The NPR Politics Podcast - This Majority-Minority City Voted For Donald Trump

Episode Date: February 27, 2020

As part of our Where Voters Are series, NPR's Ari Shapiro and Colorado Public Radio's Bente Birkeland share their reporting from Pueblo, Colorado.Over the next several months, NPR will feature stories from eight communities around the country as our reporters embed in the community to report on the wide array of issues that will shape voters' choices this election cycle. This episode: congressional correspondent Kelsey Snell, All Things Considered host Ari Shapiro, and Colorado Public Radio reporter Bente Birkeland.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

Hey there, it's the NPR Politics Podcast. It is 1.50 p.m. on Thursday, February 27th here in Washington, D.C. And it's 11.50 a.m. here in Pueblo, Colorado. And I'm Kelsey Snell, and we're doing something a little bit different today. I'm Ari Shapiro. I'm one of the hosts of NPR's All Things Considered. I'm Benta Birkland, a political reporter at Colorado Public Radio. NPR is launching a series we're calling Where Vot a political reporter at Colorado Public Radio. NPR is launching a series we're calling Where Voters Are. We've got teams of NPR reporters teaming up with

local member station reporters to get a better sense of the stories driving their communities ahead of the 2020 election. And to start with, tell me why you are in Pueblo. You know, Pueblo is kind of, it was first described to me as the Rust Belt of Colorado. Its nickname is Steel City. When you drive up, there is this enormous steel mill whose silhouette kind of like defines the outline of the city. Today, it's owned by a Russian company and it employs about 10% of the people that it did at its peak. Right now, like only 6% of Pueblo's population works in manufacturing. But this city was built on waves of immigrants. So you drive around town and you can see like, oh, that's the Slovenian neighborhood. That's the Mexican neighborhood. That's the Italian neighborhood. I mean, I went to this Italian

deli named Gagliano's that's been owned by the same family and run by the same family for more than a century. This is a city that is 50% Hispanic, but in 2016, it narrowly went for President Trump, and that's part of what makes this such an interesting city politically. Benta? Yeah, and I think Colorado did not go for Trump. We are a swing state, but in recent elections, Democrats have made a lot of gains here. Democrats control both chambers of the state legislature and the governor's office. And in Pueblo, not only did voters back Trump, they voted for a Republican member of Congress and then just two years later voted for a Democratic governor. And so this is a place that's changing fast, maybe in ways that other parts of the state are not changing.

And we found a real divide between people who want to return Pueblo to its manufacturing roots and people who see the future of the city in new fields like marijuana or solar or wind power, all of which are growing. You know, this is really interesting to me because when I hear about a steel town, I'm thinking about places like, I don't know, somewhere in Pennsylvania or Ohio. And those places are also pretty important politically in 2020. But the dynamics you're talking about in Colorado and in Pueblo specifically sound pretty different to me. Is that right? It is. I mean, this is a place that has been a union town since the early part of the 20th century. And I met a union president here. He represents some of the steel workers. His name

is Chuck Perko. He told me he thinks probably a third of his members voted for President Trump. He's hoping that in 2020, they're going to wake up and realize that as he sees it, President Trump's words were not backed up by results. But he thinks that message is still appealing to these people whose families have voted Democratic for generations. That does sound like one of those themes that we're starting to hear emerging, you know, just heading into an election where there's this very distinct choice for voters, right? It's between President Trump and a very different vision of America. I'm wondering if you guys can tell me, you know, what are the stories that you're hearing from people so far? I talked to people across the political spectrum, and I

didn't find anyone on the fence about the presidential race. Democrats were maybe undecided on who they were going to vote for in the primary, but they want Trump out of office. And the Republicans I talked to who had backed Trump last election said they still were going to vote for him. Jacqueline Riggs is a teacher at one of the high schools here. She has seven children, 21 grandchildren, and she was born and raised in this community. Her husband's in the Air Force, so they traveled the world, but she wanted to come back here. And I talked to people who said lots of people who leave come back because they love this community. And she's

struggling a little bit with some of the things Trump has done. She does not support the money for the wall. She aligns with Democrats on education issues. She's led one of the teacher strikes down here. So she's very pro-union. But on the economic policy side, she really aligns with Trump. And she says some of the things he says make it tough for her to defend him. Are his personal values, like the way he's lived his life, divorce and affairs and saying things that he said about women and about, no, those are not my values. But his policies are. Like, I don't take it seriously. I think it's a sort of rhetoric banter, like political, just like in your face. I wish he wouldn't do it as much as he does. Honestly, people hear that stuff. And that's all they hear.

