The Pat McAfee Show - PMS 2.0 1434 - BA Day with Bruce Arians, MNF Doubleheader Recap, NBA Opening Night with Steve Nash, NBA Commissioner Adam Silver, Darius Butler, & AJ Hawk

Episode Date: October 21, 2025

On today's show, Pat, Darius Butler, AJ Hawk, and the boys are joined by 3X Super Bowl Champion, and former Head Coach of the Arizona Cardinals and Tampa Bay Bucs, Bruce Arians to recap last night’s Monday Night Football doubleheader, give his biggest takeaway’s from the weekend, and give game balls for his best performing players in the NFC and AFC. Joining the progrum to chat about tonight’s NBA opening night featuring the Rockets and Thunder and Lakers and Warriors is 2x NBA MVP, 8x All-Star, 7x All-NBA, member of the NBA 75th Anniversary Team, and now studio analyst for the NBA on Prime, Steve Nash. Later, joining the show to recap last night’s Texans/Seahawks game after being boots on the ground on the sideline, why he thinks the Bengals are a sneaky playoff pick right now, the mood in New York, and much more is ESPN NFL analyst/pundit/host, Peter Schrager. Lastly, NBA Commissioner Adam Silver joins the show to give a full state of the union on the NBA as we tip off a new season tonight. Make sure to subscribe to youtube.com/thepatmcafeeshow or watch on ESPN (12-2 EDT), ESPN’s Youtube (12-3 EDT), or ESPN+. We appreciate the hell out of all of you, we’ll see you tomorrow. Cheers. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, beautiful people, and welcome to our humble abode, the Thunderdown. On this BA day, October 21st, 2025, this program begins right now. Football! His Maxwell two games, false start on me. I jumped to start. That's on me, ladies of German 47-year football coach. Our coach, BA is here. We're going to see you, Coach, BA. We appreciate the hell out of you traveling up here every single.

week. The toxic tables here at Boston Connor and at Ty Schmidt. I see the Celtics ad on con man. The NBA tips off its regular season today. And guess what? We have Steve Nash joining us. Wow, in about 15 minutes or so. And then we have a 37-minute and 37-second conversation

with the NBA commissioner, Adam Silver, that we recorded earlier this morning because he's in the middle of traveling for opening tip. There's no way he knew he was signing up for a 40-minute conversation with us. It was basically a state of the NBA. We'll run that in a third hour, although we will run clips of that over next couple of hours. We appreciate him

joining us so much. And then obviously there's a lot of ball and talk about it last night. Hey, two Monday night football matchups. How you doing? Keep it moving. The Buccaneers taking on the Lions? What? Let's get a prime time matchup that we could see maybe in a playoffs. This is maybe a team

that maybe goes on a run to Wednesday Super Bowl. This is a Monday night football treat. This is a Monday night football joy. Starting 7 o'clock a little bit earlier than usual. That's because we've got a nightcap at 10 p.m. and we'll see how many people survive that one watching this doubleheader, and it's certainly great. But how about this Buccaneers Lions game coming down to former teammate of ours? Nine-year NFL vet Darius J. Butler, defensive coordinator for the

Detroit Lions, Kelvin Shepdog Shepard, leading the boys with a lot of injuries to a massive night against one of the most explosive and electrifying offenses in all of NFL on prime time debunk. Absolutely. Shepdard was getting a lot of love, which he should be. Just grit. You had questions about how they would respond to this team, losing your offensive coordinator. Losing your defensive coordinator, both of those guys going to be head coaches. And Shepdaw did this thing, man. You got a bunch of injured guys out there. Arthur Millett stepped up with that unbelievable interception.

Not everybody up here agrees that it was an interception. I think it was an interception in the great play on reviews. It's kind of one of the game changing moments in this game. Bucks hung around. It hung around in the first half. I thought this would still come down to the wire, but the Lions ended up getting it done. Jemir Gibbs. He is phenomenal on the offensive side of the ball.

I mean, it's kind of a resurgence of, like, running backs. We got obviously Bijan, Jamir, C-Mack, all these guys, Jonathan Taylor doing his thing. But he is unbelievable. Sonic into Sonic and Knuckles, getting the ball, broke away early, had a big-time run, was big-time in the air as well as a receiver, which he does week-in and week-out. Montgomery didn't have that big of an impact, but this guy right here, you can ride number zero. Jared Gough, still slinging it, taking care of the ball, making plays down the field, St. Brown, broke the game open early with their big-time touchdown. So the stars showed up for the Detroit Lions.

It was a lot of talk about who wouldn't be there. But when these guys showed up at home and they showed out, we were all kind of surprised about the spread going into this game, six and a half points. But they showed us kind of early that why they put it there and why they'll be there at the end of the road. Yeah, six seven points was a spreader. So six seven points was forward field, real home field advantage felt like,

honestly. With what happened to that Buccaneers' offense, it felt like the defense was hunting. And obviously, you just mentioned it there. The conversation was about who wasn't there. Jack Campbell is awesome This guy's great White side

learned about him last night because they showed him this guy's undrafted last year or whatever comes in makes a massive plays for him there's a bunch of players just all over the place that Detroit Lions team

that we're being kind of introduced to and on the offensive side Jamir Gibbs is so fast this guy's unbelievable the number of zero looks so cool sick I was kind of on the fence

about adding zero into it and then you see a guy running 35 miles an hour on Monday night football and it's like wait a minute I think I like the number zero. Now, let's talk about the Tampa Bay Buccaneers side of this entire thing.

Obviously, we thought it was a big spread because how much we respect the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Mike Evans was back. Mike Evans gets hurt in the game last night. They said something about his colorbone. He's going to be out. So that breaks the streak that has been an incredible run of 1,000 yards receiving, going and going. He breaks his collarbone, gets a concussion. He leaves, which is obviously not fun.

But Baker Mayfield playing. This team was ready to roll, it felt like, for a playoff push. Throughout the beginning of this season, they're getting hell. healthier as opposed to getting, you know, more decimated with injuries like they were at the beginning of the year? Coach Bea, obviously you won a Super Bowl down there. You're still very close to that place. What are the thoughts on Tampa Buccaneers after last night? And how do you think they come out of that game thinking? I think they're all disappointed that Mike got hurt. You know, that streak means so much to everybody at an organization and Mike means so much

to the organization was a hell of a play and he caught it and then obviously broke his collarbone. But, you know, for me, playing in Detroit without your right tackle, that's bad news. And Aiden Hutchinson was eating it up. He's a beast. Now you're stuck in what I call Bucknug. You're all blocked up and nowhere to go. You're chipping with that guy.

You're chipped with that guy. They're double-teaminging everybody, those other three guys. All right? So it's like, that's bad business. And Aiden Hutchinson was the real deal. Tampa Bay's been able to win with some injuries throughout early in the year, and we're calling him the last playboys, and we thought there was a chance maybe Tampa Bay does some Baker-Mafield magic

towards the end of this potential game, because that's how they've been. Do you think they just ran into a really good team? So, like, getting by, maybe not possible? Like, Lions, how do you view them after last night? This is a team that, you know, we'll talk to Stragg's in a third hour. He was out there in Seattle last night. He was doing a hard time out there. Sure.

He was traveling over. I don't think so. I think he has zero hours asleep. Coming in the season, he was like, I think the Detroit Lions, two new coordinators, you know, a lot of new things. I think they're going to miss the playoffs, is what he said. That was like his aggressive take, super-duper take. I think he was even saying it was a little bit.

extra in that entire thing. But can you talk about what they've been able to do with two new coordinators that maybe should get talked about more or what is a heightened responsibility that everybody has now with two new coordinators? What are your thoughts on Dan Campbell being able to get this ship still go? He obviously got the right guys. You know, they're not missing a beat on the offense. I thought Jared had a little tough game.

Buck's defense kept a minute for a while. But Kelvin, Kelvin does a great job with that defense. Shepard, Shep. Shep. losing all your DBs, but still didn't play man, but it wasn't just traditional man. They were double, double single. And with that pass rush for a quarterback to figure out who the hell is the single,

that's hard. That's hard. And then when you lose your checkdowns because they're chipping and barely ever getting out, it's a bad recipe. Then the money down, too. We always talk about the money down, red area. Bucks were four for 16 on third down. So that's not a recipe to win a game regardless of who you're playing,

but especially a talented team like this. you mentioned it. Defense definitely kept them in it. Dean got a pick right before the half to kind of set up that field goal. So it was only what, an eight-point game, I think, going into the half where it felt like it could have been a 28-point game. But yeah, the Lions shut that door in the second half. Hembo stat here about

the Tampa Bay Buccaneers' offense. Baker dropped back to pass on 83% of his plays yesterday, which is highest in the game of his buck's career. Tampa's currently 0-10 whenever he drops back at 70% or higher. So Kelvin Shepard literally did exactly what I assume his game plan was in its entirety got to be able to run the rock down there.

This Detroit Lions team, though, special. What's the offense coordinator's name, Foxy? Johnny Morton. Okay, so Johnny Moe and Shepdog got the team rolling up there. And MCDC's neck looks like it's bigger and stronger than it's ever been. I think you were even a little bit worried at the beginning of the season on what was going to happen. Now you guys are all the way back to full confidence in this Detroit Lions team. 100%.

After week one, I thought it was a disaster. I thought everything everyone was saying was correct. New OC was going to stink. New DC was going to stink. And we weren't going to be able to recover. All of that is put to bed now. We're 5 and 2. We're going to the buy week.

We're going to get healthier. This team looks awesome. We can win the Super Bowl. I'm fired up for it. I'm happy for you, Detroit, folks. Thank you. And the refs kind of helped us out last night, and I appreciate them. Thanks for bringing it up.

I'm happy you brought it up. Squeaky wheel gets the oil. Didn't we hear a lot of Detroit people saying, oh, whoa, is Detroit. Obviously, in Kansas City, they're going to get calls over. Lowly Detroit. Nobody wants Detroit to win. What did he say after a second? look? Is that what he said? Hussie, veteran ref. We are all fans of Hussie. Now,

there was obviously some situations in both games last night that we are not fans of and cannot be happening. But Hussie's been around a long time. Hussie, good on the mic too. This guy very comfortable, very confident. So whenever he goes over to MCDC and MCDC says we'd like to challenge the completion of the catch, you hear Hussie make that announcement. Okay, so Hussey says, Detroit is challenging the completion of the catch. And it's like, well, he didn't make a mistake. That's not like a new rep saying that. That is certainly, because there's options now. Do you want to challenge a spot? Do you want

to challenge if it was a catch? What do you want? MCDC says that clearly to Hussie. So Hussie goes and looks. He comes back. It was a catch. Yeah, everybody saw his catch. That was never really in question. Goes on to the field, and then he says this after getting on the field. After a second look,

it is determined that the receiver was actually short of the line to game. Okay. Hell of here. Okay. Yeah. You hear Foxy and his family going crazy there. But this is now multiple weeks where, like, New York has gotten involved and did things. Now, B.A., I think we got to the bottom of what actually happened here.

So MCDC challenges the completion of a catch. Hussie goes, takes a look. He has the ears to New York. They're going through it all. They say it is a completion of a catch. He goes back out there. Bang. Then he's called back over to the thing.

And that's, is that replay assist you think at that moment taking over? How do you, what do you think what happened? When you challenge the play, the entire play goes under review. All right, so not just was it a catch, the spot does come in because you're entire, now you can't throw a flag onto the field if there was a penalty, but you can pick one up. But this, this to me, was egregious because it was like a first down. Oh, wait a minute. Wait a minute.

I went back and took a look. When you look at, for me on television, that was way too close to overturn. I mean, it was like, you couldn't overturn this. No one ever wins the spot. challenge when you, hey, I'm challenged in a spot. Don't you lose. Yeah, especially if it's like inches. Yeah.

Now, the only thing they seemingly did have, which I appreciate, is a camera right down the line. Was that the pile on you think that was on the sideline there, or is that a camera that just sitting there? How did they get it right down the line seemingly? If we could have this for every game, let's certainly do that. But to your point, B.A., it's like his fingernails are there or what is not there? Now, granted, I would like to let it be known as a person that picked the

Lions in my bed. As I was watching that, and I heard him say, I didn't complete the catch. I'm like, no, thank you. I don't think he made it. This is the first time we got a camera right down the damn line there. So things seemingly going to Detroit Lions way, even got New York looking after him. I'm just happy they're getting it right. Way to go, Fox. Oh, that's all you care about. Hey, the rest are getting right. That's all you can. Five, six, seven, eight looks, if you need to, just get it right. Okay. So after a second look, if that was for the Chiefs, let's say, I wonder what the storylines would be this morning if there was a second look. So let's just make sure we document that they did it for the Detroit Lions,

the team that I think we all can agree on, that the NFL has not wanted to win the most over the last 40 years. Correct. Okay? Them and the brands. Yes. There's a reason we say Detroit versus everybody, and it's usually because everyone's against us.

Okay, we'll also toss Raiders in there. Yeah, NFL's always hit your Raiders. Allegedly. Yeah, allegedly. All these things are alleged. It is a bit of common theme amongst those teams. They stink. Is that what you're saying?

I don't want to be the one to say it, but yeah, thank you for saying it. The teams that stink always think the NFL is out to get them. I understand. And now, welcome to a new world, Detroit. You're now the Chiefs. You're getting calls. Wow, Detroit must be nice. It's a lot better on this side, boys.

It feels pretty good. Now, on that, no, we would not like to hear from your fans ever again about any other team, maybe getting special treatment because they dropped that. We took a second look on us on a primetime game. Now, let's go to the second game of the night. Okay, there was another ref situation that happened. we'll certainly get to in a moment about a player ref going over there and protecting the money,

protecting the guy that is maybe on top of everything. This Seattle Seahawks team, good. This Houston Texans team, bad, game. A lot of flags, tough to stay up for. D. Butt, you watched the game. I tried this morning when I woke up. I tried. Sure.

Even last night? I tried my absolute best to watch the... Yeah, last night. Even last night. I'm old. Put me to bed. Okay, I go to sleep. This morning, I wake up early.

Okay, I wake up early. Catch up on all the stuff from the night before. You know that old Skip Bayless commercial that they had for Fox Sports One where he woke up early. He was on his bike and he had all his TV. Yes. Catching up to everything. Okay, I'm not at that stage yet, but you're close. I am about to get there.

You know, I'm living these things that are happening the night before the next morning. It's going crazy. I couldn't make it through this one. I just couldn't do it. The enhanced stats on this, 22 accepted penalties. Okay, five turnovers, four for 29 on third down. and it ended at 1.30 a.m., obviously there was some situational awareness that took, but there was just a lot of things that happened in that game, tough to watch.

So I'd like to let the Seattle Seahawks fans know that my East Coast Bies did do me in in a game that you guys dominated and made another team look very bad. And it maybe even made the whole ref operation be bad. I didn't watch it in its entirety. Just no massive respect for what you guys got going on. Obviously, watch through the highlights, watch a 30-minute recap of it all. It didn't get to see every single snap. Seahawks team very good.

McDonald, very good. And this wide receiver, Jackson Smith and Jigba, what did he have at the Rose Bowl? 15 catches for 347 yards. We should have known then, I guess, what we're knowing now. This is a once-in-a-lifetime-type operation

happening with Jackson Smith and Jigba and Donald right now. Yeah, in Ohio State, you know, they've kind of been known as one of the wide receiver used, then probably the LSU, and everybody in that Ohio State kind of family has always said, hey, this guy has been the one. He's the one that's kind of the cream of the crop. And he's been unbelievable.

He's been the best receiver in football this season. His connection with Sam Darno, every question about with Sam Darno, kind of a one-hit wonder in Minnesota. Would it work in Seattle? Moving on from Gino, and he's been tremendous in this Clint Kubiak offense. Came into this game leading the league

and play action passes. And there's some numbers. I don't know if we have it, the numbers with him throwing specifically to JSCN that are unbelievable. But he broke the game open. They jumped out to a four. 14-0 lead against the Houston Texans.

Here we go right here. Sam Donald throwing two Jackson Smith in Jigba this season. 14 explosive. That's first. 36 first downs, 819 yards. 41.3 EPA, we all know what that means. But yeah, leading the league and all those numbers, we can turn on the tape. I don't care what you know or don't know about football.

You know 11 is special. He's been special. And that offense, just Sam Donald, how he's operating that offense in general. I only expect him to continue to get better. We'll see how to use those backs. The Houston defense. The Houston defense is unbelievable. And they scored a touchdown.

Will Anderson had a strip sack that ended up being a touchdown. That Houston defense, unbelievable, Stingley Jr. had a pick late. But the offense, and I got to ask BA here, I don't know what the hell is going on with the offense. We all saw C.J. Stroud and kind of Bobby Sloick take the NFL by storm. But since then, it's just been a shit show. And I was battling.

I was battling to stay up. But I'm going to say early in that fourth quarter. Yep, I said, okay, I know this was going to end. and I shut it down just like the Seattle defense has. And C.J. Stride has struggled against Mike McDonnell every time he's facing, I believe, O and 3 now against this defense. But they're tremendous on the front end and then the back end as well.

But, B.A., what are you seeing from this Houston office? Yeah, I mean, ever since the rookie year when he was fantastic, and then they changed coordinators. They get rid of Laramette Tunso, they get rid of mixing. That's a lot. And you start not replacing those guys with top-tier players, especially your left tackle. and he's the sacks are coming the pressures are coming

that sophomore slump has turned into a junior slump and don't know what happened between Bobby Sloak and everybody they were rolling and then all of a sudden boom and they changed coordinators but it's it's hard to watch that offense right now yeah that was the main reason yeah and it's like the Seattle Seahawks defense might be a part of it obviously they're very good defense and we got massive respect for him but just CJ Stroud I think we might have been as loudest fans biggest fans

for his rookie here, although everybody was behind him, but we were very loud because once we saw him play football in college one time we're like, this is the one, this is one, and we were very loud about that. So we felt like classic journalists, we felt obligated to make sure everybody knew that what we thought was right. So we started going big, big, big, big,

on that. Then he has that rookie campaign that he had, and it's like this guy is actually the one. We're the smartest people on earth. We should be consulting people on who's the right people to take and who's the right person to lead your team. And then all of a sudden last year happens, a lot of injuries, a lot of change. Then this year starts happening. It's like, wait a minute.

How do we go from this place where the Houston Texans were dominating the AFC South? And it was going to happen for the next 10 years to now here we are thinking, that was tough to watch as a football team. And I don't know how we got here. Legit. We like to Miko as a coach, right? Yeah, yeah. We like to Serio as the GM, right? You talk about some of the moves that have been made. It's like maybe he thought higher of some people that he had on the team than they actually had. or maybe it's just not working out. I don't know.

This Houston Texans team is nowhere near what we thought they were going to be. J.J. Watt thought he was going to be able to come on the show every week and talk shit about the Houston Texans for the next 10 years. Certainly. That is exactly what he thought. Nico gets hurt last night. He's obviously an incredible talent. But I don't know what happened to Houston, Texas.

This is kind of befuddling, I think, is the proper word to kind of use it. But maybe the Seattle Seahawks in prime time were just that damn good. We also got to hold that into consideration. And like the offensive line thing, like so many people on the Internet are blaming in Casario. Like, this guy needs help on the outside. This guy needs a better O line. Like, Tunsell is one of those trades. You might not know for a couple years whether or not that's great, but it's not as if Washington's undefeated and they're playing really well. And then when you think about the guys he did get on the outside, he drafted two wide receivers,

both who were definitely up there when, you know, considering what people thought they were going to be, the two Iowa State guys. And then Christian Kirk and Christian Kirk got released. Casario made a call, said, no, no, no, we're going to give you a pick for Christian Kirk. that's how they got him. So it's not as if Casario is to blame. It's more so just like the first, maybe not first case study, but we talk about like how good Josh Allen got, you know, going over through the years. Like he is the guy that everyone emulates as in like, hey, if your rookie quarterback isn't great, he could still be great. Look at Josh Allen. And CJ Stroud, at least for me, is the first like, hey, if your quarterback, his rookie year is good. Don't,

you know, hang your hat on him because he might slowly but surely look worse. And we're talking about the old line but then we're running clips and he's got a clean pocket and he's throwing balls that aren't typically C.J. Stroud balls like with the one down the sideline when it was 2713 or 2712 with like six minutes left right there. That's a clean pocket and he throws a pretty good ball and then the defense is just a great play and then you look at the touchdown or the attempt on the goal line too and he throws a pass that in years past even maybe his rookie year he makes that throw and it gets deflected. It's just he's just not playing as well. and maybe there is a real regression that happened with him.

