The Netmums Podcast - S17 Ep6: The art of balance: Parenting, self-care, and sustainability with Gemma Styles

Episode Date: October 21, 2025

This week on The Netmums Podcast, Wendy Golledge and Alison Perry are joined by the insightful author and podcaster, Gemma Styles. Together, they delve into the realities of motherhood, neurodiversity, and the importance of self-compassion amidst the chaos of parenting. Gemma shares her journey as a new mum, discussing the challenges of navigating toddlerhood while managing her own mental health and ADHD. The conversation touches on the significance of building a supportive village, the joys and trials of second-hand shopping, and the impact of social media on parenting. In this episode Gemma also shares some details with us about her partnership with Pura. Pura, the eco-conscious baby care brand. Pura’s wipes and nappies are toxin-free, allergy-approved, and designed with less plastic and more sustainable manufacturing. Gemma tells us all about Pura’s exciting nappy recycling initiative which currently recycles 60 million nappies annually in Wales, and the brand’s large-scale trial which is currently underway in Bristol. In this episode:-  The realities of juggling motherhood and personal projects Building a supportive community while parenting Managing mental health and ADHD as a new parent Gemma’s partnership with Pura  Exploring the benefits of second-hand shopping Setting boundaries with social media and parenting Understanding the phases of parenting and self-compassion Eco-friendly practices in motherhood Stay connected with Netmums for more parenting tips, community support, engaging content: Website: netmums.com / Instagram: @netmums  Proudly produced by Decibelle Creative / @decibelle_creative

You're listening to the NetMum's podcast with me, Wendy Gullidge, and me, Alison Perry. Coming up on this week's show, we're juggling the juggle, figuring it out doing what I can do. And some things at the moment, I just can't do. And that's okay, because my season for that will come around again. But she won't be this little again. So that's what I'm trying to sort of lean into. But before all of that, this episode of the Netmums podcast is brought to you by Aldi Mamia. One of my favourite things about being a parent is when clever people come up with genius solutions to problems we have. Oh my goodness, me too.

Like, can we please give a dame or a knighthood to whoever invented those little syringes for kids' medicine? It makes it so much easier to look after a poorly little ones. They also make great water squirters in the bath, don't you know? But I digress. A big problem many parents have is leaky nappies. So to solve this, Aldi's award-winning nappies now have dedicated boy and girl P zones.

P zones? Tell me more, Wendy. Well, did you know that girls tend to pee more in the middle of their nappy while boys usually pee more to the front? Aldimamia nappies now have uniquely designed pea zones to draw liquid across the entire core of the nappy to enhance absorption. Clever, huh? Oh my goodness, love that. I'm also a big fan of the leak lock pockets to help contain poo blowouts and the 360 degrees leakage protection. And the nappies are really comfy and a flexible fit. They are. Plus, they're dermatologically tested and suitable for newborns. Brilliant. They've thought of everything. Get your Aldi Mummya Nappies in store now.

Hello everybody and welcome to another episode of the NetMums podcast. Alison, good morning. How are you? I'm doing good. Do you know why I'm in a bit really good mood this morning. Go on. I had a delivery from Vinted. And I'm a bit obsessed at the moment with buying from Vinted. I feel like it's a real guilt-free way of treating myself. And also, my teenager has just got into it. And she has started, you know, shopping and buying things from it and also selling her old stuff that she's grown out of and making a bit of money. And it feels like, why wasn't the surviving when we were teenagers? It was honestly, it's amazing. Do you use it yourself? Absolutely. I had something arrived this morning actually. But it's so much better than the

kind of hands and knees in the buckets in the charity shops. It's just a bit more civilised. I mean, I love a charity shop rummage, especially like if you can pinpoint the ones near you that have good stuff. There's a really kind of a wealthy mansion estate about 10 minutes from me. And the charity shop on that high street has the most incredible stuff, still tags on it. I'm there. a few weeks having a rummage. So yeah, I love a charity shop as well, to be fair. August isn't going to like me for this, but I don't love a charity shop. It kind of, I, if I could walk in there and nobody else was there, not a single solitary other person, and I could not feel pressured and I could look in my own time, but it's, I find them really stressful.

