The Pat McAfee Show - PMS 2.0 280 - MNF Recap, Aaron Rodgers, Michael Lombardi, & AJ Hawk

Episode Date: October 27, 2020

On today's show, Pat and the boys recap last night's Monday Night Football game between the Bears and Rams and try to decide whether or not the Bears stink, how good the Rams are, what makes Johnny Hekker so special (he won the game for the Rams), and why the punt is the most important play in all of football. Later, on another installment of Aaron Rodgers Tuesday, Pat and AJ Hawk are joined by the man, the myth, the legend, the starting Quarterback for the Green Bay Packers, Aaron Rodgers. Pat, AJ, and Aaron chat about last weekend's game against the Texans and whether or not he knew Davante Adams was going to have a massive game, his thoughts on the local media getting under his skin, if it's true that he stinks at beer pong, the QB exams that give him the most difficulty, and much more in another fantastic conversation (20:31-56:11). Later, former GM of the Cleveland Browns and Special Assistant to the coaches for the New England Patriots, host of the GM Shuffle pod, co-host of HammerDAHN, accomplished author, writer for The Athletic and creator of the Daily Coach, Michael Lombardi joins the program. Pat and Michael chat about last night's game, and his concerns with the Bears and Matt Nagy, his biggest takeaways from the NFL season thus far, what the problem in New England is, and which teams he thinks will make a play for assets at the trade deadline (58:38-1:23:11). Make sure you subscribe to youtube.com/thepatmcafeeshow for all content and clips coming out of the PMI office, and listen every day on Mad Dog Radio, Sirius XM Channel 82. We appreciate you all for listening, come and laugh with us, cheers. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, it is Aaron Rodgers Tuesday, October 27th, and it is a beautiful day, isn't it, Ty? It sure is. I'm very excited. Just a couple days removed from Aaron Rodgers slicing and dicing the Houston Texans. He will join us for a conversation, which the whole world will be talking about, I assume. What will we talk about? Nobody knows. I don't even know, but i'm excited to see where it goes oh yeah and what do you know he's back you know i mean the tales of his demise were obviously uh short-lived bunch of tall tales yes me fairy tales if you ask me that's not based in reality because the reality is the dude is untouchable let's get him some weapons now.

Would be cool to get a couple more weapons, but he and Devontae Adams said no need. We'll just take this thing over. Can't wait to chat with him. Also, big-ass brain in the history of football, Michael Lombardi, co-host of Hammer Don, gambling podcast that we run out of here, and also a man who has his own podcast.

He's a former general manager for the Browns, a former advisor for the New England Patriots. He has two kids currently coaching in the NFL. His life has been committed to football since day one. He's super Italian. We won't hold that against him. But get ready to learn some things about the football and the humans that have created it from our friend Michael Lombardi. And once again, if you enjoy this show, be a friend, tell a friend. Okay? We're growing by the show, which means you guys that are listening to this are telling

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they have to make you the best you possible well said that was well said wasn't it yeah yeah good for us saying things so nicely like that people won't talk about that, will they? They won't. I won't be mentioned. All right. Let's get to the show. Last night on Monday Night Football, Johnny Hecker of the Los Angeles Rams

led them to a victory over the Chicago Bears. Aaron Rodgers is going to want to talk about it because Aaron Rodgers respects good football. But let me tell you about great football. Great football is when all three phases are kicking ass. Great football is when you see a punter pin them inside their 10, defense force a three and out. Chicago Bears have to punt the ball. Now you're getting it around the 50 or maybe even on the plus side because they're backed up so far. And by the way, when you're backed up really far, you can't have the same punt because if your gunners get jammed at all, that's field goal, that's potential points on the board immediately,

so you have to kick it a little bit higher. You have to get your coverage down there. Chicago Bears had to do that. Rams took advantage of it, scored some points. That's football. Like, that is what football is supposed to be. That is why the punter position is important in football because the number three overall stat to look at to decide who won a game. Number one is the score.

Great stat. Great stat to lead it. It's huge. Turnover margin, number two. And number three is field position. It is honestly one of the most important parts of the game that never gets talked about. Now, the stats are changing because offenses are getting better and better, and it's not great for the punter position. I'm just telling you

historically for football why the punter position has been so important. That's why you hear coaches like Jim Trestle say the punt is the most important play in football. You hear Bill Belichick talk about it, greatest coach of all time, about how important special teams is because it's a game of special teams is because it's a game of real estate. Okay? It's a game of – Condoleezza Rice compared it to war because it's what it is. You're gaining territory. That's all you're trying to do. And whenever you punt, it's like, okay, we'll give it back to you.

Now you're going to try. And then your battle, you have to battle. Your defense is keeping them in there. Then you slowly gain down the field. That is what the punting position is that's why field position matters and that's why when a guy like johnny hecker who is at the top of the craft has a game that's at the top of his list of games on primetime television and it wins it is so great for the brand this is a conversation that everybody was having last night steve levy greasy le Louis Riddick, whatever your thoughts are, I enjoy them.

They talked about a lot of punting, a lot of that. They called it a watermelon ball, so that hit the internet. I think it's a banana ball. If I'm not mistaken, it's from Ozzie Rules Football, by the way. He's been doing this for years now. He's been doing this for like three years. And the first time I saw him do this uh it was actually the first ever for the brand video that i've ever put out i didn't have it called that's

great for the brand until maybe like the next week but this is the first nfl sunday of my retirement i'm watching the game it's the first time i'm watching the game in a long time obviously live uh without being in the game and i see johnny hecker do this, and I hear the commentators not even say a fucking thing about it. They're just like, the ball just, hey, and he bouts it out at the six or whatever. And I'm like, do you know what the fuck just happened? This guy turned that song bitch sideways, and he punted that thing in a chopper fashion. And that thing, by the way, you never see it return or try to catch it

because that song bitch is coming down a la a banana whenever it's falling to the ground. I believe that's why it's named that i'm not australian i didn't create the kick but i assume that is the case because every time you hit it it goes up and then it comes down like this and it normally kicks it aside which is a much better bounce than the potential forward bounce that comes from the back thing the only issue with that that particular punt is you have like that much of a spot on the ball you can hit if you hit that thing too too thin that's going straight sideways that is a one yard punt maybe two yard punt potentially if that thing just because your foot's this big the ball obviously is this big if you you're trying to

hit that thing here if you hit that just a little bit left that thing's going straight sideways you hit it a little bit to the right that thing's going straight to the left in a fat fashion so the fact that he had the and the difference obviously between aussie rules football and the nfl football the aussie rules football this is a junior version is a rounder ball so the sweet spot's bigger there's also no person rushing them it doesn't have to happen in uh 1.3 seconds from the time it touches your hands to when it happens uh but it is similar but it's very very different i saw a lot of aussie rules fans last night tweeting how similar it is to the banana ball we've been doing it for 50 years like i agree you guys have been and what you guys have helped

in the nfl game is incredible but it's a little bit different i think michael dixon would say that who was an aussie rules punter in the nfl now that comes from that world but the fact that he had enough confidence to do that, and I recorded it, basically. And I was like, I cannot believe this dude did that. I got a text from Shane Leckler that was like, I can't believe that son of a bitch did that, because that ball is going out of bounds or whatever.

It was just so impressive that he did it with so much pressure on him. And it led to a New York Times article, that particular tweet. It led to the For the Brand video is basically still happening, because I'm very much a, if something works okay i'll stick with it if something doesn't work i'm gonna bounce off because i don't have time to waste to do shit that people obviously don't enjoy and aren't that great so it's like a it's one of those things so he's probably the birth of not only the for the brand videos which i've spent my sundays doing the last four months loving by the way i enjoy the hell out of them. Me just screaming at my phone,

hyping up downs that are normally considered bathroom downs, by the way, that's what people normally, Oh, it's going into a commercial break. I was getting millions of views on punting videos, explaining to people what punting was. And the thing I found out was people were interested to hear about that type

of thing. There's just never been anybody that's been able to talk about it so i think the interesting thing to me about this whole thing is maybe i owe johnny hecker a massive thank you for even getting me into the potential football talk world because i wouldn't have known that people gave a damn about learning about the punting thing now i knew there was a lot of intricacies about it that people would respect if we started breaking down it's nowhere near as hard of a position as every other position. Okay. We get it. Your shoulders aren't going to be as banged up. Your head isn't going to be as banged up, but you only get a couple opportunities like a golfer.

For instance, people compare it to golf, which by the way, golfers mentality is amazing. Okay. That's a tiny little ball, tiny little club to do your things. But if you had a bad shot, okay, you can go save it, and then you can save it. And the kicking road, that doesn't happen. Like if you had a bad shot, you're walking back to the sideline for 45, 50 minutes just sitting there like, ah, I hope I get a chance to do this again. And by the way, if I don't get a chance to do it again,

it's probably going to be my fault why we lost, and I haven't been able to do a damn thing about it afterwards. There's just so much about having to come together in one quick moment, being able to dial it all together, and perform at your absolute highest ability. And I think punters and kickers obviously have been mocked for a long, long time for whatever reason, whether it's back in the day where celebrations, you know, tore ACLs, which that's a tough look.

