The Pat McAfee Show - PMS 2.0 788 - Dan Orlovsky, Michael Rubin, Everything DB With Darius Butler LIVE From The ThunderDome, & AJ Hawk

Episode Date: November 9, 2022

On today's show, Pat, Darius Butler, AJ Hawk, and the boys chat about some big personal news in Pat's life, an injury update on Josh Allen's throwing elbow, why the Ravens haven't paid Lamar Jackson yet, and everything else happening around the NFL as we prepare for week 10 of the NFL. Joining the progrum to chat about the Colts' coaching situation, Josh Allen's injury, which OC's have impressed him the most thus far, the Packers struggles, Mac Jones' regression, and much more is 12 year NFL veteran at QB, ESPN's preeminent NFL analyst, future Offensive Coordinator and QB Guru, Dan Orlovsky (28:29-1:02:09). Later, billionaire, Founder and CEO of Fanatics, former owner of the Philadelphia 76ers, Michael Rubin joins the show to chat about how he's gotten to the position he's in, what motivates him, what's next for him, his relationship with Robert Kraft, where he see's Fanatics going from here, how difficult it was giving up his ownership stake in the 76ers, and much more (1:43:59-2:09:14). Later, 9 year NFL veteran at Defensive Back, host of the Man-To-Man podcast, co-host of the NFL Matchup Show on ESPN, Darius Butler highlights the best Defensive Back play around the NFL in his weekly Everything DB segment (2:09:16-2:47:36). Make sure you subscribe to youtube.com/thepatmcafeeshow to watch the show. We appreciate the hell out of all you. See you tomorrow, cheers.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

people. Welcome to our humble abode, the Fandle Thunderdome. It is winter Wednesday, November 9th, 2022. This show starts now. Football is the topic of conversation 24-7 around here because football never stops. There's news breaking around the NFL at all times. We will cover all of that and more. There's certainly conversations to be had about what's going to happen this upcoming weekend. We'll also take a look back at the leaders, at individual position groups, now that we are officially on the Wednesday of halfway through the NFL season. Who has dominated the first half? We shall dive into that.

We have Dan Orszawski joining us in about 27 minutes. Cannot wait to chat with him. He's been subtweeting a lot of people. Can't wait to talk to him about that and how his season is going as a whole. He's called a couple NFL games. He's called some college games. He's on TV every day. How's Dan Orlovsky doing?

We shall talk to him about that. Also, Michael Rubin, billionaire ceo of fanatics will join us in two hours right here to chit chat about everything going on with fanatics his life his friends and also maybe dabble with the jeff bezos jay-z gonna own the commanders alongside matthew mcconaughey conversation because i think he is a billionaire his friends with all the billionaires oh yeah and not just the billionaires seems like this guy's friends with all the billionaires. Oh, yeah. And not just the billionaires. It seems like this guy's friends with everybody. Cannot wait to chat with him in two hours. His people reach out to us and said, hey, we're big fans.

If you'd ever want to chat with him, he'd be cool with that. We put that in the bank for a couple weeks and then said, did they say that he would come on the show? And we read the email back. It was like, yeah. I was like, we should get a fucking billionaire on the show. I think that's the right play to do. So he'll be joining us in a couple hours. Can't wait for that conversation.

The boys are here, the Toxie Table at Boston Connor at Ty Schmidt. Hair is flowing today, pal. Hey, thanks, Pat. I, you know, washed it last week for the first time in a long time. So, you know, it's still carried on into this. No, you did something to it today. That isn't from last week right there, pal. Well, to be fair, I have, you know, kind of put it up in a bun in the mornings just in case it's a little cold out.

I don't want the hair to freeze. And then I just took it out of the bun, so that might be why. Well, you also just got to fade clearly. Oh, of course. Oh, yeah, the haircut, yeah. Hey, never touch the hair, though. Never yet. Hair stays the same.

Oh, you're talking about the hair on the top of your head. The hair on the top. Yeah, in the back. That never changes. Not on the side. Not on the side. Yeah, you look good, man. You look good.

As do you, Ty Schmidt. We heard Aaron give a motivational speech to Green Bay Packers fans through how he's going to view the rest of the season. What are your thoughts on the Green Bay Packers this Wednesday, as opposed to previous Wednesdays after an Aaron Rodgers Tuesday, Ty? You know, we'll see. A lot of reaction to Aaron Rodgers Tuesday. Yeah, as there always is.

And it's it's kind of one of those things where i i'm not gonna let it take up too much of my mental bandwidth because i don't want to get myself super excited just to get to sunday and have them look like shit again against the cowboys and then kind of be kicking myself and saying well why did i get so excited why did i think they could have the opportunity to win? So I'll absolutely watch the game on Sunday. If they win, I'll be ecstatic. But if they don't, I'm done with the, you know, I mean. Ruining your life.

Yeah, exactly. They're three and six. They're three and six, and they play the Cowboys. Fly. The Titans. Titans. Fly. And the Eagles.

Fly. In the next three weeks. And, you know, two of those games are in one week. So, yeah, hey, three weeks from now, if they win these next three games, we'll be in a much different situation. But if they lose those next three games, you know, you're looking at three and nine, and then we're scouring, you know, hey, what Iowa Hawkeye do I want the Packers to draft? You know, in the top five of the draft next year.

So, I mean, people are going to react and be pissed at him, and he's not playing well right now so he's going to just kind of have to take it so it's a very very awkward time weird time in packer land but hey we're here i think uh well i appreciate you saying that and obviously i always enjoy getting your reaction to the aaron rogers tuesday the old art after the show over there watching you kind of take it all in on what was said. Because when you're in a conversation, you can't catch it all. Right.

There was a couple of things I caught during the conversation. As soon as he said them, I actually started laughing on the screen. Where he said, I've thrown a lot of touchdowns. I don't give a shit about what anybody on TV has to say. It's like, well, TV people now are going to take that personally. They're going to discuss that tomorrow. Now they're going to take that personally because you just kind of took a shot at them. Which, by the way, he's allowed to because they've taken a lot of shots at fucking him over the years.

A lot of people that have never been able to play quarterback anywhere near the ability that he has been able to do it have judged a lot of things that he's done on the football field. He has clearly heard them, I assume, but that's part of being a quarterback in the NFL. So him taking a shot back at him, I was like, all right, here we go. Okay, that's going to be something. And then everything else he said obviously pissed people off as well. If you win games, though, it's all good. If you don't, it's all bad.

That's kind of what the world is of professional sports, and we're experiencing that for the first time on Aaron Rodgers Tuesday. First two seasons, Aaron Rodgers Tuesday, he won the MVP. We actually thought, wow, this is awesome. This is a dream. This is what it's supposed to be. And then now we're facing a little adversity this season for the Packers. We're facing some conversations with Aaron that he might not be incredibly comfortable to be

having, especially on Aaron Rodgers Tuesday, which has been a beacon of positivity, I think, for the last couple of years. For sure. Except for the vaccination conversations. Right, of course. But football-wise, very positive chit-chat about what he's thinking, what he's doing, why he's doing what he's doing. We're getting a chance to tap into the most talented football thrower of all time and how he feels and why he feels the way he does every single game that was something that art brought the world that i don't think sports media was appreciative enough 10 15 years from now they'll look back on some of the things he said on that and be like well remember aaron this is what he was thinking whenever this type of stuff was happening so maybe it'd be appreciated

now we're talking it's bad football yep there's There's no VAC stuff. Right. It is just living in an adversity-riddled season right now. And if they're able to turn around and be a great story, hey, he said he bet on himself first. Me too, Aaron. There's no reason not to think he wouldn't come out and ball. Tone Diggs is here, one half of the hammer. Done. Cowboys.

Mike Tomlin saying T.J. Watt probably back this weekend. That's good news. That means your whole entire team will be better, right? He is the type of person that on defense side of the ball can set a tone, change an entire game. But I think the offense can also feel a spark. He's a defensive MVP for a reason. Put the guy in the fucking game. Yes, I believe

the most telling stat is obviously their record without T.J. Watt when he's been hurt over the years, which is not good. But also I believe they've led the league in sacks the last four or five years. And they're dead last, I believe, in sacks this year. It's probably because T.J. Watt hasn't been on the field. So he comes back.

They go 7-2, make the playoffs. It's going to be an awesome fucking season. And if they don't? Fucking fuck me up, boys. What? Beat the shit out of you? Yeah, like, I'll go to the loony bin with you. Line starts behind me.

I don't think I understand. Wait, hold on. I don't think, fuck me up. Well, Ty said,'ll fucking, I'll go to the loony bin with you. Line starts behind me. I don't think I understand. Wait, hold on. I don't think, fuck me up. Well, Ty said, like, you know, fuck him, I don't care anymore. Like, I'm ready for all the pain. What the hell? Oh, you're ready for the shit talk, the bashing. I'm ready for the pain.

Okay. Okay, so like crowbars and shit. I'll tell you what, I think it's maybe a state of the society that we're in. Whenever you're like, hey, fuck me up, I'm like, I think you have a mental issue. Like, whenever you said, like, I was worried about what was going on. I definitely have that. I didn't know what, well. Oh, slow down.

We had that cream from Brett Favre there. Yeah, that's right. I drink the water. I've been on the water for years. Russell Wilson, do you think he funded that business to get that concussion water? Maybe. Maybe. Through a welfare fund in Washington.

We say allegedly that Russ and three and four are in cahoots. I'm just saying, we don't know how the water was funded. Agreed. We don't need to do that. We don't know how the water is funded. We did find out how the cream was funded. And the nasal spray. And the side effects, too.

Tony said he did make them want to steal from every homeless person he saw. So you think maybe the cream led caused to the doesn't help with concussions no but it does help with your urge to rob the fucking poor that's right maybe we don't know i mean i don't know somebody might be selling those on the street somewhere if you want to get into being the opposite of peter pan being one of the worst humans of all time go ahead and do that that store is continuing to unravel oh yeah and it's only going to get worse yeah Yeah, because there's going to be more. Oh, yeah.

Because they had a plug. They had a plug on how to get a government fund. Hey, whatever you can do to create that we can give money to, we can do. Oh, I want a new indoor facility. Deal. Got it. Fuck the poor people. Hey, I want to do this cream to save concussions.

It won't lie to people about how good they are. It won't lie to people about who's also promoting it. But that won't matter anyways because we're coming from one particular fund that's going to say, yeah, we're investing this because we're trying to make more money for the fund. So we're investing in a business of the future. Here's millions of dollars here, right here. I assume there's going to be maybe a merch company, maybe a, let's hope no, Copperfit got funded by any of this. I'm not saying that it would. But like the amount of things that people were probably being told, just think of ways for us to give you money from this welfare fund because we have control of it from this one person.

Brett Favre was in the middle of that whole thing. We'll continue to chat about that just because of how absurd it is and how we need to. I think I've been bad with this my whole life. Even when I was a kid. And life, even when I was a kid. And speaking of me when I was a kid, we'll talk about something that my wife and I announced earlier. But even when I was a kid, the whole, like, you need to respect the person because of the position they're in, I always struggled with it. Tim and Sally tried their fucking best to have me be respectful to people. But if they did something that even at my young age deemed to be dumb, I naturally judged them. And I wouldn't like openly say anything because I thought that would be disrespectful to my parents or anything like that.

But the way I went about acting around those people was certainly vast. And it's obviously carried into my adulthood. And I got a chance to join Ryan Hawk, A.J. Hawk's brother, on his leadership podcast, which was recording its 500th episode. It's very good. brother on his leadership podcast, which was recording its 500th episode. It's very good. I got a chance to chat with him about the Steve Jobs quote about how the world that is around you that you see was built by people that are no smarter than you are. So I think we've always been told that we're supposed to respect these people that are in positions of power. And I think we should. But I think it's also very okay not to just blindly be like, this person's probably a

good person because they're in a position of power. If you think about that person in 2020, this person's probably a good person because they're in a position of power. If you think about that person in 2020, the person, the director of the welfare fund, who pled guilty in 2020 alongside the director of non-profit, which was a lady, in 2000 for like 70 some million or 38 million, I forget, 38 people, 70 million, 20 million dollars, whatever it was. It's a massive amount of money. The way they acted around people as if they were somebody, the way people talked to them and allowed them access to anything

and probably everything they said was good. That motherfucker was robbing people blind behind the scenes. I think we should always have our antennas up for bullshit, no matter what the position is. And I think that'll make the world a much better place going forward. And if you're in one of those positions of power, I think you should hold it in high regard, obviously. But you're also setting an example for future generations

for their trust in positions of power. Like, this story right here is going to amplify people saying that they don't trust people or making decisions for other things. Like, it's just going to get louder and louder as more of these happen.

So let's all assume that in a world not too long from now, nobody will fuck anything up whenever they're in a position of power, and we're excited. Yeah, can't wait. Speaking to you, that's what we're going to do. It's going to be great whenever that time comes.

That's just happened in Mississippi. There's 50 other states, numerous other funds that are being put. Yeah, there's a lot of people in charge of a lot of things that are probably doing shady shit. I hope we find out about it all. I hope it never happens again. Nonetheless, Brett Favre, bad guy. Terrible. Bad guy.

Joining us, good guy on the stage, host of Everything DB, the man-to-man podcast, a man who played in the NFL for a long time. That corner, nickel, and safety has some great plays to break down today and make us smarter. We'll be joining us, ladies and gentlemen, Darius Butler. Yeah, how you doing? You're 10 already, man. That's good, right, for you?

Crazy. With your season? It flies by. Just like when you're in the locker room playing, you know, you play a game, and then next thing, you're game planning for the next one. But schedule, you're getting used to it. Kind of at the halfway point, didn't hit the rookie wall yet. That's good.

Feeling good. Yeah, well, it's because you're a vet, dude. That's why you're on here. God damn right. And the traveling that you're doing, because he does, obviously, Man to Man podcast every single. Monday and Thursday. Monday and Thursday.

I knew Thursday because he does it live from right here. It's a great show. Monday, Thursday. He does this show Wednesday, Thursday. Then he flies to Philadelphia to shoot an NFL matchup for ESPN. Then he flies home, be a great dad, hop on the road again, pull on repeat for the rest of the entire season. I appreciate your work ethic, D-Bud.

You've been doing great. I appreciate it, too. You've been doing great with it all. You've been doing great with it all. That's fine. Darius, you're a great father. Got to watch you be a dad

both digitally and real life, whenever you're playing. You've handled it with such confidence and ease, and your kids love you, which I think is the telling of whether or not you're a good father. Ty, I got a chance to go to the

reception of the baptism this weekend. The entire family around Sloan was amazing. I mean, it was absolutely amazing. Tone, Paisana, your baby, watching your dad hold her in the photos and seeing you literally be a different person, I think. Now, into the microphone, you're still saying the same stuff, but living for a different thing that like it is. And obviously I have a lot of friends that are, that are parents and they're great at what they do. I grew up never wanting to be a dad. That was not something I ever wanted to do. I never wanted to have a kid mostly because I was a piece of shit as a kid. I was a tough kid to handle. I mean, I was in trouble all the time. You've heard about, I mean, fifth grade, I had a cigarette sales operation where I was, you know what I mean? Like it was,

I was just a bad kid, energetic, talked a lot. I was out and about. I couldn't play video games. I was a lot to handle. A lot of people were probably very annoyed with me as a kid. So I just kind of shaped it in my mind. Like I'm just going to work forever. I'm just going to do my thing. I don't want to have a kid. Fast forward to, you know, meeting Samantha Lutie. And then we end up getting married, Samantha McAfee. And, you know, I do something that I never thought I was going to do, which is get married. And then I start like enjoying marriage and seeing everything about it. And, you know, Sam really changed my mindset on a lot of things. And it was, it's cool to have a partner in life almost, which I never really wanted in the past. Never really thought of something it was going to be.

I honestly assumed I was going to die alone and I was going to be completely cool with it. I was going to be good uncles. I was going to go pop in. I was going to give big gifts. Hey, how you doing? Crying. Get the fuck away from me. I'm going to get out of here. Oh, you guys got Thanksgiving. Can I come over to Thanksgiving? Cool. I'm going to come over thanksgiving cool i'm gonna come over i'm gonna do that i just assumed i would die alone sam has really changed me in a massive way with that obviously we're married going on three years i mean jesus we're already two years wow covid counts for like three years in a long so 10 10 10 15 you mean yeah yeah but nonetheless we're married i'm enjoying it and sam has always dreamt of being a mother. So whenever Sam and I start talking about our future,

just listening to her passion and listening to the way she goes about doing everything, whether it's holidays around the house, the way she treats our animals and our pets, and the way she treats people and her friends' kids, it's like, oh, this woman would be an incredible mother. This woman is going to be a great mom like she cares she's invested she loves doing all the like corny stuff that parents do she tries to do it for our animals now it's like this lady wants to be a mom was potentially her greatest gift is going to be to be a mom so after I started realizing that and talking to her I was like all right let's have a kid so Sam and I we attempt to have a kid. Uh, we get pregnant, uh, first, like literally within

the first like couple of weeks of trying. And she goes through an ectopic pregnancy, which I did not know what it was. I looked into it. It caused an emergency surgery in which she had internal bleeding. Doctor told me she might die from the way. So we go from her being pregnant, having a positive on a pregnancy test, like first time doing it. Okay, my life has changed. I'm going to be a dad. Never expected to be a dad. I'm going to be a dad. And then all of a sudden we're in the hospital the night the Browns take on the Ravens and Lamar Jackson has the poop game.

Brown's taking on the Ravens and Lamar Jackson has the poop game. So I'm in the hospital while Sam's going through like a 45 minute surgery. While she goes in for that surgery, I'm told like internal bleeding. We don't know how bad it's going to be, but we should be good. But there is obviously a chance or whatever. I'm like, my wife's going to fucking die. Like that's insane. So she obviously survives through that surgery, devastated that she's not going to be a mom now, right?

Starts blaming herself. So then we have to go through an entire recovery period, not only for her body from the surgery, but also from her being so incredibly upset and let down by herself that she wasn't able to just do what everybody else seemingly is able to do. So that led to me and Sam looking into like stats and how normal it is for people to have miscarriages and ectopic pregnancies. And it's not really talked about much, but it is a alarmingly high percent of pregnancies end up not being successful. And I think that is something that women are embarrassed to share that they go through it. So don't really hear as many, as much about it or whatever. And a lot of people in high school are like, oh, it's easy to get somebody pregnant. So you're like scared in doing

it. But I don't think anybody realizes the alarmingly high amount of times that it does not work out. And it is devastating. I mean, absolutely devastating to my wife, Samantha, and to a lot of moms out there that are dreaming of it. So it took us a little bit to get past that, I think both physically, mentally, emotionally and everything. So we try to get pregnant again. We get pregnant again immediately. It happens. Here we go. We're happy. We have the entire like, hey, you're going to be a dad video Sam made. Like it was, it was really cool. Like we were doing the whole thing again, emergency surgery, ectopic pregnancy, her fallopian tubes internal bleeding that was when michigan beat ohio state in michigan i'm in the hospital that day same exact situation so i have

a lot more questions for the doctor this time i'm like how do we get to the point where she's going to maybe die again like are we not looking at this and there's obviously a lot more that goes into it but that was an incredibly emotional day there. Sam survives, gets through it, obviously. Surgery's tough. I mean, they're cutting in. It is a full thing, very intrusive. Immediately again now, Sam feels terrible about herself. She's disappointed herself. She's let herself down. She thinks that she's not strong enough to be a mom. And all these things are things that I'm trying to combat her with. Like, no, Sam, this is out of your control completely. There's nothing you can do. You can't control what's happening inside of you. She doesn't see it that way though. So I'm trying my best to be like, Sam, we were able to get pregnant. You're go, you're okay. She loses her second fallopian

tube, right? So in theory, if you just go by the natural thing, her two surgeries that had to happen, life-saving surgeries that happened, take away the natural ability to have a child. So immediately after the surgery is done, we're told like, hey, IVF seems like the perfect thing for you guys because our egg and our sperm have met and made a baby every single time. Just for whatever reason, it hadn't been able to get into, you know, the incubator to really start cooking. So we started looking into IVF, but it took us a little bit to want to do that because of how emotionally draining everything was. Sam is a fucking badass. Sam has battled and battled not only physically, but mentally,

emotionally. She's had to go through a bunch. So we start the IVF process back in July. It involves a shot every single night that I'm administering to her. She's getting multiple shots for the first few weeks a day, like three shots a day for the first few weeks. I'm giving her a shot every single night to add to this oil and this hormone that's happening. We're going in, she's giving blood every single week, or maybe even twice a week, she has to go in and give blood. We're getting ultrasounds that are very uncomfortable. We're doing this whole thing. It's a whole process. She's taking pills. She's got all these things. It's like a human science experiment. We're going through the fucking

database that they have. We have to like go through and like read and learn about every single part of the entire thing. So I feel like I'm pretty educated on the entire pregnancy thing through it all. But my wife has had to take needles and give blood and the amount of conversations and uncomfortable conversations that she's had to have every single day, all in hopes of getting pregnant. Not even that it's going to happen. She's putting herself through hell in hopes of getting pregnant.

