The Mismatch - Was Nico Harrison Overconfident in Trading Luka? Plus, a New Duo in San Antonio, the Warriors' Desperation, and Expectations for a Wild Trade Deadline.

Episode Date: February 4, 2025

Verno and Jacboy continue to discuss the wild trade that sent Luka Doncic to the Lakers and try to determine just what Mavs GM Nico Harrison’s mindset was that led him to trade Luka away (01:33). They also debate whether Nico’s time around Kobe Bryant influenced his decision to make the trade. Next, they dive into the other big trade of the weekend, which saw the Spurs acquire De’Aaron Fox from the Kings in a three-team deal also involving the Bulls, who sent Zach LaVine to the Kings (22:17). After discussing whether Jimmy Butler would get traded before Thursday’s deadline, the guys debate whether Luka will extend LeBron’s career and whether the Warriors can land another star to pair with Steph Curry (41:17). Finally, they briefly go through some of the Monday night games and share who else they think could make moves before the trade deadline on Thursday (52:11). The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Hosts: Chris Vernon and David Jacoby Producer: Jessie Lopez Social: Keith Fujimoto Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What's popping, everybody? Logan Murdoch here from Real On the Ringer NBA show. And I wanted to invite you to pull up and kick it with Roger Bell, Howard Beck, and myself during All-Star weekend for our live podcast. We're going to be at the Stoer Punchline Comedy Club in San Francisco on Saturday, February 15th at 2 p.m. pre-gaming all the all-star festivities and you never know who might stop by. Get your tickets now by heading over to ringer.com backslash events. That's ringer.com backslash events. to see you there. Welcome to The Mismatch.

I'm Chris Vernon. And joining me as he does every week from the ringer.com is Dave Jacoby. Jacobi. So Chris, we've had a few days since the big trade. And it turns out, Anthony Davis was actually traded

to the Mavericks. It was not just a promo for his incoming prank show, which is the only way that any of this makes any logical sense was if this was all a ruse for his upcoming prank show.

So we recorded on Sunday. One of the things we said in that episode was, all right, it's going to be interesting to see what we learn. Yes. In the next 48 hours because we are obviously going to be recording on Tuesday morning. Since that time, I watched Nico Harrison and Jason Kids press conference that afternoon. Yes, that I. Yes, did I? Few things.

Nico Harrison admitted that Rob Polinka thought he was. trolling him. Nico Harrison said the owner of the Mavericks laughed at him when he brought the trade up. Nico Harrison said that Luca didn't want out and didn't indicate he wouldn't resign. Nico Harrison also said the money, quote, the future to me is three or four years from now. The future ten years from now, I don't know. They'll probably bury me and J. Kid by then, or we'll bury ourselves. It was a disaster.

I don't know how you could have had a great press conference after this trade, but as I was watching it, this is what struck me, and then I want to hear what you thought. as I was watching it, because you are constantly trying to come up with ideas or trying to make sense of something that seems nonsensical, it dawned on me as I was watching it. Oh my God. This guy thinks it's him.

He thinks he's responsible. He thinks he's the reason the Dallas Mavericks were in the finals. Oh, yeah. He thinks that they have had this level of success because he's the general manager. And because of this thought process that him and Jason Kidd have, he thinks it's him. right like when I said on Sunday how does nobody stand up when they're grousing about his conditioning

when they're grousing about his lack of defense and getting blown by in the NBA finals how does nobody stand up in the meeting or somebody with some sense and say whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa you're missing the big picture we're not in the finals if we don't have

have him. You can bitch about the way he played in the finals. But understand the only reason we are having this success is because we have a guy who, yes, we need to have him take time off to get conditioned. Yes, we don't love his off-the-court habits. But also, hey, guys, he averaged last year 34 points, nine rebounds and 10 assists and was third in MVP voting and led the team to the finals. Like, that all happened too.

And so you're kind of missing the force for the trees here. And I left that press conference going, wow. I've covered ownership changes. I've covered general manager changes. and one of the things that is true is you always find they always want their own people. Anytime there is an ownership change, anytime there is a general manager change, coach needs to watch out, roster needs to watch out, right? Because they want to be responsible for it.

In the end, they want to be responsible for it. but this one is the most unbelievable of all. And this is why this has been the constant talk for the last 48 hours is because this is so much beyond I want total credit for everything. But I cannot, I can't separate myself from what I watched, which was me watching that press conference going, Wow, bro. You really think it's you. You think it's your genius. You do.

You think it's your genius. This is hubris. This is Echorus. This is Icarus flying too close to the sun. This is him being celebrated by people like us. And I celebrated Nico last year too. Because what was the story of the Mavericks? The moves they made at and before the trade deadline that brought them from whatever,

12th best defense in the league to fifth best defense in the league and brought them to the NBA finals, they beat the Timberwolves, they beat the thunder. And this is the genius of former Nike executive Nico Harrison. And what you are saying is that success, when you have the level of success they had last year and you're in Nico's position, it allows you wiggle room. It allows you rope. It gives you a runway. You're not on the hot seat.

And you're saying that this environment and his confidence and his ego led him to make this move. I do not completely agree with that. I also think you don't completely agree. I also think, no, no, no, no, this is the other thing I think. I think it's twofold. I also think because I read Ramona Shelburne and Tim McMahon's long article about the whole situation. And one of the things it stood out to me that I do not think is talked about enough is the level of closeness that Polinka and Harrison have has been well documented. Family vacations.

If you didn't read the article, they were like 2003. Yeah, like joint family vacations, all the passing of Kobe, like yeah, yeah. But here's what I will say. And well chronicled that even through his young 20s, Nico was a Kobe guy. That this is a uniquely bad combination of the way one guy thinks and the way another guy thinks. And so Nico Harrison sees things through the prism of the guy that gets up at 4.30 in the morning and is drenched in sweat before everybody else gets up. therefore has a greater level of resent towards the guy that does not condition himself and wants a celebratory beer.

