The Moth - Introducing: What We Spend

Episode Date: April 23, 2025

Imagine if you could ask someone anything you wanted about their finances. On What We Spend, people from across the country and across the financial spectrum are opening their wallets—and their lives—to tell you everything: what they make, what they want, and—for one week—what they spend. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hi everyone, as a Moth listener, we know you enjoy the magic that comes from first person storytelling and are deeply curious about people's lived experiences. That's why we'd like to present a new podcast we think you'll enjoy. It's called What We Spend and it allows us a unique window into a subject matter that feels taboo to openly discuss. Money. In each episode, host Courtney Harrell talks with one person as they document a full week of their lives and all the ways money has

factored into it. People from all over the country and all walks of life share the ways they make money, the ways they spend money, and all the thoughts and emotions they have along the way. The conversations are intimate, thoughtful, often fun, sometimes emotional, but always real. In this preview, we hear from Kelly as she navigates life with the all-too-familiar burden of outstanding student loan debt. For the full episode, be sure to search for what we spend on your favorite podcast platform. You know how you always want to know about everyone else's money? You do, right? Like,

you'll see someone buying something you want or taking some amazing vacation and you think, how can they afford that? Or you meet your friend's new girlfriend and she has some very impressive job and you think, how much money does she make? I think when it comes to money, even if you don't want to admit it, we're all a little nosy. But I don't know, I actually think that's good. I think we should be talking about money more. And all the ways, big and small, that it impacts our lives.

On this show, we are actually going to do that. We are going to go somewhere that we almost never get to go, deep into the heart of someone else's finances. Here's how this is going to work. Each week, I'm going to introduce you to a new person from somewhere across the country, and they are going to tell us everything about their finances. How much they make, how much they want to make,

what they worry about, or if they don't worry at all. Then for one week, we'll they don't worry at all. And then for one week, we'll follow them through their daily routine. Every day, they'll record an audio diary with all the nitty-gritty details of how they're spending their money. I mean, the coffees, the groceries, the rent that's due, the car accident that suddenly happens, everything. And after that, we'll talk about what the week brought up for them. What it's made them feel. Because whatever you're buying, or not buying, or saving, or spending,

at the end of the day, money is always about more than your balance. I'm Courtney Harrell, and this is what we spend. How much school debt do you have? I have $150,000. I had more. I had $300,000 after my masters. I had a great uncle, Passaway, who was an artist, and my parents chose with their share of that, that they would help pay off all my private loans. And so that was a crazy night. We'd like, I remember pressing submit on the $150,000 payment and just being like, holy shit. And they were like, yay, doesn't that feel so much better? And I was kind of like, it feels like 50% better. And it still feels like I have still $150,000 of debt.

This is Kelly. I turned 32 in one week and I live in Salt Lake City. Kelly is one of the 42.8 million Americans who has student loan debt. And also, like a lot of her generation, she wants to buy a home and have a baby, and she's trying to figure out if it's possible to make all that work. Kelly married her husband about a year ago, and eight months ago, the two of them moved from Tennessee to Salt Lake City, Utah. Ben is an engineer for a software company, Kelly is a director of client experience at a medical spa, and she's also an online mental

wellness coach. I used to be a therapist, and for lots of reasons I'm not right now, but I will always have therapy or coaching in my life and I will probably go back to that full time at some point. Kelly is paid hourly, but she makes about $50k a year. And Ben makes about $78k. That's before taxes and health insurance. Together, that puts them just under the average income for married couple families in Salt Lake City. How will you manage your health? that puts them just under the average income for married couple families in Salt Lake City.