We get pregnant. We think it's going to go good, but we didn't want to tell anybody because we didn't want to put the unwarranted pressure on people to not only be happy for us, but also then if it doesn't work out because we have been scarred a little bit the first two times, we don't want anybody to feel bad and do the whole thing. So we have completed the first trimester. The baby looks incredibly safe. We do not know the sex, although we could have known the sex through the IVF process. We chose not to. We'll find that out in a few weeks.

And I just want to tell my wife how incredibly proud I am of her. She has been a badass through this. Her persistence and resilience has been something that is nothing short of inspiring. She has been through a lot of pain. She has a lot of scars, both physically and emotionally from this whole process. And I can't wait to see you be a mom. You're going to be the fucking best mom on earth. And I appreciate you so much. And thank you to everybody in our universe for being very supportive through this all. Obviously, our family

and friends knew before we made the public announcement. And the boys, I can just speak, getting to watch you guys become dads and getting a chance to chat with you guys about it and the things that you guys, because there's been some tough mornings where I've come in here and it's like, this has been tough. Like, this has been a lot. You guys have not only kept me positive and motivated, but also have kept, like, hope for what it's going to be like whenever we're going to be parents.

So I appreciate you all so much. To my family, thank you so much. D-Butt even gave me a couple motivational speeches about being a dad a few times whenever he would travel in here. So I appreciate everybody. Sam's family, Sam's friends have been very supportive. And all the love we were shown on the Internet, we're very thankful for. But I'm scared to fucking dead i had no

idea it was gonna happen i hope i'll be a good dad and uh thank you everybody for the love honestly with that being said sam you're a badass it was a lot though that's crazy we walked into the hospital and it's like we're pregnant we're happy sam's having a little pain uncomfort discomfort or whatever yeah should we go to the hospital? Is this just, she's pregnant. Is there going to be discomfort? Is it pain? Are you going to be in pain whenever you're pregnant?

Is something going to go on? Go into the hospital and then like fucking, we get there and they're like, oh, we need to do emergency surgery right now. Internal bleeding. We don't need to bleed anymore. You might die or whatever. It's like, this is terrible. What the fuck?

So then whenever Sam wanted to do it again, I was like, are we sure we want to do this again? And Sam, like being a mom, I think is something that a lot of women, I'm not saying every woman, because I've seen people that have bad moms that,

that exists out there. And I think we need to remember that whenever we hear stories about somebody, Oh, they did this to their mom. It's like, well, let's ask what mom did too. Cause there is some people that have bad family members. A majority though, let's assume there's a majority of great moms out there. I think like naturally want to be mom, yearn to be a mom. I think it's in there, but also I feel like can prove to be great moms. And I think Sam had all those, like, I think Sam wanted to be, I think she yearned to be, and I think she prove to be great moms, and I think Sam had all those. I think Sam wanted to be.

I think she yearned to be, and I think she wants to be an incredible mom. So I'm happy we got back in there. I'm happy IVF existed. Big shout-out to Dr. O'Leary. She was the doctor through it all, through the IVF. She's a badass former Air Force guy, I think. Damn. Yeah.

I think she's been really cool. She's been a support system for Sam who sends a text. Because every once in a while, we'll just wake up, and I can't feel. So I have no. And she'll be like, oh, I'm having a little. And our automatic reaction is like, oh, no, oh, no, oh, no. So then she'll text Dr. O'Leary, and she'll get a text back from Dr. O'Leary like, oh, that's gas. And I'm like, oh, this is what I feel.

Sam, are you just going to go shit your pants right now here? Is that what you're going to do? She goes, stop. I don't do that. Iar like, oh, that's gas. And I'm like, oh, this is what I feel. Sam, are you just going to go shit your pants right now, Sam? Is that what you got to do? She goes, stop. I don't do that. I'm like, that sounds like you. It sounds like you just, and it becomes obviously I'm not supposed to be the guy that is in those situations, but it's been a fun process. It's been a grueling, I think, for Sam. She's been 150 shots.

She's, damn, 150. I've become pretty good, though, I will say. At the drawing, switching the needle, putting the other needle in, antibacterial wipe, putting it in there like you're throwing a dart. It's like you're supposed to go in there like it's a dart. And then also the conversation with the wife as she's crying because I'm stabbing her every single night. That is a tough thing for a relationship to go through because she would be like nauseous and sick because she's pregnant. So I'd come home. I make a sound. It's making her feel even worse. It's like, ah, my presence is not good here. So then I know an hour from now I'm going to have

to give her a shot too. I'm like, oh, so I'm just going to stand here and I'm just going to, I'm just going to try not to fuck anything up right now. I'm just going to be quiet. So then I've got to give her a shot, and she's sleeping because she's tired or whatever. So I have to wake her up. I'm like, hey, I've got to give you a shot. That's not the best news, right? That's not the best news to wake up to.

So then I wake her up, get her an ice bag. She puts it on there, and she hates needles, obviously. So she has had to face her fear here, like dive into a pit of needles, basically. And then every single time, it's painful. And then you hear your wife, who you love, go, like, agony almost. And it's like, this is tough. This is very difficult. But we're incredibly lucky that it worked for now.

Hopefully, we'll be able to continue this whole thing. And hopefully, I won't be the worst father of all time. That's what we're planning on. Dahmer's dad up there at number one. I think Hitler probably up there. Fogel's dad didn't do great either. There's a long list that we could go through, I guess. I'm just hoping not to be that.

Hopefully, little whatever the name is. Here we go. A lot of conversations on this particular program about what I'm going to name the kid. A lot of possibilities. Turns out I don't have a lot of decision-making. Ah. Yeah. I've learned that over the last couple weeks.

49%? Yeah, yeah. Two people have votes. I have 49% of the vote. That's a huge percentage. Massive. But when the other person, you do the math here, has 51%, I say, oh, that's a little bit more. That's the majority.

That seems like that's going to be the winning vote. But I think we'll come do it together, and I'm incredibly proud of Sam. I can't wait to be a dad, but I am scared to death. But anyways, let's move on. Let's talk about some other stuff going on in the world. D-butt. The NFL season makes no sense. Seven out of eight of the divisions, okay, seven out of the eight of the divisions

have a team that is within three games of leading the division. The only one that isn't is the NFC North, and that's because the Vikings are so far ahead of everybody else, and everybody else kind of stinks. Anybody can make it at the end of the season. Are we still sure that there's only like four or five teams? In the Josh Allen news, that his elbow is sprained, which I think a sprain is a partial tear. I don't know the actual medical, but I think they classify a sprain as a partial tear of a ligament. So he has a partial tear of the UCL on the inside of his elbow. He didn't tear it, so he's not out completely.

He doesn't need Tommy, John. That can recover. Does that change your thoughts on any of the teams that are going to make it, or do you still think there's like four or five teams that are going to be able to go? I still think it's four or five teams right now that kind of have separated themselves this far. But like you said, it's a long season left. And this first half didn't make much sense. We can assume that the second half will have just as much drama. But obviously this injury to Josh Allen is huge.

Obviously, you know, it's his throwing arm. He's throwing, but he runs a lot. He's pretty much their run game for a large majority of it at least. So that's big for the Bills, especially in that division when everybody's over 500. You know, the Patriots at the bottom at 5-4. So, you know, good defenses. They're 0-2 right now in the division.

So that's a huge, huge question mark. I think so, too. And I think the – And is it a star? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's not good. Now, he is a guy, and we talked about this yesterday,

who just do what Malik Willis is doing in Tennessee. I don't think they'll do that to Josh Allen because they're paying him a couple hundred million dollars, and he's got an absolute rocket. But the spring, maybe they rest him the next few. They've got Vikings coming up, which is a big game. And then they've got, I think, the Lions. And the Bears.

And the Bears after that. No offense to either of those teams, but I think that Buffalo Bills team is good. You could technically get them like a three-week rehab rest before divisional games end up towards the end of it. I'll be excited to see what the Buffalo Bills team is good. You could technically get him like a three-week rehab rest before divisional games end up towards the end of it. I'll be excited to see what the Buffalo Bills do. Joining us now is a man who I don't know if he's ever had any UCL issues, but I do know he's on ESPN all day, every day.

That's how it is. He's called NFL games this year. He's called college games this year. He's been on Get Up, First Take, Keyshawn, J. Will. Yeah, Max. Max. Formerly Zubin he's been on everything because this is football season former teammate of darius butler at yukon who might be back yukon might be back might be back and maybe offense coordinator for colts that's what the air let's go. Ladies and gentlemen, Daniel Shloss. Yeah, Daniel.

What's up, dude? What's up, boys? How we doing? Hey, life is good. How are you, man? I can't believe we got a chance to get you on the show and that you're not already on TV right now. You know, you're on TV all day, every day during the football season. How are you doing?

You good? I'm great, man. A couple more weeks of pandemonium, but all is good, dude. All is good. You've been sending some sub-tweets at a lot of people, hasn't he? Yeah, what's going on? Yeah, you've been doing a lot of sub. Did you just learn of subtweeting, or what is going on? You just want to let people know that you know?

How's this all happening, you know what I mean? I get really frustrated by that, and it's a little childish by me to send a subtweet, no doubt about it. But I just, I mean, I'm just going to give you an honest answer here. It takes a lot of hard work to figure that stuff out and find it. And then when you do it on TV and or the internet and then someone basically takes it and kind of redistributed, redistributes it as their own thing. Candidly pisses me off. Yeah, Dan, it happens to us like i think every day but i do

understand why you could get mad about it i appreciate that you got mad about it but you have become a sub tweeter remember people thinking that we're friends or something like that yeah what's that i had to shoot him me too oh you good is everything okay dan i just want to let you know dan we all love you, bub. And all these people that are stealing you, everybody knows. And all these people that are talking bad about you, fucking everybody knows who you are. You're fucking Dane Urschlovsky, dude. Hell yeah.

Hey, keep it going, Dane. Go, Dane. Go, Dane. Fuck them. Come on, Dane. Well, I never have a problem with you or D-Butt. North Tire, Boston. Oh, nice.

The fuck, damn, Tony. Boys are all good. Tony. Thank you, Tony. But before all that, congratulations, Bud. I know we talked this morning, but congratulations publicly.

Phenomenal news for you. Thank you, man. I've seen you be a great dad. You know, I'm scared to death. Hopefully I'll be able to figure it out. My wife's a badass. You'll crush it, man.

Hey, you. You and the missus will crush it. My wife actually texted me after we hung up. She was like, now I'm confused you're having a kid, so she even though. Yeah, a lot of response on the internet. Big Crush. My wife actually texted me after we hung up. She was like, not confused you're having a kid. So she even knew.

Yeah, a lot of response on the internet. Big thanks to everybody for being nice. Big thanks to you for reaching out. I assume I'll be calling and asking for advice. You got, what, 10 kids over there? I think so. It feels like that at times. Yeah.

Time-wise and cost. Yeah, I don't think I'm going to do that. I'm going to have one spoiled brat spoiled spoiled brat yeah for sure yeah i'm gonna have a work ethic though it's like a crazy it is a mcafee so yeah you're gonna have a work ethic gonna have to but we'll live the finer life which kind of worries me kind of scares me a little let's get into football dan josh allen ucl it is a sprain not a tear i think a sprain is a partial tear but it's not a full tear, so I don't think Tommy John is needed. How do you think the Buffalo Bills are going to move on with this, and what do you think this means for Josh Allen's future?

They have the Vikings this week, then they got the Lions and Bears, and then after the Bears, they have their divisional play to kind of close out the season that is going to be very important. You think they arrest them? Do you think that's going to be the play? What do you think they do with Josh Allen, Dan? Yeah, so I think they arrest them because they have a good enough football team as long as they get a little healthier on the defensive side to like sustain right for a couple weeks to see if case keenan can step in and play a little bit you know we had stefania bell on yesterday on live when this was kind of becoming a little bit more of a story and they were waiting on the news and kind of something she said to me or two things she said to me kind of like stuck out

because I asked her I was like well how does Josh then throw a 70-yard ball at the end of the game and she had mentioned well it's not um like a pain tolerance thing it is a it is a yeah well correct he's got an absolute howitzer but like it's it's not i i this hurts too much to do it's is josh going to be able to do that three weeks from now because she mentioned it's a rep yeah so like how do they handle the practice of him is he one of those guys that doesn't need to practice and can go play you know so as for an organization that obviously went all in this year with the people that they put on their team and realizing and believing they're going to play into January. I sit there and go, is it worse? Because he's already had a UCL injury to that same elbow.

Two years ago, two years ago, right? Yeah, I thought she had mentioned 18. But, you know, however long, however long ago, you know, I know Carson had it at the end of his career. So I just sit there and go, for a guy that that's a marquee part of his game, the only reservation I have is they've scored 25 touchdowns this year, Buffalo. Josh has accounted for 23 of them. So, I mean, when we say he's everything to them, he is literally everything to them. So it's a tough spot for them to be in right now.

But they've got to think long term. I guess McDermott said, we'll see his day to day and Josh said he's confident that he'll play, but is that the right move? Do you get him? Do you take some time here to try to get that thing as healed up as possible for when football actually matters? I mean,

Mike Garofalo was reporting with Sean McDermott says, I don't know. I'll be interested to see how they balance it because they have a good roster. They have a great team. They have an incredible run game. Can you win games by doing that? And can you get to a point

where you make it in the playoffs and are able to go on a run? We shall see. Speaking of making it in the playoffs and going on a run, the Indianapolis Colts, Jim Irsay, after his press conference called Bob Kravitz and Mike Chappell and basically told them, we ain't taking. 9-7-1 gets you

in the dance this year is what he said. He thinks Jeff Saturday is going to help the offensive line, which is in turn going to help the offense. The defense has been good. Jeff Saturday's hire has obviously brought a lot of attention to the Indianapolis Colts in a negative fashion. But allegedly through Bob Kravitz and Chappell, Jim Mursi said, we're still trying to make it.

Are you going to be the offensive coordinator here? Because I saw they hired a guy who's 30 years old who seems to be, you know, a stud. I mean, Jeff Saturday wouldn't pick some bum to call plays. This guy's probably going to be a stud. But I've seen a lot of articles saying Dan Orlovsky was going to join the crew. And do you think Jeff Saturday can make that team a playoff team? And if he does, he gets a job forever, right?

Or at least a job forever, I assume. Yeah. can make that team a playoff team, and if he does, he gets a job forever, right? Or at least any job forever, I assume. Yeah, so I know, like, one, I'm not going to be the offensive coordinator for the Colts this year, no. What? I read on the internet that he would. Oh, not this year. Not this year, Bob.

He spends a breeding ground for the coaching staff. No, that's him using leverage right there, saying not this year. So in the offseason, he can just tell you. Oh, look at that. Best friends. Dang, you've had like a Tom Brady-style glow-up. And do you have a stomach protector on? Do you have a stomach protector on right here?

No, that was the infamous game winner, dude. That's the ball. Oh, that's the ball. Oh. Oh. Respect, respect. Okay, hell of a win. Hell of a win. That's the ball. Oh, that's the ball. Oh. Oh. Respect, respect. Okay, hell of a win. Hell of a win.

Hell of a win. Yeah. And you do look much better now than you did then, but he had to be built for, you know, battle. He was getting hit a lot with us. I don't know about everywhere else. He was getting hit a lot with us, though. I don't know.

He doesn't love Saturday, though. Anyway, so you're going to. My wife was pregnant. Yeah, yeah. That was a tough look right there. Oof. Yeah, you won us games, though. You almost lost us luck. You won us games. Anyway, so you're going to... My wife was pregnant. Yeah, yeah. That was a tough look right there. Oof. Yeah, you won us games there.

You almost lost us luck. You won us games. Yo, honestly, honestly, when I see pictures of myself, I just, I

go to my wife and I go, what? Like, why did you ever choose to sleep with me willingly? Dan, don't be that harsh on me.

Come on, dude. That's why. That's a tough presentation. You're a tough presentation. Seven yards slant better than anybody in the New England region. What are you talking about? What is your problem, Connor? It's true.

What's your problem? King of UConn. D-Bud has told me about when he was on campus what the M was. Boom. And that's the truth, damn it. Boom. It's not because of how you looked, but you didn't look terrible. But nonetheless, you're going to be offense coordinator next year for the Colts

if Jeff Saturday's the guy or what? I have no idea, dude. I have no idea. Dan, they wrote 15 articles. You had to have said something. Yeah. Now you're all shy? You didn't say that you were?

No, dude. I said this yesterday, Pat. Jeff and I have had so many conversations, and I've never had conversations like this with people, at least as I've been in this profession over the last four or five years. Every week I would see Jeff on Monday afternoons in the green room, and I'd walk in, and immediately we'd have these conversations of what was going on in the NFL.

Like, dude, did you see this team? And my goodness, how bad was this stuff that they did? Or why the heck did they do this? Or what do you think is the problem with this team? And all that stuff. So we had all these conversations, and we would talk about the philosophy of how teams were doing stuff and what they were doing well and what they weren't doing well.

And we'd always talk. Jeff and I would have these conversations of, you know, where are you on coaching? Would you ever get into coaching? Do you want to coach now? Do you want to coach in the future? And I'm just assuming that these are just conversations we're having. And then the news breaks, and I put two and two together, and I'm like, oh, that's kind of partly what Jeff was experiencing.

Maybe not, because I know he just said, or say just called him this past weekend, but preparing for what's that. Maybe he was preparing for your saying. Yeah. So I don't know. Like I, I, the more I get away from football as a player,

the closer I want to get back into coaching, so to speak, like the more I miss that. But like I said, like I like what I'm doing right now, but I have no clue what the, I have no clue what the future holds. It has to be a good situation. Good leverage.

Remember the guy that sent a bunch of emails to somebody? He used to do this every single offseason to ESPN. He was going to be the next head coach at this place and then, boom, signs an extension worth $100 million with ESPN and then the next offseason, another extension with another signing bonus. This is a good play

out of you, Dan. Hey, can't wait to see what coaching role you take in the offseason or on espn hey or on espn do you think jeff saturday has any chance to turn that thing around he does not know the offense i don't think he knows a lot of the people there he said i'm drinking from my fire hydrant and he also said i asked jim why am i a candidate for this job do you think he has any chance of success or set up for success at all? And what do you expect from him this year? I think the only chance that he has is that they fully embrace going like the Baltimore Ravens style of offense,

where they use Ellinger the same way that Baltimore uses Lamar. Like, hey, we're going to go 80% running the football, and we're playing 11 on 11. If they were going to continue to play the style of offense that they have, then Matt Ryan should be the starting quarterback. And their offensive line has been so poor, you know, and Jonathan hasn't been healthy. I it's, unless they go into that style and try to play 11 on 11 as much as possible.

I don't see it this year. I also think that Mr. Ursae's got to be sitting back going, dude, I need my quarterback. I have no shot in this conference. You know, he's done the plug and play, good roster plug and play, and it hasn't worked for three years. So I'm not sitting here saying that they're not going to try to win. No.

Last year it didn't. That's crazy. It didn't with Phillip. No, no, yeah, Phillip won a playoff game. Last year it didn't. That's crazy. It didn't with Phillip. No, no, yeah, Phillip won a playoff game. Last year it didn't work, though, right? You think so? Well, I mean, I don't think Ercey's just trying to get to the playoffs, right? Don't you believe that he wants to change?

No, no, no, I agree. Phil Rivers, let's count it as a fail. He got to the playoffs, but let's count it as a fail. He retired. Couldn't talk to him on a mega cast because of the condo. I love Phil Rivers. Love it. I miss you, Phil.

You were saying last year it didn't work? It didn't work last year? Why didn't the plug and play with the quarterback position didn't work last year? Because they got whooped at the line of scrimmage week 17, week 18, and the quarterback didn't show up. Okay. There it is. Thank you.

I'm taking it on the shins from people that listen to what you say about carson wentz and are like oh the quarterback authority on espn told me the carsons are blah blah blah and i'm like did you watch the games are you watching are you watching daniel oscar you're watching the games i think carson wentz is he done is he is he done you think because you said at the end of his career you said earlier with the ucl thing you think he's done um i think it's tough to sit there and say that he's a right now in an unquestioned starter anywhere all right i'll let everybody know that was dan that said yeah okay so you show up at my mentions and you're attacking me with this guy's words i'm gonna use that clip'm going to say, did you fucking hear him say this?

