The Pomp Podcast - #932 Enes Freedom On The Corporate Profits Behind Human Rights Violations

Episode Date: April 25, 2022

Enes Freedom is an NBA Player and Activist. In this conversation, we discuss Enes growing up in Turkey, China's human rights violations, speaking up for what he believes in and his recent conflicts with the NBA and Players Association. ======================= Choice is a new self-directed IRA product that I'm really excited about. If you are listening to this, you are likely part of the 7.1 million bitcoin owners who have retirement accounts with dollars in them, but not bitcoin. I was in that situation too. Now you can actually buy real Bitcoin in your retirement account. I'm talking about owning your private keys and using tax-advantaged dollars to do it too. Absolute game changer. https://www.retirewithchoice.com/pomp ======================= Imagine coinmarketcap - decentralized. 3X in valuation is 15 billion dollars from the current price. Cryptotoday.com starts at zero, at fair launch on 7th of March. No VC. No pre-sale. Team tokens locked.  For the people, by the people. For decentralized crypto. Visit http://cryptotoday.com and read the whitepaper for the details.

What's up, everyone? This is Anthony Pompliano. Most of you know me as Pomp. You're listening to the Pomp Podcast, simply the best podcast out there. Now let's kick this thing off. Ennis Freedom is an NBA player who's also been very outspoken about a number of different issues around the world. Heed in this conversation, we talk about Turkey, China, and a number of the issues that Ennis has been speaking out about. I really enjoyed this conversation and I hope that you enjoy it as well. Before we get into this episode, I first want to talk about our sponsors. This episode is brought to you by BlockFi. BlockFi provides financial products for crypto investors. Those products include the BlockFi wallet, a US dollar loan

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today.com started out at $0 as the first decentralized token information site. You can read the white paper at crypto today.com. Again, go to crypto today.com to learn more. All right, let's get in this episode. I hope you guys enjoyed this one. Anthony Pompliano runs Pomp Investments. All views of him and the guests on his podcast are solely their opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Pomp Investments. You should not treat any opinion expressed by Pomp or his guests as a specific inducement to make a particular investment or follow a particular strategy, but only as an expression of his personal opinion. This podcast is for informational purposes only. Enos, I think you're there. How are you? Hi, guys. How you doing? We're doing

fantastic. Dude, I'm so excited to talk to you. I feel like you've got a very unique perspective on the world and uh a lot of uh courage as well which uh frankly society is lacking these days but uh thank you for inviting me it's an honor yeah let's maybe start uh with you've born in switzerland obviously grew up in turkey live in the united states like when you think about just the various places you've lived and then obviously with all the international play etc like you've been to so many different cultures and stuff like what are the commonalities among the cultures like i think that's actually like a really interesting place to start of like we always think of these geographic lines on a map meaning that like you versus me versus somebody else whatever

but i'm guessing that most of it is like actual we're humans and we're like pretty common across the board is that was your experience for sure you know i obviously i born in switzerland i grew up in turkey and i pretty much like lived in america i think one beautiful thing america is like you can find every you know culture and religion and all kind of people all kind of food actually in here that's the beauty of america you know but other than that i mean obviously there are lots of differences uh obviously politically uh about you know the some people economy obviously and stuff but other than that i think that what i found in america is just it definitely brings people together because you have people from all over the world um you know

different cultures and actually uh some of the red turkish restaurants that i've been to in america is better than the one i what i had in the turkey all right if you guys ever in like la or new jersey area especially or new york it's what especially in actually there are some really good ones in miami too i have not tried it yet but yeah so they got some really good ones be careful you're gonna offend all the turkish people tell them that the turkish restaurants in america are better uh so i i do think that this is a great point though right of like there's commonalities and obviously uh america is like this melting pot people from all over the world um is kind of a very unique uh unique experience

uh you changed your last name officially uh to freedom my first question is is it only with all caps or uh or is it actually lowercase as well let's start with a fun question uh how do you how do you actually write it when you're like filling out a legal document you know it is no it is all small but i make it big on like social media so people like really understand you know especially sir so no it's it's it's actually there's a funny story behind it um in 2009 was the first time i came to america right and i was going to prep school here and one of my teammates criticized the president and i was like oh my god he's he's about to be in jail tomorrow right i was like very scared of him because where i grew up you criticize the

government you'll be in jail the next day anyway i turned around and i told him i was like dude i saw your post you know you just criticized the president and he's like so what he's like i was like i was very afraid for him because i thought he was going to be in jail the next day and he turned around and said dude like don't worry this is not turkey this is america and i was like very like confused like what do you mean well he tried to explain to me what freedom means freedom of speech, religion, expression, media. And I was still very confused because I did not have that growing up, you know?