I feel like it's a confessional. But isn't that just shops in general? There's people in shops Wendy. Yeah, but it's all a bit more neatly arranged. I can cope. Like, I can't go into TK.K. Max either. That brings me out in a rash. Do you know what? I actually, I do get it. It's a bit more chaotic and you've got to really rummage and teach your time. Yeah, I'm with you. I should have been born to only go, to be rich enough to go to designer shops where there's only five things to look at. That's the thing. That's all collared coordinated. We need, I need to stop talking because our guest is going to hate me before she even comes on. Please can you do. Before she storms off.

enough for she introduce her. We're joined today by author and podcaster Gemma Stiles. Now, Gemma is well known for talking about slow fashion and eco-friendly living and also mental health. And her book, Why Am I Like This, is a Sunday Times bestseller. And since becoming a mum last year, Gemma has spoken out about maternal mental health and living with ADHD. Gemma, a warm welcome to the Net Mum's podcast. Thank you very much. having me. I'm chuffed to start off the chat with a second-hand shopping conversation. But

equally, hard relate to the feeling very stressed and chaotic when there's too much stuff going on. So I'm okay with it, Wendy. You stick to your vintage. You'll be fine. So how is life looking for you right now? What's the typical day like being a mum and doing the juggle? I mean, typical the toddler mum stuff, I guess, in terms of of trying to keep a small person entertained and also not have your house completely destroyed by the end of the day. So yeah, we're definitely getting to that age now where I'm such a home body, not necessarily always in the good way, as in I could not notice if I haven't left the house for three days in a row and kind of just happily potter about in my own environment.

But yeah, definitely embracing the kind of making sure we get out of the house, like get to the park, get to the library, do your sort of toddler groups and your activities and stuff like that. So yeah, it's a bit of a learning curve for me in terms of not being such a hermit. That's the stage that I'm at the moment. Has anything surprised you? We all kind of approached motherhood, I think, with quite a sort of preconceived idea as to what it's going to be like. And it's not always accurate. So as anything kind of made you go, oh, okay, this was a bit different to how I expected it to be? I think I'm a little bit clingier than I thought. I might have been in terms of, which I think was partly, I had a bottle refuser baby, so it was

very much, we were kind of glued together, especially in the first months before they start, you know, eating any solids or anything like that. So I think that's, um, maybe had something to do with it. But yeah, I don't know. I'm, I'm enjoying it, to be honest. And I don't, you know, I don't want to say that in a way that sounds too surprising. But I know that. I know but, you know, talking about mental health for a long time, that includes maternal mental health. And I know that it is, you know, one of the biggest sort of transitional times in your life.

And it is really hard in a lot of ways, even just in terms of, you know, the amount of hormones flying around and changing and shifting the sort of metrescence idea that we talk about now. But yeah, I'm kind of, I'm surprised how much I'm enjoying it, I guess. Or not, that sounds terrible. if she doesn't. No, no, it doesn't. It's good. I like it. It's good. So looking back on your own kind of childhood and when you grow up, what are some of the values that were installed in you that you want to keep carrying on into your little one's life?

I find that quite a difficult question to answer, I guess. And that's probably because I'm thinking of, I'm trying to think of parenting at the age that my daughter is, which obviously I can't really remember. a lot from being under two. But I think in general terms in kind of how I feel that we were, you know, treated by our parents and how I think of my childhood in a broader sense in terms of, you know, like spending a lot of time with your parents and it being a very kind of warm, safe environment. I think that is, you know, it looks so different for every family. But I think it's really about, you know, how you, how everybody is trying to make their child feel at the end of the day. And I think so it's that at this stage that I'm really just trying to replicate in terms of, I can't remember the sort of specific activities and things that I would have been doing

at that time. But I think just, yeah, we just, we spend a lot of time together. Yeah, I mean, I'm at home constantly. But she's got the best dad ever who is also here a lot of the time and just the most hands-on and yeah we we spend a lot of time as a three which i think is very special for her that's so lovely um obviously you're spending a lot of time as a three but it's a cliche but they do say that it takes a village to raise a child so you know outside of your your little unit of three who's who's in your village uh that that's one of the bits that we found quite hard to be honest and we and we knew it was going to be the case um where we both live quite far from most of our family. So my partner's family is from the South Coast and I'm from up north. So we

kind of live in the middle. And yeah, it does just mean you're quite far from people and we haven't got a lot of family who are very close by. You know, if we've needed help for certain things, as in, you know, if we're both working and it's kind of non-negotiable, we're just, we just need need help, then, you know, my mum's been great, my brother's babysat, people have got stuck in and involved. But in the day to day, I'd say, you know, we've, we talk about this amongst ourselves. That is one of the things that I think we found the hardest, actually, about parenting without the kind of immediate village. And I sort of, I talk to people all the time who, you know, they've, they've got their parents 20 minutes down the road or they've got, yeah, just more people around.

