The Pomp Podcast - Bitcoin vs Silver: The Ultimate Rotation Is Happening Right Now | Jordi Visser

Episode Date: January 24, 2026

Jordi Visser is a veteran macro investor with 30+ years of market experience and the author of the VisserLabs Substack. This was recorded live at the Real Vision 2026 Crypto Gathering. In this conversation, we discuss the scarcity trade across markets, bitcoin’s potential short squeeze, silver’s role as a critical industrial metal, and the inflation vs. deflation debate. We also explore how AI, robotics, and productivity shifts could reshape markets in the years ahead.=======================Award-winning Fountain Life - Energy supercharged. Memory sharper. Life extended. Ready for the best investment you’ll ever make? Schedule a life-changing call at FountainLife.com/Pomp Get $1,000 off the cost of a life-changing membership with Fountain Life when you schedule a call at FountainLife.com/pomp=======================BitcoinIRA: Buy, sell, and swap 80+ cryptocurrencies in your retirement account. Take 3 minutes to open your account & get connected to a team of IRA specialists that will guide you through every step of the process. Go to https://bitcoinira.com/pomp/ to earn up to $1,000 in rewards.=======================Sign up for the Gemini Credit Card: ⁠https://gemini.com/pomp⁠#GeminiCreditCard #CryptoRewards This video is sponsored by Gemini. All opinions expressed are my own and not influenced or endorsed by Gemini. Gemini-branded credit products are issued by WebBank. For more information regarding fees, interest, and other cost information, see Rates & Fees: ⁠https://gemini.com/legal/cardholder-agreement ⁠Some exclusions apply to instant rewards; these are deposited when the transaction posts. 4% back is available on up to $300 in spend per month for a year (then 1% on all other Gas, EV charging, and transit purchases that month). Spend cycle will refresh on the 1st of each calendar month. See Rewards Program Terms for details: ⁠https://gemini.com/legal/credit-card-rewards-agreement ⁠Checking if you’re eligible will not impact your credit score. If you’re eligible and choose to proceed, a hard credit inquiry will be conducted that can impact your credit score. Eligibility does not guarantee approval.=======================0:00 – Intro1:21 – Bitcoin, silver & the coming scarcity trade6:36 – Politics, Davos & why it doesn’t matter for markets9:52 – Inflation vs deflation13:10 – Why is bitcoin’s price not higher right now?18:18 – Quantum risk & bitcoin security19:55 – OpenAI, AI competition & monetization25:28 – Elon Musk, Tesla & humanoid robots31:59 – Robotaxis, dark factories & the future of labor38:43 – How small businesses should use AI42:34 – Strategy & bitcoin as collateral45:08 – Robotics, vision models & what’s next

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What's up, everyone? This is Anthony Pompliano. Many of you know me as Pomp. You're listening to the Pomp Podcast, which is my effort to find the most interesting people in the world and sit with them for hours while I ask questions in an effort to learn. So it would mean the world to me if you would subscribe to the show on your favorite audio platform, watch episodes on YouTube, and tell your friends and family about the podcast. My goal is to help millions learn from the world's most interesting people. So let's get into today's episode. Anthony Pompliano runs Pomp Investments. All views of him and the guests on his podcast are solely their opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Pomp Investments. You should not treat any opinion expressed by Pomp or his guests as a

specific inducement to make a particular investment or follow a particular strategy, but only as an expression of his personal opinion. This podcast is for informational purposes only. There is a short squeeze coming in this name guys it will come so the things you're seeing in silver will happen in bitcoin and i think it's going to happen this year or next year and so i don't care whether it goes down to 75 first what i care about is i don't want to be chasing it when it's 300 because i'm telling you for people who didn't listen to me on micron they're all telling asking me when it's going to pull back far enough because they missed it once something goes up fast in these banana zones you don't get a chance to get in all right we are here at the real vision 2026 event

uh jordan this is the first live podcast that we've ever uh done together um i think that the big story this week is everyone is really interested in precious metals uh there are two components to this that i think are interesting one is uh maybe the explosive moves in a lot of these metals but also maybe the breadth of how many metals are involved i saw somebody call it metals mania so that's what i'm going to go with what are your thoughts on metals mania let's see last year we were here and we all had bananas around our neck and so now we've got massive banana zones happening in high bin with memory related stocks in silver not as much gold but you've got a lot of equities that are doing it um i want to break something apart because i've

heard silver here mentioned more than any macro conference i've been at in my lifetime silver is not a precious metal guys so i hate to break everyone's kind of association with it it might be in there it is a critical mineral for technology so if you guys haven't spent the time on it i am writing a paper because it's beyond me that people don't understand yet that drones are the new tanks drones take an enormous amount of silver and they are disposable, they get blown up, and then you build another one. So the percentage of silver that is necessary for drones compared to tanks, off the charts.

