The Pete Quiñones Show - Episode 1324: Pre-1945 German/Islam Relations w/ Thomas777 - Pt. 3 - Finale

Episode Date: February 1, 2026

64 MinutesPG-13Thomas777 is a revisionist historian and a fiction writer.We conclude our break from the 30 Years War series. Thomas continues a short series on pre-1945 Germany's relationship with the Moslem world.Radio Free Chicago - T777 and J BurdenThomas777 MerchandiseThomas' Buy Me a CoffeeThomas' Book "Steelstorm Pt. 1"Thomas' Book "Steelstorm Pt. 2"Thomas' WebsiteThomas on TwitterThomas' CashApp - $7homas777Pete and Thomas777 'At the Movies'Support Pete on His WebsitePete's PatreonPete's SubstackPete's SubscribestarPete's GUMROADPete's VenmoPete's Buy Me a CoffeePete on FacebookPete on TwitterBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-pete-quinones-show--6071361/support.

If you want to get the show early and ad-free, head on over to the piquinones show.com. There you can choose from where you wish to support me. Now listen very carefully. I've had some people ask me about this, even though I think on the last ad I stated it pretty clearly. If you want an RSS feed, you're going to have to subscribe through substack or through Patreon. You can also subscribe on my website, which is right there. Gumroad, and what's the other one?

Subscribe Star. And if you do that, you will get access to the audio file. So head on over to the Pekignonez Show.com. You'll see all the ways that you can support me there. And I just want to thank everyone. It's because of you that I can put out the amount of material that I do. I can do what I'm doing with Dr. Johnson on 200 years together and everything else. the things that Thomas and I are doing together on continental philosophy.

It's all because of you. And yeah, I mean, I'll never be able to thank you enough. So thank you. The Pekingona Show.com. Everything's there. I want to welcome everyone back to the Pekina Show. Thomas is here and this little meeting series doing on Islam and the Third Reich and Germany in general. We're going to close that out today.

So, you know, what we've heard from the subs is they're really enjoying this. So thank you for the recommendation on this. Great subject. I've learned a lot. And, you know, take it away. Thank you. That makes me very happy. And I appreciate the subs and their kind words and feedback.

That's essential. This is an important subject matter for a lot of reasons. I generally agree with Ernst & Lutti. Islamic dialectics are very important to the post-Cold War historical process in conceptual terms. I don't think that needs to be said. Additionally, and I'm including this as sort of an addendum to my manuscript. That's one of the reasons I haven't submitted it for formal editing to a publisher yet. there's this myth, some of which derives from the testimony of Albert Speer, which I consider to be not remotely credible, obviously. He described the final months of the German

Reich as Hitler developing this sort of nihilistic apathy, punctuated by fits of rage, to an impulse to sort of burn everything down. Hitler's actions don't indicate that. And I've emphasized, I'm bringing this back to the subject matter, I'm not on a senile tangent, I promise. I emphasize the fact of Donets being designated as successor, not just because Hitler thought that he was a man the allies would find acceptable, and they did.

other than Yodel, he was really the only Nuremberg defendant that people in the United Kingdom, not just the Admiralty, but a lot of the aristocracy and even people in the war cabinet came to the defense of. But also, there was an understanding that the post-war world would need some sort of resistance. legacy if Europe was going to survive and if the national socialist cause was going to survive, albeit in a historically contingent configuration. And that's a subject for a whole, we could do a whole series on that. And like I said, I'm dedicating the final third approximately of my manuscript to this subject matter. one of the only authors who I think truly understands that and who really understands that there was a fascist international of a sort during the Cold War and beyond is Kevin Coogan. He was an unusual guy.

