The Press Box - A Royal Wedding Mailbag Spectacular | Jam Session (Ep. 469)

Episode Date: May 16, 2018

The Ringer’s Juliet Litman and Amanda Dobbins answer listener questions about Saturday’s royal wedding between Prince Harry and Meghan Markle. They cover everything from the situation with Meghan���s dad (1:21) to speculation about Prince Harry's real parents (24:57). Then they make some predictions for the event (41:31). For more reading on the royal wedding, check out the links below: The latest on the royal wedding The New Yorker’s Lauren Collins on royal romance 14 etiquette rules the royal family must always follow The New York Times on Markle’s family Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

We're going to get into jam session. It's Royal Wedding Week. But first, let's talk about what's going on at the Ringer. We have a new podcast. It's called On Shuffle, and it's about music. Michael Peters hosts talk to other people from The Ringer and people outside of the Ringer, about all the latest releases and just music that we care about and that he cares about. Listen to it, check it out.

It's called On Shuffle, wherever you get your podcasts. We also want to tell you about an article from Kate Nibbs. Kate Nibs spoke to the one and only Michael Pollan, who is the author of a new book called Howell. How to Change Your Mind, and it's about psychedelics. I bought this book. I can't wait to read it. And more importantly, Kate's Q&A was fantastic, so check that out as well.

Amanda, do you want to tell us about something else? Yeah, let me tell you about Bradley Burning. Today's episode is brought to you by Bridley Burning. Alexa Dunn's lush and unthrawling reimagining of the classic Janeair, set among the stars, will seduce and beguile you. Entertainment Weekly calls Brightly Burning one of the most anticipated YA debuts of 2018. Brightly Burning is a gripping examination of class, romance, and survival set in a dystopian future that feels chillingly relevant to our present times, according to Kirkus Reviews. You can find Breightly Burning by Alexa Dunn, available wherever books are sold.

Welcome to Jam Session, the Royal Wedding Spectacular. I'm Juliet. I'm Amanda Dobbins. There's just so much to dig into, and luckily, so many nice people sent us questions, and we're going to answer them. A lot of questions. I'm pretty excited. I'm oriented my whole weekend around waking up at 2 a.m. to watch the proceedings in real time. So Juliet's going to do it live. A quick note. Julianne and I live in Los Angeles in case you have never listened to this podcast before.

And the Royal Wedding starts 1 to 2 a.m. here. I'm going to I'm going to go with 2. One is too early. It's like one. There's no time for a nap. So you are going to do like a disco nap and then wake up. Like I imagine myself sleeping from like 11 to 2. And then like 6 to 11. Wow. That's the schedule I'm targeting. Okay. I'm really excited. That's ambitious.

I'm going the other way. Because of extenuating circumstances, I have to be awake on Saturday to celebrate someone else's birthday. So here's my plan. I have DVR basically everything that BBC America is airing from like right now on Wednesday through, I would say Saturday night. I like went through and was like deleting old DVR stuff to make sure I have enough space because honestly, the biggest catastrophe would be waking up Saturday morning and finally.

that my DVR was too full of like old documentaries about Charles and Diana to have actually recorded the Royal Wedding. But I think I've got the system down. And so I will be sleeping until a reasonable hour on Saturday and then watching it all on my DVR, BBC America, obviously. Obviously. Let's not miss around. Let's go to the source.

Do you have any interest in the Will Ferrell special? Who's he doing it with, Will Ferrell and Molly Shannon, right? Molly Shannon, yeah. Yeah, maybe I'll record that as well. Thank you for that DVR recommendation. You got it. So the point is that we're ready. Yeah.

We've literally scheduled this at DVRs, et cetera, and we're very excited. And we have a lot of questions. We have some, but also you guys sent them. And we'll just start. The first one is one that we've gotten a lot of different ways from a lot of different people, and it's like what is the situation with Megan Markle's dad. Great question. We got to start there.

That has been the dominant storyline in the days leading up to the wedding. And it's quite confusing and pretty sad. It's a true American tale. It is. This is the only, like, unfun part of the experience. This is the only part of the podcast that will involve any empathy and any kind of feelings of regret and confusion. And then we're going to go straight into being ridiculous about this nonsense. But, yeah, the dad stuff is sad.

So to briefly summarize, over the weekend, it was revealed that the photographs of Megan Markle's dad, Thomas Markle, that you may have seen. it was him studying a picture book about the UK in a coffee shop. And some other assorted kind of paparazzi photographs had been staged. And that is not a thing that you are allowed to do when you are a relative, when you are associated with the royal family anyway. The royal family gets quite upset about that. Are you mad at yourself for not realizing that those were staged? Because I feel a little disappointed in myself for not being like,

I don't know about this. I actually think I might have suspected it. I think I should go back into my G-chats because I think I did G-chat a friend being like, do we think, what's going on here? The selection of picture book in the window, if we had actually thought about it, and I think probably you, even a moment in passing, just knowing your brain was like, hmm, I wonder what's going on here. Yeah.

Yeah. I just feel like I should have made a bigger fuss about it. Yeah. The rest of them, it was like he was dropping off flowers at his now, at Megan's mother, his now ex-wife's home. Yeah. The others were kind of more actiony in a way that could look like he was just being trailed by paparazzi. Yeah. But it's true. The one on the cafe was like the most egregious. With the picture book. It was just kind of like, this is not, this is not serendipitous. That's not how the world works in 2018. Yeah. I think the reason it was like kind of believable is because. it was like learning about England through the path of least resistance, which is a picture book.

