The Pete Quiñones Show - Reading Solzhenitsyn's '200 Years Together' w/ Dr. Matthew Raphael Johnson - Part 5

Episode Date: January 22, 2025

55 MinutesPG-13Dr. Matthew Raphael Johnson is a researcher, writer, and former professor of history and political science, specializing in Russian history and political ideology.Pete and Dr. Johnson continue a project in which Pete reads Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn's '200 Years Together," and Dr' Johnson provides commentary.Dr Johnson's PatreonRusJournal.orgTHE ORTHODOX NATIONALISTDr. Johnson's Radio Albion PageDr. Johnson's Books on AmazonPete and Thomas777 'At the Movies'Support Pete on His WebsitePete's PatreonPete's SubstackPete's SubscribestarPete's GUMROADPete's VenmoPete's Buy Me a CoffeePete on FacebookPete on TwitterBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-pete-quinones-show--6071361/support.

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with vouchers from Trump Dunebag. Search Trump-Ireland gift vouchers. Trump on Doonbiog, Kush Faragea. If you want to support the show and get the episodes early and ad-free, head on over to freeman Beyond the Wall.com forward slash support. I want to explain something right now. If you support me through Substack or Patreon, you have access to an RSS feed that you can plug into any podcatcher

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And yeah, can't do it without you. So thank you for the support. Head on over to freeman beyond the wall.com forward slash support and do it there. Thank you. I want to welcome everyone back to the Pekignano show. We are here for part five of 200 years together by Alexander Solzhenycin. And I listened back to one of the episodes that we did. And I actually said in the beginning that his name was Alexander Solzheniski.

I actually pronounced it that way. I felt like a tarred after I did that. We've all done things like that. I do weird things like that all the time. Yeah, I could assure you you not a tard. I promise. Okay. So how are you doing?

Well, I'm doing very well. The snow keeps coming down. Makes me very happy. You know, we are snowed in an Appalachia, and it puts me in a good mood, I have to tell you. Awesome. Awesome. Yeah. Yeah.

Being trapped, being trapped inside the house, as long as you have everything you need is not as bad as a lot of people try to make it out to be. Yep. That's very true. No complaints out of me. Yep. All right. So we have, we're going to start, pick up where we left off. And this is a long paragraph.

so let's just jump right in. Thereafter, he laid out by layers and explicitly the measures to be recommended, and in doing so gave proof of his economic and statesman-like competence. First, that the Jews should have no occasion for any kind of irritation to send them into fight or even to murmur quietly. They are to be reassured of protection in favor by a manifest of the Tsar, in which should be strengthened the principle of tolerance towards their faith and maintenance of the privileges granted by Catherine, only with one small change for the previous principle,

but those that will not submit to these principles shall not be given freedom to emigrate, a demand that far exceeded in point the freedom, the 20th century, the point of freedom the 20th century Soviet Union. Immediately thereafter, it states, after a specific time interval after which all new credit is temporarily forbidden, all claims of debt between Jews and Christians to be ordered, documented, and cleared in order to restore the earlier relation of trust so that in the future not the slightest obstruction should be found for the transformation of the Jews to a different way of life, for the relocation to other districts

or in the old places, for the assignment of a new life conditions. Free of debt, the Jews are thus to be made as soon as possible into free man for the reforms. From the vantage point of the publication of the manifest, are all dues assessed by Jews for the equalization of debt of poor people is to apply to poor Jews to deflect the payment of Cahal debts or for the furnishings for migrants. From the one group, no taxes to be levied for three years, years, from the other for six years, and instead that money is to be dedicated to the setting up

of factories and workplaces for these Jews. Landowners must abandon obligating Jews in their stettles to set up various factories and instead begin on their estates to cultivate grain in order that they may earn their bread with their own hands, but under no circumstances as liquor to be sold anywhere secretly or openly, or these landowners would themselves lose their rights to the production of liquor. It was also a non-negotiable to carry out a universal exact census of the population under responsibility of the Cahal elders. For those that had no property to declare as merchant or townsmen, two new classes were

to be created with smaller income. Village burgers and colonists, where the denotation Christianian farmer, would not be used because of its similarity to the word Christian. The Jewish settlers would have to be regarded as free as not as serfs, but under no condition or pretext may they dare to expand themselves into the domain of magistrates and town fathers, so that they not gain any special rights over Christians. After they have declared their wish to be enrolled in a particular status,

then must the necessary number of young men be sent to Petersburg, Moscow, or Riga, one group to learn the keeping of merchant books, second to learn a trade, the third to attend schools for agriculture and land management. Meanwhile, some energetic and precise Jews should be selected as deputies for all these areas where land is designated for colonization. There follows minutia on the arrangement of plans surveying the land, housing construction, the order to release different groups of settlers, the rights in transit, the grace period in which they were. would remain tax-free, all these details that D'Arjavan laid out so carefully we passed by. Thank God. On the inner... I'm sorry? I said, thank God for that.