He wrote a biography of Francis Yockey called Dreamer of the Day Francis Parker Yaki and the Post were Fascist International. This was released in 1999. It's actually a fantastic book. H. Keith Thompson contributed to it and allowed his testimony to be included. Elsa DeVitt, who was a longtime mistress of Francis Yaqui, she participated in it and proffered a lot of her testimony, as well as personal effects and papers that had belonged to Yaki and things. you know coogan is definitely a left winger but of a more serious type and i mean the fact that

some of these personages we're willing to participate in the book project speaks for itself it's not a purely punitive treatment but the real value of it especially if you're reading it as a researcher there's a couple of hundred pages of footnotes and end notes that are really incredible, including a substantial amount of material about Johann von Leer's, about Der Weig and the National Socialist Resistance in Argentina and then in the Near East. And I highly recommend that book to students of the subject matter, as well as people who are just curious students of history, you want to get a better understanding of the subject matter.

But I raised Coogan, not just because I like that book, but, you know, again, he's one of the only authors I know of who has a deep understanding of this phenomenon. And the efforts particularly of the SS and the SD, to curate a national socialist sensibility among Muslim populations, this ramped up in earnest in the final year and a half of the war when it became clear that NSEG was no longer possible. And it's not because everybody was delusional.

It's not owing to some desperation, born of manpower shortages or any of those confabulations. It was because at base, and particularly in the Vof and S, the truly diehard national socialists who were ideologically committed, they had a profoundly hegelian view of the war and of the historical process generally. And of course, Germany was not a stranger to these sorts of apocalyptic conditions.

We're talking about our 30-year-s war series, I think in the first episode. We were talking about Hitler himself and Speer, speaking of Speer, as well as many personages within the traditional military establishment, as well as the National Socialist cadre that took over the government, the historical poll star of these people

was the 30 years war and the destruction of Germany, the destruction of the First Reich, and the scattering of the German racial organism to the proverbial four winds. And in their mind, it had taken centuries to reconstitute the German name. and to bring Europe into a organizational modality whereby it could fulfill its historical mission. And in their estimation, this had taken close to three centuries.

So there was an understanding that a similar process was email. emergent in 94-45. And there was the added challenge of a world dominated by the communists and by the American Zionist occupation that was looming. Both of these challenges were related. That's why these ideological schema were quite literally allied. but they were also very distinguishable in terms of what they represented and what they were trying to accomplish in terms of creating a global political regime and the tactics required to counteract those efforts to break people of their identity and characteristics and historical memory were somewhat different depending on whether

the population of the question were those situated in the east or in the west and moslem populations were under unique pressure from the communists and this endured throughout the existence of the Soviet Union the Islamic revolt was one of a many proximate causes that ultimately brought the Soviet Union down. I think that's irrebuttable. So that's something that is important to understand here. And that's one of the reasons why this remains a relevant subject matter. It's not just some sort of trivial curiosity related to aspects.

of the war that are sort of not commonly emphasized. But the role of the grand mofdi too, to change focus just a little bit, the way that he's cast in the historical record is somewhat incorrect. There's people with a superficial understanding of national socialism, and there's some Palestinian liberation

as to mean, well, but they're somewhat conceptually impoverished in their understanding of the historical record. They cast the Mufti as almost like a Palestinian Nassar. That's not really accurate. I made the point that I believe, if he can be analogized to any contemporary, it'd be Said Kutu.

And if you know anything about, Islam, particularly pious Sunni Islam, the role of a Mufti is not that of a political soldier. It's different. There's definitely a partisan aspect that goes up saying, but the Mufti also, he didn't have a sense of pan-Arabism. What became sort of the rallying cry of the resistance in the near, East, which is a combination of pan-Arabism and an east block aligned, but discernibly non-communist, sort of militant socialism. That was not what he viewed as the way forward for Palestinians. And he was absolutely a pan-Islamist, but he didn't view pan-Arabism as a meaningful concept,

and frankly, it's not. On the other side, Zayat, Zionists then and now have tried to cast the move to as sort of a Palestinian Kodriyanu or some sort of, or some sort of ethno-sectarian nationalist who's a mirror of themselves, of themselves, who wanted to annihilate jury owing to some sort of highly binary, zero-sum concept of racial and sectarian struggle in the region. That's naked propaganda. And interestingly, when people in the Churchill government, who are particularly sympathetic to Zionist perspective,

tried to convince the home office of these things, and when as far as trying to push the British authorities to try and capture the El Hussein, this was quickly quashed. And British intelligence simply refused to pursue it. And there was an internal memo that indicated that this was a propaganda effort devised by Zionists on the ground who were concerned about a leadership cadre reconstituting among their enemies, which they'd pretty successfully decapitated by this juncture.