But I don't know shit about that because, like, in an NFL building, I'm not sure what quarterbacks do when they're great rookies and then continue to get better. Yeah, Jaden Daniels, I guess, would be the next person that we're going to continue to monitor. It feels like him and Cliff Kingsbury still got it. But once again, that's the same OC. They get rid of Bobby Sloick after having all the success.

Now, are they going to be able to find that magic back for CJ Stroud? We all hope so, obviously. And, you know, because it's the Indianapolis Colts Division now. But we like the Houston Texans to not be ass because we love that city and obviously what they have going on. on. There was a situation in that game before we wrap this up and pivot to the NBA. Nate Jones,

I believe is his name, the official from last night that potentially saved Jackson Smith and Jigba and the Seattle Seahawks from getting into it all-out brawl with the Miko Ryans who's Houston Texans on the sideline while they're sitting on a bench. He comes flying and whoa, whoa, whoa, boys, I got stripes on. Can't hit me? Can't hit me?

Everybody relax. It always going to be hitting me. Now, this is like whenever you're exiting in an airplane, you know, do you go, front towards or do you go back towards? Sure. The decision. You know, and he made the decision here.

He's going front towards, okay? He's getting in there, you know, maybe make sure he can protect it. I think if he would have turned that thing and did this one too, I think we have the same outcome, but I appreciate him going right into like kind of a nurturing situation. This guy's got no helmet. He's on the other team's sideline. Holy shit, this could escalate very quickly. He's an ex-player. Shout to him. Ex-player is a ref.

We appreciate the hell out of him getting in there and saving a good situation. That's good refing. Yeah. We got a spot like that because there is some ass reffing happening out there. And him former player, being a ref, made us revisit this thought. The NFL needs to just create an academy of some sort for ex-players to be able to become officials. So in the NFL, they have, in the NFLPA, they have something called the broadcast boot camp,

okay, where guys that are in the NFL are allowed to apply, and then they go to this broadcast boot camp, and then there's network executives from every single different network, and you basically get to learn what a potential job could be. You also get to showcase if you could be good in front of them. Now, I got turned down to that thing three times. I think I'm the only person on TV out of the NFL that did not go through the broadcast boot camp. Never was allowed in. Thank you so much.

I appreciate you. Thank God I didn't get invited. Now, on that note, it has helped out a lot of ex-players. It has given a lot of ex-players, a lot of incredible opportunities. We need to do something similar for officiating. And I think the NFL could do, you know, big baby face play here if they get ex-NFL players to find, like, a purpose now, and they're probably going to be good. But also, we can get a full-time ref set up. And I'm not saying all refs have to be players,

but I think we should try to get a little funnel of people that understand the game, that aren't soft, that aren't going to miss context of plays and stuff. And I think we can kind of set precedent for other leagues to do this with their players as well. You know, it just feels like it's an easy thing to do, but what do I know? You know, I don't know. You could probably get these guys to move to a place, go to the academy, do year-round training, have them go to spring practice, have them go to training camp, have them do all that shit.

And then obviously, once they get to the level in what you're comfortable with them, you put them in. Have them do some college games. Have them do some preseason games. Have them do practices. Do this entire thing. I think you can set up like a feeding ground almost for ex-players to give back to the game and hopefully make our game better. But what the fuck do I know? Honestly,

B.A. I assume you've been talking about the rest for a long time. We brought this idea up a long time ago and it comes back to the union. They've got to join the union to ever get on the field. The refs union? The refs union. And the refs union run the whole thing. And hopefully that contract comes up soon and we can break it.

And hopefully we can get this in place so that we can place them with quality people rather than the scabs. Also, May 2026, I guess, is the NFL Ref Union deal is up. So if you have any ideas, we'll certainly do that. We appreciate all the refs of the past that have certainly laid the groundwork to get us to where we are. Refs are a very important part of the game.

Need to be full-time. And also, we need better access for players to get in there and get back to you. Tough job. Tough job. So if a guy wants to do it, we should allow him to potentially want to. Not a lot of people want to be coaches. A lot of time, brother. Not a lot of a lot of people in the earth want to be refs, but if people want to, there should be an easier way to kind of get them in there. And maybe we got another. Yeah, exactly. Nate Jones of the future

that saves a situation happening after the game. Now, let's talk about the NBA. Huge day for the NBA. Congratulations to them. Yeah. Tonight on NBC at 730, you got Houston at Oklahoma City. And then at 10 o'clock, you got the Warriors at the Lakers. Now, the Lakers are without LeBron for a little bit because he's got a sciatica. Joining us now, co-host of the Mind the Game podcast and also senior advisor, I believe, for the Phoenix Sun, NBA Hall of Famer, multiple-time MVP, 18-year vet, ladies a gentleman, Canadian, Steve Nash. What's up, everybody? Hey, sorry you had to catch a tail end to me saying that we need full-time refs over here.

Do you have any answers for the NFL? We need to figure it out. Well, I thought the front toward or back toward was an important topic this morning. Like, that's a tricky area of debate here. Like, I'm not, you know, I don't know, like what I. would choose. It's tough. So have you ever on a sideline, maybe on a bench, because things are tight there, you know, on your guys's NBA benches, they're tight? Have you ever had to do the oops, excusey, excusey, you ever have to do that? Did you do butt down? Did you do face down?

What was your move, Steve? I don't know what's Canadian. I tried to go neutral, you know, neutral right between, not front or back. Just how can I, you know, weave my way through here? Definitely, yeah. Front back, it's kind of awkward. Get thin, get thin, get thin. I understand what you're saying. Congrats on another season starting. You're also doing coverage for Amazon, I believe. Yeah, thank you. Yeah, what does that entail? What does that mean? And what has been happening to lead up to this moment to launch off with Amazon?

Yep, so Amazon Prime's NBA coverage starts Friday night. We have the Celtics and the Knicks, Lakers T-Wolves. We'll be in studio from L.A., the great Taylor Rooks, my buddy, Dirk Nowitzki, Blake Griffin, Edanus Haslam, and myself will be in studio for those two games, pre-game, halftime, post-game. great crew super fun to work with we've had rehearsals we've had seminars we've done a little bit of prep

and everyone's just excited for me it's fun because we get to hang you know like just watching games together talking about the game being together great chemistry I think we can really develop a fun show and I'm excited to kind of get into your world a little bit Pat yeah well you've been in our world and we know that if you were to get into

anything that we do you will dominate it we watch you do a lot of things in here oh yeah and you were great at all of them including house and wine I mean, that was an incredible feat as well. But speaking of our world, the media world, you know, for us, it feels like we're back in the locker room here. Like, I think if you were to ask Debutt or AJ or any of the guys that come through this show, Coach McCarthy, BA, even a little bit, we have like a sense of community.

We all love ball. When they say retired players, you know, kind of transition in real life, they miss that feeling. We have that. I'm excited for you to have that. But do you also appreciate the fact that the NBA right now has so many of the ex-goats? I mean, yourself included now being a part of it, being a part of the coverage. That's good for the game, ultimately. Do you agree with that?

I think it's great. You know, I think people are going to be a little uncomfortable to start because now all of a sudden we have, you know, we have two new rights holders in Amazon and NBC. We've got obviously ABC and ESPN. So there's going to be way more games than ever on national TV, which I think is positive. We're going to have way more talent, former players.

I think it's going to be a really interesting landscape. But it's going to take a minute for people to kind of change their habits and know what nights are we on prime, nights are we on ESPN? What nights are we on NBC? But overall, it's going to be a big win when when everyone kind of figures it out and realizes we got a lot of great ex-players talking about the game, sharing their experiences, and highlighting what a great league it is right now. A lot of games, we had a full conversation with Adam Silver that we'll be airing in about an hour and a half or so earlier this morning. And just talking about negotiating and kind of transitioning into this

new media rights deal with streaming and social and obviously still having linear games. I think it's great for the NBA. Also great for the NBA. I think the style of play. What have you seen? By the style of play, I mean, last year that's going to carry into this year, that maybe is different than five years ago or 10 years ago, if you had to get, if you had to describe it. Yeah, for sure. You know, I think we have this kind of debate, I think. You know, start of last year, ratings were down.

People were complaining about too many threes. You know, by the end of the year, the ratings have never been higher. The playoffs were exceptional. You know, we had to, as everyone complained, no offense to your home team, but there was two, you know, smaller market teams. It was unbelievable basketball, unbelievable. series. The whole entire playoffs just had an incredible viewership. I think the game's in an incredible place.

I think you do see some teams, some of the poorer teams, perhaps. They take a lot of trees. They take a lot of poor threes where they don't touch the paint. They don't create good looks because the variance of shooting threes. Oh, no. Poor. That's what he's talking about. The way they play the game, the way they defend together, the way they move the ball, touch the paint, get threes.

You know, I think that's what makes this game so beautiful. because it's kind of become, instead of like being super predictable, dribble down, throw it in the post, run a set. Now it's kind of more jazz. We're reading and reacting. We're trying to create, knock the first domino down, swing the ball. Someone attacks the clothes out. So now we're playing basketball together and out of read and react rather than it's just going into the post of this guy. And, you know, nine guys are standing and looking at them.

So I think the game's in a great pace, great place with the pace, the space. The good teams are defending together on a street. because you have to defend more space now, right? Guys are shooting from farther out. We're playing quicker in transition. So you've got to get back. You've got to cover guys in a lot more space. Makes rotations longer.

Teams are making decisions. Should they get in the gaps, take away the paint? Then that opens up the backline rotation. So I love the evolution of the game. I love where it's going. I think it's a lot of fun to see how coaches and teams and players continually adapt to try to get an advantage. Yeah, I love listening to you talk about basketball, brother.

I think you know it a little bit. Yeah, you should maybe stick to it. I think that's some bad soccer player though too right good soccer player well love me some soccer growing up my dad my mom and dad are from the UK grew up playing soccer uh still still watch a ton of soccer still play once a week I know you got some soccer skills pat yeah you turn us down for TST remember he's supposed to be on yeah yeah you're supposed to you're supposed to you're supposed to be on concave kids pat five kids I can't just fly across the country uh you know for a little soccer attorney not just good at soccer and basketball five kids

Oh, wow, well, delivery man. Okay, Dee Butt has a question for you. Hey, Steve, the NBA landscape has kind of changed now. Not as many super teams, as we would call it. A couple with a couple of stars, like the Lakers, the Mavs. But what was it like for you? I know as a player you had to do it, especially those Suns Day with Stat and the Matrix,

those superstars, but like you were head coach of the Brooklyn Nets when they had James Hart and Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving. What's the toughest challenge when it comes to managing like multiple, I guess, on the same squad? Well, clearly, you know, when players are, they build, you know, there's ego is good and bad, right? And you need an ego to get to the top, but you need to all have it in balance.

When you have three guys that have made it to the top, that it demand a lot of it from themselves. Yeah, at times it can be difficult. You expect that, though. But I think our biggest problem in Brooklyn and is why the game is changing a little bit is that we were always injured. You know, all of our three stars, they played 16 games together in over two years. So I think because of situations like that, we're seeing the league go away from three stars and go to more depth. Like getting guys 6, 7, 8, 9 who can make 3s, defend their position or multiple positions, can make a play when they get a close out, they can drive the ball and make the next pass.

So for me, I think the three star thing, if you don't grow it at home through the draft and build your team that way, I think teams are a lot more reluctant to try to go pick off three free agent superstars because you need depth. And if one gets injured, you know, everyone else in your roster is such a, you know, I don't want to be mean, but is a way down in quality. So now you've got guys stepping up having to play roles. Maybe they're not necessarily able to do. So it can put a lot of strain on the team. So I think we're seeing a lot of teams. You saw it in the playoffs.

You saw how deep the Pacers went. Shout out to Rick Carlisle, Lloyd Pierce. I think they gave guys an opportunity to develop and play that maybe a lot of coaches wouldn't have given that. much rope to. And in the end of the day, those guys took them to game seven and they had a chance to win, especially if Tyrese didn't get hurt. So growing your depth, developing players, getting a deeper bench has become really much more important nowadays than trying to pick off three stars. So it's a team sport? That's crazy. I didn't know that. I didn't know basketball was a team sport. We may have forgot for a moment, but it's back to being a team sport. Okay, okay. I'm

happy we all did forget that for a moment because it felt like that whenever it was being talked about and maybe even watching it. But to your point, we went deep on the roster and the New York Knicks just refused to do so long. So back to back years, we just kind of ran them out of the entire play. That's basically what we did. I mean, we ran these guys out of the gym. Got Tibbs fired. Didn't play his bench. Now

Tibbs, great work over there. That's a tough place to coach. Yeah, helping out Boston now. Yeah, especially, exactly. So tough stuff over there. Eastern Conference finals, right? Yeah. New York Knicks. And they fire him? Yeah, but.

Go win the big one. Yeah, Big Bad Tyrese Halliburton's howling out there. He's doing some gardening in Madison Square Garden, brother. That makes sense. Yeah, and also, it does make sense, especially for just sports in general. Like, okay, this guy's good, but not great. So let's get out of here because we might be asked,

but it's better than where we are now in the Eastern Conference Finals. You talked about Tyrese getting hurt in game seven. Let's just make sure we understand whenever we're on a microphone talking about stuff. We talk about facts. If Tyrese wouldn't have got hurt, he had 45 points that night. It's going to be a triple double, and the Pacers were going to win the title. And Tyrese goes down as one of the greatest players in the history.

of basketball because of the playoff run. Just so you know, Steve, we saw what was going to happen, okay? Just as you know. On that note, about talking about games and players. Go ahead, Conman. Yeah, Steve loved how you said basketballs like jazz. My goat, Michael Scott views the game the same way.

When you're commentating for these games, you know, during the pre-show, the one, you know, we all know is the TNT show. And I mean, we see Shaq and Chuck do not hold back. They will bury anybody in anybody to their face and also we'll admit when they're wrong. Have you thought about that, how you're going to approach talking about these superstars, most of whom, you know, you've worked

with and you have been one in the NBA when you were playing? How do you kind of approach that aspect of it when Kevin Durant or James Hardin or Kyrie Irving, who, you know, they gave great answers about the Brooklyn Nets debacle on starting five. But have you really thought about how you're going to talk about those types of players when things aren't going too well for them? I'm going to kill him Honestly, you know You brought up Chuck and Shaq And I mean, I think the biggest thing

You guys would know this You've got to be yourself, I think, on TV And the audience is only going to want to hear from you If they feel like you're authentic. So we're going to all have to find our voice, find that chemistry. You know, that show has been gold. It's been entertainment. You know, for us, you know,

We're going to probably take a slightly different direction just because of the personalities. You know, I think, you know, maybe part of us would be more analytical, you know, breaking down the game a little more. But, like, UD., you don't know, has him. He is a straight shooter. You know, he's going to give it to you exactly how he sees it.

You know, B.G., obviously, Blake Griffin, a super smart player, but also super funny. So, you know, Dirk barely speaks English. So I will figure it out, you know, we'll figure it out as we go. Good to talk, just the whole time. That'll be incredible. Can you speak German? I know a couple cuss words.

That's about it. So I'm gross beer bita okay we know that one one big one big beer please let's see donka of course that means thank you dark pants that's anytime you get a non-english who versus this man was born in Germany. What is this? Vossis Doss. Close enough. My dad speaks German yeah I think that's yeah. Nailed it. Yeah what's no I think yeah nine ah oh nine is No, I think as we're getting through. Sorry, Steve, do this on your show. They're going to love that. Now, we are very pumped for you to be on television because I think you're going to be

fair, but also the way you talk about the game is different than just like branding and shit like that. You actually talk about some substance, which leads to this. Go ahead, Ty. Yeah, Steve, as a guy who is from Canada and then, you know, played in the United States in college and then obviously in the NBA, when you look at guys like Wemby and I guess SGA to some degree too, and like much, you know, similar to you, he played in Kentucky, so he kind of gets it. But are you surprised that we're having as many of these international guys come in and kind of just take over the league right away? It doesn't seem like, I mean, I feel like when I was watching a long time ago, like there was a period of time there where it was kind

of you and Dirk carrying that international torch. Yeah, Yao. Yeah, yeah, exactly. But I mean, he was, you know, not sustained like Steve and Dirk. And it seems like several of these guys are, you know, I mean, what do we have five international players in the top 10 of the NBA right now? Like, does that surprise you how good these guys are and how quickly they're this good in their careers? Give you your, to further your point, I think it's the last seven MVPs have been international players. So it's a global game. I think that's the bottom line. As the game's grown around the world, the league's become more popular.

The league inspires the next generation. And then we also got to take our hat off to places around the world that develop talent. You know, like the European countries do an incredible job teaching guys the game of basketball. You know, I think we do more of a volume job. We've got a lot of people playing. Obviously, there's some great coaches, but AAU basketball, take it or leave it, some of it. You know, it's not all great. Whereas they have a club system in Europe that really hones in on fundamentals. It's not all just roll the balls out and play. Now, I don't want to be unkind to all those great coaches there are across the country, but the system doesn't allow

for as much coaching as it does playing and marketing players. to get college scholarships or NIL deals or whatever it may be or to fund an AU program so the system is just set up different so I think that's one of the factors a lot of talent in the United States a lot of people love the game a lot of great coaches but the system I don't think is as efficient as a small club in Slovenia or Croatia or Spain that's really honing in on details teaching the game and giving guys an opportunity to really develop they're all smack in the wood huh is that what you're saying they're smacking a wood

bopping the wood. Just getting down, smacking the wood, playing D. Yeah, they're bopping that wood there. Yeah, bopping wood. You guys love bopping wood in basketball, don't you? That's kind of a part of it, especially international hoop. I'm going to stay out of that one, but that was good. I'm talking about, you know, fundamentally

signed bopping a wood. Bop in a wood. You know what I mean? You know what I'm talking about? That's what you're saying these guys are doing, bop and wood all the time. Not just some of the time. You know, there's a different level of bopping at different places. And that type of fundamentally strong bopp is better than just half-ass bopping all the time

Celtics preach you got to eat wood if you want to win game. Yeah, Missoula's all about not just bopping but we're eating as well. We're getting out there. It's a... It's about the wood, bro. You know that, Steve. Basketball. All about the wood. I learn something new every day. You're the expert. You get on TV. We shouldn't be teaching

you that this is a wood thing. I'm not. I stay out of that that wood zone. It's good play. Yeah, because you don't play anymore. Yeah, you used to bop the wood. You used to be, you used to be all over that wood dancing on the wood. You know what I mean? Oh, yeah. He'd be dancing on wood.

Tap dancing on the wood. Yeah, he looks so smooth. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you remember every once in a while we get a cool little Steve Nash kick of balls on wood. Yeah, oh, yeah. Now we got balls on wood. You know what I mean? That is, that's what we're here for.

All right, Steve, Coach B.A., our coach has a question for you. Yeah, Steve, I'm being a big son's fan myself, being out in the desert for five years. What's it looked like for our sons this year? Good question. Well, it's great. question coach um you know the i think the first thing we want we would say is it's a cultural reset you know they swung for the fences the last few years uh didn't really you know get far in the playoffs decided to kind of reset the organization so they have a rookie coach uh they have a rookie

gym and trying to really just create an environment where players feel like they can get better they can develop an identity uh and also just you know without assets you know the sons don't their own draft pick for years right now. You've got to develop some players in-house and you're going to develop a style of play and try to be better than the sum of your part. So it's been really exciting to see Jordan Ott, our first year coach here.

He's created an environment where all the players are working hard. They're competing. They're combative. But they feel like they have an opportunity in a path to get better. So that's all you can do at this stage or arc of development. And I think for the Sons right now, they're controlling the controllables. and I think win-lose-or-draud is going to be a team you're going to be proud of watching

and they're going to surprise you a little bit because they're going to be super competitive they're going to share the ball they're going to play hard and I think the Valley will really enjoy watching them play. I love that city over there. I love that city over there. So nice.

That place is so beautiful. I mean, the arena is so beautiful. I mean, everything about that place is awesome. I hope both the football team and basketball team get very good before my wife and I and family move out there. That is what we are hoping for. Before we let you go, and we appreciate you stopping by,

I'm going to put you on a spot here. Okay, I'm put you on a spot. TV, wow. We're doing it. Rushmore on X dropped this morning, our fourth episode, and this week was Dunkers and Shaquille O'Neill, Reggie Miller, Ari Emanuel, and Ben Persky put together their Rushmore of Dunkers. Each person individually put together their top four dunkers of all time to start the conversation,

then they have to come together to get a final four. Here's Reggie Miller's Rushmore of Dunkers. First thoughts, as you look at this. omissions that you would put in there? And how do you feel about the four that Reggie brought into the convoy? I actually really like that.