Because to him, he for 20 years was around someone who took it so much further than everyone else. Like, you can't take it more seriously than Kobe Bryant. This is interesting. I haven't heard this angle yet. You're saying that the dedication of Kobe Bryant and his well-documented and chronicled sort of conditioning habits and first one in, last one to leave, that that environment, that relationship between Nico and Kobe has sort of muddied the water and expectations for him and his players that he feels like that is the approach that an NBA basketball

players should have. Therefore, when you have Luca Donchich, who does not have that approach, that he sees a bigger problem than most because of his relationship with Kobe. That's what you're saying? That's what, and again, I might be wrong. I applaud you for giving me a fresh take on this. This is new.

I like it. Well, I read the article, and it was like a light bulb went off. And I'm, because you're, again, you're trying to make sense of the nonsensical. And as I'm reading it, I'm like, oh, God. Oh, boy. This is a guy that was around Kobe all the time. You can't be more polar opposites an approach. So the level of resent towards the way a superstar treats his career is so much greater to a guy that spent his whole life with Kobe. That's what I would say. Interesting. That's what I would say.

I also feel that. By the way, let me just say that does not justify yet. I'm only trying to come up with why does he not feel the way we do? Well, why? I think

here's a couple things I expected to happen between Sunday morning and literally right now. I expected more information about the relationship between Donchich and the Mavericks to come out. I also expected us to learn that more human beings knew about these

discussions than we were told on Sunday morning. However, I sit right here on Tuesday morning, and I honestly think that this was kept quiet. I think LeBron James was actually in the dark on this, as was Luca Dodges. We have since learned from a shout to Chandler Parsons, love that guy, that Dodgers just bought a $15 million house. And another thing we learned is this is some sound I really want to play you. Okay? Because Sasa Donchich, Lucas' dad, did an appearance on Serbian television, and here's what he had to say. So, come to, because I'm not saying, so that philosophy, they're not going to pass to that guy

and so, all that this guy, but I'm, but I think that like that neka, a tynost. So what he said right there is, Fuck the Mavericks. They're hypocrites. They're liars. And I hate those guys. And Luca did not deserve this. That's basically what he said,

which makes me feel like this literally did come from nowhere. You Google translated it. Yeah. Yeah, that's exactly what he said. We're before. Yeah. I speak serving. I speak serving.

Yeah. We did have. I think we were all, we're all waiting for the, as Brian Curtis always talks about the, now you tell us. Like, here comes the notebook dump on every reason that this happened and the real story behind. Like that there, look, the real reason that that video is going around of Michael Finley taking the beer away from Luca Donchich because they talk to him all the time and they could just never get the guy to stop drinking. I mean, what's wrong with a beer after a game?

No, I don't think I've played basketball without having a basketball. without having a beer after the game in my entire life. What I'm saying is you're waiting for them to tell you the dastardly things that would make you believe that this makes some kind of sense, where you would at least read it and you would go, you know, I mean, like, as you tried to defend on Sunday, that they know their guy better than everyone. than anybody else.

The Dallas Mavericks and the people in that organization know Luca Donchers as a human and a basketball player better than everybody else in the National Basketball Association. They do. So the idea would be, and I heard Amin El Hassan, I saw a clip of him talking about this. Shot to him. And he said, think about how insane it would have been in year two for the Pelicans to get rid of Zion Williamson. now in retrospect not in shorting that brilliant right right shorting that would not have been and so what the idea then is like you want it to be the same you want it to now again Zion Williamson was nowhere near his accomplices

Luca donchic but why that's what everybody wants to know everybody accepts in the words of Tim Bontem. This is the biggest short in NBA history. What we still do not have a great explanation for is why. Why are you shorting this stock? Why? Because we do not accept the, like, you can bring up conditioning. He's five-time all NBA first team.

He just led a team to the finals. last year he was third in MVP voting. Like the results are the results no matter his condition. So that's outside, right? And then the contract thing, to your point, he just bought a $15 million house. And in Nico Harrison's own words, he said, yeah, there's teams loaded up to get him in the future,

like trying to like throw that out there while also saying there's been no inclination that he ever wanted to be out of Dallas or that he wouldn't re-sign a supermacks. All indications are that he was happy to stay in Dallas. Right. Even indications by him. By all accounts, he was stunned and couldn't believe it. Well, Sasa's pissed.

Sasa Dantra's pissed. Well, look, as with every NBA story, the best person to go to, to find out, if you want something unfiltered, the best person to ask is Anthony Edwards. Anthony Edwards was asked about the Luca trade. And here's what he had to say. They say that nobody know about the trade.

Yeah, so that's crazy. At 25, they traded probably the best score in the NBA at 25. He didn't know about it. So it's a lot more digging somebody got to do to find out why he got to trade it because he don't just trade him at 25. He just went to the finals, you know what I'm saying? I feel bad for Luca, man. I saw some on YouTube that said he just bought a crib and everything in Dallas.

So that sucks, man. That sucks. Does it inform like everybody? You were 23. Everybody get informed, yeah. I'm scared. I'm scared. Tim, hey, if you're going to trade me, let me know, dog.

If you got traded anybody is able to get trained. And remember, his best teammate just got traded like four months. go. Tim, if you're going to trade me, let me know. Let me know. Just let me know. The other angle to this that we did not get to talk about on Sunday is, and this has been documented in some of the reporting that has come out as follows, is this whole jazz being

involved and Danny A.m. had 30 minutes notice and it was too late to do anything where you Chaw was going to get two second round picks and Jordan Hood Chavino, like they were going to be taking on that contract. What is this? I don't understand the jazz involvement in this in all. Well, I mean, it was just a it was a money thing, right? Like, hey, we need a third team

in order to facilitate this money-wise. Yeah. But, I mean, the real sliding doors moment is like, there's no way Danny Ains helps this to take place. At some point, Danny Hage, like, got a phone call. That was like, wait, wait, wait, wait, Wait, wait, wait, what now?