That's what I'm going to say. Because it is a real thing. You've been a big Carson Wentz advocate for a long time. Carson Wentz comes to Indianapolis. He plays great football. Then he plays some football that isn't fantastic. They don't get to the playoffs. Jim Irsay decides to move on.

Let's get in on it. He goes to the Commanders. He goes down. Taylor Heineke starts winning games. I mean, it's like a whole different thing. Now, it hasn't worked here, so I don't think Carson Wentz was to blame here. Obviously, as we're all seeing it all kind of pan out, it is not his. But I don't think he's winning a Super Bowl for anybody going forward,

which is all we're really looking for. And if you talk to Jim Irsay, that's what Jim Irsay wants too. We don't tank around here for anybody. He said he'll get a quarterback in the draft if one's there, but he's looking at Sam Ellinger right now, making some big league throws. His exact quote to Kravitz. Darius has a question for you. Go ahead.

The whole philosophy of we want a quarterback, I think this year's college class is talented. If I was a team, and I knew I stunk, candidly, I'd wait until the year after. I think the kid from North Carolina is going to be the number one pick,

and I think the kid from USC is going to be the number two pick, and I think they're both better than anybody in this class. You got Caleb up there? You got Caleb as NFL prospect? Oh, I think Stud. Yeah? The kid from North Carolina is a freak. Drake is unbelievable.

He has like 400 and some yards rushing, too. I think he has. He's a stud. He should be the Heisman. He has like six rushing. He's got Josh Allen. He's got Josh Allen traits. Yeah, and he's young.

He's a young guy over there. Mack Brown, good coach. Mack Brown creates NFLers. So I think he's got a lot of people in there. I think we're going to try to get that Drake kid on this show at some point during the season. Drake Mack. The North Carolina people have reached out to us to say, hey, we go on there. So you're saying next to try to get that Drake kid on this show at some point during the season. The North Carolina people

have reached out to us to say, hey, we go on there. So you're saying next year there isn't a young guy? You're saying CJ, Bryce? Who else? Will Levis? Van Dyke? Van Dyke's out. Down there at Miami, he was supposed to be top five guy.

He got benched. Bryce is crazy talented, and he's so good, but you've got to be okay. He's not big, man. I'm using that phrasing strategically. He's little. Bryce is little. Little. Little.

And that's got to be a thing for you. Maybe it isn't. Maybe it is. I've heard great things about CJ. I've heard great things. CJ. CJ Stroud's pretty talented. I haven't had an Ohio State game this year yet, so I don't know. I've heard he...

That's what I've heard about CJ. Not only is he an incredibly hard worker, and you've seen him use his money that he's gotten in NIL deals for his teammates. He seems to be a great leader. Seems like everybody likes him. He wins a lot. But I've been told by people that he's gotten NIL deals for his teammates. He seems to be a great leader. Seems like everybody likes him. He wins a lot. But I've been told by people that he just, like, recalls. Honestly, any quarterback that goes to Ohio State, I think,

is going to be set up for tremendous success in the NFL. Because Ryan Day, I think, is the best offensive mind in football, college football up there with Lincoln and Sark. But they're studs. Anyways, can't wait to see Hennon Hooker as an Indianapolis Colt next year. Darius has a question for you. Dan-O. Hey, Dan.

Obviously a lot of news, a lot of talk about the Jeff Saturday hire, but I think even more of a challenge this weekend, especially is going to be on Parks Frazier, you know, putting together. Obviously he has some experience, help putting together a game plan, but what's that process going to be like for him this week with a young quarterback actually putting together a game plan but what's that process going to be like for him this week with a young quarterback actually putting together a game plan and calling plays uh this uh this upcoming weekend yeah so i think you guys have heard me say there's a massive difference between game planning and playing

calling plays you know game planning is scientific in many ways like you studied the tape this is what they run these plays should work against that and it's repeatable like it's observable so that's really i think game planning is easy calling plays is like a it's a storytelling it's an art it is a feel um you know and it's a like you're you have to see things before they happen so to speak so i think that's like the biggest challenge for him. I don't know how many guys were options in Indy, like how many guys know the lingo. And, you know, I thought maybe Matt Ryan would be a guy. Oh, yeah, we all. Hey, that's literally our first thoughts.

And then we got laughed out of a combo. I've actually been in this situation before. I think in like 2014, we were going 14 or 15. I was in Detroit. They fired our offensive coordinator mid-season, right before we were going to London. And they gave Jim Bob Cooter the play-calling role. Oh, yeah.

At JBC, Jim Bob Cooter. And it was like we were on the road in London, actually. And maybe this was 17, whatever. You guys did well, didn't you? What's up? Didn't you do well? I remember you guys did well, didn't you, when JBC came in there? As that last final week, eight weeks went on, yes. Our first game, we got absolutely slaughtered by Kansas City,

like 45-14 or something, or 44-10. There is pressing. Yeah, so I just think, like, I just, you know, like, I would imagine it's going to be very predictable because you're going to sit there. He's never been in those moments before. And, like, you might have, D-Butt, you know this, Pat. You might have five third and four calls.

Yep. And you might have five third and fours in the first quarter. And then all of a sudden, what do you do on third quarter? You know, so, yeah. But then that's predictable. Well, then there's Darius sitting on the other side. I was like, oh, they did this in the first fucking quarter. Not even like two weeks ago.

This was in the first quarter. I just think that it'll be – but, again, they might have packages for Sam that they implement that becomes that 11-on-11 zone read RPO-based offense. Defense has not been terrible. No. Defense has not been terrible. They've held up their end of the bargain for sure. I actually want more, too, Dan.

I know you make some big statements, obviously, on the network, but who right now? I got my guy down in Miami. I think he's probably the best play caller right now, at least this year, Mike McDaniels. In your opinion, who's dialing it up the best right now around the league? Mike McDaniel I would put at the very top of the list for sure. I'd say Shane Waldron in Seattle.

He's got to be up into that call. Did you hear about this? Did you hear about this? They're using a call sheet because Geno's okay with it and Russell wasn't or a wristband this year. Andane waldo said it's making things run much more smooth in his eyes or something like that did you hear that yeah i could i did not hear that but you know obviously the play call gets in a lot quicker um you're breaking the huddle it gives you time at the line of scrimmage your tempo in and out of the huddle is really good i think they're the best

offense right now outside of maybe San Fran of making everything look the same. You know, like I'm going to do a thing on live today. I'm going to do a thing on live today where, you know, like against Arizona this past week, they came out, and Dee Butter really appreciate this because he's a full-goal nerd, kind of like me. Like they came out and they went fake outside zone bootleg keeper on the first play of the game.

And then the next time they presented that same look, they handed the outside zone off in the first half. So they went throw to run. And then the second half, the first play, they go similar set, and they run the outside zone. So then that's flipped. And then the very next time they get to that set, they run the keeper game out of it.

Hey, sorry. You're going to do that on live, you said? Yeah. Darius already had it. We already had it in. We're doing it third hour. Dan, you son of a bitch. Don't steal my shit, you son of a bitch.

Third hour. That'll be like an hour before. Yes. Go back to the drawing board, dude. Son of a bitch. Third hour. And that'll be like an hour before. Yes. Thief. Go back to the drawing board, Dana. Sorry. Sorry about it. Sorry.

Can't read it. Oh, yeah, great minds, I guess. Hey, great minds think alike. Great minds. Thank you, Kyle. You know, you had it first, so you're a thief if you do it on NFL. If you could only throw a deep block, you could have played quarterback. Yeah.

Oh, shit. I think he could have, by the way. He probably could have. Played at high school. That was good to know. We're not doing it. You can do it. We'll actually do something different.

Just so it doesn't appear as if you stole from us, because we don't want you, especially after that tweet you put. Well, that's the thing. You could copy and paste his tweet and put it out yourself then, because he would be stealing from D-Bot. Well, that's what I'm saying. We don't need to put our guy Dan into the position where he would look like a hypocrite because we were planning

on doing that exact thing. We got time. Yeah, exactly. We'll be able to draw something up at the commercial break. Because you were like, man, the throw the first time. Normally it's a run the first time. Yeah, they don't usually do that. And then the next time it's the run. They always keep you on your heels. I don't know if you're being serious or not.

That's our whole show. That's our whole show, Dad. Wait, D-Butt, are you for real? Hey, tune in at 3 o'clock. Find out. Maybe D-Butt can give us his candy rankings. Yeah, and we talk about Reese's

peanut butters and everything like that. But nonetheless, we won't do it, so you can do it on NFL Live. You guys do it? You guys do it? No, no, no. The world needs to see it from you. There's a lot of plays, a lot of games out there. I go to Dolphins.

Yeah, we'll figure something else out, man. It's all right. Anyways, how about Ken Dorsey, dude? You like him? What about Andy Reid? He's always going to be fantastic. You like those guys? Did you think they're just all kind of in an upper tier up there?

Andy's great, obviously. Dorsey's been awesome. I like the way that Dorsey's used their fullback a little bit. I actually thought the Jets defensively were great against Dorsey. I think what Kellen's done since Dak has been back with the personnel

flexibility has been really cool. And the way they've used their tight ends and CD, you know, CD was lining up in the backfield a little bit for a stretch, so I kind of like that. Arthur Smith. Oh, God bless Arthur Smith. He's a freaky stuff, man. Alright.

There's a group that's still really good. But we've been told you will not join that group this year, though. Maybe next if Jeff's able to figure it out. A couple of the boys have some questions for you. Is that all right, Dan? Yes, sir. Boston, Connor, Manny, you said it was okay as opposed to Tony Diggs

who you said to fuck off to. Connor, your question for Dan Orlovsky. Yeah, very nice, Dan. And I assume you left this name off your list because you're going to give him his praise later on. But why is Matt Patricia probably the offensive coordinator of the year? And why do you think that people are right when they blame Matt Jones for the Patriots' struggles?

Do you want to rephrase that? No. No. Would you like to rephrase that? Would you like to rephrase it, Dan? Is that something that sounds like you would like to rephrase? I mean, their head coach came out and said that the middle linebacker of the other team seemed to know the plays.

Yeah, he did. Still got the job done and got the win. So who cares? Maybe that was part of the plan. It's not always pretty. MIT. So, like, I think the Patriots offense is wildly predictable. Do I think that – so here's my issue with Patriots offense is wildly predictable.

Do I think that – so here's my issue with Patriots fans right now. Like I posted a clip yesterday where the spacing on their offense stunk. So did we. What time did you post that? What time? I don't remember. Feed! Oh, no. Feed!

It better be early in the morning because we come on at noon, dude. We did as well. It was before noon. Okay. We apologize. It was before noon. Are you sure? No worries.

Let's go back to the Patriots. Sorry. It was before noon. I don't know if you're ever being serious. What's that, dude? Come on, man. Let's talk about the Patriots. I just don't want you to be here.

Here's my thing. Here's my thing with Patriots fans right now. Like, yes, Mac Jones has regressed. But Patriots fans seem to think that Mac Jones has regressed because like by himself solo just this solo I've regressed mission and they don't believe that there's anything to attribute to that the play calling is not good it is not creative it is relatively predictable the spacing on offense is bad the timing on the offense is so bad so it's like you want to tell me that the quarterback that was a pretty darn good player last year and that the head coach all offseason raved about has regret,

and it has nothing to do with the fact that that offensive line cannot drop back pass protect and the play caller is a defensive coach. That's not the reality for Patriots fans. Well, I do know that old Cousy guard got benched two times already this season. Yeah, back-to-back games. What's his name? Cole Strange. Wait, what?

Cole Strange got benched twice. Yeah, remember? He's been talking about how good he is and everything like that. Hall of Famer. Yeah, Hall of Famer. This guy is unbelievable. He's been benched the last two games. Get him off the field.

I can't protect anybody. I'd rather him go the radical streams than, you know, say, Quentin Nelson. I'd rather him be where he's at right now. Jesus. Just throwing that out there. Dan, those eyes were warranted. There's no reason for him to do what he just did. Quentin Nelson was doing nothing.

He's just hanging out with his new coach right now. Yeah, I mean, hey, look, I can say that. Dan's the one up here saying, Patricia is a big, fat, dumb defensive coach. I don't know why he's throwing that out there. He's just saying it's something to think about. Dan, that's what you're thinking? It's something to think about. At least these should be warranted

in the conversation whenever we're talking about max regression is what you're saying. Yeah, I mean, how many... Pat, ask yourself. You guys have been around. How many guys do you know that were young in their careers that regressed with good coaching there you go ryan lee the only one's this thing ty your question for dan as we ponder this affleck trivia question dan when you look at the packers and i don't necessarily want to do this but like where do you think the the blame lies like When everything looks like shit, is it more on LeFleur? Is it more on Rodgers?

Is it on the offense as a whole? Obviously, the defense hasn't been very good, but how do they correct that? Can they correct that? And do you think that this season is salvageable at all? I don't think this season is salvageable at all i don't think the season is salvageable anymore after that loss um that was a shocking loss like i don't know like blame i can i can sit here and say like the defense has been incredibly underwhelming for a defense that is absolutely loaded and for a team that took two first-round picks when they traded away their second-best player and did nothing to increase the defensive performance with those two picks,

you've got to sit there and go like the defense and those additions have failed. I think the reality is this. This is no longer Matt LaFleur's offense, I can tell you that. At least the offense that he grew up in and has been calling. I don't know why it's that case, but it is no longer like your motion, shift, under center, play action, run offense. It is gun, RPO to the side, and we're just going to take a drop back, go route, deep shot. So I don't know why that has become the case. That's certainly what has been impacting this offense. Bakhtiari's health, obviously a big deal.

Elkin Jenkins' health and lack of performance is a big deal. Oh, Aflac trivia question for you. Aflac trivia question for you. Have you ever seen somebody play first couple drives, almost score a touchdown, but get intercepted, ride a bike for the rest of the game get put on the injury report is questionable then come back for the last drive and still have the same knee from the beginning of the game what's going on with him you think

bock to you all right honestly what is your thought on i have i don't know him as a part like i'm i'm not friends with him we are friendly i've talked to him but man if i'm in that locker room i think it would be difficult to fully comprehend what the fuck's going on with one of our best players where it's seemingly opting not to play now i didn't ask aaron about this because aaron and he are tight i can't ask aj about it because i think aj and he are tight about it and i don't want to put aj in a position but have you ever seen anything like that and am i getting a misread on that is that what's happening and is that appearing to be what's happening there? It certainly appears that way. I have no idea.

Me neither. I've never seen anything like it before because why can you play on the last drive but you can't play on the second and the last drive, third and last drive, continue to play throughout the game? I've never seen anything like that. And that's a big part of their offense right now is they can't protect. Is that why they're calling it that way? And he's fucking good.

He's really good. He's like a game changer i mean he's gone from top three left tackling football to you know barely impacting their offense so that their offense you know like i wanted them to make a trade at the deadline for a receiver because i believed it would help and i think it still would have but they've got issues man they just And my biggest issue is this, Ty. For a team that has a relatively decent run game, they do nothing off that run game. So there ain't no point in having a good run game. There's no point in having a good run game if you don't use it to help other parts of the offense.

So, gloom and doom. All right. Uh-oh. All right. Good luck the rest of the season, Ty. Good to know. You got it, Ty. You got a beautiful baby. Yeah, that, Todd. You got a beautiful baby.

You got a beautiful baby. The Iowa Hawkeyes have a football season next year. We're still playing for a Big Ten West title. Are you kidding me? You're right. Big Ten West is 3-3. Yeah, 3-3, 5-4 total. Not to mention the Vegas Golden Knights.

Yeah, hottest team in the NHL. Nobody cares. Dan, we appreciate you so much for joining us. I know you've probably got a busy day. Can't wait to see what you steal from Darius Butler on NFL Live. Yikes. I would never steal Darius' stuff without his permission. I agree. That's very nice of you.

And everything we said to you is not real. We did not post anything about that yesterday. We were learning about it as you were telling us in the thing. We had to tell you about it. What you were talking about with the throw to the run on the boot with the naked. We had no idea that existed. It totally had me

sold. Well, yesterday we didn't have the Seahawks' Kenneth Walker run. So if he uses that, because that was one of the big bumps, right? Yeah, yeah. Don't be stealing from AQ either. He does a good job. I like to pay attention to those and learn from them because I don't know a ton about run game like that.

Well, and also pass protection. I think he has pointed out you don't know a ton about either. I think he has said that. Not me. I'm just saying to what AQ – because you blamed an offensive line, I think, last year, which actually led to this segment. That is why –

Thank you, Dan. Thank you, Dan. Thank you, Dan. Thank you, Dan. So we need to thank you. Thank you, Dan. Thank you, Dan. Thank you for that, Dan. That's why. I haven't received any royalty out of that. That's weird.

Well, you have, you know, because we're all benefiting from it because we're getting to learn something. But you blamed a center or something on something where the mic. Yeah, I blamed the center. Yeah, and AQ was not happy about it. I don't know what. I got a text out of nowhere like, what? This guy doesn't fucking know what he's talking about.

He said, do you have Dan's number? I want to text Dan. I'm like, what is going on? He said, you just buried this guy. He has no idea what he's talking about. Somebody needs to explain what he's talking about. I was like, would you like to do a segment when you retire? He's like, yeah, in the trenches.

Well, they got into it this year, I believe, under the Bobble exchange. You guys got into it? What did you guys get into it for? You blamed the center for something again? No, no, no, no. Oh, hell. It was a three-step drop pass, bro. No, yeah, just know that you can tell AQ, like, hey, fuck.

Oh, yeah. Cutting and D-linemen? Oh, yeah, cutting. Cutting and D-linemen. He said get his hands down. It was a run play is what AQ said. It's a run play. How are they supposed to cut a guy? It's a run play. It's a run pass option. How am I supposed whatever. It's a run play is what AQ said. It's a run play. How are they supposed to cut a guy?

It's a run play. It's a run pass option. How am I supposed to cut somebody on a run play? Yeah, yeah, he wasn't happy about that, yeah. It's a locker room. Yeah, I don't know necessarily how those offensive linemen are getting in totality taught in RPOs. I don't love RPOs sometimes, so I think that's fair. I think that's what AQ was saying, yeah.

Water under the bridge now yeah well friends and you can you can tell aq to go fuck himself too like aq is one of those guys that like he you wouldn't obviously say go freak yourself or whatever you would say fudge off fudge you like you can't say that to aq now he's gonna answer though like aq it's not like uh oh okay dan he's gonna come back just know that you can yeah you can have that give and take with him don't don't feel like you don't have to necessarily uh just say oh aq is gonna be right he enjoys the it because then he gets to eat poop aq yeah yeah you know yeah fudge off dude you know what i mean all right dan we appreciate you watch on nfl live you're the. You're having an incredible season, dude.

Ladies and gentlemen, Dan Oloski. Dan Oloski! Joining us now is a man who is in an attic in Ohio. We apologize for making him wait during the break, telling all the people who won their giveaways for the last week that they won. He's a college football national champion, Super Bowl champion, Ryder Cup champion. Whoa. All-time leading tackler for the Green Bay Packers.

His brother, Ryan Hawk, hosts a podcast that has 500 episodes. Congrats to him. God damn. No easy feat. Ladies and gentlemen, A.J. Hawk. Yay! A.J., sorry for making you wait, pal. I apologize.

We've been a bit scattered today with our conversations. Dana Urshlovsky joined us, stuck around for a long time, had an incredible debate about who's stealing what from who on the Internet and on TV. But I want to let you know I'm incredibly proud of your brother, Ryan. 500 episodes in podcast games is not easy. I was pumped to jump on there earlier with you and your dad and Ryan. And you guys are good people. I just want to let you know that.

Well, thank you. I know we appreciate you jumping on there. Ryan likes to do one of those with Pistol and myself every couple years or so. You guys are good people. I just want to let you know that. Well, thank you. I know we appreciate you jumping on there. Ryan likes to do one of those with Pistol and myself every couple years or so, so you joined for a little while today, and it was awesome. You brought the juice like you always do, and we're very real. So congrats also to you and Sam, obviously, publicly. I think it's awesome. I know it's a process, all that whole situation, but it's going to be awesome.

You and I have been chatting through that, and I appreciate your support through this entire thing as well, AJ. You're an incredible father. I have a lot of great dads around me. I'm very fortunate for that. I am scared to death to become a dad, but what my wife has been through and gone through, she's an absolute badass, and we're pumped.