On the inner ordering of the Jewish congregation, in order to place the Jews under the secular authorities, just the same as everyone else, the Kehilat may not continue in any form. together with the abolishment of the Kahilat is likewise abolished all previous profiteering assessments which the Kahilat raised from the Jewish people and at the same time the secular taxes are to be assessed as with the other subjects, not doubled. And the schools and synagogues must be protected by laws. The males may not marry younger than 17 nor the females than 15 years. Then there is a section on education and enlightenment of the Jews. The Jewish schools to the 12th year, and thereafter the general schools are to become more like those of other religions. Those, however, that have achieved

distinction in the high sciences are to be received in the academies and universities as honorary associate, doctors, professors, but they are not to be taken into the rank of officers and staff officers because although they may also be taken into the military service, they will, for example, not take up arms against the enemy on Saturday, which in fact often does happen. Presses for Jewish books are to be constructed, along with synagogues, along with synagogues are to be constructed in Jewish hospitals, poorhouses, and orphanages. Ready for huge savings? We'll mark your calendars from November 28 to 30th because the Liddle Newbridge Warehouse sale

is back. We're talking thousands of your favourite Lidl items, all reduced to clear. From home essentials to seasonal must-habs, when the doors open, the deals go fast. Come see for yourself. The Liddle Newbridge Warehouse Sale 28th to 30th of November.

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On Doonbiog, Kush Farrague. Well, there's a lot here. Now, these are, you know, I can only assume that people hearing this have heard the previous four. Otherwise, nothing is going to make any sense at this point. But what we're talking about are the results of Dersavans' commission under the Emperor Paul. Paul will be murdered pretty soon. And the Jews will succeed at least temporarily in getting rid of Dersavans. and from these committees.

We're going to talk about that in more detail when we get to the section of Alexander I. But there's a lot of contradictory things here. Now, I neglected to mention last time that Dersav's understanding that the Jews, at least in part, came from many of the so-called liberated Jews, Jews that had no connection to the Kajal, especially in Germany.

not quite assimilationist at this point, but leading the so-called Jewish Enlightenment. I don't know if everything that they told him was accurate because in discussing the Jews with these individuals, I don't know if they're ever named. I think one of them is. But this whole notion of trying to place them directly under Tsarist law, which is, of course, an Orthodox government,

especially under Paul, was simply out of the question. There seems to be this drive to, and this is all done with the best philosemitic intentions. Now, if they didn't like this, there was a slight misreading that they were allowed to emigrate if they didn't like this with all their property and everything else. my favorite part of this is again this is there's a translation issue i didn't translate this when i first did it um this section a long time ago but the but the the the quote zelsenitzen says um there's a specific interval if this is to be instituted afterwards all new credit is temporarily forbidden and all claims of debt between jews and christians are to be ordered documented

and then cleared. Now, between Jews and Christians, well, the dead only went one way, and I think we all know that. And the point of that is to make it easier. This is almost a sort of a form of coercion

for the quote-unquote transformation of the Jews to a different way of life, including their relocation, new life conditions. Now, the way Dersavin stated this, he's really talking about this being a benefit to Jews, but we all know the Jews were the, the creditors. The only time they may not have been is within their own, because he does mention poor Jews

here who are not treated very well, but are kept to the cahal. And then in fact, he comes out and says the cahal is going to be eliminated. There's this back and forth, whether it's strong, whether it's weak, it was weakened at the end of the Polish Empire, it grew in strength again. But because there was a lot of poor Jews in the Kahul, they were no longer going to be bound to it and were free to become townsmen

or merchants or anything else. That they were not serfs. They would be granted land. And really the only condition, other than the dent thing, is that they couldn't employ any Christians. So they're, you know, they're trying to completely remake Jewish life, which given the context, is extremely naive.

