any year since, what was his first year in Cleveland? I feel like they're going to do the whole, we went through this during the, the Jordan years, right? Where it's like, okay, they give it to Malone,

and then Jordan beats his ass in the playoffs, and then they come back and they go, oh, okay, we should have given it to Michael Jordan. And then they did it with Barclay. We gave Barclay the MVP, and then Jordan whoops his ass, and then they say, oh, and so this year, I think we're going to get a recoil on people say,

I don't want to be watching LeBron James hoisting up a trophy, and I'm the guy that didn't vote him. I think LeBron's going to get more votes than he has in a normal year. But I don't, I still don't foresee. I think when, if you are somebody who's placing a bet on MVP votes or rookie of the year or whatever else it is, I think, you know, I can't because I vote. But I think if you are going to do that, you do have to take into consideration media voting history and media voting logic. And typically, LeBron has not been rewarded. It's often the new story. It's the newer player. And that's where Luca, to me, a guy who just finished fourth right behind

James Harden and LeBron and Yannes. They're not going to give it to Yannis three years in a row. Well, that's the other thing. Yonis is out. Yonis could average 40, 15, and 8. And folks could tell me that his purse 36 are better than Wilk Chamberlain, and he's having the greatest season ever. And if I don't look at the bucks

as the massive overwhelming favorite, I don't understand the numbers, as people were trying to tell me last year. There's no chance he's winning it again. Nobody's won three in a row since Larry Byrd, and Larry Bird, part of winning those three in a row was winning championships. Hardin, obviously, has eliminated himself.

Okay? I don't think the Warriors are going to be good enough. Like, I would be very surprised if Steph, okay, so now who do we got? We got, I think, a dark horse. Luca Tatum. Kauai. Kauai if the clippers are awesome, which they won't because the Paul George thing,

splitting votes. To me, Joelle Embed is a dark horse because I think sixers are going to be excellent. Kevin Durant, obviously. Yeah. And Luca. The problem for everyone, guess what? Like Luca versus LeBron.

Luca's going to average better everything than LeBron in the regular season. Last year, he averaged more points, more rebounds, and almost as many assists. Like, I think it's just, and he's not going to have Anthony Davis. So I just think, I think Luke is going to be the MVP. One thing you said, you just circle back real quick, Kev on Denver. You said Denver's not going to be as good. I don't, I've heard a lot of people say that because, at Jeremy Grant, losing Jeremy Grant notably.

I think that there is a real chance, Jamal Murray in the regular season this year, is better than Jamal Murray was in the regular season last year. And I think Michael Porter Jr. definitely is going to be better. So I think that might be enough to offset the loss of Jeremy Grant. Yeah, we do have to remember. In fairness, what you're saying, I mean, look,

we talked about this a lot through the bubble. You know, Jamal, people lost sight. I think when we watch Jamal Murray in the bubble, people got, it was obviously a bunch of different experience, but he averaged like 18 points a game last year. He was averaging like 40. I mean, in the bubble playoffs. So even if there's just a, even if he just becomes a 25 point per game guy, right, rather than the up and downs that he has consistently had throughout his career. He was not a reliable. It doesn't sound bad. Tell me if you disagree. I thought Jamal Murray

was fantastic. Pre-bubble, I feel like this is what the thing was about, Jamal Murray. Who's a player in a similar bucket, like, as far as overall? The guy he played against. Donovan Mitchell.

Well, Mitchell did the same thing. But let's just take pre-bubble. I thought, I thought, take Donovan Mitchell. Mitchell was, he was a stock, was just kind of like this. and over the course of the regular season. And Jamal Murray was like Bitcoin.

It's like, you know what I mean? It's like you just don't know. And by the way, sorry, Bitcoiners, I know it's only going up. It's going to be $40,000 before we know it. But like the lack of game-to-game consistency was a real thing with Jamal Murray. And then in the bubble, he was just unbelievable.

Now it helped he played such a fraudulent team like the Clippers that nobody saw coming except for Nick Wright. But still, like, I mean, I think they have really something to build on. I also think they might have a trade in them. With Denver, so with Jamal Murray, I do want to see him have more of these nights in the regular season because you're out of that bubble element. I think there's something to the idea of an empty arena without the same depth perception, the issues that some players might encounter an NBA arena. And that could be a real thing for individuals.

