The Mismatch - Tournament NBA Potentials, Embiid Pushing for MVP, and the Feel-Good Kings Clinch a Winning Season

Episode Date: March 17, 2023

Verno and KOC discuss Ja Morant’s suspension before turning their attention to Draymond Green’s suspension after he received his 16th technical foul this season. They then discuss the feel-good Kings, who clinched their first winning season since 2005-06 (01:40). With the 76ers riding a six-game winning streak, the guys note that Joel Embiid is making a strong push for MVP as they debate the current MVP standings (22:39). With March Madness still underway, the guys discuss some of their favorite players in the tournament, as well as those players' NBA potential (42:05). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Producer: Jessie Lopez Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

It's no secret the NFL has a problem with race. Think Colin Kaepernick. Think Brian Flores. But this isn't a new problem. It's one that started as far back as the 1930s, with a ban on black players in the NFL, with a past that informs the present. Blackballed is a new miniseries podcast from The Ringer,

about the four men who broke the color barrier in football. I'm your host, Chelsea Stark Jones. BlackBald is dropping soon on the Ringer NFL feed. Welcome to The Mismatch. I'm Chris Barney and joining me she does every Friday from The Ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor, a.K. Kevin O'Bomber, Kevin O'Conflict, Kevin O Candyland, Kevin O'Campra, Kevin O'Chamer, Kevin O'Carriks, Kevin O'Korne. Feels good to be on this side of the

introduction. Super appreciate Robahoney filling in for me earlier in the week. We have this show to do that we're going to knock out today and then by the time we speak a again, the live show in Memphis will be going on. For the first time ever, I'm getting you, Bill Simmons, and Joe House all together in Memphis. How cool is that? Unbelievable.

For a sold-out show at the New Daisy Theater on Field Street to Memphis, Tennessee. On Tuesday night, I could not be more excited to host everybody and to have everybody in town. I got a little hopeful over the weekend that it might be, possibly be, the return of John Morant on Monday night, which would be crazy considering when I went out to L.A., it marked the beginning of him not playing for the Grizzlies right before that live show. And then this would be him coming back into action, but they're saying they're going to ramp him up. next week. So he's not returning Monday in all likelihood. Right.

The actual. Suspension over Monday, but not returning. Correct. And they have a game. I thought the NBA script writers were so good. I know. So close. So close.

Now, of course, he has done. We've seen the news about it. We've seen the eight game suspension. We saw the interview that he did with Jalen Rose. And look. That was funny. What was funny? I mean, I'm just like so on.

It was 20 minutes of nothing, really. I thought it was only four. There's a 20-minute version. There's a full version. Is that true? Oh, my goodness. I didn't see a 20-minute version. I just watched the four-to-half-minute version.

Here, like, the only things you want to hear was him not making, having a acceptance of his own actions that have gotten him into different situations, and what he's got to follow through on is the, I'm going to rewrite the story. I want to change the narrative about me. And that is, that's an action's thing. That's not a word thing. And so he can only be judged by

if this is the moment in which it all changes for him. And I do think with anyone, sometimes when you are given the opportunity to step back and realize what you should be grateful for, what you have a chance of losing. And it's not, you know, I know people say, well, he could lose his Nike do. He could lose this.

He could lose whatever. I mean, the more important stuff is not that. He's already got his signature on a $200-something million contract. Okay? What he's going to lose is possibly your sanity and more importantly, what you have fought for your whole life,

which is to be, a great professional basketball player with the ability to do great things. You don't want to look back and think I could have had a Hall of Fame career. I could have played for NBA championships. I could have been an MVP of the league. Like all of those things,

because you can have the story where everybody talks about you of what might have been if it hadn't gotten screwed up. And so I think everybody's just hopeful that at 23 years old, the wake-up call was the wake-up call, and now the story can be rewritten. It's never too late for somebody to rewrite his story, and here's hoping that the stepping away from basketball

for an amount of time realized everything he should be grateful for and how he's got to move different in the future. Are you at all surprised it was only an eight-game suspension, and it was a retroactive suspension as well, where they counted the games that the Grizzlies just kind of, you know, said, hey, stay away for now. Take time away. I don't.

I don't think that, I don't know what the precedent would be, you know? Like, because it was, you know, putting the NBA in a bad light. It wasn't. And the other thing is, they're so weird on punishment that, I guess when you say, are you surprised. Yeah, I'd be surprised if it was Roger Goodell, but in Adam Silver's NBA, totally, yeah.

Am I surprised? In Adam Silver's NBA, where Andrew Wiggins is away from the team for two months and nothing's going on. We don't know anything. But we still don't know what's the penalty for Miles Bridges. Yeah, you're right, we don't. Who beat up his significant other.

Terrible, yeah. But we still don't know. Yep. Like if Miles Bridges decided, like is this is he serving something now is he not serving something until he signs with somebody no idea like a dischaun watson situation is it i just i don't know so yeah that that's a fair answer chris you're not surprised in adam silver's NBA that's that's a great way to answer you're right because what's the i don't really have anything to go off of you know i didn't know

if they would do anything. And I don't think anybody did, right? I think we even discussed this on our group text. I'm like, I don't know if they're going to do anything to the guy. I don't know who's supposed to be. I don't know if it's like just let the team handle it or if the NBA is going to say something. We didn't even find out what the NBA was doing until a little bit later down the road. And you don't know if I don't know this.

