The Pete Quiñones Show - The Discussions With 'Dark Enlightenment' (So Far - Updated) - Part 2

Episode Date: April 9, 2026

3 Hours and 12 MinutesNSFWThis is the complete audio of Pete's discussions with Dark Enlightenment (and Thomas) (so far).Episode 1182: Zelenskyy, Trump, Epstein, and Opportunity w/ Dark EnlightenmentEpisode 1196: Revolutionary Change and Reaction w/ Thomas777 and Dark EnlightenmentEpisode 1241: Organisation Todt and German Infrastructure w/ Thomas777 and Dark EnlightenmentEpisode 1350: The Coming Energy Crisis w/ Dark EnlightenmentFundamental Principles PodcastDE's Telegram ChannelPete and Thomas777 'At the Movies'Support Pete on His WebsitePete's PatreonPete's SubstackPete's SubscribestarPete's GUMROADPete's VenmoPete's Buy Me a CoffeePete on FacebookPete on TwitterBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-pete-quinones-show--6071361/support.

I'm not talking about that on the air. Okay. But, yeah. Maybe late. Should be. Yeah, yeah. We'll talk later. But, hey, what's going on D?

How much, man. How are you doing? Doing good. Doing good. Yeah, just wanted to do. So we're literally recording about an hour after Trump and J.D. Vents and Zelensky had a blow up in the, in the oval. office. And so just get people a time frame for when we're recording this. And, you know,

we have other stuff we can talk about, but you want to, you've seen the video. You want to say anything about what you saw? Well, I think, I mean, it was a little bit clownish, but, but the whole situation is clownish, right? This is something that any serious person could have told you, you know, two years ago, like this was, uh, this guy was a puppet and it was literally an actor, a comedian who got put in the presidency because people were, watched too much television and are stupid by, you know, this, this thieving oligarch who basically wanted a front man. And he effectively, you know, started the war. Like, you killed 10,000 people in

Nova Russia by, you know, like, shawing them with moors. And you expected, you know, Vladimir Putin for his own sake. Like, he can't. Just let that slide because the people in his country won't stand for it. You know this because you've seen the example in Georgia. You know, when Schexe vili did basically the same thing. tried to join NATO.

John McCain showed up. Straight a bunch of crap up. You know, you have people in the United States Senate, like Lindsey Graham, talking about how, well, this is the best money we've ever spent

because, like, we just get to kill Russians, and it's, it's none of our troops. And it's just our, I mean, it's cheap money.

You know, it's the most wonderful thing in the world, dead Slavs. It's just the, my Jewish handlers just love it when, Eastern Europeans kill each other. It's the best thing in the world to them because they're still salty about a program

that happened in 1648. It's the most beautiful thing in the world. I mean, that's basically what this guy's doing. And it's not like a clown show and laughable and disgusting. This entire thing has been a disgusting mess. You know, maybe because I've followed, you know, Dr. Matthew,

Matthew Raphael Johnson for years. I knew all this stuff. But everybody in Washington should know this stuff. You should, you know, if you're on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, you should at least know why people don't like Russia.

Why are all these gentle pale of settlement Jews? Like, why do they hate Russia so much? Well, I, why do they spit when they hear the name Bogdong Kim Linnetzky? And then, you know, these are the people

that have been and running everything for, what, 70 years, you know, the occupied government you always correctly talk about. Is anyone surprised that Zelensky's this entitled little worm? I mean, that's, that's, he is what he is. Why would you expect anything different? Well, I think one of the, one of the interesting parts of this is that, you know, If you listen, if people listen to the three episodes, Thomas and I did where he talked about

Syrian-Russian relations post-Norrenberg, I mean, you understand that this is basically the same war and that, you know, you've already mentioned that this is really about ethnic grievances from centuries ago. Trump treating Zelensky like this, and if they just cut them off, He's basically saying we're not going to help you fight your wars anymore. So, you know, you can make Trump out to be a Zionist. Scott Horton calls him a Lukudnik. But, I mean, he just basically spanked an apparatchic for international jury on, you know, basically the world stage. Live on national television, international television.

I've always said this about Trump. I don't think Trump's a Zionist because I don't think he knows what a Zionist is. And I think if you gave him a dictionary definition of Zionism, you'd be like, that doesn't make any sense to me. He just seems like that kind of guy. I think he's a guy who likes Jews and likes Israel. And, you know, his family married Jews. And he's been dealing with Jews his whole life in New York.

And I think he likes some Jews. And I think he just doesn't like this international bull. that he knows that his legacy, if he ties it to his legacy, you know, it's going to be a, it's going to taint it. Well, he's already dealing like you and Thomas said, you know, and I strongly hear people to give it a listen, right? The conflict in Israel and the conflict, the conflict in Gaza and Israel and the conflict in Ukraine are basically the same thing.

they are attempts by the regime to, you know, destabilize enemies and gain territory. And once you understand that, that effectively, you know, Vladimir Putin's a lot of things. No, no one, no one who's like a nice person gets promoted colonel in East Germany in 1987. It just doesn't happen.

You know, but he's, but he's a serious guy and Russians are chess players, right? And he knows the world system just as much as anybody. And he saw that like the, the weakness of the world system that was, you know, freezing him, him and his people out of, you know, the national economy and of making them poor and trying to, you know, undermine him at home, like, like, okay, well, I can't, attack on this part of the board, but I can attack on this part of the board. And so he supported the Syrians and that, you know, caused a bunch of problems for the regime. And so they counterattack in Ukraine, right? Because the central fact of Russian life is that the Volga River that flows

through Moscow and is basically the heartland river of the Russian, of European Russia, the way like the Mississippi is to the United States, that river empties into the Caspian, which is a landlock lake that can't give you access to world markets or allow you to have a Navy. That's why one of the first Russian capitals was Novgorod on the Baltic, right? But the Baltic is lazy because it's frozen part of the year, and it's shallow, and it doesn't. And you have to get through the straits in Denmark. I forget what they're called, but, you know, like you can't control that. There's all these other powers, Sweden or Denmark or Norway or the UK, who might bottle you up in the Baltic or the North Sea and keep you from.

or of course you could go all the way to the Arctic Ocean, but that's barely tenable because it's only open a few months at the year. So the Russian nation needed a access to the Black Sea that was stable and year-round where they could conduct international trade and have a Navy. And for them, that means, like, they can't give up a spastopol in Crimea. They can't give up the rust of, you know, on the southern Russian cities. That they have to have those. It's a matter of life and death for Russia if their economy is based off of exporting energy

and agricultural products, mostly to places like India, and Africa and elsewhere, right? They don't have the ability to do that. They're dead in the water. They're going to starve to death in the dark and in the cold. So when the United States says, we're going to threaten that

by making Ukraine like an outright enemy of yours, is it any wonder that they reacted negatively? I mean, put the shoe on the other foot. If the Mexicans say, said, hey, we're going to, like, work with the Cubans and we're going to take Puerto Rico from you, and we're going to prevent you from exiting the Gulf of America.

Like, New Orleans is no longer, like, a viable port for you. Like, people would freak out, but you won't be able to export grain down the Mississippi through New Orleans. and out to wherever, or energy, or whatever, whatever else. Your LNG tankers won't make it from New Orleans to Rotterdam anymore. There'd be war. There'd be war at the drop of a hat. You can't do that to the United States. Just like there was war when the United States basically prevented the Japanese

from importing oil and food. Like, what are they going to do? in 1941. They have to. And pretending that, you know, Zelensky is anything other than a puppet of the regime

is absurd. This is not complicated. I mean, it is sort of complicated in a way, but like, if you threaten people's lives, they react. Simple as.

Well, I mean, to just make it simple. I like to make things simple just for my brain to start with before I can jump off somewhere. I mean, if you come into the administration, if you start your administration realizing with a whole bunch of people around you are like, if we don't start taking care of ourselves and if we don't look after our own interests, and even if those interests do become like Monroe Doctrine type interests where, you know, Central America, South America, the, you know, our coast, our West Coast especially, maybe even Greenland, you have to trim the fat, you have to cut the ties. And, you know, I honestly think that there are the reason why you've seen so many of the, you know, formerly hostile, of a certain, formerly hostile.

members of a certain tribe basically changing their tune is because they feel like they have to because everything's falling apart and what they have is falling apart. So, yeah, just as, you know, if you listen to, we're up to episode 15, we have 17 recorded of 200 years together, you see this over and over again. They're going to, for a time, they will switch their tune and the, message will be very clear about how, oh, we're in it with you guys 100% and everything. So this is a time when you have to not only take advantage of it, but you have to do everything you can, and especially in a time when information can travel halfway around the world, then in a half a second, this has to be a time to not only take advantage of them doing this, but do everything you can to push the narrative that they were responsible for this

in the, you know, they were responsible for a lot of this in the first place. Right. Yeah. Well, Trump and, Trump and J.D. Vance or Solenskyy, J.D. Vance, you know, arguing and then Trump saying, this is going to be hard to do business. Like, we're $37 trillion in debt. Our, our military is not capable of going up against the Chinese or the Russians and winning. The United States Navy is, you know, 12 carrier groups that are loading targets that, that

can't actually attack, you know, those near peer adversaries, they just get shot down. There are billions of dollars that are just a hole in the water. So, and whose fault is it that we ended up here? Of course, everyone knows. And if you're listening to this program, you're listening to me, you know whose fault it is. But, you know, one of the good ones, I guess, Milton Friedman, right? the system that works is a system that doesn't, you know, empower good people. It forces bad people to do the right thing even though they don't want to.

So when Marco Rubio's changed his tune, it's because he has to. There's no rescuing the present order. Like, we just can't afford it anymore. You know, like, you can't have quote unquote unmanned planes where, you know, they flipped upside out. Like, like, no more women pilots. Sorry. Like, when, when billionaires, like, oh, I'm going to die when I get on my private plane, if the pilot isn't like, you know, a 45-year-old white dude with a little bit of gray in his hair

and it looks like the aviators were welded on his face. Like, those are your choices. You have to empower the people actually capable of running the system. And right, you know, for the last 50 years at least, it's just been like, let's just take from these people and add more and more burdens. on them and destroy them with drugs

with opiates with useless wars with super high taxes whatever that that's the well we just can't carry it anymore we can't

and Zelensky is this you know this clownish burden to the tune of how many billions of dollars is it been 300 some say 350 yeah

350 billion you know what I could do with a tenth of that, you know, I could rebuild all of America with that much money. Those days are over. And really, going forward now, what needs to be done. And, you know, what needs to be done. and, you know, what we saw yesterday was basically a clown show where everyone knows that, you know, everyone knows what Jeffrey Epstein was, you know, and anyone who's arguing against that is arguing, it's survival mode for them. You know, even Dave Smith had a tweet yesterday where he said,

I'm starting to think that handing the massad petto files to a bunch of Zionists might not be the best way to get the truths of the public. I mean, you're, yeah. Well, Dave, Dave, here's what happened. And you know it, and I know it, and everybody knows it. Your cousins used my tax money to coerce and abuse kids that look like my kids, like my daughters. into blackmailing politicians that are supposed to be working for me into supporting a war

that got kids that looked like my kids killed in Iraq for no damn reason and then when they came home messed up your cousins sold them drugs that killed them or ruined their lives and they've been doing it and running everything into the ground for the last, at least half century, more likely 80 years, put the nice even number at 1950, say, that's 75 years this year. Okay?

So Dave, when your family does this sort of thing, and to his credit, he talks about it, until you do that, until you talk about that, the fact. that we're occupied, you're not dealing with reality. And what Zelensky was doing was sitting in the White House saying, well, yeah, I mean, I have a natural right to occupy you. And Donald Trump's saying like, we don't have the money anymore to afford to keep paying you guys. And he lost his mind. He lost his mind in public. It's crazy that anyone should conduct themselves like that in public. When we've been talking about an occupied government and, you know, our forebearers, you know, used to use the term Zog back in the 70s and 80s and get arrested and get their homes, not their compounds, which is a propaganda word, raided, and their families, you know, killed. like Randy Weaver who went and hid in the woods because, well, people have seen the shirt he was wearing. This just has to end.

And if you are to believe that these documents will come out, most people, I think, have a tendency to believe that the reason they're not coming out is because, oh, there are people who don't want to be exposed as pedophiles and things like that. It's like, no, there are people who don't want to be exposed as traitors to the country. Because the penalty for being a traitor is being treated like, who were the last people who were killed for being executed for being traitors in this country? Were they the Rosenbergs? Well, that's the way we celebrate Juneteenth. It's Julie Snowth-Rosenberg Day. That's why I celebrate Juneteen, anyway.

But there's huge numbers of things. people, basically everyone in Congress, but Thomas Massey and maybe a couple others, right, who if you dug into it, they're traitors. Virtually the entire Democratic Party, most of the Republican Party, they're traitors. This USAID thing, you know, Mike Ben's, for all that he's done good work and talked about, like, he's steam control. He's trying to get people to be like, well, it's bad, but, you know, like, no, no, no, it's just all bad.

It's he always has been meme, you know, because even when he was frame game, he was trying to direct you away from certain things. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, because he's, he's a member of the tribe. And he was like, well, yeah, you might have a point, but, you know, Paul Gottfried were Ron Ones. Like, well, okay.

So Paul Gottfried and not on Ron Onens get to be in the last car out. Like, I don't know. Like, not my problem. that this is you know we we were on the verge of nuclear war because Victoria Newland was salty about a program from 375 years ago like that's insane that's like me being mad about a nuclear like pushing us the edge of a nuclear war because like all over Cromwell like oppressed the Irish like yeah I'm not happy about it yeah I don't like Cromwell yeah I don't like Cromwell yeah I don't like Cromwell yeah I don't think that he's a good guy. But nuclear war? Well, you know, and I think people are, people think you're being hyperbolic with that. I don't, I don't think most people realize just exactly how far and how hard

Putin was being pushed in the last, in the last year to react in a way that would they're trying to basically make him on the world. Some of them are trying to make him on the world stage, you know, look like a maniac. Because all they can do is say he's a maniac. Oh, he invaded another country.

Great. That's been happening. The whole of our existence is one country invading another country, or one people's or tribe invading another. There's nothing new about that. But there are some who wanted to make him. No, and there were some, there are some who want us all to do.

die. I mean, there's a thread on Twitter that I shared yesterday, and it shows it has in it a paper, a submitted paper, research paper, by someone who used to work at the NIH and had an office right across from Dr. Fauci, who said that the COVID and the COVID vaccine were a Mossad plot to kill a billion people. this was a legitimate like medical paper right you know one of the reasons rfk was opposed is he brought up the fact that that you know the COVID-19 virus attacked whites and more than others ethnic groups and didn't attack what Asians and Ascanaja Jews yeah I was

going to use you Jews and Asians yeah right so we're dealing with a bio weapon that was, again, using my money, Anthony Fauci and members of the tribe went to a racially hostile communist shithole and said, help us build a bioweapon to destroy our own country in case they get mad at us for destroying their country. And notice, notice, I'll just interrupt you for a second, I'll let you keep going. Sephardic Jews, Mizrahi Jews, all the other kinds of, no, these are the Galicians. These are the pale, these are the pale of settlement Jews who are responsible for this. They're, they're targeting everyone else.

Yes. Except the people who, except the people who help them build it. Yeah. not only did they do that, but, you know, the entire COVID operation was, it's just a Boston operation from Goodfellas.

All you need to know about politics is, you know, watch enough mob movies and understand that these people are just, the difference between the Colombo's, or the Genovese's, and the Bushes and the Clintons is who, who cuts their suits? They're not any better or, you know,

different people. They run rackets. They kill people. It's what they people do. Now, You know, Justin Stam just wrote a really good book about mafia power. Like, that's just how power works. I'm not trying to sugarcoat it or anything.

Like, that's just, this is just how the game is played. But, okay, if the difference between the bushes and the clumbos is who cuts their suits, then when they use these tactics, you shouldn't be surprised. So the COVID operation, it was just the, the bust out scene from Goodfellas. It was, you know, because all of these mom-and-pop restaurants where, you know, they've got a restaurant, spent in a family 30 years, you do a pizza place or maybe a diner or something, right? Dad runs a grill, mom runs the front of the house, kids act as waiters or waitresses or buses or whatever, and then they hire a few folks. and then they've got a family restaurant that, you know,

a dozen million dollars a year in revenue, and the building is worth, uh, $250,000. And, you know, after expenses that the family makes a nice, modest,

you know, $110 grand or whatever. Well, that family has, you know, the land and the building and the business worth, millions of dollars in assets. And that person might not have,

you know, $100 million to where they can, you know, go up against, you know, the Walton family. But if 100 of them get together, they can go up against the Walton family. And they might actually be able to get something that they want because they have the capital to be actually, you know, Thomas Jefferson, not my favorite philosopher after I learned how the world actually works. But, you know, property owners. Yeoman property owners, whether the small restaurant people or small business people who guys own a machine shop or something, if they have that money, they can stand up for themselves. And it doesn't matter if it's in Iraq or in Ohio, coherent societies full of people who can stand up for themselves is the thing that the regime does not want. That's why Springfield, Ohio got fluttered

with all those Haitian refugees. Because they don't want you to be able to, like, be in Springfield and look around Ohio and go, man, we're getting screwed, and we should do something about it. They don't want you to be able to resist. Yeah, they've created, I interviewed a gentleman that Jay Burden interviewed recently, introduced me to named John Moody, and he's a guy who he puts on events with Joel Salatin. Oh, yeah. I think a lot of.

Yeah. It was a great show. Moody. Oh, thanks. Yeah, he's, um,

uh, you already listen to the one I put up? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, he's a Kentucky guy, six kids living on 25 acres,

producing his own food. And you know, one of the, one of the takeaways, one of the things you can take away from that episode is yeah, that, you know, was this malicious?

Was it, was it, um, you know, stupidity? Well, whatever it was. I mean,

it weakens. people. It takes our strength away. It also takes away our ability to rationalize. I mean, people can say whatever they want about lower testosterone, you know, weakening men and also making them more leftists, but it also damages, you know, lower testosterone is shown to be something that affects cognitive ability. So if you're taking away people's not physical strength, but their cognitive ability. You know, the argument can be made that a certain tribe doesn't, the majority don't exhibit physical strength, but they still, their cognitive ability to rationalize and

scheme and do things is still there. Well, I mean, that's even trying to be taken away from, that's trying to be taken away from us. Right. Well, because they don't want you and I to be able to argue with them. Why do you think you got to monitor? It wasn't because you were wrong. It's because they don't want to have to deal with this,

this, uh, obnoxious Spaniard. Like, Spaniards defeated us once. We don't want these people to be a problem again. Take his money. Take his wallet. Take his coat.

Kick him out. That's what they did. You know, Thomas should be a professional. at the University of Chicago or the Ivy League or Oxbridge or like a major like law academic something and to his great credit he's built a life for himself outside of that

after the system took all that stuff away from him but if it was just pure ability why isn't this guy you know teaching at Harvard why isn't he teaching it at Yale or Princeton or University of Chicago or Stanford. Why not? Well, because he's against the system. And the system wasn't like, well, we don't want to give you a shot. You'll make us look like fools. He did it anyway.

But that's, you know, they don't want us to be able to organize because they know they've got a losing hand. You know, like, hey, do you want to be like weak and dumb and dependent? and not having industry in your country and not be able to get married and not have any kids and be gay. That's not a real like, that's, like, no one's going to sign up for that. I guess more than what you would want more than seeing the government fixed and, you know, seeing the deep state or the administrative state dismantled is, you know, and I'm not, this isn't

coming from a populist kind of standpoint is you want to see people just making the decision that, okay, I can't rely upon these people and I can't rely upon the system that's been built. I need to take care of myself. I need to take care of me and my family. And I think that there are definitely, you've seen since Trump started, you know, in 2015 with his rhetoric, you know, if nothing else, Trump's just a wrecking ball. And I think he's managed to help a lot of people have a reset in their own mind. And you see more people being like, okay, yeah, I'm going to have to do this on my own.

Yeah, we're going to have to do this for ourselves. This is not something that we can rely upon. And to those people, I know there was a lot made of, oh, you know, Trump, if you, Trump is just, he's going to be a pressure release valve. If he's a pressure release valve for people, those people are lost. And those people, they're just sheep and they need to be led. So you need to step in and you need to tell them how they need to live. I mean, after 2020, anybody who thinks that the overwhelming majority of people should be left to their own devices.

I mean, you're not even in the game anymore. These people need to be told how to live and hopefully more people when they're seeing what's happening and things like realizing, oh, the Epstein thing, no one's ever going to pay for what Epstein did. It's like, well, then you can't rely on the government. You have to start doing things for yourself. And we can do things for ourselves if we make that decision instead of waiting around or fucking making excuses. Like, the Jews control everything, so I can't do anything with my life.

There's a lot of people. There's a lot of people who know what we know, who are very successful. Why are they very successful? Because they fucking try and don't make excuses. Right. Well, it's, there's a couple things that you mentioned there that I think are worth talking about. First of all, all right, 10 organized guys can control 10 million people. Right. And in the vast majority of people don't want to be free. It's too much work. If you still believe in like being free for the majority of people, like, no, that's not,

what they want. They want their beer cold and their football on. That's what they want, which is fine. Like, you can want that. Me personally, I want to be free. So I do what I do and I, you know, to incur all these risks because I think it's worth telling the truth. Now, with those two things in mind,

the only people who can actually deliver something where those people who just want to just want to grill, want to watch football, what the beer to be cold, the only way that those people can live decent lives is of someone who cares about them is in charge. Right? People who would flood their communities with opiates

don't care if those people like that, that's not good for those people. Destoring marriage is bad for those people. Megan, so they can't afford a house is bad for those people. Okay, well, how do we get things in such a way that we can be in charge? We can have some agency in our lives and we can, they start to change things. Well, I mean, it starts with, you know, the first rule of, you know, getting in a group conflict is have some pros. Reach out to the old glory club, an active club, or whoever it is that you feel most compelled to reach out to.

Reach out to them because the long wolf dies alone. And if you know what we know, things aren't going to get better. Trump is trying to bring this in for a control, like the landing gear is stuck and it's moving too fast. And Trump is trying to bring it in for a controlled landing. It's going to hurt and going to break a bunch of stuff. But it might mostly be intact and not kill everybody. Who is he going after? USAID?

Well, everything that they did was bad and evil. You know, the entire useless, you know, Sheeniquet industrial complex. Well, that's just a money laundering operation for our enemies. Why? Why is it acceptable that there are tens of trillions of dollars of real estate that are just wasting in all of our major cities where decent people could live and work and have families?

But why is that okay? Why is that acceptable? Well, I think you know the answer to that. Well, yeah, you and I know most of people listening know. And the answer is, of course, that we live in an occupied government. And the first step to on occupying that government is having enough people with some agency, some ability to do things in their lives, recognize that occupation, and start to organize against it. you know, Pete, you've done great work talking about elite theory.

Well, you know, the first step to any political fight is having a lead on your side. Yeah, if the old glory club was about populism, we would just let anybody in. That's not what it's about. And the sooner people figure that out, the better. I was listening to Steve Bannon on with Tim Dillon this morning. I made it about 20 minutes. He's just all populism, all populism. Oh, the people this, people that, and we had to do this.

Oh, you know, the people, this is a guy who acts like people will make the right decision if you just give them the proper circumstances. That's, where has that ever been shown? I mean, it's been proven wrong in this country because you, they had the chance to be like, no, in 1880, they had a chance. no, we're not going to take, we're not going to bring in this group of people who has been causing problems throughout Eastern Europe for centuries. Oh, no, we'll just let them in. Oh, yeah, we'll let them in.

