The Mismatch - Ten Things We Are Thankful for This NBA Season

Episode Date: November 22, 2022

With Thanksgiving this week, Verno and KOC each give five things they are thankful for this NBA season (06:15). Some of the things the guys are thankful for is Russell Westbrook accepting his bench role, the Spurs' tasteful tanking, the 'NBA on TNT' crew, Kevin Durant, and more. Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Producer: Jessie Lopez Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey everyone, it's Kevin O'Connor, aka Kevin O'Bomber, aka Kevin O'Connor. Wait a minute, you're not Chris Vernon. No, Kevin, sadly, I'm not as cherubic or as raspy as Verno, but it is I, Jay Kyle, man. And folks, basketball has been and continues to be so very good. That's exactly why Kyle and I are hosting a brand new basketball show on a brand new podcast feed, the ringers NBA draft show. We're going to have you covered every week as we go in-depth and deep dive in hopes of answering an ever-important question in the NBA. Who's got next?

Whether it's an international phenom like Victor Winbenyama or the G-League Scoot Henderson. Or stars from Overtime Elite like A. Men Thompson, as well as a full-blown swarm of talented prospects from the promising 2023 NBA draft class. For sure, Kyle. And we're also going to get into players from the college ranks because this is a loaded class. for us to discuss prospects rising and falling, and we're going to revisit and redraft recent draft classes and get into how the league's evolution could help inform what's valuable in a prospect of the future.

This is a podcast for a fan of every team, whether you're losing and have high draft lottery odds or you're looking for sleepers later in the draft. We're going to be covering everything in the months to come, so please make sure you follow and subscribe to the Ringer NBA Draft Show. And hit us with those five-star ratings. Welcome to the Miss.

I'm Chris Vernon and joining me he does every Tuesday from the ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor aka Kevin Obama, Kevin O'Connor, Kevin O'Candekin O'Clymer, Kevin O'Colns, Kevin O'Colns, Kevin O' Cranor, Kevin O'Colns, Kevin O'Colns, Kevin O'clock for. It's interesting because the last time that we recorded was on Friday, and I told you I was super excited that I was going to get to see Shea Gilders' Hall of and that Oklahoma City team in person, which I did. And now we fast forward to tonight.

I'm going to go see the hottest team in the entire NBA, the Sacramento King. Yeah. The beam team itself, as they have been absolutely off the chart offensively and have racked up a bunch of wins recently. And so I'm going to get to see it in person. I guess that's the first thing I can be thankful for.

It's not on my list, but I am excited to see them in person because they've truly become one of the really good stories in the NBA. We know that they probably should have a couple more wins than what they even do because of a couple weird calls at the end of games. That being said, their record's good and their offense is otherworldly recently. and they're putting up like 120 points a game. So I think when you sign up to see them, you're usually in for a good time. Absolutely. I mean, it seems like you'll have a good time time.

You still no Jha, no Bain, right? Well, they have upgraded as time of recording. Morant was yesterday listed as doubtful on the injury report, and then this morning they upgraded him to questionable. Okay, so you could get Jha versus Fox in that back court it would be really, really exciting. That would be great. Because you've got two of the very few fastest guys

with the basketball in their hands in the world. And it's always a good matchup. Always. It's always a lot of fun to watch those two guys. The other thing is, you better hope Moran plays. Otherwise, it's very, very tough sledding for the Grizzlies. They could get run out of the building. because in the absence of Desmond Bain and John Morant,

it has been very, very difficult to score. They have been, over the course of the last five games, I believe the worst fourth quarter team in the entire NBA. And so you're running up against a team that is red hot. But I'm excited to see it. I'm hopeful if Morant plays, maybe you can get a very, very competitive, good, high-flying basketball game.

If not, for the first time, in maybe, I mean, maybe since like the Weber Pesia, whatever years, I would be nervous as a Memphis fan watching Sacramento come to town.

Which is such a cool thing. I mean, I don't have the Kings on my thankful lists either because we've talked about them a bunch, right? I don't want to hit the same points, but they're like at the top of our lists of what we're most thankful lists.

before. Both of us are shared lists. Yeah. It's just been so nice watching them. It's a good story. They had the two BS calls. They could be 11 and 4 instead of 9 and 6 right now. So I'm excited to get to see them in person. I've been watching them from afar. There's been a ton of articles written

about them. We see all the numbers and I'm happy for them and hopefully hopefully I get to see a really good basketball game. I'm hopeful. We won't be talking about it later on the week on this podcast because we're taking Friday shows off with Thursday being Thanksgiving. However, on the Ringers NBA Draft Show podcast feed with me and Jay Kyle, man,

we're going to talk about some of the young players from this King's Grizzles game on tomorrow's podcast. So be sure to go follow that podcast feed, the Ringers NBA draft show. Perfect. Well, we're always timely on the mismatch, and it is Thanksgiving week. Therefore, we figure a lot of our listeners are going to be listening to this on their drive to wherever they are going for Thanksgiving, maybe their flight, wherever they're going for Thanksgiving, or maybe they're just laying around lazy, doing yard work and they want something to listen to. So we are going to do the 10 things that we are thankful for currently going on in the NBA.

We have each put together a list of five. You want to go first or second? You call it. I want to go first. All right, let me hear it. I'm thankful that Russell Westbrook has accepted a bench roll. There are only two people on the planet who believed Russ could do it. Me and Darvindham.

And I was done with him after that game against a blanche. Lasers, that last start. Remember the game, Chris, when he took that horrific pull-up jumper with 30 seconds left of the game, 18 seconds left in the shot clock, the whole arena went, no. Ever since that moment, he's taken just one mid-range pull-up jumper with over 10 seconds left in the shot clock, just one. He's completely changed his shot selection, and on the season, per cleaning the glass, he's taking 4% of his shots from deep mid-range, a career low.