And to be clear, that Murphy was in exile from 1936 on, we're going to the Arab revolt. The Arab revolt is complicated. I don't want to deep dive into that right now. Briefly, it was a general strike. It was an uprising. As more and more European Jews, streamed into Palestine, it became clear that the Palestinians were going to be ethnically

cleansed. Okay. And we talked about how the British were inconsistent and how they responded to ethnocectarian violence and, you know, categorical attacks upon Palestinians to realize annihilation-oriented goals by the Zionists. So this represented an existential fear. It wasn't just a question of resistance to Palestine being dominated by a hostile Jewish majority on the ground. There was an element among Palestinians underarms, too, that had always favored an armed struggle. And their reasoning was, we've got to pull the trigger now before. the situation deteriorates the point that it's no longer possible.

There was a pious Islamist organization that was also highly militant, led by Isle Dene al-Kasam. He was a Sheikh and something of a lesser aristocrat, but it was also a dedicated revolutionary. And as early as the mid-1920s, he was the demanding that money that was coming into mosques, the equivalent of alms, be spent on arms and military needs, rather than on, you know, proselytizing and, and, um, and traditional ecclesiastical activities and things of that nature, you know, the equivalent therein. Um, this caused tension between him and El Hussein. he'd approach Al Hussein and tried to cultivate his friendship and asked to be brought on to the Supreme Moslem Council as an itinerant preacher of sorts.

And Hussein he turned him away but did help him find a permanent place in a mosque that would be more receptive to his revolution. concept. This is viewed as some people too, including, again, some Palestinian liberationists who mean well today as being perfidious and Alicini being political. I don't think that's fair. And Alessini also knew that his people weren't in a position to win at that moment. He was continuing to try and curate a relationship with the British, too, out of necessity, owing to, again, the hopelessness of the military situation at that juncture. But as it happened, in 1936, a general strike did kick off. And once the uprising began, the move that he stood with Palestine.

He was very much accused, though, of fermenting this and being a leader of it. the British commanders on the ground who he'd curated a relationship with, I believe they talked to the foreign office and British intelligence, that's why the move he wasn't harmed. He was allowed to live in exile relatively undisturbed at that juncture, because, you know, it was clear that he wasn't devising a revolutionary resistance movement. He wasn't trying to force a kinetic outcome to then extend conditions. But this was when Al-Sini began approaching representatives of the third.

Reich and they began approaching him and we talked about Gottlob Burger and elements within the both the Algemann SS and in various party offices who viewed this as a imperative and Al-Hsaint he only met with Hitler face-to-face once in November 1941 but the fact that he met him at all is remarkable because it was not easy to gain access to Hitler. What he was able to procure, Hitler guaranteed, and he convinced Il Ducche to co-sign this guarantee,

that after the defeat of the British Empire, Palestine would become an Arab state and would be ethnically cleansed of Jews. Whether the Mufti would become the rifti would become the ruler of that state. I find that unlikely. Again, there's, it's complicated how traditional Islamic authority is organized. You know, and to be clear, people get that people have this misconception because first of all, they'll look at a place like Iran. And of course, there's a sectarian divide there because Shia and Sunni are very different. And even within those

broad sects, there's, there's differences within Sunni Islam and Shia Islam. that are profound. The Iranian government called itself the revolutionary government precisely because it's not this reactionary regime. The Foucault, one of the few essays he wrote that's oriented towards ideological praxis

that's in a direct capacity. He went to Tehran as the revolution was underway and he made made the point that this was something people hadn't seen before. It wasn't some reactionary regime of clerics. It was very much an Islamic movement,

