The Pete Quiñones Show - Episode 1082: The New Age of Politics w/ Jeff Deist, Zman and Jose Niño

Episode Date: July 21, 2024

77 MinutesPG-13Pete hosted a Space on X/Twitter and invited Jeff Deist, Jose Niño and Zman to join him to talk about what Jeff coined "The New Age of Politics."A Strange Liberty: Politics Drops Its Pretenses by Jeff DeistMonetary MetalsJose's SubstackSubscribe to Jose's Newsletter10 Myths of Gun ControlJose's Mises.org PageThe Zman dot comPete and Thomas777 'At the Movies'Antelope Hill - Promo code "peteq" for 5% off - https://antelopehillpublishing.com/FoxnSons Coffee - Promo code "peter" for 18% off - https://www.foxnsons.com/VIP Summit 3-Truth To Freedom - Autonomy w/ Richard GroveSupport Pete on His WebsitePete's PatreonPete's Substack Pete's SubscribestarPete's GUMROADPete's VenmoPete's Buy Me a CoffeePete on FacebookPete on TwitterBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-pete-quinones-show--6071361/support.

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All right, Jeff and Jose, you got your invites sent to you. There we go. Hey, Jeff, what's going on? Mr. Cunonis and El Nino, how are you? And where is, Jose? I sent you the request. Jump in there. I'm going to invite our friend Zeman to be a speaker in this if he wishes.

Jose, answer the request. Guys hear me? Hey, hey, what's going on, man? Nothing much, man. All right. So, Jeff, when the term New Age of Politics is thrown about, what are you thinking? Well, first, thrown about by whom? Who coined this?

Where are you hearing this? From you. From me? Well, look, it feels increasingly inescapable. You know, we've all been through this period where we thought that the solution here was to strangle politics and shrink it down to its tiniest size and put it in the bathtub and drown it and throw it out the world. and throw it out the window and that the, you know, the goal was to depoliticize life. In other words, I think we all recognize the left is hopeless. They're not humans who can be reasoned with in the sense of persuasion, political arguments,

economics, however you want to look at it. But the idea was like, well, we need to decentralize, we need to federalize, we need to separate ourselves politically. But we don't want to lead political lives, right? We're productive, normal people. We're not psychotic, crazed, leftists who politicize everything, right? They politicized every facet of human life. Sex, sexuality, where you eat, religion, your workplace, you know, everything is political.

And we thought, well, that's crazy. We have to get away from that. We have to distinguish ourselves from that. But I think over time, Pete, we've reached a point here where progressivism is like a home invasion, right? It's like you can't escape it. And if you say, well, I'm not going to participate in that. Well, that doesn't work. If you live somewhere where there's home invasions, you have to buy a firearm and prepare yourself.

If you're in a bar and you say, you know, I'm not interested in getting in a bar fight tonight. I'm interested in drinking quietly with a friend, but a drunk is harassing you and then starts throwing punches. At some point, I think we're forced into a posture where lulbertism is of very little value to us. So that's where I think we are, Pete. Jose? Yeah, to add on to that, I would say this new age of politics assists the consolidation of the populist white working class realignment that has been taking place. since the election of Donald Trump in 2016, where the prevailing order and political assumptions and narratives of the 20th century

after World War II up until the collapse of the Soviet Union are just being upended. And now a lot of the strong gods of ethnicity, race, religion, and culture are making a comeback. And as a result, people are triving up. And these talks of like just trying to persuade people, convince people about like the benefits of like free markets, liberalism and all of that, they're just falling on deaf ears. People don't care about like if your policies boosts GDP by 5%. they aren't really caring if this immigration policy is going to make your neighborhood more diverse

or it's given more of a diverse cuisine like assortment of like foods that select from now people are going back to basics it's becoming primordial where they actually are worried that the countries that they their fathers and grandfathers grew up in are just looking like a Moss Isley Cantina for like

a better term. It looks like a tower of Babel increasingly. So people now are starting to worry more about immigration, crime, and really just the protection of like their historic nation overall.

And because of the existential nature of these political conflicts, they will start to become more violent. As Peter Brimelow of Veedare says, it will come down to blood.

And we sadly saw one of, I would say one of the first acts of this taking place last weekend with the failed assassination attempt of Donald Trump, which I do not see as an isolated incident. I believe this is the first of many potential attacks that the left will launch against the right. you got anything for us Zeman? Well, first I have to take myself off mute,

which is kind of ironic, given the way on which I throw around the word mute. You know, I just got back from a very, very normie event, lots of normies around all Trump supporters, love Donald Trump, very few of them actually watched his whole speech, and went to bed.

And I'm not really sure, that there's this revolution of the mine going on out in the normie space, I think they're all rather confused about what's going on. I mean, they, they, they just taking the temperature of the room, most seem to think that there's something hanky going on with this whole assassination business. They don't, they don't believe the official story at all. There's an undercurrent there that don't really believe the official story of anything. I mean, and these are fairly sort of rural people, semi-rural people. So they're, you know, kind of typical Trump land, you know, the kind of place that he wins, you know, 90% of the vote. And, you know,

but these are still people who fundamentally believe in the, you know, the old gods, you know, they believe in old America. They want that to be true. So I don't think that, you know, in a general population, there is a new politics at all. But I do think that the official politics at the official level, you saw this a bit at the convention, it just simply isn't believable to anyone who is political, who's engaged with politics on a fairly regular basis. I think that's really what's going on, is that all the old answers are just not working anymore, so you're kind of searching around and finding new language, new things to say. You know, I was struck by Vance's speech in a way, and that it's...

almost as if, and my suspicion is, is that, you know, they just kind of lifted a lot of stuff from dissident Twitter, dissident podcast, that kind of stuff, but don't really fully understand what it means to say the things that they put in this fancy speech. So I think we're in a really great transition. You know, we don't know what the new age of politics will be. I mean, I guess you could say that the transition is a new age of politics, but I think we're just in this great period of that the old ways are still falling apart and there's not some new thing to kind of crystallize in the people's minds what needs to be done. We're not there yet and we're still in this interregnum where a great degeneracy I guess is really the way to put it. Do you think that

there's any way that we can go forward and have order, have a civilization, again have even I'll even throw the Faustian spirit in there when we have and have 30 to 50 million people in this country who aren't even legal aren't even supposed to be here what would you say about that Jeff well we're a long way from that and I agree with Zeman there hasn't been a shift fundamentally in the normie GOP space per se I mean the parts of the convention I caught, I was struck by the fact that there was this hodgepodge. It's not really an American-American first message. It's not really a new foreign policy separate and apart from neocons.

