The Pete Quiñones Show - Episode 1074: Marx, Sorel, Dialectics and Partisanship w/ John Slaughter and Aaron for Timeline Earth

Episode Date: July 2, 2024

83 MinutesPG-13John Slaughter is the proprietor of the Old South Repository Substack, and Aaron is one of the hosts of Timeline Earth.John and Aaron join Pete to discuss John's recent Substack article, "Marxism and the Modern Right: A Complex Legacy."Marxism and the Modern Right: A Complex LegacyJohn on TwitterTimeline Earth PodcastReflections on ViolencePete and Thomas777 'At the Movies'VIP Summit 3-Truth To Freedom - Autonomy w/ Richard GroveSupport Pete on His WebsitePete's PatreonPete's SubstackPete's SubscribestarPete's GUMROADPete's VenmoPete's Buy Me a CoffeePete on FacebookPete on Twitter

Where do you go for Ireland's biggest thrillers, craziest finishes, wildest upsets and fiercest post-match debates? Good afternoon to you. Hello there, you're very welcome to the programme. An awful lot of live sports on the way. Well, over a million of you go to Ireland's number one radio station. RTE Radio One. Listen now on RTE Radio Player. You catch them in the corner of your eye.

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regulated by the Central Bank of Ireland. Ready for huge savings? We'll mark your calendars from November 28 to 30th because the Liddle Newbridge Warehouse Sale is back. We're talking thousands of your favorite Liddle items all reduced to clear. From home essentials to seasonal must-habs, when the doors open, the deals go fast.

Come see for yourself. The Liddle New Bridge Warehouse Sale, 28th to 30th of November. Liddle, more to value. If you want to support the show and get the episodes Earl and ad-free, head on over to freeamambionthe-wall.com forward slash support. There's a few ways you can support me there.

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So I really appreciate all of the support everyone's giving me, and I hope to expand the show even more than it already has. Thank you so much. I want to welcome everyone back to the Picanuano show. Got a couple people here, one for the first time, but let's talk to Aaron, because Aaron's only been here 20, 30, 40 times. How you doing, Aaron? I'm doing great. Happy to be be co-hosting again. And for the first time, John Slaughter. Hey, John, how you doing? I'm doing great. I kick the wife and kids out of the house, so I should be able to do this

with no interruptions. Oh, that's amazing. Why don't you, since you've never been on this show before, why don't you give an introduction? Yeah, I'm John Slaughter. I run a substack called the Old South Repository where originally it started out as a history blog, but it just turned into a little bit of every. And so I've kind of turned into a jack of all trades as far as things go on this sphere of the internet Cool, cool. All right. So this is a subject that Aaron and I have talked about before

numerous times and you you wrote a substack and oh, or in McIntyre had you on your big he's becoming the star Yes, I'm becoming a full grown man soon So give us the premise. What were you talking about? What, where is your mind at? So, I mean, I've read most of the elite theorists, and I'd actually finished Oren's book. And when I was going through it, he cites Sam Francis a lot.

And I'm sure, as both of you know, Sam Francis uses a lot of Marxist rhetoric, right? You see him use proletariat, bourgeoisie, it means of production, et cetera. And as I was looking through it, it sort of dawned on me that there's this kind of through line in my mind that the managerial class functions in a very similar way as the bourgeoisie class did that Marx is writing about. And I kind of took it back to trying to get people on the right to understand that you can

kind of separate Marx's, his prescriptions from his diagnosis. And so I looked back at like what caused, like, what was going on with the Industrial Revolution that caused Marx to react and caused people to be so receptive to his ideas. So Aaron and I have read The Staten Revolution on the show by Lenin. I think we did that over five episodes. And Aaron and I had read it a couple times before we read it on the show. But the first book we ever read together was, Uncle Ted's manifesto. And it's interesting to see somebody's take on technology in the late 20th century,

someone who lived until just last year, and what he said it was doing to man, and especially what it was doing to man, what it was doing to him as a human being, what it was doing to his psyche, what it was doing to, I mean, he doesn't use the term soul, but really what is doing to his soul. And then you look back at what Marx was talking about. So, Aaron, what do you think when you hear what John is talking about? I think on everybody's progression, right words, no matter where they start off, they're always told that Marx is a bad word.

If you see that word, stay away. Marxism is intrinsically evil. It has nothing to offer. And you know, you just need to watch the daily wire. You just need to, you know, watch Rogan and start there. But as me and you kind of found out in parallel and then together, Marxism does have a framework to offer when you're trying to interpret what the hell is going on. Like how do I like, what is class?

What is our interaction with the means of production? All these words that you hear all the time, but aren't really allowed to look too deeply into if you're kind of new to the right. And I'm happy to have this conversation and spread the gospel. Well, what I think is, it's interesting that it is such, talking about him as such,

so dirty. You know, you don't want to be known as a Marxist. You don't want to be known as a socialist. I made it my entire bit. You did for a long time there. It was awesome. You don't want to be known as those things yet. When it comes down to it, especially if you listen to Thomas, talk about, you know, the early 20th century. I mean, he says, you know, basically the whole of the 20th century is just a dialogue with

Marxism. And I think that's hard to deny. And I think it's something that we have to, we have to embrace the fact that that's what we're dealing with and we're still dealing with it. Yeah. I mean, when you, it's really easy to look at the material world through the lens of dialectics. And it's extremely useful. It's not the only method you can, you can use to interpret reality. I, uh, when you, when you, when you, when you, when you, start getting into spirit that what your next stop on the right is getting into spiritual warfare and then that opens up a whole new interpretation but uh when you're looking at the material world it is very useful to kind of borrow what you can from from marxism in terms of dialectics you know

dialectic materialism historical materialism um it's like just like john said the prescriptions are not correct, but there's something to be said for the usefulness of the, of the interpretations. Well, John, you have anything to say about that as we have three Catholics here? Well, I mean, you know, we could probably get into like distributivism or something, but I wanted to say, I think one of the key elements in getting people to be receptive to this idea is helping them to understand exactly how we got to where we are. They don't understand how destruct or disruptive the industrial revolution was to human life, they don't get that. And I explain that in my piece that, you know, man goes from being able to provide from his labor to the selling of his labor.

And that is a massive change. And, you know, I sort of reference the point that all of these trades you have, right, it's not just working on the land. You know, you can be a candlemaker, a cobbler, you could be a blacksmith. All that is gone, almost in historical terms, overnight. And this disrupts everything. And people are forced into factories and, and, and, And, you know, and I make the point that when Marx is talking about, you know, people getting crushed in machines or kids getting crushed, like that's actually happening. And so, of course, people are receptive to that. And I think giving people that framework to understand, okay, well, this is what was happening to people. This is what it did.

