The Press Box - A Veep Debate Cheat Sheet, a WNBA Controversy, and More on Zach Lowe and ESPN

Episode Date: September 30, 2024

Hello, media consumers! Bryan and David open the show by discussing Zach Lowe’s departure from ESPN (0:34). Then they preview the vice presidential debate between Tim Walz and JD Vance (12:34). Later, they react to DiJonai Carrington’s postgame interview about Caitlin Clark (28:37). Then they talk about Only in Journalism classics following the story about New York City Mayor Eric Adams (37:56). Plus, the Overworked Twitter Joke of the Week, Only in Journalism, and David Shoemaker Guesses the Strained-Pun Headline. Hosts: Bryan Curtis and David Shoemaker Producer: Brian H. Waters Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey y'all, Sirot Sohi from The Ringer here, and I wanted to let you guys know about a new show that I'm hosting. The Ringer WNBA show. We're going to be talking about all the biggest personalities, breaking down and analyzing the latest happenings that make the W so fascinating, featuring some of the best guests and experts from around the league. Tap in with us on the brand new Ringer WNBA show feed on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. David? Yeah. Right off the top, I wanted to get your thoughts about Zach.

Whoa. Whoa, we're jumping right in here. I didn't get to give my two cents. I got plenty of shots, but I'm ready for you to take a shot at this. I will say that. I thought ESPN letting him go was absolutely. And, of course, we don't know the ends and outs of these things, but, you know, with ESPN, it seems like we can kind of divine the conversation or lack of thereof that happened.

When they show people the door, I thought it was wild. I thought it was, you know, as a writer, as a reader, I thought it was sort of unconscionable. Even still, I don't think I was prepared with the sort of outpouring of grief that attended his departure from the SPM. I think it was deserved, but I feel like I just expect this to be sort of all...

My expectation is that we're all just sort of so weathered to these things now that, you know, it doesn't rise the level that Zach's departure did, but I think Zach hits on a number of levels that... You know, he's not the same as all the people that have been laid off before. And also, it's kind of symbolic of something in a way that a lot of the people who have been let go or not.

You know, like, you can love RG3 as a commentator, but I don't think it's, you can necessarily draw the line to a, to, you know, a larger scale critique of ESPN. And Zach, you know, certainly did that. just the accumulation of people that have been let go from ESPN over the decade. You know, without even making judgments between person A and person B. It's just the farther you get into these cuts, the network gets smaller. Yeah.

And, you know, people you love just begin to disappear. We're talking about this with Bill on Thursday. It's like we always used to say, well, you know, ESPN still has and then we would insert somebody with a 90 plus percent approval

rating. Yeah. I got one fewer of those people after Zach Lowe leaves. I was trying with Bill and with Jason Gade to kind of put my finger on what it feels like is ending at ESPN. With Zach's departure. I don't think I did a very good job. But thank God, David, our ringer teammate Howard Beck sent me an email right after the podcast went up. And what he said, I thought really hit it because he said, in the team.

at ESPN, you had what you could almost call the rise of the NBA public intellectual. Writers like Zach Lowe, like Henry Abbott and the True Hoop Network, like Kevin Arnowitz, my friend, like Ethan Strauss, all of whom are gone now. You could also broaden that and say it was almost the era of the ESPN sports public intellectual more broadly. Yeah. But Monty Jones, Dan Lebitard, Jamel Hill, Pablo Torre, Mina Kimes, who's still there. And that was the creation of a couple of very specific circumstances, one of which is that John Skipper, the former president liked words and was interested in print journalists. And two, that ESPN was making crazy money and could do whatever it wanted.

Yeah. Both of those things are gone now. sure jimmy bataro doesn't like words in the way john skipper does and doesn't have the money to do whatever he wants right it's a very different place and i think we can you can sort of say both of those things at the same time are true but if something is ending at ESPN i feel that's a pretty good approximation of it yeah i i think that's absolutely true although there's been this slow creep I mean, it's not just skipper to Pitara. I mean, we've talked about this before.

