The NPR Politics Podcast - Trump’s picks wins GA runoff for Senate, but not governor

Episode Date: June 17, 2026

The results are in from Georgia’s Republican primary runoff contests for Senate and governor, and President Trump is one for two — the Senate candidate he backed won, but his gubernatorial pick did not. We discuss the results, plus how conspiracy theories about the 2020 election are still shaping Georgia politics. This episode: voting correspondent Miles Parks, political reporter Stephen Fowler, and political correspondent Ashley Lopez.This podcast was produced by Bria Suggs and edited by Rachel Baye.Our executive producer is Muthoni Muturi.Listen to every episode of the NPR Politics Podcast sponsor-free, unlock access to bonus episodes with more from the NPR Politics team, and support public media when you sign up for The NPR Politics Podcast+ at plus.npr.org/politics.See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for sponsorship and to manage your podcast sponsorship preferences.NPR Privacy Policy

Hey there, it's the NPR Politics Podcast. I'm Miles Parks. I cover voting. I'm Stephen Fowler. I cover politics. And I'm Ashley Lopez and I also cover politics. And we are recording today at 1.10 p.m. Eastern Time on Wednesday, June 17th, 2026. Today on the show, key election results in Georgia. The state's Senate and governor's races are now set after yesterday's primary elections. And for President Trump, the results were mixed. Stephen, I want to start with the Republican primary runoff in the governor. race. Who were the candidates and how did this race unfold? So Miles, Georgia Governor Brian Kemp is term limited. The race to replace him was wide open. You had several of the state's top officials running for the Republican nomination, but the runoff was between Lieutenant Governor Bert Jones and Rick Jackson, a billionaire healthcare executive outsider who jumped into the race last minute and has spent $100 million plus of his own money on this race. And ultimately, That was one of the reasons where Jackson prevailed, even though Trump endorsed Bert Jones, the lieutenant governor, Brian Kemp endorsed Bird Jones to be his replacement.

But when all was said and done, Republican runoff voters in Georgia picked this billionaire health care executive who said that he would be President Trump's favorite governor and would govern in the mold of Brian Kemp and spent nine figures to convince people of that. Yeah, I feel like both me and Ashley's faces when you said $100 million, we're like, that is just so much money. So Jackson's going to face Keisha Lance Bottoms in the November election. But I want to focus here specifically on Trump's endorsed candidate losing. Ashley, what do you make of this? Because it feels like we've talked a lot this year about the power Trump holds in Republican primaries. But this seems to go against that. Yeah, I mean, if you look at some of the Republican gubernatorial races, like the primaries there, have been.

like the only places where a little bit of Trump's power seems to crack. We saw this in Iowa as a good example recently. And I mean, a lot of this has to do with the fact that, like, people have view state leadership differently than they view Washington. They maybe have like a more independent streak when it comes to who they want to be their leadership in the state. And if you think of how the Trump two, this second term, has been going, like governorships are where lawmakers really have been pulling a lot of weight.

in blue states and fighting against the president. So it is interesting that this is where, you know, the party seems to have a little bit more of an independent streak. I don't know what to make of it, but it is interesting. And it's also important to point out here that the biggest loser is Brian Kemp. Kemp backed Bert Jones at the last minute. And so there could be a world in which that last minute boost would be enough to put Jones over the top, actually in election day votes.

Jones did better. but waiting into the last minute, backing the losing horse, so to speak, does not look good, especially when you think about Kemp's pick in the Senate race, which I know we're going to talk about in a few minutes, also losing. Well, I want to stick with Jackson just for a second more because this idea that he spent $100 million promoting himself, and it seems to have worked, does also cut against something we've talked about on the podcast a bunch in the last couple of years. I feel like just this feeling that like having a bunch of money doesn't necessarily translate to votes. I think we saw this a little bit in California with Tom Steyer not making the top two in that state's governor's race recently. But this does seem to be a situation, Stephen, where money did matter.

What do you make of that? Well, I, as you know, live in Atlanta. I receive about a metric ton of campaign mail basically every week for the past 10 years here in Georgia. and it was just stunning the scope and scale of what was received. Probably for every one campaign mailer that I would receive for any candidate for any race, you know, governor, Senate, down to city council. Maybe for every one of those candidates, there was two or three just for Rick Jackson. You turn the TV on, every other ad was about Rick Jackson.

