The Press Box - Cesar Chavez, a New Doc About the Manosphere, and the World Baseball Classic

Episode Date: March 20, 2026

Today on The Press Box, Bryan and Joel start the show by discussing the New York Times piece about Cesar Chavez containing accounts from women who say he abused them as young girls for years (00:54). Next, the guys discuss the price of oil being the main character of world news this week (06:08) and whether the pushback on rising oil prices will be the thing that will rein in President Trump. After that, Bryan and Joel discuss the ongoing U.S.-Cuba situation (18:15), including what Trump has said about Cuba recently and what reasons he could have for wanting to take action against it (22:35). Following that, the guys review the new documentary ‘Louis Theroux: Inside the Manosphere’ (28:56) before ending the show with some talk about the World Baseball Classic (42:18) and whether we need more sporting events like it (52:20). All that and more, here on The Press Box. Hosts: Bryan Curtis and Joel Anderson Producers: Isaiah Blakely and Bruce Baldwin Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, media consumers. Welcome to Pressbox. It's Brian Curtis, it's Joel Anderson. It's producers Isaiah Blakely and Bruce Baldwin. Coming up on today's show, how high oil prices became the main character in world affairs. An American act of war has been obscured by another American active war. Joel and I review a new Netflix talk about, The Manosphere.

And finally, the World Baseball Classic was a geopolitical home run. Do we need more TV and streaming ready events like that? But, Joel, I thought we'd start today's podcast by saying a word or two about the New York Times piece that came out yesterday about Caesar Chavez. Oh, man. Yeah, absolutely. What a piece of journalism this was by Manny Fernandez and Sarah Hertz about Chavez, who died back in 1993. they went back into the 1970s and found multiple women

who claim they were sexually assaulted by Chavez. One woman interviewed by the Times told the paper that she was 13 years old when Chavez initiated a sexual encounter. Another was 12. The second woman says Chavez had sexual intercourse with her when she was 15, which the paper notes is rape under California law.

Delores Huerta herself a civil rights hero, says Chavez sexually assaulted her, which resulted in a pregnancy. Would you make it that big time story? First of all, the Dolores Huerta piece of it was breathtaking. Like, I was just shocked. Actually, she bore two children. Bres says her Chavez. And I guess in a manner speaking, gave the children up for adoption or placed them with families.

But I actually the whole thing is just breathtaking and jaw dropping. Like I don't know, you know, Cesar Chavez is, you know, one of America's great labor heroes, a champion of farm workers, you know, just one of those truly, you know, we thought prior to this, one of America's greatest men, one of the greatest people here. And this is kind of what journalism, It's meant to do, right?

It's meant to shine a light where people aren't necessarily looking. And I saw that Mani posted something on X about how they've been working on this for five years, man. And I just can't even out. We almost need to bring him on here and talk about how long it took, you know, the work that he did, teasing the strings there because that has a long time to work on something without knowing if there's going to be any payoff on it. But I think it's a necessary story to tell. And it just, you know, I feel like it's a piece of the, the Me Too movement reporting that came out almost a decade ago now. And just sort of a reminder that, you know, that there's still so many people with stories to tell.

And, you know, if you put the resources toward it, you treat the, you know, the victims humanely and guarantee them that they'll get their hearing, then, you know, they'll still have something to say. What did you think? Same. And, you know, I was amazed the way that story was put together, the work that went into that story. It's already been hugely consequential. You know, you're talking about, you know, first, all, on the high end, just rethinking everything we thought about Chavez. It's a state holiday in California, like his birthday. Yeah. Yeah.

And they're talking about renaming the holiday, renaming streets. I mean, again, this just, it's almost one of those pieces where you're just reading it just washes over. You think, oh, my goodness. Yeah. How much are we learning from this story? It was just, it was remarkable. Like you said, the fact that Fernandez and Hertz were working on it for five years, putting that together, checking, cross-checking, you know, going back to these big Chavez archives and looking at letters. I mean, do you think, I mean, who else, so Ronan Farrow, wherever he's at, he's another person that could have done it.