The sort of slow creep of, you know, your sideline reporter or your reporters, your, your insiders being being people who came from the printed page, right? So just people who were full-time television personalities. And it's not a knock on them. But that evolution has been there for everyone to see over decades. I guess to me, what I wonder more. than anything is like what replaces Zach Lowe on the website on dot com, i.e on the as in the written word in the form of written word. And certainly it's possible the Jimmy Pitar or whoever ESPN decided we can get the same

amount done, you know, with replacement level players or you know to to butcher a sports metaphor, um, which would be, I mean, I think it's nonsensical. I don't think you're ever going to be able to replace Zach Lowe. but I guess that that would be a quibble if they actually thought, oh, now we're going to publish twice as much for half the money or something. I don't think they're going to publish twice as much. Yeah, no, I'm just saying not knowing that. But I think that in the big picture, you're absolutely right.

I mean, it was, listen, I mean, all those public intellectuals that you talked about were people that largely came from the blogs, came from the True Hoop Network, and evolved up, leveled up. in house at ESPN. And that's just not the business they're in anymore. What's kind of mind-boggling about Zach is that he was on TV. You know, he had a very successful podcast. Seemingly reluctantly on TV at times, but on TV.

But, I mean, but they're all the time by the end, you know? I mean, reluctantly, I don't know if that was, if you call that shtick or just personality or persona, but it was, but it suited him. And I thought it suited, you know, his work on the jump and everywhere else he was. that's kind of what's most stunning to me is that it seemed like he was on the trajectory that they would have wanted. And there have been, you know,

there tweets and stories going on around about his salary. And I guess he was making a lot of money there. Not that, you know, we should be crying on behalf of ESPN for the amount they have to pay anybody. They pay a lot of people a whole lot more. But, I mean,

without having a spreadsheet of numbers in front of me, one would think the amount that they were paying him could have been recouped by his podcast alone, let alone his writing, let alone his television appearances. You know, it's not, he was, he was a big mover for them, you know, and it's just sort of crazy to think, now I'm sure they have a spreadsheet that says otherwise, but that, but if they don't know how to monetize these things appropriately, it's, it's hard to fault the talent, you know? I mean, it's, it's just a, it's just sort of crazy. that's what gets me to those big salaries for a words person or a words forward person

were definitely a product of the skipper era when those contracts were being handed out sure we know this at the ringer because sometimes people wouldn't come work at the ringer they'd go work somewhere else because ESPN was still giving out those kind of deals but I got a note from somebody who was a sports podcast who was asked the same question you did if that indeed was his salary, could most of that have been recouped for ESPN as pure profit? We're talking about, you know, how much is somebody worth as a sports writer, sports personality,

just through the podcast alone? Yeah. And don't you want lots of podcasts of your ESPN moving into this uncertain future of television? Yeah. Where you're leveraged to your eyeballs with these sports rights, where you have people who are going to work for you anyway, talking about the sports you've paid through the,

knows for. They're enhancing that thing that you're going to put on television, drawing people into your orbit in various ways. Don't you want that? Yeah, one would think. I mean, there's a, there's a philosophy that like I don't even want to barely want to like give voice to. But I guess I could imagine a world that I totally disagree with in which they thought, you know, you said it's fewer and fewer people there. I mean, maybe the model is we just want. to create an army of Pat McAfee's. You know, we want to create it. I mean, and maybe, you know,

maybe Perk, you know, is closer to that than, than Lowe was in their eyes. And I agree with Bommani, other people that said you don't need to be setting those two people against each other. But, you know, the people that are still there. And maybe they decided that wasn't going to be Zach Lowe. But again, I just think that's ridiculous.

I mean, it's, Zach Lowe was such a net positive for that company. I'm sure financially. Like, he should have been. And it's such a huge loss in ways that I can't even imagine that they fully contemplated, or at least they fully grasped if they thought about it. You know, I mean, it's, it's really, it's really unusual. I mean, I remember when Grantland shut its doors and the ringer was, you know, starting back up.