I should know this. If the Grizzlies had discussions with the NBA beforehand saying we are going to take these measures, what are you guys thinking or what's, I mean, I don't know what the standard is. You know, he wasn't arrested for what he did. You know, he's acting like an idiot on Instagram. So I don't know what the penalty for that is. I don't think Adam Silver necessarily has a book that says, okay, acting like a fool on Instagram.

That's eight games, right? I don't know if it matters if you're waving around a knife or a gun. I don't know if it matters if you're, you know. The thing is, is like what you're saying, it feels like Jha, you know, agree or disagree. You know, it doesn't matter. But it feels like NBA, the league, the Grizzlies, the team, the media, sponsors, all of those combined have kind of, I feel like, supported Jha. And I think now he has an opportunity here where, you know, regardless of what he says in interviews with Jalen Rose, this is going to be about action. moving forward. And he's being given a chance to build here from making a mistake and, you know,

a run of mistakes. And hopefully from here, he continues to make more positive actions and decisions in his life. And like, this is an opportunity here where I think, you know, media team sponsors, all that are, you know, supportive of him. And now it's at the point where you hope job just makes better choices. I have talked to people that have spoken to Morant that tell me that he while he has gotten off of social media he is very aware of the level of support

all around and it does encourage him to act differently you know good when you see all those people you know rather than

coming down on you but rather hey we hope this guy gets better which is what it feels like it also makes you want to it also makes you want to be better right? Because then you feel like

you're letting people down if you're not I think yeah I hope yeah you know um

Anyways, Grizzly's Warriors is tomorrow night. Warriors play Atlanta tonight. They're going to do so without Draymond Green. And this is worth noting because he's sitting out because of the text. So Draymond's going to have to miss this Atlanta game. And so he's reached the limit on text. We've already seen Dylan Brooks reach the limit on text. I know Luca is really close to the limit on text.

Now that he's hit the limit, is he like, can you miss play? Playoff games for additional texts after this? So the way the NBA rulebook says it is, you get to 16 during the regular season. You get the suspension as Draymond is. Then for every two, so the 18th and the 20th technical, you get suspended again. However, the technicals reset during the playoffs, and then it goes to seven. If you get the seventh technical, you get suspended. Then if you get a ninth, you get suspended.

When Draymond was suspended during the finals, many years. ago, that was for their flagrant rules. You know, when you reach a certain amount of points of flagrant file calls, they suspend you. So the technicals, Luca and Dylan Brooks and Dremont, these guys, it will reset in the playoffs. Yes, I don't remember if somebody like Dilla Brooks got a tech before he clipped Gary Payton out of the air, but he got suspended last year. And that was, I mean, maybe he had just accrued the point system or whatever by that point. But you got to imagine that if guys get suspended for playoff games,

it's because they've committed flagrant fouls because seven is just too hard to get to. If that's the number you have to get to, seven texts is extreme. That's a lot of technical. You have to be a lot of bitching to get seven texts over the course of a playoff run. That's crazy. Yeah, that's a lot of technicals. So I guess you have to just commit flagrant.

here and there. The big story that we got to get to, Kevin, is the Sacramento Kings, the butt of so many jokes for 17 years, the Sacramento Kings and their fans have had to deal with losing season after losing season, 2005, 2006. It was the last time that they had a winning season,

and they clinched a winning season last night. So bonus, 24 points, 21 rebounds in the game. And it's just been, it's been a great story. I think it's fair to say they have been, they have been the most heartwarming story of this NBA season, have the Sacramento Kings, hiring Mike Brown, making some really good moves, you know, drafting Keegan Murray, getting Kevin Herder, getting Malik Monk, you know,

getting solid head coach and then kind of unlocking this sub bonus Dier and Fox pick and roll both all-star level players going to have chance at all NBA teams possibly for them but super cool story man for the Kings and Kings fans and though we said their schedule

was going to get harder and they still got some tough games they've been great. And they surpassed the Grizzlies. They have. I mean, look, if that's the two three. I thought you said let's only talk about things that are possible. Here we are. The season's not over yet, Kevin.

You know, speaking of the season, I'll be over. I was trying to decide if I should bring up the tweets after the season is over or are we good now. Let's focus on the Kings right now. Oh, you want to talk about the Kings right now. Let's talk about the Kings, yeah. Oh, okay. I was just saying I happened to be looking at the point

We're okay We'll talk about the Kings We don't need to talk about those tweets With the Pelicans The last time Hopefully Kevin Hurder with his hamstring injury There was a report about an hour ago Before recording

That the MRI came back clean That his hamstring injury is okay He's day to day he'll return soon But yeah man They're such a There's such a fun Fun team Everything about them