I'm helping the Lakers get Luca Dajic. Can I not do that? And they're like, no, Danny, you cannot do that. No, they just didn't tell him. Yeah. They were like, look, look, look, here's the deal. We've got a deal coming. I can't tell you who it is.

But you're going to get Jordan Hoochepino and two second around. And we need $55,000. Which is what he gave up? All right, deal. Sure. I cannot imagine his face when they say, said, oh yeah, and it's part of, we've got to call the deal in, and he's got to, like, be his part. And he's like, bro, what?

I was just like, oh, my God. You son of a bitch, there's no way. I like, no, I don't want it anymore. They're like, sorry, too late. George, you already, you already, you already said, you already said cool dude, sorry. I can't imagine. I cannot imagine that he, like, you know, because they told him. they obviously don't want it out

and they don't want anybody to stop it but they just kind of said hey like look we've got a deal here's here's your end of it and here's what you're going to get and then by the time they told him what the deal was

it was too late like he had already said yeah yeah fine we'll be involved and also what has happened it just feels like the Kevin Garnett anything is possible statement because since Sunday we were talking about like oh maybe Zach Levine gets traded maybe Dierrin Fox and usually when we talk about these big names heading into the deadline it ends up

being time lord who gets traded and just like these little moves around the peripheral but now since Sunday oh now we got lebron james going to golden state we got kevin durant going to golden state we got lebron james and kevin derrant going to golden state we got jimmy butler going to Phoenix. Like, I don't even know. Is Shaquille O'Neal going to come out of retirement? Like, what? It just seems like everything is now on the table to happen in the next week. Anything could happen. If you are in need of a midweek boost, Fanduel, America's number one sportsbook has you covered with the NBA Hump Day Parlay Profit Boost. That's right. Every Wednesday, you can get a parley profit boost on everything from spreads to over unders and even player props. We have a couple of huge games coming up this Wednesday. And of course, the marquee matchup is the Cleveland Cavaliers traveling to Detroit to take on the pistons. And remember, this is a back-to-back for the Cavs. They will be playing the Celtics at home on Tuesday.

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bandool.com. Gambling problem. Call 1-800 gambler or visit RG-Help.com. One thing that did happen, as we'll get to all the rumors, was the Deeran Fox deal, where the Spurs

got Deeran Fox and Jordan McLaughlin and the Kings got Zach Levine, Citi Sosco, and three different first round picks. They also got three different second round.

Picks. And the Bulls are involved in this. And they got Zach Collins, Trey Jones, Kevin Herder. Red Velvet. And their own 2025 pickback from the Spurs. Like, so if you're the Chicago Bulls, you're like,

all right, Zach Levine, he's gone. What do we get back? Zach Collins, Trey Jones, and Kevin Herder? What? Make that make sense. Like, that makes almost less sense than the maps deal. how did they get like at least the king's got a bunch of stuff like if you're moving to

air and fox you got an awesome player and a bunch of picks a ton of picks i mean not all picks are created equal the bulls got crap it's wild it's not even a starter oh no the only thing they got a rotation player they didn't even get a starter Zach Collins? I guess. I guess. I don't understand this. What?

Who is he starting for? Somewhere the Bulls fans are just like, well, at least we're not Mavs fans. In Chicago, it's like it could be worse. We could have just traded Luca Dachshundjic. So I saw San Antonio in person last night.

Wembe was coming back from being ill, but he was awesome, nonetheless. He is still, I would encourage anybody, that is out there. If he is coming to your town, he is at the very, very top of my list of something that you need to see in person. Like it is something to behold. But I could not watch that game without thinking about the future and what is going to happen with this team now that they have made the Deerran Fox acquisition. And I got to tell you, after watching them last night, I was like, oh boy.

Like, if the whole idea is we talked about Nico Harrison shorting the Luca Donchage experience in L.A., the best long position in the world to me would be the San Antonio's person. I mean, I love Fox. I love him. I've always loved him. I've loved him. I saw Deeran Fox walk into Memphis in the NCAA tournament, and it was the huge showdown. It was going to be Deeran Fox versus Lonzo Ball.

And this was the team that had Fox and Monk and Otabio and a group of those guys, that Kentucky team. And when I tell you, Deeran Fox emasculated this guy, I'm talking, it was one of NBA. college, high school, you name it, one of the best basketball performances I've ever seen in my life. And so from that moment on, I was like, give me this guy. And of course, he went through ups and downs

in Sacramento. I realize he's a one-time all-star. I shouldn't talk about him like he's a 10-time all-star. But he is right in the middle of his prime. And when I think about him and Wembe together, but you don't have much. You just got to fill out those other few positions. And I love Castle watching him last night.

They didn't have to give him up or Vassell or they didn't really give up any of their rotation guys. It's just a heist, truly. A heist. So Han is still there? I don't understand how they bring in Deerran Fox and don't really lose anything of material. Not even Keldon Johnson. Who I love, Kelton Donson will dunk on you, by the way.

Yeah. And Kelton Johnson is like 30 pounds lighter this year. Like he's evidently gotten a chef and taking everything seriously and whatever else. Look at Donson. He's like, look at Johnson. He's going on that plan. I just, I, uh, I think if you're the Spurs, if you are the Spurs, you're saying to yourself,

we've got the five figured out. We've got the one figured out. two, three, four, I need defenders and shooters. That's it. I need defenders and shooters. That's it. Just give me defenders and shooters and this is over. If they get like true good wing defense and Deer & Fox is never going to make an all defensive team, which is fine.