28% of shots from 3, a career high. 48% of his shots at the rim, a career high. He's almost completely eliminated the deep mid-range pull-up. He's accepted a lower on-ball usage in the half court. He's playing with greater effort on the defensive end. And of course, he's still not the perfect fit for LeBron. You want to see him cut more often, set more screens, but he's doing everything he needs to do.

He's showing that he can evolve, extend his career, and for that, Russell Westbrook has my utmost respect because he's shown that anybody can change just by putting their mind to it. Can we just end the podcast? I mean, I know it's only going to be like a six-minute podcast. But I mean, Kevin O'Connor, with his love letter to Russell Westbrook, I mean, after all these years,

I feel like we should just mic drop it. And let's just end the pod, Kevin. I am in stunned disbelief. I never thought I'd see the day and here we are number one on the things that you are thankful for Russell Westbrook

What a world What a world Remember the Game of Zones video of us Chris With it was a boulder Or the dragons get Bleared their fire at us Whatever it is, I don't know And I forget the exact scene

This would be like me having Harden number one But I mean he's injured It's not No he's injured yeah Can't do it it. All right. Number one on my list is, and this is a little sentimental, because as you know, I have a free teen son that is growing up as a huge NBA fan. And I want to say I'm thankful for

Janice and I'm thankful for Curry. I think these two guys are the most popular amongst kids right now. It's kind of their guys. They're the best guys at the time that they have been growing up. Every kid goes out and tries to act like Curry when they're out on the court. They both have signature shoes that you see a lot when you're at all of those games. You see a lot of jerseys for both of those. Every time I go to a game, when you see those players come to opposing arenas, you will see more kids want tickets to those games than any other games on the schedule. I mean, just counting, and this is just my experience,

and maybe it's different in other cities. But Janice and Curry, even in small market NBA, have a profound impact. And I just want to say that despite Laddergate this past weekend, which might be the only thing that people have ever found to be upset, if anybody was upset about the way Yadis reacted, maybe in his unblemished career. These guys are both intensely likable.

They are great at what they do. They both have amazing stories that are great stories for kids that are growing up. You know, Steph Curry, who was a very good basketball player, wants to go to Virginia Tech to live up to his father's legacy because he had this famed career at Virginia Tech. And Virginia Tech,

won't even give him a scholarship. They offer him to be a walk-on. And Virginia Tech, I mean, it's not like he's trying to go to Kentucky or Kansas or Duke or something like that, right? And so then he goes to Davidson and he, you know, and then obviously the rest is history after that. But it wasn't easy for him. This wasn't like a consensus five-star destined to be one of the greatest players on earth. He had to work for it. And clearly the same goes with Janus.

I mean, for God's sakes, there's a Disney movie about him and the way he grew up, and him and the brothers sharing shoes. And then you see the way these guys conduct themselves. You see the way they interact with fans. You see the way they carry themselves. And even as family guys. And I do think that both of them are so worthy of being looked up to. and I think that there is a tremendous value to that.

I love the idea that you've got these two guys that smile, that seem like they're having fun all the time, that carry themselves both on and off the court with real character, that I'm thankful for that. I'm thankful for that because I view it in a much different way than I would have probably any other time in my life as someone, you know, growing up with an adolescent that cares about this stuff. And, and also, look, my daughter, she's nine, she 100% knows both of those guys.

And thinks highly of both of those guys, right? Like these guys, and it does matter. You know, in the end, there's these old, you know, the very famous Nike campaign with Charles Barkley, you know, basically parents should raise kids. I am not a role model, whatever else. And that may be true, right? In the end, as a parent, you are responsible for your children, the way they act and what they believe, et cetera, et cetera,

and the way they conduct themselves. But you cannot replace their athletic heroes. You can't. They are going to have those. And those guys being worthy of being looked up to while also simultaneously being so incredible at their sports, I'm very thankful for that. And I certainly would not mind either.

Any kid that I see in those jerseys, I don't think twice about it. They said an example of the value of hard work. It doesn't necessarily guarantee success, but having that discipline and that vision and working towards that can position you to change your life or do something that you're happy at or do the best you can at whatever your interest, hobby, passion, whatever it is.

That's what I think of, you know, everything you just said about Stefanianus, right, with the example they set for kids. You know, like you said, they have amazing stories. And I think, you know, also they have a fun style of play. You know, the way they play is appealing. That draws you in.

And then you learn about them. And you understand why they are in the position that they are. And that's because of their approach they take to their crafts. Yep. All right. Number two on yours. Another hard worker here. I'm thankful Alexei Pochette.

Grushchevsky is a real competitive NBA player. Poku! I mean, this is a list. Ross and then Poku are one and two. This is great. And we saw Poku block your beloved angel from heaven, John Morant. How dare you? How dare you?

Poku's been one of the best shot. He was swatting a fly and got lucky. Poccus been so good blocking shots. He's been swatting a lot of fly. man you know he's also in a transition helping on the weak side he had this block a couple of weeks ago against christian wood in dallas where he just came flew over from the weak side stuffed his shot wood got the ball back and then puku just went two arms straight in the air and just towered over christian wood nowhere to score nowhere to go okay so you got the ball after that playing good drop coverage and pick

and roll pretty good on the perimeter as well shooting over 40% from three point range chris it's still making his fun crazy, you know, zany passes. I'm thankful for Alexei Pocchewski. Look, I saw him in person, and he had like 10 points fast, and then he got hurt

and he was angry. Like, angry, yelling as he was leaving. Yeah, because he is hardcore. He's so hardcore. And it had a real effect on them in the game that I

watch, I was impressed. I don't go over the city. They played really hard. They made you beat them. They ain't got anybody tall after him. You know, it was a Jared Jackson junior field day in the game that I watched after the kid went out. But kudos to Sam Presti.