I would have had Vince MJ and Dominique in there. Zach, though, super worthy. I mean, crazy speed off the floor. Incredible dunker. I like Reggie's Rushmore. What do you think? I don't know. I'm not the person that should be given

any. LeBron? Okay, I'm going to say LeBron, obviously, can have some of the biggest ones. He's very strong. Sean, Cam. Camp. I think Kenyon Martin's name was mentioned. Power Dunker. I mean, Shaq. Shack himself. Shaquille O'Neal is on the show, and I'm not sure how that whole

conversation went with him, especially Reggie going, you broke how many backboards? Don't care. Yeah, you don't make my list. We got the human highlight real here, brother. If you want, so who would have been your fourth? You don't have to give a fourth, actually. You're not on the show. Don't feel obligating. Yeah, that's a good question.

I didn't do my prep work on the Rushmore at Dunkers this morning. But I mean, Zach's great. LeBron's a great call. LeBron, like, in transition was, you know, just a train. Like, there was no getting that back in the bottle. You're just getting dunked on. So that's amazing. It kind of dunking's different, right?

Like, it's a mix of things. Like, Shaq can dunk on the whole team, but he's also bigger than the whole team. So sometimes it's, like, less impressive, even though he just did something that no one else can do. Whereas, like, Zach Levine was six four. Bango. Yes, Bud Webb. So I think it's like, you know, Nate Robinson. Like, it depends.

They're talking to in-game dunkers. You're talking guys that, like, surprise you. You're talking to, you know, maybe we value bigs like Shaq, who are unbelievable, just getting offensive rebounds and punching on someone. So I also give a little shout in-game dunker to my guy Amari. Amari Stott Amar, my pick-and-roll partner. He definitely caught some bodies when we played together. Incredible hands, incredible feet, who take off.

And, I mean, what a pick-and-roll partner for me. transition. He just throw it anywhere. He's going to go get it and put it down. You guys were fun to watch out there. I remember those. The highlights were obviously epic. I don't know if I was watching the games live. Go ahead, B.A. Where's Dr. Jay? Okay, so... The king of the dust. The man of Beneddon.

I mean, if anything, Steve's partner in crime, you know, is going forward. Boston Celtics legend, Blake Griffin would be one that should be on there. Yeah, because, like, he jumped over Akia. He did. With a fire behind. Yeah, we watched him over Akia when he was doing. That's why

the show is wild because everybody's making an argument for who they think and they start telling stories it's like a great history lesson of dunking this entire episode available now on X and Steve I thought you did an incredible job with buying the game podcast and going to

continue to do that I think you're going to do incredible with Amazon man we're pumped you're in the sports media world we're thankful for that thank you I really appreciate it Pat that's nice you to say good to see you guys hey by the way just seeing the studio I feel good I have my best shooting performance and over a decade in there.

Boom. I'm kind of sad. You didn't, you didn't roll the tape, though. Well, I don't think we had on film. We only had pictures. We only had pictures of this. Steve. It's a studio, Pat. Like, the camera is all of it.

What are you doing? You're right. You're 100% right. You, even from the warm-ups, from the warm-ups, just, ah. Three bottles of wine. Yes, yeah, probably two and a half, three bottles of wine. Yep. Do this with, ah, I don't know.

I haven't shot. Splash from like three feet. Okay, let's back up six feet. I don't know. Splash. Okay, eight feet, boom. One more. Yeah, I'm pretty good, I think.

Go to the corner. Splash, splash, splash, splash, splash, splash, splash, splash, splash, splash, splash, splash, splash, splash. Splash, splash, splash, splash. It's going to play defense. Okay. Now we play defense underneath. No miss? No miss.

Didn't hit the rim. Splash, splash, splash, flash, flash, flash, flash, blast, blast, blast, dude. Great sidelines in the dome. What's that? Great sight lines in the dome. You felt good in there, huh? Felt short.

Oh, good. The hoop looked. It's very big to you. I mean, it was unbelievable. You and Tyrese both. Tyrese, I guess, sightlines is all that matters. You guys are pretty good at what you do. Two-time MVP.

Yeah, all right. 18-year NBA event. I remember when I learned that on camera. You're the best. Ladies and gentlemen, Steve Nash. Yeah. Unbelievable. So cool.

That was pretty boozed up. Yeah. We have his warm-up on film? At least, yeah, I need to watch that. Dude, he's three feet away. Boom. Just, swish. This the whole time.

Oh. A whole time. Typical OG shit. Swish. He still has yet to touch that rim. He has still yet to touch that rim in his entire time and being here. He was here for five hours. That was here for five hours.

It was outrageous whenever I say that. And just how cool he was. We're thankfully came on. I learned he was an 18-year NBA vet when I was sitting down with him for something for DeZone up in Canada. DeZone was launching something in Canada. And they asked me and Marshaun Lynch and Steve Nash to go up there and do some stuff. So I was about to interview Steve Nash. So I, like, did some research quickly on my phone about Stephen.

I knew of Steve Nash. Obviously, I didn't know all the intel. And I'm sitting right next to him. I go, 18 years in the NBA. And he goes, yeah. Holy fuck. And I just keep scrolling. Nothing else.

And it's all caught on camera. And Steve just sits there, looks at me for, like, two seconds. And he just looks back ahead and drinks his water as I'm continuing to scroll. He could have hated us immediately. And instead he went the opposite way. We're very thankful. He loves the game. Oh, yeah.

He loves to get, there it is. Yeah. Holy shit, that's the exact. This guy has no idea. No idea, yeah, I had no idea. And then I learned quickly. And then what we've learned since then is a guy loves ball. I like what sports are doing right now.

A lot of coaches, a lot of players. Not saying there isn't a spot for the people that go through a journalism machinery class and everything like that. I'm saying that's very important for sports. I'm never going to take that away from sports. It is vital to have people who did not play the sport, talk about the sport, not only for the good of the sport, the growth of the sport, but to keep the sport in check, too, I think, from people that are kind of outside.

More objective. Yeah, I think it's a good thing. I think it's a good thing and a bad thing. But more players and coaches talking about sports, I think it's great for the fans. And the NBA is, I mean, they got everybody rolling in over there. That's good for the league, I think, B.A. I think it's fantastic. Yeah, the same thing with the NFL.

The more real smart talking heads that know what they're talking about is better for everybody. Yeah. Same with the Major League baseball, you know, when he got A. Rod and Big Poppy and those guys on there. That's a hell of a show. Yeah. Okay, so let's talk about baseball. Last night, huge night in the baseball world. So last night, we should have been talking about,

there was a double-headed money on football. Yeah, exactly. So I don't know what we're supposed to do here. Honestly, I don't know what we're supposed to do here. Huge night in baseball last night. It was a game seven last night in baseball. Yeah, game seven. And, you know, for two teams that both, you know,

Toronto hasn't been to a world series in a really, really long time. Seattle hasn't ever been to a world series. So, I mean, you know, just all the drama was already there. boy did the game deliver. Start in the top of the fifth inning and big dumper kind of get a season of a lot of signature moments. This was definitely his most signature to this point. He hits a solo homer to take the Mariners lead to 3-1. And if you're a Blue Jays fan, you're thinking, oh boy, here we go. The season's about to go down the pooper. But then in the bottom of the

seventh with two guys on right after a pitching change, George Springer, pull. He gets a sinker right down the middle. And it was absolute bedlam in Toronto. no. The 1-0 pitch high-fly ball left field a rose arena

what is it go! That's awesome. Yeah. One more time, please. Can we get back to the beginning of that sound? You can be there.

The 1-0 pitch. Oh. No doubt. A rosarina, what does it go? Who's on the photo? It was John Smolz and then Joe Davis, I believe. What a call. What a moment.

This guy went to Yukon. Yukon has a baseball team or he started playing baseball after he went to Yukon. Disrespectful. Yukon Legend. You know Yukon baseball was just in the thing with Jig last year. That's respect. They were close to the thing with Jig. This is George Springer's thing on the postseason, right?

Yeah. So that Homer gives him 23 for his career. He is tied for third all time for the most postseason homers. So, yeah, he's a bit of a Mr. October. A lot of people will say, hey, this guy was on the Astros. He cheated. But he has since been remorseful about that. And, yeah, anytime they needed a guy to do something, he answered the bell.

And then this is the bottom of the ninth, Jeff Hoffman, Julio Rodriguez at the plate with a full count. He strikes out on a slider low and away. And the Blue Jays are going to their first World Series since 1993. Just, I mean, incredible game. Like the drama in that. And as someone who, like, Blue Jays beat the Yankees. They're in the Yankees division.

I definitely didn't want to see them win because the Mariners have never been there. You know, we talked to Cal Raleigh a couple times this year and followed him throughout the season. But, man, that is just incredible because you could, like, Toronto is, and maybe a Gump is a better question for Gump. I don't know about Canada as a whole, but, like, Toronto is so invested in the Blue Jays. Like, they will, I mean, hearing that place, you could hear a pin drop in there when they went down 3-1. It's kind of like, hey, we had the best record in the American League this year, and it's all going to be for not. Who knows if we'll ever get the opportunity to get back to this place,

and then boom, one swing of the bat, and it's like Toronto is ready to riot. Gumpie, is that Canada's team up there, the Blue Jays? Absolutely. They all love them out there. Rogers owns the Blue Jays, the Maple Leafs, the Raptors. Oh, they need it. Yeah. They certainly need it.

Yeah, lots of money. Yeah, lots of money and they need it. He also, there was a photo, I think you showed me, of Vladias with an expo jersey on, I think, whenever he was a boy? Yeah, when he was a kid, his dad played for the Expos, and it was a great picture of him with his helmet up in there as a young baseball player, and then with his helmet up in the air

as a Blue Jay champion. What a time. You're a big baseball guy, huh? I love it. I just wanted to see the best drama, the dumper was on deck. I know. Take that damn pitch and let the dumper come up. What happened? Yeah. So, yeah, the big dumper was on deck in that situation, but Julio Rodriguez was

two for four, you know, in this game. Like, he has been nails for them. But that, yeah, a lot of people are saying, man, if you could just find a way to kind of get on base, work a walk there, then you're going to bring up Big Dumper, who earlier in the game, after he hit his solo homer, they intentionally walked him with no one on base. And you're thinking in like a situation like that, like, they got a pitch to. Yeah, you kind of have to because if they put somebody on, then, you know, a single wins the game. So, like, we potentially would have got Big Dumber for all the Marvel. So, yeah, it's tough. Someone released or not someone, it was on the internet of like the pitch.

in the last app bat and none of them were strikes they were all balls and he's he just swung three times oh that whole inning the two batters before him like nobody was swinging at what they should have been swinging at oh the dumper could have had a chance to save the city he could have one person on yep that's world series kind of stuff I mean that is that's what dumper dreams of yeah but I mean that's what I dream of as baseball fan I was well I must fell asleep right before that all happen. I didn't get a chance to see the ending there, but boy, baseball, huge night in the game 7th. Would be great on Tuesday. Well, you know, we'll get that for the World Series. Would be great on a Tuesday. Would be great if that was happening tonight if we knew that was

happening. Very true. In hindsight, though, like, boy, do I feel bad for you, if you were, like, a Seattle resident and you decided to watch the Seahawks game instead of that because that game fucking sucked and this game was awesome. So, like, you know, you'll have more Seahawks games. That could have been, you know, the end of it. But just for context, The Blue Jays, their preseason win total, 79 and a half. The Dodgers, 105 and a half. So, like, the Blue Jays were not expected to be here at all. So if you really want, like, the underdog against, like, the big, bad superpower,

that's exactly what we're going to get with the World Series. And David Roberts said, let's win four more games and make everybody hate us for something like that. And Shoah, you know, in their close-out game had the greatest game in the history of baseball. So we'll see, you know, something's got to give. Is Shoah just going to do that four more straight times? Let's just put them in there four straight times. This was let Shohay have a Shohay night and just let's go ahead and win the World Series. At this point, I'm with it.

You know, hey, four games left. If you burn three years off this guy's career because you let him throw four nights in a row and give him the opportunity to hit 12 homers and 12 bats, we need to see. Sounds like there's a little bit of mockery in that answer. Not at all. I love Shoehay. Blue Jays also thought they were getting Shohay when he went to the Dodgers, too. So there is a little bit of beef.

Well, I want to let you know. Bad news for the Blue Jays, because he is everything they thought he was going to do. Without it down. And he was never going to Toronto. Ron. I hate to break it to him. He is special. Yeah. This guy is unbelievable.

They released that the $750 million contract was made back in one year for merch and ticket sales and everything for the Dodgers. But you said best performance in baseball. Is that the greatest single game in just the history of sports when it comes to 10 strikeouts, three? I think it's definitely on the Rushmore if there was to be a Rushmore. I don't know what a guy scored 100 some points in a game. No, that's not real. What? Yeah, that was a long.

In high school, a half time, a hundred and a half time. Oh, yeah, Reggie Miller's sister as well. What are you said? Will Chamberlain scored 100. You saw it? Well, it was in Hershey, Pennsylvania. That's what they said. Should ask Steve.

Were you there? No. Was anybody? There was a bunch of folks there, but yeah, Will it scored 100. Really? Are we 100% sure? I will put you as a vote for yes. Conman?

You already said no. That didn't happen. Absolutely not. Ty? I'm going to say yes. Debutt? No. And Ties, yes, also comes with the asterix that he believes we went to the move.

Correct. So we have, we did get at him. We're all kind of consistent up here with how we feel like that. Yeah, a little open-minded verse. Yeah, no, I believe it type of conversation on that note, I wish he did. I hope he did. Come on, people of Hershey would lie. But if we're talking about, they are good people up there, you know.

I think their park is far inferior to Kennywood, but that's neither a conversation we need to have. No. Is there any... Tell him, Bruce. Tell him, Bruce. I got my first kiss that hurt you, fuck, guy. Boom. That was back when it was good.

Kennywood has evolved. Kennywood is the best... A long time ago, brother. What is another one? What would be another one? Is there some game seven hockey for, like, four goals? Well, what was the guy would have to fucking score a hat trick and have 40 saves in the net? For football, you have to throw three touchdowns and then also have 20 tackles.

Yeah, and a pig six. I don't know how you do it That's game seven too And then scoreless through seven Ten strikeouts Three dong shots And everybody was hoping That would what you would do

And he'd go out there and do it That guy's a machine With Amex platinum Access to exclusive Amex pre-sale tickets Can score you a spot track side So being a fan for life Turns into the trip of a lifetime

That's the powerful backing of Amex Presale tickets for future events subject to availability And varied by race Terms and conditions apply. Learn more at mx.ca. This episode is brought to you by Peloton. A new era of fitness is here.

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Yes! See that, I got a little laid off the ball that time because I was so excited to get to cadence, ladies and gentlemen, that's 47-year football coach, multiple-time Super Bowl champion. Bruce Ariens is joining. Yeah, B.A. A nine-year NFL vet, Derrish Jay Butler is here. The Toxic Tables here at Boston, Connor, and Attai Schmidt.

Joining us live from Manatic in Ohio is the main as a college football national champion, champion rotter cup winner ladies the gentleman a j hall yeah hawker let's talk about what you've seen from the detroit lions defense last night listen we got four or five guys out okay this is kind of becoming the thing for the lions last year they had like 14 of their starters somehow out on the defensive side they still rallied to the number one overall seed in the nfc they lose both their coordinators peter schreger who will be joining us in about 10 minutes or so before the season said there's chances lion's team doesn't he make playoffs this year well prime time against Tampa Buccaneers and Baker Mayfield

is maybe on an MVP run. They show up and show out up there at Ford Field. What's your takeaway about this Detroit Lions team, AJ Hawk? Yeah, I mean, the defense and what Kelvin Shepard was able to do. That's the thing, like, when you lose one DB in the back end, it's tough because you're working together so much throughout OTAs and camp and everything. But when you have multiple guys, younger guys or less experienced guys,

in there together, and to be able to match up like they were, like on third downs, you see them chasing guys all across the field here, and all of these highlights you're playing. Like, it's just, it's pretty impressive. See, that's a zone drop right there, obviously, as I'm talking. It's mixing it up. Yeah, I think it's just, it's unbelievable that they wouldn't do it for four straight quarters.

That's the thing. You can sometimes hold up for a while, but it all, you know, it's a collaborative effort. Obviously, the front forward did a great job. If they weren't getting the quarterback down, they were pressured and make them feel uncomfortable. Yeah, the Detroit Lions have taken on the attitude of Dan Campbell. What's his record in primetime games coming? 13 and 3 under MCDC with the Lions.

Isn't that a completely vastly different world in reality for Detroit Lions fans, Foxy? This must be really nice. 100%. And it just changes everything about the Lions. People in Michigan now, kids, adults, everyone wears Lions gear. And I think it's because when you're watching them on national TV, people enjoy watching this brand of football. They love MCDC.

They love the Jared Golf story. So it's changed everything. I was mentioned this to you earlier this morning. The Colts are so good right now. the nation needs to see them. The Colts need to get on national TV. That's a big deal, especially for a team like the Lions

who have been so shitty for so long. It's changed everything. They talk about a national appeal that getting on primetime TV gets, but also, like, fans that are maybe on the outskirts locally, like who have maybe checked out on the team for a little bit. It's like, oh, shit, we're on primetime, and then get a huge win.

All of a sudden, you're reback invested. Primetime games tell the story of your teams. They showcase your team. They're very important. Colts, I'll tell you, well, we've got a couple four-clock games this year, and that's awesome. I'm pretty excited about that

but last year was 1 o'clock across the board brother didn't even have a Thursday night I thought everybody had a Thursday night and Colts didn't even get a third I thought you had to have a Thursday night no no first year they didn't Colts didn't have one I'll tell you that in Dan Campbell's first year we had all

one o'clock games yeah it is a it is a different world whenever you're doing that and then you're on primetime making magic happen especially whenever you lose both your coordinators coming into the year tell me about MCDC Bruce Ariens tell me about his style and why you think it works up there even though they have new

coordinators and new pieces. Because he's real. He's real. He keeps it straight. He didn't pull any punches. And those guys know what he expects from them and they deliver. He's got a great rapport. I really think he's a younger Bill Cowher and reminds me a lot of Bill

and he's fire. He's into it. He obviously loves it. And his players play that way. How about his neck, B.A.? You know, we talk about... His neck and Cowher's jaw. Yes. That's a combination. That would be quite a tag team. I couldn't even imagine.

You'd be able to actually chop wood if you had Cowers' jaw on that neck right there. AJ, we always talk about Vraibs, obviously, being able to handle himself in a league-wide head coach battle. MCDC's only getting bigger. Is that what we're all seeing from him? Yeah, it sure feels like it. I mean, yeah, you're right. Look at his neck as his neck and traps his shoulder, his back. I mean, this dude is a great representation of what the NFL could be, I guess, or I guess what the NFL is.

I guess, man, think about him. and some other coaches around the league. Other head coaches when they stand next to each other. Yeah, I couldn't even know. You remember it was Vraibes and Harbaugh, right, when the Titans and Ravens were about to fight? Yep. and Harbaugh and Vrabs were talking to each other, and then immediately the internet goes, John, John, you don't want any piece of that.

You would have been a great shit talk. If you had to put brackets of head coaches, Dan Campbell's definitely one seat. And if there were two sides of the bracket, Frey will be the one side, one seat on the other side. Okay, but let's say there isn't two sides of the bracket. You're saying one seed is MCDC. One overall, yeah, I'll probably go MCDC. Okay, I respect that. Because I've heard similar stories about MCDC, maybe two SIGs.

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, he's a dude. We know that. Damico. Back in the day, not now, obviously. Domingo, Ryan's is certainly in there. Mike McDonald's a fiery son of a bitch. Who would be a sneaky little guy that you think would just...

McDaniel. Yeah, McDaniel would knock. Bite not ankles. He gets your ass, dude. He gets your ass real quick. McDaniel will come on and then some of the right hand will come across. Not that little, but not that little, but now that we've seen him in action, Gannon's got a hook on him now.

Oh, yeah. And a chop. He's got a backhand and a forehand. Now that we've seen it, expensive, too. He's got a valuable chop. That's a six-figure chop and slap that guy's guy. He doesn't even care about that. He actually chops that to the side.

Exactly. I don't care. Yeah, whatever. I do this to the fire. Sean McVeigh definitely fiery. Yeah. I think he's a survivor no matter what. Like, if it's a brawl till death, I think McVeigh's around long.

Yeah. Are he being Ceri-Rani? You better put Pete away early because Pete's never stopping. We know that. Yeah, but with the way the Raiders look right now, I don't know if Pete's even walking into that. That thing. You boys can have it. You know, you boys can have it. Have you heard the reports? Man, we haven't heard from a long time. Good to see, actually. Trey Wingo reported that the Dallas Cowboys have inquired about trade for Max Crosby potentially, which obviously Trey Wingo used to work at ESPN. I think he does have sources of some sort might still have them.