Right. Which was like, yeah, that's what I would do to cram as well. Yeah. And so then it came out. So then the story came out and then he wasn't going anymore. And it also was released that he'd recently had a heart attack. And I hope that his health is fine. Right.

But I was like, this is suspicious. Like they're like making it like, oh, he doesn't want to take away from the event. Plus he has like a health issue. Right. There's been so much back and forth now. And in fact, at time of recording, unclear if he's interested in going or planning on going. Right. And if he had a real medical condition, there would be a lot more certainty and finality over his capabilities and ability to travel.

And also, like, it's Wednesday. Right. He lives in California. It's a 10-hour flight. He lives in Mexico. He lives in Mexico. Right. It's far.

Got to get to it. Yeah. So according to the Telegraph, which I'm kind of using as my official royal wedding source, because they're just like a royalist enough to not be. total dickheads, like the Daily Mail, but they also know that you want to know everything. Yes. So according to the Telegraph, he is at this moment he's not going and is in fact undergoing heart surgery on Wednesday. Okay.

So we don't know the nature of the heart surgery or it would seem like he's not going to show up. If I were a betting person, yes. I would guess that he will be there. because the best way for their royal family to kind of pretend that all this unseemlyless like all this stuff never happened is for him to walk her down the aisle

and for them then just to say of course he wouldn't have missed it. It's his. Sure. And just to pretend none of it ever happened, which is what they like to do. Yeah, so I'm glad you brought this up because I felt a lot of people at the ringer

were blaming the queen for this. And they're like, oh, the queen doesn't want him to come. We're like, God. Right. the royal family won't let him come now. And I don't think that's what the royal family would do. And also, if I'm Megan Markle and my dad's causing those problems, I'd be like, fine. Just don't come then, dad.

Right. So this is, let's unpack this a little. I kind of think everyone is a bit to blame. And no one is really, no one is really to blame. So this is the thing. Also, just this is families and weddings is so raw. I don't know anyone who's gotten through a wedding. without having a huge family flare up.

Like, many movies are made about this. It's horrible. I am kind of having a little reaction myself. So in a way, this is quite relatable. Yeah. And truly an American story, as you pointed out. But I do think it's sad. So a couple things.

Let's go person by person. Sure. Number one, Thomas Markle, her father. Yes. Megan's parents were divorced. It's very clear that she was always much closer to her mother. Yes. I have read some reports that suggest that they were in fact that Megan and her father were estranged for a bit.

Yeah. They no longer seem to be. But if you recall in the engagement announcement interview. It was about her mom meeting the queen. And Harry had not yet. Yeah, met her father. Which is to listen, he lives in Mexico. There are a lot of reasons for that.

But you would think if they had a much closer relationship that probably at some point they would have met. Yeah, it would have been important. Yeah, and I don't mean to judge. Families are really difficult and especially like divorced and all of that stuff. I relate personally. So I don't want to judge too much of what's going on there or who's to blame in it. But it seems like they're not as close as she and her mom. Yeah.

And as kind of what might be expected for the royal family likes to pretend it's some like tight-knit, nothing's wrong, traditional. nuclear family type of thing. And that's, it's a little hard to put that structure on this particular family. Right. Anyway. So, he lives in Mexico. He, he was a lighting director in Hollywood for a while and then was just like I'm out. And now lives, he's not like off the grid.

No. It definitely doesn't seem like he's reading TMZ regularly and is aware of kind of how paparazzi photos work. Definitely not. It doesn't seem like he's some kind of like diabolical mind. No, it seems like. So it's later come out and we'll talk about Samantha, the half sister, the quote half sister in a bit. But she, in one of her loudmouth rants, came out and was like, I encourage my dad to do this because I thought he was getting a bad rap in the press.

Yeah. And that seems plausible and like he wouldn't know any better because not everyone is media savvy. So it seems entirely possible that someone was like, can we take photos of you? it'll be good for your daughter, and he doesn't have a lot of relationship or knowledge and support and just kind of didn't think too much about it. There's also the question of was he paid, and then... I'm going to say he absolutely was paid. You absolutely was paid, but also, if you don't have a lot of money, who are you to turn out?

It's like, you know, it's also like the royal family, like shows up in hello. Like the lesser royals are in hello and being paid for it all the damn time. So, anyway, I think that's what happened. Yeah, I think that's definitely what happened. And that's fine. Get paid for it. He probably should have told Megan he was doing it. He probably should have told her.

And he probably should have been in some sort of communication. And like, I don't know how much common sense is not, I have learned that common sense is not global. But in general or really just, you know, even across a family. But I do kind of feel like if you, if someone is approaching you to take photographs because your daughter is like suddenly really. famous. And also, if you worked in Hollywood, like, maybe a text. Like, would this be okay? Would this not? So not great common sense. Yes, agreed. But also not diabolical. Right. And also, I don't think that, I actually, I find it more believable that the, the royal family pushed her to be walked down in the aisle by her father. Yes. Then they pushed her

to uninvite him. Because if they don't have a really close relationship, why, I don't know if that necessarily would be important to her. I have no idea. But I thought this. sort of like picture perfect announcement that her father would be walking her down the aisle seemed way more staged than him being uninvited and reinvited. I 100% agree with that. And as soon as it, you know, weddings have a funny way of, as soon as you say wedding, then all of these expectations that come from nowhere, like descend upon any situation and suddenly you find yourself like having to fight off a bridal party of 15 or like the

photograph of the shoes before the wedding. Why do we all do that? Why does everyone? I wanted to be clear that I didn't do that. But like, how did that become a thing? Because as soon as you say wedding, people are like, now we got to do all this stuff. And I did have that ring of it. One thing that's rough for Megan is that since Prince Harry doesn't really have like a last

name. Yeah. She can't do one of those hangers that says like Mrs. Harry or whatever. I'm sorry to any of my friends who have done this. I don't think they have. The personalized hanger to like hangar. to hang her dress. It says, like, Mrs.'s new last name makes me want to die.