But if you get wing defenders that can switch and they can play perimeter defense, you've got, rent protection is done. We've got an eight foot tall French guy who's going to stand in the middle. If they get true perimeter defense and shooter. It's like, this is a championship contender in like 20, 26, 27. Devin Vassell said last night, we probably got 10 times better. I mean, and we will see how much better they are the rest of the way. So they've played 47 games.

That means they've got 35 left, right? So they got 35 games left. 21 and 26. They are after last night. What are you doing? Are you putting that in the finals? What are you doing? now.

No, no, no, no, no. I'm asking you. Hold on. Let me, let me, let me, let me, what are you doing? flush it out. They are three and a half back from Dallas, which is eight, and they are three back of Sacramento, Phoenix, and Golden State. The question is, can San Antonio with Fox for the last 35 games of the season play three games

better than two of those teams? that would get them into the play. They can't. That's what they have to do. From here on out, I'm saying, they are, they are not, like,

look, they're sitting now at 12. Okay. So they need to play three in, three games better than their peers, um, that are ahead of them with 35 games left. And so,

and that's in order to get into a position where they're in a play yet. I'm saying even to 10. Yeah. Even to nine. Right. I think that if you are the spurs, you say to yourself, we would love to be in the playing. We would love to get Victor Wembenyama and Deer and Fox,

our new point guard, some playoff level experience. And we have no designs on contending. We have no designs of even going to the second round of the playoffs. But just getting some of that experience, finishing the season like the Rockets did last year, and just getting some momentum as a franchise and developing chemistry and strategy between Fox and Wimby, those are your goals.

But what I'm saying is, Jacoby, let's say they get to like nine or ten, right? So as it stands right now, if you're seven or eight, then you've got to play in that thing. Like if you're Minnesota or Dallas, that's a nightmare. Oh, yeah.

Like, this is the team that you know, now you've got to see Wimpy and Fox. And Fox? You got to be? Like, I mean, it sucks. Well,

it's interesting. It makes them so much more interesting if they get to that moment. And not only that is, and this is a wild overreaction, the Blazers can't be beat right now. Oh my God. They're behind the spurs.

They might get overtaken by the Blazers. Five through 12 in the West is just mind boggling. The Portland thing feels like, The Utah thing last year. I mean, yeah. Which is now you're going to see them. The value has been built up. The value's been built up of a lot of those guys.

You know that going forward you would think theoretically, you're building around a core of Scoot and Shaden Sharp and DeAndre and Klingin. And MVP candidate DeAndre ad. No, you're building around that. Do you see it last night? I understand. but the best possible thing, much like what happened with Utah,

is to build that up the year that Mike Conley got traded, the year that, right, like you can move off these guys. So now, like, your future is not these vets that have been playing,

whether it's Jeremy Grant, whether it's Aiton, whether it's Time Lord. Simons. You know, Anthony Simons, like, that's not the future.

But have those guys built up their stock enough that you, you can get some really good stuff for the future from them. Have they become guys that you can now get a first round pick for, or multiple first round picks for, or good young players coming back that fit more of your timeline that is with the scoot, sharp,

Kamara, Klingin. Love Kamara. That time. Yeah. It's, it is interesting because if you look at the five through 12, in the West is Lakers, Clippers, wolves, Mavs, kings, sons, warriors, spurs, right? All of those teams are trying to get better in the next week via trade to make a run.

All of them. Every single one. And it's going to be interesting to see which of those teams end up dramatically better a week from today. Because they can't all improve. There's just not enough assets out there. Some of the trade rumors that are bopping around, and I will say that this week is always a very strange week for outcomes in the NBA. I have been in many locker rooms.

All of these guys are on hoops hype. All of these guys are on social media. All of these guys are scrolling on their phone. They're talking to their agents. They're stressed out about them going home and they're, girlfriend or wives or whoever, like, am I going to have to change schools? Am I going to have to sell the house?

Right. There's a, there's a large percentage of the league, which even became, I must tell you, a much greater percentage of the league because once there is something as shocking as the Donchich Davis deal takes place,

then much in the words of Anthony Edwards, what's who's safe? Who's safe? I was reading about LeBron James. I know. LeBron came out with a statement. Like there was an actual news article that was like, LeBron James is going to stay with the Lakers.

I read that and I was like, is that where we are in the year of our Lord 2025, February 4th, we have to come out with a statement saying LeBron James is going to stay with the Lakers. For me, for you, for everybody that covers the NBA. But I am also telling you, players in the association, you pull up hoops hype this morning and you're scrolling through, you are going to see a news item about Paul George and about the Hawks and the Warriors calling about Paul George.

You're going to see a story about the bucks. And, oh, I guess they're not in the Jimmy Butler thing, but now there's some tread on the maybe Kyle Kuzma, you know, Mark Stein. Well, apparently Niko called about Janus. Apparently there's reporting that Nigo called. up and said, hey, how about Janus for Donagin? And the bucks were like, no, we're good. Kevin Durant's name is right at the top of Hoopsight.

Going to the Warriors. Is Phoenix taking calls on Kevin Durant? And then there is, in that same Stein report that the Sons might have a level of interest in Kaminga. And then it's like, wait, wait, wait, what? Hold on. You tried Kevin Durant for Kaminga? And then you have, Jimmy Butler doesn't want to play for any. He literally only wants to play for Phoenix?