I agree, okay? And I'm happy Gramatica got his knee back together and everything like that. And there's stories like, you know, when the guy gets kicked in the head by the returner and all that stuff. But the mentality to go out there and perform your job, whether you're a super nerd or a super jock, in such a moment of pressure with so much on the line, I think deserves a little bit of credit, a little bit of,

hey, that's pretty impressive what you're able to do. And Johnny Hecker is at the top of the world doing that. That was one of the most impressive nights I've ever seen in my entire life when it came to ball kicking. His first one, it was good. I was like, okay, that's Johnny Hecker, though. Then that 63-yard bomb that just checked up, by the way. Perfect.

Perfectly. When you see that ball in the air, okay, there's a chance that that thing's going to bounce back. You can tell with the way the ball air okay you there's a chance that that thing's gonna bounce back you can tell with the way the ball is spinning that there's a chance it's gonna bounce back or there's a chance it's gonna go straight forward whenever he saw that ball turning the way it was and it was coming down there was probably this like oh man this could be perfect and then you're like watching the gunners and you're watching the ref to see if it's far or if it's close because if you're three feet off by the way that's a 20 yard difference in field position and that thing

just spikes and bounce straight up oh my god he ran down the field doing that that moment of while you see that ball turn and it checks up like the amount of relief the amount of happiness that all hit him i was so happy for him he beat the bears last night yeah and now the bears have to question whether or not their offense is worth a fuck because whenever you're starting from the five, you're going to have to be a great offense if you're playing on scoring because I do believe the chances of scoring is like below 15% or maybe below 10%. I think it's probably below 10% if you start inside your 10.

And I think it's obviously much, much lower if you start inside your five. There's a good chance you're going to be turning the ball back over to the other team, whether it's turnover on downs, interception because you've got to make a play, or you're going to be turning the ball back over to the other team whether it's turnover on downs interception because you got to make a play or you're going to end up punting it and uh yeah he dominated the bears last night and i think it's a little bit unfair to judge the chicago bears offense this morning because they were put in positions where they had to play perfectly like they would have had to play perfectly now they played nowhere near that they look very bad very terrible i mean almost disgusting looking at times

but they did not really get a fair shake i think whenever you got johnny hecker dominating your entire soul the way he did so like talking about hecker so like tat viva lazito here chicago bears fan bear oh no victory steaks i still have god so i can't eat steaks but uh well you didn't win either yeah you're right either way uh tegan Jr., though, should he ever turn any of those or at least get under the ball? Yeah, that's interesting because the one that landed at the 10 maybe, but I only think it was a yard or so. If he catches that one that spikes up at the three or whatever

and he gets tackled there, everybody calls him an idiot, right? So he can't touch that. That one that he hit sideways, like that ball, that's a tough ball to catch. Everybody knows that's a tough ball to catch. Everybody knows that's a tough ball to catch. First of all, Ted Ginn's been around a long time, so I'm sure he's seen it before. I'm not 100% sure if O'Donnell hits that ball. So has he seen that in practice all week?

Maybe, maybe not. I'm not 100% sure. But that's a tough ball to catch. I mean, that thing turns. It literally turns sideways. It's awesome to watch because it's like when you learn that your beer league softball friend, okay, who takes it very serious and does like the tournaments

and all that shit, and you see videos of him hitting, smashing softballs, just smashing softballs, yeah, off of like lights and everything like that. Whenever you learn that, I guess their pitchers can throw like curveballs and knuckleballs and High-level beer league softball. That's what it's like whenever you learn how much a football can move. A football can move so much. You can hit a knuckleball where that thing goes sideways.

That chopper one turns a lot of – but that's what the punt return is back there for, right? To be the most athletic person on earth. But if you're Ted Ginn and you see that thing cutting at the last second pretty hard, which is what it does, is it better to let that thing bounce or is it better to try to catch that thing, buff that thing? You know what I mean? So there's something.

That's why the punt, by the way, is so damn good because there's a chance a muff is coming from this thing as well. Because he was trending last night for being so bad, but I didn't want to say he was bad because, obviously, we don't know much about heckers like ballsies. I mean, Ted Ginn's in a – I mean, Parker Turner is one of the wildest positions that ever exists. He's a hecker, too.

Yeah, a hecker's hitting great balls. The thought, though, of people coming after Ted Ginn, I didn't even think about it. I didn't even follow that. I didn't know that. It reminded me a lot of a game the San Diego Chargers at the time played against the Indianapolis Colts in the playoffs, and it would have been the 2008 season.

Yeah. played against the Indianapolis Colts in the playoffs, and it would have been the 2008 season. And Mike Cyphers had the greatest game in the history of punting at the time. He pinned Peyton at the four, the five. I think he averaged. He won the playoff game, basically. Mike Cyphers won the playoff game. It came out afterwards.

Hunter Smith, I was then drafted immediately after that. So Bill Pauly in that game changed. He got rid of Hunter. He was like, we need a new punter or whatever. came out afterwards hunter smith i was then drafted immediately after that so bill poley and that game changed like he got rid of hunter he was like we need a new punter or whatever and it was because mike cyphers won that game johnny hecker last night won that game against the bears and i'm not sure o'donnell could have changed it so i'm going to let hunter smith know that i think he was unfairly judged yeah whenever he got cut for that game i don't because i mean unless pat o'donnell was able to hit like a 70-yard rocket, which, by the way, he could have tried to do,

which is a great way to combat that. But you're banking on your offense and defense moving just a little bit or stopping just a little bit. Because if your offense gets a first down all of a sudden, now you're gaining a little bit of field position. But the way – because they weren't able to, and he was hitting those – he was hitting the end-over-end ball like 44 yards every time. There was no change.

Johnny Hecker won that game last night. For sure. Smash teams won that game game what's your poll right now though this should lead into a pretty good conversation i'm excited to hear this yep so who's the worst coach in the nfl uh right now adam gay 77.4 percent mike mccarthy 11.7 mike zimmer 1.5 percent and matt naggy 9.4 percent five and two team has a coach at 9.4% of a poll for who's the worst coach. Mike McCarthy almost being out. That's an interesting situation. Wild.

Yeah. Is it? Jerry Jones said he's our guy, but there's a lot of heat and smoke coming from that Dallas Mike McCarthy one and done thing. Funny. There's no way that you're rid of Mike McCarthy after this year. But that locker room needs to figure it out. Don there. Jerry Jones had a hilarious soundbite.

We'll talk about here in a little bit. At Bubba Gumpino is sitting in on the couch at Boston. Connor's here. Ty Schmidt is here. All the boys in the back. Diggs would not be here today. He woke up this morning feeling a little sick. He said out of the air on the side of caution,

told him to stay home. We have been getting two people in our office tested every single week for COVID here. We have managed to keep it locked down, which, by the way, I appreciate that. Diggs does not think he has that at all, but to err on the side of caution, said, hey, go get tested and then you'll come back. Yeah, T's and P's to Diggs. Hope you feel better. Good luck. T's and P's, Tony.

Good luck, Tony. Good luck, Tony. Good luck, Tony. You can do it you feel better Good luck, Tony Good luck, Tony Let's go, Tony Come on If you can send him tweets At Tone Diggs With a Z at the end there Tell him we're pulling for him I think it was a smart move, though

Oh yeah, takes all of us Had to do it You did it early in this entire thing It was maybe three weeks into the entire quarantine. Yeah, that's when the hysteria was at its peak, pretty much. Ty wakes up, feels like shit. I'm going to stay home, self-quarantine here for a little bit. Yeah.

Gets tested, comes back. All right, here we go. Back in the game. That's right. It's a smart thing, what we're doing here. Have to do. How about the Big Ten would keep T tone or you out of here for 21 days we'll talk about that and all of the nfl uh on the other side we have a guy named michael

lombardi joining us who former gm of the cleveland browns he's an advisor for a long time at the new england patriots uh he is co-host of hammered down our gambling podcast when you hear this guy speak about football some people have come out against him, obviously. Jason Kelsey called him out in the Super Bowl speech, and he owned it, by the way. This dude will own it. He understands. But this guy has forgotten more football

maybe than anybody else has ever learned. There's probably a couple up there. I assume Belichick is up there. The football conversations he has and his ability to just probably a couple up there. I assume Belichick is up there. The football conversations he has and his ability to just be incredibly blunt with it. I'm excited for this conversation. He's been hot too in the gambling world.

It should be a lot of fun. We'll be back on the other side with Michael Lombardi. We'll talk about the world that is the sports world. And Aaron Rodgers joins us in the third hour. And potentially Johnny Hecker

in the second. What? I don't know. I sent him a text. Sent him a text. He's probably out celebrating all damn night. Rightfully so. With his family, by the way.

Super dad. He is a super dad. Anytime I ever talk to him, I FaceTime him. He's super dadding at the moment. Last time he was on, he played guitar. Yeah, he did. That's a little melody. He shredded it a little bit.