Yeah, sure. I mean, so much of a problem that German Jews who had been here for, you know, 80 years prior wouldn't even let them into their golf clubs. They were like, we think these people are, these people are a problem. But, oh, okay, sure. Yeah, we'll just all the pale, all the pale, all the Galicians, bring them in. Yeah, all the Polacks. Well, and I, and here's the thing about Steve Bannon is he's lying. And he knows, like you know he's lying.

He knows that you know he's lying and he's doing it anyway. Because this dude's read Avila. He's, he's read. Back in the first administration, they were always like, oh, Steve Bannon reads this dangerous stuff like Carl Schmid. Like, he knows. He's, you know, he's, he's a former spook. There's no such thing as, of course, is a former spook, but, you know, like, he knows.

So why do you continue to talk about populism? Steve? Who's pulling your strings such that you think you have to, you know, justify yourself for, like, populism of, you know, the multiracial working class? Well, maybe I don't want to be solidaristic with people who aren't my people and don't share my interests and consistently vote against those interests whenever they're given the chance and constantly take from me and their entire middle class is the fabrication of federal government spending. And they commit all the violent crime in our country. Maybe I don't want to be forced to be soloristic with those people.

And you know this. I know you know this because you work for Bright Park. And they touch it, sort of. And in order to know where the line is, and go right up to it, you have to know what's on the side of the line. Otherwise, you'd have blundered across it ages ago. So if you're constantly tap dancing on that line, you have to know what's on the other side to not cross it.

So why are you lying, Steve? Well, Breitbart, conceived in Israel, born in America. America. I had Tom Luongo on a week or a week and a half ago. And he, I told him, I said, I want you to listen to this episode I did with a guy who's a hedge fund manager, Ron Dodson. And I said, oh, he talks in the beginning about how Trump negotiates. And he listened, what those are fantastic, by the way. Yeah, Ron, Ron's wonderful. He's going after OSI-N-T, OS, INT on Twitter this morning. I told them, I said, listen to this about how Trump negotiates.

And he got past that and he started listening and he's like, you know, he listened to what we talked about right after that. And he got with me and he said, I want to thank you for sharing that episode. And then he went on like a couple podcasts and actually mentioned the episode. Because what we talked about after that was that the fact that we're the age of consensus politics is dead. which means that populism is dead. We are not in, nobody cares.

Nobody really cares about what the people wants anymore. It's about who's going to get power and who's going to do a thing. And if Trump has proved anything by getting rid of, you know, the cash cows to, you know, I said today with him slapping down Zelensky was basically him slapping down, you know, a branch of international jury. him cutting off USAID is a way of basically defunding a branch of international jury. And he's doing this without, I mean, taking the Pugles of the city of London is defunding, you know, like, yeah. Right.

And Jews are just, Jews are just criminals. Like, they're just mafiosi, right? Beaming Netanyahu is a hard dude, but he's just a mafiosi. right he's corrupt he's you know constantly engaging in shady deals like like that's he's just that's that's what he is and and they've all been that way every single one of you know um what was it the the former prime minister who was dawson's talked about this the the guy who was um former israeli intelligence who was neck deep in the msahd or in the the Netanyat are a need-eep in the

that's the same thing. Not Ehud Barak. Yeah, Barack, yeah. Ah-Hood-Brah. Oh, is it? Okay. Yeah. So, these people are just criminals, right? The only difference between Congress and your local mafia is who cuts their suits.

Right? Stormy's talked about this a lot. It's worth, you know, former senator from Washington State. Henry Scoop Jackson, right? The joke was that he was the senator from Boeing all through the Cold War, right? We need more appropriations for, you know, like he just never met the, you know, defense appropriations bill. He didn't love because he was Boeing's man in Washington.

Well, everybody's that. everybody you see on Capitol Hill, they're all somebody's somebody. They're all like a walking wallet for somebody. They're a mouthpiece for somebody. They're their legal guy, whatever. You know, what do you call CBS? CIA broadcasting system, right?

Yeah, 100%. You know, Washington Post. How did Bob Woodward? former intelligence operator, like go from, you know, junior cup reporter to the man on the biggest story in the history of the newspaper. I mean, we've basically found out that, like, Operation Mockingbird never ended. Like, Politico's just a Mockingbird operation. Like, you think Bill Buckley left the CIA to found National Review,

or do you think the CIA told him to found National Review? Which one? What do you think really happened there? Rothbard covers that in betrayal of the American right, which is basically a pretty good, you know, if you read around the obvious libertarianism and things like that. It's a good history of the neocons, one of the better history of the neocons, actually. Yeah, it's a wonderful book. But yeah, like, you think Politico's any different? You think The Washington Post is any different?

like, oh, R.T. is not available in this country because it's, you know, propaganda, state media. What do you think NPR is? It's just, it's just state media for shitlips, you know, PBS, it's not any different. The BBC, it's all, like, and the receipts are there. Like, this is, you've been paid by, you know, left wing, uh, Zionists to, promote their narrative. And they don't want Western nations to be full of free people who are capable of standing up in their own because they might stand up for themselves against the occupiers. Simple as.

Like they didn't want the Bath Party, you know, in Syria and Iraq because the Arabs, due to their own civilization deficiencies require like a strong man, central power to like keep, organize them and get them to do anything. So the bath parties couldn't stand because that had enabled Arabs to organize and especially their own interests, contrary interests of Israel. Just the way that, you know, Governor Shapiro in Pennsylvania doesn't want those, you know, white coal miners to be able to organize successfully in their own self-defense because then the storm Harris bring them.

Dude, what's going on? Well, then they could oppose him, so they don't want that. I guess that brings us back to, you know, talking about, or we've never finished talking about just, or it's just a continued conversation about what we do for ourselves. And that's what it's always come to. We can't, as much as I would love to see Trump just absolutely dismantle, you know, the administrative state, sitting here and expecting him to do that, or sitting here and hoping he does that, and then hoping it somehow benefits me, because I think one of the things that we got

straw man on was when we started talking about the PayPal Mafia last year, that we were like, oh, you want these guys to be in charge. It's like, no. What I'm thinking is there is quite a possibility that these people don't want. want me dead as compared to the regime that's in charge. And considering some of the things that I know that I've heard that they want to do, maybe there'll be some things that'll line up that I'll be able to take advantage of. It wasn't, oh, we think these people are going to be in there.

They're going to be our friends. And they're going to be at 100%. No one ever said that. But, you know, if you're a dyed in the wool ideologue who, you know, needs every, things would be 100% their way, which you're never going to get, then you hear one thing while we're saying another. Okay, well, Mark Andreessen is a lot of things. Stupid is not one of them. Okay. Mark Andreessen knows that in a world without reliable electricity, his billion dollar fortune that's built on computers and technology, and we're daily squads.

I don't know what his day-to-day life is like. But I imagine being able to take a private plane wherever you want and have multiple houses and cool locations is pretty cool. It's kind of nice to be able to like, oh, the Metropolitan Opera, New York is doing La Traviata this weekend, and I really like that opera, and they've got a really good soprano playing the main part. So I'm going to go. I'm going to go, let's see La Traviata on Saturday night tomorrow night.

So I could be in Florida. You'd be like, I'm going to go see La Trove tomorrow. And you call your guy up and you get on your plane in the morning and you fly from Florida to New York and you land at your private airfield that only other really rich dudes go to. And then you go to your New York apartment. It's nice. It's quiet. And you change into your nice house. fit and he goes to La Traviata and you go to your nice restaurant after the opera that's exclusive

and you crash at your nice New York place and then the next day you fly home to your nice sunny place in Florida in the Keys in the wintertime and it's fantastic well in order for all of that to happen mark and Jesus has got to have people who are capable of flying his airplane and maintaining his airplane and maintaining the airport and maintaining the roads and maintaining the power stations so that all of that stuff works

and maybe just maybe Mark Adrescent wants to be in charge because Mark Adreason or Peter Thiel or whoever wants to be in charge because they want to be in charge. Well, guess what? They have billions of dollars and if they want stuff, stuff happens. If Peter Thiel wants to be in charge of things, and he wants there to be functioning electricity,

because PayPal doesn't work when there's no electricity, and so he doesn't have any money if there's no electricity. Well, then I benefit because, hey, I like electricity too. Not only enables me to talk to my buddy, Pete, but it means they don't freeze to death. So I'm a fan. And what I think these guys have seen is that we white western civilization, particularly the men,

were carrying such a parasite load that it was going to kill the host. And they were like, oh, well, I like being king parasite, to use an analogy, and I like being the guy at the top of the heap who has my billions of dollars and my nice tech fortune, all which, you know, they've genuinely done things to earn, right? PayPal is handy. Netscape Bowser revolutionized everything. Eelan Musk is no dummy.

Like these people are genuinely doing things. But what they've exposed is just how much of everything else was dragging us down. Millions and fake social security, millions of fake social security numbers, millions of billions of dollars in fake influence ops. You know, 10% of the country is working. at some sort of nonprofit that is mostly just a government money laundering operation. You know, you and I talked about the teachers unions in our, in the series on race warrant high school. That's just a money laundering operation. It's funny when I started reading that book.

And I think I'm, I think I rereleased it recently or I'm getting ready to re-release it, in the big file and everything. You know, we didn't realize, we thought we were just going to find out about, you know, a bunch of kids, you know, a bunch of kids, quote unquote, chipping out in high school. And we found out that, well, no, we were going to read about the Jewish take, the Jewish takeover of a public union. And it laid out exactly how they did it. I mean, that's the craziest thing about that book is you're like, oh, okay, well, you know, black, black, are beating people up doing drugs and raping teachers. Wow, I did not know that.

No, I kind of knew that. I just had never really seen it spelled out in such detail. But what we really found out was we found out why nothing was ever going to be done about it because a heist was happening. Right, yeah, because Randy Whitegarten is the, you know, AFT head, right? And she's a Jewish lesbian, Mary do a rabbi, quote-unquote, married to a rabbi or something. And basically, right,

it was just the same USAID scam, right? They're going to take a bunch of decent people's tax money. They're going to splash it out to all their friends. And those friends are going to be like, well, you know, you just gave me a thousand bucks. I'm going to give you $100 back to continue to splash out that money for me. Because, you know, I'm getting, you know, summer's off. huge, you know, and they knew it was going to, like, they could read an actual aerial table in

1976. They knew it was going to bankrupt the state in New York, you know, 50 years from now in the 2020s. They didn't care because they were getting paid now. It's like, well, you know, again, Peter Thiel, Mark and Driesen, not dumb guys. They read that actuarialial table and said, oh, well, if we want to live in a society that, that it functions well enough that we can enjoy it and do things like go to nice restaurants and go see the opera and and go see, you know, symphony orchestras and have nice houses with,

with, you know, functioning electrical systems and clean water and all that stuff. Like, we're going to have to put the ship all right. Because there's no other elite around to do it. We said for years, hey, maybe he's 50. Fix us, maybe he used to fix this. Well, lo and behold, you know, old cocaine Mitch, whose wife was the former transportation secretary, who is from an oligarchical Chinese family, she's not real interested in fixing America. Well, why not?

Well, because she doesn't, because she's not American. Elaine Chow is not an American. Why was this prison? You know, this transportation secretary under W. Bush. why are all these federal judges who aren't Americans being put in place where they can block the Trump administration and say, well, I mean, I'm not an American and my wife works for, you know, an open border NGO, but I'm going to tell you guys how your constitution works. What? No, like this can't work. It will not continue to function.

There's probably a hundred million fraudulent illegal immigrants in America. If you, if rounding up, like it might be 80 million, it might be 75 million. But tens of millions, there's certainly that many if you include their offspring who shouldn't be citizens, right? But are because, or temporarily are because of our ridiculous system. Have you been to a public emergency room lately? They're unusable. The streets look like the dark side of the moon. Yeah.

If you're anywhere near a city, it just looks like the, um, you know, an airport in Africa. Yeah. And so no matter what, right, Trump just telling Zelensky, hey, like, we can't do business like this. I'll believe it when I see it. But whoever's pulling Donald Trump's strings understands that we're at the end of the runway. There's no more room.

Now, the national debt, interest on the national debt exceeds our defense spending, and that was already bloated by three or four times too much. Basically, at this point, what we're hoping for is you're just hoping for more of the rot to be cut away. Because the more rot that's cut away, the more opportunity that is for you. The more chance that is removed. Yeah, that's... Well, I mean, people need to understand. There's too many people looking at this, and I get them,

coming into the comments on my live stream or leaving comments on Twitter, they're, I'm willing to do something as soon as everything's perfect. It's not ever going to be perfect. So you have to be able to recognize opportunity when it presents itself. And it's presenting itself right now. Things are being, things are being put in place.

Now we may, we may have a, quote unquote, correction coming in the market very soon. So I don't know if that's the place you'd look now when everything goes down. If you have some extra, you know, you might want to ride the wave back up. But no, what I'm talking about is I'm talking about tangible goods, employment, starting your own business, all of these things, starting a family, going and, you know, seeing if you can find some land somewhere.

And it doesn't have to be, make sure it's not in the, it doesn't have to be in the greatest zip code. We've been sold that. Just someplace where you're comfortable, someplace where you're safe. All of these things can be, all of these things should be had, you should have been able to do this under the Biden administration if you had your head on straight. But now, a lot of that rot is being torn away. and if you're just sitting there and you're complaining and you're like, well, I don't want to do anything until everything's perfect. Well, that's not going to happen. So you're just going to be lost.

I used to think like that. I used to think like that. It's like, well, why should I even bother really trying when, you know, if you own a house, you never really own it because of property taxes. And the more money I make, the more income tax I'm going to pay and everything. And I mean, that's just a loser mentality. It's just a loser mentality. And I hear it, I hear it all too often. And it's one of the reasons why I ran away from libertarianism because you'll hear that.

I remember in 2021, people were complaining about, you know, it's like, oh, well, what do we do? And Matt Erickson said, make more money. And immediately, there was like five comments saying, oh, so that I can pay more taxes to pay for the war in Yemen. Yeah. It's like, look, so you have more power, dumbass? Because money is power. That's why. I mean, the people who don't want to win, just don't want to win.

And you can't help those people. So leave them behind and do whatever you can to help yourself and those that want to help you and those that also want to win. Yeah, you know, when Thomas, people still contact me all the time and go, when Thomas says, you know, we're not Jehovah's Witnesses, we're looking for a vanguard. What does that mean? it means exactly what it means. It means that we're putting information out there, and I know that a lot of the people listening to this don't want to be a part of the vanguard. They're looking for information, they're looking for education, whatever can help them.

But, you know, one of the good things it has come out of this show is a lot of people joining the Old Glory Club, and us getting to meet a lot of young people who are eager to be elite. They want to know how to do that. They want to know how to get power. They want to know how to get... That's what this is all about. You're looking... It goes back to what we were talking about, about populism.

Not everybody's going to be able to... That's one of the reasons why Jesus said you'll always have the poor. because some people are just not going to want to do for themselves. They'll always find an excuse to not. And yeah, I mean, what we're doing, what this was always all about was trying to lift people up who want to be lifted up. And now some things are being, some rot is being stripped away. It might even be able to make it a little bit easier so that you can, Maybe some regulations will be gone.

It'll allow you to do things that you would, you never thought about doing. So right now, if you're a white man under the age of 30, you've been hiking with a bunch of other people's food in your backpack and expected to, you know, when it's time to stop to camp, you're expected to hand them their food. Well, what the Trump administration has just done, said, well, you don't got to carry that anymore.

you can hike farther and faster and take care of yourself more when you're not carrying other people's stuff. Now, if he actually does it, or if it's just all talk, we'll see. This Epstein rugpole was pretty disappointing, but nevertheless, he's exposing the brat. And that might give people the moral courage to understand

just where we're at. I don't know if that's his play. I don't know if that's their plan. I don't know what the goal is, but I know for a fact, then no matter what happens, I'll be better off if I find guys that I know I can trust

that are also working to improve themselves and improve their own situations as I'm trying to do myself. So no matter what, like there's a wonderful old prep blog, probably from the 2010s, it used to call the Wood Pile Report. The gentleman called himself Old Remus.

And he said, if a prep doesn't make your life better in general, it's useless. So having a case of MREs, good idea. Spending every last dime you have to have a year's worth of MREs, bad idea. No matter what you're doing in your life. If you don't have any debt and you're in good shape and you're looking to network with bros.

Like, do any of those things make your life worse? No, of course not. Does it mean you're putting together like a, you know, Mad Max's Apocalypse Squad? I mean, maybe. But, like, being in shape and, and having friends is like not a bad thing no matter what. So just do it. Do the prep that makes your life better no matter what. you know, instead of just endlessly, you know,

suppose it's a little bit hypocritical guy, you know, guy who does a bunch of podcasts telling people to stop just endless to go us in a podcast, but go out and do something, you know, use this knowledge you've been given that, you know, those of us who give it to you, you know, incur great risks to do it. You know, not only should you use that knowledge to improve your own life, but, you know, support the people that support you and go to your free man on the wall slash support to

enable Pete to you know keep doing this so that you have more more of a larger network because right now if you're an OGC guy you can go just about anywhere in America and find a bro and within a year from now or two years from now I would be very very surprised if there weren't OGC guys in every state at least getting a chapter up in every state up and running because I believe we do have OGC guys in every state now spiritually. We just, we're doing this officially.

So, yeah, I got to cut it there because I got another one coming up this afternoon. But I do appreciate you coming by. And I really hope people got the message today that, you know, there are some good things happening. You will be disappointed.

It's politics. You have no control over it. you're going to be disappointed. Suck it up, keep going, and do what you need to do to take care of you and yours. And, you know, don't buy into this lie that collectivism is socialism or communism. And then when you say that, people are like, well, no, only if you use a state. No, if you're local and you get one of your people elected. I mean, one of our people is a state's attorney right now.

one of our people like a bunch of our people are working in this administration you know and that's that's something that's something to celebrate if if that can happen there's no reason why your local area you guys can't get together and take over and you know defeat the enemy in your local area and try to work on making it what you wanted to look like what you and and your people want it to look like. So I'll end on that, and I'll give you the last word if you have anything. No, just, you know, support the people to support you.

You know, rebrand me on the wall slash support, right? I appreciate that, man. Well, thank you. And until the next time, take care of yourself, right? Thanks, man. I want to welcome everyone back to the Pekingana show. I have two frequent beloved guests. here today. So Thomas, how are you doing? I'm well. Thanks for

avoiding me. Dee, how are you doing? I'm fantastic, man. Thanks for having me back. All right, Dee. This was your idea for a conversation. So have at it, man. M-Casa, Sukasa. Thank you so much. So everyone should totally check out, I mean, everything that Beat and Thomas have done together, but the Mosley series in particular, I found really fascinating just because, you know, Mosley, there's a culture familiar with us. And in I think episode four or five, you guys talked about the fascist international conference, the first one, first and only one. And we mentioned all the different nations that were there. And if you haven't read Paul Gottfried's fascism, the career of a concept, I think it's a really

good book, despite, you know, Dr. Gottfried being of the tribe, I believe he's an honest man. And it got me thinking that in 1916 at the psalm, if you'd gone back a century to the Congress of Vienna, where Napoleon was, or the, you know, Hapa recently called it a gentleman's piece, right? You have this where despite firearms, most of the people in the world were still agricultural peasants. and despite advances in things like the McCormick Reaper Binder in the 1850s or improved yields and crops and other things, right? Like an agricultural peasant from like a Roman Latifundia would fundamentally understand like a guy who was growing food in Mississippi in like 1855. but in the 19th century between the Somme and Vienna you had cars, trains,

refrigeration, canning, telecommunications, in the telegraph and the telephone. I mean, just literally everything in normal life, everyday life changed 100% and in a very weird way, like World War I represents like the death of the old world. And fascism is this opportunity.

There's like there's three kind of semi-coherent ways to deal with this new change world that happens after the war, after the great war of capitalism, Bolshevism, and fascism. And really, to me, the only one that actually kind of makes coherent sense with like human beings as they are that have particular loves and attachments. and it doesn't destroy religion and whatever. Fascism was the one coherent way to actually address all these changes without just rejecting them entirely. There are people who will, you know, LARP as Catholic monarchists or whatever. And like, we just need to go back to the way it was in the 13th century. Like, that's a nice thought, but that ain't happening. So I couldn't think of anybody better than Thomas to, like, actually elucidate how fascism was disdiscate.

how fascism was this just very real attempt to grapple with the world as it now found itself. And I think that people need to understand that like those are your alternatives, right? You can have Bolshevism. You can have Judeo-Jus various capitalism or you can have some sort of state socialism. And that's it. So, well, it's also, it's important to consider, I think, I mean, I invoke the term capitalism because just for intelligibility, and people like Schumpeter, they invoked it for the same reason, even though he didn't think that it was particularly useful as a descriptor in absolute terms. But, like, the important thing to keep in mind is that the New Deal Revolution, it was with Revolutionary as what happened in Germany in 1933, or would it happen in the Soviet Union.

Like it wasn't, Roosevelt wasn't just this guy. He was like, well, you know, there's a structural crisis underway. So we needed an executive to step in and, you know, and kind of manage the, the crisis situation. Like the new deal was this top down ideology of retooling the entire way of living of, you know, millions and millions of people. And I make the point again and again that like what became the civil rights revolution, euphemistic. basically um that started under rosyville like forced racial integration this kind of trying to forcibly strip people of their identity and um characteristics you know um that was one of the kind of secondary imperatives the military draft was the kind of condition people um towards those uh

towards those imperatives, you know, so it wasn't, um, it wasn't this kind of like neutral administrative apparatus that was implemented, but that also, you know, had, uh, sort of like a war profiteer's sensibility, you know, in terms of power political affairs. So that's fundamentally important. Um, and, uh, it's not in, these people were very much adjacent, um, that, the communists. I mean, that's why they wasn't just that they hated the fascists and the national socialists and it's not just that they were sympathetic

to Zionism. Like, first and foremost, I, Roosevelt himself didn't particularly like Jews. I mean, that's just a fact. Like, his, his primary sympathy was for communism. You know, like, in the view of people like him,

you know, this is an inevitability. This is the way the world is going. you know and for context too because people do this day they still talk about guys like burn them as being neocons because you know in the 1920s they would bandy socialist ideas people don't understand that ontologically every single person thought that way because there'd been a total collapse of the nascent world economy

and in the absence of information tech that situation is a manager like laissez-faire is not possible in the true sense if there's no such thing as situational awareness up to the moment you know really the situation kind of endured until the late 1980s like the reason now like there's not true economic crises um part of that is structural and part of that has to do with the uh the the deep integration of capital but the primarily it's the elimination of uncertainty like i can tell you tell you right this moment, like what's happening in European markets. Okay, even like 40 years ago, 30 years ago, I wouldn't know for hours. You know, in the 1920s, I wouldn't know for days. So this idea that people, you know, who weren't inclined towards New Dealersism or towards communism or towards utopian socialism or whatever, they were just advocating status

models of of the planned economy or whatever or that they were like bandy and Keynesianism. They weren't doing that because like they had some ethical disposition in that way. It's because that's the way every single person thought. You know, if you started talking about lazy fair economics,

people would have looked at you like you were an idiot or a crazy person. Like how would that even have worked? You know? So there's that. I tend to agree to change gears back to the main subject matter

because that was kind of a tangent. I generally agree with Ernst Nolte. I think fascism, like true fascism, as it emerged, you know, in Italy, it was a radical tendency. It was as much a radical

tendency as communism was. It just didn't have the same political orientation, obviously. And a lot of that was born at future shock. um you know but also the international situation had to do with it you know i make a point again and again one of the reasons there's the alibi of conservatives and other midwits that oh you shouldn't be too hard on churchill because the uk had to prevent the ascendancy of a rival power in germany

that was dead like cabinet warring and you know this kind of uh sensibility of oh we've got a geostrategic rivals in utero to preserve our ability to manage these captive markets and things. Like that died in 1914. You know, by the time of the Great Depression, the superpower era was emerging. You know, so Japan and Europe, and Germany specifically, but I mean, I say Europe because the Axis wasn't just Germany. That's a misconception that this was some German nationalist enterprise. but Japan through what they called the greater Asia

co-prosperity sphere and Germany slash Europe would become superpowers they would perish you know and you know I put it to people who invoke that sort of ethical alibi that I just involved you know the UK obviously lost the war and it became like a third rate power you know that's now like overrun with

with aliens and is you know quite literally airstrip one so like obviously like that victory was the most purec victory that's ever that's ever been had yeah mostly was completely correct right like we have to secure the empire we're going to lose it you know just to briefly bring up like denunzio's cult of speed right we didn't have paved roads until like 1820 macadam didn't invent the process till 1820s so think about this like Roman transportation in like the first century was the best roads got until the mid 18th century and 40 miles an hour was the fastest any human being went. More than it like a second or two and live to tell about it for for centuries.

