The Pomp Podcast - 302: Spencer Dinwiddie of the Brooklyn Nets

Episode Date: May 26, 2020

Spencer Dinwiddie is a professional basketball player on the NBA's Brooklyn Nets. He is also one of the most forward thinking business minds in the league, which led him to create the first tokenization of a professional athlete's revenue in the United States. In this conversation, we discuss who the best NBA scorer, defender, and shit talker is, along with a surprise choice for the Greatest Of All-Time. We also discuss the latest on Spencer's tokenized bond and what the goal of his recent GoFundMe campaign was.  ===============================  BlockFi allows you to keep your crypto, put it up as collateral, and receive a USD loan funded directly to your bank account. They do loans ranging from $2,000 to $10,000,000, and they're perfect for helping you reach your financial goals of all sizes. Visit BlockFi.com/Pomp to learn more about putting your crypto to work without having to sell it. www.blockfi.com/pomp  ===============================  Pomp writes a daily letter to over 50,000 investors about business, technology, and finance. He breaks down complex topics into easy to understand language, while sharing opinions on various aspects of each industry. You can subscribe at www.pompletter.com

This is Anthony Pompliano. Most of you know me as Pomp. You're listening to the Pomp Podcast. Simply the best podcast out there. Let's kick this thing off. Spencer Dinwiddie is a professional basketball player on the NBA's Brooklyn Nets. He is also one of the most forward-thinking business minds in the league, which led him to create the first tokenization of a professional athlete's revenue in the United States. In this conversation, we discuss who the best NBA scorer, defender, and shit-talker is, along with a surprise choice for the greatest of all time. We also discuss the latest on Spencer's tokenized bond and what the goal of his recent GoFundMe campaign was. I always enjoy talking to Spencer, and I think you guys will love this episode.

Before we get into the episode, though, I want to quickly talk about our sponsors. The first is BlockFi. They've got three products. You can buy and sell cryptocurrency. You can deposit crypto and take out a U.S. dollar loan, or you can deposit crypto and stable coins and earn up to 8.6% interest on your deposit in their interest-bearing accounts. I'm a huge fan of the company. I'm an investor and a user, and I'm most looking forward to later this year when they launch their Bitcoin Rewards credit card. Overall, BlockFi is at the cutting edge of a lot of stuff in Bitcoin and crypto, so go check them out at BlockFi.com slash Pomp. Again, BlockFi.com slash Pomp.

The interest-bearing account is a no-brainer all by itself. BlockFi.com slash Pomp. And don't forget that I write a daily letter to over 50,000 investors about business technology and finance. I break down complex topics into easy-to-understand language while sharing opinions on various aspects of each industry. You can subscribe at Pompletter.com. Again, pompletter.com, or just go in the description and you can click on the link there. All right, let's get into this episode with Spencer. I hope you guys enjoy this one.

Anthony Pompliano is a partner at Morgan Creek Digital. All opinions expressed by Pomp or his guests on this podcast are solely their opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Morgan Creek Digital or Morgan Creek Capital Management. You should not treat any opinion expressed by Pomp as a specific inducement to make a particular investment or follow a particular strategy, but only as an expression of his opinion. This podcast is for informational purposes only. All right, guys. Bang, bang.

Spencer's back for round two. Thanks for doing this, man. Thank you for having me. Absolutely. To start this off, last time we did the rapid fire at the end. Let's start off in the beginning this time. Who's the best scorer in the NBA? Best scorer in the NBA?

Kevin Durant. easy best defender in the nba best defender guard or big because that changes things both both um i'm gonna give bam the best big defender very versatile uh homer picks uh i also like him as a person and then i'll say best guard defender drew holiday most underrated three-point shooter in the NBA? Actually, I'm going to choose Kyrie Irving. Ooh, okay. Yeah, he's actually a

really, really, really great three-point shooter and I think people don't necessarily lock in on how good of a three-point shooter he is. Hardest worker in the NBA? Oh, Spencer Denwood. Yes, sir. Best shit-talker

in the NBA? Best shit-talker? oh that's tough um i mean i think i think russ is always saying funny stuff especially in the media like his quote about patrick beverly was actually hilarious all time all time comment uh best business mind in the nba best business mind um in terms of what they've actually accomplished i go with lebron you know with the school and everything he's done so for sure all right uh best rapper of all-time boy all-time or are we talking about nba rapper let's go nba rapper first and then all-time oh nba rapper i'm going dame lillard sorry all time i think uh body of work longevity

