The Philip DeFranco Show - PDS 4.08 The Tinder/Hinge Rape Problem is Worse Than You Think, RFK Jr. Food Poisoning Situation is Crazy, &

Episode Date: April 8, 2025

Go to https://hensonshaving.com/DEFRANCO and enter DEFRANCO at checkout to get a free pack of 100 blades with your purchase. (Note: you must add both the blades and the razor for the discount to apply.) Go to https://saily.com/Phil and use the code “phil” to get an exclusive 15% discount on Saily data plans! https://BeautifulBastard.com Get 15% off the best tees and hoodies out there with CODE: "PDS15" on top of select 50% OFF sale items. Subscribe for New shows every Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, & Thursday @ 6pm ET/3pm PST & watch more here:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_w6k9WqrVEU&list=PLHcsGizlfLMWpSg7i0b9wnUyEZWI-25N3&index=1   – ✩ TODAY’S STORIES ✩ – 00:00 - Report Finds Tinder & Hinge are Knowingly Allowing Predators to Use Their Apps 12:24 - Sponsored by Henson Shaving 13:34 - The Human Egg Trade Black Market Exposed 24:23 - Sponsored by Saily 25:30 - How RFK Jr., Elon Musk, & DOGE are Making the Food System Less Safe ——————————   Produced by: Cory Ray Edited by: James Girardier, Maxwell Enright, Julie Goldberg, Christian Meeks, Matthew Henry Art Department: William Crespo Writing/Research: Philip DeFranco, Brian Espinoza, Lili Stenn, Maddie Crichton, Chris Tolve, Star Pralle, Jared Paolino Associate Producer on Match Group: Jared Paolino Associate Producer on IVF: Jared Paolino Associate Producer on Food Safety: Lili Stenn ———————————— For more Philip DeFranco: Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-philip-defranco-show/id1278424954 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6ESemquRbz6f8XLVywdZ2V Twitter:   https://x.com/PhillyD Instagram:   https://instagram.com/PhillyDeFranco Newsletter: https://www.dailydip.co TikTok:   https://www.tiktok.com/@philipdefranco?lang=en ———————————— #DeFranco #ElonMusk #RFKJr ———————————— Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Service fees, exclusions, and terms apply. Instacart, groceries that over-deliver. Dating apps like Tinder aren't just trying to hold you hostage on their platforms. We're now seeing reports that they are openly allowing people flagged for sex crimes to stay on their apps, including one doctor who was convicted of 35 counts of drugging and assaulting women, with his victims saying that all of this could have been prevented if he had been banned from the apps. IVF has become a global multi-billion dollar industry, and because of that, many are now preying on poor women and even girls on the black market

to further the so-called human egg trade. And experts say that RFK Jr. is potentially setting the country up for a massive food disaster that could poison and kill who knows how many people because of his massive FDA cuts. We're deep diving into all of that on today's brand new Philip DeFranco show.

You daily dive into the news, how it's being covered, and how people are reacting to it, starting with this. We need to talk about dating apps, assault, and what one company knows about abusive users on its platforms, but won't tell you. Because on some of the most popular dating apps in the world, reported rapists are still swiping right. And that is according to an 18 month investigation produced in partnership with the Pulitzer Center's AI Accountability Network, and the markup and co-published with The Guardian and The 19th. Right, and with all that, the focus of this investigation

is a company by the name of Match Group. And the thing is, if you haven't heard of Match Group specifically, you've almost definitely heard of at least one of the more than a dozen dating apps owned by the company. We're talking Tinder, the world's most popular dating app, as well as Hinge and OkCupid. And all in all, this multi-billion dollar company

operates in almost every country on earth, controlling roughly half the world's online dating market and facilitating meetups for potentially millions of people every month. And that is, we live in a time where people are now more likely to meet through online dating than through personal contacts and connections. So with that, of course, it's more of an open question as to whether Match Group can really help you find a soulmate. I mean, there's even a class action lawsuit alleging that the company goes out of its way to make sure you don't actually do that, claiming that its apps make use of addictive game-like features to keep users hooked. But in any case, right, whether or not they make it easier to find a partner, according to this investigation,

they definitely make it easier for predators and creeps to find their next target. And so with that said, we got to go back to the night of January 25th, 2023, because that is when a young woman who I'm not going to name here, met a man by the name of Steven Matthews at a sports bar in Denver. She had connected with Matthews, a then 34 year old cardiologist on Hinge. And the date, I mean, it went well enough that this young woman accepted an invitation

to go back to his place. And so they get there, she goes to the bathroom, and when she comes back out, he hands her a drink. But then after taking a sip, she says she soon began to lose control. And according to later testimony, her memory blurred and she fell to the ground with Matthews then filming her,