And as you pointed out right like there's, was just no alternative. Well, the two key, the two key, the two key, the two key aspects of future shock that translated, that both informed and were the catalyst for,

and, and, um, were most significant, um, to the political situation. It was, uh, it was the crisis of labor and it was the,

the military and strategic situation, the emergence of, of a war tech devastating war tech at scale and also what's significant is that

massive warfare at scale basically never ever happens so the 20th century the fact that this became the reality constantly that's completely abnormal those conditions happen maybe once every thousand years

and obviously that again the war tech that emerged in scale capacity that was totally unprecedented but also I make the point to people a lot, you know, the crisis of labor and the fortunes of millions of people being bound up with labor imperatives, people can't conceptualize that anymore. That's the reason why I'm always telling people, don't use the term working class. There is no working class. There hasn't, like the last of it in structural terms went away in the early 90s.

Like when we say working class, we don't mean people with jobs. We're like guys who do work. We're talking about millions and millions of people doing pretty much the exact same job in factory settings. They're almost all young. They're almost all men. Their jobs are dangerous. They're very, very low wage. There's basically no room for advancement.

It's a totally urbanized setting. for this kind of labor, that is the working class. Okay, it's conditions that don't exist anymore. Really anywhere on this planet, like even in place like China, where there's just like mass like apple factories. I mean, don't be wrong. Those people have like a really brutal lot of life. And they don't have like the right to organize or anything.

And they're very much like exploited. But that's different than what we're talking about in, you know, the early 20th century. Like that's the, that's the, that's the, That's the ideological soil, if you will, from where, like, communism emerges. That is the working class. If you read up, then Sinclair's The Jungle, which I think is a great book. You know, I know socialist like Sinclair was, but what he describes in the Chicago stockyards,

that's the way that it was. You know, every day people die on the job. Like, going to your job is, like, going to war. And there's always men who want to work. Like, if you age out of the ability. to physically do your job. If you get injured on the job, you'll be thrown away like garbage. There's a hundred other men who want to do your job or younger, stronger, and we'll do it for half of what you do. Like, why do I need you? That's the working class, okay?

And there's an ontological aspect to it. Like, people emphasize a lot the fact that these people lived in poverty, often grinding poverty, and in the cities that were dirty, dangerous. these people have been ripped out of their kind of natural patterns of living in rural or semi-rural environments, you know, to go work there because they had to survive. But also, there's an ontological aspect. Like, in one of Youngers, I mean, Younger dealt with this directly and they're Arbiter. but he um in a lot of his fiction it like the pro tags or some of the secondary characters

they're great war veterans who find themselves in factory environments and um those experiences like bleed into one another you know like fighting with these dangerous machines you know to like earn like a paltry wage just like being in the trenches again you know

that's it's not it's not just an accident or it's not just a flex that these guys on the street in Vimar, you know, who fought under the communist banner called themselves, you know, combat group of the working class. Because that wasn't, like, verbally. You know, and those conditions are psychologically devastating. You know, like, basically you're forced into conditions where it's like, I've got to, I've got to do this dangerous, dirty job of the rest of all die, you know, and I have no recourse.

you know, that's, that's a lot of what underlay, I mean, that's what underlay all revolutionary imperatives, you know, including, um, fascism. I mean, and Mussolini's background in, like, the communist movement, despite what a lot of communists said and what a lot of left revisionists say today, it wasn't just like some cynical ploy, like, oh, I'll start donning, um, the, this, this, this kind of guise of, of, of, of, of national or racial pride or something. mostly he believed everything he said you know but he he wasn't putting on airs with defining the fascist movement is like a movement of like workers and soldiers and artists because that's what it was

um kind of the it was also responding to it was also responding to tendencies like the action of France say who were very much reactionary like Maras himself was like an atheist and very much kind of like a 20th century modernist but he believed in

And like the, he thought that, you know, the Roman church should have, like, retain, like, a fundamental role in French political life. He believed in, like, the monarchy. You thought these things were, like, essential to the sovereign authority and, like, symbolic, psychological aspects of culture. Mussolini was responding to that in large part. He's, like, no, that's nonsense. We're done with that. You know, like, Mussolini kept obviously, Mussolini didn't oppose the monarchy. Part of it in Italy.

Part of that was tactical. A part of that was, you know, he thought those kinds of things were important as a matter of, you know, like, you know, like Latin heritage and stuff. But he, uh, the, the National Fascist Party, I agree with Ernst & Alley. It was largely in response to that. Like, the National Sociality German Workers Party was like very much like a synthesis of those things. You know, uh, not entirely consciously. It was like a discursive process with them. I think that's the way to think about it, frankly.

Let me jump in and ask a question here. When you look at the 19th century with the 19th century basically being a, I mean, you had seminaries who were, seminaries who were formally reformed adopting Darwinian models. So basically the metaphysical has gone away. How much of an effect does that have just basically, I mean, on the car. culture, we know what it does, but how much of it effect does that have on the political culture, even outside of like Marxism? Yeah, it's tremendously impactful, and that's why, that's one of the, what was two things? It was that, it was, you know, the death of metaphysics and things that were, things, like

transcendent aspects of culture, but also, you know, people, people took for granted that, you know, religion is dead, you know, even if that thing, even if that kind of thing is value, nobody believes in that anymore. You know, human affairs are reducible

to the material and the biological. And that's what I'm really like a lot of racialism. Okay, I wrote a whole essay for my dear friend, Giles, who runs the asylum meg. I wrote an essay for it that he asked me to because people have this idea that, oh, you know, this kind of racialism

with some jillism, with some German obsession. That's the way everybody thought. You know, America was probably the most avidly, like, racial eugenicist country that existed then. I mean, people thought that way in England and in Japan and France. Like, this idea that, you know, well, the reason humans behave the way they do culturally is because of your race. Like, I'm not saying, and like, race is a real thing. I'm not saying that.

But it's not, you're like your DNA or your blood, as they thought in those days, like, doesn't make you, like, act. Jewish or like act German like that doesn't make any sense but in those days everybody thought that way like honestly that's why these like internet guys like I mean yeah there's like an ethnic component to any

sectarian belief structure and obviously like Judaism is an ethnos as well as like a sectarian cultural structure but these guys these weirdos like bandying like oh Jews are a race

like that nobody thinks that way anymore that's the way people thought in in the 1920s like on both sides the divide like oh like you're Jewish because you have this kind of you have this kind of blood you know like that you know and if you're if you're a if you're European or Aryan like

or Japanese you know your blood makes you behave this way like that's that's not the way things are like that's Darwinist nonsense you know like Darwinism is nonsense I don't know if people on the right can't like let that go but that's that's as much it's as much it's as

much like an enlightenment, you know, kind of secular humanist, uh, lie is, is, is the rest of it. You know, like, you're not, um, you're not some like, you're not something like meat robot, like running a program. Like, it's not what a race is, you know, like, yeah, there's a biological aspect to it, but that, you know, but no, that, um, that's why, uh, that's why people, they kind of cherry pick, they'll look at something like, uh, some guy like, uh, Some guy like Serrano Suneer or somebody like Mussolini or somebody like Hitler like said or wrote about religion. They're like see like these guys hated religion. It's like everybody thought that way.

You know, and honestly, like people like Hitler and Mussolini, they had like a softer view. I mean, first of a comedy, just wanted to literally like Merv. People who were, you know, still clinging to the old ways. but you know the the national souls and the fascist

I mean they such that their views of of religiosity seem punitive which in the case the latter

I don't think they did they were like look at look at the conversation like Himmler and Gottla Burger were like burgers talking about how like

yeah you need to like among Islamic allies we need to like cultivate their like belief and like in Orthodox and Roman Catholic territories We got to cultivate like religious beliefs They were doing the opposite if anything

But it um Like cynical is that way of better not Like the point being It wasn't even like For a lot of people It wasn't even like a it was a value neutral thing Like this is the way it is People don't think that way anymore

You know so why would we talk about that stuff It's irrelevant Do I see? This is all gold that I do think that it's important for the listeners to remember that in the span of like three generations like down there was actually good at this. If you were like a poor peasant and you needed a job, you could go to the local burger, the local, ridder, the local gentleman in pretty much any country

in Europe, right, before 1914, they'd be like, hey, I need a job. And he'd like, oh, well, I guess I could use another gardener, another this, another that. And, you know, between the revolution in industry and the revolution in the war, right, that killed that for a lot of reasons,

like the entire upper crust of Britain, of France, of Germany, like they all died in the trenches, Russia and the entire era, the aristocracy, but itself white all across Europe. And, you know, the natural leader class just basically got slaughtered in 1914 to 1918. So the, and I was incorrect earlier, it was a, it wasn't Dinozao in the Conda Speed, it was Marinette. I'm sorry. But that brutal work environment that you talked about and, you know, effectively the factory being no different than the trenches, was there any like precedent for this in history that we know of? I mean, like, I'm struggling to find with some kind of parallel here where like the entire economic, social, religious, you know, sociological, familial paradigm just, they all just shattered.

There is no parallel. And like despite the song's making the point that like only morons say history repeats itself. It absolutely does not. You know, like only idiots think that. Well, consider this, man. The Ford motor plant, I mean, Henry Ford was a great man. And in part because he humanized labor and he did. He took heroic measures to elevate the cordial life of his workforce.

So that's relevant, but just in overall terms. But my point is the Ford Motor plant employed 100,000 people. That's utterly insane. Like literally tens of thousands of people working on one site. And thousands and thousands of men literally doing the same job. but it's also like general strike could bring the economy to its knees you know because these evaluated manufacturers you know they if you could if you get a halt production on them you know uh they you nothing there was no business was being done you know it wasn't at all like today and when

you're talking about um when you're talking about a true working class where you have you know people integrated with productive machines, like literally, you know, all doing the same job, they become part of that machine and they can stop that machine. And like, that's why, that's also why scab labor became a thing. Because you can, if you got like a, if you got like a young man literally with a strong back, if he can physically handle it and endure it psychologically and physically, you can teach any strong young guy to do this job. Like, that's part of, that's part of, that's part of what was critical to this paradigm, is that we're talking about physically very difficult but unskilled labor.

You know, it's basically, you know, it's like a labor army. That's why Spangler talked about how the city is a barracks. Because urbanization at scale, that's why it doesn't make any sense anymore. And like since the 70s, when the federal government stopped bailing out cities, which was a huge deal under the Ford administration. Gerald Ford, like the whole, the mad scramble has been to like find a way to like make cities profitable because like they don't make sociological sense. You know, other, I mean, I think cities are important for sociological and historical reasons, but they exist. The reason why cities exist as we know them is as worker barracks, you know, and finding a way to make them profitable when that paradigm went away has been a very difficult. thing and it's still it's ongoing. Something you said there that just triggered

something right in my brain was about general strikes and a lot of people will say oh the reason why you ship your you ship your manufacturing over to China is because it's cheaper to manufacture there and ship back here than it is to manufacture here. Yeah you also don't have a chance. There's no chance of having a strike in a shutdown. Because it's yeah, because it's illegal and it's thrown

jail or you'll be shot yeah yeah exactly exactly right well or sabotage right like think about the average ford plant today how many billions of dollars in human or in capital is there at a ford plant you know every robot's probably 25 30 40 000 or more i have no idea right more like i worked at a machine shop is my first job and there was these machines that literally had been made in world war two that were valued at like 75 or 100 000 that's in since same. Yeah, go ahead. And that was a number of years ago, so they're probably even more now, right? So you talk about an army of labor. Well, armies can go towards the other guy or they can mutiny. And so like if they, your workforce mutinies and they destroy a bunch of your stuff or sabotage any of your stuff or and it doesn't even need to be much, right? Like if if one of your lathes is like a tenth of a degree of a degree out of spec, like every single part it puts out. is going to be wrong. And when you have to have tolerances of thousands of an inch in order for something to work,

like think about how crazy it is. I was talking to my friend Sandbatch about this. Like if anyone understood what a car is, it's a metal tube filled up with highly explosive, volatile gasoline and you light it on fire and you go down the road at 90 miles an hour. Like, that's crazy. And in order for that not to like just fall apart or break, you have to, you know, you have to have very tight tolerances. And we're not talking airplanes, which are even tighter or, you know, anything like that.

This is just cars and they have relatively loose tolerances compared to something like an airplane or let alone anything involving space. So you've got these where you, everything has to be up to spec. No, 100%. I'll also add to talking about the labor situation and the radicalism. of the laboring classes, as well as World War I, and managing conflict at scale.

You know, this kind of thing, it's like trying to ride some out-of-control animal. Like this idea that every step of the way this stuff can be controlled or that there's like discrete kind of temporal snapshots whereby if you're in an executive role, you can somehow put the brakes on things. Like, that's nonsense. Like, these things get out of control rapidly.

And trying to, trying to bring a labor revolver under control, or trying to end, uh, they're trying to bring a conflict to, you know, to, um, to ceasefire. As was the case on like 1916, 1917, that's, that's almost impossible.

You know, like, once these things, things start, they can't really be stopped. They have to run their course. And I mean, that was the case if you're talking about, if you're talking about, you know, some, some local lord in the 1500s. If you're talking about a national state of 80 million people, you know, involved in a war that's rapidly becoming mechanized, you know, where, where 20 million men are mobilized, fighting it.

it's impossible to stop it you know and um that's why uh and there was there's in and the leadership element was uniquely ill-suited to do that you know i mean the point again again is the reason why hitler actually personally hated very few people i mean he wouldn't have gotten very far as and he certainly wouldn't have become the most single powerful man in the world if he sat around hating people he hated de kaiser wilhelm And many, many veterans did, as they should have, because he was a piece of shit. And Holveig was the real, Holveig and Franz Joseph and the Hasbury Empire were like the real heroes, the central powers, in my opinion. But, and both of them understood that if this war begins, we won't be able to stop it.

You know, I mean, while the Kaiser was carrying on and he was like some kind of money python character or something, just like oblivious to these things. I mean, as were like a lot of his counterparts to be fair across the continent. But, you know, the German Empire was a mixed system. It was, you know, the Bismarckian system. There was a genuine separation between state and government. But at the end of the day, I mean, the Kaiser and ultimate war authority. You know, I mean, people, the general staff, the Reichs consular, you know, these guys had a lot of power

and they had independent power to negotiate within reason, but, I mean, it was in the hands of the Kaiser and, like, if you got some, if you got guys, you know, guys who were born in the mid-19th century who have been kind of cloistered within palace walls, like, both physically and

conceptually, and a modern mechanized war is in their hands. Like, that's, that's a nightmare. You know, I mean, so that's part of it. Yeah, well, I, go ahead. You were talking, Hitler was born in 18, 1889.

And Mussolini was 1883, I believe. Right. So they were young men when, like, the world had changed in a crazy fashion. But all the guys you'd mentioned, you know, the Kaiser was born in what, 1853, I want to say. I can't remember. But, you know, like the 1850, like, he was an old man by 1914. And he was a literal prince, right? So he's in this, he's never had to work in industrial, even the kings of France, who, you know, quote, worked for a living.

They were taught a trade as part of their raginal duties, right? They were never taught like, okay, be careful, don't stick your finger in this or lose an arm. Like, that was never a thing that any of these people ever had to deal with. I think France Joseph was an exception. And he was probably elderly by the onset of hostilities, but he'd bronze Joseph He'd regularly fast. He slept on a military cot. He like would forego luxury. He was a career soldier. Like even when he was out of active service, like he'd still like wear a uniform every day.

Like he didn't like having to put out like regal finery. But yeah, go ahead. Generally, yeah, that's he was the exception that proves the rule. Yeah, well, he's he's a there are people who want to canonize him. no one of Catholics, particularly who wanted canonize him because he was just such a, he tried so hard to stop this, you know, and as you mentioned, like, it had a momentum all its own where, like, no one could stop it, you know, like,

perhaps in 1913, like, if all the cousins had met and been like, this is insane, like, if they'd gotten together and perhaps done a demonstration, like, this is what a modern machine gun can do and, like, had a bunch of cows in the field or something. And what's, that's critical, too.

Like, after Waterloo, there wasn't a real European war. Like there was the, there's the Franco Prussian war, which was like an incredible victory. I mean, I said it would put the Prussians on the map. And there was, there was the Crimea, but the Crimea was like,

very much restricted to localized theaters. But there, you know, there wasn't a real, like, modern war. There was guys and the guys who'd served as mercenaries and the war between the states and America. Like some of them tried to send the alarm bells like, look, like this is going to be a slaughter.

But yeah, they, people had no idea what like modern wartic was like because it had been a century since most people have been exposed to that kind of thing. And everything changed so much too. I mean, yeah. Well, that's one of the things I wanted to bring up is you go from the Franco-Prussian war to World War I, which is less than 50 years. And World War I, you have planes that are flying around and they're dropping manually. dropping bombs out of them. And then just less than 20 years later, the Condor Legion is frigging cities on fire in Spain. I mean, how do you not, how does humanity and people who are of a high culture thinking,

people who are looking towards the eternal and looking towards doing great things, how are they not all over the place in trying to figure out an ideology when you in 20 years you go from oh here i'm dropping a bomb out of a plane with my hand to i just let guernick on fire yeah no and things like and things like things like chemical warfare i mean it's not just like poison gas is disgusting and it's it's just like awful to contemplate that's that's a terrible way to die but this idea that you know i can I can fire poison at you, like, well outside a visual range through, like, indirect fire. You know, and within seconds, you'll be like, your lungs will tread to pieces and you'll die, like, choking on those pieces. Or, you know, like, you'll scratch your, you'll scratch your, you'll scratch most sensitive areas of your body, bloody, because, like, a blistering agent is, is, is, like, tearing your stuff. skin apart. You know, like that kind of stuff. It's like something out of like science fiction. That'd be like if guys went to war tomorrow

and like the Ivans or like the Cuthys had like found a way to like launch like Xenomorce at you that like grab your face and then like pop out of your chest. I mean, I'm being obtuse, but that's like what it would be like. But people are just like what the fuck. You know, like I

that I mean, not like people were habituated to violence unfortunately very much in those days. I mean, not cool like noble sword, but stuff like that is just like the horrors of technology kind of shit, I guess is my point. Like the largest the Grand Army got was like 600,000 people and that was only very briefly, right? And then like World War I, that's not even, I mean, that's like casualties for a couple months, you know? Yeah, the burn rate is, was unbelievable.

And what's also, too, some of the exigencies that emerge in game theory and reached their zenith, you know, by the final cycle of the Cold War, where there's conditions of strategic parity and planning for nuclear war fighting. You know, you're, like, you as a commander of, or as part of the command element of strategic nuclear forces, you're charged with identifying potential war indicators,

like before the enemies even started to act, arguably before he even understands that conditions are moving towards war, you know, and then, you know, you've got to be able to read those indicators and decide whether to like preemptively assault or not. Like stuff like that was, though those kinds of variables were already emergent in 1914. And that's why I believe, I agree with AJP Taylor. when the Russian Empire, when the Tsar gave the order to mobilize, Russia had a two-phase mobilization paradigm.

And once it was implemented, even if the czar or, I don't know if the Russian Imperial Army had a general staff or not, whatever their command element was, even if he or them had put the brakes on mobilization, you know if if the German Empire and the Haftsbury Empire

hadn't assaulted they would have been dead because they were like rolled the dice and been like okay will not mobilize in kind you know taking like the Tsarit

like his word but it's like if this is a war ruse like we're dead you know because you don't have force even if you have forces in being and even if you have like a properly trained

an outfitted, like, reserve system of like, able-bodied men. They're not, like, sitting around mobilized. You know, so essentially, it's the equivalent of, like, deloping, metaphorically speaking, like, while you're dueling opponent, like, has his weapon trained on you.

You know, so this head, I'm sure people listening are going to think I'm being punitive and mean to the Russians. I'm not there's not like a moral component here. I'm saying like in causal terms, when the Tsar gave the order to mobilize forces, the die

was cast. They couldn't be stopped anymore. When Hullwig approached the French at the 11th hour and begged them to stand down, if they had done that, I think that that would have stayed the hand of the Russians because then they would have been fighting

they would have been fighting both the German Empire and the Habsburgs on like a single front whereby like the bulk of both forces could be thrown at the Tsar's army but that's a bit abstract but yeah that's important to consider man and it also relates too to like I said like situational awareness particularly as regards

the window of decision temporally, you know, as to responding to world market conditions, there's a parallel, not just a similar, not in terms of similarity, like structural similarity, but there's a parallel in terms of causality, you know, between military and geopolitical crises and and um economic uh events at scale you know and um this is uh

these are the things that really created kind of like the the late modern state you know like the managerial state if you will um as uh as James Burnham called it um you know like in some ways we're very

fortunate man like I'm not I don't have pontificate or derail the conversation but I you know especially if you're old enough to remember remember the Cold War. I mean, I was like a little kid and like a very young teen when the Cold War was going on, but it was just something you lived with. Um, you know, people these days are like, are compared to even 40 years ago or like unbelievably safe. That's why it's bizarre. They act like a bunch of hysterical old women all the time are scared of everything. It's

like, what the fuck you talking about? Like I'm compared to somebody 100 or 50 or 40 years ago, you're like unbelievably safe. But yeah, I didn't. I mean, well, it's like, but it's also like you say, Thomas, the U.S. military is designed just to fight the cold war. So is our political, so is our political thought. That's what we're taught. We're just, I mean, our philosophy now is we're just continually fighting the cold war. Everyone's an enemy. Everyone's out to get us.

And then it's just come home. And now it's, we're fighting the cold war on our home on our, on the home front. Yeah, it doesn't make any sense. And you'd think that, um, like again, I, you know, I'm the. first to admit or first to emphatically state that history doesn't repeat itself. But when you're talking about, but I mean,

human activity is basically like a closed loop. You know, like, there's like limited numbers of like outcomes, you know, and there's like, there's like, there's not like infinite variables of like human behavior. Okay, so there's like parallels. So if you're trying to, you're trying to like identify, um,

if you're trying to like identify potential courses of action, like in any given like emergent scenario of a political nature. You know, you do go to the historical record, like, trying to find parallels. I mean, like, obviously, particularly on things related to, like, military questions. The, um, it's really unprecedented for that, that level, like, kind of structural senility, the way, like, America is.