Every single part of technology, everything, semiconductors, solar, massive for solar, so the energy that powers. You're going to start to hear more and more over the course of this year, people talk about this. So Venezuela, Greenland, I'm giving you some inside information. Something will go on with Cuba very, very soon for the exact same reason. Part of it is strategic from a military basis, but part of it is also making sure that the hemisphere does not have Russia, China, Iran, and also that the critical minerals that are in all of these places are also something that the U.S. has access to.

So all of this stuff is happening, and I think when you're looking at things like silver, it again gets brought back into artificial intelligence. So I've seen people break down the market into utility-based metals, which I think is what you're highlighting here, that these are being used. My friend Will Clemente had a really interesting approach. He's thinking about this from an investment standpoint. He said, well, from the lessons I've learned in crypto, people normally rotate from Bitcoin to ETH to altcoins. That's kind of the capital rotation. And when Bitcoin runs, then you kind of move through that cycle. So he really big brained it and he was like, well, gold and silver, copper, platinum, and there's kind of this rotation. It does look like platinum and some others are starting to

run here. I recently saw Stanley Druckenmiller talk about how the copper market is the tightest he's ever seen in his career. What about things outside of gold and silver? And is that just a utility story or are there other things going on there? Well, two things about it. Chris Perkins and I were talking about this at breakfast this morning. Same exact argument. And it's one of the reasons why on the Sunday YouTube, when I get into the charts of Bitcoin, I've been showing lately utility over Bitcoin. So think of Ethereum over Bitcoin as very similar to silver over gold. gold was leading silver was lagging and then the utility function kicked in and everything kicked in really during the summertime if you do an overlay of micron technology stock relative to

silver you'll see a very similar pattern now here's the way i want to kind of break it down for you guys because jensen yuang says this but so you get this whole like process of going from energy. So think of it as anything you want, gas, oil, but the physical fossil fuel side, it needs eventually to be converted into intelligence. With inside that conversion are two tracks. One shortage is in high bandwidth memory. That is the chips that are necessary. So the reason Micron, SanDisk, Western Digital, SK Hynix, Samsung have all gone banana zone is because there's a scarcity right now relative to the demand. There's a race to buy this in massive size. On the other side, you have the conversion in the efficiency side for energy. And that's

where transformers fit in, gas turbines fit in, silver fits in. Silver fits in on both components. You're just at a point where all of the utility side, those charts are going higher. And so eventually you will get to the point and this is why ethereum to me will be the one to watch for the breakout and then bitcoin will go with it because we're now at a point where people are talking about silver they're not talking about gold as much and the reason is because silver is going up at two times the pace of gold and i think you'll start to see that in crypto the same way all right we got to talk about the big event of the week which was uh donald trump scott besant J.D. Vance, these guys, this was like their Super Bowl.

They went to Davos, and I got the sense at the beginning of the week that he sent all of his squad, and his squad went, and they were kind of really hitting the Davos elitist crowd with some pointed critiques. And my view was going to be that Trump was doing that so that the administration could soften up the Davos crowd, and then he would come in, he'd look like a good guy, He'd be really nice and welcoming, and maybe the warm temperature of collectivism might take hold.

He savaged the – Mark Carney, he was just exactly what you would have expected two or three weeks before. Greenland, all of a sudden, it looks like there's some sort of agreement there. it feels like the administration's commentary and the stock market are so interconnected at this point that you almost have to be a political pundit to be an investor how do you look at davos and its impact on asset prices it's a story this week and it'll be forgotten next week Every week, there's something new. So we went in, we got Maduro. There's an event every week.

Who? Forgot about that guy already. I think they're gone the following week. So earnings are growing at 15% this year, and the economy is growing at 4% or 5%. None of this matters in terms of what's going to happen to the stock market over the course of the year. Will there be movements for a day like we saw this week? Yeah. But by the end of the week, we'll start to focus again on what's happening with earnings and what's happening with commodities and the story that's going in.

