The Prepper Broadcasting Network - Church & State - Pursuing Truth with Kristina Karamo

Episode Date: February 17, 2026

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Pocan Valley could become a sanctuary city of a different kind. I'm proposing that the city of Spokane Valley issue of proclamation stating that our city is a Second Amendment sanctuary. Welcome to the fire. Today on Church and State Pursuing the Truth with Christina Karamo. Hello Christian Patriots and welcome to Church and State where we drive morality and religion over tolerance and apathy. And I'm your host, Caleb Collier, once again your favorite far-right shock jock and the show that talks about politics and religion. Jesus Christ is our referee, so it's always nice and clean. Real quick, I'm going to point you to church and state.

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Now, where you are going to be pursuing truth with Christina Karamo, sorry, she's American politician, was actually the Republican nominee for Michigan Secretary of State and was elected chairwoman of the Michigan Republican Party, where she had quite the experience battling for liberty, freedom, truth, and the establishment did not like her. Christina, thank you for joining us on Church and State. Thank you so much for having me on. I appreciate it.

It is a pleasure. I got to tell you, as I've gotten to know you, you're me, basically. I mean, we agree on so much. And as we were talking before the show, like, we almost forgot we were having a show. We were just having a conversation. And then, you know, Chris, the producers over here, like, you guys going to start at any time. But I love this. I love how in unison you and I are when we're observing what's going on politically,

within religions. It's just very refreshing. Yeah, no, thank you for having me on. Likewise, because it's a lot of people like us out there who are constitutionalists, who love America, who ultimately, number one, our heaven is our home and our focus is Christ, and we realize that we've been manipulated and tricked, and we're tired of the Hagellian dialectic, you know, and just because we're pushing back against a Hagellian dialectic, that doesn't mean we've softened or weakened our positions as constitutionalists. Oh, no, to the contrary. Many of us have dug our feet down in the

deeper, but we realize that our enemy is not our fellow Americans who may disagree with us. Our enemy is this construct, this globalist cult, who actually has infiltrated to institutions of America, and namely our party, who intentionally make the Republican Party controlled opposition because I'm so tired of these people who preach faith family freedom on a campaign trail, they show up at our banquets, they show up at our dinners, but then they go to our state capitals, our county commissioners, they go to D.C. and they betray us every single time. I mean, we as Republicans right now control all three branches of government. All three.

It is no reason we shouldn't have sheer just ramming down the Marxist throat constitutional legislation. It's no excuse. It's no reason except for these impostors. They want to distract us on petty minor issues that since some of these are real issues, don't get me wrong. But then when it's time to play like abortion, which is a real issue, then they can abolish abortion, but they're not going to do it. Because a lot of them are poor abortion themselves.

I mean, look what the, look what happened at the 20. for convention when a Republican Party changed our abortion stands as in the party platform from life being from conception till national natural death to now we're just against late-term abortion. So it's just any rate. It's

extremely frustrating. I mean, we just had this Melania documentary that everybody's going and seeing and she's talking about the fact that she's always been pro-choice. And it's like these are our leaders, these are the best of the Republican party. It's extremely frustrating. And I'm right there with you.

This is something I've been talking about a lot. And I want to go into this, but I got to go to this first because I saw this and I'm so excited. And Chris, I want you to bring up the website. You have one of the coolest images here. And we were talking off camera and I want you to share this with the audience because you were a college professor. And as we bring up this image, I hope the audience knows like that is a direct reference to They Live. Christina, I don't want to steal your thunder. Share the story here.

It's so good. So they live as a movie from the 1980s with Roddy Piper, and I think his name is Keith David, was his friend. And what was going on is the world had been taken over, at least America had been taken over by this race of aliens. And people could not see the aliens for what they were unless they put on these special glasses. So there was this secret group of people who had these special glasses that they were disseminating. And when you put on a special glasses, you could see their true nature where they were these aliens and you could see the subliminal messaging that they were programming onto people, but you had to put on the glasses first.

And there's this one really powerful scene, which I think that all of us, you know, the people who are called conspiracy theorists, now it's all like, you know, we're having the most painful I told you so moment. I don't enjoy I told you so moments, but I mean, it's just kind of where we are. And so Roddy Piper and Keith, David,

they get into this fight because they're their friends and he's trying to get a friend to put on the glasses and look and he does not want to put the glasses on he's fighting him he's fighting him he's like put on the glasses and eventually he's uh roddy piper beeps him up he forces the glasses on him and then he has to see reality and i think that that's where we are as americans and so let me complete my thought is that so many people do not want to see reality because they're so comfortable in the world as it is they just is so comfortable you know as americans for most people. Any problem you have is like interpersonal issues or family issues. Maybe you have an illness