He's like six foot6", by the way. Yeah, they got a monster of a guy. Can they move the yardage back? Because that 20-yard punt to the 5 was a 75-yard punt, but it only registers as like a 63. Yeah, it makes no sense that the field goal kickers get from the spot where the ball is spotted. Punters get from the line of scrimmage because that's the only part that matters,

by the way, is how much you gain. That's the stat. see doesn't you see and it is officially aaron rogers tuesday October 27, 2020. Another Aaron Rodgers Tuesday has come to us in a beautiful fashion. This week, it comes after a massive dub. Massive, massive dub. Slicin, Dyson, the Houston Texans. He and Devontae Adams almost had 200 yards together. Bunch of touchdowns, celebrations. Life is good.

Is he on right now ladies and gentlemen uh alongside an incredible man who's won a national championship and a super bowl uh aj hawk the man joining us in the middle after a big dub just days after learning that defenses had his offense figured out he won out and did the same damn thing he was doing for the first month in some days to begin this season ladies and gentlemen number 12 Aaron Okay, there we go Did you hear everything that just happened? We just want ape shit in here for you

No, I just blacked out I'm not sure what happened Do you want us to do it? We could do this from the jump if you'd like We don't have time, let's get to it Have AJ do it Hey, could do this from the jump if you'd like. We don't have time. Let's get to it. Have AJ do it. Have AJ. Actually.

Hey, by the way, mason jar, real crowd pleaser last week whenever you were drinking out of that. I'm a big fan of that move. Is that just what your kitchen is, just a bunch of mason jars and paper plates and stuff like mine? No. No, that's vodka, by the way. Oh!

Could you imagine him right here right now? Aaron Rodgers is potentially dealing with an alcohol problem on a Tuesday or let's talk about the game. Immediately after the game, you were asked about Devante Adams and you said something to, you know, Devante and I talked before the game and we knew or something. We there was some conversation that was had and you guys knew it seemed like you two were able to do whatever the hell you wanted on Sunday with the Texans. Did you know that going in, and what was that conversation with Devontae like? No, I don't think we knew that going in. I think it was more just a feeling that based on Aaron Jones being out

and Bakhtiari not playing, you know, and obviously their offense having so much success last week against Tennessee. It just felt like we were going to have to have a big game. And it's just what happens sometimes. You're sitting in the locker room. It's strange. I mean, that locker room had, you know, the plexiglass up between every single locker. So you don't really see guys' faces.

I wasn't quite sure where he was at. But just sent him a little reminder that I was going to need him in a big way, and I felt really good about things. He obviously felt the same way. I just think it's important sometimes to remind star receivers, I used to do this with Jordy Nelson all the time, just to be patient. I think especially in a game where you know you've got to make plays, you're expecting to be patient I think especially in a game where you know you got to make plays you're expecting to make plays just to have patience with the way things go because you

got to get in the game to see how teams are playing now you know thankfully for for today we got off to a really good start in the beginning got him a touchdown on the first drive but we had a couple real subtle adjustments in the game that really made the stats look better. He's such a talented guy. I mean, he does so much. A couple times he was so damn wide open, he was just trying to not miss them with the ball. But him and I have been in a really good groove.

And two days ago was just kind of the culmination of a really good week of practice and good communication even on an hour before the game. Hey, Aaron, can it sometimes hinder a quarterback if you have a stud receiver that you are thinking like, hey, I got to go to this guy? And I only bring this up because their whole Baker Mayfield, Odell Beckham Jr. situation, Dan Orlovsky actually explained it very well, I think on whatever NFL Live he was on.

He said sometimes he saw Matt Stafford get in this situation with Calvin Johnson. Like, hey, I got to, in your mind, I got to make sure I push the ball to Calvin. But then it kind of takes away you being able to go through your progressions. And then when he's out, you can kind of free up and see everything. Is that a real thing? I don't know. I don't think any quarterback looks at it like that. I really don't.

I just think that's the wrong way to play if you are, you know, there's a difference in my opinion. Outside pressure though, Aaron? Think about like you, you don't have pressure, but if you're a lower stature quarterback, they're going to want you to throw to this stud they brought in. I see what you're saying, A.J., and I'm not saying it's not a real thing.

You're stupid, A.J. I'll say it. Go on with your answer. I'm sorry about that. But look, there's a reason that guy is that guy. It's because he's probably open a lot. And open to Calvin Johnson, you know, in his heyday, was different than most receivers.

And open for Odell is different from most receivers. And open for Devontae, you know, I just think that there's certain guys who just have that special, special star quality like Julio, you know, just to just, so you do feed them, you know, intentionally sometimes because they have usually a bigger catch radius. They have the ability to run more routes. You know, so I don't think you're really necessarily fighting that. I just think whether you're not in the rhythm yet or not in the groove yet

or you guys need a spark, those are the type of guys that you want to go to in those situations. Now, we started off hot and kind of kept it going the entire game. But, you know, there's been times in my career where I need a play, and it happened in the Super Bowl. You know, I felt like we were just a little bit off. I was maybe running a little high emotionally, and we called a screen pass on third and one.

And I alerted the go-rat outside of Jordy Nelson for a touchdown. And that settled me down. I think it settled our offense down. And we went on to win the game. So sometimes, you know, you do make subtle adjustments. And people might say it's forcing. And for the offense and for yourself, it's a way to kind of settle into a group because those guys are so talented.

By the way, shout out to you just calling here and playing the Super Bowl, saying, I need to throw a deep ball here. That's awesome. I wish I would have done that in the Super Bowl. It would have been cool if I just looked out at the gunner and said, hey, fucking go, pal. That would have been beautiful. It would have been a magical moment, and maybe that's why you are you and I am me. You said that maybe you're a bit high emotionally or

whatever it is. Cause we always see you laughing. It always seems like you're laughing, having a great time. Do you, is that a conscious effort by you? Like I am a better me whenever I'm having a good time. Cause for me it was like, whenever I was like either super focused or something like that, I would, I would overthink it or whatever. I had to be very relaxed. Was that something that you kind of realized about yourself? Well, Pat, I just think it's the moment in the Super Bowl, you know, and we all played and won.

It's just a different feeling. You know, you just – the emotions are higher. The adrenaline's going. The nerves are higher. And you kind of just want to get that first you know big play to settle everything in I think and we had taken a couple shots and missed him and I just felt like you know we had press coverage on him and liked the matchup and and just wanted to at least give it a look and based on his initial release you know he was know, he was probably going to be a yard or two on top

and, you know, hit him in a good spot, and the rest is kind of history there. But I just think it doesn't matter, you know, I'm in my 16th season. We always need that kind of first play to get settled into the game, you know, whether it's a deep throw or taking a little shot, you know, or getting outside the pocket and running there's always that play that kind of settles you in the game less nerves i think the older you get because you're more used to it but if you don't have nerves out there i think you need to maybe focus in and realize it's game time i always thought i was mentally weak because i felt that

even like whenever i was at the top when I was doing very well I mean what Johnny Hecker did last night might be the new top of everything whatever that was unbelievable but whenever I would go out there for the first time even whenever I knew I was like I was nervous like I would get like a little bit not not nervous but like I was like anxious to get the first one I'm like man what a mentally weak son of a bitch you are it turns out everybody does that's good news by the way I just learned something about me. So I appreciate you saying what you just said. Yeah, you can write that in your dream journal later. Yeah, I'll write that down.

I don't suck. That's good news. I'm not a mentally weak guy. That's great news for me. Hey, Aaron, what about that? So that play to Jordy, you say a third and one screen called. I don't know if you're not confirming or denying that you agree with that call on the screen, but let's say you throw it out there to Jordy and you don't connect.

What's that conversation like on the sideline? Big Mike. It's one of those things where you better make it work if you're going to do that. You know, there's times in all games like that. You have to understand the consequences and trust your instincts. You know, we had multiple plays in the game against Houston. This happens all the time where you make subtle adjustments and you make it work or you must have a good reason why you did something.