From the beam To the locker room stuff that they do hang like they just have fun players a dominant offense a great system

the ability to play any style on the half court or fast in transition I don't know it's just like it couldn't have been it could have not been a more cool team to get into the playoffs

it's not like they just snucked their way in with some unlikable team they have an absolutely lovable roster I think about what it must be like to be regardless of, like, if you're in your 30s and you, like, last time they made the playoffs, you were a teenager, or like you're just becoming a Kings fan,

you're like 13, 14 years old right now, and this is the first team you really fall in love with. Like, regardless of your experience as a Kings fan, I don't know, this just feels like the perfect team to fall in love with. They have, as I mentioned, the first winning season since 0506. That team was 44,000.

and 38. Think about that this. They're 44 and 38. They were fourth in the Pacific Division at 44 and 38. Fourth in the Pacific. That's crazy to think about. That was the winning season. They had Mike Bibby, Francisco Garcia, Jason Hart, Sharif Abdurahim, who was kind of there as quasi-assistant coach. Kevin Martin, Brad Miller, Battali Potapenco, Ronnie Price,

Pesia was still there, Bonzi Wells, Kenny Thomas, Corliss Williamson, meta-world peace. Wow. I do not remember the meta-world peace

King's era. Wow. Do you? I don't remember him being a king at all. Huh. It is wild. You know,

he would have got, like, they give out nowadays their defense defensive player of the game, the chain, and the Kings give that out after the locker room. Brana Artes would have won some of those on his day. How about this?

He was second on the team in scoring. 17 points a game, five rebounds, four assists, shot 38% from the field, and played 40 minutes a night for the Kings. Oh, wow. 40 minutes a night. He's 26 years old.

That's sassy. He was traded from Indiana to Sacramento that season. For Pages Stoyakovich. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I kind of remember that. I'm trading Pager. Page's son. He's got a chance to make the NBA.

I've heard that. Yeah. It's it. I'm looking at his basketball reference. I'm sure that you looked at too. It says, Born Ronald William Artes changed to MetaWorld Peace in

2011. Subsequently to the Panda's friend in 2014, he changed his name to the panda's friend? I miss this too. And then it says subsequently the Panda's friend changed to meta

Sandiford Artest in 2020. I can't keep up. It's a better World Peace, right? Formerly known as Ron Artes. He's Ron Artes. I suppose. I suppose formerly known as the Pandas Friend. That is an awesome name. The Pandas Friend.

I guess you just put friend on the back of a jersey? I don't know. I don't know what you would do. He said he played in China and Italy. I guess that's what he did it when he was playing in China and Italy, because it says it 2014, The Pandas Friend. Who knew? Anyway, he was.

He should change his name to hoe you fat next. the last time the Kings had a winning record I got to get one of those jerseys Steve Ho You fat I gotta get one of those Meta World Peace

played 40 minutes a game and was the second leading score of the Kings the last time they had a winning record that's crazy yeah what a team that's the last time

and you know we talk about this where the Mariners just broke their street by going to the place playoffs in Major League Baseball. And so the Kings were the ones that were on the hook

for longest playoff drought in professional sports. The Mariners had broken theirs. And now we know that the Kings are going to break theirs. So I don't know who would be on the,

I don't know who would be on the hook next. I'm going to have to look at this. Because the Kings was so long. I mean, 17 years. It was 16 seasons. I guess the 17th season. The Mariners was 21, 21-year playoff absence.

Oh, my goodness, you know who the next is? The Jets, the New York Jets. Oh, potentially with Aaron Rogers next season. Wow, 11 seasons. And they are tied with the Buffalo Sabres. Wow. Those are the two. Wow.

Last playoff appearance in 2010-11. and the Jets' last playoff appearance was 2010. Mark Sanchez and Rex Ryan. It looks like the Buffalo Sabres are 33, 28, and 6. That must mean they have a chance to make playoffs. Yeah, they'll have chances. All these drops are going to break in the same like calendar, or I guess in the same year?

I don't know. I'm not sure. I don't really know anything about hockey. It says Buffalo is fifth in the wild card standings. Oh, wow. I don't know what that means. All right. I mean, Buffalo has been terrible for the better part of those 10 years.

They've either been like last place or close to last in their division. Points are what matter, I guess. Yeah, right? So they have 72 points. They're an 11th in their conference. That can't be good. So maybe they won't break it. So the Jets, if the Jets get Aaron Rogers, they could break theirs.

They're the next. Yeah. Their next one. That's kind of crazy. that the Jets are the next one after the Kings. Aaron Rogers was not great last season, though. I know, but I would not have guessed. I mean, better than Jack Wilson.

Come on. Yeah, Zach Wilson stinks. I mean, is that actually going to happen, though, with Rogers? I mean, isn't there stuff holding it up and all that? Seems that way. He's already giving them receivers that he wants, they say. So you got to figure. I think that's what he found out in his cave or whatever he went to.

Is the trade just going to? going to have to wait until a certain date or something like that? I guess it'd be closer to the draft, right? I don't know, probably. Kings, though, great story. They're holding down the fort. They've got their two seed right now. You've got to figure they're going to be a home court advantage team.

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Next thing we've got to get to is this Embeddd run and the Yokic souring that has taken place over the course of the last really week and a half. I checked Fandul. Embed has now moved into the favorite for MVP.