or family struggle or a loved one passed away. You're having troubles at your job or relationship issues. Most people's problems aren't this external threat that they're conscious of. But it is an external threat. And it's like the frog in the boiling water. You know, they just turn it up just little by little by little by incrementally. And so now we're at this moment, not just with the release of the FC FISA fires, but I also think that the fact that we as Republicans control all three branches of government, and we've not seen any true constitutional legislation. Actually, what Catherine Austin Fis refers to as a control grid,

that's what we're actually watching being developed. And it kind of makes sense because naturally we as Republicans will be against statism. We saw, like, with the shooting of the guy in Minneapolis, and you have people just defending it, I don't care that he's a communist. I don't even know if he is a communist. But let's say he is, let's say he's a hardcore Karl Marx,

worshiping Marxists. Let's say that's a case. In America, we live by laws. We are a constitutional republic. So even Marxists have constitutional rights. And when we start going like, I don't care, he's the Marxists if they die. That's godlessness. Because what does scripture tell us? What does God say? He doesn't rejoice in the parish of the wicked. So if God says that he doesn't rejoice when the wicked perish, that he hopes that they turn, then how can you call yourself a Christian and rejoice in the parish of the wicked? See, this is not, It's one thing if you have someone killing you or attempting to kill you and you have to kill them

and defend yourself, even then you don't rejoice in their death. You just acknowledge that it was necessary for you to survive. But this man was not posing a threat to anybody in the immediate. As a matter of fact, and the reason why this is relevant, I know the story, people have like short attention spans, but it's important not to have that, is that this man, it was a woman,

ICE walked up and started shoving her, shoving a woman, just walked over to the woman and shoved her. Now here's the thing. I support mass deportations. I do. I support them. But that means they still are to be done lawfully and constitutionally. That doesn't mean you just start going up to people and going,

you got an accent. Are you an American citizen? I mean, this is like, it's really the kind of society we want. And then also, Caleb, lastly, I apologize for rambling. But I think it also discredits us as constitutionalists because if we have these Yahoo's just walking up to random people like, you got an accent, are you an American?

You know, and all this. I mean, it's a video of that. It's a video of a guy, an ICE agent walking up to a guy, asked him and he American citizens. Wait a minute. I thought these are supposed to be targeted deportations of pre-identifying individuals, not just walking up to random people on the street. Like, what is

this? And I almost feel like they wanted to fail so they can have a justification for mass amnesty. That's one opinion I have. And I also feel like they wanted to fail to cause chaos and incite animosity. Because this just, this doesn't make any sense. You can't just walk up to random people

and start asking if they're citizens. I've just, I've never seen such a thing. Yeah, it's a sudden intentional divide. And I don't know, maybe it's my rebellious nature, but something like that makes me want to start working on my accents. Like, I want to start walking around to ice agents and start talking in a foreign accent. That's just me. I love that you bring up Catherine Austin Fitz, too. I just saw an interview where somebody was interviewing her talking about more of that Q&on conspiracy stuff. And do you think there's going to be mass arrests? And she basically said, if you still believe there's going to be arrest, you're smoking dope. And I'm like, thank you. Thank you for saying something.

like that. Real quick, just to finish the thought, I got to put this feather in your cap, because when you were a college professor, you actually showed your students this movie, they live. I did. I did show it to them because I did not want to be overtly political because that was not my job. That was not the course I was teaching. But I wanted them to at least think, like, I wanted them to think through and say, okay, everything isn't what it perceives. And the students saw like we do feel like something bigger is at play. We do feel like something is more manipulating us

and we're not seeing what's really going on and who these people are and that's the thing that I want to encourage people and I just want to my students to see just question things. Just question things and when you see information always look at what's the primary source of this claim

what is the evidence that this person is using to back up their claim and what are the other counter arguments? Because one of the problems, you know this phrase that there's two sides to every story. That's a misnomer. There's six sides to the story. There's no, we try to see the world in real black and white because it's easier to process. If you just say it's either this or that. So you got two choices. It's just like when you go to a, you get, go to a restaurant that's a menu and they got three items. Well, your choices are limited as

what you can pick. But when there's 10, 20, 40, 50, 60 items, it's like, wow, there's a lot of choices. I got to process this. So it's easier to control people if you just present them with two sides. Like, no, it's way more to it than that. So I just wanted my students to just be thoughtful in how they process the world. Well, and that's the best kind of educator right there, is to present that idea that we do live in a gray area world. And, you know, you bring up this individual, Freddie, who for me, I mourned his passing. Like, I didn't know him.