That word's going to come up a lot because it really is. They're going to be tax-free for a while. There are so-called profiteering assessments, which is all the scams that we talked about already, and they'll be under secular taxation. But on the other hand, their grant of land will be free and clear. they will not be served under any circumstances their schools will be protected and everything else

but this today in 2025 we realize that this is a very strange approach to the Jewish question and Russia was not the only place that tried this and this was an ongoing thing Sir Nicholas II was trying to do stuff like this

and they could serve in the army but not any high rank so there's a sense of assimilation of the Jews who might assimilate but for the elite they'll be granted almost a certain privileged status but not such that they can lord it over anybody but of course all of this failed there was no what the profiteering arrangements that

he's saying are going to be eliminated that's what it was to be a Jew even the middle layer of Jews you know their protection if they weren't engaging in this kind of profiteering they wouldn't need protection anymore the attacks on the Jews

all for the same reason undercutting competition destroying entire villages using debt to to dominate entire regions you know but of course this isn't going to work even if Paul had lived there was no chance

that the Jews were going to accept this I think that maybe there was an idealized version of Jewish life in Germany, that small group that left the shuttle and became more or less Germans. They had to take last names. So they took the most aristocratic last names, you know, Goldstein and these were all German names and took the highest level name they possibly could

because they had no choice. As far as I know, that was being done here, and it was eventually done. They couldn't just use their first names anymore. And of course, when they say a detailed census, that had to have rubbed the cahal the wrong way. Because so much of what they were doing was hidden based on deceit and being able to identify them and where they lived would harm at least some of this. You know, smuggling. It's no different than what the so-called Russian mafia, which, of course, is a Jewish mafia.

It does today. So long as they're not on what we today call Israeli soil in the Middle East, and see these same people who have, of course, no right to that land, they have no obligation. The very fact that these people were moving from place to place, which Dersavent wanted to have Paul stop, this whole concept meant that they had no connection. It was much easier to manipulate people or to exploit people,

That you don't know. No relationships can be, can be, you know, that was very difficult to do anyway. The Kahul didn't have much of an outside connection, but if this is going to dissolve, you know, essentially what he's saying is those Jews that are increasingly dissatisfied with the Kahul system and its tremendous inequality, we could bring into into Russian society as much as humanly possible. So what it comes down to is it's kind of a mass of contradictions, a mass of naifte, I think maybe some good, some bad information, but this agenda in one form or another is going to be tried and it will fail all the way up until the Bolshevik revolution. Thus Der Javin concluded quite self-consciously, thus this cross-grained scattered people known as Jews. In this, it's sad condition. will observe an example of order, especially regarding enlightenment. The first point will bear fruit, if not today and immediately, definitely in the coming times, or at worst, after several generations in unnoticed way, and then the Jews would become genuine

subjects of the Russian throne. While Der Javen was composing his memorandum, he also made it known what the Kehelot thought about, thought about it and made it clear that he was by no means making himself their friend. In the official answers, their rejection was formulated cautiously. It stated, the Jews are not competent for cultivating grain nor accustomed to it, and their faith is an obstacle. They see no other possibilities than their current occupations, which serve their sustenance,

and they do not need such, but would like to remain in their current condition. The Kehleot saw, moreover, that the report entailed their own obsolescence, the end of their source of income, and so began quietly, but stubbornly and tenaciously, to work against Der Javen's whole proposal. It's common for kind of normies out there, and I got this argument a hundred times, to say that the Jews were in these profiteering relationships, because they weren't allowed to be anything else. the claim is that they couldn't own land, they couldn't be in the professions, which of course is question begging, number one.

But here, they're being offered the chance to be normal people, and at least the elders of the Kahul are rejecting it. The faith is a problem. We don't know how to do any of this. We don't want to do any of this. There's nothing else but these current occupations, and they want to remain in their current conditions.

So when anyone brings up that they weren't allowed to be things and therefore could only be usurers and scam artists, well, you simply quote this. And this shows that time, and it wasn't just in Russia either. The time and again, they were offered to be regular citizens and they largely refused. Now, of course, things changed after World War II as far as the foundation of Israel and Zionism was concerned. but we'll see here coming up some of the things that they did they eventually did get D'Rzavun off that committee later on because despite his phylo-Semitic approach when this whole thing first started he learned exactly what the Jew really is so this was kind of a way using as little coercion as possible to use their own divisions to try to get them out of that way of life and to become a pretend.

actual citizens of the Russian Empire, but they come out and say, no, this is not what we want. You catch them in the corner of your eye. Distinctive, by design, they move you, even before you drive. The new Cooper plugin hybrid range for Mentor, Leon, and Teramar. Now with flexible PCP finance and trade-in boosters of up to 2000 euro, search Coopera and discover our latest offers. Coopera. Design that moves. Finance provided by way of higher purchase agreement from Volkswagen Financial Services Ireland Limited. Subject to lending criteria. Terms and conditions apply. Volkswagen Financial Services Ireland Limited. Trading as Cooper Financial Services is regulated by the Central Bank of Ireland. Ready for huge savings? Well mark your calendars from November 28 to 30th

because the Liddle Newbridge warehouse sale is back. We're talking thousands of your favourite Liddle items all reduced to clear. From home essentials to seasonal must-haves, when the doors open, the deals go fast. Come see for yourself. The Lidl Newbridge Warehouse Sale, 28th to 30th of November. Lidl, more to value. Discover five-star luxury at Trump Dunebeg. Unwind in our luxurious spa.