I mean, the Yokic thing had been a foregone conclusion for the majority of the season. That was the conversation. And I know you liked Yonis. But now, Yokic, I mean, I think the reason why this is shifted is because Mbid is on the best run of its entire career, you know, on both ends, dominant on defense, an absolute force on offense. and Yokic is playing defense like when James Hardin was trying to demand a trade.

Like he just is not trying. He's coasting. He very clearly, after he had a great defensive performance against your Grizzlies, you know, ever since then, he's just been putting up stinker after stinker, not really trying. And that's going to work against you when it comes to MVP voting. Whereas Embed and Yannis, these guys are chasing that awarded, and not letting up on defense and continuing to play at an absolute elite level.

And maybe part of that is Yokic, you know, Denver right now, you know, I talked to Bill Simmons on his podcast earlier this week, and he asked me, you know, you feel like Sacramento or Memphis has any chance to catch the nuggets for the one seed? They're four and a half up on Sacramento right now. I don't feel like Denver's going to totally free fall. They have a good cushion. Maybe that's part of why Yokic is taking an easy on defense, but that's not going to help you in the MVP conversation. One of the things I've thought, and I know they're defensive metric, or they're back. They're bad. Their offense is great. Their defense is bad. When you get to the playoffs, they're going to be able to target that.

They really don't have defenders, Kevin. I mean, I'm saying in front of him. Sometimes you could, however good or bad he is on defense, it gets exposed to the highest degree. Because they don't have a bunch of guys that are like fighting through screens and staying with their man. Jamal Murray. They're super active defensively. Porter Jr's lame.

Porter's been better than before, but like Jamal Murray's a real weak spot right now. Like the fighter is Brown. Like he's the one that like, yeah, he fights. The tough part is is you put Bruce Brown out there and then you have, granted his numbers are solid from three. He's a low volume shooter who does not garner, you know, great respect from the defense.

So you're like, if you bring him out there, yes, you're helping your defense, but you're hurting offensive spacing. Right. So even if they're like switching with some of those like some of those guys, like there's this, you're not switching on to, there's no great matchups for them defensively. And so when you don't have a guard that's like going through screens and slithering by and staying on their man and refuses to get, you know, screened off of them,

like you are leaving him exposed all the time. And teams just, look, he is not a good defense. I don't give a damn what any metric says. Those defensive metrics, if you find a defensive metric that tells you that, Yokic is a good defender, urinate on it and throw it in the fire. Yeah. Because just open your eyes. Just watch.

Just watch. This guy ain't stopping anybody. But he is amazing offensively. Me, I say hogwash. You say urinate on it. Yeah. Whatever. Same difference.

We're getting to the same point. Those defensive metrics are goofy. They are. They really are. Some of them are so terrible. Like, it's almost laughable. It really is. It feels like you're going to.

It's misinformation is what it is. Like I think. Exactly what it is. It's misinformation. Some of these defensive metrics, I think, do more harm than good. And they should not be utilized at all. Because they turn people off to actually valuable metrics in terms of assessing the game.

Offensive metrics, I think, can have great value. But the defensive stuff is ridiculous. It's just like the data is not good enough. It's just not. And what people have done is they put both together to act as if there's some super number that shows all encompassing. I've thrown together Raptor and Crafter and slapped her.

Dude, I've had NBA analytics people tell me over the years. I've said, hey, with tracking data, have you guys been able to put together, you know, valuable defensive numbers? And pretty consistently, like, I'm sure some people might be hiding partial truths, but for the most part, like, the smartest analytics people I've talked to say,

I mean, defense is so hard to look at with any individual number. It's so much about process versus results. You can't really look at numbers. And even if you're using tracking data, it still doesn't necessarily tell you the full story of what's happening. Whereas with offense, it's a lot easier to put together valuable numbers to assess the game. But for defense, it's far more difficult. And maybe that'll change.

You know, they have X, Y coordinates right now. The league is doing stuff with, you know, new technology to add a Z coordinate. Tracking of arms and limbs and all that. Maybe you can figure out some data for the quality of a contest, right, of a contested show. Maybe there's other ways to innovate defensive data. But as of now, most NBA people I talk to just don't find a lot of value in defensive data, even the advanced camera tracking stuff, never mind, you know, the stuff that we have publicly.

And that's what's so impressive, honestly, about Yokic is that what we can value is a lot of the offensive numbers. And he's off the chart. He's all-timer. And that's why they've got the number one record. That's why they've got the number one seed. because he's so damn good offensively. To be clear, number one record in the West.

Yeah, yeah. Bucks have the number one record in the league. Right, but I mean, this guy, like, the reason they're number one in the Western Conference is because they're so good offensively. And they're so good offensively because of him. So, yeah, he's got some, he's not a great two-way player. He is an amazing one-way player,

but I do think so much focus went on to the, layup line that teams can run on them and their defense as a whole. They're going to, if they lose in the playoffs, there will be the discussion about having to flank him with good defenders. Yeah. Because they're light on those. You don't have anybody that you consider like, hey, throw them on that guy and that guy's not getting a bucket tonight or this guy's going to have an off night.