putting her in a headlock and kissing her forehead. But then, thankfully, she managed to free herself, grab most of her things and leave, despite Matthews trying to force her back inside. With this young woman eventually waking up at her home, soaking wet on her bathroom floor without even having taken the key out of her door. And finally, after throwing up for hours,

she somehow had the presence of mind to report the assault to Hinge. But what she didn't know and what Match Group did, another woman had reported Matthews for rape just a few days before. And in fact, the first time the company had been alerted to his behavior, it was almost three years earlier in September of 2020

when yet another woman had reported him for sexual violence. And get this, a little more than a week after his assault on the woman from the sports bar, another woman reported him for rape. This time though, the survivor also went to the police with then at least 15 women eventually reporting Matthews had raped or drugged them. And nearly every one of them said that they had met the man on dating apps run by Match Group. And so ultimately his arrest was the only thing that actually got him off the apps, despite the information the company had on him. In fact,

at one point after Matthews had already been reported for rape at least once, Hinge elevated his account as a so-called standout profile to be seen by more people. What's more, Match Group reportedly didn't make it easy for prosecutors to build their case. A search warrant was reportedly issued for Hinge in July of 2023, but two months later, the company still hadn't complied with the judge in the case

asking at a hearing whether he needed to start dragging people in to get stuff done. But even still, it reportedly wasn't until February of 2024 that the DA's office said they had gotten the documents they needed. But with that, in the end, right, the evidence, it was overwhelming. And a few months later, in August of last year,

a jury convicted Matthews of 35 counts related to drugging two women, assaulting a woman, and drugging and sexually assaulting eight other women. But the judge soon after sentencing him to 158 years to life in prison. Though very notably with all of this, of course, you had attorneys representing the survivors claiming at least some of Matthew's crimes could have been prevented. With Laura Wolf, for example, the attorney

representing the woman whose police report led to the arrest saying, it is shocking that for years after receiving reports of sexual assault, Hinge continued to allow Stephen Matthews access to its platforms and actively facilitated his abuse. Countless women have suffered and will continue to suffer. Hinge and other dating platforms have taken no steps to ensure the safety of the product they are selling, matching unsuspecting women to known predators without pause or concern.

You know, with all that, I will say, this is obviously not a brand new issue. But I mean, it is incredibly and horrifically easy to find literally dozens of cases of women accusing men they met on dating apps of rape. And then going back to 2016, we started to get some idea of how common this was getting. Right in the UK, for example,

the country's national crime agency said that dating-related rape had risen by more than 450% in six years. And then in the US in 2018, there was a particularly shocking case in which police identified a man they said used Tinder to find, rape, and kill victims in New York, Connecticut, and California.

And with all of that, over time, of course, more attention shifted to what role or responsibility the dating apps themselves had to improve user safety. With the scene in 2019, for example, ProPublica revealing that Tinder, OKCupid, and Plenty of Fish let known registered sex offenders use its app. With the outlet also reporting in 2021

that moderators for certain apps were ill paid, poorly trained, and overworked. Where sometimes they were left with just a few minutes to resolve customers' claims of sexual assault. And then in 2022, you have things like a Utah-based research team also shedding light on this issue with an analysis of hundreds of sexual assaults across the state,

with them finding that attacks facilitated by dating apps happened faster and were more violent than when the perpetrator met the victim through other means, with them also noting that survivors of dating app-facilitated sexual assault were more likely to self-report mental illness and or the use of psychotropic medications,

with the researchers concluding, quote, violent sexual perpetrators use dating apps as hunting grounds for vulnerable individuals. And so with all that, Match Group publicly promised to improve safety and increase transparency since at least around 2020. Right in 2021, for example, saying in its inaugural impact report that it was working on standardizing its safety incident data tracking and reporting, saying they have a goal of creating its first transparency report in the US in 2022 to, quote, ensure that as we grow, we continue to prioritize the safety, security,

and wellbeing of our users. However, as I'm recording this in 2025, the report has not been released. And that's just one of the ways that the company may be letting its users down. Now with all this, of course, I will say, the unfortunate truth is that whether it's dating in the real world or online, it is never risk-free, especially if you're a woman.