And this is why his ideas are, are helpful to look at and understand, especially with, you know, you look at the comparison to AI, right? If AI can do what it, what they say it can do, you're going to be right back in the same position. as the people were, you know, at the turn of the century or at the, in 1900s. You know, if the product, if you, if the proletariat was alienated from the products of their labor by the bourgeoisie. And that was kind of the, the whole appeal of Marxism was that it told people that, you know, in plain terms, like you have no chance of ever owning the products of your labor. It's funny that you should mention AI because I don't think that I think we are currently

being alienated from the products of our creativity. Everything that we put out on the internet is scraped and repackaged and commodified. And AI is one of the vehicles of that. You're talking about data collection and everything like that? Oh, yeah. I mean, large language models, that's how they converse with you. It's just a collection of scrape data and then packaged in a neat parlor trick, and then you pay 20 bucks a month.

And it makes all of us obsolete in the end, right? Yeah. Yeah, well, it's funny because it can only parasitize true creativity. It can't create anything in and of itself. Where do you go for Ireland's savviest takes, liveliest events, biggest discoveries and favourite weekend rituals? Hello there, welcome to your very good afternoon. Hello there, you're very welcome to the programme.

Well, over a million of you go to Ireland's number one radio station, RTE Radio One. Listen now on RTE Radio Player. Ready for huge savings? We'll mark your calendars from November 28 to 30th because the Liddle Newbridge Warehouse sale is back. We're talking thousands of your favourite Liddle items all reduced to clear. From home essentials to seasonal must-habs,

when the doors open, the deals go fast. Come see for yourself. The Liddle Newbridge Warehouse Sale, 28th to 30th of November. Liddle, more to value. But, you know, it has to parasitize whatever it can, and you're going to see the internet, probably the fundamentals of the internet change to deal with that.

Yeah, it's, it can't create something that doesn't exist. so it's not a god no but can't innovate the problem is is can it gets to the point where it believes it's a god if you program it too

anybody got anything well I guess if you were going to look at Marx and even you know when you look at the early

20th century everyone was calling themselves a socialist you know, in Europe especially. You had people who were on the left, who on the historic left that were calling themselves socialist. You had people who you looked at and they were on the historic right,

and they were calling themselves socialist. So how do you, and Americans don't want to hear that. You know, try to explain to a libertarian or a narco-capitalist. how the national socialists in Germany, exactly how different they were than, say, a socialist in, you know, the USSR,

they don't want to hear it. It's just this word, this term, has become so... Interchangeable with status, bro. Yeah, it's become so defined as one thing in their mind. And then, you know, of course, the whole state thing, you know, where they, they see the state as the devil and anarchy or some kind of libertarian society is like Jesus. You know, but they're not willing to sacrifice. They're not willing to sacrifice for it, so they're never going to get it.

Yeah, pretty much. I mean, the line between the different factions of socialism is simplified down to international versus national. and national doesn't really exist anymore. Yeah, I was going to say, I think that the socialism being such a dirty word as a byproduct of the fact that, you know, Werner Sombart, who's a German economist, talks about how the U.S. did not have the same socialist revolutions, as you saw in Europe, largely due to the meritocracy, right? Because people actually believed, and they could in practice, move up the ladder. So they weren't as receptive to talk about class and these sorts of things, right?

And I think what you see is that that is effective at first, but because of that, you know, you roll into the Cold War and capitalism like becomes the new religion to fight against socialism. And Americans have that's born and bred into so many people now that it's almost like, it's almost a religious term in many ways because it's, it's heretical to even mention the fact that you would even want to put any forms of of restrictions on on free market capitalism at all or that you would want to look out for your own people in any capacity whatever that means because that automatically is some form of socialism at the end of the day yeah yeah i mean if the if the robber barons and captains

of industry you know your your rockefellers your Carnegie's, all those guys were just a little bit less evil. This could have all been avoided, you know? Like, it did, it costs them barely anything to just, you know, give your guys like a 10, uh, 10 hour day instead of a 14, you know, give your guys a six hour work week instead of a seven. Like this all could have been avoided. I say Henry Ford's like the only one that tried to.

Yeah. from what I remember to try to actually look out for his workers. But, you know, I had brought up when I talked with Oren, I said, you know, you can read, you know, George Fitzkews, Cannibals All, right? And he makes the argument back then that, you know, he's obviously making a pro-slavery argument, but his argument is that the slaves have a better life than the factory workers. And when you read it, you're like, I mean, back then, yeah, they kind of did. They had health care.

They had housing. They had a retirement program. I mean, they had food, I think, provided for at least. during the day when they were working, you know? Yeah, there was this intrinsic, this intrinsic attitude that, you know, if you manage a business or maybe you're a slave owner, that you have this obligation to a base level of stewardship to your workers or slaves. And I think that was the case more often than not, but you only ever hear about the worst

cases. Yeah, they always go to the large plantations where you could afford to be, you know, to treat slaves a certain type of way, but you can't afford to do that on a smaller, you know, you have four or five of them and you look how much they cost. I mean, it's, you know, people would get mad about this analogy, but you wouldn't just beat the crap out of your tractor, you know. Yeah. That's why I'm glad I'm on this show. I could say things like that. So, sorry about your demonetization, Pete. Oh, believe me, it's, I mean, YouTube hates me. You know, I was demonetized for one of our episodes on Uncle Ted, right?

Oh, yeah. We did that three years ago. Yeah, I have that pin somewhere. Yeah. So I guess the question becomes is how do you use this? How do you use it in real life? How does the right use it? How is a right who is not scared of, you know, being called, you know, being called the socialists or a Marxist by, you know, little homosexuals, you know, who, you know, think that they're just, the government's going to fall one day and then everyone's going to choose libertarianism or narco-capitalism.

how do you have a conversation about this especially i mean even within our with our sphere within our sphere you have people who they don't want to deal with this they would rather deal with monarchy in some way and just skip over the fact that i mean for basically the last 200 years this is the conversation i don't think there's a wrong i mean there's plenty of wrong answers but there's also plenty of choices. I mean, where do you start? You know, what really kind of calcified my worldview of how I interpret political economy nowadays

is Burnham's managerial revolution. That's how I kind of identify, you know, what the interaction between classes in 2024 and then I made a conscious decision to become it, become the managerial class. Where do you go for Ireland's biggest thrillers, craziest finishes, wildest upsets and fiercest post-match debates? Good afternoon to you.

Hello there, you're very welcome to the programme. An awful lot of live sport on the way. Well, over a million of you go to Ireland's number one radio station. RTE Radio One. Listen now on RTE Radio Player. Did you know those Black Friday deals everyone's talking about? They're right here at Beacon's South Quarter. designer sofa you've been wanting.