you go with jay-z all right that's a solid pick uh greatest like biggie i like biggie better though but i would say you have to go with jay-z just all-time longevity on that okay greatest basketball player of all time oh Kareem Abdul-Jabbar okay why what's the logic so I the the goat debate it's always like I have to ask like what do you define goat as so for me I say like the most dominant in terms of like high school college pro like a complete career of just excellence and if you look at it like that kareem is not even close he like never lost in high school i think it was 85 and 2 in college he won the championship all three years he played in college you know then he goes to the nba he's the highest score of all time he's like i think in the top 10 or so in

rebounds like you know he's got five rings like yada yada yada the list goes on and on um you know a lot of people measure that as like who had the highest peak in which case i would say michael jordan for sure the six titles you know not losing in the championship yada yada all that stuff like I agree but just spanning a complete career like to go from you know high school to college like eight years and you only lose two games and then you know you got five titles in the league and you're a bit uh highest scoring mark of all time like it's kind of unfathomable yeah it's a good body of work there what's the greatest what's the greatest prank that's happened in an NBA locker room that fans don't know about i am sorry i'm gonna have to pass on that i am i'm not divulging

locker room pranks i'm not i'm not gonna be that guy the look on your face told us everything we need to know um all right so let's get into uh some of the stuff you've been doing you uh i feel like you have seized the moment with quarantine uh it started with uh proposing the playoff system so maybe just give kind of a quick two seconds like where did that come from and then what was the reaction from the league or or the team or anything like that when uh when you threw that out there so really it it all stemmed from obviously quarantine number one and then number two the conversation you have with your boys you know just like texting and stuff like that and you you start spitballing ideas you know you get stuff from like uh John Geiger and then um you know just

other people that I talked to Jeremy Adams one of my best friends um and so when you formulate and put it all together I decided to tweet it see what the fans thought about it um you know my model in terms of social media or motto in terms of social media it's just you know I wanted to feel like you're having a conversation with me so a lot of that stuff that I put on Twitter especially um it's really just like my actual thoughts I'm just kind of talking you know um the league actually called me about it and asked me to explain it because they want to incorporate some of the ideas you know people thought they might be mad at me but they actually really enjoyed that part yeah i gotta assume that there's some people at the league who

they enjoy the the banter the fan engagement and kind of the forward thinking and then there's some people who are probably more old school just like hey we got it you know everyone else stay out of our job one thousand percent one thousand percent i mean you anytime you're dealing with a legacy system um there's always going to be people that are like look if we just do it our way it'll always work you know and then there's obviously some upstarts that are going to be within the ranks that are like hey you know maybe maybe that guy's on to something so I know there's uh some controversy within that um and some going back and forth within that uh for me I mean nothing that I do is designed to harm the league in any way like obviously why would I you

know start playing basketball three four years old wanted to do nothing else but play in the NBA why would I try to then like take down the NBA while I'm only six years in and potentially have like another what seven eight years to play or something like that you know this this has always been about enhancing um any any additional structure it's been about like engaging the fans because at the end of the day like the fans as we see are the most important piece of the ecosystem if you guys watch you know we still have a job we still have a you know a league a a system of being an ecosystem but if you guys don't watch then we might as well be playing in the park I mean it'd be a lot of fun but we'd also have to get a day job yeah what do you think

kind of the fan relationship looks like coming out of quarantine right do you think that games end up getting played with no fans in the stadium or do we kind of wait till they can come back like what does that look like from where we're sitting today in kind of end of May of 2020 I mean with the immediate proposal really uh there there's no there's no way there's going to be fans you know um with uh finishing this season and potentially playing obviously these playoffs and and trying to get a true end to the 2020 season uh there's no way they could do that with fans such a condensed time i think uh 2021 we'll we'll see what that brings um if there's a lot of headway on a vaccine or we just have a lot more knowledge based on you know what this virus kind of means and its

implications then i think we will see fans return i mean i know uh you know that's what the owners are pushing for and what the league collectively is pushing for yeah whoever ends up winning whatever that ends up meaning uh for the 2020 uh final season here is there an asterisk next to that win like because it wasn't a regular season do people kind of look at it differently 1000 and you got to remember like an asterisk doesn't necessarily mean good nor bad you know it just means different um i i know and we could take like let's say the front row for example we'll take the lakers right um lebron will have won another championship he's on a quest to you know try to usurp jordan as you know the the goat or the most dominant or whatever you want to