You know, the point that Benta just made about the appeal of the Trump economy really ties into something that I've seen here, which is that it almost feels like there's a story of two economies. On one hand, unemployment is low. The stock market for the last few years has been at high record levels. And that suggests that things are going great. At the same time, here in Pueblo, people say they have jobs, but the jobs just aren't enough to make ends meet. I mean, I went to this food pantry that was started by a consortium of churches in Pueblo more than 30 years ago when the steel mill was laying off thousands of people. It's called the Cooperative Care Center. It's still in operation, but today the clients are not laid off steel workers. The director, Mona Montoya But today, the clients are not laid off steel workers. The

director, Mona Montoya, told me the clients are people who have what should be good paying jobs. They just can't make ends meet. It's a middle class now that are hurting. Well, we've seen people from the police department, fire department, school teachers, nurses. You close your eyes and you think of a homeless person, they're families. And there's where it really pains the states to see this kind of deal. We hear a lot about how this economy has benefited some people more than others, but it's really interesting to hear it described exactly that way. There's something I wanted to ask you about Pueblo in general is how big a place is this? Are we talking about a big city? Are we talking about a small town? Help us kind of wrap

our heads around that. There's a lot going on here, but it's not a big city. It's about 100,000 people. Definitely some good restaurants and a nice downtown area. We are relatively close to Colorado Springs, which is a big metropolitan area, but it just feels worlds away. It's interesting. So many of the facades are beautiful and clearly built 100 years ago when the steel mill was at its peak. But, you know, downtown, there's this towering office building that is empty. But in the lobby windows, there's an art installation by a local artist. And so much of what I've seen here is local creative artistic people who are trying to take up space that the industrial past has left behind. You know, there are murals all over, there are brew pubs that are making local beers. There's a real creative class here, even as the working class struggles to make ends

meet. And we've heard from officials here, they want to keep cultivating that because their concern is a lot of younger generations will go to school and not come back in Pueblo and settle in other parts of Colorado. And Kelsey, we would be shunned and never allowed to come back if we didn't also mention the Pueblo green chilies, which are famous and delicious. And because we're in Pueblo, we are contractually obligated to say better than New Mexico hatch chilies. It's very important to get those plugs in. Ari won't get another interview in Pueblo if he doesn't say that. Well, we have to take a quick break. But when we get back, much more about Pueblo. Support for this podcast and the following message come from Google.

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Actor and comedian Nick Kroll, next time on It's Been a Minute from NPR. And we're back. So this is a special treat for me because, Ari, I don't usually get to be asking you the questions. That's true. Usually the tables are turned. So I want to know what you are excited to watch in Pueblo over the rest of this year. You know, that's one of the things that I find so exciting about this project is that we're able to return to the same community month after month. And on this first visit, we're doing some kind of top line stories about the economy and what makes Pueblo run. But some of the stories that I'm hoping to dig into on future visits include, you know, this is a place that, as I mentioned, has had immigration for so

many decades. I'm interested in how Hispanic families that have been here for five generations feel differently about politics from families that have been here for one or two generations. I'm interested in looking at the booming marijuana, solar, and wind energy sectors that are a hope for Pueblo's future, even as Pueblo tries to resuscitate its steel past. And Benta, you are a local reporter there in Colorado, so you have a perspective on this community and its relationship with the rest of the state. I'm wondering how you're approaching this and what you want to learn. You know, Pueblo has a really unique place in Colorado. The governor launched his campaign

here. He called it the heart of the state. And I think there's a lot of pride from people who are in Pueblo. But just because it's in the state, a lot of people in other parts of Colorado, maybe not as familiar with the history here and the political history. We talk about Trump narrowly winning in Pueblo. When Republican Senator Cory Gardner was elected, he narrowly lost here. That's expected to be one of the most competitive, closely watched Senate races in the country this next cycle. Gardner's campaign said they will focus on Pueblo. And Gardner's relationship to Trump, how closely he aligns himself with the president, what voters think about that will definitely be something I'm tracking. Democrats are also going to be focused on Pueblo. And one Democratic political operative