It's, like, one of the worst parts of the wedding and death show complex. I just had a flash of her getting a bathrobe that says the Duchess on the back of it. And honestly, I think... Burgess, like, send that back to me. Yeah. But also, she has far too much taste. Actually, she won't do that. She knows better.

She has media savvy. Maybe she has media savvy, if not taste. I don't know. I don't know her. I don't know what is her choice and what is whatever. But she won't do it. I actually love how she's been dressing. She really is making the royal dress coat her own.

I think that we could hem the pants. Sure. That's my note. It's like, let's find a tailor. They have them in London. That's, you know. Watch Phantom Thread. She's giving someone to pull those pants up just a damn inch.

That's it. She's giving Aqua Zara a new life. She like just fucking loves Aqua Zara shoes. I wonder if that's another one where I'm like, is this a sponsorship? That also would not surprise me. I don't think she can do that anymore. Though it's like, it's on a sponsorship. But all famous people wear clothes for free.

Yeah. As an exchange of advertisement. And that goes back to, like, I mean, Diana wore clothes. You know, they all. Of course. I believe that Kate Middleton has to pays for a lot of her clothes. I think at some point once you become real, you have to pay. Right.

You can't accept donations or whatever. Yeah. Donations. Actually, I think you can because their whole life is a donation from the United Kingdom, like literally. But including this wedding. That's the thing about being rich. You get so much free stuff. Yeah.

But I don't know what the protocol is. Anyway, she's not accepting money for it anymore. She could have before, but I got it. I like Kate, she wears expensive stuff, but not, like, astronomically expensive. Yes. Which I also really like, which is nice. She just seems like her family is complicated. Half-siblings seems very complicated.

So let's go through the rest of the characters, because there are some, like, true villains, and it's her half-siblings. Yes. Half-brother and a half-sister. Half-brother and a half-sister. Who, it seems like she does not have any sort of relationship with and never has, and they have a use this opportunity to just insert themselves in the spotlight. Trash talker. Make some money.

They're like random cousins who flew to London who are like half cousins. They're going to be on the broadcast Sunday, Britain Sunday or whatever. That's also very American straight over rom-com. And it's like extremely tacky. But they are just because they are in the media so much already, they should know better. The fact that they have managed to insert themselves this much in the conversation means they should better and they're bad people. I actually think a testament to the lack of power of the royal family is the fact that a

British morning show is having her like her cousins on. If they were like scared of like retribution in any way, it's just. That's true. And so this is what I'm going to say. I do think that the palace is a little bit to blame. I don't think that the queen was the was like kick him out of the wedding. Yeah. First of all, that's just even if even if he were diabolical and had done this and arranged it

to be a bad person or whatever, they wouldn't. do that because it creates a larger problem. Right. And what they want is for this to go away. No problems. What they want is for him to like rise from the stretcher and like walk down the aisle on Saturday. And I honestly think that that might happen because. Yeah.

It's a good point. Yeah. But I do feel like they didn't give him enough guidance. Like you kind of have to know if this person is suddenly being married into your family with this level of press attention that the other family members, are going to be targeted. Sure. And there's a way to handle this and a way not to handle this.

And listen, they may have tried and he may not have wanted help. You never know. Right. And they also are kind of famously insensitive and may not have tried at all. And they may not have anticipated the ways in which it would happen.

You know, they're snooty people. There's definitely a level of, I'm sure they didn't give him the best help. No, definitely not. So in that sense, I think that they they could have done more. Yeah. Because, like, if they didn't want...

I don't know. Can you prevent a TV show from having random family members anymore? This is the other thing. Like, the media is being pretty gross, and it is what the media does. And, like, here we are talking about it. So, hi, it's me, too. I think that if the morning show was, like, interested in having the royal family on or thought it was remotely possible at any time in the immediate future,

they wouldn't do this. Yeah. Because why would they go on the show now? It's true. And I do think there are reports that the royal family and the press officers have been behind the scenes, like really working Fleet Street and all the programs to be like, please don't publish these photos. Like, please give them some privacy.

And that hasn't worked. No. I guess. No, it hasn't. I wouldn't leave the house. I would just stay home. It's really, it's a lot of grounds anyway. Just, you know, it's like, it's just stay.

where you won't be photographed. Although it seems like that they like to be out and about. They are out and about quite a bit. Megan and Harry? Well, those are all like their public appearances. That's what they do. It's their job to like go to a fish factory and be like, wow, cool fish. I wonder if he misses partying. Who, Harry or Harry? Her too, but he was just such a partier. That's true. He was such a staple of the nightclub scene in London. But now he's 33. I know, Amanda, but not all men grow out of it. That's true. Sometimes they just squash the feelings. I don't know. I mean, I just, I kind of miss seeing

him drunk climbing into a car. I hope for them that if they both enjoy that, they could do it together. Yeah, in the privacy of their own home. Yeah, absolutely. Oh, so this reminds me segue. So basically, to sum up the question, what's going on with Megan's dad, it's a real mess. We hope that his surgery goes okay. And if I were betting, I would say he shows up on Saturday. Yes. There we go. Next question. Where do Harry and Megan get to live? Someone asked me this. I can't remember who now. I think that they are renovate. They're going to live at the same place. They're renovating it, aren't they?