call it um jordan fans will say there no that championship shouldn't count it was a weird season you know the the quarantine stuff and then they played a neutral site and so it wasn't near as tough as Jordan going on the road and being the jazz and the shot and all that stuff. But then LeBron fans will say, well, because he had to deal with all this stuff and because he had to go through all these things, it makes him, it makes that championship better. You know, he had to deal with, you know, Kobe's passing and the turmoil of the league and the quarantine and being off

for so much time. And he came back and he was, or wasn't rusty and all that other stuff. So when I, when I put out that comment about the Astros, I was merely just saying it causes more controversy in the debate. um i wasn't saying it was either good nor bad yeah and it almost makes those debates like uh more lively right having all of this it's not so much just hey how many championships now you get into all the nuances and as me and everyone else knows that's really what uh what people love the debate is all the the kind of nuance 1000 that's what really structures the debate because if you

really were only basing it upon like one hard fact then there would be no debate because the one hard fact would tell you uh you know i'm saying the answer yeah give us an update on the tokenization so uh your original proposal came out obviously the nba wasn't so hot on it uh you kind of reworked a little bit where are you with that right now and kind of what updates do you have for people yeah so i mean obviously i always have to preface these things by saying uh you know you gotta contact the broker dealer on file tritorion capital um you know we're doing everything obviously on the up and up it is for red uh creditor accredited investors only um but pretty much you know uh we we started the process back well shoot when we started the process and went

through all the legalese and everything it was shoot 18 maybe 20 months ago now uh but when we kind of started talking to the nba it was in september of last year um obviously like you said they weren't too hot on it um we continue to go forward uh talk to them kind of set it on a structure that was more like a a pilot um it's it's a bond obviously um and then you know attaching a safe to it for the larger uh business investment as well but you know like i said multiple times i view this as the start of an asset class it's about unlocking liquidity and and creating fan engagement. So my bond is not necessarily the most interesting thing in the world. But as this continues to scale, there's going to be a host of different things. You know, any business can offer

any product they want. And, you know, we all individually are our own businesses. Yeah. And I think what's really interesting about this, right, is you came out with something that was really, really innovative. And then you kind of get walked back a little bit to something that, you know, your words is more boring, but it still gets it done. Right. And it's almost like it's more important to get it done than it is to have the most innovative sexiest structure right out of the gate is that fair oh that's 1000% fair see and that's why I try to you know communicate to people a lot when you know they they see the things like the GoFundMe they see the things like the initial kind of spitballing of the offering and what was reported or misreported in some

places you know they think if you don't do the the absolute sexiest thing that you somehow fail But in a lot of ways, you don't necessarily think that you're going to get all that accomplished when you're dealing with legacy systems. You understand they're going to draw their hard line somewhere. But what you're saying is this is all of what I want to do. Now, tell me what you're going to allow me to do and where we can work together. And so there's typically a midline that, you know, you get to because you were bold enough to say what it is that you wanted to do. but if you come out and you and you tiptoe they typically would just try to hush you and move you over to the side and say you're not going to do it and then you know those people pack their bags

and go home you have to have enough uh gumption to you know really kind of try it yeah do you think that there would have been a different uh approach from the league's perspective if it wasn't so much drawn to the um the player contract and had been more like sponsorships or something like that or is it just generally the idea of uh tokenizing a revenue stream from a player and having fans uh potentially invest in it that's really what was kind of they were trying to wrap their head around quite honestly i think it's uh both you know i think uh they don't necessarily want the the athlete taking control of their revenue streams or their fan engagement or really um blurring that line between themselves and the fans and really making it uh a cohesive unit in

a sense I think because their jurisdiction does deal with player contracts that's why they were allowed to say something if I was doing that with you know Nike money for example they could hate it all they want to but if they came out against it I could very easily just say hey like this has absolutely nothing to do with you you know so um that that's where they had some jurisdiction but at the same time um I don't think they would have liked it regardless yeah and then uh you came out with this go fund me which when i saw it i literally said this dude's either the biggest genius in the world or this is going nowhere and so tell us kind of what was the uh the impetus for even starting it uh and then kind of how did you structure it yeah no so so the go fund me thing