said, because this is kind of considered the mini Roosevelt of Colorado, they feel like if they can figure out Pueblo, they can figure out the country. You know, I'm personally also really interested in that Senate race. I am sitting here at Capitol Hill right now, and I've been following Cory Gardner for several years. And just watching the way that he has navigated that relationship between the voters that you're talking about and the president, I think is just really fascinating. And Ari, you are out on the road quite a bit as a host. And I'm wondering if you are getting a sense of, you know, any changes about people's political feelings here there in Pueblo versus what you're hearing other places when you're out? Honestly, what I'm hearing from a lot of people is anxiety and exhaustion. I

interviewed one woman who told me she considers herself a liberal Democrat. And she said, four years ago, I felt in October, the way I feel now. And she said, four years ago, I felt in October the way I feel now. And she said, if I feel this way in February, what's it going to be like over the next nine months? I mean, I think people are deeply dug in. As Benta said, there don't seem to be a lot of people who are on the fence about whether they're going to vote for President Trump or the Democrat. And I sense just a lot of dread, exhaustion and anxiety, even this early in the process. And I've talked to people who are friends of completely opposite political persuasions, that they don't feel like talking about politics. On both sides, people feel marginalized and attacked for their political views.

And some people said they're losing friendships over this because people cannot understand how someone could vote for Trump or not vote for Trump. You know, that really reminds me of things that I've been hearing as just a nationwide election issue. I had somebody just the other day say that it used to be that people would put their jerseys on, red or blue, Democrat or Republican. But this election cycle, they're thinking about it as people are painting their jerseys on. And I think that that sounds a lot like what you guys are talking about. They're really embedded feelings. Absolutely. And before we even get to that point, we have to remember, Super Tuesday, Colorado is one of more than a dozen states that's going to vote.

And so the Democratic primary is raging here. And the two names, interestingly, that I've heard more than any other from people I've interviewed who are Democrats, the names are Bernie and Bloomberg, who probably could not be more different from each other on the spectrum of people who've been on those debate stages. And it's really clear that kind of the labor people I've talked to who are members of the union and work in the steel mill, they tend to be supporters of Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders. And the people who are in more white collar official positions, they tend to be supporting former New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg. And during the last Democratic presidential race, Colorado had a caucus. Sanders did really well here compared to Clinton. So this cycle, it's a little bit

different. We have a presidential primary and unaffiliated voters can participate in that primary. So we'll see if that shifts the dynamic. Oh, that's really interesting. That's definitely something to be watching for as we're talking about, you know, where independents wind up this time. And a lot of people we've talked to have described themselves as independent politically, which fits with the larger Colorado identity. One of the stories that I did here, for example, was about a synagogue that came under a bomb threat by a white supremacist. And when I talked to the president of that synagogue, he said in the months after the man was arrested, members of the congregation came up to him and said, don't you worry, I have a concealed carry permit.

That's something that seems so very Colorado to me, and not something you might see at a lot of Jewish congregations across America, but definitely here in Pueblo. Wow, that is an amazing story. And we're going to be hearing a lot more stories just like that from the teams spread out across the country. Stevens Keep has been reporting from Charlotte, North Carolina, and we're going to have teams in eight communities across the country. Stevens Keep has been reporting from Charlotte, North Carolina, and we're going to have teams in eight communities across the country. We'll have reporters in places

like Orange County, California, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, and Milwaukee, Wisconsin, throughout the course of this election. In the meantime, Ari, where can folks find all of this reporting? We are just starting to roll it out, and it will all be at NPR.org if you just search for where voters are. I cannot wait to hear more of this series. But Ari, you have to go host All Things Considered. That's right. We're hosting from Pueblo, Colorado for the next couple of days.

Good luck. And we are going to have to leave it there for today. I'm Kelsey Snell. I cover Congress. I'm Ari Shapiro. I'm one of the hosts of All Things Considered. I'm Benta Brooklyn. I cover Colorado politics. And thank you for listening to the NPR Politics Podcast. play in other people's movies. It was a really sort of palpable fear that they were going to reject me or worse.

The unseen pressures we place on other people, this week on Hidden Brain from NPR.