Good to see you, Trey. Good to see you, Trey. Out there doing it. The Spowtrak immediately puts together a bunch of numbers for if he was to be what it would cost, when it would cost it. Two years of guaranteed money out of the Spotrack folks, first year and second year, then everything else not guaranteed. Basically, the offsetting money comes in March 2nd of next year is the guarantees. Yeah, here's the entire thing. Crosby's 29 million, 2007 salary becomes guaranteed next March, making it a two and a half year, $80 million contract for practical purposes. 20.3 guaranteed, 30 million guaranteed in 2026. So first three years, potentially fully guaranteed there.

that price though for a max crosbie makes you wonder well uh if you're going to pay that to max could you have could you have paid something to michael but we're not even going to get into that road but now that everybody kind of knows what the numbers are exactly for max and tray wingo is reporting that people are interested in potentially trading for them does that mean more people also probably interested behind the scenes b a if they understand that maybe max is available at this point yeah if he's out there somebody shopping and uh when you hear that stuff so There'll be a lot of folks that want to get in on Max Crosby, I promise you that. What makes Max different?

Obviously, his motor. Is that everything? Yeah, I think when you think of Jared Allen and those, he's all those guys wrapped in one. I mean, he's relentless. And does you have the biggest, strongest looking body? No, but man, he's powerful. But his motor is unbelievable. He's also a menace.

It feels like he would be a great cowboy. He is unbelievable hands. I'm sorry to interrupt, but I love watching Max. You could have three different defenders at different levels, get to him, and he does such a good job. he doesn't he's never looking at his blocker he's always looking at the quarterback wherever the ball is and he's just so good flipping his hips flipping his shoulders his hands like he never lets guys get a good shot on him and he can also though you have to be able to bulrush as well so max

definitely has the power but it just he's so fluid with his hands and just relentless he just doesn't let anybody block him like it's really fun to walk he actually fights in the office he's right in that like he does a lot of handwork obviously mitt work cardio work he has a battery and energy that i don't think anybody else has in the entire league obviously he works on his technique his work ethic is tremendous his tats look very cool we got to see him live whenever the raiders played against the colts he looks so cool yeah he would be a cool cowboy he would be a very condor the cowboy i would be a very cool cowboy and jerry jones goes this fucking guys available remember i said like hey i got these picks now you never know what's going to happen

people never think i'll bring in another pass rusher same a little bit older maybe actually this guy's already been paid this guy's a little bit older nobody would expect cheaper too Nobody would expect me to give up a couple firsts for that. Boom! Then the Magic Man does it again. Look at the land man pulling this thing off. Max Crosby now is getting to the quarterback. And that's Cowboys all the way back.

We got MVP DAC. Everybody's called me a big, dumb, dip shit. MVP, Dak Prescott. Now we got the Cone Door playing for the Cowboys. And don't look now, is Iber Flues excited? Jerry Jones has a chance to really do something sweet here. And then he has a chance to walk his ass, right out to those cameras,

probably big tuck in. Had to. Bring him in. What I fucking say? And then he gets a chance to flex. which is why I think this is possible. That's the only reason why I think it's possible is because Jerry Jones will take a victory lap

if he's able to accomplish this. And Max Crosby, I think we know exactly who he is. Now he got hurt, I believe? Yeah, I think he had a groin. He didn't finish the game versus Chiefs. So we don't know his health status, but he's a guy that we know is going to be productive. Yes.

Like all the time. So that would be a home run-type signing for anybody, but Jerry Jones definitely with everything that took place in the office. Yeah, and AJ talked about his hands, like his band, he plays well against the run in the past, and usually guys who have that type of effort down in the downout we kind of like to put him in that bucket of like oh he's just a lunch bell guy he's

going to short to work but he has high-end like elite pass rushing traits as well and he's going to elevate anybody on that on that defense i don't care if you run his own coverage if you're on man coverage having a guy like that that doesn't come off the field i mean that's going to boost that entire roster i mean it's just got classic jerry written all over if they do get him he's going to say well that was part of that that was the plan all along what are you think i thought the raiders are going to be good yeah that michael's a shitbird that That's why we got him out of here. Max Crosby, he's a cowboy.

But ultimately, like, this just makes them look good, right? Because, like, we had Chef Dionne yesterday and asked him about that. And he was like, this has always been the answer from the Raiders is people reach out about him. And it's, no, we're not trading him. We're not doing that. So, like, they can put the, hey, sources tell me that the cowboys are snooping around in Vegas. They, they want, like, that doesn't mean anything. Because if the.

You're talking about Trey Wingo's report? That is exactly what I'm talking about, you know. I mean, it's a nice phrasing because it does, you know. They're talking about Wingoes? I mean. What's it going to take to get them? That's not. You're talking about Trey Wingo right now?

Yes. Yes, I am. Really? You know what? Yeah, I just, I get it. Trey Wingo? It's out there. I get it.

I mean, it means nothing. Trey Wingo gets a little chirpy, don't he? Yeah, I'm a big. Trey Wingo is full of shit guy. That's me. Is that you? Yeah, I'm a big. Sorry, I should have done the full sentence.

I'm a big. big, Trey Wingo's full of shit guy, but I do know people like him. Yeah, and he did, do they? He did the, he did have a long sports media, so we assume he has inside information at different places. Joining us now as a guy who has a lot of inside information, ladies and gentlemen, front of the program, a man who's an Emmy Award winner, and he's fresh off a red eye out of Seattle, run on no sleep. Ladies and gentlemen, Peter Schragge. Yeah, Mr. Schroggis, how you doing, buddy?

I'm doing great. It wasn't just a red eye, fat. Red eye with a connection in Minneapolis. Yeah, two red eyes. We're like two red eyes. Yeah. If I can just tell you, last night was the latest an NFL game has ever ended. I think I did the latest post game interview ever in the history of sports.

I did this thing at 1.30 Eastern. Me and Sam Darnold, I'm like, all right, up and down game. I'm like, I'm not even listening to what you're saying. I got to get to the airport. It was great, though. Donald played well, the Seahawks, the elements, the everything was awesome. And then I run, run. Like, I've never ran before.

And I'm not A.J. Hawk. I'm not a runner. Okay. I run to the trucks. And I'm like, where are we going? Let's go. And they're like, well, we got to wait for Orlovsky. Like, okay, well, I have a flight that takes off in about 30 minutes.

Well, we got to wait for a lot. Dan Orlovsky just called the game. Did a great job, by the way. Comes downstairs like, like, Strakes, we're good. bro we're gonna be fine i'm like no no if we miss this flight i missed my kids flag football game tomorrow i don't get to go on mackoffie and orlovsky's like bro we're good coolest customer he just called the game he's feeling himself we get in the car our guy steel is driving we got jeff to find the producer in the back we got credence clear water revival blasting okay ccr blasting we pull up

to the seattle airport run to the gate little line TSA, who knows what's going on in that world right now. We get through TSA. We get through security. We are the last ones on the plane. Orlowski didn't break a sweat. I was a complete drenched mess. It's just our lives. We made the fight. We made the fight.

There we go. Hell yeah. And that's Dana. That's quarterback. You know, that's Dana being a quarterback. Everybody mocks them because the 11-yard end zone thing. But, you know, he's got a lot of the qualities of a quarterback. You know, okay, let's not like, hey, whoa, this ain't helping us right now.

Okay, what you're doing right now. That was it. Not helping any of us right now. We kind of got to go ahead and do this. Now, Dan Rolovsky, he didn't book that flight. He had no backup plan, and he also had no idea about what was happening, probably in that moment. Ignorance is bliss. Let's talk about you making a flight and also doing our show.

We appreciate that. That game, what were you talking with Sam Darnold about? Were you talking about how their team was able to turn over so quickly whenever they kick Pete Carroll out the door? They paint over the walls. McDonald's taken out of the Baltimore Ravens defense. They're basically turning a page. D.K. Metcalfe. See you later.

We don't want you on a team anymore. lock it, see you later. We don't want you on team anymore. Gino, see you later. We don't want you on team anymore. Brand new Seattle Seahawks. And they've turned the page here pretty quickly into a great team. Is that your takeaway from last night or the Houston Texans shite? And I love how explosive Jackson Smith and Jigba is able to one step and dunk that thing as if he's seven foot tall. Yeah, let's start with the former the Seattle Seahawks because, and there I am on the sideline in that beautiful blazer if you see on the near sideline. I talked to John Schneider, who's a GM for a long time before the game,

and Schneider's really the one constant. He's been there since 2010, and it's been through not only the Pete era, but the Russ era, and now we're changing guards, and now it's Mike McDonald and Sam Donald. Pat, Sam Donald's only 28 years old. He's only 28 years old. He started with the Jets at 21, and I thought it was fascinating talking to Sam for a while during the production meeting call. He's engaged.

He just bought his first house of his life. He's always been a transient guy renting in New York, renting in Carolina, renting in San Francisco, renting in Minnesota. And he's like, and I'm finally feeling the love that I'm wanted. And it's almost like sometimes it takes guys this long. And Donald is so in control, is absolutely the leader of this team. And yesterday, he and Jackson Smith and Jigba looked as good as he looked with Justin Jefferson last year. It's unbelievable the connection they had, eight catches, I think 153 yards, maybe something less than that. But every time that JSN was getting open, Sam had an eye on him and would hit him.

And the two of them have this great connection. And he's like, this guy, not a diva, not a give me the ball, just does everything right. And the two of them are on the same exact wavelength. I loved watching these two connect. And I loved watching Mike McDonald, this that's like very even-keeled guy who is a defensive first coach putting the ball in Sam's hands and saying, Sam Donald, you lead us there. Our defense will do the rest. And oh, boy, did they?

Yeah, I think Sam Darnold with his little revenge tour here that I'm a good player. Buying his first house is crazy to think about at the age of 28. Feeling the love is crazy. The fact that Minnesota just let him out of the building also crazy every single week that continues. Jackson Smith and Jigbo, one of those Ohio statewide receivers. He can't be a diva in there because there's another guy right behind you that's willing to take a spot. Go ahead, AJ. Yeah, Shrix, what was the atmosphere like?

On TV, I couldn't really, you know, the game was, you know, it was a slog at times. but what was the atmosphere like? And also, though, about that Seattle Seahawks defense. Can you talk about them a little bit? I think they obviously are under the radar from what they're doing. J.J. Watt and I were texting Humble Brag. During the game, I'm over there on the sidelines,

and he's like, I'm sorry, bro. I got to turn it off. I can't keep my eyelids open. I'm like, I felt like I was watching Bruce Springsteen in a small New Jersey bar in the Jersey Shore, like the Stone Pony in the 70s. Like, if you're watching this game, you're one of the diehards you're one of the early and like that's fine what you missed

was an atmosphere that was completely deflated at about the 10 minute mark of the second quarter because George Springer hits this home run and it basically eliminates the Seattle mariners from their first ever trip to the world series while that's happening everyone's checking it on their phones in the crowd they have it up on the big screen it's a heartbreaker and then the Seahawks defense is basically like all right not only do we have to carry our offense at time. We're going to carry this entire city sports fans on our back, too, because they start showing up, and it's Leonard Williams, obviously, who's in his 11th year and is still as dominant

as every was, DeMarcus Lawrence is everywhere, Neuosu's everywhere, and you're looking around, you're like, oh, my gosh, they play with their, you know, on fire. And here was the deal. It was interesting. This one should have been a safety. I don't want to say that. Mike McDonald lost his mind on this one. They called that forward progress.

There was a third and short and a, there was a third in short and a fourth and short. And the Texans decided, Nick Cayley, the offensive coordinator said, let's run it both times. The Seattle defense just closed the door. You know, Seattle turned them all over four times yesterday. They also had a field goal blocked. It didn't seem to hurt them. They were up the entire time. It's because that defense did not let the Texans do anything on offense.

Yeah, and not doing anything on offense. The Texans, interesting story, brother. I mean, I mean, it's an interesting story just from a couple of, years back to what we were crowning them. You talk about J.J. Watt. J.J. Watt a couple years ago was like, we got the future. We got 10 years of greatness down here in Houston. They make some moves. They get rid of some people. They lose Bobby Slowick as the O.C. They've looked like a very different team after talking to them and getting to learn about them. What is their thoughts on where they stand right now? Yeah, we met with C.J. Stroud. We met with D'Amico Ryan's,

Nick Cayley, and Will Anderson in person. And Matt Burke, the defense attorney in person late Saturday, Sunday night. So it's like you really get a feel for where they're at. And they're hopeful that these young wide receivers can step up. I know Debutt mentioned earlier that they have the two wide receivers from Iowa State that they drafted and the hope is that like maybe they play a role. Well, they have to play a role now. You're out there and it's Dalton Schultz and Nico Collins, basically the only guys that are established players at the wide receiver or tight end position.

And the running back spot, Nick Chubb used to be one of the better running backs in the league. He hasn't really done that this year. And then Woody Marks is a nice compliment. player. But like without Joe Mixon's leadership out there with Nico Collins hurt, it just didn't feel like they had the weapons. And then you get to the offensive line and it's so young, it's a lot on CJ Stroud. And he's not, you know, he doesn't get no blame in this thing. He had some passes that maybe that were, you know, on him. But for the most part, you're looking at this offense and you're like, wow, that was a really lopsided situation, that defense in Seattle, that offense in

Houston. It might still be enough to win the AFC South and challenge the Colts. We'll see. shut up it's not too late it's not too early yeah two red eyes you had two red eyes last night i understand i understand i understand who's in the afc south oh yeah yeah yeah yeah the best team in the nc yeah oh shit i forgot about that i understand i respect for yeah because they have been running the afc south for a long time they have and then they get cj stroud it's like they're only going to get better and then it's kind it's kind of well in stroud's won playoff games the last two years right they've gone to the final four of the divi of the conference the last few years so you're like we're going to take

the next step they move on from slowick which i thought was interesting Nick Cayley comes from the McVaytree, also at eight years with Belichick. So it's like he's going to mesh those two systems. I just didn't get a feel for them last night on offense, that they have the firepower to compete with a Kansas City, you know, an Indianapolis right now. And of course, you go up and down the board of all these AFC teams that are airing it out. All right, you're saying right now, you're saying a lot of things.

I don't have to go back to your lines take after what happened. We'll just skip that thing, okay, and the dolphins, and we won't talk about that. Okay, so. Dolphins was bad. Yeah. You had a lot of good ones, those rings. We're out here live in real time. It's going to happen to us all.

But you talk about the Texans defense. Here's some HEMBO stats. Below is an uncomprehensive list of statistics in which the Texans defense leads the NFL. Points per game, points per drive, drive score. QBR allowed EPA per play, pass EPA, which we know EPA matters. Big deal. But the Texans defense is real. And that is certainly something that the Miko Ryan probably has a lot of pride in.

If the offense can get rolling, they get healthy, maybe get some more weapons. Maybe the Houston Texans are all the way back. But welcome to Danny Dimes, AFC South. Now, Danny Dimes, obviously, in the Colts on an incredible run right now and to continue for the rest of the season. Dibut has a question for you, Shreggs. On that note, the Texan that defense, that is a reason to be optimistic. It's not just a complete shit show.

You do have one of the best defense in the league, so hopefully they can figure it out. But Shreg, at this point in the season, what team do you see that can maybe, aside from the teams that are already hot that came out of the gate hot, that can kind of get hot and make a run down the stretch. Yeah, look, you look at the records right now, and it's like there's so many good teams. I think someone posted that in the NFC, you know, everyone, there's nine teams that are, you know, half a game apart.

You look at the 49ers right now, they're leading the NFC West with the playoffs for today. They'd be the two seed. And that's with everyone injured. So you pick it. Now, the team that really intrigued me last week, and I could easily say the Patriots, they're 5'2. I thought the Bengals found some magic on Thursday night.

Oh, brother. And suddenly it's like if Flacco can throw the ball 23 times to Jamar Chase and complete it 16 times and get six receptions to T. Higgins and they have an offense, that was the plan all along. They were going to outscore you. That's what they did against Pittsburgh. Suddenly you look at the Bengals. They're just three and four. Do we know when Burroughs coming back? Do we know if Burroughs coming back?

It might have been just a flash in the pan, but I will promise you this. That trade, they give up a fifth round pick. And basically they're paying an extra million dollars here that the. the Browns don't have to pay to get Joe Flacco. That was not a white flag by any means. That trade for the Bengals was essentially them telling the rest of the league. No, no, no, no, we're not quitting. We see this isn't working and the season's going down the drains and we're swirling around.

Like, we've got some fight in us. I thought that might have been the most impressive win of the week and it happened all the way back on Thursday night. But Flacco suddenly gave life to this team and that's the strength of their team. Higgins and Chase, that's who they pay the money to. So if you're wondering, well, what about the offensive line or the defensive line? it's not a priority as far as getting those guys their balls. And guess what? That's what they did.

They outscored the Steelers. And they were able to make that very high-priced Steelers defense look very mediocre. You can hear a tone all the way and hammer. Dahn, sign saying, I know, I know. Yep, there it is. Yep, there he is absolutely feeling that as you're saying it. And also think about T. Higgins doing that slide at the end of the game

so they can go for the game-winning field goal. That's a testament to their culture, I think. You know, you talk about them saying this isn't a white flag. we understand it's not working, we want to keep going. T. Higgins getting paid all that money, having an opportunity to go ahead and maybe hitting incentive, maybe get another touchdown, especially fourth quarter, game winning touchdown

potentially against Pittsburgh Steelers. Instead he slides. I think that it says a lot about the culture they have inside that building. I'm a fan as well. Now, there was a game that happened on Sunday that has only happened one other time since the 1970s merger. And it obviously

happened to the New York Giants team, but it happened for the Denver Broncos. team. So Denver Broncos, good on you. That's right. Good on you, Denver Broncos. That's an incredible display of resiliency and getting back into it. And I don't know if anybody's ever put 33 points up like that in a quarter after

looking like such ass the first three quarters. And the answer is no, they haven't. Now on the flip side of that, have we lost the moxie? Ty has a question for you. Yeah, Shregs, what is the temperature? What are the vibes around the Giants right now? Obviously, a couple weeks ago, hey, this team's going to the playoffs. You know, we

might have a Hall of Fame quarterback. And then they have arguably the worst collapse in the history of the NFL. Is everyone still very high on the Giants with Scatabo and, you know, Jackson Dart? And are we thinking, hey, Dable is going to be safe. He's going to be around. He showed enough the last couple weeks with Jackson Dart that everything's going to be okay. And we're kind of just playing with house money for the rest of the year. No, Giants fans are depressed.

They are completely, you know, in misery form. And knowing my Giants fan friends and knowing people in the New York City area, Not only do you have this terrible Jets team right now, you have a Giants team that for 55 minutes looked like they were going to go win the Super Bowl on Sunday and then completely, you know, gave up everything in the final 10 minutes of this game. It was a historic loss. This is a team that was good enough to beat the 4-0 Chargers a couple of weeks ago. They were good enough to be up with the Cowboys by, you know, with 13 seconds left.

They were good enough to beat the defending Super Bowl champions. So you think, all right, you got a shot. But then you lose to Spencer Rattler and the Saints. And then you lose in this fashion. and you wonder, well, what's missing here? They're young, but that's not an excuse. Up and down the roster, you could say, well, this guy played well, but this guy didn't play well in the moments that mattered.

Then the coaching questions, it's game management. And then at the end, the defense, completely giving up 33 points in the fourth quarter of a game that you had them shut out the first three quarters is so inexplicable that I think a lot of Giants fans and even the journalist covering the team are still numb trying to piece it together. Now, I'm interested to... The journalists are numb. You know, that's deep. You know, that is...

Show some grit. No, they are. They're just... They're shell-shocked by this entire. Yeah, it's a quagmire. Yeah, it is a quagmire. They're flabbergasted, I believe, by the entirety of it. Are they not, Ty? What are some other predicaments that these journals feel?

Gob shmack. Oh, gobsmach. It would certainly be, you know, right at the top of the list there. Bamboozled, maybe. Oh, really? Really? By the Broncos or by their own team there? Well, it's actually one of those very rare double bamboozles. You're bamboozled by the Broncos coming back.