And it was Zach and Barnwell that made the leap, or I guess it's the reverse of the leap. They decided they got offered good deals to stay at ESPN. And it was sad for the future of whatever Grantland 2.0 was going to be. But it was also like, yeah, I mean, they are the future of what online sports writing should be. Totally. Totally. And that's exactly the voices that ESPN should be spending lots of money to hang on to. And yeah, like I said, I mean, I was, I've been pleasantly surprised by Zach's multimedia presence everywhere.

I mean, I listen to the low posts religiously and watch them on TV a lot. I just I just don't know. It's hard to imagine what they were thinking, really. You mentioned the outpouring on Twitter. I was trying to think of the list of sports media people, trying to grasp for a synonym to sports writer there, sports media people who young people want to be when they grow up. Yeah.

And Zach has got to be. a top fiver in that group. Oh, for sure. Oh, dude. At least a seemingly attainable sports media careers. Not that it's easy to be Zach, but people can imagine themselves doing. No, no. I mean, yeah, my 15-year-old thinks about being a sports writer. And that's, Zach is like the person that you point at, right?

I mean, because he's, he's incredibly good at what he does and he's successful across, all these platforms, you know, it's not, and I'm not imputing anybody in particular, but this isn't an empty calories approach to being a talking head. Because frankly, when you're looking up to someone, when you're looking at a career, it's like that's like, as impossible as it is to be Zach, it's like almost random to find success as a, as a just a performer, you know, as a talking head. And, yeah, I mean, Zach is, I'm sure so many people, so many young journalists look towards All right, coming up on the podcast, a preview of tomorrow night's vice presidential debate from the new rule about hot mics to the character actor who's

playing J.D. Vance. Plus a WNBA interview, the return of the Think Peace Championship Belt and a presidential non-endorsement that's on steroids. All that and much more on the press box. A part of the ringer. Podcast Network. Hello Media Consumers, Brian Curtis, David Shoemaker, and producer, Brian Waters here. David Tomorrow is the vice presidential debate. As the old wrestling announcer would say, a classic

contrast of styles. Tim Walls in this corner, J.D. Vance in the other corner. I think I have a better idea of what J.D. Vance's plan of attack is going to be.

Mm-hmm. Which is attack, attack, attack. Yeah. Tim Walls feels a little hazier to me. What do you think Tim Walls is like on a debate stage?

I think there's going to be a lot of project 2025. I think there's going to be a lot of, you know, playing the hits from the Harris

you know, public speaking routine. Walls Harris, I guess I should say. And I think there'll be a lot of, as we say, as we, you know,

as he's often described, a lot of folksiness, a lot of down-homeness, you know, I think this is really the opportunity for this is like the humanity Olympics, right?

Or at least that's the way Walls is going to try to frame it. And if it does get framed that way, he's going to win going away. I would say so. If the question is, who do you like more and who feels more human to you standing on this stage? Yeah. America votes Tim Walls as a winner. I think part of this comes down to the natural mode of each candidate to Kamala Harris, prosecutor.

we can project that to a debate stage. J.D. Vance, owner of the libs on Twitter. Okay, I can project that to a debate stage. Tim Walls, football coach, guy fixing things around his house in Minnesota, just a little harder. But I agree. If he defines it on the terms you talk about,

he's going to have a good night. Some of these specifics, David, it's going to be a 90-made debate. The CBS moderators are Nora O'Donnell and the press box's very own Margaret Brennan. It's once again going to be one of those very tortured titles where it's the CBS debate on. And here's where you pick the network that you're watching the debate on. I noticed while I was watching football this weekend, the networks that didn't have the debate, their strategy was to really foreground the people they had doing the pregame show.