This guy's going to have a problem. That's not on that team. and I do think that when he's the guy in the back, that it might serve them well to have maybe even a little more size, you know, with as much as he plays not down next to the basket. You know, and they run Gordon at the dunker spot, and Gordon's been fantastic, but I'm just saying like the kind of fly-around guy that is a great help defender, White B.

the best type of thing next to him. We'll see. We'll see how it plays out. Teams are going to have to game playing against them, and you know they're going to put them in those one-five pick and rolls every time down the court. We'll see if they can hold up. You think the Nuggets can make the finals?

Of course. You think would you put their chances ahead of, you know, kings? Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Head of the Grizzlies? Yes.

I'm on ahead of the suns. Yes, right now. Clippers? Yes. Okay, so you think they're the favorite in the West? Yeah, I think you have to, when they're getting to play at home, they've got the best player in the conference, and they've got a ton of playoff scars. I think it's unfair to bet against them. Okay.

You know, would I bet against them if you get a bad matchup? Of course, I could see that losing. But, I mean, they're going to get a game seven. in their place if it gets to that point. That's not an easy place to play. They'll have home court advantage, and they got the best player. So there's none of those teams, though, Kevin. Every one of those teams you mentioned have questions.

So if I said the Kings, guess what? The Kings are terrible defensively, too. And you think it's going to get any better with somebody game plans against it? The offense is going to get harder to execute, and the defense gets more exposed. It's the way it goes. but if I've got a team that's been through a lot of playoff series and I got the best player, of course they have a chance. I do think it's open.

I don't consider them some kind of massive favorite. And I could see scenarios for sure where they lose, just like I can see. There's not a team you can name that I feel great about saying that's a team that will represent the West. I think there's anybody, outside of three teams in the east would be surprising. So in the east, Bucks, Celtics, Sixers,

you wouldn't put the calves in that? No. How come? I'm just out of curiosity with Cleveland because... Scars. Scars, yes, but they also have the number one net rating in all of the NBA right now. I know.

They have the number nine offense. They have the number one defense. I know. And they have, they don't have scars together, they have scars individually, you know, guys that have kind of, you know, gone through it in their own way. Donovan Mitchell for years with the jazz. I just think you got to do it together. It's like you're going to be in those big playoff games as a group.

I think that's fair. I do think it's fair. And I think the other teams are better than them. And I think they're going to draw the bucks. I agree. They're drawing the bucks in the second round. I agree that the other teams are. better. Boston and Philly are going to beat each other up in the second round probably.

And that is the most fascinating when you take a look at the standards. Yeah, they're tight right now. Because you wonder what kind of changes would take place for either of those two teams dependent on if they got bounced in the second round, Boston or Philly. That could be a big sliding doors moment where, either of those teams could be making big decisions based upon a second round loss

to the other one. But I think that it looks like you know, you can catch the bucks. They've got a game against each other. Boston could catch the bucks. But if it stayed the way it is right now

and there is some kind of separation and we're really getting 10, 12 games left in the season, then the Cavs are probably not moving up into that top three. And if you're not moving up into that top three, then you're catching the box with home court advantage. And I do think they have to be the favorite in the same way. Yonis right now, I was talking about the MVP kept.

He's plus 370. Do you think it's just too far down the road? I mean, MB's plus 100. Yoke is just plus 160. I just put out my MVP rankings two days ago. I have Janus 1 and B'd up to 2, Yokic 3. That's what I have. That's what I've had.

I've had Janus won pretty much all season. And Beads coming fast, man. He is. I mean, I very well could end up voting in Bid, but it's a three-man race between Janus and Bid and Yokic. But I've had Janus 1 and I haven't moved off of that quite yet. Does it matter who ends up with the number one seed to you? I guess it depends on how it happens.

Like, why did it happen? Well, you know how it's going to happen. It's going to be happening because either Janus is amazing or it's amazing, right? Like, I mean, there's no way around that. I mean, it could happen because a guy missed his time, you know, a lot of different ways. Well, we've got very few games left. Yeah. And so, you know, it's going to be, look, those guys are either in first or second place in the respective conferences right now.

Those are the three we argued about last year. The only other one that even had a chance to get in there this year was Tatum or Luca, right? Yeah. Do you think Luca belongs in the top five? I had a hard time keeping him on there. I'm like, Luca at five, the Mavericks are not a great team. They're 500. They were below 500 at the time.

Does Luca belong at fifth on MVP with some of his, I mean, he's been dominant on offense, but it's not like he's anything good on defense. I just didn't know who to put there instead. It is tough to figure out who you would put five for MVP. It's like Fox. Jalen Brunson? I don't know. You know what I mean?

Donovan Hedgel. I had a really hard time thinking about who I put there instead. I think on the Fandul Odds Curry was listed. And I was like, what? I didn't get that. Yeah, I don't know. Curry was listed on there. Yeah, I think you're right.

There isn't anybody else that's not biased. But the Blazers are way below 500 as well. Booker hasn't played more than 44 games, 45 games right now. Yeah. I don't know. Brandon Ingram? Donovan Mitchell? Ingram?

No. What was that? No Brandon Ingram? I didn't hear that. LeBron. What about? Ron. How about J?

D. Jha? Right? I don't think he's going to be getting many votes. Yeah, I guess Mitchell or Brunson, right? Yeah, it's not easy. It's almost by default because all these other guys have gotten hurt. And honestly, and really it doesn't matter.

