The Pomp Podcast - #392: Dave Portnoy on Barstool, Betting, and Bitcoin

Episode Date: September 25, 2020

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What's up, everyone? This is Anthony Pompliano. Most of you know me as Pomp. You're listening to the Pomp Podcast, simply the best podcast out there. Let's kick this thing off. Dave Portnoy is the founder of Barstool Sports. In this conversation, we discuss the business behind Barstool, the new sports book they launched, why Dave started trading stocks, how he manages his money, and whether he's going to buy Bitcoin or not. I really enjoyed this conversation with Dave, and I hope you do as well. Before we get into the episode, though, I want to quickly talk about our sponsors. First up is Athletic Brewing. They're reimagining beer for the modern adult. We love beer, and so do they. But they've also loved being healthy,

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bang bang i'm here that's what you do this guy just bang bang you want to try it that's what eddie does what who's eddie this guy here who does like i'm starting a podcast after this and that's what he does bang bang well he uh has to pay royalties on that who was doing first uh me obviously you just hit us with bang bang real quick no i won't do that i'm not gonna do other people's schticks all right let's just start with uh you have made this grand entrance into uh the finance world and absolutely lit it on fire basically just got on twitter one day started live streaming and basically blew up all the scams all the whatever why did you do it well sports was discontinued and i was looking for and we're slowly getting ready to move out of

the office so i was looking for something past the time i mean it is gambling i like gambling it's definitely gambling it's 100 gambling it's just a legal casino exactly it's walking into a casino anybody who says otherwise is a liar and you shouldn't trust them um so i love gambling and i was looking for something to do i mean i bought a couple stocks way back once i had an e-trade account i think with twitter in it and that's it so i just started uh trading a couple stocks made a uh i didn't start with the live stream i put on a suit pretended it was you know my own wall street's like oh this is interesting and people gravitated towards it right away um and i'm in the content business first and foremost so it's like okay if people are interested in

doing this i'll do it i mean we'd live streamed gambling before sports gambling and people are into that watching you win lose money no different than stock market so i feel like you have this resurgence like you did all the content for a really long time then the pen deal happened you kind of were like doing business stuff a little bit of content and then when the pandemic hit you just went hard at the content again and kind of reminded everyone like this place is here because that's what you did for years and years and years right early days yeah and so uh i think that people kind of forgotten that you're just a degenerate gambler at heart and the stock market is no different if you treat it that way right so you know davy pages like that's the name from

way back like i can get pages for anything that's what i used to call myself and it really was i was all content like that's all i did uh maybe like a little business but once really with the churning deal and moving forward i do a lot more on the business side i don't have nearly as much time for the content um which i missed to a degree but quarantine and corona when you're isolated yeah in your own office there's not much business stuff or not nearly as much going on yeah i got heavy into the content game all right so i want to talk about pen first then we'll talk about stuff uh in 2016 you do the churning deal yeah most people say horrible deal where you sit now hindsight pretty good deal you mean right horrible deal in what sense like the whole tech world is

like oh my god i can't believe you sold more than 50 of the business for like whatever but based on what i know like you guys pretty much needed help to scale the business and so would you do that deal again yeah i mean churning it's such a interesting answer because and it's no different than the pen deal to the great there were no other offers like nobody and anybody who was interested the conversations were quickly shut down because i wasn't i was making a lot of money that maybe personally correct i was making seven figures and our company was doing well and i was making more than i ever thought and so i had no aspirations necessarily to take investor or sell it in the churning guys kerns mike kerns who reached out he was a believer in the content and it wasn't like

we want to change it can you it was like you do you let's add some fire let's get a ceo ramp up the business but there was i didn't have anything to evaluate it it wasn't like a bidding war there weren't people knocking down if that deal didn't happen nobody was buying it you had to basically accept the risk and the negative perceptions which i think are all faults oh barstool but it is you know it wasn't a wedding registry that's safe there was some element of risk there so was the valuation extremely low yes was the first offer mike kerns made to me insulting yes was in hindsight it what was it what was the first one i think seven million seven million valuation yeah and you got them all the way up to 15 it was like 12 and a half

all right um but to be fair like that's pretty good negotiating on your part mike's not mike's no pushover when negotiating well i think he went so low my i mean kerns yeah he's a professional and the Turner guys are professional negotiators. They're super legit. They know what they're doing. So if you move it from seven to 12, like you did a pretty good job. Yeah.

Well, it was so fucking low. And by the way, it's like I don't, I had a number in my head. I don't negotiate. So seven is like, okay. I think I was just like, no, I'll see you later.

And then it's like, well, it's going to have to be 12 and a half. And then maybe it was back and forth and that's what it is. And Kearns will probably say that. I am probably, and I wouldn't say I'm a good negotiator, but I say the price and that's it.

and if you like i mean we have two data points you also did with call her daddy same thing correct here's the price yeah and we had a little sticking point with uh to be honest the pen deal and it's like there's i needed churning to anti something up and what was it i i can't get into the details but it got testy and i there was one call at one point where it's like well we split it want to do this it's like i don't think you're hearing me it's like i'll walk away from everything or it's this and but i i also am too low now again churner brought credibility like expertise erica well no i brought erica okay um so they brought all of that to the table they were the only so they get credit for and huge credit for seeing it taking the risk being the one who offered no different

them pen like hindsight pen looks like they got an awesome deal that's what we met with everybody else fan duel drafting i mean nobody made an offer like why are they scared of you are they scared of the content are they scared of just the perception and the controversy i think there were two major factors scared of me controversy a b we had worked with them for a while so i think they kind of thought hey we've gotten everything out of barstool we've gotten their audience the two you you guys in a way built those companies i would say absolutely okay i was offering explain that a little so we were working with the daily fantasy companies before draft kings existed i believe fan duel draft street a lot of early ones and when i say early i nascent

like they were starting the we had this big blackout tour that was a concert tour we did and became wildly popular and huge that was started because draft street which was later bought by draft kings asked us to do a promo to reach frat guys to get them to sign up literally and uh draft kings i sat with like jason robbins and all the owners probably a decade ago in nantucket or something like that and they offered me equity in the company because we do these contracts in pit fan duel draft kings versus each other and highest bidder and they go back as a war because we're so effective now did you take the equity net did not take the equity why the main reason was i couldn't i was so focused barcelona and there was i thought there's gonna

be too much going on where i sit in the room and i didn't totally understand it but it's like i didn't envision um wanting to sit in a room every week and have these meetings like i was concentrating on barcelona um and i didn't totally understand the equity portion of it in hindsight i don't know which way would have worked out better like i could have done this deal um but i obviously would have had a small percentage and i don't understand dilution and all that shit what it would have ended up with um so we worked with them throughout but as barstool grew and that as that space became more competitive we started and this is something i never did back in the day one ad will be an mgm casino the nexus fan duel the nexus draft games the nexus point bet

it's just being whitewashed just like how it is if you watch a football game now and there's 10 commercials do you pay attention to any of them probably not so i don't think any of the companies we're meeting with realized well when we're bought or acquired or focus our energy just on one company what will happen it changes the game the narrative everything so i think they underestimate that i think they were a little bit scared but they could have gotten us fan duel specifically and could have gotten us for far cheaper i think than pendant to be honest all right and they missed the boat so you do the churning deal uh i remember talking to erica in 2017 she laid out this vision we're joking earlier like to the point where it was almost is that even possible