I think the beauty in play-caller-quarterback relations is there has to be trust. You know, there has to be trust coming in to execute the play called and trust that if I see something, that it's, in my opinion, what's going to put us in the best situation. Like the touchdown to Devontae where he absolutely smoked him off the line. That was an adjustment that actually went back to a conversation from earlier in the season with Devontae. I believe we were playing Detroit,

and we talked about a route adjustment versus press when he was number two in the slot in a two-man stack. And in the moment, I saw the alignment. I didn't necessarily expect the safety to go double weak like he did away from Devontae, but I made just a subtle little adjustment to uh to Darius and to Devontae and obviously Devontae smoked him off the line and create about six yards separation and under thrown by about four yards so I still gave him a two yard window to break free smart smart smart but uh but you know there has to be trust there from from uh

from coach to me and and also understanding when is a good time to do that and when is the time to kind of go through your progression and trust the nature of the play. The risk-reward factor is an ultimate balance that you have to do, I guess, in everything, especially whenever it comes to your relationship with a floor who a lot of people wanted you two to hate each other early, and that has kind of settled off in the conversation. But last night it was alleged, okay, Brian Greasy, I believe, said something, and you heard it was alleged okay Brian Greasy I believe said

something and you heard this obviously Brian Greasy said something on the cat yeah you did you did you did you heard it so Brian Greasy said last night on uh the game that Nick Foles told him or told them that sometimes a call will come in for a play and he knows he has no chance because he doesn't have enough time for the thing or whatever so basically the way Brian Greasy delivered it was like Foles told us last night that Nagy was sending some plays that he knows isn't going to work because he's not going to have enough time and then Nagy came out and said well Nick Foles never told me that and now Nick Foles has said well that was a misquote but let's forget about the misquote that happens between interview of quarterback and commentator which I'm sure there's a couple stories that you

have for that but we don't have to talk about that. Is that what the conversation you and the floor had this offseason, where you go through the offense and you say, like, hey, I think in this situation this happens? Like, is that the play caller-quarterback relationship? You two literally have to be tied at the hip, right? And if there's any type of tension at all, it's not going to work? Yeah, I think the tension is released through the conversations you know whether it's during the

week uh it's situational conversations about third down plays that we like and you know this everything is uh complicated whether over complicated or or complicated right to the right amount um as far as the analytics part and the breaking down of each section of third down and uh and of the field really you know third down and uh and of the field really you know we have different uh areas of the field where we you know break down tendencies and stuff we like calling certain spots and there has to be a conversation about all those things and the thing i enjoy about working with matt is you know there's been there's been a lot of great conversations throughout the off season and and during the regular season about stuff that we like and why we like them. And he'll show me a clip that he likes it from, or I'll

refer back to something that I like or something that I saw or something from years past on a reason that I like one play over another play. And, you know, I think it really helps him see how I see things and vice versa. You know, when I understand the why, it really helps. That's just kind of how I've always been as an athlete, just understanding why we're doing things helps me kind of see the entire picture. And as quarterback, you really have to see the entire picture and understand not just, you know, the play call, but the protection, the stress points and protection and the subtle adjustments you can make within the play.

And then how to kind of go about the play to use this scheme to your advantage. God, there's so much going on. Yeah, there is a lot going on, and pivoting off of that, Aaron, goes in line with it. I know you, in so many years of playing in Green Bay, you've had a lot of celebrities that come watch you play. Oh, yeah. Who are some of your favorite celebrities,

maybe at away games that you have seen that you may or may not have been catcalling certain celebrities on the sidelines during warm-ups at times? Doing what? I don't know. I think it needs to be more specific. Well, Chicago.

For sure. Who? Scott Stapp! Yeah! Of course, Scott Stapp! I don't know if we won this game aaron you'll know if we won the game tim allen tim allen i'm sorry it muted it mutes you but no um in uh i don't know if we won this game or not we're in chicago it was a night game and there was a a certain actor i think he had a mustache at the time and and you were very excited, and you could not stop trying to get his attention during warm-ups. I don't know if you're talking about Vince Vaughn or Will Ferrell.

This was Cusack. Oh. It was neither of those guys? You're talking about... Cusack, John Cusack. John Cusack, yeah. Yeah, he's definitely up there on favorite celebrities we've seen. Will Ferrell's been to a game.

Kevin Durant, when we played the Redskins, he was wearing Redskin colors. Kevin Durant has been to games. Anthony Davis, who's a Packers fan, has been to games. We've had the Milwaukee Bucks at various games. CeCe Sabathia, way back in the day when he was playing on kind of a rented loan contract for the Milwaukee Brewers, came to a game. Harry Styles from One Direction fame. Oh, you know Harry Styles?

Holy hell. That's your guy. That's your dude. Love that one, Harry. The Jonas Brothers have been to games. No, the Joe Bros! Nick and Joe. No!

Age was really excited to meet Joe, I think it was. I think I met the middle one, right? The guy that sings. Oh, Bill. Age is a big Shakira fan, too. Really? She was rumored to be at one of our games.

I think it was in Dallas a few years ago, and I don't think she showed up. She was kind of bummed out. That's a shame. You said all these people, and I would assume they all come talk to you, which is one of the perks of being the quarterback of the team. I would assume they all come. No, they don't. They don't talk to you?

Lars Schragser? You know what? Before we keep going, there's one person who's going to get really upset if I don't mention him. And that's Kevin from the office, Brian Bumgarner. Who's a good friend of AJ and I. He's been to a few games.

He's a great fan. Met him years ago. Also, I think I'd be remiss if I didn't talk about his finish this year at Tahoe, which was his best finish of his career. Congrats to him. Bye, Brian. Atta boy. Atta boy, Kev.

Good job, Brian. Really excited for Brian. He's definitely gotten out of the Barkley groups and into kind of the more middle-of-the-pack groups, so we're proud of him with his golfing. You're talking about the Eddie George, Charles Barkley, A.J. Hawk groups, the things that you're referring to right there, I believe, at that Lake Tahoe thing. How come you've not said Lil Wayne yet?

Yeah, Lil Wayne has been in the locker room, actually, post-game. What was that like? What was Lil Wayne like in the locker room? That was amazing. That was during, I think that was during our playoff run. That was during 11 when we were really good, I think, age. Age probably remembers. I think he got a picture with him.

I didn't get a picture at that time. But I still have a soft spot in my heart for Green and Yellow when it comes on. Oh, yeah. His remix of Wiz Khalifa's song, I believe. Yep, you're hip. Yep, you know. Thank you, yeah. I'm definitely up to date with my with my rap

these days yeah well you just crushed it right there i think you just slaughtered it wiz calif has a couple new songs out by the way from pittsburgh great rapper loves marijuana um let's go move on the conversation last week do you know that uh well you did you actually you were there the reaction to your zoom conference call where you were asked about defenses figuring out your offense and you said 1 of 5 or whatever, the reaction was awesome. It was like, Aaron Rodgers is in a bad mood. Aaron Rodgers

is moody. This is what happens when Aaron Rodgers loses games. He's moody and all this. It was everywhere. It was awesome to watch by the way. Just like, not you. It probably sucked for you to hear all this shit, but you've been hearing this for your entire life, so you're probably used to it. But for me, just watching this thing kind you've been hearing this for your entire life so that's you're probably used to it but for me just watching this thing kind of catapult because i know i was going to get to ask you about it when you sit there and

you say something like that and you watch the world react to it what are your immediate thoughts just immediate thoughts while watching i didn't see a lot of the reactions to be honest pat i really didn't um you missed it they were good and. And Tom Fanning, who works PR with the Packers, didn't alert me to a lot of stuff going on. I will address last Wednesday. I think it was one of the poorest set of questions that I've received all year. Okay. Those people got a job to do. We were four and one.

And I think I've been really good on those. to do we were four in one and I think I've been really good on those and I try and be as thoughtful as possible and give them answers that you know that didn't answer the question and maybe give them some insight but I thought you know some of the questions were just poor questions so poor questions don't always get the same type of answers and and, I know they have a job to do, and I'm not saying it's easy, but when it started off the way it started off with that question beginning the press conference, it really didn't get much better at that point. That was the first question?

I didn't know that was the first question. That was the first question. Hi, Aaron. Happy Wednesday. Okay, so your offense stinks. The entire NFL figured it out. What are your thoughts on that? What a hilarious start to a conversation. That's awesome.

It didn't get any better from there. I can't say it was everybody. I don't want to throw everybody under the bus, but there were a few good questions in there, but I'm going to talk to them tomorrow, and I know they can do better than they did last week.

You know right there, you just either made somebody's day for saying that, or whoever potentially asked that question is now going to run with this and act as if Aaron can't. That's what they're going to do to this, but you know that everything you say is going to cause a firestorm anyways. Look, I don't think they should be sensitive about it. I've known Mark for years and I've been on his radio show and worked with him for a long time. And I think Mark does a really good job. I don't think it was a great question.

But, hey, you know, you're not going to be perfect every single week. I'm sure, you know, maybe there'll be some sensitivity. I'm guessing he'll probably ask a little better question this week. I have nothing against Mark at all. I just didn't think it was a great question. Well, maybe to them it was. Maybe that's what they want. They wanted a strong reaction from you.

I mean, I didn't give them a strong reaction. I just told them that one out of five teams have figured us out. And then what was the next question? What was the next question? Because I enjoy interviews. Like, I enjoy them a lot. I enjoy how conversations go. Like, I think it's a very captivating thing. Whenever you start with that shot, okay, that's just a pow! All right, here we go. We're leading off with this thing. You automatically that where, you know, just, you know, to

me it was questions that didn't have, didn't even give you the opportunity to give a thoughtful answer. And I looked over at Tom a couple times during, and I wasn't trying to be rude, but I was, I couldn't believe what these people were asking. And again, it wasn't every single question, but it was like, come on. You're with me every week. You know I can give thoughtful answers. You know I give them a lot of time. It's all in your framing, too.