But Match Group, right, this investigation found has been doing far less to mitigate these risks than it could be. But to use words from this investigation, quote, "'While Match Group has long possessed the tools, "'financial resources, and investigative procedures "'necessary to make it harder for bad actors to resurface,' "'internal documents show the company resisted efforts

"'to spread them across its apps, in part, "'because safety protocols could stall corporate growth. And with that, again, looking back, let's talk about what the company did do to try and make things better. So on September 28th, 2020, the same day Matthews was first reported to Hinge for rape,

Match Group hired its first ever head of safety and social advocacy. And over the next few years, the company stepped up its cooperation with law enforcement, introduced an optional AI-assisted photo verification system on its apps, and looked into other ways

of collaborating with companies and nonprofits to improve app safety. And an example of one of those nonprofits is called Garbo, and it started providing an online background check service to Tinder members in 2022. With that, I'll say, you know, all these approaches, they can be criticized. For those concerns about user privacy, for example,

and then with the background checks, you have experts saying that they're not always reliable since they often pull from outdated databases. Now to mention, most people who commit sexual abuse don't ever come into contact with the criminal justice system anyways. Right, less than half of sexual assaults are reported to the police

and the overwhelming majority of perpetrators never end up in jail or prison. Right, I mean like Matthews, he didn't have a criminal record and he raped multiple women before being reported to police. You know, in any case, you could say at least it was something, right, for security. But then, about a year and a half

after that partnership started, Garbo ended its relationship with the company, with a single blog post coming from the org's founder, not naming names, but saying, "'It's become clear that most online platforms "'aren't legitimately committed to trust and safety "'for their users,' saying, "'There are some great companies

"'that do take our mission to heart, "'but the sad reality is that most social networks, "'dating apps, and online online platforms care more about the bottom line than they care about you. And the investigation's other findings, which are based on internal company documents, as well as testimony from former employees, seem to back that up.

Like for example, Match Group's official safety policy says that if a user has been reported for domestic abuse, assault, or criminal activity, all accounts found to be associated with that user will be banned from its platforms. And so of course, with that, some say that means that anyone can get someone else banned unfairly by throwing around baseless allegations

without evidence. But this, as you have others saying, well, that is a small price to pay to potentially make dating apps safer, and it's a decision that Match Group is entitled to make as a private business. But in any case, whatever side of the debate you land, that is the company policy.

And what's notable with that is that according to the investigation, the company may not really be following that policy. But at the time of reporting at least, banned Tinder users, including those reported for sexual assault, could reportedly easily rejoin or sign up to another match group dating app. All without even having to change or lie

about key personal details. And to figure that out, the people behind this investigation, they simply created a series of Tinder accounts that they then reported for sexual assault. And while Tinder went on to ban those accounts, soon after, they were able to create new accounts with the exact same name, birthday,

and profile photos used on their banned accounts. And they were also able to sign up for other Match Group dating apps without changing this information. And as far as how this works on the backend, well, Match Group has reportedly known since at least 2016, which users have been reported for drugging, assaulting, or raping their dates.

And since 2019, it's even had a central database keeping track of every user reported for rape and assault across its entire suite of apps. And by 2022, this central database, which is called Sentinel, it was reportedly logging hundreds of troubling incidents every week. So it raises the question,

if they have all this information, why wasn't anything being done? Because, well, basically, let's say someone's banned for sexual assault. That will create a case in the Sentinel system with the phone number and email associated with the banned account. Also, notably, create a case in the Sentinel system with the phone number and email associated with the banned account.

Also notably, the system would log the original profile's IP addresses, photos, and birthday. But according to internal company documents, that information would not be used to ban a user if they appeared on another Match Group dating app. Also, none of Match Group's apps required users to provide photo identification. So once a person was banned,

they could just start a new account with different contact information. And then with all that, one former employee who works specifically on the OkCupid app, he says he and his team tried to remedy these issues. So for example, he says they developed a tool to automatically ban a profile that was linked to a phone number or photo or URL that had been previously banned, even if the user had made an account with a different email or IP address. And while he says that company leadership praised their work, he also says they never

tried to replicate this work at the company's other reps. In fact, he claims that he and his team face pressure to speed up investigations and train outsource labor to use complicated moderation tools. And then with all that, he left the company in 2022, claiming that most of his team also left due to a negative workplace environment. Also that same year, Match Group fired the woman

it had hired as its first head of safety and social advocacy. With then much of her team also getting laid off in the next few months as well. And then in February of 2024, the remaining critical investigators and law enforcement liaisons on the central safety team got kicked out too. We then also saw in 2024, the company getting a new CEO who reportedly put even less of an emphasis on trust and safety than the previous leadership. For example, in more than a year of quarterly investor calls, he reportedly only referenced safety efforts once. Also under his leadership, all mentions of a transparency report disappeared

from the company's annual impact report. Or with that former employee saying about this guy, he just wants to make money. He's just there to increase profits. If you're looking at a bottom line, then it's easier to have a lawsuit than it is to provide safety. I know which one he's gonna pick.