You have YouTube or streaming ads, Rick Jackson. I mean, he blanketed the entire. entire state with this message that he was a billionaire outsider who had a business background and conservative principles. And it kind of sounded like this guy named Donald Trump. I don't know if you've heard of him. And it was really effective too because Bert Jones, the lieutenant governor, he has a bit of a more controversial past. He was very involved in the Everett's overturn Georgia's 2020 election, but also didn't really campaign much or in the same way. And so, you know, yes, in California, Tom Steyer spent a lot of money, but California is a big state.

There's a lot of people running. There's a lot of money to be spent. I mean, we're looking at two different audiences here. There is a big difference between a primary and deep blue California versus a Republican primary in Georgia. These are just different groups of voters with different concerns. They, you know, most definitely look at billionaires differently, like, you know, how they relate to, you know, the income inequality in this country is very different if you're talking about a more low. left-leaning electorate in California versus more conservative group of voters in Georgia. Well, we also talk about how runoffs usually have slightly lower turnout than a primary election and then a lot lower than a general election.

I guess I wonder whether the money goes further in a race like that where it's just a smaller pool that you're trying to influence too. I don't know. Definitely something to watch. Well, that means it's also a more conservative group of people. It's the ideologues in the runoffs and in the primaries. And like the smaller that group of voters gets particularly in runoffs, the more ideological they get. All right. Well, let's turn to the GOP Senate race now, Stephen, where Trump and Governor Kemp actually endorsed different candidates.

Tell us about what happened there. The winner is Congressman Mike Collins. His father was a congressman. And Collins is this sort of prototypical MAGA congressman. He's very aggressive and brash online and in interviews and in campaign ads. He's very big on supporting Trump's immigration policies. He actually sponsored the Laken Riley Act, which is one of the first things that Trump signed when he, he returned to office, he is everything you would expect a Trump endorsed candidate to be.

And that was ultimately what ended up happening there. He beat Derek Dooley, a former football coach and friend and ally of Brian Kemp. And part of the logic and rationale there for Dooley's portion of the race is to compete against John Ossoff in a year that is not favorable for Republicans to have a more moderate, electable outsider in the race. And that is not what happened in the runoff here. And so if you look at it from the outside, it might seem strange based on having the more moderate electable governor candidate and the less moderate, more ideologically pure candidate in the Senate race. But those two are not incompatible with kind of how the Georgia Republican electorate is right now.

So I want to look ahead to this November race, which I think is going to be something. We're going to be talking about a lot for the next few months between Democratic Senator, incumbent Senator John Ossoff, who's been able now to get a head start on campaigning because he didn't have to deal with a primary while Republicans have basically been bashing each other for the last couple months. This is a key race if Republicans want to keep control of the Senate. Worth noting again here, President Trump won Georgia in 2024, very recently. Any thoughts on which way this race is leaning at this point?

Well, I mean, most experts, including the Cook, political report would say this is leaning towards Democrats keeping this seat. John Ossoff has been polling very well. And mostly because, you know, he's been able to focus on a general election while the Republicans have been battling it out in a primary and then a runoff. But also, you know, we did a focus group with swing voters in Georgia recently. And voters there, you know, those who did know who John Ossoff is, they had like pretty decent opinions about him, pretty good opinions. So he's seen fairly well there. And those are Trump voters. And those are Trump voters.

We'll swing voters and more independent-leaning voters, which is, you know, what a big part of that electorate that is changing from year to year in Georgia, like the people who are deciding elections. Like those are the kind of voters that we're looking at. And so I think that's interesting. You know, and it's been kind of interesting to see all the clips that are coming out of that. There's a, you know, it's gotten to the point where there's even a little bit of 2028 chatter because he's like just has a little bit of. to shine on him right now. I was going to say, I don't use the word glow up usually, but I do kind of feel like John Ossoff's had a little bit of a glowup recently. Yeah, he's having a little bit of a moment. Look, 2028 is very far away. This happens a lot right. It's like, ooh, is this person like maybe

going to run? Like, I mean, there's a, there's a lot of variables there. But yeah, he is well positioned to keep that seat. Stephen, what are your thoughts on that race looking ahead? This is a little bit of a conundrum. The more John Ossoff focuses on winning his 2026 Senate re-election campaign, the more people talk about 2028. If you look at what Assoff has done, he keeps his head down. He focuses on his Senate oversight responsibilities. The things that he drills down on is what he calls corruption and sort of holding the Trump administration accountable to things very focused on constituent services. You don't see him popping up on a lot of cable TV shows or podcasts or there's no books or policy manifestos or things. He is just locked in on winning Georgia