It's not really a new conception of the right that rejects this absurd, you know, propositional nation, the idea that America is an idea. It was nice to hear J.D. Vance say that, but I don't think the majority of people really got that. That was just sort of a one-off. So I don't think there's been a fundamental shift there. Maybe in tone, but not in substance. And, hey, I'll take it. Don't get me wrong.

But when you come to this broader picture of order in America, which I think goes to the election itself, I don't think we're going to get there. I think we're going to have a very hot remainder of the summer. I think I'm very, very, very, very happy that the Democratic Convention is in Chicago. I hope they burn themselves to the ground and show America what the left in this country is. That's helpful. And, you know, this is another thing that libertarians got very badly wrong, which is that order really is the precondition for liberty. And, you know, you can hate the state, and you should.

But the libertarian conception of hating the state as an abhor. abstraction is a bit silly because, of course, the state is not an abstraction. The state is just people, right? We say it's silly to hate guns. I hate guns. Well, you know, I'm for gun control. Well, that's absurd because guns just an instrument. It's the human actor who uses that firearm to, let's say, harm someone inappropriately.

Well, the state is people, so it's not an inanimate object like a gun, but nonetheless, it's an abstraction. So when you say you hate the state, what you really mean is, you. is you hate people. You hate people who are engaged in running the state. You hate people who control the state. You hate people who work for the state, who benefit from the state, who maybe enter into contracts with the state, who capture the state, who get welfare from the state, whatever it might be, right? And so, I think Zeman's right. There's this very inchoate, you know, sort of spinning around in the air. There's this Anger. Obviously, the economy is way shakier than officialdom will admit. And there's a real sense that we've been sold out and that it's almost impossible for younger people to get a home. White collar jobs are drying up. All these things that used to be attract to middle class, you know, middle class existence. Like be a teacher, be a CPA, be a doctor, be a lawyer, you know, all that stuff is getting more and more difficult. And one thing. that was not mentioned at the GOB convention. As a matter of fact, was, I think, dismissed was that immigration is just a huge part of the unsettled feeling that people have. I mean, as Jose alluded to, you know, an extra five points of GDP, this, you know,

George Will, neoliberal, wet dream approach, you know, this Cato Institute. approach to American politics, that's just not cutting it because well-being is subjective. That is the constantly unspoken reality to immigration. And Hapa makes this point. The well-being of a community, of a country, of a nation, of a people, whatever it might be, an economic region is subjective. It's not GDP. It's not even GDP per capita, which is far more important.

It's a feeling, it's a subjective feeling of well-being. So if you want to call some guy, you know, if you want to call some guy blinkered, because his quiet, becolic little town in Idaho has been absolutely overrun by condos in California since COVID, let's say. I mean, you can call him blinkered. You can say he's reactionary whatever. But in his subjective experience, he's worse off. even if all the newcomers from California brought economic growth to the town, right? So that's the thing.

And we see this constantly within the United States, how people moving from one place to another within the United States ruin it. And that, and that, of course, demonstrates the lie, the Catoite lie of open borders. You know, it absolutely changes the politics of a place. And that's absolutely the design of, you know, mass immigration advocates. Ready for huge savings We'll mark your calendars from November 28th to 30th Because the Liddle Newbridge Warehouse Sale is back We're talking thousands of your favourite Liddle items

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Keep it to yourself. Jose, you write a lot on immigration. Do you see anyone having the will to do what it takes to fix the problem? right now. Really not so much but the nomination of J.D. Vance has

given me a little bit of hope because they not only brought in a intellectual populist into the mix but he's also someone that has attacked both legal and illegal mass migration

which is I think it definitely a marked improvement from the GOP in the Reagan and Bush era and even the Tea Party era I would add as well. But unfortunately, I went to expand upon one point that Z-Man raised. There is still some degree of inertia, not just in the GOP grassroots, but in a lot of the leadership because if you this is just me thinking in my number counting like lobbyist sense where I just look at see like the amount of votes that there are in both chambers of Congress you look at the overall makeup of the GOP it's still largely establishment chamber

of commerce some permutation of like you know conservative like Reaganite types that are just not on like the same kind of wavelength as say vance or ostensibly trump much less people like myself so we have a ways to go there um there's definitely a transition going on as as e-man alluded to so this is going to be a process that is going to be in motion for some time and It might be a generational thing because people in my age cohort and lower, as I approach my mid-30s, there is definitely a degree of cynicism and just despondents with regards to their faith in the system altogether. And you're seeing more and more people either adopt more radical views, whether it's on the hard right. or the hard left

or just check out quiet quit or just like opt out of the system altogether. And that is one of like the bigger stories to look at as we start to see the institutional

and cultural breakdown of the U.S. continue. Zeman, there's probably no one I can think of who knows con ink and side it out better than you do. Do you think there any, do you think that the wins can change enough that, you know, the power, the real power behind Connink that they could look at the immigration issue and seek to solve it? I mean,

even in the next four years, but not even talking about the next four years in the next 10, 20 years. Well, you know, it's a funny thing about immigration, and that is it is probably the easiest problem for our government to solve compared to all the other problems they have. When you dig into the problems of, say, Social Security and Medicare, those are tough problems. I mean, look, I do math for a living. I can work through the numbers, but I can also look at the politics and say, it is impossible to make these numbers work. I just don't see how it can happen.

You know, once the baby boomers kind of get into their peak retirement, I guess they're pretty close to it, the money drain is going to be enormous. I don't see how it can be fixed. I just don't see a political solution there. Immigration, on the other hand, is a simple problem. And the reason for that is that there's no constituency for open borders. There's no constituency for immigration at all. If all of a sudden Chuck Schumer said, you know what, I've changed my mind, I think we

need to seal the borders and put an end to all immigration. There wouldn't be riots in the streets. There wouldn't be people protesting. I mean, sure, you'd have some people who didn't get the memo, you know, Ocasio Cortez or, you know, some of the freaks from, you know, that they put out there to distract us. But, you know, they might not get the memo right away. But eventually it'd be told but shut up.

We're going to shut off immigration. And that would be it. I mean, it would be real simple. No more visas. All these temporary programs they have, you know, the millions of people are here from what the heck is that? Was it the, I think it was an earthquake in El Salvador or something like that in 1990. It's like 150,000 people still hear from that.