right like hey we're going to the moon type thing uh i wrote this piece and said uh you guys were i think it was a 15 million dollar valuation or 12 and a half i always said because churning didn't want to say what it was so i would always say 10 to 15 but it was 12 and a half okay all right you probably shouldn't say the exact number now well it doesn't matter now except people be like you idiot i think i may turn like a quarter milli or something like that no big deal did he buy you dinner no we haven't we he has offered he has offered but he just didn't go i don't know that chernan's given me anything like not even like maybe a thank you card a couple nice emails maybe i like those guys but they haven't i don't think they like they're waiting they're waiting till

you make them a billion and then hey great job you mean as a cool you return a nine gazillion that was a unicorn investment for them okay so uh i wrote this piece and i said barstool's gonna be a billion dollar brand if basically you don't sell too early right and the whole idea was just you have the fan base and it was so obvious early on like if you have the relationship with the fans you win because you can create companies sell it through products sell it through whatever at some point you decide one to sell right a piece not the whole thing but a piece and then two you do it where now you're focusing all your energy on somebody else's product it's not something that you guys created talk through like why do that versus just go start your own sports book

plus a bunch of other stuff and put it through the the distribution you mean here with like pen with pen well we could never start our own sports book we'd never get licensed we'd never get access we all that shit would just never happen so um you needed the partner to do needed the partner and they were the perfect partner and again it is a question i get asked a lot but when you're in our shoes and i've been fucking grinding at this thing for 17 years um you know i made money but but and it's all relevant like i i'm obviously have done well but when you look at the churning deal it's not like i was obscenely rich like i had money but that wasn't like oh my god and even now it's not like now where you can tweet at celebrity net worth hey correct they

did the 200 million right um on paper uh but so this what and there aren't it's not as if we have this waterfall of offers and meetings when you're going through and you nobody's making an offer it's like well is anyone gonna get an offer and as do i want to do this for the next 20 years to build it up i always thought sports gambling it's how we started the second the legislation the united states changed to make it legal i'm like okay this is our moment and we spent close to a year trying to figure out the best fit and penn was by far and away the best partner that presented itself from jay snowden who i love the ceo to them understanding what we do and having faith and believing in it um there was it it was almost a no-brainer i mean we named our price

there was no negotiation with penn and i thought it was crazy because based on fan how'd you come up with the price i didn't like the you know the turn and the churning guys as you said are fierce negotiators so if they're naming it i'm like okay but they named it and and penn was like yep that's it done they didn't negotiate it was nothing as long as they felt we were aligned and we are because it's not like i got paid it's like a lot of stock and all that shit how much did you take in stock versus cash it was like it it was uh 55 45 55 uh cash or stock 55 stock 45 and that's like different for me it's like the barstool people are different than the yeah yeah so i mean it was a great deal now when the stock goes up and bumps pre-corona

you know it's like oh we should dump we just made them a gazillion dollars in 10 seconds because wall street reacted obviously super favorably to the deal and that's when the other companies we met with who i like like i obviously it's like the brady six when he's crying like i get a chip on my shoulder like i'm meeting with these guys who know us it's like you're not even gonna make an offer are you fucking an idiot and they probably had to spend on talent now more than they would have spent just to buy us because we put them in a box it's like oh fuck well what is it fanduel did the pat mcafee deal right yep on top they're doing all of them yes because like okay and they could have they missed and i don't know if they'd say they missed you but

they missed because i actually really like the fanduel guys and the ones running it it's like if they made an offer that was competitive like okay we can win with these guys i feel like everyone in the gambling sports fantasy world are people like barstool right like the type of person is so similar so the people who are running those companies there's a very cultural fit with what you guys have done oh maybe not not at the top okay that's different yeah maybe down below but that's why we're gonna be like i i've met with them all they don't they're they're not like how bad does this get in the sense of fast forward five years the barstool sports book versus all these other guys like how bad of a massacre is it oh i don't know because they have such a gigantic

lead they have great tech they have a huge lead um and there's no industry that i'm aware of where there's like one guy i mean it doesn't matter what there is there's multiple players and they're competitive and in a way it can help each other but nobody outside like i guess the cable company and telephone well even there's multiple but you can only get one cable company in your house other than that there'll be multiple players like phantom and draft kings are not going anywhere yeah we're we're different like those two to me are one of those i don't know what'll happen they're identical companies to me they're both out of the daily fantasy the big databases they're going to try to win with offers and plays no one cares no one's gonna wear a fan

dual hat or draft as much as they try that's never going to happen but they're they're going to be there we and i saw one interesting stat when i was looking at downloads and it's like it didn't our downloads and what we did in pennsylvania and handle all that didn't seem to take away from the others and i can believe that oh interesting so it was additive to the correct because we have our audience who may not have been so you know it could help both markets i could and who knows i'm anybody who thinks i've inside we talked insider knowledge like you came in and i'm like well pen was down 10 they did this stock offering i had no idea that was coming and i have so much pen stock even beyond like you know why they don't tell you right because

it's our trading no no because telling you wouldn't be bad because you're an employee but then you'd go then you would go sell it then you get yourself in trouble exactly so so they basically know you better than you know yourself they protect me but it's still so they told me just late last night so i wouldn't be like stunned by the news well i'm so confident in myself and what we do here that i just keep buying it as it goes like i'll bet on myself 100 so when he told me that i would never know this if i wasn't doing the day trader like oh stocks gonna get killed like not because pen anytime a company does this stock gets killed i've seen it like i've owned stocks i'm like what the fuck is it down and then people are like oh they did an

offering it doesn't generally last it comes back but when he told me that it's like i'm sitting here with i'm like all right you motherfucker like i didn't say it's like i'm gonna get murdered tomorrow and it's like i have to wake up all these people and sure enough it did they buried some good stats but yeah it's uh hold on before we talk about the stock stuff you guys launched the sports book in pennsylvania this past weekend you outperformed downloads for all the other ones did you guys have to spend money to drive that or is that all organic just putting it through the distribution which to me which is the big advantage that you guys have yeah so that is the story and that's why even the way they did this release which they can't tell me

like the press release and all that i feel like they should talk to me because i'm understand marketing i feel like better than they do like it's stock offering and then at the bottom it like had the stats and the stats and people twist them people don't like me will say they're bad they're good it was like i think i have it's like 30 000 yeah it's like 30 000 downloads in pennsylvania 11 million handle like 24 000 registrations is really really impressive there's 10 existing companies sports books in pennsylvania with a huge lead on us we know where it's like a race that is a 10 mile race and the other companies are are five miles in and we're just starting there's no other company in the world who could have that dent with zero dollars

spent we didn't spend a cent so how and when you guys go to market this how much is this just you send a message to everyone here you're like hey we're launching this like you know go promote it versus it's uh specifically like okay we're gonna promote it on this show we're gonna promote it on this show like how strategic is this pretty just promote it however like you see fit and that's what it looks like which makes it which makes it so much more valuable yep and that that is how it is and it's a natural because our history is gambling and then i was saying like extrapolate it you know take a state like michigan where it is not legal yet and that's like i went to school there we're huge in the midwest penn has one of the nicest casinos there that the greek which is