Now with all that said, there seems to be another shift back the other way with a new CEO and a little more emphasis on safety. With the issue coming up more often in general, also there's a new VP of trust and safety being hired and then some new features being tested out on the apps. Also, thanks to a new law in the EU requiring tech companies to disclose reports of non-consensual behavior,

you can now find thousands of sort of incident reports being uploaded to a European database. Notably there, I will say, there's not a whole lot of information in them. Also I'll say on the US side, there's not much movement at the national level, but some states are making an effort. Colorado notably passed a law triggered by the Matthews case

that forces dating app companies to tell the state attorney general which safety measures they're taking to protect users. But it also doesn't currently require the company to tell the state or the public how many people report being raped or assaulted after using its platform. And of course, with all this,

Match Group, they've defended its efforts to make its platform safe, with the company claiming they vigorously combat violence, saying, we take every report of misconduct seriously and vigilantly remove and block accounts that have violated our rules regarding this behavior. You know, ultimately, we're gonna have to wait to see where all this goes.

But if it's an industry, likely to be more regulated anytime soon. Also, will there at least be enough of a profit incentive for Match Group and other dating companies, which have been struggling for a few years now to keep trying to step up safety? And of course with this, I'd love to know anyone and everyone's thoughts

as well as experiences with these apps. And then I've got even more news for you in just a moment. But first, have you ever wondered why your razor feels like it's working against your skin instead of with it? Because shaving, it shouldn't be a daily war with your face. And have you ever wished it could actually be healthy for your skin?

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today, we need to talk about the dark side of IVF and specifically those cases, at least 6% of them, according to estimates in which the eggs used aren't coming from the woman trying to get pregnant, but from a third party donor. Because while this can absolutely be an amazing way to give someone the gift of having a child, I mean, the global human egg trade is also a massive money-making business, often operating in a legal gray area, if not outright outside the law. Right, and that, according to an investigation from Bloomberg Businessweek,

showing how egg donors can be exploited and have their health put at risk in the name of profit. But to really start this off, we gotta go back to how all this started way back in England in 1978. Right, because that is when Louise Joy Brown famously became the first person born after being conceived in a Petri dish using the egg and sperm

of her biological parents. With then, a few decades later, a new technology known as vitrification emerging, allowing donated eggs to be flash frozen, stored and used later with much greater success than the previous method of, you know, just sticking them in a freezer, which can actually lead to the formation of ice crystals

that damage the eggs and lower the chances of survival. And with all that, by 2012, the world's largest organizations representing fertility practitioners backed the technique and lower the chances of survival. And with all that, by 2012, the world's largest organizations representing fertility practitioners backed the technique and it was no longer experimental. And I mean, in the US alone, the number of fertility procedures using frozen donor eggs or embryos tripled to 26,700

between 2012 and 2021, according to the CDC. With most IVF treatments involving women using grown eggs and at least 6% of cases, the eggs reportedly come from so-called donors who agree to have their eggs removed often, but not always in exchange for money. In fact, every 15 seconds or so, a batch of eggs is extracted from a woman

somewhere on the planet. Globally, more than 120,000 embryos were created with donated eggs just in 2019. And that was actually almost double the number in 2011, according to the International Committee for Monitoring Assisted Reproductive Technologies. However, I will say the real number is almost certainly much higher.

I mean, one, the numbers do not include India, which is the most populated nation on earth, where there are at least 1,400 fertility clinics registered with possibly thousands more in operation. And while donated eggs are used in a small percentage of embryo transfers worldwide, more than a dozen doctors in India told Bloomberg that at their clinics, it can range from 30 to 50%.

And then two, while 120,000 is the most recent estimate. That's more than half a decade old. And we know that this is a fast growing industry. And in some of the few countries that do reliably track shipments, for example, I mean, the numbers are exploding. In Italy, imports of eggs nearly tripled over five years, reaching almost 18,000 shipments in 2021. And in Brazil, imports increased from only four in 2016 to more than two and a half thousand shipments in 2023. And so with all that, the global market for assisted reproduction is reportedly already worth around $35 billion. With this being a market of not only would-be parents and donors, but also recruiters, agents, doctors, and clinics increasingly backed by Wall Street and private equity. And also with all of that, the demand for eggs extracted from younger donors is only

expected to increase as more women wait longer to have children. But despite being so, so massive, the industry is often minimally regulated. And even when individual countries make an effort, it's such a global industry now that the cross-border egg trade, it operates with almost no government oversight. When the rules or circumstances change in one country,

donors, aspiring parents, and companies, they take their business elsewhere. You know, in Greece, for example, as police eventually discovered, there was an organization called the Mediterranean Fertility Institute, or MFI. And they recruited vulnerable women from Ukraine, they take their business elsewhere. You know, in Greece, for example, as police eventually discovered, there was an organization called the Mediterranean Fertility Institute, or MFI. And they recruited vulnerable women from Ukraine,