You're also bamboozled by your own team who, you know, just at the most important moment, once again, has failed you. Okay, so do you think they're going to be okay after all the bamboozling and the obviously quagmire and gobsmackiness that's been happening to all the local journalists around the Giants? Well, it's very interesting because, you know, you've got the Super Bowl champions coming in and they're going to be red-assed after getting. and beat, you know, by the Giants just a couple weeks ago. So, in my opinion, you know, Dable, the bamboozled needs to turn into the bamboozler. He needs to find a way

to bamboozle that Philadelphia defense and stymie them once again, and I think that's what they're trying to do. Dimey's a good word, too. Yeah. Tiamy's a good word. We got journalism over here. Look, that was Ty Pete right there. That was an actual journalist, the authority in it all. But you're saying that everybody's kind of gobsmacked, if you will, by the loss

to the Broncos, which is a good thing. not a bad thing, I think. Well, they also, gobsmacked, whatever, but like, then there's questions. Well, Graham Ganoe got hurt in, like, the second week of the season. You bring up, you sign Youngwee Coo, you're thinking he's going to be a kicker.

Then they had, you know, the Irish kid who's number 99. I can't get his name right now, and he missed... Jude Macatomney. Jude Macatamney, lad. He's missed three extra points, and you're like, should he be kicking

for an NFL team right now? I don't know. Maybe there should have been another option there. I would imagine a move will be made or that Gano is healthy to play Sunday. You can't trot out that same situation. But there's these little things that, like, yes, we love Dart and Scataboo, and we love the fact that this team responded when Malik neighbors went down and still found a way to win games.

But like, should they be four and two or five and one based on what I just rattled off? Like the Saints game, they had five turnovers and five straight possessions. Against the Cowboys, they were in that same deep prevent defense when they're Just head-stracting stuff. Brian Burns really pumped up about it. Brian Burns not happy. Not happy at all. Yeah, it sounds like a lot of people not happy.

And McAtonny, this is life as a kicker, brother. You're going to be okay. I like that he owned it, took accountability for it. And I also appreciate the fact that the Irish lads now, you know, because the international pathway is- I saw McQuaid. McQuaid said, he's getting some terrible things said about him. It's like, yeah, this is the world of a kicker now. Sorry, that is the, I don't like it.

I don't like somebody should have been a little bit more transparent with the Irish lad saying, hey, you miss a couple of these. They're going to fucking kill you a lot. People get real mean, they're real mean. Don't go out for dinner. You should see these Irish NFL reporters talking about it. They're like,

the things they are saying. He's 7,500 kilometers away from his family lads. Take it easy on it. They are like, they're saying mean things. This guy. It's like, yeah, my daughter will never be a kicker in the NFL or in college.

Wow. Amen. Won't let her. No chance. Okay. I think back, whenever we're at the game, I'll watch like a kicker jogout or even a punter jog out. I'm like, yeah, right, dude. Thank God I don't have to do that anymore. I have no idea how that was a chapter of my life. Because that Macatominy got such good story for the NFL. Yeah. Incredible. Got an Irish. Holy hell. This is a big deal. On the pathway program, which they've been promoting so hard everywhere. Like, this is awesome.

33 yard extra point. That's no big deal. And then you just hit it a little bit thin. And all of a sudden, that thing goes to the right. And then it's like, get this Irish. bastard out of our city. It's like, that's the opposite side of the coin, mate. That's the other side, lad. They're tough enough for it, though. Bounce back, lad. But that's not going to be the first. You know, there's going to be a lot of, I think, I think the international influence in sport, our sport, is going to come through ball kicking sports. So, like, it's been a lot of punters, obviously, because Australia and Jamie, Scottish, which comes from rugby as well. But I think as the soccer players come over, I think there is going to be

a little bit of an adjustment to, like, hey, these people are expecting you to shut up, make these kicks. And if you don't, it is, it is game set match. There's only 32 jobs, B.A. Yeah, my son had one of those. I know what you're talking about. He was in NFL cake. Yeah, for a couple years. Jake was a kicker, right? Yeah. And kick for Buffalo

in Atlanta. And you thought to yourself every time anyone out there, please God, make the kick. That's my worst nightmare as a parent. That's my worst nightmare as a parent. It was hard in high school. It was hard in college. And, dude, my mom. My mom in college, there's no way she enjoyed any of the games, not a single one. I'd go onto the field, and it's like this. And I ended up being the all-time leading score, and I still get death threats because of the situation that happened.

One bad night, obviously your entire, everything is talked about. But every time I want on the field for everything, a punt, my mom, please hit a good one. Please hit a good one. Then every single field goal, please snap good, hold good, block good, ball goes through the uprights, please. And then she'll hear the reaction, and it's, oh, thank God. And it's like, she did that. like when I went to punter I think she was like thank God this one is a lot of tough

because I mean sports is sports but it's certain sports and certain moments were like okay all right your turn everybody's looking at like golf like okay your turn everybody and it's just I'll never I'll never forget in Seattle a wild card round game Vikings versus Seahawks I'm the reporter it's zero degrees out there Blair Walsh who had an amazing season misses that little

chippy I'm the one at the locker and Blair Walsh has 10 of us, you know, slob journalists with a microphone in his face, and he's having to answer it as this world-class athlete, but it's like that's the job. It's a real burden. And even last night, Kayami Firebarn, who's one of the best kickers in football,

at the end there, there's a situation where there's two minutes, four seconds left. If he kicks it straight out of bounds, the Texans get the ball with a timeout, or there's a timeout, and they can stop him before the two-minute warning. Or if he blasts it through the end zone, they save a time out also kicks it into the end zone

D'emico Ryan's look like he's ready to lose his mind like what are you doing it's it's there's so many thin lines and there's little grace from the fans when it comes to kickers yeah very little especially we just saw a guy almost break his neck hitting each other and then you come trotting out here that's cute make the kick dude okay these guys and obviously you got to know these kickers feel terrible okay because they got to walk in a locker room like everything you guys are saying in support of the other players those actual other players are in the locker room where he's headed you know so it is Like, you've got to look these people in the eye that are sacrificing their bodies for the betterment of everything.

And you just trot it out there and just ruined it for everybody. And then you've got to be like, so sorry. Sorry, Lutz. Sorry, lads. And it's tough. They need to start telling these international kids, like the actual reality of this entire thing. Because McAtony, I think he'll be strong enough to bounce back. But that's the real life of being a kicker.

Now, let's move forward. Let's talk about teams that can potentially go and win Super Bowl. And then we got biweeks happening already. Go ahead, Conman. Yeah, Shrags. run a buy so no one's really talking about them anymore and it feels like everyone's low on them because of their loss in new england in prime time but there's still another team that is very good even as a patriots fan i can foresee a massive bills run in them uh winning the a fc east but right

now uh times seem to be tough what do you think about buffalo's chances this year do you think it is one of those terrible situations it's going to be a bad season or do you think they'll figure it out and eventually go on and, you know, make a run at the Super Bowl. And with that being said, too, is there ever a chance that they don't win 10 games and they stay with McDermott forever? Yeah, I mean, I did their last game, their Monday night game against the Falcons, where they look like a shell of themselves because of all the injuries. And you get down there in big time moments on third and one and Joe Brady's calling a end

around to Elijah Moore. And you're like, well, what does that call? And then you look on the field and it's Elijah Moore, Shavers, you know, no Dalton Kincaid, no Josh Palmer, he was hurt. And you're like, wait a second, is this, is this the team that we thought was the class of the AFC or is this team going to have to fight and crawl for everything and just put it all on Josh's shoulders? I do think there's too much experience, there's too much history, and there's too much

talent at that quarterback spot for this team to just fade away. So to me, I have the bills winning Super Bowl this year. I have not changed that pick. I still think the bills win the Super Bowl this year. and I think it is Josh Allen's time. The buy could not have come at a more perfect time for Buffalo, and they're going to come back healthier, and I would not be surprised if they come back scorched earth.

What were the records of the teams coming out of by this week? 0 and 2 this week, 4 and 2 on the season now. Okay, so because they were 4 and 0 the first week of buys coming back, and then this week they were 0-2. Texans, one of those teams, and then now we got the bills. Now we're in buy season here. It would suck to be that first week like the Steelers were.

I mean, that, especially with how old that team is, and I want to, you know, call them. old, but you got a lot of old heads out there. So that being like week five and still having 13 more weeks on the other. That sucks. That absolutely sucks for them. Right now is when you get into the time where if it's a buy, it's like, we'll deal with it.

This is a reasonable. Too late's not good either. Nope. Because then you can work your ass out of contention and not be able to catch up. I'm curious, Ravens out of the buy is what I'm fascinated by because that was, well, everyone is. We're all like, oh, yeah, there come the Ravens. But they have been terrible.

terrible football team So why is it Here comes the Raven Lamar missed yesterday right I think Lamar They're saying Lamar's hamstring Still not good Because wait I thought Lamar was gonna play

Coming out of the buy Which is why Lamar still And AFC North still Favorites everything like that We're all saying way to hold the phone Early in the week But yeah yesterday Monday

Monday though Monday not a lot happening Yeah but still No we'll see And I and I was on get up I think that Friday morning After the Steelers lost And I think we all

Kind of agreed like Well here come the Ravens and when everyone's saying something, it's like, here comes the Ravens, why? I don't, I don't, why? So they'll all get healthy and we'll see, but they need to actually win these games. You got to watch your tone, Shregs. You got to watch your tone, okay, with your whys.

Okay, you're dog. Chuck will be coming for you. Chuck's coming for you. Chuck is. You know why? Because we're fucking playing football. Chuck this, Shrek. All right, take a nap, brother.

We appreciate your coverage and your commitment to the game. You're the man. You are the best. And Sean, the Rain Man Kemp belongs on that. Thank you. Rushmore, the power dunker. Let's go. He might be on the final Rushmore. At Rushmore on X, available

now. You're the best, ladies and gentlemen, Peter Shreg. Yes, there you go. From Shregg's age to one of our favorite segs. You know, we got good segs on this show. Great sex. Yeah, we have good sex. It's all about that good sex. Yeah, that good sex.

Hey, what's next? That good sex. Ladies and gentlemen, it's time for BS. or no BS with B.A. We will make statements of fact that have been said around the NFL and B.A will tell us if it's BS or if it's no BS.

Let's start with the first one. Pittsburgh is a lock to win the AFC North. Obviously, this is fresh off a Thursday night loss to the Cincinnati Bengals. They are a lock to win the AFC North. Aaron Rogers are quarterback. They got T.J. Watt out there. D.K. Metcalfe.

Hayward, Friarmooth, Mount Washington, and Mike Tomlin, he always has a winning record, and they still have a winning record and have done some special things, feel like they would say they're ahead of schedule on the offensive side with Artie Smith and Aaron, kind of finding their groove. Pittsburgh is a lock to win the AFC North. Is that BS or no BSBA? I think that's total BS. Oh!

Yeah, because Mike T's worst nightmare, Joe Flacco went to Cincinnati. And he was absolutely right, ripping Andrew Barry's ass for the that one because Joe Flack now has a winning record against Mike Tomlin. And that's all Jamar Chase and T. Heagans and needs was 33 targets. And a running game. All of a sudden, the offensive line can block for Cincinnati. They couldn't block two weeks ago. Isn't that interesting?

It's crazy. All of a sudden, now they're blocking T.J. Watt, Highsmith, those guys that got close to him. And Joe just lit them up. Lid them up. And he did, Joe did so many good veteran moves. Like for Jamar to get, what, 26 targets. A lot of those were running plays. Right here.

And boom, he's just, hey, you're 101. Yep. We just call that whatever the run was X hot. All right. Run a slant. If they're off of you, I'm just going to throw it to you. And he's going to get five, six, eight, ten every time. And Joe Flacko, veteran knows when to do that, when not to do that.

Every single time. Loaded box, boom, he's one-on-one. They have a little hands say he don't run a slant or just off-coverage, just throwing it to you. The little single bubble screen. And he's, what, there for 10 days? That's only going to get better? He's, what, crazy numbers.

Connor, you've got the numbers. Yeah, he's got like... Here it is. 60 for 92 for 5161 yards, five touchdowns, no interceptions, and it has only been sacked three times in two games. Two games. That's crazy. I've been there 10 days. Now, it's just going to get better.

On that note, Joe Flacko down to the Cincinnati Bengals is enough for them to win the AFC North? Are the Cincinnati Bengals now your favorite to win the AFC North? Because the statement was, the Pittsburgh Steelers are locked to win the AFC North. and you said, that's bullshit. Then you went straight to a Joe Flacco highlight package.

Are you saying the Cincinnati Bengals are your AFC North favorites? I'm not saying they're favorites, but they're game back, and they have the tiebreaker now on the Steelers. So it's just a matter of Steelers better stay ahead of the Bengals because the Bengals ain't going nowhere. They're just going to get better. So you're saying it's not a lock, brother. There ain't no locks in his business.

Let's go to Hammer. Dine, Dime. Tone, how's it feel here today's bullshit? Thinking that you guys are a lock to win the AFC North with how that season started? Yeah, it's tough because it'd be stupid of me to argue with a Super Bowl winning head coach. You know, that would be tough. But, you know, Joe has always turned back into a pumpkin. He does always have these flashes.

But since the 2015 season, which was 10 years ago, his record is horrendous. So I'm not worried about the Bengals. I think Steelers will be fun. Okay, that's Pittsburgh Steelers, Superfan. Tony Digg. Craig's NBA on the Bengals. I know. It's getting live.

Hey, Joe Flacco, you ain't sneaking in any. any games anymore. Flaccoe's ready for it. Year 19, year 20, you're not sneaking in there. Joe Flacco, too, just having this aura about him of confidence and moxie. I think that helps everybody, AJ.

I told you he didn't sweat during the game. I feel like he didn't sweat, just catch, I just so I just make it look easy. Like, I don't know. You got to show young kids that might have like happy feet in the pocket or, you know, or like just too amped up. Show him Joe. I don't know how you get this demeanor,

obviously through reps. But man, just very impressive. We will see, though. I guess if he can keep it up. Can't say this enough on the post-game interview with Nightcap, which Thursday night football does a great job with all of that. Joe Flackler said he had no idea what the plays were. There was multiple plays where he had no idea what was going on,

and they still did what they did. Obviously, Cincinnati Bengals have a chance. Let's go to the next BS or no BS with BA, Debudge. Yeah, talk about another team that ain't sneaking up on anybody. The Chiefs are the Super Bowl favorites, and they should be. BS or no BS, coach? I think that's total BS. Whoa.

What are you talking about? We saw brand new Chiefs. The third place in their division. There are two games behind Chargers and the Broncos. They're going to come back and beat a bunch of folks in their own division to get to where they want to go. Now, can they? Sure. But if they stay healthy, I just don't think there's any way that there's a lot.

Their third place, they're going to fight a long way just to get to the top. Okay, so let's talk about whenever you see them start to be good again, though, like when they start putting it together. Rishi Rice obviously comes back, added weapon for Patrick Mahomes. Patrick Mahomes looks like two years ago, Patrick Mahomes, as opposed to whenever they turned to the conservative run game, let's not turn the ball over, let's not our defense do our thing, Can City Chiefs.

They've been able to win in a variety of different ways throughout this dynasty. Now it looks like Showtime, Patrick Mahomes is all the way back. Sportsbooks got excited as soon as they saw a glimpse of it. He's the favorite for the MVP, and as soon as they saw it, they go, yep, they're the favorites to win the Super Bowl. In your eyes, you're saying not so fast, Jack, this is going to be a tough road in that AFC West, which Bo Nix is in there and only getting better and better each week.

Yeah, I mean, if the Chargers can get some guys back in, they've been decimated with injuries, and, you know, they beat them pretty good, and Denver beat them. So it's going to be a dogfight in the AFC West, just like a couple of other divisions. But, I mean, beating the Raiders by 33 to nothing does, that doesn't impress me at all. What?

Beating the Lions, the way they beat the Lions, that's that impressive. Okay. That's different. Okay, now you beat a hell of a football team at your place. Now go on the road and do it. Okay. So you said not so fast, my friends, too. They can't see a chiefs, even though all of us have fallen in love completely.

Let's go to the next BS or no BS with BA tie. Yeah, coach, after last night, a lot of people are saying, hey, the Texans' offense is in trouble. Is that BS or no BS? That's no BS. This one felt like a layup. A little bit. This is a little bit of a layup. I mean, I don't know what happened to C.J. Stroud.

I mean, he was the odds-on favorite to be the MVP for the next 10 years after his rookie year. and with Bobby Sloick and everything they were doing offensively and all of a sudden now they obviously missed Larry Mittonso they missed Joe Mixing guys that were leaders and great players they haven't replaced them with great players

and with Nico getting hurt I don't know who the hell he's going to throw the ball to and they can't run it they can't run it and that's the other thing in Cincinnati that Chase Brown had 100 120 yards rushing all of a sudden they couldn't get 50

two weeks ago now they get 100 yard rusher that changes everything for a quarterback It's crazy what a quarterback can do. AJ, are you completely out on the Houston Texans? Because I tried to watch that game both last night and this morning. Okay, that's been my new thing. And it was just ugly. It was hard.

And I want to say sorry to the Seattle Seahawks. I hope they forgive me because they put on a dominant performance, but nobody in the East Coast was up for it. So once again, Seattle Seahawks are kind of getting overlooked or slept on, actually, in this entire thing. But Houston Texans have not looked great, AJ, to B.A.' No. Yeah, with how B.A. lays it out, yeah, it makes sure.

you makes it pretty easy to, I guess, to be out on the Texans. The only thing that keeps me in, though, that defense. I think that defense can play at a high level all year. And if your offense can find something, I don't know what that might be. You still have a chance, as long as your defense is still playing the high low. Yeah, start running a ball. Classic run the ball. All right, let's go to the last BS or no BS with BA, man.

Yeah, B.A. Some people think the AFC West, the AFC South, maybe even the NFC West. But is the, excuse me, the NFC North is the best division in football. Was that BS or no BSBA? That's no BS right now. It would be the West if the Arizona Cardinals could figure out how to win a game at the end. They've lost five, one score games, three on the last play of the game. Then everybody in that division would have a winning record like the North does.

The Vikings are a little shaky ground right now at 3 and 3. But everybody in that division right now got chat to go to playoffs. And if the Cardinals could get it going because they're so close, so close each week, then I say the West is the toughest division. We all love Phoenix, Arizona. Okay, we just talk Steve Nash. She's part of the thing. We compliment.

Incredible place. We love Arizona as a whole. That Cardinals team, I don't know, man. It just feels like one of those things where, yep, I just don't think they're going to be good. And I don't like that, I think that. But it's just kind of becoming synonymous. And you talk about the last play of the game and five games are not able to finish it. Look at the rest of that.

Five and two, five and two, and five. I guess we shouldn't just rule out the Cardinals for being bad. Maybe they're in an incredible division, you know. Maybe. Yeah. Eight of their games are against three teams that could potentially, you know, go on a win the whole damn Super Bowl out there in the NFC West. A little cannibalism potentially in the NFC West.

And then the fact that the NFC North now is what it is, is obviously a spectacular testament to what the Lions have been able to do. Ben Johnson is doing what the Chicago Bears. And obviously, KOC trying to figure it out whenever they got quarterback question. Yeah, but to your point, just about the Cardinals, like you have that thought towards them. and maybe it's because the Patriots played the Saints like I feel better about the Saints

than I do about the Arizona Cardinals. And the Saints, there's really not too much you can look at and be like they're great, but Rattler is kind of electric. And like Kelly Moe, I personally had no faith in Kelly Moe, but then you watch them playing it's like, oh shit, they're actually like playing their fucking asses off.

And I'm not saying the Cardinals aren't doing that they are. They're in all these games. It's just they don't. The Saints really coming into the season, nobody had any high hopes for them. you're saying they're playing their balls off still for them for Kelly Mo, which is good to establish the culture. I think they also have some salary cap stuff,

so I think it was like a projected couple year thing for the Saints. So then being one and six, not a surprise. The Cardinals having Kyler paying Kyler and then having another year with Marvin Harrison Jr. And everything like that, it's like at what point are they going to, you know, at what point is all the plans going to be the... Well, that's the biggest thing because, like, it's pretty evident after the last two weeks. I mean, like, the Cardinals gave the Colts everything they could,

like everything on the road damn near beat them and then they look great against the Packers so it's not this is like I mean if you've watched the games Jacobi Reset has made them look like 10 times better of a team than when Kyler is playing and like that's not good when he's

supposed to be your franchise quarterback so like if they do want to win these games like it's tough to they probably will go back to Kyler but clearly Jacoby has been the better guy for them this year I'm a fan of Kyler Murray anybody that's that athletic and that successful in sports I am a fan of the amount of time that he

has had to commit to sports throughout his life to be a top 10 pick in baseball and a top 10 pick, obviously, in football is incredibly impressive. But at this point, I'm sorry and what his baseball career has been a lot better than the football careers, right? I'm not saying that it can't be still.