You know, solve all this stuff. Put the border back in order. It's easy. They can do this overnight. There's just no will in the ruling class for it. And I don't think the will is there because I think to a great degree they have to find themselves, you know, who they are is to spite the rest of it. Well, to spite the white majority, the, you know, what they think of as the bad whites. It's who they are now.

And that's why they fight it so much. It's not really because, you know, they care about bringing in, you know, millions of people. And to some degree, you know, they're bringing in millions of people. Keeps the army of busy bees and the administrative state busy. You know, it gives them a problem to solve. But, you know, the old argument that the, you know, that the Democrats wanted immigration because they wanted cheap votes and the Republicans wanted it because of cheap labor. None of those things have been made any sense for 20 years now.

The Democrats didn't need any more votes, really, and Republicans didn't need cheap labor, at least not this kind of cheap labor. I mean, most of these people coming in, they're just piling into the welfare system, creating new problems. This is just, you know, this immigration problem is purely because we have a ruling elite, or at least a managerial class that is completely tuned

to doing that which they think cause, is the maximum amount of anguish and unhappiness amongst the white majority. That's the only reason. And the economic elites behind them are simply indifferent to it. You know, we're in a lot of respects. We're at this sort of French Revolution moment, you know, in that there is a solution there, but the rich people who do control the apparatus are indifferent,

don't care, concerned about other things. And, of course, the people who are actually functioning and running the administrative portion of things for the rich people, they're getting their jollies out of this. I mean, look, I think they do take pleasure in sending 20,000 Haitians to a town in the Midwest that has 10,000 residents. I think they actually get probably some sexual pleasure out of it.

I mean, these people are deranged. They're doing it out of pure spite. So to think that a popular groundswell against immigration is going to change their mind, I don't think that's going to happen at all. I think they just dig in their heels. They just keep fighting and fighting and fighting. I mean, you know, we've been at this, I mean, Trump won in 2016.

So we're eight years into this and who knows how long it'll go after this. If they haven't kind of wised up and said, hey, you know what, maybe we just give these, you know, we'll give the dirt people, we'll throw them a bone here. We'll cut back on the immigration stuff. If they haven't come to that point now, they're never going to come to it. and you know it either has to happen something has to happen where the you know the plutocrats they're super rich start to feel some pain from immigration and therefore tell you know the politicians to do something about it or it just continues along until things break in you know something

something happens something else happens after that yeah keep trying to figure out how when so if you I know Project 2025 is turned into like Q and on for the left, but if you understand properly what Project 2025 is, you don't really see a great deal in there about immigration. You see it like an attempt to dismantle the administrative state. So if there's, even if you could dismal, and handle the administrative state, get rid of the deep state, or at least weaken them in some way where they feel it.

I don't see how without the, without solving the immigration problem, without solving the problem of having tens of millions of people here, they're not American. They're not a part of the nation. I don't know how we do anything except possibly start a reconquista at the local level and just work its way out. What do you think about that, Jeff? Well, we saw that at the GOP convention, right? I mean, they took great pains to show diversity on the stage and even religious. That Harvey Dillon woman, I believe that's how you pronounce her name.

She's an attorney who's defended. I think a lot of Trump causes. She gave some sort of Hindi prayer. So there's a lot of that and this idea that it doesn't matter who you are as long as you accept these conservative principles. Well, of course, that's not going to work because... There's so much rugby on Sports Exeter from Sky,

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I mean, this is an economic zone, right? America is certainly not a nation any longer. And I would argue it's barely a country. It's an economic zone. Things kind of work here and the pay is better here. So that's the only thing bringing, immigrants here. And not that that's a small thing. It's a big thing, but it's the only thing. And let's not forget, I mean, if you're from, I don't think most Americans have much of a sense of how

horrible vast parts of China are, how horrible India is, how, you know, how horrible most of Africa is, how horrible much of Central and South America and Mexico are, right? I mean, Americans are notoriously not well-traveled. And so that yields this sort of deer in the headlights. Aw, shucks. They're just like us, you know, just come here to the magic of America's just an idea. Well, I always noticed that if it's just an idea, well, it can be recreated anywhere, right? The Liberian Constitution almost mimics the U.S. Constitution word for word. The last time I checked, Liberia had not yet become bar harbor main you know or you know it doesn't have the hamptons there's no hamptons in liberia and and yet we imported our constitution there it should just it's magic it should work so

the gop has no the right in america has no stomach uh for putting the brakes on immigration and of course what we saw during covid was that there was a huge decline in people coming to america for period. And so that's that concern the Biden administration. So after they quote unquote won the 2020 election, of course, that was one of the huge priorities. There was no legislation passed. There was no news about this. This was just something they did. You know, inaction is the form of action. So you just sort of turn the other way and flood the country. And we don't know how many illegals have entered the United States since COVID. But it was really stalled for a while. And here's the thing is that if you look at the demographics, you know, without a concerted effort, you know, if things could even be slowed,

absolutely whites will be a minority in the United States numerically, but they could still be a, I think, a durable and lasting 40%, let's say, the biggest minority. And so that's sort of that, that's the unspoken, unexamined, undiscussed truth. is that, you know, yes, whites are almost certain to become a minority, but if you look at California, where whites are a minority, there's still sort of a stubborn 40-plus percent there, and that's probably not changing that rapidly. So, you know, I don't know, I don't know politically that this can be done from the top down, even with a real change of part in the GOP. I think, Pete, as you said, at the outset, it's got to be bottom up.

Immigration is a real tough problem. And you can't blame people for wanting to come here, but at the same time, unless it's stopped, America will absolutely be deep blue. Well, one of the things that I've been saying is that we have a certain segment of the population that does an overwhelming amount of the crime. And if we don't have the stomach to get rid to eject whole groups of people that just can't seem to exist in civilization, well, then we're going to have to look at other countries around the world. who are multicultural and who seems to have some order. Singapore immediately comes to mind. Well, sure.

I mean, yeah. I mean, Pete, Pete, Singapore and Dubai, right, are both touted as multicultural destinations. But guess what both of them have a backbone of what any, you know, what most Americans would consider authoritarian criminal law. That's, that's what makes Dubai and Singapore work. You know, try, go try your hand at graffiti. And, you know, go into the jewelry district of Dubai and try to do a smash and grab at a store full of Rolexes. Your treatment will not be the same as it is when you do a smash and grab in the Chanel store at Beverly Hills.