Could it be a real thing for Jamal Murray? I think we're going to find that out because I've interviewed, you know, their GM, Tim Conley in recent years. for a story I did and he's he like we hit it straight on with him he's he's talked to jamal maria like you have to be this consistently and we saw that in the playoffs but the fact is is that was such a unique environment and unique circumstances that i'm not weighing that super heavily when it comes to projecting Denver this coming season if we see it early season i'll immediately say you know what they're going to be better jamal marie is for real i'll admit that I was wrong, but I'm not going to use the bubble performance for projecting the coming season right now.

To me, it comes on Yokic. Yokic is going to have to be somebody who steps up even more, even better than he was defensively last season, do even more offensively, even more than he already does. Michael Porter Jr., I don't know, man. Like, I like him. He's a solid young player, but let's see him do this over a larger, you know, longer period of time before we're jumping again. He's actually one of the best young guys. And plus, by the way, he still is also a major injury concern, too.

That's the end, I'm very confident that Mike Ford Jr. is going to be awesome offensively. If he's healthy, but the if he's healthy, Verno, like, is obviously a big concern with him. Well, yeah. And I know you guys are both, you both really like Dallas. I tell you this. Kevin, you're going to laugh because I've made fun of you so many years for, I think Phoenix is the, yeah. Right future sons. I think Paul is going to have a just a profound effect.

on that team. I really do. And their lineup is friggin' good. You see them roll out there, and I know I get the preseason game last night. But like, when you just see their five guys lined up at the beginning of the game, you're like, damn, man, they got some players on this team.

Here's my concern with Phoenix. And I, you hate to assume injury. But Chris Paul was shockingly healthy last year. Yeah, right. For his age and his history. and it's now like the compacted off season, it's like if there was a guy that a team is really going to rely, like anybody can get hurt.

We obviously, you know what I mean? Yeah. But I would like when I look at it, the reason I'm not like betting on the suns over wins or the sons to even make the playoffs. Like I'm not saying they won't, but I wouldn't put money on it is because I do feel like if Chris Paul misses six weeks with a hamstring injury,

to me, as good as they were in the bubble, like they're not markedly better than they were last season. One benefit is, though, one benefit is Phoenix has not been known for really anything over the last 15 years, but they have been known for having an elite level medical staff. They were like way ahead of the curve. I remember talking to, I went and interviewed Jared Dudley in his hotel room at one weekend when he was in town for a game. and he had all this like normatech braces.

This one he's playing for Phoenix. All these like normatex and all this stuff. And I was like, what in the hell is all that? It was like a big case in this room. And I was like, what is all that? And he was like, man, I'll tell you, Phoenix is different than everywhere else. And he's like, they give you this when you get off the plane. Like that's part of your luggage that you take back.

Now, obviously, look, if you got shitty players, it doesn't help anything. But they are, they have always been way ahead of the curve in keeping their players relatively healthy. Can I give you one galaxy brain take about that involves the suns? And then I don't know if we have time, but I'd love to know where you guys are on the nets. Phoenix and Miami this year are going to be the two teams most negatively impacted by COVID because historically they have had such an advantage of players coming to their city

and partying the night before games. So, like, part of, like, Atlanta's big. Okay, that's, no, Atlanta for sure. I just, well, I was thinking of things that, like, people are expecting. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Potentially be, like, really good. Um, like, that is, like, a big, like, under, I don't know,

underrated edge that those teams have. And if the nightlife doesn't exist in the NBA this year, and guys are, like, actually rested after, before Miami and Phoenix games. Maybe that's only worth a couple games. I'm going to reverse Galaxy brain you on this. Yeah. I had a player tell me that the reason

Phoenix was so good in the bubble is because they have a young team and all that shit wasn't able to have. Oh, those guys were out partying. Yes. He said when we put them in the bubble, they didn't have, because, right? And a lot of them are young. There's hot girls everywhere in Arizona.

Yeah. Right? And so that these guys, it benefited them the most because they were. Okay. I wasn't thinking about that. It's a reverse galaxy brain. Maybe it's just Miami. Maybe this is the reason Miami is going to go back to the NBA finals is like the

matured team. Tyler hero. It would hurt Miami, I guess. If Mark Cuban's right, I mean, by April, we're talking about maybe more fans in the stands, hopefully. For sure. I don't know if it's going to come that soon. It's hard to predict the COVID stuff.