But the more I meet with people, the more I talk to people and experience it, I was like, wow, this is something amazing, you know? And then that's why I wanted to change it. Yeah, it's incredible. And obviously you've been critical of a number of different governments. And so maybe in some way, America like red pilled you

And you're like, oh, you can do this and you'll be able to do it on social media, et cetera. But let's start maybe with like the Turkish government. I think that was really the first time that I personally heard any of this. Maybe what are the issues that are going on there that people should be aware of? And then also, like, why did you choose to speak out about it, given that, you know, playing in the NBA and kind of having all of these things that for most people would be this amazing life and everything going in your favor? Like, why even bother with it? I'll tell you the whole story. You know, I got drafted in 2011. I mean, my first two years in the league, all I cared about was just playing basketball and, you know, having fun with my teammates. That's literally all I cared about. Well, then my third year in the league, it was back in 2013, there was a big corruption scandal happened in Turkey.

President Erdogan and his family was involved in it. And, you know, as a basketball player, you know, I was like looking at to see what's happening in my country. You know, this dude was putting innocent people in jail, you know, police, prosecutors, judges and innocent people. and he was going around and shutting down media outlets whoever talk about this you know corruption scandal and i was like i don't care who you are but if you if you're gonna fight against you know free press and if you're gonna start putting journalists into jail i'm gonna say something so i like very simply like tweet something out right and because of the nba platform it became a conversation here in the united states and uh turkey and i was like even

one simple tweet can change this much from now on i'm gonna start you know paying attention about what's going on in my country more you know so i was like my teammates were going out to parties and hanging out and stuff i was going back home i started to study about you know the relationships between turkey and america middle east what's happening in my country and stuff and i was like the more i studied the more i started to talk and the really big you know like media outlets in America and newspapers and magazines started to give me a platform and I started to write op-eds and give interviews and you know started to do some panels and discussions and stuff and obviously Turkish government hated that every time I say something it was becoming a conversation so that

the things that I talked about affected me and my family my dad was a genetic professor he got fired from his job. My sister went to medical school for six years. She still cannot find a job. I think the saddest one was my little brother because he wanted to be like his big brother. He wanted to play in NBA, but he was getting kicked out of every team because of the same last name. He was so young. I couldn't really explain him why he was getting kicked out. So they started to get affected so much. They had to put a statement out there and said, we are disowning venice publicly i remember going to practice that day was definitely one of the most like toughest day you know and uh turkish government didn't believe that they sent police to my house

in turkey and they raided the whole house and they took every electronics away phones computers laptops ipads because they wanted to see if i absolutely in contact with my family or not which they couldn't find any evidence but they still took my dad in jail for a while but we put so much pressure from here to turkey with media with politicians then they let him go they had to but you know then after that they revoked my passport they actually tried to kidnap me romania it's all over the internet you guys can check it out what happened there um so i landed in romania right i give my pass because there was like a big event i give my uh passport to this passport lady, she started to look. She said, hold on a second. She went in the

back. She came out with the police and said, I'm sorry, you are not allowed to get in the country because your passport has been revoked. And so they put my name on Interpol list. So in the Turkish government, if you're in Turkey and criticize the government, you'll be in jail the next day. But if you're outside of Turkey, criticizing the government, they put your name more interpolist right and then whichever country you're in they have to deport you back to turkey because of the interpol arrest warning so they detained us in airport and there was two police was actually watching me and one of them was a big basketball fan he came to me and said you guys have two hours it was me and my manager you guys have two you guys have two hours to leave this