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Volkswagen Financial Services Ireland Limited, trading as Cooper Financial Services is regulated by the Central Bank of Ireland. You know, one thing that he points out in that book is he's looking at, you know, FDR's New Deal, but he's also looking at Hitler's Germany and he's looking at Stalin's Russian. He sees exactly the same thing. Yeah, I mean, it's the same as like socialism with Chinese characteristics is, you know, Maoism. Socialism with Russian characteristics was Bolshevism. each nation is going to undergo the revolutionary process for managerialism and impart kind of its own cultural flourishes into it. I mean, you see that, you can pick a country today and you can see that if it's not completely inundated with, you know, CIA coups. Well, even back in the 30s, in the 20s and 30s when fascism had movements in every European country, every European country, every European country. was approaching it in a different way.

You know, Mosley wasn't completely on, on the same page with Adolf and Mussolini was, you know, out in left field. The action fronce was, I mean, you can call them fascism, but there was a lot of left, I mean, hard leftism in there. So, yeah, I mean, it's. It really is like they needed to destroy nationalism because everyone would become very distinct from each other while choosing to exclude certain, you know, some countries may choose to exclude certain ethnic groups. And so that's why internationalism had to win. That's why, you know, the whole world basically went to war against two countries and volunteers from 11 others. I might be the optimist of the group because I think that I think the only way out is through. And I think that, you know, I wrote another essay previous to this about John Michael Greer's catabolic collapse theory.

And I really think what is explain that. So what John Michael Greer essentially is saying is that in any organization or in an empire, it will expand until it can no longer expand anymore. And once it reaches a certain point, instead of stopping, what it will do is it will eat itself, right? It will, on the fringes, it will use up its own material to keep going, right? It'll catabolize itself the same way your body would if it's starving, right? Starts eating its own fat reserves. and in that process, you know, the, the fringes will begin to be able to be independent. Kind of like, you know, as Rome is receding in power, barbarian tribes on the fringes realize like,

oh, we can raid these places now. No one's going to do anything. We can do whatever we want. And so I think that we're starting to see that because, in my opinion, that's what happened at the border, right? They didn't enforce anything because they couldn't. And so I think as that happened, happens more and more and we start to see the power of, you know, the gay or whatever we want to call it, recede.

Opportunities at the local level will become extremely important. And from there, you can sort of rebirth nationalism or localism by having the right people in the right positions and fostering. Because I think everybody on the right understands that hierarchy exists. That's partly why we're here to some degree. Well, class is just, it's tangential. It's right there with hierarchy, right? And if we understand that, we understand that these local positions by putting the type of people with that aristocratic thinking in those positions, they can maybe implement some of the prescriptions that we see that can put a limit on the exploitative nature of, you know, capitalism or whatever it might be. Yeah, that's one of the last reasonably correct phases that Marx put in historical materialism.

was that capital will eventually run out of markets and have to consume itself. And after that, he predicted a proletarian revolution, which we're not going to have. But that's kind of the last phase of historical materialism that seems reasonable and seems like a play on that. And I think Nick Land has similar views on, you know, when a system is in atrophy for so long it has no choice but to consume itself and leave room for other systems to rise. Yeah, it's something that back to Vernor Sombart, he actually, I think, coined the term late stage capitalism, if I believe so. Right. And you kind of see where in the end, Marx is probably going to be correct, but what Marx was wrong about and Sombard is correct,

as Sambart, you know, said that capitalism is so flexible and robust, it would adapt. And so I see the managerial elite as that adaptation that he predicted. But either way, in the end, it will, as you said, and maybe it's, maybe it's the Catholic in me. I just look at like the Tower of Babel. I'm like, you can't, you can only go so far. Yeah, that's, that's like the third level of, of being right wing is contextualizing things in terms of spiritual warfare. And I love it. So, um, and, and, and, and,

John's mentioned Sombard a couple times. Sombart's amazing. His book is, Why is there no capitalism in the United States? Great book. He also has a book that was used as a college text for a very long time called The Jews in Modern Capitalism. That is a history, the last thousand years,

of looking at how Jews basically created everything that we do in commerce. And he actually has the names of the historical. And, you know, the one thing about Sombard is he was not an anti-Semite. He was a phylo-Semite. He was well-known and beloved. And they loved his history so much that it was a Talmudic scholar that translated it out of German. Because he wanted, he wanted everybody to know, hey, look, this is what we did. But what I was going to say is that in some way, and I don't, you know, in the,

some way the answer to all of this is going to share and is going to have some semblance of socialism in that it's going to have to be a collective effort and if the only way out is through one person doing it is not going to you know maybe you start with one person going through and another person going through then they get to the other side and they start they're going to have to collectivize in order to pull everyone up else through that they want with them. So the language and how to how to navigate talking about collective action is important because as soon as you do that, the term socialist or Marxist, because people don't even know what a Marxist is, is going to be thrown around and you're going to

have to know how to answer them and how to basically give an apology for, you know, for what you're doing, not in an apologetic from an apologetic standpoint not a and not saying you know we're doing something wrong yeah that's a i think that's a really difficult road to navigate um i tend to look at it like a generational generational thing i think as you see the younger generations are starting to have either rebirth in regional identities or racial identities that's probably going to be the the lines in which people as they start to break into these groups and they see each other as a group that language becomes much more palatable for them, right? Because without that, they still are hell-bent on buying into individualism, right?

And it's not until I think they're forced into the position that individualism is no longer viable, that you can even really have that conversation. I completely agree with that. It is generational. I look at it in terms of, you know, where are we? in the in uh where are the generations in terms of potential energy like potential revolutionary energy i don't mean like you know taking up arms and overthrowing the government i mean like fundamentally changing the system and not an empty way and uh millennials don't have it um gen xers don't really have it

and boomers are dying off and they certainly don't have it because they want to keep things as the status quo um i see a lot of hope in I know that that might sound crazy to a lot of us 30 and 40 and sometimes 50-something year olds. But I think their main issue is that they're so alienated, alienated from doing anything kinetic, whether that's just meeting up in a youth group, at a church or whatever, or just doing things in real life. social media and the availability of entertainment and pornography and all that has done a really good job

of alienating the younger generations and kind of trapping them into this digital prison and domesticating them. But the good news is that... Pst, did you know? Those Black Friday deals everyone's talking about? They're right here at Beacon South Quarter. That designer's sofa you've been wanting? It's in Seoul, Boe Concept, and... and Rosh Bubaois, the Dream Kitchen, check out at Cube Kitchens. Beacon South Quarter Dublin, where the smart shoppers go.

Two hours free parking, just off the M50, exit 13. It's a Black Friday secret. Keep it to yourself. Ready for huge savings? We'll mark your calendars from November 28 to 30th, because the Liddle Newbridge Warehouse sale is back. We're talking thousands of your favourite Liddle items, all reduced to clear. From home essentials to seasonal must-habs,

when the doors open, the deals go for. fast. Come see for yourself. The Lidl Newbridge Warehouse Sale, 28th to 30th of November. Lidl, more to value. Gen Z is the most polarized generation, like I've ever seen, certainly more than millennials. I mean, I'm in an extreme minority as far as being on the dissonant right. But, you know, Gen Z, in terms of their online presence, at least, they seem to fall into either hard left, hard right, or just checked out. Well, the whole idea of getting together in meet space is, you know, basically how John and I met Old Glory Club. I mean, that's what it is.