I have a hard time with that. With the Chris Paul injury history, that's a concern to me. DeAndre Aetton's going to continue getting better and better every single month. Like he has been through his first two seasons. He was not good in the first preseason game. But have you seen these clips? K.O.C. Really good in the game.

Really good in the game versus Lakers. I got a lot of Chris Paul screaming at DeAndre Jordan vibes when I watched it. Well, I mean, for sure. But he made DeAndre a better player. He did. He made DeAndre and he's going to make Aten a better player too. He already is with some of the feeds that he's giving Aton on the role. that's going to be a really, really good team.

Because we're talking about Chris Paul and Devin Booker and DeAndre Aiton, but the sons are so much more than just those bigger name guys. Michael Burgess is really good. They have like Jay Crowder now, solid role player. They have guys coming off their bench with experience. Derek Jones, Etouan Moore, a great locker room guy. Etouan Moore is like one of the more underrated free agent acquisitions this offseason because of the fact that you're talking about maturity and veteran leadership.

more everywhere he's been has been a player people love he's a good veteran example good voice to have you heard me on this show I went on and on about Crowder you talk to Morant you talk to Jaronjian Jackson you talk to Brandon Clark I mean they worship

this guy he was the OG he was the dude he was because he he busts his ass every single day you know and he just set such a good example and he's like willing to help them along and teach them the NBA

rather than resent them, right? And it has a massive effect on teams. It really does. Because some of the veterans are resentful guys, you know, rather than help along guys. With Phoenix, they have that good mix of veterans and youth and defensive-oriented players. And that's what I worry about with the other team you mentioned

in passing, Nick, and that's the Nets. I'm not sure if the leadership is there. I'm not sure if the defense is there with Brooklyn. And they obviously have final upside. Anytime you have Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving on your team, you have that upside. But everything else, I need to be convinced

that's there. So here's the question. Here's the people will say, this is the first take question. That first take question. It's the first thing's first on FS1 from 730, 930 a.m. Eastern every day, Monday, Friday. Here's the first thing's first question. What is more likely the Nets win the championship

or the Nets don't make it out of round two. Oh, God. Number two, by a wide margin. By a wide margin. Oh, yeah. They win in the title. What? So you said what's more likely?

Kyrie Irving's made it every second one. Wait, what is the last time that Kyrie Irving made a team better? Like, we let's look. Perry Irving, if LeBron hadn't been there, has not, okay, so we're, so, by the way, I don't dispute any of that. I just, I think that I'm not disagreeing with you guys. That's my take as well. And I think that the, I think that people are with the Eastern Conference doing something people sometimes do with like all start teams where it's like, well, this guy's got to be on it, but you don't say who goes off it. You know what I mean? Like if you put a guy on, we, okay. So Milwaukee, Philly, Miami, Toronto, Toronto, Brooklyn,

and there's one more. There's a sixth one. Indiana. Indiana. Indiana, maybe there's not a six. We can, like,

damn. Yeah, we're not putting Indiana in that, Chris. No, come on. No, I thought there was a team

I was forgetting, but I guess not. So that's five. So one of them is not making it a round one. Forget round two. You know what I mean? And then two of them obviously, three of those five, wouldn't make it to conference finals.

And I know people will say, well, Toronto and Miami would be teams that people jump on. Okay, fine. But still, Philly with, I think, going to be a revamped roster and potentially James Hardin, but maybe not. Milwaukee, you know, assuming that Yannis addresses some of the holes. I just think Brooklyn is going to be, and I know I'm not the first person to say this, an aggressively bad defensive too. Like really wow you at because of their top six guys, the best defender is Durant.

And he's coming off in Achilles. And they're not, like he's not there to be like their, you know, rim protector guy. Like so I just, I don't the. They also have Mike Dantone as their lead assistant. not exactly the kind of guy that's screaming you to defend.

Can I ask you guys a different Brooklyn question? And then when you can shut up this is probably going way too long. He doesn't cut out all the stuff in the beginning where I was talking about myself. It's so sad. If the Rockets came to you and you're Brooklyn,

I already know what Vernon's answer is. So I'm just at MSN KLC. They came to you and said, we will trade you James Hardin, and you can pick. you either send us Kyrie Irving and two future first and two pick swaps or you send us Dinwiddie Lavert Allen and two future first and two pick swaps. If you're Brooklyn, what would you do?