Jimmy Butler is like, what about me, guys? What about me? What about me? Well, my favorite one is the Jimmy Butler has made it clear he wouldn't resign with the Warriors or some crap like that. It felt exactly like the Doc Rivers has interviewed in Phoenix, but they're not going to hire him. And then he's like, Doc Rivers has pulled his name out of consideration. Yeah, yeah. I have pulled my name out of consideration for people,

magazine sexiest man of the year. I'm making that official right now. That's what Jimmy Butler pulling himself out of consideration. It was already reported that the Warriors don't want you. Jimmy Butler went from, I will literally play anywhere but Miami. Remember that? That was like literally,

it was reported that he would play anywhere but here, anywhere. And then it was, oh, oh, hell no, I'm not going to Memphis. Oh,

no, no, I'm not going to Golden State. No, no, I will only resign with, the Phoenix sons. What?

What? Does Jimmy Butler even get traded at this point? He must, right? He must. You would think so. But where? Where? I mean,

you don't want to hear my idea. Put him in Memphis. No. Put him in Memphis. No, you can't have him. I do want to hear your idea. And the fact that you said, I don't want to hear it makes me want to hear it more.

What's your stupid, idea about Jimmy Butler. Anything is on the table. They just traded Luca Dungeons for Anthony Davis and Max Christie. So your idea can't be worse than that. As soon as I saw those reports of, hey, people are calling about Kevin Durant. I went, Memphis called and tried to get a deal done with Brooklyn when that all took place. And then they tried to get a deal done for McKell Bridges when that all took place.

When that all was going on, it's like, oh, okay. Okay, well, we would have gotten into, right? And DFS. They've been trying to get everybody from Brooklyn. They talked to him about Duran. And then they talked to him about bridges. Okay. And DFS.

And this year. And D. Yeah. And Dory and Finney Smith. My thought was, what if, what if you said, hey, we'll send this to Phoenix. We'll send this and make Miami flood. you know, Miami obviously had interest. The reason that it all came out,

hear me out, the reason that it all came out is because they obviously had interest in a Memphis deal. Okay, that's why Jimmy Butler had to go out of his way, not once, not twice, but three different times had to say, no, no, no, no, right? Because there obviously was like, hey, Memphis has got these assets. They've got these picks. And here is a deal that could take place. So if Miami has interest in what Memphis has and Phoenix, I can't speak to it, but let's say they do have

interest in getting into Jimmy Butler business, now all of a sudden Miami can still get flush. Phoenix can get their guy and Memphis gets their guy. What guy does Memphis get in this cockamamie scenario Kevin Durant. So why would Phoenix be like, let's get out of the the Kevin Durant business and get in the Jimmy Butler business?

Why? Because they're average. I guess anything is possible. I guess anything is possible in today's NBA. No, no, no. But that makes no sense from Phoenix standpoint. And they would also get first round picks in the future.

I guess. Which they need for their future. Literally zero. Because they use them to get Kevin Durant, Bradley Peel and his no trade clause. So you're not just talking about just getting Jimmy Butler. You'd be talking about getting Jimmy Butler.

And Pits. Which is going to be cheaper. And what does Miami get out of it? Why am I even going down this stupid road with you? This is ridiculous. I'm trying to come up with deals. This is ridiculous. Do you know what?

Like low key. This is something that I've not heard anyone say, but I'm sure someone has said. That no one has said about this whole entire process and information sort of like dissemination. no one's talking about the fucking Super Bowl. Who's even playing in the Super Bowl? It's this Sunday, right? It'll crank up at the end of the week. Bro, I literally, I saw a picture from New Orleans

that had like Eagles and Chiefs fans in it. And I was like, oh, they are having the Super Bowl on Sunday. Like, nothing. Not nothing in my algorithm, in my news feed. No, you're right. Like nothing is about the Super Bowl. Because, I mean, that's how big that Dantage trade was, though. If we did not have the Dantage trade, it's not like the Fox trade would be taking over your algorithm.

I mean, it's all surrounding. Of course. But in fairness, it is the most shocking trade in NBA history, which is a league that's been around over 75 years. We've never had anything this crazy happen. I can't wait to look back on this in four years. Because there might be a world in which we're like, Nico kind of called it. You know what I mean?

Or it could be like the 22nd banner in the crypto center. No. Does Luca Dodgers win a championship for the Los Angeles Lakers? I'd say yes. I mean, I think betting against that would be, I would say betting against anything Luca is capable of. is a bad bet. We know that guys, I say this a thousand times. You typically win when you're 27, 28, 29, even the best of the best, all of them. Jordan, LeBron, Curry, Yoke, go back through.

They're generally that age. This guy has already been to the NBA finals and he is 25. He's not even to the age when everybody wins. Here's a question for you. That I just just thought of this now. does this trade extend LeBron's career? I could see his career being longer because of having Lucas Dantich on his team. He does not need to be the, I am the entire offense. He doesn't.

He doesn't need to work as hard. He doesn't play defense outside of the playoffs in four years. The interesting thing, I think, is is that the last jersey he ever won. because this is now a Lucan Dantich operation. The whole goal, and Rob Polinke even talked about this when they talk about it. The whole goal is now building out around Luca. This has been a-

LeBron James has never been expendable in his career until Sunday morning. He has never been expendable, ever. Correct. He has been essential for every team he has been on until now. So what I'm saying is forget the whole- he has already said like he's going to be a Laker and he's got that no trade. So I'm talking about when this contract is done. If you are right and this extends it and he does even play longer,

is there a chance he ever wears a uniform other than the Lakers? I think that they will soon. But we would admit that the chance is much greater now. Yes. Then it would. If there ever was a chance that we would see LeBron in a uniform other than Los Angeles, that the chance is much greater now because we know their future is Luke. I think LeBron is smart enough to know.

I think LeBron is very realistic about his title contention and chances. And I think that he and his heart of hearts knows in September of the last two years that he was not contending for a title. And I think now he wakes up and says, we have a title contending team, and I think that they will not be, you know, they're not going to go to the Western Conference Finals this year, but with some roster construction over an offseason, they could,

they will be one of the handful of teams that you could see hoisting the Larry O'Brien Trophy next season. They will. I didn't feel like that this September. Did you? I do not think in the app, again, let's let the list next 48 hours play out. Sure.

