The Mismatch - Six Players Who Deserve More Recognition This Season. Plus: LeBron James's Comments on NBA All-Star Plans.

Episode Date: February 5, 2021

Verno and KOC are back this Friday talking about Adam Silver’s LeBron James–induced headache over the NBA’s All-Star plans in Atlanta (0:30) and James's MVP-level performance against the Nuggets on Thursday night (18:05). Then KOC officially hits the panic button on the struggling Dallas Mavericks, as Kristaps Porzingis continues to play below expectations (28:16). And finally, KOC and Verno give some love to six players who deserve more shine for their achievements this season (41:30). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, this is Kevin O'Connor. On today's episode of The Mismatch, Chris Vernon and I talked about a lot. This was a really, really good show. We opened up talking about LeBron James saying that he's not feeling great about the idea of an All-Star game, his MVP chances after a huge win on Thursday night over the Nuggets. We also talked about the Dallas Fabrics and whether it's time to hit the panic button on them, as well as some players that we think deserve some attention and some shine. All that coming up next.

Welcome to the mismatch. I'm Chris Vernon. and join him as he does every Friday from the ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor, a.K. Kevin O'Bomber, Kevin O'Connor, Kevin O'Connor, Kevin O'Conflict, Kevin O'Candibus, Kevin O'Kandemann, Kevin O'Kindness, Kevin O'Hourne. It's Friday. What up? It is Friday, and we started the day off this morning with a little controversy. Dave McMinneman from ESPN had a report from last night after the Lakers, which was a very impressive win over the Denver Nuggets.

LeBron James spoke about the recently scheduled All-Star game, and he is not enthused. Quote, I have zero energy and zero excitement about an All-Star game this year. I don't even understand why we're having an All-Star game. Short off season for myself and my teammates, 71 days. And then coming into the season, we were told that we're not having an All-Star game, so we'd have a nice little break, five days from. the 10th, 5th through the 10th of March, an opportunity for me to kind of recalibrate for the second half of the season, my teammates as well, some of the guys in the league, and then

they throw an All-Star game on us, and it just breaks that all the way up. So pretty much kind of a slap in the face. Wow. I mean, it's like we talked about, not what Adam Silver needed this morning, right? Not at all. I'm sure he's not happy. It's like we talked about earlier in the week when those reports started trickling out about the potential of an all-star game increasingly certain that it would happen. I don't know, man.

I'm still not sure this is the right thing to do. I know it's not the right thing to do. It's just not worth the risk. Ultimately, it's another choice about, you know, fulfilling the TV contract and being able to earn all that. And I just don't think it's worth it. You're bringing the best players from all 30 teams to one place, one city right now that is open in Atlanta. It just doesn't seem worth it, Chris, and I think we're going to find Mbid expressed also last night that he's iffy about doing it. You know, there's been other players that have been, you know, reluctant to want to do something like that. It wouldn't shock me one bit, Chris, if we got players that end up pulling their name out from that All-Star game to get that rest and just

not go because there's already so much sacrifice happening for the good of their own teams. Why do that for an exhibition during a pandemic? Well, I think the big part of all of this is that their expectation was we will have this break. There's a lot of games in a shortened amount of time. And so I don't think if it was already at the very beginning, if everybody kind of understood and we're having an All-Star game, but that was something to look forward to for these guys. It was something to look forward to that they were going to have this break in the middle

of this. And I'm sure a lot of them probably scheduled stuff to be able to. to get away or made some plans to be able to get away. And so this has all kind of been thrown together recently. And so it's more to me, it's not about if it would have already been scheduled. And everybody was under the understanding that this was going to be happening, it would be a different deal than you throwing it on them now. But when you set your expectation that we're not going to do this and it's a tough position, Kibb, because like the NBA, in order to make their argument. It's one thing for Deeran Fox to say it's stupid. DeRen Fox signed a $180 million contract.

It's one thing for LeBron James to say it's stupid. He's a made man. He doesn't, you know, he doesn't need the money. And it doesn't impact him. There are guys that have this stuff like as incentives in their contracts. That's number one. Number two, though, and more importantly, the only way for the NBA to make the argument that people, and there would still be people that say, oh, well, you're just being, you know, a slave to the mighty dollar would be to outline it and say, this is the financial impact and this is why we desperately need this to happen. Yes, in the end, LeBron James is going to be paid hundreds of millions of dollars.

DeR. Fox even, you know, he got his money. And he, his contract. Those guys are set. but it is for the well-being of the league all these other guys that are maybe year to year and keeping their job in the league and whatever else that they're the ones that the finances of the league affect the most and the only way to make a persuasive argument would be to truly outline here is the financial impact of us doing this and here's how here's why it is good for our league and the majority of our league.

Because you know that's why Michelle Roberts and, you know what I'm saying. That's why they're down with it in the first place. Nobody's, nobody's trashing Michelle Roberts because there's an All-Star weekend because she's privy to the information, right? And it's not like they're going to release that to the general public, but the truth is the financial impact must be so great that they're willing to take But they can leak it. They can leak it.

You know, we did, we did learn and understand the reason to finish the season last year, right? Yep. And I think a lot of people who may have been iffy about it understood why. You know, you had players. I remember Ed Davis came out and defended why they were playing and why it was important to, as did many, many, many other players last year before the bubble actually got going. So, you know, I think that clarity and that openness and honesty, about it would be more well received than anything else.

Maybe so. Also, Kev, to your point, that's why we started at Christmas. You're right? I mean, they didn't want to have that quick of a turnaround. So they didn't want to have the, some people didn't want to finish the season. Some people didn't want to start the season in December. And obviously, you're now getting some people out there saying, hey, we don't want to have an All-Star game.

And I understand the player safety angle of. of it, I think it's more that these guys wanted and look forward to being able to have a break, right? And in the absence of the NBA explaining to everyone, yo, here's the financial impact of us doing this. This is why we are doing this. We're not doing it just to have, and there are going to be people out there like, oh, yeah, well, you'll just do anything for money. You'll put people at risk. You'll do this, whatever. But people need to see. the numbers, you know what I mean? And like understand that the reason that this is, they want to throw this together is because a league that has been financially suffering, you know, as have

many leagues, is trying to find a way to make things right. Because here's the thing, Kef, in the NBA, it is not like every other business. The players share in the revenue. So this money is greatly impactful for the league as a whole. And it's not like, oh, yeah, the league wants to put this on. They get all the money. I have to lose my vacation. Like, whatever they make off of this All-Star weekend, the players are going to benefit from that also, you know?