Scared? I'm definitely scared. Pumped, though. Pumped. Certainly pumped. And I appreciate you, AJ. Let's dive into the story of the day. Josh Allen. It is a sprained UCL as opposed to a fully torn UCL. I believe a sprain, and everybody that we've talked to has agreed to this, and I think the internet agrees to it. A sprain is like actually a partial tear of something. That is why they say some things that are sprained are worse than if it was to break, because the partial tear isn't going to necessarily heal clean potentially

or how long it's going to take to heal. Sprain a little bit more unpredictable than like a clean break of something. A sprain is a partial tear. Josh Allen is going to get a second opinion, obviously. They're going to do this. They have the Vikings this weekend, which is a massive game, massive game. After the Vikings, they have the Lions who just beat the Packers. What? What?

Two games out of the wild card. What? And then they have the Bears who beat the Patriots. What? If you look at the schedule with the Vikings coming up, obviously that's going to be an incredible battle with teams that we expect to be around the long haul because of how great they have been thus far. But then you look at the Lions and the Bears there,

we potentially have a three-week span here where they know that he has a sprain. Do you think they're thinking about resting that at all, healing that, rehabbing that for the next three weeks so that whenever they get to the divisional play at the end of the season, he's maybe more healed? Or do you think this is the type of thing where they don't know if three weeks would be enough anyways? Let's put him out there.

What are your thoughts on it? What do you think this does to the Bills, AJ Hawk? Well, I instantly, as you started talking, was thinking, all right, are they going to shut him down for three, four weeks, two, three, four weeks, whatever it may be? You know, he doesn't want to do that. He will not. You have to pull him out of the line and probably take his helmet from him

to get him to not go in there. But, yeah, I would. I want him healthy when it matters at the end. You know they're going to be there. They'll find a way without him. But I understand him wanting to play and all of that. But I'm thinking, I just. I want him healthy when it matters at the end. You know they're going to be there. They'll find a way without him. But I understand him wanting to play and all of that. But I'm thinking, I just don't know. With the injury, if they said, if Josh says, hey, if I sit three weeks,

how is this going to feel almost 100% back? If they say, yeah, we think so, or they think, yeah, we don't really know, but it should help at least a little bit, then Josh is like, no, I'm going to play there. Yeah, if it's a little bit, if it's not a guarantee that it's going to get better, because I think sprains can be unpredictable i think i think there is uh like you don't know how it's going to come back to the throwing you're throwing on it too like

it can get you throw one weird you drop down throw a weird angle does that hurt it more like how does that well and if it does heal a little bit and it does feel better with one throw is that thing like it's three weeks enough time for it not only to heal but become strong enough for me to put any torque on it? Like, these are all questions I think they're probably asking, and we don't know the answers to. The line changed, right? Yeah, it was down.

It opened at 7. It was down to 5.5 yesterday. Right now it's. Their Super Bowl odds change. They don't have. I mean, it seems like the sports books do not have a lot of faith in him possibly playing this game. It's down to 3.5 now.

Who's the backup quarterback? So, I guess from 7.5 to 3.5? possibly playing this game. Down to three and a half now. Who's the backup quarterback? So I guess from seven and a half to three and a half? Seven to three and a half. The Vikings are a good team. Yeah, they're really good. It opened two before this last past week. They were nine and a half point favorites.

Yeah, the Bills have been a wagon. Yeah, I guess this will be the fourth potential backup quarterback or non-starter that the Vikings will have played this season. So I think that people are starting to hold that against them. Yeah, a lot of people are saying the Vikings have been in battles with not good teams or whatever. Yeah, they're talking about that. It's the win, though. Yeah, because they were losing those games last year. Exactly.

A bunch of one-possession games, and we all know that's a fine line between winning and losing. Getting lucky is a big part of it, isn't it? The year we were 2-14, I don't remember the exact stat. I referenced it a lot, so I should look it up and get the exact stat. One score game, like nine of those games or something like that. So that is literally a ball comes off of a pinky, and somebody picks it and scores.

We win that game. I think that happened. I was with Carolina that year, and we beat you guys like that. Caught like a tip ball, interception. You did? Crucial no call or something by a ref. And that was nice. We were a bad football team.

That's a bad football team. Good teams create their own luck, though. Good teams tend to get lucky because they create their own luck by having 11 dudes run to the ball and you get tipped interceptions, things like that. Oh, all of a sudden our linemen are running downfield, running like chasing our ball – the guy running the ball. He fumbles.

Oh, our lineman's there to jump on it, things like that. That's like we're creating – Was it nine? That's a lot of games. Yeah, I thought it was though. I think it's a lot of games. Like I think it's a surprising amount of – like we definitely would have made the playoffs.

You hear what I'm saying? Definitely would have made the playoffs. 2011. 2011, yeah, because 2012 was luck. Is anyone getting just rocked week in and week out, though? Does anyone get blasted by double digits every week? Not in the NFL. That's not a normal thing.

That's why some of these massive spreads have been alarming. Like, damn, the books are like 14 and a half. Like, what the fuck? That's a lot of points. This is like a college line. This feels like a college line. Two of college, yeah. When colleges are playing out of conference.

Even the Jets last week against the Bills, they were 10.5 point underdogs. The Jets have five wins. With the Bills, it's hard just because if they lose two of their next three, they can go from first to last in their division. Maybe they can rest Josh Allen.

They're right there. They're 6-2, 6-3. It's a terrible decision for the Bills. I would not want to make that one. Yeah, it's a terrible position or situation. It could be. I think it's going to force them to evolve a little bit on offense to include that run game a little better. Yeah, because he's what, 23-25 touchdowns.

What, Dan Orlovsky said that? Hey, Dan Orlovsky said that. Fucking make sure. In the record books. Because I'm tired of people stealing Dan's shit. Yeah, it's bullshit. Did you watch that? Did you watch us talk to Orlovsky said that. Fucking make sure. In the record books. I'm tired of people stealing Dan's shit. Did you watch that? Did you watch us talk to Orlovsky? I got to see a good chunk of you guys and Dan.

He was a bit confused, it seemed like. It did seem like he was in a blender a couple different times. But, yeah, I understand why he's upset about that. I understand why he gets – he sent a subtweet that was basically like, if you're going to just steal other people's work, give them credit. No cap. We learned about this. It's called plagiarism.

Okay. No cap. He didn't say no cap, did he? Yeah, he did. I think he used the emoji. The emoji, yeah. The blue cap. Wait, who stole this stuff?

That's the thing. Everything just kind of blends in. I thought he said no cap. Yeah, everything just kind of blends in. That's the show no cap. Yeah, everything just kind of blends in. That's the show. That's the show, really. A lot of people in the breakdown game. Eight one-score games in that season.

Wow. There was a stretch, though, that you guys didn't score more than 10 and lost 62-7 in one of those. That was the Saints. Yeah. That's when you were scouting quarterback. I threw for 10,000 that week. Yeah, I felt good.

That was a bad month. A couple of seams there. Seven in New Orleans. First play of the game. I don't remember if it was a botched handoff or if it was Curtis Painter dropping back. We're on primetime football in New Orleans. Bad team. Him dropping back, and he got stripped, I think, and they touched down.

I think it was touched down. That was a tough place to play, too, when the Saints got rolling. Bull. They had a blast. They had a great time that night. But you're talking about us? I don't know if we elected to receive that game. Anyways, we had the ball first, and they were up 7-zip with 10 seconds into the game.

That's not a good way to start. No, it was not. You got the ball, and they're up 7-zip on the road. Your team has not been good in the paint. New Orleans didn't even get a chance to showcase the seams being wide open. All week in practice, I was throwing it. All week. All week.

We're reading the cards. You look here, then you throw it here. Got it. Break. We go out there. Look to the left. Mike moves. Boop.

Boop. Right to this guy. That was when Jimmy Graham was there, I think, at the time. And we were just off and running. Next play. Okay. boop, boop, right to this guy. That was when Jimmy Graham was there, I think, at the time. And we were just off and running. Next play, okay. Same kind of thing, but a little different formation. We're going to send a fucking wide receiver over here.

You're going to look here, boom, and you're going to hit, boom, basically right here. All right, ready, got it. Scout team DB running one tight end. You got maybe a backup wide receiver who plays special teams playing this this tight end, playing against like the skeleton there of the defense. It's the linebackers and the secondary. And it's just kind of, you know, it's not full go, but it's pretty, I mean, three-quarter, we're going here.

And it's look, boom, bang, boop, fucking another one. Carving them. Next day of practice, same exact thing. I mean, if you're looking people off in practice, if you're playing scout team quarterback looking dudes off in practice, we might know on Wednesday that we have an issue that week. Well, it was literally what Drew did. I guess that's what Drew Brees did.

Like, Drew Brees, I guess that was his big thing. Like, hey, you look this way, and then you literally – like, I even got shown film. I got shown film. Like, hey, this is what you're going to do. You're going to look this way, and then you're going to throw gonna throw that way that's not the play but that is certainly the evening jimmy graham scored one of maybe 10 touchdowns but yeah it was i threw for like no shit i probably threw for over a thousand yards that week it was so i had uh

i was like damn i'm going were they pissed. Yeah. Like the defense, where they pissed at you and just like, we were terrible that year. I mean, we were terrible that year. And I got along with, I did a pre-work like pre-practice warmups with the linebackers. Right.

So I was at the linebackers, like we'd given looks or whatever. So I had a pretty good relationship with that crew. I thought, you know, and then we'd go out and do the throw thing. And it was just like slicing and dicing. It was always like,

damn, Pat, a lot of like, come on, we're going to figure it out or whatever. But we're all on the same page. It wasn't like I was playing offense. It was like I felt like I was part of the defense. It was like, goddamn, we're going to get killed here. I think A.J. Eads was staying at my house at the time, former Iowa Hawkeye linebacker.

He can hit a golf ball 420. He's like you. It's a draw, though. Farther than me. No. I think you and him are very's like, he hits a draw though. Farther than me. No, I think you and him very similar, but he, he murders a golf ball. He was staying at my house at the time and he was injured and he had watched practice though all week. So on Saturday when I was heading to the plane or whatever, he was like,

you think they score a hundred points this week, actually with that play that you beat him up with all week. I'm like, I think so. Get on a plane, get there. We lose 62. It was maybe the most predictable thing I've ever seen in my entire life. But that's not normal NFL. Normally, if like, look what the Carolina Panthers, everybody think they're just mailing it in. They'll fucking beat teams. They will be good teams at the end point. That's the end of, there is levels to this shit. I think a lot of it revolves around coaching though, AJ.

And I think like in the pursuit of great coaching, though, AJ. And I think, like, in the pursuit of great coaching, I think you're going to go through some shit. You lose a great coach, you lose a great quarterback. Same type of effect, you think? Or do you think one affects much more than the other? And everybody's going to point at the Patriots here. Everybody's going to point at the Patriots here. But I don't know if that's just the only example we have.

Because what I'm wondering is, like, when did the Colts get fucked? Was it when we lost a good quarterback? Was it when we lost, you know, a good coach? Is it when we, you know, like, when is it, you think, that affects a team? What is it, you think, that affects a team more going forward? I mean, that's a great question. I would always point towards the player because they're the ones on the field making the plays. I think Phil Belichick even said, like, I'm not out there. I'm going to make zero plays.

I'm not going to be on the field at all. It's like, how have I coached my guys up to make plays and put them in the best position to be successful? So I think a quarterback is key. When you lose Andrew Luck, he retires, what, nine days before the season? That's a huge, like, earthquake that happens to your team. When Andrew Luck was a guy like, hey, we're set for the next 15 years, man. Here we go.

Let's do it. Because I want to judge, like, Frank's time here. Yeah. Like, Frank had success, I think, as a coach for us. Winning record, right? There was success. He never had a losing coach here. Amen.

Don't hire him. Jim Irsay said. Don't hire losers. Yeah, don't hire. Not since 2020. Top quartile, top quartile. We went through that entire thing, where I think Jim's messaging, you know, is always going to come in a different fashion,

so people aren't going to listen to him. And he followed up with a call to Kravitz and Chappell to explain and elaborate even more. They both write at The Athletic, I think. Chappell has a Hall of Fame vote. Kravitz has been in Indianapolis for a long time. He's wrote a lot of pieces on Jim. Him and Jim are very tight.

So interested to hear those quotes coming out from him. But, like, was Frank a good coach? You know, and will Frank be remembered as a good coach here? And was it Frank's fault? Should we view Frank, or is it just a situation that was basically unwinnable, you think? When you wear that hat, like, you're going to take some blame. You're going to take probably more blame than you deserved.

Same with the quarterback. But, you know, it's a combination of both. Obviously, quarterback is extremely important, but that's only one phase of the game. You still got special teams. You still have defense, game management. How do you prepare? So coaching and all that stuff, general manager.

It all got to line up to win this league when you're playing against the best of the best. And that's why I was so impressed with what the Patriots were able to do for fucking 20 years. That just doesn't happen. Because everybody else is getting paid, too. Yeah, everybody's getting paid. But I'm with AJ, though.

The players, I look at the players first, but then obviously the coaches have to get those players prepared. But these are professional players, too, so they take more – Owners. Yeah, more owners than college players or high school players. I understand that completely because, you know, Frank Reich, I think by all accounts, good dude, like great man. And I think a lot of people like him.

I've gotten a chance to chat and interact with him. He coached me when I back on that original team that we're on because I was the emergency quarterback. So there was a lot of work that Frank and I have done together. I like him as a person. As a coach, I wonder, like, is he looking back on these last three years as a complete failure? Is he looking at it as a success? Like, what are his views on it from Frank Reich? Because I guess he has talked about

taking a break. One of the local reporters tweeted, I forget which one it was, I don't want to misquote somebody, but this is not our information, or this is neither Dan or Orlovsky's information as well. Frank Reich's going back to Carolina, I guess, for a few months where he has family and everything like that. He's planning on coaching again, and he would like one of the head

coaching jobs again in the future, so he's still going to go. I wonder what his whole take is on it, he would like one of the head coaching jobs again in the future. So he's still going to go. I wonder what his whole take is on it, because now Jeff Saturday is the head coach. Jeff Saturday said, it has been reported by Zach Kiefer of The Athletic, the guy that was on our show yesterday, great writer, formerly of the Indy Star, that the first time Jeff Saturday heard about being a head coach was during a phone call from Jim Irsay during Sunday's game against the New England Patriots. Jim Irsay sitting in Robert Kraft Stadium up there in Patriot Place in a suite.

He just got done cutting a promo on the street next to his bus with his dog Drake walking around. He's sitting in there with his incredibly custom-tailored sport coat, his very comfortable pants and Salcani shoes, cool sunglasses, watching the game. He's watching it unfold like all of us other people are there watching that game. The coats fucking stink. He says, call Jeff.

He goes to his friend. 63, right? Fucking calls him. Are you watching this, brother? And Jeff's like, yeah. What would you do here? And Jeff's like doing, well, I think right here you got to blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And then what would you do right here? Wow, definitely challenge that. You got to challenge that., blah, blah, blah, blah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then what would you do right here? Well, I would definitely challenge that. You've got to challenge that. That certainly has to be challenged or whatever. Yeah. All right, thanks, Jeff. You know what? Fucking hiring Jeff Satter.

Yeah. Is that what happened, AJ? It sounds like it. How much more of that are we going to get from this story? What's that? The plane's on the way. Yeah, Jeff, congratulations. You're a head coach of the NFL.

Why don't you ask your wife if she wants to be a head coach? Because I know you probably just told her, oh, old friend Jim Ursa and I are just chatting on the phone. You didn't even know it was really an audition or whatever. But you were, certainly that was an interview whenever I was asking what you were doing. It seemed like you got it right. This is a fascinating, everybody has an opinion on this now.

A lot of people are mad that Jeff Saturday got this job. A lot of people pissed off because they think he's just jumping to the front of the line when there's been a lot of people waiting. It's like, I think this is an interesting situation because how close Jeff and Jim are. And this isn't just because Jeff played for the Colts for a long time, was in the Ring of Honor for a long time. Jeff was a massive part of that CBA negotiation. And I assume he and Jim Irsay had big conversations throughout it all.

His relationship with the owner and ownership has been very strong for a very long time. So Jim Irsay saying, I'm going to hire not somebody that's on the current staff, which is, by the way, first time in 62 years. So I understand that is an anomaly. But Jim Irsay has been an owner for a long time. Jim Irsay is probably, he's never done this in any of his ownership years. He probably had this plan all along that if he was to do this, he would do it differently. Probably seen other people fire their coaches, judge them for how they're doing it and what he would do. Hires his friend, which people are pissed off about. But I think Jeff, if he has any success at all, maybe going to be the fucking head coach of this team going forward.

It sounds like that's what Jim would like going on. And if you're Jeff Saturday, what a whirlwind of a life. Just like pancakes on get up. Greeny said, a week ago, my guy would be here. Now he's a head coach in the NFL. It's like such a real thing. It's an insane situation. Saturday said, Ursae asked him, what the hell is wrong with our protection?

No mention of Frank Reich or an interim head coaching job. So Jeff Saturday cleared up the protection on the phone. And then Jim goes, perfect. We fixed the offensive line, brother. We win. This staff has been here the entire year. They have chosen not... If Gus Bradley was going to be the head coach, that's awesome. Did he fix our offensive line for us? No.

Reggie. We fucking love Reggie. He's a leader. He's going to be in the ring. He's already in the ring of honor. He should be in the Hall of Fame. Reggie, do you want to be head coach? Reggie, hell no. I don't want to be head coach. Okay. All right.

I'm going to be Reggie. Can anybody else coach the fucking offensive line? No. Jeff Saturday. Get in here and fix this offensive line. This is the highest paid offensive line. You see that stat in that graphic? Jim knows he paid them a lot of fucking money and that they stink.

Got to figure that out, right? Because he's a bad owner. If you pay a group and they're bad, that means you can't judge talent. You can't scout football. Things are getting worse. What a whirlwind for Jeff Saturday. If you're Jeff Saturday right now, what are you trying to do, AJ? What do you think?

Well, so today is Wednesday. He had probably his first team meeting, right, where he was leading the team meeting, where he walks through the door as the head coach. Like how surreal and weird was that for him and his cold skier? Good morning, man. Good morning, man. Good morning, coach. Jeff. He's doing the Chuck Pagano. Yeah, man.

Also, I've seen where people are pissed at Jeff, where people try to claim, well, he probably should not have accepted it. Like, okay, get out of here. I have zero desire to be a coach. I'm a terrible coach. But if someone offered me a head coaching position in the NFL, I would have to seriously think about taking that thing. And that's a big change in your life.

But I'd be like, this would be cool. Why not? Let's go fast. Give it a shot. Let alone if you were a coach. You said you would do that. Neither of us want to be a coach. Neither of us think we'd be good coaches, mostly because neither of us want to spend the amount of time it takes to be a good coach. But you're 100% right. If I was offered, fuck, a good coach. But you're 100% right. If I was offered, fuck, I hate coaching. I mean. It seems like one of those, it's too good to turn down, right? I think I've got to do this.

And Jeff wanted to be a coach. So, like, Jeff had coaches. You lose every game. Yeah. You lose every game. It's still a cool experience. Darius, everybody's pissed off about Jeff Saturday cutting the line. And, obviously, the Rooney rule has been talked about by Jim Ursae and by everybody.

In my opinion, I talked about this yesterday during the What is Jim Ursae? I talked about it a little bit in there. This could actually help out in the future for how many ex-players are coaching at a high level, because if they don't have to do the coffee grabbing and the card drawing and the get paid nothing and see your family never after an entire career i think you're going to see a lot of former ex-players want to become coaches more if jeff has success here that's not really being talked about do you enjoy the entirety of how this is all panning out and what are your thoughts on jim hiring jeff i mean

it's honest for me it's hard not to enjoy it just because you know this is something we haven't seen ever you know what i mean and that being a former player who i feel like you know maybe not cut the whole line but once again if this job is off to me i'm definitely accepting it but there are like jeff started saturday shouldn't start as an intern or start as you know earning your stripes and doing all this stuff so um i think in the grand scheme of things with you it could help former players get in there and get into better positions. And I understand people being upset about, you know, other qualified candidates or minority candidates and things. But, you know, for me, it's been the same thing.

And I said it a few years ago in 2020 when it was a bigger story. But, you know, as long as you have, you know, the leagues that are majority, you know, white owned, like these guys are more than likely going to hire people who they have, you know, these that are majority you know white owned like these guys are more than likely going to hire people who they have you know these type of relationships with or i had a former gm tell me most of the time the hiring process it comes down to the decision who would you rather have a beer with and in reality whatever i deal in reality like okay we all want a world we all want a world where it's equal opportunities and these type of things. But in reality, that's just what it is. It's relationships.