Probably disagree with him on a number of things. But that's not the America that I want to live in. I don't want to live in a police state. I don't want to live in a country that intentionally divides us over race, over genders, over, you know, poverty class and rich and this all intentionally done to keep us at each other's throats because the reality is America, and I think you're going to agree with me on this, as it was originally intended, as this constitutional republic that you've brought up, which was brought about by these founding fathers who read the Bible, who understood,

they saw all the way back in the beginning this creation of a republic in Israel, and they mirrored that, they mimicked it. And that has been the biggest threat to the satanic agenda for a very long time. And that's why they want to keep us divided. Yeah, you're right. In the book of Deuteronomy, I believe it's in where Moses separates, he starts breaking them up into groups to govern each other, like a republic form of government, where they had these representatives. Because from what I recall, please correct me if I'm wrong, but it was Moses' father-in-law that told him he's going to be worn out.

He couldn't do it the way he was going about it, where every problem was coming to him. so he had to have breaking in groups. So this group goes, you go to this person, and it goes up a chain, but it was all to be honorable people. And that way you could govern society, and you could have immediate resolution to these problems based on the principles of the Word of God. And as you said, our founders design a beautiful form of government.

It was a beautiful form of government. That way we could live free, but important that we have to have righteous rulers, but having righteous rulers starts with a righteous people. And I think that's the fundamental problem, is the reason why we keep getting these corrupt people is because we've allowed corruption to premiere our lives and even as individual citizens. We reject God's word. We don't want to live by God's word. And even the people who may not live an immoral lifestyle, they're very apathetic to the world around them because they don't want to get involved.

There is a, it's in the book of Proverbs. It's really interesting. And our church, our pastor's been going through the book of Proverbs. and he, and it's a, I apologize, I wish you had the top of my head, but he talks about how a king is to winnow the wicked. Like, it's not, we are not supposed to tolerate unrighteousness. And that's what's happening in our society and for lots of reasons, but it's going to be the end of us. Our republic cannot survive if we as society are embracing unrighteousness and tolerating unrighteousness amongst our leaders and who make decisions over our lives.

It's just not sustainable. No, you're absolutely right. the scripture you were referencing, not Proverbs, but for the Republic, is Exodus 18. I talk about it all the time. But Exodus and Deuteronomy, both are this creation of this Israeli, you know, Jewish Republic. And it's a beautiful thing, and I recommend for the audience, go check that out. If you want to know where our founding fathers got this idea, this concept, it's directly from the Bible, ladies and gentlemen. Now, going into this, you know, this intentional divide, because I think this is probably one of the most

important issues we're talking about right now. And unfortunately, far too few people are talking about it. Because you have this left-right construct, this divide that they've intentionally created. You and I were talking off air. But when you actually sit down and talk with a Democrat, you're going to find that you have a lot more in common with them than you actually disagree on. Now, when it comes to the leadership, and I'll put this in both parties, most of them are wicked. and they have an agenda that is anti-American, anti-Christian. When you come to the extremists on either end, yes, these are individuals that you're probably going to disagree with.

But when you're talking about your average American, look, ladies and gentlemen, you want the same thing. You want to go to work. You want to be unmolested by the government. You want to go on vacations. You want your kids to go to a good school. We need to get back to just some civil conversations with each other. Yeah, you know, to your point, I think one of the things that you see,

even with the Epstein case, you know, you see people of irrespective of political affiliation going like, we can't tolerate this or even with the murder of Peretti, I think his name as you mentioned. You know, you see some people who just have to, we have to defend the regime. We have to defend. I mean, if we don't defend every Republican, then we're going to have abortion. Like, even when we have total Republican control, they still don't do anything about abortion. You know, and I'll get to that another time. That just aggravates me so much how the issue of abortion is being used to manipulate Christians to support

corrupt Republicans who don't do anything about abortion. But nevertheless, I digress. But to your point, though, everybody's not a Marxist. Like, we have to stop this like other end of people. If somebody's, none of us are going to change our positions. That's what we're not saying. We're not saying that we need to come to the middle. Oh, no, no, the middle is mushy. Anything that's soft in the middle collapses. So no, we're not moving to the mushy middle. But what we're saying is that there are plenty of people who are Democrats, who are liberal, not Marxists, who, and the Marxists have a right exists. I'm just going to fight them every step away, lawfully, peacefully, of course.