It's, like, it's, like, total inability to, like, adapt after November 9th, 1989. Like, Bush and Baker were adapting, which is, it's fascinating how, like, the deep state totally and completely sabotaged like their vision moving forward in globalism. I'm not saying you've got to think like Bush was like a like Bush 41 was like a good guy or something. But um,

people totally misunderstand. What's that? His management at the end of the Cold War how no one got nuked is I mean like it's really truly yeah, it's a remarkable diplomatic team. I'm just a. Yeah, the Gulf War coalition that was a, the Prussians would envy that. Like in

like how the war was executed but the way he he corralled literally uh you know the um the syrians the Saudis he had that he had he had the soviet union which was in its final days then like sign off on the operation you know like he had like he had a literal like army of the nations like a raid against Saddam that's that's completely insane like the guy was like a historical giant of a u.s. president in post-war terms but even if you don't like him like some guy the other day on the internet was like yeah bush 41 was he was what a gray man idiot I'm like what the fuck are you talking about like that that's so like delusional but um but no but the the the total inability of the deep state to manage like the post cold war

environment and it shows you like how like the rot was deep like even people's idea that like the Reagan era was like really based and the government really did shit together and don't get me wrong, that cadre that filled out the Bush 41 administration, like James Baker, Casper Weinberger, Lawrence Evilburger, like a bunch of these guys. Like, those guys were, like,

very serious guys, especially Baker. Baker's somebody I really admire, okay? But, uh, the wider kind of, uh, national security apparatus, it was a bunch of goofs and,

and idiots. You know, like, I mean, people, just couldn't handle, you know, the, the changing of the guard figuratively and literally. And, and they didn't want the Cold War to end because, like, they were, there was, it was, it was, it was like, basically like a con to them. It was just like a way of, like, you know, being able to. Yeah. Kind of live off the public coffers and, and profit by the ongoing threat of, uh, of, of war. Don Rumsfeld and Dick Cheney just. Yeah, guys like that.

Exactly. They just treated the entire thing like this existential struggle. And I'm just old enough to remember, like, the Cold War when it was serious. And I grew up next to, you know, a military base in the West Coast. And so there were times when I was a kid where, like, you know, the F-16s would come screaming, you know, off their base. And, like, you know, you knew some serious shit was going down. Or, you know, something like. When I was in elementary school, we'd still.

we'd have they called them by then emergency drills like euphemistically you know like we'd have to we'd have to go to like the bell would ring like three times um over and over again and we'd have to like go single file to the lower level and then you'd like we're like that was structuring being like it was structurally more robust i guess and um like every classroom it had like a number that was posted where like you'd have to and like that's where you'd like assemble and then like you'd get down on your hands and knees and you'd duck and cover and like put your head like against the wall and we'd you have to hold the position for 30 seconds it was oh this is the emergency drill yeah well the only emergency you do that in is nuclear war okay and um so this uh i felt like slapping people i mean even not just not not

not not just i mean kids a pass like young people i mean people fuckers like my age and older like when the covid thing was like we've never faced a threat like this. I'm like, what the fuck are you talking about? Are you insane? You know, like, I and every other kid in America grew up with the reality, you might become countervalue attrition.

You know? I mean, like, it was, the seasonal flu is like an existential menace unlike anything, really. Like, it's, but that's, that's a aggression. Well, it is, I think, a good illustration of just how fundamentally

unsurious. our elite have become, right? Like, I've talked about this on Pitchell before, and everyone should check out, like, as here's Dr. Johnson on 200 years together. But, like, fundamentally, this whole Ukraine thing is just because, like, a bunch of American neocons are still salty about the Hamanitsky program from 1648.

I mean, that's why the war in Ukraine is a thing, right? I mean, the tribe absolutely hates Russia. Like, the degree to which they hate Russia, I can't be overstated. Like, just anecdotally, um, I kind of like Ralph Bakshi, even though he's like a huge fucking Jew.

Like, you know, the animator. He made this really interesting movie called American Pop, and I really like that movie. And it's basically about this family. It follows these four generations of these guys. Like, one of them's like this vaudeville performer. Like, one of them's just like piano prodigy. It's killed in World War II.

One of them's like this songwriter. He's kind of like a cross between like Lou Reed and D. Ramon who becomes like this huge heroin addict and his son then becomes this like a huge rock star you know like in the 1980s it's a cool movie but it opens up

where uh the cossacks are like programming like the Russian Jews because like even Baxter used like this like New York City guy he's like oh you know the Russians are like you know they're those antithic bastards like that's literally like their number one enemy they fucking

hate the Russians. And to be fair, the Russians have no love for them. But the Ukraine war is complicated. It's in large measure it was returning the serve for the Russians and Assad's forces levying a huge defeat against IDF and their and their tech-firy proxies in Syria. Yeah. Yeah. But I mean, so, yeah, like anybody doesn't understand the dynamic between Russians and the Jews as a people.

Like, it's not in the game. Right. But we're dealing with, right? Both World Wars start over like border disputes in Eastern Europe that heavily involved Jews, right? And we're supposed to just sit here and like, be like, this is fine and get more involved in like, wait a minute, didn't World War one start over a border dispute with Slavs? Well, just this idea too.

I mean, it's just like the monumental ignorance. I made the point of people before, you know, like the American left, like guys like Peter Arnett and the like and media especially. I mean, I thought those guys were terrible people, but there was like a consistency to them. And, you know, they, there, there was an internal logic to like their perspective. Like the American left now, like, they want to like, they, they're basic a shoe leading section for like the warfare. state, like, it's bizarre. These people are totally illiterate. You know, like uh,

like if the if, um, you know, it's like that scene in the movie Caligula, which is probably apocryphal where it's like Caligula, he he orders, uh, the Roman allegiance to, like, assault the sea to, like, conquer like Poseidon's kingdom.

Or like Neptune, I guess, his kingdom. Okay, like, if Joe Biden had, like, ordered, like, the U.S. Marines would attack the Atlantic Ocean, like, these faggots would have been like, yeah, we hate the Atlantic Ocean. They're like racist and stuff. Like, like they're literally retarded. You know, like they, they, they, they, you know, it's like, if you're going to

pretend to, like, care about some other country, Ukraine is literally, it's, it's a failed state in order of Somalia, like, run by a literal, like, homicidal criminal mafia. It's like sitting around saying you love, like, Edia means Uganda. Like, you know, it's like, you really, you love. you love Ukraine. Like you think like the Zelensky Mafia is awesome. It's like your idea of like a good government that needs to be defended. Like it's you can't you can't make this shit up.

These people are literally insane and they're literally retarded. And I mean, of course you're right. But this, um, this notion that like individual rights or that a, a society. where your like weird devotion to transsexualism as a religious value um

absolute personal autonomy to the point of of you know like shedding male and female um and you know total um liberation from any kind of that that's possible in any kind of society that actually functions

these people will talk about like, well, you're a gender fascist. What? Because I think boys are boys and girls are girls. Like, if egalitarian, ralzian liberalism leads you to the point where you think, like, cross-dressing is a major political issue as opposed to like a very weird, very niche fetish that should be, you know, put into the closet. Yeah, that's why you're like people, I make that point of you all the time. It's like, don't, it's like, what the fuck you're doing, like, arguing with, like, sexual parapheriacs. It's like, first of all these people are insane, and those of them that aren't insane, it's like, they're basically, like, they're, A, making fun of you and there be, like, running after you have to sabotage. You don't, like, engage people who, like, say crazy things. That's, like, arguing with some hobo on the subway with, like, shit in his pants, you know, like, you don't, it's like, I'm not going to argue with these fucking people.

You know, like, not just because I don't argue with my people's enemies, but it's like, yeah, it's like you just said. Like if you're, if, if, if, if, if, if what you believe is politics is, like, talking about, like, paraps sexual parapherias, like, I, like, I, you know, traditionally, like, the remedy to that would, would, would, would be to have you shot. Right. And, and, and this is, this is why, this is why, like, you've seen. Yeah. I mean, we're, I'm not going to advocate murdering people, but I'm also not going to argue with them and pretend, like, they have some. position that deserves being heard. Yeah. I'm just enough younger than you, I think, that like everyone, like I'm in my mid-40, so everyone

younger than me, like, has no coherent memory of like a coherent society and why they're constantly talking about fascism and why the resurgence in interest today. And I think one of the great services you provide, Thomas And I kudos and plaudits for this, you know, in the dark years in the 70s, 80s and 90s, when all the men who'd actually been there were dying of old age, and there were a few people like yourself, Mark Weber, a couple others who kept the light alive. Around 2013 or so, it was the 2012 election where, you know, you had like literally movie star,

handsome, like graying temples, Mitt Romney, right? like you know he's like central casting Republican. No yeah he agreed here yeah you know like Just about it just got all you had but yeah Right but but You know conservatism Like they saw

That um Like it had failed Like like Like we lost to Obama again You know like this guy Obvious lightweight probably a homosexual like Well he's just an empty suit Yeah just an empty suit and you know

The 08 crisis he'd done nothing about you know done nothing with that and just it was tool of the banks and um it was just it looks like this random guy like it didn't his candidacy didn't make any sense it's like if you were gonna like if you're gonna like if you're gonna take i'm dating myself with this reference but people remember j c wats he was this he was a canadian football league jock and he was kind of the republicans token like black guy he was this kind of like slick black dude who always like wore really nice suits and uh he came up it was kind of corny you know because he's like oh i'm j c wats i'm like i'm like i'm like i'm like handsome in like Hollywood terms

like polite black man it's like okay if you're gonna draft a guy like that and like make him and like install him as president like okay get it or if you're gonna draft some like Spanish guy is like you know this is like Mr. Immigrant like Spanish guy who like bootstrap himself

into success and like basically make his candidacy like a reality TV show however fake that was it's like okay get that it's like here's this random guy who's like from Hawaii from Hawaii, you know, we're going to pretend these from Chicago and then we're going to pretend pretend he's black. Like the whole thing was like very. And the and random and weird. Straight and pretend he's like. Yeah, but it may, but it's like why it's like why you're

going to pretend he's black? Like why if you're going to like personally in Chicago. Yeah. It's like either draft an actual black guy or make the narrative. He's just like citizen of the world colored person. Like why they made no fucking sense. And that's also why. I, the guy's like totally forgotten now because I had no context you know it's yeah oh it's he has he has cia connections that's why he ended up but anyway no the thing that thing to think about right is um and this is where i came in i came in came into the movement about 20 years ago in after the failure of the ron paul revolution um and you know you really only are given these three alternatives, right? How do you deal with this mass society where millions of people are, you know,

turning wrenches in a car factory or millions of people are, you know, driving to and from work every day? Millions of people are, you know, logging into a computer, millions of people are doing all these things. And, you know, the coherent alternatives are like capitalism as we know it, which is, which has failed people my age and younger, like spectacularly. They can't afford houses. They They can't get married. They can't save. They can't afford to live anywhere safe. They have to live in vans.

Like, you know, that was a joke when we were a kid, you know, Chris Farley. And then you live in a van again. Right. Yeah. Well, now that's like, that's like aspirational. Like, oh, you live in a really nice van down by the river. You know, wait a second. Like, when I was a kid, this was like not a good thing.

And now, like, it's all the, you know, younger, like, older zoers and younger, but but leaders can afford. And so. It's been going on for a. minute. I mean, absolutely right. When I was when I was homeless, I mean, like much of that was like my own fault. I'm not, I'm not saying that like conditions like

macroeconomic conditions made me homeless. But I meet like other homeless people. And a lot of them were yeah, they were like young guys and girls where they couldn't, they literally couldn't afford rent or whatever or like I'm certainly not a mortgage. And they had like fucked up parents who basically threw them out. there were like, or were like shitheads who like wouldn't let them stay with them while they got on their feet. And it was like eye opening. I'm like, wow, that's terrible. But, uh, right. I'm going to, I'm going to be a broth, but I figure I've been going for an hour and

I'm still kind of not feeling great. Um, we can take this up again sometime in the next few days or like in a week if you guys want to make this an ongoing thing. I think, I think it's been really great, but I just and I'm happy to hear to listen to you talk anytime but I think it's important for the listener to realize like you know there's a reason like hardcore Bolsheviks after the 2008 crisis like did the occupied Wall Street thing and then it failed because they were obsession with like DEI stuff and why the resurgence of influence or interest in in you know fascist alternatives why why there's a bunch of guys who were 30. years old and who Stan Hitler is because you've seen the same kind of conditions that, you know, created the revolution in the first place in Weimar, like, you know, there's hyperinflation in trannies and like Jews are in charge and like, no, I think young people are awesome, like, not just because, I mean, young people are the future. I mean, that's who we should be focused on anyway, but young guys and girls generally have their shit together. That's why like, I don't

like when people trashed zoomers because, I mean, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's stupid anyway and like a shitty way to be but um zoomers have a lot of they got a lot of uh dynamic energy and and even like a lot of the zoomers on the left like i was talking to some of these kids um that i i ran across at the at the dnc protest and like other places and like a lot of them uh they're kind of naive in in terms of their uh utopian concepts but a lot of them are are kind of They read guys like Emmanuel Wallerstein and they read a, like they read serious left-wing stuff. And they realize that, they realize that, like, pro-regime, like, perverts, like, are pieces of shit. And, like, they're their enemy.

Yeah. I'm not thinking it's great of kids read Marx and Lenin, but I, at least that's serious stuff. It's not, it's not, it's not like regime pornography and, like, boozy fucking garbage. No, that's true. And I was talking with a friend today, like, the most depressed people in the world right now and for probably the last 50 years at least have been like indigenous Christians in Israel, in West Bank and Gaza. Oh, yeah, Palestine. Yeah. And like to give those guys on the left at least credit, they're at least serious about like these people that are oppressed and they're being murdered by the thousands by this regime. call a fascist, I might call it. And there's some truth that because Jabotinsky was a fascist,

right? The Lulakou founder of the Lekut party, like basically just stole Mussolini's notes. So we know it works. Yeah, I mean, Leakutism is like, it's like a pastiche of, of, of, of, of, of all kinds of things that don't really make sense in, in the context that's

implemented. But yeah, if, um, no, there's, these are, these are amazing times and things are incredibly, uh, I'm incredibly optimistic and anybody who's not doesn't, anybody who's not said they're like addicted to their own,

addicted to like the stink of their own failure and misery or they're just like not engaged with you know, what's happening around them. But no, I appreciate you guys. Yeah, I'll help us, I'll help us close out here. I think just a lot of people too are,

their whole stick is nothing's going to ever get better. and they're just selling it and they're monetizing that. All right, let me let me let you guys get out of here. Thomas do plugs and then D, you can promote whatever you want.

Yeah, the best place to find me is my substack. That's where all kinds of good stuff happens. It's a real Thomas 7777.7.com that's substack.com. That's the place to go.

you can find everything I do there, there's hyperlinks and stuff to what else I do. My social media is alt is at capital R-A-L underscore number seven, H-M-A-S-777. And yeah, well, we'll reconvene whenever you guys want, and just give me a couple of days notice. Cool, Dee, you got something. Thank you for, yeah, thanks for having me, Pete.

I just have the fundamental principle on substack, fundamental principles.substack.com and, you know, gumroad of FP podcast at gunnroy.com. So people are interested in my religious project. That's what there you can find me. And of course, you know, I'm privileged to be here once a month with Pete with the thought crime syndicate. So please give that a listen.

And I'll do my standard sign off of like, you know, go to Freeman and Billion on the wall slash support, kick Pete a few bucks. It's, you know, he does so much work behind the scenes, folks. Like, he helps so many people, you know, not just me, not just Thomas, but, but dozens of people all the time. And so please support the people that don't lie to you. You know, all of us work pretty hard at this. And, you know, a couple bucks if you can spare it helps a lot.

So thank you. All right. Thanks a lot, guys. Have a good night. I want to welcome everyone back to the Pekun Yono show. So the interesting thing about this episode is this episode is a year late. We had this episode planned for July 13th of last year. And then something really weird happened in Pennsylvania, Butler, Pennsylvania.

And we ended up talking about that. And, well, what better time than on the year anniversary to revisit the subject of the infrastructure of the NSDAP and Germany of 1930. of the 1930s and um yeah especially as our infrastructure is crumbling around us so um thomas are you doing today yeah i'm doing pretty well man thanks for including me cool d e how are you i'm great man it's always a pleasure to be on with you and always a pleasure to be on with thomas i've learned with so much to you guys man the college classes every single one of your guys is a series or a series of college lectures it really is fantastic that's a great compliment thank you this is this is your subject man this was your idea i'm i'm just going to interject to ask questions

why don't you take off and uh and go where you want to go all right well i'll try to try to keep the autism to a minimum here but um just as a a brief aside i'll give you a brief sketch um the road network in europe wasn't as good as it was in the time of uh the five good emperor again until like the late 19th century. And McAdam invented his macadamization asphalt paving process. And I want to say like 1830. So imagine like a road network where nothing is paved or hardly anything is paved and only like cities might have cobblestones. And maybe, maybe like major highways between say like Rome and all.

Alastia might be paved. But that's not normal. Now, I mean, like, you can get like lightly laid in carts and stuff, you know, to and from places. But really, like, in order to keep the road from turning into like a mud bog, you got to pave it to keep the water off. And, uh, the most efficient way to transport anything is, of course, via water, which is why Germany is rich. than Italy because Italy has one real river valley, the pole in the north, and it outflows into Venice, which is a decent port only because of the heroic efforts of the Venetians themselves. It's normally very swampy and not a difficult or a very difficult place to make a living.

Only the heroic efforts of the Venetians have made it someplace prosperous and livable. and you know, France has got six huge river valleys basically. Nowhere in the UK or nowhere in England itself is more than 25 miles from water, from like a port that will get to get to water. So that's why those two countries were in Germany were the most prosperous countries in Europe, you know, Spain only has the ebro. So in a world where like heavy transport has to be done via water, basically because the roads aren't up to it.

Like, how do you develop internally, right? And Germany had only been united since, what, 1871 was that? I want to say 79. Right. Okay, 1879. So like, like four years after uncle is born is, you know, like, you know, is, or four years before, right? Like, this is not. I don't know.

I was born 1889. All right. I'm sorry, I was thinking Mussolini, right? Oh, okay. Yeah, so, you know, Mussolini's born in 1883, right? He's only 13 years before is when Italy was, was, was, was again, a whole political entity. And, you know, Hitler was only, like 10 years before Hitler was born, is when Germany became a whole nation again.

So you have these, what had been, you know, how do you, how do you, how do you, how do you, integrate like the kingdom of the two Sicily's road network into the papal state's road network into the city states and the north road network um you know do you have the same standards in bavaria and pomerania how does that work so you've got this huge coordination problem that takes forever to figure out and uh at least in the holy roman empire a big part of what made like little barony's economically viable was their traditional right to tax so you'd have these locks all along this river network in germany where you know this baron of this one little spot would charge a toll there's this massive increase in internal costs you know just shipping something down the rind there'd be a stop here and a stop here and a stop here so improving the transportation network and essentially internal free trade right like what list says right internally free trade and and and and development allows you to greatly decrease your transportation costs, your friction, right? And allows you to ship things over land between rail, which is 10 times more efficient than roads.

That's why the 19th century was a century of just railroad mania, right? The United States, Germany, France, the UK, all over the place. Rail was the name of the game. but that rail network that build out of the rail network allowed you to build out the road network because your transportation costs for things like I don't know gravel all of a sudden drop by 50 60 70 80% when you can throw it on a train and just uh just as a quick aside you know one of the things that the British wanted to do um when they when they when they for all practical purposes won the scramble for

Africa. They wanted to build a railroad that started in North Africa and ended at the Cape. So basically, like, they wanted to have, like, a trans-Siberian railroad that, like, spanned Africa, which is totally insane. But it would have been, it probably would have been viable, man, if they could have held it, you know, and if they hadn't detonated their own fortunes. Yeah, go ahead. I'm sorry. Well, and that's actually part of the, you bring it up, but like there was a conflict with the Portuguese because the Portuguese had Angola, yeah. Angola and Mozambique, right? And they wanted to, they wanted a trans African railway to control their, their holdings on the east and west coast, and the British one of theirs going north, south. And they, they almost got it. I mean, I can't remember they actually finished the African railroad or not. But. Yeah, that was Seesel Rhodes big, that was his big ambition, you know, and in some ways, Rhodes,

Rhodes kind of reminds me a blackjack person in some ways. I mean, I, I think, I mean, obviously, Rhodes is more, roads of a certain type. He was one of these, he was one of these kinds of, imperialist characters that came up through the crown charter system of wealth management and adventureism. I mean, Pershing was very much, you know, like kind of a logistics and engineering genius and a very effective combat commander. But yeah, these guys are really extraordinary

in terms of their intellect. Well, and that that leads us to, I, if he hadn't had died in an untimely fashion, I don't know, what your personal opinion of Fritz Totis Thomas, but I am a massive admirer of Toad personally. Dr. Toll.

Well, he and Helmar shocked. Helmar shocked is a reason why the UK delegation to the International Military Tribunal basically intervened and said, you know, you're going to cut this man loose because we need him. you know, Tote was much more a patriot than shocked was, but Tote and Helmar Schacht were responsible for the economy of the German Reich becoming what it was in terms of such that centrally planned efforts. I mean, all banking systems are going to be somewhat centralized. Okay, I mean, like that, that's not an ethical question. It's just the reality.

But yeah, I think they're both personages who are essential understanding the economics of the German Reich. And they were both, you know, towering intellects in different aspects of macroeconomic praxis, definitely. So for those of you who don't know, Dr. Fritz-Tot was the head of organization Tote, which was the, and please, Thomas, correct my pronunciation. because I'm terrible this sort of thing. He was succeeded by Albert Speer, who is the guy who designed the Volkshall

but ultimately turned to Trader and after the war and I have a low opinion of that. Anyway, Dr. Tote goes to you know, the University of Munich and gets a PhD in

civil engineering on on effectively paving roads and he is the one who's responsible for the audubon for the atlantic wall for honestly most of you know the the third rites construction projects um he was the inspector general for watered energy the rites minister for armaments munitions i mean yeah that was the key that's what i mean the key really played was as as as armist minister you know in terms of the war effort and and um some of these projects that were essential to national defense to be clear with the autobahn too at um this kind of mass highway system i raised pershing because uh you know pershing was um eisenhower was a disciple of pershing and that's basically where he inherited the

idea for what became the interstate system and like a mass highway system among other things on a continent-sized scale you needed to be able to deploy forces in being an event of general war and that was one of the reasons for the you know the Eisenhower expressway system you know is that you can deploy east and west rapidly and the autobon obviously um when uh the rice commissariat mascoven was realized you know it had the soviet union been defeated and assimilated into the greater german reich you know the um the the the the audubon was going to go from spain to the the earls you know um probably so even by call really i mean why not why not let of us talk no i i think it's no go ahead it's important to to realize that

Like the U.S. interstate system is directly, Eisenhower got to Europe, got to Germany, and was like, wow, these roads are fantastic. And basically just stole the plans. And the early days of World War I with all the mobilizations and all the difficulties and the logistical problems, right, of feeding people. were so ingrained in the German people that they just didn't want that sort of thing to happen again. And by building this network of really good highways, you could distribute the food. You know, if one section's bombed out, you can rebuild that and route the food around. So the problem with rail is it's way more efficient in terms of how much energies needed to move, you know, a ton of stuff from point A to point B. but you mess that one switching yard or that one track up and you know the line is is cut whereas a road network is more yeah

compatibility too of the rail gauge and stuff causes issues I just wanted to it seem real quick to I've got almost nothing nice to say about spear but some of his design concepts I think were pretty brilliant and one of the things he insisted upon and that the fear very much approved of locally spears said that you know we need to source materials locally as much as possible in building the autobon you know so and we need to incorporate natural features into things like bridges so you know um like in a section of the autobon that you know like stretches through the rhineland or whatever is you know you know, going to reflect the natural environment there and like a local ecology, you know, like ditto for, you know, East Prussia and what have you. And a lot of these, this had really great optics, you know,

and that they can't really, as an imperative priority to the German Reich at, you know, the highest levels that can't be overstated. I mean, Hitler was an artist. That's one of the things he had encountered with Speer. I mean, you know, Hitler's primary interest was architecture and things. You know, and Speer obviously was kind of a pure architect. I mean, he had capable. I mean, I stipulate he had capabilities, you know, that were remarkable. As an architect, he was a genius.