It's coming together to build social capital with people. And then, you know, once you get a certain zenith, you're basically going to push forth to civilizational capital. Because, I mean, that's what we've lost. lost the civilizational aspect of it. I mean, we don't have a civilizate. You can't have a civilization if you have, if you're part of a polity that has open borders and people can just walk over whenever they want. And you also, go, oh, you're also able to collectively identify opportunities to take power. I can't do that alone. I need you, Pete, to tell me when, when they're getting's good. Or just take

I need intellectuals. I need brick layers. I need finance guys to take the temperature of my environment as far as the political economy goes. And you can you can do that online, but it's also regional, you know? I think it's sort of a, it's a filtering system, though, because the ones that are willing to do that now are much more high achieving and much more capable. you kind of it's kind of a good thing in the sense that you might be top heavy with some people that are extremely capable and you won't have nearly the dead weight that you would be carrying in another situation like I kind of just stick to the philosophy that we're in the business

of planting trees I think that's really what we're doing um I think it's going to be as you said know gen z you know I have kids there'll be gen alpha um and those ones they're they don't they've been bombarded by the same level of propaganda. So they're not nearly as bought into some of the stuff that we're trying to fight off from the older generations or even our own generation. Yep. Shaking off the influence of just boomer liberalism, pop culture is going to be so freeing. Well, let me, um, going back to the whole socialism, uh, you know, on the right, using that language

and, you know, thinking about collectivism. Um, It was pointed out to me a while ago that George Sorrell, who wrote reflections, most famously wrote reflections on violence, that even though he called himself a socialist, that he was our guy. And this description of him might be a place to start with where you're trying to explain this to people. It says, Sorrell shared with Perdone and Hobbs, a pessimistic view of human nature. This is the one facet of Sorrelian thought that fundamentally alters the way in which Sorrel's relationship to socialism is to be understood. Sorrell viewed man as basically mired in sin and driven by his own avarice and egoism and

desire for his own gain. This tendency in the Sorrelian view is only overcome by submission to sovereign authority, customary as well as formal, in ordinary conditions, and when necessary, by immersion in collective dynamic and violent efforts, often themselves both revolutionary and restorative in character. So any comments on that? Makes sense to me. Let me go on a little bit here because this is says Sorrell's commitment to socialism must be understood within this context that socialism for better or worse, was considered a historic inevitability in structural terms. And if nothing else, it was at least grudgingly stipulated even by most of its staunchest critics on the European

right that at least some concessions to the popular demands of socialist parties would need to be made for any future government to enjoy the legitimacy it required to effectively rule. Of course, in addition, despite any arguably reactionary tendencies, Sorrell was genuflecting more than slightly to the modernist conceptual bias of political philosophy toward a pseudo-neutonian balancing of forces in society. This is not to say that Sorrell's seminal volume reflections on violence is merely anarchist apologia in guise of Adam Smith, substituting bloodshed for labor and capital mobility. But it is, in fact, a point that is more than marginally relevant in discerning the Sorrelian relationship to modernity. Like Pradone, Searle postulated that poverty,

or at least a real possibility of it, was a beneficent force insofar as more highly-scale human societies and urbanization in the attendant tragedy of the commons, forced men to seek out new and more effective, productive mechanisms, which in turn generated new tensions between casts, some of an ancient, others of a newly emergent character, thus accomplishing a balance of social forces, but also conditioning man individually and collectively towards action in lieu of apathy and sloth. Yeah, I think what you can get out of that is just having an elite class that either is either cares about their people

or at least is willing to give them some scraps rather than elite class that's actively opposed to their interests and just wants to loot the masses. He kind of sounds like a little bit of realpolitik there too in the same way that Bismarck understood that in order to keep things functioning, he had to sort of cut the socialist out at the knees.

He's like, okay, well, what do the people really need? Okay, well, they need, you know, insurance. They need, you know, we need to take care of the elderly. So he gave the basic things that were needed and all of a sudden it took all the wind out of the sales, right? But he also was looking at it as, I think, a realpolitik, but there's an element of paternalism there too. Like, okay, we do have to take care of these people. Yeah. It's either you can voluntarily do it or it can be forced on you because populism is a force.

to be reckoned with as we're kind of seeing right now maybe. And it's always on the horizon for when your elite class starts to slip. Yeah, I think as far as having, you know, as you mentioned, a class that actually cares about people and looks out for them, this is where, like, in my mind, I get a little esoteric on it because I do think that people come from, I think there is like, whether you call it spiritual or genetic class, or I think that really does exist. there are people that that are aristocratic in class and those people are meant to be in charge

and the merchant type people which isn't just the merchants but the people that that have that mentality of making their living in that capacity they don't view people in the same way they don't have that paternalistic nature they want to take it like you said the profit and efficiency is all they care about you have to have people that care about something other than that and those people exist but they were you know as we both know they're sort of usurped of any power during the Industrial Revolution and replaced by the bourgeoisie. Yeah, no, empathy. There's a thing called empathy quotient.

We always hear about IQ, but there's this thing called EQ that's also measurable and statistically relevant that I think people forget about. your boss, your parents, whoever is above you in the hierarchy, the outcomes are almost always better if they have a high EQ and they're just all over the place if you have an IQ, if their IQs in like the 120s. That means you're really smart, but whether or not you're empathetic or apathetic doesn't really correlate with IQ. I think this would be a lot easier to sell to people if you could get people to even have any relationship to a sense of nobles oblige.

Like if they'd experience that in their life at all. Yeah. You know, but almost nobody has. So like getting them to understand that, you know, you can have this, this upper class, right, that's in charge that actually cares and it's going to treat you well is so foreign to everybody. And I feel like that's a giant roadblock in having these. these conversations about socialism.

You know, back during the Industrial Revolution, it used to be a contest amongst elites to as far as like, who could throw like the biggest philanthropy party, who could raise the most money, who could open up a new theater or a new opera house, who can drive culture the most through philanthropy. And that's, you know, it's still kind of there, but whether or not it's actual philanthropy or it's just money laundering,

that's probably the latter mostly. Yeah, we're not seeing Carnegie Halls getting built. Instead, Jeff Bezos takes fake rockets halfway into the atmosphere and says he went to space. Yeah. Pst, did you know? Those Black Friday deals everyone's talking about? They're right here at Beacon South Quarter.