But to the liberals, there are people who they're not looking to subjugate you. They're not looking to take over your life. We're going to fight about tax issues. We're going to fight about abortion, for sure. We're going to fight about a lot of these issues. But that doesn't mean we can't agree on certain issues and fight together

for those issues. You see like Thomas Massey and Rochana over the Epstein 5. I'm sure these men disagree with each other on tons of stuff. Tons of stuff. But what we can't tolerate is having our society control by satanic network who rapes molest children and do other horrible things, kills people and engages in satanic sacrifices. I mean, a lot of people think that that's crazy. If you've been following the rabbit hole and you look at people like Marina Abrahamovich and

Alastair Prowley and spirit cooking, I mean, they write about spells where they, and I apologize if it's a child in the room, I think they probably shouldn't hear this part. But these entertainers, they pay homage to Aleister Crowley and Marina Abrahomovich and this spells. spirit cooking is where they sacrifice a child, take a child's blood and mix it with cement and breast milk. They write about this stuff. So it's not like we're crazy. No. So when the people who are entertaining you and involved in politics and you saw what the whole Podesta brothers and Hillary Clinton and their ties with Marina Abrahamovich,

it's like at what point do we say like something dark and wicked is truly, truly happening. And I don't care what your political affiliation is. We cannot tolerate this. And I know you've seen the video of the man screaming in the airport. And it's just like a lot of people are just... Your software needs to be compliant to win deals, but you also need your engineers focused on building your product, not pulling SOC2 evidence.

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And I don't blame that man. Like, he's just like, what is wrong with y'all? Like, this is really happening. But I think for people like you and not, we've been exposed to this stuff knowing that these people going on for some time, so we're not shocked. It's just that I feel like the matrix is breaking

and a lot of Americans are really struggling on how to process it. And so it's going to behoove us to start linking arms with our fellow Americans saying, you know, well, we're not going to sit here quietly while it's satanic cult controls our society. We're not. We're going to fight back lawfully and peacefully

to the glory of God. You know, I love what you're talking about here. And I want to ask you a question about this because this is something that I've been discussing on this show. And a lot of people that will watch Church and State will say, in fact, Chris oftentimes will tease me that I have TDS. But here's my point on this. I think MAGA, when they showed us that they weren't actually about making America great again, about bringing us back to our Christian roots, about the restoring the republic i think what you were just talking about with the man at the airport it started to wake people up and we saw this you know during the maga process we had oh look at this the the party they're wicked we're bringing in this outsider it's can trump is going to come he's going to fix

everything he's going to save us it really they built him up as this is christ-like character in a sense and then we saw within the media and i think this is a is a key factor here we went away from the mainstream media and everybody started to realize they are lying to us but then they replaced it with these conservative influencers who are literally saying the exact same thing with a little bit of a right bent message and i think people are starting to wake up to that and they're hungry for the truth and that's something that you provide on your show and i love your take on this yeah you know i think when kamala harris was defeated it was we were very happy right because this woman is clearly a marxist her families have ties to Marxism in india this

This woman was Attorney General on the case covering up how abortion clinics were selling baby potty parts and who knows what those baby body parts are being used for. I have some theories. I mean, I won't go there, but well, I will. I think that some of those body parts and some of those remains are being probably used from beauty treatments. That's my opinion because you can buy. They have some things women can buy to put on their face that are stem cells from

an umbilical cord. Like where are you getting these umbilical cords from, you know, so this is something you can buy. So you can buy cream for your face that form an umbilical core. Where are these umbilical cords coming from? You know, so when you start looking in that, this woman was into some very dark things, you know. So when you have somebody that's so obvious wicked and I will say in 2016, we saw a lot of policies that made us so happy. I was like, I was over the moon happy things. I didn't like.

But in the totality, I was extremely happy. when the punch in the face to me was after the inauguration when I saw Sam Altman and Larry Ellison from Oracle talking about this Stargate project I'm like oh blank oh blank I'm like oh my gosh this these guys are some evil the Lord has been working with me not to say expletive but they are evil this is evil I'm like guys this AI system is the beast system and in me makes sense that the B system would have to be built in the time where Republicans control all branches of government because our natural disposition as Republicans is to be suspicious,

is to push back against government control. So if the government control is coming from a Republican, people aren't going to do nothing about it because you have the Ali Best Snuggies in the world who just want to go, focus on abortion, focus on abortion, focus on abortion. But then when the actual Republicans in power, but they don't do anything about abortion. So if she would have some of a point, if they were actually doing something about abortion, but they don't. As a matter of fact, they're weakening their position on abortion and they're pushing people out the party who are abolitionists. Look at the abolitionist movement right now. You have states that are total Republican controlled that are rejected abolishment abolitionist legislation.

Just so the audience is clear. That legislation is saying that 14th Amendment protections extend to unborn children. So it's no reason all these faith, family, freedom, co-called Christian Republicans, we've been. got in Lansing, I mean, D.C. aren't sitting here banging down a door to get 14th Amendment legislation protections. Legislation that's in the 14th Amendment protections on born children. But where's questions are supposed to go along with it because the left is so terrible. So there's the dialectic. You know, so I'm very concerned with the growth of Palantir. I mean, if you read Alex Carr's book, Technological Republic, I encourage everybody to pick up that book. And he's talking about how we need to have these DARPA projects. He's celebrating DARPA.