Who else could have done this but for the New York Times? Maybe the L.A. Times? Maybe. Maybe, yeah. Paper that's willing to invest that kind of time in a piece Has reporters that are able to sort of, you know, dig and report at that level and gain the trust of their subjects. So Fernandez mentioned too and is in his comments about it.

It was really remarkable. Yeah, man. Yeah, just please, if you haven't read it, please go read it. Yeah, if anything, it makes me want to get more familiar with Samos. Like, again, I've no... the top line summary of his life, right? Like, I know the Google Gemina, the Google Gemina summary of his life, but this makes me want to learn more.

And I assume they spent five years on this. There's going to be a lot more stories to come on this. So, yeah, please check it out. This is what, man, this is what supporting journalism is all about, man. You know, like paying for it, paying for reporters to do this sort of work. This doesn't happen if people don't have the money to do that sort of stuff. So, yeah, just really proud of them and the work that they did. And it's really sad for all the people that have been affected.

On another topic, if you ever look at British newspapers, they will often have a profile of the important person in the news that week. The main character of world affairs, if you will. And they say, here's a cheap and cheerful, aggregated profile so you'll know who we're talking about. well for our press box main character of the week I'd like to nominate the price of oil all right

which seems to be its own distinct newsmaking entity right alongside Donald Trump and Mark Wayne Mullen and everybody else this week what does that mean for Texas A&M football good things more revenue

Texas tech you know maybe Texas who knows My New York Times that landed on the driveway this morning. Lead headline, oil and gas prices jump as wave of strikes hits energy facilities in Iran. And then yesterday, NBC's Jonathan Allen did a classic television news bit. When gas prices rise, Joel, where do the TV reporters go? Got to go to the gas station, man. They've got to go to the gas station and ask people filling up their cars what they think about the gas price.

It's like when there's, you know, when it's Christmas, you go to the airport and you say the airport is busy. Right. Because people are flying across the country this year as they have done in previous years. Oh, you know, people used to be Black Friday, too. People would go post up outside of a Walmart, you know. The stores are busy today. The store is open. Yeah, that's right. The opening were just after midnight. Yeah. Well, Jonathan Allen was in Pennsylvania, Millersburg, Pennsylvania, where you can get a great deal. if you buy two packs of Marlboro's.

Okay. And here's what one woman told him. Say something to President Trump and he was going to hear you right now. What would it be? You are a worthless pile of shit. And you voted for him how many times? Three times.

That was my bad. Apparently, I'm an idiot. I mean, true. Or as the kids say, facts. I guess the comment, that's a great clip to get. Like, I know that as soon as Jonathan Allen got it and, you know, the camera person, they got that there like, oh, yeah,

can't wait to get this shit up. Was that live or was that recorded? It was on tape. And it was preceded, by the way, by a bunch of people saying, hey, the, the prices were up, but, hey, you know, I think we got to take care of business in Iran. That was just the one that went viral. That was the one that went viral. Yeah.

I mean, I guess, you know, as an aside, it's just kind of sad. And, you know, I can't wait, you know, I guess, you know, it'll be. right around September when people start going into the heartland and the Midwest and they start interviewing people about their feelings about this stuff. Because these are the people apparently that have the attention of our political and media elite. And it's just sad. rounding up thousands of brown and black people and packing them in a concentration camps didn't do it. Epstein accusations and like a couple dozen sexual assault cases didn't do it. illegal wars haven't done it.

A general spirit of animus for more than half the country didn't do it. But if you got to pay $15 more every time you fill up, that pisses people off. It should be more embarrassing to admit that publicly, but I'm glad that she did, and I'll be curious to know how that will

affect her behavior in the future. Regular was $3.54 cents a gallon in Millersburg. It does not seem like gas should cost that much in a place called Millersburg, Pennsylvania, to be honest. But that was the line that was crossed. 354 for regular. Okay. I'm out. Yeah. That's silver spring

prices, man. That's kind of gas we're paying for out here now. A couple of things you see in the media when the price of oil becomes the main character. Explainers about the Strait of Hormuz. About the different kinds of mines that can be laid in the Strait of Hormuz.