I mean, I would do the Kyrie one. And that's because of the mix with that roster with Kyrie and Hardin and Enduring. I'm not so sure that it would work chemistry-wise. Obviously, you have three better. players, but to me, Levert, then Woody Allen, those guys you mentioned, are important players and an important piece of the championship puzzle.

With all that said, though, I mean, Houston's not doing that. They're not going to take Kyrieving back. And for Houston, I wonder, like, we've talked about this a bit, Chris, in recent weeks.

I wonder what team is actually going to step up and give what it takes. Because I'm not sure Brooklyn, like, even in this theoretical example, has enough. Is somebody else got to step up, and surpass them. And for Brooklyn, let's say,

can we at least admit the price hasn't gone up? Well, it hasn't gone up. But for Brooklyn, though, let's say you're not getting hard in. What is the move for Brooklyn? I mean,

is there something that they can do to both of their defense? Is it just finding role players? Is this like a multi-year thing? Or is there a potential trade out there that maybe stands out to you, a player that they should target? I think it's running the offense

through Kyrie Irving in the post. I think you made that pretty clear. Get it made a game, right? I think I, two a quarter. I mean, it's not that much. Yeah. I already on that podcast sounded like Shaq on inside the NBA when he used to rip every center for not having 30 points. And Shaq would be like, it's not that hard.

He's like, you get two dunks and two duckins each quarter. He's like, that's eight points a quarter, a couple points, a couple transition baskets. Now you're 36. Like, what are we talking about it? Like, Kyrie. And when you break it down, it's like, well, two a quarter, that doesn't sound like that much. And it's like, what are we talking about posting up Kyrie Irving? I thought you're Yonis out of the Kumpo.

take, I think it was this morning, Nick was really good with his decision to resign, sort of being an admission of, you know, there's things that he needs to work on too. It's not just about the Bucks or any team that he could have gone to. It's also about himself. And with Yannis and this Bucks team, I feel like I have no confidence that jumper is going to improve. He shot one for four from three the other night, one for seven from the free throw line. You know, I don't feel great about that.

and Drew Holiday, Drew Holiday is obviously going to help that team. But we're talking about defense with Brooklyn, and the bugs were the best defense in basketball last season. They were not the same level in the postseason because of their inability to adjust. Buden Holzer and that team's talked about adjusting more, changing on the fly.

We'll see if it actually happens. But I look at that bat court. You obviously got Drew Holiday, but you got Dante DiVincenzo, DJ Augustine, and Bryn Forbes, three guys who are poor, defenders last season and in recent years. For me, I look at them in certain matchups in the East and I'm like, how are they going

to defend, you know, a Brooklyn? How are they going to defend a Philly or a Boston? Do, are they the same level defensively when that's really what they hang, hung their hat on last season? I would, I would say it would have to start with playing your best players, 42 minutes a game in the postseason. Bingo. And that might mean for Bud, letting them, like my, in KOCU and I talked about this, I understood

the impressiveness of Janus averaging as many points as minutes essentially last year. I got why that was so impressive. I never thought it was smart, though, because if you can't say, hey, this is what, I'm the world record holder in the 400. So let's extrapolate it and say what my mile time would be if you never train for the mile. Like people are like, like, why can LeBron play? And I know LeBron's an outlier, so maybe it's not fair. But why can certain guys play such heavy playoff minutes?

Well, some of it's because they're playing heavy regular season minutes. And I know it's the smart folks say, no, guys play too much and they need to be rested. But you've got to get your body ready for it. And so like there's whether maybe that means you give guys more games. off, but during the regular season, Yanis needs to play more games of 36, 37 minutes. He just does because in the postseason, as like as bad as it looked against Miami, I don't think they're down 03 if he's playing 42 minutes a game. And you can't convince me that at the time, a 25-year-old, like literal and figurative freak,

couldn't play 42 minutes a game. And so like, hey, guess what? through Holiday, Chris Middleton, Janus. How many minutes are in an NBA game? You have 240, right? Guess what? There is 130 of them taking care of it. Now you only have to figure out 110 minutes with everyone else on your roster.