Like, they're slapping in our face because they had Matt Walsh's and Allie Bedstucky to divert you on, you know, minuscule minor issues that don't really matter and get you all hyped up because Bad Bunny was singing in Spanish, which that guy is a total degenerate. Don't get me wrong. Why am I worried about some Super Bowl halftime show, some guy because he's sung in Spanish. Oh, my God, the horror, you know, he's a Spanish-speaking artist. But that's not the point. But the control grid, the technocracy, the Luciferian cult, they'll never touch those issues because more likely than not, they're being handsomely paid by these. people. So my encouragement is to stop following people, follow Christ. You listen to people like you and I want people to listen to us. Don't follow us. Follow Jesus. And start looking at what is

really happening in our society and what issues aren't being solved because there's no reason with us having this control of all three bridges to government like issues like healthcare. And the list goes on, why are the issues not being solved? Why are we sending money to foreign countries? Why is our debt just going through the roof? I mean, we are all parents. Like what do we think? What kind of future are we leaving our kids? And then the bait and switch with the whole stable coin thing. Guys, any form of digital currency is enslaving. Or we're not going to have central bank digital currency.

We're just going to have stable coins. It's like, y'all really think we're that stupid. Well, unfortunately, many people are. Many, many people are. Let me ask you this. Everything you just said, I mean, so dead on. I so appreciate you. You ever find yourself in, like, a grocery store,

or some location and you just look around at the masses and just kind of, man, I'm such an outsider. Like, I know so much of what's going on and all these people and watching them on their phones and their TikTok and Instagram reels. And you're just like, how do we save this country? You know, I don't want to say that I know this for a fact. And I look to begin to be clear, I love my country. I would risk my life for my country. I absolutely would lay my life on the life for my nation. I love my country that much.

This is my homeland. I think any same person would feel the same way about their homeland. So let me be clear. But I personally feel like our country is Mystery Babylon of Scripture. That is my opinion. I'm not saying I have a firm theological argument, but it just seems that way. And I feel like, to your point,

that our country, we are so comfortable. Because sometimes I wish, I wish I was ignorant all this stuff. I wish I would have done something like going to beauty school and done something. Or like the Matrix where he realized, he's like, this isn't a real steak, but it tastes good. You know, I want to go back into it. Yeah, it is because it's so much more peaceful. You know, so knowing these things is overwhelming. And I do feel like most people, a lot of people don't want to know the truth because it's too painful.

You know, and sometimes I admit, I have to distract myself with jigsaw puzzles, by the way. That is my fun. But I, it's a great one because you have to. be super focused to get them done. So I just like don't out on a jigsaw puzzle or like I love sports. You know, I'm a huge sports fan. But I have to do that to just maintain my sanity because to your point, this stuff is so overwhelming and it's so big and it's so deep. And it's like how do we fight back? You know, and I just think about George Washington. How George Washington warned us, not just about aluminumism. He wrote his farewell address about so many things that it's like

nobody listens to him and it's just so upsetting to me. It's like if we would just listen to George Washington and what he warned us, but I'm not saying he's the only person, but he warned us. He even warned us about political parties. You know, he warned us about so much and it's just like he's not just some guy in history. He's not just this, it's not just this statue of this guy in a ponytail. Like George Washington was a wise man and he warned us about so many things.

and if we would listen to not just him, but many of our founders, and what they were trying to tell us and how to maintain and preserve this republic, we wouldn't be in this situation. We really wouldn't. But a lot of it, I think Caleb goes down to the infiltration of the churches. I think that is a large part of it because it's this greasy grace, worksphobic gospel, where God is just a genie to give me what I want and I have no duty to society. It's a lot, but I just...

You know, Christina, it's such a great to be... great teaser. We're about to hit this hard break. But ladies and gentlemen, we're going to come back. And I love that you brought this up, Christina, because that's the next subject we're going to be talking about. This is Caleb Collier with Church and State. Are you tired of your device spying on you? Ladies and gentlemen, we live in 1984. Your phones, your tablets, your smart televisions, they all are spying on you. And this is why I heavily endorse mark37.com. This is everything you need for your digital privacy. Phones, tablets, laptops, All of them are ghost protocol.

So that means that you are in charge of your own data. Just go to church and state. com, scroll over to shop, and hit mark37.com for all of your privacy needs. Make sure to use that promo code, church and state. And we are back. Thank you for staying with us. You're over at church and state. Dot media, and we're going to go right back to our guests.

But real quick, we're playing more music. Chris is just loving the buttons. Hey, real quick, we're going to talk about one of the affiliates. And we got a new one, Chris, right? that's up on the air, or up on the website. Oh, yeah. Okay. Hey, we got coffee back, ladies and gentlemen.