So it was like ABC News with your trusted team. of David Muir and then it would go to a final graphic that's at the CBS debate which they would get off the screen in like a nanosecond Yeah

we do have some new rules one is for the first time in this cycle there are going to be hot mics during the debate Mm-hmm mics were assiduously muted during Biden Trump

and Harris Trump Mm-hmm They're going to be hot this time CBS also tells the APs David Bouter that there will be no fact-checking like there was during the Harris Trump debate. Yeah.

Now, thank goodness J.D. Vance has not said things that he knew weren't true and then repeated the madnauseum. So I can't imagine what need we'll have for fact checking tomorrow night. We've laughed a lot on this podcast about managing debate expectations. Yeah. Politicians always say they're going to do badly and then for some reason reporters print that they're going to do badly even when they don't believe they're going to do badly. Well, Tim Walls has set a new world record here because in his job interview with Kamala Harris back in August,

he was confessing, you remember, to various weaknesses. I'd never used a teleprompter. And we learned this at the time. He said, I'm a bad debater. Yeah. He was lowering expectations before he was even picked for the job. Yeah. And he's only continued that.

This month he said of J.D. Vance, look, he's a Yale law. guy. I'm a public school teacher. What right do I have, David, to be standing on that debate stage with somebody who went to Yale Law School? Yeah. You have to be a good debater to get into Yale Law School, apparently.

There's also some funny stuff. There was once again a debate coin toss, which always makes me smile. Yeah. J.D. Vance won, which means he gets to go last with his closing statement.

This is the debate equivalent of we want the ball in the second half. Shouldn't they have the coin toss like they're live on television? So you're not, you don't come prepared for when your closing statement's going to be. Sort of a draft lottery of debate where we can eventize every little thing that happens. By the way, I love politics. You love politics.

90 minutes into a debate, I'm not totally locked in. I don't know if going last is really the advantage. advantage you think it is. I might have picked what side of the stage I stand on. That's my first choice because that's what people are going to be looking at. Yeah. For some reason in the past

vice presidential candidates have always sat down during debates. If you remember the fly landing on Mike Pence's head four years ago? I do. Yeah. Walls and Vance will be standing this debate. We're breaking precedent. Walls is going to be

on stage left, which meaning the right side of your television screen. Vance is going to be on the left side. And I learned that the New York City television stage where they're having the debate has hosted editions of 60 minutes inside the NFL,

Geraldo and Captain Kangaroo. That's all according to the AP. Then David, there are the nuggets. Those behind the scenes details we learn about debate prep. This comes from the Washington Post Tyler P.

Pager. Now, we know Tim Walls has tried to project like, I'm a normal Midwestern guy. Just the most normal guy you've ever met. Can you count off the normal guy identifiers here in this sentence from Tyler Pager? Go for it. Fueled by Diet Mountain Dew. One. And dressed in casual wear cargo pants. Yeah, there you go. And a t-shirt. Walls was in a Minneapolis Hotel Wednesday, dot, dot, dot, taking notes on a yellow legal pad. Oh, there you go. Okay.

The normal guy presentation was so much and he couldn't even jot down some notes on an iPad or on his phone. He needed a yellow legal pad. Yeah, it helps organize their thoughts. In Tim Walz's preparation, the character of J.D. Vance is being played by none other than Pete Buttigieg.

Oh, wow. he also played Mike Pence for Kamala Harris during her prep for the VEEP debate four years ago. So he's a multi-faceted impersonator. Yeah. It's like when the British movies always call Michael Sheen in to play Tony Blair. Pete Buttigieg can play any Midwest Republican. Sure.

You know the role. You feel comfortable with this. I hope he takes a show on the road after the election. Just Pete Buttigieg doing Republicans. It was like Hal Holbrook doing Mark Twain for years and years. Exactly. CNN had this, and this is the kind of behind the scenes nugget I love, Pete Buttigieg did not grow a beard in order to play J.D. Vance in the debate prep.