It's like the guy's not going to win. But it does matter. It is kind of cool to be fifth in MVP voting for a year. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Isaiah Thomas, his great Celtics year, was fifth in MVP voting. That was pretty cool. I saw him put on one of the greatest performances I've ever seen in person. Same here.

Really? Yeah. It was a game in Memphis, and I just like, it was amazing. He was so awesome and unstoppable. That season, that's one of the greatest offensive seasons that anyone has ever had. it is so crazy to think back to that. He ever's like 30 points a game, didn't he? Yeah.

Yeah, he did. I remember, I think I put this in the story. I wrote when he scored 53 points against the Wizards and the playoffs, I'm pretty sure I had this in there, but Tommy Hineson told me before a game that series. He said there were three Celtics players he watched in his 80-plus years that made him say, how did he do that?

It was Bill Russell, Larry Bird, and Isaiah Thomas. How did he do that? And it's true. That was the special thing about watching Isaiah Thomas for that that couple of year period with the Celtics is this 5'10,

5 foot 9 guy doing things on the court that we haven't really seen since Alan Iverson. That was special. I love to watch an IT. I really did. I think this is the game. I think I found it.

December 12th. 2016, I believe was the game. And he had, let's see, he ended up with 44 points in the game. 7 of 10 from 3, 17 for 17 from the free throw. That's wild. That was a special time, man. That was one of my, that was really the last year I felt something towards the Celtics, like something strong.

16. That's 16-17 season. Yeah. That was like my first year with the Ringer, my last full year living in L.A. I'm living in Massachusetts watching most games with my dad. Watching Isaiah Thomas that year. That made me still feel something

towards the Celtics that year. But I miss that. I miss rooting for a team, man. I do. It's weird. I do miss that. still doing? No, I can't. On the low. No, I can't. No, I can't. I can't. I would do it openly. I don't care. I just, I just, it's just not there. I miss it. Maybe, maybe someday. I think, I think I would need

to have a kid who likes basketball, or then I feel that connection again with family, like over the sport, which is the beautiful thing that you have, Chris, with your generations of fandom. Oh, God. It's pretty awesome. Look, the other day, we were on vacation, obviously. and I actually turned off the game. The grizzly got killed by the heat. They're down by 30-something points. Bain got thrown out of the game. And I was like, all right, we're seeing enough of this.

Let's go to bed. We woke up the next morning, and he was so mad at me that he did not get to see Kenny Lofton's 10 points. He was like, he played the whole fourth quarter. He always loves the guys that never get to play. That's so cool. So he was mad at me that we did not watch the fourth quarter because Kenny Lofton, evidently had 10 points.

And I was like, go back and watch it on YouTube. That's so special. I love it. I'm sitting there going, I'm not watching, I'm talking about 34 points. I'm not watching this crap. I don't care if he's got 10 points in garbage time. That he cared. That's amazing.

You guys get 10 points of garbage time. Is the Vernon family going to be there Monday? I don't know. Tuesday night, rather, Tuesday. I think my wife's going to go. I'm not sure about the kids. Yeah, I'm not sure. For the live show, I mean,

I don't know, he probably would be entertained. My daughter would be bored out of her mind. Yeah, she'd be bored. She doesn't care. Those four bumbling idiots on stage. Yeah, I don't know, maybe she thinks it was cool. Yeah, right. I know this for sure all weekend.

going to be watching the NCAA tournament. And I want to ask you about a couple of guys because it does seem like there's quite a few that have got a lot to gain. One of the games that I circled for NBA perspective was Kansas, Arkansas. Because Arkansas got a big win yesterday in their first round game,

and they're playing against Kansas. Kansas guy Grady Dick, who is in most everybody's top 10 now. Is that true? He's in a lot of other people's top 10 right now? Yeah, he's in a lot of top 10. the lottery. But that Arkansas team is loaded with draft prospects in between Nick Smith, Jr., Anthony Black,

even that Ricky Council the Fourth. They got four or five on there that are probably going to play in the league one day. And so you have this weird scenario where you've got the number one seed playing the eight seed, but the eight seed has got this loaded. Like Kansas is usually the one with all the McDonald's All-Americans. Arkansas's got these McDonald's All-Americans. And so I kind of feel like this could be big for either Grady Dick or the Arkansas group. Of the Arkansas group, is there one that you really love?

Are you more, Nick Smith Jr. and Anthony Black, which of those are you more sold on for the next level? More so Anthony Black. I'm not a big Nick Smith guy. I just, I'm having a hard time seeing it with Nick Smith. I mean, he's missed time this year too, right? He has mistime this year. I, like, I get it with Nick Smith. I see the appeal.