And it's another relationship business. So I'm rooting for Jeff, you know, to be to have some success and maybe open the doors for some other guys. But unless, you know, you have a league where it's diverse ownership and it's things like that or sponsors come in and say, hey, you know what? sponsors come in and say hey you know what i see a diversity issue here and we may pull our money or sponsorships going forward unless we see a change by you know 2024 and our contracts up then you may see some change because that's what the language these billionaires speak and um if i'm on something that's worth a couple billion you're not gonna tell me who the to hire either so you gotta understand that part of it too but i definitely get people being upset about it um but you know jeff has some he's familiar with this team too we were there and for training camp i bumped oh yeah yeah there he was a

consultant he was there in training camp so all the guys know him um even the young guys who probably went around to watch him actually play they know who jeff saturday is so it's not like he's just getting plucked from georgia so he was around him in training camp spent some time with him and as a head coach it's about managing personalities, you know, having some, you know, managing schedules, obviously, having some emotional intelligence more so than like X's and O's and stuff like that. So I'm rooting for Jeff.

It's going to be a tough, tough, tough, tough position. Young quarterback. But it seems like everybody was pissed off about the hire. Yeah. And, you know, i understand that as well whenever you think about in the off season when there's a full coaching cycle and interview process and everything like that and somebody's interviewing with like five different people and he doesn't get hired and then the person is hired not great ends up not being great too so that puts a spotlight

on and all we're talking about a middle of the season hire right normally this is just coming from within the uh staff and to darius's point and i didn't even remember this we were there at training camp we got to see the training camp jeff being him being that tight with the organization is that it's just it feels like jim probably thinks he did hire from within and this whole thing even though everybody's like this is 62 62 years and you haven't and if it doesn't work out i assume j Jim will do a full interview cycle. I assume he'll do the same thing. He has to no matter what. I think no matter what, he has to do a full interview cycle.

Even if he plans on keeping Jeff, you have to go through the whole process still. Yeah, so it feels like everybody's pissed off about it. What about Josh McCown? Wasn't Josh McCown supposed to be a head coach? I thought he would be more pissed that they brought him in. See, that would be... That's interesting. Anyways, Jeff Saturday had his first team meeting

this morning. We had chatted about it where he walked in as if he was Chuck on Thursdays here. Good morning, bud. Good morning, Coach. I told the guys this morning I care about the players and their families. I've sat in their seat, man. This losing sucks, man. I like Frank. I've texted with Frank. He's a heck of a coach. I mean, they played for this dude. I don't

minimize that at all. And Jeff Saturday also was asked about his strategy going forward on fourth downs because Frank Reich was going to be pretty aggressive. He said, I'm an offensive lineman, bro. Okay, we're going to take points how we can get them. It's tough in there. He said, it's not easy to get points. It's not easy to drive

down a field and end up with nothing. So I'm intrigued to hear how he has to handle his stuff. I think Jeff will use analytics. I think he will because I think he's young enough, smart enough, and familiar with them enough because he's been on TV, so he's had to sit in production meetings where these have been laid out by the analytic people, andff is a astute human being so he's going to pick up on it i'm pumped to see what type of coach he is you know is he going to

be chirping with refs you know all we're going to learn all these things like is he going to like to talk i think he's going to be very active on the sideline i think so too yeah i think i think refs are potentially come all i think you're going to see a lot of can't have like you know that type of stuff with the sheriff exactly and i're going to see a lot of can't have it, like, you know, that type of stuff. You're chirping with the sheriff. Exactly. And I'm sure you saw a lot more of that than everybody else did, but even just that little clip of, like, you know, that's Peyton. You don't see, like,

you always see Tom, like, getting on the O-line, and I'm sure it's some back and forth, but you see Jeff, like, hey, man, run the fucking, run the damn ball, and then, like, you know, that whole interaction right there. It's going to be interesting, man. I think a lot of former players are locked in on this and i think so too honestly i think a lot of former players that are thinking about getting into coaching probably have the ability and the traits to be a great coach are watching this because if they're success now they

have reason to campaign for other jobs as opposed to being fucking assistant consultant too. You know what I mean? Head coaching gigs, though? You think this opens up for future, like, guys going from nothing to head coaching? I mean, you know, Jim Irsay, I think, is one of one. So I don't think many guys would get called for head coaching jobs. But, you know, maybe position groups. And it's not like that's unprecedented.

We saw Kellen Moore retire as a backup quarterback and become a quarterback's coach immediately so it's happened it's some precedence there but i think it should happen more because when you think about it as a player especially a veteran player you have to somewhat be become like aq i'm sure as a player he was somewhat of a coach you know you bring younger players in and your success you know relies on them knowing the fuck to do we know where to line up like you got to get those guys lined up. So you have that part of it.

It's the other part that you don't have, game planning and PowerPoints and presentations and shit like that. The guys can figure out. So I think this will open more doors, hopefully. Now, if you think about it, you know, if Jeff goes on, it goes undefeated here. Okay. We're talking about A.J. Hawk, Darius Butler, these guys,

getting offered head coaching jobs. Because this is how these owners are. Yeah. Remember, Sean McVay had success. We need to find the next Sean McVay. Can't be too tall. Got to be. Yep.

Younger. Got to be young. Good beard. Fiery. Got to have cool hair. Got to be able to go off. That is what. Officially. It worked for the Rams, didn't. Good beard. Fiery. Got to have cool hair. Got to be able to call offense. That is what. Officially.

It worked for the Rams, didn't it? Yeah. That worked for. We need to do the same. We need to do the same thing. We hired a consulting firm. The consulting firm said, we need to find somebody similar to the successful people in your league. So try to find somebody like McVay.

Find us the next McVay. Boom. Here's Sixville. Zach Taylor. Cliff Kingsbury. Matt LaFleur. Other LaFleur. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, said, you know what, we're going to attach a hotel to here, a plaza to here,

and a casino to here, and whenever people come to games, we're going to get all their money. And then now every other stadium's like, boom, we need to build a plaza, casino, hotel alongside the stadium so we can do it. People see what works for other people and they fucking mimic it. That's why the Sean McVay thing came. If Jeff

Saturday has success, Jim Mercer is one of one. I agree. We are very fortunate to get to know that fucking dude as opposed to the people that haven't. But I think there will be other people that are like, who's somebody that's attached to our program that our fans love

that could potentially display the traits of being a good head coach? This is if Jeff has success. And what is success for Jeff? Is it making the playoffs? I don't think they're going to be able to do that. I think he's fucking winning two games. Two games. Playoffs. Playoffs!

Dude, they got a great defense. The defense is good. Offensive line. If they get in the playoffs, they might vote Jeff in as president if they get in the playoffs. If he can do a job like that, come on now. What do you think Jeff's thinking? Jeff might just sign over ownership of the team to Jeff if he can do that. I don't think that's ever going to happen.

From what I've heard, there's been some conversations about, you know, signing over parts of the team, and those have not gone long or well from what I've been told potentially. So what do you think success is? Let's say it right now. How many games left? Nine, eight? How many games are left?

I don't even know if it's wins and losses. I think it's just because, like, they just need to be competitive. Moral victories. Not even moral victories, but, like, they just can't look like they did last week. Because also the way everyone in the media has been, like, if the Colts go out on Sunday and they get beat by five touchdowns, like, there will be blood in the water and it's going to get just – it's going to be absolutely terrible.

But if they actually – if they don't quit and they compete and they look like they're actually improving a little bit, like, I don't necessarily think it matters if they – if they win two games, I think people will be like, you know what, that actually was a lot better than we expected. Because look at – I mean, not only on the offense, like, look at the staff that's left. Like, offensively, like like it's bare bones.

It's just like you've already fired everyone that was. We're talking about Parks Frazier. Yeah, who the fuck is Parks Frazier? He's calling plays. I know he's calling plays. Parks Frazier. He's running around for Duck Hodges three years ago. No, no, no, absolutely not.

It's not personal to him. What happened? So we got Parks. You know, this is the hand that Jeff is being dealt too. Like you got Parks Frazier calling plays for the first time. If the O-line gets better. Let's go, baby. Now you see the field differently.

I think that's success. If the O-line gets better and they score more points, that's success. I'm betting this guy's fodder and his fodder's fodder and his fodder's fodder's fodder. We're in the football world. Parks Frazier, he might have started at Samford in 2015 as a defensive assistant. Right. But in his last seven, eight years, not only has his brain grown,

but his brain has found out that it was put into this body on this planet to be a play caller. Hell yeah. Wait till you see what fucking Parks does this weekend. I've heard he's been on the dry erase board like a beautiful mind, that fucking guy. I've heard we got things and gadgets going on, just like Kansas City. Just like you see Kansas City run.

Wait till you see this Parks Frazier. He's going to hit out of the park. Yeah, out of both parks. There it is. I hope so. I hope this guy recognizes how unbelievable of an opportunity this is. Oh, I'm sure Parks is baffled. Yeah, exactly.

Look at Mike McDaniel. If you'd have looked at him, just off the street, say, this guy can't be a coach in the NFL. He can't get it done. And what'd he do? What'd he do? What'd he do? Get him done.

Yeah, you know the difference, though, is that the Dolphins have a good team. And I get that the defense is good, but their offensive line has fallen into the Rodgers-Brady category. Yeah, they have a good offensive line on paper, but they're not good this year. Like, they fucking suck this year. Yeah, but remember, Jim was talking to Jeff. Sure.

Like, bring in Jeff. What would you do? They're fucking killing our guy. Okay, but they still have a little duo there. You see, you've got to run a wham. They need to can open a ball here. That's a hell of a fucking answer. You're our head coach.

Goddamn right. Why don't you ask your wife if you could be a head coach of our team? When? Tomorrow. Tomorrow. I'll call you in 20. Don't have a quarterback. Don't have a running back.

Don't have a quarterback. Matt Ryan. Their weapons aren't good. Jonathan Taylor. Jonathan Taylor hasn't played in three weeks. He's back. He's practicing. They traded 9-9.

The first three games he's ever missed in his entire life since peewee football. They fucking stink. And they're not going to get better because they brought in Jeff Saracen. You've got to put Matt Ryan back in there at this point. Yeah, I think so, too. Colts running back Jonathan Taylor, who missed last week's game due to an ankle injury, was spotted today participating in practice. Well, guess what their record is with Jonathan Taylor in the game.

This year or just ever? This year. Zero-zero with Jeff Saturday here, Coach. Boom! Boom! Boom! Undefeated with Jeff Saturday as a coach. They aren't a good football team. Oh! And let's keep in mind who the interim head coach, you know, last year

of the year, Rich Versace took his team to the playoffs and they didn't rehire him. So, there is i did see a stat it was a 26 percent success right if for like uh interim coach what determines i think playoffs it might have actually been hired after now i think about it gotta be the only show gotta be the only show. Got to be the only show in history. Zito, thank you for that stat. Big talk. Stat that.

Stat that. Anyways, sounds like chances are low. You know what I mean? And that's what past experiences are. But maybe they have a good defense. They have a good defense. Jeff Saturday. They can score three or four times on defense.

They have a shot. It's really good. Do they have a good defense, too? Like, they lost to Taylor Heineken. No, you got a good defense. Really? Do they have a good defense, too? They lost to Taylor Heineken. No, you got a good defense. Really? Do they this year? If you look at the numbers offensively that you get,

all the turnovers, the fumbles, the sacks, and defensively you're still holding teams to what they've been doing, yes. That was their first touchdown of the day. Their best player doesn't play anymore. They're still doing good. He needs to play more. We've got to find a spot. Jeff will make sure. We've been at those games, Connor.

Think about how terrible the offense has been. That's what I mean. They've all been like one-score games. You know why? Because on the flip side, you know, those games have been terrible. You know why? Because the offense stinks and our defense is good. They've been incredibly boring to watch. That's bad football. You have great defense and a terrible offense.

That makes the game experience pretty terrible. It makes the game pretty terrible. That's what it's been. Also, early in the season, though, they lost 24-0 to the Jags, and we were like, maybe there's a different Jags team. The Jags fucking stink, too, and they still got killed by the Jags. To your point, think about it. Bears fans are celebrating their win in the Super Bowl

because they're scoring points. No, it's because we have a fucking quarterback. They're 1-4 in their last five. And you know why? It's because the games that they have had to watch for the last 30 years have been terrible offense, great defense. Think about how miserable of a four-hour Chicago people have had to have. That's why Lamar Jackson coming to Baltimore,

remember, because that's what Baltimore was. They actually won a Super Bowl because of the defense. They were a great defense, bad offense. That's a miserable watching game. Now, you get some highlights from the defense side of the ball, big-time hits. Not saying defensive football is miserable to watch, but if there isn't a spectacular play made,

it's kind of a boring... Not that defenses can't provide that. Don't want this to be a shot at defenses, but you get it. Lamar Jackson needs to get paid by the Baltimore Ravens. Not only because of what he does on the field, he put the game on his back against the Saints there. I mean, I know Kenny and Drake scored two touchdowns, but

Lamar's the guy. He's fucking unstoppable. He's going to go get a bag year, which he was in last year. He might get franchise tagged a couple times. But the reason why we think he has to be paid, not only because he's already won the MVP and won a playoff game and has been all of these incredible things on the football field that have made a lot of fans of the Baltimore Ravens

that would have never been fans of the Baltimore Ravens in the past. They see these clips. They see these highlights. They see the way Lamar operates. And they're like, you know what? Fuck it. I'm going to be a fan of the Baltimore Ravens because I'm a fan of Lamar Jackson. Lamar Jackson has already done that just on his rookie contract,

all these things that we just mentioned right there. But off the field, the motherfucker's been perfect. In the community, the only questionable things that he's done is he almost ran into a jet ski, okay, on a beach, which can't have it. Lamar can't have it, okay? But maybe that was him trying to avoid contact like he does during the game, so maybe that's part of his training. Could be.

And I guess he did some one-on-ones and flip-flops, and people got really pissed off about that. But other than that, the dude is perfect off the field. He is a role model, a mentor to everybody. In this moment between he and Landon, who is going through a heart condition of some sort, Landon obviously surprised by getting the opportunity to see and meet Lamar. This kid's crying his fucking eyes out.

You think this happens with a lot of people? No. Lamar has impacted his community. Lamar has been a playmaker on the field. Pay this man his damn money already, Baltimore. Cheapskates. I really don't know what they're waiting on. I mean, it's not going to happen before the end of the season now.

But if I'm him, too, I mean, I guess there's always that number that no matter what, if they give him that number, he's going to resign. But if I were him, I'd be like, you know, part of you has got to be like, you know what, fuck these guys. I don't know how he isn't already like that. Especially after the offer they offered him. Like that. Yeah, they low-balled him.

The alleged offer, but it was, what, $135 million guaranteed? Yeah, and $230 million is what Deshaun got in the same exact division. In Kyler. Even Kyler. $185, right? What was his? Was he $65? $165?

Yeah, still. And he hasn't won anything. No, he's not even in the ballpark. No. I thought Lamar's offer was that. 185 or 165? Well, 135 was initially announced, and then someone said it was between 135 and 180.

But unless Lamar's leaking information, which I assume he isn't, we're only getting the Baltimore offer. Who knows what the incentives were on that, how many years that was, when the guaranteed money is. Why do you think it is, AJ? Do you think that because Lamar, you know, he held up that sign the other day that said, pay Lamar's money or whatever, which I think everybody agrees upon, except for whoever's making the decision with the pocketbook in Baltimore.

Like, they go to an offer with him right now and they're like, hey, here's five years, $250 million, or here's six years, $250 million, $250 million guaranteed or whatever, however they want to cook it so they can, you know, salary cap game, cash over cap game, that thing. He would take that deal middle of the season, even though he said negotiations down, right? Or do you think that is the reason why they haven't got a deal done, AJ? What are your thoughts? I mean, I would think if they came at and came to him with the offer that he felt was

right for him, he would absolutely accept it. But Lamar doesn't seem like the guy that it would turn on the team, though. He seems at least how he looks like like everything is on the up and up, and he seems to have a great relationship with everybody there. So if he is, he's hiding it well. If he is pissed at the team, I don't think he is. They're going to have to figure it out. They have to.

Instead, the Ravens offer Jackson an extension worth $250 million with $133 million guaranteed. That would have run through the 2027 season, according to ESPN. Asked whether or not he turned down a quarter of a billion dollars from the Ravens after the Jets win, Jackson replied, fully guaranteed. Businessman. What a fucking answer.

It's got to be the sticking point. Yes. You know, you gave two-thirds to Deshaun. Like, it's not his fault, but you got to do business as business has been done. And, obviously, I don't have the same off same off the field issues that Deshaun has. I'm a better player on the field. I mean, I've been on the field and then these other guys who've gotten paid. So 200, I mean, I've been saying four years, 200,

but whatever north of 200 fully guaranteed, that's a sticking point. And in my opinion, I think it should be. I think so too. And I think everybody's on his side. This isn't normal. Normally the public perception is like this greedy asshole. And I think there are some people. They side with the billionaires.

There's probably people, yeah, some reason. Always siding with the billionaires. You do not relate to the people that are paying the money at all. You relate to the person that came from nothing and is working their ass off. But after you leave, the team will still be there, is why the fans feel the way they feel. It's like they've been with the team since before you got there and after it's an interesting dynamic that always comes to a head during the cba negotiation when the public perception is always like on the billionaire

side and i'm so confused i'm so why are you why i was literally i grew up you i'm you i'm a fan like you could be me like your kid could be me why are you siding none of it makes sense to me but in this particular case feels like a majority of the people are on the more side they give lamar his money i don't know why if you're a baltimore if it's a baby face move to do so and the guys i don't know why you wouldn't do it i honestly don't have a clue why you wouldn't especially when you look at that it's like you know i mean from everything we've learned now too which i think in years previous people haven't known this it's like you see 250 million and you assume it's 250 million like 133 million guaranteed when which is awesome

money let's not get crazy for sure it's an insane amount of money to play football we get it absolutely but that's not what he's worth yeah he's worth well more than that you know and the guys who have are getting paid more than him haven't done what he's done on the field. I don't even know. I mean, Deshaun especially, but, like, Kyler, I don't know how he is in the community. Like, Lamar means everything to Baltimore. If they don't have him, if he's not their quarterback,

I think the amount of fans you have in, like, that franchise, like, it drastically changes. And if it is $250 million, I mean250 million, you guys would know much better. What are the realistic chances that he ever has of making $250 million off that contract? Oh, no chance. Never. Those escalators, probably not.

Probably Pro Bowl, Super Bowl, Pro Bowl, Super Bowl. Don't miss any games. Yeah, percentage of completions, the amount of incentives you put in there. But nonetheless, it's not his fault that Cleveland Browns set the precedent on what the NFL is. And if you look at the amount of money that he is worth and has brought to the Baltimore Ravens organization, let alone on the field, off the field, I think keep fighting the fight, Lamar. Keep going, Lamar.

Founder and CEO of Fanatics, Michael Rubin. Yeah, Michael! What's happening? How are you guys doing? Hey, fantastic. How are you? Thank you so much for joining us. I assume you're an incredibly busy man. Not only is your company, you know, Fanatics Commerce and Fanatics Collectibles and Fanatics Betting and Gaming, and you own half of Lids. Now you invested in Mitchell & Ness.

You're friends with every billionaire we've seen on television and we've seen in the world. Thank you for taking time out of your day to chat with us, sir. We are honored to have you here. Listen, I just want to say most importantly, I fit into the qualification of an equal dumbass. So you've got me. I'm ready to go. And I think I can compete with any of the best dumbass. Okay. Well, I feel like you're one of the smartest dumbasses on earth because I was reading a little bit about your bio here that was sent over and then on the Internet. Whenever you founded Fanatics, you had a vision, basically, of making the merch business that licensed NFL and college kind of like new school.

You know, in here it said that the old way of doing merch for these schools and teams and leagues was you had to order 9 to 12 months in advance, and you had to try to predict who was going to be a star, whose merch was going to move. So normally that led to unpredictable outcomes and a lot of merch being held in a store, overhead being high, or being out of stock of people that are hot. You innovated that. You changed the game. Fanatics gets to deal with the NFL, NBA. Everybody becomes a licensing partner of.

You've changed it all. You knew this was going to happen. And now that you're sitting at a $27 billion valuation, do you look back on it and wonder how you did it? Or is this the plan all along the way you went about doing it, Michael? No, I honestly think we're just getting started. I mean, people think I'm crazy when I say that, but I feel like we're at the beginning of the game. We have so much growth ahead of us. We're just getting started. We've certainly, you know, we started in the what we call finance commerce, which our merchandise business in 2011 was about a $250 million business. Then next year, we'll kind of be encroaching on almost $7 million in the merchandise business. But we really feel like we're just getting going.