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The Liddle New Bridge Warehouse Sale, 28th to 30th of November Little more to value So let me There's a little more here I wanted to read This section is called modernist violence Now we're not calling for violence

This is a book about violence It's just We're looking at what Sorrell was teaching here Sorrel's model of an ideal society Is easily discernible as what old Athens By the time of Socrates's trial The ideal Athenian citizen Having both a being both a yeoman farmer

and soldier. Sirel did not view this combining of functions in de mazalian terms as accidental or a mere pragmatic affair of making men tied to the land into a warrior cast and a hedge against the emergence of tyrants or oligarchies that relied upon mercenary armies. He viewed the organization, management, and economics of the homestead and the cultural values intrinsic to this enterprise as being inextricably linked to and mutually reinforcing of military competence and endeavors and the waging of war itself. Relying heavily upon Xenophon as a primary source of the aforementioned values, Sorrell discovered what he believed to be an ideal balance of formal equality between those

men deserving of citizenship, the warrior yeomanry, agrarian productivity, paternal virtue, and heroism, as violence and competence in violence makes the home. homestead possible. He further views the yeoman homestead as a school of command. A man must rule his wife and children firmly, but also caringly and justly. He must also demonstrate his worthiness to wield his authority. A man's wife and children are obliged to obey his commands, but only insofar as his command role is tempered by correct virtues and practical reason. A man incapable of wielding authority over his homestead correctly is not fit to command men in battle and vice versa. You know, it's funny because that reminds me of, if you go back, you know, pre the Civil War, you see there's a lot of commentary about how the plantation owners that had become politicians and all were much better at managing things and taking care of things because they had been managing what was essentially a small city for their whole lives.

Right. They had kind of been born into that situation because a lot of these plantations, you know, had churches. They had, you know, all kinds of things that a city would have in, in. many cases. Yeah, it makes sense. I mean, whenever, when he's talking about those virtues, I don't think those exist in reality anymore. Um, all, like, what would be the virtues of a soldier today? It's, um, diversity, equity and inclusion. It's you, you know, they're our greatest ally. Um, It's spreading democracy around the world still. There was any semblance of virtue that that's a common theme throughout our culture right now, unless you're Catholic or Christian or whatever, has been completely corrupted and dare I say, Judaized.

Well, John, what's your opinion on that? because Aaron was just a Navy guy. So, yeah. Well, I mean, so I got out in 2012, but when I was in the Marine Corps, they were still trying to drive home this idea, you know, honor, courage, commitment. We had that drilled into us. And I think at the, you know, at the line company at the infantry level or combat arms in general, you'd be tanks, whatever, that still existed because of that brotherhood.

But anything outside of that, once you got past like the company, level, you know, or you get these officers that, you know, they're, once they get past captain, you lose all that, right? And all the stuff there is mentioning is absolutely true. But those core principles still existed. And, you know, I don't know what boot camp is like now. I'm sure they're probably not nearly as hard on like honor, courage, and commitment. Those virtues exist. But the only way you're going to get those back is I think you kind of, you have to go through like a really hard time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. the people that embody them, because people still have them, they'll rise to the top,

but a hard time has to draw that out. In the Navy Creed, there's still an excerpt of it that's, what is it? I will support and defend. It's something about spreading democracy around the world. But no, honor, courage, and commitment are certainly words that are said very often. and there is that level of camaraderie for us who would be the division level that you would absolutely risk your life to save the guy next to you that you've been stuck in a ship with for months and enjoying the same amenities as but um on a on a bird's eye view it's more about like

power projection and uh you know spreading democracy around the world and what that actually looks like on the ground. And just not a whole lot of people are able to make that connection until they get out. Oh, yeah. No, and I think that's largely because the guys who do embody those things, they get filtered out, like when they go to get promoted, the officers. I mean, I was in when they pushed out, when Obama pushed out the real officers. But I'm wondering how maybe you all know this,

how do you think Sorrell's idea of myth plays into this? Is that something that could be used to maybe get people willing to talk about or to entertain the idea of socialism or some form of that, whatever word you want to use for it? I think subverting our national creation myths is a done deal already. you know, the the Davos, you know, whether whether you're, whether it's Davos or Zionists, they've kind of already subverted whatever creation myth we had to suit their own ends.

And it's going to be very hard to, to create a new myth or mythos until, you know, until it's time to create from destruction, I guess. no go please go no no i was just going to say i think um you know reading serrell which i haven't read all of reflections on violence but i did read most of his talk most when he's talking about myth and i think you know he talks about how uh well i think maybe burnham actually talks about this and the machiavellians but he makes a point that like with marx using marxism like it doesn't matter

how many times it fails because that myth is there that it's the okay well this time it didn't work, but the myth keeps people going through failure, right? And I guess that's more what I'm wondering is like, how do you create that? Because that could be the fuel people need. But like you said, I don't, I can't even think of how you create one until it has again, and I hate to say, but it has to be almost born out of some type of catastrophe or hard time. Yep.

We have to wait until the thousand year shit lib Reich is over. Let me just read this last little second. here, because I think it's kind of important. So Sorrell's view of action are more properly within Sorrell's paradigm of violence, similarly praised the hardships faced by man, and found it outrageous that political discourse at the turn of the 20th century seemed to revolve almost entirely around a degenerate, secular eschatology of material comfort and hedonism. Although again, Sorrel's dissent had an unmistairns, guys. It is this author's opinion that much if not most of what both

Orthodox academics and historians as well as revisionist discern as the Nietzschean influence in fascist and national socialist aesthetic and ethical discourse, in fact, owes far more to Sorrelian influence in lieu of Nietzsche.

Sorrel's most intriguing essays in this regard revolve around his own belief that the trial and judicial homicide of Socrates was entirely justified. This was not mere polemic nor an effort to court controversy for its own sake. Rather, Sorrell's justification for the execution of Socrates was an essential component of what he considered to be the common good

and of influence is essentially positive and laudable, informing the social character of individual men within a society, and of what he considered to be irredeemably harmful and deserving of scornful contempt in kind. Any comments on that? I never thought of it that way. I knew that Socrates was kind of an enemy of the state. And I just, I never thought to say, yeah, I'm glad they did that. That was good, actually. But Nietzsche talks about that in the, I forget which one of his books where he just, like, he just shits all over Socrates for a while.

He even talks about how ugly he is. But he makes the same point, essentially, that, like, I guess that he's constantly he's undermining everything. Yeah, no matter how you, no matter what utility you can derive from from a

social pariah's teachings. He's, he's still a net, you know, a net harm and should be dealt with. I guess I understand that. Well, I guess I was going to say, I think it's the same as

in a monarchy, you know, you can't really tolerate too much, you know, pushback, right? You can't allow people to question the king's authority openly, right? They can do that in private, maybe, but once it's openly questioned, once you allow that, you've kind of lost your authority. Yeah, yep, and legitimacy. Yeah, legitimacy is key.