Let's just put it to you that way. What I would say is, is that I really think that that's what is going to be. to have to be embraced here, especially in the cities, is you're going to have to have a sense of, a sense of authoritarianism in order to have any kind of order, any kind of civilization, any way that children can actually, like, go out and play in the streets anymore. So Jose or Chris, either one of you, I mean, am I wrong here?

I agree, especially with Jeff's examples. You look at many of these, yeah, if you look at Gulf Arab states, Singapore, even like some of these are lesser developed, but still up-and-coming places like Malaysia that are all like multi-ethnic, there has to be some degree of authoritarianism. And I could definitely see actually at the local level, because a lot of local municipal races, they're nonpartisan, and you could definitely see some people enter the mix that become like local authoritarian to clean things up.

And I would venture to say that it could be also not just like a white person, but somebody that's got disgruntled like third generation or fourth generation Asian minority that does it because we've already seen it in San Francisco with like the late like the most recent recall of Chesa Boudin that a you started seeing for the first time like Chinese like shop owners which are generally a constituency that is not the most politically active start to get loud

like the Asian community start to get very restless about the growing crime problems there. And I think that could be a trend to watch in the upcoming decades. Because I do believe that this recontista model is probably going to be the most viable way. Because in my nearly two decades of being involved in political operations, I have seen like the same old trends at the federal level where there'll be some type of insurgent movement like a populist libertarian or whatever movement to try to like shake things up. But then it gets like either neutered, assimilated or it just fades into obscurity. And I think there might be time for some changes in terms of the strategy.

And I think that the take taking back your own backyard and then making some gradual incremental gains will be probably the best way to go. On the many days of Christmas, the Guinness Storehouse brings to thee, a visit filled with festivity. Experience a story of Ireland's most iconic beer in a stunning Christmas setting at the Guinness Storehouse. Enjoy seven floors of interactive exhibitions and finish your visit with brett-taking views of Dublin City from the home of Guinness.

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I mean, look at my sort of general conception of society is that the people in charge share the same preferences as the general population. And so, for example, with regards to, say, immigration, we don't have to have any justification for saying we don't want these people. We simply don't want them. They could be nice people. They could have great resumes. It doesn't matter. We get to decide who lives amongst us.

And we decide that these people are not going to live amongst us. And that's it. That there's no other justification needed. It's just our will to do it. This is the fundamental problem. in my view that we face is that so many people have been tuned and I get the whiff of this from Jeff is that your preferences have to be justified against some objective standard well no they don't we get to live the way that we want to live you want to call it authoritarianism that's a

completely normative term okay good call it whatever you want you can call us the unicorn people I don't I don't care this is how we want to live this is how we want to live this is how we want to organize our societies. This is how we do things. I mean, this is why there's not smashing grabs in Dubai or in Singapore. It's because these, the people in charge represent the general will and they say, this is how we choose to live. We're not going to tolerate these things. You know, the Japanese are throwing out these black YouTube guys who show up and act just like you would expect them to act. They're picking them up and shipping them out of the country because they don't tolerate these things. And it's not because they're intolerant. It's because

they are who they are. That's not something they question. They don't think about it. They don't think about trying to justify to anyone. They're going to be Japanese people. They're quiet on the subways. They are respectful of one another. You know, that's just who they are. And someone who comes along, whether it's one of their own people or some

foreigner, particularly a foreigner, they'll just, all right, well, foreigner, we throw them out and get them out of the country. If it's one of their own who can't cooperate, well, then they put them in prison. And Japanese prisons are very unpleasant. They make them unpleasant for that reason because they want to emphasize that this is who we are. This is our will to be Japanese is going to be expressed through our laws, our culture, our behavior. And there's nothing wrong with that. I mean, how can anyone question it?

Because the only people who could question it are people from the outside and their opinions don't count. That's the problem that we keep running into here is that we've all been tuned for, look, I'm, look, I'm going to. old guy. I'm almost as old as Pete. And we've all been conditioned to believe that somehow, you know, we've all been conditioned to believe that we somehow or other, we're supposed to compare our preferences to some objective standard, some invisible God, some, some entity out there that decides whether our preferences are acceptable or not acceptable. And frankly, I reject that. I mean, my preferences or my preferences. I prefer to live a certain. certain way amongst certain people. And I don't have to answer to anyone for that. And if we do that as a

country, then our immigration problem is solved quite simply. Because again, the mechanics of solving the immigration problem are really easy. There's nothing hard about it. What's hard is the fact that the people who rule over us have an entirely different morality. And to a great degree, their morality is based on us not developing a morality of our own that says, this is who we are and this is how we choose to live. You know, they fear that more than they fear anything else. So that kind of gets back to the central problem. We can have the country we want to have if we have people who rule over us or us instead of an, you know, an alien ruling class. Yeah, I get that and everything. And, you know, that takes work and it's going to take time. But I think in the meantime,

what you describe, I think that's something that we can have. on local levels. Maybe not if you live in, you know, your old stomping grounds of Lagos, or my old stomping grounds of Atlanta. But, you know, now where we, where we live, there's a better chance of that happening of people coming together and go, these are the values we share. This is what we're willing. This is what we're willing to put up with it. We don't even really have to talk about it. It goes unspoken. And this is, this is the way things are now. Yeah, I think that's true, but I would also warn that white people in America have moved away from these problems rather than face them. In fact, where I was this evening, one of the guys there has actually written about this problem.

He himself has experienced it. And if you go around different parts of the country, one of the things, Virginia is a really good example. You know, people, normal people keep moving away from the abnormality and the abnormality keeps chasing them. So northern Virginia, this weird, perverse sort of Casablanca of an area just keeps expanding and expanding. So the idea of building a parallel society or living outside of the norm is great as long as it is in preparation for not a final defense, but a final assault. In other words, you're regrouping your forces so that you can retake society. It really is a change in mentality that has to take place. And I don't think that's easy.

I think that's very hard, by the way. But simply moving away from a problem or trying to build parallel societies, these people will never leave us alone. They will never quit. They are relentless. They will never stop. You move to the rural area, and they're going to figure out a way to come into that rural area and try and screw it up for you.

