The Personal Finance Podcast - How to Create Your Dream Life With Jamila Souffrant

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Starting point is 00:00:56 Find your advisor at IG Private Wealth.com. On this episode of the Personal Finance Podcast, we're going to talk to Jamila Sufant about how to design your intentional life and pursue what you really want. What's up, everybody, and welcome to the Personal Finance Podcast. I'm your host, Andrew founder of MasterMoney.com. And today on the Personal Finance Podcast, we're going to be talking to Jamila about how to craft your dream life. If you have any questions, hit me up on Instagram or TikTok at Master Money. co and follow us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or whatever podcast player, you love listening to this podcast. If you want to help out the show, leave a five-star rating and review on Apple Podcasts.

Starting point is 00:01:58 So today, I am really excited to talk to Jamila because we're going to be talking about how to craft your dream life. And Jamila has an amazing podcast called Journey to Launch. And Journey to Launch has been around for some time where she talks about financial independence and how to build wealth for you and your family. In addition, she has some great episodes on side hustles and other things. things as well. And today, we're going to be talking through how to actually craft out your dream life, meaning how do you think through what I want out of life? And then how do you build out the

Starting point is 00:02:25 financial plan to get there? So this is going to be a really exciting episode. I'm so incredibly excited for you guys to listen to this one. And without further ado, let's welcome Jamila to the Personal Finance Podcast. So Jamila, welcome to the Personal Finance Podcast. Hi, Andrew. Thanks for having me. So you have this incredible podcast episode. on Journey to Launch that I really want to go through because it was so thought-provoking to me and it was one that I really had to think through exactly what I wanted.

Starting point is 00:02:53 When I listened to it, it really was kind of like a lightball moment for me. And it's called how to design your intentional life and pursue what you really want. And I love this because you can really get clear on exactly what you want and then you can start to build your financial foundation from there. But first, getting clear with what you really want

Starting point is 00:03:09 is extremely important. But before we dive into that, I want to get into some of your backstory in how you started to craft the life that you wanted it as well. You know, Andrew, like, we could take it far, far back from when I was a wee little, I was going to say lad, but, you know, girl, but I feel like I've always had this desire to live life on my own terms. And I know people say that, but I was definitely a rambunctious, outspoken child. And I always envisioned just having a life of freedom. But then as I got into the real world, so I started working pretty young at 14.

Starting point is 00:03:42 My mom came here at 20 years old. She was a single mom. We were born in Jamaica, so she actually had to leave me behind in Jamaica while she established herself. And so coming here with really nothing and having to establish ourselves from the start, I really saw what money could do and the lack of money, what that did. And I started to grow up. And luckily, my mom was very intentional about how she raised me, which helped drive, even though I was not wild in terms of like the way I asked.

Starting point is 00:04:12 but wild with my mind. Like I wanted to achieve so much, she helped nurture that. And so that eventually led me to getting my first job at 14, realizing about saving and how important that was, which then brought me into the real world with a real job. And even at the first day when I started full time, I said, I'm not doing this forever. I cannot sit in this cubicle. Like, there must be more to life. And I had that spark, but bills, I bought my first house at, well, condo at 22. You know, I was wondering, how will I not work if I have all these bills to pay? And so I kind of resigned my life to, well, everyone else is working until retirement age. Maybe that's just what I should do. I have a great job. I'll just do that. And I started side hustles while I was working full time, but they never panned out.

Starting point is 00:04:57 And I really just didn't know what to do. So again, I was like, I'll just work full time and make more money. And it wasn't until I was pregnant with my first child in a very long commuting from Brooklyn to New Jersey. It was about an hour and a half when I first started it. But now it's pregnant. And sometimes it could be two hours one way. And it was a nightmarish commute one day and pregnant, really heavily pregnant. I think I was like either seven or eight months pregnant with my first. And I said, no, like I cannot do this.