Because though it did not play out the way that we thought it was going to play out, he said, look, the one tall, goofy bastard I have doesn't feel enough. pressure. I am going to draft the tallest, goofiest bastard I can. And so he brings in Ched Holmgren, and Poku's got to do a lot of self-reflection. He's like, hold on now. If we have Chet, unless we're going to be Twin Towers, they just drafted another guy like me. So I better crank it up a notch. And so Poku's decided he's cranking it up a notch. I'm going to be honest with you, Kevin. I turned to my producer during the game.

First five minutes of the game, whatever it was. Kid had 10 points, quick. And I turned to him, and this is the exact quote. I said, hold on now. Does he not suck? And he's like, you know what, maybe he doesn't suck. And I was like, I thought this was like a punchline or something. I thought it was something to be funny about.

I was like, he might not suck. What are the what are the ramifications of this? What are we going to get to goof with O'Connor about? This is, I'm like, this guy's got 10 points in the first quarter. He's going off. And let me tell you, they got stuff to build around. They got Gildes Alexander. They'll clearly get Chet back in the fold next year.

They just need, they need some shooting around Gilders Alexander because Lord knows he commands all kinds of problems. You know, it's like every great guard. But, I mean, and any great player for that matter, right? You've got this unbelievable talent. You want guys that can space around the floor and knock down shots because, man, he'll get you open threes. They just got to have some guys that can knock it down.

I mean, he chucks it out to giddy, he chucks it out to maybe one of the rookies, like a Jalen Williams or something like that. And Jaila Williams can shoot. He just needs to extend his range, right? Like a guy like him, It takes time. They don't really have guys

that can knock down threes. Or else, they would be even more of a problem because they score a lot. Clearly, SGA is having this great, great season. It's going to be fascinating to see the way they play once Chet is back, because Giddy would be the non-shooter in those lineups, right?

Like, let's say you surround SGA with all shooters except for Giddy. Like, I wonder how they use Giddy. You know, is he near the basket? Is he screening? Is he like a yokey? you know, around the elbows or subonis facilitating. It's just going to be really interesting to see the way they kind of invert their offense

when you get Chet who can do stuff on the perimeter. Poku, if he's out there in a lineup. I'm very intrigued to see what Dagnalton that coaching staff does once Chet does come back, you know, sometime next year. And the crazy thing is, and I think I spoke about this last year, when I had seen Giddy. I feel like every time I see him, he's awesome. But he's worth seeing in person. Because, as I've mentioned, much bigger than you think once you see him in first.

He's huge. He could pass over guys. The other thing is he's one of those guys that you're shocked he's doing everything that he's doing. He is so good at everything except for shooting from range. That's it. That's it. That's literally his only weakness is shooting. This guy, this guy passes.

This guy rebounds. This guy can get to the basket. This guy can pass. under you pass over you he is he's a solid basketball player and if he ever gets to where he could be a reliable guy knocking down shots that you could throw it out to him and he can knock down shots watch out because he is he is so good at everything else and you're like how does this guy get to the basket he's not quick he does it with these weird he's got this great footwork steps you know, that he does it with and he's, he's tight handle as well.

Like he's, he's a ball on a string, that type of player. With him, it's, I mean, he's a plus 70% free throw shooter. If he can just get to 33, 34% from behind the arc, like he doesn't need to be a 38, 39% three-point shooter. If he could just get to that level, kind of like Janus has, right? Granted to Janus isn't shooting the ball well this year. But Janus got to at least like a slightly below. average level from behind the yard and from mid-range, right?

If he can just get there, it's going to open up everything for him even more than it already is. I was talking to these guys from the Thunder, and I was saying, man, this SGA season's unbelievable. It's like, you guys just need some guys that could knock down shots and be nice if giddy could knock down some shots. And I had forgotten about this, but their response to me was that's why we hired Chip Ingle. Yep. And I forgot they had hired the long-term, renowned shooting coach from the San Antonio Spurs. And they said, it will happen.

We'll become a good shooting team. And whatever these guys can become, shooting the ball, they will become. Because we've got the best guy. Yep. Got the best guy. It's him formerly in San Antonio now OKC and Fred Benson in New Orleans. Those are the two best shooting coaches that are assistants. the NBA right now.

Yep. Number two on my list. The offense. I mean, we spend at the beginning of the season talking about how the abolition of the take foul has been great. And I think that part of, you know, there have been people that have written about this and short sample size studies that have already been done about the take foul. And yes, there is some level of impact with that.

But I think maybe it's this ancillary impact, which is the pace of the game. This game is being played at a higher pace than ever before. And not only are teams playing it at a very high pace, they are doing it with the best efficiency in years. So you have this take file being taken out, and then you have these highest numbers in years. You have 22 teams that average 110 points a game.

If you round up the 109.5s, that gets you to 22 teams. It means only 8 teams in the league are averaging under 110, Kevin. I mean, so the pace went up in all of these games by and large. but then you would think that maybe that would lead to less efficiency. But that has not been so. Now, as of last week, you had John Schumann who had done these, he had done an article last week about efficiency and the historic nature of it. This came out on November 17th, so it's been a minute since it came out.

But the numbers are the numbers. Through middle of last week, so less than a week ago, the numbers were teams are averaging 113 points per game, which is up from 110 last year, which is at time of print, the highest mark in the last 53 seasons. since the 1969-70 season. Wow. The league has shot better from two-point range, from three-point range, and the free-throw line than it did last season. But right now, the jump is more about the pace of the game than efficiency. But these numbers, these points per game, the efficiency and the pace of the game, these offensive ratings, has just been spectacular.