Yeah, no doubt about it. I mean, ultimately, I mean, you kind of hit it right there. It's, you know, I'm not sure how to say it exactly, but like to harken back to our conversation me either earlier this week or last week. I mentioned I picked up pizza at a place and like nobody had masks on inside and right. Someone messaged me saying like, you know, KOC, like I love the show and all that, but you got to understand that, you know, people have to work jobs and put food in the table. I'm like, I know, I do. I do totally understand that. Like, you can't lock down everything. The government is not sending checks to everybody every month like many other governments are.

Totally understand. Ultimately, you know, there are benefits to play in the game. You're going to have arena workers there that are going to be able to get a paycheck. Another. night, which could be the difference between getting a meal or not, right? There are benefits to doing it and holding the game on a real level for people that need that money and need that check. There are benefits. Ultimately, just from the NBA perspective, from the NBA's perspective here, it through the pros outweigh the cons for the players, for the rest of the season, for the health and safety of the players, not only with, you know, the risk of getting coronavirus, but the risk of the fact that you don't have those five days off during a truncated season where there are a lot of

games packed in, you know, near each other, especially in the second half. We might see that depending on what the scheduling looks like where you could get an injury. You know, we saw a member last year, Kemper Walker, he was not the same after his like 35 minute, 40 minute, all-star game. So, you know, do the pros outweigh the cons? Probably not. Probably not. Would you still watch the game if it's on?

100% Yeah, me too. Does that make as hypocrites? No, it doesn't make as hypocrites. I don't think it's either. I mean, look, again, I would have to know and I guess we're going to find out because if it's not a great,

if it's not super significant, if the amount of money is not worth this, PR, well, your best player in the league coming out and saying, it's an agreement that the players association in the league came about,

it's out of my hands, I'll be there if I'm selected. I'll be there physically, but not mentally. In other words, he's saying he's not going to bust his butt like he did in last year's All-Star game, but that great game. In other words, we're not going to get one of those. It's going to be an All-Star game with Open Dunks and not a lot of defense. Well, I think the other thing is this, it's in Atlanta, which is a more open city

than most of the cities around the country. And so what do you expect? Right. Like, I mean, really, are you going to send all these guys to Atlanta? And then you're going to, and the expectation is, I mean, I don't know. It's kind of like years ago. I thought it was funny. I had this, I had this agent. Are you saying to send him to Utah or something? Yeah, I, maybe so. I thought there's respect to Utah. I'm just saying. It's interesting because years ago, I had this guy that was a, he was a player agent in the league. And he was, and this is never really. taken where you've had a lot of teams that have ever, like, not wanted. In fact, it's grown bigger in Las Vegas, right, for the summer league to be there. But this is probably 10 years ago.

And the guy said to me, he goes, these kids, he goes, I get them, you know what I mean, they signed with our organization that are, are a company out of college. And he's like, and then they get drafted. And then we put, you know, a million dollars in their pocket. And the first thing we do is send them to Las Vegas. Yeah, right. He's like, what sense does this make? He's like, because he, and he said, and he told me this horror story of a player that years ago, he was like, he, he blew his whole first check.

Oh my gosh. He's like, I was having to advance him money, like right off the bat. And he's, and obviously, they've done such, they've done a much better job about education and everything. else since then. And it hasn't been a catastrophe. But it is funny. And it's like, if something bad comes out of, if we find like, if there's a TMZ, like, oh, these five guys were at Magic City last night.

Like, is anybody, man, like, what are you? I don't know. You know, at Las Vegas Summer League, I have yet to gamble a dollar. Is that true? That's 100% true. I've yet to gamble a dollar in Vegas. Look at you. you. I think next time around I'll play some like of the futures bets in Vegas or something like that.

I wish that. Hey, I wish. And this is why we are the mismatch. I wish that were true of me. I still get. Do you remember the first time we ever met in person was at the win in Las Vegas? This is probably four years ago. And to this day, I haven't stayed at the, win, I don't think, since then. I still get emails offering me free nights, comps, everything. That week was a debacle.

I think they think I'm a high roller just because of how badly that that was like my first time at Summer League and I went absolutely off the charts. And I remember they sent this letter

to my house. And it was Mr. Vernon, this is probably six months after Summer League. They're like, Mr. Vernon, we would like to offer you three complimentary nights and $500 in free play and something, something. And I was like, wow. I said, how much did I lose? I was like going back and looking at my bank account. And I was like, oh, my God. Is that the year you had the 100th floor in the winter?

That was crazy. Greatest view. I can't believe the Grizzlies. That was supposed to go to like Mike Conley. I know. The first night, the first night that I was there, I, it's like two in the morning. And I'm like, and I'm trying to go to bed. Is this the concert?

I think you've told me this. Yeah. And it was like, doodoo, I want something just like this. And I was like, geez, man. I was like, they were playing that chain smoker is a little too loud. for two in the morning, whatever. And I looked out my window, it was the freaking chain smoker.

It was really them playing downstairs. And I'm like, where am I? What is happening? Yeah, that was all, that was all a blur. Vegas was something else.

Yeah. I can't wait to go back. Like, I think for any fan, for any fan listening to the show, if you were able to go to Summer League. Oh, it's amazing.

I think it is such a fun time to just hang with friends. And just have a good time watching carefree, you know, exhibition basketball. You're high off the draft and you're excited to watch your your favorite young player that your team just drafted. Or you're worried about the guy that your team just drafted and you're scared at the game. It is such a fun environment. Just walking around Vegas and nights at Vegas, Chris, like it's hot during the day, July, even though we'll see with the season schedule what happened in the future. But nights at Vegas and the sun's down.

it's so nice walking around. I love it. It's so freaking fun. I can't wait to see you again there, Chris. Yep. It's going to be great. Hopefully. So back to the little Bronn thing.

I wonder if Adam Silver is going to acknowledge this. Because this is kind of like the first time. Yeah. LeBron is such a powerful entity in the world of sports that, you know, when De Aaron Fox says it's stupid for us to have an All-Star game, that passed at 12 hours. I mean, there's people listening to this right now that don't even know Deeran Fox said that.