I mean, look, I live in West Virginia now, and you see it. They're constantly trying to figure out some way to get the developers in, to put Section 8 housing in so they can export their favorite people out of Baltimore and Washington out to our area. They're constantly scheming this way. The hardest thing for people to accept, and look, this is a hugely difficult problem, and I'm not trying to pretend here that I have an answer for it. But we're in a war, and yet we don't think we're in a war.

We think that, well, if we turn this knob this way, and we turn that knob another way, maybe we'll get the result that we want. While the other side is not thinking about that at all, they're thinking about our utter and complete defeat. And somewhere along the line, we've got to waken up. We've got to come to this realization as collectively that we're in a war. As Pat Buchanan said, almost what?

30 years ago, 32 years ago now. We're in a culture war. Culture broadly defined to include the people. And we just, we haven't joined the war. I mean, we're seeing some hints of that. I mean, I guess kind of the circle back to the topic here, the age of new politics, we've started to kind of get some whiffs of that. There was some sense of that in that Republican convention.

You know, Papi Cannon, you know, God bless him. He was probably watching it. probably smiling a little bit because he's lived long enough to see the wheel turn, but it's got a long way to go. You know, there's a long way to go because, you know, we're only going to start to win when we decide that we're going to win, that we're going to defeat the other side utterly. And we're not going to care about their artificial normative claims. Oh, it's authoritarianism.

It's central planning. It's communism. It's racism. It's homophobiaism. It's, you know, all these crazy isms they have. We're just not going to care about those things and we're going to retake our societies. There's a long way to go between where we are now and that place. But we are seeing some little hints.

It's starting, it was little green shoots starting to turn up. So, I'm getting back to the sort of topic of the, what do we call these things? Spaces. Yeah. Well, anyway, whatever this thing is. you know there's little hints that there is a new sort of politics but it's it's not going to be gentle it's not going to be polite it's going to be it's going to be ugly and we're going to have to have to have the willingness to uh you know to be ugly you know to be tough and uh because that's the

only way you win you know you never win by playing by the rules you always win by trying to find some way to force the other guy to play by the rules while you find some way around the rules. Yeah, that's why I've taken to use in the term reconquista, because, you know, if you know, your Spanish history, it was a seven, it was an almost 800-year fight to take back what they, what they had lost. And, you know, that just starts with, you know, one generation, one generation takes a mile and the next generation, you know, the next generation may only take three feet,

but you just, you keep going and you keep fighting. And I think that in the age of instant information and being able to communicate with people instantaneously, that things can move a lot faster than seven or eight hundred years, it's just not going to be overnight. It's going to people who think that we're going to elect this person and this person is going to do this. We can elect somebody who can actually break down a wall. you know, maybe in the next four years a wall will be broken down that we can walk over that rubble and then we're back to someplace or we're someplace new

that... There's so much rugby on Sports Exeter from Sky they've asked me to read the whole lad at the same speed I usually use for the legal bit at the end. Here goes. This winter sports extra is jam-backed with rugby. For the first time we've been every Champions Cup match exclusively live, plus action from the URC, the Challenge Cup and much more.

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Foot Solutions, the first step towards pain-free feet. Leads us towards getting away from everything that we've allowed to take over, but it's not going to be something that is going to be instantaneous unless, you know, that Caesar comes along. And I don't know that that Caesar could even accomplish the things he wanted, wanted to do without having a shot taken at him by some in-cell 20-year-old who now the story is, he didn't even know. He just was looking for the most high-profile target that he could find in his area. And Trump just happened to be there. So, I mean, I don't know. Yeah, you know, look, I think, you know, it is incrementalism. And I thought, that's really, really hard, man.

You know, the weird thing about it, and I learned this from John Darbyshire. You know, he said, you know, old guys always care about the future more than young guys. And, you know, and I first heard that I was, you know, still technically kind of young. And as I've become an old guy, it's true. You know, as you get, the more long, you start thinking about the long game. And, you know, that's what this is all about, is this putting, down one stone after another in the foundation so that those who come after us, and look, you know, there's a lot of younger people on this space for sure, you know, younger than me at least,

you know, they get to put their stone on it and do so knowing that the guy, you know, the stone of which they're setting their stone on, he's not around anymore, but he somewhere is believing that, you know, those who came after me are going to come building on this. And then that's what has to happen. You know, look, the mess that we're in as a country, And as a people, it was a long time coming. It's not going to turn around with one election or one speech or anything like that. It's just this slowly nibbling away at these old ideas, these old beliefs, these old ways of looking at things and opening the space for younger guys,

newer guys to come along and fill that space with new ideas that motivate people to put their own interests ahead of some abstract concept. You know, they stop thinking about America as a concept and start thinking about their neighborhood, their family, what kind of world their kids are going to grow up in or their grandchildren, you know, they start thinking that way and say, you know what, I don't care about those abstract things. I'm not going to be swayed by the flag waving or, you know, there's other stuff that we see all the time. I'm going to do small things so that my people have a chance to thrive and survive in the next round of the competition. And, you know, and that's, look, that's a hard sell. everybody wants an easy answer, but the right answer is incrementalism. What are you thinking, Jeff? What about all that?

Wow, a lot there. I guess a starting point for me is there were people on that stage, and at least in some of the portions of the convention I happen to catch on YouTube, you know, there are people at that convention who don't hate my guts. So that's, you know, that's a starting point, right? When we look at Hillary Clinton or Kamala Harris or whoever you want to look at, they hate your guts and they want you and your family vanquished. So, you know, this idea that, again, Lalbert's, you know, the George Wills of the world, they want to remain wedded to the side of this capitalism versus socialism. That's not the interesting question or really the question at all of the 21st century.

and so you know and caps and people who have come up through the way I have tend not to like this idea of political us them Leninist outlook or whatever it might be

but you're forced into it and so I think you start with the idea that the Trump world doesn't hate your guts so there's that and things sort of spiral out from that. I mean, there needs to be a non-conservative right,

a vital non-conservative right in this country. There's no question about it. Conservatives are useless, and they've proven that. And, you know, it was funny. I'm thinking to myself that I'm just imagining that I think boomer cons think Kid Rock is like 25. Kid Rock's like 50 or something. And he passes for, I guess, young,

hip outreach or whatever. And I was interested in Dana White simply because, you know, you've got Dana White, you've got Hulk Hogan, you've got Kid Rock, and you just sort of wonder where we're going relative to, if you think of the conventions back when I was a young guy in the 80s, I mean, you'd have some speech from a senator or something. And so the idea that you have to get cultural or that you have to get out into, you know, touching people in a different way than just the political stuff. I think that's probably true. Dana White and Kid Rock and Hulk Hogan strike me is maybe a strange way to do that.