Savour sumptuous farm-fresh dining. Relax in our exquisite accommodations. Step outside and be captivated by the wild Atlantic surrounds. Your five-starred. getaway where every detail is designed with you in mind. Give the gift of a unique experience this Christmas with vouchers from Trump-Dunbeg. Search Trump-Ireland gift vouchers. Trump on Dunbiog, Kush Farage. This opposition expressed itself, according to Der Javen, by means of a complaint filed by a Jewess, a Jewess from Leosno to the Tsar, in which she alleged that in a liquor distillery,

D'Javan horribly beat her with a club until she, being pregnant, gave birth to a dead infant. The Senate launched an investigation. D'Javan answered, as I was a quarter hour long in this factory, I not only did not strike any Jus, but indeed did not even see one. He sought a personal reception by the Tsar. Let me be imprisoned, but I will reveal the idiocy of the man that has made such claims. How can Your Highness believe such a foolish and untrue complaint? The Jew that had taken the lying complaint was condemned to one year in penitentiary, but after two or three months, Dershavin accomplished his being set free,

this now under the reign of Alexander I. Paul, murdered in May 1801, was unable to come to any resolution and connection with Dershavin's memorandum. It led at the time to small, practical results as one could have expected since Der Javin lost his position in the change of court. So when I say that, that, you know, normal Christian people in Russia elsewhere were not prepared for the Jewish mind. This is what I'm talking about. This is stock and trade, making up, you know, ridiculous crimes, trying to pin it on on people who don't like them or know too much about them.

and in this case it was very ridiculous there was no witnesses there was no evidence there's no nothing the person who created this and it's hard to tell whether it was about a Jew but was it a male Jew who

initially made the complaint the very fact that they were heard so quickly shows you exactly you know the honesty with the Russians approach the Jewish question but it's stuff like this that

slowly educated the Russians as to what they're up against, going this far, willing to do anything, to smear a man, to destroy a man, and inventing crime. They did this all. They did this in the Turkish Empire all the time, where Greek Orthodox teachers

that were reviving on a national basis, the Greek nation, you know, the Jews would then go to the Turks and say that they're, fomenting rebellion. They're violent. They're leading the people astray. They hate you. They're telling everyone not to pay taxes. Whatever it took. And in that case, it was often successful to get them killed or otherwise neutralized. And Dersavin, this was a huge education for the Russian elite and things for better or for worse are going to change when the new czar comes in. Not until the end of 1802 was the committee for the

the assimilation of the Jews established to examine D'Irjavans' memorandum and prepare corresponding recommendations. The committee consisted of two Polish magnates close to Alexander I, Prince Adam Zartarizki, and Count Severin Potaki, as well as Count Valerian Suboff. Der Javen observed regarding all three that they, too, had great holdings in Poland, and would notice a significant loss of income if the Jews were to be removed, and and that the private interests of the above-mentioned worthies would outweigh those of the state. Also on the committee were Interior Minister Count Kachubi and the already-mentioned Justice Minister, the first in Russian history, Dershavin himself.

Michael Sparansky also worked with the committee. The committee was charged to invite Jewish delegates from the Kehalot of every province, and these, most merchants of the First Guild, did come. Besides that, the committee members had the right to call enlightened and well-meaning Jews of their acquaintance. The already known Nodanotkin that had moved from White Russia to Moscow and then St. Petersburg, the Petersburg tax leaser Abram Peretz,

and who was also close friend of Sparonsky, Yehuda Leib Nevaevich and Mendel Satanova, both friends of Peretz and others. Not all took part in the hearings, but they exercised a significant influence on the committee members. Worthy of mention, Abraham Parrot's son Gregory was condemned in the December's trial and exiled, probably only because he had discussed the Jewish question with Pestal,

but without suspecting anything of the December's conspiracy and because his grandson was the Russian Secretary of State a very high position. Nevasovic, a humanist but no cosmopolitan, who was deeply tied to Russian cultural life, then a rarity among Jews, published in Russian the crying voice of the daughter of Judah, 1803, in which he urged Russian society to reflect on the restrictions of Jewish rights and admonish the Russians to regard Jews as their countrymen and thus that they should take the Jews among them into Russian society.