it's another kind of tool of fan engagement right like um there's all these factors that play into a person making a free agency decision and typically speaking they try to keep it you know off to the side right we talk about market size uh fan base we talk about state taxes uh if a shoe company is going to push you to a team that has a lot of history or or a team that you know has a big media following or whatever it is or your hometown etc you know there's all these different factors your family your friends all that right well what if you involve the fans in some of those decision-making processes right like the cba pretty much states that you can't um like take a discount or anything like that so you know when i tweeted and then went back and

read the cba i was like okay i have to take out the minimum portion of it but there's nothing in there that says they can't be factors in your decision quite frankly if i'm choosing a team based upon you know their their fan base and you know how big of a global presence they are then i'm choosing it because of those fans you know i just didn't tell the fans that they're why i'm choosing them you know and so kind of reimagining that now when i set the actual price once again i set it sky high because there was no way that it was gonna uh get there and the way i chose that i actually just picked my three favorite numbers put them together multiplied it by the price of bitcoin and got it people people thought i was choosing like market value or something else i

literally took and i wrote it i took 26 25.8 and then multiplied it by the price of bitcoin which is probably i think like 9200 at the time or something in that range and that's how we got the sky-high number and the reason why i said you know if even if we're a dime short it all goes to charity is because it about it was about the idea and the concept how can we enhance fan engagement how can we bring more people in how can this ecosystem thrive in the middle of covid if there are no fans in the in the stands next year but guys want to do some things that kind of keep people entrenched in the game well what happens if they literally chose a player's destination you know or if a player had you know a set of three destinations he said you know what i'm torn

between you know brooklyn and two other teams you guys pick you know and and and obviously they wouldn't be able to uh talk about money and things like that because that's between the player and the and the team negotiating but if that if that was right for him then he could do that and if a gofundme campaign or uh another blockchain based you know uh uh system allowed them to have that kind of voting power in there then i mean there's nothing saying that they couldn't do that so you know like i said it's picked sky high number because i know i wouldn't reach it it would end up in a charity donation which you know i wanted to do good during covid as well but it was all about the concept and the idea yeah uh my brother texted me i didn't see it at first when you posted

it and he texted me he goes what's he doing and i as soon as i read it i said he might be a billionaire by the end of this if people give him 25 25 million dollars of bitcoin yeah no i mean don't get me wrong like if they if they had it done i probably would have been like whoa like what just happened um i would have definitely been uh shocked to say the least but yeah i mean And the plan was definitely always to give the money to charity. And that's why, you know, I wrote it in there like that. Yeah. And so I guess part of this is at least this question of the GoFundMe is a hard one to do.

It's had a sky high price. But this concept of like the fans having a say, you could imagine somebody building some, you know, kind of auto magic governance system, let's say. And now fans can actually act almost as like mini GMs, right? Yep. Do you feel like that's closer to a world that we'll move towards in all sports, not just the NBA? Or do you feel like it's just such a big leap from where we are in owners and teams across the major sports? They just don't want to even get into that game where fans have that much type of control of players and how teams are put together. I don't think they necessarily want to get into that.

And maybe I'm 20 years off here, but you're going to have to get there eventually. You know, with the more we kind of move into, you know, e-gaming, cyber, all that stuff, part of the attraction of that is the control. You know what I mean? Like, that's just kind of like psychologically speaking part of the attraction. So, you know, when you want to continue to compete, especially with live sports, you're going to want to involve these people, you know, as much as you possibly can. You look at the Green Bay Packers, for example, they have one of the most rabid fan bases. And that's because, you know, a lot of those people own shares and feel like they are really entrenched and on the field with the Packers. That's what you want to create. You know, and like I said, it doesn't necessarily mean that, you know, a fan says, all right, Spencer, we're trading you tomorrow.

But maybe it does mean that if I come to a free agency decision and I am choosing between Brooklyn and one other team that I say, hey, you know what? Normally I may flip a coin or I may ask my mom or I may ask this or I may ask that. Well, you know what? I'm going to let you guys decide, you know, and if that's right for that player and that specific business, then that is you know i'm saying something that that that can happen and i think it will the nba will see that that will enhance the ecosystem because they will feel personally responsible now for their team's success or failure if you tell me to stay on the nets right and then we don't win a championship and you feel like i'm the reason we don't win then you're going to feel also personally liable for the loss but if you do win then you're going to feel like you personally