Yeah, yeah. As a political soldier, he left a fair bit wanting. He was a cynic. I mean, I think he, Spear is the kind of guy. who, you know, he, um, he, he finds a way to insinuate himself around powerful men and impress them. And he, he doesn't care about the politics. And he will do an about face as soon as it becomes expedient to do so, you know, um, which, yeah, which he did. Yeah. Um, so Dr. Tutt, right, he dies in a plane crash. Um, he himself won the, the Iron Cross under the German Empire.

in the first world war so um but the internal road network of germany i mean they're still using the same audubon that fritztaught built in like 1938 right and and not only was it a massive internal improvement project but it's one of the ways that you know that the rike was was able to kill unemployment in the Reich was just they didn't have trucks. You know, I mean, the SS was invading Germany, or not invading Germany, invading Russia with mules and stuff, because they didn't have enough trucks. Well, because they didn't have the earth moving equipment, because they didn't have enough trucks, a lot of this construction got done by hand. right and you had large gangs of laborers that were relatively low-skilled but they get told like dig this out till it you know this this slope matches here and you could you can have lots of guys using picks and shovels and stuff and you can build this road network internally that enabled you know the germans to shift entire divisions from east to west relatively quickly And in terms of, you know, building the German economy, right, if your, if your shipping costs go down by, I saw something, by the time they were done, taking something from the port at Hamburg to Munich, the cost had dropped by like something like 25%, I want to say.

but that could just be so that's tickling the back of my brain but if you're if your costs going from hamburg to me go that far down right that's that's obviously a massive um just go to the internal economy right there's going to be more jobs um once you if you're no longer working on like the toot gang right or you maybe you take those construction skills you learned building the building the roads to other projects

which is how they ended up with the Atlantic Wall and you know like the Channel Islands forts and all of these other interoperid line yeah yeah the Sixthread line right like much later yeah but

but right you have all these experienced personnel and you know before the call we were talking right the notion that like oh, it's socialism. They're using the government to build all these projects. Does anybody really think that like a Bechtel or a Conoco

Phillips or a GM or really a private company? Well, it's also the whole point, I mean, the reason why the reason why the one thing that the Warsaw Pact excelled at was military hardware, You know, and things like space-faring vehicles is because obviously, like, the spontaneous ordering of the price mechanism isn't essential to, like, building a good tank. And you don't require, I mean, I don't even know what those inputs would be. Like, we're going to, you know, we're going to, we're going to, we're going to accept bids on who can, like, build the best auto bond. And then we're going to take a hands-off approach, however they want to devise it.

I mean, like, I, yeah, that doesn't make a. sense and um all uh all capitalism and the industrial era is state capitalism so yeah it's there's there to suggest that there's this like public private distinction we're talking about fixed capital definitely i think that as you built or you're completely completely correct there is no such thing as like particularly things like roads or canals or anything like that, right? Like the notion that like, oh, this is a private enterprise. Like, no, it's not.

It's not. It's one of those things that the libertarians get completely, completely wrong. The free market is going to build, you know, this highway system. Something you talked about earlier, Thomas, is the aesthetics, right? I have a quote from, from Hitler somewhere from, I think it's from the book Hitler's engineers. But he said, you know, our roads have to. be beautiful and as as they reflect us as a people and I'm paraphrasing here the the the Audubon as envisioned by Hitler and Tote reflects that German artistic soul that's very

ordered but also has this kind of longing for beautiful things and yeah my spontaneous harmony yeah yeah but the interstate highway system in America particularly as you get west of the Mississippi is the most brutal utilitarian, like, just like massive project you've ever seen in your life, right? Yeah, Route 94 through Shaitown is not beautiful. Right. Well, and the reason it's not, right, is because the Reich was using mostly hand labor and what, what electricist explosives they did have had to be saved either for wartime or for something where, like you're blowing a hole a tunnel or something right or for clearing canal so they just didn't have the you know the massive amount of explosive and the personnel to use it just willy-nilly the way they're really fancied at me there's this book called hitler and the power of aesthetics by this guy named frederick spas and um spear designed and built a lot of these projects

with an eye for what was called ruin value. And that's why the Germans had certain ideas about, you know, discrete building materials like feral concrete. Because the ethos was, we've got to think about 3,000 years from now. You know, we've got to have our great works leave ruins, you know, like that of the valley the kings in Cairo. or like the Parthenon or like the Colosseum, you know, this is a deliberately historical enterprise that spans millennia,

you know, and that's, that underlies, you know, very much like the ethos of the Reich, and I find that very compelling. Yeah, it does. And just to give you an idea of why that's actually better to, to elaborate here for a second. So the United States, after 1947,

right has effectively what is unlimited manpower unlimited expertise unlimited resources and so they build out the federal highway system and they just make it straight because that's the most efficient and if there's a little hill in the way they'll just throw a bunch of dynamic they've got a bunch of guys who did demo in the war they can absolutely you know just just blast so you'll have you know sections of of road in the United States that are 5, 10, 15, 20 miles long, just in a straight line. And as you're driving across like North Dakota, do you listen, no offense intended to any of our listeners in North Dakota, it gets really hard to pay attention when you're like just going 20 miles straight, right? Even even at email.

That's like tailored for highway hypnosis. Exactly right. So because, because the Germans didn't have all that access to easy blasting path. They had to, we had to, roads have to follow the, the path that is most flat, relatively speaking. And so if you've got to go like and make a slight curve to the left or, you know, gently kind of rise and follow the terrain a little bit more, that's actually makes a better drive. You don't, you don't do things like fall asleep. the way you can like you know if you're driving from i 90 from like chytown to you know seattle right there's places where you're just going to fall asleep because there's nothing

we realize too like if you like automobiles and you know i always i mean i don't drive these days but you know i was really like i was really like driving and cars and stuff when i was young you know like driving them and working on them and the you know all these carol shelby design planes, you know, that were grand touring designated vehicles. You know, like a touring vehicle, I realized like Ford and all kinds of other American companies took on that designation, but it doesn't make any sense in America. Maybe it doesn't like Redwood country somewhat, but, you know, driving a Porsche, like, around these, like, winding roads through Bavaria or, like, through the Elks.

You know, it's a totally different experience. Right. Yeah. Like, the only places in America where, like, a GT-type car makes sense is, like, on the Pacific Coast, high. highway or something like yeah and I've been yeah and I've driven um not just 101 but I've driven these mountain roads through like Oregon you know which are like incredible so then so don't be wrong like America they've been at the wheel of a

you know like a like a comfortable um like big block you know Cadillac or something um oh it's uh it's uh yeah it's dope but uh it um but it's not at all the same thing is you know, the European experience and even there's a this footage like over Salzburg you know, eagles nest and stuff you know like that's a perfect example

and um there's a this footage of what amounts to you know the kind of work what became kind of the war council um Von Brouchich had been sacked but this had to be like at the latest

like very early 942 you know, like convening it over Salisburg. And you see like these, you know, you see these, these like stately vehicles, like pulling up. And it just looks like an incredible drive. It looks like something from another planet or something. Oh, yeah. Could you even imagine like in a, like the Mercedes S.K.

And you're driving from Frankfurt on Maine up to Vienna in like one of those bad boys. You know, just the, just the aesthetic experience. But because they didn't have that ability to just black. straight through right the road actually doesn't do the old road has noticed this thing where you're gonna fall asleep because there's just nothing to do and nothing i've driven through like south dakota and you know like you gotta have you gotta have somebody like sitting with you to like punch you in the arm so that you don't end up driving off the road you know no it's crazy you know i take the ground so much i see a lot of like american highways you know and uh yeah they're

very flat it's crazy too when you get out west like the hills, the foothills and some of the smaller mountains, they just like blast these huge tunnels through them. And when I was a little kid that really like zoned me out because they don't have that here in Chicago, but I'd be out in California and it's like, yeah, you're just like driving through this like mountain tunnel for like freaking, you know, like 45 minutes.

Yeah, or, you know, driving through this tunnel in the Rockies, right? That is two miles long, you know. But that's, that's something that, um is I think by by caring about the aesthetics by making sure that everyone had to have something beautiful to be able to look at something that they can be proud of. Um, it really,

uh, you know, you can not only, not only people are more likely to maintain it. But it ultimately ends up being easier to make. because you're not fighting nature all the time. You know, you can drive nature out with the pitch for it because the same goes,

but it always comes back. So how do you, if the, if the road itself, like, is part of the nature, it's not as difficult to constantly be fighting nature

to get the road accomplished. Oh, yeah. No, 100%. Yeah. I mean, I'm expressing myself poorly because I'm retarded. But, and by making that something that is the most important thing as you're doing it, do those beautiful roads not only become more likely to be maintained and more likely

to function longer, they also become an advertisement. And this is, this is, this is why. I mean, ultimately, this is why the Reich had to be destroyed, right? Is that just allowing them to be free was an advertisement against a capitalist system. Well, yeah, it was a totally different ethos on potentialities, and it transcended conventional politics. You know, I mean, in some ways, like the Stalinists did too, and I mean, I think Soviet cosmism is sort of a callback to that, sort of transcendental mysticism of of Byzantium stuff.

But no, I mean, but that was somewhat incidental, obviously, and it was a result of a dialectical process that very much sort of deviated from the core ethos of Marxist-Leninism. But no, the something that the fascist, the National Socialist, Axis Europe was disposed towards, as an essential aspect of the politics of the era and specifically the revolutionary mandate that they were abiding was, you know, something that was epochal in nature and purely historical almost and was, you know, partook of the highest possible forms of human action and cultural productivity, absolutely. well that I think that something else that that that needs to be I think I've talked about this like the entire world changed like in you know in um the Rome of like comitus right like after the period of five good emperors you know Marcus Aurelius even then most of the population was still agricultural peasants. And you could take an agricultural peasant from the time of Marcus Aurelius. And there have been some very, very good alternative history, time travel type stuff.

But you could take someone like that and take them to the world of say, I don't know what point the break would be. Like the 1860s. And aside from like firearms, like most of everything is like readily apparent and still even into the 1860s of war between the states, most of the people. people in the world are agricultural peasants. But, you know, in the Psalm in 1915 and the, you know, Waterloo in 1815, like the world changed so completely in that 100 years that nothing was the same afterwards. And the national socialists, the fascist, whatever, like that, that organization, those, that aesthetic idea.

Like those were the of the three choices or three ways to confront that massive change where there was Bolsheviks, there was Judeo-Masonic capitalism, and then there was this, this national, you know, organic aesthetic romantic nationalism. I don't know how else to describe it.

But of all those three, no one is going to care about like if, you know, if the United States government falls apart. No one's going to care about like I-90 in 100 years. Or like, yeah, exactly. Or like some random federal building, you know, downtown. The, a film that I like, you know,

this seems crazy now, but HBO actually used to make really good original movies. Like they made this film about Andre Chiquotilla, the Soviet serial killer, um, called Citizen. X with Donald Sutherland. One of my favorite movies. Yeah, it's dope. They made

this biopic of Stalin or Robert Duvall. They did a film version of Fatherland, the alternative history counterfactual where the German Reich is victorious in

World War II. You know, there's in the film it's the German Reich's preparing for Hitler's 75th birthday celebrations. Joe Kennedy is the president. Joe Kennedy is trying to end the Cold War that exists between America and the Reich, but it opens in the year in 1964, and this American delegation is touring Berlin, which is now, you know, the European, like the capital of nation Europa called Germania. And it's a combination of early CGI and match

paintings, but it looks really cool. The centerpiece is the folks hall, which would have held 180,000 people. Hitler would have been able to access it from what would have been the Fuhrer's Palace by way of an underground access road, and he would emerge by elevator behind the podium. And the folks hall would have been so massive that it would have had its own weather inside. Clouds would have formed. And it speculated that it would have occasionally rained within the dome. Like stuff like that is fascinating.

Yeah, the best thing Amazon has ever done is they did the Philip K. Dick Manor-Nal High Castle, right? Yeah, the show is silly. but the optics are brilliant. Yeah, yeah. Like, I've appropriated the flag that they utilize for some of my own purposes, because it's that good. Oh,

the aesthetics were on point. But to give you just a, here's, here's a quote from that, the book I mentioned, Hitler's, Hitler's engineers, Fritz Todd and Albert Spear,

master builders of the Third Reich. Tot started developing detailed plans in July 1933, keeping Hitler closely closely abreast of developments, and then, interquote, although the entire road plan was Hitler's, and although he took the first step in Oregon, of the plan, he allowed the general inspector and his staff that is taught to make all decisions.

He considered a good policy to be in agreement with those in daily contact with the problems of highway construction. He did, however, offer suggestions when the problems were brought to him. The bridge symbolized the fear's approach to construction. He is concerned with beauty and appearance, but the primary goal is durability. As he has often stated, quote, we must build, what we build must stand long after we are no longer here, unquote. So, you know, do you build, do you build a society that is concerned with the future and with aesthetics. And, you know, Tucker Carlson's talked about this a little bit, like, but the people who build ugly stuff in America's cities hate you. They don't care about you. You know, if they build, you know, people who build

ugly stuff for you, they're telling you they don't care about you. They're telling you that your kids don't deserve to have beautiful things in their lives. Well, it's also the, yeah, and I, the concept of the geography of nowhere, you know, because I'm not, because I don't drive, I'm always on foot. And thankfully, you know, Chicago is one of the few places you can live and not have a car because there's public transportation everywhere.

And one of the reasons I like it here is because there's, a lot of dedicated nature preserves and things but like most of this country it's just built up ugliness and like you can't you can't be a pedestrian in a lot of places because there's nowhere if you to walk and you know architecture and um the design of living spaces it physically dictates your movements yes you know so there's that and yeah if you live um a missed totally ugly surroundings, you know, it's, it beats you down psychologically.

You know, like I, when I get out west and I'm not trash and I'm, people live in the west suburbs, like West of Oak Park and stuff, you start, when you get far enough away from, like, Cook County, it becomes, like, geography in nowhere. It's, like, inless, flat highways,

and you've just passed, like, Buffalo Wild Wings and, like, Target and these, like, disused, Yeah, old camera. Yeah, no, I mean, I'm, yeah, it's awful, man. Yeah. I've talked about Jim Kunstler's, you know, geography, you know, geography, you know, are a ton. Um, because it's really important, actually that, you know, Chicago is the, um, the last city, like,

the furthest west city where you could actually live like a European-style city. Mm-hmm. Um, there's a really good book, um, William E. Cronin Nature's Metropolis about Chicago. You should check it out if you get a chance. about the development of Chicago. But if a society that cares about itself and cares about its future is going to build things that make that society stronger internally and a better place to be. And I think that, you know, what have we built?

You know, I've been a political adult basically since 9-11. What has the United States built in the last 25 years that you can say that that's going to matter in 50 years? Yeah, it's um... I can't think of a thing. I can't, I literally cannot think of a single thing in the United States. No, and even, um, even these like dedicated monuments where you have, you know, people who at least have some rudimentary idea of aesthetical sophistication and, you know, how things should be harmoniously devised. you know to kind of comport with the natural features of the setting in which it's situated like a lot of the stuff just looks bad you know like i the when i when i was in dc last you know i i went by the world war two memorial which i thought was

kind of tacky anyway because the iwogee memorial is the world war two memorial if there is one and there's nothing like patently offensive about it but it just looks bad it's something that's like tacky about it it's just aesthetically not well done yeah and it's just like totally unremarkable yeah it um

you know no the only there's some beautiful architecture here and that's kind of my reference point for America I mean stuff like Mount Rushmore is fascinating you know but yeah you'd think that especially because You think that especially in the years, immediately after the Cold War, that would have been like a priority.

You know, not in some crude, triumphalist way, but, you know, kind of America saying, you know, we defeated the communist enemy. You know, now sort of culture can reign of an elevated sort that we're the standard barrier up. Like, whether that's true or not isn't the point. You'd think there'd be that impetus and that sort of desire, even if it's exploited for reasons of political expedients. in ways that are somewhat impure of motive. But there was none of that. Yeah, like, where was the great symphony to celebrate, like, the end of the Cold War

and, like, the triumph of freedom? Yeah. Or a great opera or something like that. Yeah. There's nothing. No, there was only, like, an not particularly good song by the Scorpions. And, I mean, obviously, they were, like,

from the Bundes Republic. Yeah. I mean, Winds of Change is a banger. like i'm not gonna not gonna knock it you know in terms of what it is it's great but like yeah there's there's no and you know hitler was a pretty talented draftsman himself but yeah he was great um the the built environment like if if if you build a beautiful built environment it's it's no it's no coincidence that like Mozart and the strowse family and like how many great composers like spent all their

their great time in Vienna. No, and yeah, that's why, and that's why people gravitate towards Prague these days because Prague partakes that same sort of Habsburg, Baroque beauty. Like, I'm always telling people, one of my destinations, if I happen upon a time machine,

would be Habsburg, Vienna, because, I mean, I'm very, very Protestant, you know, like, but I find myself taken in by that kind of Baroque grandiosity, you know, as much as a Roman Catholic person would be, man. Like, it's just incredible. Right. But, but the reason, the reason Vienna produced so many, including, you know, our chancellor, right, like, all of these people were inspired by the beauty that was everywhere around them in Vienna.

Oh, 100%. Right. Yeah, Joseph Schumpeter made that point, too. I mean, he was, you know, you don't associate economists with the same sort of creative, aesthetic endeavors, but, you know, it's, but it's, everybody who came out of that milieu was, you know, shaped by it in terms of their, you know, habits and the conventions they gravitated to and, you know, the, the things that drew inspiration from. Sure.

You know, and yeah, that's what great civilizations are made of is those. sorts of those sorts of uh you know aspects and it's funny because i like in preparation for this episode and just in general right you know i've i've tried to find everything i can in english about this pro this movement of construction and infrastructure and right and i can't find anything in English that doesn't just attack right attack the Third Reich there's nothing out there

I mean maybe you know Thomas maybe we've got like a book from 1946 or something that it might have and if you do like DME later but well yeah you can't you can't take this stuff seriously it's the same as there'll be some like middling college professor from some fourth rate university like talking about Hitler was a loser

it's the same thing it's like it's like okay bro like the guy conquered Europe from France to the gates of Moscow defeated the British Army defeated the French army conquered Poland, conquered Czechoslovakia

conquered the low countries stop the American army dead in its tracks but he's like a loser compared he's a quote of a loser compared to some middling college professor okay like you can't I mean it's so preposterous It's like some hobo waving about it's Kurtnerod declaring he's the emperor the universe.

I'm expecting to take it seriously or something. Like you roll beneath me. And Joseph Stalin, right? Like I don't think people, I mean, I've talked about this enough so that people would know, but certainly this audience is well-educated to have to know this. But the Iranians are not pro-American because American trucks and American bullets were given to British and Soviet soldiers in 1941 to invade their country from four different places. Yeah.

Right. So that they could secure the Persian supply route, which supplied 45 divisions worth of troops to the Soviet Union. The United States sent 10,000 aircraft from like Montana up through Canada, through Alaska, all the way across Siberia. We're talking about like, we're talking about a third of the way around the world. Yeah, it's insane. Um, and in addition to like, you know, constant convoys over the North Atlantic to like the white sea and the, the worst ocean in the world. And we, we just lost tons of shipping and, uh, you know, that, right. And if it hadn't been for that kind of heroic effort, you know, the Soviets would have lost a war.

They say themselves that that, that's why they would have lost the war. Well, yeah. That's why, you know, I mean, I, it, uh, I'm supposed to listen to some, I'm supposed to listen to some fourth-rate self-styled propagandist tell me that I'm a bad person because I won't accept it was an absolute moral imperative to exterminate Western civilization and alliance with the communists. You know, I mean, like I, I, I, these people are beneath me. Yeah, Thomas, if you don't support supporting the communists, you hate freedom. Yeah, and like I, if I don't go, if I don't hate Muslims for no reason, if I don't hate my fellow Christians in Palestine, and go around pretending that I'm Jewish, I'm a bad person.

Yeah, that's, well, I was always under the impression people acted that way were mentally ill, but I apparently like, no, they're, they're, they're just really, really bursting with, with moral integrity. and I'm like I'm just like a bad person. Yeah, no, it's it's absolutely true, right? And I mean, we can talk about it. I don't go to parades either where guys like pee on each other and stuff like apparently I'm supposed to do in June. You know, like that, you know, and I do things like honoring like, you know, the heroes of my own race instead of like going to like pee parades.

How dare you, Thomas? How dare you? You know, the, the, the, I suppose we can talk about this just a little bit, you know, a year later, right the the the trump skeptical um anti-jewish people have been completely vindicated you know like there's i only want to bring this up because um the the the only salient and this is something i got from you thomas so i'm going to just steal it right the only salient political conflict in the world today is Zionist versus everybody else like those are the those are your options you're either on team Zionist, you're on team like civilization.

And it's the same conflict in 1941. It's the same conflict today. Like you're on team Zionist or you're on team civilization. Those are your, those are your teams. You know, like Charles and I's always used to tell each other like it's always January 1936 in Spain. Like you got two teams. You got teams. Yeah. The thing is surprising about Trump. I mean, I, I never had any illusions about Trump or I thought

was a good guy the way in which he crashed out kind of surprised me because it it was really really stupid and he continues to kind of cook himself in the court of public opinion when he doesn't have to he's become i think he's slipping mentally yeah you think a narcissist would have more self-respect you know well he also trumps a master of manipulating the psychological environment i mean it's really that that that's really how he's gotten to where he is and it's like he totally took a leave of you know his his is a Machiavellian sensibilities as well as his instincts for how to proceed an index with the media cycle it's he's been doing incredibly dumb things and I mean not to derail us I got to raise up in a minute too so it'd be

abrupt I got like 10 minutes but the um you know the way you handled this Epstein matter was just incredibly stupid you know it's not like he got it's not like he got murked because he got put on the spot and, you know, didn't really see a way out. So, you know, he kind of, he kind of issued some, he kind of made a declaration. He couldn't deliver on to get,

you know, a hostile interrogative media off his back. And then he came back to bite. It was like, nothing like that. He's just doing dumb shit. You know, and the way he's responded, you know, he could have he could have basically

placated his master's, well at the same time put on errors like he was you know demanding that you know you was sovereignty of your respective vis-a-vis Israel and he did the opposite you know it's like what the hell's wrong with you

like you especially considering the current environment conceptually and the way people feel about Israel that that was about the dumbest possible thing you could do but um that's a subject for another day forgive me

and um yeah forgive me for being abrupt i um i um we can we can reconvene and continue this subject matter if you guys want to i mean obviously i'm sure you guys are going to continue with it but i'll oh i'll rejoin you guys at a later date if you want to continue this subject any anytime you want to talk about whatever you want to talk about thomas i'm always happy to listen you know if you got to rise up that's no you should um i'm doing this series now with the world at war guys Nick and Adam, which is great. I'm very blessed. They wanted to include me.

But I, you know, I also, we put, like, Pete and I with a couple other guys. You know, we do the Inquisition Pod. Yeah, you should, you should, you should, you should dip in there sometime, man. Anytime I'm, I'm a big fan of Astros and Nick and Adam. I've been old friends of mine for years.

You know, I first. Yeah, no, he's a great dude. Okay, yeah, you're aware of it. Oh, yeah. But that, yeah, I, I, I'll be in touch and I'm always, at long last, I'm going to start, I'm going to start live streaming on the regular. And it would help if you'd be willing to collab with me on that sometimes too. But you call it.

You call and I'll jump on, man. Yeah, my phone number from Pete, man. And like, shoot me a text in the next couple days. and just like identify yourself when you do. And yeah, we'll talk about it over text if that's cool. That's fine. Yeah. And let's close this one down then.

That sounds good. All right. So Thomas, get plugs. Yeah. You can find me. I run a charity for autistic LGBTQ children. No, I don't do that. That's my live stream.

You can find me at Thomas 777.com. It's number 7, HMES 777.com. And my substack is where I direct people to as well, because that's where my podcast is. A lot of my long-form writing, and we got a very active chat there.

