The Mismatch - What Are the Washington Wizards Capable of This Season? Plus More Ben Simmons Rumors.

Episode Date: September 7, 2021

Free agency may be winding down, but you can’t stop NBA players from opening their mouths. Verno and KOC discuss Kyle Kuzma’s comments on ‘The No Chill Podcast’ that the Buddy Hield trade was basically in the books before the Lakers pivoted to the Russell Westbrook trade (0:30), Jonathan Isaac’s comments that he and the Magic are being very cautious with his return from injury (14:40), and Michael Porter Jr.’s comments to the Denver Post that his contract extension negotiations with the Nuggets are going well (28:30). Then they dive into more Ben Simmons rumors from Sam Amick of The Athletic, who reported that the Kings were not willing to give up De’Aaron Fox or Tyrese Haliburton in a trade for Simmons (46:40). Hosts: Chris Vernon and Kevin O’Connor Associate Producer: Sasha Ashall Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Dave Chang is an avid student and fan of sports, music, art, film, and of course, food. With a rotating cast of guests, they have conversations that cover everything from the creative process to his guest's guiltiest pleasures. Follow the Dave Chang show on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to The Mismatch. I'm Chris Vernon. Join me as he does every Tuesday from the ringer.com is Kevin O'Connor, A.K.K.K.E.O.K.K.K.O.K.K. Kevin O'Conflict. Kevin O'C.? Kevin O'Conflint. What's going on this Tuesday? Well, we actually have a bit of news that we've got to get to. We actually do mid, mid early September news. All right. While free agency is gone and there's still going to be news that takes place in terms of roster building here and there.

What does not stop is players from talking. And this week, we got a couple of players that said some things that we need to discuss. The first of which was Kyle Kuzma. Kyle Kuzma was on the No Chill podcast with Gilbert Arenas recently, and the story goes like this. The Lakers appeared to be on the verge of trading Kyle Kuzma and Montrez-Herald to the Kings for Buddy Healed. Instead, the Lakers dealt Kuzma, Harold, Contavius Colwell Pope, and the 22nd pick to get Russell Westbrook from the The Wizards, Kyle Kuzman said I was kind of shocked because I thought I was going to Sack. Like the Sacramento deal with Buddy Healed, that ish was done.

So I'm thinking of my head, okay, sack, 45-minute flight, that's not bad. I can go to Napa. But then, out of nowhere, you're going to Washington. I was super hyped because it's a better situation. Going to Sack would have been fun. I would have went crazy for sure. That's how I think. but I have the opportunity to play with Brad Beal.

It's someone that is really trying to be a winner in this league. Oh, boy. Hey, I mean, in D.C., great museum scene out there. A lot of good museums here you go to. Not sure. That's up, Coos Mazzale, compared to California beaches, California, been general. But he's near New York City as well. So good for Coos to be in Washington.

I mean, ultimately, I mean, that whole 24, 48 hours. was funky. It did seem like the Lakers, Kings thing was actually going to be happening. But lingering under the background, of course, was that Russell Westbrook situation. And I think it's true.

I mean, he said it. Washington is a good situation for him. It's a good situation today. And that's because they have Bradley being on the roster. We'll see how that plays out if he stays in Washington after this season because he can become a free agent next summer. But on paper, Chris,

I mean, I look at that wizard's team. I'm kind of into it. I'm kind of into it, Chris. I am. Here's the thing, Kev. The most important quote is going to sack, it would have been fun.

I would have been, I would have went crazy for sure. That's how I think. But the opportunity to play with Brad Beale, it's someone that is really trying to be a winner in this league. And Cus was started to become a winner in L.A. He learned it, right?

Yeah. Yes. And I just think that, you know, you hear a player talk. And what do you? make of him saying that I was super hyped because it's a better situation? I mean, I look at the Wizards roster and I mean, look, Beal is the headliner. I mean, he's the star there.

But the Beal Dinwiddie backcourt, intriguing. Holiday coming off the bench, Netto was solid depth backup guard intriguing. You got the Lakers guys, Harold, KCP, who are all solid in their own roles. you have some young talent, Kispert, Avdia, Hachimura. Hachimura has gotten better each year of his career. Maybe he'll take another leap as well. You get Gafford at center, Thomas Bryan, who's hurt to start the year, but they have a good amount of depth. You have Isaiah Todd off the bench.

I didn't mention either. This isn't like some contending team, but this is a team that can make the playoffs and has the upside to get better around Bradley Beale. And I think with Kyle Kuzma here, I mean, also didn't mention your. guy, Chris, your favorite contract in basketball, Burtons. I was like, you're not going to name the billion dollar man, billion dollar burtons. But I think, I think the wizards, look, like I said, they're not going to be some like finals

contender. They're just a playoff contender in the east. But I like, I like their roster and I think they have the versatility to play different styles. I'd love to see them play some small ball with Hachimora at the five, who's met the four, see what happens when you do that. They can play big. They can play small with spacing. This team can play a whole bunch of different ways. They have a new coach there and unselled. It'll be interesting to see what type of system he installs there. So I think for Washington, with their amount of young

talent they have, including some of the, you know, more proven players like at Coosma. He's still young. I look forward to seeing how these guys develop in a new situation. I think for Coosma specifically, a lot of people have said once he leaves LA, he'll be forgettable, right? Like the Lakers spotlight was one of the reasons why he became the biggest star. Going to Washington, he will not have that spotlight on him. This is an opportunity for him specifically to show in a new situation. Yes, I can still play winning basketball. And for him, the key there, like he had a quote earlier in the summer, I believe,

where he said something about like his inconsistencies can be pegged on like the fact that he had inconsistent role. That's true to an extent, but he's been an inconsistent player, regardless of his role ever since he was in college. That's one of the reasons why I was low on him entering the draft. I was too low on him entering the draft. I made a mistake with my ranking for him. But, you know, will he at some point in his mid-20s now be able to find some semblance of consistency as a shooter, as a decision maker? He already has as a defender, but the offensive side is now the next step for him, which ironically is the thing people, people, weren't concerned about when he was young because he was putting up almost 20 points per game.