in 2026. And the more he does that, the more attention he gets for 2028 because of the things he's saying resonate with a broader Democratic audience. I think the other thing to consider and think about is, you know, if John Ossoff were to run for president in 28, the governor of Georgia would appoint a replacement. So there has to be a Democratic governor in Georgia. He has to help Keisha Lance Bottoms get elected to even move to that phase of the conversation. Otherwise, you could have a multiple-time, hard-fought Senate seat for Democrats that could go pretty easily to a Republican. But the real secret is, is he's not the Georgia senator that is most likely to be on the presidential ticket in 2028 from where I said. You're talking about Senator Raphael Warnock then.

I'm talking about Senator Raphael Warnock, who will also be on the president. ballot in 2028, who also won several hard-bought elections, and who also has a pretty compelling national story that he is using to be head-down focused on what's going on in the state. Yeah, he's doing a book tour in the middle of John Ossoff's Senate campaign. He's making sure he's not out of the mix. I will say, like, I think the benefit to Democrats of having someone like Ossoff talking about corruption and affordability, all the things that Democrats want to be focused on, is that he is a young, telegenic man and right. Right now, Democrats just need to be signaling to voters like, hey, we're still in this.

Please still consider us when you vote, whether or not it's, you know, for the for the upcoming midterms or the presidential election in 2028. I think like candidates like this are helpful for Democrats. All right. Let's take a quick break and more Georgia politics in just a moment. And welcome back. So sticking with Georgia politics today is the first day of a special legislative session in the state. This is a closely watched session because it could have a big impact on how people vote there. Stephen, what can you tell us?

So, Miles, once upon a time, there was the 2020 election. Oh, God. And it's Groundhog Day. We're still talking about the 2020 election. Georgia narrowly went for former President Joe Biden, as you know. President Trump tried to overturn the defeat, as you know. And there have been myriad efforts over the years to find different ways to rectify that. in the eyes of Trump supporting Republicans.

One of the things that they did a few years ago in the Georgia legislature was to pass a bill saying that at some time in the future, July 1st, 2026, it will be illegal to use Georgia's current configuration of voting machines where you use a touchscreen to make your selection. It prints out a piece of paper that has the text of your choices and a QR code. That QR code is scanned, and that's how it's tabulated and uploaded, and we know who won the election. Well, it's almost July 1st, 26, and they haven't fixed it.

The General Assembly has not appropriated money for a different system. The Secretary of State's Office and the General Assembly has not picked a new system, but the long and short of it from what I've been told is that the legislature is going to meet during the special session. I've seen a draft of a bill where they are going to set up an election commission to deliver a report next year, to fix the voting machine situation by 2028. So we are going to keep using the machines until somebody else figures out something down the road. I mean, Georgia, this is like a real test case for what happens when you write election policy based in conspiracy. And you don't really know how elections work.

For so long, I mean, Miles, we both have covered elections for a long time. It used to be just like sort of nerdy experts, like a lot of technocratic knowledge that went into changing. how elections are run and changing election policy. But because so much of election policy right now, especially in red states are being shaped by conspiracy theories, things rooted in not really like expert advice, stuff like this happens. And it's like really, I mean, this is a mess now that lawmakers have to clean up

or at least for this summer, kick the can down the road and figure out what to do with this law that they passed a little bit ago. So, I mean, it's a mess. And, you know, if it's confusing to read, imagine being an election administrator in Georgia right now. Well, and it's worth noting, I do think that, like, the average person might hear the idea of, like, my vote is in a QR code. Georgia also has one of the most advanced auditing processes in the entire country to be able to double check after the fact and make sure that the election results are what the computers initially calculated. And, again, computers are much better at counting votes than humans are.

Research has confirmed this time and time again. And so I just want to explain that for people who initially are like QR codes. That is kind of scary. So, Stephen, I guess how certain are people there that this is going to be resolved in time for the election to go off OK in 2026? Well, there have been numerous court cases actually predating the 2020 election over Georgia's voting machines. And so it is the never-ending story of somebody doesn't like it. There's questions about it. It goes to the courts.