And he very well could turn into a very good NBA player long term. But he's had just so many stinkers on offense, including in that game against Illinois the other night, two of ten. I just, I would, I think he's got a lot to prove this month for Arkansas. Anthony Black is more of like the reliable playing. maker connective peace gritty defender

so much to like with him and the one guy we didn't mention on the Arkansas side of things Jordan Walsh I mean you wish he shot the ball better only 27% from three this season but he's 6-7 he's long he's a mother effort like that dude grinds

constantly on the floor really good defender a lot to like from him so I'm sure you'll see him defend Grady Dick on some possessions on the Kansas side of things so Yeah, you're right. That's a good, that's a really good game to watch for scouting purposes for both teams. Because on the Kansas side, yes, like Grady Dick is the big name there. But somebody like Jalen Wilson, you know, he's a junior, he's an upperclassman, but he very well could have a long NBA career as well ahead of him. So there's a number of guys in the Kansas team, just not as big name as the Arkansas guys.

I know this is juvenile, but do you think you're always going to say Grady Dick every time you talk about him? And like, you know how you say M.B. Or Yokic or Janus or whatever? Are you just going to always say both names? I don't know. I mean, as to say. Well, if you're going to say I love.

Right. You're going to say Grady, Dick. You'd say great. But the thing is, is what's the... You don't want it to be confused that you... Soon enough, it's not going to matter with voice AI technology. Every podcaster is going to have clips of their voices out there of things they actually didn't say. Oh, come on.

Oh, come on. We're there. Kevin O. Darkweb, here you go again. Okay. I mean, I know that it is a possibility. We're there now. I can go find your voice. anywhere?

No, you could make it if you want to. Oh, I can make it. Well, I don't want to do that. What kind of weirdo does that? What kind of weirdo does that? I'm just saying you could. I know. What kind of weirdo does that?

You see the stuff of Draymond Green and Adam Silver, the voice AIs of them on Twitter recently? I haven't seen it. Uh-uh. You had to send it over to me. Is it good? How about like the Trump Biden ones and Obama? Like kind of the video game ones that people have been doing?

Do you've seen those? I did see that. Okay. Yeah. Like, those are good. not amazing. Yeah. All right.

So you like Dick. Baylor. Keonté George. Yeah. Keonté George, you a fan? Yeah, I like Keonté George a lot. Yep. I do.

You do. You like him a lot. I looked at the other guy. You know, look, we're recording this right as they're about to be playing the Santa Barber team. The point guard from Santa Barbara from Belgium. Oh, I fell down a YouTube wormhole on him. You tweeted you were watching him for like 10, 15 minutes.

AJ Mitchell. He's like Gilgis Alexander or something. It's so weird. It's like all slithery footwork crap. And he's like 6'5. He's going to be a pro. I'm almost, I convince myself of everything watching a YouTube clip. But I liked him.

He's Belgian. And I love Belgian players. I don't know any others, but I love him. So something I always like that. Spike Askin did with the Rights to Ricky Sanchez podcast is the YouTube Big Board and Michael, Michael Levin. You should do like your own YouTube big board. That's a good idea. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah, I like this guy. Hopefully as it. And Kiante, George, you like, it seems like Kaysen Wallace from Kentucky, he feels like one that could. They're playing today, right? Kentucky. Yeah, yeah, yeah. People could fall in love with in a big way.

You know, once upon a time, the aforementioned. The aforementioned. The aforementioned SGA is the one that turned up late in the season, right? Did not have a very good year and then mowed to everybody in that SEC tournament. Next thing you know, the guy ends up being a lottery thing. It's Kaysen Wallace. Can you see him be in the line of the next, you know, Kentucky guards that people really love for the draft? I think he'll be borderline lottery is what I would expect with Kaysen Wallace.

Borderline lottery. You could see, like in my recent mock drafts on the ringers NBA, you know, big board. I have case in like ninth on a mock draft, but he could very well end up 19th. It's that type of year. Duke of those kids,

Filipowski, and then the weirdest thing when I was going to your mock draft, they've got two guys named Derek, neither of which spell it conventionally. Derek Whitehead, D-A-R-I-Q, and D-E-R-E-C-K. Derek lively, and is it Dorek or Derek Whitehead?

Dereke. Dorek. You can call him Derek, though. Philipowski, Whitehead, and Lively. You know, I started the year hating Derek lively, but I'm growing to really, really love him. He's like, oh, he started the year terribly, and he looked like a guy that would free fall to, like,

the second round, despite being a top-ranked high school recruit. Over the course of the season, he has figured it out on defense, and looked like the super versatile shot blocker, perimeter stopper, interior presence that people expected right out of the gates. So Derek lively, you know, I've been very impressed by him in recent weeks or recent months.

And I think this is an opportunity if Duke makes a run for him to kind of show, oh yeah, yeah, I'm back in the lottery. I'm a lottery guy. And they got a real chance too because that Tennessee team looked weak last night. And then if they beat Tennessee, they're playing the winner of probably Purdue and Memphis. I mean, they've got, Duke can make a run.

Oral Roberts was afraid of lively. He had six blocks. They were terrified of him around the basket. Well, Mark Williams action from last year, right? Where he was just blocking everything. Lively's so nice, man. Like I love seeing, and we've talked about this in the context of Brandon Miller, these guys who get better over the course of the season.