I want to bring up one more thing and just make sure, because this is an important point. When we're talking about commodities, there's an oversupply of fossil fuels. So this is very 1970-ish. And from an investor standpoint, that's where you should go back and do your homework. Small caps, value, commodity-related names. So far this year, energy and materials are the two best-performing sectors in the stock market. tech is the second worst. I think that's what this year will be about. I think everyone that's been sitting in software names and everything related to abundance is going to be in trouble

and commodities are going to be a theme. But the only thing that traditionally takes down that theme is when energy prices spike too high and you get actually a demand shock and you start, that's not going to happen this time because we have an oversupply. Silver does not matter to the cost of a data center. It does not matter to almost anything. It does to your iPhone. So your iPhone costs are going to go up, but whether the iPhone is $800 or $900 is not going to change the demand side. So you're going to see this play out in a very different way. This is a reflationary boom. This is not the 1970s where the stock market went sideways for this. You're going to see everything continue to move higher. So if you get caught in the geopolitical stuff,

unless there's literally a war that happens on the grounds of the United States, it's not going to matter man it's crazy stuff that's happened all year who knows all right um trueflation lowest reading that we've had in a long time 1.2 percent um the government still up in the mid to high twos are you worried about inflation or deflation deflation will be the next fear that will be real i think we'll have an inflation i don't know what you call it it won't be a scare but inflation will will will go higher this year i'm sure from where it is now but nothing that matters and the only reason i say that is because eventually high bandwidth memory less important you know on the silver side high bandwidth memory

prices, DRAM prices. I mean, they're up 500% since September. So that's going to filter through the technology side, but that's not a big part of inflation. As long as oil doesn't go higher, you're not going to see the transfer side. So I don't expect inflation to go meaningfully higher. And that's the part that I say, a reflationary boom is where you have inflation happening, but the stock market is going higher at the same time. Precious metals are going higher. You're going to have Fed rate cuts this year. I mean, this is a situation where if you're not involved in the market, I think you're really dealing with trouble. The deflationary aspect, I don't agree with what was discussed.

And I think you said it, so I'll disagree with you. Yes. Finally, we can disagree. I think deflation is massively positive for Bitcoin. Wait, explain that. I disagree. Perfect. Yeah. I don't subscribe to the fact that this has been a move to avoiding inflation.

So that's a nice story that fits in. This is about jobs. So if you go back and you say, well, this is to hedge against inflation. This is about voting in New York City for socialism. This is about having the consumer confidence level sitting at 50 year lows. we're having a societal break that's what bitcoin is about for me deflation makes that societal break happen now and that's going to be heading in that path which means the disruption from ai is just starting everyone in here has heard about humanoids humanoids will be a fear at some point very soon there is no way for anyone to look at what's coming down the road and i was

having this discussion with an older investor who you've all heard of this week. And I literally said, how are you going to feel at your age when there's a humanoid walking down the street in six years? How is that going to feel? What are you going to think about? Have you put that in your mind of how to invest now until then? Bitcoin will benefit all the way through humanoid. So I don't view it as an inflation thing. I view it as a deflation thing. And I always have believed that. And I think the reason is, and someone mentioned it on the stage, I lived in Brazil. I talked to people who had money confiscated from their account. This is not about stealing money a little bit a day while you have a job.

This is about stealing money a little bit every day where you either don't have a job or you're worried how you're going to be able to afford a house. So I think Bitcoin is a different story. Why do you think Bitcoin's price is not higher right now? Well, it's higher than it was two and a half years ago. So it's a moment in time. here's some simple math for people to kind of get through and let's just because i wrote a paper on this about a silent ipo a redistribution so glass node has kind of estimated that over the course of the last two years and i picked two years because of the etf we've had about

two million bitcoin sold and about a million worth a million and change of bitcoin bought by etfs you're kind of offsetting things and this transfer is happening i don't see wealth management and larry fink changing that at any point that has continued to grow stable coin market cap has continued to grow. So on the one side, I've got the network effects. On the other side, I have the redistribution, getting OG whales to sell, of which for everyone out there who's wondering why they're selling, if you owned a billion dollars of Bitcoin and you weren't selling it, you guys should all leave here. There's no reason to have all of that money tied up into one asset, especially at a time where you should be worried about quantum. You should be worried

about it. Not that it is a real risk, but you have to diversify your portfolio. And if you have that much money in one asset, it should be redistributed. There's other opportunities. So I think the redistribution story has kept us unchanged for the last year. But again, part of it was what happened last year, coming into this event when we all had bananas around our neck. You ended up with a situation where retail got burned immediately. We had a meme coin come out. that frustrated people then as the year went on we had liberation day so all of a sudden the president who was supposed to be pro-crypto had events that were going on that didn't seemingly care and then we had the event on october 10th so i think really what's happened is right now