About Harg Island. Yeah. A certain news, you know, you can use spirit that connects world events to things that people like that woman in Millersburg experience every day. Yeah. They're also, and tell me if I'm wrong about this, there seems to be a meta quality to the coverage as if reporters are admitting we don't think people care about death and destruction

overseas. Yeah. But we think they might care about this. I think that's right. Because I mean, just quite literally, unless you have active military in your family, you probably won't feel the effects of the war. Like, you know, I mean, you know,

the Trump administration has sort of waved their hand at the idea that we might get attacked domestically here. So obviously we would feel that. But for the most part, Americans don't have to really deal with the brutality of war, like the reality of like the reality of like how horrible and gruesome and, you know, life-altering it is. But, you know, almost everybody, unless you live in New York, maybe a little bit of D.C.,

you got to go to the gas pump, man. And even I, like, I moved here a year ago, and I didn't really think about gas anymore. When I lived in California, it was something I thought about all the time because it was like $5 a gallon, like just as a rule in Cali. Still is, yeah. But when I moved here, it was more in line with the gas prices that are in Texas. or where I grew up and I'm like, whatever. But then I was like, oh, shit, it's like 350, 360 now.

All of a sudden it became a thing, and I'm sure that's happening with a bunch of people. And you're traveling into the office now. You're in that nice studio. I'm sure you're having to fill up. You noticed it too, huh? Even out there. Yeah, yeah, looking at my gas cage. And my mom is really good at texting me and be like, make sure the car's filled up.

Anytime there's any kind of world event, do you get that text? Make sure your car's filled up. Was she affected very deeply by the game? gas crisis of the late 70s because my mom was and so I get a lot of that like such a big deal in Texas yeah like she she said I she never if her gas gates gets below half she's got to go get it filled up because it's that big of a deal for her it's that muscle memory from the late 70s yeah another thing about oil prices being the main character it feels like all of us reporters are trying to guess what will finally reign in Trump.

Congress didn't reign in Trump. The courts didn't reign in Trump. The system more generally didn't reign in Trump. But maybe oil prices like the bond market several months ago will be the thing that gets Trump to end the war. You buy that? I think it will affect Republicans who go before voters, right? I think that, you know, and we can see that through results all around this country so far. That does seem to be a backlash, a growing backlash against the mega political project.

But I think his supporters have been pretty clear that they like this or that they're not willing to challenge him on anything. I mean, again, the Epstein thing, just it is a global sex trafficking ring of children. mostly young white women, right? Young white girls. And it really has not taken a chunk of it. It has not prevented Donald Trump from doing anything he's wanted to do so far. Right? And so I kind of feel like, you know how I kind of felt like Sandy Town or, you know,

Sandy Hook. Sandy Hook, Sandy Hook, yeah, Sandy Hook. It like I felt like it's one of those things like where if that didn't change your mind, about the accessibility of guns. Nothing will. And I kind of feel like Epstein, the same thing. I remember we won here. I was like, just show me how it's going to affect Trump. Like, what is actually going to happen to him?

And I actually don't think that it's going to anything's going to happen to him. His supporters have made it clear that if they can't have this country the way they want it, nobody else will. And he's the person that they've chosen to enact to do as he sees fit. So I still don't think it will affect him, but it might affect people that are connected to him, which is always how it kind of goes down. I mean, do you think people, what do you think will actually happen to Trump

as a result of this? Well, we're talking about two different things. There's political consequences for Trump. Yeah, right. But there's also the thing that I think reporters are trying to figure out and is why they're calling his cell phone every 20 minutes,

which is what's the thing that's going to make Trump start the war? He didn't sell the war to America. Yeah. So we don't have a, you know, you can stop the war? Stop the war. Okay, okay.

He didn't try to sell. the war to America. So we don't have a checkoff list and say, okay, this happened, therefore the United States is going to declare victory and stop. So you're trying to figure out what it would be. Are there actual things he wants to accomplish in Iran? Or is he just going to look at oil prices? It'll be like, ooh, too high, I'm out of here. I'm stopping now and backing down. One is as likely as the other. So to me, there's there's what you're talking about, which is the political consequence, what's it going to mean for Republicans in November? Is Trump ever going to suffer a consequence from his MAGA base?