Right. I am, I'm fascinated with the whole idea that the guy was going to be traded to Sacramento, but then he goes to Washington, and he says it's a much better situation. I mean, that would not have been the case a couple of years ago, but I also think it speaks to, you know, why you are careful about letting go, of Brad Beal. His was the name that all the time was coming up, was coming up, was coming up. And it is in part because you hear that quote and another player in the league saying, I'm excited to go play with this guy, right? Now, that doesn't mean necessarily they're going to get a bunch of great free agents because you've got Brad Beal, whatever. But it also means that people

think they've got a chance when you've got that guy on your team, right? But like, If I go there, hey, they got Brad Beal and we got a chance to win because he wasn't saying that, like, you know, in the same sense of, hey, they got the Aaron Fox and hey, they got a lot of young talent. And they just drafted Davian Mitchell and they got Halliburton and whatever else, right? Now, obviously, you're thinking about it through the prism of how is this going to affect me and my career. But beyond that, guys do want to win. And the truth is, if you got Brad Beale, you're a lot of close. to win in than if you don't. You know?

Yeah. You know, it is one thing I'm thinking about with Washington here is, the obvious question is, is this team good enough to keep Bradley Bill happy? I mean, we'll see like he, they'll have options. The Celtics,

you know, with Tatum, he can reunite there. There's many other teams as well that he might, you know, look at maybe New York, possibly with a lot of teams. The inverse is this.

For Washington, if it's, what will be the situation that pops up where they say, we're going to cash in our future picks. We're going to cash in some of our young players, you know, maybe including even a Kuzma. You know, Bradley Biel was one of the 10 or so current NBA players at Damien Lohd's wedding this weekend.

Would Washington be one of those teams that would throw themselves into a Damian Lord sweepstakes? Like I've said for weeks now, everybody talks about Philly wanting to wait for Damian Lurd and try to go after him with Ben Simmons. like every other team is also going to think about going after Damien Lowe's as well. Would Washington be one of those teams that says, I'm going to go for it. We're going to go all in.

We're going to give seven picks, all pick swaps. We're giving Avdia. We're giving Kisper. We're giving Kuzma. We're giving Hachimor. Like all in, you know, some teams could decide to do that. All it takes is one. And I just wonder, you know, will we see a team that has a little bit of desperation to them,

try to go all in on one of those guys who might become a. Yeah, and that's the flip side of this. I think for so long, we thought, hey, is Washington the kind of team that's going to, you know, move their guy and then just get way worse. But now they've kind of on the fly, Tommy Shepard, and put them in a position where they do have that opportunity. I mean, those guys, even if they're not great for you and don't push you to solid playoff performance. There's still assets. People want Montrez-Harrel. People will take Kyle Kuzma.

Pope on a veteran team could help him. Certainly he had his moments in the NBA finals, for goodness sakes. And those are contracts, right, that can be paired up. Some of them expiring, too. Yeah, and they're big, right? So, I mean, those guys aren't on small deals. So you can pair those up with some of your young talent or draft picks in order to actually take this and improve your build with Brad Beal rather than

we're moving off of Brad Beal in order to rebuild. Right? They don't necessarily have to do that. They do have assets where they could go and they could trade for something. And all of a sudden, a team that we kind of pinned as a, they're going to have to trade their star because you're wasting his prime. they might be able to make the most of his prime by going out there and put together a deal for somebody really good. Absolutely. And that's the advantage that Washington has because Beal,

like my understanding has been for months now that Beale and his family, they're happy living in D.C. They're happy there. They're happy living in the area that they are. But like winning ultimately, you know, Trump's all with the decisions that, you know, players make. Not all players, but a lot of players. I think for Beal, that will be an important factor, which is why the with are in a position. Like I said, I don't love their roster. This isn't some great team. They're solid. This is a solid team. They look, they've gotten bypassed probably. They were eight last year. Indiana will be better with Carlisle. Charlotte will be better healthy. Chicago should be better than they were last

year. I mean, just those three right off the bat, which were the three behind them, are probably if I'm penciling it in at the beginning of the season, bigger favorites to make the play a than they are. And nobody in front of them really dropped back. Well, and that's the thing. The East has gotten stronger. So they're going to be solid. Are they solid enough to be appealed to Bradley Beale in a sense that he's like, yeah,

I'll stay here a long term. Are they solid enough? So it's to the point that the team would be willing to go all in on a trade that may present itself. This is a roster that's ripe to make deals, not a roster that's going to win a lot of games. Yes. They're kind of at a crossroads here where you don't know if they're going to go down the path of keeping Bradley Beal long term or going into a full on rebuild or if they're going

going to go down a path where they're like, you know what, we're going all in here and the next guy who's available. We don't know. That might not even be Damian Lillard. It might be a guy we're not thinking about. But I'm just using him as like the big number one, you know, one A example of who you would target and having like a back court with Beal, you know, Lillard, Dinwiddie. That'd be awesome. But so we'll see how things shake out. But I'm very, very intrigued. by Washington because I agree with Kuzma. They're a better situation for him. It's just about how long

this situation remains good for him. And they may be able to surprise some people, you know what I mean? Maybe they'll be better than what I'm giving them credit for because they are you know, I always talk about just don't have crappy players on your team that you've got to give real minutes to

and they're a lot closer to that now. They're a lot closer to that now with the roster. You go down the roster and there's not a lot of people that you say, geez, Louise, if you're having to play this guy, you know, real minutes in a game, you're in big trouble. Can I just say one last thing about them? Yeah.