Well, we all know what that means. These are the same people who were opposed to Drozhavin's recommendations that we just discussed. But when he says something, you know, nothing changes. This is the exact same kind of language that they use today worldwide, that Russians have to reflect on the restrictions on on Jewish rights despite the Jews saying these aren't restrictions this is this is who we are

that we're Russians just like you he knows this is a lie and taking Jews in Russian society means if you make us just like you pretend that we're not Jews which in some places you know they try to do we know we're going to win we know we're going to be dominant especially after the 18th century, especially after the murder of Paul,

because they knew that any restraint, at least temporarily, was going to be removed from their activities. And that would just be, you know, it's like the liberation of the Jews after the French Revolution. It's an automatic, you know, because they're so cohesive versus the peasant class,

and even the mid-level noble class in Russia, that they're always going to come out ahead. they had a mentality that the Russians simply didn't have. We'll talk about the Decemberus, I think, as time goes on at the end of, because of Alexander's death. But the manipulation of using terms and talking about liberation, forcing Russians to reflect on things, knowing full well what the truth was,

it's day to day. This wasn't debate. This was just an attempt to, first of all, sideline D'Rjavid and to influence this fairly young, new emperor, Alexander, as much as humanly possible, at least in the beginning of his reign, they were quite successful. The committee came to an overwhelmingly supported resolution.

The Jews are to be guided into the general civil life and education to steer them toward productive work. It should be made easier for them to become employed in trades and commerce. The constriction of the right of free mobility should be lessened. They must become accustomed to wearing ordinary apparel for the custom of wearing clothes that are despised strengthens the custom to be despised. But the most acute problem was that Jews, on account of the liquor trade, dwell in the villages. Notgan strove to win the committee to the view of letting the Jews continue to live there, and only to take measures against possible abuses on their part.

The charter of the committee led to tumult in the Kehila, Gessen wrote, a special convocation of their deputies in 1803 in Minsk resolved to petition our Tsar, may his fame become still greater, that the worthies assume no innovations for us. They decided to send certain delegates to Petersburg explained that an assembly had been held

for that purpose and even called for a three-day Jewish fast. Unrest gripped the whole pail of settlement. Quite apart from the threatening expulsion of Jews from the villages, the Kehelot took a negative stance toward the cultural question out of concern to preserve their own way of life. As answered to the many points of the recommendation, the Kehelat explained that the reform must in any case be postponed 15 to 20 years. and the reason for that is pretty clear. Something like this is going to, at least on the surface, divide Jewish society. And don't forget, the Hasidic movement was continuing to grow at this point, who rejected most of this anyway.

Saying unrest gripped the whole pale of settlement. Well, on the one hand, they're getting the benefits of expanding their commerce outside of the the countryside. On the other hand, there's going to be Jews who are going to lose a lot of money because the liquor trade and their very secretive way of going about things might be threatened here. Of course, wearing normal clothes, on the one hand, that could be considered a kind of assimilation. On the other hand, that could be a very effective way of disguising themselves. Going back, you know, centuries, you had when Jews did wear in the cities, kind of ordinary clothing, that had to be some mark on them to identify them, at least to each other, if not ordinary people,

because you're not dealing with the same kind of mentality. E. Michael Jones, Michael Hoffman, so many other people on the Jewish question have brought this out in great detail. And Barron Metal, E. Michael Jones's book, which I recommend, you know, 1,500 pages, deals with the Jewish question precisely on these issues for many chapters. and that the mentality didn't fit, and this is where Zionism ultimately came from, the mentality of the Jews didn't fit a settled agricultural people. They were the opposite of a settled agricultural people.

So the point of postponing this was, first of all, we have to see what Alexander's going to become, and we need to settle any kind of actual or apparent divisions amongst our own people. Der Jaavin wrote, there were from their side various rebuttals aimed to leave everything as it was. In addition, Gurdko, a white Russian landowner sent Dershavin a letter he had received. A Jew in white Russia had written him regarding one of his plenipotentiaries in Petersburg. It said that they had, in the name of all Kehlat of the world, put the sherem or harem, the ban,

under Javan as a prosecutor, and had gathered a million to be used as gifts for this situation, as has forwarded it to St. Petersburg, and had forwarded it to St. Petersburg. They appealed for all efforts to be applied to the removal of Der Javen as Attorney General, and if that were not possible to seek his life. However, the thing they wanted to achieve

was not to be forbidden to sell liquor in the village taverns, and in order to make it easier to advance this business, they would put together opinions from foreign regions from different places and peoples and how the situations of the Jews could be improved. And in fact, such opinions, sometimes in French, sometimes in German, began to be sent to the committee. D'Jauvin was labeled as a persecutor. This kind of, you know, given the fact that they lived among the going, it was delicate. But as a persecutor, his life was now forfeit.

gathered a million, meaning a million gold rubles for bribery. That's what gifts mean in this case. Getting people, and this is a very common tactic, getting Jews from all over the world to write the monarch.