That we know. Yeah. Everyone, yes, that we know. So we're clear on that. Best piece I read about all this was by Edward Isaac Devere on CNN.com. He had a piece called He heading into the vice presidential debate. Tim Walls is fighting nerves. CNN was talking last week

about how they're going to try a metered paywall for their website which could be complicated because their website is absolutely the dog's breakfast and I was thinking like what in the world would I pay for on CNN.com I'm reading Edward and Isaac DeViers

because I would pay for this. This is well written, well reported, full of stuff I want to know. You will be happy to learn, David, that once again, the Walls Harris campaign has put their game plan

for the debate online. Remember they did that for the Harris Trump debate and it works? Absolutely, yeah. So apparently they're doing it again because this is from the article. The plan for Tuesday night, several people involved told CNN will be to largely skip Vance and go right at Trump. If they get their way, Trump will be triggered into a storm of anger, jealousy, and peak. You may say that sounds kind of obvious. Last time it worked.

Yeah, well, you know, sometimes you like to be surprised, but sometimes when you're, you know, the crowd, likes when they know the punchline is coming, right? Sure. And repeat it along with the comedian. Yeah, a little call and response. Speaking of which, we actually put one of the punch lines into the public sphere as well. This is also quoting from CNN here. People involved say walls may even try a line that originated when Harris was preparing

for a vice presidential debate before Joe Biden dropped out. Asking Vance, what promises he made to Trump so the former president wouldn't send an angry mob after him with a gallows like Mike Pence experienced on January 6th. So we are trying out lines. Yeah. Publicly on CNN. This is the game plan. Here we go.

You get it. Yeah. It's like you workshop them in the small clubs. And then you know, you do your Netflix special. And everybody who's seen you perform knows the joke is coming. And it makes it feel like, yeah, you're part of the process. So the CNN.com in this case is like Tuesday night of the comedy store. Exactly. Yeah.

Edward Isaac Devere also makes a good point about Walls. He said traditionally running mates service attack dogs for the past six weeks of calibrated campaign appearances, Walls has been more emotional support animal for his party. Harris Aides says he's a walking permission structure for people to feel joyful and hopeful themselves. Going to the point of what character he will play on the debate stage. Final note for you here,

this may be the last debate we see. in 2024. As we speak, there are 35 days until the election. Harris, as a reminder, has committed to a debate on CNN on October 23rd, which seems pretty late, but there was actually an October 22nd debate four years ago. Trump so far is a no on that debate. He said it was too late, though the Washington Post is reporting that Donald Trump,

is thinking about it, quizzing people about whether he should do one more debate. Yeah. I don't know. I feel like the generic point everybody makes on Twitter is this election is going to be close and polling all the way up to November 5th. Yeah. I don't know if that changes the thinking of Donald Trump on whether he shows up at CNN in late October. Yeah.

It's impossible to get into his head. I mean, it'll probably be whatever the person he talked to. right before you has to make a decision said to him, right? I mean, I, or just wanting to have a surprise. Like, I just, I'll just, show up after all. I'll announce three days before that I'm ready to go.

Yeah. And make them have this debate. I saw somebody on Twitter wondering a lot, like, should Kamala Harris's invitation really be an open invitation? Shouldn't you be like, we have accepted the debate, but you have to agree by October 10th? Yeah.

Oh, we just need to make other plans? We could be in Pennsylvania that day. Yeah. I like the idea of the, I like the open, I mean, listen, I'm a wrestling guy. I love, I love the open challenge. Just like, I'm going to be there on the stage waiting for you at 8 p.m. You or anybody else can show up if they want to to debate me. That would be fantastic TV.

That's even better than putting the coin flip. Yeah. on CNN. Before we move on here, I wanted to read to you some of the emails I've been getting from Kamala Harris and Tim Walls. Oh my gosh. Because I'm on this email list. I didn't ask to be on this email list. I know some political reporters want to know because they tweet out the little pictures from the fundraising emails. I'm actually not one of those people, but I got on anyway. And I wake up every morning. I want to read to you some of these subject lines that have been coming lately. I've probably gotten some of these too. Go ahead. Polin, what will happen in Pennsylvania? Kind of an old school email reply there.