The courts hear things. The courts maybe also kick things down the road. And so one thing is certain in Georgia. there will be an election in November, and people will be able to vote in said election. And the system that Georgia has in place is safe and secure and tested. And that, like many other things, the nuts and bolts of what is to come afterwards is a problem for a different day. Well, it is also striking kind of what you were saying, Ashley, about just how much 2020 still feels. The 2020 election in President Trump's loss in Georgia still feels like it permeates the entire.

state's politics. It also came up in the Senate race, right, Stephen? Yeah, one of the reasons that Trump endorsed Mike Collins, the congressman over Derek Dooley, Kemp's pick. Well, Trump kind of dinged Dooley and said, I've never heard of him. He didn't live in Georgia most of his life. He didn't vote in 2020 and 2016. Oh, also he said, I lost the 2020 election. Trump did lose the 2020 election despite the years of him saying otherwise. And so it is a prerequisite it now to have Trump's support to falsely claim that he won the 2020 election. And even six years later, even in a must-win state for Republicans' governance in the future, you have to acknowledge what Trump says the reality is about 2020 rather than the actual reality. Well, Trump hasn't let it go.

He keeps on talking about it. As long as he talks about it, this is going to be an important talking point for every Republican nominee or candidate and it's going to be in the Republican agenda no matter what. Well, and it's worth noting, obviously, Trump didn't really feel a penalty for continuing to talk about in 2024. He won the popular vote. But we've found that in down-ballot races in races that aren't for the U.S. president, there has been in some cases Republican underperformance in races when candidates have kind of gone down the road of election in Nile. Do you think that this could be a penalty, I guess, Ashley, that like a candidate running for U.S. Senate in Georgia who thinks that the 2020 election was stolen, could that potentially hurt him with independent voters? Or I don't know. You have any thoughts? I mean, I think there are other things.

that independent voters are more angry about. I hear from them every month. This does not come up every single time. But what still matters the most to every Republican candidate is that I get Donald Trump shine, because that is a thing that could make or break you. The other thing with this special session, Stephen, is that Georgia was expected to redraw their congressional maps, not necessarily for 2026, but for 2028. What's the latest there? Well, the latest just before we started taping this is a letter and a press conference by the Republican-controlled House leadership that said, thanks but no thanks. The gist of it was that the House prides itself on doing redistricting with public input and taking time and careful consideration. And so a rush special session where there are no maps that have been released and there is no public comment, that's not on their agenda. There are other things like fixing the election bill, and there's some property tax and gas tax incentives that they are looking at handling.

So the door is closed for now asterisk on redrawing the maps for 2028, with the asterisk being if Keisha Lance Bottoms wins the Georgia's governor's race in November and would be in charge of any future map-making process, then the legislature could come in after November, in December, and do it all again. I feel like it'll be interesting to watch how President Trump takes this news then, too, because we've seen in some places where states that have decided not to redistrict, he doesn't take it super well. Well, they made the decision after a primary because that's where Trump has the most amount of power. So they really, I mean, this was a compromise to even consider it for 2028, which is probably a smart move in Georgia. Like, look, if you look at the states that have redistricted, Louisiana, Tennessee, Alabama, these are deep red, Republican, solidly Republican states. Georgia is a swing state. It is Republican. but it is a swing state. And Republicans didn't want to gin up support and enthusiasm among

Democrats, which is what could have happened if they redistricted. So, but we're not, yeah, this isn't, this isn't the end of the story, especially if Democrats also start redistricting in 2028. I don't think this is the end of the story for Georgia either. And I think to that point, I mean, you look at South Carolina, which is not a state that is purple or in danger of flipping the Democrats anytime soon, there was extremely juiced Democratic turnout in the primary, as a the legislature there debated redistricting and is one of the reasons that Republicans ultimately there said, no thanks, we don't want to give them any more help than they're already getting. And it also just sets up, I mean, like you mentioned, Ashley, the sort of duality of places

in the South where in Georgia and North Carolina and even Florida before the most recent mapmaking, Republicans already squeezed out all the juice they thought they could get and hold in years that were good for them or in years maybe like this where there could. be a Democratic wave. And so, you know, doing the maps any further runs the risk of having a majority Republican-controlled state and majority Republican House seats look very, very different and very, very Democratic in a year where the dam breaks. So that is another kind of meta reason behind this decision, like many other things, to kick the can down the road. All right. Well, let's leave it there for today. Stephen's so happy to have you monitoring everything going on in Georgia

in the South Forest. Thanks for being here. Of course. I'm Miles Parks. I cover voting. I'm Stephen Vowler. I cover politics. And I'm Ashley Lopez, and I also cover politics. And thank you for listening to the NPR Politics Podcast.