country if not because i get deported back to turkey and i started to tax and call the senators i know the congressmen i know the nba mdp at the player association even some of the players because because the more pressure you put on the romanian government that will be easier easier for us to get out that uh detained detained so i'm glad luckily many of the uh senators worked and we got out but it it was very crazy so like when that happens you're sitting there and they're like we're going to deport you back to turkey you probably think that there's bad shit that's going to happen if that occurs uh what do you do like can you not just go buy a plane ticket and get on the plane like do you have to get the senators to like get a special plane to come get

you like what happens not a special plane but so just because of they revoked our passport we are not allowed to fly you know i have no passport um so i remember texting senator lankford so back then i was playing for oklahoma city thunder so i texted you know senator james lankford i'm like hey senator i'm stuck in romania and they detained me and i need to leave here as soon as possible so he worked with homeland security and stuff so like they brought me back i'm glad they brought me back um because if if it was happened to me if i was going if i was if i went back to turkey it would be a very ugly situation i didn't want to think about it you know because i mean there are so many reports out there saying that there are thousands of people innocent people in jail

right now getting tortured and raped and these reports are like embassy international human rights sports human rights foundation so these are some like legit reports you know so like it would be a very very ugly situation so when you think about this uh you became more and more vocal over time does your family still live in uh turkey yeah they i mean so last time i saw my family was back in 2015 they unfortunately there is no communication i have another brother plays basketball in poland so i talked to my brother and my brother talks to my family about like if you ever want to communicate that stuff yeah but right now they're scared because i mean the last four or five years there's been so many people media outlets and politicians and stuff

behind us now every time like they touch my family it becomes like international news so like they're they're scared yeah and then when you went from the turkish government right i think that uh people were like okay cool he uh he's uh grew up in turkey he understands kind of what's going on there and then at some point i saw you start talking about the chinese government and i think that's when i was like oh okay hold on a second this isn't just going to be like i'm going to criticize my own government this is like there's a bigger story here and so walk me through kind of the evolution from just the turkish government to kind of other you know oppressions that are happening around the world so the last 10 years when i was in the league i only focused on one

dictatorship obviously because of my my plate was so full because of my family there my family was stuff we've been trying to bring him over here for years now and it's been eight years you know so and they were they're having some very you know tough times over there but just past summer I'm doing a basketball camp right and after we had an amazing camp with the kids free basketball camp and after the camp kids came and we were taking pictures and I was you know signing autographs one by one. And I took a picture with this kid, and his parents called me out in front of everybody. And he said, how can you call yourself a human rights activist when your Muslim brothers and sisters are getting tortured and raped every day in concentration camps in China? I was like,

and media was there, parents, kids, other people, my friends. I was so shocked. I was just like, didn't know what to say or what to do anyway and I'm still smiling for the picture anyway I turn around I'm like I promise I'm gonna get back to you so that day I canceled everything right I went back to my hotel I started to you know study about what Uyghurs are going through I mean I grew up as a you know Dalai Lama fan so I looked at what Tibetans are going through too I already knew about hong kong because two years ago when you know general manager of houston rockers tweet something it became a huge mess in nba i you know i already knew about taiwan because i was wanted to go to another another conference between china and taiwan and also i started research about

mongolia so i was like seeing all the human right abuses one by one right i was so ashamed with myself i'm like i cannot believe the last 10 years i only focused on one big data ship So I promised myself, I was like, whatever it takes, I'm just going to go out there and just speak up. And that's how I started to talk about other dictatorships. And it wasn't only China, because there are human rights abuses happening all over the world. You look at, I don't know, like Venezuela, Cuba, North Korea, Iran, Russia,

and we can go on and on. So I wanted to speak up for all these people, not just for the people that in my country got it and so when you think about this it feels like um if you spend enough time studying you will find this happening in every single country and people in the united states this makes them very uncomfortable to talk about but even the united states has things that uh if folks were educated on they would say hey i didn't know that was going on that feels like um um it's wrong right right and so when you think about uh you as one person you have this platform right having uh played in the nba for so long and and uh uh

really caring about this stuff but is there like a prioritization in your mind of like if i can i talk about all of them should i just focus on one or two of them like how do you think through you know where to focus your time energy etc given that you're just one person so i was i was hoping once i started to talk about these issues you know others will join me you know other players or even coaches or not just the people in them or athletes in nba because i did this right before the winter olympics i'm like god i was praying every day i'm like god please send me one athlete it doesn't have to be a basketball player it doesn't have to be an nba player anyone to join me to talk about these issues you know um i mean i reached out to so

many people so many athletes so many celebrities i mean unfortunately there's not one person wanted to stand right next to me um you know i asked them like like dude you know you talk about all the human right abuse is happening here and good good for you it's amazing and i'm with you um but what about there i mean human is human you know um well they're like well listen we love you I think what you're doing is so amazing. We support you. We just cannot do it out loud because we have shoe deals, endorsement deals, you know, jersey sales or family defeat and stuff.