An autograph from our future president emoji eyes. One says 48% to 48%. They love polls or they love emails that have like a bad polling result in the title. Another one says, and this was a little confusing to me, Donald Trump is tied with our campaign. What? He is tied with your campaign. They've also been having surrogates send me emails.

Oh, yeah. I got one from filmmaker Ken Burns. Another from Anthony Scaramucci. It says, now is our chance. And then I got two emails from Barack Obama. I'm glad you guys are still in touch. We're still in touch. And let me tell you what.

The most recent one said, Brian in the subject line and Brian was spelled correctly. We have some press box listeners that DMA would be RIAN. They've been listening for years and they don't know how to spell Brian. Barack Obama, former leader of the free world, knows how to be properly spelled. Also, Jimmy Kimmel sent an email on behalf of Team Heresy. That was pretty funny. All right, David, coming up at 30 seconds, we are ready once again to award journalism's

most prestigious prize. the think piece championship belt. But first, let's do the overworked Twitter joke of the week where we celebrate a gag that it was so obvious that all of media Twitter made it at exactly the same time. Send your nominees to at the press box pod where they were always, always gratefully received. We got the news via Semaphores Max Tanny, David,

that Kamala Harris has picked a sports podcast to go on. All right. Alas, it's not one of ours. No. It's All the Smoke hosted by former NBA players Matt Barnes and Stephen Jackson. She made some legalized marijuana

news today. That was big. Would you like to hear the best jokes about Kamala Harris appearing on all the smoke? Number one, we're about to have a presidential candidate talking about how underrated Monte Ellis was. Number two, it'll be funny to hear how she manages her answer to rank LeBron,

MJ, and Kobe. Number three, Madam Vice President, do you think AD is finally going to become the Lakers' number one option this year? And finally, really hoping Kamala has an answer to the ultimate NBA podcast question, what's the most heinous thing Kevin Garnett ever said to you on a basketball court? If you think it's about time that Kamala Harris levels with the American people about over-under-win totals, congrats. You made the overwork Twitter joke of the week. All right, a couple of quick things for you in the notebook dump.

Did you see the WNBA story that people were tweeting about? Which one? The end of last week? Well, it was game one of the playoff series between the Indiana fever and Connecticut Sun. Yeah. Caitlin Clark has the ball at the top of the key. She goes up like she's about to shoot it. She actually passes it.

But the son's Dijunet Carrington, who is defending Caitlin Clark, jumps up with her. and after Caitlin Clark passes the ball Carrington's finger comes down and gets Caitlin Clark right in the eye. Yeah. Clark goes down to the court.

There was no foul call. They replayed it a bunch of times during the game. The announcer said, I don't think that was intentional. Yeah. Well, USA Today columnist Christine Brennan wanted to ask

Bijunet Carrington whether that eye poke on Caitlin Clark, in fact, was intentional. Here's how that went. Dijane, did you, when you went and kind of swatted at Caitlin, did you intend to hit her in the eye? And if so, could you just, or if not, either way, could you talk about what happened on that play? I just, I don't even know why I would intend to hit anybody in the eye. That doesn't even make sense to me.

But no, I didn't. I didn't know I hit her, actually. I was trying to make a play on the ball, and I guess I followed through and I hit her. So obviously it's never intentional. That's not even like the type of player that I am. So yeah. Did you and Marina kind of laugh about it afterwards? It looked like you there was later on in the game they caught you guys laughing about it?

No, I just told you I didn't even know I hit her. So I can't laugh about something I didn't know happened. So that was the exchange. Questions asked, questions answered. Then the WNBA's Players Association comes out with a statement going after Christine Brennan. This week was dedicated to celebrating and amplifying the association writes, and they listed a few players for their hard work and truly exceptional performances all season long.