Bradley, you mentioned those other teams that should be better on paper than them. Yeah. The one factor not to underrate here is Bradley Beale himself getting better. Sure. I don't think that. I know like he's averaged over 30 points per game two years in a row now and I'm talking about him getting even better. But he's gotten better for like seven straight years.

In this offseason, he said he worked on extending his three-point shooting range off the dribble. This used to be a guy who only used to take mid-range pull-ups. And now he's talking about extending his range not to Dame territory, not to Tray Young territory, but closer to what the range of those guys shoot. And if he can successfully do that, that's going to change who he is and how defenders try to contain him, which can open up playmaking opportunities for him of which he will get more without Westbrook there this season. and there'll be more balance in that backcourt. So I look forward to seeing how he himself also develops because he could be one of the reasons why this team could also exceed expectations. A team that is rebuilding is the Orlando Magic.

And speaking of quotes, we had one that has taken place since we last spoke, which was Jonathan Isaac was at an event and was asked about being ready for the upcoming season. And we're talking about less than two months away now. and he basically said, we'll see, right? He is, he's trying to go without a brace. He's trying to get back better, but he certainly didn't give a, I'll be ready to go opening night.

Now, we know that this kid has had some very serious injuries, the first couple years of his career, they dedicated a lot of money to him, regardless. There is an insurance clause in that regarding his needs, but they staked a lot of money on the future of Jonathan Isaac and the promise that he has shown when he has played, right? Because when he has played, you watch it and you go, man, if this comes together, you already saw him take a big leap defensively rather quickly. And I swear to God, every time I've seen the kid in person, he gets taller.

Like, I don't know. I think the time he's in his fifth year of the league. six year of the league, he's going to be eight foot tall. When he has played, there's a lot there to really, really like about Jonathan Isaac. And he was just starting to come into his own when he tore up his knee. What level of concern to me, I look at it like a team that is and should be extremely overly cautious about this. I mean, I'd want to make sure he's 150% ready before he ever came back. I mean, you know this.

I covered a team last year that did this with Jared Jackson Jr. Just was not going to let him come back. The magic or another team like that. They're very conservative with bringing guys back. Forget that. Forget whatever your normal timeline is. The truth is these guys over the course of their careers, and we can go all the way back to the Porzingis,

these unicorn-type guys, they're just not made to be face-up guards, right? Their body is not that way. When we think about the guys that have had like real longevity, it's not guys that were swatting every shot necessarily or playing above the rim all the time. It's more of the Paugasals and the Boshes than it is some of the others that have been guys

that like to drive to the basket. Like we say, these unicorns, these seven-foot guys that do guard stuff. And the track record's been pretty bad in terms of most of them have not even been able to make it through their first four years without injury. And so if the magic are being ridiculously careful about this to give it the best chance at working long term, I think that's probably wise because they're not winning crap anyway. So he tore his ACL August 2020. right in the bubble and he missed all of last season um i mean maybe mid mid midway through this coming

year maybe november december january something like that seems reasonable for isaic to come back um would that be a long time for an acel definitely it's it's a lot of time i mean if if they're playing ultra conservative i could see that and he said we'll see when it comes to opening night um so i make i guess we'll see there yeah ultimately like he he is a critical part part of their future, though. What we last saw from him when he was playing during the 2019-20 season was a guy who got a little bit better offensively. Had a higher, you know, taking more shots per game, doing a little bit more off the

dribble, maintaining his efficiency. That's always encouraging when a guy is taking more shots into their efficiency, doesn't drop off. Only 22 years old at the time. And with him, though, the defensive versatility, he was one of the better defenders in the league despite playing for a crappy team. So individually as a defender, plugging this guy into a team that now looks dramatically different than what we last saw when he was playing basketball. This is a totally different team and plugging him into a situation with a bunch of other young

guys, Wagner in that front court now. You get also Wendell Carter in that front court. This is a team the magic suddenly that can play different types of styles. I say it all. the time teams that can play big or play small. Isaac is the guy that kind of keeps that all together, whether they're playing big or small. Because on defense, he can defend on the perimeter if need be, but he also has the size and length and athleticism

to defend more in the interior if necessary. So for the magic, he's kind of that Swiss Army knife piece in the middle that allows them to play so many different styles, which gives them hope. That's all you can ask for is it gives you hope. I still have my Jonathan Isaac stock. I think he could be a, I think he could, you know, he comes back healthy.

He could take a big, big leap because this time around, you know, obviously, as we said, they're not going to win a ton of games. But I do love Suggs and I do think Suggs is going to make people better. So there's one thing. And he wasn't playing with his player as good as that in terms of making you better the last time around. And he's kind of just playing a role because he's wedged between Aaron Gordon and, Fuji-Mane at the time, right? So where are you fitting in as Jonathan Isaac, right?