but it was a hybrid ideology that was a truly third positionist tenancy in the true sense. Okay. Al Husseini didn't represent some super, variant of that. And also, once what became the Palestinian Liberation Movement, its proverbial DNA is in the Arab Revolt and in the men who they took inspiration from. And the Mofti wasn't really part of that. You know, he definitely was a partisan and he took on the function of a political soldier as he became insinuated into the SS organization,

but military command and political credibility became inextricably bound up in theater. And that, some of that addures to this day, but, you know, it's not this idea that the Mufti simply approached Hitler because he had ambitions to become emperor of Palestine or the boss of the Arab committee or something and wanted to parlay that into authority over a Palestinian ethno state that was going to emerge at N.C. I don't think that's credible. What was important was that he got a guarantee from Hitler. He had the patronage of the axis. and it guaranteed

that forces would be brought to bear and Hitler made clear to him Hitler said he believed in the Arab people and he believed in the Sunni's cause which I think was true but he also said that the German Reich had essential interests

in the region and they expected the Palestinians to help those things be realized so obviously it was a real politicistic aspect to this too. But both men came to realize

also that this had become a planetary struggle. You know, and by November 1941, America wasn't as, I mean, America

de facto was a war with Germany from September, 1941 onwards. The Reich was the Vermeck was closing in on Moscow. And it became clear that the struggle was global in character. And even after final victory was realized, which appeared to be eminent, as in November 1941, no, Germany needed allies in newly liberated, formerly colonial spaces.

but there was also a basic affinity and that's coded into national socialism through influences like Schopenhauer and things and the German character generally. Hitler wasn't some orientalist like von Leer's, but I think it's clear to all but the most literal and binary minds when I'm getting at. And towards that, I mentioned before about Oberghruppin-Fir and Genoa de Vaffin-Siss Gat-Lauberger,

who I think was a fascinating individual. And he was a key personage in forcing the through policies within the SS relating to the alliance with not just the, Palestinians and al-Husini but with the Islamic nationalities in the East he clarified Burr said and I'm paraphrasing the relationship between Islam and national socialism there's a vocish imperative but what is not intended as a synthesis he said quote it is not intended to find a synthesis of Islam and national socialism or to national socialism on the Muslims. Rather,

national socialism is to be seen as the genuine focused German worldview, while Islam is to be seen as the genuine focus Arabic worldview. He was using Arabic as a stand-in for I mean, obviously the land of the prophet and the Arabic language

and Muhammad himself means that Arab cultural forms have an outsized significance in Islam. He was using Arabic in the Arabic rule of view in a Spanglarian sense to include, you know, and most of the Islamic elements under the Reich authority were not Arab. And again, there was this emphasis on Syria Yavl and specifically in Bosnia. as the as the heartland of European Islam and thus there to be given priority and

Berger emphasized that and mind you burger was a he was second only to the Reich sphere SS Himmler in his rank he held rank equivalent to Paul Hauser and Sep Dietrich so he his word was a law within the organization. Then he clarified that the Muslims, the Balkans, were racially part of the Germanic world. Well, ideologically and spiritually, part of the Arab world.

So he said, among other things, these Balkan Muslim peoples, they represent, you know, what the complementary aspects are of this alliance. and this unity of Velt and Song against communism and Jewry. And he continued by saying, through the deployment of a Muslim SS division, speaking of the Bosniaks here, there may hereby, for the first time,

be established a connection between Islam and national socialism, or rather between the Arab and the Germanic world on an open, honest basis. Is this division, in terms of blood, race is influenced by the North in terms of geology in contrast by the Orient. I think I got into in the last episode, I tried to clarify by reference to my outlines what I covered, so stop me if I'm being redundant. But in 1944, the SS head office at behest of Berger, they established two Islamic Centers for Religious Education.

The first one, which I think I got into a bit, was open in April 1944. It was in a small town called Gubin in Brandenburg. This was the Emom Institute, and we talked about emoms in the Vof and SS and the important role they played at not just divisional level, but at company and even platoon level. and this Al Hussein himself attended a ceremony with Gottlob Burger and an imam named Hussein de Zozozo who was a Bosniak. More significant particularly to the subject matter that I started this discussion with with what was colloquially called the SS Mullis School.