It makes for wildly entertaining. When you only have eight teams in the league that are averaging under 110, yeah, you've got the take foul, which leads to more transition basketball, more fast breaks, and I do think has a bigger impact than just the take foul is not there.

So, of course, you know, there's more possessions. I think it's just, it leads to the way the game is being played, which is this end-to-end, And free-for-all with this offensive brilliance taking place on regular occasion. And I think that if you sign up to go to a game, you're very likely to see some kind of spectacular offensive performance from one of the superstars that you signed up to see, assuming they play in the game, which is its own problem, which I mentioned last week. And we have even more, right? By the way, has anybody done the studies on this? Just a quick 20-second timeout.

Does anybody done the studies on this? Like, there are less games in a short amount of time. There's less back-to-backs. There's more teams that are on like homestands and then go on long road trips. There's more times that you're playing a team a second time in a city as to cut down on the travel. And I don't feel like anybody's any healthier. And there's more guys sitting out games than ever before. Is it healthier now with all the other?

of these different measures. And not to mention that these teams employ 700,000 people to try to keep these guys healthy. I don't understand. Like, I mean, I swear to God, every day I wake up and there's another terrible injury. Really. And it stinks.

So in between the sitting out and the injuries, I've been pretty. Not thankful for that. No. But I am thankful for the way the game's being played. I do think it is a wildly entertaining brand of basketball thus far. Get more out of your holiday week with Fandul because new customers get

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And West Virginia, visit 800 gambler. Dot net. Number three. I'm thankful the spurs are tastefully tanking. Speaking of sitting out. we talked about the Rockets and their tactics last week and how we'd have a little disagreement there. But Spurs, they're developing the young guys. They're playing the competitive brand of basketball.

They won some games early in the year. And then against the Clippers, against Paul, Georgia, Kauai Leonard, they say, huh, we'll sit one of our best wings. We'll rest him for injury management, Devin Bacell. We'll rest our wing. And then against the Lakers, who have Anthony Davis pummeling teams inside, They say, huh, we'll rest. He ain't a Pertel, our starting center for injury management on the back.

I just thought it was, well done, San Antonio. Well done. Yeah. They're going about it a little different way, right? Yeah. You're sitting there going, why is he out? Why is he out? They could have had the other way.

They could have had Pertil out, you know, for the Clippers game. And they could have had the sellout for the Lakers game. Well, I could have played him anyway. It wouldn't have accomplished their goal. I think, yeah, they're the first one to take real measures. Is that fair? Like, if there's a race towards who's got, like, they started off, they're playing good basketball for the first 10 games.

They're popping the ball around. They got 30 assists. They're knocking down threes. And then it's like, all right. Gorgie Zhang, you're in for Bertel. Yeah. It's kind of crazy because you saw all these other guys, right? Like, you saw Utah, you've seen this shocking,

Indiana thing that's going on. People already tweeting me, are you raising your blinds yet? The beginning of the season, I said I wouldn't raise my blinds for a Pacer's Wizards game. Hell, that'd be a playoff game as would be right now.

I guess I'd have to. But, you know, yeah, like San Antonio, they weren't being rather competitive. And they're still playing all the kids. Like the kids, Sohan is awesome. I love watching this too.

Jeremy Sohan, one of my favorite rookies to watch right now. Caldon Johnson, you know, he was horrible the other night against the Lakers, but for the most part, this season,

you know, still making positive development, getting reps with the ball on his hand. And Evan Vassel playing the best basketball he's ever played. So, you know, you're seeing these young kids get better

and they're resting them at opportune times. It's cool to see. Hey, I will say I agree with you on this front. Because as someone who is covered tanking teams.

I am much more of a fan of not putting enough out there to win off the jump. Rather than go to the game, winning through three quarters, bench them all to make sure you don't win, right? I don't like it in the course of the games, it irritates me much more than if you just feel something that can't win, right? If you field something they can't win, it's not nearly as bad. I liken it to, right, if you were in some football game, and then a quarterback went out there and, like,

threw an interception on purpose. Like, I don't want to see you actively doing this. The real art of tanking is the positioning of the players in the court, the plays you run, the lineups you put out there, you know, regardless of who's active and inactive. That's really where, like, the true artists are reveals. Imagine this. Imagine this.

The Spurs were the best at winning for 20 years. Imagine this. They're the best at doing this too. Just a model franchise. They know how to do it. They know how to win correctly. They know how to lose correctly. Well, I mean, it's going to be really interesting, though,

to see how hard teams go here. because Detroit, if Cade is out, he's going to be out for some, you know, I texted you and Jesse about this last week, right? Like, if he's out for some extended period of time, they're going to be bad, right? If he gets surgery, he's out for the whole year. They're going to be locked into one of those bottom three top lottery odds spots because the three worst teams have 14% chances at the number one pick.

So that means there could be two spots available. Odds are Houston's not going to let go of one of those. So, I mean, I wonder who that third team is going to be. San Antonio, Orlando. Will OKC turn it around, you know, and start trying to lose games? Or will SGA miss time at some point? Who knows? Utah is so far off right now.

I don't think they're going to have any chance of getting there. You know, if they do lose and then it's the playoffs, they'll have like 7%, 9% odd, something like that. But Detroit and Houston look like they're going to separate themselves. San Antonio is Yeah, I think it's San Antonio Detroit. I don't think Detroit has a choice. Well, Detroit's going to be horrible. And it started off.

They lost Isaiah Stewart. It's not just Cade. They lost Stewart. They have been playing without Sadiq Bay. Like, this had a chance to, with the way they ended the season and then being able to draft, you know,

Ivy, it had a chance to be, like a hope inspiring season and instead it's on the other direction drastically. The silver lining for Detroit is without Cade.

Let's say he's out for the rest of the season. You get to see Ivy and Killian Hayes the whole year. No, I'm serious. This is not like, you know, ha ha, ha, funny. I know it's not. It's Ivy gets to be the guy.