Yes. So they are renovating Nottingham Cottage. I hope they're adding a second bathroom. Me too. But there is a bonus, which is for their wedding present, the queen is giving them a house. Amazing. It's called York Cottage. It's definitely not a cottage. It is a staley home. And it's on Sandringham, which is the estate. It's like the Norfolk estate.

Yes. Where the queen lives. And also Kate and Will also got a house for their wedding present. It's also nearby in Sanringham. Yeah, they lived in Sandringham for most of their early, like, years together, Kate and Will. And for the beginning of Prince George's life for the privacy. Yes. So they will have two homes.

That's beautiful. They really need to, you know. I was really worried about it. So they can definitely disappear. and live, like, in a palace. Yeah. That sounds great. Good for them.

Okay. Next question. Yes. Is Megan Markle allowed to ever act again? Absolutely not. She's out of the game. Well, I mean... She said she's retiring from acting.

Okay. Well, no one ever retires from acting. Here's the thing. Again, if I were a betting person, I think before her life is over, she will act again. I agree. However, I think that will come after she's divorced from Prince Harry.

Yes, exactly. So that's why I'm betting the money. There's also a semantic aspect to this, which is like she's definitely acting now. Sure, every time she steps out in public. Yes, this is a public performance and she was cast perfectly for it. Yeah. But no, as long as she is married to Prince Harry. She will not be accepting acting jobs from studios or television networks.

And I suspect that the divorce agreement and whatever titles and war, financial benefits that came with it would involve some very specific guidelines on what she was able to do. And also when she's allowed to do it. There certainly got to be like a waiting period of like five years from the end of the end of the marriage to when she can act again. Right. I just also want to say that I think they'll get divorced because I think they're rushing into this. Okay. Not for any other reasons. Yeah. That was another question. How long do you give this?

I give it seven years. Okay. Do you think that with a child, seven years with at least one child. Yeah, I think that they will have children. Me too. Which does then prolong it for a few years. Yeah. I think that they, I agree with you that they will get divorced and not because, like I've said this before,

I cannot imagine someone as independent and successful and established as Megan Markle. I mean, she had a career whole life, then suddenly marrying into this weird mausoleum. where all she gets to do is visit fish factories and has to wear certain types of clothes and is, I don't even know. Like, we can talk about the precedence and who she has to currency to, but she's got a curtsy to a lot of people. Yeah. And also pretend to care about shit that I'm sure she doesn't care about. Right. And not talking about the charity, but like the like the visiting of a factory and visiting of like a random town in the UK.

For sure. And so much of your personal life is a performance as well. And there's no freedom because of. of all of the ridiculous etiquette that we'll talk more about. You know, I think the optimistic side of that is that she will be allowed to kind of shake things up and that the monarchy really needs someone like her and they need to be less stuffy. And they're not in line for the crowns that gives them the latitude to do that.

I mean, the optimistic thing is that she will, she and Harry will kind of reinvent a life that is happy for them. But I, here's the trouble. With all respect to the queen, she's quite old, and she's not going to be queen forever. And so then you've got Charles and William second in line. And that, he's going to be working out a lot of shit. I feel like I don't know if the monarchy will survive King Charles III. There's a whole play about this, by the way.

It won a lot of award. It won like Olivier's. Sure. And I enjoyed it. But it's going to be a real mess. My mom has a theory that Princess Charlotte was going to be Queen. And she said that she's really worried about what that means for the people ahead of her in line for the throne. And that includes her father, her brother, and her grandfather.

Yeah, that's true. Maybe there's an abdication. I would love it if we get Queen Charlotte. That would be great. Queen C. That would be great. I'm open to it. Yeah, absolutely.

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Find your perfect vacation rental. tripping.com slash jam. And now, back to the royal wedding. Spectacular. Okay, let's get back into these pressing questions. Our friend Phoebe asked a really good one. Is Harry really Prince Charles' son? This is a long, gestating rumor in the British press

that is a tantalizing one. So I'll give the quick, may I? Please do. So, Diane and Charles, not a happy marriage. No. Certainly not. And, you know, Camilla, Charles's current wife is like the famous third person in the marriage. So it was a bit crowded.

That was me quoting Diana, which is a dangerous thing to do. But Charles and Camilla had an affair for much most of the marriage. It's not really sure. We're not really sure when it started. But Diana also had some affairs. Once that, once it broke out, once it failed the marriage. Sure, came out that she had affairs as well. Yeah, but also I think just kind of in the marriage as soon as she realized that it just wasn't going to work out, she started finding love other places.

Sure. And the main character in this was a guy named James Hewitt, who she had an affair with for several years. He was her driver, wasn't he? No, a bodyguard. No, different one. Oh. Different one. He was just kind of like, I can't keep track of all the cavalrys and guards.

And he was one of, he was like a military guy that kind of then had like a ceremonial role in the royal orbit because they just have a lot of like various guards and things. I see. So he was one of those. So he was on the staff though, basically. Yeah, yeah. I mean, everyone's on the staff. Like literally all of the UK is on the staff. But yes, he was kind of in the orbit and she asked him to give her writing lessons.