God knows, you know, I haven't seen a lot of these or if they've even been preserved, but what they said concerning any of the, all the false claims against Rejaven, the one that we mentioned, there were many others,

many of them never quite, you know, got to Petersburg, but anything, he simply knew too much. He saw how the Jewish mind worked directly. He went from at least a neutral to someone who was a tremendous critic of the cahal. Now he wants to dissolve the cahol. And I think there was a lot of money that went into the convocation of this second committee, with all the names we just listed, people who were already economically related to the Jews, many of these being Polish, including Jews themselves.

You know, you don't have a lot of strict Orthodox people on that committee. These people all had an interest in this. And whether or not there was a direct relation with Jewish bribery, but they had to cash and Dersavin had to go. Thank God he died in actual death. But once they labeled him like that, they also inherently labeled anyone who was following him, Anyone who thought that what he was doing was a good idea.

So he couldn't be accepted. He had to be opposed, although the opposition may have come from different sources and for different reasons and different interests. He was now labeled as a persecutor, as Amalek, and I know there were assassination attempts on him, but they all failed, and eventually he's going to retire and die in natural death. Besides this, Noda Notkin became, the central figure that organized the little Jewish congregation of Petersburg.

In 1803, he submitted a brief to the committee in which he sought to paralyze the effort, the effect of the proposal submitted by Derzavin. Derjavan writes, Notkin came to him one day and asked, with feigned well wishing that he, Derjavan, should not take a stand all alone against the colleagues on the committee, who are all on the side of the Jews, whether he would not accept 100 or, if that is too little, 200,000 rubles, only so that he could be of one mind with all his colleagues on the committee. Der Javin decided to disclose this attempt at bribery to the czar, bribery to the czar, and prove it to him with Gorko's letter. He thought such proofs prove effective, and the

czar would start to be wary of the people that surrounded him and protected the Jews. Sparansky also informed the czar of it, but Sparonsky was fully committed. to the Jews, and from the first meeting of the Jewish committee, it became apparent that all members represented the view that the liquor distilling should continue in the hands of the Jews as before. Der Jaubin opposed it. Alexander bore himself ever more coldly toward him and dismissed his justice minister shortly thereafter. 1803. That means at this point, Dershavin is all by himself, and he's aware of it. He's aware of what may be in store for him.

The false accusations didn't work while Paul was still alive. That didn't end. But when that failed, they figured, well, he's not going to say no to 200,000 rubles to agree with everybody else. But he went to the young czar and told him about it, and it meant absolutely nothing. Sparonski was one of Alexander's early teachers. and he was at least for the day fairly liberal. He was as much a part of this Jewish network as the other members that we've mentioned,

D'Jarvan, knowing what they really are. I mean, I mean, not to say the other members didn't know what the Jew really is, just that they profited from him. And so now Dershavin has to deal with the fact that he has the entire globe's Jewish wealth, which was tremendous, most of it, most of which were, you know,

centered in just a few cities. with the population, mostly being now in Russia. But it says Sbronsky was fully committed to the Jews. And so even bribery, even the attempt to bribe Dersovan, and I think it was just dismissed, there were no witnesses or anything. But, and it all came down at least at this point to liquor distilling, manipulation of the peasantry using alcohol. So God knows if they were willing to pay $200,000 to Dersavent.

these other men, despite the fact that they're already making money off the Jews, how much additional were granted to them to focus on the issue of liquor distilling. And now, the young Alexander is very different from the older Alexander. In fact, I am of the opinion that he voluntarily left the throne

and became a monk that's very controversial. I did a whole show on that one time, but he matured quite a bit. And at least, but early on, he was a, he was a, you know, I think Napoleon, of course, 1812. The invasion changed him completely. And Napoleon had already, you know, at that point, promised the Jews their own, essentially a resurrection of the Khazar Empire. You know, and so many of the Jews fought for him. And this is part of the reason why the military issue was so, was so sensitive in Russia.

So Spiransky is the bad guy here. And it really is a minor miracle that D'Javon wasn't murdered, but he was dismissed from his post. Besides this, Dershavin's papers indicate that he, whether in military or civil service, always came into disfavor and was hot-headed and everywhere soon took his leave. One has to admit that Dershavin foresaw much that developed in the problematic Rousseau-Judeic relationship throughout the entire 19th century. even if not in the exact and unexpected form that it took in the event. He expressed himself coarsely, as was customary then, but he did not intend to oppress the Jews. On the contrary, he wanted to open the Jews' path to a more free and productive life.