Yeah. It will be everywhere. 100%. No, LeBron James said that. I'm sure. I'm sure like in first take, they're talking about it.

And, you know, first things first and all these shows, you know, they're talking about it. Yes. So that is the one guy. I mean, Adam Silver has to be like,

oh, no. Yeah. Oh, geez. Because now it's a thing. LeBron has the power to say, hey, if LeBron came out last night and say, look,

I wish I had a, I wish I had a vacation like everybody else. I was really looking forward to that. We had a short season, but like this season is unlike any other season, and we all have to make sacrifices. And so I'll be there just like I am every year. And it's not ideal, but nothing about this last year has been ideal. It goes away and everybody's like, yeah, yeah, let's have an All-Star game.

Or he could go the opposite way, which he did on that. and you see that now everybody's going to be debating it, there will be think pieces about the dangers involved with it. Like, he's that guy. Like, what he says goes. And so, and you're also going to have a lot of players fall in line behind that and be like, this is stupid. I don't want to be here.

And if he walks into that locker room and everybody knows, he's checked out, he don't want to be there in the first place. Like, I don't know. It's just, like, he really, one of the first times that he's really like wielded that that power you know we're about to see what that power how that power impacts change we are speaking of lebron james and that team he was unbelievable last night oh my goodness and that you know that looked like you know you always look ahead and it was the western conference finals last year you feel like denver is going to be a real

playoff team at the end of this year if everybody stays healthy. And a potential MVP in yoga, sure. Yeah, and you've got two fantastic teams playing against each other last night. And Denver really looked like they were there for it in the first half. And then the second half came and that Lakers team buckled down. And I'll tell you this, when they want to get stops, they get stops. End of store. They are devastating defensively when they really.

lock in. They are something else, man. They are something else. What does it say? I don't want to get into MVP debate when we're like a third into the season, but doesn't say something that in the past week, LeBron has outplayed Yokic and Embed and they're both matchups. Granted, they lost by a point to the Sixers last week. Right. Beat, you know, throttling the nuggets last night. You know, I understand, you know, LeBron's probably not going to win MVP, but I feel like that. Why? I think he's overwhelming favorite right now. Interest. So, I mean, I find it fascinating because, you know, when I read NBA Twitter and what

others are writing and like these MVP ladder rankings and all that, a lot of people put Yokic in a beat at the top. And you're saying that LeBron should be the favorite for most valuable players. I think especially after last season, he made everybody feel stupid for not voting for him. As we talked about recently, that was a thing. That will play a factor you're saying. He said after the season, I don't really know what we're looking at. I don't know.

Remember, he? Yeah. I mean, I'll tell you what. I'll tell you what, Chris. A couple weeks ago, I kind of pushed back saying, yeah, probably being B to Yokic. And we'll see. I mean, it's still a long way to go. But I'd put LeBron up top on my personal ballot right now.

Like, if I were voting today, I'd put LeBron at number one. I think the tone that he sets defensively, like put away the numbers. We know the numbers. We know LeBron does every night. 27, 7, and 7. That's what's career averages. We know that. But the tone he sets defensively at hit is his age in year 18 coming off the shortest off season ever is truly remarkable to witness.

It really is. Chris, like when your best player sets that tone, it trickles down to the entire team and inspires everybody. And we see that roster with a bunch of guys that play with that mindset. Did you see that play Dennis Schrooter made last night, diving on the floor twice? That was insane. I mean, like, effort plays like that happening in a early February game, I mean, it happens time and time again with that team. When they lock in defensive way, there's nobody better on that end of the floor.

Well, and we talked about the last dance and, you know, we kind of, we opined that that may have, that may have had an effect on LeBron really putting pedal to the medal throughout this season. And I also think that oddly he was able to get a little bit of a chip on his shoulder because of the Yonis stuff last year. And he said after the season, I don't know what the criteria are. I remember him saying that, right? But you think about this, I think that also that kind of stuff and more people being aware of the history of everything can have a profound effect. Because much like the Jordan thing, LeBron did not get a. awarded that. He went on. He led a team to victory in the NBA finals. He won another title.

He's the one there at the end holding that trophy. And there's people saying he's still the best player in our league. And so they think about this through a historical context more so because there is the, we saw Carl Malone win an MVP and then he gets vanquished. And Charles Barkley wins an MVP. And then he gets vanquished. And we saw that happen. And we saw that happen. And we saw that happened with Jordan. I mean, LeBron has, he's only won that award four times. You talk about 17 years of greatness. And the last time he won it was 13. He won it in 2009. He won it in 2010. He won it in 12 and he won it in 13. I mean, that's eight years ago. It was the last time LeBron James was named MVP of the league. And I think there is, I think

that's part of it. That there's just human nature for there to be an attempt to make some kind of course correction. You know what? I've had execs, including two general managers from rival teams, teams like LeBron has, you know, had good battles with their regular season

in playoffs and in the past tell me that they think LeBron should have like 10 MVPs. I'm serious. They don't get the media always trying to find somebody else. And I've told the story before, but the year hard and one MVP. I had a GM on the phone tell me he's like, you know, I get the numbers,

I get the offensive impact, I get everything Hardden does. He said, but what media and fans don't consider enough when it comes to the term MVP, most valuable player, is how does this player impact his team in terms of chemistry, in terms of leadership, in terms of example? And he went into this long, you know, rant about how LeBron is better than anybody at that. and how not only his accomplishments on the floor are enough to put him in the conversation for MVP, but everything else he does for that team elevates him to an even higher level. And he also mentioned, like, you know, in the regular season, he's also not always going full throttle because he knows he's going until June, you know, to a final.

And you know what, man, it's amazing. Like, if you had executives vote, I would be willing to bet that LeBron would have more than four MVPs. if execs voted. And one reason why is because I think they have felt the pain of what he takes from you more than anybody else when they're on the other side of that because he just takes it every year, year in, year out. He just takes what you're hoping to win and achieve away. And they feel that and they see that and they know that and they experience it.

And ultimately, you could be right, Chris. This could be the year of course correction where LeBron is awarded an MVP in year 18. Which is remarkable. And by the way, like, because that becomes a great story too, right? A guy winning an MVP 18 years into his career is that's like, that's crazy. It's insanity. It really, it really is remarkable.