And then the writing lessons turned into more. But I think that according to the Tina Brown book, they wore together for several years. Like, William and Harry had a relationship with him. You know, he was like present. Sure. And as Harry has gotten older and all this came out, a lot of people have noticed that James Hewitt and Harry do look like. It's the red hair that is the common, its most obvious characteristic. Same square jaw.

Yeah, they do kind of look alike. I wholeheartedly believe it. You do? I do. Okay. 100%. All right. If it's not James...

I also believe that O.J. Simpson is Chloe Kardashian's father. So that's where I'm coming from. But I believe it. It's hard to tell with Chloe because she had someone with plastic surgery. But once upon a time, she looked like OJ's daughter. Right. She did. There's just kind of like a genetic thing if she is like a foot taller than all of her sisters.

Yes. In a way that, well, all of Kim and... Yes. Robert Kardashians' kids. Yes. So similarly, I believe this one. Harry doesn't have the balding gene that his brother and father have. Right.

That skips, you know, it doesn't go to everyone. Sure. But just saying. Right. The red hair is also just in Diana's family. Yes. Pretty predominantly. So it could be that.

Sure, it could be that. He and Will just don't look alike to me, like at all. Yeah, but one thing to keep in mind is how much Will doesn't look like himself anymore. It's just really like everything is just kind of rounding and sagging in a way that is like very puzzling. He's turning into a cartoon caricature of himself. So I go back and forth on this.

It's tough, but I believe it's tough. I kind of, I don't, I don't think it's possible just timing-wise because I don't think that he was, I don't think she had access to James Hewitt. at the point in which Harry was conceived. I see. It happened so quickly. Will and Harry, boom, boom, pretty early in the marriage. There's another rumor about a driver, though, too, right?

That sometimes is also rumored to be Harry's father. Yes. And he, I believe, did come before James Hewitt, chronologically speaking. Yes. So I don't think so. But I wouldn't put money on it. He's a true red-headed stepchild. Yes.

Except, yes. Right. Oh, man. Also, he just, yeah, I don't know. I believe it, but I also like just, I'm really prone to a good conspiracy theory. Sure, that's true. So that's where I'm coming from. I just the timing doesn't match up for me to go conspiracy theory with you. Okay. That's fair enough. We'll never know. So. We probably will, but will we know or will we live long enough to, for like the exhumation and DNA testing? I don't know. That's a good question. I think a real tell for me is going to be when Harry and Megan have a child.

because George and Charlotte are so clearly the grandchildren of the queen. Like they look like her, particularly Charlotte. They just are so obviously from this line of Cambridges. Windsors. Yes. The Cambridge is their family. You've got it. I was going to say Tudor, but they're obviously Windsor.

They're so clearly Windsor that I need to see the child of Harry and Megan to know. I mean, but he doesn't look as much like the queen. Sure. I know. So. Yeah, that's part of my point. No, sure, but he looks like Diana. I'm just saying, like, with the expression.

Well, looks like Diana, too, I think. Yeah, he does. He has the... He has a similar smile. Yeah, exactly. So I need to see the next gen. It's going to be tricky. It's going to be tricky, though, because Megan's already biracial.

Yes. So there's just, it'll be a lot going on. I bet they'll have beautiful children. Like, absolutely stunning. Yeah. I'm excited. I don't know. I love Harry.

Okay. I like to believe that he's cleaning up to act as a human. I don't know if that's true, but I just have decided to believe that. It seems like he has. He's like, listen, tough life. His mom died when he was 12 years old. Terrible. And then he was stuck with all these people.

Yeah. So I think, and he's even talked about now how his 20s and all of the party and everything, he was like, quote, lost. Acting out. So he's definitely in the. they're reflective, I've at least read a book about emotional healing phase of his life. I don't think he's gone to therapy. Maybe he watched in treatment on HBO. Possibly. So maybe in that sense, he's at least moving forward. Right. So that's good. That's good. Beautiful. Yes, I like it. Good for him. I have a question for you. Yes. Who do you think is a bigger cheater?

Yeah. Harrier or Will? At this moment? Yes. Will. I think will too. I think so too. Yeah. How frequently do you think he cheats on Princess Kate? Duchess Kate. Duchess Kate. Yeah. I mean, I guess we should talk about this, right? We haven't really introduced this topic. He absolutely does.

Yeah. I mean, just think about it. I've spent a lot of time recently thinking about how his parents are Charles and Diana. Yeah. And it's kind of amazing that he's gotten through like this much of his life without everyone just hating him because those were two extremely difficult people. Yeah. And there's no way that he doesn't have an extremely difficult streak. A friend of mine sent me an anonymous, like a blind item from some Facebook gossip group that she's on.

I don't know. Marissa, thank you for sending this. That was basically about Williams' terrible temper and how he yells at Kate when she talks to drivers about, like, dogs. And that kind of all clicked in for me. I have a feeling he's a real jerk. Yeah. You can kind of sense it now. He is

He's never been the fun one But you can sense a Reluctance or Condescension Behind the The polite Joking dad stuff She also is so quiet

Right Which You know the rules for her are different Than the rules for Megan But I think that we're seeing There's more room to be a different type of Royal than there was 50 years ago

Right And I don't think she's been a four that latitude. She might not want it, honestly. That's true. And I was saying, I said this to my mom. And I was like, I think she hasn't seemed happy in a long time. My mom was like, why do you think you have any idea, like, if she's happy or not?