Like you're pretty low on the totem pole when we saw him, and yet he was rather effective. Now, the trick is, can you keep that level of efficiency and that level of play when your, when now your usage grows dramatically, which I would tend to believe it will? I think he is a special talent. I really do. I just hope he could stay injury-free because he's had a really rough go of it these first couple of years. And that can do a hell of a toll on you mentally also, you know, just trusting it and coming back.

And so it may take a little while for him to get his sea legs as it were. But I got my stock. And I still think... Would you buy more stock, though, Chris? Or would you just hold what you have? I'm holding right now. So you're not buying more, though. I'll tell you this.

When I went to that national... Not buying the dip. When I went to the National Sports Collectors Convention, I bought some Isaacs. Oh, you did? Really? They're nothing. They're nothing. Interesting.

People, they were in the... So somebody like him, he's in the bin. Like the, we're getting rid of this bin. You know what I mean? So you bought some cards. How about some top shots? I would go search it through the bins. I don't have any...

I might have... I don't know if I have an Isaac. I might, but I mean, hell, you can go buy one for a dollar right now, I'm sure. Top shot's done a little bit better this past month. It has done well. Yeah. I mean, NFTs in general seem like they're, you know, after the huge boom earlier in the year, you know, including top shot. Then then the big fall from there, it seems like it's kind of like progressively, more naturally going back up now, which is interesting. Look, I'm not the guy to talk to about this, but I do have Ethereum, which I've been very excited about that.

that's gone up. Right. And it seems to me that, I mean, it's not that hard to deduce when Bitcoin, Ethereum, crypto, all that stuff is doing really well and is extremely healthy, then that NFT market is booming too. They run seemingly parallel, right? The more flush with money or liquid as it were that the, that they, these guys have, then all of a sudden,

uh, those, you know, whether it's a crypto punks or it's top shot or whatever else, it's going up, uh, in the same kind of way. It's, it's really dependent upon the health of cryptocurrency in general. It appears to me. It's crazy. All I know is when my top shot's done well is when my Ethereum's doing well. So if there's not a coincidence in that, then, then I'm a goofy, but I just think there is. Ethereum one year ago was 300,000, $151. Right now, it's $3,396.

Jeez. Crazy, right? That's nuts. Yeah, for one Ethereum. And so, I mean, I do think that probably, you know,

they were on parallel. And so you just got to hope cryptocurrency still does well. I will tell you, I went and looked up my jaws and my Zions that had tanked like a lot of that stuff. And man,

they are, they have blown back up. They're back in the thousands. Yeah. It's crazy. I'm still just holding on to the stuff. You're probably holding like 85% jaw. I had a guy.

I had a guy riding on those legs, Chris. I had a guy in the NBA tell me that there's going to come a town where there's key there's key, there's key, uh, in every arena. Well, they tried it out at Summer League.

I mean, uh, I'd be, I'd be willing to bed like someday the NBA will have some stuff like buy a ticket, you know, comes with a free top shot or whatever. Like, type of deals like that because, I mean, I think you, you probably see it with your son, right?

Like playing video games, the younger generations, they, we, I mean, I'm still, I'm in all 31. I had video games, you know, growing up too, but like growing up with virtual like skins on games. Oh, yeah. Or different equipment or, you know, different, you know, gun skins or lasers on guns, whatever it might be. And like, it might cost like 100 points in the game, the equivalent of five bucks or 10 bucks, whatever the metric is. But people really like that stuff.

And I think with NFTs, like we'll see some of these NFTs are going to, like people spend in a million dollars on some of this stuff. Some of it's going to go to zero. Some of it's going to go up to $5 million over the course of the next 10, 15, 20 years. But I think with NFTs, the real potential with those is as we integrate VR, virtual reality, and AR augmented reality into what we do as people and society. As those things get more popular, the potential with NFTs is going to grow. That's what I would think and expect.

But we'll see how this develops, though. Every time TopShot comes up on Twitter or people ask a question, how did you get into it, we get tagged in a million different tweets. Yeah. I mean, I see it all the time because people brought it up. So I am just here to tell you, and you don't have to divulge what you've done, I'm here to tell you that I did talk about this a long, long time ago. When I first got on it, I know a lot of you did get in on it.

Some of you were able to flip. Some of you got bad because it went spiked up and then it went down, big, whatever. I have all of mine still. I never sold anything. So I just kept them. Because to me it was like, all right, let's see where this goes. either you're a believer or you're not, in my opinion, right? I wasn't doing it.

And I was never doing it to make a quick buck on the stuff. Because Lord knows, I could have made a quick buck. And at that point, like, look, my account got to this insane level. It was like mid-February when it was like times eight, times 10 or whatever. When there was no, when there was nothing out there, right? The only thing that was out there was the stuff I owned. I mean, I will tell you, I sold, it got so goofy. I sold an Alec Burks for 35 bucks.

Alex Burks. An Alec Burks, man. I said, well, this is, this is silly stuff. Like, who is buying this for this? But it was just the supply and demand was so outrageous that, so I take it back. I have sold some things. I sold that out of birds. purchase that, Chris?

Alan Burks. Probably. Probably did. Or his mom. Look. But at that point, like, then my,

I watched every day my account go down exponentially. And then I was like, well, hell, I'm not selling off now. No way.

So I still have it all. So I hope it does well. I really do. Yeah. I mean, I hope it does well, too, because I also think,

you and me, we see like a little snapshot of some the excitement people have. Yeah. It's just a cool, you know, different alternative way

for some people to be a fan. No different than trading cards, just virtual. So it's much different in that sense. Yeah, but the same feeling of excitement of opening a pack, people get virtually.