It was a, it didn't formally, it wasn't formally established until November 44. And once again, there was an inauguration ceremony tailored to celebrate and emphasize a Germanic Mazzam Alliance. The opening speech was proffered by Walter Schellenberg. and the emphasis of it was interesting because again it seemed very much coded towards a post-war world and proceeding under hostile occupation without without resorting the language that suggested what in the national socialist ideological culture would be looked upon pejoratively as defeatism.

but the crux of Schillensberg's speech was the historical associations, the traditional bonds between the Kaiser Reich and Darl Islam, the longstanding support for Muslim peoples who were besieged by Jewish tyranny. And it emphasized, too, that the Soviet Union, by its very existence, it represented a assault, not just on folkish ways of life, but on all confessional practices and cultural expressions, first among them Islam. And Schellenberg specifically said that the fulkish core of Russia had been

destroyed for all practical purposes and totally deracinated and that the non-Russian people under occupation and on the periphery of the Soviet Empire were similarly

being targeted for destruction and their fate would be the same as that of the Russians if an effective resistance wasn't

cultivated and the only way that that could be realized is by the dual commitment to racial hygiene and confessional piousness and in this respect Schellenberg said Islam was the

quote custodian of the eastern people and their biological substance as well as their confessional heritage in linear terms back to the time of the prophet. And he concluded by saying that because the Bolsheviks lack traditions of the past, they're not long for this earth, but that Muslims are able to cope with the future,

no matter what hardships emerge, because not just to the racial purity of the several populations who are very tribally randed, who constituted the Eastern Muslims, but that basically their faith would carry them through the historical destruction of Bolshevism and the racially impure intermention who are the standard bearers of the Bolshevik ideology, who are really just the vestigal remnants of the Russian racial racial, core that died in the Soviet death camps. Very, very heady stuff.

Not, not typical, just sort of grab bagged propaganda. You know, and this is important. And the Mullah school, it was far larger than the Eam school. It was based at this villa in this affluent, neighborhood outside of Dresden. There was this Victor Clemper.

He was this Jewish writer who curiously, you know, didn't get like shot into space or something by the Nazi Holocaust. But he was, a lot of people, I think including Shire, William Shire,

who wrote a very silly book that a lot of court historians hold out as some great treatment of the Third Reich. Of course, Shiret pulled it. There was the rising fall of the third Reich, and then there was the nightmare years. That's an objective and not at all hysterical

title for a history book. But Victor Clemfer, he kept diaries and he documented his observations on various things. They really like to keep diaries, don't they? Well, to be fair, that was something people did in those

I mean, I'm talking actual people, not fictitious diaries of, you know, girls who wrote like Judy Blume books that were marketed for like 1970s junior high students. You know, most, I mean, Gerbils was especially prolific, but Yodel kept a diary, so did Keitel, so did Rosenberg, Alfred Rosenberg, so did Earhart Milch. No, I take your point. but Clemper's diary, I believe, was real. And he noted, he was observing, obviously, from without, what was going on in this old but rather stately property,

which I believe was a repurposed hotel in Blasfitz, this neighborhood of Dresden. And he said there was a quote, mysterious Muslim study group there. I just a few might not relate but I uh what I read that uh I had this I had this funny image of this like little nebish dude like peeking out at uh at these like SS posbi eggs going in a going in out of this coffee building and saying it was like what's what is going on I don't know, maybe I'm prone to

silly silly kind of shit like that but moving on it it can't it can't you can't chug this up

to some sort of you know effort to corral hapless POWs in the frontline service or something to flesh out the ranks of of devastated divisions and battalions,

you know, the people who suggest that sort of thing don't know the subject matter. And there was a guy named Rainer Oshachcha, he was assigned to set things up in the Mullah School. and make it culturally compliant with the students who'd be attending it. So, Oshaka, he decked out the interior of the building in ways that reflected Islamic architectural styles. The main entrance hall was decorated with a mosaic pattern specifically after mosques

in Central Asia. There was a lot of, you know, Islamic artifacts on loan from museums in the Greater German Reich. There was a Quranic verses and calligraphy painted into the walls. There was a prayer niche in one of the main assembly areas. There was an ornate prayer. Hall, which was sort of the center of activity on the ground floor. You know, and so I mean, the SS went out of their way to create an authentically Islamic

environment. And they went as far as to hire Kurt Erdman. He was the foremost expert on Islam. culture and art history in the Oriental Department of the Pergamon Museum in Berlin. And he consulted with architects from Berlin in Dresden to mock this up. And it took half a year. There was a great library. It had authentic Islamic texts from France, from Bosnia, from the Netherlands.