I mean, like, I know like on today's show we're going to talk about some guys that we feel like aren't talked about enough. But like in many ways, like with LeBron, I know we talk about him enough, but don't take what's happening for granted. Just don't. Right. We go. You can't, man. You can't. By the way, like a quick, a quick aside note here.

I saw on Twitter this morning, today is the anniversary of the Patriots coming back from down 28 to 3. Is that right? 28 to 3 happened. Like, this whole week has been a string of like on this day, the Patriots lost Super Bowl 42, David Tyree catch on this day, you know, lost the Eagles. On this day, they won this Super Bowl. Like, it's all been a string of memories. And like I was just thinking this morning about when the Patriots are down 28 to 3 that game,

I remember my. dad and I turning to each other and we're scared, but we both felt this isn't over. This isn't over because we have Tom Brady. And that level of belief that you have in a guy when you've seen him author so many magical moments since I was 11 years old, Chris, I was 11, 11 years old when Tom Brady won his first Super Bowl. And now that I'm 30, I was 26 when that one happened, you know, that level of belief you can have in a player is remarkable.

and the fact they're still going is not something to take for granted at all. And the fact we have LeBron and Tom Brady both competing at this level at this stage of their careers, this is something that when we're all old and gray, we're going to look back on and think, oh my goodness, how lucky were we to experience that greatness in sports together with the people we care about, with the people, even whether you root against the person or root for them?

I mean, it's special, man. the fact that these guys are still going. It's awesome. It truly is awesome that this is happening. I don't use that word lightly. This is awesome. Well, I suppose that the only one that wasn't paying close attention to the whole, because I think you guys were super fans of Brady,

but there were still people, he always, when the other team had him, you knew that they had a chance, right? I suppose the only one that didn't watch that was like, at LaFleur, head coach of the Green Bay Packers. Because when he punted away to him with 210 left, or he kicked away to him with 210 left, I remember saying to my buddy, I said, this is the equivalent of I'm down by one against Michael Jordan and the Bulls.

And I go and I'm going to take the last shot. And I go and I take the last shot, but I take it with 10 seconds left. and now I'm giving the ball back to him and it's like, what do you expect, bro? What do you think? It's been 20 years of this. Like, are you expecting to win that? Why are you giving him the ball?

You know, because to go get the first down. He's getting the first down. That's what's happening. That was an unforgivable mistake. Unforgivable. What do you expect? Yeah. What do you expect?

Like, really? I don't know. That's the equivalent to me is like, you gave Michael Jordan the ball with 10 seconds left to go. What do you expect? You deserve to lose, bro. You deserve it. Unforgivable.

Anyways, all right. So that takes place as I said. And to your point, I want to pivot off of the LeBron thing and the whole leadership thing that the executive told you about. Because that is one of the things that we are seeing young players throughout the league go to. Part of becoming outstanding players quickly is that. that franchises now, like, they turn the keys over to you. And some guys are prepared for that and some guys aren't. But you talk about how guys, you know, they follow LeBron's lead on these teams.

And we're seeing that happen with some of these young players that were annoyeded so quickly. And one of them is Luca. You know, we're seeing that, that they have turned the keys over to Luca. And it's like, follow my lead. And some guys are not cut out for. for the whole, you know, they're not the guy with the sword at the front of the group saying, follow me, you know, and some guys are. You know, and I do think that that is one of those where the credit to LeBron is that so many of the guys take on that personality, right,

or that swag or whatever you want to call it. And I think you're seeing a lot of young guys throughout the league go through it, where it's, you know, you're really learning on the fly how to be the guy, right? And I even saw it last night with a frustrated John Moran. When he is mad at the refs and he's going to the basket and he's not getting some calls and he's frustrated and the team takes on his personality. They just do. When he's flying around and he's knocking down shots and he's got the swag.

going than the team. It's like it lifts all ties. And you're seeing it with Luca too. And they just got ran out last night against Golden State. I mean, giving up almost 150 in regulation is truly incredible. I'm officially pressing the panic button. You are with the Dallas Mavericks, especially because of Chris Tapsp's Porsing is he is not the same player defensively, Chris. He's just not the same player defensively. And if he's not, his, impact is completely minimized overall when he's not hitting three at the same level. He's not a knockdown guy. 35, 36% from three is great, you know, for a guy his size, though.

When he's not hitting threes, when he's not being an enforcer around the rim, that team cannot be what it needs to be. And right now, I mean, I look at that roster. And I feel better with Maxi Kleba out there that I do with Chris Taps, poor thing is different. It changes the style of the team, but he's a better shooter. he's a better defender, more versatile, more switchable, hustles more. KP does not look the same and like, you got to be a little bit forgiving.

He's coming back from a meniscus surgery. That's right. During the offseason, he's working his way back. But guess what? That's part of the source of the concern is durability and health, his ability to stay at 100% and stay on the court. That was the concern prior to the draft. That was the concern with the New York Knicks.

that's one of the key reasons why Phil Jackson traded him in addition to him wanting out. Him wanting out pushed his way out the door. But Phil Jackson and the Knicks front office wasn't against it. They had concerns long term about him. Dallas took the risk, a fair risk to take to add a player of his caliber with his talent. And we saw last year 27 points per game, 11 rebounds, two blocks, dominant force over the last 20, 25 games of the season into the playoffs, before he got hurt again. His 13th time having an injury to his lower body in his short NBA career.

He's missed an entire season. He's 7 foot 3. And the history of 7 foot 3 players are taller in the NBA is not very promising for their health. And so for the Dallas Mavericks, they have to now seriously, seriously evaluate how do we maximize this roster around Luca so he's not pissed off all the time? This isn't happening because, like, you can point to Lucas, you know, frustrations and, you know, he's got to be better on defense himself. Lucas had some really poor possessions on the defensive end of the floor that are really tough to watch.

But what's more infuriating is the fact that Christop's poor thing is the guy you're paying $30 million and traded two first round draft picks for is a shell of his former self. What's more infuriating is the fact that your team is last in three point percentage. That is annoying. The, I tell you this, yeah. The average fans on my timeline, they are done with him. Done. With KP, I know.

