The NPR Politics Podcast - Biden Announces Bipartisan Infrastructure Deal, But That's Only Half The Story

Episode Date: June 24, 2021

Standing next to Democratic and Republican Senators, President Biden declared, "we have a deal." The group had agreed to a framework for a large infrastructure package. But the path forward could mean far more partisan deal making before any roads or bridges are built. This episode: White House correspondent Asma Khalid, White House correspondent Franco Ordoñez, and congressional correspondent Kelsey Snell.Connect:Subscribe to the NPR Politics Podcast here.Email the show at [e-mail] the NPR Politics Podcast Facebook Group.Listen to our playlist The NPR Politics Daily Workout.Subscribe to the NPR Politics Newsletter.Find and support your local public radio station.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

Hi, this is Anna calling from my front porch in Texas, waiting for my parents to complete their three-day drive from D.C. to see me for the first time in 474 days. This podcast was recorded at 2.43 p.m. Eastern Time on Thursday, June 24th. Things may have changed by the time you hear this, but that's my parents' car turning the corner, so here's the show. That is so heartwarming. I hope you all had a good time. Hey there, it's the NPR Politics Podcast. I'm Asma Khalid. I cover the White House. I'm Frank Ordonez. I also cover the White House. And I'm Kelsey Snell. I cover Congress. We had a really good meeting. And to answer your direct question, we have a deal. After decades of talking about infrastructure, it looks like the country is inching ever so

closely towards actually doing something about it. The White House and a group of 20 Democratic and Republican senators have reached a nascent deal on infrastructure. Let me be clear. Neither side got everything they wanted in this deal. That's what it means to compromise. And it reflects something important. It reflects consensus. The heart of democracy requires consensus. And this time, a true bipartisan effort, breaking the ice that too often has kept us frozen in place,

prevented us from solving the real problems facing the American people. All right, Kelsey, let's start with you. What do we actually know about what this deal is? This deal is for about $1.2 trillion over eight years, and it focuses on hard infrastructure. So the traditional definition of infrastructure, there's roads and bridges, there's safety and public transit, there's broadband and airports, and about $570 billion of this is new money. So it is not all new money. It's not all new spending. A lot of this is money that Congress was already intending to spend on infrastructure. But Biden set out the parameters when they were talking to these bipartisan senators, saying that that was okay. It was okay to include this baseline spending as part of whatever deal they came up with. We also know that it is being paid for without increasing taxes, though I will say that a lot of the programs that they want to use

to pay for this are on a list of things that we as, you know, people who watch federal budget would kind of call budget gimmicks. They are not big revenue raisers. They are not things that, you know, one would expect to see on something of this size of a bill. So I'm going to be really interested and watching very closely to see exactly how much money they think they're getting from each thing here. You know, Franco, the president just delivered remarks at the White House about this infrastructure deal, and he made it clear that this is part of a larger two-tier plan, and he's not going to sign this deal in isolation by itself. Yeah, I was very struck by that. I mean, being in the room when he said that, he said he would not sign this bipartisan plan without the larger plan, which obviously is going to be very difficult to get through.

But he says, you know, he's pretty clear about that. It's either both or none. And I found that fascinating because it's basically counting out a potential win. But, you know, he seems pretty serious about that. Well, part of that is because House Speaker Nancy Pelosi told reporters earlier today that she wouldn't be taking up any kind of bipartisan agreement unless there was a broader bill coming along right with it. There won't be an infrastructure bill unless we have a reconciliation bill. Plain and simple. She says she needs the Senate to pass the bipartisan bill, but also something under budget reconciliation, which is something we've talked a lot about in this podcast. It's the way that the Senate can get around the 60-vote threshold of a filibuster and pass something with just 51 votes. And that's something they can do with all the Democrats and Vice President Kamala Harris jumping in to break a tie. So this is kind of

a little bit of Biden acknowledging the political reality in front of him. Kelsey, can you spell out this distinction for us? Like what is this infrastructure deal in front of us? And then what is this larger plan that a number of Democrats say needs to actually occur in order for them to sign on to any infrastructure package? One way to think about this is Biden put out his bigger, broader American jobs plan. And that was much larger, right? That was over $2 trillion. And that included not just the hard infrastructure that we're talking about today, but included things like childcare provisions. And it included elder just the hard infrastructure that we're talking about today, but included things like child care provisions. And it included elder care and it included the child tax credit.

It included things that were supposed to address the human barriers that people face as they are trying to enter the workforce and participate in the economy. What Democrats are saying here is that it's great that there has been some bipartisan agreement on the traditional infrastructure parts of this. And they want to show that they can pass things through Congress with Democrats and Republicans getting along. But they're also saying they're not going to let go of the entire rest of Biden's proposal. They still want to follow through on the promise that they made that they would pass that larger bill. So they're just essentially doing it in two separate bills. Got it. And to be clear, you know, some of that human infrastructure like child care and some of the climate change initiatives as well, they are not a part of this bipartisan deal. Right. And the Democrats say that they are not part of that because Republicans wouldn't get

on board. But you know, the reason that they want to tie these two things together, the reason they want to vote on them all at once, is because there are some people who worry that if they just moved ahead with the bipartisan stuff, it would be really easy to let all of the rest of it, the harder part of it, just fade off into the distance. And that's one of the things that I found very interesting about Biden saying that he would only do both of them together. I expect that in the coming months this summer, before the fiscal year is over, that we will have voted on this bill, the infrastructure bill,

as well as voted on the budget resolution. And that's when, but if only one comes to me, if this is the only thing that comes to me, I'm not signing it. It's in tandem. Because later in the speech, he made very clearly that the country should take what it can get. He made a plea to members and constituents that, look, it's like, why should a member, if he can get some of what they want, but not all of it, why shouldn't they take the good stuff that they can get? The question is, how much can we get done? And the bottom line is, when all is said and done, does what you agree to preclude forever you getting the things you really want? Well, I'm not for that. I'm not going to vote for one of those deals. Secondly, do you get all of what you wanted, wanted and you come back and fight another day?