You can ask anything I've learned. It's all in how you frame the question you know like the framing of the question is your opinion on what the answer is going to be right so or or what the answer should be and it's a very interesting tactic because you can really lead people into a certain you watch dateline or whatever those those investigators that are asking the questions they just walk the person right through every fucked up thing that they do. They just walk them right through it. It's the same thing whenever you talk about a conversation. I'm excited to hear how it goes tomorrow, Chipper Aaron Rodgers.

You know what I mean? I can't wait to hear how it goes over there, man. Let's just wait and see if Bob Domoski tries to project onto me that I'm in a bad mood. By the way, is that not the most irritating thing ever? Are you okay? Yeah, I'm okay. Are you okay? Are you sure you're okay? He seems like, you know, I, my wife, I'll ask her every once in a while. I'm like, are you in, are you in a good mood or whatever? She's like, yeah. And I'm like, are you sure you're in a good mood? She's like, all right, now you're getting me in the back. I'm like, all right right i'll shut the fuck

up i will walk it away i guess uh ty what's going on aaron uh last week there was an article that came out about your quarterback room over the course of your career and i was just curious everyone knows you have arguably the single greatest game in jeopardy history uh which of your backups had the toughest weekly exam and what kind of questions were typically toughest for you? Oh, man. Yeah. Matt Flynn really started doing a lot of those, making some really, really good tests. His were, you know, about three football questions and then about 20 pop culture trivia questions.

You know, I have obviously a few kind of zones where I'm really good, whether it's history. When pop culture stuff, I'm pretty good with music, South Park, TV shows, movies, you know. What a direct genre there. So he would really try and stump me on certain things, but he was good at tests. The thing I love that I always try to get him to do is put some fun facts on there. So do some

research on the other team, the DBs. Give me some, you know, potential trash-talking material about certain guys. Maybe it's a childhood nickname that they weren't too keen on, or maybe some sort of uh you know thing that that said or did you can use against them i'm not talking about like a mean trash talk way necessarily but just something you could maybe rip them about during

a tv time out that'd be fun and i used i mean i would say i used many of those little fun facts over the years or maybe we just have some laughs on the sidelines but every now and then you kind of throw one of those out there and um you know the guys be pretty surprised that that research is being done so a big shout out to matt flynn and graham harrell brett hunley was really good too he kind of carried the tradition tim boyle's done a really good job and now jordan's been doing been doing them lately and uh and he's he's into it he's still you know a little football heavy at this point but hey stop taking it so serious okay this is not a serious we appreciate you being dialed in but let's get to the uh you know eighth grade report of insert name of corner here yeah exactly

that's what we're going for so i heard in that same article i didn't read the entire thing um i should have probably, I guess. It sounded awesome. I read your article. Yeah, well. That article, and I texted with Graham Harrell afterwards. You know, there was some liberties taken for sure. So that's why I didn't want to read it, by the way, because I didn't want to, you know. I heard you're a bad flip cup player.

That makes no sense at all because with how good you are at throwing a football. Again, that's a total lie. Graham Harreld had no idea how to play flip cup. Okay. Wow. Okay. I figured. That's what he's talking about.

All right. I heard that because I didn't read the article. I don't do a lot of the reading, okay, which isn't something to brag about. Okay, kids, read your books. I never have, but read your books. And I was given some information because we're a big flip cup town where we come from big flip cup town it's the best drinking game it brings the entire place to its feet beer pong you only got two people performing you go seven on seven with flip cup it can be an electric atmosphere it's always been my favorite drinking game and whenever i heard that you were

terrible at it i was so bummed i don't think you i was bummed for like 20 25 minutes didn't leave my office and now i'm very happy to hear that that's not the case i'm thankful you got out of there man your spirits yeah lifted up you got back to your you know your trash talking about wrestling that i saw earlier i'm excited to see what happens with that i thought maybe you're going to call out aj to be a partner of yours and get him involved he's long wanted to follow in the footsteps of his heroes like macho man randy savage oh yeah hulk hogan i mean he's done probably as many drugs as those guys so a lot better if i did we always always wondered, Aaron. We always wondered.

Hey, did you get a chance to, before we let you go, you're so generous with your time, by the way, and we can't thank you. Did you get a chance to watch any of Letterman's new conversations on Netflix? He talked to Kanye. I'd be intrigued to hear your thoughts on that conversation. I haven't seen it yet. And I also, I did see this week, I'm a big fan of Joe Rogan. He also talked to Kanye. Yeah, so I haven't seen it yet. And I also did see this week. I'm a big fan of Joe Rogan. He also talked to Kanye.

Yeah, so I haven't seen it yet. It's definitely on my watch list. I did get to watch Borat 2. How was it? What are your thoughts on it? Have you guys seen it yet? Not yet. A lot of my teammates and a couple coaches who saw it said it was better than Borat 1.

Now, also, 2006, a lot of those people were, even some of the coaches, were probably in high school or middle school or elementary school. I was not. I was in the NFL at 22. I loved Borat 1. I thought Borat 2 was really, really funny. Not as funny as the first one. Oh, wow. What a review right here of Borat 1. I thought Borat 2 was really, really funny. Not as funny as the first one. Oh, wow.

What a review right here of Borat. But it's not a knock on Borat 2. Borat 1 just was so ridiculous. And I'm a fan of the Ali G show from way back. Way back. Way back. So I just thought, you know, it was tough because because bora is so the character is so well known you know even when they showed him bora too like people recognize him on the street you know

obviously he's wearing the same gray suit but um and then i hadn't seen this yet but i went back and watched the first episode of who is america oh yeah his other show? That is. And the first episode is unbelievable. Hey, Sacha Baron Cohen, he did this interview, or he wrote something. He just typed out something as himself. And he talked about how his genre of comedy is something that can showcase the realities of certain things or whatever. He has to be so fearless, that guy. He told a story about how he wrote in that thing, the realities of certain things or whatever he has to be so fearless that guy he has to be he

told a story about how uh he wrote in that thing and i think we've seen it where he was at a rodeo or a fight of some sort and him and his ex-boyfriend and he said chairs were getting thrown at him he had to get rushed out of the back he has to be the one of the most fearless humans in entertainment uh yeah and that was in bruno that was when he was when he had that uh a scene with uh you know down in the deep south when they were wrestling like i mean and i heard i talked to a guy who was a producer on the borat movie when he sang like uh the um kazakhstan anthem at the rodeo um they surrounded the bus and they weren't gonna let him leave oh they were they wanted him to get out of the bus they wanted to you know beat the hell out of him so like what

a dominican suit wants to do to you you know i mean i think we're i think we're on okay terms at this point but i yeah i mean sasha is is uh his comedy is it's pretty amazing it's pretty incredible what he's able to get away with and i think you know a lot of times he goes after you know the same type of people you know it's it's just amazing that you know when you look it up because you're watching this especially last night watch this and i'm like there has to be actors, right? Some of these people have to be actors like it cannot be but then you go back and look and these people are like normal people and now he figures out

ways to fool them into thinking that this is a real event they're doing or whatever but it's still amazing that, you know some of the views and ideals of some of these people that he's able to dupe. Yeah, humans, interesting species.

Final thing for me, I haven't seen the movie. I've only seen what's getting at a bunch of pub. What was Rudy Giuliani doing when he untucked his shirt? What is that? That was all over the air. That's all I hear about the movie. I don't know anything else. Yeah, he was doing an interview with what he thought was a young journalist. In a hotel room? It's Borat's daughter in the movie, right?

And the whole premise is that he's, in order to get out of the work camp that he's been put in, because Borat embarrassed the country, he has to make this grand gesture to someone in America. So he was bringing the minister of something. I don't know if it was film or whatever. Wait, is this spoilers right here? It was a monkey. No, this is in the trailer. He was bringing a monkey to America to give the monkey away

to Mike Pence or something. So when all this stuff didn't work out, then he was going to give his daughter his daughter away and rudy thinks i don't it looks like he's taking off his mic pack maybe but there were some i don't know there's some weird things that you just got to watch it for yourself all right can't wait to watch it that sounds great um mr Rogers, why have you not watched Ted Lasso yet? And how does that

not make it into your time when you're not watching film, by the way? We know you watch film all the time. Maybe you just put other stuff on to go to sleep at night or whatever. I don't know how you haven't watched that yet, honestly. There's a new show out, a new trivia show. It's a new old show

called The Weakest Link. I've seen a couple episodes of that. a new show out a new trivia show it's a new old show called the weakest link oh goodbye yeah so i've seen a couple episodes of that other than that i haven't really watched any tv besides last night watching a little bit of a little bit of borat hey is it not borat by the way i don't know you tell me you're the fan i don't know you just you did a critical acclaim of the fucking both of them there i don't it's Borat, I think. Okay. No, it might be Borat. You're smarter than I am.

When you go on Jeopardy, you did the Jeopardy thing. And Ty, what did you say? You had the highest score of all the best games? Arguably the greatest single-game performance of all time. Will you ever go on just normal human Jeopardy? Well, not normally. That's because that's like the nerd Super Bowl, right? Do you think you could perform well against the Jeopardy Jameses and all them?