Romania, Moldova, Georgia, and Albania to be egg donors and surrogates. But then in August of 2023, eight MFI staff members getting arrested, including the clinic's founding doctor and its scientific director, with the authorities discovering that clinic staff had falsified medical and court records

and even aided in illegal adoptions. And this is the police also uncovered hundreds of instances where the clinic charged patients for IVF services that were never actually performed, including sham embryo transfers. Hell, they also identified at least 75 cases of egg theft, such as one woman named Maria, who reportedly froze her eggs for herself,

but later found that the clinic had taken more than they told her and they used them to create embryos for another woman. With Maria reportedly still having no idea whether a child was actually born from her eggs. Well, you know, this is an extreme case with one organization in one country. We also know it is not the only horror story to be found. I mean, just going back to India, for example, egg donors there must be at least 23 years old.

But in October of 2023, a 13-year-old girl in the city of Varanasi donated. With her reportedly having been recruited by her grandmother's neighbor, who told her she could earn as much as 15,000 rupees, which is about $180. With the woman even having her pose for a photo for a fake ID, showing her his 24, drilling her on her story that she had to tell, and had her own husband sign off as the girl's spouse. With the girl's mother later learning what happened, reported it to police, and eventually police arrested the woman who had recruited her daughter, her colleague, and another three male accomplices. But also, notably, all five have since been freed on bail.

And this, as it's become clear that this young girl is far from the only victim, right? The guy who made the fake IDs? He said that one of the women who recruited young girls initially asked him to falsify one or two cards every few days, but that quickly turned into as many as 100 a month. You know, with that, the clinic where this happened,

it was a branch of a company called Nova IVF Fertility, which is one of India's largest fertility chains. And notably, they've been backed by American financiers. Now with that, the company told Bloomberg it had cooperated with local authorities and cut ties with an egg bank whose employee was among those arrested. But they also disputed the claim

in the state's chief medical officer's report that doctors should have been able to determine the girl was underage, calling that an impossible task and adding, "'Identification of fake official documents "'is something beyond our expertise, "'and we are unfortunately impacted "'by this deceitful operation,'

and saying, in effect, we are a wronged party here." And you know, meanwhile, this girl, she reportedly dropped out of school after seventh grade after being bullied for what happened. And again, this is one country and it's an extreme example, but there is still concern about inadequate or unenforced regulation in places like even the US, for example,

where the FDA requires that donors undergo a physical exam, including tests for infectious diseases and provide their medical history. And beyond that, clinics are expected to comply with guidelines set by the American Society for Reproductive Medicine, which, you know, recommends, among other things, donors receive mental health counseling

and get their own legal review of all contracts, as well as suggesting that donors undergo only six retrievals in order to reduce the chances of complications. Right, and that is a key number to keep in mind because, as we'll talk about more, it's not always followed. With the same things like one Taiwanese woman, for example, telling Bloomberg she's completed 11 cycles in the U.S., as well as sold her eggs four times in China, where it's illegal on the black market. And then with that, describing her experience being loaded into a van with darkened windows with five other donors and then having the egg retrieval done in a well-equipped surgical suite on the black market. And then with that, describing her experience being loaded into a van with darkened windows with five other donors, and then having the egg retrieval done

in a well-equipped surgical suite on the second floor of a residential building. And then, you know, as far as why doctors recommend donors stop at six? Well, that, it has to do with the process required to get a woman's eggs ready for donation. Because you see, normally during ovulation, a woman releases one egg.

But egg donors, they take hormonal medication to induce super ovulation, usually producing a total of 13 to 25 eggs in both ovaries, sometimes as many as 30. With the saying Diane Tober, a medical anthropologist at the University of Alabama and author of Eggonomics, the global market in human eggs

and the donors who supply them telling Bloomberg, "'Some clinics try to get as many eggs as possible, especially for their egg banks by providing higher doses of medication. And notably with that, producing any more than 15 eggs, it puts women at risk of developing something called ovarian hyperstimulation syndrome or OHSS. The short term risks of which range from discomfort to,

in rare cases, death. And to get more specific, a mild case can mean abdominal pain, nausea, and diarrhea. Whereas a severe case, it can lead to blood clots, fluid filled lungs, or a twisted ovary that could cut off its own blood supply. Although I will say death from OHSS, it appears to be rare. The European Society of Human Reproduction and Embryology

says that mild OHSS affects as many as 33% of IVF patients. And this is the American Society for Reproductive Medicine says that moderate to severe OHSS occurs in one to 5% of IVF cycles. Though notably the condition still is not fully understood and it often goes unreported. And in fact, in the Australian state of Victoria, for example, which is a pretty tightly regulated market

as far as these things go, auditors reportedly found that clinics had been reporting only about a third of OHSS cases that required overnight hospitalization from 2018 to 2021. And in the US, the CDC does reportedly collect a whole bunch of data from fertility clinics, but it only publishes their rates of success, meaning live births.