I was asking one question all to Olympians, NBA players, athletes in different organizations. I was like, if your mother, if your sister or your daughter was in those concentration camps getting tortured and raped every day, would you still remain silent? No one answers. and you know when i started to you know research and start to study i mean obviously on the internet you can't find all kind of news good news bad news fake news because i called my manager i

was like i want you to find me a concentration camp survivor obviously he was very shocked he was like what are you talking about i was like i want to talk to one so he found me a woman that was in concentration camps a couple years ago and she told me about some of the stories that happening in there i don't know if the kids are watching this podcast or not i don't want to go into details but some of the things that she told me it was like mind-blowing she told me about gang rape and torture and forced abortion sterilization and how many people dying in there every day so like i was like i don't care how much money or business or more if you carry a heart you have to you know say something about these people you have to support these people and

every time a person who has a platform says something it becomes a conversation and actually it helps people over there you know so i mean unfortunately there's not one athlete wanted to you know join me but i mean it is what it is yeah well one of the things that um i think is unique about your situation is uh the platform that you've got uh as an nba player uh also afforded the opportunity to financially make money and so once you get to a certain point i'm assuming that uh you don't strike me as a guy who uh has 17 private jets and 14 yachts and you don't have a house or a car i don't even have a house or a car all right so i'm assuming the money you made in the nba right there's a an ability for you to kind of weather the the

financial blowback right of you're not playing in the nba right now sponsorships like all these things that uh you were able to do for a number of years um you got the platform and you're able to kind of financially get there. And so in some way in society, there's actually a group of people who have that ability. They have a platform and also they've got enough money

where once they start to kind of speak out, they anticipate it. They know what is going to be the blowback. And so I think that it's even more so like you have more to lose than the average person, which makes this whole thing kind of a pretty incredible.

I mean, people always talk about like, dude, was it worth it? I mean, you talk about, you know, the things that are happening in China and you lost your job but like i always tell them like listen i i want to talk about the issues that happen in my country i lost my family just because i talk about the issues that are happening in turkey i haven't seen my family since 2015 you know but people are always asking me that question but i was like listen man my family is only one there are thousands of families in jail

or around the world right now are suffering you know you look at the numbers there's actually a really uh good uh uh web page it's like uh turkeypersh.com and you go there you can see all the numbers you know it right now so far last time i checked there were there were 17,000 innocent women or almost over 800 babies and kids are in the jail right now with their mother waiting for help and these women innocent women are worked in a place like a media outlet or a newspaper or school or whatever that said something against the government and that's their only crime that that's what the what they put my dad in jail just because of he was my father you know so it is this is it it is bigger than basketball because it is bigger than making

millions of dollars or it is bigger than beer you know so i mean just it's i hope that people can see that yeah i've got two of my brothers here with me uh joe john what questions uh you guys got my question would just be around how you feel the nba has handled this specifically right you've obviously been very outspoken and i think some of the things you mentioned earlier and i think everyone's aware that these are sometimes topic uh topics that they shy away from what is your general feeling and your general take on just kind of how they've treated the situation with you speaking out against these injustices i mean they handled horribly because i mean so let me give an example last 10 years right i talk about the issues are happening in turkey i did not get

one phone call only phone calls or text messages text messages I was getting are support from the NBA support from Adam Silver Adam Silver texted me twice on my phone and said listen whatever you need let me know when the Turkish stuff was when the Turkish issues were happening and so I did not get one phone call so this China thing happened right my phone was ringing once every hour what you doing so i the how i did it was very colorful because when i was a kid right when i went whenever i watched an nba game the first thing i was like looking at an nba player was the shoes what color it is what bread it is if it's comfortable you know uh and stuff so i wanted to do it in a very unique way where it's going to inspire millions of kids out there so whichever