Well, not against him, no. Him and Ken Jennings are the two best players of all time. Amen. James rewrote the whole strategy on how to play. I mean, he put people away in the beginning by going for the biggest clues and then doubling his money. And then his ability, you know, he's just such a savant. Like, the ability to, like, figure out wagers on daily doubles

in order to get them right and equal dates that would correspond to important events in his life. I mean, that, to me, you know, I mean, it was unbelievable. I wish he was, I think he's a Chicago Bears fan, which I don't hold it against him because, you know, he's a Jeopardy hero. But no, I couldn't compete against him or Ken Jennings. I think some of the other, you know, when there's not one of those type of players on there,

I think I could maybe do okay. But I'd probably do better against celebrities. Against me and AJ. That makes a lot of sense. We're dumb. You're smart. You're athletic. You're great.

Good luck this weekend. You're going to play fantastic. Thanks, guys. I always enjoy seeing you. Ty, especially you, buddy. You buried him last week. You buried him last week. Hey, guess what?

Got to get better. And you did, by the way. Got to get better. And you did, by the way. Got to get better. And you did. That's right. Hey. Oh, wow. He's been trying to say it about my Chuck Norris shirt, by the way.

I don't know what that is. Chuck Norris? Chuck. Chuck Norris. Merrick wasn't ready, baby. Aaron, do you think? So I know Pat didn't notice. I noticed that your camera angle was slouching lower and lower.

I was trying to go this whole talk without mentioning your shirt because you've been trying to shoehorn into this conversation. I love Chuck, though. I don't know anything about him. I put on this shirt just for this interview, and I just wanted one little recognition for Carlos. He's a northern California guy. He's a legend.

You know, he's in Silent Rage, one of the greatest movies of all time. And Expendables. Yeah. You know, I just think we need to give him his due right now. I have no idea who you guys are talking about, but somebody does. Walker, Texas Ranger. Oh, I know Walker, Texas Ranger. He fucked over Ben Stiller at the end of Dodgeball.

That guy. I remember him. Yeah, fuck you, Texas Ranger. Oh, I know Walker, Texas Ranger. He fucked over Ben Stiller at the end of Dodgeball. That guy. I remember him. Yeah, fuck you, Chuck News. That's all you remember from him. Yeah, yeah, that's it right there, pal. Thanks a lot. Some Ron Haas kicks, huh? Yeah.

By the way, Condor was a zillion twice or something like that. Infinity twice. I remember all that, but I don't know much about him. Ben Stiller is your favorite actor, yeah? You like Ben Stiller a lot? Have you ever met him i love ben stiller he's great you just know everybody huh your your phone is just like boom i'm one text away from insert name of world leader here i know this person is that what it's like to be aaron rogers i'm one degree of separation from a lot of really cool people. Yourself included, Pat.

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which is a newsletter that shows up in your emails. They're awesome. They're like motivational things, little tidbits. Guy hosts shows for VEASAN. He writes for The Athletic. And he knows more about football

than any human I've ever talked to in my entire life. Italian man man Michael Lombardi nice to be here Pat nice to be with you Pat thank you hey I always thought I had a lot of jobs whenever I was going through my vitamin brain there listing off all the things that you did I realized quickly this guy has does everything at the moment i try to be busy you know i mean i like writing and uh so that keeps me busy and talking about football i mean it's really not a job it's just fun it's something i've done my whole life you know since i started the league you're handicapping games you know when you're a pro personnel director in the national football you're basically handicapping teams and i've been been able to take that and use that kind of knowledge

and broad-base it into this world that we live in today where people can make bets on the telephone and break down teams. So it's been fun for me. I love it. I have never – you know, when I was a mom, I was a fast truck here in Ocean City. When I was 17, that was work. I haven't worked since then.

Paisan. Paisan. First of all, people putting bets on their telephone. I mean,, that was work. I haven't worked since then. Paisan, Paisan. First of all, people putting bets on their telephone. I mean, Jesus, come on. I think you just say phone there. I mean, come on. I don't know if they're picking it up off the wall and they're like, hey, let's call it in.

By the way, you probably used to have to call in bets, I'd assume, back in the day, but obviously you know nothing about that because you've been in the game for so long. And that feels like a good path, by the way, for GMs to go. You're a GM, okay? You know more about football than almost every human on earth at this point. Not all GMs.

There are some bad GMs, but most good GMs. You want to retire, you don't want to do TV, just give out gambling advice because you, hey, the way you have helped me gamble this year, I am very, very thankful for. Well, I should give out gambling advice because you, hey, the way you have helped me gamble this year, I am very, very thankful for. Well, I appreciate that, but you're on a hot streak. You're a lot hotter than I am. I mean, we took a lump last night on the Bears, which we should have known better. Are there

two Nick Foles? That's what I really want to know. There's like two of them. Sometimes he's really good and sometimes he's really bad. There's no in-between Nick Foles. You don't even get a decent, you either get a great one or a bad one what happened uh johnny hecker just dominated that game and i went on like a 20 minute at the beginning of this i went on like a 20 minute run about why the punter position is important one and why it has been for a long time and why people like bill belichick talk about it why people like jim tressel called it literally

the most important play in football because it is just a territory game where you're trying to gain and gain more territory. Why do some people have no idea about special teams? Do you think it's strictly because TV people don't know about it and never talk about it or because it's not as sexy? Penalties in the

kicking game are disastrous, right? So you're supposed to have the ball at the 45-yard line, but there's a penalty on the kicking play, and now your drive starts at the 15. Well, that's a 30-yard penalty that doesn't show up in the stat sheet. You know, it's hidden yards. You can't find it. I mean, you can't find that number anywhere. And, you know, when you look at that one Super Bowl that was played in Indianapolis, the Giants' punter, I mean, that one Super Bowl that was played in Indianapolis,

the Giants' punter, I mean, he was the reason they won the game. I know they gave the MVP to Eli, but the Patriots' starting field position in that game was the 23-yard line. Steve Weatherford was that punter, by the way. Yeah, I know. But nobody wants to talk about it. You play on a long field, you've got to get a bunch of first downs. And if you're not making explosive plays like the bears can't do then the drive's going to stall and now that they're calling holding against the against the the offense drives are really stalling

now um last night was that more of a the los angeles rams are for real even though four of their wins are against nfc east teams or is it more the Bears who everybody was saying is the worst 4-1 good team, 5-2 team there is? I think if they played that game in Chicago, it would probably be different. If they played that game in Chicago in the cold, it would be different. You know, I don't think Goff could have traveled back to Chicago when the temperature dipped below 35. I think Goff's one of those players you should

really look at your smartphone and as the game is going decide how you want to play him because his body language tells you everything you need to know. And I didn't think that last night, even though I didn't think he was sharp sharp, I thought there was a sense of energy by the Rams. I think if they played

each other 10 times, I think the Rams would win six and the Bears would win four. Okay, so you're not giving up on the Bears at all. You think last night they had terrible field position at all games, so it's not really a fair indicator of how terrible their offense is or how good their offense is because it's a completely different

playbook back there. You think they potentially get back into a little bit of a run or you think they'll just be able to show a much better football team than they showed last night? I think anytime they play against a good offense that could score against their defense green bay for example they're going to have a hard time with green bay if the game's in the 20s the bears have to basically check out they have to fold their hand they're never going to get in the 20s they rank on my power rankings they're the 27th offense in football and you know for all the luster around matt nagy's

great offensive mind bu on his call sheet you know his offense is really whether it's been with mbp mitch or with with foals he'd rather run a triple reverse to get one yard than actually run the football and play with physicality he's in chicago and he plays soft i you know me i don't i i'm not a big fan of their offense I think anytime they play against a good defense a good offense that has to score if they play Kansas City they can't beat them if they play Tennessee

can't beat them no way you know because they can't match the score I love how matter of fact you are by the way knowing for sure that those games could happen and come back to bite you in the ass. You're so matter of fact, because you've been around football so much and you know so much about football at this point where you're just like, yeah, yeah, they're going to suck.

They have no chance against that. They'll win here. They're going to stink against this team. And you're just so matter of fact, that's why Jason Kelsey had to call you out on that stage because of how matter of fact. I wonder what he's thinking right now. I like to call you out on that stage because of how matter-of-fact you are. I wonder what he's thinking right now. I'd like to know that one. You know, I think football is a game of match-ups.