And so I think it's cool for fans and I hope it's successful. I really do. I'll tell you this. Look, they're getting into it though, Kev. These trading card companies,

they're getting into that. Yeah. Topps has got them. And that says a lot. That says a lot. Panini's got them. You know, fanatics just bought out these different companies and they're going to have them. I mean, those companies are getting into it, to that, right?

The cyber collectible. Michael Porter, Jr. was quoted as saying the contract talks are going smoothly. Now, the reason this was fascinating to me is because I hadn't really thought about that draft class in a minute. know, we had the slew of news. You had Shigergildes Alexander signed his massive deal with Oklahoma City, because it is contract extension time if they want to for that draft class. You saw Trey Young get his max. You saw Luca Donchich get his max. And then it just kind of goes away.

And inevitably, there'll be some of these guys that signed before the season begins. A lot of these guys that are going into their fourth year are having contract negotiations or their agent is with their teams right now. But really, those are the three that have gotten it. I'm interested in kind of what the number is going to be for like a Porter Jr. You know, what the number is going to be for like DeAndre Aiton. I think Aiton, you know, he's up for like a Porter, you know, he's up for like a Porter Jr. like a 5, 168, would be the max on him.

I wonder if some of these guys are going to get maxed out. If there are any other max deals that come out of this after we had gotten the, you know, totally predictable Luca Tray stuff. You think anybody else gets maxed? You think, uh, you think a Aiton or a Porter Jr., you know, any of these guys? I don't know. That draft class, I mean, here, I'll read them to you. Throw, throw us the names for the listeners.

Aiton, so that's a chance. I'd say no to the max for Aperian. I'll go, I'll go. All I answer is you read them off. Okay, Bagley, no. Bagley, no. Bagley, no. Luka, no.

Jaron Jackson. Luca, no. Uh, uh, he already got his. Yeah, of course. I think he'll get, no, no, he's not getting Max. I think he'll get like kind of like the Isaac deal. Maybe like a hundred million.

Yeah, I think something like that's reasonable. For me, like 400 or, you know, something like that. That's what I'd guess. I don't know, though. Trey Young got his. Momba. Of course, he's getting paid to Max. Yeah, right.

Wendell Carter. I hope Obama gets playing time this year, though. Be interested if they, uh, they've got both those guys. Yeah, and Carter, if one of them gets an extension and the other one doesn't.

I wonder, there's a six and seventh pick in the draft. Yep. I'd extend Carter if I could lock him up, for sure. I think if I'm the magic,

I'd want to hold. On Carter? To be honest, yeah, I'd want to hold. Okay. Colin Sexton? He's not going to get the max,

but I mean, I do what I would do wonder. You might, be able to get a really good value if you assigned him out. Yeah, you might be able to good value now. He's one of those guys where maybe I want to wait if I'm calling Sexton. Yeah, probably right. But then again, what if you get turned into a situation in which you're not getting as many

opportunities? Like, there's risk in waiting. Oh, you can always get hurt too. Yeah, you can always get hurt. Yeah, you can get hurt. And also, I think the, you know, coronavirus is still looming over all of us here. And I think that with some of these deals we're seeing, like, we've had a lot of two year extensions this

off season like you know guys who already had a year or two left in their deal extending further I think there's some fear with players and their agents about like well if we wait what if the cap stays the same or goes down further what if teams are less willing to to pay my guys

like this or that like so many XYZ reasons here but my I've talked to a couple of agents this off season let's say that's why you're seeing a lot of these deals early because of the fear to know on Kevin Knox. No.

McHell Bridges will get a good contract. I mean, he's not getting anywhere close to the max, but he'll get a good deal. I mean, let's hope if you're a son's fan, Sarver is willing to pay Aiton and Bridges. You get a lot of money coming up with those guys. Boy, Bridges does good with the Duncan Robinson deal, doesn't he? I think a lot of these guys probably do.

They look and, I mean, if I'm Bridges agent, I'm like, hold on now. This guy just started on the team. that played in the NBA finals. Right? I know Duncan Robinson did too, and I know Duncan Robinson could shoot, but I mean, my guy is, you know, just coming into his own, elite level defender. McKell Bridges, I think, could actually get a really big contract. Yeah.

You know, one that may be surprises some people. That's all I'd say. Shea already got paid. Yeah, Shay Gilz-Ox-Ga-old already got paid. Miles Bridges, I really like him. I do. Yeah, good player. he'll get a good deal like 20 million dollar range as well I would expect.

It's wild because a lot of these guys though, Kiv, like you do think that I could see contracts becoming values for a lot of these rather than outrageous overpays. Like I think that some of these guys are going to get some of these contracts that if they do just sign their extensions and they could really like outperform those. Right. And once upon a time, look, it enabled Golden State. I'm not saying any of these guys are going to be Steph, but make no mistake. What partly enabled that entire dynasty to take place was Steph having all those ankle injuries early in his career and then signing what ended up looking like an insane deal for Steph Curry, that he was outperforming

in the most outrageous way possible. His second contract was just not what he should have been getting paid. Therefore, they were able to wrangle a roster together around him that was so fantastic. And then you got Jerome Robinson. I don't even know if he's in the league anymore. Is he? I don't think Jerome Robinson. Is he in the league?

I really don't know. He's the 13th pick in the draft. I saw him play in the G League a couple years ago. you go he was unbelievable the night I saw him I thought he was pretty good at college too I liked him in Boston College but I don't know if he's on a roster right now that's unbelievable I like him I was a fan

it's a 13th pick of the draft I don't even know he's around now he was he was waived by the Wizards earlier this year that's crazy yeah I mean there's a couple of those now because I hear Smith a little bit later um But Porter Jr. then at 14. That'll be interesting to see with Porter Jr. That'll be very interesting to see. Because with Porter Jr., you know, the talent is obvious.