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and hey use the promo code church and state and you get a 10% discount and of course you help support us and speaking of that support i'm just going to remind you once again please do hit the donate button for us ladies and gentlemen it's it's so vital for keeping us on the air to have great discussions like this this is so important um i tell you when you're looking at these conservative influencers and they're all literally saying the same thing aren't you tired of that aren't you tired of propaganda. Church and state is one that we are going to be anti-propaganda, anti-censorship. So if you love us, please hit the donate button for us. All right. With that, let's go ahead and go back to our guest, Christina Karamo, and we've been having a wonderful conversation. And she just brought up

the church. And this is a subject that I love diving into because the buck really stops with us, ladies and gentlemen. Christianity should be the focal point in this country. And And we've allowed it to become a subject that we don't really talk about. We don't want to offend people. Christina, please continue on with what you were talking about with the church. Well, yeah, I mean, our churches are infiltrated because it's like people, we don't want to be confrontational. And when you look back at it, the church used to be so much more aggressive as far as dealing with cultural issues. And when I step back, right, and you look at these Christians who are in the Democrat Party.

You know, you ask yourself, how did they become this pro-abortion Marxist, pro-homosexuality party? A lot of the Christians in the party just went along with it because they're like, we got to win. We got to win. So they just kept little by little by little shifting their focus of the gospel to fit in with their political ideology. You know, I grew up attending was crazy enough, a liberation theology church. And I knew something was bizarre. I'm like, why are they always, every Sunday is about the black struggle. Like, what is this?

Like, I just knew something was strange. My parents wound up leaving the church because they started getting worse and just increasingly heretical in some of the things they were saying. The reason why that's relevant is that in society, we have these idols in America in many regards. And we're starting to flip and switch and modify our religious stances and where we are and what priority we make and what priority we place God's word in our lives based on whatever external agenda or folks. that we have. And you see even looking at ancient Israel, so I've been going through, I'm in second kings right now. And then, you know, as the society change and they, the kings of Israel had their own agenda, then they began to modify their obedience to God's word to fit their particular agenda. And you got so point to, they then had the prophets to ball over, all over Israel,

we're killing God's prophets. Why is that relevant now? Is that we see that in the American church. We modified to fit in with the society. You have to be. Christians who want to embrace evolution. You have people who claim to be Christians who embrace abortion. And now you have even within the conservative ranks, you have pastors who make it all about allegiance to the Republican Party instead of allegiance to God. Because, and I think that that hurts the church. When we are unwilling to call out, let me scale back and clarify my point, is when we as Christians, right, when we come out and we say, okay, as a Christian, you are to vote this way because these are the people that best align with God's word. I don't think there's

anything wrong with that. But then when those people don't live up to living out and governing according to God's word, then you have a duty to call it out. And that's where a lot of these so-called conservative pastors are not doing because they're so obsessed with maintaining proximity to these powerful people that they could care less about God's word. God's word is secondary because they've lied to themselves that if I say anything that I'm going to lose access, what? Like, so what? Okay. And so you've lost credibility. The reason why it may seem like I'm harder on conservatives, because with the Democrat Party, they're Marxists. They have a child sacrifice in front of their convention. They've already given themselves over the Lucifer. So

I'm not addressing the world, but I'm addressing people who claim to be followers of Christ because we have a duty before God to put his will, his way, his agenda first. And this is how it's become where the churches no longer care. Then you have these other set of churches where the Joe Osteins of the world where it's just all about living your personal victory, walking in your purpose. I'm not saying there's not a place

where we're supposed to say, hey God, what do you want me to do with my life? There's definitely a place to say, what is God's purpose for my life? But that should not be our primary focus because that's not most people's problems. Most people's problem is a lack of obedience to God. And their failure to obey God,

then manifest in other problems in their lives. And then a lot of churches I've been to, the pastor barely walks through scripture. They spend the whole time just telling a long story about what they think. I mean, I love my church. I don't disclose where I go to church for lots of reasons. I just kind of keep where I attend church private. But I love my church. Our pastor, he goes verse by verse by verse, by verse, by verse, by verse, by verse, and explains each verse.

Why it's relevant. And he goes, we study one book of the Bible at a time. So then you walk out like, I really understand. and you can then apply it to your life. So there's no true biblical exegesis going on. It's just this guy that's just a love of himself and the sound of his own voice, just talking about whatever he wants to talk about, and then encourage you that God is going to help you and break through.