and yeah, it's tricky. It is really hard. And of course, you have a rather well-known brother. Is Harry loving being an uncle? How hands-on is it? You mentioned a spot of babysitting there. Yeah, I mean, as hands-on as you're able to be when you are not always in the same geographic location, we face time a lot and they, yeah, love each other a lot, which is lovely. That's still nice.

In your book, Why Am I Like This? You write about self-compassion and being kind to yourself. How have you maintained that when you're in the thick of sleepless nights and new routines? And new routines because when you've got a toddler, it does feel like things change. You know, you just have something nailed and then things change again. And it's quite relentless in that way. Yeah, that's been one of the things. I think that's been one of the most useful sort of pieces of advice that I've heard is to kind of not

get too hung up on whatever problem it is you're dealing with in the moment because it tends to by the time you think you know it takes a few weeks to to fix one thing you've kind of moved on to something else and everything's a phase and kind of shakes itself out down the line anyway we've found so far so yeah I'm trying to stay as kind of roll with the punches as possible is like is what mum friends have told me that's that's been good advice And yeah, just trying to To soak up and enjoy each stage as you're in it Because that's the other thing that I'm really conscious of

And everybody tells you all the time And you meet people on the street And they go, oh, mine's 20 now, it goes so fast It's the blink of an eye So yeah, trying to remember that And yeah, soak it all in is what I'm going for And you've spoken about living with ADHD as an adult Has that changed how you think about parenting

and the mental loads that we all carry as mums? I think so. I think it's been my kind of, I don't know, ADHD journey, if you will, is kind of, I feel, been slightly on pause only because I was, had not too long been diagnosed and I was still kind of testing out a bit of medication and sort of seeing what was going to work for me. And then was pregnant and having a baby and breastfeeding. and all the rest of that.

So, and I know it's not the same for everyone, but for my, you know, specific stage of where I was at, it was better not to be taking medication at that time. So, yeah, it feels a bit, a bit like sort of bare-knuckling it through the first few years as well. And it's, I think it's definitely sort of tying into the self-compassion thing. There are certainly things that I find difficult, But I think being aware of my ADHD, it kind of helps me focus on it a bit more kindly at times in terms of even just, you know, yesterday I was kind of could just feel myself getting really stressed and a bit overwhelmed.

And I was sort of like, I was like, what, what's going on here? And I realized it was because the radio was on. There was like a bunny rabbit that has white noise in it that had been stepped on. so the white noise was going. Somebody was like playing a xylophone singing bar bar black sheep in the corner. And I was like, oh, hang on, it's fine. I'm not that stressed. There's just too much noise.

So I think in terms of trying to remember, you know, is it being a bit more sensitive to like my own sensory requirements and, you know, just being aware of maybe why I'll struggle with certain things, which I think had I not known about the ADHD beforehand, I think I maybe would have beaten myself up a little bit more for it. It's obviously quite a mild example that but I think just sort of tying it through the day and realizing why you might react in certain ways or why you might struggle with certain things. I think I find that really does help me kind of yeah, not beat myself up as much for sort of getting bogged down in little things and just actually try and try and make my experience of motherhood a pleasant one for

myself where possible. And so many women are being diagnosed with ADHD as adults. What advice do you have for someone who suspects they might be ADHD but is putting off talking to someone about it? Because it's so easy to dismiss all of the symptoms and it does feel a bit like everyone has it these days and that in itself might put someone off from speaking to someone. Yeah, I mean, that everyone has it these days thing is kind of, I mean, not true. And also, I think when you look at actual numbers of these things, I think the estimates, and obviously there are always estimates, but I think it's something between sort of three to five percent of adults. So it is a small number, but also when you multiply that by the millions of people in the country, for example, like it is quite a lot of people. But you also have to remember that in terms of more people being diagnosed as adults, and women in particular, it's not that those people suddenly have ADHD. They always had ADHD.