has something to do with the win and at the end of the day fan is short for fanatic you want them to feel entrenched in that environment in that ecosystem and so the closer you can bring them into you know the bubble the better yeah and it feels like there's other aspects of sports right i mean literally just if you own a seat license at let's say the new york giant stadium right obviously the value of the seat license goes up if they're better it goes down if they suck right and so there's there's elements of this it's just not as direct of like hey here's my vote for where you should go right and it seems like that that's the big leap forward next yep I think you're 1000% right on that yeah it talks to us a little bit about during quarantine like what are players

doing right now I've seen you post on Instagram a couple times like you're still trying to work out and all that but like how hard is that given that you're still somewhat expected to be ready to go to a moment's notice really as a professional athlete but then you've got kind of this whole health care crisis and lockdown going on yeah uh that's definitely probably the hardest part um to a restart i think i think it's the part that people aren't necessarily talking about enough i know we have concerns about covid obviously um we have families and and people that we take care of that you know we're worried about but there's also an injury risk to you know coming back too quickly if they do decide to do that um i know guys are trying to work out to the best

of their ability um you know some have access to more things than others depend upon you know their environment right now which city uh they're in but um yeah i mean it's tough you know most gyms are locked down obviously so getting basketball working right now um unless you're a max player and have you know a gym in your house and all that stuff uh is not the easiest thing to do yeah and is there um concern about like coronavirus itself obviously hey i don't want to pull hamstring twist an ankle that type of stuff is just we'll call it rust right from not having played for a couple weeks but is there actual like covid stuff um especially since a couple of players tested positive uh earlier in the year yeah i mean i think there is you know

if you talk around the nba everybody is cautious um i won't say scared because we understand the demographic that we're in you know being between 20 and 35 and obviously in pretty good shape uh that we're probably not you know like death risk and we're not in that demographic but there's so little information on it right now that you know people are cautious you know and and rightfully so yeah uh you want to pick one of your teammates who you think will come back uh least in shape out of all this who's at home eating all the snacks who's at home eating all the snacks uh theo pinson at home eating all the snacks i love it i love it um last dance uh has gotten a ton of attention the documentary on michael jordan uh what was your general takeaways

from uh from watching it um you really get a glimpse into the mind of you know who michael Jordan was and what made him so great uh you get to see kind of how the Bulls were almost kind of like the Beatles in a sense uh the Beatles of the league um that's something that obviously I never really got to experience because I was too young you know when they were really on their run I was four or five years old so you understand who Michael Jordan is how great he was as a player and all that stuff but you don't remember all the fanfare necessarily surrounding it um Dennis rodman might be my favorite player of all time now but um yeah just overall it was it was it was interesting to see i mean really i wish they could have dived or dove even deeper into everything

that went on because obviously you know you only have so much time in a 10-part doc yeah i saw a tweet about rodman somebody said like uh the first tweet was uh if you want to know how good dennis rodman was he had michael jordan chasing around uh vegas to get him to come to practice exactly and then the other one was uh you're telling me this man was you know a multi-time nba champion he basically was doing drugs drinking going to wwe matches like they laid out everything in the documentary and like and he still was you know not even the best guy on his team right and you just kind of look at it it's like and and by the way like all that happens because there's no social media imagine some guy trying to do that today right no there's no way there's no way you would

get eviscerated by you know coaching staff fans media all that like there'd be no way because somebody pull out their camera phone and you know video evidence is a lot different than hearsay um yeah that that that's not even possible now i mean i'm just imagine like i was watching it and when uh when he disappears after one of the games right and they find out he went to the wwe thing i was sitting there saying like imagine today if a player just disappeared right everyone's like where is he you would have fans going nuts all over social media like it'd be a global manhunt to find the player oh yeah well i mean he'd be found because he'd be walking through an airport whether it was private or not and somebody would snap a picture and be like hey i'm in you know

cleveland ohio and i just saw dennis rodman and everybody'd be like what the heck is he doing in cleveland ohio so yeah it would it would be over quick yeah and then what's your take on uh i saw like horace grant i think scotty pippen a couple of guys were uh unhappy with how the way the documentary was put together like what's kind of your takeaway from that i mean i think the scotty pippen one actually kind of caught me off guard because if you look at the way michael jordan talked about him he basically said like i don't win without you you know and for somebody that is notorious for being extremely hard and unforgiving and holding grudges and outrageously competitive for him to basically say like hey i needed scotty you know i'm saying i