But I guess they had, they've had some other celebrities up there as well. But, you know, I don't take much hope from that convention. don't take much hope from the GOP because, I think it's just too late. It's too late for all that. Conservatism doesn't work. It didn't conserve anything. And now we've got a masquerading form of liberalism, which is actually just voracious managerial social democracy. And you need a reactionary right. And, you know, Zeman says. you need to realize you're in a war. And unless until you have a true reactionary right,

I don't think politics is going to work for us. And how you create that? Well, it's happening. It is happening organically, slowly, painfully. It's definitely happening. And thankfully, it's happening amongst younger people, especially, because boomer cons are, they obviously, they just want Social Security last.

I mean, right? Social Security and Medicare, are their top issues and they think that they're going to sell their McMansion for 800 grand. Their five-bedroom, 5,000 square foot McMansion, well, guess what? The 38-year-old you think you're going to sell it to doesn't have any kids. They don't need your boomer McMansion. So the fact that that GOP convention was so boomerish, I think, tells you that it's not viable. and the vital right, the reactionary right, is young,

and that's where our focus has to be. And let's just hope and pray. It doesn't take a true economic disaster, which we're flirting with. I think nobody can predict that stuff, but of course we're always flirting with that. Or some sort of ginned up WW4, call it whatever you want, right? I mean, Israel wants to,

once Israel and Gaza want to blow up the world, I mean, get Iran involved, get China involved, get over Taiwan, get Russia involved. I mean, these things are always possible. And you have to understand that the progressive mindset is so insatiable, so voracious, that they'd literally blow up the world before they would voluntarily just let a vital reactionary right gain prominence in the United States. So I think that's a sober thought. On the many days of Christmas, the Guinness Storehouse brings to thee,

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My goodness, it's crazy. Christmas at the Guinness Storehouse. Book now at ginnestorehouse.com. Get the facts. Be Drinkaware. Visit drinkaware.com. There's so much rugby on sports extra from Sky. They've asked me to read the whole lad at the same speed I usually use for the legal bit at the end.

Here goes. This winter sports extra is jam-packed with rugby. For the first time we've got every Champions Cup match exclusively live, plus action from the URC, the Challenge Cup and much more. Thus the U.S.C and all the best European rugby all in the same place. Get more exclusively live tournaments than ever before on sports extra. Jam-packed with rugby. Phew, that is a lot of rugby. Get Sports Extra on Sky for 15 euro a month for 12 months.

Search Sports Extra. New Sports Extra customers only. Standard Pressing applies after 12 months for the terms apply. On the many days of Christmas, the Guinness Storehouse brings to thee. A visit filled with festivity. Experience a story of Ireland's most iconic beer in a stunning Christmas setting at the Guinness Storehouse. Enjoy seven floors of interactive exhibitions and finish your visit with breathtaking views of Dublin City from the home of Guinness. Live entertainment, great memories and the Gravity Bar.

My goodness, it's Christmas at the Guinness Storehouse. Book now at ginnestorehouse.com. Get the facts. Be Drinkaware. Visit drinkaware.com. Well, let me make this point. Let Jose, I want to hear a Jose comment on it. It was something I mentioned on recording that Jose and I were on the other night,

but I don't think he had a chance to comment on it. It seems like when it comes to the right, you need to have the most, you want to have somebody who's presentable, somebody who's above it all, somebody who presents as a model citizen of sorts. When the left, the left will, like, they will have open communists that they will just get elected to office. They will have open, like, Marxists that they will put into, like, cabinet positions. And, you know, guys like us, we, the right would never even think to have, you know, Jeff, Jeff Diced as the Attorney General, you know, myself, Department of Education or something like that. It just wouldn't, we're not even, we're not playing the same game. I mean, we're not even in the game.

They're playing this insane. Just, we're going to kill you. Pete, you're so right. I mean, Bill de Blasio was mayor of one of the biggest cities in the world. I mean, you're entirely right that the left elevates its radicals. The right diminishes them. I mean, look at Rand Paul, right. I mean, you're 100% right.

They whitewash. I mean, Obama must be the least examined president. presidential candidate in modern history, especially with the advent of the internet. I mean, Obama's background is wildly radical. And who do, who do Republicans get? Mitt Romney, George W. Bush, right? So you're 100% right that we are, we're on the political part. You know, we're playing a different game.

The right's not even, I shouldn't say the right. Conservatives are not even playing the same game. What do you got, Jose? The main theme that I was largely optimistic about after the RNC was just seeing the conspicuous absence of a lot of Bush-era standard conservative figures. And I do think it should be emphasized enough the point Jeff is making how we need to distance ourselves from the conservative movement. This is something that Paul Gottfried has talked about emphasizing more. of the right than the conservative movement because that movement

has just utterly failed on all political fronts. But we do have obviously challenges ahead because that convention was largely a freak show and it is, it was I would argue, a very accurate representation of the country's changing demographics

and cultural makeup as well. But there are still silver linings because I think that with like the U.S. is federalist system. You can still experiment with many things at the local level, build

up your local power bases, and it's important now to, especially in an era where incompetency abounds, it's incredibly important to stress competency, build people up, get skills, build your

network, and chase excellence. Because that is what will ultimately stand out and build a power base more than just engaging in pointless debates online or of other people that are never going to come to your cause anyways. I think that's one thing to note in this post-persuasion era. And I do believe as well that we will find unconventional allies because Jeff mentioned Dana White. And it's funny because I've been following MMA for almost like, almost like, two. decades, been a fan of the sport, but I was saying from the start whenever I would just travel across the country for like political campaign events and just go at bars, I noticed that whenever

there was UFC fights, that there was a lot of chud-like people and working class people there watching those events. And I, and I would laugh back then that these people would be like the, like, the muscle for like an eventual right-wing movement. And lo and behold, we now do see a like the UFC and like assorted MMA organizations and even figures becoming very prominent in this new right wing sphere and I think that that's going to be like one of the stories of like this new age of politics is some of the strange bedfellows will be making in new forms of strategic partnerships and alliances and I think that while it's easy to black pill I think that there's like a lot of new opportunities that tap into it's just we're just going to have to

creative and get rid of outdated assumptions about politics. Well, Chris, mentioning, you know, us putting our radicals into office. I mean, we're not even talking about radicals. We're just talking about people who, you know, aren't on Apex, on the take from APEC. I mean, aren't people who, like, literally care about their neighbor, care about what's going on in their community. How did we get to the point where it's, we can't even get someone into office

who isn't immediately just captured? Yeah, I mean, look, there was a guy who ran for, I think, town council or something like that, and he did Oklahoma. And he had been at Charlottesville. Yeah, I had him on the show after he got to. after you voted out. Yeah, I mean, perfect example.