We just didn't know that that was maybe what it could look like. And it's guidelines that have changed, you know, through nice and then fed into the NHS. Adults weren't even able to be diagnosed with ADHD in adulthood until sort of, I forget the exact year now, but sort of in the last sort of 10 years or so. So it's kind of, it's a frustrating narrative, I guess, in terms of when people try and use that as an argument to sort of downplay someone's experience with ADHD because, I mean, I know myself it can have a really massive impact

on people's lives. But on the other hand, you know, I understand why people would feel that way as well and think, oh, you know, everybody's talking about it now and everybody this. and it's honestly it's similar with with a lot of mental health conditions and I talk about that kind of right in the beginning of my book actually and sort of just get into that question of why do we feel like everybody's got mental health issues ADHD not being a mental health issue but all tied together I think it's a similar sort of conversation it's the visibility makes a huge difference because the fact that we are collectively a bit more comfortable and more willing to talk about it now means that you will hear about it more because you know it's something that's not held as quietly as it once was and also because more people are being diagnosed because we have more information um so it's a combination of

those things really i think is why why we feel like it's a lot more prevalent than maybe it was in the past um but practically i think what that means is just that more people are getting the help and the information that they have always deserved and should have always had. So it's a good thing as far as I'm concerned. Just a reminder that this episode of the NetMams podcast is brought to you by Aldi Mammaia. As well as award-winning nappies with P-Zones

that enhance absorption, we love Mammaeer wipes. Plastic-free and gentle enough to use on your little one from birth. They make nappy changes so much easier. Head to your nearest Aldi store to check out the entire Mammaia. Lots of parents listening will probably be struggling today when they're listening with anxiety or with burnout.

It's really common. What's a good mindset shift or a practical thing that you would say can help reset when things feel overwhelming? I mean, I could reset. The difficult thing with that is, I guess, is it will be different for everybody. and I know that's kind of an annoying answer I guess but I think when we talk about self-care the thing that I would sometimes find frustrating with that conversation is how one size fits all it can tend to be and it can be very prescriptive in terms of you know

take a bath or listen to this music or sit and read a book and actually that's one not practical for everyone because you know if you've got yeah you just need more help you've got you know kids around your ankles as I'm sure a lot of listeners well you can't just run out of the bathroom and take an hour's bath and expect that that's going to be fine because maybe it's not but I think trying to figure out what you do need as a starter so for me for example because I'm you know a pretty introverted person all and also if I'm feeling

particularly overwhelmed it might be I just need some time on my own to like be a bit quiet or watch a bit of TV or sit on my phone for a while and it's it's the time on my own that would be quite restorative for me whereas if you're a far more extroverted person what you actually might need in terms of self-care and feeling less burnt out and feeling better is to go and have some social time and see people and you know try and make time to see your friends or see your family or or whoever whoever it is that you want to see and again it's it is a tricky thing because equally saying that is not always the easiest and like you know I know that first hand it might be that I quite fancy going for dinner with some friends but actually

you know my partners in the office or just whatever it is that you can't always just do exactly what you want to do all the time but I think you know in that regard I think that's where the sort of smaller moments of self-care and kind of just prioritising what you need is important even mentally like take the smallest breaks where you can and I think we're all just doing our best to kind of build it in

and yeah for people listening who are just feeling completely overwhelmed and like self-care feels like an absolute fantasy your heroes we're all going through it and yeah you deserve to take what you can and ask for the help wherever you can find it so true

As we've mentioned already, sustainability is a really big theme running through everything that you do. So how do you approach things like baby clothes, toys and general motherhood in a way that is more eco-friendly, but also realistic for you as a busy parent? That, yeah, is definitely my wheelhouse at the moment. The sustainable and realistic is definitely where I'm leaning into. So, I mean, you started the episode talking about vinted. I love Vintin and the vast majority of clothes that my daughter has worn so far throughout her short life have been secondhand which is good fun and kind of I think at the beginning sitting and scrolling on Vinted while nap trapped or feeding or anything else is actually quite a nice use of time I think and then in terms of things like toys we love charity shops for a toy my dad had taken her out on his morning a couple of weeks ago and they came back from the charity shop very happy with themselves with a brand news well sort of like workbench tool bench thing so she's got

a screwdriver and her hammers and is bashing away on this little wooden thing but yeah we've had some great charity shop finds and we have an ox found bookshop near us as well which is a great one for kids books do you know much really good as well as she gets older you can take her with you so my i've got six-year-old twins and one of our go to weekend activities is we take them to the charity shop and they get to choose one thing. So like a book or a toy or an outfit and they love it. And it doesn't cost the hour. So you can keep doing that but involve her in the process as she gets older.