And like she, maybe she, too is also always acting. But I do feel like there was like a spirit to Kate Middleton that is now gone. Like, there was like some light in her eyes that I don't see anymore. I might actually push back on that. There's a lot of talk about, and there's a very good piece by Lauren Collins. the New Yorker this week about the royal wedding. She just read a ton of books about the royals and did kind of one of those classic New Yorker, like, book report plus pieces. But no, it's really good.

And she points out in one of them that the theme in Harry's romantic life is that he couldn't get any of his girlfriends to agree to want to marry him, basically. That's dope. Not in the, not in the like, they don't want to marry him, but they don't want to be royal. I love that. They know what it is. And they're like, I don't want to do that. Sure. And I think, and the point is that there is this real knowledge now of what it means to be married to one of these guys in the constraints and that it, like, is not, you know, all, like, princess nonsense.

That's a real testament to Harry, though, and the type of woman he's interested in. Exactly. But so I do think Kate Middleton knew. She's not, like, she knew what would be expected and what that life would be like. And I think she never evidenced anything other than, like, total interest of it. She didn't get a job. I mean, she did, kind of. She, like, worked as a shopper at, like, jigsaw.

And then, like, worked for her parents. Yeah, sure. I mean, no shots to that. I also love shopping. But, you know, she didn't have any sort of career. She didn't have any sort of outside life. It was just kind of like, this is what I'm going to do. And I think, honestly, she has, like, a really nice house in the country.

She has kids. She gets go skiing every year. I think that, like, she's fine. I think that some of that is maybe what she wanted, which is a bummer, and it's not how I would choose to live my life. But I don't know. I don't know if the lights gone out necessarily. Okay. That's fair.

That's fair. I think maybe she just got matched to the right job. That said, I mean, whenever he went out, he went on the skiing trip with his friends and was, like, partying with whoever. some waitress or something. It was clear that there's some other stuff going on. Wow. I mean, his parents are Charles and Diana. I know.

What do we expect? I've heard from friends in London who are like plugged into the posh scene that it's notorious. He's just like out all the time without her with different women. I guess here's my question. How are you that stupid in 2018? I guess he's trying to get caught. This is the self-destructive side. I was going to say we haven't seen any pictures yet, so I'm actually impressed.

Yeah. I mean, number one, how is he getting away with that? Yeah. Because they are notoriously. London has so many private clubs, though, you know? Sure. That's true. Oh, great note.

Harry and Megan went on a date at the Soho House, which I didn't know until recently, which is very funny. I also learned that from the Lauren Collins piece. And that's like a famous private club, you know? Yeah. And one of their rules is no social media and no photos. And like think of all the ones that are even like posher that we don't. that we Americans don't even know about.

It's true, but it's just like this is, it's impossible to cover this sort of thing up at this level. I mean, I guess it's not. It's what money can do. And that's what we've learned, you know, time and time again, that if you are. Similarly, not a lot of pictures of the Obama's floating around. Yeah, it's true. Like there were some last summer when they went on vacation. It's actually almost only when they're on vacation because they can control their environs less there.

And so if you're really rich and you're really powerful, you will not, you'll not, You will not be photographed. I was thinking about Beyonce giving birth to the twins and none of us knowing when or where. Yeah. You can do it if you try really hard. Yeah. And it seems like William probably puts a lot of effort into that. Yeah.

It sucks. It's fine, though. I'm on Team Harry now. It actually doesn't suck. Like, maybe they're both happy. Maybe Kate has her own James Hewitt. But, yeah. They are so invested in the image and, like, in perfection that it feels like a real betrayal for us Royal Watchers.

Yeah. And I suppose it's also if they are, if the whole premise of the Royals and, well, I don't know, the premise of the Royals for us is that it's a ridiculous soap opera and we like watching it. And it's, it's absurd. And so that's fine. That's fun. They can do whatever they want. They do seem to try to present themselves at least the older generations as like an ideal family, you know? And who am I to say what an ideal family is?

Yeah. But this is against what they are trying to present themselves as and enshrine themselves as and protect their power as a result as. So in that sense, I'm kind of like, this seems a little dicey, but I don't care. Do whatever you want. Yeah. Whatever. Do you guys. As long as you guys are okay with it together, I don't know.

Be kind of your children. They're pretty cute. Okay. Let's do one more. And then we're going to do rapid fire questions. Yes. Okay. You pick.

Oh, I wanted to talk about the royal pre-nup. Okay. So I did some reading. There is no royal pre-up. There isn't. There isn't, even for this one. And so the reason for that is, so this stated reason is kind of what we were talking about. It's like, royals don't get pre-ups because royals get married forever.

And this is like a, you know, they wouldn't deign to do this. The interesting legal reason, and I had forgotten about this, is that you don't really need a pre-dup because all of the money is the queens anyway. They're basically all being paid for by the queen. salary, the houses. I mean, I don't know what the deed is on the house that she's giving them. Yeah. But it's, if you were doing like a splitting of assets, Harry wouldn't have that many assets himself.

And I do remember from the Charles and Diana divorce that it was, she got like a huge lump settlement. And it was the queen who paid the settlement because Charles doesn't. It's the queen's money. But so there weren't actually, there weren't any, like, property, like marriage laws and play. There was no community property like we have here in California. So you don't really need it. Interesting. I mean, I guess you need it in the sense that Megan could sue for a tremendous amount of money from the queen.