abuse are happening in the world or in China, I put that abuse on my shoes. I work with one of the artists that are being oppressed or abused by their government. And we put this 100% American made, no slave labor, no sweatshops shoes. We created those and then we put the art on it and went out there and played. So my first game, I wore a free Tibet shoes, right? So I wore the shoes i went out there to warm up it was a medicine square garden actually in new york and we sang the national anthem and we were in a team huddle while we were in a team huddle there there's two gentlemen from the celtics you know boston celtics came to me and said we are begging you please take your shoes off your shoes have been getting so much attention that they're calling

us from the nba you have to you have to take those shoes off and i was shocked because i looked at the rules there is not one single rule that says that i'm not allowed to wear those shoes anyway i was like i'm not gonna take my shoes off because i'm not breaking any rules i was like i don't care if i get fined and they said we're not talking about fine we're talking about getting banned and i was shocked i was like it was the perfect moment because i was getting i was just getting ready for my citizenship test and i remember i'm like okay there are 27 amendments My first time I met Freedom of Speech, I was like, I'm not taking my shoes off. This is my Freedom of Speech, right?

So that game, I played zero minutes. Prior to that game, I played every game. So at halftime, I went back to my locker room. Obviously, there were thousands of notifications in my phone. And I clicked on my manager's text message. He said, every Celtics game are banned in China. so it took them 24 minutes to ban every celtics game in chinese television i was like wow that clearly shows that the censorship you know um so that was like mind-blowing to me but then i was

like after the game nba called me obviously and they're like sorry not nba mbpa because the player association used to work for us well in this situation they were working for the nba you know So they're like, NBA is pressuring us so much. You cannot wear those shoes ever again. I was like, dude, I'm not breaking any rules. Like, you know, they said, we know, but please work with us. Don't wear those shoes ever again. They bugged me and they were bothering me and my manager so much.

I was like, sure. I promise you, I'm not going to wear free Tibet shoes ever again. So the next game, right, I wore a free Uyghur shoe. They called me after the game. They were like, you're a liar, blah, blah, blah, right? I was like, I never told you that I'm not going to wear free Uyghur shoes. I just said, I'm just not going to wear

free Tibet shoes, right? And at that point, it was over. You know, it was just me and them was just like, was not the best friends after that. Ines, would you say that the NBA has tried to silence you? Like, is that what you're basically saying is that they, on multiple occasions, publicly were saying, hey, we're behind this.

Like we believe in free speech, but behind closed doors, they were doing the exact opposite. A hundred percent. They're hypocrites. Let me, let me, let me just tell you this two years ago, right? When we were all in NBA bubble and they were all about social justice, they were all about standing for, standing for freedom, standing for, you know, the things that happened in America. And I was like, this is amazing. Cool. You know, finally NBA is standing for something for bigger than basketball.

and two years later this happened there is not one player there is not one officials one coach or anyone stand right next to me and same time they were they try to silence me so i now now they've been exposed right and they hate they hate that now there's not one we are actually messaging mbpa the player association right which we pay every month so much money to them and the only thing they they have to do is just protect us they're not even returning my calls are there are there any players that uh uh tried to get you to stop talking about it like are there any like uh conversations you have with other players uh that were either very supportive or uh or very anti this uh i don't want to say i mean they were always like silently supporting me you know they

never be like i mean they said just listen only i remember like the first time i started to talk about this issue i started to talk about nike and china right they're like listen man i think what you're doing is so amazing but just know that this is your last year in the league you're not going to get another contract you you're not gonna you you're gonna say something nike you'll be out of the league you're gonna say something about the things that happen in china you're gonna be out of league i mean think about this just last year more people watched nba games in china than american population so it's crazy uh i'm also uh inferring from all the things i've read online uh you and lebron don't go to each other's birthday parties like you guys aren't uh

aren't as friendly as maybe in the past definitely not no no no we don't i mean i mean people are people are thinking that i'm attacking him right it's not it's not just him right i want i obviously he is the face of nike i mean he is the face of nba so whenever i call him out it's not just him it's about you know his company that he works with or like you know the other players that who is signed with nike or some other companies who has something to do with their slave labors right so um it's not just him that i'm calling out i'm not just picking him and attacking him but it is all the players out there who pretends to care about uh social justice or not not just the players but the companies right uh so pretends to care about social justice but when it comes to obviously