the energy of this market is you guys it's retail and everyone here wants to buy it when it's going higher nobody wants to buy it when it's been sitting down here so i fully expect that we'll get a breakout. I think Ethereum will lead it for the utility reasons. So I think we're in the utility phase. And when it does happen, the next time we get above 100,000 in Bitcoin, I don't think it's going to turn around and go back. I also thought, and I, again, have bought more Bitcoin over the course of the last two months than at any time in my lifetime. That's how much I feel that this year is going to be a big year, because I do think that the conversation, which we had talked about before, there is a short squeeze coming in this name, guys. It will come. So the

things you're seeing in silver will happen in Bitcoin. And I think it's going to happen this year or next year. And so I don't care whether it goes down to 75 first. What I care about is I don't want to be chasing it when it's 300, because I'm telling you for people who didn't listen to me on Micron, they're all telling, asking me when it's going to pull back far enough because they missed it. Once something goes up fast in these banana zones, you don't get a chance to get in. Today's episode is brought to you by Fountain Life. Are you ready to seize the day that will change your life guaranteed you invest in wealth creation every single day but what's the point of it without an optimal health span award-winning fountain life is the

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You mentioned the Q word. You're not supposed to do that. The what word? Quantum. The Q word. Are you worried about that? I saw this past week, I think it was Jeffries put out a piece that they are very worried about quantum. I think they may even be recommending now people don't buy Bitcoin, if I understood it correctly, because of the quantum risk.

i think raul said it exactly the way i would say it and i have said it on the show why people care about bitcoin when quantum comes in is some marketing thing that has stuck with people if a nation state gets quantum why do they care about getting the bitcoin that isn't stored somewhere. I just don't see the relevance when you could go into bank accounts and get 20 times the number in the U.S. You could go set off nukes. You could go do whatever you want. So I don't see how a nation state would care about an asset which is so tiny relative to all the assets in the world. I mean, we're talking about $2 trillion asset in a world that is $500 to $800 trillion. It's an odd lot. It does not matter. It wouldn't change anything. And trust me,

in the traditional finance world, when Bitcoin falls, everyone then extrapolates and goes, well, microstrategy is going to go over. This is going to be a domino effect. The economy is going to go into recession. The asset's too small. So I don't worry about quantum at all. And that gets aside from the fact that it's technology. So as quantum gets further ahead, the defense mechanisms get further ahead as well. You're talking about Bitcoin from an enterprise versus consumer standpoint, the retail investor, and this transition to an institutional investor? AI is going through a similar thing.

You have OpenAI, which is very consumer heavy for a lot of their revenue, but you also have Anthropic, which is much more enterprise heavy. Dario from Anthropic was sharpshooting a little bit in Davos and he was amplifying the concerns around OpenAI's ability to drive revenue and how hard consumer is, et cetera.

I know that you've got some thoughts around OpenAI talking about adding ads and this kind of pursuit of revenue? Are you worried about open AI at all? Before I answer this, I just got to take a little redirect here. I'm dressed like I'm in Miami. You're dressed like you're in New York.

I'm wiping sand off my face from yoga this morning. You look like you've been sleeping all day. Well, as the people who were at dinner with me last night, I did get a good night of sleep. I was with you, so I was not. All right. Yoga? Yeah.

Morning yoga. Nah, it's not for me. There was a spot right next to me for you. I woke up this morning. I did a lot of push-ups. Same thing. There you go. Different name.

All right. I'm going back to New York, by the way, into a snowstorm. You're going to probably hang out and enjoy the weather. Yeah. The OpenAI thing is probably going to be the most important story for the stock market this year in terms of how this plays out. If you ask me and you put together a timeline of all the events over the course of the last year, there's a lot of desperation showing up for them to get revenues. They've made a consumer bet. I use ChatGPT more than the other ones, nowhere near as much as it used to be.

But let's say 30% of my time is on ChatGPT. That's low. That's low. Yeah. Well, it's gone down significantly. It was probably 70 a year ago. I didn't use Gemini almost at all a year ago, and now Gemini is third, Anthropic and Claude is number two,

but that's mainly because of the recent coding advancements. Regardless of the numbers, this is going to become a problem for them because I think the majority of their users are using it for Google search reasons. When I talk to consumers, they use it as literally an answer system. They don't use it for anything tech-wise, and that's the problem. If you ask me, they're getting the lowest adoption users, and they're kind of depending on ads, and I think that's why they said they're coming out with ads. All of the other ones, Perplexity Finance, Gemini, used for all deep research, all consulting things for sure.