Yeah, definitely. I think it is because it's fun, isn't it? It's reusing things and you can also, you know, do things like rotating toys. So if something's been in a drawer or a cupboard for a couple of weeks and you take it out and it feels like a new toy again. I wish I was organized enough to do that properly. I'm not really our toys are kind of my version of that is our toys all get like lumped into massive baskets because it's the only version of tidying a room that I can can keep on top of. So it's whenever you dig out the basket and find the toys that are at the bottom that you haven't seen in about a month

and a half. That's my version of toy rotation. Exactly. And yeah, I think just building in what you can, where you can to your routine. So a big one, obviously, when you have small children ends up being nappies. And I work with Peora now, a nappy company, and they make fantastic nappies and wipes and are, you know, they do things in the most sustainable way that they can do for, for what are disposable nappies. But also the reason that I wanted to work with them in, you know, in large part is because of the nappy recycling that they're working on. And they've funded schemes to essentially start up. It's something that actually already happens in Wales.

But it's a service where your nappies will be collected and recycled curbside, just like any of your other household recycling. And yeah, I think that and the work that they're doing to roll that out to the rest of the UK, I think it's such a, it's something that I've really, really wanted to get involved in, partly because it is that kind of realistic thing that you could do. And it's not asking a huge, huge amount of parents. And I think the thing about sustainability is that we just need to make it as accessible as possible to as many people as possible. So even if, you know, you're not someone who would necessarily consider yourself, you know, big, into sustainability or you don't feel like you have time to kind of implement a whole new system. I think making things like that as easy as possible for parents is kind of the whole

point. So brilliant. So what's the aim of the recycling trials then? So the pure nappy cycle aim really is to get the nappy recycling rolled out to the whole of the UK. The trial that they've done so far in Bristol, which was free for everybody to participate in, they've recycled 500,000 nappies in that trial so far, and it's had brilliant feedback. The family's involved, you know, I've read a lot of that feedback, and it's been great. And I think there's no reason why it shouldn't keep rolling out. That's what the aim is, really, to have it for everybody. So, you know, you can put your nappies to be recycled out with your cardboard.

We use three billion disposable nappies per year just in the UK alone. and they can take 500 years to decompose. So getting this recycling scheme, I think, will definitely, definitely help a lot of the waste that we're producing in this country. And, yeah, I think it's going really well so far if people want to learn more about it or, yeah, find out how you can support the trials

and support the aim of the project. You can find out more at mypura.com. Brilliant. On the purer front, actually, for I gone to my next question, We just used purer wipes when my twins were little, and it was so brilliant to find wipes that were sustainable and eco-friendly, but also didn't just, your fingers didn't just go through them.

Like so many of them are just not strong enough to withstand what they're actually designed for. So, yeah, big fan here. But you have built a career in writing, podcasting, collaborations. How are you finding the balance between creative projects, like those and being present as a parent. Do you have firm boundaries in place like work time and family time? I am still kind of ad hocing it a bit, to be honest. And it was, so my book came out last year when my daughter was still very little and there was quite a lot of stuff and work that I needed to do when she was smaller. And I mean, that is kind of as much as we can try and

plan life to be as convenient as possible. It just doesn't always work out that way. So I did end up working more than I would have necessarily wanted to when she was kind of under one. But then I've kind of tried to balance that. And this is the thing about about being self-employed. I'm sure a lot of people will relate to it. It's kind of you don't, it doesn't always work out that you can just take a full maternity leave. So it is kind of finding a balance. But then, you know, there are also certain things so far that have had to give in terms of I would love to get back to the podcast soon. Loving being back on a podcast again, having the microphone right in my face. Because I do love that.