Yeah. And you get to just throw him out there into the fire and say, go to work, improve on your change of pace, improve on your playmaking. And then when Kate comes back next year, hopefully he's in a better position to thrive with him. You get to see if Killian Hayes can,

without any fear of having to pull him, if he can actually figure it out as a score, because he's already got the playmaking, he's already got the defense, can he figure it out as a score? He's been better than he's ever been the last seven games, shooting over 40% from three, shooting better from mid-range,

getting better to the rim better. if he can keep that up, then you show Killing and Hayes can be a real NBA player. So I think the opportunity and the reps those guys will provide, you already know Kade's good, and you want him to get even better,

but you already know he's good. Now it's time to find out what value do Hayes and Ivy have to the future of your franchise around Kade Cunningham while also having probably the top lottery odds. You got to imagine that teams are already

on the phone about Bogdanovich. They are. Like that's a big one that can swing it for a good team. Oh, yeah. Adding Bogdanovich to the mix, he's having a very, very good season. It's just a matter of, does Detroit want to move them? Because they're so bad, they don't need to move Bogdanovich to get worse. They do view Bogdanovich as like a nice placeholder, a developmental veteran next to ID.

But that changes. It does change. You're right. And also, like, if teams, they gave up nothing for him pretty much. If a team calls and offers a first round pick unprotected, and maybe. like a future second or a young player of appeal. Like, how do you say no to that? Bogdanovich isn't part of your future?

He's just not. And I think you do right by him, which is he's only got, yeah, he's only got a year or two left. And those are the only teams that are going to want him is a team that's in the playoffs that has a chance to do something special. And he can offer something to those teams. We saw him do it for years in Utah. What's he going to do?

Toil O.A. and Detroit, it just doesn't do right by him. I agree with you, Chris. Yeah. Number three on my list. I want to give a shout out to TNT crew. You know, as an NBA fan, and I know, look, they say all kinds of goofy stuff, but they clearly matter within the landscape of the NBA. But beyond that, you know, there were these stories that came out about a week ago, like, oh, well, who knows what's going to happen in the next contract. TNT doesn't need the NBA, whatever. I mean, I can't think of anything that would bother me more. in terms of sports broadcasting, than not having Ernie Johnson, Shaq, Kenny, and Charles together as part of NBA coverage. I agree. Totally agree with you, Chris.

And the reason that I wanted to shut them out is because I know that, as I said, they're going to say goofy stuff. There's got to be people that take shots at them, whatever. it is, I think, now become more abundantly clear than ever that it's virtually impossible to pull off what they have, which is to be that wildly entertaining on a regular basis

and to keep it all together. You know, there have been all kinds of shows that I have been a huge fan of. But you think about over time and you see the way that ESPN has struggled with putting together like a standard what we are used to in terms of NBA coverage. Like here's the team, here's who we're used to. You know, they've swapped out here and there over the course of the last, I mean, really every year, right?

It's almost been impossible to pull off. You think about in other sports, it's really not the NFL one per se of what, you know, the Fox one with. Kirk Menafee and Terry Bradshaw and Strahan and Jimmy Johnson, those guys. Like, I probably, I don't watch as much of the NFL pregames. I love the guys on the NFL network. I love Eisen and Kurt Warner and Michael Irvin and Mary Eugen. None of it.

That group. No, but none of it. And I love college game day too. With Reese Davis and all those guys, right? It's just not inside the NBA. None of it is for live games. It's just not. None of them, you know, because of the intense humor, you know you are going to laugh about it.

You know, you're going to roll your eyes about it and the chemistry between those guys. You know, I guess it's one of those things where because of that story that had come out last week where it was like, oh, well, what if TNT's not a part? I never even considered. And I know that the TV contract, you know, we got years before that thing is going to change over anyway. But it made me think about how much I value that and how much I like them and how much I go out of my way to watch it, you know, before and after games in a way that is just not true of anything else. And also, I love Kevin Harlan.

And I have to mention that. And every time I turn on a game and Kevin Harlan is calling it, I am happy. and I wish he wasn't with Reggie Miller, but I love Kevin. Reggie's gotten better. He has gotten much better play-by-play, I think. What color commentary, you mean? Oh, sorry, color.

Yeah, my idea. He's better. But I mean, Harlan is just, he's so good. I very rarely will, like, turn on any game and be excited that somebody's announcing me.

But Harlan's on that list. Iron Eagle. Yeah, I love I. He's a really good one too. Yeah, really good. You know he's doing the NCAA tournament? now? Oh,

wow. Yeah. Oh, that's exciting. When Nance steps down, he's doing the NCAA tournament. That'll be cool.

And very, very deserving. Yeah. Yeah. And he's great with Raftery. Yeah, different sports, too.

He does a great job across sports. Yeah, Iron Eagles, great. Yeah, just has a genuine, like with Kevin Harlan,

genuine excitement and love for the game. Yes. Passion. Sure. All right. What's your next one? What's your number four?

I'm thankful Donovan Mitchell landed in Cleveland instead of New York. Oh, wow. Well, it's for two reasons. Brunson looks pretty good in New York. It would have been messed up having him and Mitchell in the back court together. But in Cleveland specifically, it's just so fun watching him with those bigs, man. You know, with Evan Mobley, Jared Allen. You look at the numbers this year, I put out a tweet, you know, this morning of the top pick-and-roll duos.

And of the top eight, you know, Mitchell Allen's number one, they're scoring 1.3. three, four points per pick and roll together. And number five is Mitchell Mobley, 1.18 points per pick and roll. Those guys have been a dominant force this year. It's just been cool to see them grow together early on. And Donovan Mitchell's playing the best basketball that he ever has right now during the regular season.