It's my number one tool for it. Claude has gone completely with Anthropic down the enterprise that is dominating that part. They've all kind of taken their niche. Grok will be the best model, I'm sure, once the rollout comes out of Grok 5, just because of the leapfrogging. And Grok is an interesting one because it's already integrated into a Tesla.

It's already integrated in a lot of different ways. I think ChachiBT has got some problems. It's a valuable asset. It's a valuable brand. But they just don't have the users to actually make money off of it. And so in the case of Anthropic, Their revenues are up to $9 billion, I think they said.

It's like half of OpenAI? Half of OpenAI, and the losses for OpenAI are now supposed to be $14 billion. The problem you're going to run into with this is their valuation is significantly above Anthropix, and it's wrong. And what you've seen in Oracle stock price, which is back down to new lows, is representative of the fears on OpenAI. So I do think this is going to be a fear. It's not systemic, but I do think it's another problem for the tech stocks. You want to be in scarcity. And the problem with OpenAI at the end of the day is unlimited competition.

So they had a huge lead. Normally, when you get that kind of a lead and you've won the brand recognition, you usually win or at least it gives you a long time to lose it. They lost it in less than a year. It's impossible that things move this fast. But that's what we're in, is the constant leapfrogging every single month, the exponential change. Human beings' brains can't deal with this, and that's what's happening, and this is going to continue. So I think there's going to be risk with them this year. I don't trust Sam Altman, and he was the only one.

Well, perplexity is kind of a lower tier, but of the four big boys, he was the only one not at Davos, and he was rumored to be in the Middle East trying to raise $50 billion. So that's another desperate act. You don't trust Sam? How can you trust a guy who had a mutiny, the board tried, like, go through the stuff with Microsoft not that long ago, and then go to the BG2 podcast with Brad Gerstner when he basically walked off and couldn't answer the question directly, said, I'll find people to buy your shares. Like, there's a lot of warning signs there with them that stand out more than just what's showing up on the desperation. By the way, Gemini said they wouldn't do ads. And Demis Hassabis on stage two days ago in Davos said, I was very surprised that OpenAI said they were going to try to monetize ads now.

So, again, it's all lining up that they're desperate to raise cash and SoftBank's connected to them. And I think that's always historically been a bad sign for the winners. Let's talk about the big dog, Elon Musk. He's got self-driving cars. I think people now recognize, right, they've got the taxis on the road. I saw people now are reporting, you know, hey, I got to wait seven minutes. The robo taxi will pick me up. Uber was 20 bucks.

This is like $1.50. That's a big gap. So we know that that is at least in production and people are starting to adopt it. We know full self-driving for people who own the Teslas. He now is changing the business model to become subscription. He recently in the last 24 hours said that he's going to raise the price in the future as full self-driving becomes more and more valuable. So he is giving himself the option of price elasticity. And then the humanoid robots, he's now saying that it sounds like 2027.

He thinks that these will be out in production in the world. People will be interacting with them, et cetera. So you've got kind of what I'll call Tesla AI-related robotics. At the same time, XAI, I mean, this guy has got his hair on fire. They are building multiple facilities, and I think these are the largest data centers in the world. They also are starting to show kind of the power in all of these rankings or benchmarking tests that Grok is very, very good compared to these other models. And he is maybe the only person who has figured out how to vertically integrate their model into a consumer product because now the X algorithm is being run by AI. And so when I look at this, it seems like he has the most pervasive or expansive AI portfolio or empire.

Does that give him an advantage or a disadvantage as we move forward compared to some of these other companies where, you know, Anthropic is an enterprise AI, et cetera? Like, how do you look at Elon playing into this? Because he's playing it in a very different way. it's a long time since a year ago when he was awkwardly dancing on stage at the post post inauguration and getting memes thrown all over the place and then being hated around the world i prefer two years ago when he sat on stage with andrew ross sorkin and he told the advertisers to go f themselves and then said let me make sure you were clear so i i own tesla i think it will be the best performing of the mag seven and the reason is