He's still young, man. He still got a lot of opportunity and everything like that, but it is, it's crazy to think that always like, what if? I wonder if he does that ever, AJ. I wonder if he ever does that. Remember the whole hoopla when he was coming out, like when he was getting drafted, like the whole baseball situation. He wouldn't really answer it, but

was he a top 10 pick? I know he's first round pick. He was top 10 pick. Nice, right. Yeah. And baseball. And actually if he wouldn't have got drafted by the A's who are, you know, like parenally just kind of a shitty franchise it, like if it would have been one of these teams who has a massive payroll, like I wonder if

that decision might have been muddied a little bit more. Yeah, because he's got a hose, right? Yes. This guy's got an absolute host. He's a great hitter too. Yeah, I heard he can hit the curveball. Yeah. He can see it in there. He can also hit the fastball. Yeah, only player ever drafted first round in both. And we know all these great athletes that's come through

and been able to be drafted. Like obviously, and it'll always be the what if. Even Dion Sanders, first battle of hall of fame, and greatest cornerback ever. He always talks about, what if I were committed to baseball? I like baseball more. Jordan, the greatest basketball player ever retired and went to play at baseball. So it'll definitely always be the what if.

But I feel like it's always the what if or it's always something with Arizona. We're talking about being in these games. And even if you just look at that division as a whole, like everybody in that division kind of could use, they have excuses. Like San Fran, they're injured, most of their, a lot of their top tier players, including their starting quarterback hurt, new head coach, new quarterback, new a bunch of things in Seattle, L.A. coming into last year, nobody had them on the radar to go as far as they did.

But every year these coaches and these teams, they find a way to win. And we always say in the NFL, you are what your record is. You know, it's a one possession league. We know that. It's a lot of games that come close to it. will that quarterback and team marriage happen? We all remember the contract and the language that was in college contract that made a big stink about it.

I think they changed it, but it's always going to be that. What if I'm very interested to see how it plays out, but I think we all can kind of see what's coming down to track. Yeah, because, I mean, they took Seattle and San Francisco to the last play of the game and lose on a kick, and it's just really one bounce of the ball, and they could be four and three and in the hunt.

And so they're not a bad football team. And I do agree. They're playing better, Jacoby. I mean, Jacoby is, he knows where he's going. He's lighting it up. And I don't know where they go when Collar kids healthy. Oh, whoa, oh, that seemed like pretty deep. They paid him a lot money now. Jacoby's great leader. When Jacob was a backup quarterback here for the Indianapolis Colts, I think he was one calling team meetings. I think he comes from the Parcell's tunetry of leadership and everything like that. We are big fans of Jacoby around here. I was trying to

get him the MVP for the Indianapolis Colts. Now, I don't think, you know, he's necessarily winning one B.A.'s game balls. Okay, we started this segment last week. Who are your two game ball award winners, B.A. from week seven of the NFL football season? Well, the first one for me is no brain. That's Joe Fleco. I love it. Yes.

Yeah. That's what he did in that game on Thursday night. And again, only been there 10 days, not knowing half the down plays, and just lighten up what is the great defense in the Steelers. And to have 33 targets to those two guys is amazing. I think what else is amazing?

BA coach for the Steelers for a long time. You hear the way he's talking about him. Tomlin, obviously, Steelers' long time. You hear the way he's talking about him? Yeah, right. The only people that aren't talking about Joe Flackle like this are people that didn't have to play his ass two times a year. It was really important, right?

Exactly, right. Because he can still spin it, man. And then NFC is Christian McCaffrey. I mean, boy, there's a hell of an argument right now. Who is best back in the NFL is? We talked about Bijon a lot last week, and he saw Jumar Gibbs last night. But, man, Christian McCaffrey, he never goes away.

I mean, 63% of their offense was him. Yes. That was a record for the year, actually, most by one player on a team for any of the teams this year. He's on pace to have, I think, like 1,200, both rushing and receiving. This is exactly what they were missing last year when Christian McCaffrey got hurt four days before the game started. What do you think, Christian, can he continue this? Can this be a year-long thing for Christian McCaffrey? Yeah, as long as those guys up front stay healthy. Now they got kiddo back, who's one of the best blocking tight ends and receiving tight ends.

And all those guys, if they just stay healthy and start getting a couple of hours, receivers back. All right. Mac Jones is carrying them right now, playing his ass off. Whoa, whoa, whoa. All right, but Brock Party will be back soon. Okay.

Okay. Do you think that's a potential? No. I think they're sold on Brock. $200 million or something like it. Yeah, that's a lot of cash. That is a lot of cash. Good thing to Max getting him wins, though,

and obviously when Brock Purdy comes back, we'll be excited to see him, but that is an interesting situation, brewing. Which is a good one, by the way, not a bad record. I've got to give John Lynch credit, man. he's had a hell of a backup quarterback for the last two or three years. You know, when it got Sam, they've always got a guy to see their number one pick or first round pick as the backup.

He's franchise quarterback maker out there, John Lynch. You know, like Sabin would have coaches come into his tree. They'd get a head coaching gig. Obviously, Baker Mayfield's turning offensive coordinators into head coaches, might do that again this year. And then John Lynch, you come in as a backup quarterback, Kyle Shanney, coming in his backup quarterback, you're going to go take over a franchise after this. You're welcome. Congratulations.

That's a beautiful thing to be having over there. Yeah, incredible. and having CMC to kind of wrap the whole thing together is even better. Kittle said Shanahan told the entire team like, hey, the game playing is Christian McCaffrey. This is going to be a Christian McCaffrey game. What does that mean when you're a head coach telling your team something like that? This five-star game, baby. And the five-star is getting a rock every way we can get it to him.

And they are, they're struggling at wide receiver, you know, and having Kiddle back help. But, man, he put on a show in this game. It was fun to watch. They haven't been able to run the ball all year. really till this game is that kiddo makes a big when you can block the edge it just changes the whole running game whatsoever if you're stuck between the tackles and they can condense you all day long but when you can block the edge stretch it and hit the middle that's hard to defend the five star game is uh want to be a speeches you know there's five stars there's the other guys okay sometimes the

five stars kind of counter each other okay this ain't about the five stars they're all going to kind of counteract each other you other guys going to have to win this fucking game okay that is the speech. And then whenever it's the five-star game, it's like, hey, our guys are better than their guys. Our guys got to go win the game. Pretty simple strategy. Yeah. And the message gets through very clear to the team. It's like, all right, these are the guys. We'll continue digitally. We have an entire conversation with the state of the NBA with Commissioner Adam Silver and also more breakdown of the news. That's AJ. I'm Pat. We'll see you tomorrow. Goodbye. I think it was off like half a second. And on that note, I feel like we really had

home run there. We were covering something. Not just me. We were covering something there until about 17 seconds before the hard out. That was great work by you. B.A., you're a TV host. You are. Did you know that? You're a TV host out here, brother. You're killing it. Absolutely crushing. We're giving out game balls to people. Love it. Bro, you. How about this Joe Flacco shit? It's the best thing ever. It really is. Yeah. We are fans of Joe Flack. Yeah. Oh, yeah. So, like, we obviously love everything that's happening. Let's go to Hammer. Don, time. Tone, whenever Joe Flacco gets traded. the Cincinnati Bengals, your immediate

reaction was to tie to stop being so dramatic. It's not the Sunday game, that's the Thursday game that is going to be the problem. That was certainly the case for the Pittsburgh Steelers. But as Pittsburgh Steelers fans, you don't have the same fear that it sounds like Steelers coaches have of the big bad

Joe Flacco coming in and doing his thing in the AFC North? No, because, I mean, I've watched him turn the ball over a million times to the Steelers in the playoffs. And he never had Jamar and T though. He was never thrown at Jamar and T. I didn't know that. That's a good point. I just realized that.

So, yeah, I am worried then. Sounds like he's a little bitter about it. I think he might be. A lot of errors headed up there at Andrew Barry, man. What the fuck are you doing? And Andrew Barry's like, that's why I did it. Pittsburgh's up in arms. Sorry about it.

I'd rather screw the Browns than help the Bengals. I'm excuse me, fuck the Steelers. The Browns are all about fucking the Steelers. It ain't got nothing to do. Bengals, there are buddies, they're down the road down there. Hey, let's help them fuck the Steelers. Okay, it does feel like that was kind of the move. Oh, yeah.

And it started with paying Miles Garrett $40 million. It starts paying a quarterback $230 million. Then trading a starter in the division just to try to take down the city. It does feel like there is a little bit of from ownership down the Andrew Barrett. Hey, if you want to, if it grinds the gears a little bit of the Pittsburgh Steelers, we're okay with that. That is okay. And once again, that's great for football. if new cities are doing that to each other.

We love everything. That's AFC North football, literally in a nutshell. Yeah, another great kind of in this conversation when it comes to quarterbacks like this. I mean, Andy Dalton going for the Panthers at home against Buffalo after he, Andy Dalton got Buffalo into the playoffs all those years ago by beating the Ravens. And not to mention Brandon Bean and most of their front office comes from Carolina. Like the older quarterback, like Joe Flacco, Aaron Rogers, and Andy Dalton. and are starting football games in 2025 next week.

Like, that is insane to think about. It's a great time to be a lot, maybe. Oh, yeah. It's the matcha or the three ensemble Cado Cephora of the FACET that I just need to denishe who energize o'clock? Mm, it's all right.

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Choose security solutions from TELUS for peace of mind at home and online. Visit TELUS.com slash Total Security to learn more. Conditions apply. Hello, beautiful people. And welcome back to our humble abode, the Thunderdust. On this BA day, October 21st, 2025, however three of the program, begins now. Football! That's 47 years.

football coach, B.A., obviously, with a great cadence there. That's A.J. Hawk. You know, we haven't talked about it. So I think now is a good time to talk about it. AJ's hair looks cool. It does. AJ, your hair looks cool. Have you figured out what you're going to do? Is this what you're going to do with it going forward? Because you used to be scalp to straight back.

Then you changed your face completely with a whole new, we're growing this thing out. Thought maybe you're going back to draft Hawker, going back to all the time leading tackler for the Packers, Hawker, the long hair. Then you start shaping it a little bit. We want to let you know, we think it looks very good. You should be incredibly confident with what's going on on your head right now. Oh, thank you. Yeah, I don't know.

Who knows? I haven't put much thought until I just get a little low fade now and we'll see what happens. Who knows? I like that age. You got a barber. You got a routine. You go low fade. Shave the face up a little bit. I'll live your life. Yeah, of course. I mean, you I know you've been shaving your face lately.

That's a thing now. A new thing for you. Do you actually use like a razor, like our dad's used to do back in the day? No, I got that metal, the foil. Yeah, the zero. Okay, yeah. Yeah, the zero foil. Yeah, I used hair clippers on mine.

I used to use the hair clippers just straight across. Yeah. Yeah, so I used to do that, but it was always like a little stabby. This one gets it down to like your babies, babies fresh, you know, smooth in there. You could do it in the shower, too. Take that thing into the shower. Yeah. It goes like that.

Tough to get some spots. As a new shaver, not really. This is very difficult here. It's kind of, I don't know how you guys do it. I'm gonna be honest. I still yet to accomplish it. Every once in while, there'll be like a 7 p.m. shed or not even a 5 o'clock shab in both my jaws. Then I start thinking to myself,

wait, does it actually give me a little bit more of a jaw line in my shading at the shadows? Yeah, by adding the shade. So then I started telling myself, don't even worry about shaving it. And then I started looking like an asshole. So it's a whole new world for me doing the shaving, but I am I'm enjoying the process. I do like it.

I mean, never doing it before. It kind of gives once I become a fat ass again, post, holidays, probably won't see it. You see the beard, be back. Right now it's been nice to have a little baby face. The talks at tables here at Boston Connor, at Ty Schmidt. Conman basketball starts this season. Good luck to your Celtics and good luck to all

the boys trying to go ahead and get to the top of the commissioners cup first and then to the NBA title at the end of the season. Yeah, it'll be cool for the other teams. I think for both of us, both the Pacers and the Celtics, it's a little bit of, we'll see what happens type season. But like, Kevin Durand on the Rockets, I am pumped to see what that's all

about tonight. I think that'll be a pretty sweet. And then, you know, the other one with Jimmy Butler. Jimmy Butler, full season with Golden State tonight. It'll kind of be the start of their new era with those guys. It'll be a good season. There's the odds on favor to Oklahoma City Thunder who are the reigning champions or the favorites to do again. They paid everybody.

That was on their team. They're all back. And obviously, Oklahoma City has proven to be an incredible home court advantage as well with the way they've got to go. And plus 200 to win the championship. Cavs plus 650, Nugs, Knicks, Rockets, Lakers, Clippers, Timberwolves,

Orlando Magic and the Warriors round out the top 10. And the Celtics still sitting there pretty because they got Missoula and they just put on a clinic against the media, the coaches. Yeah, if you're going to bet on them, it's kind of a cash out situation. You can get them at really good odds there. Missoula and Jalen Brown will help him, you know, win a bunch of games, then Tatum will come

back and those odds will change drastically. So you should bet on it and then cash out of it. Yeah, they're talking about Tatum coming back. Crazy because the initial reports are like, he's done, he's done, he's done, he's done, and he's like, I never said that. Yeah, exactly. That is crazy. How many months would the playoffs be?

Sorry, how many months would the playoffs be from post-surgery? From post-surgery, yeah, it would be, yeah, 10, 11 months, I think. I think it was the number I saw was 10 months. Because I'm watching it, obviously, because Tyrese is like two months behind. So, like, what we, you know, like daughter's two years old, when out and about you see a kid, and the kid's like three years old. I've always asked, hey, how old is your child here? Three, okay, so I'm watching.

Okay, so that's where she's headed to, you know, because there's, like, little steps in that whole thing. Same thing with Tyrese and Tatum. I'll see something, a video come out of Tatum. I'm like, okay, immediately call Tyrese. Hey, are we working on getting it standing dunking? Like, Haydham is able to do right now. He's like, yeah, I'm moving, you know.

So he's probably chasing that as well. I assume they're in constant contact. But it's crazy with the Achilles that it's still just assumed, like, hey, you're going to be out for a long time. And I think the worst part of it is you can move a little bit. And that's like a part of the problem. Like, no, you really can't. And we're seeing Aaron kind of come back from now like two years later.

Kevin Durant was able to bounce back quick, I think, is what everybody kind of hopes for, especially as an older player, a superstar player, and he continued at that level. The Achilles is difficult, though. I think it's a tough one, obviously. Absolutely, especially for these big guys. We've got to run on fucking hardwood for however many games a year. But with those odds, I'm surprised the Mavericks are so low. We know Kyrie, he won't be starting off the season healthy, but number one pick,

you got Anthony Davis there. You got some depth, and are they behind the Boston Celtics? Am I saying that correct? Longer odds than the Celtics. Surprising to me. Once again, Missoula will take Cooper Flag and, I mean, he'll break his back and choke him out of him. Yeah, Jalen Brown. He said if him and Jalen Brown were getting in the fight, who would win, he'd say, oh, I don't know, because we both die, because I'm not dying alone.

Okay. He'd be one seat. NBA coaches, I think. For sure. Oh, yeah. Interesting. Carlisle has real killer vibes, though. Yes, he does.

He would pick kind of the McDonald field. Sure. Missoula is out there. J.J. Reddick, who. Yeah, a bit of a dog. Jay J.J. Reddick will fight till death, I think, if we had to put it.

I'm guessing Coach Spoh's just very scrappy. Yeah. No team of USA coach, so I would hope that he would be willing to go till day. You know, I think we don't give enough credit to the toughness of basketball players. Let's not get crazy. Okay, let's not get it. Let's not outdo ourselves here. But I think there is a little bit more to that league than just a bunch of divas that don't work hard.

And I'm thankful for this season to get going. And maybe the Pacers, are able to figure it out obviously coach b a is here there's some news coming out of the NFL world because the owners are having their meetings right now which i don't think we knew about we should have been on top of that we apologize woodie johnson was asked about the state of the jets and the state of his head coach aaron glen in his first year here and obviously as you recall erin rogers uh this past off season flew from los angeles to new jersey to meet with the new head coach and gm and the way he tells the story is that thing ended before it even started

Aaron Glenn said, we're going in a different direction, basically kicked him out of the building. And Aaron said, well, what the fuck I fly out here for? You could tell me this on the phone. Now Aaron Glenn, obviously, after a rough start with the New York Jets, is getting a lot of heat, a lot of conversation. Woody Johnson was tasked with asking some questions or answering some questions. Here's what he had to say from Tom Rock at Newsday Sports. What's your confidence level in Aaron to turn it around? It looks like he's turning around parts of it.

You know, it's hard when you have a quarterback with, you know. with a rating that we've got, you know? I mean, he has the ability, but something just is not jiving. But if you look at any head coach of the quarterback like that, you're going to see similar results if you go across the league. You have to play consistently with, you know, at that position. And that's what we're going to try to do for the remainder of the season. So what gives you hope then?

I just think defense special teams are doing. better. Defense is pretty good. If we can just complete a pass, it would look good. You've got to complete some path. You've got to convince them that you can do something. Otherwise, it's hard to have a game that you can win.

What do you say to the fans with loss? So, yeah, what do you want this guy to do? Our quarterback stinks. It's kind of what would he talk? confidence there for the QB, man, that's tough. Pay them $20 million a year. You've got to be able to just complete a pass, you know, like that is something you've got to be able to give confidence to the coaches in calling it,

and we appreciate that in real time being reported from the owner's meetings. But yeah, I appreciate the fact that Woody Johnson's like, you guys think Aaron Glenn's a problem? Fucking look at the quarterback that I paid $20 million a year after we kicked Aaron Roders out here. That's an interesting dilemma, but I think it is the truth that we're all kind of seeing with this Jets team, but it's tough coming from ownership is probably how Justin Fields is feeling.

Yeah, I guess what were expectations for the Jets coming into this year? Like, okay, somehow if they had won one or two games so far this year, would we be okay and people wouldn't be questioning his job or what? Paid Garrett Wilson, paid Justin Fields $20 million, paid sauce Gardner, have a good defense. Aaron Glenn's coming in, we assume, with a brand new mindset for the entire building. They were obviously very focused on turning that place around and trying to become a contender and a winner. And then it's just same old Jets stuff, I think is what Jets fans would say. But I would like to say, okay, even though Aaron Rogers, Tuesday was something that we were very lucky to be a part of,

we didn't mind Aaron Glenn moving on from Aaron Rogers. We didn't mind the decision to kind of go ahead and have your own team. So I think it's going to take a couple years, obviously, to have to change a culture at a place, but I think everybody was hoping that they'd be able to do it quicker. What are your thoughts on what Woody Johnson said there about the reality of the Jets series? It's going to be hard to go in that locker room right now as the owner. And look at your quarterback, if you're still the quarterback. I would think they're going with Tyrod Taylor the rest of the year.

Yeah. I mean, after that. After that, for sure. Tyrod just about beat the Bucks a couple weeks ago down in Tampa. Last second field goal when the Bucks win, the Jets are close. They're getting closer, and I like what he said. Defense special teams, they're doing better job, but they've got to let the tie rod go with the rest of the year.

Rapsheet reported another quote coming from Woody. I do believe in Aaron. If I were a player, I'd respond to him. There's no BS. There's no agendas. because Aaron Glenn's trying to bring a whole new culture to the Jets. How do you feel about what just happened there, D.B. I mean, that was tough to hear that from, like, everything NBA said, it would be tough.

I mean, he's still on the team, so he's not going anywhere. But speaking on your quarterback like that, the guy you just paid, that's rough. But to you guys' point, the defense have given up, what, 13 points back-to-back week. So that's something to build on. And defense at some point, that's going to wear the bad offense is going to wear it on your defense as well. So they've got to figure it out offensively. and it's been a shit show in New York for a long, long time. I don't know who was recording this kid,

but somebody caught this poor kid walking out of a Jets game, and he was like, man, I was born in this shit. I'll be a Jets fan for the rest of my life, but it's horrible. And that's been a state of Jets for a long, long time. So it'll take some time to figure it out. But at this point, what's today's day? October 21st, I still believe in Aaron Glenn.