The business has really been about how do we reinvent and make it better for the fan. And by the way, there's so much more for us to do. But we do operate the Flagship Fanatic site. We do operate the NFL shop, the NBA store, NHL store, Major League Baseball store, and also hundreds of individual professional collegiate teams. But at the same time, we're globally expanding. We're building the soccer. We're building our college business more quickly. And we're finding so many we're building the soccer, we're building our college business more quickly, and we're finding so many ways to make it better for the consumer as well, which is what we wake up and go to bed thinking about. And you're right. The way the business worked 10 years ago is someone got hot in sports, somebody got traded, somebody won,

and the manufacturer had to make the merchandise, ship it to a store, hope they got it right, hopefully the consumers came in in and now our business is mostly direct to consumer. And of the direct to consumer business, about three quarters is the internet. And then as you said, we also are partners and own half of Lids. We also operate a bunch of

bookstores. We operate many venues. You can basically find Fanatics merchandise at many of your favorite places to shop online for sports fans. Next is our first business. Hey, yeah, I know it's an incubation period here, too. We're still going to go on. We all got to build.

We got to keep incubating. Hey, $27 billion incubator state. Congratulations. No, it's not easy at all. AJ, go ahead. Your question for Mr. Rubin. Mike, I've seen where I know I'm sure you surround yourself with a lot of great people. I see Magic Johnson.

Is he still like a special consultant for you guys? He's a fascinating character to me, especially what he has done in business off the court. What has he brought to you guys and what kind of help has he given? Yeah, he's a great board member for us. I've known him for a really long time. We actually met randomly at the next Kabat in the Bahamas maybe 15 years ago. And we were always next to each other over a holiday vacation and he became a good friend and i wanted to get somebody who was a incredible you know athlete who then really built their business and he's been great at helping us

uh he's been involved with the business you know formally for probably a year or two but informally for years and you know for me you know oh God, I said this all the time and people don't get this, but I barely made it out of high school. I legitimately got 780 on my SATs, actually 670 combined the first time I took it, 780 the second time, which is pretty hard to do that bad. You know, I barely made it out. I went to college for six weeks. So, like, I need smart people around me. I've got to be learning from people all the time. And he's a great guy to learn from. And to be honest, I've got lots of great people I learn from every day. Hey, so why do you think you've made it? And that's like, hey, I need you to tell me why you are who you are.

But you barely make it through high school. Listen, here's a real thing. Because especially with what happened the last couple years where people were given an okay to kind of sit at home and chill. You know what I mean? Like, hey, you're not allowed to leave your house, actually. And they say a habit is formed in like 21 days or whatever the case is. And a lot of people, maybe the working and employing people is not as easy in some jobs because not as many people want to get out there and work. What do you think it is about you that

made you made it? And is it just a work ethic that doesn't stop? And where do you think you got it from? Yeah. So first off, I definitely have no chill. I don't know what that means. I'd be very bored with any chill. You know, for me, as I said, I was a god awful athlete. I was god awful student. I was equally as bad as an athlete. The only thing I was ever good at was work. And I loved it from the day I was a kid. Like I've always loved business. You do things that you're good at. That's what I always kind of focused on. kind of focused on. You know, for me, it's come down to just a few basic things. You hit one of them. My work ethic is pretty insane. This morning, you know, I started at 4.30 in the morning. I just worked 11 and 12 o'clock.

Why? That's always. But what? No, no. I thought you were going to go through your entire day. I was going to give a what as an echo in between. That's the thing we do on the show. Sorry. Very dumb.

Very dumb. I thought you were going to 4.30 golf Bible. That's Mark Wahlberg. Yeah, I've never played golf once in my life. Actually, I played golf once in my life for about 10 minutes. It was very embarrassing. And I went back to drinking

at that point. Much better skill set of mine. But for me, look, once it really comes down to one, I think you need to have common sense. I don't have an educational background, but I do have pretty good street sports. And that lets you get your strategy right. It was easy for us to figure out how to reinvent the licensed sports business, how to reinvent the collectibles and trading card business,

how do we think we can reinvent the online sports betting business. Those things that we think about deeply. And then from there, there's been a couple of things that I've always talked about my whole life. I'm pretty decent in relationships. And that's really important to life. Like I already see this in two seconds. You guys are all good relationships,

skilled guys. And that makes people want to do things with you. And that's helped our business. And then I've had a crazy work ethic, like outwork, anybody never give up, always unrelenting. And the last thing is I get great people around me. Like if you get really smart people around you and you get them to want to work ethic, like outwork anybody, never give up, always unrelenting. And the last thing is I get great people

around me. Like if you get really smart people around you and you get them to want to work together, which is equally as important, you're going to be pretty successful. Make the business strategy right, work your ass off, get the right people around you, you're going to succeed. Hell yeah, sounds like that is the perfect recipe to become a very successful person. You said you outwork

anybody around you. You better not be in the same room as Boomer, Sison, or The Rock. The Rock, the hardest worker in the room. Do you two just run head-to-head to each other? I actually don't know The Rock well, but I'll tell you one thing. Kevin Hart is a

really good friend of mine. I watch Kevin's work and I always say he's one of the hardest working really well-known people on the planet. He always says The Rock is just like him. So I believe from watching Kevin, who works, you know, 18 hours a day, seven days a week, nonstop, that probably, and he talks about The Rock in the same way. So I think we all have the same hustle.

You know, to me, it's fun. I'd be bored as shit if I wasn't doing it. So hold on. So, yeah, Kevin Hart, good friend of yours. We know you got tight ties with Meek Mill. Robert Kraft, that wedding you gifted him, Baby Blue Bentley, I believe, a year ago or so. Well, what I gifted him for his wedding was we actually took the bar where he met his – I was with Robert.

We were actually going to Vegas. It's actually a great story. We were going to Vegas for the Conor McGregor Mayweather fight. And Robert said, like, Michael, I know you're going to make me do bad things to your body, to his body. So why don't we first go to a spa the weekend before and try to make ourselves healthy before we do bad things to our body? So I reluctantly agreed. We went to the Canyon Ranch in Massachusetts. And as we were pulling in, he saw his now wife, who he knew, I think, from vision and sight,

and a quick conversation he was going to be madly in love with. So actually, for his wedding, what I did was the bar that we went to as their first date, we renamed it after Dana. Her last name is Blumberg, and we called it Blumbergs for Robert and Dana, because I call Robert Blumberg on my phone. So every time he calls me, he's

Robert Blumberg, not Robert Kraft. He's been begging me to change my phone to get his identity back. It's a reminder for him. I always want to keep him on his edges and on his heels. He's Robert Blumberg, and we named the bar after him. If you were in Lenox, Massachusetts, you could go to Blumberg's, which was the bar named after Robert. That is awesome.

You literally bought the place and changed the name? Yeah, there it is. Blumberg's which was the bar named after robert oh that is awesome you you literally bought the place and changed the name yeah there it is blumberg's linux master there's actually a buy buy a place where we renamed it and bought drinks for everybody and food for everybody for the period of time it was renamed but uh it was a uh it was a good funny uh humble reminder for all of us but it's it's blumberg's now in my mind it'll always be who did it al michaels did it? Al Michaels did the ceremony. No, who did the... Who did the... There were a couple of great performers.

Elton John performed. He was one of Robert's dearest friends. Meek Mill, whose family to each of us got up and did an amazing wrap-up about Robert. And then Ed Sheeran performed as well. Yes, Ed made me drink so many shots that I forgot who it was. Who performed the ceremony?

I think it was Al Michaels. I thought it was Al Michaels. That did the ceremony. It actually didn't get met. This was Roy writing reception, not an actual ceremony. It was a party, not an actual ceremony. So at what point in your life were you at one of those events? You're like, yeah, this is normal.

Isn't that a fucking crazy, insane thing for a guy that almost didn't make it out of high school that you're hanging out literally with all the billionaires, your friends, with everybody, and you're in there, if not just in there, you're at the top of that thing, leading the way? Is that a holy shit moment for you, and when was it, you think? No, it's honestly not at all, because to me, I'm just like, I'm always pushing.

I'm not like a reflective person. There's not a time. There's nothing I've ever done in my life where I've been like, man, that was so cool. Like, I just don't think that way. I'm always like, what's next? What do we do next? How do we do better?

How do we make something for the fan better? How do we improve better? How do I get better? It's just the way I think. So I'm not like a reflective person. It's just not my personality. So when you're sitting in there, you're at the wedding, you're like, ah, could have been better. Maybe Elton John performs alongside Adele next time.

I'm happy for Robert and Dana that they're happily married. And I'm talking to everyone there who, you know, I've had the honor and pleasure of, you know, getting to know over the past several years. And, you know, so many of these people are involved in our business. It takes a village to kind of build something. If you look at Fanatics and the way we're building our commerce business, which is merchandise, the way we're building our trading card business, the way we're building our gaming business. There's so many people involved. We have all in about 18,000 employees now. We've got so many great partners,

all the sports properties that work with us to build a business. So to me, I'm always just thinking about how we can learn from each other, how we can build together. That's what I'm thinking about. And it's something like that. I'm just having great conversations. Well, you should know that you've done good. Don't reflect. Don't take too much time because somebody's going to the edge on you don't do it don't do it don't get

soft don't do it if I get soft somebody I'll get a bowl in the back of my head hey don't even think about how awesome it is hey don't even think about it 27 billion dollar valuation on a company you found and started and worked with don't even think about it right don't don't get fucking soft, Ruben. You want to get another $27 billion. It's not happening. Don't even think about it. Don't even have a drink and say, you know what?

Pretty fucking good for a guy who almost didn't make it out of high school and scored. Do you know what was the possible score on SAT, including the points that you get for writing your name? Don't think about it. Don't do it, Ruben, especially at this stage. I agree that SAT was a hard accomplishment. It's hard to do that poorly. I completely agree with that. Oh, so you're proud of yourself for that.

I feel like, yeah, I've tried to explain to my daughter why it's actually not impressive. She needs to do great, but she says, Dad, you were a complete loser and did terrible. It was a one-time thing for her, Ruben. Well, I hope at some point you take it all in. You've done incredible stuff. Darius has a question for you. Go ahead, D-Bud. Hey, Michael. I saw an interview with CP3 a few days ago, and he kind of talked about how intentional you were about being inclusive

with the NBA players when acquiring Mitchell and Ness. You got any future ideas of doing that with the NFL, maybe with some current or former players? And then number two, two-part question. How hard was it for you to give up your ownership stake in the Sixers to move on and obviously fully take over with Fanatics? Two great questions. I'll do the second one first because it will help answer the first question.

So for me, giving up the ownership in the Sixers was pretty obvious. It was something I had to do. You know, the leagues have rules that say you can't take bets on your own team. You can't have players that are investors in your company. You can't have commercial relations with the players where we have close to 3,000 relationships. You can't have agents that are investors in your business. So we were kind of violating every rule that every sports league had. And it was, it was, it was time for us to move on. It just became too complicated to be honest.

You know, fanatics is such a big opportunity. I don't want the Sixers to get in the way. That does not change my loyalty for the team. I think everyone knows not only is, you know, Josh Harris and David Blitzer, who the two managing partners, you know, family to me, but look, Joel Embiid and James Harden are both family to me. So I'm super committed to staying involved and helping these guys. And, you know, I talk to, you know, all these guys nearly daily.

You know, I think I talk to them all, you know, all the time. So it was for me something that had to happen. It's the right thing for Fanatics, the right thing for the Sixers. And it doesn't change. I believe the Sixers. something that had to happen. It's the right thing for Fanatics, the right thing for the Sixers, and it doesn't change. I believe the Sixers. I'm here to help. And to be honest, if you keep it real, it's better for me now because I have no rules that I need to live by.

So I like that. So you're betting on it. Yeah, a lot of hammering. No, it's not about gambling. But, look, if I want to up with a free agent or I want to be involved in something that's very easy for me, I don't have to worry about, you know, breaking rules. I can, you know, it's, you got complete flexibility. So as far as Mitchell Ness, look, when we bought Mitchell Ness,

what we thought was this is this super culturally relevant brand that we wanted to partner with the people that we make our business with. So it was like really easy for me to say, Hey, you know, do this with Jay-Z, do this with Kevin Hart, do this with Braun, do this with D book, do this with Joelle, do it with James, do it with, you know, CP3, um, do it with KD. And by the way, do it with Odell Beckham. Like these are all the people that like, you know, they're helping us build our business. We're helping them build their business. So we were honored and thrilled to have them as part of it the one thing i will say anytime i take

someone's money i worry about it like a hundred times more than if it's our own money so i only put people into great deals we did the first deal we actually did where we brought outsiders in was lids and you know i probably i actually never told the story before but we brought you know meek who's like a brother to me into the deal he made He made 40 times his money, got his money out, like, a year and a half into the deal. That brought me more happiness than it probably brought him, and so I love that. You know, now, by the way, that's an extraordinary situation. Probably will never happen again. But Mitchell and Ness, you know, we thought it was really important to have, you know,

the best athletes, the best artists, you know, great celebrities involved with the business because they're making culture. So we wanted them to not only – we want them to have equity appreciation in the business. So it was a really easy decision. And yes, we're going to do that stuff more. First time we ever did it was Lids. Second time we did it was Mitchell Ness. And then we got a bunch of guys that are investors and fanatics as well. And I think, you know, if we're all working toward the same thing, we all help each other. I also think for the players, you know, I think, look, look,

a lot of athletic skills on this, on, on, on, on, on this discussion here. You know, the reality included, you included, no, me, I'm like, eating was my best skill set. Oh, I get it. Drinking maybe second best. That's where it stops. So the reality, the reality, the reality is this was easy for us. we want these guys and bob they're going to make the business more valuable we're going to do it more and more and i think what you hear out of a lot of athletes is they're really good at making money they're less good at saving and least good at properly investing so if they have people they trust that want to be aligned with them to be able to get their money to work for them is a great thing.

By the way, I have friends who play sports who literally have never, you know, who have tens of millions of dollars in the bank, have never invested a penny because they don't know who to invest with. They're nervous about it. They're uncomfortable. So to take people you're comfortable with and you can properly invest is something that I think a lot of people are doing. A guy like CP3 is super sophisticated. By the way, most all the guys I run it off are really sophisticated guys. They, you know, they want to be in the right business deals. They want to, you know, they want to create generational wealth for themselves, not just, you know, get a big paycheck,

pay 50% of the government and then spend a budget, but they want to invest in great, you know, that value and wealth for themselves and, and really for their, you know, for everyone in their family. I can see why a lot of people like you, man, listening to you chat and, you know for everyone in the family i can see why a lot of people like you man listening to you chat and you know give deflect any sort of like notoriety is pretty cool to kind of see at a position that you're in um you said it was easy for you to give equity to the guys and want them to have a stake in it and the athletes and everything in every business that you do and you've you've talked about having street smarts not really having a good book but how come it took so long you think for some of these industries to change like i feel like giving somebody a percentage of a company so they'll work harder and they'll enjoy it seems to be smart

especially if you're going to utilize their brand how come it took so long you think for people to start doing that and why did the business need you to change you think so first of all i think many businesses get stuck doing things the same way forever. And you need someone who likes to break shit, likes to disrupt. At my core, I'm a disruptor. I like to reinvent things. I like to break things we're doing if they're not right. So I've got that kind of mentality. That's not a normal mentality.

So it's kind of a very entrepreneurial mentality. I think as it relates to working with the players and the other artists. Guys have been, hey, businesses have been fucking over athletes for a long time. Taking advantage of business-wise, investment-wise, everything-wise. There's been a lot of that for a long time. So that's why I think you're so impressive because everybody you do business with loves you still. You know what I mean? Here's the thing.

I think if you, first of all, look, I still own a big percentage of my company. So money doesn't make any difference to me. Like, I want to win. By the way, you want the people around you to win, too. Because then, like, I love, like, I've had this discussion with different of my friends. I'm like, I'd rather you do something that's 99% less financial meaningful to me for you because, like, I want you to win. And, like, I always believe in, like, we all build each other up. So like the way I look at it, I actually watched, you know,

Chris's interview a few weeks ago. He actually told me about it. I went back and watched it. It was like, he was so thoughtful about how important it is for players to invest in things. And I thought like, that's my responsibility to help with that, to get more people involved.

And so I think a lot of people are too traditional. I also think, in reality, you guys tell me, but I think a lot of, you know, athletes, you know, you don't trust the boring suit that's like, you know, like so many rich people are like, they're painful, they're boring, and they're like, you know, I can't have it. Like, there's so many people who want to spend time with me, I'm like, I'd rather, like, I just could spend a second, you know,

having a conversation. So, like, if you can spend a second, you know, having a conversation. So, like, if you can relate to somebody, then you find shit to do together. It's why everyone, like, like Robert Kraft is such a relatable guy to me. Everyone's like, how are you friends with this 81-year-old guy? He's just like a kid in a, you know, in an 81-year-old body. Like, Robert's like up at 5 a.m. He goes to bed at 1 o'clock. He's on text message and email all the time.

You know, by the way, Robert Kraft, after his wedding reception, that had this incredible reception, called me and said, where are you? I said, I left 10 minutes ago. He said, where did you go? I said, I went to, I said, little baby had his album launch party today. He said, where is it? I said, Robert, you just had your wedding reception. Go home.

He said, I'm coming to baby's party with Dana. Let's go. That's like, I like that. Here's this guy, 81 years old, just had this ready reception with everyone in the world there. And he chooses to go to Baby's, you know, album launch party because he wanted to be there to celebrate Baby. And like that mentality, like staying young, being relatable, like that's who I am. That's not most successful people. And I think that's what makes me think about things a little bit differently.

And also, you know, be able to do a lot of stuff that people, and by the way, it's win-win for all of us while winning together, which is great. Hell yeah. God, AJ. Mark, last thing for me. I think I might know the answer, but any chance, like, as you get older, you think you're able to slow down? It seems like this is your life and you love what you're doing. You ever see yourself taking a step back ever?

No. I'll be dead when that happens. You know, look, like, it's the truth. Like, I am actually working the hardest I've ever worked and having the most fun I've ever had. I'm also learning the most. Like, you know, when you get to have – I have failures all the time. Like, shit goes wrong all the time. When I finish the result, look at my phone.

There will be three things that went right, two that went wrong. Like, that's interesting to me because you're always learning. You're always growing. And so, like, why would I change that? Like, I think – i don't know for me and this a lot of people won't agree with me who hear this i think the second you retire i think that's just like a step toward death and like i'd like to live a long fun intellectually interesting life and so why do i want to be on the way to dying yeah yeah yeah that's not good the road to death doesn't sound like a fun

one at all i think you're doing i think you're doing it just fine last question from me before we let you get back to your six text messages of either happiness or failures uh jay-z bezos and mcconaughey potentially buying the commanders do you guys have like a billionaire group check uh that you guys all kind of talk to each other and what do you see the future of the n NFL with more of these teams probably coming up for sale? Is everybody going to be trying to get into the NFL? I mean, obviously you rattled off a bunch of reasons why you don't want to own a professional team, but do you see a lot of the big money folks like yourself getting into the NFL and what does that mean for the NFL, you think? Yeah. So I'm in a very unique position where Fanatics is such a big opportunity that sports ownership would interfere with the success of Fanatics,

which has a chance to build a digital sports platform for billions of fans. For me, it's not right. For most people, it's, look, there's 32 NFL teams. There's 120 professional teams. There are 150 professional teams at soccer, maybe 200 teams in the world. It's a very scarce asset. I'd say there are a lot of people that definitely want to get into sports ownership. The NFL is an incredible business model. It's a really good business. So it's not only this incredible sport, it's also a good business. You know, I think sports in

general is a really good business. We see tons of growth. So I think, yes, you're going to see a lot of people get into it. And by the way, like sports properties would be lucky to have a guy like Jay-Z as an owner. Like, could you imagine how much value? I look at what Jay adds to our business. I mean, I remember sitting with Jay a couple of years ago. I was talking to him about leads and I was talking about how to make sure we keep head hot. He said, Michael, you're thinking about the wrong way.

Like when you get trashed, you put on your sneakers, you put on your jeans, put on a hoodie, you put on a hat. That's part of your wardrobe. You're not even thinking about the wrong way. Like when you get trashed, you put on your sneakers, you put on your jeans, put on a hoodie, you put on a hat. That's part of your wardrobe. You're not even thinking about it the right way. Here I am taking input about we own the biggest headwear retail in the world. It's, you know, 1300 stores and Jay's telling me how to think about it differently. So like sports properties would be so lucky to have, you know, Jay's an owner. There's so many of these guys that can, you know, add a lot of value. And I think like, look, I want to see sports get younger. I want to see the ownership groups get younger. So to me, it's a good thing to have, you know, a lot of these people that I think, like, look, I want to see sports get younger. I want to see the ownership groups get younger. So to me, it's a good thing to have a lot of these people that I mentioned

interested in sports ownership. And I think you keep picking up good owners. I'm partners with, you know, Todd Boley and the guy who just, you know, the guy who just bought Chelsea. You know, he's been an investor in Fanatics for a long time. And, you know, it's great to see him not only own the Dodgers and part of the Lakers, but also now go out and buy Chelsea.sea he's got great partners there clear lake so i think all this stuff is great for sports it's going to make better product for fans and better businesses for you know the

players ultimately who get half the revenue well keep crushing it man we appreciate you you're a trailblazer for people like me and us who are trying to you know keep doing it in a common sense fashion while enjoying every step of the way. We appreciate your time on this busy Wednesday, sir. Hey, fun having you. Fun being with you guys and keep going. I know you guys are doing great. So congrats to you guys.