You know, what he says is it's essential to the, it is this essential structure, the foundation of any good society that Socrates worked tirelessly to, to undermine, to destroy doing so during a period of active warfare with the highly militarily competent enemy state. It is in this regard of Socrates' adamant belief that the trial and execution of Socrates is not merely just and legitimate under the law, but in fact necessary. This is where it becomes clear that Sorrell, radical as he may have been, in describing political remedies to Europe's long crisis of the modern age that commenced in 1789. But at base, but was at base a highly conservative theorist far more in the model of de maistra than nietzsche so

that's zarel and that's also um that's from the imperium press version and that's thomas forward to it thomas wrote the forward to it so that's what i've been reading from i knew i recognized it because i have that book so i'm going to add it to my list my never-ending list I remember buying reflections on violence back in the early days of libertarianism and never getting around to reading it. Really wish I had to write it back then. Could have saved yourself some time. It's interesting because, you know, it's featured in the Machiavellians and everyone kind of glosses over it. They jump for, you know, Pareto and Mosca and all, but they just kind of skip over the two, I think, two little chapters about, about Sorrell, which is mostly about the function of.

from, I think, Burnham's perspective. So, I mean, this is something that we were talking about. Aaron and I were talking about in 2020 during COVID. It's the creation of myth. It's the creation of narrative. You know, it's just how hard it is to create a myth or a narrative that people want to embrace when, you know, you don't have control of the means of getting that out there in a you know, and the way that the press can do,

even though the press is just basically talking in their capacity on TV to boomers and, you know, shitlibs, if at all them anymore. But also, you know, I think one of the one of the things about acquiring X that Musk definitely thought about and the money behind that thought about was this is a way now where we can not only control narratives but we can create them.

Yeah, I just... Go ahead. I was just going to say, yeah, I certainly hope it's people we like doing that. Yeah, I wonder as though. I was going to say, I wonder as far as the myth is concerned, and I guess maybe I'm hung up on this, but I think because if you look at Marxism and look at that lens of myth, right, it's obviously materialistic, right? That's what's driving people. I think that's a spiritual myth, something that's not tangible, right? Something metaphysical could work, but how I don't know how you implement that in such a material world. you know, people are so material now. That's all they care about.

I think that's where our conversation about generations comes in, is that this coming generation is searching desperately to fill that void that they know exists now. That's why you're seeing, you know, as feral as they are, Groyper's. You're seeing, you know, the online, you know, teal network, right, whatever our opinions on them are. And just church pews being filled, regardless of a branch or sect of Christianity.

There may not be as many people, but the people that are showing up are younger and much more zealous than any generation that I can remember in my living memory, So that gives us some hope that as far as myth goes, there is probably going to be some spiritual, some spiritual connotation to it if and when it does happen. If we're at the end of an age, which we very well might be, you know, a lot of people who've written about things like this have said that this is where the veil is thinnest. So, you know, how do we use that? How do we, if you understand that, if you're coming at it from, if you're coming at your worldview from more than a material standpoint, then that's something to think about, too,

is that there may be more power available to us than we realize. I mean, in terms of. of what we can do in our daily lives, we can just add drops to the bucket. Like, and that might mean making irrational, um, irrational decisions at face value. But like with, with my position, for example, I have, I, I can exercise a certain amount of power over hiring, over procurement, over, you know, how easy of the time, uh, people have in their, in their daily work life and their productive lives. and the ways in which I employ my preferences in my work life are just drops.

I look at them as drops in the bucket, doing whatever little I can to influence just my region. But it might also be a path with social forces, right? Like nobody knew 30, 40 years ago that the tech bros were going to be so powerful, right? They ended up in that position. So if you can kind of look forward at what the upcoming social forces are, and you can get the right people there, you know, that power is going to increase exponentially as time goes on. Yeah. Yeah, on a micro and macro level, there's plenty of right answers. The idea of creating myth, I don't think. think the myth needs to be created out of thin air. I think there's myth that works,

that works time and time again. I think the people who rule over us know how to know that, know how to employ it, or our experts at employing it. It just seems like there's no better time where we have all this technology at our fingertips. And, you know, like I said, when you have one age, when you have an age ending, you have an age that's starting. And the age that's ending is always fighting its hardest to hold on. And the age that's starting has a tendency to not be, to not be so, to not be as, what's the word I'm looking at for, um, aggressive as the one that's ending. So if we know that there's something new starting and that most people, as they're going into a new age, are going to go in a little more docile than normal. Maybe we can take advantage of the fact that those

of us who realize that, that we can amp it up and that we can actually lead from, not lead from the front, which we would be at leading, but at least lead in some way. See, I think we have a saturated market right now for people who recognize the zeitgeist and that we are kind of in this interregnum between the 20th century and whatever comes after. And there's no shortage of people that are, we're kind of in a civil war right now on the right to determine the character of, you know, know these maybe maybe one or two generations from now what what you know what the great man or the great men that leads us into the next stage looks like literally what what color will you be um you got anything john no i mean i think the only thing i would say i think this kind of goes back to my earlier point about if we're if we're on the cusp of a new age like in my opinion

these these local positions become exponentially important because they're going to grow in power even if that's at the city level the state level whatever it is they're up for grabs in a lot of cases right we've seen this in places where you know school boards have been taken over and stuff and we can kind of laugh a little bit at the type of taking them over you know because they're kind of boomer con adjacent right but but if they can do it there's zero reason our guys can't do that and that's going to be in my opinion like I said I really do believe catabolic collapse is already happening is going to continue and that's I think the path forward and that and as we both

know most of what people believe comes from the top down so if you're in those positions you get to dictate what people think and most people are going to go along with it. Yeah. It's it's never been a better and easier time to get in either a local government position because boomers are dying off. Everybody's like the in the next five years, all the boomers are retiring. They're going on their they're going to blow all their money on cruises or or go to a nursing home depending on how old they are. But there's going to be a lot of open positions of power and influence either within the corporate sphere or the local government sphere. And if you're a dissident right now and you have somewhat of a head on your shoulders and

you're able to hold a conversation with people, it's never been a better time to just shoot right up the ladder. Yeah, I would say so many of our guys like to fancy that we kind of joke, you know, oh, everybody's a disaffected elite. Well, maybe it's time to act like one, you know, if that's the case. Just a disaffected manager. You don't have to be an elite. Like, just, like, I don't think the managerial class is going anywhere.

I think, if anything, their managerialism is here to stay for a while. It's just what is the character of the managerial class? You know, elites aren't going to go back to direct ownership. You know, they're going to hire people like me to manage their day to day and give you actual power. That, man, that's true. if we understand the managerial class, being able to run everything, if we're the managerial class, that means everything. It's a no-brainer.

I've been telling people in my GCs, like, these 20-year-olds, like, start off, like, as a laborer and, like, just work your way up. It's so easy. If you have a room temperature IQ and you're able to hold a conversation, you don't even have to work that hard. Just fake it until you make it. And you'll be, you know, you'll be managing something. You'll be in a department somewhere running people. The point that you made, Aaron, that I'd like to address is the fact that, you know, there's a lot of people, you know, who we agree with, but the disagreements seem to be huge, you know, the disagreements, everyone wants to make huge.