including rare ancient texts that have been purchased in Sarajevo around this time anybody no matter there any any folks Deutsch or any any non-Jewish outlander could obtain a free Koran

from the propaganda ministry just by asking for one there weren't a lot of Korans that have been properly translated into German, so an effort was made to remedy that by the propaganda ministry. And one of the reasons for these efforts was the SS wanted to attract top religious scholars and imams to teach at the school, but also to attend it for political education and military education. within the SS model.

And reading between the lines, you know, again, this is the last year of the war under desperate conditions, they were looking to build cadres. They were looking to build dedicated national socialist cadres within these populations for a post-war world.

You know, I, that should, be clear to anybody who understands what they're looking at, metaphorically speaking, I think. Alam John Idris, or Idris, he was coveted as director of the Mullah school, but he was still in the service of the propaganda ministry, as well as the foreign office and he was the top man in charge of propaganda in the Islamic world and neither the foreign office nor the nor gerbils would let him go you know and again this they were emphasizing the propaganda aspect in theater and in Palestine as well as in among the nationalities and in the Soviet Union and uh

Of course, in Bosnia, but the Bosni acts, again, they, they were racial Europeans. And most of them were multilingual just because of where they lived. You know, and they had a privileged position within the, within the Reich. So it was, it would have been redundant to make them the, the focus. group of these efforts if you follow me but nevertheless ultimately the propaganda ministry they let Idris preside over the mullah school three days a week um he was young comparatively charismatic he was very modern and had western habits he had a great admiration for the European

culture and he assimilated very well into Germany culturally but he was also a very very dedicated Muslim he was kind of viewed as the model Muslim National Socialist he had a son

who worked as an interpreter and then ultimately joined the Eastern Muslim SS Corps in the final year of the war. And that obviously was, I mean, I, anybody who joined that late in the game

knew there was a good chance, they weren't coming home. I mean, he was a dedicated, he was coming to the jihad, but he, this also was something of a propaganda coup. You know, look, this wealthy Mullahs offering up his son to fight for the Reich. It's no small thing, obviously. You know, and the SS insisted on only employing Muslims as teachers in the Mullah school, in contrast to the Vermat.

And in contrast to other party institutions that dealt with the education and political indoctination of Muslim peoples, the SS took this very seriously. you know and that um that tracks with its overall orientation you know the it's a fascinating sort of um aspect to the rites relationship to romania you know Hitler uh Antonescu and Hitler were very close and Antonescu was probably the fear as best ally. And I mean, Romania sacrificed tremendously for the access cause. And also the fact that they, when Stalin began World War II with this war of conquest, obviously Romania was very much in the crosshairs of Moscow. So there was an existential imperative as to why they'd welcome the Vermaq deploying its scale there, but also obviously Antonescu,

not only to commit close to a quarter million men to Barbarossa, but he availed Romania as a staging ground for a huge component of Reich forces in being in operational terms. But later, you know, Antonescu, he, presided over the brief national legionary state and then he banned the iron guard owing to what he viewed as their revolutionary subversion this was in the aftermath of this is when Sima had succeeded Kodriano who'd been murdered but the SS famously they backed the iron guard against Kodriano who the fear himself, you know, unconditionally backed Kodriano.