because i believe this is the beginning of the physical world and integrating ai into it and the fact that we have a problem with silver is an indication of the problem in fact i tweet i posted this week elon effectively speaking about silver so if you don't trust my judgment on how silver is not a precious metal. Just look at the thing that I posted this week, which was reposting something Elon posted, I think three months ago, highlighting the danger of silver

in the industrial process. He didn't mention it as a precious metal. He mentioned it as an industrial metal. So here's the person who out of all of the leaders at Davos, of which he spoke as well, he's not a coder, he's an engineer. he's a vertical scale builder he understands the importance of vertical integration he understands the importance of being able to produce enough robots and cars to not have it take five years

and he's built this out the gigafactory is a massive structure one of the largest structures in the world he built that a long time ago and his expectations of it so if you take that he's going to bring an IPO this year with SpaceX for $1.5 trillion. And XAI will be after that. And he will probably bring XAI into Tesla. Tesla, XAI, and SpaceX as a combined group, you have to really put your brain to the test and think about what his end game is and then go back and look what his plan is, then try to think of any human being you've ever read about in any book to scale in this proportion and to be this prepared with a 10-year plan and to be doubted by everyone on Wall Street, to not be trusted. So what he's doing right now is beyond comprehension

and the stock trades at a very high quote-unquote fundamental value, meaning there is no valuation for it. But I think this year, the things you mentioned are all real happening now. You left out one thing. With the full self-driving, we should have the rollout, according to him, in Europe and China this year as well. This is a big deal. And I think more people need to spend time on it. I think it changes the way people think, again, about the shortages and the scarcity. He has thought about everything vertical integration, which, again, gets into scarcity. Ladies and gentlemen, as you know, I scour the world trying to find ways to help you make money, make better decisions financially, or try to figure out what to do in your portfolio.

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things i don't hear people talking about as much anymore is tesla's impact on the other car manufacturers we know that the ford ceo went to china he basically he scared the hell out of people. He came back and said, this BYD guys, they're going to put us out of business. There will be no Ford. Tesla, obviously, with these robo taxis, do consumers not want to own their own car anymore? Is there regulation where if it is whatever 10 times safer for self-driving, do we ban human drivers? How do you think about this market developing? Because you're not just talking about consumer preference at this point. You now are talking about cost and safety. And so Insurance costs are 50% lower.

If you can prove that you can save lives, I mean, I don't know. There's got to be a politician somewhere who says, screw it, let's ban human drivers. So let's start on this question with what the Ford CEO said when he came back from China. If you guys haven't read this, just type in, I forget the Ford CEO's name, but just type in Ford CEO Dark Factories China, and you'll get the story. And this is after he had- Jim something, right? Jim something?

it's not jim ford but it's jim so um basically his horror and this was a year after he had said that he he purchased a xiaomi and drove it around for a while and could not believe how much better the car was than ford cars and said they were screwed then he went to china and visited to go see the quote-unquote dark factories now a dark factory is called the dark factory because there's no humans in it it's all run by robotics and humanoids china's already there elon musk will be there. No US car manufacturer will be there. So effectively, this is the only way that you'll be able to have cars cheap enough for human beings to buy. So when people ask me questions and they try to come up with ways that there won't be deflationary, all you have to do is

look about what he says it'll cost for a humanoid and what it'll cost for a car. The only way to reduce the cost dramatically is that the number one cost that's associated with a car is not the parts. It's not the steel. It is the labor that's involved. That's the most expensive cost of anything. And so if he has humanoids building everything and it's 24-7, the cost drops dramatically. I said this last week when we did the podcast. I said it on mine. Average hourly, the weekly hours in the payroll numbers that come out are 34, about 34. So in the U.S., it's about 34 hours per week is what a worker puts in. When you extrapolate the cigarette breaks, the lunch breaks, the pantry talk, the flirting, and everything else that goes associated

with people in an office, you're probably down to 20 hours. A robot will work 168 hours a week. That means they're eight times more productive right off the bat. You can see where the cost of making anything will be down dramatically. There's no injuries involved. There's nothing that happens. You don't have people quitting. There's no strikes. It changes the entire game on the industrial side, and that's what's coming. And in the case of five years, the six-year talk is walking down the street. With Inside the Plants, if you listen to Moonshots, you heard MIT grads, Dave Blunden and Peter Diamandis, talk about what they saw in there, and they were astonished at what he had built, including an aluminum smelter inside the Gigafactory that was

