The NPR Politics Podcast - Biden Administration, NYC Spar Over Immigration Policy

Episode Date: August 28, 2023

In New York City, more than 90,000 migrants or people seeking asylum have sought refuge since spring 2022. The city's Democratic mayor, Eric Adams, has asked for more federal assistance, and in the meantime, has cut back on services for those coming to his city. The Biden administration blames Congressional inaction.This podcast: White House correspondents Tamara Keith and Franco Ordoñez, and criminal justice correspondent Jasmine Garsd.The podcast is produced by Elena Moore and Casey Morell. Our editor is Eric McDaniel. Our executive producer is Muthoni Muturi. Unlock access to this and other bonus content by supporting The NPR Politics Podcast+. Sign up via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org. Connect:Email the show at [e-mail] the NPR Politics Podcast Facebook Group.Subscribe to the NPR Politics Newsletter.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

Hi, this is Jonalyn, and I am on stage warming up before the opening night of my sixth Broadway show. This podcast was recorded at 11.19 a.m. on Monday, August 28th. Things may have changed by the time you hear this, but I will still be living my childhood dream of being on Broadway. Wow, our listeners are so talented. What's the show? I want to know what the show is. I guess we'll have to get another timestamp for that. Hey there.

It's the NPR Politics Podcast. I'm Tamara Keith. I cover the White House. I'm Frank Ordonez. I also cover the White House. And joining us from New York City is NPR's Jasmine Garst. Hey, Jasmine. I finally made it onto the podcast.

It's almost like Broadway. Hey, Jasmine. I finally made it onto the podcast. It's almost like Broadway. Yes, this is my Broadway. That is boosting us way more than we deserve. But we have you here because we're going to have a conversation about immigration. And although much of the conversation in the U.S. has focused on the border and the states closest to Mexico. You're here with us because New York is among several big cities experiencing challenges related to immigration. More than 90,000 people seeking asylum have arrived in New York City since spring of 2022, and now the city is cutting back on some of the resources that it provides to them. Can you explain what's happening?

Sure, absolutely. So as you mentioned, more than 90,000 people have been bused to New York City since last spring. And the city has said it's at capacity. New York Mayor Eric Adams has said there's just no more room and it's costing us. This is compounded by a housing crisis in New York that has been severe for decades. And so, you know, in response, New York City is, of course, a sanctuary city, right? I mean, New York has to give shelter to anyone who requests shelter. And in response, the mayor, several things have happened. The mayor has shortened the period that single people can stay in shelters for, it's now 60 days. The administration has also

said that they're going to be handing out flyers at the border urging people not to come to New York. And also the Adams administration, relationships with the Biden administration have soured. It's almost once a week that Eric Adams does a press conference and he asks, beg Angeles, Houston, and El Paso cannot be left to show that a national crisis without the proper aid. When you say that they've been bused, are these the buses that we've heard about a lot in the news that are paid for by Republican governors or Republican states busing people to Northern Democratic run cities? Or is this something different? No, a good amount of it is that. Absolutely. And the other thing that I have encountered as I'm, you know, hanging out at shelters and migrant camps that are essentially homeless camps is also I've encountered people coming from Florida because of some of the new legislation in Florida. It's hard to work.

You know, it's a situation that's scary for a lot of migrants. So I've also encountered people who are coming up from Florida because of that, in essence, being pushed up. Franco, immigration is an issue that critics of the Biden administration have used as a cudgel from day one. Typically, those have been Republican critics. But now he has a problem with Democrats, too. Big city mayors, fellow Democrats making a lot of noise about immigration. Yeah, I mean, it's a big problem for Biden. And you can tell that they're kind of struggling with it and how, you know, limited they've been in their answers and explaining it. Karine Jean-Pierre, the press secretary, was asked about it a couple weeks ago. And she didn't have any good answer. You know, she said they were, you

know, taking it very seriously, talked about a senior advisor, Tom Perez, who, you know, former labor secretary who's, you know, doing work, how they're throwing money at the issue, $100 million to address the crisis. But there really is no light at the end of the tunnel. And it is a big issue. And it is, you know, it is something that, you know, he is getting hit from for both sides, you know, for this. I mean, a Democrat lining up with Republicans is not a good look for Biden right now. But also, it's worth remembering that Eric Adams did run on a more conservative platform. He is a former policeman. And, you know, he's gotten a lot of criticism from the left about kind of being, you know, more of a Republican than a Democrat. That's a criticism that gets lobbed at him pretty often.