Then you've got these leftist churches where you have women standing in the pulpit. I'm sorry, people ain't going to want to hear that, but the Bible is very clear. The pastor is supposed to be a man. Like, and he is explained explicitly why. He said Eve was tempted first. So God say this, but we're just going to do what we think. the primary problem. God says, do this. Ah, yeah, but God, we know better than you, you know. It's so true. So you speak so much rebellion in these little ways and these little pockets where people got there.

And I tell this big, long story and gave a lot of examples of individuals who put their agenda above what God said. And now you have these people where there are these churches where you have drag queens singing in a church. What? That's not a church. Not a church of Jesus Christ. That's a church of Satan. You know, so it's just... Absolutely. Yeah. You know, we are so aligned and I absolutely love this. I spend so much more time on this show addressing what's going on in the conservative churches more than the liberal ones.

Because as you just pointed out, it's very easy to take the word of God, look at her liberal church and go, wrong. No, we don't do that. It's also easy to look at the Joel Olsteins. I call them the more ostrich churches, you know, they just want to kind of keep their heads. head in the sand and say, no, we should be out there. We should be active. And so for people who watch shows like yours, shows like mine, we're going to be more in that camp of the conservative churches, the churches that are getting out there and doing things, getting out in the world, not afraid to address what's going on politically. And there's a lot of problems in that church.

I've seen pastors, Christina, tripping over themselves to get next to Paula White. Like, Paula White's a heretic. Like, enough. And end a story, okay? Just stop. Okay. So, stop following her. And yet we have all these people that are so obsessed with these conservative celebrity pastors who are literally leading us down the road to hell. You've got, you know, Bethel Church out there with their whole Sean Bowles, you know, hot reading prophecies and things. And it's like, guys, we've got to address what's going on inside the church, inside the conservative church, because otherwise we're going to lose her. You know, to your point, because we're, the problem is that in the conservative churches,

they claim that we have an orthodox stance on scripture, right? And the more liberal progressive churches, they are open that we open it to our interpretation, which is heresy, right, in it of itself. But they've already declared that they are moving past orthodoxy and kind of integrating social. So they've done that. But so when the conservative churches say,

hey, we believe the Bible is an in-errant, infallible word of God, we are to stand on scripture all the time. Then that means you've got to follow through with that. You have to do that. And we can't, and I was actually talking to my pastor about this on Sunday. You know that passage in scripture where Jesus says that you do not fear him who can destroy the body, but fear him who can destroy the body and soul and shield.

And I think one of the things we don't realize that within the conservative circles, we are so afraid of the Marxist and of the left that we are willing to tolerate iniquity in our own camp. So we're still doing the same thing. it's not so we are we are so terrified that now we're turning to pragmatism and political pragmatism in order to help say well we got to these guys are worthless than these guys these guys are dangerous so the democrat party has become so threatening that it's like well we'll tolerate iniquity in this camp because they're not as bad iniquity is iniquity and isn't it more dangerous christina i mean it isn't it's so easy to identify the left

the left wing woke ideology within the church and go, that's the enemy. But it's within our circles where as you're just talking about it, we become pragmatic and we excuse things. And hey, it's for the victory. I mean, like everything that's going on, you know, with this celebrity pastor or maybe this politician, also a celebrity, but they're better than the other side. And how I've always put it is, was it matter if you're going to hell in an airplane or a bus, you're still going to hell.

Yeah, you know what? You're right. It's like taking us a destruction slower. You know, it's like, I love my country, but heaven is my home. My loyalty primarily is to Christ. And if me standing for truth and doing what's right before God means that we're going to lose an election, then that's what it's going to be. But here's the caveat. Here's just the practical side and all.

Even when we win with our people, they still don't do anything to actually stand for Christ in the Constitution. So it's not even like they personally wicked but then turn around and actually stand for constitutional governance. No, they're personally wicked and they actually destroy and rip up constitutional government and actually subverted. So it's like a Greg Locke. Like you have him that

if you're not a Democrat, you're not welcome in my church. And you have people cheering it on. And who did Jesus eat with? The prostitutes and the tax collectors, you know? I mean, that is unreal. I feel out as a pastor for you to say if you're a Democrat, you're not welcome in my church. Like that is so wicked. So wicked.

And so then when you, and also this harms the witness of the gospel. Because when you sit there and you see this kind of stuff happening, it's like, and you see non-Christians, they're going to be like, wow. Really? That's what these people are? Like we have a duty. Jesus tells us to be sought and light. We are to be sought in light. If our conduct didn't matter, then why would we need to fulfill?

Why would Matthew 28, 18 through 20 exist? It wouldn't matter. And I believe, I'm not sure if it's in, I don't know if it's, I think it might be first or second Timothy, where Paul talks about how our reputation in the world does matter. We're supposed to live quiet, peaceable lives depending on no one. It's even first and second Timothy. So we are supposed to represent and reflect Christ. So, yes, a Democrat should be welcoming your church. That doesn't mean you don't stand and speak truth about wickedness in society.