Starting point is 00:05:24 I want more children. I want to do more things with my life. Like, it cannot be in this car and in this cubicle for the rest of my life. And it was there that what I had pressed down or buried within me started to come back up and started to Google. So it got to work the next day, started to Google. How do I quit my job? All these things I actually didn't know what it meant. Like, how do I retire early?

Starting point is 00:05:45 And stumbled upon the blogs and podcasts that were available at the time, talking about the fire movement, financial independence, retire early. And I started listening and devouring them. I'd becoming obsessed with reading and listening to the podcast on my commute, saw that everyday average people were able to turn their income into actual wealth. It may not have been as quick as I wanted it to be, like not a next year thing. but I was like, okay, I could give myself 10 years and I could be free from this cubicle life. And so that's what I did. I set myself up and I was married at this point. I believe, again,

Starting point is 00:06:17 pregnant, but had my first child as I was looking at all these podcasts and blogs and set a plan for us to reach financial independence and to be able to quit my job by the time I was 40 years old. That was when I was 33. And since then, I've just been really intentional about what my life looks like, since I have such limited time with now having three kids. So yes, it's like jump forward. I have three kids now. And I just designed my life to a space where I was able to quit my job, run my business now full time.

Starting point is 00:06:46 So I have my own podcast and company. And it all really came from this passion and this thing within me that almost died, but that didn't. That really called me to find more for myself and to want more. And that's how I kind of just started to the path to where I am now. That is absolutely incredible. And it's amazing how much kids can kind of have that lightbulb moment for you as well. It's one of those incredible things that just kind of happens once you have kids. And I think that's what a lot of people are searching for. They're trying to search for what they want. They don't want to be in the cubicle all the time,

Starting point is 00:07:19 but they want to figure out what they want in life. And a lot of people want freedom, just like you've achieved, being able to have a flexible schedule and do what you want day to day because you have this successful podcasting company. And I think that is one of the things that a lot of people are looking for. But if someone's not clear on exactly what they truly want, how can someone go through the process of maybe becoming clear on what they want or start designing the life that they want? I think designing a life is one of those things that a lot of people don't fully understand. And I think your episode kind of opens that up completely to this. So how can someone start designing the life they want by first kind of thinking through exactly what they want? So you have to be honest with yourself because sometimes we just resign ourselves to the status quo or.

Starting point is 00:08:01 or what everyone else around us is doing and we think that we are okay. And it does take like a moment where our back is against the wall or for my instance, it was being pregnant. And I could no longer ignore it that I needed it and wanted more. So that may happen for people where it is like an instant or a moment that you have to come to terms with. Or it may be a slow burn, like a death by a million paper cuts that, you know, you finally wake up and say enough is enough. But to be honest with looking at where you are in your life right now and are you truly happy.

Starting point is 00:08:30 And that can be hard when we have so much messaging since we were born about what we should be doing. Like, you know, where we should be living and we have family and our cultures and all these outside influences in the media and multi-billion dollar companies who have studied how to market to us to infiltrate the way we think. And so it's really hard to get to that sense of who you really are and what you really want. And so that first step is always going to be, well, there's a few of them, but the first one is to think back, on what motivated you or what made you happy as a child or growing up before the adults in your life started to tell you no. So that's one. And for instance, for me, like I said before, I was always very questioned authority. I thought I was going to be a reader. Well, not a reader, but I was a heavy reader and I thought I was going to be a writer. And I used my voice a lot. But of course,

Starting point is 00:09:23 like going through school, all those things are not necessarily always promoted or encouraged, right? They want you to stay in line. And when I started to think about what I wanted in my life, I just wanted the freedom to speak and to be me, which is not ironic now that I'm able to do that with my own podcast. So it took a while, though, to get there. So just because I had that realization as I was going through the process, I had to make the steps to make it true. But I think thinking back to what you enjoyed or what made you happy as, you know, a child or growing up in your teens when you thought the world, like was your oyster? And it still is, by the way, is a great first step.