It's real Thomas-777.7.com. And as I kind of restructure my content, on. I know I'm active on those two platforms every day. So go there and you shall find. Dee? Well, I have my own show, a fundamental principle. It's also on substack. I got to give a strong recommend to following Thomas's telegram and his substack. I follow all of them. And of course, everything, everything Pete Canona is, you know, give Pete money, listen to his shows, do his live streams, you know, get your out. through OGC support the people to support you, you know, that you're given, you're given, you know, what amounts to do 300 or 400 level college lectures by Thomas and Pete or by, you know, Dr. Johnson and Pete or, you know, Pete, Pete enables so much stuff to good things to happen.

And he works really hard behind the scenes that you don't see and he helps people all the time. So, you know, the stuff that Pete does in front of the camera is only a portion of the hard work he puts in. And on top of all that, he's like a really great friend. So please, you know, support the people to. that don't hate you. Yeah, well said. I appreciate that. All right, gentlemen, have a good evening.

Thank you. I want to welcome, everyone. Back to the Pekingana show. DE is back. What's going on, D.E. Not much, Pete. So good to talk to you again, my friend. Good to talk to you.

So let's talk about something that has had a hold on my interest since I was very young, probably like, oh, God, probably five or six years old watching my first game and became obsessed and wanted to play it. People have probably heard me talk about this before. It's the sport of hockey. You know anything about hockey? I know that Wayne Greske was a really great defenseman and there's a dude in the goal. well you um you got one of those right okay yeah that's about as much as i know about hockey i mean really uh you know i um you can't be a sports guy which i was for a bit and not know at least a little bit right but but basically i'm completely eager and so yeah well wayne gretsky was a he was a forward

he was a censor sometimes he played wing not a defenseman but um i actually have a video queued up of uh who i to be one of the greatest defensive of all time. We can talk about that later. But yeah, I think there's a lot of reasons why I think it's the greatest, the greatest sport on the planet. And probably the one reason that it is is because of where it's played, the cold, how much it costs to play, the times you might have to wake up to play, and how much equipment costs.

Oh, it's a lot of price. Yeah, you're basically keeping out, um, the worst, the worst of all elements of every, of every group out there.

You know, most of the, um, when I was growing up, the, the schools that had the, had the better teams were, um,

schools that had like the highest tuition. in the Catholic League that I that I played in. So it just makes sense. I mean, again, I don't know much. So, I mean, correct me if I'm wrong about any of this. But it's overwhelmingly played by Canadians, Americans, and not just Americans, but Americans from like the Upper Midwest and the Northeast. And it's played in Europe, and that's about it.

Pretty much. Yeah. I mean it's like total white supremacy and I know that when I was growing up like ice time was a thing and you'd have to get up at like five o'clock in the morning to go get ice time. Is this is this correct? Five o'clock, sometimes four o'clock. If you were in a league that was outside of like a high school league or something like that, sometimes your league games would start at 11 o'clock at night or midnight or midnight. or something like that. Yeah,

it's one of those things that, one of those games that you're, they can actually make more money from an open skate of people, of couples walking, you know, skating around to music and holding hands, and they can for people coming in

and paying to play hockey. So couples aren't going to do that. Normally at 11 o'clock, 10 o'clock, 11 or 12 or midnight and 5 o'clock in the morning. So that's when you get ice time. You get ice time. Like in New York, there was a place called Skyrink. And if you wanted to play open hockey,

you would normally have to get there around 6, 6.30. Lasker's rink, which was basically in Harlem in Central Park, 110 Street. you had to there was a open skate on Saturday and Sundays from 730 till 9 where you where the rink would be like an advanced game going on a media you know a beginner game going on and then like guys who you know been playing for a little while going on all on the same gigantic rink so yeah it basically it there was just the way it was just the way it was structure the gatekeeping was pretty amazing.

And the sports, I mean, sports occupy such a huge place in the culture that you know, like I personally am, I've started, one of the reasons that I wanted to do the show is I want to get more into hockey because

you know, I can, occasionally I can make the drive and like go see a Crackens game. And you know, like, go. Go. to see a Seahawks game is way too expensive. It's everything I don't like about American culture in like one specific spot. Mariners games are much better. It's a several hour drive for me to go.

Of all the professional sports teams out there, I would much rather go see it. I don't know anything about it, you know, because it just wasn't, I wasn't raised with it. I didn't grow up with it. So, like, explain it to me like I'm a retarded five-year-old. Okay. So, I mean, you know that there's a rank and everything. God, it's been so long since I, like, I can't remember the length of the rank and the 210 feet.

I can't remember. But, and the width of the rank. But the rank is split into sections. there's a center line, your team will be on one side for the first period. The team will be the other. Then you'll switch after there's three periods. You'll switch sides after, which really what that does mostly is, is your bench in the first period is going to be on your side of the ice. but in the second period, your bench is going to be all the way on the other side of the ice.

So if you need, if you're, if you're gassed and you're, you know, you're huffing and you can't, you can't continue your shift. You have to make a longer trip to the bench to change, you know, to switch out and get somebody who's, who's fresh on the ice and everything. There's zones. You have center ice. You have blue lines. And then you have goal lines. lines are all the way down. That's where the nets. The nets are set up on the goal line. You want to get the puck between the score goal, got to get across the goal line and it's got to be in the net. The blue lines are to prevent icing, or to prevent offside. And so are to not prevent offside, but to regulate. So the easiest thing you could do in hockey is, is you'd have one guy

who would stay all the way down by the other team's net, and you just throw the puck down to him, and he'd be alone with the goalie. That line, the puck has to go over that line to go into the other zone before any of your players do. And that prevents that from happening. So that's probably the hardest thing when people first start getting into hockey. They don't really understand what offside is.

If they've ever watched soccer, They might have an idea of offside, but offside could be manipulated in soccer because, I mean, it's just basically a bunch of hooligans and they're not to be trusted. But in hockey, that line basically prevents you from, you know, hanging out over it down here. Hey, hey, throw me the puck. I'm all alone. No, the puck has to go over that, has to go over that line before any of you guys do. and the center line is basically where they where you center ice is where the game starts from or after a goal is scored where you drop the puck and you have a face off who you know you try

to get the puck back to your guys so that's basically i pretty much just explained the hardest part of people first watching hockey they're okay why did the whistle blow well the person was offside they went across the line before the puck did fuck has to go across line. It's more sportsmen like that. There's more sportsmanship according to it. And that's another thing about hockey that I love is, is it's very, it gets a bad rap for fighting. But the fighting is essential to the game. And as you had mentioned before we even started, we've seen a lot of problems in hockey since they took, since they basically tried to, um, try to eliminate. eliminate fighting because fighting was really a way to police the other team.

If somebody was getting out of line, if somebody went after your best guy or, you know, a cheap shot at one of your guys, you know, a fight would be a good way to, the enforcer would go after that guy or, you know, if a game needed, and this happened a lot back in the 70s. If a game just needed a little more excitement, both teams would throw their enforcers out there, enforcers out there at the same time. And they would just pick a fight with each other. And then, you know, it was off to the races, especially before they started mandating helmets. It was a lot more fun. And I would argue hockey was a safer game before they started mandating helmets because people took more care. They knew that guys weren't wearing helmets. They weren't as

they wouldn't be as dirty and they'd be a little more hesitant to like really crash a guy into the boards headfirst or something like that and um you know it just it's always been a gentleman sport well i mean it's not always been a gentleman sport but it's it's a more gentlemanly sport because you can fight you can take out your aggression and also it's mostly real white bread kids playing it. Any questions? Well, there's that awful piece of commie adjut prop that Clint East would directed with the starring Matt Damon

about the World Cup in South Africa for rugby World Cup. And one line that stuck with me from that is that rugby was a gentleman's game, a thugs game played by gentlemen. and that soccer was vice versa and played by hooligans right and it strikes me

that hockey very much fits that the a thugs game played by gentlemen sort of ethos that you want in sports where that there is the competition there is the violence

I mean how fast are these guys skating like 20, 25 miles? I have no idea. I mean 25 miles an hour is I would say a pretty quick player some players you know Pavel Berre was getting probably up closer to 30 so that's like you car crash shapes to be this dangerous like if you oh yeah it's insane yeah you hit the board you go into a board the boards head first um you know i forget what the guy's name was who um it was a boston

college player kid um and he went head first into the boards and paralyzed um In a game, yeah, that was in the 90s. Oh, by the way, you were mentioning the Seattle area. The Seattle Metropolitan's were the first American teams to actually win the Stanley Cup. They beat the Montreal Canadiens in 1917. Most people don't even, probably don't even know that there was a Seattle metropolitan's team. I had no idea. Yeah, no idea.

Really, this is the first I'm hearing, you know. Yeah, there's actually a picture of them. And you can imagine. It's all a bunch of white kids. And half of them definitely look German. That's for sure. Right. And one interesting thing about hockey that,

I think it's the only major sport where the season goes on hold for the Olympics. Well, the season will go on hold for the Olympics. Yeah, mostly because the basketball is played during the summer. and that's when they're off. So yeah. And it's, well, what's interesting is for a while there,

pros played in the, in, they allowed pros. I can't remember the year that they allowed pros back in. I think it was in the early 2000s. It was in the 2000s of almost positive. Then they took them out.

And then this year, they let them back in. It had been a while since they had pros in the game. So, Well, I just think it's cool that, like, because I only know this because his name is so weird. Is it Dominic Khashik who's like Czech? Or, like, he was, you know, like maybe 10 years ago or something. I remember like reading about the Winter Olympics.

And like he was playing for his country in the Winter Olympics. And so you get all like you get really the best players. from all over the world, right? But, you know, what's the, he's like one of the best scorers in the league now, Aveschkin? Alexander Avechkin, yeah, he's Russian. Yeah, did he play, like,

has he played for the Russian teams in the Olympics? I'm positive he did during the Oaths. I don't know what his, I don't know his scoring record in the Olympics or anything like that, but I'm almost positive he would have, yeah. Right. So you get, like, Canadians, the Russians, the Scandinavians, the European, like, you know, Western civilization

effectively, like, plays hockey is, is what I'm saying. Or, like, white civilization plays hockey. And I don't know, like, Australia and New Zealand have hockey teams. It wouldn't surprise me if they did. But, right, it's the only, it's the only sport I can think of where I can look at the teams and be like, I'd have those guys over for a barbecue. They look at it. They're a good time. right like you know like where i'm not just visually off put and not just because like oh a braces but like what do i have in common with like NBA players you know my life and their life are completely different you know baseball like not you know just just nothing in common at all yeah and so hockey is this it's like oh these are these look like guys that i would have known

growing up. Yeah. The hockey has gone through a lot of like first hockey. I think when I was growing up 90, it was 92% of the league was Canadian. And the rest were basically American.

Then the as the wall started to fall and everything started falling apart in Eastern Europe, you started getting more of the Eastern European players come over and really the last to come over were were the Russian players obviously. So you know hockey has gone through when it became more of a world sport that's when the league really started to expand

where you started you started seeing more teams added you know there was I don't remember how many years it was but there was only six teams in the NHL for a long time called the original six was uh montreal toronto uh it was the canadians the maple leaves the rangers the black hawks the red wings and who am i leaving out boston boston so there was only six teams for for a long time and it was pretty much because you know well it how much is the supply and demand how many people are demanding to see hockey and everything and then once uh uh the game started to get some in the 60s it started to get popular especially after the United States actually won the the Olympic gold medal in 1960 I think that was at Squaw valley and it started getting popular and then people had just started picking up so you had teams that were adding on adding on adding on you actually had a team in Cleveland at one point and a lot of teams moved that they had to find their uh find their places to go to where

you know you would find a crowd which is why you know the famous line from baseball and basketball um the new orleans jazz moved to utah where they don't allow music um you had all these teams that were had to change your names and move move around to find find their niche but um you know eventually with more Americans starting to play the game, especially after 1980, the Olympics in 1980. You just, the league just started to explode. But then as soon as Eastern Europeans and Russians came in, I mean, now you have teams in Florida. So, you know, mostly, most of the people go into those games are obviously people who are from, you know, retired to Florida. from New York and on the west coast, the Midwest.

Tampa's more of a Midwest, a lot of people from the Midwest, where the East Coast, where you have Florida Panthers down in Burrard County, is mostly people from the tri-state area in New England up in New York. So, yeah, I mean, the game started to, the game started to explode. And, you know, it's always been one of those games where I remember when I was growing up, I can't remember what the guy's name was. but there was like one black guy in the league and honestly if there is a black guy in the league he's the whitest black guy

you've you know if there's a guy playing hockey in the NHL and he's from Canada he's the whiteest black guy you know so what else you want to know well like if if you were to say all right like here's if you want to learn more about hockey like learn about like these six players or something and watch these like go to YouTube and watch the like the you know

the night obviously there's the 1980 you know silver silver medal game or whatever where the US beat the Russians um uh like what what I know names like Brett Hall

and um uh grain Gersky and like Mario Lemieux because when I was a kid those were like the big three names and you could be like into sports and not hear those three names, but like one of their players, you know, like, if, if,

if Pete had to put together his all-time, like, best squad, like, goalie and wings and defense, that's the three big terms, right? Yeah,

I'm gonna, God, I'll be naming people no one have ever, my goalie would be some, somebody, most people have never even heard of. It was Ken Dryden for the, uh,

Montreal, Canadians played in the uh played in the 70s um i think he actually joined the league late because he went to law school or something like that but ken dryden was i mean he was just it was impossible to get anything by him but in like the modern era um i mean dominic kashik patrick waugh as far as goaltenders go i mean these are guys who um you know took their team to championships um i mean i don't want to say i can name people name goalies who um you know like won the stanley cups but they didn't like they didn't carry their team on their on their shoulders you know and i'm not going to name a lot of um current players because after covid i just dropped out of watching

pretty much all sports. I've only started watching hockey again recently because, yeah, I needed just another a distraction of some sort. And, but so, like, I don't know, if I had a goalie that I needed to, you know, we need to win a game, like one game, it's kind of hard not to pick Dominic

Khashik because the guy would just, the guy was doing a lot in Buffalo with a team that, I mean, he had some good defensemen in front of him, but I mean, there were nights where he was carrying the team. Mike Richter was another guy who, like, carried his team to, the Rangers hadn't won a Stanley Cup since like 1940, 1941, and Richter took them to the Stanley Cup in 93, or was it 94. I remember, but it was 93 and 94.

I think 93 was Montreal, and the next year. was the uh the rangers so goalie i mean Patrick wae dominic haschick these guys can trident um someone's probably screaming martin bordeur from the uh from the new jersey devils he had it he was a great goaltender but he also had a great defense in front of him um defenseman is i mean this guy right here how many how many defensemen are there There's two, so there's two defensemen, okay? And usually you're going to, normally what you're going to have is on the ice at one time, you're going to have one that's right-handed, one that shoots right-handed, one that shoots right-handed, one that shoots right-hand and one that shoots right-hand is going to play the right-hand.

The one that shoots left-hand is going to play the left-side. There's just reasons. There's your, you want your, you want the stick closest to the boards on the side you are. That's the way it was always explained to me growing up. Although I played, I shot right-handed, even though I'm, normally if you're right-handed, you're supposed to shoot left-handed, shoot left-handed, but I was, I'm kind of ambidextrous,

so I shot right-handed. But the, so here, let me share this guy. This guy was played in the 70s. When defensemen, when you talk about defense, He gets left out because he played so long ago, and he had a short career because he played so hard, he got hurt a lot. But this is Bobby Orr, and he played for the Bruins. And before he came into the league, a defenseman basically played defense. They, when the other team, when the other team was on the offense, he dropped back.

And defenseman's job is to make sure that the forwards, don't get an open shot, make sure to put body, you're supposed to just get your body between them and your goalie. And Bobby Orr kind of changed that. Bobby Orr led the league in scoring as a defenseman. And there was really nothing like him when he came along to the point where,

I mean, like videos like this are, this show how legendary he actually was, where he is a young kid and he's making men who've been playing the game, you know, twice as long as he has just looks silly. So let me just run this video. I have a few videos that are, um, might be of interest. No helmets, too. This was back when the game was just absolutely amazing.

Drive-by park goes wide. Or, long shot. It's almost behind that goal line, but it's somehow, some way, that puck went in behind Brighton. He comes off. Right in. He shoots. There's no reason a defenseman is going in on a goal on basically unchallenged.

He should be back. He should be back behind the forwards, waiting for the puck, waiting for the opposing team to pick the puck up and bring it back down the ice. And Orr was just like, no, I'm going to, I'm going to totally break that model and just become completely offensive. And people just didn't, they didn't know what to do with him. I mean, it got to the point where they were hurt. Some people, some of the dirtier players would try to hurt him on purpose and actually succeeded. Now, war breaks, delayed call. He's out to Walton.

heads for the net. Walden closes, fires and misses, rebobb. Score, Bobby, R! Now watch Bobby heading for the net. He's going to turn and come over to the right side, adjust as Walton drives the puck. There he turns. Now watch this backhander, right here at the top corner. How does he do it?

I don't know. Moore gets it. Picks up speed, leaves Montahan down the other end, and here he comes. Three men back. He's... Four, fight for it behind the net, has it. Looking in front. Wheels in front, locked on the pass, has it again, or cuts around, a backhander, scores off the boat.

The craziest thing about that goal right there is that it started with him behind the opposing net. Something a defenseman is not supposed to do. When I was playing, if I was playing defense and I ended up behind the other team's net, I was going to be benched. You just don't do that as a defense. man, you're like leaving, you know, you might have a forward drop back. I mean, you know, drop back to cover for you, but a forward is not going to be able to play as defense as well as you do, especially at this level. I mean, as in high school, yeah, maybe, you know, a guy will play defense as well as

as you. At this level, no one's going to play defense as well as the defenseman. Plant stops it behind the net for O. Orr with Gould there. Drives it on an empty net, throws you out, and it is a score. This is him just like at the end of the game, if you're down by a goal within the last two minutes of the game, you can pull your goaltender out for an extra attacker. So you can try and score and tie the game. But basically that just leaves your goal wide open. So, you know, or had this habit of being all the way on the other end of the ice and being able to just pinpoint shot all the way from the end of the ice.

and being able to just pinpoint shot all the way from the other end into the net on the other end of the ice. And that takes some skill for sure. Was he actually good at defense too? Or was he just like this weird scoring machine who should have been playing wing? Oh, no. I think he won defensive player of the year six times. So he could win defensive player of the year

and be the overall have the most points scored in a season, which makes no fucking sense whatsoever. I mean, that's why at the time it was just this anomaly where people were just like, what are we seeing here? We're seeing like history. We're seeing something new. So he would have been your all-time defense.

So there's two defense. And once you got Bobby Orrin and who's the other guy then? Well, I mean, yeah, unfortunately. Yeah, unfortunately, it's, well, not, unfortunately but um if i was going to pick a defenseman who like to play alongside or it would be another left-handed shooter shooter it would be scott stevens from the from new jersey devils the guy was just one of the most brutal son of a bitches ever let me see if i can find this here

scott stevens eric lindross yeah here we go He's bumped. Miedemeyer trying to get out of his own skate. In a lot. Here's 88. Lindrosh makes the rule. And Lindrosse is hammered down to the ice by Scott Stevens. And Lindrosse remains down on the ice as all.

Concussion. I mean, that, a lot of people say that pretty much ended his career. The other players come together. Stevens just had a friggin, if somebody put their head down and they were skating, they had the puck. you didn't want to be around it. So when is it legal to hit somebody? When they have the puck. You're only allowed to check somebody

when they have the puck. Okay. Okay. So you can't just like like take some little guy who's up skating up front and like hey, shoot me the puck, should be the puck who's small and then just have one of your biggest guys like run them into the boards. Yeah, no.

You have to the rule is you have to the person has to be has to have the puck. you know, sometimes referees don't see everything. So together. This hit became legendary. Oh, boy.

This is the worst case scenario here for this hit. For Eric Lindross. Steven. Lindross was a total prick, by the way. There weren't, I think the only people who were upset at this point were Philadelphia Flyer fans. But this pretty much ended his career. I mean, he kept having, he had multiple, more concussions after this,

and he just had to quit at a very young age because he, I mean, he was looking at brain damage. Evans came across like he is done in the plea, and he swung you with your. Here we go. He's coming through. He beats Niedermeier. Head is down, and it's a shoulder right to the jaw of Lindross. and he has no clue this is coming. This is a freight train coming.

Look how fast he's going. A freight train. And it is a wicked hit. Even, even, I mean, even slow motion. Look how fast he's going. This is coming. This is a freight train coming his way.

Well, so like, and it is a wicked. In car accidents, right? If you get in a head-on car accident, it's the speed of, say, car one is going 30 miles an hour, and car two is going 30 miles an hour. It's like running into a brick wall at 70 miles an hour. Yep.

Both those guys are doing, 20 to 25 miles an hour. Yep. That's like hitting a brick wall at 45 miles an hour with those people. Oh yeah. Oh, it's that's bad. I've taken some monster hits, man. And it's, and I've delivered some monster hits.

And yeah. And me, if it doesn't hurt you like to the point where you're like, okay, I'm, you know, I might need to see the trainer. It takes everything right. out of you and you have to get off the ice. It's hard to get up from a hit like that and like get back into your get back into your groove. Get back, you know, start skating again. You need, you need some time.

Yeah. So, I mean, it's just, it's a brutal. It's another thing I love about the game, though. It's a brutal game. You can really hit some, you can, you can really do some damage. But, I mean, I don't. It's hard to know. what Scott Stevens,

what his motives were there. But here's some, I think it's Scott Stevens' greatest hits. Holy shit. Did that can just flip over? Yeah, hip check. He just did a full, like... Yeah.

He just did a full like 270 in the air. Oh, my gosh. Boom. So we're in force. generally defensemen oh what so the role on the team of enforcer we talked a little bit about was that usually fulfilled by a defenseman or no normally not normally it was like a fourth line wing you know like right winger left winger somebody who wasn't going to get a lot of ice time he would just be out there at certain times you know like um you know you know

If one of your best players, if one of your best players got a cheap shot or something, he'd go out there and instigate with that person. Oh, okay. So it's a gate. So, but yeah, so just those two guys. It's hard as part of their duties, but not necessarily fight as part of the game. Okay. That makes sense.

Correct. Yeah. So, yeah, those would be my two defensemen, would be Bobby Orr and Scott Stevens. just because they would complement each other well because one would have the ability to play defense and be insanely offensive. And then you'd have another guy who was a really good defenseman who could just deliver brutal hits.

And, I mean, that's what hockey's about. Hockey's about, you know, letting people, you know, leveling people, you know. And that's, you know, really the fun part of it. So my, well, then I guess we'd have to go to, we'd have to go to center. And center is so hard. There's been so many great centers of, center is basically like quarterback on the ice. Your left wing, your left wing, your right wing, these are forwards, obviously, ones are on the left, ones are me on the right.

they're going to attack on their side into the, into the zone. When they come back to play defense, they're going to be playing defense more forward in the zone, like up near where the defensemen come up into the zone and hang back. But the center is somebody who can go, basically can go anywhere. He takes the face-offs, and then he is, so if a puck goes into the corner,

and he can go in and help the, help the winger and whatever. Would they typically be the fastest skaters? Not necessarily. No. Or the best puck handlers? Would they be the guys that are the real? They would be the guys who could probably handle the puck better than anyone else.

Okay. So, you know, like the reason why the Edminton Oilers of the, of the 80s were so dominant, was they had two dominant censors. They had Wayne Gretzky and Mark Messier. And these were guys who were magic with the puck.