like i think they're nicest las vegas style casino and all of a sudden everyone's at the starting line at the same time well we're going to cause real damage there so not everyone's totally understanding that i guess some people do some people don't but pennsylvania was as encouraging i think as we could possibly expect it to be and like the stock offering thing again it's like we're not unless i'm being strictly lied to which i know i'm not that's money is not going to people's hands we're using it as it was i said to give me like guns ammunition so we can start spending so i i feel like uh and this is external looking in if somebody just gives you a camera and says go live stream you'll win some portion of the market right you big cat etc like whatever

then when they put a company that's got real technology behind you right okay now the product actually works it's good great and then if they put marketing dollars behind this as well it's like it's unbeatable 100 and i think there'll be consolidation again this is just a yes in the market like if you took a fan duel or draft kings and combined them with us that's the end of that's the end of this game do you want that to happen depends how much money i'd get like honestly that's all yeah that's a great answer though yeah that's all a finance thing like who's in control i know this like if those two combined it doesn't matter it's the same company who cares they probably have a very similar they tried already yeah and they have a very similar database it's

like i guarantee you almost everybody who has fan duel has draft kings and vice versa and they're shopping lines and where so we are a very different thing we combine with one of those the other one's dead so i like that position and it could happen down the world and then you look at things like mgm grand shut out i mean whatever they had jamie fox they i don't know if you saw no they they signed him like a big jamie fox he's the face of mgm gambling with an app it's like are you kidding me jamie fox versus dave portnoy in the gambling space that that that is a beat down like that isn't it by the way by the way they have real production studios etc and you're basically sitting on uh you know in your backyard and the fucking hamptons or whatever streaming right and

the nutty thing is like i know mgm and i know caesars and we talk to them and they never do a deal with us because there's old stuffy suits and whatnot i'd never heard of penn ever until like a lot of their uh properties were different names like i heard of penn national like casino i knew the tropicana which is a dump which they had owned at the time but like i never knew what they are go ask people now who penn is it's like everybody knows everybody knows suddenly it's like you look at the casino groups that's all barstool um it's funny because i know i'm underpaid again like i was underpaid with churn and i realized i didn't how did you structure the deal now that you did that deal you obviously got cash and stock yeah right your five-year deal i have

five-year contract here okay and you get stock and cash correct okay and i can like i'm basically they tied me in long term like r and j and if it goes better you probably get more if it doesn't go so well then well my stock is fluid i can't sell it so it's like it do you do they treat you like an athlete where uh you know hey if you hit 20 home runs you get a bonus or anything no no um and and i this is where my lack of negotiating skills probably comes in i generally don't like renegotiate it's like all right i like the deal now no don't renegotiate the turning guys were essentially that kind of like yeah you were underpaid the whole time it's like no shit i was like they did give me raises but uh you know when you see did you ever when you were handing out

newspapers at the uh subway and train in boston did you think you were ever gonna have a boss no and i still don't i still don't i do but i don't because all right explain well i have technically a boss jay snowden and i guess you churning guys are as well yeah but they let you do your thing well when the ultimate trump card is i'm just gonna walk away if you don't give me what you want and your business is gonna fall apart i don't have a boss are you negotiating with jay and chernan right now no no i i don't do it that way i i never it's like whether erica i'm pretty sane like our interests are aligned and i'm honest i'm straightforward and as long as you're back to me we'll never have a problem and i would never do a deal with jay or chernan if i

thought that was going to be an issue but our business strangely enough is so dependent on the content whatever it literally when the ultimate card and i'm i am crazy enough to walk like i know i know but it's like on principle if you're like okay you to be honest from afar if there was ever a okay here's the moment and it was give back the 200 million dollars or like concede to whatever bullshit i literally think you'd give back the 100 which is by the way it's fucking insane yeah that that that would be the easiest if it was something where i'm like this is wrong i can't do this or you're fucking me over i would rather the entire ship burn with me then like then then concede it's just in my nature you know that's why mgm and caesars and

all them couldn't do a deal with you probably probably but but it boils true but it boils down to it when i say it's like honesty and being straightforward and you may not like it but i i would never go into business with somebody who i didn't have the vibe like there i don't care if i it's not whether i like something or don't like something it's whether i feel like you're being deceitful or misleading that's where i'd be like no you you said that i remember the churning deal there was like 50 grand in lawyer fees that i know at the beginning it's like they cover my lawyer fees it was 50 grand i was getting a lot of money for me at the time and we were like the last moment they're like yeah you pay for the lawyer fees i mean no we agree

that you did and not like someone else called and they tried to negotiate it and i literally at the end i'm like the deal's off it's like i don't they're like we'll give you 40 not 50 i'm like it's 50 or the deal is off because we agreed on it that's it if we agree on something with me you better fucking honor it or else i will walk and you do the same in return totally right okay all right so over the last couple months you've been yelling and screaming all kinds of crazy shit like stocks only go up right now going down right now well hold on but most people think dave porno is an idiot he doesn't know what he's talking about he knows nothing about finance blah blah whatever you've actually been right you don't know why you've been right probably but

you're actually right and the reason why it only goes up is because they're literally just creating fucking money so i want to shoot bucks exactly so that was that's what i want to talk about kind of insulting that you said i don't know why i mean i've done the shoot box thing so that video is probably one of the most real honest evaluations of the stock market and the economy right then anything anyone will watch on television right and the whole idea is basically this everything was selling off the fed steps in they pump a bunch of money into the economy and it just fucking shoots up right like literally 50 60 off the bottom whatever while that's going on you start screaming stocks only go up and i think everyone's uh reaction in finance is so visceral

to like what does this guy know he doesn't know about whatever but you're right right and so like talk just about the experience of all these people in suits and ties yelling and screaming day four night doesn't know he's talking about one you've been right two you're right structurally and three there's no end in sight for them to stop doing this shit right and i mean if you look long term the one thing i have said with it's like if you're an old person whatever and you need to get your money out you gotta be a little more careful but if you're if you can wait if you're 25 if you're gonna outweigh the stock market you can always outweigh the stock market it'll always go up it doesn't matter how far down it goes that's just a fact if you look at it but yeah

the suit you know it's an industry that i've never been involved in i don't think they had ever and i've had this happen a lot during the course of barcelona they just didn't know what to do with me it's like you know you the guy you said ross gerber he's like hey come on my podcast i don't like i'm like suck my dick like you know they don't know it's like okay like how do i respond to that well he deleted the tweet that's how he'd respond to that and they'll chirp me from the cheap seats when things are going on but i don't care that's like i like that that that's my world they're playing into the game correct you want to talk shit they the way they talk shit is not actually talk shit they basically like throw these little intellectual zingers and you're just like

look yeah let's just full-on let's just go at it and for any time i'm on tv or mentioned it's good i mean as crazy it is really when it exploded was when i started making fun of warren buffett but the financial community and there may be by the way you're not wrong with his performance he has to beat the s&p over the last 90 years old people like that if you're in your prime at 90 than you were never good before no one gets shopper at 90 i can't remember what i had for breakfast so you know they took a quote because it all started with the airlines basically cruising airlines i was getting killed i had shorted i was getting murdered and and part of it's like wait a minute the stock market is not connected at all to what's going on in the world we're in