Starting point is 00:09:57 And the other thing is to practice, you know, whatever it is that you believe in, whatever higher power, and if that is God, is to get back within yourself. So whether that's meditating, praying, time alone, so you can get rid of the outside voices will help you start to believe or to understand what it is inside of you that you need to let out. I love that. And I think it's one of those things where as you start to craft this a little bit, maybe you start to put pen to paper and start to kind of work through some of these ideas. So is that something you recommend is kind of writing down some of these ideas?

Starting point is 00:10:29 And if you do start writing this down, how specific should you be? So I listened, I remember a while ago to Tim Ferriss podcast episode with Debbie Millman, and she had this great exercise where she talked about her students. She is in the design world and is a podcaster also. And she talked about she made her students design their dream day in their dream life 10 years later. And it wasn't just like, oh, I live here and I do this. It was talk about how it feels, where you wake up, how the sheets feel, the weather, like the details of your life 10 years from now, just one day and what you do all day.

Starting point is 00:11:06 And I thought that was powerful because that really gets you to hone in on what you want your life to look like, right? If it involves work, what is your work, what does your family look like? So being specific is very important. But I think having flexibility in what your dream life looks like is key also. Because as we all know, like your mind can change. Your preferences change. What you think you want changes too.

Starting point is 00:11:31 But you do need, I think, a starting point, a North Star to aim towards. And so getting specific about that dream life is important. And then, of course, so that's like the way my magical side thinks. Like what is that? Like pie in the sky, nothing can stop me life I want. And then, okay, practical, what is it that I want? What should I be doing to get there? Which I think a lot of people get hung up on because how do you get from A to Z when there's so many

Starting point is 00:11:54 letters in between, right? But if you can at least get the end point and then know your beginning point, you can start to plot out what you need to do to get to that Z point. And I did that same thing very early on. I kind of did my ideal day. What were my ideal day being? It might have been the same podcast that I listened to where I learned that from. But walking through that ideal day, a lot of times what you'll realize is that it's not as hard to get there as it may seem. It may take a long time. And there may be a lot of steps to get there. But sometimes a majority of people's ideal day, is just kind of doing what they want throughout their day, having that freedom. And getting to that point, there's a couple things that you can do, but it's sort of taking the right financial steps to

Starting point is 00:12:32 get there. So I love that idea. It's not always like some grand idea of, you know, spending your time on a yacht, sipping champagne or anything like that. A lot of times our ideal day is, you know, spending more time with our family and doing some of those things and having flexibility with our schedule. So that is one really cool thing as well. If someone's dreaming through this, maybe they're going through the process, writing this down, how big should they actually dream? And then you said, you know, maybe we should get more practical as time goes on here. But how big should they start? Should they start with their just perfectly ideal life? Or should you go to the point where it's maybe your bare bones minimum, you at least have that freedom and then kind of work out

Starting point is 00:13:06 up from there? So I've been, I'm actually writing my first book and I'm at the chapter now when I am talking about goal setting and crafting your dream life. So this is perfect for me to practice my talking points. So I think you need to have your financial goals, like the practice. And goals that we should do, like pay off debt, invest, save all that. And then we should have our life goals, which should be more fun, not attached to numbers, even though numbers, like, you need the money to make it happen. And so I think if you start with a list like that, you can get all the practical, what you should be doing out the way, right? Like, I should pay off this debt. I should invest. I should have this much net worth, right, if you're doing the practical. But then when you

Starting point is 00:13:48 look at your life goals, I think you should go as big as your heart desires. And, you know, not everyone wants a yacht, not everyone wants the private jet. So, you know, surprisingly, that's not going to be on everyone's list, which is not surprising. I think just go to what you want. And the other thing I've been exploring is this concept of minimums where what is the minimum life or goal that you can set for yourself that if you attain it, you're not necessarily compromising, but it's a life well lived. It's something that you'll love. And that way, when you reach that minimum goal, even if you're striving for more, you win. So you win if you reach the minimum goal. You win if you reach the maximum goal. So in short, I think the answer is dream big,

Starting point is 00:14:29 but also have like a minimum point where you'd be happy regardless of what happens and then that way you can't lose. I love that minimum point thing because I think that's one of the things where you can at least get to that point and you'll at least, you know, like you said, have that dream achieved and then you can go farther if you want to, but at least you have that set so you can have that freedom and have that time there as well. And one thing to note that you mentioned earlier is that this plan can definitely change. It's an evolving plan over time. I think one of the things for me that my plan changed significantly is when I had kids, where at the beginning I thought I wanted to live this bare bones minimum financial independence life. And then I realized once I had kids, no, I actually do want more.