How would you describe your relationship with money? Consuming. Oh. I would describe it as all-consuming, yeah. The thing that keeps like coming to mind is, you know, when someone has like an addiction or a struggle and they call it like the monkey on their back. Yeah. Because you just can't get away from it. It's just clinging and it's present with you all the time. It feels like that. And I try really hard to like be in control, like maintain my control. Yeah. But it's kind of this tug of war. What do you

do on a weekly basis to manage your expenses? On a Sunday, I will sit down and look at the budget and I made a spreadsheet. Okay, yeah, so walk me through your spreadsheet. So I would love to hear what all of your regular expenses are and like what you kind of typically pay in each category. So rent and utilities, $2,800. That's pretty expensive for rent. Anytime I tell someone that, they're like, that's more than my mortgage. I'm like, yeah, I know.

Please don't tell me what your mortgage is. I don't wanna know. Two gym memberships, $108. Car insurance, $254. Gas, $125. Gas, 125. Do you have a car payment? No, we just buy used cars. Nice.

Ben's car, basically the roof flies off, but you know, just don't take it on the highway, you know? We don't have a car payment. Who needs a roof? Yeah, who needs that? It's a convertible. Yeah. Phone payments, 75.

Pet insurance, 76. and physical therapy for $250. It helps with Kelly's chronic back pain and osteoarthritis. And then groceries. This one sucks the most right now and I really feel like everyone will understand. I put $600 a month for groceries. And that includes toiletries and stuff too. They have a Costco membership, but they pay that yearly fee with the cash back they get from their credit card.

Medications and supplements like Ben works out. So he has like this huge bag of protein batter that he gets from Costco. So Ben's is mostly workout supplements and just one medication. And mine is, I I think like four medications and like a probiotic and some multivitamins. Total for that is $6.50. Streaming platforms? No. We moved off of our families. Some of the subscriptions are on them though. Dropbox for $12, SoundCloud for 6, Spotify for 10. Hair. My hair. I put $40 next to my hair.

And that's so I can spend that $40 and get my hair washed by somebody else one time every month. And it is like the gift to me to have somebody else wash my hair every once in a while. Isn't that shitty that like even now just reading my own budget that it really is just my business, I still feel the need to justify like, I just need to treat myself sometimes and have my hair washed. What does that make your expenses altogether, your regular expenses? Around $4,800 a month, but then you get to debt. How much debt do you have? A lot. If you are including my student loans,

we have $202,728 in debt. Where did you go to school? I went to Belmont University in Nashville, Tennessee. Why did you go to school? I thought I was supposed to, because I was told that, you know, this is the next step. And I think this is part of like the dream or the lie that was sold to my generation was like, if you don't go to college, you're going to end up working at McDonald's. You know, like you're going to be a deadbeat and you're going to have to live with your

parents and you're probably have to live with your parents and you're probably gonna use marijuana even. Now like you're gonna be a bad person essentially if you don't go to college. Kelly's degree cost about 40 grand a year. And after undergrad, Kelly went on to grad school at the same university. She has a master's in mental health counseling. But as Kelly sees it now, the math

doesn't make much sense. I want to ask you something about that. And I mean, no judgment with this. How did you think you were going to pay off that amount of tuition? Or were you at the time like, I know I can't pay this off. Like, how did you think about it then? Oh, no, it's a good question. I didn't. I did not think about it. I had no clue what I was doing. It wasn't like, hmm, I wonder how I'm going to pay this off when the, you know, average annual salary for a therapist is $40,000 to $60 thousand dollars a year. I was not thinking about that. I had no idea what I was doing and I didn't really have anyone around me who was explaining what I was doing. Like, your prefrontal cortex is not developed when you are making those decisions. Ultimately, I don't regret anything because I am who I am and I'm happy,

but I'm financially trapped. So that's Kelly. And this week, instead of just tracking it in her spreadsheet, she's going to tell us about every dollar she spends and every feeling that comes with it. How are you feeling about tracking your finances for a week? I'm feeling nervous because maybe I will just realize through tracking every expense that I'm actually just a dumb dumb and I'm very irresponsible and this is all my fault. But I'm very irresponsible and this is all my fault. Uh-uh. But I'm feeling curious. I'm just curious to see what comes of it. Yeah, me too. I will check in with you on the other side of your week.

Okay.