I appreciate the time. Hey, where are you at? Is that your office right there? I'm actually in my apartment in New York City right now because I had a lunch that I just finished here before. Do we get any deals done at lunch? I assume you're working. What are you eating if you're not working? What are we doing? I eat very

little because I used to be fat. I'm trying to be less fat. I've got from pleasantly plump to just... I've got actually from fat to pleasantly plump. Husky. Active husky. I like husky, but you have muscle. I don't really have a lot of that right now.

I always get stuff. There's no media that's not getting things done. That's not the way we roll. You're the best. We appreciate you. Ladies and gentlemen, Michael Rubin. Yeah, Michael! Remember the clock strikes three on a Wednesday.

We know what that means. That's right. Yep. It means we're going to get smarter. We're going to get better. We're going to become not only better pundits and analysts, but better people as a whole because we're going to find out why things happen that nobody else gets to know about.

Ladies and gentlemen, with the 10th episode of the highly acclaimed series Everything DB, nine-year NFL vet, former corner safety, and nickel in the NFL, Darius J. Butler. Let's go. We 10 already. That's crazy. Damn. Let's start.

All right. Let's see right here. I'm blocking it right now, actually. But being an athlete, this is actually a good coverage, a good rep by these guys playing this coverage, which is quarters coverage down here, quarter, quarter. And then you got the half coverage up here. Heineke kind of under pressure, closes his eyes and throws this downfield. But as you'll see as this play unfolds,

it's one person on the field not being an athlete. That's the guy right there in stripes. Got lost, man. So you got the backside corner, I mean backside safety deep half plays if you run it back early from the white cop again plays this half perfectly all the vertical routes kind of die down leads him right into the overhang and helping on this deep route and he's in great position to go and pick this ball off but the back judge right now he's like oh shit how do i get out of this he should have just came back towards the line of scrimmage,

got out of the way, but instead he catches this, rolls over, and scores. Watch the ref gets up. He probably has a heart attack. It's a pick probably, huh? It's a pick for sure. It's a game changer, career changer. I don't know if the moxie on Heineke would let this be a pick. No, Paul, he's timing it up.

He's counting his steps at this point. He's trying to get. He's counting his steps at this point. He's ducking. He's looking for ribs. I mean, that's your natural body position where you're going to protect yourself. So he's going to drop his shoulder. He hits him. And just watch the panic in him as he rolls over. He hits him.

And if he keeps playing, you'll see him roll over like. Oh, no. Oh, no. Don't catch that. Please. Please. Did he? Sorry. So that's that's tough man that's tough stuff so be an athlete but that would have been on the good clips but it ended up on the bad he get up and signal touchdown he was he didn't want to he was you know that's it i am so sorry

but uh this is another it's another uh thing you're going to see week in and week out slot phase right slot phase you probably hear people mention it. And it's a tough, tough route to defend as a defender because what offenses do typically is they put one of their best receivers in this slot formation. This is really him lined up at X, and you got this running back out here lined up at 1. But you got Justin Jefferson here lined up in the slot.

And as this DB, not only do you have to cover the inside route, but now when he lines up here, he has so much space out here to the sideline. Kirk Cousins is going to see pressure, feel pressure. It's almost a zero look, but he kind of drops back and ends up kind of like this low-hold defender. So it's only one, two, three, four, five that ends up pressuring. And they're going to almost get home, but he's going to make a great, accurate throw under pressure

to his best receiver. And once again, he gets on those toes, on 2-5's toes, and he has so much room, so much space. You'll see it from the back copy to throw this ball. It's obviously a great ball under pressure. Knows exactly where he's going. Got his wind knocked out of him. Look at all that space that he has to throw to the outside, lead him,

hit him in stride under pressure. So great, great, obviously, play design, putting Jefferson in there. But this is a tough, tough route to defend that slot fade. What's he supposed to do, get hands on him or what? I mean, that's tough. You're off. So typically in this position when you're sending, because they only send five, they still get home.

But if this is a zero pressure, you're thinking this is third and seven also. So you're kind of, all right, let me hang around these sticks. But when pressure is getting home, you're expecting either a slant, you know, quick slant, a quick out, or a fade ball. So he's, I mean, it's just tough. That's one of the best receivers in the league for a reason. He gets on his toes, just run past him, and it's a great ball. Great execution.

Kirk knew he was going to him when? Immediately, you think? I mean, yeah. So once you get this alignment, he knows he has 18 here, and just by alignment he knows the safety is all the way on the other side of the field, so he's not going to get middle of the field help. It's nobody to help him. This has to be a one-on-one.

So when you line up in empty as an offense, you're going to get answers pre-snap. You're going to get answers quick. It's hard to disguise when teams line up in empty. And defenses, A.J. obviously would notice, defenses going in every week, you have a game plan for empty. Like, alright, when they go empty, we're going to go cover two. When they go empty, we're going to go zero. We're going to go three. And then maybe you switch it up

at some point. So, Kirk knew pre-snap exactly where he was going. Hey, throw this one out aj this is jack del rio too you know yeah that's right you're good happy birthday if they debunk what if they brought think all the there's six up there yeah i got you there's six showing up the line if all of them come they got a free runner obviously this is a play too though with that inside fade kirk can kind of backpedal and buy a little time and still put it up for yeah absolutely so if if the guy who have number four on him, I think that's Curl.

If he just comes, like AJ said, they'd probably get home a step quicker. But they kind of drop him in there to take away this quick crosser, take away a quick throw. But as a DB, if we're going to blitz, I'd rather you send everybody. Just send the guys and let me figure it out in the back end. But Kirk does a good job. He's already looking at his target. He knows exactly where he's going. He does a good job of actually putting the ball

knowing you're going to get hit anyway but putting the ball out there to where only 18 can catch it or it's going to be incomplete hey remember kirk has said on the record if i die i die so i don't think he's ever like lacked courage i mean he I mean, him sitting in there, he lost his win there. He said he was moaning, and Payne said, you'll be all right as he was walking by him. They get the win over the Commanders. Close game, but this is something that you just got to make a play, I guess. That's the expectation.

It's a big third down. This is in the fourth quarter. So this is obviously a huge play. Now, this, excuse me, this is a great play design from Mike McDaniel because you're going to put this middle linebacker in the bind. I'm sure AJ's been in this position a lot. But he's going to shift. He's going to motion this fullback up to the end of the line of scrimmage.

And then they're going to have a play action run fake. And what this fullback is going to do is he's going to crack this D in. And then that's going to put him in a situation where once he sees that crack, to him he knows, shit, I got to replace. I got to get somewhere to fill a lane in the run game. So you see the crack here, fake run. And now obviously it's a play action. So where you would want him is to be able to drop back and kind of get some depth there.

And then for this backside safety, this is your number one receiver. You got to be able to push. Once this boot action is happening with Tua back here, you got to be able to push once this boot action is happening with two up back here You got to be able to push and get over there and help On this guy, right? This is your one guy this second vertical going through there is going to be on that cover to their plan cover to in the back It's gonna be on that cover to corner But a great play design tool is gonna get out here on the edge and as you can see the play action fake works

You got Tyree kill here and you got waddle right behind him and it's a obviously a huge huge gap there makes a great accurate throw but it started with the play design it started putting 57 in this bind but you can see probably better from the uh from the tight copy are these the two hardest uh receivers to cover on the same team as far as from a db standpoint yeah they're so fast and like as a DB, as a safety, wherever you are, your typical landmarks that you go in every week, like it have to change because they're just, they move, you feel it. They just move differently.

It's one thing to see him on film. I played against Tyreek Hill, I think once. It's one thing to see a guy like that on film. And then when you see him in real life, it's like different. Probably like, I'm sure AJ, you probably faced Randy Moss before. Like you see Moss on film striding on his prime, but then when he's actually on the field with you, like this dude ain't human. It's different.

So it's like two Bugattis out there moving for sure. But AJ, let me get some of your input from the tight copy. Is he the middle reader? Is 57 the middle reader there? I believe he's going to be. Yeah, he's the, yep, this Tampa. So they bump over after this motion. What is this, a boss?

Boss over? Boss, yeah, bow away, boss too. What does that mean? This is 21 personnel. Boss strong, bow away. Like you boss strong, so they're bumping strong. If you bow, you bow away. Like if they went weak, bow away.

What does B.O. mean? Bump over? Ah, whatever. I don't know what it stands for. Is it bump over strong, bump over away, or no? I remember Chuck said it last week. He said bump away weak, but then it's still B-O. It's still both.

So they're bossing over to the – That's how it's always been. That's how it's always been. All right. So it's 21 personnel. So you think, you know, 21 personnel, you know, coming out of the huddle, you're probably thinking run, tight end backside, two receivers frontside, and then him, and then.

So how would you play this, AJ? Well, now you know the outcome. Pre-snap. Yeah, of course. Yeah, when you know the outcome, it's easier sitting here in an air conditioning room. But I would take one step back, so I'm like six yards at the snap. If you're the middle reader, a lot of coaches will tell you, like, you're almost, you're not a secondary run

defender, but you're not expected to go up there immediately. Like, you should have to wrap over the top or if the guy's going to knock it back to you, you're going to be a step late on that run fake. So, you know right away, you're screwed right here if you're 57 because they are showing good run action right in your face. Was he the backup too because Roquan just got traded?

He's a rookie. He's still going that way, AJ. We can't win with it, AJ. We can't have it. What's he doing, AJ? Tell him to keep his fucking eyes up. I will tell you, this guy has a lot of heart, though. If he hands that ball off, obviously he's got to win. But now it's all shit.

And obviously, you know, you got Waddle coming behind him. Good play design, though. Good play design. Good, accurate throw from Tua. I would like to let 57 know me talking shit there is not serious. What are you joshing? Because what a nightmare situation because he has to think, this is all happening so quick.

That's why what you guys do on the field is so fucking stupid. The reactions, if you take one false step, he literally, what, just one step the wrong way right there. That one. That's the one that just completely fucked up. Hey, that's Tyreek too, right? That's Tyreek. Yep, that's Tyreek in the slot and then you have Waddle.

Can you run it back, Pat? If you run it back, Tyreek, he pauses on him. He gives him his little stutter. It looks like he's going to try to crack him. So the backer thinks that, oh, he's going to crack me here. Uh-oh, I've got to get underneath it. Oh, see ya. Oh, yeah, because he was trying to get ready.

Bracing himself for it. Good job by that. Good job by Tyreek, man. That's how I have football IQ stuff that won't get talked about whenever you talk about fake by two or two yeah that is just a great play call on that play action you can't see the ball yes fucking musician and also i mean this is a fucking good oh shit can't do it there you go back to look at this lineman pulling too you see that guy out in space like i gotta get downhill now you look at the guard pulling or whatever but also fullback cracking down look at the running back or whatever, but also. Fullback cracking down.

Look at the running back. Yeah, Wilson. I mean, that's good. You could see how a ball could potentially fucking, like it's full commitment by everybody. And Wilson had kind of been chewing them up on the ground too, so it's. Had to play it.

Good play, Mike. Good execution, guys. Stop it. Sorry about it, 57. Sorry about it, 57. Smart with that little motion pre-snap too, D, but just to get him thinking, like just move the fullback out to make it. You go to the wide on that side just to get you. You let me ball.

Oh, wait, here we go, ball snap. Oh, no. What am I doing? I'm also getting a lot of reports. Jackie Boy has watched this play 500 times, so he won't make this mistake again. Okay, thank you. That's tough right there.

That is tough. Good play. Good play That's tough right there. That is tough. Good play. Good play. Good play right there. Hey, they're going to get you. You know, not to Colts. We didn't score any. No.

We had negative two yards. I mean, it seems like this play actually gets you yards regardless. It's like putting your name on the SAT, which I think Michael Rubin didn't do well. Yeah. Get like 400 points. You just run a couple of these plays, you're going to get yards guaranteed. Got to have weapons, though, because everybody's got to respect everything. Yeah, you still got to have weapons.

You know, play design obviously helps, but players make a difference. Those guys obviously move so fast. And then on the defense, not only Mike Linebacker, but that backside safety. Like once your threat, like that's your number one threat. Once he moves, like everything should move when you have a boot or sprint action. All the zones move. What's that called? Plaster? Plaster is more so like the quarterback.

The routes have been ran and Big Ben used to do this a ton. He'll go and you get home and he just throws a guy off and now the receiver just starts to run in the backyard. Then you've got to just find him, fuck the zone, and just find him and play. This is just mirroring quarterback. Yeah, this is mirroring quarterbacks. Then that linebacker, he's not going to make that play,

but it's really his job to make him have to put more. You saw he just put that on the line. But if he makes – force him to put more air on it, and if that backside safety is actually squeezing, it's a potential that he makes that play. But, I mean, that was obviously a big area that – Connor, we knew that. We knew that that linebacker is trying to get a little –

his job in this particular role is literally just to get a little bit more air under the ball so that the 4-2 guy in the back and maybe close on it that's that's the type of fucking planning happening in the nfl though like that's the type of shit that's going on that's why i think like people whenever you watch games and if you see bad football you see bad football but like when teams are going the amount of fucking detail-oriented structure thought that is going into every single play is, I think, should be talked about more. That's why I enjoy this type of shit.

I think D-Bud chose to play either last week or two weeks ago with the Vikings against the Lions, and the guy was just lined up half a step inside. It's crazy how minute the details are, but it's the difference in a game. Leverage, alignment. Leverage is always critical. That's from Super Bowl champion to being fucking top five pick.

That type of stuff. It's crazy. It's insane. Speaking of Super Bowl champion, so we got to obviously the Rams end up losing this game. Not this year. But you got Cooper Cupper here, the Triple Crown winner. So tight end, receiver. Receiver.

AJ. Fucking. Whatever. Fuck it it cover three on what is aj doing in the middle of everything db did you hear that he probably got some ashes what is that all about aj three weeks yeah well wait wait till after the show dirtbag do it so we got empty on here once again once you get it empty you got to get answers. Priest now, what's the down and distance? I think it's the second. Yeah, second and 11. So empty. You got Cooper Cup in the slot here.

And now this is, so we've seen a bunch of Eagles clips. And on defense, what they do on defense is they carry their seams, right? So these seams go up and out. You carry them as the flat defender. And this true zone cover three is more of a landmark defense. A lot of coaches in the league will call it like high school cover three where you're getting to landmarks. So as a curl flat defender, you're going to get out here and kind of get into your landmark. That deep third defender, instead of being like a man principal on that number one receiver out here,

because we know the flat defenders carry a number two. So he's staying with number two. Now, as this deep third defender, you have to split the vertical. If these guys run vertical, you're responsible for both of them, right? And then, obviously, as a post safety, it's your job to be on the landmark and get a good read and break off this quarterback. But you're responsible. If both of these guys go vertical, you got to split them. Same thing for this deep third defender up here.

So if you let this play, you'll see he does his job. He sinks out but this guy he kind of pause it he's going to get caught up with this number one tight end who runs a comeback route he almost treats it like a three carry or a three match when he's supposed to continue to run three you're talking cover three cover three cover three match so he's playing it like number 22 is going to continue to run with Cooper Cup and that way he would be able to play this comeback but since he's dropping Cooper Cup and just getting to his own he's see how he's pointing you end up with the receiver wide open up the scene now this guy is trying to do a better job of it but he's not getting to his midpoint either so we used to have midpoints in New England

hey two yards outside of the numbers that was your landmark as a deep third defender and that way what's he saying here? Man, man, man, man, man? 2-2? Yeah. He's just kind of pointing. You know, you're in zone defenses. You're just pointing. You're talking. Sometimes it's verbal. Sometimes it's nonverbal communication. But he's expecting that corner to continue to run with him. And if Stafford

was to throw this ball out here, he was just expanding. That's on him. Yeah, that's on him. That's on his flat defender. Same as it would be up here. So you see, he's trying to do it. He's trying to split these two verticals. I think that's on him. That's on his flat defender, same as it would be up here. So you see he's trying to do it. He's trying to split these two verticals. I think he's a little too wide. But, you know, he's getting caught up on his comeback route. So that's a blown coverage, a blown assignment, an Emmy.

And this is just miscommunication. I mean, this is the best player on the team. Like, you don't want the situation for that play. And if you see this from the tight copy Stafford gets a bad snap here But then he runs and fucking scores a touchdown But Stafford will get a bad snap here And he still catches a snap

Looks the safety off to his left And then goes He knows exactly where he's going with the ball So this is still high level quarterback play But defense we can't make it that easy What do you think about Jalen Ramsey Just absolutely Well

Well Well Oh yeah That's one of the things you say amongst is we can't make it that easy. What do you think about Jalen Ramsey just absolutely? Well, well, well, well. Oh, yeah. That's one of the things you say amongst, you know, probably each other. Like you come off, he made the play, he took his helmet off, you think. But, I mean, it's football. You know, sometimes you got to go back out there and get another stop. It's just football. And actually, Jalen Ramsey, I think he'll come over the next time.

What he's saying is valid. Yeah. Yeah, but that's not something you say to somebody outside of the meeting. Now, you bringing up that question with me knowing what play is coming next. Fascinating. Is that right? Yeah, yeah. I did not know.

I did not know. Our team's starting to realize that, like, with the Rams, like, hey, they only throw its Cooper Cup. They don't complete passes to anyone else. Yeah. How does this shit continue to happen when he is literally the only guy who is making any explosive plays? Yeah, hold on. Answer

this question. Whenever they say, well, they're going to make a play left-handed, they're going to take away their... What does that mean normally, and is that what the Bucs did all game except for that particular play? Because Cup is their only weapon. No, it was other plays where he was wide-ass open, too. It's just, when you put Cooper Cup, and that that was it didn't matter

who was running that scene right there that could have literally been anybody if you drop them in coverage but typically in zone coverages if you run a zone coverage against a quarterback and a receiver that on are on the same page like matt stafford and cooper cup they're going to be open they're going to complete the ball it's just about uh limiting the yak yardage after catching the ball when you're playing zone coverages now if you're playing man coverages you're trying to eliminate which i would try to play as much as possible against the rams that's when you're okay we have a guy assigned to cooper cup and then we got another guy assigned to help him so i may be playing them and hey there he's just don't let him win outside and then i know i have help inside um but it's always easier said

than done and then you have other things you have to worry about within trying to stop an offense. But you can't, regardless of who this receiver is, this can't happen. I mean, this guy's wide the fuck open too. Like I said, I don't think he's doing a great job of splitting. So I don't think either corner is doing a good job right here splitting the difference between those two verticals. Is this a cover three beater?

Yes. This is a cover three? Four verts are a cover three beater because you've got one guy responsible for two verts. So unless you get a great breakout in this post, you saw from the back copy how Stafford moved him, that little movement just opens it up even more. D-Butt, are you a bit surprised? With 22s in the slot, I don't know how they're supposed to play their cover three, but if it's true, spot drop cover three.

I know pre-snap, if I'm walked out, I'm the curl flat defender. That corner, whoever it may be, I got to tell them, hey, man, I will be under that comeback. I'm going to drive to the sticks, almost to the sideline to take care of that so you don't feel threatened as a corner. And you can run with – you can kind of get to Cooper Cup faster, I guess. Yeah, but that's – to me, that's on the corner. The corner just has to 100% know the design.

Yeah, that's the design of the defense. And it's called high school cover three for a reason because this is the kind of cover three we run in high school. So this is something, maybe a conversation they have during the week. Like, hey, they run this route. I'm going to be out here. But he has to know. Like, his eyes should never even go.

If you rewind it, he goes into a back pedal and then his eyes go. Like, this looks like a man-to-man. Yeah, yeah. Like, his eyes should never even go if you rewind it he goes into a back pedal and then his eyes go like this is like this looks like a man a man yeah like his eyes should stay so right now he should be opening his hips to the like how he is running back please yep so 35 his hips are going to open this is a zone turn what he does is a man turn he's his hips open up to the man he is a zone open the whole way like that's how you have to play a cover three. Once again, he has to... And you're saying he's the only one that's not doing it. That's how you can assume. This is the one guy that's not playing

this coverage correctly, I would say. And it's as easy as that. We're assuming he got the call. He didn't miss the call. But you get one guy out of 11 a little bit off. We got 75 yards here for Cooper Cove. And maybe they go back and forth with how they play cover three. Sometimes they carry it.