Jessica, I want to talk about some of the whys here. Not necessarily the why are people coming to the U.S. or why are they going to New York, but why is it sort of taking so long for folks to get through the system, either to have their asylum cases adjudicated or to get work permits so that they aren't staying in shelters. What's the hang up? Right. You touched on something that has been kind of the crux of the argument for the last couple of months, which is work permits, work authorizations. This is the big thing that Adams and Governor Kathy Hochul are asking for. Let people work. If you let people work, they will graduate from the shelter system quicker. And frankly, every single person I've spoken to at shelters and in these homeless camps has said, I just want to work. I think that people don't

fully understand how long it takes to get a work permit in the U.S. There's all these different categories. But for example, if you're an asylum seeker, first you have to figure out how to file an asylum application, which if you're living in a shelter with, you know, you're fighting for one bathroom with 80 or 90 other people, you have limited Wi-Fi access, applying for asylum is very confusing and difficult. Then you have to figure out, well, in 60 days I have to be out of here. So maybe applying for asylum isn't your number one concern. Once you apply for asylum, which can take months, only after you send that application, you have to wait another 150 days to apply for a work permit. So essentially, we're talking about

at least six months in the system without the ability to work legally. And what's the difference between working legally and not working legally? I know that you've interviewed a lot of people who are finding these workarounds, but there are challenges. Oh, absolutely. I mean, people are working. People are being pushed into an underground economy, which is highly exploitative. I've met so many people who are working, you know, at restaurants and other gigs where they're being paid well below the New York minimum wage. A lot of the guys in these shelters tell me they've been working for delivery apps. And I've met a lot of guys who have gotten into accidents, you know, and they have

very little recourse to ask for help. So it's pushing people into an exploitative underground economy. And so the request that these politicians, whether it's Adams or Hochul, what they're asking for is, can we make the process for getting a work authorization quicker? Can we expedite this? That's something that Congress has to do. I will say it's also it's not just politicians. It's business leaders. I've spoken to so many business leaders who have told me there is a labor shortage in the U.S. We need workers. So, Franco, how is the White House responding to these calls for action from the mayor of New York? They don't have a really great answer. They have been asked about this. They say they're working on it. They don't have good answers, though.

They say they're putting money to the problem. They have a senior advisor looking at this. But it is a significant issue that they don't have any good answers for. And let me just add that the Biden administration has actually made asylum more difficult since taking office. So these problems are not going away. Well, and Jasmine, correct me if I'm wrong, but some of the things that the Biden administration has tried to do are held up in court. Yeah, absolutely. You know, last week, Biden's the humanitarian parole, it went to trial. And,

you know, when we say, well, why can't the immigration system be fixed? Why can't something be done about this? I think, you know, this case is just really emblematic of how things come to a standstill real quick. I mean, essentially, you know, the humanitarian parole allows people in, you know, and it's from certain nationalities. And it's, I think it's Cuba, Nicaragua, Venezuela, and Haiti. And when you get humanitarian parole, you can apply for a work permit right away. It does still take a really long time because there's such a backlog. You know, we can't talk about this without talking about the backlogs in the U.S. immigration system for work permits. It takes a really long time. But you can apply right away.