I mean, look, this is a sweet little town, and yet they were bullied by a couple of blue-haired lesbians into getting rid of this guy who genuinely loves his community. I mean, it's, you know, look, I don't want to get too carried away with this, but, you know, there is, the reason that white people in America have many of the pathologies of Native Americans, high suicide rate, alcoholism, drug addiction, all these other things, is because we're a beaten people. We think like a beaten people.

We operate like we're just been conquered and, you know, we're hoping that the conquerors will just beat us a little less today than they did yesterday. And there's no willingness to fight back because there's no willingness to assert our, again, our preferences, you know, who we are. you know that that guy you know I don't want to say anything bad about it but that whole scene was what should have happened is that he should have stood up there

and actually been the been the guy that they accused him of being and explicitly so confidently so raising his fist in the air one of the things that the takeaway from that Trump assassination event is that the guy hits the deck pops back

up raises his fist and everybody I mean the internet lights up why because you saw a man who's willing to fight men follow man that's always been the way it is and you know you you can't succeed by being led by people who say I oh geez you know if we tinker around the rules here we you know we fix this little thing over here or whatever you're never going to win that way you know It's this attitude that has to change. And that's a hugely complicated and difficult problem. Getting white people to say, you know what, I don't really care what all these other people say, calling me racist or homophobes or, you know, all the isms or all that stuff.

I don't care. This is how I want to live. This is the kind of people I want to be around. These are the rules I want in my society. And I'm not going to accept anything other than these things. So you can negotiate with yourself all you want. but this is what we're going to accept. That's it. That's a big leap from where we are.

Because most white people now, most white people listening to this, probably, flinch at that idea. They flinch at thinking, flinch it telling some black guy in her neighborhood, look, we don't put up with this crap here. We understand that's who you are and all that stuff, and we watch television too, but you don't get to do this here. We're sorry, but you have to go someplace else with that. They would flinch it saying that.

They wouldn't say that. They wouldn't have the courage to say. We have to change this. We have to change how we think. We have to completely revolutionize our mindset. And that's a hard problem. It's a hugely difficult problem. But it isn't going to happen overnight.

It's going to happen kind of slowly and start to build a little here and a little there. And I think, no, no, I've kind of got off track here. But I do think, you know, my experience this evening is that all these Trump people, these Trump supporters, these regular sort of salt of the earth people, and a lot of them are farmers and that kind of stuff, you know, they are a part of the real world. They saw that.

They saw that, hey, they sensed that they were validated because the guy they support is not a guy they support because they figured out some way within the rules to say that they should support him. They support him because he's a lion. You know, he's a, he's not a fox. He's a lion. and they don't care about all the rules.

They're going to support this guy no matter what. And that's a little step, a small step in the direction that we need to go in. Well, that's it, isn't it, right? People are just scared to be called the fascists. People are scared to be called the racist. People are scared of this, scared of that. And it's the brainwashing. It's where it's that feminized society we have where everyone is,

is waiting to pounce on you for saying something, you know, like a devouring mother. So you can't say that. No, no, no. And until we have to invoke like Jungian archetypes like a vengeful son, until people start getting that kind of attitude where they're just like, no, I don't care. You can call me racist all you want. No, I don't care. Call me a fascist.

Okay, great. And what are you going to do? We don't get past this. We don't get past this. And unfortunately, it is, you know, you get around boomers. You get around white boomers and they're the first ones to fall for this. They just fall right into that civil rights act kind of trap where, you know, it's like, well, you know, we don't want to be, we don't want to be mean. Yeah, you know, you'd rather, you'd rather die than be rude.

I mean, I think John Darbyshire, you should say that a long time ago. And look, at some level, you know, I have sympathy for my fellow white people. Because, I mean, look, I sense this too. I mean, you know, part of what makes me who I am is someone who seeks to find accommodation with my neighbors. And, you know, so we can work together and, you know, we can make each other better. I mean, these are all good qualities about us. These are not bad questions. We shouldn't be ashamed of the fact that we're open to new ideas.

and that we like to cooperate and that we're generous to other people. I mean, these are all good qualities. These are things we should be proud of. These are the things that... This is why everybody else envies us and wants to be us, but at the same time knows they can't be us

because we have these things that are just so natural to us that we don't think about them. We don't talk about this stuff. We just accept it. This is who we are. And we bring all these people in and foolishly thinking that,

this is just how everybody is. Well, in fact, that's not the case at all. And they know this more than we know it. And that's why they hate us so much. That's why they're so full of envy. That's why the people who rule over us are so black in their hearts towards us. You know, why they indulge themselves in policies that are harmful to us, but maybe not even helpful to them.

And so we shouldn't shy away from them. should be proud of that. But fundamentally, we've got to figure out a way to start telling each other that it's okay to be defensive of us in order to defend these good qualities, to preserve these good qualities. In other words, our morality has to change in a way and says, you know, instead of just being generous and open and in caring and conscientious and all that stuff, these things have to be subservient to preserving us as a people and as a civilization in order to preserve.

those things that we care about. That's a tough sell, and it's going to require smarter to people than me to come up with the way to do it. But that's what has to happen, I think. All right, well, let's finish up with this question, and I'll let each of answer it. So say Trump gets elected, J.D. Vance is his vice president. What's the best you can expect over the next four years? Jeff?

Well, that's interesting. I wrote something back in not long after Trump won called What Trump Could Do. And I laid out some of the areas where, and let's recall that both the left and the right exalted in creating the superior presidency, right? the ever-shinking Congress. So, you know, if John U and the neoconservatives and the W administration want to create this doctrine of the unitary executive, then they deserve to get it good and hard from one Donald J. Trump as far as I'm concerned. So I think he would have some huge latitude first and foremost in if J.D. Vance is at all legit in the sense that he's not a neocon. in his foreign policy, I don't know, but I think Trump has the right instincts there. And he could certainly back down on the saber rattling with China over Taiwan.