They are. I don't know if you can't get anything for him. You can't get value. You know what I mean? Like you need him to work his way back into being good, try to, you know, that his value is on life support. You know, and maybe he can resuscitate some to where, you know, somebody out there says, I'll take a, I'll take a crack at it, right? it's better than what I've got. But right now, like, this is, it's not even buying low. Like, you just couldn't even get any, you couldn't get anything close to a good return for him at this

point. So you've just got to cross your fingers and pray that as he works his way back, that you look in three weeks to a month from now, he is a lot more like the guy they had last year than this version because this year's version has been pitiful. I wrote about this on Monday about the concerns about KP. I wrote about it last year. I wrote about at the time of the Knicks trade. I have serious concerns. And this is, you know, I love KP.

I love KP in 2014 the year he pulled his name out of the draft when Oklahoma City wanted him. I remember I wrote about for Celtics blog at the time like, who is Chris Stavs for Zingis? You know, put on my draft guide, scatter, report. It was like, hey, I want the Celtics to draft this guy. high upside player, a little risky, but go for it. Pulled his name out, becomes a top five pick, goes to the Knicks, and he shines.

He became, you know, the player, Knicks fans were before. He became a unicorn. He became a player that made Knicks fans feel hope for the first time in a long time, which is why that trade was so painful. But unless a player can stay available, unless a player can stay healthy, unless a player can stay at their near peak level, which he hasn't shown that he can do ever in his career. Even the year he started out with the Knicks averaging 30 points per game

over the first 10-15 games. And that was the unicorn year, I think. He fizzled. Hold on, Kemp, you had talked yourself into it because if you go back and listen to our season preview, you were really high on the Mavs. For sure. And I kept fighting you and saying, like, this guy does not stay healthy.

You're right. Like he has to be, he has to be. It was just a hedge against. against him. I don't know. I think it's, look, the history of seven foot three guys playing basketball is not great, you know, especially guys that are athletic, you know, guys, not just like trees that stand in front of the basket. It's even though achieving the trees, it's hard to have long careers. I'll be honest with you, Chris. I think with my Dallas projection ahead of the season, I expected KP to still be better than this. I expected Josh Richardson to be more

like the Miami version. He has not. He's been worse than the Philly version. and Finney Smith. It looks like his 37% from three last year may be an outlier. He's back down to his career level, career averages. Other guys in that team are falling below what they did last year. This entire roster, almost all of them are underwhelming. And, you know, I think a lot of Mavericks fans will contribute that to the fact that they, I believe they've had the most games missed due to the COVID protocols. It might be wrong about that, but they're near the top of the league, at least. That plays a factor. But I don't think. it plays as much of a factor in the fact that there's something fundamentally wrong with

this team, whether that's leadership with Luca, whether that's just the encore product, or whether it's something with coaching and Rick Carlisle's voice not resonating in the same way that it has in the past, whatever it might be, there's something seriously wrong that needs to be addressed with the Dallas Maver's. My buddy Tim McMahon, I listened to him on with Zach Lowe, and I thought this was was mega fascinating, Kev. He talked about, and this is something that somebody like Tim who's around that all the time and really covers that team would know that I wouldn't necessarily,

that I wouldn't be privy to. And he talked about how they made a choice in that offseason, that they kept pushing this leadership role on Luca, that this is going to be the guy. Rick Carlisle talked about it a lot. And this was what was fascinating. He said Berea was he was the veteran. He was the steadying voice.

He was Lucas Yoda, as it were, right, for that team. And he's not just saying that because he's short. But he was like, it was almost like the team conscience, right? There's a reason that, well, yeah, maybe baby Yoda. There's a reason that like, you know, Eudanus Haslam does not necessarily contribute on the court at all for the Miami heap. but they still got them around, right? And there was a reason that for so many years, JJ Berea, and he was still contributing to that team

and had an effect on the court for them. But that voice in the locker room, being like that guy, kind of like the holdover from even the title, you know, that the Mavs won, like this guy that was the team's conscience and this, the leader, you wouldn't necessarily expect that to be so.

with somebody like J.J. Berea. But he thought that that had a, you know, kind of a profound effect. And in the end, you know, players have the impact. You know,

you have to have your, your best players on your side and guys that people will follow and guys that people will listen to. And that's one of those things that I don't think. I think that in this world we live in, you just look on paper and you say,

ah, well, so what? They got rid of JJ Berea. They added Wesse Wendew, no big whoop. But it's something that can never be quantified is having that veteran voice and that guy lost for that team. And I was fascinated by that.

I really was because that is, I can see, how that is so. Because it really don't have, like, the veteran guys, right? On that team. You know, Luca, it's kind of, that's Lucas team now.

End of story. And I don't know. Like, it's one of those minor things that takes place in the grand scheme of the NBA, but Mike could have changed a team dramatically. Your player, so Dallas on their roster, there are players who are older than 28. Maxi Kleba,

Dwight Powell, Bobon, and James Johnson. Those are their four guys all over them, 28 years old. And ultimately, none of those guys are necessarily that, you know, vocal leader type. You know, they don't have their hassle. They don't have their beret. And I wonder how that's an unquantifiable, you know, variable that we don't know how much of a difference that makes. You always need the vets. You just do.

because they teach everybody else how to, guys that are young in the league, they don't know, right? So when they take that first crushing loss, you know, they need somebody saying, don't get too high, don't get too low. We've got another game in 24 hours. All of this can change at the drop of a hat, right? Don't get too frustrated, whatever it may be. Just let it go with the refs.

Like somebody that's not getting the calls that night, somebody to just go over to the bench, And be there and say, look, man, like, this ain't it, right? Like, I mean, you can't, you can't let them get to you like they're getting to you tonight. But like we talked about, though, that wouldn't change the fact that you have a team with KP who's struggling. That's last three point percentage. Luca, who needs to be better on defense and so on and so forth as we've hit the last couple weeks and today. That wouldn't change everything, but it would make a difference.

And, you know, bottom line is I have pressed the panic button with Dallas. and it's clearly time for them to evaluate what changes need to be made to maximize this roster around Luca. All right. So this week I watched The Void. Very good video you did on Lou Dort, the Hardin Stopper.

Yeah. And so with that in mind and what you guys are doing with Ringer University, one of the things you guys do with Ringer University is highlight young players that maybe aren't always the topic of conversation, much like Lou Dort. It's not going to be the topic.

of conversation on NBA shows that you hear about a lot. So what we want to do this week is try to highlight three guys each that are not getting the acknowledgement necessarily. They're not part of the national conversation all the time, but we think that they deserve to get a little shine for what they've done so far this season. I'm going to start off with an older guy because typically on Ringer NBA University, which will be out again next Wednesday. I look forward to doing that next week.