I'll give him some time. Me too. Me too. AJ, you? Yeah, you got the guy, you got to have at least a season in an off season. that was awesome figure things out yeah that was we need a little bit more of those yeah you know but we've seen this team this organization suck the soul out of somebody robert solid didn't

smile for five years yeah okay and he was the guy that was all over the field yeah for the san francisco 49ers and he's back so i like seeing that from maren glen but he knew what he was signing up for he took the new york jets coaching job yeah exactly yeah he knew exactly what he was signing up for you would assume and uh tyrod taylor much like Joe Flacco, he'll do it. And there's a reason why he's still in the league right now. Like everybody talks about these older players. Why they have his older? Because

these fuckers are good at football. And they also know a lot about it. So if the Jets are able to somehow maintain on the offensive side, and their defense and special teams are able to do some shit, Aaron Glenn steals some wins, goes into the offseason, everything's on the up and up. Let's find our quarterback for the future. Let's go ahead and do this. And the Jets

fans will be all the way back. Michael Cole, yeah, we got our culture back. We're a tough team. You year and glenn. And then I fear, then I fear that next year comes, and then all of a sudden it'll be some new shit that they'll figure out. And that's what Jets fans fear as well.

There's just always some new shit that's going to come down from the clouds and rain on the New York Jets' success. Is how Jets fans feel? That's going to be a tough culture to change, brother. That's going to be a tough culture to change. It takes some time. I'm wondering, how's Greenie doing? Is Greenie all right?

Have we checked on him lately with the jet? He just completely just give up. I think he's packed it in. Yeah, this is normal. This is normal Jets. Could you imagine I'm listening to that Woody Johnson quote there for the first time? Do we have to say that? I don't know if we have to say that.

There's some things we probably don't have to say publicly, but I guess that's one of them that we just need to let fly as the ownership of the New York Jets, which a lot of people have brought in the question. A lot of people have said ownership is part of the problem. And we're not going to say that this particular answer is part of the problem, but we do know you're not hearing other owners throw the quarterback under the bus in most situations. Certainly not. So that's certainly an outlier.

Yeah, and that's the thing about when they signed Fields. It wasn't like, oh, this is stupid. Like Fields won a bunch of games for the Steelers last year. So you kind of thought that they were going to go with the running offense during the clock and then, you know, it turns out they're trying to throw it and they can. And, you know, maybe this is an MCDC umbrella type thing. Any really, really poopy organization you go to, it's going to take some time. Ben Johnson would be the outlier because, you know, that setup was kind of perfect for.

We also probably should have known when multiple people came on the show and they said that the Jets formula for winning every game was like, they got to win 1310 every single week. Like they got to play from ahead. If they're down by 10 points, they're going to be screwed because they can't, you know, throw the ball the way that they're going to want. It's like the NFL's not like that. We had teams scoring 30 to 40 points every week.

So it wasn't exactly a stroke of confidence going into the season, but it's New York. So, you know, people get excited. How's Graney feeling? Well, we have some tweets from him during games. For the second consecutive week, Aaron Glenn chose to let the half end without attempting Hailberry. with a team that didn't score a touchdown in either game. It's an excusable. Hashtag Jets.

Seems like Graney's already on his way out of this whole thing. And Woody Johnson's reading his tweets. I agree, man. But what do you want him to do? The guy can't complete a pass. You think we're going to do a Hail Mary? Every throw is a Hail Mary. We're running bubble screams and we're calling him Hail Marys over there with Justin Fields.

Good luck to the Jets and Justin Fields. Don't worry about it. He's paying you. Check with cash. This is the last time Jets have been like good. I know Rex Ryan. September 11th, 2020. three, first four games, or four plays.

Do you remember that? I do. The entrance? That was sweet. They were good. Yeah, it was Fitzmagic, 2015, Brandon Marshall, Eric Decker. That was the last time I think they won 10 games or nine games, and it was Todd Bulls, I think. How about you, during your 47 years of coaching, 27 in the NFL?

How many of those decades were the Jets like good? Two at least. Do you remember, like a... Curtis Martin. Curtis Martin. Curtis had a little run. Curtis Martin, all those guys, and Vinny. Rex Ryan.

Sanchez took him to the ASC championship. We played him in the championship game at Pittsburgh. Yeah, we played him as well. Dougie O'Brien missed that field go. Oh, yeah. Who? It was Herman Edwards. Yeah.

Who missed the field goal? Doug O'Brien. I remember him. He was a kicker for the Saints, and he was up at Jets, and it was like 10 below zero. and we ended up winning that game. Rex Ryan had them rolling. I think that was Herm.

I think Herb was head coach that year. So you need somebody that's pretty, you know, feels like you have to take on that entire thing. You talk about Herm, obviously, very, what would that? So why you play the game, baby. Extrovert. I think he was a good extrovert. Rex Ryan, obviously, big time.

Aaron Glenn has a lot of dog mentality. It feels like that might be the style of coach that you need to be able to win at the Jets. that Rex Ryan run was fun. That was a fun time. That was ground and pound and defense. They had a great defense weekend and weekend. That was the year, actually, that was the second year,

was 14 and 2. They can't wait that moment. It came into New England one and then went to the AFC championship. But, you know, that was a few years. And then you talked about Curtis Martin in that era back then. But like, as far as like sustained, you know, the Giants, you know, they have a run now where it's been a shit show. But we all can remember when the Giants,

and won a couple of Super Bowes did their things. Like the Jets, man, it's been a long, long time. On that note, Nick Mangled, pulling for you, brother. Yeah, yeah, Nick. I know we shouldn't, like, expect updates all the time. I think next update could come in, like, November, I think, is what he said. For the next month or so, he has to go through dialysis. I think we'll get a heads up in November.

We're obviously, hey, Nick, we love you, dude. We absolutely love you. And I think from this all, there's going to be incredible awareness. of, like, what organ donors or being a donor can do for other people's lives. Obviously, Nick, but many others that are currently waiting for anything in the hospital. So we love you, Nick. Nick was a great thing for the Jets. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. Lovable. He was the leader. That was the only player for a while for New England. It's like, well, the Jets suck, but they do have Nick Mangold. And then when Sanchez and, you know, Chris Ivory and those boys started running and going to those AFC championships. Atlet Fenica. Yeah, Fanica.

Yeah. Oh, I forgot about Fannico. Debrichita. Yeah, Debrich and the Charleston. Woody? Well, yeah, Damien, Woody, right, was also on that team. Here's how you can help Nick Mangled. You can scan that QR code or go to

Columbia Surgery.org, forward slash kidney dash transplant. Sign up at the link, and then you'll get some tests to see what your blood type is, and then they'll let you know who you can help, whether it's Nick Mangled or many others that are looking for any type of help and just kind of waiting, literally, for somebody to help them save their lives. Nick Mangled is one of those people. Type O Blood. There are many others as well. Hopefully that story will inspire people to give back.

Now, before we run the Adam Silver conversation, which is great. We have to do some sort of giveaway, don't we? Do we have do some sort of giveaway, AJ? Is B.A. going to putt again? Because, I mean, that was flawless performance. I don't know if we should have B.A. do anything after the four puts ever again. You know, it's kind of difficult for this attorney. Yeah, first day of NBA, we could have DeBone, maybe, or one of D. Bone and But to maybe shoot one of the U.Ball shots.

Yeah, the bone and butt team, yeah, put them out. Yeah, bound and butt team. When was the last time you guys played with bone and butt? When did you guys last time? I was Wednesday. It was we didn't play yesterday. You guys, you know, ducked the smoke yesterday. Yeah, had some things to figure out.

Got a lot going on in life right now. A lot of business. D-Bound throwing a U-Balls right way to do this. Hell, yeah, bone. Hey, DeBound, will you please step out here to the U-Ball court in the middle of the Thunderdome? Your presence is a necessity at this point for a giveaway. Now, D. Bona is a champion of U-Ball in the past. He is not currently the champion.

That championship basketball obviously resides right here on my desk down there. Down left right there. It is a bedazzled ball. Sweet. Fantastic shot to the NBA sending it. Boom, right there. Boom. That is a bedazzled ball.

That is perfect for the U-ball title, actually. That would be a U-ball if it wouldn't shatter if we were to shoot it. Somebody took a lot of time on that. We are very grateful for the NBA sending that to us. is currently me and Foxy's. Hell, yeah. Okay, so as it's won, it'll move. Yeah, it'll move.

Yeah, it'll move. Nice. Probably not, though, like, because me and Foxy got it figured out. Will D-Bone have it figured out? Will he be able to win 25 people, $500? Coach, will you please give D-Bone a D-3 national champion offensive linemen? Little maybe words of encouragement before he attempts the impossible, which is make one U-ball shot from the opposite free throw line.

Go ahead, coach. Okay, now, brother, we had this opportunity. Not long ago. Never know you didn't give that opportunity. Make the best of it, my man. Boom. We only have right now, D-Bone. 25 people could win to $500.

Let it fly. Take a deep breath, says Coach Mee-A. Shoot any of them? What's that? Nope. No, he throws him. He only throws them. Okay. Foot's not on the line.

Jesus, correct. Why don't you shoot? Oh! Holy shit! That's my partner. Count it. Count it. Count it.

25 winners of $500. All you're going to do is repost that miracle. Wow. Go buy a lottery ticket right now, Deep. Say something nice to somebody and put the easiest way to pay you. DeBone, that was spectacular. Wow.

If you were playing against me and Foxy, the champs, we would have batted that shit or dunk that shit so quick. But for the people, you stepped up and made it happen. Coach, B.A., what an incredible speech. What a way to motivate that guy. Wow. What a shot, what a bounce.

What a day. Congrats to DeBone. congrats to the 25 random winners and also shout to the NBA launching in beautiful fashion. AJ, you're the man. We appreciate the hell out of you. Boys in the back, great work.

Coach, B.A., we love you. We'll see you next week. Thank you for joining us. And here is a state of the NBA conversation with the commissioner of the NBA, Adam Silver. Congratulations. Another NBA season tipping off today. Thank you.

Thank you very much. How do you feel? Obviously, we've got some new media rights deals going on. We got some younger generation of stars about to take over the league potentially. What are your thoughts as you embark on another journey to an NBA championship here? I'm feeling great. I mean, as you said, it's an interesting blend of old and new, just beginning on the media side.

NBC's back, of course. It's been 23 years since we were there on their air. For your viewers, we saw the Today Show this morning. They had John Tesh on. They brought back Round Ball Rock. So that's wonderful. And with Round Ball Rock came Michael Jordan, so he's going to be on tonight. NBC telecast being interviewed by Mike Terrico.

But maybe more importantly on the basketball side, you know, as I said, we got, you know, Oklahoma City thinks, you know, they're going to be right back there this year. But, of course, we've had seven different champions over the last seven years. So, you know, people always ask me this question, is that what you want, a different champion every year? And I said, no, you know, we just want the best competition. We want a system where everybody has a fair shot. But if, you know, great GMs like Sam Presti can put together an organization that can

win, you know, multiple championships, you know, great, you know. So I, but you got Wembe back in San Antonio. You got Cooper Flag in Dallas. You got J.L. Brunson, who's, I think, it would be right up there competing for an MVP this year in New York. So, you know, and, and sorry about the Pacers. Yeah, okay. They're going to fight their way through it. But Tyrese, I mean, you know, it was heartbreaking, obviously, to see him go down in game seven. But, you know, he and I've been texting back and forth. He's going to be right back there. I think that's the thing about you that we respect, especially from the NFL world and understanding what the commissioner's job is and how it's not an easy one. Now, the NBA's relationship with the commissioner is clearly

different than maybe the NFL, but it does feel like you really care about ball and the players. The fact that you're texting with Tyrese, obviously we're thankful for. Jason Tatum, also another megastar that's going to be out missing a lot. But whenever you talk about Cooper Flag and Jalen Brunson and all these stars, let alone Aunt who's a megastar in Wembe, and then you got Kevin Durant. Then you got the OG still kind of around Booker. And then LeBron James out for a little bit. How do you kind of view, you talk about it in a transition area,

but as a commissioner, obviously you would like the next generation to kind of take the next big step. Is that kind of goals for this season as you lay them out from a league? It's like, all right, we'd like our young stars kind of do their thing. It's in their hands potentially in the next couple years. Let's see what we have going forward. Is that something that the league thinks about or you think about? Absolutely. By the way, I should say, you know, I'm a Duke guy. So with Jason Tatum, you know, in his spare time now, as he's recovering from his injury, he's been named, like, I forget the exact title, but he's got a Duke basketball title now. So he's helping recruit and run the program down there. So I mean, these guys are keeping busy in college, even when they're not on the floor. But to answer your question, in terms of old and new, I mean, look at Luca. I mean, you know, I don't know if you guys have seen sort of his transformed body. You know, he completely.

trained himself, you know, over the, in the off season, you know, he was obviously upset with the trade, but I think is using it as motivation now to show everybody that he's one of the greatest in the game and wants to be viewed as one of the greatest ever. You know, at the same time, like then having him play with LeBron, who, you know, he's out just for maybe a few weeks now, but no doubt has one of the greatest work ethics ever. I mean, I'm always saying to the younger players, it's a combination. Part of it is, you know, your God-given talent. Part of it is, you know, the training and coaching you get, the mentorship to be put in that position.

But once you're in the league, the really great ones, and you know from the NFL have these incredible work ethics. I think people don't understand, like, how hard a player like LeBron works to be able, it's about to be 41, to play at that level for that long. So, yeah, you know, they're going to get dinged up along the way. He's got a little injury now. But I'm hoping for a much younger player like Luca, he realizes that there's a lot more to it than just having. that talent that in that experience that you see what a guy like LeBron is actually doing. And by the way, you know, some of these Olympic teams I've been with around over the years when these stars come together.

I mean, I can remember in 2008 in China, like when some of the younger players were getting an opportunity to see Kobe's work ethic, you know, where they were meeting in the morning and Kobe was coming back from like a 5.30 a.m., you know, training session, you know, And he was coming in with towels wrapped around him. And guys were, like, rubbing the sleep out of their eyes. And like, where's he coming from? You know, and like, that matters. And when guys see what it takes to be, you know, truly great, you know.

And I think we've all had that experience that, you know, you sort of, whether it's in sports or whether it's in business, you know, when you start meeting other mentors, you say, well, that's what they do, you know, and you realize that so much of it is you have to have good luck, you have to have good health and certain talent. but that it ultimately comes down to that work ethic. And it's something that for the NBA, the WMBA, it's what we try to teach all the younger players. I mean, broadly, you know, in all our programs, that a minuscule percentage of players are going to be fortunate as you were to play at the highest level, you know,

whether top college programs or top pro programs. But like, that rub off of those values that come from sports, it's truly remarkable. Yeah, sports help people. people in everyday life. I think you have to be a team sport person to do anything. Like my daughter, obviously, she's a dog and I can't wait to watch her, but she's going to play team sports because she's going to learn a lot of things through that that she's going to carry into her life. I agree with that. And I think after watching the NBA more and also getting to know

a lot of these NBA guys, there used to be, I think, kind of a narrative about the NBA players being soft. You know, these guys are soft because there was a, you know, they're resting some games, they're not resting some games. And then you meet these guys that are at the top. And it's like, these are dogs through and through. And you go back. through the history of the game. I mean, you guys got them on NBC's coverage. Give me, give me the basketball. Give me. Because I'm going to dunk it. Yeah, we can't wait for that, obviously, with MJ being back, but that mom, the mentality

you talk about. And then I can echo that sentiment about, like, I had Adam Vitari. Okay, I had Adam Vititari literally on the same team. It's like, hey, what does this guy do? And I'm just going to try to do that. The NBA does feel like a family whenever it comes to that type of thing. And I think you guys are in a great. spot just from what I've witnessed and the people that I've gotten a chance to chat about. And your league's a fun league to be a fan of at this exact moment, especially with all the different media

broadcast partners and also you leaning into the digital side of things, which I respect and appreciate because you guys are a digital league. You guys take over the internet. On that note, Rushmore on X, Dunkers is available now. Have you seen this? Shack and Reggie Miller put up their Mount Rushmore's of Dunkers throughout

the history of the game? We'll send it over to you to get your opinion on it. It is a fantastic combo. about the history of basketball, basically, and rim rocking. So I like where your league's at. I assume you do as well. Now, the world that we're in is a little bit different than maybe 15, 20 years ago, especially with all eyes on the money side of things during these games.

Go ahead, Dee Budge. Yeah, Adam, with the huge growth of the game and obviously growth of sports betting as well, I can't wait to put a 12 game team parlay together tonight. But how do you balance, I guess, protecting, I know, sorry, protecting the integrity of the game And how do you balance that with the growth and obviously the relationships that you have with these sports betting partners? You know, interestingly enough, I think in the modern digital era, the choices between legalized sports betting or illegal sports betting, not do you want sports betting or not? And so ultimately our view has been that since we know there's going to be enormous betting on sports out there, there always has been lots of illegal betting when I was younger. but it was much more difficult before the internet you'd have to meet someone on the corner or there were betting slips things like that or you had an old school bookie of course now you can just bet on your phone so on one hand with this regulated structure of legalized betting we can monitor it in ways that were unimaginable years ago that if there's any aberrational behavior people betting large numbers who hadn't historically done so just opening an account to place bets or even the geo-target

We know exactly from where the bets are being placed. I mean, very specifically, if you're in an arena and place a bet, we know you're in the arena. In many cases, we know where in the arena you are when you place that bet. So, sort of analogize to a stock market where there's, you know, of course, there's a legal framework, but there's a lines that make activity illegal, like insider trading, for example. And so you have potentially the equivalent in sports where somebody may have inside information. information it may it could be a player and though the worst case scenario is a player who's trying to impact their own performance for a bet or it may be

people around a player and it may be unintentional on the part of a player but somebody who's around the player knows that the player isn't feeling well or isn't going to play even though that hasn't been announced yet so you know we have a framework a structure in place to monitor to prevent those kinds of things are happening so that there is that the information is available to potential betters so that it's it's a level playing field in terms of placing those bets but it is no question it introduces a whole new set of issues one of the issues you see if you in arenas and I hear from players and coaches on this are fans I mean who are yelling out about you know

especially when it's a profit yeah yeah you know but it's often the case that you know you know, your team wins and a player scores, you know, 25 points, but the fan better had bet that the player was going to score 28 points or 30 points or whatever else. So I would say one thing, we sent a memo out to our teams recently, and we made it clear in conversations with them that we want to see strict enforcement of those rules. I mean, we have to protect the competitors. You know, we want to protect the environment in the arena, the people getting out of hand. I mean, but as I said, we accept betting is legal in roughly 35 states now in the United States. It's unlikely to go away. I think probably there should be more

regulation, frankly. It may be surprising to hear from me. I wish there was federal legislation rather than state by state. I think you've got to monitor the amount of promotion, the amount of advertising around it. And also, we've pulled back, you know, it's not completely in our control, but we've asked some of our partners to pull back some of the properties. bets, especially when they're on two-way players, guys who don't have the same stake in the competition, where, you know, it's too easy to manipulate something which seems otherwise small and inconsequential to the overall score, maybe, you know, the couple rebounds that some player, you know, gets or whatever. So, you know, we're trying to put in place and

learning as we go and working with the betting companies, some additional controls to prevent sort of some of that manipulation. I think that's a really good defense. Getting rid of that kind of smaller, obscure bets. Like, hey, do we really need this to even be a potential distraction? One and a half rebound. Or a potential setup. Like, I respect that you're trying to figure out and navigate this as it's happening in real time.

Do you feel the, and you said you wanted it to be strict on the fans in the environment, very intimate, very, very intimate, the NBA. I mean, there's been a couple times where I felt like I was sitting on a bench, you know, and it's like, now, granted, I loved it. I enjoy being there. Let's go, boys. Let's kind of do our thing. Give me a microphone. Maybe not. Let's not do that. Maybe I just sit here and talk to the group here. John Mellencamp's going to be pissed. But there is a very intimate relationship between the NBA and its fans, I think, in the arenas. That's a part of the allure, I think. Hey, come watch these six foot eight, six foot nine tall guys, run back and forth, dunk it, bring the kids out.

You'll even maybe get a high five as they're jogging through the thing. And on the flip side of that, when it's not a family or a little kid and somebody that's pissed off about the amount of turnovers you have. had. And instead we got a win, but should be happier in a mean. I can see how that could get a little loud. And there's been, you know, NBA and players and fans' interactions before. I don't know how it doesn't have them more often. Just strictly because Bruce, I've seen Bruce at an NBA game

and he's a problem. He's a New York Knicks fan and he's a good shit talker and he is very okay doing it right to T.J. McConnell's face and they're like three feet away. In real life, T.J. McConnell potentially knock Bruce Brown out, especially with his punchable looking face.