Let's let the next 48 hours play out because they've got to get some front line stuff. If they, in the absence of them getting front line stuff, they do not have an opportunity. Who do you, do you, time lord? Like who, who get, Valanchunis, Vusevich? Like, what are they going to get? Yeah, I know. Those are the only three that really makes sense. Do you trade Austin Reeves?

He's certainly a much more expendable piece today than he was prior to you at team. Oh, absolutely. Oh, yeah. Yes. And so. What about your nemesis, the man that you hate so much, Kirk Goldsbury. I don't hate anybody.

I love Kurt Goldsbury. You hate him so much. I listened to, you know what? You hate Kurt Goldsbury. I love Kirk so much that I listened to his podcast with Bill twice. No, you did. Yes, I did. And I rewounded every time he spoke, just so I could hear what he said again.

He reported that the deal was bigger. I know. That there was more. on the table headed in the Maverick's direction, but Polinka convinced Nico that the price was too high because of the concerns about conditioning. Can you imagine that? No, it's one of those. And I know that Kendrick has called Drake the master manipulator,

but that title might have been taken away from Rob Polinka because it's one of those things where, you know, he speaks with forked tongue. And this sweet talking guy has now played into all of your, like he's one of those guys. They can be like, you know what? Yeah, you're right. This guy, you know what? Now, the more you talk and the fact that you're even willing to get rid of him, Nico, I mean, kind of freaks me out a little bit, you know, and I talk to, I talk to everybody around here.

And they're like, hold on now. If Nico wants to get rid of him, there's got to be something there. And he's like, you know. You know, you know me and I know you. And look, Nico, this is like a real risk for me. Like, this is a real, like, you have convinced this guy. Like, you're the master manipulator. This is my career is on the line.

That you're taking the risk. Yes. Because he's, you know, you just played into all. I just can't part with that 2031 pick for Luca Donchage. Or don't connect. When you have Luca Don't touchish, when you have Luca Dodgish, that's, that's That's a 27th pick in the draft. That's what that is.

That's what that is. Crazy. We've got a potential first ever three-peat in the NFL. We've got Taylor Swift involved. And no one is talking about the Super Bowl. No one. None of my friends have mentioned the Super Bowl since Sunday. Nobody.

I got one text about the Super Bowl last night. and it was House and it was about prop bets. Oh. That was it. That was it. I'm dead serious. So he's true. Hey,

I love House. He's amazing. But yeah, Joe House and it was a prop bet text. Other than that, that's the only person that has mentioned the Super Bowl to me. But what you haven't mentioned is the prop bet was how many times Luke Dodgers's name will be mentioned. during the Super Bowl broadcast, because I'm taking the over on that. It's going to be more than one. I swear to God, it was Harrison Butker over one and a half field goals.

There's a freebie for everybody. There you go. Over one and a half field goals? Oh, I'll take it. Oh, yeah. Oh, for sure. God. This is nuts.

There's your Super Bowl talk. There was a report that the Warriors inquired about every All-Star. So someone explained this to me, Chris Vernon. because I'm old enough to remember two weeks ago when Draymond and Steph Curry were going on and on about you would never make a drastic move to improve yourself now and you have to think about the long-term health of the franchise and making a win now move is not smart.

That's not how we behave here in the Bay Area. We would never do that. And then two weeks later, this report, acquired about every all-star. They didn't inquire about Jimmy Butler. They inquired about every all-star. Everyone. The Paul George one was the one.

I was like, what? What is it? I don't, I've, I've never understood the love for Paul George as a basketball player. I've never understood. And I've always, look, you know where I stand on this conversation that we've had

for over the last month. where they were coming out saying all those things. And I was yelling into the microphone. What future? What? Like, you don't even love the one guy, which is coming. Like, you could have him locked up and you don't want to. So Moses Moody, who has been on a tear recently?

Like, what is this Pizzinski? Like, what is this Trace Jackson Day? Like, what is this future that you're building out? round like the best of all of them of your young players you don't even like don't even want to and they're inquiring about every all-star everyone so i never bought that baloney in the first place i thought that was a good thing to say i think that was a good public stance to take i think it makes everybody probably feel good in your locker room i also thought it was absolute baloney because it's like bro there's a short timeline on draymond and step you let clay walk you want to get a third guy to

give them a chance. They don't have a chance right now, but if you got him a third guy, whether it was Levine, whether it was Jimmy. So when you say third guy, you're, you're, counting Dremont as the second guy. Yes. Dremont is still a valuable basketball player, but like, he still makes his teammates better. He's a valuable basketball contributor, but I don't think he's scored 30 points in four years. But he's also the quarterback of the defense that can be. If you have Draymond Green as a quarterback of your defense and you have guys that are committed to playing defense, that's how they were successful at the beginning of this season. They were defending at a level that was so great that they were able to get wins because of it. And so I do think, like, if you had, but Steph can't be the only guy that everything revolves around.

Do you think the Warriors get a star before the deadline? Star? I do not. I think it's totally possible dependent on, I mean, you're going to have to find somebody that's in love with Kaminga

and love with the idea of signing him. Well, it does feel like you can kind of get whatever you want from the Bulls because that, I don't understand their involvement in this Foxx. I mean,

look, they, they, look, the Kaminga thing is, and I get it, he's still out with the ankle injury, whatever,

but he's, he's on the mend. Like, you can't lose him for nothing. like and if you don't want to be in the comminga business they don't then now is the time that you would get out of the comminga business so i mean again it's about finding someone that you would be able to i mean let's just say there is like legs to that and durrant could end back up there that would be that makes no sense it makes no sense it would be insane though

why would the sons do that it would be insane they're going to get comminga and wiggins for Kevin Durant? I know. What? What are we doing? What are we doing? Me and you, we agree. But anything is possible now.