We focus on younger guys. So let's take advantage of having an older guy here. No rule limits. No age limits. Thaddeus Young, Chris. Oh! That is young. He's averaging a career high.

4.3 assists per game at age 32, up from only 1.7 throughout his career because Chicago is using him more in positions to facilitate. I know Nikias Duncan from basketball news.com had a great Twitter thread about this recently, where he talked about Thaddeus Young being used in more dribble handoff situations that gets him at positions like a bam, you know, to playmate for his team in the half court, brings the ball up the court a little bit. And it's fun watching Chicago play through Thadius Young at time. And it feels like his ideal role. It's fun to watch him have arguably a career best season at age 32. And I just wanted to highlight that because when we talk about Bulls, it's never about Thaddeus Young.

We didn't even talk about this. and you probably don't know this, but this is a subject close to my heart. I love Thadde's Young. Daddy's Young's a Memphis kid. His wife owns a beauty shop like maybe a couple miles from my house.

Like during the summer, you see Thaddea's Young out at his kids games. I don't know that. Around town. The first time I saw Thadius Young, one of the best high school players I've ever seen.

I've been watching since high school. He's a Memphis kid. I had no idea. Yeah, he is. Totally. He's grained in the community. Wow. So I mean like, yeah.

He, um, uh, yeah, his wife owns like a, like a spa and beauty shop called Forever Young. Okay. I see he went to Mitchell. Mitchell High school and Pennsylvania. Okay. Wow. That's funny. All the times I've been on his basketball reference page.

I've never glanced at born New Orleans, Louisiana. High school, Mitchell in Memphis. This is hilarious too. So you know I am a, a big collector of sports memorabilia. this is true story. There's two, I got two, every once or a while, if I'm bored at night, I'll go search through eBay and see what kind of auctions there are for like bobbleheads. And I see if there's bobbleheads that I want to get. I got a Brooklyn Nets Thaddiator bobblehead. And it's Thaddeus Young in like the gladiator outfit with a sword and the

gladiator outfit. And it says the Thadinator. or whatever. And the other one I got was Ben Wallace holding up a trophy, but the bobblehead has the real fro. Like it has real hair on it that pops out. Those are the

two that I got. Two of my most recent purchases on eBay. That is funny, man. Thaddy Aided. I just looked up the fattiest young bobblehead on eBay. Yeah, 25 bucks. It's pretty good. I didn't pay 25 bucks for it, by the way.

I wanted it in like an auction. Oh, yeah, I see. It's like a buy it now. Buy it now. Off from 10 bucks. Maybe you'll get it, right? Yeah, right. It's a great bubblehead.

That's cool. I hope he has one of those. I am actually going to go with the veteran too. And this is the guy that has spent his entire career not getting the acknowledgement that he deserves. And that is Mike Conley. He has this year, but, you know, last year was a real struggle for Conley in Utah, like kind of finding his way within the context of that team.

And that team never really got it going until the bubble. And that's when they were without Bogdanovich that they kind of hit a stride. And of course, he missed a three at the buzzer that, you know, it changed the plight of both Utah and Denver, as sister will tell it. He came back, he missed that three at the buzzer. He came back this year. and he is never going to be a guy that you see on highlights that get passed around every night via social media. That's not what he does. He doesn't have highlight games unless you hit a game winner, you're probably not going to see Mike Conley highlights.

He is leading, in terms of guys that have played minutes, he is leading the entire NBA in net rating, Kevin. They are plus 16 and a half. with Mike Conley on the court this. I mean, that is crazy. That is a crazy number. And he's figured out a way to be awesome in conjunction with Gobert. He's figured out a way to be awesome in conjunction with Donovan Mitchell and the rest of that team. They are scoring 116 points per 100 possessions with him on the court.

They are giving up 99 points with him on the court. And so this is a guy that's like, that is. affecting winning. And he's never a guy that's going to get a lot of shine. He's never a lot of guy. I spent the last 15 years, you know, whatever, rooting for the guy. And last year was just not a great representation of what he is. But that's a guy that came back this year at his age with his contract.

And he is having probably one of his best seasons ever. If not the best. Yes. I mean, we'll see how the year continues to develop, playoff run and all that. but it's it's a remarkable season for him and to add on to your point about the net rating stat i just looked this up as you were saying it on p b pbp stats.com you can look at you know how the team performs with like mitchell and conley or mitchell or just mitchell without conley the team is you know only plus one with mitchell on the court without conley with conley on the court without mitchell still plus

16 points for 100 possessions, as you just said, the same stat. So like, that puts into perspective how important he has been in situations when Mitchell has been off the court to help elevate that team against some bench units, against some starting units, depending on how the other team's rotation looks. And you know what, man, like, I've been blown away by his play this season because like last year, remember the lack of chemistry with Rudy Gobert. That's right. How he couldn't throw a lob. And he sort of acknowledged the fact that, hey, I've never had to To allow to Marcusol. I'm not used to this.

And he has gotten so good with that. Like with the Lou Dort video, we did this week for the void, the followers on YouTube, the YouTube channel, and then on Twitter, people who, you know, follow the ringer NBA page, voted on that. The other choices were a Ben Simmons video about, you know, how he's, his offense has changed this season. And then the other one was about Mike Conley getting back on track. So maybe in the coming weeks, I'd love to do a Mike Conley video because he deserves

that attention for coming back from a down season. Yeah. It did not have the impact that we thought it would last year. You know what I mean? That was, it wasn't easy. The fit wasn't easy. But that is clearly an example of now we get the bigger the sample

gets, the more comfortable you get. And that is the plager that they attained. Right. This Mike Conley is the one that they wanted that they thought could really take them to a different level. And it didn't happen last year, but this year they are at a different level. That team is awesome. They really are, Kemp. They are really good. They are.

I don't think they're on the same level as Lakers and Clippers, but that doesn't mean that they can't have a chance. Sure. To make a strong run, if not an upset, you know. they're a great well-rounded team with no weaklings. Who's your second guy that deserves shine? You know, I had Larry Nance on my lists, but we give him shine all the time. So you come on. I'm not going to mention where it is.