whenever the things that they talk about affects their pocket affects their money or business they will be silenced i got one more question i think john's got a question we'll let you go uh my question is um we are seeing the united states uh and other countries other types of sports other events i think wimbledon just did this and a number of others all start to um attack silence ban uh suspend etc russian athletes from participating uh given the conflict that's going there one of the things about censorship or you know some of these issues that i always think about is like is it just as long as these people agree with the u.s we're cool with it or is it that we think it's bad always and so what are your thoughts in terms of let's say

wimbledon not allowing the russian players to participate given actions that their country is taking but not necessarily them themselves the question you're asking me is is basically like what are your thoughts about these other leagues that appear to be punishing players from certain countries but again the nba etc you know there's no uh uh there's no punishment for players from uh china or turkey or any of this type of stuff it's basically almost like ad hoc sometimes they want to punish sometimes they don't and it's almost like when are we cool with it when are we not that's the that's the one thing that i'm asking like whenever i do an interview or write an op-ed if you know right now russia is attacking ukraine

right and then you see all the you know players are getting banned or all the companies or ceos be being getting pulled out pulled out there if the china if it happens the china's attacking taiwan with the same ceo same companies or same people or whatever will do the same thing i don't think so you know and i hope it won't happen you never know with the china but that is the one question i'm always asking myself we're asking for people with the ceos or companies or other people uh will pull out from the china or not yeah it's fascinating john what question you got and it seems that you're trying to inspire education are we good he's shutting his phone yeah i'm doing an interview give me one second i'm gonna hold back

give me one second i'm talking freedom i'm in a hotel so like they just keep they just keep calling you're a busy man we got you we got one more question then we're good i'll be quick you're clearly trying to inspire change in the world what does that change look like what do you mean like what's your goal yeah it seems like you're trying to help people get educated about the things people being oppressed around the world what does the change look like that can happen to uh get the world in a better place i mean first of all people are always asking me whenever i do an interview or panel um i mean i don't have an nba platform or i'm not a politician or an athlete how can i help i mean you might not change the

whole world but you might change someone's world that is one and the least you can do is when you see when you're gonna buy something when you're gonna when you pick that item when you see made in china put it down that's the least you can do you know i think for my dream world i just because of experiencing from firsthand i see how this ccp is pretty much controlling so many american-made companies and like wall street academias hollywood uh sports world some of the you know congress of local congress so i feel like we need to understand that like they are trying to invade us from the inside because they know they cannot try to they cannot invade us from the outside you know so i I think for, we just passed a bill, it goes Uyghur Prevention Act.

I mean, if you have anything to do with slave labor, you're not allowed to step into America, you know. So that is actually a plus. But it is happening, but it just happened very slowly. But I just need the people to understand and people to wake up that, you know, they are trying to, like, you know, pretty much they are controlling American-made organizations, their companies. And I feel like, you know, people need to wake up and they need some courage. And someone had to open that door because I was experiencing from firsthand. They're talking about all the problems that are happening around the world, but when it comes to China, they're remaining silent. So I think my perfect dream is like the oldest, you know, things like, you know, Big Tech and Wall Street and Academia or Hollywood and sports world, you know, to be wake up and not go down to a Chinese government.

Appreciate that. It's a great answer. Where can we send people to find you on the internet or find out more about the work you're doing? Well, I mean, they can follow me on social media. It's pretty much at NSFreedom or I have a website, nsfreedom.org. You know, they can just go there and actually they can just see all the shoes

that I've been creating. So it's very simple. Just click on it and yeah. Awesome, man. Listen, thank you so much for all the work you're doing. I think people are learning quite a bit from you. So keep going and we'll definitely bring you back as you continue this.

Thank you so much. I appreciate that. All right, buddy. Have a great day. Thanks so much for listening to today's episode. I really hope you guys enjoyed this one. Make sure you're subscribed on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcast player.

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packed into that three-week time period. go to pompscryptocourse.com to learn more and i'll meet you guys for the next episode