Well, I want to say something about Zar Paul before we move on to the next section. Now we're getting into far more substantial and detailed parts of the book. as I mentioned earlier Zarpal was canonized he like most Russians except for this membership of this committee hated his mother

Catherine Catherine the second and he tried to reverse this masonic this cosmopolitan spirit that had infected the upper levels of the nobility especially those found in the Senate Orthodox nationalists

he released from prison because as Catherine the Great had thrown many them in the dungeon. They didn't have a formal prison system, but they did have private dungeons. He spent a lot of his own money opening, opening peasant schools and villages, educating them, not just, of course, about Jewish question, but everything else. He banned Freemasonry, which was one of the reasons that now, it's not just there was an economic connection with the Jews. Now there's a semi-quazzi theological connection with the Jews through Freemasonry.

he also said given the damage that women have done the two annas both Catharines he forbade women from ever becoming empress again and that lasted as long as the empire lasted Paul wanted to create a

class of peasant yeoman not necessarily apart from the commune but remember this was still a time of serfdom which only affected and I have a whole I've written on this substantially.

A portion of your typical Russian farmer, typical Russian peasant was under serfdom. On the 18th century, that the peasants were squeezed a little bit harder. Earlier versions of serfdom were not, I don't even like to calling it that. But he made it easier for peasants to complain against their lords. He knew what this elite was becoming.

Just to ask you later on would make fun of them because they were trying to speak foreign language. especially French and it never quite sounded right offering serfs generous you know loan possibilities to buy noble land Paul was aware of the massive grain profits that were coming to Jews and and their friend throughout the Baltic ports he attempted to use his power to artificially lower or lower the price of bread which means by the time he was murdered there was not one single faction of the elite that he didn't irritate. Paul's program, and I've written on this too, and why the very members of the committee,

the first committee and their allies hated him so much, he wanted to force Russia's elite back into their older service capacity, which was abolished by his mother, Catherine. you received you were a noble but that title to land and peasant labor implied that you had service obligations so everyone in Russia had a someone to serve a job to do when that was abolished by Catherine trying to get their support that meant that nobles really didn't have a purpose they became parasitic and hence saw a fellow traveler amongst the Jews

Paul said that nobles exist it wasn't a tightly class-based society like in the West Peter the Great tried to change that a little bit but nobles either as a class or just as a de facto entity they existed only to serve

the state, the nation, the church otherwise they have no reason to exist they have no reason to have serves because all their titles, all their privileges, were connected to serving the state, either usually in a military capacity, but sometimes in a diplomatic capacity. And so their answer was to finally murder Paul.

And they brought Catherine's grandson, Alexander, to power, who they thought, and people like Sparanski certainly thought, would be more responsive to enlightenment. And that centered, at least in part, around the Jewish question. The way D'Jarvan thought about all of this,

for the day, it was well thought out. We only have a thumbnail sketch here. He knew too much about how the Jews operate. He condemned how the old rabbinical system in the Gahal functioned. The Gahal maintained and empowered rich Jews at the expense of everybody else, Jew and Gentile alike. It was when he declared war on the Jewish Monopoly over vodka sales.

That's when the Kahal turned on him. The gloves were off. Russians were all the way up to the revolution. We're not used to propaganda. They weren't very good at it. He became the subject of endless moral terror, slander, blackmail, violence, and threats. And he mentions the Talmud in his opinion. as I mentioned, many interviews with Jews of all types, both foreign and domestic,

that Talmud is what made your typical Jew hate everyone else. The basic view was that when their so-called Messiah comes, all the wealth of the world that wasn't already in their hands would then accrue to them. And that's why under the Polish system, messianic ideas flourished all over the place, given their fantastic wealth. What else could this mean? We have such control here. But of course, Kim Monyinsky showed that to be a bit premature.

But this Jewish yoke, both the nobles who profited from it, as well as Jews themselves, they were aware this was a parasitic burden that the goyam had to bear. Interest compounded over, God knows how long, ensured that no one, Polish and Russian nobles included, could ever get out of debt. That doesn't mean the nobles can't still profit. nobles especially in Poland or of Polish background were often ignorant of their financial condition. They saw the Jews as their best friends. So this clear community of interest kept the noble Jewish alliance in Poland and the Russian Empire alive.

And as far as the Polish Empire goes, the price was destruction of the falling apart of the empire by the 1790s. but the Russians never quite got their hands on the question. After Napoleon, after D'Urjavun's stuff became, you know, his writings became well known. Of course, he became a very famous poet, apart from this question.