But instead, T.J. talks back and they keep it moving. It's a beautiful part of your sport. I'm happy to see that you want to keep it a safe thing for everybody. And when it comes to the gambling, do you feel like you have to set a precedent now with this? Because, like, to the players, obviously, do you feel like we got to kind of make sure we nip this in a butt before it gets big? Or are like you all just kind of riding the wave together to see what fits this situation best each time? Well, you know, we deal obviously case by case with anything. comes up but I think we've made it clear our players and I think Andre Aguadalu's head of the

player association you know former all-star champion himself knows that there's nothing more important than the integrity of the competition so for if a player steps over the line I mean there's been players I think as you know who've been banned from the game because of betting we had you know we you know we monitor really closely there's signs in every locker room you know we we've continuing education throughout the year just so guys know that you know it's a really bright line. Because the problem with all those prop bets is that I always worry, you know, I'm sure that there are players who would never, ever think they would want to manipulate the ultimate outcome of the game. They wouldn't want to do that to their teammates. They wouldn't want

to do it themselves, but are thinking, oh, what's the difference if, you know, I've won fewer, more rebound or whatever else? So that's why, you know, we've made it clear there's very strict enforcement that anything you do around betting, you know, just the mere betting on a game, even if it had nothing to do with your particular performance, you know, will result in a suspension, you know, and possibly at the end of your career. So, you know, again, we live in an environment of legalized sports betting. And by the way, not just in the United States, but the NBA is a global league. I mean, remember, when sports betting was legalized in the United States, it was already for decades had been widely legal throughout Europe. Oh, yeah. You know, with, you know, in the old days,

It's all moved to the internet now, but in the old days, you know, you could go to a soccer game in England and they had betting windows, you know, like at a horse track and there were betting parlors throughout London. Again, most of the action is now online, but that's actually a good thing that's online because when people aren't using cash, you have to identify yourself to the betting company, you're putting in a credit card. And again, so if there's something unusual that's happening or if somebody is, and there's a whole separate issue about problem gambling. So let's remove sort of. your regular activity among participants in the game. But then there's people clearly who get sucked in and are betting too much money and are betting over their means. And so there's also ways to monitor those things and to cut those people off if the betting company detects that there's an issue. Yeah, we had some friends that had that happen to them

from Sportsbook. Looking to you again, Bruce. Look at you again, Bruce. And we like that. You know, got him out of a potential spiral, though. And I agree that it's gotten to a much better place in the gambling world. for you guys have to navigate it, we're appreciative of the amount of thought that you put into it because

the integrity of the game is everything. Because what are we betting? What are we watching if we don't, you know, if we don't think that's a big deal. And oddly enough, I mean, even the betters want to be insured that there's integrity behind the data because if they think it's not a level playing field or somebody has

information they don't, they won't bet your sport. Yeah, they're on the take. Listen, if they're going to be on the take, I would like to know that they're on the take so we can do that because then they feel like they're getting bamboozoo. So we appreciate the amount of work that you're putting into that to play defense and also make sure that the NBA will continue to be a sport that we can all, you know, definitely know what's going on wherever we place our wagers on. Now, you brought up Europe there in the gambling culture, but let's talk about the basketball world that's starting to brew over there in Europe. Love what you're doing with the All-Star game format, USA versus the world, basically.

Maybe this will entice people to care a little bit is the hope? Hopefully. Is that kind of the hopes, Adam? Because we all know that it's not just the NBA. Every, the NHL figured out with the four nations. The NHL figured out with four nations, but they were having problems too there for a few years. Baseball obviously has the home run derby. They were going back and forth with like home field advantage in the playoffs.

They kind of got rid of that. The NFL had a problem for a while. It was bad football. It was bad, bad football. Now they try to make it a festival. So these all-star games in festivities aren't the easiest things to nail, okay? You guys saw what the NHL did and thought maybe we'll take a hack at that. saw what the Olympics were for the entire world.

We'll try to pull on that. Maybe find what guys care about. Is that how we got to this point? And what is your expectation for it? Yeah, Pat, exactly. I mean, we try to learn from everybody else. There's no question that what the NHL did in terms of the four nations was incredibly successful. And then in addition, the All-Star game is moving to NBC this year.

And our All-Star game falls smack in the middle of the Winter Olympics. So we want to take advantage of the fact that you have this global international competition. you know, where the country is focused on, you know, on USA, USA, and taking on other countries. So we're going to move to a Ryder Cup type format, again, like taking from golf as well as hockey. And because we have an imbalance in the league of international players to U.S. players, it's roughly 30% of the players who are born outside the United States. We've got to play with the format a little bit. I think where we're likely end up is, you know, around Robin, where you have two U.S. teams and won international

team and then they'll play each other in a round robin. I do. USA versus USA and the finals would be great. I would be celebrated. I think the guys will be motivated because of the Olympic atmosphere they'll be in the middle of because of wanting to play for

their country. And in addition, I would just say on behalf of the players, I mean, last year we were hoping for more. I mean, I think the format didn't quite work, but the players care. And I don't know what, there's something about NBA All-Star game. And even as I was in Europe for a bunch of things this summer, doing some other stuff for the NBA. And I was amazed how many fans came up to me and said,

you know, great, Oklahoma City won, finals were incredible. You got to fix the All-Star. And I think it seems to me to take on disproportionate interest. And I think when we've had bad all-stars, I think maybe a little different from other leagues, it seems to linger longer in this league that, you know, it sort of you referenced it, that it becomes a proxy for how much the players care or their investment in the game. And it seems very unfair to them in ways because sometimes there's just a larger conspiracy that includes all the teams

who don't want their guys to go out and get injured in what seems to be an exhibition game to a lot of people. But I think that the younger generation of NBA players are understanding that All-Star is really meaningful. And it's not necessarily it needs to be played at the level of the finals. But we also don't want to see guys going out there not playing defense and sort of just sort of like bombing away three-point shots the whole game.

I mean, and I think there's a happy medium there. And I'm encouraged this year, as I said, like Andre Aguadal at the Players Association has been great. Terrific individual conversation with players are like, we get it. You know, we're going to be in L.A. this year. It's going to be a big stage. So, again, I'm hoping we can bring back that tradition. I think there's going to be great tradition. And I'm outsider looking into your world.

Dream team was so big for basketball because a lot of people watch basketball for the first time, saw all the stars. they were like the Beatles, right, if that documentary is right whenever they come to town. I think the All-Star Game provides similar opportunity. It's where all the stars are. Some people are maybe only watching that first time really getting to see people. I think that is why it is such a big interest because you guys have such a limited amount of people that can be so good at your sport, and there's only a couple times that we see them all together. Olympics, certainly when we see them all together, we love it.

We all love it. KD. takes over a game. Steph takes over a game. LeBron takes over a game. It's like, here we go. These are all the greats doing everything. Tyree Saliburton's holding it down. holding it down over there in the entirety.

And then whenever we get the All-Stars, the same thing. We see everybody, and then it's just kind of like what it is. So I think that's potentially why your fans are a little bit more passionate about the All-Star game than maybe the NFL. Like, Pro Bowl, I mean, nobody cares about. So it's good that people care, I think. But what you're saying is it's a tough thing to get right. Maybe this will be the right answer on the Internet.

To your point, it would be a worse problem if nobody cared. Bingo. Yeah, yeah. I think it's a good thing. But also, figure it out, Adam, fix it. Figure it out. I need to figure it out. This thing that can only hurt people for the future

as they're trying to win an actual championship and there's a lot of money on the line. Other people are getting arrest. The best players don't get a rest. Go ahead and nobody's dunking. Don't want to hurt themselves. Just, Adam, figure it out, dude. Make it great, okay?

We need that thing to be amazing. Now, you talk about the international team and how great they have got. I'll tell you, I want it to USA versus USA Final. I'm thinking that's probably not going to happen because what's going on overseas with this sport is obviously incredible. Go ahead, Conman. Yeah, Kermas, you just said it, 30% of the players in the NBA are international.

But, I mean, if you look at the MVP's, damn near 100% of the MVPs are international now because I think our last seven. Yeah, the last seven of them. There it is. I thought there was a number there. But the NBA International is huge. NBA Europe is going to be massive. How did you kind of, you know, decide to launch it this year or next year whenever it's launching?

And is there any worry that some of these international players are going to leave the NBA to go to MBA Europe, whether that be, you know, 10 years into their career or even just towards the end? Because you think of guys like Dirk Nowitzky, who, you know, might have gone back to Germany for a year or two. And then you think of all the international players in how much they love their home countries, Janis with Greece, Yokic, Lukah, there's a ton of them. SGA is Canadian. and I don't know if he falls into that category, but still, you know what I'm saying. Is that ever a thought with the NBA Europe? And how excited are you for that launch as a whole?

Yeah, well, so a few things there. I mean, I think if some of those international players decided to either end their career or prolong their career a bit by playing in Europe, I think that would be fantastic. I think for the foreseeable future, the NBA is so big, is so global. The pay is so high. I think it's highly unlikely that any of these players would choose to forego the NBA and to play in Europe. And I think that's kind of the case right now.

I mean, the quality of European basketball is off the charts right now. It's just not commercially successful. And so to your question, why now, I think that you're seeing enormous interest maybe, you know, clearly unprecedented in live premium sports right now. It's being reflected in all the sports. I mean, it's as if other than, you know, honestly, shows like Europe. around sports that people want to consume live or near live because you're talking about such topical issues or the live games themselves they've separated themselves from everything else certainly on traditional television and now people are watching more streaming

than traditional broadcasting and cable and by the way you were mentioning before that pat I mean you were a pioneer there I mean you to have a show that simulcast on ESPN and YouTube and then to then take portions of it and then make those available on social media, it's not that different than what the NBA has become. There's sort of the live aspect of it, and then there's the sort of highlights and other aspects of it that people will watch after the fact. But in terms of Europe, I think we're at the point now where there's just, there's a huge opportunity, both in the quality of the game in Europe, as we're all talking about, you know, 15% of our league now is European, and they represent

some of the very best players. There's enormous interest in the game there. Our numbers, something like over 250 million basketball fans in Europe. It's the number two sport after soccer. And on top of that, there's an opportunity to build an arena infrastructure in Europe. Like even when we were all in Paris for the Olympics, the building there, they did some upgrades for the Olympics, but it doesn't have the sort of amenities that, you know, you see in Indianapolis or you see in our NBA cities where there's a lot of areas for pregame meals, big halftime celebrations, you know, fancy sweets, the whole thing.

And the great thing about arenas, really different from stadiums, is that the top arenas are used, you know, 250, 300 days a year. So it's sort of a separate economic engine for communities. And again, just like you see in Indianapolis, then you can build around it. You have commercial space, you know, retail residential. We saw it in Milwaukee with the new development there. You know, you saw it in L.A. You're seeing it all around the country. They're talking about that in San Antonio right now, moving their arena to downtown.

So a combination of all these factors are coming together. I think we're not all the way there yet. We're working at the league office on, you know, what the right model is, but there's certainly no lack of interest in potential owners. I'm hearing from, you know, a lot of well-known wealthy European families who are interested in American families, institutions who would like to see this happen. So if you look at the gap right now, I mean, soccer is, you know, head and shoulders more popular than any other sport in Europe right now. But basketball follows, like, let's say, this far behind, but the economic gap is like this. I think I just went out of the picture. Yeah, we get the point. And so, you know, right now, the teams, and even some of those well-known soccer brands in Europe, like Real Madrid and FC Barcelona, they field basketball teams, very competitive basketball teams. In fact, you know, Luca Donch has started his career at Real Madrid.

But it's just an – it's a yearly investment or loss. it's not there's no chance they have of making money on those programs and it's not just about making money at the end of the day you know it's the way market economies work if you can generate money you reinvest it you reinvest it in your facilities and your players and your marketing and making the enterprises that much bigger so as i said i mean we're probably a couple years away from being able to launch something in europe but we're spending a lot of time on it we're really lucky for the NBA here in indiana obviously we just explained it ties about to ask a question about that here in a matter of moments, actually, not just here, but many other places. The fact that

you're investing in towns and cities over in Europe for good of your sport, I respect that. I really do. I respect and appreciate that. And also, you talk about the arenas. We're talking about building stadiums in the NFL. You need a lot of space to do that. Arena's a little bit different ballgame. I'm not saying you don't need a lot of space, but the footprint, obviously much smaller in these towns. And if you can get those things up, bring these city around, I don't like what's going on with American basketball's future. Okay, I don't like. I'd say the other issue with stadiums, it's hard to fill them for, you know, whatever the NFL represents, you know, with preseason, I don't know, 10 dates or whatever it is.

You know, maybe you get a Super Bowl occasionally. You better watch what you talk about preseason. There's only so many acts these days. There's only so many Taylor Swift's and Beyonce's or whatever else who can truly fill a stadium, you know, and then some of the roof stadiums, you know, they can bring in some corporate, you know, big sales, you know, organizations coming in. and a few other things like that, but arena business is very different. As I said, like arenas, because of smaller, they're obviously roved facilities.

You can, in many of these buildings, it's like 300 dates a year. They're active. That's good business, brother. And it's what, 16, 17,000, 13,000, 16,000, 17,000, 17,000? Yeah, you know, 17, 18,000. That's a huge audience, though. Like, whenever you talk about, like, stadium everybody's, like, selling out stadiums. And you mentioned Taylor Swift, obviously, she has records all around the world

for how many stadium tickets she's been able to sell. Beyonce obviously does as well. Morgan Wallen filling up stadiums all over the place. Luke Combs, Zach Bryan, but you're right. This is just a Chris Brown can fill up a stadium. You're only talking about a few people. I think Kevin Hart did two stadiums. I think he did a stadium as a comedian.

One time I think Chappelle might have as well. But then you talk about arenas. It's like arenas is a stage that a lot of people can get to. And that's a great payday for these acts. If you sell out an arena. And also it's a great setup. Like this Gainbridge Field, house down here, the green rooms, great stuff. Beautiful. You got food everywhere, easy walk,

easy access for the crowd. Not a bad seat in there. The modern arenas are spectacular. I mean, I think they, it's a recognition as the entertainment business. So you go to a game and part of the whole ambiance of the event is, you know, what are the sweets like? What are the concourses? You know, what kind of retail do they have? Like, think, you know, when I was a kid, certainly it was a hot dog and a pretzel. Now, the food selections off the charts, you know, local specialties, you know, you know, everything you could, you can imagine. And I think that, you know, and in our league, as each new arena comes online, they keep

upping the bar just in terms of, you know, wanting to be part of the festivities there. So, and the issue is in the NBA, it's a recognition that, you know, roughly half the teams are going to be under 500 in any given season, you know, not. every game is gonna light it on fire. So part of, you're going for the experience. And one thing we're seeing change in the arenas is that people want the communal experience, I think more than historically,

where you'd go to a game, you'd sit in a seat, you'd sort of talk to the person on your left, talk the person on your right. Now, if you look what's happening in the arenas, they're creating more common spaces. You know, more mini-sweets, more lounges, sort of overseeing the court,

kind of in a way like a sports bar. But instead of having screens up, you're in a sports bar and big windows are opened up to the court. So you can, you know, singles can go, you can use it to meet people, you can use it to entertain. But, you know, rather than being locked in one spot for two and a half hours at a game, you can be talking to 20 different people. And, I mean, I enjoy doing that at games when I'm in, you know, in sort of one of those areas or in a suite or something, not just, you know, because there's food and stuff up there, but it's an opportunity to talk to a lot of people. Yeah, a lot of people come to your guys' games. I'll tell you what, I appreciate the fact that you're talking about streaming in the future of trailblazing for, you know, rights and deals and everything. Now you're talking about the live event experience.

It's talking about the arena experience versus stadium experience. I'll tell you what, Adam Silver, under that bald head, you got pretty good little brain in there, buddy. You got a pretty good little brain in there playing defense against the gambling or the potential of that. Now, I just mentioned about how Indiana has obviously been very appreciative of what your league has done for us. More specifically over the last few months, that was amazing. Ty has a question for you. Yeah, Commiss, you mentioned Indiana and the Pacers and Milwaukee and obviously Oklahoma Cine winning it all last year.

But when we got the finals match up initially, the only conversation is, oh, this is going to be the lowest rated finals of all time. No one's going to watch this. Is it good for the league when small market teams around the league make deep runs into the playoffs, especially because it sounds like the linear number or like the television numbers really aren't the end-all be-all anymore? Well, so first of all, in terms of those predictions, Oklahoma City, Indiana ended up having more viewers than Dallas Celtics before, and the reason was because the competition was better.

And at the end of the day, we're largely, you know, if markets, the size of Indianapolis and Oklahoma City are considered small markets, were a league of small markets. On the other hand, as the mayor of Oklahoma City, David Holt pointed out last year, Oklahoma City and Indianapolis are larger than roughly 90% of the cities in the United States. So by really any standard for most of your listeners or viewers, they live in smaller cities and towns than Indianapolis and Oklahoma City. So again, from the league standpoint, you know, I've said this before, the goal is to be more NFL-like from that standpoint.

If the, you know, the Steelers, you know, are playing the Browns or whatever, nobody is saying, you know, it's a matchup or Green Bay. If Steelers are playing Green Bay in the Super Bowl, like nobody's ever saying it's a small market Super Bowl. And when in our league, you know, we still carry that title

or that headline going in it's small market. The goal for me is to make it it's about the two best teams playing in the finals. And frankly, in this world now digital media, I mean, look from your standpoint, like you're broadcasting

from Indianapolis, and I've been to your house, so, like, right outside the city. Like, it's irrelevant, right? Like, nobody's going to suggest that you would be more popular if you were in Chicago instead of, I mean, it's almost a ridiculous point. And I think in a digital world, you know, Janus in Milwaukee, you know, winning the MVP, winning a championship, talking to a global audience of billions, which the NBA has. You know, as I've said before, if you went down the road to Chicago, I don't know, an hour and a half drive or whatever it was and there's a million more people in in a world where we're

reaching billions of people it's immaterial and and i think like again hats off to oklahoma city i'm not saying there are some advantages to being in certain markets over others but i think just like the nfl the players ultimately realize in a cap system they're going to make their money based on the quality of their play wherever they go and even in terms of commercial endorsement deals those are going to come, not from the market they're in, but from winning. And so they want to put themselves in winning situations as well. So, you know, I think we've really evolved the league over the last decade or so or longer to where market size is less relevant.

One more interesting statistic. So for the first 65 years of the NBA, three teams won 60% of the championships. And as we've talked about, so now the last 15 years, it's been 11 different teams and seven different teams over the last seven years. So it's like, and it's not a close call when people say, well, don't you miss

those dynasties? Again, you know, as I've said, if Oklahoma City goes on to win two more championships in a row, I'm not going to say, no, I wish there were other teams that were winning. I think that's great,

but they're doing it with a level playing field. You know, it's not, they're not doing it because they're outspending every other team in the league. And I think that's the way it should be. And so, you know,

let, let, let, let, whatever happens with the competition. But I don't think having a few teams dominate the competition year after year is good for the league long term because fans in those other cities don't think their teams have a legitimate shot. And we want, like, this is about hope.

We want teams, you know, we want fans of every team regardless of market size to believe if I have a well-managed team and, you know, and the luck falls our way and the players are remaining good health, that we got a shot to be there. And you've got to believe it, you can't, you know,

it's not any given Sunday. It's a different sport. You know, a single player can have such an outsized impact. We have to be realistic about that. But we also want every city to think they got that same shot at getting that superstar. Hell yeah. I love everything you just said. In the Packers, Steelers reference is such a good metaphor because they're playing on Sunday night football.

Okay, that's coming up this weekend. And nobody's like, you know, two small markets, Pittsburgh. Everybody wants to watch this game. Nobody's saying that at all. I mean, and also, AFC, NFC there. And you said in the Super Bowl, pretty good. Pretty good at, I mean, you are, you know, I don't even know if you knew that that was a home run there, but people that know ball would say, Silver, actually, not bad there.

If you would have won with Steelers Brown, Superboy, everybody would say Adam Silver's a dip. No, you see, I checked myself. You moved a little bit. That was good. All right, have an incredible season. Thank you so much for the time, and we'll see you again soon, man. Are you moving to Christmas Eve? When's that happening?

Are you moving to Christmas Eve? We're on Christmas. Christmas Eve. Eve. We need you to move to Eve. Oh, no, no. Oh, I'm sorry. No, no. We're not on Christmas Eve. That's been a traditional day off in the NBA. I understand that. It's a trade-off, right? Guys are home, Christmas Eve. Don't play in Christmas, and they're not playing on Christmas. Don't you think maybe? Listen. And they are playing on Christmas. Wait, I'm getting confusing me.

Christmas Eve has been a traditional day off, and we do play on Christmas. I understand. And the NFL has joined us. To my point. To my point. Christmas Eve. I don't know. I'm not, no plan to do it at the moment. Okay, I respect that. I respect that. I do. I appreciate you. Ladies and gentlemen, the commissioner of the NBA, uh, front of the program. You're the greatest, dude. Ladies and gentlemen, Adam Silver.

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