But to openly say something like that, like your priority priority isn't Jesus. It's access to politicians. And so these people, I'm not, I can't say who going to hell or who not. But when God, I will say, when God gives you a platform and God allows you to have a platform, that is to be for his glory, not yours, not for a political party, not for a politician. And scripture makes it clear. People like a Greg Locke are going to get judged. Like it's a lot harder than that Democrat who might be sitting in his church.

So these people need to think twice about their conduct because God let you hide that platform, Mr. Locke. And what are you doing it to bring glory to him and not yourself in the Republican Party? That's what he's trying to bring glory to. Not Christ. And these people, they're harming our cause. Because our primary focus is to bring people to Jesus. Even as much as we love our country, our primary job is to bring people to Jesus. Then secondarily, through the process, discipleship is showing.

people how to live out their faith, which will necessarily include political activities, but not the primary focus. I mean, those are scary words, but you're right. And you're literally paraphrasing the Bible right there. You know, Greg Locke, people like that, man, I don't know if I'd want to be them at judgment time because something like that, you know, I mean, where do you stop at something like that? You know, if you're a Democrat, you're not allowed in my church. If you're a Satanist, you're not allowed in my church. How about if you're just a sinner, you're not allowed in my church? Well,

that's going to be a pretty empty church because every single one of us is a wretched sinner that's saved by the grace of Jesus Christ. So, Christina, it has been a phenomenal interview where we're out of time here. I feel like I could keep going for another couple hours, to be honest. We'll have to have you back because it's just such a fun conversation. I'm going to bring up your website one more time. Chris, if you can do that for us, but the caramoreport.com. Christina, tell us about your website as we're closing out. Yeah, so please go to our website.

you can catch all our past shows. Caleb, thank you. You joined our show. It was a great episode. If people want to support the project, they can. And so, I mean, we talked a little bit about the They Live reference. And I just hope that people can see the truth of what's happening in the world around us and not be deceived. That's what we call our taglines pursuing the truth, because there's so many false people out there trying to manipulate us and trick us. And I'm hoping to use my experience in politics for people to see like, we got to follow scripture first. And I think the best way to inoculate yourself from all of the foolishness and the agendas and the shady people is to dig deep in the word of God. Because when you dig deep in the word of God, not only are you

growing your relationship with God, you're getting closer and allowing the Holy Spirit to direct your steps, your actions, but then also you can see a lot of the foolishness because I don't care what group of people, their ethnicity, their time in history, their location on a planet, people are the same. And you can see when reading the history of ancient Israel, that we see the same shenanigans going on a day all around the world, because the problem is our sin nature. And Satan is smart. He might be, he's smart in understanding how the world works and how to manipulate people. And when one of his minions dies, he has another one lined up ready to rock and roll. and he used the same schemes on us over and over and over again.

And if you read the Bible, especially the Old Testament, and I apologize to Kate up, if I could have one more second, I encourage people to really dig deep into the Old Testament. There's this false notion that God in the Old Testament was mean. No, he was not. God is the same. He's never changed. When you study the Old Testament,

you get to see how wicked humans truly are and why we need a Savior in the first place. And when you study the Old Testament, you get to understand human nature and what we're capable of, and you can see the parallels in our current society. So it's important to dig deep into the Old Testament. And the more you study and understand God's word, the better you are equipped to deal with this world.

And you have more peace when dealing with the foolishness and craziness of this world because you understand that ultimately this is not our home. Heaven is. And you look forward to that day being in the presence of the Lord. Amen, amen, amen. So ladies and gentlemen, just a phenomenal interview. I want you to share this with everyone. And I'm going to tell you, out of all the guests that have shows that

come on. I recommend this one so highly. Okay. This is a great show. I love it. I know that the audience will love it as well. As I said, you're kind of me. So I love that about you. You're addressing a lot of the same things. And this is something that we've got to drill down into, Christina. So thank you again for joining us on Church and State. It's been a real pleasure. Thank you. God bless. Thank you. God bless you too. All right, ladies and gentlemen, there you go. Christina Karamo. Please check out the website Karammer report.com. And remember, ladies and gentlemen, If you want to pursue the truth, if you want to dig down into it, you got to exit the system and the system that has been established for you. And I'm talking specifically to you conservatives.

You have to understand that a lot of what you ingest is pure propaganda. So pursue the truth, find some good sources. The best one, of course, is the Bible. Church and State is brought to you in part by Colonial Life, Spokane Independent Agents, Finders Insurance, and Mark37.com. I'm Caleb Collier. I was born for a storm. Welcome to the fire. This is Caleb Collier with Church and State. Media.

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