So Sarah Ferguson, the original Duchess of York. I always think of Fergie, Stacey Ferguson, when I talk about the Duchess, Sarah Ferguson made money from Weight Watchers. Yes. But also how, like, what was her, how did she maintain her lifestyle after the divorce? She didn't. I mean, that's why she wrote children's books. She did Weight Watchers. They had basically, she had very little money.

And apparently, like, her mother also had a bunch of debts. So I think even when they were married, they sold, I'm also, this is all coming from the Tina Brown book, the Diana Chronicles, which I recommend to everyone. But if I recall she, even while they were married, they sold pictures of, like the four of them, including Prince Andrew, to. hello in order to like pay off some of her debts because here's the other thing. Prince Andrew has no money. None. And he is like he has like literally none. He is definitely only living on his mother's money and what she'll give him.

And that's why he's, it's always a scandal when he's like taking helicopters to play golf, which is why they call him Aramels Andy because he's just literally the taxpayer have to have to pay for her kind of like deadbeat second son who's doing nothing. I've also heard that he is a real fixture of the elite. secretive nightlife scene of London. Yes. He's available to go out if you want to. He doesn't have a job. And he needs to hang out with rich people because he doesn't have any money of his own because he has to ask his mother for everything. So I think Fergie didn't even get that much money in the divorce. I mean, she got more than you and I will ever get.

But she didn't get that much money. So she has then made up a whole career. Yeah. And a good job. I like her. She's probably my favorite married into the royal family. Love Beatrice and Eugenie too. The Fuggy show before the Eugenie wedding is going to be fascinating, and we'll definitely come back to that. I can't wait. I can't wait. Let's do a couple rapid-fire questions. I'll ask you answer.

Okay, great. Why is this not a royal holiday? So the harsh answer, it's on a Saturday, but they picked a Saturday because he's never going to be king, so no one gets a national holiday. It was a Friday for William. Yeah. And it was a national holiday. It was a quote, bank holiday to use the proper terms. Yes.

Why must all women wear hats, aka fascinators? I mean, this is just weird traditional British stuff. I love it. I think it's, I have actually just often wondered, do people just have a collection of hats? Where are people keeping all these hats? So I watch the ladies of London. Great. And they are rich and get invited to events that are not royal because they're on a reality TV show.

That would never happen. But they pretend to be of the same kind of posh. And yes, they just have hats. And then they also just like, you know, they have like a hat. hatmaker they go to and they say I have a collection. I think it's also, you can't really re-wear them. It's kind of, you spend a lot of money on one time and then maybe you wear it to a second event where you won't be photographed, but you can't be seen in the same Fascinator twice. That's true. One thing that I think is brilliant about the fascinator culture doesn't ruin your

hair. It's true. Because it's not really a hat. It's more of like a head fixture. It's true. But then you do have to kind of worry about the architecture of the fascinator versus your face. That's true. And I, like, a lot of people are not mastering that. Not that I would be able to. Sure. If anyone here listening is familiar with my face shape and wants to let me know what fascinator would best suit it, let me know. I also like that it's sort of like the case for the updo because you're like, well, I got this fast. And I feel the updo has been maligned by prom culture. That's true.

But it serves a real purpose. For those of us who touch our hair a lot, the updo is useful. I know, but I never do it because then I just mess up my updo. Anyway. Moving on. Okay. Who has been snubbed off the guest list? Thanks so much for asking.

So many of, there aren't that many Americans coming and not that many of her family, but the best, everyone's very mad, the minor royals got snuffed. There are a lot of like second cousins of the queen and people who even live at Kensington Palace who aren't getting invited. That's a little ridiculous, but. Well, I don't know. She doesn't know them. That's true.

I think this is fine. That's true. Also, like, the queen and Albert or Philip have so many. cousins because of his weird relations being Greek and German and now British, like the Mount Battenes. Right, right. But there's so many people tied to this union, to the matriarch and patriarch of this family. Got to draw the line somewhere. Yeah.

Like, I don't have that many cousins. It would be much ruder for me to not invite my cousins. Yeah. But this family is massive. Yeah. One that's pretty tough. Fergie is apparently not invited. Sarah, the Duchess.

Sarah, the Duchess of. Well, you know, I mean. I get it. It is how family. family's work. Yeah. You got to pick aside. She is not part of the family anymore.

Yeah. We'll see. I mean, she could show up. She's like a career woman who has become a celebrity. That's not something the queen is into. Right. She parlayed being the Duchess. I think actually, it's the fact that she parlayed being a Duchess into some career choices that the Queen is not into.

I think actually the queen. She's no problem with career women, right? Yes. And in fact, I think that was rude. Edward is married. His wife, Sophie, Reese Jones. Yes. Actually, like, had a career.

and she's one of the queen's favorites because she is actually a person of some substance. Sure. I mean, we're maybe giving me the queen too much credit, but, you know. Sure. You know who my favorite lesser royal is for sure is Zara Tindal, lover. She's great. Yeah. Formerly Zara Phillips.

Yes. Daughter of Princess Anne. Yes. The Princess Royal. And married to a rugby player. And very candid about her pregnancy struggles. Yes. Which I think is great.

The Obamas won't be there. They were invited, though. They weren't. Oh, they weren't because they didn't want to buy Trump, right? No, I don't think so, because they didn't do political people. So I think also, like, Theresa May won't be there. Right. They wanted to make it a non-state event.

Tazars, we don't, we, who's surprised? We don't really need it. Who's surprised? It'd be funny if they're like Jeremy Corbyn, you can come. Right. Well, and I doubt they'll do that. Well, David Cameron be there. Out of office?