this pandemic shit's going on stocks go up down whatever but i said i'm going in on airlines spirit was at seven and literally i did this big rant and like five minutes later warren buffett comes out with a press release it's like we're getting out of the airlines at the bottom of the market correct and it was literally i said go in on airlines two seconds later he says get out do you think he was watching the live stream i i don't i wonder if he actually knows who i am i doubt it but so after that stock the the airlines went ballistic yep parabolic is the crypto people like to say and then you know that uh one of my business partners he's got jason williams yeah i know he is yeah he's got he's got a youtube channel called going parabolic the merch and

all that when you started yelling parabolic parabolic's a great word yeah that's like a crypto they should just uh trademark that word it's a very good word yeah so it went nuts and then i'm like oh warren buffett sucks i'm the captain now and like investing.com and business insider took that quote and then from there it was kind of game over ran and i did notice like CNBC they liked having me on a lot more when I was losing and when I started winning it's like they stopped having me on and they didn't want to talk about it but it's also the type of content like it's the memes it's the live streams it's like all this stuff that they don't really know how to deal with right and part of what's so funny and when you started playing around with

bitcoin and crypto like you realize immediately like holy shit these people just meme the hell out of anybody you got a great meme community very very impressive meme community so that's why the mainstream media is like what do we do with these people right because they're literally it's a pseudonymous account that's just throwing out crazy memes and they're just like what the fuck yeah that's my that's so i have nothing crypto right now that is probably the thing i miss the most is the memes although i like the link marines i think are dead they are did you kill them i well what what is it at now eight i mean oh did you all right so hold on let's back up for a second let's talk about bitcoin first i don't know why you bought anything else other than just bitcoin

because the link marines were blowing on my thing about link link link marines it's like i see other shit it's no different the stock market everyone's pumping their own shit all right what questions do you have about bitcoin eight look at that 890 when'd you buy it so i bought it at i think 14 it went to 19 i sold it at 16 oh so you made money then about even yeah uh what well bitcoin you want to see the crypto the 2017 bitcoin is a in my mind just one big ponzi scheme okay why the 2017 video you have by the way bitcoin marty says hello that fucking bitcoin marty he's part of first of all all the people i know in bitcoin bitcoin marty bubbly gang are people caleb that caleb yeah he told me to stop bash he's like you gotta stop bashing bitcoin yeah he came on the

podcast he played it he understands it now i understand what i think you guys think it is to me it is a ponzi scheme that you get in and and you just got to not be the one held left holding the bag i'm going to give you ammo for the finance world and then i'm going to tell you why bitcoin's the solution well i know it is it's gold and pumping money and they're set i mean i the stock market you know you say it always goes up it's like that 45 degree angle correct since 1971 direct 45 degree angle a couple of drops whatever but it's straight up that's because it's denominated in dollars they're just devaluing the dollar right stocks go up if you denominate that same stock market in gold the stock market is down since 1971 it's all the stock market is a

complete scam in terms of accruing value it's all the dollar being devalued so go straight up 45 degree angle but if you denominate it in ounces of gold it's down okay so okay well here's a different language but no here's what here's why it's important to go to mine gold no here's why it's important uh you bought a house right in uh where uh a lot of places i have one there yes okay why'd you buy that house in nantucket i love that place okay i mean i love it that that's not something i was trying to get like i thought i'd live there the rest of my life okay and there wasn't that many to select from right yes okay and because there's not that many the prices are expensive and you have a lot of money so you could buy right yes okay same thing in the digital world

is there's some things that are just scarce and if those things end up having a large community that wants them what ends up happening the price goes up go up correct okay so bitcoin's only got 21 million obviously and the whole thing behind it is the strongest computing power in the world so literally the computer network that runs bitcoin is stronger than anything in the world no government nobody can hack it because it is the strongest computing network in the world it's got more computing power on it than anything else the reason why that's so important is because the whole idea of like why does barstool work it's because you guys are completely decentralized like nobody if they try to like come at you they get attacked by all these other people at barstool

right and that decentralized type media model where you're not going and telling somebody okay send me your thing i'm going to be the editor and then like i'm going to approve it it's just like here's a fucking camera go post on your accounts and like just blow it up right and do it that's the same type of thing that's going on but with money now so rather than the government saying uh hey today we're gonna print more money or remember what happened today with pen where they just all sudden all these new shares right you're like fuck what the hell like i had no say in this right that's basically what the federal reserve does so earlier this year they printed three plus trillion dollars you didn't get a vote i didn't get a vote was fuck okay whatever cash

you have so let's say you're worth 200 mil and let i don't know 30 million dollars in cash right that 30 million dollars of cash if you leave it in cash is gonna be worth less next year worth less next year right because the purchasing power goes down and so what ends up happening is you're financially incentivized to get out of the dollar and buy stocks buy gold but you know buy fucking property whatever but with bitcoin they can't do that because there's only 21 million and a computer runs it so the only way to change the computer is if more than half of the people agree to change what the computer does so there's no person there's no like old guy in a suit who basically is like i think that we should print more money or ah you know what we should take some money

of circulation it no human is involved in making the decision it's the consensus of everyone involved so the reason why it becomes so valuable is because nobody can fuck with it and that's why the bitcoiners are so like rabid about it is they're just like it doesn't matter what anybody says what you think i think anybody nobody can fuck with it and because it's like that on the internet and globally everyone's subjected to the same rules it continues to accrue value because people realize wait a second they're fucking with the dollar they're fucking with the euro they're fucking with the yen the r&b whatever but the only thing you can't fuck with is bitcoin and so as that keeps going you should just take one to five percent of your net worth put in bitcoin

don't look at it just leave it there and that'll be the best performing thing in your entire portfolio if you take one percent out of everything else in your portfolio whether you own real estate stocks anything what's one percent gonna get me well let's say it goes up 20x what's one what's one percent of 200 million i don't have a 200 million but what's one percent so a million dollars i make 20 million and what how long so there's something called the having i'm sure that they've all told you about this but basically the whole idea is every four years the amount of bitcoin that shows up every day gets cut in half so it used to be 50 bitcoin a day or 50 bitcoin every 10 minutes then it was 25 bitcoin every 10 minutes and 12 and a

now it's at 6.25 that just happened in may it got cut in half again every time that that's happened the next 18 months bitcoin's gone up an incredible amount because it's a supply shock right it's like think of it as uh if we all wanted something and then what is even bitcoin at right now like 10 500 do you remember when you first started buying it well i bought way back in the day yeah what was the price more than that was over 10 000 yeah i think so i bought it in that huge rush when everyone was yeah but it was only

it was only above 10,000 for like 20 or 30 days so you would have to really have bad timing I thought it was close to like 20 it went to

it went from 10,000 to 20,000 in 18 days in 2017 so I probably bought around 15 or 16 okay do you still have it

or do you still have it it's lost it was in one of those keychains you lost it yeah that was another part it's like I don't

I don't like having to hold shit in like keychains and weird and like Marty how much how much did you have

Probably like 50 grand. Marty like had to do it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He helped you and then he gave you the wallet. He gave me something with the weirdest code. And you lost it. Yeah, it's gone. Okay.

So I lost that, but I'd be down on that. And that was what? 2017? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you got to remember, but you got to understand that the markets, the way that they work is so that halving happens. It goes up a bunch in prices or supply shock. Usually it takes about 18 months for that to happen. Then it draws down 85%.