And they had great wingerers playing them. Gretzky famously had Yari Curry, who was a Finn. Pretty sure he was a fin. And then I forget who his other winger was. I know, I know, sorely, I can't remember. But like when Gretzky left Edmondson and went to L.A., Like Curry followed him. Like the line just like that, that duo went with them,

went to L.A. together. So if I say Gretzky is the greatest center of all time. I mean, it's so obvious. Now you can make the arguments can be made that, what's his name? You just mentioned him, the Russian. um from ovechkin yeah ovechkin Alexander ovecgan and the only reason I know that name is that when the capitals won the cup uh I happened to be in Washington DC at the time on like a tourist thing and caught like a chunk of their parade

and so I was like that was really cool yeah well I mean he's he's considered really a left winger I mean if if you're going to consider him a left winger um and I know he's played center before then he's going to be the He'll be the top left winger of all time. I mean, he's the top goal score. He beat Gretzky's 892 career goals, which no one ever thought was going to have. Now, he's not going to beat Gretzky total points because I think Gretzky had twice as many assists as he did goals.

And at one point... What's the distinction between goals and assists, or goals and points? It was you, the puck, you're sticking, and you can't even with that. An assist is credited to the last two players to get you that puck.

So if the three forwards come across the line, say you have Gretzky in the center, Yari Curry, I think Yari played left, actually even though he was right-handed, and say McSorley was out there just to play,

just to make sure no one fucked with Gretzky. If they came across the line and McSorley passed it to Curry, and Curry passed it to Gretzky and Gretzky scored. Gretzky would get a goal. Curry and McSorley would get assists. Okay, and then your points are your assist plus your goals?

Yeah, yeah. Okay. So your points for assist and goals. And the, so say Yari Curry went into, say the opposing team had the puck and Curry went into the zone to go after, try and take the puck away from him. And he did, he took it away from an opposing player and passed it to Gretzky and Gretzky scored.

Then only Curry would get an assist because he is the only player. He took it from the opposing team and put it on, put it on Gretzky's stick. Now, if Curry went in and took it from an opposing player and just took it from the opposing player and scored on his own, then that would be scored as a goal for Curry unassisted. No one would have an assist on it because none of the players on his team touched it before passed a puck to him or touched it.

That makes sense. And then so you've got the vachan on the left, who's playing right wing then? The best position. It has to be somebody that a lot of people have never heard of. Mike Bossie from the New York Islanders in the, late 70s, early 80s. The Islanders won the Stanley Cup four years in a row from, I think it was 80 to 84.

And Bossie was just, he was just one of those middle-sized Canadian guys who could just do so much with the puck and just had a knack for putting it for putting it in the net. So let's see, let me get his stats. He was six, you know, he was a guy, he was a guy from my. Montreal, six foot, six foot tall. Oh, he died in 2022. I don't know that. Oh, wow. At the age of 65.

Damn. Six foot tall, 185 pounds. Yeah, he was the second of five players to score 50 goals in 50 games. I mean, this is, this, this guy was a complete beast who just knew, knew how to find the back of the net. and I'm looking for his career statistics. Yeah, so he had 573 career goals in 752 games, and he had. So he played 752 games, have 573 goals, 553 assists, 1127 goals, 177 points in 752 games. So he averaged over a point of game.

That's a lot, isn't it? The guy was a fucking monster. Okay. So like soccer is typically a relatively low scoring game. Right. Like, you know, lots of, lots of games that are 2-1 or 3-2 or whatever. Right. Is it a typical hockey game like more like a soccer game or like five goals is like what's like if you had to like guess like the median score like total like five points?

Like is it like three to two? Well, it just depends on the team. You know, if you have like, so the New Jersey Devils of the 90s, it had Martin Broder as a goalie and Scott Stevens as their defensemen. When they were, they had a system where if you tried to bring, if you tried to bring the puck through center ice, they had a system where they would just stop you, where it would just basically line up, line the team. up across and just wouldn't give you a chance to get through it's called the trap it'll win you games it won't win your fans i i used to have seasons like i guess the florida panthers and whatever the devils came i never went to the game because i knew it was going to be boring i knew it was going to be a two one game or something like that but if you had like if like colorado that had joe sackick and peter

Forzburg and Chris Drury and guys like that. That could be a 5-3 game, something like that. You weren't get it. It's very rare you're going to get like games with more than six or seven goals on one team. Mostly because you don't want to score 10 goals on a team because you're going to have to play them again. And they're going to remember that shit. And they're going to try and shove it up your ass next time they play you.

and you might have the toughest game of the year. There might be a lot of penalties in that game, and it might be a little dirty, because you just don't do that to people. It's unseemly. You just, it's considered rude. Let's just put it that way.

In a lot of... So, like, if it was five to six, that would be like, okay, close game, everyone's, but if it's like, if it's like six to two, you know, then people are like... Six to is fine. Six two is fine. I mean, they'll be, they'll be butt hurt a little bit.

But if you're, if your goalie is just like completely porous as Swiss cheese that night, and you, you decide you want to score 11 goals and they score one or two. Okay. That next game, you might want to set that next game out because it can get, it can get ugly. Depending, you know, they may, they may even do the old school, um, the old school. the old school thing where if they don't have an enforcer that they really think can handle the job, they'll call someone up from the minors who can just for like one game to go out there and just wreak havoc on your ass. So there's a little bit of a street justice that goes on there.

It's not really street justice. It's more like, you know, yeah, you're, you shouldn't have done that. There is just, it's rude. I mean, just, I guess the best way to say is rude. Okay. So, that makes sense. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, you're a lot of these guys you grew up with. A lot of these guys, if you're the same age, you may be playing against each other since you're like nine or 10 years old, especially if you're from Canada. And you're playing in, in junior systems where they have, I mean, they have. Okay. Explain that because I don't know. What does junior systems mean? Okay.

So they have junior hockey in Canada, and somebody who's Canadian is going to be going to be real pissed off at me because I'm not completely familiar with the junior system. But the, like Bobby Orr, so when Bobby Orr was 13 years old, he was, he was taken, basically he left his family to go play hockey. and the junior leagues were basically like a the buildup to the minor leagues where you would where well I mean it's really where you're going to cut your teeth where people are going to see you so you can get drafted into the NHL and some of these some of these um you could actually get you got paid um you got housing and you got you know you you're being trained, a lot of the coaches and a lot of the trainers were former NHLers. It's basically like a farm system for hockey.

I don't know what it's like now, but back then it was definitely like pretty much anyone who came up, went into the NHL who was from Canada, played in the, play junior hockey. So basically, like for American sports, right, like, Typically, you'll play in high school and then to play in college, one or two years, and then you'll get drafted into the NBA or NHL, or not NHL, MLB into the NFL. And then in baseball, right, you graduate high school and you might get drafted by a major league team. You might play college ball, but you can do one or those.

Like you'll do with some time in the minors and then a couple years maybe, if you're really talented and then and then get your shot in the big leagues like is so in your hockey like like hockey high school and then once you're done with hockey high school pretty much you're it's a system to get you ready for the NHL um then you get drafted and if you get drafted I mean if you get drafted like um I'm pretty sure like bossy was drafted 15th overall he went um he went right to the um i don't think he played any let me see i don't think he played any any minor league hockey yeah he played um he played from 1972 to 1977 he played for la ball national of the quebec i think it's quebec maritime's junior hockey league which is a um let me describe it one of three major

junior hockey leagues they constitute the canadian hockey league alongside the ontario hockey league and western hockey league um and the um what is uh basically most of the teams yeah it's just basically it's it would be our version of um like baseball playing playing in high school and getting drafted out of high school and the same thing football uh football getting drafted out of college so but the thing is is that the one difference is is that um you can you can start playing in depending on how good you are you can start playing in the junior leagues at a very young age like i said bobby or was playing in the junior leagues at 13 so you know they have a they have a system up there they've changed the rules I'm of an age where like Kobe Bryant and Kevin Garnett got drafted in the NBA like right around high school like right after I agree like these guys in the same age I am what are they doing to play in the NBA right with American football right like you just can't take an 18 year old kid and go have him throw them into the NFL because he'll get killed right they need that extra time to just get bigger just so that they don't die uh when you know 200 it was I think it you had to be three

years you have to be three years out of at a high school in order to be drafted in the NFL i don't know if that's the same if it's the same now and in basketball for a long time it was one year yeah yeah it's been one year out of high school and um lebron changed that to the point where there were i remember reading articles around the time like lebron was coming out where they um they wanted to draft him as a junior in high school. Yeah, yeah, he was so good, so early. Yeah. So not my cup of team, but I have to admit he was, he's freakously talented.

Yeah, I, I enjoy playing basketball more than I, um, more than I do watch watching basketball we played. Uh, yeah. Yeah, well, that way with a lot of sports. Uh, so you mentioned, okay, so there's six guys on the squad, right? Three, three guys in the wing. a goalie and then two defensemen. Three forwards, two defensemen and a goalie.

Okay, so six guys on a squad, and you said something about lines. What is that? So, okay, so you're going to have, most teams are going to have three lines. So you're going to have, you have three forwards, so you'll have nine forwards,

you'll have three lines of three different guys. So you can swap out, because one thing that most people don't realize about hockey is, and I remember, talking to someone and being like, you get out there, after about usually 35 to 40 seconds of going balls out, you're out of gas. You have to change.

You need to change. And you know, you hop over the boards and then say, I played left wing a lot, the left winger on whatever line the coach called to go out next. There's always a first line, a second line, and a third line. You know who that is at the beginning of the game. and so if I'm coming in, if I'm on the ice and I'm like, I'm gassed, I need, I need to rest.

He's going to call second line, you know, if I'm playing first line, he's going to be called the second or third line, left wing. And then that person will jump out and will replace me. But usually when I'm jumping out, you want to get my center and the coach will start screaming for the center on my line and the right wing around. my line to hop out too so that you can get the other two guys out there who have been playing together who are used to playing together on the ice. Each line is something where you're going to be practicing together. You're going to get to know you're going to get you know, you're going to get to know where your guy's going.

You know, if I have the puck in the corner, I knew where Chris V was going. I knew he was going to the, you know, he was going to go to the top of the circle or something like that for a slap shot and I had to set him up for a one timer or just feed it into throw it in front of the net and hopefully you know he could tip it in or something like that okay um so you're you have three lines and there are many cases where there are fourth lines but the fourth line is usually your least talented players you may put them out there only if like your three your first three lines are completely gassed and they need a little you know whatever line you you want to put out next needs.

So like in a typical NHL game, say you start, game starts with the first line on both sides. How long are those guys playing before they get swapped out? Five minutes, 10 minutes. 40 seconds? Yeah.

Wow. You cannot stay on the ice. I was talking to a, a marathon runner. And he had picked up hockey later in life. I think he started playing hockey. It was like 22. started playing in men's leagues in South Florida when he was 22. And we were, you know, I told them I

had pretty much been playing my whole life and everything. And, and he, you know, we started talking. He's like, and he's like, yeah, you know, I've run marathons for, you know, since I was like, you know, since I was like 15, something like that. So he'd been running marathons, you know, 26. 26.2 miles for seven years. I said, oh, that must really help. with your wind. He's like, are you crazy? He goes, there's no correlation. He is, I'm out there for 40 seconds, 45 seconds, and I need, I need to get off the ice. I mean, it gases you, especially if you're hitting, especially if you're, if you're getting hit and you're hitting, I mean, you go out there and it is balls bucking out for 40 to 40 seconds. It's just like full on sprinting. Oh yeah. And then you have to

get off the ice. Now, a defenseman can have, if you're a forward, you're going to have shorter shifts. You can have defensemen who can stay out there for a while because if they're true defensemen and they're not puck rushing defenseman like Bobby Orr, you can hang back and you can actually, if your team is, if you're hanging out at the line while your team is in the offense, is in the offensive zone and your wingers and your, if your forwards are up, there and they're trying you can you can actually get um get a breather as a defenseman but a defenseman usually isn't going to last longer than a minute a minute 15 seconds so games are what an hour and they're three 20 minute periods or three 20 minute yeah three 20 minute periods okay so so

the reason a hockey game looks like total chaos is because it's an hour of every once a minute like a line getting changed out yeah Oh, yeah. So you're going to have 50 line changes in a game. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, no wonder I couldn't follow it. Like this makes so sense.

What's going on? Yeah, people just jumping over, you know, jumping over the boards left and right. You know, swapping out, switching out. I mean, it is. It's okay. The best way I heard it was control chaos. That makes a complete sense as to why I couldn't follow it. First of all, because the puck is very small, moving very fast and very hard to follow

from a television. but and then just like it just looks like a madhouse out there because apparently it's a madhouse like that that makes total sense why I couldn't follow the game is I had no idea that like a shift was 30 seconds long I mean it's also it's complete insanity sometimes where that puck that's galvanized rubber it's hard as fuck man I don't know how many times I've been hitting the face with it. I mean, I mean. Well, there's a reason those guys are all missing teeth.

Like, well, yeah. Everybody thinks it's because of fighting. It's not because of fighting. Because you got hit in the face of the galvanized piece of whatever. Was it what, 50 miles an hour? Oh, yeah. Oh, God. Some, there are guys like,

I can't remember what the name of the, the defenseman for the Bruins. He was like, Xenochara. Yeah, like a hundred, like sometimes you get up to like a hundred. four miles an hour slap shot. Oh. That thing hit you in the, yeah.

Oh, I mean, you talk about fractured cheekbones, fractured orbitals, if that catches you, right? Yeah, most people are missing, like, I'm missing teeth. I lost my teeth because somebody, I was playing with somebody who wasn't as fucking good as I was and completely lost control on their skates. Their feet went out from under them and they just, their hands went backwards and their stick just like, they lost control of their stick. I just took a stick in the mouth. And like I get popped. I taste the blood.

I put my tongue on my teeth. And I'm like, well, I don't have those anymore. I fucking like I was 13 years old. Ow. Yeah. Well, and I mean, because I hang out with racist on the internet, there's that one game in England where that Negro guy like legit killed that other dude with the skate. Then he should have been in prison for life for that.

but you know you got guys moving at 25 30 miles an hour with razor wades on their feet carrying like I don't know what they're made out of but like sticks and this puck moving at 100 miles an hour or you know probably 80 like I imagine everybody's slap shots in the 80s um like that's that's a dangerous environment and then you've got the you know every 60 seconds somebody you know guys moving on and off the ice like it's that's nuts the stick you know there were some problems with the stick for a while so originally the stick was wood with fiberglass cover especially on the blade reinforced with fiberglass in the blade those those sticks break very easily break them all the time um the blades would just pop off um then someone got the

idea that they were going to um make the sticks like one piece fiberglass all the way then someone got the bright idea of well you know you know so people are sick and tired of buy a new sticks all the time you got to buy a whole new stick let's have a metal shaft all the way down to the blade and then you can just change the blade okay one of the problems with that is is that first of all metal you don't want people on a hockey rink with having a metal basically a metal bar. I remember one player, I can't remember who it was. It was someone on Tampa.

And he got slashed in the hand with somebody from someone who had one of those metal, metal frames. What is slashing, please? Slashing is you take the stick two-handed and you, basically it sounds like it sounds like what it is you slash someone with the stick either in their assault with a stick

basically assault with a stick but slashing is the the penalty is the two minute penalty if you get caught doing it so he slashes a guy in the hand and because he had a metal because he had one of these metal frame sticks he takes his glove off and his fucking

pinky is hanging like literally like It's like friggin dislocated and like his pinky. He's got a compound fracture and his pinky's hanging. So I don't know if they use those metal sticks anymore. I hope they don't. I don't think they do. But the, you know, wood, the good thing about wood is it would break.

I mean, you hit someone with a wooden stick. There's a good chance if they have good equipment. It'll just hit the equipment and break and, you know, won't do too much damage. But that's just as an aside. But yeah, the violence of the game, slashing is a penalty, two minutes. If it's gross, if they consider it to be a beyond the pale kind of slash, you can get four minutes. If it's really fucking horrible, you get five minutes for a game misconduct, get kicked after the game, possibly a suspension. Elbowing can't hit someone with an elbow.

that's two minutes could turn into five or something like that. Tripping. Tripping is the most obvious one because tripping would be the most obvious thing you'd want to do if someone's like skating by you, you take the blade of your stick,

put it right into their skates and just give it a yank. I mean, like you said, you're skating on razor blades. It's just very easy to fall or you put your stick, you can put your stick right between their legs. You don't even have to have a pulling you don't even have to use any force you just stick in between someone's legs

and it caused them to fall. What are hockey players get beat up so bad? Holy cow. Yeah. Oh yeah. I mean, you get brutalized out there, man. It really depends. It depends how

I don't know what the, I don't really know what the game is like anymore. I don't know how I know like in basketball you can't even like touch anybody anymore from what I understand people like you can't even touch anyone. The whole like like just elbowing people in the face that used to happen

in the 80s and 90s not happening anymore. Yeah. I don't know how I don't know what what hockey is like. Like I said, I haven't. I've watched some games and I've mostly watched playoff games and during the playoffs they tend to let things go a little more. you know, they don't want the, you know, you don't want to play off game decided by a penalty where, by the way, here's something else, say I'm out there and I elbow somebody and I get a two-minute

penalty, I go to the penalty box for two minutes and now my team is short-handed. My team only has four guys and the goalie on the ice and the other team has five guys and their goalie on the ice. So it's a huge advantage. Okay. So they can't just swap out. Like if you were in the left wing, they could just swap out another left wing guy

while you're in the penalty box. Nope. Nope. You got to play with it. You got to play one man down. And that's what they call the other team has a power play. And you're playing shorthanded. And if they,

if the other team scores within that two minutes, you come out of the penalty box. So if they score, your penalty is not negated, but you don't have to stay in the penalty box. Now, if it's like a major, like they decided that you elbowed somebody and you were trying to like really hurt them, and you got a five-minute major, then you'd be down for five minutes and they could score as much as they wanted. A goal wouldn't take you out of the penalty box. But for a two-minute, a two-minute penalty, if they scored within 10 seconds, you're right back at you're right back

out and probably on the bench because the coach is going to be fucking pissed at you for taking a penalty and the other team's scoring. So hockey fighting is normally five minutes. Both guys will get five minutes and

that'll just negate. It'll negate each other. I mean, sometimes there are sometimes where it won't be four on four, where it'll be five on five, but there's sometimes it would be four on four. I've never really understood the fucking rules behind that. But the,

so yeah, so fighting is five minutes and most penalties are going to be two minutes. So like, there's like 17 games in an NFL season or something like that. 82 games

in an NBA season, something like 150 games in a baseball season. How many games in an NHL season? 82. Same as the NBA. Okay. Yeah. So if you have season tickets and you have full season tickets and not like a half season, you had tickets of 41 games. And if you make each one of them, you don't have a life. That's a lot. I've had full, I've had full season tickets that I always end up, I always end up giving them away to people because I just can't make every game.

Or, you know, like the one year we had season tickets to the Panthers and they won nine home games. so I think it's a 41 games and they won nine home games that's where you're just going to the game to drink and be belligerent I mean that drink and be belligerent just kind of at European pastime so I guess that

I think that I think that I don't know what what tickets are costing these days but I know it's like much more reasonable God. Is it? Then other major sports.

Like the NBA and NFL tickets are just insane. Let me show. You know. So. Let me say. Florida Panthers ticket places. So Ottawa. Let's see.

They're playing Ottawa at home. Two tickets. So yeah. In the upper, in the upper. for the Florida Panthers who are having a horrible season, even though they're Stanley Cup champions. $29 a ticket.

That's all the way up. Yeah, up in the nosebleeds. But, well, yeah, but if you're like taking a kid to a sporting event, like, yeah, you know, the same ticket at like the, where are the Florida Panthers play out of? Broad County, Florida. Okay. I don't know.

I don't think of a little area. where's the like the nearest NFL team Miami Dolphins okay yeah like compare that to it like in those we Miami Dolphins seat it's like 400 I mean they only

they only play what 18 games or 16 games so yeah it's gonna be so like if you wanted like row 20 row one well no not row one so I'm looking at um row 12 down by the ice. So you're 12 rows off the ice for the Florida Panthers in the corner. It's $75

a piece, which I mean is kind of not bad. Although, although, oh, no, that's $22 each. That's not good. But yeah, this one, no, this one $76 a piece. Yeah, that's not bad. If you, If you want to get really close to the ice, you're going to have to pay. But this one's only 12 rows off the ice. And it's $76 a piece, which isn't bad at all, actually. Oh, like, like as long light out, the misties or something, spending $150 on an event. Like, opera tickets are going to cost you that in a much. Yeah.

Right. I mean, symphony tickets are going to cost that much. Yeah. Right. You know, graduation present for, a nephew or something I'm going to take you to an NHL game you know that'd be kind of cool

it's a good game it's a better game to see like live I always tell people if they want to get into hockey go see a game live before you start watching on TV you'll enjoy it more on TV after you see it live okay I've tried to watch it on TV a few times and it's just it's incomprehensible yeah it's hard they um it's hard to follow um to follow the pup for a lot of people and plus if

you don't really know the game a lot it's going to be uh it could be it could be confusing but the um so what else is there i don't know you can keep asking questions and i don't like uh again explain this to me like i'm a five-year-old retard what what other i mean The original six teams is what, like 30 teams now? God, yeah. How many teams are there now? I know about the Seattle Crack and I know about the Las Vegas Golden Knights. Isn't there a team in Utah?

There might be. I have no idea. Now, let me see. Standings. Let's see, three, six, division. Eight. Okay, so there's 16. in the east and 32 you know there's a 16 in the west so there's 32 uh teams total

okay that makes the Seattle crack in Vegas golden nights I remember that I mean these are teams that didn't even exist when I when I started watching so like the teams that existed when I started watching hockey the Buffalo Sabres Montreal canadians Boston Bruins Detroit Red Wings, Toronto Maple Leafs, Islanders, Pittsburgh Penguins, Philadelphia Flyers, Washington Capitals. Yeah, there's a team called the Utah is a team called the Mammoth.

The Winnipeg Jets, who went away for a while and then came back. St. Louis, Blue, Chicago Blackhawks, Edmunds. Is New York the only team with two hockey? hockey teams um well let's see new york has the islanders and the rangers but then right over you have the new jersey devils which are it is where they play is i mean not a far drive from where the rangers actually play um who else is there so um and then boston was one of the first

six right so boston didn't no boston doesn't no yeah i think i i think i Los Angeles and Los Angeles Kings and Anaheim, Anaheim ducks. Okay. They would, that would be the same, same neighborhood. Okay. So not a lot of double up teams. And then, no. Florida, you have, you have the Panthers and you have the lightning,

but there are a four hour drive away from each other. Yeah, Florida is large. Most people don't. It's ridiculously large. It takes forever to drive from one. into the other. Yeah, if you were to go from Miami to to Tallahassee. Actually, it's Alassi's a holy shit, that's a long fucking drive. Well, that's the, I mean, are there any

any other big cities in the Panhandle that are closer to the Alabama line? I can't really think of anything. But if you were to go, that's like a 15 hour drive, isn't it? Yeah. That's a long fucking drive. That's, that's longer than actually going from Miami to to where I live in Alabama. Yeah. So, yeah, 32 teams. I think there were, okay, so when I started watching hockey, there were 21 and 16 teams made the playoffs.

So there was only five teams that didn't make the playoffs. It always seemed kind of weird to me. But then you had the WHA, which was the World Hockey Association, which was out of Canada. and that brought a bunch of other teams into the league like who was it? But, blah, blah, blah, definitely, the Edminton Oilers, definitely, I think. Calgary Flames, yeah.

Well, actually, Calgary used to be Atlanta. Atlanta had a hockey team. Atlanta tried to have a hockey team a couple times and it didn't work out. I imagine my shock that Atlanta. Yeah, well, yeah. Atlanta Flames, which, I mean, you want to talk about fuck you names for an Atlanta team.