On the other hand, however, it refuses to disclose how frequently IVF patients and donors at each clinic experience medical complications. With also here Bloomberg reporting that it's filed a Freedom of Information Act lawsuit seeking to force the agency to do so. So we're also gonna have to wait to see if that data ever becomes available.

But in any case, beyond all that, even less is known about the long-term risks of repeated egg donation. With us also here seeing Robert Klitzman, the head of the Masters of Bioethics program at Columbia, claiming that's no accident and adding, they are making millions of women who are making thousands.

If they did the research, they might find out there are long-term harms that may decrease the business and the amount of money they can earn. You know, with that, even in cases where there's no blatant exploitation or illegal activity, even when everything is working out, there are often concerns. Right, in Australia, for example,

donors must be someone you have an established relationship with, and they must be motivated by altruism. And so with that, there's a very real debate about if and how much donors must be someone you have an established relationship with and they must be motivated by altruism. And so with that, there's a very real debate about if and how much donors should be paid with some fearing that it opens the door to exploitation. But in any case, you know, one Australian couple, Alice and Paul, they tried relying on altruism,

but it just resulted in a miscarriage. So instead, they ended up accumulating more than $170,000 in debt to get eggs through a US agency from an Argentinian woman named Karen. And Karen, she's not someone who would say that she's being exploited. She actually says she sees donating as an opportunity to help.

And to the delight of fertility clinics, she is what's known as a super producer. Someone whose body reacts so strongly to hormones that it churns out far more than the typical 15 to 20 eggs. In Paul and Alice's case, the retrieval went incredibly well, 51 eggs. And 19 were successfully turned into embryos, but not a single one of those embryos was viable.

And so Karen also offered to donate again for free and the clinic agreed to do the entire procedure over again for free. But the agency that connected the couple with Karen, a company called Growing Generations, they reportedly would not allow it, with them declining to waive their fee, but offering a 20% discount.

And so eventually the couple welcomed a healthy baby boy with Karen breaking down in tears when she heard the news saying, that for me was a sign. It was telling me what you are doing is not bad. It allowed for this baby to be born. And so after that, she made her sixth in what should have been her final donation,

according to health guidelines, with a whopping 58 eggs getting taken out and shipped to the US. With her also joining others to found her own recruiting firm that she said is focused on donor wellbeing. But reportedly not long after that, someone from the Growing Generations Agency

contacted her again and asked if she could consider donating once again. And this notably as she had not only completed six donations already, she was almost 31 years old and the agency's own internal age limit was 29. And that's without mentioning her history of hyper egg production and past experience with OHSS that put her at greater risk for another bout.

But then the person who contacted her initially denying any involvement, but then was presented with evidence suggesting otherwise. With them finally acknowledging the agency's role in the donation while noting she'd left the agency by the time of Karen's retrieval and claiming she hadn't remembered the initial conversations. And then adding that while industry guidelines

typically recommend limiting donors to six cycles, it is common for exceptions to be made, such as in the case of exceptionally healthy donors. And so at the end of the day, Karen happily donated. She seems fine. And Alice and Paul and other couples were able to have a kid because of her. But again, there is still a question about this agency's practices and whether or not there are other cases where things didn't work out so well. You know, with all of that said on this deep dive, I now got to pass the question off to you. We will say there are a few like, what are your thoughts on this issue in general? That's for everyone.

Also, what do you think should be done so we get the good parts of this industry without the bad? And then finally, if you or someone you know has experience in this world, of course, I'd always love to hear your stories. And then I've got more news you need to know about in just a moment, but you know, traveling abroad, it's amazing, no doubt.

But you know, getting hit with crazy international data charges, it's not cool. You know that text that you get when you land, your cell company offering you an international data plan? They're expensive at $10 per day and often limited to two gigs per day before pushing you to 3G or even 2G. And I don't know about you,

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off your first plan. Say goodbye to travel headaches and don't forget, code Phil gets you 15% off. But then next up today, we need to talk about how RFK Jr., Elon Musk, and the Trump administration at large are all jeopardizing food safety in the United States and increasing the risk of Americans getting sick or poisoned by foodborne illnesses.