So it's just nice to see him elevating those guys, those young bigs, and them enhancing him as well with their different styles. Because for years, we see Mitchell with Gobert and how effective that is with Gobert's, you know, downhill rolling style. It's being replicated with Jared Allen. But then when Mobley, it's just a new piece, you know, who can pop,

who can attack closeouts, who can roll, short roll, handle the ball. Like, it's just been nice to see that dynamic grow with Donovan Mitchell and that Cavaliers team still performing very well. And they're fun, man. I mean, we've got to get everybody healthy. Yeah, they're just going to get healthy, man. That's it. Like, they've had that little skid, you know, they've won three in a row now.

But they had that little skid, not healthy. but. Oh, and then he got the love thing. You got that love thing. And then you got Rubio still hasn't been coming back. And so, man, if they ever get it all together and they've got that Rubio Love back, you know, for sure. Rubio and Love back as a bench unit, you know, with Jetty Osmond and the others.

Man, they're going to be really, really good. Yeah. You mentioned there. What was that stat you mentioned last week with Kevin Love, you know, leader in plus minus or whatever? I mean, he works with all their front car. I'm buying the calves, man. I think they're for real once they get it all together. Still missing a wing, though.

There's only one more wing, better than Okoro. Number four, and this is going to be weird timing, and I think you're going to be surprised that I'm saying this day. Okay. Kevin Durant. Oh, yeah, I like it. The reason I'm thankful for Kevin Durant is because many times throughout sports, things can become homogenized or not that interesting.

And I don't know, I was thinking about this the other day. This whole plight of Durant is so intensely interesting. So as I told you, once upon a time, I hosted a draft party where an entire city wanted so desperately to get either Greg Oden or Kevin Durant that this guy was going to change a franchise. And then he got drafted by Seattle. then, of course, Seattle loses their team to Oklahoma City, and he does, in fact, help change the entire franchise. And at that time in Oklahoma City, he is completely and totally universally beloved.

The same way that I talked about Janus earlier, that was Durant. Durant was on commercials. Durant had the coolest shoes. Durant was the best scorer. Durant was in this small market, but was still winning. and big and then it all kind of culminates with him winning that MVP, stand up on the stage,

while it's become a meme now, it's like this incredible, heartfelt moment with the, you are the real MVP to his mother and he's crying, and it's like, who can be more likable this guy? And then, like, Hulk Hogan, when he joined NWO, he turns total heel. and leaves and goes to the team that beat him, signs up with the team that won 73 games. Next thing, you know, he's getting like a huge mural of Rick James tattooed on his leg, and you're like, what is going on?

Now, keep in mind when he was in Oklahoma City, during the lockout, Rudy Gay hosted, I think I've told this story before, Rudy Gay hosted a, like Nike was behind it, and they hosted like a basically a pickup game. LeBron and Duran, everybody came to this small gym in Mississippi, and I went down to it. And LeBron had like this halo around him. Like nobody's going to go up and like talk to him.

It's just kind of understood. And he kind of put off an aura of, hey, don't bother me, right? I'm not. And meanwhile, Duran is like walking around the arena and like kids are around him like Muhammad Ali and Zaire. And he's walking from. place to place, taking pictures with everyone, signing everybody's autograph. And meanwhile, like, none of the kids are, like, running up to LeBron because it's almost

like scary to, like, there's like a security's going to tackle you or something. And I'm like, this is, like, if people could see this, and the way this guy is interacting, this guy is, like, the most likable superstar I'd ever been around in my life. And, and then it all, like, went heel. And then he has the success. He wins two finals MVP's and the whole thing. Then he goes to do his own thing in Brooklyn, and it's just been a debacle.

Like the whole damn thing has been a debacle. And intensely drama-filled the entire time. Meanwhile, he is still unbelievable. He's unbelievable. He's an MVP candidate. And he's great at Twitter. He fires back at everybody. He's just this.

What appeared to not be that interesting has weirdly become this wildly fascinating guy to me who has been through this total roller coaster of fame and greatness. And now here we are as he's towards, you know, I don't want to say that Twilight because he's still as good as anybody in the league. But it's like, is he going to be on that highest, highest level again, and is it all he's doing, you know, tying himself to things that maybe he didn't, he certainly did not expect the type of blowback that he would have gotten for the Golden State thing. And then the Brooklyn thing is just gone from bad to worse over and over again.

And the fact that we have a character like that in the NBA, I think it could, It could end up making for an amazing book, an amazing movie, like just watching his whole career play out all the while. You know, even with that interview with Chris Haynes, this guy is, keeps it real. Say whatever you want about him. He keeps it real. As authentic as it gets. And so the fact that it's so fascinated and it's all just so intriguing and watching it

all play out, I'm thankful for it because you can say whatever you want, it's friggin' interesting. We're still in the middle of it, too, Chris. It's all these choices. It's all these choices, right? Like, you know, people talk about these sliding doors moments. Oh, yeah, yeah.

Going to Gold State instead of staying in O'KC or going to Boston, you know, deciding to build it in Brooklyn instead of in New York after his horrific injury. And then he, you know, he slid one door this past off season. Demanding a trade. He didn't get to go through it.

But we'll see what ends up happening with Brooklyn. He's still in the middle of it, right now. Ben Simmons is looking better the last couple of games. He's setting more on-ball screens, more dribble handoffs, Kyrie's back on the court, get Joe Harris back, Seth Curry back, the T's

the Nets are starting to look like, you know, the team that you would have hoped for, right? And so how will this develop over the course of the year and will Kevin Durant want to stick around? Real quick, because people will have listened to this and know the outcome, what if Simmons goes off there?

Oh, in Philadelphia tonight? Because they don't have anybody. Yeah. They have no Hardin. They have no Maxi. They have no Embed. This is not the circumstances in which you wanted Ben Simmons to come back. You wanted him to get booed and then be humiliated.