Starting point is 00:15:06 I want more for my family. I want to build that generational wealth. So for me, my plan started to change and they evolve every single year. So I go back to those goals. I look at those goals and see how they're evolving and what I really truly want to do. And as we grow, I think that's part of growth, just understanding that things can change. So how have you seen your plan evolve? over time. Yeah, well, same thing. When I first found out about financial independence, I think what happens to is that a lot of the early movers and people who caught steam were frugal, right? Like the Mr. Money Mustache and all the other kind of bloggers, what that I started to follow, practice frugality. And I remember listening to episodes on podcasts where the person was only spending like $20,000 a

Starting point is 00:15:44 year, dumpster diving, which are all things I think are important to just understand, like, and know that that's a lever you can pull to reach your goals. And so I thought to myself, and here's, I think, the interesting thing, I think if you are in a position where you are trying to get out of something quickly, so whether that's a job or debt and all these things, most likely you will think that, all right, the way to do that is to cut back and to save and invest aggressively, which is fine. And that's kind of how I felt I did not like my commute. Like, it felt imminent that I had to get out of it. So I thought, okay, I'm going to use my income and I had a great income at that time living in New York City to save and invest most of it. and we had a plan my husband and I. I mean, I came home, I told him, I was like, what if we could invest and save half our income?

Starting point is 00:16:28 And then in seven years at the time, I'll be able to quit my job and we could figure out what our life looks like after that. And I thought, you know, that that could be sustainable, but it wasn't because then I started to have more kids. I realized that it's not just about what I want, right? Like my husband, he's an equal say in the household and what he wants in his life. And I want him to be happy. and I want certain things out of life. And so just being realistic with the fact that, you know, it's okay to want luxury items.

Starting point is 00:16:57 It's okay that my husband may want a nicer car one day or we want to stay in New York. We actually don't want right now to leave with our family here because that's important with small kids to have this environment for them. Then we're going to have to make concessions. And if it takes longer for me and us to reach our financial goals because we're spending more in the now, that's okay. Because I rather enjoy the journey

Starting point is 00:17:19 and have a more balanced approach than trying to fit my life in someone else's idea of what financial independence looks like. I absolutely love that. And I think lifestyle design, a big part of that is where you live, are you around family, all those types of things. It doesn't matter if the cost of living is higher if you're around the people that you want to be around and that you're happier that way. And that's a lot of people try to design their lifestyle like in the tax-efficient ways and things like that. But the way you're doing it and the way I would do too is, wherever my family is, I want my family to be around my kids and all those things. So whatever brings you that joy and that happiness is one of the most truly important things.

Starting point is 00:17:50 And that's what money is there to do. It's to help bring that joy and that happiness to you so you can do things that you actually value, which I think is absolutely incredible. So one person that you actually talk about in that episode is George Kinder and his three questions. And these questions actually craft what you want out of life first. And then you go to the financial plan afterwards, which I think is the reverse of what a lot of financial planners and people do.

Starting point is 00:18:12 So I love this idea of actually doing that. So what are those three questions and why are these important? Right. So there are three questions that you ask. And as you go down the line, they kind of get a little bit more bleak. But the first question is, imagine you are financially secure and you have enough money to take care of all your needs now and in the future. How would you live your life? And would you change anything?