And then they had the Atlanta Thrashers for a while and that didn't work out. I forget what the Atlanta Thrashers became. They might have became Winnipeg. I can't remember. But the National Predators didn't exist when I was a kid and the Dallas stars didn't exist. The Dallas stars were the Minnesota We're the Minnesota North stars And now it's the Minnesota

They have the Minnesota wild So the hockey team left Minnesota And then Minnesota is like hey We're like one of the hockey capitals of America We need a fucking team here No Minnesota is like But most of the guys who played in the 80 Olympics Were either Minnesota

Or Boston Minnesota and Boston Right. Like I said, hockey, like I'm a Minnesota, Wisconsin,

Michigan, maybe a little bit of Illinois and then like doing England and New York. There's a great line from the movie Miracle, the one where Kurt Russell plays,

Her Brooks, the story of the 1980. And one of the guys goes, oh, you got a bunch of guys from Minnesota and Boston. Yeah, that's going to work out really well.

Those guys hated each other. But, Minutes. Well, how often is the, Frozen 4 like the Minnesota Golden Gophers the Boston College if you're forget what the name team and like it's like BC Minnesota the Wisconsin Badgers and then like some team Colorado yeah the university like every once while the

University of Colorado sneaks in there too right but like and even those guys like like you know the it's March baddest I think right now I kind of hardly pay attention to college basketball anymore, but like when I did pay attention to college basketball, like you could be virtually guaranteed that like the guys who played really well in the tournament would be in the NBA next year, right? And some of them would be big time players in, you know, the Frozen Four hockey tournaments, right? Like the really good guys their age were already playing in the NHL and on the farm system, you know? So. Yeah. Most of the guys who played on the 1980 Olympic team did not make it in the NHL.

They were basically career like college players. You know, even the goalie Jim Craig, Jim Craig played for Atlanta and played, but he didn't really have, he didn't have an NHL career. I think Mark Pavlich, Mark Pavlach played a decent. There were not many guys.

I think there were only three or four guys who actually had like really prosperous, careers in the in the in the hl i mean it's 1980 you got to remember it's still in 1980 the like 90% of the guys in the nchl are um canadian so right well well they had a national system to you know like you don't produce i mean like if you go to like canadian hockey players on wikipedia right the list is as long as my arm it's just the national sport in canada and you don't produce, was Mario Lemieux community? Oh yeah.

I mean, Lemieux, right? So he's Cape Cibiqua, right? And, because when I was growing up, like, the three best players were, in the 90s were like, Wayne Greske was on the tail into his career, but he was still, you know, he was known as the great one for a reason. And Mario Lemieux was like the up-and-coming kid. And Brett Hall, right?

He was on Dallas, I want to say. Yeah, Brett Hull was. Isn't he Canadian too? Well, here's a funny story about that. So he talked about it in 1996 when they had the World Cup of hockey and it was before the season started. And NHL players played in it. It was a bunch of guys playing for their home countries.

Brett Hull, his dad was Canadian, Bobby Hull. Hockey Hall of Famer, but Bobby married an American. And Brett Hull wanted to play for Team Canada, I think, in 1986. I can't remember the name of the coach for Team Canada, though, but he, like, told, said, I don't like the kid. I don't want him on the team. And Brett Hull, I got a chip on his shoulder. He was like, fuck you.

Then I'm going to, I'm going to use my American, I'm going to use my American citizenship to play for the USA. And I mean, thank God he did because in the 19, they wouldn't have won the World Cup in 1996 if, if that Canadian coach had insulted Brett Hull. So they won the 90s because Brett Hull was a joint U.S. American, Canadian American, okay. So, right, like the three best players in the 90s, all Canadian.

Pretty much, yeah, yeah. And I mean, well, one was half. Canadian. Okay. Well, but his dad was also one of the greatest hockey players of all time because even I know the name is Bobby Hull. Right? Like that's, that's amazing. Yeah. And to that point, I think it's, you know, like America's getting smaller. So like big guys like me, I mean, you've met, we're, I'm pretty tall. I'm having a harder time finding clothes that fit in the store because the population is shrinking because it's getting, you know, more Hispanic

and more Asian. And so, um, like being big and fast and strong isn't like the BL end all of like things like winning fights, but it never hurt. And a society that can produce like lots of big, uh,

you know, in both. World Wars, right? The Canadians or the Americans or the Aussies and New Zealanders would go over to Europe and everyone would be like, holy shit, these guys are giants. What the hell? What do they feed them over there? And it's like lots of meat. And the French and the British were like, what the stuff? Like these guys are monsters. You know, a society that can produce those kind of guys. That's a good thing. Like we could discuss, you know, neither you and I want to discuss politics. this particular juncture, but like a society that produces like lots of really athletic guys that are somewhere between, you know, 5-8 to 6 foot 3 and, you know, 175 to 230 pounds and they're all strong and they're all quick and they're all coordinated. Like that's a, that's a reserved in terms of like a prosperous functioning society that you want people to have.

like if everyone if everyone in your society played hockey then everybody knows how to like look dude you're a defenseman your job is this and I think that a society that doesn't have things like

sports in common and is a less cohesive less functioning society so if we're going to pick a national game let's pick one that's like socially useful and I think hockey would fit the bill

you know but yeah I mean I mean I agree but yeah the South is just I mean we're I live in SEC country yeah and it's just college football it's just college football college football

well yes but but but they're I mean if you listen to Jose just published an episode about how there are major high schools in Dallas that don't have the ability to to feel a hockey a football team anymore because of the South Asian invasion You know, like this is not, I mean, I'm consciously trying to get into hockey because it's the white sport.

And I want to support the people that don't hate me, where obviously the NFL and NBA, like, they just completely, they want nothing to do with me and I'm fine with that. but um you know hockey I can't think of a great hockey nation whether it's any of the scantahooving countries or Russia or uh

Canada or the United States or any of the Eastern European countries like this is a place I would never want to live and I don't like their society like hockey seems to me to be a sport for like places that I would like like like like 100% formerly you know like

Would I be happy with Malamo right now? Probably not. But like Stockholm, nice spring day, sounds like a pretty good time. Ben. Yeah. I think the, I used to,

well, let's say allegedly, I used to have a access to a lot of European channels, TV channels. probably not sanctioned. But, you know, allegedly this happened. The games in the German League are great.

You know, I would watch games from Germany. Just the German leagues themselves are great. The Swedish leagues, they have Swedish elite leagues. Those are great. And, I mean, these are, I mean, it is. It's a white sport. I mean, it's, you've had some good black players over the years, but they're the exception that proves the rule.

You know, you've had like, you know, I mean, one, one Hispanic I can really think of, Scottie Gomez, and, you know, he was an American from Alaska, really good player. But, you know, when it comes down to it, I mean, it's a white sport. I mean, my high school team, we had, I mean, guys, my last name, another Hispanic last name, had a black dude playing on the team. I mean, it's New York City. And, you know, none of us were ghetto. You know, we were all going to a nice Catholic school and, you know, having, you know, paying tuition.

And, you know, we all spoke properly, as proper as you can speak with a New York accent. and yeah but the exception it's really the exception um it just reminded me of something hilarious um there was this player in the 70s french canadian guy raj jilbert if you spelled his name it would be rod gilbert it was pronounced raja jlbert because french canadian he said one of the funniest fucking things in an interview, I remember. And they got so mad at him even back then. They asked him, they said, how come there aren't more black hockey players?

And he said, well, because in Canada, we use black people as hockey pups. Well, I mean, the one example I have of a black hockey player that I know of, you know, he committed murder on the ice in England. So. Well, the goalie for that. great edmonton oilers team was grant furor and he was he was a he was a black guy there was um jerome againla played a played a long career um he was like half i mean he was like african

he wasn't like african america i mean it's like he was like half like african his mom was born in africa or something like that i mean when it comes down to it you're you're talking about um you're really just talking about the exception i mean you have i think less so four or five percent of the players or POC. Like hockey basically selects for like intact families with a little bit of money. Yeah. Like that between like taking kids to, you know, five o'clock ice, five o'clock in the morning practices that all the gear, you know, skates and pads and sticks and helmets and all that stuff and ice fees and that's expensive.

Right. So between all that, like it sounds like basically hockey, hockey filters for like intact families. Well, not only that. Here's a thing. Parents that are willing to get up at four or five o'clock in the morning and take you to play. Yeah, like involve parents. Yeah. I mean, you're, it's going to have to be parents who are now, in the city like we would um even if my dad didn't take us or something like that a bunch of us would get together and travel together we could ride the train you know or do something like that um but we were together you know we would you know the strength and numbers kind of thing i mean for the most part when i was going to play at last year's on a hundred and cent street in central park That's my dad driving us.

You know, and this is, you got to be there at 7, 645 in the morning, 7 o'clock to suit up and get on the ice by 7.30. So, yeah, I mean, it's, you know, your parents are not only going to have to be present, but they're going to have to be involved. And they're going to have, and they're going to have to be, I mean, they're going to have to be okay with you doing this. or even promote you doing this. So it's not like the most famous hockey parent in America. You know, Sarah Palin. Like, um, right. You know, she made lots of jokes about that, but,

but that's the sort of thing that actually, yeah, like moms who have to care about their kids like, yeah. You know, the difference would be the hockey mom and a pit bulls lipstick, right? Like, you know, that's, that's a funny line. I mean, like, that's a funny line. That's a funny lie. That's the sort of mom that actually really cares about their kids. You know, if hockey dads are like willing to throw down about their kids

not getting enough ice time or whatever, like that's a dad that cares about their kids. So there was, there was a hockey movie in the, in the 1980s, came out in 1986, called Youngblood starring Rob Lowe, Patrick Swayze, Keanu Reeves was in it. Kenner Reeves actually plays a French Canadian in it and he's using a French, Canadian accent and he's not bad at it. It turns out he plays the goalie on the team. It turns out he was a goalie. So like you see, yeah, so you see him like, I could actually play this video, but

I just wanted to play this one clip from the movie and tell me if you would hear a clip like this in a movie today. Listen to this. To the game. Getting out of this hit town. Thank God there is still a sport for middle-sized white boys. Would you hear a line? No, never.

Never. Never. And so, I mean, part of the reason I'm in this is that I was a big sports fan over 20 odd years ago. Because it's just whatever else you want to say about it. It's a field of excellence. And like, you know, it's extraordinary. Like some of the stuff that is, you know, shack, 7 foot 2, 300 pounds, can bench pressure truck, right?

Like, it's, it's extraordinary. And Steve Saylor, right, just was also a guy who's interested in sports. They would just talk about the truth about this stuff. And the fact is, is it like every other sport in the world, every other big pro sport, like selects for, you know, like maybe five people in the NBA are under six foot. Right.

And most of them are like, not just saying, foot, but like six four or six five is the small guys. They're fucking monsters. I mean, they're huge. They're huge. Like, you know, a substantial percentage of the population of the world that seven foot plus has played in the NBA, right? Like, it's just, that's the game, right?

You know, guys that are, you know, six foot five and 300 pounds. Like a lot of those guys, you know, the really, really just not tall guys, but just huge guys. Like, they're all in the NFL, right? on on the line somewhere um and you know the the NFL or the NHL is the only sport where there could be like a really great player who's 510 170 and you know he's just skilled maybe baseball but yeah the um the yeah when i was growing up so in the 70s, I think if I remember correctly, the average height in the NHL was 5 foot 10.

It's gotten a lot bigger. It's 6 foot 1 now. And the average weight is like 200 pounds. But when I was growing up, it was a lot of skinny white guys who, you know, who were 5 foot 10. And it's just one of those things where as players came in from Eastern Europe, you know, who were had a tendency to be bigger, especially a lot of the, a lot of the Czech players were bigger. And a lot of the Russian players came in who had a tendency to be stronger, someone like Vladimir Konstantinov, who was just this, he was a fucking caveman. You know, it was just, I mean, it had shoulders that you could, you know, were just so broad and flat that, you know, players just had to get bigger.

and it was um you know you still see you still see some players who they're going to be skill players are going to be finesse players who can be 5 foot 10 5 foot 5 foot 11 but um yeah most of the most of the guys now are going to be in the 6 foot 1 range and i mean they have goalies that are like 6 foot 5 6 foot 6 when i was a kid like goalies were like 5 foot 8 5 foot 9 you know so um You know, it's, you know, it's changed as it become more international. But then, you know, remember, when it's international, it's just becoming more Slav and more Eastern European. It's not like, you know, people, it's not like they're coming in from, they're importing

seven footers from Africa. Manute bowl is coming. Yeah. No, that's not that ain't happen. It's going to be, you know, Ivan Ivanov from Kempelensk, you know, like. Right. Like, and a lot of those Russian players were finesse players too. Like a Pavel Beret, I met Pavel Beret and he was my height. But I mean, he was so fucking fast and so graceful. And he could do things with the puck that were, I mean, it were like, it was like beautiful. Like he was like on dancing. He was playing ballet. You know, it was ballet out there on skit, you know, on skates. But yeah. I remember watching a documentary about like the, the, the. Russian feeder program or something. And I know that the broads,

years ago is listening to reading something about the 80 Olympics. And basically like the Broad Street bullies, right? The Philadelphia, that's Philadelphia, right? Yep, Philly. They just absolutely, like, destroyed the Russian team because they were all like finesse. But I remember watching this documentary about the Russian farm system,

whatever their equivalent of like the junior hockey is and they actually had the guys like doing like ballet in the summers right like it's like you know like yeah I've seen that documentary yeah uh huh and

I I understand why people on our side of defense like signal against sports ball and I absolutely understand like the whole obsession with sports is a poison in a culture especially the way we do sports in North America particularly in the United States

like I get it but also like you have to have a healthy masculinity outlet and like you know when some guy does something wrong on on the field then he gets knocked into next week like there's some justice in that that I think that like those lines in life there's there's some kind of lessons you can only learn playing sports there's a lot of life lessons that can only be learned playing sports and I think that that that's a good thing that like people learn those. Well, team sports is also important too because it, you know, teaches, it gets you out of that individuality mindset.

You know, playing. Absolutely. Yeah, tennis is. And my brother was a, my brother was a phenomenal tennis player. He had offers for full scholarships to, I mean, 20, 25, 30 colleges. But yeah, that's an individual sport. And team sport is something, especially hockey. I mean, you really are, it's very hard to be one guy out on the ice.

You know, you're relying on your guys out there. So, you know, it helps to build that collective kind of spirit. And, you know, you're not that whole thing of, oh, we're just, we're all individuals and collectivism is communism and everything like that. Okay, well, you know, fuck you. But I liked playing team sports. I liked being part of a team, even though I didn't really have a lot in common

with a lot of the guys on the team. But when it came to being on the ice and in the locker room, we got along. But, you know, I went to high school with these guys and I ran with a different crowd, like the jock crowd, even though I played. But, you know, still everyone, you know, had a click and the playing a team sport like that especially um when you're playing football

you can get totally like you have linemen on opposite sides of the line who may never you know they're not doing anything together you know in tandem but hockey when you only have five guys out there and you're condensed into this you know right like like hot like football is a very bimodal sport, right, at certain levels. Like, if two-way balls aren't really a thing anymore. But, like, you know, the offense and the

defense are almost totally separate teams with totally separate ways of doing things and totally separate. There's two separate games. Playing defense and football and playing offensive football are completely different. Versus hockey, you know, it's six guys. We're out there all the time together.

They're all doing the same thing, you know, trying to win a game. even the goalie even if he's slightly different I mean the goalie is the goalie is relying upon his defenseman

as much as as much as a forward you know a winger is relying upon his center to get him the puck you know the the goalie is really the goalie is

the general out there you you will see a lot of goalies when their team is on the other end of the ice when they're on the offensive end, there are goalies that will skate up almost to their blue line. And you'll hear them barking. Like they'll be barking out borders like, hey, you know, watch this.

You know, so goalies can actually become generals out there. And when you're backing your own defensive end and the other team is like the offense. In your goalie, you have to listen to your goalie. So you mentioned like the center being. the quarterback. Like in basketball, your smartest players tend to be point guards in baseball, it's catchers.

Our goalie is the guy, like, are more, like, a lot of former coaches in baseball will be like former catchers, right? Because they were, there were the guys who were the most, like, saw the whole field or whatever, and tended to be the more intellectual players. A lot of point guards end up being

coaches in the NBA. A lot of quarterbacks end up as coaches in in football. Is it like goalies and centers that end up being like if someone was to retire or from playing and then become a coach? Is it like, would that be like goalies and centers or? You have goal.

You have goalies and centers. A lot of times if you go through, I'd have to go through like the head coaches. Like when I was growing up, most of the head coaches of the teams had never played in the NHL. It was, they were coaches

that strangely enough came up through those junior systems as well you know they started being they played in the juniors they weren't good enough to play in the NHL

so that they they became coaches and you know trainers and stuff like that and then they just worked their way up I know why I know Patrick Waugh

was a head coach for a while but God who who could understand him his french accent jeez um it the kebicua accent is like redneck french it's very difficult it's so some i i lived you know where i lived in in fall lauderdale there were a lot of quebequa and yeah sometimes it'd be like what that's awesome what you know guys who lived in the same building i did down there what are you talking about can't hear slow down but um yeah i'm

I'm trying to think now, like players and where they played. Yeah, centers. Yeah. Brindamore. Yeah. Yeah. Centers. Goleys.

I'm trying to think a defenseman. To me, defensemen would be, would be a good head coach. Huh. Is it a defenseman, the goalie can see the whole ice. Everything is happening on the ice, but so is the defenseman. Oh, that's got me thinking now. I'm sure someone's screaming at me going, Pete, come on, you know this. I just don't, like I said, I really liked watching, still watched, I didn't like it,

but I still watched a lot of sports up until the time COVID hit. When COVID hit, I just, I was so pissed off at all these leagues for shutting down and everything. Oh, yeah, I understand completely. I was like, fuck you guys. You know, it's like, why would you do this? Well, you're giving up billions. I mean, you know, I, and I think I, yeah, I wrote something at the time that these guys had to have been getting reimbursed. They had to have been promised to get that money back and everything.

I'm sure they did. It was worse than, you know, there was, there was a strike in the 2000s to shut the league down. And like a bunch of people went and played a game. Europe and a lot of people went played in Russia in the Russian leagues everything and I understood that you know it's like yeah you're going to have people who are going to strike you know they're going to strike and everything like that and then be like for free agency or for you know more mostly for you know we want to have more control over who I can sign with so um you don't have to wait to be in the league so long to become an unrestricted free age and things like that.

But yeah, COVID was just the, I just, I couldn't get past that. COVID just changed pretty much everything for me. It was like, that's, I just dove head first into the political and had to figure out what the hell and why, why all this was happening. Well, I, you know, that's why we're friends, actually, is that, is that a friend of field house actually. was like, what happened to Pete? I was like, well, 2020 cured him with the delusion that people want to be free. Like, I remember Pete from Libertarian days.

Like, yeah, actually, well, he was. And then everyone was like, oh, I don't want freedom. Freedom sounds icky and hard. Like, well, yeah, that's kind of the point. But, you know, it's having played in that team sport, right? knowing your role and doing like not everyone's got to be the rock star not everyone's got to be you know our mutual friend uh mike ferris right like everyone thinks they're in a superhero movie now yeah and everyone you know like has everyone has main character syndrome it's like that

that's not how life works actually that's that's a very unhealthy way to let go about living life a lot of people have main character syndrome man you know um i don't know if you heard the episode. I haven't released it yet with Darrell and Fieldhouse. I was listening to it right before we got on, Ashley. Yeah, Darrell made a really good point. He said, you know, people, everybody wants to be a general. No one wants to be able, no one wants to be able to take, no one wants to take orders. Well, yeah, well, and that's, I learned from doing certain team sports that like I'm not good at certain things. Like, I'm just not. But what I am good at, I'm good at. And it's all like I'm not going to try and do like you do such an amazing job

with this show of finding all these different guests and dealing with all these different things, headaches that I just would be bad at. And being friendly and like respectful with people that I just want to be like, you're a fucking moron and like, and and, you know, like hosting a show and and being like a subject matter expert at two different things. And I think that, you know, playing a team sport where it's like hey man your job is this we need you to do this one thing consistently and that's you know that's your day job that's you know that's your family life right dads can't be moms moms can't be dads um and and you know I look at the kind of society's hockey produces or hockey comes from and I'm like this is a good sport

and I want to learn more. So, yeah, thanks for the education, Pete. Yeah, man, I'm glad I could help. I recommend if you want to get a good, like an entertaining hockey movie. Okay, people are going to tell you Slapshot. Slapshot is actually a really good hockey movie, but it concentrates too much on fighting. It is more of a, you know, it's an enjoyable movie. I mean, Paul Newman.

Paul Newman actually learned how to forget. play hockey to be in that movie and paul newman was like almost 50 at the time so you got to give it to paul newman um it's a good movie but the the 1986 movie young blood is such a good movie to like get into hockey with because um it's like i was watching a video of somebody reviewing it earlier today and what was his uh he had a really good line about it he said um where is it he said young blood actually got hockey right so there are some things in it where if you're a hockey fan you'll be like uh uh uh and he he he points it out but when it comes down to it like it's it's a a good introduction hockey movie and you know i played that one little clip from it and you know it

really is it just shows you that um if this is a sport that was you know dominated by canadian white boys from small towns even though they're in it takes place in hamilton ontario that they keep calling a small town but as the guy points out in the video hamilton ontario is like half million people um i would hate to see what hamilton ontario is right now um it's not good i don't know it's like when i found out what happens at brampton Yeah, similar to thing. And I only know because the late great Kathy Shadle was was from Hamilton and she complained about it. But yeah, if anybody like wants to watch a movie about hockey, find Youngblood, it's, you'll, it's entertaining.

It has everything. It has it has movie tropes where, you know, the main character, you know, is attracted to the coach's daughter. You know, I mean, you know, just that those kind of. tropes and everything, but it's a fun movie and, uh, there are some lines, you know, there, there are some themes in it and some lines in it that you're, um, you're going to laugh your ass off and you'll be like, uh, never get away with saying that today. You know, slap shot to another one of those movies. It's like that too.

It's just like, oh, this movie is really white. It's like, yeah, because it's hockey. Right. Well, and that's, that's, that's, that's one of the things about hockey that's attractive is is that it's still European culturally. Yeah, very much so. That's something that ought to be preserved. Yeah, man.

All right, well, let's get out of here. I appreciate this and nice to talk about and share a little bit of videos and everything, and Bobby Orr and Schitts relive some, you know, I didn't do much research for this, but, you know, looking up some of the videos and watching some of the things, I was like, oh, man.

God, I used to love this so much. It's like, I got to get back into it. I got to start watching again. Although, you know, the National Predators did put out their, did you see that logo they put out the other day? No. Rainbow logo. I was going to say, was it Jeffrey Epstein?

Well, yeah. It was like a, like they did their logo with like a rainbow. rainbow colors it's like god come on they tried to you know they didn't ben jphera moved to nashville couldn't you just do like you know silhouette of bang well yeah he moved he moved his business to nashville and then he was like yeah i'm not staying here and went to miami oh that makes all the sense or something like that yeah where where they all are um but yeah so he gets to say oh my business is in nashville but um yeah where do you live then Let's not.

Oh, go ahead. Florida. Let's not talk about politics. But, well, I promote your show. Well, I have the fundamental principle. It's on Telegram. Pete's been kind enough to be on it. And then, of course, I'm fortunate enough to be a regular guest on the thoughtgrams

etiquette with Pete and our mutual friends, Charles Spadiel and Jose Nino. I was just on Jose show. That should come out in the next couple days. And I did an episode of the Third Rail last week or something. something like that. So I'm just kind of, you know, here, there and everywhere, usually talking about, you know, doom and portents and awful things, which, you know, there's been no shortage of lately. So I appreciate Pete, give me the chance to talk about something I genuinely could learn something about. Yeah. So, no, man, I appreciate it. Thank you.

You're welcome.