That was a little bit of a... Michael! I think football is a game of match-ups. I think, you know, look, the Eagles are my power ranking. They have the 26th-round offense. I mean, they're not playing very well either right now. But football is a game of match-ups, right? It's always about how your team fits, how your team plays. You know,

I thought, we all thought Pittsburgh was a tough matchup for Tennessee because they could slow them down a little bit. Whereas Tennessee's playing Cincinnati. Cincinnati will move the ball, but eventually that game, Tennessee will take it over this week. And that'll become a hard game for Cincinnati to win. So it's always about the matchups. And when you're a team like Chicago that's built on just your defense alone, you play Carolina, that's a good game because you can hold Carolina down. But you play a team like the Rams that can

score or San Francisco that can score points because of their offensive coordinator, you're going to have some issues. The matchup thing is what people talk about for Bill Belichick, how their offense every week is different. They have a new game plan. They're going to have some issues. The matchup thing is what people talk about for Bill Belichick, how their offense every week is different. They have a new game plan. They're going to attack your weaknesses. They're going to expose them. They're going to take over. They're going to make you play left-handed, which is kind of a shot at lefties, by the way. I don't think

playing left-handed is anything bad, but you get it. Make them play left-handed. Is that because of the matchup mindset? And did you develop that before you got there? Or was that just kind of the similar minds we think alike because we're smart about football thing? I think it's, I mean, I don't know about being smart, but I think we think alike. I think football's a game of matchup, right? I think that, you know, the way we see the game, the way Al Davis taught me the game from reading about him to working for him

was always about matchups. Like always, like last night, you know, like if I'm coaching the Bears, whoever the opposite corner is whether it's troy hill or anyone else i'm throwing the ball at him the entire game i'm making him know that i'm coming after his ass like i'm going to set it up so i'm coming after you and you're not getting off the hook i mean andy reed does it all the time andy reed does it every week andy reed basically when you're done playing him he's told you what he thinks about your defense. Those are what

good coaches do. They tell you when the game's over what they really think about your team. And if you don't have it, if you just run in place, what I call battleship football. You ever play battleship as a kid? Oh, yeah. I sunk all those in the bag. Boom. G4

hit. You know, it's like, that's the way Nagy calls a game. Well, let me look at my sheet and see what I can call now. Like, go after that other corner. He can't cover anybody. Go after his ass, you know, and make him earn his key. And there's not a lot of coaches in the league. They're all scheme-oriented. They don't care.

Some coaches, you put a Coke machine at left corner, they won't throw the ball over there the whole time. Why is that? Is that just two different philosophies on football? Two different ways. And then here's the other thing that I think makes it different, and this is an Al Davis-ism, is the great coaches can evaluate players. They can evaluate talent.

So that evaluation ability allows them to know who to attack, whereas there's some coaches, and you've been around them, Pat, some coaches just don't know talent at all. They just don't understand talent, and so they really can't break the game down from players and plays. They just break the game down from plays. And you've got to be able to combine players and plays together. It's one of the problems I think the Patriots are having this year

because they haven't had an offseason. And they really rely on that offseason to really allow them to understand who their players are and what their strengths and weaknesses are. Okay, so we could dive into that Patriots conversation but I think the whole world thinks they're dead not 100 sure with Bill Belichick you're ever dead but I would like to go back and talk to you about the uh the coke machine thing that you put out there what and I assume this is why Bill Belichick had a lot of respect for Peyton Peyton and I've told the story a couple times I saw it whenever I was uh a and I've told the story a couple times, I saw it whenever I was a rookie,

I was watching the game, it was the first time I noticed it because on TV, I don't think you get the chance to see it. A corner got hurt and jogged off the field. Some number 40-something came jogging in or some late 30 number came jogging in. And I watched Peyton literally just watch the guy jog all the way over to the corner position.

And then I saw him look at the guy and then I saw him look at the guy and then i saw him attack that guy seven straight times and we scored a touchdown or whatever and then the next time we went out same guy just got they tried to move a safety over he just won at him the entire time and i was like oh this guy is a savage like that is by the way it's what you should do in every sport if you're playing ping pong against somebody and you find out they don't have a backhand fucking feed that backhand it ain't about how how entertaining this game is for everybody to watch let's go ahead and get the dub and get out of here i wonder why that isn't a a universal mindset when

it comes to competing that's the easiest way to get a win is that what we're here for is that not what we're here for i think it's hard for some coaches to evaluate the talent i really do i think they can't see it like peyton like you know belichick writes up he writes up personally every defensive back every linebacker on the team he's getting ready to play and then he has a meeting with the quarterbacks to go over every defensive back and every linebacker they're getting ready to play so when the second team linebacker when the second team corner cup 13 corner comes in who hasn't played, they already know he's from Virginia. He's 5'11", 5. He runs 4'8".

He's got really bad ball skills. Whatever it is, they already know it. It's like Al Davis used to make the defensive coordinators, used to piss them off too, Pat. He would make the defensive coordinators sit in the draft room and discuss the quarterbacks in the draft. And they were like, why am I going to sit here? I'm wasting time.

Because what Al wanted to make sure that when a quarterback, when there was an exchange, when, you know, out goes the starter and in goes the backup, when my man Fenucci goes in, I call him Fenucci from the Godfather, when the kid from James Madison goes in for Dallas, boom. You know, the coordinator for the – Jack Del Rio should know exactly who that kid is, how he plays, what he does, what he likes to do because he's scattered him before.

You can't get ready for a game if you don't know that. Man, it sounds like Al Davis – I didn't know Al Davis was this – all I knew was Al Davis loved speed, always drafted speed, and just win, baby. I didn't know that Al Davis was like a football mastermind like this. He was great at understanding matchups more than any person I've ever been around. He taught it to Parcells. He taught it to Parcells, and Parcells taught it to Belichick.

And he was also really good at game management. If you called a timeout with 2.05, with with 206 to go in the half, you might have, you would have not made it back on the team plane. You would have not made it back on the team plane because now that gives the defense, the offense a chance to throw or pass, right? We're trying to get the ball back. We want them only to run the ball. We don't want them to run and throw. His game management, understanding that, like, let's say, you know, you're backed up for a punt. Nobody practices this. No one really.

They do in New England. I'm sure they do in other places. But every week you should practice when the team has the ball on their own one-yard line. Right? They have the ball on their own one-yard line. How many plays does an offense really have backed up like that? They run a fullback. They run a dive.

They run fullback in the flat. They run a nine route. They run about four plays. They don't stand back there and hold the ball or run choice or to run bingo cross. They stand back there to get it out. So if you practice those six plays they run and you stop them, you're going to get the ball back where?

40-yard line, one first down, you're kicking a field goal. That's situational game management football. That's what Al Davis is all about. I'll tell you what, I used to practice those one-yard line punts. I hated them. I used to jog out on the field just like this is the worst thing on earth. You have to get it out quick. You have to get it out quick. You can only take like a half a step the whole thing. And

by the way, you have to catch it. It's not even like you can find the laces. It's just like catch it, put it down, and get it out of there. It's a very difficult punt to do, which, by the way, sets up to your point. You're getting the ball in points territory. As soon as you get that ball, you're getting points as soon as you get it. Like when Teddy Bridgewater took that sack

the other night against New Orleans, Al Davis would have gone berserk. He would have blamed the coaches, not Teddy. He would have blamed the coaches, not Teddy, because he would have wanted he wants quarterbacks to know we can't take a sack. Like if you're at the opponent's five-yard line and you take a sack,

what's the big deal? You're going to kick the field goal. If you hold the ball too long there, you're going to kick a field goal. But you take a sack at their 35 and now you're back at the 42, that field goal becomes a lot harder. So it's that kind of stuff that he constantly wanted the players to teach, to learn and understand it. Same thing that happens in New England.

He teaches a class in football 101 from the time the players show up in April until they start playing. They don't have that this year. Well, yeah. Well, Hoyer obviously missed that every single time. Took a sack, ended the half. Oh, my God. Ty Schmitt, what do you got?

Michael, you mentioned a couple times on Hammer Don so far this year that you think the trade deadline is going to be pretty active if you were the gm of the packers wouldn't you be trying to either get like another explosive piece for rogers or someone to maybe shore up uh like the defensive line or the linebackers if they're not doing anything like that uh does that mean that they're just comfortable with their personnel obviously the cap is part of that but like why they see this window. Why aren't they going for it?

It's kind of like their philosophy since Ted Thompson was there. I mean, they've never really been a free agent team. Ted Thompson would only sign college free agents that were drafted. They were very one-dimensional. But if I was Guttekwest, I would be active as hell. I would want to find the piece that I could get. I would have been all over Antonio Brown. I mean, I would have been all over Antonio Brownio brown to put him on that team it shifts the

balance of power and and it makes you more competitive if you put him next to devonte adams assuming that he's going through all his off the field issues yeah i think strength builds strength and i think as a general manager when the season starts you have to make at least 10 moves to make your team better during the season how, you have to make at least 10 moves to make your team better during the season. You have to recognize what those 10 moves are. And some of those moves impact the next year's team, but some of them impact this year's team. And you've got to be there.