spitting out car parts from aluminum cans this is how much the guy has thought about everything and this is where he is on like on top of the uh the planet from thinking about things jim farley jim farley there he's uh in trouble for sure um when you think about uh these dark factories you're talking about cars are there going to be dark corporations right like people keep talking about like one person companies i now one of the things i think i see online that's pretty cool is people are buying these like mac minis and they're like well screw it i'm not going to use the computer for myself they're setting up like its own gmail account its own github its own credit card its own you know phone number email like all that

kind of stuff and they're basically just like turning this thing loose well if you can do it for one. Why don't you just do it for like a thousand? So Raul said something interesting yesterday. I've never mentioned NFTs. We've never talked about NFTs, but I had a, I had a conversation with someone this week about NFTs and just related to what Raul said. And it gets into your question about dark companies. I wrote a sub stack about context this week, and all of you have heard prompt engineering. If you really want to get good answers, you need to have better prompts. The problem is everything in our life is human to human. So you can have robots making everything. You can have digital employees and AI agents executing, but they're executing and

they're building for people. They're not building for other robots. They're building at the end for some consumption by humans. And the human-to-human contact, in my opinion, will never stop. People will not watch the humanoid Olympics. Nobody here is going to sit there and want to hear the story of how this robot was made from a poor upbringing and everything. You want to hear the Olympic story about how they overcame everything. There's a reason why Rocky was a big movie and Rudy is a big movie. And the underdog wins is something that resonates with people. They all have this human experience that they want. There's a reason why baseball cards are still collected and Babe Ruth cards and all of these things have lasted. And it's a reflection of human beings being

attached to memories. So I don't think until we get through the contextual part, which I don't know how long that's going to take. And just so you know, when a waiter comes to the table and you say you want a steak, the context is, how do you want it cooked? We're at that point where the contextual side of what you need for everything in a prompt, what you actually need from the prompt, you have to give it more context. When you go to the doctor, the doctor needs context to figure out what's wrong. Well, my knee hurts. Give me the context. Tell me why it hurts, when it started, when you notice it. the context has become important. And until we get to the point where our feelings and the things

that are inside of us can actually be identified by this, we're not going to have dark companies. It's not coming soon. Second thing we disagree on. Fucking good day, Jordy. Two things to disagree on. All right. We got a lot more than that. Yeah, that is true. Let's do three questions real quick. Who's got questions? Go. Just yell. I'll repeat it. Damn, I don't need to repeat anything. Go ahead. I appreciate you sharing your journey with AI and how you use it. You talk a lot for big companies. I'm curious what guidance you might have for small service-based companies. Context.

I'm a coach. My wife and I are business partners, small business, small team, executive coaching. When I ask AI, how can we use it? It gives some boring answers. Microsoft. Create a clone of yourself and do the Palo Alto or whatever else. So, two parts to the question. One is, what would you suggest might be something interesting

to look at in the service of a small business company? And secondly, what would you suggest how we use LLMs to figure that out for us? The question, just real quick, is how do smaller businesses use AI compared to the large companies and how do you think about actually making

it productive? Number one, it can absolutely help any small business in any person. Here's my suggestion for you to do with your wife immediately. First of all, as someone who writes, when you, if you sat down with a blank piece of paper and I had to write, I mean, I write three to four papers a week. I need to come up with an idea that I think will resonate with the people reading them. And I need to organize my thoughts in a way that creates an outline. And I've gotten very good as like a mini movie writer, where if I asked you, what's the secret behind writing? When you go see a movie, you think it's an hour and a half. It's not. It's like, divide that by 90 seconds. It's 90 second scenes. And that's the

way I break down a paper as I go through it. The way to get off the blank paper fear to where you sit down and you're like, what am I going to write about? I can't write a paper if I have a blank piece of paper. What I need to do is talk. Because when you go from writing something, thinking to writing, that actually makes it hard. So what I would highly recommend is you click the little, you and your wife sit down, and you click the little button on your laptop in ChatGPT, and you just start talking about what you want from it. What do you want it to do for you? And what I would do at the end is, if you think there's anything we forgot that will help you. I call it Socratic mode. So Socrates, the difference between Socrates and