And so, and of course, Janus has to figure out a counterpunch. It's got to figure out a counterpunch. I don't know what it is, but he, listen, LeBron had to figure out a counterpunch one day. And he did. And so, like, guys, guys have to evolve. and Yannis has to evolve. I've done a lot of reporting on that bud stuff. And, you know, I've asked around like, is that a front office thing?

Is that, like, who dictates that in Milwaukee? And my understanding is that is a bud thing. It's not necessarily. It can't be front office anymore now because Yon is locked up. Like, it's not like, it's like, well, he doesn't, you know, with the Anthony Davis thing last year, it was like, why aren't they playing more Anthony Davis at center? And part of it was he didn't want to. And while he's not leaving, he could.

Like, you know what I mean? If the playoffs, if the Lakers playoffs had gone. the way the Clippers did. Then, like, everyone, when LeBron and, and then I'll shut up, I apologize, Berno there. I know you want to ask for something. But when LeBron and AD re-signed, it almost was like not a big story.

I was like, oh, everyone knew it was coming. Everyone only knew it was coming because of how the season is. If the Lakers had blown a 3-1 lead to Houston in round one, and the stories were that guys didn't like playing with LeBron, then there would have been real suspense there, right? And so, like, the, I didn't mean to go in. to that. But my point was, one of the reasons they weren't playing more AD center minutes, because he didn't want to. And he wasn't locked up. If they weren't trying to protect Janus and

whatever, well, now he's locked up. And now the only thing that's separating him and the Pantheon is a championship and at least playing for a championship, like get, at least get to the next step, which is make a finals. They sure they went a step backwards. And so he's got to be better to, for sure. You said to us earlier that you made your bets, that you are degenerative gambler. And you say you like Luca, he is the favorite to win the MVP, and that if you had to put money down, that you would bet on Luca. Anything else that you would bet on for this upcoming NBA season? Oh, yeah. No question about it. Okay. So, do you want to know bets I've made? Yes, yes. Okay, bets I've actually already made. I bet on Lakers win the title, obviously. I would be

shocked if they don't. I bet a Lakers, Sixers, NBA finals. I think the Sixers are in a really, really great position because they get to see if it works with their roster. And if it doesn't, they get to trade for James Hardin. You know what I mean? So it's like you get a free, it's like they have a free role at Ben Simmons, Joel and Beed, Seth Curry, Darry, Darry, Doc Rivers thing. They get a free look at it. If it doesn't work, they can immediately pivot to Harder, who I think is going to be available. So to me, there is, they have two packs there.

They'd be awesome early or, you know what I mean? Or just try to pivot to Hardin. So I like that a lot. I like Memphis to miss the playoffs. How dare you? I like, this isn't a bet, but I think Zion will make an all-MBA team. We'll make one of the all-MBA teams. I think Zion's numbers are going to be.

are going to be out of this world. They'll be absurd, absurd, this season. It will be at least four and a half. I'll take the overall on four and a half articles written about why Danny Aange didn't pull the trigger on the latest big trade and explaining how, listen, guys, there's a nine-year-old in Southern California really has his eyes on for the 2031 draft. And he's stocking up to that.

And I like Lamello Ball. I bet a lot of money on Lamello to win. in rookie the year. You did. Interesting. I did. I just don't, I don't think the Warriors are going to try to make the playoffs. So I don't know if Wiseman's going to play like as heavy of minutes as other guys. I like Anthony Edwards a ton, but I don't know if he's going to have like the wow moments. And I think the Timberwolves are going to try to be good. I don't think they're going to succeed. Edwards won't get the usage because you got cat, you got D.Lowe. Edwards numbers won't be there. like it could be for La Mello.

And I think Lamello, it's just going to be like, hey, here's the car keys. You know what I mean? Like, we'll deal with the highs and the lows. And so I like Lamello to win a rookie of the year. And I would say Brooklyn is all go further than my previous question to you guys. I would, I say Brooklyn is more likely to be out before the conference finals than to just make the NBA finals. Forget win them. I don't think

I think the only way the Brooklyn thing works is if Kevin Durant looks like he never tore his Achilles. And while I hope that's how he looks, most of NBA history says that's good. Like his best case scenario is he's 85 to 90% of what he once was. And if he is that, he's still one of the six best players.