didn't want him on the team i needed him on the team that's a huge compliment and then you know the other stuff that went down i mean a lot of that was scotty's decision so you know i i don't really have too much to say on the scotty front on the horace grant front um i could see how that was tough you know they blamed him for snitching effectively um but you know one of the things he said was that for the guy to publish the story he needed two people at minimum to corroborate the story so he said you know forget the fact that one i'm denying that i ever said anything but two if he needed two people it couldn't have only been math says that like it couldn't have only been me so like how are you guys solely pinning this on me there's got to be somebody

else so i could definitely see why horace grant you know felt a certain way this guy the scotty thing is you know maybe it's personal so i don't know like i'm not i don't know those guys uh but i can't really i i can't begin to comment on that yeah my two favorite parts of the entire thing is one the steve kerr story where they get into like the fist fight or whatever and it just showed like one i think kerr understanding like hey if you stand up and basically back it up jordan will respect you and i think that's kind of like he just saw him over and over and then two is uh the security guard with the jerry curl man that dude all the time oh yeah no his Jordan Shrug was crazy and like I guess part of as you're watching like how much of the behind the scenes stuff

right so literally we see Jordan like throwing quarters with security guards before the game I'm assuming that a lot of that is uh they pull the best parts right you know and put into a documentary but like is that the general atmosphere before the games for players in the locker room or did you feel like that was like oh that must have been fun in the 90s because we're not doing any of that type of stuff now well not necessarily shooting quarters and and as of now people don't really have uh their own personal locker rooms away from the locker room but in terms of the banter and the joking and you know that type of stuff yeah that's that's that's definitely consistent in the locker room you got to remember like these are 15 highly competitive guys um who

we're about to you know kind of go to war in a sense you know you don't want to be on all the time you want to be on you know an hour two hours before the game up until the game ends but when the game does end especially after wins you want to kind of be able to turn off and you know so in those moments you're definitely going to see more quarter type of atmosphere and guys laughing joking with each other yeah makes sense um since last time we talked there's been a bunch of chaos in the financial markets uh we won't even pretend that we know what's going on uh but but just a lot of chaos how have you thought about uh kind of your investment portfolio and things that you've looked at from uh investment opportunities like how has that evolved over the last eight to ten

weeks is all this has been going on well i know a lot of things have been getting hammered um you know, obviously the crypto market as well. I mean, if you trade it, you've been able to kind of capture some of the fluctuations both ways. But I don't think anybody could have predicted, obviously, COVID as a whole. I think the scariest part,

even though, you know, it is seemingly necessary at the moment in terms of like, you know, the SBA or, you know, the, what do they call it? The $1,200 a month or whatever. Stimulus check. stimulus there we go um it's it's turning the helicopter money man like it's it's crazy because you know they just printed six trillion dollars over the last what is it like several months uh

how how we recover from this i have i have no idea you know i mean we we all obviously have our theories and hope it goes one direction in part because obviously it benefits us as well because we're kind of part of that vanguard um you know solution but it's it's tough i don't i don't think this gets better uh quickly because i don't think people necessarily understand the ramifications like if the market goes through a normal cycle i would i would assume the u.s at some point in time has to experience uh hyperinflation i mean it's it's a it's a lot money it's a lot of money that they're printing and they're not showing signs of slowing down either yeah and i guess like nba players or other athletes are in a very unique position right

because most people who would have the type of income that an nba player has uh they're either very very deep on finance like literally an expert you know whether a trader investor whatever they've built big businesses etc one of the trends over the last couple of years in the league has been people getting very sophisticated about business about investing and all that so do you hear teammates or other players in the league talking about this stuff right now in terms of maybe not like hey the stock market's down but the the more like structural issues or the longer term impact of this type of stuff or they just focused on playing basketball right now and not talking about as much um you know you actually hear more conversations about like the stock

market being down or people getting into bc and things like that i don't think uh people have uh really kind of gone deep enough to really talk about like the actual structural issues of the economy um you know or the way we stopped the 08 kind of artificially stopped the 08 recession with the bailouts etc etc um those are things that aren't really talked about in the NBA locker room um yeah I mean it's it's tough man I mean to be able to have disposable income during this time period is definitely a blessing um obviously if you uh invest into the storm and you are able to kind of strike right um you know you have good people around you that are able to kind of steer you in the right direction you have the capability to really come out you know more than on top on

the back end but but this is going to get tough for everybody you know if the league wasn't coming back i mean you know they're talking about uh cutting salaries for you know a period of time And, you know, it's already an escrow system, so it already holds a portion of the salaries and all that other stuff. So, you know, it's not as easy on us as some may seem. And it's just – it's a tough time for everybody, you know. It just really is. Yeah. And I guess the last thing I want to finish up on is the smartest players obviously are surrounded by a lot of smart people.