There was an SS ideology into itself, which was very pan-European, very revolutionary, very different, not just from the Vermecht and traditional German society and even traditional German military culture, but distinguishable from the mainstream of the NSDAP as well. and I find it fascinating. But to bring it back to the subject of hand, one thing that the Mullah School emphasized, and this is another reason why they insisted on on Muslim teachers exclusively,

the theological program, it was very oriented towards overcoming sectarian hostilities. And in the essay, tried to prioritize bridging the divide between Sunnis and Shiites. There's a constant emphasis against religious sectarianism among Muslims. You know, and traditionally in, in Vermont units where traditionally, Shia and Sunnis were segregated. And the SS were not only refused to do that, but they pursued an anti-sectarian line.

And the emphasis again was that the schism was contrived by men who coveted worldly power after the assent of the prophet to heaven. and that the current struggle where the dual threat in existential terms to the Islamic faith and to the race of the nationalities and populations that constituted Darul Islam that

that calls for a healing of the schism even were it not a contrivance premised unworldly and thus axiatically corrupt

the ambitions you know and again the implication in my opinion is obvious it's you know we a political soldier looking ahead circa 1944-45 needs to adopt as its primary concern

the racial survival of his people and the continuity of his faith on this planet in the face of the dual

assault of of Zionism and communism and we'll stop it there I hope this wasn't, I hope people got something out of this. I mean, I presume they did because people have been very nice in their feedback. No, I mean, if anything, I would like to hear more people not talk about Islam, like they're a boomer right after 9-11. Well, yeah, I mean, they're idiots.

That's one of the reasons. of I mean, we've got Islamic comrades who are great, but beyond that, you know, I don't, well, just the only people whip off at me about World War II or about the law. It's like, oh, you're the expert, you know, how, like, you watch a lot of TV, you watch a lot of cable legacy media, so you're an Islam expert. I mean, I, that's why, that's why, that's why I emphasize these topics, because even in, supposedly disincoded spaces. These people are

conceptual illiterates by and large. But you can't, the fun of the reason I'm trying to get more guys who have a theological expertise or their background

is, you know, in Bible Christianity or Catholicism or Orthodoxy or Islam, because that I mean, at the end of the day, I mean, I, like we've talked about, it's, I'm more a capital T radical tradition with us than I'm anything, probably. I mean, you're talking about like my political philosophy, you know, I mean, I identify as a yakiist national socialist, but what the, it's Renee Ginoon, it's Marcia Eliotti, Julius Evela. that's a substantial part of my canon if you want to look it like that okay and there's this kind of

dummy anti-intellectualism that's just hostile to to theology and religion you know you know that that's common to any epoch really you know um even people i've argued that point with some of our Orthodox friends, some of our Catholic friends, who view the medieval era as a period of high culture that's unduly maligned, which is absolutely true. Casting the Middle Ages as a sort of hellish time of cultural poverty, I mean, that's ridiculous. I mean, I don't know how any Anglophone person can think that way anyway. I mean, our Thurian lore and the Ulster cycle, if you're somebody like me, that's like only the King James Bible. you know like I and that that that comes out of the horrifying medieval era you know but beyond that I think some people they kind of view with the rose-colored glasses they have this idea oh well then there was this there's this integrated concept you know that they mean in terms of the

trifunctional hypothesis but they mean that religious life informed everyday sensibilities and That's somewhat true, but I think it was, I think most people, and not talking about class, this doesn't know class in terms of where these sensibilities are concentrated, but I think most people, even then, it was a very kind of superficial thing, you know, people are always going to look at scantz at you if you take religion seriously, and you want to emphasize it as the subject matter that is, is your sort of topical focus, you know. But yeah, I, people like that are,

I don't know, I mean I, I've had to get habituated in tuning out ignorant people because they're all around me and they're all really noisy. They're, I don't know, you know. I'm not here to educate morons and I'm not, not here to like listen to assholes lip off on things they don't know about so i just the minority of people who want to talk about serious stuff and acting like little fucking kids i mean it you know those the people i want to interact with all right everybody go over to thomas's

substack uh real thomas seven seven seven dot substack.com and check out his website thomas seven seven dot com the t is a seven and you can hook up with him uh from there Thank you, Thomas. Appreciate it. Thank you, ma'am.