Anything is possible. Anything is possible. A couple of things that we do want to mention. How about your boy Brunson last night? I know. Oh, by the way, another guy. The maps got rid of. Right.

What if they got rid of? of the two best players in the world. They might have. I'm sorry, fans. I'm sorry. You got to laugh to not feel the face. I think that Brunson was just getting,

one of the things about the Rockets is they played defense. And in the fourth quarter, Brunson was just getting to the hole at will. It was why. How about what Thompson did to precious in the open court was. That little inside out, the little inside out move that he did. It was fine,

finable. crack on him. Yeah. That was what. I like the precious got back up though. He's like he got crossed over. They got back up and then dunked on. Thompson's had a triple double, didn't he?

He had to end up with a triple double, I think. I do have some concerns over, uh, I'm just going to, I hate, I hate to do this. I hate, and I want to apologize in advance to all Rockets fans. And the, the, the, in all people celebrating the terror twins, I just want to say that Tar Easton needs to develop his offensive game a little bit. because when he had the ball in his hands, I was not concerned as a Knicks fan at all. You know what?

Watching them last couple days, like, you realize how big of a deal it is to just have Van Vleet kind of just run the thing. Also, there's so much Stephen Adams. I've always loved Stephen Adams. I have an irrational love of Stephen Adams.

Yeah. But there was so much Stephen Adams without Sangoon. It's just like, God, they don't really have another. They need Fred, but they can go as long as they got Fred. because he just kind of sets the table for all those young guys, right? But my God, Brunson, what a night. The Hawks who have gone to hell in a handbasket since they lost Johnson. It lost eight straight.

Trey has one of the most incredible game winners of the year. So shouts to them for finally getting a win after this long time. You mentioned the Blazers earlier. And in that Phoenix loss to the Blazers, Blazers. Devin Booker broke the son's scoring record. And I need to make, oh, I'm sorry, it took this long. I need to apologize to Devin Booker. Wait, you want to restart the show and lead with Devin Booker? Bring Walter Davis's record. The Greyhound? I'm going to, no, I'm apologizing to Devin Booker. Why? Last week, I got got. I'm not proud to admit this. Oh, with the seven-year-old sound that we played on the show?

It was five. That's my fault. I think I sent that one in. It was nice of you to say, I got God. That was me who got God. Devin Booker talking about not making the All-Star team. Now, if I were to defend myself, I would say, I would imagine Devin Booker's opinion on the matter has not changed great. Yeah, it could have been from yesterday.

But so someone online presented that as current. Yes. And we fell for it. So, and it was Devin Booker talking about how the league is all political now and it's all drama. And it used to be when I was a kid, all the best players made the All Star team and whatever. Now, again, I could defend myself and say, I bet Devin Booker feels exactly the same way, but it was old audio. And I feel badly for attributing that to him in the current day. I think he'll be okay.

Maybe he does not feel the same way. I think he'll be okay. But he didn't make the All Star team and he's probably pissed. There was a very brief personal story. I was hosting this just in because Max was out. And at the very end of the show, on the rundown, they had a quote from Jama rant about how Michael Jordan would be like a role player in today's game or something.

Or he could beat Michael Jordan one-on-one or something like that. And it was just in the rundown. And it was in the teleprompter. And literally before I read it in the teleprompter, I was like, I can't believe I'm saying this. But here's what Jama rant said. and we did like it was like the end of the show we did like a minute on it

and it was a completely fake quote absolutely completely made up by ball sack sports and it was like and then I got dragged online about it my you know it's like no way if you make a great point no one ever mentions anything but if you mess up oh god oh yeah I mean

just just notification after notification about what an asshole I am and then I don't remember anybody from the production staff or or ESPNPR sort of saying actually it's not his fault it's our fault but it's not that you're there well I'm I'm taking blame

I'll even take the bullet for you on this one and I'll take the blame and say that we should not have played we attributed Devin Booker with a quote from unfortunately years ago but but I will 2019

I think you probably different decades he does feel the same way I think he's fair for sure feels the same way right also something to monitor I think in the next couple of days is what happens with the bucks. So I'm just going to tell you a little something about last night in the pregame show before Grizzly Spurs. One of the things we'll run is the walk-off interview from the game prior.

And so there was a walk-off interview that was done by my buddy Rob Fisher. and in the background of the walk-off interview for the Sunday night game between Memphis and the Bucks, you can see Janus, and he is standing like in front of the scores table, and he is like, just like with his hands on his hips, and he's just like looking up, like at the,

like around the arena and at the scores. This is after the game, right? So anyways, we go to break whatever, and Rob goes, did you see, he's like, you see on that interview? He's like, you see Janice in the background?

And I was like, yeah. He's like, bro, he stood out there for like 10 to 15 minutes, just like that after the game. And this is a, for those who didn't pay attention,

it was a loss to the Grizzlies. Yeah, Sunday night game, lost to the Grizzlies in Memphis. So he's just, he was like, he just catatonic from losing, just like,

just staring out into space because they lost to the grizzlies. Like, I guess just totally frustrating. They didn't play anybody last night against the Thunder. Dame didn't play. Janice didn't play. Lopez didn't,

like nobody played. It was odd. It was like one of those games that it's like, you know what? This is a loss. We're just going to lose this. Well, and they got trashed by Memphis on Sunday night

in the fourth quarter so badly. And that's right after the Spurs had dropped 144 on them on Friday night. That's right. I mean, it has been a rough go. It has gone the wrong way really quickly, this last heading into the trade deadline.