I wanted to mention one guy you mentioned in passing earlier this week, one of your Memphis Grizzlies. Desmond Bain. I think Desmond Bain leading the NBA in three-point percentage as a rookie is a really impressive feet and it's not like all of his three-pointers are like just standstill, catching shoots in the three, you know, in the corner. He's moving around, coming off some screens and handoffs. It's such a great job relocating, depending on how the rest of the court is shifting depending on the action. He's such a smart player. And it's sort of like, you know, Hallibur and Esk in the sense that it's very rare you have a rookie come in

with his level of feel and intelligence to read the game and understand the game. And and I'm just very, very impressed by Desmond Bain. And in many ways, he's like everything like draft Twitter thought he would be. Like he was one of draft Twitter's favorites. And yet the Grizzlies land in him second year in a row. Brandon Clark was that guy last year. Grizzlies got him. Desmond Bain was that guy.

People love this year. The Grizzlies got him and he is shining. It's just been a lot of fun to watch. Desmond Bain. Tied his career high again last night. Oh, yeah. And so I was there. And look, for people,

that we're not watching Houston Memphis last night, that final score is 12. Houston could have beaten them by 30 if they kept the pedal down. I mean, that is not a, that is one of those games that if you saw that game, you realize that score is not indicative of what that game was.

Houston beat the shit out of them last night. And I was super impressed. That's the first time I've gotten to see Houston in person this year. We've talked about the defense. They are so active. They are really on a string. And that it is,

Steve Asilis deserves such a massive amount of credit because that team is literally just thrown together pieces. Like they have no, there's no reason that they should have the chemistry that they play with. But they do. It's just kind of like this island of misfit toys that is thrown together. And to get them to play as they play. they do on offensive defense is super impressive. The Hardin trade has unlocked a different Eric Gordon. Like that is a different guy than what we had seen prior to. And I think I read last night,

he was shooting like 29% from three prior to the Hardin deal and he's over 40% since. And he's playmaking. Christian Wood, first time to get to see him in a Rockets uniform. Now, I'll tell you this. I don't know if there's a report yet out about him. But, he was really hurt. That angle injury did not look good. No, it was bad. And he tried to, I don't know if TV cameras caught it,

but he tried to get up and like walk and just could not. He had to have guys helping him and then had to have him get help all the way back to going to the locker room. And he had 17 and 7 in like 20 minutes. He was awesome while he was out there. And it was just crushing.

to see him hobble back to the locker room. But he was in, that was not like I just twisted my ankle. He was in real pain. And so I'm crossing my fingers for them and him. But anyways, at that game, you mentioned Bain, and I talked about the career high. It's the other guy. And now that I got to see him in person,

now I've really got to give him shine. I'll tell you this, Jeff, this J. Sean Tate is a player. Yeah, let's go. This guy is a real player now. It's not just beginning of the season. Who the hell is this guy? Like, he's kind of, he's tenacious. He can knock down shots from the outside.

He's always, like, he just is in the mix so often. And it's so funny because this morning, this is why I really have to give him shine. This morning, now, of course, the game was over so late. I got home. And I said, my son came in as he was getting ready for school. And I was like, boy,

that was a butt kicking, huh? And he goes, Jay Sean Tate? My son's 11. He's watching the game last night. And he was like, what about this guy?

And I was like, yo, William, he is, that's a real player. You know, and I love, love,

love stories like this. 25 years old. Go, he's playing in the, the Australian League with the Sydney Kings last year. And what a find for Houston. And it's not just, I really don't think this is just a flash in the pan. It is very, you know, I don't want to get too extreme because Christian Wood would probably

on the extreme. But it is Christian Woodish in the sense that wasn't highly, you know, regarded and had to work his way to the point he is at right now. but he's a good fit on that team in a league that, you know, cherishes wings. To have a guy just work his way up at age 25,

playing in Australia, then make this transition to the NBA and come in NBA games and like be extremely impactful. This guy, what a story. What a story.

So on the answer, on the Ringer NBA show feed, Chris Ryan invited me on this week. I cheated on one Chris with Chris Ryan and we talked about defense on the pod which by the way it was a great conversation

with Chris and I look forward to listening to it after we record but we talked about defense and I went on a long rant about just how much I love Jay Sean Tate Oh really? So it's great that we're talking about it here like we didn't know that we talked about defense at all but like Tate is

I think if not the best help defender in the NBA one of the best to help defendants in the NBA. And that says a 25-year-old rookie who one year ago is playing with the Sydney Kings. It's a remarkable story. And I just love watching him play basketball. I do. He just brings that energy that's contagious and inspires your team and inspires you sitting

sitting on your couch at home, you know, thinking like, damn, this guy's. No, as I was watching him last night, because it's the first time I got to see him up close. I was like, I was like, damn, man, this guy is like legit good. Yeah. Like, this isn't like some flat. Flash in the pan, you know, and we like, remember that guy, Jay Sean Tate that played good for a couple months? Like, he's a legit good player. He's going to stick too.

He is. He is going to stick. He can defend. He just brings that spark off your bench or in your starting unit. That it just, it's like we talked about earlier, like the unquantifiable variables. Well, it's always the guys like that that impact winning. Yes. Yeah, people are going to talk about wall.

they're going to talk about Christian Wood, they're going to talk about Gordon and his resurgence, and then there's this other, yeah, PJ Tucker, and then there's this other guy, right, that is really having a profound effect on what they've been able to do. You always look for,

how are they doing this? How do you just throw a team together? And you've got to have guys like that, you know, in order to pull it off. That's why you're better than what you should be when people just look at your roster. I was impressed. I was impressed,

especially impressed with how Silas has got them playing. All right, last one. Can I take the inverse approach? We've had a couple positive conversations and some players we like the way they're performing. I want to talk about

specifically Mo Bamba and the Orlando Magic. Okay. I don't understand a team investing the number six pick in the draft and any player, forget about Mo Baba and any player in the draft. And then when you're losing games and you're 8 and 14 and your season,

like it's not promising. Even if you make the playing tournament, I'm sorry, Orlando, you're not going very far. When your season is all about looking forward and MoMA is not getting any minutes at all, you're not investing minutes in him a year before he's going to hit free agency and you got to know, is this a guy we want to keep? Is this somebody who's part of our future? they're doing nothing to facilitate his development with on-court opportunity when this past season, he showed some flashes as a shop locker, showed some flashes as a three-point shooter.