Yes. And instead tonight, they're facing a depleted Sixers team. And what if he goes off? Yeah. What if he scores like 30? Oh, that would be so great. I will say this. Most personality he ever showed was that question from,

that reporter about has there been enough time where it's died down? I legitimately laughed at that. Eyes bugged out of his head. It's so good. We haven't gotten to see him in that situation yet. We've only gotten to see him get booed in street clothes, but it'll be, it's going to be fun and it's going to be interesting because he has gotten much much better as the season has progressed. He's been the best he's been recently.

And now it sets up for this relentless booing. What if he started knocking down threes and shit? Oh, it would be amazing. No, it's not. That's not. He still, he still shoots with the wrong hand. But the screening and rolling,

yo, what he did the last couple nights against Portland and Memphis, that's the way he's going to play, man. Like, he's doing what he's got to do. He's playing in that Bruce Brown role, but with a Ben Simmons skill set at 6'1, 240 pounds.

It's nice to see. All right. Number four. I had a number of things on my list here just in case we had some overlap. Oh, no, you're five. You're number five now. This is five. Yeah, I had a number of things for my last one just in case.

We didn't have any overlap. Just rattle them off real quick. You thought I was going to have Poku? Maybe. I never know. Killian Hayes? I didn't say I was thankful for him. We were just talking about being in Detroit.

Maybe next year I hope to be thankful for Killian Hayes. I'm thankful for bowl bowl. Just so fun to watch him. So exciting. The length, the fact of Orlando is putting the ball on his hands, kudos to them for giving him the freedom to do that. The Pacers, you mentioned them in passing earlier, Chris, that Halliburton, you know,

he looks like an all-star, Matherin, sixth man of the year, or I called potential rookie of the year before the season. Miles Turner playing better than he ever has, had this weird stat in my article for the ringer that it came out today where he's like rolling out of the pick and roll more than he ever has it's just cool to see him playing that style and then Toronto's length

I just love seeing them throw out lineups with five six six six nine six ten guys just cool to see you know that positionless basketball and granted they have guys out right now not as able to do that but they show their depth guys like Banton even being out there with that size versatility and length It feels like futuristic basketball. They just need somebody to run to the rim at the end of a game. That Atlanta game winner.

What a weird ending, man. That Atlanta game winner, I mean, you can't set something up more perfect in three and a half seconds. That was incredible. I mean, there's a colossal defensive breakdown by Toronto. But that Atlanta game winner was freaky great. Oh, so cool. So good. It looked like kind of like a football play.

Like end the game, like hook him out, type of thing. right? I know it. It's like a hook and ladder. Yeah, it's so cool. It's like one of those that you see in the NCAA tournament. Yeah, yeah. All the lateralists and stuff.

Yeah. Where it's been practiced again all year. Toronto was so unprepared in that moment. Let me ask you about the pacer thing real quick. Like, they've been good. They've been really good. They're like nine and six now, I think it is. 10 and six winners of five in a row.

10 and six winners of five in a row. Would you recalibrate the whole Moss Turner? I know that he was. on a podcast, you know, pushing for the Lakers to trade for him. But, I mean, if you're Indiana, you sit back and say, look, selling Miles Turner's old.

Like he can fit the timeline. And he fits the skill set with Maps or in Annabur. And as a big, you know, pick and pop, picking roll big, you know, defensive, you know, shop locker. Should we now change our minds from, hey, this is a guy on an expiring contract? that we can get real value for to build in the future to,

hey, let's just go ahead and talk to this guy about contract extensions. I think the answer's yes, you should recalibrate. However, will Miles Turner want to recalibrate after he's been involved in trade talks every single season of his career, including just a few months ago when the Pacers were flirting with the Andre Aiton. If you're Turner, yes, you're playing at this high level right now, but you've been in Indiana now. This is your eighth season, and you've been in trade talks for probably,

six or seven of those years. Is this really the organization that you want to be? Or do you want to at least enter free agency and decide, hey, I'm going to choose where I want to go for a team that I think is the best fit for me and that's going to pay me a hell of a lot of money rather than signing some deal and sticking around with an idea? I think that's what Indiana needs to be very careful of. If they keep him through the deadline, that he could just walk next summer. because I think at this stage, the Lakers, the Pelicans, among other teams,

they should at least be still highly interested in Turner. Like Turner's an upgrade over Valenciennes in New Orleans. Turner would help the Lakers a lot right now with spacing, rim protection, moving 80 to the... And people talking about, well, Turner doesn't help add wing defense. Yes, he does because Turner would add rim protection. AD would be the player who adds wing defense because he's such a dominant force. he can defend out on the outside if he needs to. So I think the Lakers, they're at a point right now with where they're playing,

they should at least be thinking about making a move rather than waiting until the off season instead of, you know, forgetting about this entire season and building for the future. So for the Pacers, there could be teams out there that make an appealing enough offer that's worth moving off Miles Turner and just, you know, saying Isaiah Jackson, Jalen Smith, it's your turn at the five. And you do wonder if it's the best case scenario. We talked about this regarding Utah earlier in the year. Is this to stay or is this really the best case scenario where you have acquired these guys?

They're part of winning. They're playing winning basketball. And they are exponentially increasing their value. Yeah. By being as good as they've been. And so the value, like that it actually has played out perfectly. You can look at it one of two ways. You can look at it as, hey, the guy's so good, Andy's so good with our guys.

We should just keep him for the long term. Or you can look at it go, this is working out famously. Like whatever our possible return was going to be for this guy, now that has increased greatly. And that may be so. Because he does look. I mean, and they're winning. It always helps when you're winning.