The statement continues to unprofessional members of the media like Christine Brennan, You are not fooling anyone. That so-called interview in the name of journalism was a blatant attempt to bait a professional athlete into participating in a narrative that is false and designed to fuel racist, homophobic, and misogynistic vitriol on social media. You cannot hide behind your tenure. The statement continues, you have abused your privileges

and do not deserve the credentials issued to you and you are certainly not entitled to any interviews with the members of this union or any other athlete in the sport. It ends, we see you. Wow. So there's a much bigger discussion about Caitlin Clark and the WNBA

than we have time for right here. I would recommend her old pal, Jake Kang, who had a great Twitter thread sort of laying out all this and did in a very smart way this last week. But if I could weigh in on the narrow journalistic point here, I don't get the need for an intervention from the Players Association. Yeah.

If DeJunei Karrington thought that question was stupid, I would love to hear her thoughts on that. Yeah. if she wanted to pull Christine Brennan aside the next time she sees her and tell Brennan her thoughts personally about that question, I'm good with that. Or she can do what athletes have done since the beginning of sports writing, which is to be a little short with a writer they're not happy with.

It's probably my least favorite option. But in all these cases, I don't totally understand why the Players Association needs to weigh in and muse about pulling credentials. Yeah, it seems like this whole season has been building in this direction or some direction. And there was probably a lot of pressure on the Players Association to get involved. And in the playoffs, especially with all these eyes on them, they, I think they probably just swung too hard. I mean, it's it, but I totally agree.

It just, it just makes, it feels like it just amplifies the issue. instead of trying to resolve it. I've had that happen a lot when there's moments of tension between athletes and sports writers. It almost always gets amplified when other forces intervene. Yeah. Like we've seen this where you have a little moment in a locker room where somebody has a short reply or even, you know, gets into it a little bit with a sports writer and then

it gets tweeted out. And all of a sudden it becomes this big deal rather than something that would be worked out between the parties likely in a couple of days, or maybe never worked out. But that's just the way these relationships in the locker will go. It's interesting about this one. This was not even like a podium interview with 40 people in the room. This was a court side interview that Brendan herself tweeted out,

which apparently led to a lot of the reaction. We have something on this podcast, David, called the Think Peace Championship Belt. All right. This is the prize given to columns that people write over and over again as if they had never been written before. The previous title holder was How Politics is Like a Reality Show, which had a weird comeback in the New York Times like a week and a half ago, I might add. But four years ago, you and I stripped the title from how politics is like a reality show and awarded it to a new think piece. how pro wrestling explains American politics.

Oh, yeah. I got a note from national journals Kirk A. Bado about how this might have reached its apex mountain now through a combination of Hulk Hogan appearing at the RNC and the Mr. McMahon doc coming out on Netflix. Yeah. We might be in a new spring.

Well, the bulwark published a story last week, how wrestling explains J.D. Vance. Here's the subject. subhead, understanding Xbox heat and why everyone hates America's most famous heelbilly. Yeah.

I think there might at least be some insider wrestling knowledge involved in this one. Mm-hmm. But once again, the Washington Post opinion section, meanwhile, made some progress because they published a story titled Donald Trump is not

Hulk Hogan. Huh. But the piece went on to argue that he is more like Rowdy, Roddy Piper and Stone Cold Steve Austin. I'm not sure if I like that. The wrestling politics adjudicator needs to weigh in.

If we're going to indulge this think piece, which wrestler is Donald Trump actually like? Can we table this and bring in and discuss next week? Yeah, we'll let you do some research. I mean, Donald Trump was briefly involved with WWE. We've never heard several times of the course of years, but one time as an on-screen character. and something just to say Donald Trump

with Donald Trump. I'm going to let you go to Peacock and watch all of these old pay-per-views and come back with an answer because we need one answer and then we can just end the think piece. We're all good after that. All right.