19 points per game last year can shoot from anywhere. It's 6.10. Can do a lot off the dribble and constantly improving. He's a good rebounder. He's improved as a defender, even though he's still not great by any means. But with him, the injury concerns are looming. That's still something that's always going to be. there for him. How much is Denver willing to wait? They were willing to gamble on drafting him.

Very happy to do that, eager to do that. How much are they going to be willing to pay him a heck of a lot of money, which he obviously is going to want? All right. You like him as a third guy? That that's your, that's your core. I don't look at it like that. I think sometimes, like some nights he's going to be. We got to decide what you're spending the money on though. I mean, I'm saying, is that good enough? Yokich Murray Porter. I think so. I mean, hell, one of them's the MVP. Are you willing to go over 20 million today for Michael Porter Jr. Over 20?

Yes. Over 25? No. So, but somewhere between 20 to 25 is your sweet spot. Maybe like 25, right? Like, I mean, I think that that's, if I gave him, I mean, I don't know, if I'm doing a fifth year, that's what that's dependent upon to me. And I kind of want an injury, you know, insurance on there.

Right? Like they did with Isaac. Like they'll probably do with Jared Jackson Jr. Yeah. I'd want that with Porter. He did not have a good playoffs. Probably not the best time to cash in, honestly. You know, because it wasn't that great without Murray for him.

Likewise, Herder should probably cash in right now. You know what I mean? Coming off an Easter conference finals appearance. Andy had some big, big night. I think if you're Kevin Herder, you'd probably catch him. that shit. Porter, I mean,

just the last impression wasn't great. Yeah. So that's probably why I feel the way I do in terms of I don't want, I don't want the money to get too crazy

because I'm not sure. I just don't know. I don't know. And obviously he's had very serious injuries in his past, right? And he's kind of

that tall unicorn type too. I think it's time to retire the term unicorn in the sense that we have so many guys who are six foot 10 to seven feet you know who can handle the ball and shoot they're not unicorns anymore this is the new norm it's not the new no it's not the new no it kind of is chris it kind of is there's less than like 10 of them yeah but there's there's more and more and more coming every single year every year these guys are coming there's just a fleet of unicorns then we need to think something more rare lock nest monsters

Something more rare than either. A centaur? A centaur? Something like that. In mythology, what's the rarest thing in mythology? I have no idea with the rarest thing in mythology. You're not into that? I don't know.

Let me ask my Denmark and friends. I just Google it. Pegasus. A Pegasus is the most rarest and most legendary mystical creature, according to my Google search. Pegasus. Pegasus. Yes, according to Google. Then let's do that.

Yeah, I kind of like it. Pegasus is a legendary mythical creature in the most detailed in Greek mythology. That's even more impressive than the unicorn, a Pegasus. Yeah, I'm into it. And then if there's, if there's a couple of it would it be Pegasai or Pegasuses? I'm not, I'm not like a Pegasai person. I've always been a Pegasusus. I don't know, I don't know, plural.

You're nothing. I'm not good with plural. So sometimes I'll just leave it out as it is. Like I was like, you know, look at the Pegasus over there. You know, there's multiple of them in the distance, you know? Right. I would not say Pegasai. Right.

Like the Moose or something. Yes. Yeah. Isn't it the moose? They don't say the Meese. The moose is. I think they just say the Moose. English is a tough language, Chris.

Very tough. It's very difficult. I have a hard time with it. Oh, trust me. And I'm a writer. I have no idea. idea how I got their school. None.

Like that whole like, are you smarter than a fifth grader stuff? No. My son's in sixth grade. Oh my gosh. I look at his homework and I'm like, he'll be like, can you help me with this?

And I'll look at it. I bet, bro, I ain't got. You're like Googling underneath the table. I got no idea. Using the calculator for his math class. Look, you ask me who led the league.

scoring in 1988 or something. Like, I'm out on this preposition stuff. What was the foreign language you took in school? Oh, Lord. It was Spanish. Really? Okay. I wish I took Spanish. I mean, but I don't want to, I mean,

the worst experience. Really? Oh. I had a guy. Yeah, because like my Spanish teacher was the biggest dumb ass in the world. Like, truly. And I recognize, I, Senor DeLuca, I recognized this when I was a kid.

And he used to say, this guy called my dad, like, was a businessman, right? Like, got up and, like, I didn't see him when I got up to go to school. He wore a suit every single day to work, right? And this guy called my dad, like, at work, like, multiple times. Why? Just me being goofy. You know what I'm saying? Like, nothing like, and it wasn't like, it was.

It was just such a massive overreaction. Were you like in class arguing, you know, Scotty Pippin's better than Michael Jordan? No, no, no, no, no, no, I will tell you what it was. So, like, I'll give you an example. Like, one day we go in and they're teaching us, and I still remember this to this day. They're teaching us, I like and I don't like, right? And so the guy, he didn't ever teach you nothing. He'd play these videos.

right? He'd play like these videos and he would just press play. And so they would say, today we're going to learn I like and I don't like. And then it'd just be people on the screen and they'd be like, me goista, me gustav. Me gustav. Me gustav. And it'd be like different people like saying this.