And Lively goes from playing 10 minutes per game to, you know, 30 plus during the tournament. He plays 29 versus Orell Roberts. Would have played more if he needed to. He'll be a 30 plus minutes in competitive games. He's these, like, they need Derek Lively. It's gotten to that point. That's a credit to him. Anybody else you super have your eyes open for you're going to go out of your way to watch

because you want to see how they perform on the biggest stage? Let's look at today's games. I mean, I know Kyle Mann and I on the draft show talked about some of the potential matchups for Yukon and their guys, Jordan Hawkins. I look forward to that, you know, depending on how their tournament breaks out. The Indiana kids, you know,

I think they have an interesting path as well. Those two come to mind of the teams playing today. Yeah, because Indiana, they might face more, I mean, they're going to place the winner of Miami Drake. obviously you'd probably rather face Drake just talent-wise but that Drake team's supposed to be really good Miami has made

they made some guys look bad in the past boy they made Auburn they made Auburn look like shit last year including Walker Kessler and look at how Kessler turned out and then Indiana could potentially face Houston in the Sweet 16 like if you get Houston Indiana that'll be a great barometer test for both those squads

I don't know if Houston's going to get there now man they you know obviously I've watched them all season they lost they lost the sasser kid again and then the other one Shed Shed went out with the

injury last night I mean that's two of their best three guys that's a bridge too far and they're drawing Auburn yep I mean luckily Auburn's clueless so you might still have a chance

just playing smart but who'd you pick the win at all Did you do a bracket? Bama, yeah, same hair. I'll tell you this. I know they lost their best guy, but they used to UCLA. Woo!

Oh, I know. You see them last night, started off like 17 to nothing. I'm like, Jesus, cry. I don't care who you're playing. They, like, the other team, I'm like this team is. I was at their senior night game against Arizona, the one that they won on March 4th. They lost Arizona in the conference title game. Obviously, Arizona gets loses.

in the first round major upset. But I was at that Arizona UCLA game, but UCLA won. And I like Hame Haquez a lot, man. Like, I think that dude's going to be a good NBA player for a long time. 6-7 just knows how to play, high IQ, great defender. I think he's going to be good. And the one they lost is Clark, right, J. LaCardt? Yep.

Yeah. And he's as good at defender. Yes, there is. Yep. Yeah. That's a really tough loss when you get later in the tournament. Ted Hockes, because I looked at it, Ken Palm had him as the, he was on the player of the year standings. Yeah.

He was number three. He's so good. Zach Edie, Trace Jackson Davis, that's a kid from Indiana when you were talking about their players. Hockes, Brandon Miller, Drew Timmy, Jaylen. Wilson from Kansas. Jalen Pickett from Penn State, my God. Have you watched him? Watching him, he's not on any draft board, and I don't know. They say he's like as old as Anthony Simons, but I mean, it's like you took Andre Miller from back in the day and threw him in a college game now. It is the most church league, like, point, like, he's so awkward. He's so

awkward. He posts up. Like, he backs people down as a point guard, like, all the way. And sometimes he shoots turnaround jumpers, and sometimes he dumps it down, but he, like, controls the game completely, and it's all just, like, nothing

you've ever seen, Jalen Pickett. I've never, they said he was the only, I was watching their game last night, they just beat the shit out of A&M. And he said he's the only college player to average six rebounds and six assists the game. oh wow and he is weird man he is weird to watch but he's awesome i can't figure out they play

texas next how are you feeling about memphis this year he's thinking Memphis has a shot to make a little bit of one they they would potentially face Purdue yeah and the next round right well they would eaty and all that if they can get there that FAA the florida Atlantic team's really good Really good. But if they can get past them and play Purdue, if you got some dicey guards that could get rattled, Memphis is not the team you want to face. Because if it turns into a speed race,

you're in trouble because they'll press you to death and just start forcing, force, and forcing. I'd like to see Purdue make a run. I just want to see Eadie. Kendrick Davis can be the best player. Best player on any court in college basketball. For people that have not watched him, he's probably not going to be an NBA draft pick. There's nobody more fun.

He is like college Isaiah Thomas. Yeah. When we were talking about Isaiah Tom. Which is why, like, when it comes to the tournament, I selfishly root for NBA drafts prospect matchups. Yeah. I'm rooting for Memphis. not because of you. I'm rooting for Memphis

so I can see Davis you know, King Kendrick versus Zahidi. You know, I'm rooting for Purdue so we get another round of Zahidi against Duke or Tennessee.

You know, it's like I root for prospects in the tournament. I mean, look, the NCAA sets it up that way for you. They try to get all these little guys

bounced if they can. They usually make them face each other. That's why Memphis is playing FAU. They don't have Memphis play like NC St. or somebody that they can bounce out. They make sure that they get two of the,

they get conference USA and the AAC and okay, now one of you get to advance. They set that up like that all the time. Kind of goofy, but whatever. I think today, again, we're recording this right as they're starting. There's going to be a bunch of upsets. I think so. I think there are.

I think there's going to be a bunch of episodes on Friday. There are a couple really good ones on Thursday. Yeah. I think we'll get a couple more today. I hope so. Up sets are fun. Yep. By next week, we'll be doing the live show in Memphis, Tennessee.

I can't wait to have everybody here. Thank you to our executive producer, Jesse Lopez, as always. Kevin, I'll see you in Memphis next week. I can't wait. Have a great weekend.