And so they're one to really monitor over the course of the next 48 hours and see kind of what they do with their roster around yons. I think Middleton would be the obvious piece for them to move, right? I mean, we were waiting because remember Middleton didn't start the season. So they had a slow start. And we're all like, well, they don't have Middleton.

They don't have Middleton. And then Middleton comes back and it's like, well, that wasn't the problem. Because Middleton hasn't looked like an All-Star or a contributor to a champion. championship team like he was a few years ago. So one of the things that has happened as we close this out over the course, we've had to recalibrate everything.

Like we've said, if Luca can be traded, anything is possible. Yes. Right? I think we would both agree. And maybe our answer would have been Luca three days ago. The most stunned you could possibly be.

It would say Yokin's right. Um, Janus. Janus. I think if Janus is going to leave the bucks, it's going to be very loud. Yeah, but the Janus thing, like, look, the expectation that Janus would be in a different uniform one day is not,

it's something that people have opined. Of course. A lot. No one has ever. They've never brought up Nigelioch, ever wearing a different uniform and neither has he. and to me it's more likely

Nikola Yokic just announces his retirement like tonight at halftime you know what I mean? Like that is much more likely than him being traded. I'm going to do the horse thing. That's what I really love horses.

I want a championship. I'm good. I'm out. Would you be less surprised if it, Curry? I think Curry would be more surprising than Yokic.

Who would you be more convinced that Shams, hacked if you reported it. I mean, these are things that we now have to consider because of the stupid Luca thing. Nico, you have ruined everything. You've ruined everything. It's like, honestly, it's like, I feel like the bucks are going to trade for Lamar Jackson.

Seriously. Seriously. We just landed Lamar Jackson for A.J. Green and two first. And I'd be like, all right. Sure. I think at the very time. top, though. It would be Curry and Yokic. For two different reasons.

Obviously, one is the best player in the world. And we've never seen them in another uniform. Like, I've never seen them in another uniform. Well, and the other one is, yeah, he's forever. Like, the idea that you would trade. I mean, that's just, that would be, I could understand it. Right. End of the career. Moving on.

Getting the most possible value. Whatever else. But it's still, like you never fathom seeing him in anything other than that you. So one thing that came out in that article from Ramona and Tim, shout to them, is that this started on January 3rd, right? And you're Rob Polenka. I find it hard to believe that Rich Paul and LeBron James were not made aware until late

Saturday night. You literally said at the beginning of the podcast, you believe it that they didn't know. I'm just having a thought exercise here. How can you possibly keep this a secret from January 3rd? Because the second that this gets told to anyone, to anyone. And in fact,

only a friend that you've known for 20 years, could you keep this between? I can't. Honestly. Well, and riddle me this. this this has not been discussed enough for my taste. Why in the world did Anthony Davis waive the trade kicker? I mean, to help them get under the...

Oh, that's $6 million. Don't worry about that. The $6 million that I'm contractually owed. Alice, waive that. Don't worry about it. Because I think that you are not unhappy with your landing spot. that the reason that that is involved is because if they move you to a place eventually that you don't want to go, that is your $6 million. And one thing I hate, I hate when people say, well, well, he's got hundreds of millions of dollars.

He's made $300 million just career. What's $6 million to him? $6 million is still $6 million. And it's not my fault. It's not my job to manage the counting of the Dallas Mavericks. I don't need to do the casino conglomerate family favors to the tune of $6 million that would be in my pocket. Why did he waive that?

To help them. It's one thing if you're like, Tom Brady. To help them be able to have the best team that they possibly have a rat. And you restructure your contract where you still make all the money, but you just restructure it so it's delayed to later or whatever. But like the $6 million? I'm just going to wave that.

Jacoby, there's always a wink, wink. Like, bro, we're going to make you right on the other end. Yeah, he's going to be in some sort of like Don't worry. Don't worry. You won't ever. You ain't ever get paid for. You ain't going to worry about that six million bucks.

When do you think Rich Paul found out that this was a possibility? You think he doesn't tell LeBron? I really don't know what to think on that. I really don't. I think LeBron knew. I'm starting to think that LeBron knew the more that I worked this out in my head. I don't know. I think it's so insane that you would worry about a leak.

You know, somebody's going to tell somebody. It's interesting. You just have to have. You just have to have incredible trust with anyone that you give that information to. Because it is, again, it's something so serious that the whole world thought it was fake. The whole world. Nobody thought that was real. Nobody.

And to his stupid point in the press conference, he said, Rob Polika thought I was trolling him. my owner laughed at me. That's him saying that. That's not like conjecture. Like, hey, they probably laughed at. Like, he told you that he got laughed at. Oh, crazy.

I cannot wait for the next 48 hours because all hell could break this. For real. Well, like, that Fox deal is a big deal. Huge deal. No one gives a crap. Somebody, so much Trey Murphy's like, I scored 41 points two games a row. And no one gives a shit.

Nobody cares. Nobody cares. Nobody cares. Nobody cares. The Super Bowl is in like three days and no one cares. I know. Taylor Swift could be starting for the Eagles at quarterback and no one cares. No one cares.

Right. And so who knows whether it's, whether it's Kevin Durant or it's Jimmy Butler or Paul George or it's Zion Williamson or it's on the table. Brandon Ingram. Who knows? Who knows? Just keep an eye out for Lamar Jackson to the Bucks. You're heard of your first on the mismatch.

February 4th. 24th, 2025. Milwaukee or Tampa Bay? Either one. Either one. Both of them. Who knows? All right.

That's going to do it for today's show. We will obviously reconvene on Friday after what promises to be an unbelievable trade deadline. Thank you to our executive producer, Jesse Lopez, as always, and Jacoby. I'll talk to you later this week. Must be 21 and over in present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino. 18 or over and present in D.C. Got a gambling problem?

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