And then they'd go, I don't like. And it'd go, no, me gustavs. So he wouldn't be teaching you. It would be a video. No, I'm watching a video. And of course, I'm making fun of the video. So actually, Chris, he was just innovative. This was before the days of YouTube since you're old.

No, he's a lazy bastard. And he didn't do nothing. And of course, you'd play these cockamamie me videos and I'd make fun of them. I was cracking jokes. I'm gonna, I mean, like, and he was like, so he was like leaving, he called my dad. And he'd say, Chris was bad at class. He got to the point where my parents were like, will you tell this Signior DeLuca to stop? Stop calling us at work.

And I'll be like, I'm sorry. You know, I mean, my parents. At that point, they thought he was such a goof that it wasn't that big of a deal. Usually I would get in trouble for stuff like that. Because, I mean, I goofed around in class. But this guy was like, I don't know, he was out to get me. He's a prick. And he stunk.

And it made me dislike Spanish. Yeah. If you had like the rate my t-shirt.com, that you would have given a zero. Yeah. Zero. an absolute zero less. I mean, F minus for senior deluca. I mean, most teachers are

wonderful people. Yes. I mean, this guy was just a bozo. Yeah, that guy's a bozo. He didn't get into it because he wanted to teach kids.

He's like, I don't care about this. No, he just turned on videos. And then it would be like, that's lazy. That is lazy. It'd be these awful videos, too.

Like, I'm serious. I remember that one vividly. Megastah. No, mega, I'm like, I don't have, my memory stinks.

but I don't remember ever watching a video in my, guess what language I took, Chris? Guess which language? German. No, this is an easy, it's a layup, Chris. Oh, French. Of course you did. Yeah, so in seventh grade in junior high.

No, may goista, Rudy Goeher. In seventh grade, you didn't get a choice. You would take Spanish, Latin, or French, and you didn't have a choice. they put me into French seventh and eighth grade and I feel it's okay with that I got probably B's um but then in high school ninth grade you got a choice you know French Spanish or Latin I was like I'm gonna take French again because it's the intro two classes which I've already taken this will be an easy grade so I did it for the easy grade in ninth and 10th grade and I don't

remember really much of anything which is a shame because I liked it at the time I just never retained any of it. maybe I could relearn it easily but I wonder I'm making connections here Chris do you think this do you think me taking French class through 7th the 10th grade has directly influenced my

mistakes in draft coverage I don't think there's any question some of my biggest mistakes have been because of the draft I've ranked you know Timothy Loahu too high I rank Killian Hayes too high I ranked Rudy Gobert too low I had him way too low

Frank Nillikina Frank Nilekeena Frank Nellikina, too high, who's a free agent, by the way, one of the top remaining free agents, if we're being clear there. The what? One of the top remaining is. I'm like one of the 10 to 15 best remaining. He's going to be playing for the Honey Badgers. Oh, God.

Oh, Friday. I'm wearing my Honey Badgers jersey. The Canadian League sent it to me in the mail, the CBL. By the way, Frank Nillikina might play in Italy this year. Just so you know, Chris. Just telling you. He's a good seat's available. I might want a jersey.

In Italian, Frank Milikina, Jersey. Pretty cool, yeah. So you'd think that this is all because, yeah, okay, that that, and so if, for instance, you would have taken German, you'd have been high on Dennis Schrooter, you would have obviously been a huge dirt guy. Wagner. Yeah, Wagner. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. Mo Wagner, Franz Wagner. Wagner. The Frantz thing didn't look so good in Summer League. We'll wait and see. We'll wait and see, but it was a struggle. Didn't look so good for old Franz. Last thing before we get out of here, I do want to mention the Sam Amick article or piece of news.

Because we've talked so much about the Ben Simmons thing. Obviously, it's at the top of mind of so many NBA fans, especially because every week it feels like the story gets advanced. But Sam Amick, who has had a beat on the Sacramento Kings for the last 20 years, rights for the athletic. And he mentioned in one of his articles that, I guess, when conversations had been had with Sacramento, that they were unwilling to give up either Fox or Halliburton in a deal for Ben Simmons. that that was kind of a non-starter if they were going to have to give up one of them. So it does speak to how much they believe in those two players,

or it speaks to where they're kind of add-on how Simmons would fit with them and don't want to give up that in order to get Ben Simmons. Now, I'm still a huge Fox guy. I know there are some people that have gotten down on him. I think that we're still at the beginning of his career in the sense that I think he's going to progressively get better and better and better. And I think he is a special talent. I do. Obviously, Halliburton had a great rookie season.

But what do you make of the phone, that conversation not being able to continue if it includes Fox and Halliburton for a Simmons deal? We'll see how it develops. I mean, it wouldn't surprise me if that's 100% true. Fox is signed with Sacramento. There was a report, I believe, a month ago that he's content in Sacramento. So if you have a player that's happy to be there and likes the situation that they're in, great. You know, you want to keep that guy.

But we'll see how things develop. You drafted Davey on Mitchell. If he blossoms and looks terrific right away and if Halliburn continues to get better, and if suddenly your three-guard lineup that is appealing and fun and fast on paper, if maybe it seems like one of those guys should be moved, maybe things change. So you could see things changing as well. And I think, you know, when we talk about Ben Simmons deal, deals with possibilities, I'm still operating under the assumption that Daryl Morey is going to take this into the season.

And the things will probably get ugly and frustrating and annoying for everybody involved. And that's when things can change. Price could go either up or down depending on how things develop. What's important about what you said? You talk about three guard? I do think that you're at kind of a crossroads. You know, when we start off the show talking about that Kuzma quote, right? That that deal was done.