And we'll be all done. Media piss test, David. Joe Manchin, you know him, Senator from West Virginia, he's not endorsing Kamala Harris because she wants to end the Senate filibuster to restore national abortion rights.

here is Joe Manchin's quote shame on her she knows the filibuster is the holy grail of democracy it's the only thing that keeps us talking and working together if she gets rid of that then this would be the house on steroids not just that the Senate would be the house but yeah but the house on steroids yeah

in particular I love just I love the shame on her we should have we should be we should count shame I should count shamings in the political sphere so ridiculous. Yeah. That shame on you is my second favorite phrase. The first is what Mark Robinson said last week, whereas the media is at it again, which we may even change the name of this podcast to the media is added again.

What a fantastic phrase that is. I'm all about that, man. Only in journalism. Just got two new ones this week. Matthew Cornelius in email tells us that we need to look for the word tenor. Oh, yeah. Not the three tenors, but tenor, especially in political stories, the tenor of our discourse. Chris Reed down at the San Diego Tribune nominated three-dimensional chess, and boy, that is a phrase.

I am absolutely good with never reading in my life again. Also, Vulcan chess on puck. They've figured out some new forms of chess. While we're doing only in journalism, David, I also wanted to read to you from the print edition of Saturdays New York Times. Oh, I love reading. There was a story about the indictment of New York City Mayor Eric Adams. Now, when you have crazy breaking news, that's when you reach for the only in journalism classics.

So I'll need you to count off for me one more time as I read you some good ones here. Here we go. A muted one, but defiant Mayor Eric Adams. and back-to-back appeared, muted and defiant, right? Yeah. In back-to-back appearances inside a federal courthouse

in Manhattan and outside its granite facade borderline on Friday professed his innocence. Oh, yeah. Professed of criminal charges including bribery and fraud and stood by as his lawyer railed

against the evidence in a case that threatens to topple his, wait for it, embattled administration. There you go. That's the bingo card right there. That is the full bingo card. It's time for David Schuemaker guess is the strained pun headline.

Yeah. Today's headline, David, comes to us from Jeff Dittsler and Claire Cossadine. It's from the New York Post. And it is about that aforementioned Eric Adams' indictment. Did you see this headline anytime over the last 48 hours? I don't think so. No. Okay.

As I was going to say, we should just celebrate it if you did. But if not, we can guess it. You knew the New York Post was going to weigh in on an Adams indictment. Mm-hmm. Even if the paper had supported Adams over the years. Their subhead is feds charged mayor with giving turkey favors in exchange for airline flights. Turkey is the key word there. What was the New York Post strained pun headline?

Turkey? yeah turkey turkey moral turkitude that's pretty good turkey turkey it's not a Turks and Kikos

pun either what if I give you a popular video game where you drive around shooting people that is Grand Petto or okay Grand Theft Auto but not auto it's Grand Theft Reach for the history books here

David. Turkey. Grand theft or perhaps a certain empire that figured heavily in World War II? Grand theft Ottoman? Grand theft Ottoman. Not a joke with the New York Post

headline. Grand theft Ottoman. Unbelievable stuff. He is David Shoemaker. I'm Brian Curtis. Production magic by Brian Waters. We got a lot more press box company this week. Wednesday morning, David.

we're going to have our Veep Debate Reaction Pod with semaphore's Benji Sarlane, the official politics reactor of the press box. It's always nice to have Benji here. And it's actually part of a double header because I have seen the new Donald Trump movie The Apprentice. Oh, I enjoyed the new Donald Trump movie The Apprentice. And Gabriel Sherman, journalist turned screenwriter, at least in this case. We talked to him Friday. He is going to be talking about how he wrote the screenplay.

for The Apprentice. That's Wednesday. And then Thursday, we're not done yet. The aforementioned Bumani Jones is going to be on this podcast. Yeah. Talking sports, probably talking politics, talking everything in between Bumani Jones on the press box,

and then Shoemaker and I return Monday with more lukewarm takes about the media. See you then, David. See you later, Brian.