And so what the case is about is, you know, various Republican politicians saying, well, you're just letting people in en masse. You need to vet them individually. Essentially, it's being treated as Biden has created a shadow immigration system. Like you just created this category, like a parallel immigration system, and you can't do that. And it's, you know, the administration is countering back, if you take out this humanitarian parole, then a lot more people are going to cross without papers. And we're going to be back to square one. Those court cases are also emblematic of how the federal government needs Congress to act. You know, the Biden administration's moves on immigration have

not only been attacked from the right legally, there have also been lawsuits from the left as well. And that just shows the limitations that the executive branch, as it tries to do these things, why they can only do so much without Congress taking action. All right. We're going to take a quick break. And when we get back, more on what it's like for the migrants who are living here. And we're back. And Jasmine, you've been talking to so many people who are seeking asylum, gathering their stories, learning about their experiences. And I'm wondering if there's anything that stands out to you about conversations that you've had

or experiences that you've heard about again and again. Yeah. I mean, when you go to some of these shelters, it does remind me a little bit of those Great Depression photographs, those black and white Great Depression photographs where there's just a lot of people, you know, who are just sitting outside kind of staring into space wondering what's going to happen next. And I think that's like the big sense. There's like a sense of heaviness and of depression. What's going to happen next. And one of the commonalities that the story I've heard over and over again is I've just been bused and shipped to so many different places. And I just don't know. I need some sense of stability.

And I met a young man in upstate New York, in Albany. His name is Johnson Coronel. He's in his mid-20enties. He's from Venezuela. So basically what he's saying is, you know, we're tired. We're just so tired. Coronel came from Venezuela. He was escaping, you know, government violence and police violence. He was in two different shelters in Texas. Then he got bused to Boston, where he spent four days. Then he got sent to a shelter in New York, where he says it was 12 people per room. Then he was told, listen, Albany is going to be less crowded. So he immediately got sent to Albany. That's a lot of places for a young man.

And Coronel, he's a cook by training in Venezuela. And, you know, what he was saying is, I just want to be able to be in one spot. It doesn't, that's the other thing you hear a lot about. I didn't choose New York. This isn't like some tourism, you know, I don't need to be in New York City. I can go anywhere. is still out of control. In part, that's just an indication of how intractable the politics are right now. But also there are real frustrations. Oh, real frustrations. And look, this situation just gives, I would argue, Republicans more fodder to attack Biden.

It allows Republicans to kind of point to Eric Adams, point to New York and say, look, even these liberal towns like New York are complaining about the same stuff we are. And frankly, politically, it's very effective. I mean, this really is a no-win situation for Biden, having a Democratic mayor calling him out for similar things that Republicans are calling him out for. We know Biden is watching this closely and needs to be watching this closely because it is one of the issues, immigration, that he is seen as most vulnerable on. And actually, there was a poll released last week by the Siena College Research Institute that kind of looked at Democrats and Republicans and independents in the city of New York, as well as upstate New York.

And a majority of them said that more needed to be done and that roughly 46% said that migrants resettling in New York has been a burden, more of a burden than a benefit to the state. So this is a tough issue politically as well. And as Biden, you know, looks forward to 2024, this issue is more than likely only going to get bigger and more critical. Yeah. You know, Franco, we even hear this on a local level. I've been out and about in different towns in upstate New York, and you hear local leaders say something similar. You know, I went to this town, Colony, which is about 20 minutes away from Albany, and I spoke to the town supervisor, Peter Crummey, and he said in no uncertain terms, this is not our problem. This is not the town of Colony's problem.

The solution lies at the feet of the federal government because immigration is decidedly a federal issue. It's not a town issue. Immigration is not a town issue or a village issue. And yet these communities and communities all over the country are figuring out how to welcome or not welcome migrants who have come to the U.S. Jasmine Garst, thank you so much for your reporting. Thank you for having me. Thank you, Jasmine. Thanks. I'm Tamara Keith. I cover the White House.

I'm Frank Gordonez. I also cover the White House. And thank you for listening to the NPR Politics Podcast.