Because ensuring the safety of the food system, it's one of the most impactful things the federal government does. It's something that it's relevant to literally all Americans, regardless of where they live or what their politics are. Now, of course, like any system, this one is not perfect. According to CDC estimates, foodborne illnesses cause over 3,000 deaths and 127,800 hospitalizations each year. You may remember there have been some

very high profile incidents in recent years. Like I mean, the Boar's Head Listeria outbreak last summer, the worst in more than a decade, which resulted in 10 deaths, 60 hospitalizations and 7 million pounds of meat getting recalled. Then there were the lead-laden applesauce pouches that poisoned at least 60 kids. And then, of course, there was the whole Abbott baby formula disaster where several products were recalled and a whole plant was shut down

due to the spread of a bacterial infection. In fact, data shows that recalls have actually been increasing in recent years. According to the FDA, which groups food and cosmetics together in data, 1,908 of those products were recalled in the last fiscal year that ended in September. That's the highest level since 2019 before the number of recalls fell during the height of COVID.

But very notably, experts say that the rise in recalls, it doesn't mean that the food safety system is becoming more dangerous. It's actually the opposite. The system, it's working better, right? There aren't necessarily more outbreaks now than there were before, but the technology and tools used for catching

and tracking outbreaks have improved, allowing officials to identify and manage outbreaks that may have been happening all along. You know, without the food safety system, all of those situations would have been a lot worse. I mean, we could see a lot more outbreaks, hospitalizations, and deaths in general. During each outbreak, federal, state, and local health officials across multiple agencies, they conduct a labor-intensive process to trace the spread from each sick person to a given product, issue recalls, and ensure the products are pulled from shelves.

Now we're seeing experts say that the system is in peril thanks to ongoing doge cuts and policy changes by Health Secretary RFK Jr., who oversees agencies like the CDC and FDA. And so now, many in the food safety field, they're worried that when taken all together, these actions could result in more unsafe foods reaching the market, more outbreaks, and a government that is less able to respond quickly and effectively. With that, including Darren Detweiler, a food safety

consultant and professor who lost his young son in an E. coli outbreak, explaining, it's as if someone without enough information has said, what's a good way to save money on our automobiles? Let's just take out the seatbelts and airbags because do we really need them? And he says, that's exactly what we're seeing in various different actions taken by the Trump administration, Musk, and Doge. For example, numerous essential food safety workers, they've been swept up in Musk's purge of federal workers. But according to reports, 5,200 probationary workers

were fired across Kennedy's Department of Health and Human Services, including FDA staffers working on the safety of food additives. And those cuts were so dire at the time, you even had the FDA's Deputy Commissioner for Foods, Jim Jones, resigning from his post. With him saying in his resignation letter that the indiscriminate firing of nearly 90 staffers in his division made it fruitless for him to continue. And adding that he had been looking forward to working on Kennedy's goals of making America healthy, but the Trump administration's disdain for the very people

who would do that work gave him no choice but to leave. With him then going on to explicitly take aim at RFK Jr. saying, past remarks he's made criticizing the FDA are false and undermine the agency as a whole. And all of this, as many have noted, those layoffs aren't expected to significantly reduce government spending. At almost half of the FDA's $6.9 billion budget,

it comes from fees paid by companies the agency regulates. But also those related layoffs, they don't just impact the health department, the agriculture department, which also oversees food safety. they've reportedly laid off key workers like food safety inspectors. Now, notably here, it's since been reported that the FDA moved to rehire essential employees who were laid off, including ones working on food safety. And similarly, the USDA also said it was trying to reverse the firings of several officials working

on bird flu that the agency had accidentally fired. And even beyond all that, a federal judge has also since ordered the Trump administration to reinstate thousands of probationary workers, ruling that their termination was illegal. But since that ruling, RFK Jr. announced that he would be laying off 10,000 HHS workers as part of a massive overhaul. Some of the biggest cuts were made to the FDA staff

with Kennedy saying that he'll slash 3,500 workers, nearly 20% of the agency's workforce. And you have experts saying that those purges will certainly impact people working in food safety with the FDA commissioner under Biden saying, the FDA as we know it is finished with most of the leaders with institutional knowledge and a deep understanding of product development and safety

no longer employed. Now of course, there is still a question of whether this move will pass legal muster. I mean, things move so fast, there's always a chance that the second this show goes up, the whole effort will be blocked or reversed. Still, you have experts saying these staffing disruptions, they've jeopardized the food safety system, especially given the fact that many people won't return to their old jobs