It's happened three times already. yeah right well the thing why i say but it's like so i got out i i really this latest round i think i had 1.25 million in it at one point went up went down and then went back and i was like i absolutely don't know what the fuck this is and it's too much money to not like at least with stocks even though i don't believe half the shit they say like okay our stock got tanked today i can do a direct like line to we did the stock offering i know i got or earnings or and what i don't like i think a lot of this bullshit i think the day-to-day like but i understand it's like almost like watching a sports game like all right my team lost i bet a minus two they lost by three

i lose my money bitcoin i have no fucking like there's no rationale why is it going i have no idea why it's going up or down think of like a uh a technology company when barstool first started actually it's a great idea you didn't have a stock price right so it was just every day the only person who saw the pnl or whatever it was if you guys even had one right and if there's a stock price in the early days of barstool it'd be like in the morning it would be through the roof right by the afternoon to be down and it was basically like what you emotionally felt there's highs there was lows it was like super volatile you're like are we gonna fucking survive are we not whatever super super volatile but because you're a private company there's no stock price

so if you think of bitcoin it's really a technology right and it has that same volatility that barstool had or other tech companies have it's just that there's a price associated with it so what you're seeing is you're seeing all that incredible volatility but like imagine if uber the first couple of years what is that what is that based on emotion right now no well it's price discovery right so think if you think of bitcoin people are buying and selling bitcoin to me did you hear about this guy mike uh micro strategy what he did micro i saw that in my travels but i didn't like research it but it was popping up like all my 500 his 500 million dollars on his balance sheet publicly traded company over a billion dollar valuation he took 85 425 million dollars of

out of dollars and put it in bitcoin and the reason he said is if i leave this in cash it's going to get devalued so every year that i sit with this cash it's going to be worth less and less and less so he moved it to bitcoin now that's a really really aggressive move you think right of course but if you think about from a personal perspective one every investment you make you want asymmetry right if you if you think about the best investors in the world they're right like 55 60 percent of the time so all these guys who are like oh i'm right every time they're all fucking right well whoever right they're all full of shit yeah the absolute best investors in the world right 55 to 60 percent of time but they only put trades on where it's like i can lose 10 percent

or i can make 20 times my money right so asymmetric in their favor that they're willing to take kind of the losses 45 percent of the time because the 55 percent of time they're right it just pays for it in space right so what you want to do is create a portfolio of assets that have asymmetry right so pen stock has asymmetry in a sense it's not going to go to zero right and it can go up a lot bitcoin has asymmetry in that yeah maybe it drops down but it drops 10 20 but it also can go to you know hundreds of thousands of dollars right and then what you want is you want a bunch of stuff that's non-correlated so if you have pen stock and then six other stocks and they're all moved together so when pen goes down they go down well then just put it all on fucking pen stock why do

you have all six of them right because they all move together but what you want is you want different types of assets so you want bitcoin you want pen stock you want whatever and then what ends up happening is if pen stocks down that doesn't necessarily mean that bitcoin is up or down there's just no correlation although bitcoin lately lately seems to be tied to what's going on the stock market good observation so in liquidity crisis right and since march basically the reason why the fed pumps so much money in is because everyone fucking panics and says like to me what My original gut was, if you asked me before, like, this would be beneficial to Bitcoin, but it hasn't been. It's the best performing asset this year.

Like from an asset class. It's up like 60%. When you say asset. So think stocks, precious metals, crypto, like whatever, right? So, yes, there are individual stocks that perform better than some. But as a whole, stocks are basically up single digit percentage from year to date. Gold's up like 20%, 25%. Bitcoin's up over 50%.

Right. so it's outperformed all the other ones on like a asset class basis and the whole thing is uh they're pumping all this money people are scared of inflation they run to inflation hedge assets precious metals real estate whatever but bitcoin is the most volatile and so it dropped 50 a single day earlier this year like scares the shit out of people right but then when everything goes up it just goes up more than everything and that doubly scares the shit out of people i think in part of my i know what you're saying like what sakashi or whatever the fuck the guy's there's nobody count i'm an accountability guy so like nicola you know that guy was a fraud and

he's like i like knowing even if you stole my money i like knowing who stole it i can be like this fucking guy so you see i think he deleted his twitter account he did he did yeah he got out he got called out and so to me is that what's worse losing your job or having to delete your twitter account like would you rather get kicked out of barstool or have to delete your twitter account i mean i have no problem deleting i'll just come out it's like michael paper michael scott paper company i got like lots of names i can do so i'm not worried about that but you know that's part of the thing is bitcoin and i get like i understand what you're saying but still there's an unease and maybe it's i also have a like i don't put my toe in the water yeah i

generally like jump in like all right i want to make like 10 grand i don't want to fucking do that i want to put millions into something like if you looked at what i'm doing right now like that's why i got caught with my hand in the cookie jar with my own fucking company it's like but that's how i operate so not knowing being like do you think pen stock or bitcoin performs better through the end of next year it's a tough one but it makes you think well no it makes me think because i if you told me a month ago that pen was gonna be like 75 it's i'd be like that's crazy like we're not going like i i was happy when it hit like 40 i bought it at like 20 so i don't it's an interesting one because it was not only just pen the we we've hit and you could look back

we've hit a legalized vice so i don't think people truly know the market of what we're in And one of the things I keep hearing, whether it's Penn, whether it's DraftKings, anybody, which I have a banana's disagreement with, is, and I haven't really said it, people keep saying the sports book is a gateway drug. It goes to iCasino. All the money is in iCasino. And I think, but that's what everyone says. Yeah, but that's stupid because it's literally a completely different experience. And if you're a degenerate sports gambler, you want to do that. You don't want to go play fucking real life.

but the margins are better on online yeah of course and like picture down the road if we have online blackjack and i'm talking i'm dealing and like that's something people can't but are they there for you are they there for the blackjack like how many how many of the stoolies want to go play what they for most young kids are probably going to assume is a rigged online gambling i see i don't think penny and major companies i don't think they're going to think they're rigged i really like if you're some for the online gambling like the actual like casino correct okay and and if it's set up in a world where at halftime hey go play blackjack for like i think you can do it my point is different i look at because a lot of the brick and mortars pen included it's like

our sports books don't make a ton of money people want it to value go look at casinos how big are the sports books most of them how much real estate do they take up not that much because they're like it's not the money makers the tables and things like that but i equate it and i think this will be something that people are factoring in to online poker and poker if you go to a casino know poker rooms don't make money they don't online poker made a shit ton because there's no wall so the problem i've always thought and it's no different with sports books you need physical space how many people can you put in the sports book not that many but if you run your sports book correctly and you have 50 50 and you're just getting juice and unlimited walls that juice

should be just like the poker that's taking the rake should be wildly well you guys are also promoting it in a way that the entire space has never seen before totally different everything we do will onset even the prop i had yesterday i don't know it's like like you can win a jacket if you do this all this bullshit that you guys are doing like by the way it's genius marketing but they are shook because they don't understand like they don't have the personalities to go do this jamie foxx is not going to be like hey if you do this bet we're going to do some crazy not only that jamie foxx and i like jamie foxx he doesn't give a fuck well it's like jamie foxx has so much money and is doing so many things you think he really cares about pushing mgm sportsbook