Probably not just because it seems like they're doing. no politics. I'm office responsible for the Brexit. Yeah. Well, that's a tough one. Not invited. Are Harry's ex-girlfriend's invited? So, thanks for asking.

Chelsea Davy, this is according to the mirror, who I think is, more or less. 50 to 60% relaxed. I mean, actually, they have, like, a tradition of pretty good royal reporting. Yeah. Good being a, whatever. Chelsea Davy is apparently invited to the actual ceremony and kind of the wedding breakfast, the immediate reception. but she is not invited to the evening event,

which is basically like she's being treated like a friend of the parents, as opposed to a friend of the bright and groom. Right. And the mirror says that she is extremely upset about this. I feel like Chelsea Davy doesn't give a fuck based on what we know about her. Definitely does not give a fuck.

But apparently she's invited. Cressett a bonus, not invited, according to everything that I found and might have something to do with her Instagrams. Crescenta Bonaeus is just What a trip. What a trip that girl is. God bless.

I like it. Okay, we got that settled. Next question. Yes. Is it real that Megan Markle can't eat shellfish or can't go on a trip without packing a black dress? So this is about this. Okay. These questions are from Jason Gallagher and Tanya Hubbard to beloved Rigger Safers who read one list about royal etiquette

and have just been asking a lot of ridiculous questions ever since. So these are these are some royal etiquette things. The black dress thing is because, this is probably true, but it's fine. Do you recall on the crown, season one, Elizabeth is traveling abroad when she gets the news of her father's death. Very sad. And she doesn't have a dress. And so they have to bring the black dress on the plane because if you're a royal, wearing black when someone important dies, it's like blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So I think that's probably true.

Not a huge ask. No. Right. I'm wearing a black dress today out of my own volition, as I do many days. She tends to wear a fair amount of black, actually, so more than royals usually do. The other thing is that you're not actually supposed, if you're a royal, you're only supposed to wear black to funerals. I mean, it's not a hard and fast rule, but it's suggested. So she's already wearing a bit more than they or Anna Winter might like.

Anna doesn't like black either. The shellfish thing is apparently to avoid food poisoning. So it's not like someone is, it's not like a bodyguard is tackling her before she puts a clam in her mouth. These are common sense guidelines. Sure. You got to go out and meet a lot of people. Like I said, you got to go to a lot of factories. People are handing you stuff.

Yes, stay healthy. Maybe shellfish, random shellfish, a random shellfish attack, not ideal. Agreed. Okay. What's the one royal wedding rule you wouldn't have minded at your wedding, Amanda? So they don't have, in the UK, they don't really do, like, grown-up bridesmaids. They don't have, like, bridal parties like that. Or they do, but they're all children.

And so I think Megan literally has like eight to ten children following her in little outfits and no grownups. And that's probably my ideal situation. I couldn't compel any of my friends with children to actually allow their children to be a part of it. They didn't really want to do it. Like we had one of my, our good friend's sons was going to be helping us with the rings. And the last minute got a little nervous, understandable. Sure. So we didn't really have the posse of children that I would love to have.

Or the little hats or whatever. So that, I would have liked that. Finally, let's do some predictions. Okay. Who will be walking her down the aisle? Okay. What will her dress be like and who will design it? Who, as I've said, I really do think it'll be...

Her father. My prediction is that it'll be her father. In my heart, I think that it should be both of her parents, which I do not think will happen. Sure. That's the Jewish people do. Exactly. Exactly. And they are technically, they're part of the Church of England, so I don't think they can do that for confusing things. But I think that would be nice. I think it'll be her dad still. Okay. I think her dress will look like every other damn royal dress in history. They're nice. They're very nice. I really liked Kate's dress, but I will have some long sleeves and a fitted bodice and a skirt. I doubt the skirt will be as voluminous as other skirts, but I don't think we're doing a slinky number here. Okay.

I think it'll have some sort of train because, like, what? What's the point of a royal wedding if you can't have a train? Literally, what is the point of taking all this bullshit on if you're not going to have a train? I honestly don't know. And who will design it? You know, I'm not really sure. Erdem was, it'll definitely be a British designer. Erdem was rumored for a while, and that seems to not be the case.

There's been a lot of talk that the people who made her, like, the dress for her official engagement photos, Ralph and Rousseau will be the people doing it. And that makes sense to me. The same photographer who took those photos is doing the wedding photos. So it's all planned out. It would make sense to me. I don't think that she'll do McQueen because. Me neither.

Yeah, that's what Kate did. Yeah. Jenny Packham and Alexandria Queen are for Kate. I think, yeah, that makes sense. My predictions are Prince William walking her down the aisle. Oh, that's nice. He's the best man, though. Oh, is he?

Yeah. Oh, of course he is. Well, but I mean, he could probably. He could do both. I feel like that would be a nice twist. Yeah. I think you're probably right, but he would be the backup in my mind. I think she's going to go cap sleeves, not full long sleeves, as she's been as skewing stockings and pantyhoes.

That's true. I feel like perhaps there's some room there for her. Okay. And I truly have no idea who will be designing her dress. I think it has to be a British person, though. I think that's unquestionable. Yes, it can't be like some cool American, whatever. Yeah.

I can't wait, Amanda. I'm really excited. It's going to be extremely silly but fun to watch. I can't wait. That's the theme. Silly but fun. To the Royals. To the Royals for one week only.

And thanks to brightly burning and tripping.com. We'll be back in two weeks.