So I found it very curious that he would actually automatically count out, count out not going forward with part of what he says people should want. And, you know, obviously that's politics. All right. Well, that is how this deal fits into the broader framework that Democrats see for infrastructure. We are going to take a quick break. And when we get back, we'll talk about why bipartisanship is so important to Joe Biden. Capitalism touches every part of our lives. Capitalism is a giant force that I don't understand. I feel that it's a very safe system. I am constantly in fear of losing my job. It is our biggest success and our biggest failure. On this special series from Throughline, capitalism. Listen now to the Throughline podcast from NPR. And we're back.

So, Franco, talk to me a bit about the politics here, because if there is a plan to do this separate, larger budget reconciliation process, and Biden is saying that he won't sign one without the other, then you do kind of wonder, well, why all this big like hoopla about the bipartisan deal today? And why all this focus on making sure that he has a bipartisan deal? Look, this was a big, this is a big part of President Biden's agenda. And in today's Washington, I mean, you do not see the scene that we saw here at the White House very often. You haven't seen it in a very long time where you had so many Republicans and Democrats standing together shoulder to shoulder, you know, announcing a deal like this. And in some cases, you know, with Senator Manchin and Senator Romney, actually with their arms at one point, you know, over each other. That's significant. Also, you know, this was a big deal, not only for Biden, but also, you know, in the room, you could see Brian Deese. He's the director of the National Economic Council. He was in the room, you know, fist bumping, you know, the secretary of commerce, Gina Raimondo.

There was definitely a lot of good feelings that they had made a step forward. Is it a premature victory lap? Yeah, perhaps. But it is a step in that direction that Biden will be able to point to, as he did in his remarks. I think it's really important. We've all agreed that none of us got what we all wanted. I clearly didn't get all I wanted. They gave more than I think maybe they were inclined to give in the first place. But this reminds me of the days we used to get an awful lot done up in the United States Congress. We actually work with them. We've got bipartisan deals. Bipartisan deals mean to compromise. Yeah, you know, I was struck by hearing how much this president,

and even during the campaign cycle when it was running, he believes that in order for you to prove that democracy still works, you need to have bipartisanship and bipartisanship requires compromise. And it feels like he on a philosophical level, just really wants to have a bipartisan deal to prove that bipartisanship can still work. Yeah, I mean, I think it's I think it's definitely part of his identity as as a politician as a senator. I mean, he this was a big part of, you know, his leadership. I mean, in his remarks, he talked about, look, we have to be positive. There are ways to work together. And he also made it clear that when talking to reporters, he's like, I know the Senate better than you do. And there are ways to work across the aisle. And this is something that is very important to him because we're seeing it in other ways. He was complimenting Mitt Romney. He just nominated Cindy McCain, the widow of former Senator John McCain, to an ambassador position. You know, he has definitely made a point of that. Now, how much legs will that have in today's Washington? You know, we'll find out.

And the cynical political flip side to this is that, you know, it's also convenient for Democrats to be able to say that they tried as hard as they could to get something bipartisan and then blame Republicans if things don't work out. towards blowing up the filibuster, removing the 60 vote threshold in the Senate, because they are, you know, going through this whole legislative process in the Senate right now, where they're voting on things just to prove that Republicans will not get on board with most major priorities. So this kind of, while it may be core to Biden's feelings about this, it also has a lot of, you know, more raw political power to it as well. And even if this bipartisan deal does go forward, I mean, Kelsey, it still is going to take a long time before folks actually start seeing construction on a local bridge in town because of this deal, right? Like what needs to happen between today and that eventual endpoint? Yeah, we're not getting a new highway next week.

This is, I mean, there are some of the legislative delays that are common, which is it takes a while to write a bill to turn an idea into legislation. But then actually negotiating the details of getting whatever budget reconciliation package comes together, that's going to probably take a long time. First, they have to pass budgets, identical budgets in the House and the Senate with instructions for reconciliation. And they have to write all of the rest of that policy we were talking about, about, you know, child care and elder care and about tax credits. That all still needs to be written. So there are a lot of delicate negotiations going on. Oh, and not to mention getting votes in order, because we talk a lot about the Senate and how narrow it is there. But the majority in the House for Democrats is

also tremendously narrow. And they will have to be able to come up with some way to write bills that will satisfy both Joe Manchin in the Senate and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez in the House. And that is going to be a challenge. All right, well, we will make a deal to stop talking about infrastructure, at least for today. I'm Asma Khalid. I cover the White House. I'm Frank Ordonez. I also cover the White House. And I'm Kelsey Snell. I cover Congress. And thank you all, as always, for listening to the NPR Politics Podcast.