Starting point is 00:18:31 And so this is where you just really be honest with yourself. Don't hold back. Like you have enough money to do what you want. What does your life look like when your life is completely yours to live the life you want? So that's the first question. Then the second question, now that's where we get to the point where, okay, we are going to the doctor and they tell you you only have five to ten years left to live. You don't feel sick. So you're able to do things that you want to do, but you don't know the moment of your death. What would you do in that remaining time? And how will your life change knowing that? Like, what would you do differently? And then the third question is go to the doctor and they say, you have only 24 hours to live. And what happens? Like, how do you feel if they say that? What did you miss? What did you not do?

Starting point is 00:19:17 What did you hold back on? So those are the three questions that helped, like, really with a sense of time, right? Because time is our biggest asset, honestly. Money is important, but time in our energy is really what is non-renewable. So with those constraints, what does your life look like? I love that. And I think it's one of those things that kind of actually, it just makes you think deeper in terms of what your financial plan is and how you want to think through life and what you really want out of life.

Starting point is 00:19:43 because like you said, time is the most important asset that we'll have. I think that's why we pursue financial independence is to have more freedom with that time, to have more time, to do the things that we love. And so they get through these questions. I encourage anybody who's just starting on this journey to kind of think through those because I think they're something that can really open up exactly what you want to do with your money. And speaking of money, we're going to start to go towards money and what we need to do with our dollars once we have this life designed. So as we go through this process, and once someone's kind of crafted out their ideal life or where they want to start. They know the end goal and they have their starting point. How do we implement a

Starting point is 00:20:17 financial plan to get there? So what is the first thing someone can do to become intentional with their money so that they can achieve their dream life? So you first need to know where you are. So an assessment of your starting point. And we all have different starting points, different privileges, different assets that we can use to help us go further. But the way I thought about financial independence and what helped me and many of like the people who listen to what I talk about is let's break that down because coming in, especially for a first-time person hearing about this or even just if they're not at the level in terms of income, what they want to be, right? Hearing that you need million, two million, whatever that final number is where you reach

Starting point is 00:20:55 financial independence, like from the technical definition, can be very overwhelming. And so you have to break that down into manageable steps. So understanding how far you are from your goal when you set that goal of what you need to be financially independent is important. And I broke that down into stages, and the stages help you break down the journey to financial independence. So the first stage is helping you get financially stable. That is where you can pay your bills, pay your minimum debt payments without going further into debt. Second stage is how do you get debt-free, consumer debt-free, where your priority is paying off that consumer debt.

Starting point is 00:21:29 Third stage is how do you get financially secure? So this is where you're building assets. You don't have consumer debt. You may have a mortgage or student loan debt, but you're working on building up your assets so that you can hit that portfolio number that you're desiring to hit. Fourth stage is being work flexible, which is the stage I'm in now, where I don't have all the money I'll ever need again. I still do need to invest and save to reach my financial goals, but I can take extended time off. I can say no to certain opportunities. That's why I was able

Starting point is 00:21:58 to quit my job and do what I'm doing full time. It really opens up another world for you when you get to this level, and I do think everyone can actually get to this level. And then the next level is the financial independence. You never have to work again, ever. And so deciding and figuring out where you are along those stages are important because depending on where you are, will determine, you know, like how you invest or how much you invest versus pay off debt versus spend more in the now, right?

Starting point is 00:22:25 Because I'm all about enjoying your life versus delaying gratification. I love that you added that work flexible stage because I don't think a lot of people talk about that. And I think one of the coolest things about being work flexible is it almost feels like slightly financial independence because you're doing kind of the things maybe that you love or you're spending less time working day to day. You're not doing the full on nine to five grind every single day. Although sometimes when you work for yourself, maybe you work more hours. It just depends how you are. But I think that part and that getting to that point is so much more freeing than just

Starting point is 00:22:54 having that nine to five. So I absolutely love that you add that part in because I haven't heard a lot of people talk about that. So that is one of the cooler points to actually add in there as well. So lately, I've been noticing how fast things are changing at home. The kids are growing like crazy. Clothes don't fit anymore and routines are changing. And it just hits you. Life is expanding. And when your life grows, your responsibility grows with it.