You're going to have, I think they end up moving, buddy. I don't know where. Where, I don't know. I think they move him, right? You know what I'm saying? If we're just piecing it together, right? Okay. And maybe it's about Simmons, maybe it's not.

But that's in all, this guy's made all NBA teams. And they obviously love Fox and Hallibank. Burton. I believe that's probably true. They love those guys. Now, would they get rid of them for something insane? I'm sure they would just like everybody would for, you know, if it's like the Brad Beals of the world, now maybe it's a little bit different thought process. But they love them. And we also know that according to Kyle Kuzma, the Heald deal was done. that's tough. Because Buddy didn't even want to be there anyway.

We know that. It's been a disgruntled tenure there. And now he knows, everybody knows, that that deal was done. He was packing his bags to go to L.A. So I can't imagine what kind of mind's at going into a training camp. Therefore, I think it's going to depend. And you could smooth out your roster some. I mean, I think you could get a pretty good haul for Buddy Healed.

I really did. And ultimately, I mean, it can work with those three guards. And after Tuesday, last Friday show, when we talked about the idea of trading Fox for Simmons, I saw us tagged in a number of, you know, post saying we're underrating Fox. You know, maybe I am underrating Fox here. It's, it's, there's no doubt he's gotten better four years in a row. He averaged 25 points per game last season on the best efficiency of his career from the field, the best at getting to the line of his career, best scoring around the rim of his career.

the guy's gotten better at all four of his seasons. Whereas Ben Simmons has not gotten better on the offensive end of the floor. He's gotten tremendously better on defense, but not on offense. If anything, you could argue, Simmons has gotten worse on the offensive end of the floor, despite his willingness to do a little bit more in the screening department. It's still not what it needs to be. But I think when it comes to Ben Simmons, with who he is and what he can become in a new situation, there's two ways to look at it.

one is the Sixers did surround him with shooting last season. He had the shooters around him to thrive in ways that he didn't. But I think the real key to unlocking Ben Simmons is going to be up to him. And it requires something that the Sixers didn't have. That's a shot creating point guard on the perimeter you can run, pick, and roll with. If you plug Simmons into the Dremont Green Roll, I think this guy can be a monster. The Kings could do that with Mitchell or Halliburn. will what the question will be and this is why sacramento might not be willing to give up dearon

Fox to get Ben Simmons because Fox has gotten better four years in a row he's only 23 he could continue to get even better than he already is whereas with Simmons you might get that guy in your new situation and he might be like nah I still don't want to do this or that because I think I'm this guy and there's always going to be that fear especially if you're a team trading for him that he doesn't want to go to he said he wants to go to three California teams do you think one of those teams was the Kings? I don't think Kings fans think they're on that list. It's the Warriors. It's the Lakers or the Clippers. That's what

he would want. Doesn't mean he's not going to get that. He might get Golden State, but he's not getting either of the L.A. teams. I don't think unless they pull something crazy out. And look, and we've talked about this a lot. I don't think it has to be a point guard. I think it just has to be a perimeter shot creator. Because they

could have won the title, which you mean. If the guy's too big, the defense will just switch that screen, though. I think it needs to be a smaller guy ideally. Like someone Jimmy, they could have won the title with Jimmy Butler. They could have, yes. You know. But I'm speaking strictly to like the Simmons in a Dramon role aspect, like strictly to that,

having him with a smaller guard, like Simmons with Lillard, then it could work if he's willing to do it. It's all about Ben's own choices and his willing to do the things that sometimes it's like the dirty work. If you're willing to do that, then great. And I think with Ben Simmons, over the years he's shown he can do it on defense. He's shown at times he could be tough and aggressive on offense.

And then he goes through stretches where he's just doing nothing. He's just standing there, not even setting a screen, not even crashing the board, he's not doing nothing. He's doing nothing. If he's willing to commit to it and embrace being the guy who's doing the dirty work, setting screens, rolling to the rim, kicking out passes, then I think he can thrive with a perimeter scoring guard. Will he don't want to do with that?

That's the big question. And we'll see with him. I look forward to seeing Ben Simmons, regardless of the uniform that he's in. Will he come back in crater? Will he come back from this and shine? Sounds like somebody needs to go pull up Instagram because he bombs threes now.

Oh yeah, bombing him on these Instagram cuts. It's like one shot. It's never like multiple shots in a row. It's one shot. And by the way, this is the one thing I'm going to say about that, Chris. people say Simmons just needs to shoot it

Oh no he doesn't Unless he's efficient If he's inefficient Don't shoot it Don't do it If he's efficient then shoot it If you're inefficient don't shoot it Continue doing what you've been doing

I think the last four years It was probably for the best That he wasn't shooting I'll just say that Kevin it sounded to me like you I'm not going to put words in him it sounded to me like you think that that probably took several takes. Several takes, yeah.

To get them made. Scorsese was in the room. I think there, you say Scorsese was in the room. You think there are many deleted videos of misses before the one that has posted, the beautiful laser-like three? I think those TikToks and IG stories take a while to add it. You do.

Yeah, I do. Do you think he actually shot the ball that did go in? Or do you think that part is that? They edit Steph Curry's and the ball flight and then the, he does fall out of the frame, you know? I did say, I'm telling the source to say Scorsese was in the room. Scorsetzer was in the room. All right. We're going to do a mailbag again on Friday.

Give out that email address, Kemp. NBA mailbag at gmail.com. NBA mailbag at Gmail.com. Thank you to our executive producer, Sasha Eschal, as always, and we will talk to you on private.