And these people have been investing capital for athletes and others for a long period of time. How much has Bitcoin and crypto kind of infiltrated those portfolios or those conversations with what I'll call kind of the financial advisors to players, right? So players, obviously, my expectation would be some of them care, some of them don't, and it's all personal preference. But the financial advisor is supposed to understand all the different asset classes and give recommendations. What's going on there with Bitcoin and those financial advisors? I don't talk to financial advisors that frequently in terms of like others. But I mean, I definitely have heard a rise in, you know, the frequency of blockchain being brought up amongst those conversations. you know obviously everybody knows about 2017 boom everybody knows about the crash and kind of its fluctuations now in between but i think people are really starting to kind of expand

the horizons because they're not understanding what's going to you know come next i don't think anybody really does you know we all have our guesses but i think as they're starting to say hold up this doesn't really make too much sense and it's not just our economy that's going through it there's a lot of economies most of them really around the the world that are going through something like how can we start to protect our clients and obviously make them money because you know they get paid by asset under management so the better they do you know the the the sorry the better the the client does the more money they make as well um and i mean we just we just had uh you know tutor jones not too long ago say uh you know he's now in bitcoin so you know it's

it's definitely gonna continue the the bug is gonna continue to spread so i'm excited about that for sure uh to end i usually ask questions uh two questions but i've already asked them to you so i got two new ones for you if you're the nba commissioner for a day what's the one rule that you would change in the league oh i would allow player contracts and ownership of teams to be democratized if they so chose bring them all in i love it i love it last question is if you were president of the United States for a day, what's the one thing you would do? That smile. Come on. What did you just think of? No, no, no. Oh, man. No.

That's a lot. I don't know. Is there a drone around here? i don't know um nah man that's that's tough that's tough because obviously we talk about finance and it's a you know predominantly financial uh platform i mean you got prison reform you got all types of things the president thing is it's hard you know i mean but one of the things that definitely sticks out of my mind has to be has to be prison reform we look at everybody making money off legal marijuana right now and how many people have life sentences and 20 and 25 year sentences on marijuana like i you you gotta change that you have to you know and then the prison system being privatized and all that stuff you know people are making money you know

they're making money off of the wrongdoings of other people which to me is a wrongdoing because if you're if you can incentivize somebody to do something wrong because you have financial gain then you're part of the problem you're pushing them towards that you know end goal so you can profit right so i would say from a personal standpoint that would be one thing uh for a personal gain perspective i mean we can start doing something about printing this money and switch it over uh you know what which currencies we're going to use and how we're going to use them so that's uh that's where i would go but yeah that's where i'm at i love it man listen it's always a pleasure to uh to do this with you you uh you got a lot of ideas and the part that i

like about it is most people who have ideas they're they're unwilling to uh kind of share them with the world because they're scared that uh the backlash right but uh i i i tell you all times look not only do you share them you get in the comments right you're there you're there and you're explaining you're defending right you're doing all this kind of stuff which i think is important right because we live in a society where uh as more and more people become afraid to do that less innovation happens right you need to explore those ideas in order to kind of come up with where we're going next exactly and and you gotta you gotta understand the value of different opinions you know some people obviously go crazy in the comments and just want to be rude that's

one thing but you know there are people that ask really uh thought-provoking questions and they make me expand you know they they make me explain why it's nuanced this way or nuanced that way or maybe their little nugget actually propels the idea forward so you know i welcome it and like i said i hope twitter continues to be a conversation platform for me absolutely man where uh where can people go to find out more if they want to learn about um the tokenization uh dreamfanshares.com and other than that just contact Trattoria on Capital broker deal on record

like I said try to not speak about this in detail too much just because you know SEC, FINRA I love you guys my dog alright Spencer

look I appreciate you doing this we'll do it again soon appreciate you alright guys thanks for listening to that episode I hope you enjoyed it just as much as I did my goal is to educate

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and informative videos thanks again for listening to this one and i'll see you for the next one