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Starting point is 00:26:17 How does someone figure out what their freedom number is? I mean, there's the kind of the back of the envelope, quick calculation that you can do. And it's known. But I always get people who say, well, there's all these things that can contest that. There's a better way to figure it out. Essentially, it's a 25 times rule. So it's multiplying your expenses, your annual expenses, by 25. And that number will generally give you how much you need in your investments.

Starting point is 00:26:44 So your retirement accounts, your taxable accounts, to be able to consider yourself financially independent because the money that that investment portfolio spurs off, and you can include passive income in that. So if you have real estate and you're getting income from that or something else that's passive, that money then takes care of your living expenses. And of course, there's more behind the number, but that's a quick way to figure it out. Exactly. So if you have, say, for example, you need $60,000 per year to live off. You need $1.5 million to actually be able to live that off that every single year. And it's also based on the 4% rule of the Trinity study. They both go, same thing,

Starting point is 00:27:22 different directions. So that is absolutely perfect. So when you started to do this, you had your number in place. You kind of knew which direction you and your husband wanted to go in. What was the first thing that you did financially? Financially, well, because I have a partner who's getting him on board, because I would not be able to do this by myself unless we completely just separated finances. And we don't operate like that. We combine everything. So luckily, he got on board because I showed him, like, okay, would you like to have, let's just say, $5 million at, you know, 55 and we're good. And our kids by then will hopefully all be like, you know, in college and doing their own thing. We could like live our lives. Or if we continue what we're doing right now until 55, we'll

Starting point is 00:28:00 only have this and you'll still have to work and also have to work. So that got him on board. So getting whoever it is with you on board is key. But then it took the assessment, right? So figuring out how much do we earn together and how much do we spend and where are the places, because we have to invest more to hit our goal. So where are the places in our budget that we can cut back? And so we saw places that we were just not paying attention to over spending. You know, we both in our 20s. We had nicer cars. He had a little. He had a little. lease payment and we said, okay, like, it's time to get rid of that and get more economical cars. We're just more intentional about eating out. And so for us, expenses were a place where we were able

Starting point is 00:28:42 to see a lot of benefit when cutting back, but we also didn't like cut back bare bones. And then because our income was together combined really healthy, that was good. I always like to say that because in the first two years that we started this journey, we were able to save and invest, $169,000 across our retirement accounts and taxable accounts. And the reason we were able to do that is because my husband, he's a teacher. And this is one of the things I learned really early on listening to all those podcast episodes is that teachers actually can qualify for two pre-tax retirement accounts. So they're 4-3B and then the state retirement account. And so we're able to put like double the maximum limit into his retirement account and then I was able to max out my retirement account.

Starting point is 00:29:24 And again, our income allowed for us to do that. But it was saving and investing were the priority. we set our saving and investing goal and then everything else had to fit in there. So yeah, we could still go out, but it was after we took care of our major goals. And I want everybody kind of notice what they did here because what they did was they prioritized their saving and investing first. They paid themselves first. Then all their other goals kind of fell into place. And when you started to cut back your spending during that time, did you feel deprived at all? No, honestly, not really. And this is what some people don't believe that. And I know it will be harder for some people. So I do want to, acknowledge that depending on your starting point, and if you're not earning a lot of money, that you may not see it so quickly. But a lot of people, just being aware and looking at your budget or creating a budget can take you so far because you'll realize, like, I'm actually overspending on things I don't care about. Or it's not that I can't go out to eat, but maybe not every day, right?