What I would say is, and this isn't only because myself and John or old glory. Club is look for people who are doing stuff in person, too. And I'm not talking about only conferences. I'm not talking about, you know, I'm not talking about, you know, throw a conference once a year. Everyone goes there, gets hammered and yada, yada, yada. No. You're getting together all the time.

You're planning on doing things. You go and plan out stuff like, you know, maybe it's a fishing trip. Maybe it's something like an escape room or something like that. And you just go out there and you get to know each other and build, build that social capital that is so important. I mean, social capital is, you know, this is something a friend of mine told me of like four or five years back. And it's just stuff with me. He said, he said social capital is way more important than money or anything like that. Because with social capital, you can build.

people will be there to help you build. And I think that's what we're doing. And if you have people who are, you know, thought leader is like one of the most cringe terms in the world. But the only reason it's really a cringe term is because most people who are thought of as thought leaders don't do anything in the real world. They're just hyper online. They're on their podcast.

And hey, that's what I used to do. I mean, you know, but once you start getting out there and you start meeting people and you start getting together with people who can think more outside the box than you can, who are more organized than you are, who are more ordered than you are, and you start coming together and you start figuring things out, those are the people to follow. The ones who are just complaining, and I love to complain, I love to complain online. I know that. But if that's all they do and they're not talking about getting out there and actually doing something,

those aren't people to follow. Those are not people to follow. Those are people to watch. Yeah. And there's a big difference. Where I would disagree is I think what I learned in the Navy, and I'm sure you, John, saw in your time as well, is that everybody has a maximum potential. And you can kind of tell when somebody's reached their maximum potential. and your job is to utilize whatever that maximum potential is to its maximum productive potential

and motivate them however you can and encourage them however you can while at the same time tempering your expectations. And for that, you can extrapolate that to this. And there are a lot of people that are exclusively online. I think they have a place. their place is to make their place where we're talking about more for you know defensive and fortifying our you know our positions as leaders and to pretty much call it area denial for progressivism um i would look at them as more uh cannon fodder offense um these like

gen z uh they don't stand to inherit very much um they're not going to be the wealthiest general they really have nothing to lose. And they also are not the most socialized. So if they're most comfortable being online and, you know, brigading progressives every time they post something stupid, maybe that's their maximum potential. And maybe that's their best use. And then, you know, give them time when they hit their 30s and 40s.

If they're still doing it, well, it is what it is. or maybe they'll grow up into something beautiful. Well, look, in the base world, we'll need people in the monasteries, you know. There are people that that's their function. But I just wanted to say, you know, I work in fairly high up in corporate, and I always tell people this, 90% of business relationships or friendships. Yep. You know, I pick contracts less about the money and more about whether I like that person or not.

Yes. And so I've made this point that, like, The guys that have that potential, you need to go out there and be, I call it Normie maxing, but go out there and you go to pool parties, talk to people, because people listen to people they like. Yeah. That social capital gets built through that. I need to learn golf so bad.

Yeah. I need to start playing golf. Well, when I said that there are some people who you follow and some people who you watch, you know, the ones who are doing that way you were talking about brigading and stuff, I watch that. I don't engage with those people. I watch it. I enjoy it. Yeah, I enjoy it sometimes. Sometimes, like, I have friends that get caught in the crossfire, and I'm just like, you guys retarded. Yeah. You guys are just retarded. They're feral. I know who you're talking about. They are feral. You just wasted two days. You just wasted two days. You could have been doing something else.

But you know what? Like, I'm in those group chats with them because I like to know what's going on. And I like to dip my toes and, different waters and uh there's there's a subsection of them that do have potential like anything else there's a there's a perito distribution and uh there's certain people within those circles that uh that do actually have potential and most of them when you talk to them one-on-one they're just they're just zoomers with literally nothing to live for and are angry at the world and the fact that they're even if it's just nominally catholic like i think that that's a step in the right direction. They could be worse.

I think we need to, our standards are up here, and we need to bring them way down. Well, it's kind of hard for me because it's like, you know, OGC is not, we're not recruiting, you know,

we're not recruiting people who can't. You know, our conference was probably, definitely, there was, there was, there was autism. them there. But it was the least autistic thing I've ever been to. I don't know about you,

John. No, I think, you know, I was actually thoroughly impressed for the most part. I was, I guess maybe my expectations were low, as you said, but it exceeded that by a lot. But, you know, and Aaron, to your point, I think something people need to understand is often overlook quality in leaders is knowing where to put people and how to utilize them. You know, some of the best generals are the best generals because they put the right people around them in the right positions that make them look good. And they recognize this person is good at X and this person's good at Y. Yep. You know? So, I mean, you can find that potential in people and if you can point them in that direction, you know, that that that is that's worth gold. Yep. But in the meantime, it is super

annoying. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, I originally was in college because it was going to be a teacher. and then I realized I hated everybody's kids but my own stuff. That's literally what happened to me. I went to college for two years and longing to be a history teacher and thank God that didn't work out. Well, I forgot what

I was going to say. Well, okay, so I was going to say here, it's like okay, so going back to the original thing we were talking about is Marxism, socialism, the, how useful it is for I mean, the

dialectic. Just the dialectic is perfectly useful, but, you know, it does tend to turn people into partisans. I mean, do you, to either of you have a problem with that, with, you know, the idea of a partisan? Because once you become a partisan, it's like, and you truly understand what becoming a partisan is, is where, okay, I've chosen this side, and I will die on this side. I think for our purposes,

if accelerationism is what we're after, then that's great. It's the utility of partisan partisanship is perfect. I think there's a danger there because you don't want people, I mean, useful in the in the short term maybe, but you also don't want people married to ideology. And I think you do kind of have to look at like, what is their core driving principles? I'm a firm believer that principle matters more than ideology. That's just, that's the way I see it. I mean, I know people that ideologically are aligned with me, but I don't trust them because I can I see why they're they're on this side right and in there's there's an argument being made that you know us having this conversation about socialism um and essentially

taking care of the people around you because that's really kind of where that stems from right that in in based world we would be on the left we would be the left side of base world because we'd be the ones concerned about you know the welfare of the people around us so you know I fact I look at that as like, I'm not married to the ideology. I'm more concerned about the end result and what's right and wrong. And that, you just got to, you've got to really be careful not to let people get married to those ideas. Yeah, I've found that it's less so about ideology and more about aesthetics. Because, I mean, what is our current system right now, but just a slight difference in aesthetics between the right and the left, at least in the American

political system. And aesthetics do certainly matter. But, you know, if, look at Trump. Look at populism. I mean, the difference between Trump in 2016 and now is policy and principles and brass tax stuff. But the aesthetics are pretty much the same. And you can lead people with aesthetics.

Eventually, people are going to align themselves with power anyways. And whoever rises up. you know, becomes the next great man if you subscribe to that theory is going to be non-ideological anyways, but they will have some type of aesthetic to them. The, I think the, the idea of ideology is, yeah, you can't get trapped in that, but there's definitely a usefulness to it, at least in, yeah, at least in the short term. But I wanted to ask you, Aaron, you mentioned the term accelerationism. Toward what end?