and even if you look at the deals which i never understood um if you go to fox bet or terry bradshaw these guys work for the network they don't like my life is in this and a lot of our guys here this this is it like if this fucking thing tanks then i basically fucked myself on how i sold it so i'm not guaranteeing that it works but when you invest in pen or do this or pen invest in us you're getting like my best shot and my only shot really so it's a huge difference and and i love pat like i taught pat how to fucking gamble guy never placed a bet literally till three years ago and he's a jack-of-all-trades so talented but he's doing a lot of fucking things this is it i have like laser focus and at the very least they got my action which is a lot of action

and i always lose are are you moving to philadelphia so i am in philadelphia now i have to be here wednesdays because we film all day and then i head back well we do the show with dion so generally on thursdays so wednesdays i'm in the office filming thursdays generally we can't be on schedule now because the job is all over the place and by friday i'm back in philly till tuesday so it's like four three okay tell me how the dion sanders deal happened so by the way epic epic get dion is a thousand percent better than i ever thought he would be he fits perfectly like you can literally say whatever the fuck you want to him he gets it he knows he's busting balls he doesn't take offense um so were you were you worried that he might yes yeah like hall of famer

he made a lot of the athletes famous athletes or even personalities we've dealt with do not fit in they come from first of all network people and people who have money don't have the work ethic we do we're born from the internet the only way people find out who you are is because you're better funny or worked harder than other people that's it that's the culture here um if you have a lot of money you're an athlete you've been told you're the best your whole life you may have a very different like work ethic than we do um so we we have a podcast out of philly uh million dollars worth of game amazing most underrated podcast there is they're hilarious hilarious so they're friends with dion um and of course they are and they're like hey he's looking and he they did the

introduction and we went to you uh to barstool yeah to erica and i we flew down met with him it's like what do you want um it seemed like a good fit there was a lot going on it's one of those things combo he's expensive we're willing to pay it was a good look for us we had the pen deal going on so it's like football show but he's awesome he's better than and everything's like credibility as well like okay we can compete with these big guys but he's been i don't know how he's going to continue it with the job but he is for those i don't know he just what jackson state is he the head coach yeah head coach did you see his press conference uh i saw a clip of it it's insane it looked like someone said it looked like coming to america it did he had like

this calvary of like cars coming to the gym like people dropping it was very prime time but he's not super prime time off camera yeah like he is but he isn't like he's a guy like that obviously you know if i'm with someone younger and like deon sanders they may be like who's that i'm like really it's like to me he's like he was it two three most famous guys like bo jackson deon sanders like they're it um you ever heard of anybody playing in a football game in a baseball game exactly but but in the shit you can say so i didn't know what to expect because the persona but he's so down to earth and you're gonna be like you what did i say oh a guy from boston dan shaughnessy called him a fraud the other day and i'm a boston guy i'm like hey deon he's like

and you can bust the ball but like you should dump a thing of gator out of his head like mccaffrey's like i fucking hate that guy like he he's he's very real very authentic i didn't know what to expect but he's uh he's as good an athlete to interact with i probably have a handful where i'm who else is up there greg olson yeah i couldn't be it like he's one of the early guys but i'm as comfortable talking to you wasn't he doing the uh the van talk right he left super bowl media day media day because they won't let us in to come talk to us in the van early and by the way there is nothing like i'm a huge loyalty guy like i really really appreciate the guys who were with us before he blew up and in or before they blew up and stay with us um goes a long way

i'm the same way but it is crazy like i went to a party the other day and the hampton is no big deal but it was like i walk in and blake griffin was there he literally like grabs me and like just he's like i love barstool and just grab me we went up and shot the shit in a room for like an hour it's surreal shit like that yeah that that is still stunning the point when i realized like this is no longer barstool of i think that everyone grew up in college whatever on was uh the joe burrow or coach oh whatever interview i was like wait what that was the first interview that they gave yeah how the fuck did this yeah it's great you know we've always been with the athletes very strange because athletes unlike espn where they're out and asking athletes like asked to

come the ones that do well like kevin hayes who's had an unbelievable season for the flyers like i'm legitimately very good friends with these through the system and we got to the point kind of what you said a lot of the guys who play sports now or in the pros they grew up with us like they were reading it in like high school so the the they're like fans and then they know we're not out to get them like we're never trying to get out of people like gotcha quotes we're trying to be funny and interesting give a different look and they appreciate it but i think that's also why you guys are so successful right it's like media is shifting now to nobody cares about what does x you know network how do they take what i said manipulate it take a quote and put their spin on

it like i just want to hear what you say i just want to hear what greg olson says whatever and you guys just created platforms where they come do that and we're protective like i mean kevin hayes like for example we got a video sent to us he didn't do anything wrong he was just making a ruckus on like a chinese food restaurant it was very funny i was like dude like clean it up like we're not gonna post it just heads up so you know we're not it we're not out yeah we're not out trying to make people look bad and we're also one of the few places especially nowadays where like we don't really apologize for hey you like to drink beer and like go fuck chicks like that's like frowned upon somehow now like we don't it's like all right we're guys like we're not we're

not bad we're not what everyone's you're just authentic correct it's just like literally this is what i would do if the camera wasn't here so like if you want to watch watch if not then that's always always the shit that i've heard the negative about me they're always like if he says this on camera imagine what he says off camera it's like that that's the fucking point like You're getting as unfiltered. That's why you're mad to begin with is because I literally said the worst thing I was going to say. Right, right. And that's it.

There's nothing else. I'm talking as if we're not on camera. That's how I am all the time. I've always said the people I don't like. People have come through the walls and like, oh, I like this person. I don't like this person. This person is cool. Put a camera on me 24-7.

You're going to get the same exact person 24-7. A lot of people probably not like that. All right. I got three questions to end it. Yep. Biggest regret you have over the last 17 years? I really don't have many. I've been asked this before and it's like I started one company. It's this.

Did I have like irrational confidence because like maybe other people would quit or whatever? But everything I seem to do has seemed to work. It's been a dream. i mean i started a company in my basement with no money delivering newspapers and got here i would have been happy making 60 grand a year honestly it wasn't about money so it's hard for everything's worked so i don't have business i have i have no regrets all right side note real quick the espn van talk yeah controversy what happened so that that was an interesting point in barstool because part of my take blew up and espn wanted them basically and we're at a point

probably dan and i more so than pft where he's looking his open market value was more than what he was making here it's like kind of like everybody's like how am i gonna you know this is my moment too so espn wanted them i was never comfortable with the deal but uh essentially what happened was and we did that deal why we agreed to that deal was to like basically okay we we can't test it see what happened not only test it we got to let them like stretch the legs and grow they wanted it dan and pft really wanted this deal um so it's like okay we'll try to make it work and at first espn just like wanted to call it like van talk no barstool in it they essentially what they wanted to do was test drive dan pft the contracts would be up in a little bit

it's like they knew they could probably pay them more and it was very obvious to like myself and erica like we know what you're doing so you if you're gonna use our talent you better fucking call it barstool van talk so we did fine this was like a year in the works no i was never comfortable with it um i always felt like they thought it was dirty but we get there and i don't know a day or two after it launches the first episode goes first episode it was a hit it did well okay i mean they put it on i forget it was on like midnight or something in the morning on espn2 um so they put it on they didn't even give you espn they gave you espn2 and it would have it was just smart because you have our audience who's going to watch it and and honestly those two guys are as