You know, it makes it look like these guys can be a part of a winning structure that's playing really good basketball. And Pacers really are. They are. And I think they're, you know, their schedule's been kind of soft. And I do think they are benefiting from teams. There's always these teams at the beginning of the year that they look across and they think that's the light night, you know.

Yeah. It's not going to be on national TV, don't have to get up as much. and they're just catching people. Because if you're not signed up to play that night, you're in trouble. Yeah, I mean, they're win streak. They've beaten Orlando twice, Houston once, Charlotte once, and then Toronto without Siakum, Van Fleet, and others. I mean, like the wind streak isn't.

It's impressive, but at the same time, it's not like they beat, you know, the Celtics and the Sons and all that. Number five, you know I had to include. John Morant. Yeah. Look, hopefully he is going to come back. My wife will attest that the night,

that the Grizzlies got second in the lottery with the Zion Williamson draft, no less. I walked in and I said everything just changed. Now, we had had a different feeling about Morant in our house than maybe other places because she had gone to Murray State. My son and I had watched all the Murray State games that we could on ESPN Plus. And so we were in on him. You know, I covered the NBA and an NBA team for almost 20 years by the time guy came around. And the opportunity to go to an arena and maybe see what you feel like is the most spectacular thing you've ever seen, like literally every night.

Every night there is something that that guy does where I cannot believe it. I can't believe that he pulled it off. And he literally transformed an entire franchise, an entire franchise, to where now there's not a kid in the city that doesn't have a Morant jersey or swear by this guy. And that he is one of those guys that if you go to the game, and there's never been anything close to him. You know, there's teams that were beloved, but not in this spectacular fashion. And he is on this ascent.

And you see it now, even when Memphis plays road games, people all throughout crowds in opposing arenas wearing his uniform, right? And the level of rock star-ass fame that the guy has. But then, honestly, like, I can't be more thankful. Like, it has been so much better than I ever thought it would be to get to watch him every night. Because I don't think anybody could, you know, you have an expectation like, hey, this guy can be a superstar player. But the fact that he dunks on everybody, the fact that he could switch hands and talk the fact that he might pull off the most crazy dribble move you've seen or the most insane no look past that you've seen, like the whole package, the whole package. And hit clutch jump shots, right? Yeah, and I'm just, I turn it to a reliable perimeter player.

Can't be. There's nobody, he is as entertaining as there is in the entire league. You know, as someone who watches games every single night. I watch some kind of games every single night. And like, there's a night where you're like, yeah, I'm going to go see the Kings. I'm hopeful that he's going to play. But like, every night, it's a different deal. I've been going to that arena every night for the last 20 years.

every home game night for 20 years. And there's nothing like what it's been like over the course of the last like two, two to three. I mean, this is year four, but the fact that you might at any given point see something that you've never seen before, very, very uncommon. He just can't get by poker. No, couldn't do that. Poku ate. I thought it was interesting for Poku to fake an injury. so he wouldn't get dunked on.

Because he knew after that block. He was, oh, he, look, I said right after the block, I said, oh, that guy's catching nuts on the head. Just wait. This dude's getting straddled tonight. And then he said, oh, I'm hurt. I got to leave. I got to leave. I don't want any part of this.

He said, I got to get out of here. It is pretty cool, though. I mean, I forget, maybe it was one of the inside the NBA guys. said John Moran's going to be the best player in the world in a couple of years, right? You get that type of hype right now down in Memphis, which is really cool. I'm going to get to a game there this year, Chris. I have to. I got to.

I got to. But you wait until everybody's back. Desmond Bay and John Moran. That would be a horrible time a year to go. I'll make it happen, though. They never have anybody. They never have the team healthy. It's unbelievable.

We talked about doing a live show in L.A. later in the season. We should do one in Memphis, too. That'd be really cool. Yeah, whenever that, yeah, I'm going to come on. I'm going to do the LA thing. Yeah. For sure. Rissillo did his Denver show.

That looks like a great time, right? With Jeff Green? Oh, my God. That looked awesome. I saw it. That looks so cool. Hey, if we could do that, you know, in Memphis, that'd be dope. I'd love to do that.

We've got to pull that off. Kevin, oh, it goes without saying, for all of you that listen to this show on a regular basis, say nice to us regularly. Very, very thankful for you. Thank you. Our seventh season, Chris, doing this. Yeah.

I'm thankful for everybody. Thankful for you. Yeah. And our producer, Jesse Lopez, who puts up with us and has to edit this every single week. Thank you to Jesse. Thank you, Jesse. It's been fun.

I hope everybody has a wonderful and safe Thanksgiving holiday and remember the things that matter the most are not what we didn't talk about on the podcast today, whatever that was that you're saying. Think about what matters the most. and be thankful. Absolutely. So much to be thankful for, Chris.

You got any fun plans of the family this week? I'm very thankful that I get to be around my family, right? My parents. Absolutely. It's another year. It's another year. I'm thankful to be around my mom here in L.A. Her first Thanksgiving in L.A.

It's pretty cool. It'll be good. Yeah. I don't take it for granted. I don't. I don't take it for granted. You know, I've had, I think anybody out there that Ted, older parents, right?

You're always concerned about health. There have been times where I didn't think I was going to have my dad anymore because he was in the hospital or years ago my mom had a heart attack like out of nowhere. And so, you know what I mean? Like it's always you're, I have this real awareness. You know, they're in their 70s. And I have an awareness, right, that I want to cherish that time. I do.

And I'm lucky because I get to be around, you know what I mean? It doesn't have to be Thanksgiving. It doesn't have to be Thanksgiving. You're thankful every day. Every day. Yeah. But the fact that you get to all be together on Thanksgiving. And eat some good food together, absolutely.

Sit at the dinner table together. Nothing better than that with your family and loved ones. Yep. Everybody have a great Thanksgiving. We will talk to you next week.