He could certainly be a little bit more hardcore with Netanyahu, whom apparently Trump is pissed at. He could certainly be, you know, help perhaps dial back this ridiculous situation between Russia and Western Europe, whereby Europeans are paying a hell of a lot more for natural gas and oil, and they've shut down all their nuclear plants. So Trump could actually have some real effects on foreign policy for the better, and that would at least allow our absurd federal budget to take a bit of a breather on some of the overseas spending. And I think one of the very first things he could do would be to just tell Israel no moss. you guys need to work it out and that would be a huge benefit for the world. So I think all that's legitimate.

I mean, obviously, as Eman mentioned, there's nothing to be done about entitlements that, you know, a train left the station. It's just mathematically impossible and politically impossible. There's not much you can do about all the other forms of spending. I mean, those are pretty much locked in. So presidents don't really have that power, but what he could do, I think overseas is important. And he could also be a lot more aggressive in allowing states to try to figure things out for themselves. I mean, I think that would be, he could be the anti-Ragan in that sense.

You know, instead of being the great federalizer and trying to use federal dollars as the carrot and stick, he could go the opposite direction. and I think he understands the overturning of Roe v. Wade. I think he gets the fact that that ought to be done at the state level. And let's face it, I mean, this is never, he was never an evangelical or a social conservative. This is not a guy who's animated by abortion or marriage or any of that stuff. I mean, he's a New York guy. And so I think he, he can. could take advantage of the fact that he doesn't have to run for re-election again.

And I think he could take advantage of the fact that he's not quite elderly, but he's quite old, and he could really, you know, cement in his legacy. There's not much more he needs in life after this. And why not go for broke, you know, and have a much better second term. And I think the proof would be in the pudding if he were to win in November. I think we would see even before he was installed in January, we would see who's around him. I mean, if Jared and Ivanka are weaseling their way into a little sub-training office right off the Oval Office, if we've got anything like a John Bolton sniffing around, that's going to be your proof, I'm afraid, Pete.

Yeah, let's hope Jared. And, well, I think this is, this would be the first vice president who wasn't like the, there to represent the Zionists in how many president and how many terms now? I mean, at least going back to, I mean, some people may say Dan Quayle, I think wasn't Bill Chris, wasn't Bill Crystal Dan Quill's chief of staff? I mean, you have to go back to what? Carter? No, no, not even Carter. Maybe Spiro Agnew? Jose, can you answer that one? I think that what we can expect, in my opinion, is some degree of competency to come back to American governance, namely in the form of bringing back competent white males, which are,

becoming increasingly scarce, especially in the public sector because of DEI anti-white programs that have been part and parcel of the civil rights revolution. I think that is one thing that that's one of the few silver linings of a Trump vance administration, despite my misgivings of it in other areas, is that you could see the forgotten man from Middle America be reincorporated into the American polity and playing the role and like bringing back some degree of order and revitalization of certain parts of America. I definitely see some potential for rollback of some of the most pernicious elements of the civil rights revolution and especially in the bureaucracy. But I don't see like wholesale reductions, but I could see some progress made there. I can definitely see, for example, with Russia, Ukraine that get slightly wrapped up, or at least they cut off the money spigot there because I note the belief that there will be massive external forces that will have to compel the U.S. empire to retrench.

And chief among them is going to be just the fact that like this war in this border war really between Russia and you can. Ukraine just doesn't make sense for the U.S. So, like, continue to subsidize. But, yes, I think that, too, on immigration as well, like, the most we could see is probably, realistically, is no expansion of, like, legal migration. Because that is one trend that I saw that was kicking off a lot in Republican and, like, conservative circles where they would be, like, signaling against illegal, but then promoting massive legal migration, which would basically open up the floodgates to

striver-class migrants from the South Asian subcontinent and East Asia. But I do think that the Trump vans administration could put the kibosh on that and just scuttle it altogether. But yeah, my expectations aren't great, but I do think that there are potential avenues where they can score some small wins here and there. Chris, what you got? Yeah, I mean, I think of by some miracle Trump wins and takes power. I think, look, I have some insights here as to what they're thinking about. And I think two things that they'll be mostly focused on is one is having learned from reforming the administrative side of immigration, that they will push through a bunch of administrative changes that will be intended.

to not only address the illegal immigration problem, but immigration in general, but also make it extremely difficult for the subsequent administration to reverse them. There's a lesson they do seem to have learned from the first term and what Biden did, like, in January of 2021. I think the other thing they're going to do is build on the Chevron case. and seek to really strip the administrative state of a great deal of authority, pushing a lot of this stuff back into Congress. Now, I don't really, my sense is they haven't really thought it all through completely,

but because, I mean, it's an enormous change in how things are done. But that will be a big deal. That's going to be a huge deal for the American economy and how we think about business. The idea of, you know, most major corporations now understand that they've got to win friends in the, you know, administrative state. You know, whoever they're being regulated by or their industry is regulated by, that's where they need to focus their attention. They don't really focus their attention that much on Congress as much as people suspect that, you know, corporate money flows into Congress. It flows into all parties and all people because that this buys them friends in the administrative state. So that's going to be a new relationship

Because now all of a sudden you actually have to buy friends in Congress And that's going to be a huge deal People don't realize how big a deal that is And I think that the Trump people understand that They smell some blood in the water there Based on a Supreme Court case I'm a little concerned that they haven't learned anything About foreign policy

I think I don't know A lot of the stuff that I hear from these guys It doesn't seem like they've really learned a lot But then again, you know I'm kind of a hard ass when it comes to the neoconservatives. So maybe my bias is there. I don't know. But other than that, I mean, I think if Trump does win by some miracle, it's going to be,

it's going to be hell, man. It's going to make his first term look like a walk in the park. The bad guys are going to go balls to the wall on this guy. And, you know, that event in Pennsylvania, that's not going to be the last of it. They're going to come after him with everything. And so it's, you know, my prediction is if Trump wins by some miracle, it's going to make 2016, or that the first term, it looks like a walk in the park.

Well, whatever happens, for those of us who have podcasts and other things, it's going to be good for us. It'll provide us with tons of material to talk about. Jeff, I appreciate you doing this with me. Let's do it again real soon. Jose, same. And Chris, I know you weren't invited, but thanks for, thanks for joining it and adding to it. Really appreciate it.

Hey, thanks for having. Thanks for having. I really had a great time chatting with y'all. All right, everybody. Take care of yourselves. Have a great weekend. Bye.