talented dan's like the most talented hard-working guy there is so that he's got everything he does worked so it would have worked um and then they cancel it they issue a press release i but i believe or no we found out that they were canceling it and it all stemmed from i talked about sam ponder with dan years and years ago in barstool it's locker room talk and we had a podcast pick them podcast which we still do it's like 10 years old we'd call each other up and we were talking just about the games which we always did and in sam ponder just had a kid and she was toting the kid all over espn game day and we were talking about game and i and we were both going back and forth but it's like you know i don't want to see sam ponder's kid on game day nobody does i'll die

on that hill it's like young who want sam par super hot but nobody wants to see it's like an all-guy show the reason she was hired is she's very attractive knows football another thing i sometimes get in trouble it's not a coincidence most sideline reporters are attractive doesn't mean that's the only requirement you have to be talented but you have to be pretty to look at so it's like talking away it's like i i don't want to see her and her kid on the sideline anymore and i actually said she has to stop being a prude and slut it up that's what i said i'm assuming she didn't like that we didn't know she didn't like it okay we didn't even know so that's an important point you guys never had a conversation okay so but but obviously understandable why she

didn't like that totally yeah and i've said this about her in a respect first of all it's not calling someone a slut i said it's semantics i went back and looked i called my sales guys i just used the word a lot it was different time it was a free word you could use but i was being like we you you go stop yeah stop being yeah so whatever i didn't call her it's like you're being i said the opposite she's got her kid and like but three years pass four years pass and the show gets launched and she starts according to the press reports the crusade against us being like we're going to business with these guys who said this about me four years ago i didn't even know what we said we said a lot so that in that actual respect i was like i do respect sam par she

held the grudge for four years i was gonna say yeah she's a dave portnoy she waited for the moment and she came in guns a blazing and sank it and the quote that john skipper had kill shot yeah yeah and the quote john skipper had was i didn't know that people associate the barstool sports barstool van talk with barstool sports it's like what are you talking he literally said that by the way like two weeks later resign coke addiction best thing ever pup and champagne bottles i was gonna say was that your uh you had a bottle so the samponder where where i differ from sam ponder because that part we said it i have no problem with it she then made up things that i didn't say and just blatant lies so i can say i just said what i said and i wouldn't say it

now and she actually the stoolies being who they are went back and dug up like a thousand tweets of her calling people sluts and shit similar language she apologized like it's like i've changed as a person it's definitely a different world today than it was even five years ago and that's always like deadspin who who you love you despise you know are the first ones to throw stones at me in the past they deleted their entire twitter history all of it and then they'd be like we changed i have always said i won't delete any of my twitter history it's all there it's an open book i've said what i've said times are different i wouldn't say it most of the shit that people dig up on me now is five to ten years old and they were meant to be jokes and it wasn't bad

at the time mostly there might be one or two that people get very upset about right and rightfully so but for the most part most of it there's nothing i ever have said that was with the intent to make people truly feel bad unless i hate you but then i won't use that like the things i say that are trouble or people i don't know or like just in conversation like in a locker room environment if i despise you like ross gerber i'm saying things to wound you on a professional level but like the sam ponder thing came up so organically and we're like talking i would have said it in a different way but the point like nobody wants to see your newborn every single week in all your segments on college game day i would say like that did did that show getting

canceled say fuck it we're not gonna play with the networks anymore pretty much okay that's what it looks like yes and you don't need them i think tv still matters okay and i would love a network our own network but like we do the barcelo sports advisors which i think is pretty much the best football show on tv we tried to build for the internet like literally built for the yeah they tried to say they that we couldn't swear in it like we like to beep out the words they're like you can't swear like all right we're not running we're gonna keep it fresh um that it'll come around i think everything will come around i mean when i did the is tv ready for like what i'll call the internet content like how you use the green screen you have all the graphics like tv's

ready for that definitely okay it goes backward i mean again you look at everything he did get in trouble if you're like you know people just pick and choose the hypocrisy of everything which drives me nuts like jimmy kimmel man show and like that almost if we did that and he did get in some trouble for i think blackface but if he if i did the man show i'd never stop hearing about it ever i never get job and people what i say and do even though we're very clear comedy i've always said what people say about us is you go into a comedy show you don't have a ticket you don't know who the comedian is you hear a joke you don't like you go into the street you'll be like you never believe what this guy says and you give no context of where you heard that's what i feel

like people do to us i don't know how it started i don't know what it is because i think a lot of people now do kind of similar stuff to us but when we say it it hits different i have no idea why you know you just get uh almost labeled as people people are waiting for you to say something and then i double down i get in fights like i don't back down i'm never like oops sorry i shouldn't have said that it's like fuck you it's like a joke you can't take it but is that not the right way to handle it like like in terms of there's some people who say something and they would immediately backtrack and almost like fake apologies yeah and then the crowd or the mob wins right versus if you say something and you mean it and you just stand the line yeah i get a

lot on twitter and anybody like hey when's he gonna learn you're idiot when i'm gonna do this and i turn around it's like why would i change what i'm doing because it's what got us here you know it's like barstool is as successful or more than i ever dreamed by being authentic and just being kind of myself and by the way my friends i'm like just a combative person and even like kevin who's sitting over here is relatively new like i'm pretty mean and straightforward and then i forget about it like five minutes later like that's how i am people can come in and like yell at me i don't really care that's just that's my personality that's fair yeah are you gonna buy one percent of uh net worth in bitcoin i'll get back i've been saying

i'll get back in bitcoin all right i don't know what i mean like so you should you should do it and then just wait till the end of next year i you know you can't look at it because you got weekends like you'll sell it that somebody made me like a mini pair of mittens like i love the did they did they sent me did you did you see all the uh the replies to the question i asked yesterday i said you wish i asked them the week 50 of them or just ask them how how does he how does he eat with such weak hands how does he listen everyone thinks i'm like some the the i know i knew i had to be involved in crypto within like 15 minutes of starting to see the response like oh these are kind of my people and the best memes like that vindog is

good well vindog's the best i mean if you if you go if you go vindog versus bitcoiners who who wins the meme dog i don't know they're relentless they're it's one man versus an army how many live action memes have you seen from the bitcoiners not listen if you if you put the challenge out categories if you put the challenge out then the bitcoins are going to send you live action memes and they're and you're going to literally run out of money hiring all of them for live action means are good i listen i they are good vindog is one of the best oh vindog is right on the perfect line of you can't tell whether he's serious or not because his actual memes are all like super pg so it's like he he puts your face on like a baseball and hits like

a home run himself like there is no answer for that there is no answer for the vindog he's out in his yard like drop kicking his son and that's probably why we in the crypto like i don't know how many of them have actually like know who vindog is or saw it but there's very few people on our side of the world like when i saw vindog like i knew it was higher like oh my god i have a nuclear meme weapon sitting here it's like well i need this guy instantly hired we we literally he was a shop teacher that we hired um he's like what about my social all that's like dude just you're gonna make memes for us and kill people but no the crypto i love you you talked a uh somebody who was about to get social security i had to take social security to come make memes