When he's been on the court in some garbage time situations this year, I've watched those to look back because I loved Mobamba in the draft. And so far, I look dumb with him. But I've watched and I'm like, damn, dude, like I don't feel like he looks awful. I don't think he looks awful when I see him out there on the court. When people talk about the effort, I see him hustling. I see him boxing out. I see him rotating and staying alert on the court.

And it's like, how is this guy not getting minutes ahead of Kim Birch? Who, Kemm Birch, by the way, Ken Birch is a quality rotation player. He is and he deserves to have a role on a team. But for Orlando, you got to balance trying to win now with on-court development. and there are some teams like the Toronto Raptors and like the San Antonio Spurs that are better at that than really anybody at balancing the two. Orlando,

I don't understand what's happening here and I've seen a lot of magic fans tweeting about this recently. How are you not facilitating developmental opportunities to a guy you invested the number six pick in the draft two? It blows my mind. That's what I was going to ask you. I wonder media and fans of the number, the Orlando magic how they feel about this.

Is this a thing? This thing that he's not. This week, this week it's been a big thing. Josh Robbins posted a story about, you know, Steve Clifford saying, you know,

we're just playing the guys that we think are going to help us win now. And I read all the comments in that article of like magic fans saying, this is stupid. We got to see what this guy has. Yeah. I'm like, thank you. I'm glad magic fans are saying that because like,

even if Mo Obama is a bust, I want to see him be a bust getting 15, 20 minutes per game. Let's see what happens. Give him regular minutes and let's see. And then you can, then he assid him, then, okay, we saw him. It wasn't what we thought it could be. And you are rightfully not playing him. But in the absence of that, I mean, like you do it.

Not seeing what he can be or what he is. We don't even know. Like seriously, he's never, what is he averaging? Is he ever averaged 10 minutes? Yeah, so he, so last season he did average over 10 minutes. Last year, he averaged in 62 games, 14 minutes per game. It's a rookie 60 minutes per game. But even then, I mean, he's dealt with injuries.

Yeah. He had COVID last year, came back from that. He has a nagging injuries. Right now he's healthy. Let's see the guy who invested the number six pick in the draft in that suffered multiple injuries over the years. And let's see what he looks like when he's actually helping him. healthy right now. I just, I don't, I don't get it. It's, it's frustrating, you know, from like a developmental

standpoint that you see a team doing this with a guy that was drafted sixth. I just fail to understand how Steve Clifford's not playing him at all. All right. The last one for me that, a guy that I think deserves some shine is San Antonio's got a bunch of these like young guys that are all, like they've got, they've got, they've got, they've got, they've got, DeMarters-Ros and they've got I know where you're going. Lamarcus Aldridge. But then they've got, you know, Lonnie Walker, they got DeJonte Murray, and they got Derek White, they got whatever. The one I love is Kelda Johnson.

Yeah, baby. He's the one. He's the one. This guy is a dog. Like, really? Like, when I watch them, I sit there and go, give me that dude. Like, give me that.

Like, he's there. Yes, he plays hard as, he plays hard as hell. He rebounds, like, crazy. I think he's average. Yeah, seven rebounds against. That's just a guy that gets in the mix. And he's kind of got that, like, I don't know. Like, he plays angry, you know, sometimes.

He's not there for, like, the smiling and having fun. Like, he's there for a fight. And I saw him for the first time. He really, because he didn't have that great of a college career at all at Kentucky. He was kind of an afterthought guy there. and I remember seeing him in the Salt Lake City summer league. They played in the Utah Summer League a couple of years ago. It was the first time I saw him and I thought, boy, they might have found something in this guy.

Like he just, he clearly was better than his competition there. He looked like one. If you watched a game, you thought he was one of the best guys on the court. And then he had like a pretty good rookie year last year. But like, this is year two. And you see already. guy that can get you 15 points, get you seven rebounds, some nights even bigger. And it's just year two. And to be that young, like, those are the kind of guys. I love those kind of guys.

And he's strong as an ox, too. Like, he's going to be, he's a real one. Like, they've got a lot of young guys in that range of like their first four, five, six years in the league. He's the one that I would pick out and say, this guy could, this guy could be even more. Like, I could look up but Kelden Johnson's like a big time player in three, four years. So I didn't have Kelden Johnson on my list because I had him in my article earlier in the week. I was like, eh, I wrote about it. I'm not going to talk about him again on the pod.

But Kelden Johnson, I had a line in that article comparing his drives to the rim. For anybody who's seen the movie, Old Boy, it's like a South Korean action thriller movie. There's a scene in that movie, a classic, like a three-minute uncut scene where the main character, Dysu, comes out of an elevator and just like fight. his way through an entire hallway of bad guys just fights his way through a hallway. It's like a realistic scene because like, you know, guys are just getting tired. It's not just like some cheesy scene. And the way Kelton Johnson drives to the rim with that relentless attitude and just really like

almost a carelessness in a way like where he's like, I'm not worried about what's going to happen when I fall here because I'm going to score no matter what it takes. He has no fear of going to. the basket and it's just a heck of a lot of fun to watch him play. Not only is he putting up numbers, not only is he playing great defense, but he is just a straight up fun

player to watch play the game of basketball and the sports got a number of those guys. That's a stock I would want because I could see that is the type of guy. When you see that kind of tenacity, usually that is indicative of what kind of kid you've

got off the court and those are the ones that are going to work, work, work, work, work. He's a great kid. And you look up in two, three years, and he's taken the huge leap to becoming a different guy. Because this is just year two. He's still really young, man. Like, you could look up in a couple years, and this guy is, he's a big time player. Yeah. I can see him taking a leap. It wouldn't, you know, be a total shocker necessarily. It depends on what level his jumper

reaches, but, like, ultimately with Kelden Johnson, he's a good player to invest in, whether it's cards or NBA top shots. There you go. There you go. I have to check out to see if there's any top shots of Kelton Johnson. They better have a good dunk of him. Not a bad idea. Yeah, right?

Let me check. All right. Kevin, it is always a pleasure. Thanks to producer Sasha as always. And we will talk to you next Tuesday. Have a great weekend, everybody.