Plato and Aristotle. Socrates was a question thing. Let's go into Socrates mode. Ask me the questions. And you can do that from the beginning. We have this business. We're looking for ways that we can get from here to here. You just have to define what you're trying to accomplish to help what you guys are doing. You can say to it, go into Socratic mode. Ask me the things that you think you need to hear from us that it can go. But I would first just hit that button and speak for as long as you want. It could be three minutes. And when you hit done, it'll take what's there. Then you hit the enter button. You'll be shocked that by conversing with it as opposed to text, and we've all been trained to use our keyboards. It's stupid. I speak to it all day long. And that

means my questions or my prompts are, I mean, they're three minutes long. So as I'm speaking there, you guys could have hit it and said, what did he just say? And it's going to give an answer. That's what I would do is just explain it to it, see what comes. And if you don't like the answer, say, hey, we wanted to get to this point. What questions do you need us to answer to help you give us a better answer? If you start doing that, you'll get it. Every person, every business can use it that way. So you use the AI as an executive coach for the executive coach? Yeah. It's pretty smart, right? All right. How has Jordy's thoughts on microstrategy or strategy evolved? well when i looked at the pnl for my trading account last year my investment account

if micro strategy wasn't included it was phenomenal um so i i still have it i've actually bought more in the last 48 hours nothing has changed in terms of the moat story um i think they own four percent now no what do they own of the of the total 21 million 700,000 Bitcoin. You're the mathematician. So it's close to four. Nothing has changed. So my moat story on it is all dependent on where Bitcoin goes higher. This last year had two major problems. And this is the way my impression of Bitcoin's importance goes in the world and the premium. The premium is a representation, obviously, of the sentiment of retail. It's a representation of the volatility and the underlying security. They're both at historic lows. So until we actually get it moving

the other direction, the premium should stay at very tight levels, particularly after all the DATs and everything that went on last year. Nothing has changed in terms of the moat story, which is when we get into the collateral side of the importance of Bitcoin, which I do believe is going to be a major story. As tokenization happens, it's going to matter who actually owns the Bitcoin, who can post it as collateral, who can use it for expanding their business. I've always believed in microstrategy as the capital structure of the future. Stablecoins are changing the capital structure of the future by impacting the way transactions have.

Tokenization, both real world assets, but also on-chain assets, new things that are happening, those collide this year. So microstrategy just needs Bitcoin to trade higher, it needs Ethereum to trade higher, it needs volatility to pick back up, it needs the banana zone. And then once that comes, it'll be viewed differently as a business. But unfortunately for right now, it's just caught again in what is effectively a bear market where Bitcoin is unchanged from a year ago, which is kind of astonishing that we could be at the same price we were in December of last year. But the feeling at this place and everyone I talk to is one of like horror.

Micro strategy has been bad. So that's my take. Last question. the question is uh all of the ais are mainly based on llms but jordy has previously talked about vlms how long will it take for those to have an impact so they've already had an impact um, they have been rolling out, but so let me, let me do the first part. Anything multimodal at this point takes visual language. So if you've seen the advancements in nano banana, if you've ever used nano banana, if you haven't, and I'm not kidding you, when I went outside and he was yelling at me and I came back in nicely, I was nicely. Yes. I literally put a prompt in for a

visual that I'll use in my weekly video on nano banana, which just ran now. So I'll have a surprise when I get in. To do anything multimodal, the advancements have been there. So the VLMs are already happening. The Blackwell situation is really important for you guys to understand. I've talked about it a lot, but Blackwell's efficiency in chips is significantly over the hoppers, which are now we're selling to China. This is a dramatic increase in efficiency. Rubin behind it will be another dramatic thing. So you'll go from needing, you know, 10 gigawatts to one gigawatt to power. That's how efficient the gains will be over these two. So you need that kind of efficiency and power to be able to do video. And one of the places that we've made

advances is obviously Colossus. And that's one of the reasons why full self-driving is so important, because that is the ultimate of the VLMs. That is absolutely what's happening. VLMs are the stage before VLAs, which are vision, language, action. That gets into humanoids. For that, we actually need it to be so strong that it can be inside locally. And that gets into the on-premise side. But full self-driving already has that.

So think about it at the training level, they've already been doing this. So it's happening now. It's being rolled out. But Blackwell's rollout starts really in big form this year. And really when Grok 5 comes out, that'll be when we truly get to experience how much better this training model is based on Blackwell. All right. We're going to do something. Jordy's going to be really mad, but it's okay.

It's worth it. A lot of you have come up to me in the last 24 hours and you've told me how much you enjoy listening to him on Saturday and Sundays. What you don't know is Jordy puts in an incredible amount of work to do both of those things. And so I figured that maybe when we say goodbye right now, you guys could all stand up and give him a standing ovation to say thank you for all the knowledge over the last year or so so thank you very much jordy thank all of you all right everyone