The problem is some of these GMs are at Texas A&M. They're at Toledo. They're at some college campus, and they're not watching the practices to understand what they really need. Baltimore does, getting in Dockway. I mean, now they've got a fifth rusher. Here's why they do that. They get a fifth rusher so that they can rush by against an offensive line,

and they don't have to run those overload pressures that Mahomes was eating alive. Every time they ran an overload pressure, Mahomes slid the protection. He got them in the right protection. He threw the ball and killed Baltimore. Now Baltimore can play balanced, rush the ball and killed Baltimore. Now Baltimore can play balanced, rush five, and get home. I have a question. Whenever you're signing like Antonio Brown, who

I think we all agree that Antonio Brown is a touchdown maker. That's what he is. He's a very, very good football player, obviously. And the old adage is be who you can afford to be in some places and all that. How do you know whenever you're signing Antonio Brown? The question is that a lot of people have. Not us. I think if you get him in the old adages be who you can afford to be in some places and all that how do you know whenever you're signing antonio brown like the question is that a lot of people have not us i

think if you get him in the building he respects tom brady enough he'll be able to he'll want to be focused in because of that he doesn't want to let down tom or whatever and i think he's trying to come back but there's a lot of people that are like hey the buccaneers seem to be hitting their stride now granted chris codwin's going to be out for at least a week because of a fractured finger or something that he got this weekend but there's a lot of people who are like why are we trying to fix something that maybe isn't broke right now that could potentially be a disaster in the locker room some people think that i'm not saying we do but there is that thought how do you feel about how do you balance that alongside adding talent too if you're a general

manager well i think you know the culture has got to help you right so i think brady's probably told them look i got antonio brown i was with him for 13 days i got he won't be a problem i promise you i'll handle him and i think the same thing could happen up at green bay aaron rogers like i got that dude i'll handle it you know davante adams and me we'll take care of it we'll get this under control because it'll help us now do i want to stay with them for six years probably not that marriage won't last but for the next 10 weeks i think we can make this thing work i think there's a part of the season where you have to really evaluate your team and say we really have a legitimate chance to get to the super bowl a legitimate chance to get there baltimore has it kansas city has that pittsburgh has it you know, Tennessee has it. They need to strengthen their defense.

But there's some teams that might be playoff teams. Maybe New England makes it. Maybe they don't. But they're not one player away from really making themselves a Super Bowl team. They need more than just that. Very interesting. Speaking of New England, Mike, obviously everyone's talking about the struggles on offense,

but the defense didn't force a punt against the Broncos or the Niners until the fourth quarter. So my question for you about the struggles on offense, but the defense didn't force a punt against the Broncos or the Niners until the fourth quarter. So my question for you about the Patriots is, do they just fucking stink or are they going to turn around and this is just a two-game skit? That's a great question. A lot of people are asking that question. A lot of people are asking. I think they lack team speed on defense.

I think they lack team speed on offense. I think that they try to play a lot of nickel against Denver. They try to get faster by playing smaller people like they did against Kansas City, and they don't have enough power or enough girth. I think that they tried to play a lot of nickel against Denver. They tried to get faster by playing smaller people like they did against Kansas City. And they don't have enough power or enough girth. I think they missed a ton of tackles against San Francisco. I think they didn't set the edge. I think they need to improve.

There's no doubt. I think their talent level, they're very young on defense. And I think that's costing them. And I think the other thing is, remember, when your Mike linebacker is slow, your Mike linebacker is slow your mike linebacker is slow your defense is slow and bentley's a good player but he's not a fast player so their defense is slow and you can attack the edges of their defense because they're slow and i think that's one of their biggest issues they've got to get faster on defense and and the way you do that how do you know a team's fast on defense go to the stat sheet and look at how many forced fumbles the defense creates not how many they recover how many they

create because it's the true theory power and mass equals violence and the ball comes out and the patriots just don't do that they don't have enough physicality or speed in their defensive front seven to create problems what did you think of dkcalf's speed on defense the other night? That was outlandish, dude. That was unbelievable. And, you know, his effort was more unbelievable than anything. Absolutely. I mean, the fact that he never gave up on the play

and his commitment and his team effort. You know, I mean, on one hand, we see that play, and then we watch Andy Dalton get hit, and no Cowboy player goes over there to pick him up. So that's messaging in the locker. That's messaging. Hey, that can't happen. Jerry Jones, we have a clip.

We have a clip for Jerry Jones getting interviewed this morning. I'd actually want to hear you react to this because you've been a general manager. You've been up there at the top where Jerry Jones sits. He's getting interviewed now about the locker room, and this was – do we have this, Foxy? His response, he basically told the guy to shut up and let him answer in the middle of it because i think jerry jones is getting sick of either seeing the headlines about the locker room or whatever he's trying to bury it this is

his answer here where do you where would you have a leadership board is it an experience void is it a talent void is it a leadership board i'm not trying to be cute here. The answer is no. The answer is no. There's not a, will you just shut up and let me answer? No. When I go into the locker room, there's no leadership void in my house. Well, then after that key line right there to the sentence, when I go into the locker room, there's no leadership void. Well, they're never going to not tell the owner, the man who's writing their checks, if there's a void. They're going to tell him what he wants to hear. That's part of leadership. That's what happens to you when you own the team. People only tell you what you want to hear. You've got to have some contrarian views

of what's going on. And if Jerry can't see it, look, Jerry's in a profession where I know he's in the Hall of Fame, but he got there for his marketing skills. As Bill Parcells once said about Jerry Jones, he could talk a cat off the top of a fish truck. He's really good at that, right? He's really good. But his football acumen is what needs most today. So he's got to decide what's wrong with his team.

Is it players, coaches, or scheme? When you give up 173 yards a game rushing and you can't hold anybody under 40 points, you've got problems in all three areas. But you've got to identify where's the key area. The key area is scheme and coaching. So there's leadership voids in those two areas. And as a general manager, you don't need to walk in the locker room to know that. Just watch the tape. Watch practice, what they're teaching, and what they're doing on Sunday. That's the connection. Practice execution becomes game reality. If you can't tell the difference in the tape, then you're really making a mistake.

And Jerry is showing that he's really more of a fan than he is truly a football expert because he's answering the question based on what people tell him. It's what he needs to know. What he needs to observe is the answer to the question. Wow. Jeez, that was incredible. What an answer right there. So you're saying like your answer in of itself is already showcasing that you are out of touch with your actual team and what's happening.

Now, the interesting thing here, though, is whenever he was running the team right way back in the day, he had success, right? There was success. So I would assume that's potentially because of coaching and everything like that. in the day he had success right there was success so i would assume that's potentially because of coaching and everything like that but people always fall back on that response whenever people say that jerry jones should get his hands out of the football side they're like well he did have a a little bit of a dynasty type run with the cowboys back in the day whenever he was running it was that him was that somebody else and has he just lost that was jimmy that was give him all the credit in the world he deserves this for hiring jimmy when he hired jimmy nobody thought

jimmy was a good coach everybody thought jimmy was a college coach when he hired jimmy and paid him a million dollars a year paid him a 10 million dollar gave him 10 million dollar contract a million a year for 10 years the national football league went berserk but jerry was so smart he went to apex which is no longer a clother out in business anymore which would be the equivalent of nike or reebok or Adidas or Puma, whatever. And he went to them and said, look, you can control my sideline. I'll give you all the cowboy paraphernalia. You pay me $10. You pay me $10 million for the next 10 years. They said, sure. So there's Jimmy's contract covered right there. Jerry didn't even pay for

it. And he put all their merchandise on, and that started the NFL controlling the sidelines. That started the NFL having parallel deals. Before, go back to some of those old tapes. You'll see Belichick with a starter jacket on. You'll see Parcells with an APEC jacket on. The guys were selling the sidelines like it was their own business.

Well, Jerry's done great business for the Dallas Cowboys and the NFL. Ladies and gentlemen, Michael Lombardi. Nice to be here, Pat. Nice to be with you, Pat. Thank you. Can't thank you enough for choosing to listen to this show. Hope you had an incredible Aaron Rodgers Tuesday like we did.

It's a great day to have a great day. People forget about that. And it's also a great day to tell people about this show. If you enjoyed it and if you hated it, just act like it never fucking happened. From all of us to all of you, you're the best. Hashtag end the pod squad. Go ahead and send in some photos to potentially win some merch. We've given away like 30 shirts, I believe, in the last five days.

Something like that. Pretty good rate there. Just want to keep giving them away. I know you do. We appreciate when people listen to the show. We do oh yeah big time because not every show is great no some shows are really meh to be honest with you i walk out of it i'm like you bat 300 you get into the hall of fame you know bingo that's baseball not in this profession but i understand what you're saying right right but i look at other people's shows and I go, eh, better than that fucking show.

If you felt that, please be a friend, tell a friend. We'll be back tomorrow. Massive guest tomorrow. Big time, baby. Big time. Tomorrow, big guest. I mean. Can't tell you yet.

Can it get bigger than Aaron Rodgers? I'm not 100% sure, but we tried. I ask myself that every week and I am continually blown away. All right, Ty Schmidt, please play some independent music and send these people on the greatest Tuesday they've ever had in their entire life. Cheers. We'll be back manana. Remember to subscribe, rate, and review. ស្រូវនប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប�ាប់បានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានូវនប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប៶ប់បានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានបានូវនប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប់ប�ាប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់បានប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប� Outro Music