after everything that's happened. Especially as it comes at a time when the FDA was already dealing with Biden-era budget cuts and understaffing due to competition from private sector jobs that can offer higher salaries. But also beyond that, the firings haven't been the only cost-cutting disruptions. Government credit cards regularly utilized by FDA scientists to buy and test food were also frozen under an executive order that Trump signed backing the efforts of Doge. A move that slowed or stopped the testing

of grocery store products for hazardous bacteria and monitoring packaging for forever chemicals. And the stakes there are incredibly high with one expert even explaining, "'Even hours can matter in an outbreak. "'Any delay is unacceptable when you're dealing "'with a product that can kill someone. And then to make matters even worse,

in early March, the administration eliminated two expert committees that advise the federal government on key food safety matters. The National Advisory Committee on Microbiological Criteria for Foods and the National Advisory Committee on Meat and Poultry Inspection. This also coming as part of Trump's executive order

to reduce government bureaucracy. But experts have said that both of these panels were incredibly important and barely cost the government anything. Saying experts have said that both of these panels were incredibly important and barely cost the government anything. Their combined budget was around $300,000 a year and members weren't even paid salaries. You know, with that, many officials have raised alarm bells

about the disbanding of the Microbial Committee in particular. We're seeing experts saying it upends progress that the panel made on studying how to more accurately identify babies who are at risk for being infected with a deadly bacteria that contributed to the closure of the Abbott Baby Formula Plan. And that's in addition to ruining two years of work

using existing technology to limit outbreaks, which is a move that committee members say will end up costing the federal government way more than it'll save by getting rid of these panels. What's more, many have also said that the sweeping cuts to food safety programs, it raises questions about the government's ability to implement RFK Jr.'s food safety initiatives. The health secretary has taken a very big interest in food as part of his Make America Healthy Again plan, with RFK Jr. specifically targeting chemical additives in food like artificial dyes.

But with that, you had a former senior advisor to the FDA commissioner on nutrition and food safety explaining, in my experience, the way you achieve these things costs money and require regulation. But they've begun by undoing a lot of the groundwork that was put in place. And this is, others have also said

that RFK Jr. has further jeopardized food safety by repeatedly undermining the effectiveness of the FDA and openly discussing policies that experts say would actively make outbreaks worse. Like for example, Kennedy has been a loud supporter of raw and pasteurized milk, which experts say can expose people to any number of dangerous foodborne bacteria.

He then also recently suggested on Fox News that instead of culling flocks of farm poultry that get bird flu, farmers should just let the disease rip through their flocks unchecked. The question is, should you cull those flocks? Most of our scientists are against the culling operation. They think that we should be testing therapeutics

on those flocks. They should isolate them. You should let the disease go through them and identify the birds that survive, which are the birds that probably have a genetic inclination for immunity. And those should be the birds that we breed like the wild population. Now, notably here, Kennedy doesn't have a say in agricultural policies, though Trump's agriculture secretary has also said that there are farmers who would be willing to try this idea as sort of a pilot program. But this, as experts widely agree, that it would be an absolutely horrible idea.

Right, in addition to causing unimaginable poultry death tolls that would further increase egg shortages and grocery prices, Kennedy's plan just simply wouldn't work. The bird flu is incredibly deadly for poultry and very fast acting. I mean, almost all farm birds that get infected die within a matter of days. So that means, one, these birds aren't developing antibodies that could help them survive reinfection. They're just dying. And two, given how rapid the deaths are, there's really not anything scientists could study

to uncover future treatments or resistance. With one expert even explaining that resistance in chickens and turkeys is not a thing. And this is allowing the virus to just proliferate unchecked. It would increase the risk of mutations and spread to other animals like cows, which have already been impacted as well as humans. With more bird flu among farm animals, also then meaning a higher risk of disease transmission from uncooked or undercooked poultry, eggs, and beef,

as well as unpasteurized dairy products. I mean, we've already seen bird flu-related recalls on raw milk products, which again, RFK has repeatedly touted. So yeah, this is an area that is increasingly concerning and just kind of fucking scary because there's also seemingly not much we can actually do about it besides continuing to monitor the situation. So, you know, stay in the know, try to be safe out there. And

of course, in the meantime, I'd love to know your thoughts on this. But that, my friends, is where your deep dive into the news is going to end today. I hope you're liking, actually, it likes too strong of a word for news. I hope you're appreciating deep dive week so far. And of course, remember, I've got more for you because I got a brand new show every Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday at 6 p.m. Eastern, 3 p.m. Pacific. Thank you for watching. I love your faces, and I'll see you right back here tomorrow.