So what end? What are you accelerating towards? What are you hoping to see? So me and Byrd have talked about this. Bird's the co-host of Timeline Earth, if you don't know, the podcast that I'm a co-host at. And how he described it, and I tend to agree with him, is during this time frame, if we're talking about accelerationism, This is kind of an incubator time frame where the longer we can draw this out, the more you can incubate the next great man or the next crop of elites who will eventually replace the current one. So you want the heat turned up as much as possible, but you also want to draw out the time of troubles as long as you can to just incubate the future generation of leaders.

as long as you can to just incubate these future, the future generation of leaders. Yeah, I mean, that seems, I mean, that's low time preference. Yeah. For once. For a term, for the term accelerationism, that's pretty low time preference. Yeah. Are you seeing the contradiction there? A little bit.

Yeah. Yeah, I mean, it's a nice, it's a nice wish list, but, you know, the whole hard times create, what is it, hard times create strong men, yeah. I mean, that's, that's what it boils down to. We want strong men, so we want to prolong the hard times as much as possible. But we need a replacement of elites. And we need those elites to be competent. And the way that you breed competence is through hard times. What do you rally them around?

Okay, so, you know, if we go back to the 20s, it was easy to rally people around the fact that they were German, the fact that they were English, the fact that they were Italian. What do you rally Americans around? See, that's kind of the battleground right now. Do we rally around race or do we rally around culture or, you know, what identity do you rally around? And I have my preferences. I'm Catholic. We're all Catholic. I'd love to have a Catholic monarchy at some point.

But, you know, I don't know what we will eventually rally around. I'm guessing it's going to be a synchronization between race and religion, Christianity and race. You know, white phenotypical Christians. I think it's going to be regional. I think it's going to be regional because I don't think that the, if you, accelerate, I just don't see the United States as you see it lasting because just the scale of it is too large. You already have these mass divisions. I think. Bulkinization, yeah. Yeah, I think you'll have something that looks like balkanization. And I think those

regional, it'll be a combination of regional and it'll be a combination of regional and probably racial. Like for example, down here in the south, right? Like if you're a Catholic, you're in the minority. And you kind of look at, well, how did Catholics function during the Confederacy and prior to? Well, you had people like Raphael Sims or Beauregard. They were Southerners, right? And they were from Louisiana or Alabama, whatever state they were from, that's probably what I think it will go back to. There'll be a hierarchy of things you rally around, but I would imagine your region will be the most important one. And you'll be able to, because those things are tangible, they're in front of you, you know, the rivers, the mountains, the lake,

that's your place. That's something that you can get people behind. They can sing big... Blood and soil. Yeah. They can sing that or whatever. And then you're going to have divisions within that that are smaller in my opinion. Yeah.

No, yeah, blood and soil. Definitely. I could see... I mean, I kind of hope we don't balkanize only because I look at the geopolitically. I think that would be catastrophic in the long term. But, you know, it is what. it is and the the regardless um regardless of what you think the the the next turning looks like it can't hurt to just secure yourself in your position as much as you can prior to well that's all

you can do is at this point most people especially if they're out there on an island by the you know if they're trapped in a blue state and they can't move you know and they're one of our guys yeah like like the mass hole over here. That's all you can do is build. You know, I know a couple of, I know a couple of our guys, one who's from California and the other one, I can't remember where he's from, but blue area. And they're, yeah, they're moving to a deep red area.

Yeah. No, I mean, I'm, Massachusetts is still kind of race-wise. It's still pretty majority white. But yeah, I mean, who knows? I live in kind of an enclave, an Irish Catholic enclave. And who knows how that'll serve in the long run. But I'm pretty secure where I'm at right now.

And I'm setting up a good foundation. That's really all I can do, getting involved in the community, you know, thinking dynastically. And that's pretty much all I can do. It's crazy that, like, Democrat strongholds, like Massachusetts and Vermont and Maine and New Hampshire, as long as they stay, don't accept migrants, that you can still, you know, it's like, oh, Democrat mayors bring crime. Yeah. Vermont and Maine are all Democrat mayors.

They're doing pretty good on crime. It's the weather. Keep certain elements out. It's too cold. No, I mean, it's like anywhere else. The cities are the real problem. You know, the closer you get to the city, the worse it gets. But the suburbs and the rural areas, they're fine.

I mean, they're always under assault. They're always, you know, you always have some, you know, pride parade or whatever, some progressive corruption trying to worm its way through and sometimes it does but at the end of the day all it is is just you know LGBT flag

flags on the town hall again it's aesthetics and at the end of the day people will align to power regardless of what happens and if that happens to be a thousand year shit lib rike for Massachusetts then I'll have to I'll contact

you by radio from the underground. Yeah, people talk about Alabama, and they're like, oh, the crime in Alabama. And it's like, I'm sure John and I can just start naming the cities where it is. And there's like no crime anywhere. And the crime everywhere else is minimal. Yeah. That's exactly all. I think that's everywhere.

But, yeah, and it's the same with like the crazy progressivism, too. We have a lot of like purple. I would call them purple towns that are. starting to, you know, gain some type of consciousness and starting to fight back against, like, the state level government. And it's been really interesting to watch. But, again, it's local politics. It's, if you're not, if you're not in it, then it's boring. Yeah, well, we've been gone about an hour and 20. Let's start wrapping this up. Anybody want to have any final thoughts or anything?

No, I have no final thoughts. No, I mean, this was a good conversation. I'm happy to meet you, John. I'm going to have to hop on your substack. Oh, yeah, it was good to meet you, too, man. Final thoughts-wise, I think to your earlier point when we started this, kind of anybody listening needs to kind of get rid of whatever preconceived notions they have of Marx and at least engage with him on a purely intellectual level.

And like I said, if you need to, it's best to kind of go into it and say, I'm not going to buy into the prescriptions, but what is, what is he reacting to and go from there, you know? And that might help it be, help it be easier to swallow, I guess. And there's something to be said for learning the language of your enemy, too. Even if Marx is, you know, out of date as far as, you know, whatever Marxism looks like nowadays, you can at least figure out. where they're coming from as far as the Davos crowd. There's utility in

learning about Marxism and learning about historical materialism, dialectic dialectics, critical theory, all that because you can, the more you know about your enemy, the better you can fight them. Yeah, Aaron, I remember watching Aaron talk to people who were

calling themselves Marxists in their profiles on Twitter, and Aaron was so much better Marxist than they were. He knew so much more about Marx, what Marx believed and what Marx thought than people who are calling themselves Marxist, which is just basically what you said, it's aesthetics. Yeah, yeah. Like, a lot of people that call themselves Marxists now are just rainbow capitalists. That's literally it, bourgeois liberals. All right, gentlemen, I appreciate it. And let's do this again. Sometime.

All right. Sounds good. Agreed. Good night.