But it's one of those things that practically just is tricky, especially when, you know, we have our daughter at home. She's not in childcare yet or at the moment. So, yeah, trying to find even kind of like a solid, solid time. in a week where I can guarantee that the house will be quiet and she will be asleep and I could get on a podcast and that would actually be, you know, a good time for a guest and all the rest of it. I think it's the logistics of stuff that make that hard. But yeah, my, my partner's very supportive and we share things wherever we can. So, you know, he's got her now, for example. So I can, I can do this. So we're sort of, yeah, definitely, we're juggling the juggle. And I don't think have

a firm answer for it yet, but figuring it out doing what I can do and some things at the moment, I just can't do and that's okay because that will, my season for that will come round again, but she won't be this little again. So that's what I'm trying to sort of lean into. So talking about overwhelm, social media can feel really overwhelming for parents, both in terms of what we share and the pressure to look like we're coping. How do you approach boundaries with what you post, especially now that you have a child? So my boundaries for social media and parenting, I guess, is at the moment we, I mean, I don't post her online. I'm quite heavily boundered actually, I suppose, compared to a lot of

people. So you might see the tiniest glimpses here and there, but we don't, certainly don't show her face. I don't say her name or exactly when she's. she was born or all that all those kinds of things just um details wise which i guess is um i don't know i think i think it's something that i'll sort of figure out as we go along i feel like starting from a place of kind of you know an abundance of caution just make sense to me because the way i describe it is sort of you know you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube once it's out so it's kind of if you share things and then go oh i wish i hadn't hadn't have said that or i wish i hadn't have posted that. It's too late. It's out there then. Which, yeah, after being on social

media for a long old time, 10 plus years, is something that you definitely learn along the way. Yeah, I think it's just figuring out what you're comfortable with. And I think it can be quite, it's a bit of a contentious conversation at the moment, I think, or I've certainly read various bits and bobs on social media. And it does seem to be a bit of a, bit of an us versus them at the minute in terms of, you know, people who post their kids online and people who don't post their kids online. But it's genuinely, it's not a judgment thing for me. It's kind of, it's just what I slash we feel comfortable with at the moment. And yeah, for me, even in terms of, I know there's a lot, a lot of conversation about kind of, um, AI and having

photos around and the impacts that that can maybe have. My main thing kind of in the back of my mind, to be honest, is sort of, you know, what, how is she going to feel when she's 12 and she's at school and it's kind of, you know, you're getting into that sticky age where, you know, I didn't, didn't always have the absolute best time at school, you know, it's like an awkward time. And if you've just got people who are, I don't know, being a bit mean to you or something, I just don't want her to feel like, oh, I wish people hadn't have been able to, you know, search my childhood online and be able to find photos of me that I didn't want them to see. So that's kind of where I've come from boundary-wise at the moment.

But as I say, it's, you know, it's very much each to their own. And I know it's not, everybody's not in exactly the same position. Not everybody will have the same boundaries. If you've got, I don't know, private Instagram and you post things for your family, like I think that's a completely different scenario altogether. And it is, yeah, I think it just depends on people's individual comfort levels. I'm quite aware of, yeah, saying anything that sounds like I'm being judgmental because I'm genuinely not. But it is, I think, one of those things, there's a lot of judgment in parenting.

And I think all you can really do is the best for your family and your children and judge your own situation and try and just let other people get on with theirs is kind of my approach. So true, so true. Now finally, Gemma, you've probably learned a lot in the last 18 months or so. But if you could go back and tell yourself one piece of advice before becoming a parent, what would it be? Oh, I think, yeah, I mean, the thing that I feel like I have now learned, which I probably mentioned, is, yeah, the kind of the role with the punchers approach to it in terms of not everything will last forever. everything is a phase and it's kind of you know the teething phases are tricky the no sleep phase is soul destroying the um and it's getting through you know the no bottles thing for me and but the sort of tied together nature we had a strong several several months of contact napping where that was that was all that happened and that you know and then it and then it isn't and you move on and it's something else um so i think yeah advice wise as much as much as it's the classic thing of the days feel long, but the years are short. Is that what they say? I've probably butchered that thing. But I have a mug with it written on it. It's very true.

I've tried to remind myself of that a lot, actually, that when things feel, you know, very heightened in a moment or problems feel all-consuming to try and, you know, remember they're not going to be sleeping in your arms every day when they're 18 years old. Everything, everything moves on and goes to a different phase soon enough. So I know it's not always the most practical solution to a problem, but I do think it's something that's very handy to hold on to. Brilliant. Well, Gemma, thank you so much for joining us today. It has been fantastic to chat to you. And you, thank you so much for having me. Thank you, Gemma. Good luck with your next vintage buys. Oh, thanks. Don't forget, you can get in touch with us on all social channels. Instagram, Facebook, TikTok,

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