And this could play a big part in that, Nick. I'll just ask you this way. More or less likely that they are a top four seed, which I mean, right? playing. Let's hope we're having. I think there'll be a top four seed because I don't think the defense in matters as much in the regular season. I think there's a certain night you just go out to score people. You know what I mean? Like and it's just guys. And so, but I think in the playoffs,

I think not being able to get stops, you're just ruined. Like, and so, and that is, by the way, the concern with the Mabs on the other side. Like the reason that I am hesitating on pulling the trigger on a Lakers Mabs conference finals, I don't know. what I think the Western. I think the Eastern Conference Finals is going to be Sixers, Milwaukee. I think the Western Conference Finals are going to be Lakers, somebody. Mavs and Nuggets are where my head's at, but

I don't know yet. And oh, I think that you're going to have a fun and very interesting. This isn't a bet. This is a prediction. I think we're going to learn a lot about Steph Curry this

year in this one regard. I think everyone knows that take the 15-16 warriors pre-Dorant, that if you drop, if you took out Steph and you put in Russ in his place or James Harden in his place, those teams are markedly worse, right? They're not 73 wins, they're not champions.

I think everyone understands that. And because of that, Steph fairly is elevated above those guys. And he should be, by the way. He's a better all-time player than both. That doesn't mean he can do what they've done. none of us believe they could have done what he did. But what we know about Hardin and what we know unequivocally about Russ is he can single-handedly will a team, you know, in a regular, in 82 game season,

at least 43 wins and a postseason ber. I want to see if Steph can do that. I really did. I saw I watched them the other night. That roster is bad. Without Clay, without Clay. Without Clay. That's kind of my point.

they don't have players. I mean, I'm watching it. With Steph, that I, look, Steph's an all-timer. That goes without saying. He's a Alzheimer's, but that doesn't mean you can do everything that everyone else can do. And that's what's going to be so fascinating

about this season for the Warriors and for the MVP race and for even how we talk about Steph, because how the Warriors perform in those six or seven minutes in each half where Steph is resting is going to determine how good they are. in the if they're a playoff team in the west if they lock in a top six seed to avoid the

plan or if they're a top four seed and by the way when it comes to the MVP race if they're passable in those 12 14 minutes without step on the floor and if step is really energizing them in those minutes taking more shots taking more threes he could find himself in that MVP conversation maybe absolutely but it's also it what is also true is this i think step is the i just did and I'm going to release it in some format soon. The 50 best players of the last 50 years, so Kareem to now. I've got Steph slotted in at 13, right behind Kevin Durant, Moses Malone, and Dr. Jay.

And ahead of Dirk and ahead of a lot of great, you know, well, everyone but 12 guys. I want to see him drag a team. We know guys that are considered worse than him could do it. Russ, the first year Katie left, that team Russ had was not good. And we can talk about the triple doubles being overrated, whatever it was. He drugged them to the playoffs. Just said, you know what? On my will alone.

And I think Steph can do it. But I want to see it. So I just want to, nobody can take away how great he is on a good team. Like Steph Curry, you add Steph Curry to a good team. And he has the ability to be as impactful on the offensive end, as Apex LeBron. Like, that's what he was in 2016. Nobody can ever deny that.

The 2016 version of Seth Curry was like the most unstoppable offensive player, one of them that I've ever seen. It looked like he had broken the sport. But that doesn't mean I want to see him on this. That's why I was so mad last year he broke his hand. I was like, I wanted to see it. But then unfortunately, Clay got hurt again. So we're able to see this.

He's going to have to average over 30 points for that team to be worth of shit. I promise you that. By the way, before last season, I picked Steph to win. MVP last season for all the reasons we're talking about. I picked them to make the second round of the playoffs. I think I thought step would carry him. Clay would come back. So I'm not saying he can't do it. I'm just saying I want to see just like you know what I want to see Kevin O'Connor and Chris Vernon carry their own channel. It's one thing to be a part of the ringer the ringer NBA show you know this great collection. Let's see them carry their own channel and see how it

works. So that's what I would say. We've got our fingers crossed. Yeah. But hey, we're off to a good start with guys like Nick Wright say yes to coming on this show. We are big time appreciative for you coming on, honestly. And thank you so much for a nice, nice words at the beginning. It's been fun having you on with us. Absolutely. Thanks, you guys. Continued success.

I appreciate you guys having enough. Thank you, Nick. That is going to do it for another episode of The Mismatch. Everybody, have a wonderful and safe weekend, and we will talk to you on Tuesday.