for barstool memes like a lot you've been a shop teacher for like 40 years um the yeah i i'll get back in my finances are so weird it's like i i do like knowing what i have i have so much in flux with pen um in my own day trading account like you you cannot answer this but what do you do you just keep a bunch of cash or is it all in pen no i i i have so you strike me as a guy who's like super risky with a majority correct but then you're also like i probably should keep more cash than most because i know i'm crazy and we'll do crazy dumb risky things i'm pretty much pushing at all times like i uh so i have my own day trading account which is now about even so i was down three i was up four and now i think right now i'm like dead even because the last two weeks

i've gotten lost like four mil um and then i have a like a investment that i'm not like day trading but if you looked at what it is it's still pretty risky and i just like buying pen because it's like me is that what it is all pen yeah no i probably have like i have like pen i have amazon oh so it's stock portfolio correct okay yes um but i don't have much like liquid really it's all invested yeah you're not sitting with like 10 million dollars in my bank account i'm sitting with like nothing in the bank i was all invested it's all invested which by the way is a smart strategy right now given the fact that they're going to devalue the dollar and well i don't know it's the it depends who you talk to everyone says no but i mean again i'm young enough so it's like

i'm not what are you 42 43 so like amazon i don't care if amazon goes down it's coming back like the amazon's fucking what's bezos shopify like those you had an amazon warehouse in your uh apartment correct yeah so those thoughts i have zero zero fear or anything like that of um you know the ones that i'm risking on like the the energy cars and shit like that not the teslas but like the younger ones and even like i said i don't think anyone knows this space the gambling i will be safe but i think the majority it's a race to the bottom for a lot of the i think there'll be a ton of consolidation in the online gambling space that's fair uh last question every saturday dominoes mainly because it's just super you do every saturday every saturday for

real for real where do you live in new york 44th and 3rd what do you do what do you mean what like you're sitting here with me like i saw your like what do you do dominoes is the inflection point well it it it raises credibility issue so like it does if that's like what you're eating well i was what i was gonna ask it just every saturday one meal and i was gonna ask where i'm assuming that you've done a pizza review for it dominoes dominoes yeah it's not good no no that's why it raised credibility issues what would you remember what you ranked how many times you think you've dominoes last year over under five times i do dominoes it's it's the i can't remember the dominoes stock outperformed amazon the total would be half well it was the pandemic was very good no

No, no, no. The last five years. Oh, five years. Really? Domino's outperformed Amazon? Crushed it. That's impossible. I'm going to show you a Domino's outperformed Amazon. I don't believe that.

Here's why. Because the mobile ordering, they've absolutely crushed it. I don't believe that, though. All right. Well, when I show you, you're going to go buy Domino's stock now. Here. Look at this fucking chart. dominoes you're showing me stuff but that all right that's a good chart but i still

that's from 2010 to 2018 so eight years absolutely crushed amazon apple facebook and google so you didn't answer though what do you do what's your do a bunch of stuff all right what invest build a company what company i've got a whole digital content thing okay so right now these these are vague so are you like a professional well i'm here to ask you questions well no i'm that's what i'm trying to figure out like what what is it uh so i've got a couple of funds right that i invest all early stage technology are you just an investor is that what you say professional investor yeah so i invest what's like your net worth are you rich huh rich enough are you richer than me no okay but where'd you make your money yet where how

investing and then starting like you just took your own money and started oh no no i did other things i worked at facebook and other places stuff like that too but uh and then i've got a uh podcast got a email i'm on it right now you're on it right now correct top 10 tech podcasts in the u.s got it and uh there's obviously very good business to be in um that's what by the way i always like the ross garbers of the world do you like him huh i i'm cool with everybody he's a cock but and a used car salesman but i love guys like what that guy do what guy is he just uh but here but here's the thing right so but did he ever do like guys like that who chirp at me it's like dude what are you talking like he like what you have to remember but so here's the thing a lot of those

guys you got to remember they have built businesses it's just not the type of business what he built well that's what i'm saying he the place that he built right is an asset management firm now it's a completely different business than actually selling products or doing anything like that but it's always a weird thing who can't do teach like what is this quote he said at me where uh today this guy this guy really got underneath your skin well someone when you were coming in i saw somebody tweet at me be like ask him a girl because he's on your show oh yeah he came on the podcast a bunch of the finance guys have yeah because right you know why those guys need fucking publicity because they gotta fucking

sell their junk bonds to the fucking unknowing old ladies and steal their pensions you realize that their uh their argument back would be that you're trying to get people to gamble totally but i'm honest about what i'm doing yeah but like that's that's also why it works this this ross gerber pen gaming issued a ton of stock as we called that secondary from a mile away pen is out of money with 41 bleeding casinos they used pump dave to pump the stock and now the dump that's that's just a blatant lie that's an absolute lie did you respond uh my response was hey ross remember when you begged me to come on your podcast and i stuffed you in a locker all right you deleted it he did delete it because you are a used car salesman who lies and cheats

and deletes whenever they're wrong you should be in jail for stealing hard people's life savings with the screenshot he did ask me to come on he's like come on my podcast i was like hey i've hey i have an idea suck my dick you realize that people in finance are not used to that type of reaction well this guy would this guy thinks he like i don't have a memory like he called me an idiot for not he literally he's all right so the only reason i know who he is he reached out to me is like basically in so many words said you're too dumb to invest your money give it to me and i'll invest it i've seen plenty of people like you make money and blow it it's like who the fuck is this guy so i said i like talked about it basically like who the fuck is this guy and by the

way if you're out on twitter trolling for people who invest that's not who i want to invest with i want to invest with people who i have to wine and dine them that's who i want to give my money to is like no we don't want your money your money's no good here like that's who i want to give my money not some fucking junk bond guy who's like hey give me your money on fucking twitter to a rando who would ever give your money to that that's not how it works like you're gonna find somebody who's so exclusive that they don't want more people not fucking ross gerber do you do you have anyone who manages any of your money i have one guy but it's like a collab issue yeah all right but so you're not doing it all yourself the no i have a guy like jp more yeah who like helps

oh you like work with the suits at the bank that call him a suit you probably but again it's the same way like so in an endearing way yeah there's somebody who like i do you send him emails hey suit will you if his socks are down like the suits you you and your suits you're fucking killing me but he's actually been more conservative like you should sell it's like no we're fucking pushing push push but uh like so there was a guy i know who started a hedge fund like through a friend or a friend and it was the same words like i'll try to introduce you it was hard to find somebody who's comfortable with not fucking this guy who was wearing rent-a-tux on the fucking social media begging people hold on go back to dominoes for a second you don't remember if you did a review or

I actually thought I'd bid it, but I think it's pizza hot. I don't think I've ever done it. Yeah, I've never done Domino's. I'm telling you. I'll order the pizza. I've had Domino's. No, no, no. Lately?

Sober? No. Yeah, exactly. If you eat it sober, you're going to be shocked. Stock's outperformed. I'll do a review. All right, you do a Domino's review. That doesn't mean it's good.

Well, people keep buying it. Yeah, but that doesn't mean it's good. Do you keep buying shitty pizza? a lot of people would buy like there's plenty of no no but do you no i don't all right but i mean you could use there's plenty of stocks of food stocks i probably don't like that like kentucky fried chicken which i actually can't but fast food mcdonald's i don't like mcdonald's oh that's blasphemous at least we feel bad i mean i like the taste i don't like the after effects well that's fine yeah but you enjoy it when you're eating it yeah of course that's that's what makes it great

all right that's it guys appreciate it thanks no problem