Sometimes we drop it, which we did that sometimes too. So you got to be able to execute, and everybody got to be on the same page. It is obviously critical. This is the – so let's play right here. First and 10, and this is the – so Ramsey and the defense got to stop. They had to go back out there again. It's the beginning of the two- game winning drive from Tom Brady Bucks. First and 10, 44 seconds left on the clock.

No timeouts. So right now we're keeping things in front of us and we're trying to tackle guys inbounds and we're not giving up big plays. Like that's the thing. That's what your coach should do in this situation, because time is your friend. Yet it can complete the ball. Just don't let them complete it and get out of bounds. That's what your coach should do in this situation because time is your friend. Yet he can complete the ball. Just don't let him complete it and get out of bounds. That's what they let him do. I could have just ran, obviously, the four or five, six plays on just this drive alone because they just let him get the ball all the way downfield. But right here, this is this is kind of like that. We talked about this coverage, too.

This is kind of like a trap. And this is tough to do because you don't know exactly how to coach. But he's playing this like a trap. It's basically me. if this tight end runs up and breaks out i'm going to steal that but whenever we do that trap we know what that means for this half field safety you have to get more with because you have to be able to get to this number one receiver and obviously scott scotty miller is a burner so i felt real good about that i didn't know what you were going to do i we had not gone. We went over this. This is week 10. I know.

Week 10. That's what I'm saying. As I was doing the thing, I'm like, oh, shit. I think he's got to get out. He's got to get more wigs. We saw Honey Badger, I think, get a pick on this early in the season in London. In London. In London.

In London. London. You remember the queen was there. She died. Before she croaked. Hello. Hello, Varun. Oi. Poppet. Hello. Hello, Ron. Puppet.

Wasn't it, AJ, what they did in London? I'm not doing any more accents. That's the only one you got. You cheeky cunt. That's a term of a German game. I didn't say that. Someone from London did. They do more German games. Wait till you hear what we do. No, yeah. Someone from London did. They do more German games.

Wait till you hear what we do. Oh, my gosh. Leave that off next week, D-Bud. D-Bud, do not have to do the game. Do not come in here. Don't do it. A hawk will be excited. We know AQ is basically playing the whole game on Tuesday.

One, two, three, four, five, six. So we got six DBs out here. We got dime personnel. Because of the bus. Yeah, and there's 44 seconds left. So anyway, this is Jalen Ramsey up here. He's the nickel, dime, whichever one. It would be the dime in this because this is the passing strength down here.

But this is tight end. Once again, you can't give up these chunk plays. So if you're going to give up a route that doesn't go on the box, it can't be a big 25, 30-yard gain. You'll see he does not get enough depth here, in my opinion. This is the route that you want to be pat. You want this check down to be caught, and then you rally and tackle it

as zone defender. If Tom Brady throws this ball to seven, we got Bobby Wagner, we got two, we got five all coming and getting him tackle and bounce. And the next snap is probably going to be 20-something seconds. But you can't give up this big seam route. Like, this is too easy of a play to give up with 44 seconds left, no timeouts.

This ends up being a 28-yard pitch and catch, and it obviously sets up the game-winning touchdown. I think it goes to him as well. I think he catches the game-winning touchdown. So is this miscommunication? What is it you think? You're trying to guess on something? No, I wouldn't say trying to guess. I think he catches the game. So is this miscommunication? What is it you think? You're trying to guess on something? No, I wouldn't say trying to guess.

This is them playing the call. But once again, as a pro, you have to take the call and then you have to know the situation attached with that call. Like, there's no time. Like, this is the one I can't. So you just got to continue just sinking back, just getting depth, forcing Tom to throw this check down in this situation, in my opinion. So, like, it's just – do we have this one from the back copy?

Yeah, sure. Okay, yeah. So, I think if you're a quarterback and you just see the tempo and the pace of his drop, you know right – Tom knows right now that this seam is going to be open. Just off his drop because there's no depth, there's nothing out of his – What is he doing? So, that's – I mean, that's that's that i mean that's you

can't you can't have that you can't do that in this situation uh regardless i don't care what your coach should do as a player as a pro you have to know 44 seconds left first and 10 we get a couple tackles and bounce the games over how about they need a touchdown too it's a four point game how about the little hop from tom just like so pumped oh here we go yep a little he needed this one he did boy it's fucking awesome you saw the reaction after the game it was like he wanted so pumped. Oh, here we go. He needed this one. He did, boy. It was fucking awesome. You saw the reaction after the game.

It was like he won a fucking playoff game. But it was a big one. And obviously a big win for the team. And the Rams had to go back out there in defense. But you got to be able

to get a stop. What's that all about? Is that Jalen just being so pissed off about the situation potentially? Maybe. The game's over. Maybe.

Potentially. Like legitimately being like, why can't you guys, you got to run three so pissed off about the situation potentially? Maybe. Maybe. Game's over. Maybe. Potentially, like legitimately being like, why can't you guys run three isos or powers or whatever, give the ball back? You take 14 seconds off the clock, give the ball back. How about you guys just do something? You're talking about humans here. Talking about humans.

Obviously, he was bothered by having to go back out there, but once again, that's part of it. If you've got to go back out there, you've got to go back out there. Three under three deep, something we've been talking about a lot this year, five-man pressure. And also another route we've been talking about since the preseason, I think the first time we saw with the fast kid that was the track star that was in Philly. Devin Allen.

Devin Allen, yep. So this is going to be the same route. So you're going to get an over route, a deep crosser from him, and then a post from him. And then one of the best corners in the league right now, Jair Alexander, he might be even communicating what's coming. Let me see this. I didn't see this earlier.

Run it back a little bit. This Packers secondary is struggling. Yeah, so he's giving them a little signal right here, right now. He's like, hey, they're trying to fuck us. Hey, they are trying to. Or just be alert. When you see this formation, a lot of big bodies in it. This is actually an extra lineman right here that's coming in as an eligible tight end.

He's motioning. So right now, this is just a bunch of big bodies condense everyone inside the numbers. So as a veteran player, you're expecting this type of play. And obviously, he was all over it from the jump. He showed golf exactly what he did. Oh, God. So as a veteran player, you're expecting this type of play. And obviously he was all over it from the jump. He showed golf exactly what he did. Oh, God. Hey, him flipping his hips, big deal.

Yeah, he's just open. Zone coverage, keeping everything in front of him. So right now he's almost filling this receiver, but he's looking across the field knowing what's coming and also looking at the quarterback and really just waiting for. Because to him, I don't know how much he sees 23 but he feels like okay i got what i need i got a ton of space running back it's going to be a play action fake it's going to be a play action fake so all three underneath defenders respect the play action so it's going to be a big hole but he's all over this as you saw from the pre-snap signal like he he knew this play was

coming the entire time. Him, too. Watch how quickly he opens his hip to cover this post route. Like, right now. Like, he already knows, okay, I know what's coming. Ten yards away. And he's looking like, I know what's coming. Yeah. So, obviously, this is what we've been expecting to see from the Packers all year.

But great, great play by Jair here. Look at him plant his foot. Yep. Ball's not even. It's only a two-man route. Boop. Two-man route. They're him plant his foot. Yep. Ball's not in Boston. It's only two-man route. Boop. Two-man route. They're all condensed, too. You know someone's –

Good chance they're cross. Great return, too. It's an alert shot. So this is – You know, that's making it play and knowing what's coming before. Guess how many points they scored after that. How many? None.

Hey, look at how the motion messed up their linebackers. If you run a backpack. Yeah, they're jumping over top of each other. He jumps over and then he comes back. They're like, oh, no, who cares? We're not going to go back. Like, if you see this, watch. 70.

Okay, here we go. Flip, flip. Let's ski up. Oh, no. Yeah, they all took like a step that way and then came back. Get you out of sorts like before the snap so you're playing behind. I'm a big proponent. If I'm an offensive coordinator, I play Carla. Give me some

pre-snap motion, pre-snap shifts. Mess with the rules. More to think about. Lift his hand up and think about going over and put it back down. Shift your tight end, motion, because there's a difference between shifts and motions. There's different rules. It's tough. That's another thing that

Mike Medan of Miami does. And Sam Friend does a lot. A lot of pre-snap. But he's all over it. And these type of plays that are made, a lot of big plays that are made in the NFL, especially defensively, are made pre-snap. Either Deans have a tell. They know, you know, all right, I'm going to make this move on the tackle.

I set him up early in the game. And as a DB, that's calling it knowing. Formation recognition is what that was. Oh! And going into it. Another formation wreck. Jesse Bates, another really good player in this league. They were obviously all over the Panthers this weekend,

but it's going to be covered, too. First route's going to kind of die down. He's only going to have one vertical threat, and you'll see him get with. And you always talk about tips and overthrows. You got to got to have them but watch jesse bates just watch him run this rep it's not even much to this is a cover two rep he's a deep half safety with really one vertical threat over here so this is an easy play for him to read you don't have as much to fucking figure out it's yeah because you got you got one one i mean unless this guy streams which

this tight end is a burner he may put some more pressure on it, but this is literally, that's his only threat. It's his job. We always talk about it as an underneath flat defender, get depth, play things top down. But he's already breaking, and this is an overthrow. And if he doesn't overthrow it, remember we talked about the linebacker earlier. His job is to make that underneath job. If you're going to throw it over my head, you're going to have to put some type of arrow in it. But if he makes any other throw, I think his corner makes a play on the ball.

He overthrows it. But that's a great rep from beginning to end from Jesse Bates. P.J. Walker, you think that was kind of his comeback to Earth game, or do you think he just had a tough day? Sometimes you just have stinkers, man. That was an absolute stinker on both sides of the ball for him. But he had a really rough, really rough

go at it. Linebacker got a pick this game too. That was really nice. In the NFL, you have a bad game. At certain positions, you can get exposed quick. This game was over 20-something in the first quarter.

Six minutes in. It's like, all right, here we go. This is 20-something in the first quarter. Six minutes in, yeah. Yeah, it was. Joe makes it in three. And it's like, all right, here we go. This is going to be a tough one. We had a Steelers buzzsaw this one time. Oh, yeah. It was like, you have a bad game in a couple different positions, and the other team is on it.

It's like, you can get fucking boat raced real quick. I feel like that happened to P.J. Walker and the Carolina Panthers. And this Bengals team is coming off an ugly performance of their own. So, you know, you come in with an opponent that you feel like you should beat up on, and that's what they did. Jordan Whitehead, this is cover three right here. We actually had a play with Jordan Whitehead earlier this season against the Packers. Oh, really?

Aaron Rodgers under center, play action. Jordan Whitehead bit up on the play action and then got back to the, I think it was a flat route, with the moving pocket. So it's going to be the same thing here, but this time Josh Allen throws the ball to him. So you see him running back so you can highlight him pre-snap. So he has, this is cover three down there. You usually don't see cover three down here in like the 14-yard line, but deep third, one, two, three.

These guys are responsible for the deep part of the field you got one two three four underneath defenders so he has a run responsibility he has a run gap which he comes up bites but then once he uh does that he's get back into his pass responsibility and then he expands with the moving pocket and then josh had it undercut it he undercut the receiver i mean that's just a basic like thing that a lot of people might not notice, but you see him. He gets out. He drives.

He sees, like, the route. He's like, all right, here we go. Let me slide underneath. And there's a chip there, right? That's on purpose, obviously. Or is that a fake block? Oh, that's a fake block by the tight end. Yeah, he kind of helps, you know, helps secure that edge a little bit

because this is going to be a boot. He's coming out. So, boom, he does his job and he gets out. And it also kind of gives him timing, too, because if he goes too fast, he'll already be out here by the time Josh Allen gets out of that fake. But Josh Allen has to see that, throw that away. This is the first drive of the game, too. I don't know if you all remember that.

Stephon Diggs double move on sauce. This was that same drive. After the slip kickoff. Yep, so you give the big play and then you end it in the red zone so this is why why didn't josh see him you think what you think 91's too big can't see over him no i don't know yeah i couldn't tell you maybe 91's in his vision but if a db is looking at you like and you're throwing a flat like i don't know what josh was thinking here but he has the next play. It's probably a worse

Interceptor 17 really this thing this is the one thing you could you can look at Josh Allen tape and say alright You can be better with taking care of bar eliminate these bone bonehead plays, but it's something I want damn I feel actually feel bad about doing this or saying this doing this or saying this. Oh, it's too late now, D-Bud. No, no, no. We're, like, feeling good. But for quarterbacks, I feel like the ops right now. For quarterbacks, if you ever see a corner out here, right,

with this type of energy, pre-snap, let it rot. Whoa. Pre-pause it. State season. He ain't in man coverage. All right? That ain't, that ain't, that ain't, you ain't, look. He ain't in man coverage.

You're doing all this and that. Look, he's going to be most likely in cover two. All right? So, whatever the safety very confident very relaxed he's a confident player he's all that but in man coverage you know you kind of like locked in it's like a one-on-one fight like all right i need to split i need this what am i getting released what's going to be the concept but if i have a flat route some some young corners especially what kind i'm not saying it's about sauce but just corners in general you have cover two some guys you'll think about it as kind of a down off. It's kind of like a, all right, you know, all right, let me get out here.

But if you see your cat out there doing that, that's a telltale sign. That lets me further know. So when I was watching this game, I already knew, all right, he's not going to be a man. What are they running? But he rose up, and there is some disguise here, guys moving around. But as the snap goes, it's going to be split safety. It's going to be covered too.

And this is second and 17. Second and long. Second and 17. It feels like there's a lot of dudes up here on the second and 17. That's just Salah? Second and long. Yeah, he's showing pressure just to maybe create some type of confusion to help your four-man rush. But it's going to end up being a four-man rush.

Everybody's going to get out. And as that underneath defender once again, you just got to continue sinking. You see this cover to a corner, continue to sink. And Josh Allen, once again, I don't know if he doesn't see him. Gabe Davis takes an outside release and then runs an out-breaking route. I don't see that much, especially against cover two. Usually that's conferring to a fade. But once again, Josh Allen throws the ball right to sauce.

And now you got the ball in the offense. Zach Wilson in the offense is going to line up at the 19, 20-yard line. And what point in the game was this? This was third quarter, five and a half left in the game. So another huge turnover. Obviously, Josh Allen, he makes plays that only Josh Allen can make, you know, with his legs, with his arms sometimes. But these are the plays, obviously, that he has to eliminate.

Yeah, because he thought Gabe was going in, right? I mean, is that one of those – they talked about choice routes they have. Is this something Gabe decided to break it out because he felt sauce inside? Normally he'd be outside leveraging cover too. Yeah, honestly, this is a head-scratcher to me because you don't – usually if you've got a rolled-up corner, these receivers just convert these to fades you know what i mean if they do run a seven route then they it's almost

like a must inside release you're saying this way as yeah just a straight fade you know you you hear it a lot oh the whole shot the honey hole shot but like to run a seven route here with a with a flat defender right underneath yes that's maybe that's something that that offense does i'm not sure but um regardless of what route he was running you can't throw that's underneath. Maybe that's something that that offense does. I'm not sure. But regardless of what route he was running, you can't throw this. That's not on you. Sauce doesn't care. At all. He's doing his job.

Second and long, I'm getting a reroute. I'm getting depth. And, you know, I got vision on the quarterback as an underneath flat defender. But quarterbacks obviously got to see him. It's second and 17. So right now he alerts. He's making whatever protection calls because you do have a double mug look. So maybe they just completely fooled him on the coverage.

But he looks at him literally from the snap and still throws his ball. So I don't – I mean, this is a head scratcher here. But – You said Josh, though, is known to give a couple away. I didn't know that. He is. He will take some shots. Even the Packers game.

That Packers game, that's why they covered, really. Because that game should have been a blowout, I think. But it was some plays like, you know, just throwing it back, crossing. Because when you are that talented, same thing with Luck. Luck will do the same thing. When you are that talented and you can make those type of throws, you're going to give some away. But these, if a corner makes a great play,

if a safe makes a great play, that's one thing. But these type of picks, obviously you've got to eliminate those. And this can't, you know. The referee's not on your team. You've got to be a fucking athlete. You've got to be an athlete. Dude, look at this cell though. Good bump.

That's a flat back. That's a full flat back. Look at him right there like, ah, fuck. Curtis Samuel is fancy. I will say, if you're going to fall on your back, I will say, if you're going to fall on your back, that is how you get as wide as possible to heat up as much as the collision with the ground as you possibly can. Good bump.

Yeah, that's why. Pump that chin, too. Boom. Yeah, tuck your chin, too. You don't want to get the old. Did you see Humphrey? We talked about this yesterday. Yeah.

Marlon Humphrey against Olave. Olave? Olave? Olave. Olave on Monday night. One-on-one in the corner or whatever. Marlon bats it away. Good play.

Yeah. He falls in end zone. His head. Bam. Off. He hopped right up. Yeah. Flex did the whole thing.

Impressive. Led us to a full conversation of like, I've seen somebody do that and be locked up. And then he's able to do it. It's like, is that the next step of the whole concussion thing? Like trying to figure out literally who's in the most. That was Tursh too, right? Yeah. Right up.

Some people got those AJ Hawk noggins. A lot of swiping up out of there. But that was a good play by him too. Good play on the fade. Got his eyes back. Marlon Humphrey had a hell of a game. Had lot of swiping up out of there. But that was a good play by him, too. Good play on the fade. Got his eyes back. Marlon Humphrey had a hell of a game. Had a sack. Dope.

Good play. But that's this week's Everything DB. Be a fucking athlete. Hey, we appreciate you. Appreciate you, fellas. Well, great work on Everything DB. Also, the Man to Man podcast every Monday and Thursday. Tomorrow's episode will be live from the Fendal Thunderdome

alongside Antoine Bethea, another absolute superstar, defensive secondary player who I got to be teammates with who is a legend. I got to ask him about that 62-7 game too. Was he out there or was he hurt? I assume he wasn't playing at that stage of that game. I'm going to ask him. That year was a tough year. That was a tough year.

I'm telling you, look here. This is pretty easy. He got everybody like that, though. Everybody. Patriots, my rookie year, maybe. We went down there to the Super and they had Devery Henderson.

What were you fucking doing out there then, D? What were you doing? That's just a well-oiled machine. We were running to Tampa, too, at the time. So I guess that is, I guess, like, I guess that is the beater of it all. But it seemed to be pretty simple, though. Drew Brees. I don't want to minimize what Drew Brees accomplished on that night

because I think he helped break a lot of records for himself that year. Sure. But it did appear as if he had any protection at all. And just, and then. Who was the middle linebacker? Not getting enough depth. Yeah, because I think you got to turn and sprint, right? You're covering that?

No, it's the hook droppers that are, they got to get, they have to like reroute by positioning or reroute at five and then sink and then roll back inside. Jimmy Graham was unstoppable there. Well, yeah. Big target. Big target. Came from Peyton.

I mean, Peyton gave Brady that seam route that they did with Gronk. Oh, the pull of the guard. Yeah. Pull of the guard. It's play action. Pull of the guard. Linebackers have to come because it looks like a run. Seam to the tight end.

Gronk scored 100 touchdowns because Peyton Manning told Tom Brady what they do with Dallas Clark. Bingo. Peyton Manning created an Brady what they do at Dallas Clark. Bingo. Did Peyton Manning create an RPO? Ooh. Nah. Let's give him credit, yeah. Hell yeah, as an Indianapolis Colt.

The Indianapolis Colts, you know, have given to football as much as they possibly could. You're welcome for the RPO. Yeah, but if Peyton had invented the RPO, he would have won more than one Super Bowl. Well, the thing about it was he couldn't do the part that really was needed. And that was the run part. That was just the elementary level.

That was the beginning level. Nonetheless, thank you so much, DB. Thank you, AJ. Thank you to the Toxic Table. Hammer will be in 13 minutes. 13 minutes at 3.55 Eastern Standard Time. Everybody in the back, great work. Michael Rubin, thank you for your time. Dan Orlovsky,

thank you for the time. To my incredible wife, I can't wait to come see you. I'm happy we got to announce that we are pregnant. And I'm scared to death to be a parent, but my wife is going to be an incredible mom, so that's all that matters. I appreciate you all so much. We'll see you tomorrow. We've got football to talk about. Falcons,

Panthers, and an NFC South rivalry that is going to get the juices flowing. We'll see you in about 20 hours. Thank you so much, AJ. You're the best. Cheers, everybody.