Starting point is 00:30:21 Like, it's like, I'll go out two times instead of five days a week. It's really about being intentional and doing that allowed us to get really far with our money. Exactly. And that intentionality is the biggest thing, because it's spending on the things that you truly value and then cutting out everything else that you don't. And I think once you do that, it's so freeing because you can see how much less that you're actually spending every single month so that you can focus more time on growing that income. And speaking of the income side of the equation, you have a bunch of great content on side hustles as well. And I think income is one of the biggest things in personal finance in terms of reducing the problems that you have with your money. And as you increase your income,

Starting point is 00:30:56 what you can do, as long as you understand how to keep the majority of that income, then you can really start to accelerate your path to wealth. So you have some amazing stuff on side hustle. So what are some of your favorite side hustles to accelerate your path to freedom if you're going through this process? So side hustling, really there's different levels to it, right? Like there's like the quick and easy, I'm going to sell something on Facebook marketplace or like it's not a necessarily reoccurring thing you do. It's just like I'm going to use this as a goal to pay off a debt. Or there's that kind of gig economy, like you're going to go drive for Uber or do something where you pick up a shift at a restaurant as a waitress. That could be a side hustle.

Starting point is 00:31:39 Then there are the other things where you're doing a side hustle based on your actual, your career itself. So if you're a teacher, right, I always say like teachers have the ability to make so much money because not only can you relay content and and create lesson plans that all of us business owners, you know, if you're not a teacher, it can be a little bit harder to grasp. But anytime I see a teacher who comes into the space, they do so well because they're able to teach content is that you can create lesson plans for other teachers. You can, you know, what's your hobby where you can then transition that into being able to like teach that subject? But teaching is just like one side of it, right?

Starting point is 00:32:14 And then there are the things where it's a hobby and I'm not saying all hobbies need to turn into a side hustle, but it's something that you're good at, that you enjoy doing that people would pay you for. So whether that's you're good at doing hair or you can draw, something where it's like your friends talk to you about it, ask you questions, or get your, ask for you for your advice. Like that is potential for a side hustle. Exactly. It's kind of the intersection of your skills and some of your passions as well. And if you could find that intersection, then it really is something where it's very easy for that side hustle to come naturally for you, especially if you have to work outside of your 9 to 5, which is really cool. So obviously, you talked a little bit

Starting point is 00:32:51 about some of the investments that you did early on when you started to invest, but we have to invest our money to get to financial freedom. If we don't, we're never going to be able to actually get to financial independence. Are there any other ways that you like to invest your money, or are you still doing the same system that you were doing when you first started? Well, so I was really into real estate or I thought I would make my millions being a real estate investor. My career and background is in real estate. I have my master's in real estate. So I really do have a love for real estate. And I did buy my condo at 22. And my husband and I also purchased a condo together, but sold that. And I thought that would be the method that I would choose until the place that we sold,

Starting point is 00:33:30 like I had a tenant that just annoyed me. And I was like, I'm not doing that. I don't think this is the way to go. And so with more of my responsibilities of being like a mother, having more kids, and just my personality, I realized I needed a lazy, just kind of, not quick, but lazy, slow and steady way to build wealth. And that was just investing in index funds. Like I thought it was like a no-brainer once I learned about index funds. So I don't want to go pick stocks. I don't want to trade actively. I just want to like put my money into the market, bet on the entire market.

Starting point is 00:34:02 So low-cost index funds, not pay a lot to do that, not have to pay anyone to tell me how to do that. and just write it out as a long-term investor. So that's primarily how we invest our money actively, like on an ongoing basis. And then, you know, we were lucky enough to then bought our home in New York City and then I still own my condo. So that does help to create, you know, a portion of our net worth when we look at our full portfolio. And you and I are totally aligned on that as well. It's the passive side of index funds are just absolutely amazing.

Starting point is 00:34:31 There's nothing like it in terms of being able to just have that buying the entire market and just kind of letting it chill or index and chill. essentially is what I love to call it. So that's absolutely amazing. So I want to shift gears to a couple of questions that we ask a lot of our guests. And the interesting thing about these questions is that we get different answers for a lot of them. So it's something that we love to do. So the first one is what part of your work or your life make you come alive? What makes me come alive in my life, I have to say my life, is actually choosing my schedule or saying no to things. Like I can't imagine I've been approached since I quit my job a couple of times to join a company or to work for someone else.