The Russians slowly but surely were educated. Certainly Nicholas I, who will be his successor. knew the issue. Alexander II, not so much. Alexander the 3rd and Zard Nicholas II were aware of it, but they didn't have the enforcement mechanisms at hand. So from Paul to Nicholas, the point was to elevate the status of the Russian peasant,

the Russian merchant, make them, you know, make them, you know, they own property, they always own property, but via the commune, of course, in Zara Nicholas's time, they were able to own it in their own right. By the time of the revolution, at the time of World War I, something like 90% of Russian land was owned by peasant owners. And also the idea that low interest or zero interest loans would be available

for peasants to buy their own, to escape somehow the Jewish debt burden. And Dersav, clearly, was aware of it, even mentions it in his memorandum where he says, you know, we'll protect the Jews, but you have to clear these debts. And he put it in such a way where it acted like it went both ways. But no, the debts only were Jews, you know,

being creditors of non-Jews, of Russians and Poles, with or without their knowledge. So, and they never were able to succeed. Certainly they weren't able to succeed, settling them on the land. And the kind of stuff that was said about D'Arzom, by the Jews. They just applied that same contempt, the big lie, which was their stock and trade, as I mentioned, against anyone who didn't like them. And that really continues today. Some

czars at this point knew more than others about the Jewish question. Some realize that the financial interest was too great for them to do that much about. Alexander III probably, and Nicholas' son more than anyone else, knew what was happening, but it was very different. to do a lot about it because unrest in the wealthier, commercially oriented Western parts, exactly the parts we're talking about now, they made too much money. They couldn't afford a lot of unrest here. So to some extent, they had to leave it as it was. But rather than talking about the Jews as such, the solution was to elevate the common Russian peasant, which by World War I more or less succeeded. Russian peasant was better off than any other part of the

part of Europe at the time. So, and this is, you know, Paul was legitimately canonized. He was extremely pious. And just that alone, the Jews were aware of what kind of man he was. And eventually Alexander I was going to learn that. But it's, you know, it's going to take a while. And now that we're at a whole new section of Alexander I think this is a perfect place to stop. Sure.

Let me throw a question out there before we get out of here. How much of the wealth that they were accumulating in liquor and in their devices that they were in charge of? How much of that was getting sent out internationally? Oh, that's a very difficult question. I don't know how this system worked. It was a network. I think the concentration of wealth was in Constantinople, or is the? It depended on what trade, but you know, Antwerp, London, and now Western Russia, the money that was sent out, it really depended on circumstances.

I don't know in any detail how that, how that circulated, if it circulated. Well, were they paying a Vig back to the, back to Istanbul? Well, the chief rabbi, see, because of, you know, them being driven out of so many places, the chief rabbis tended to shift. Istanbul, because of, you know, they were the, they dominated the Turkish Empire in all of these professions. They were, you know, far more so than in Russia. Russians ran the Russian Empire. but as far as the financial position of Turkey,

of the Ottoman Empire, that was in Jewish hands. So that's why I want to say that that's really where the center was, especially right now at the point we're talking about, the transition to the 19th century. But Vig usually means weekly interest. How that circulated, how that moved from place to place, I simply don't know. but the point to remember is that any time a Jew needed to dip into that for the sake of their communities undercutting their Gentile competitors, they had access to it.

And that meant that they could offer interest rates, at least initially, lower than anybody else. And it put these governments in a terrible position. The Ottomans were dominated more than anyone else. We're in a point where pretty soon, after Napoleon, England will be, Antwerp will soon be. Russia was always the problem because they were never able to control the Russian currency. This is why these people were moving to Petersburg. But that's my opinion. It changed all the time.

It depended on grain prices that went out of the Baltic. But, you know, and you don't know at any given. in time which Jewish community had the most available liquidity. It's not like there was a papacy. It's not like there was even a chief synod somewhere. It didn't function like that. They were quite autonomous but fanatically devoted. As you see here with trying to condemn Dersav and getting all these people, including from Turkey, writing the czar saying how awful he is, they had access to liquidity if they needed it. whether that automatically put an obligation onto the Cajal elsewhere. I don't know.

I think so, but I don't know that in detail. I don't want to say anything and be wrong about it. Okay. No problem at all. All right. So we'll pick up chapter two in the next episode. As always, I will include your links in the show notes so that people can support your work.

And we appreciate people doing that. Please, people go do that. Go to any way. this is posted, you will see the links, you will see links in the description. And yeah, we'll be back for episode number six and start chapter two. Thank you, Dr. Johnson. Appreciate you. See you soon.