Starting point is 00:35:10 And the thought of having to be somewhere, like someone telling me to be somewhere, I just can't. I can't do it. And so I love the fact that I can like wake up, drop my kids to school and then go for a run. And like I can have an interview with you. And then after that I could take one of them to basketball. Like that's the point. And it's interesting because we've been talking about financial independence and creating a dream life. And I think a lot of times we have the opportunity to have the dream life now.

Starting point is 00:35:36 It may not be everything, right? Like my dream life would involve me being able to live on an island half the year. That's not possible just yet. But I feel like there's a lot of things that I wished I could do when I first started that I'm doing now, that I have now. And so for me, is that flexibility with my schedule that I can choose literally what I do? And of course, I still have to be responsible. I still earn money with Journey Salon. So I show up and I put out podcast episodes, but there's nothing like it.

Starting point is 00:36:02 Absolutely. That's absolutely incredible just having that flexibility and that freedom is one of the best things that's out there. So the second one is what is the best advice about money that you ever received? The best advice about money. I think it's the feeling about money that I have that I know the world runs on it, but it's like made up. Like these concepts and some of the things that we're talking about, I think I know it can seem complicated, especially if you're just starting. but you don't have to be that smart and you don't even have to be born into it. I know it helps. But I just think that we have access, like there's so much money in the world.

Starting point is 00:36:41 The Federal Reserve can print how much? Like, it's out there. It's just figuring out a way in which you can use your talent, your skill to get more of it to fuel the life that you want. So it's more about realizing that while money is important, it's literally made up. And if it's made up, It's a game that we can figure out how to win at.

Starting point is 00:37:01 I love that because it's the abundance philosophy because you're right. There's money everywhere. It's just figuring out ways to get it. And then once you start to build up those skills, because it really is a skill acquiring money, once you have those skills in place, it becomes a little easier and a little easier as time goes on. And the last one is by far my favorite one. And we want to do an episode where we kind of compile all these together one day because I think some of these answers have been incredible. So what does wealth mean to you?

Starting point is 00:37:24 wealth to me is the idea that I'm secure no matter how much money is in flowing or that I have in a bank account. It's the idea that I can't, Jay-Z, is it Jay-Z? One of the rappers, I feel like I'm getting so old now because when I quote rappers, I'm like, what did he say? But one of the lines, I believe that Jay-Z said was, put me anywhere on God's green earth, I'll triple my worth. And I just feel like, you know, usually when they say people who are wealthy, they can lose it and be placed anywhere and be able to get the money back. And so I feel like wealth is more of a way you see the world. It's in relationships with people. It's knowing how to give and take and it's a dance. And so it's not necessarily about the dollars.

Starting point is 00:38:10 Like that comes with it. But it's about how you feel, how you present yourself, your confidence and how you are in the world. And I think with that, like a lot of us are more wealthy than we know. Absolutely. I love that answer. And the depth of it goes so deep that it's absolutely amazing. So, Jamila, where can everyone find out more about you, listen to your podcast? Tell us about everything that you have going on. Sure. So my podcast can be found anywhere you listen to this amazing podcast. It's called Journey to Launch. And I'm on social media at Journey to Launch on Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook. I usually hang out on Instagram and then Journey tolaunch.com to check out

Starting point is 00:38:45 everything that I'm up to. Absolutely. We will link everything down below in the show notes. So make sure that you go listen to Jamila's podcast because it is absolutely amazing and is one that was really thought provoking. But she has so many great ideas there as well. And some of her guests are absolutely amazing. So make sure you go listen to that podcast and we will link everything down below. And Jamila, thank you so much. This has been an incredible conversation. Thank you so much. Rosen lasagna, medium power. 15 minutes. Sounds like Ojo time. Let's play. Feel the fun with Playojo. The online casino with all the latest slot and live casino games. What you win is yours to keep with no

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The Personal Finance Podcast - How to Create Your Dream Life With Jamila Souffrant

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