Totally agree with you on that. But then the other thing is people just trying to figure out what Donald Trump is thinking. So when you center oil prices, you're saying, is this the thing that will sort of break through into Donald Trump's brain and make him think, okay, the war must end right now? I'll report. I mean, again, reporters are, you know, these are people that are connected to him that have followed him for years. He's been in the public spotlight. I guess the question I would have for that is, like, do you think he even, like, you said thinking, right? Right?

Like, that was an important part of this. And I just kind of felt like as reporters, like, trying to suss out what he's thinking, why, motive, all that sort of stuff. We fall for it over and over again. Like, there's no rhyme or reason to a lot of this stuff, right? Or sometimes, I mean, sometimes it's like what he just wants to change, you know, change the subject. Like, you know, some people change the. subject by farting or leaving the room and he's just like I'm going to I'm going to start a war you know I'm going to choke off another country or something you know I'm going to take over another

country or something so yeah I mean it but yeah I mean I admire them and I remind people for their stick-toitiveness on this point but I just don't think all these years later we have really any real insight into the idea that he feels any sort of consequence or that he feels a lot of pressure Yeah. And look, I'm not trying to say that they're trying to like fashion some grand geopolitical theorem. This is the Trump doctrine. And therefore, this is how Iran fits into this because I think we've given up on that now. But there is going to be something that's going to make him stop at some point. Now, maybe it's just like you said, he wakes up and it's all instinct with him. It's all situational thinking. Today is Thursday. And therefore, I'm done with this and goodbye. That's just as likely as anything. But I believe. oil prices, certainly a story in and of themselves, right? That's like there's a big economic consequence for the whole world. Oil prices go up. But there's also a sense, I think they're just trying to figure out, like, what will be

the trigger for Donald Trump that day? And maybe that's just like, you know, walking blind around the room and trying to pick something up. Well, okay, well, what about this? This is going to affect on him? Who knows? The range of possibilities, I mean, not to be overly bleak or grim. I mean, I assume people also are working into that potential calculation, like dropping a nuke.

You know, like, I don't know how serious people, I mean, I get, you know, I haven't really seen a lot of people. I've seen that on social media. I've not seen that in media. But, I mean, that just as likely as anything else. I wonder if, you know, people will work that into their calculations as well. Foil prices have been the main character in the news. Cuba has been a supporting player.

Yeah. Cuba's right now subject to an American oil blockade. If you heard the audio I played on Tuesday, Senator Tim Kane from Virginia compared that blockade to an act of war. The New York Times is Jack Nekis has a paragraph that sums up the consequences of that blockade, and it's worth reading here. Cuba has not received any significant oil or fuel shipment since January 9th, creating a rapidly escalating crisis on the island. Gasoline sold on the black market is soared to about $35 a gallon, and the electric. is failing almost every day, including a nationwide blackout on Monday. Surgeries are being delayed.

Medicine is running out. And food insecurity is increasing. Here's Donald Trump musing about Cuba in the Oval Office on Monday. I think Cuba, I don't know, it's in its own way. If you know, tourism and everything else, it's a beautiful island. Great weather. They're not in a hurricane zone, which is nice for a change, you know. They won't be asking us for money for hurricanes every week.

Fact check, untrue about the hurricane zone. When is the last time you think he's looked at a globe? Didn't he do this with Greenland? I was going to say, I know the answer to that. It's January with Greenland. Yeah, he's like the last time. He's like, yeah, that's, yeah. I mean, anyway, yeah.

Here's more of Trump on his options in Cuba. You know, all my life I've been hearing about the United States in Cuba. When will the United States do it? I do believe I'll be the honor of having the honor of Taking Cuba That's a big honor Taking Cuba Taking Cuba

In some form Yeah Taking Cuba I mean Whether I free it Take it I can do anything I want with it

You want another Thus far It's hard to say That he's wrong I mean It just kind of seems Like he It is his prerogative

Which is sort of weird Because Cuba is allied With Russia And Putin Right but you know it doesn't seem like anybody's managed to stop him from doing this sort of it is it is just shocking again what do you think media prep looks like for trump for an oval office session like that yeah like do you think i mean do you think they go over anything with him like do

you they never have any clue i'm surely about what he's going to say because those aren't talking points that a normal person would come up with like what do you think is going on there But he's just allowed to do this. I mean, the fact that he's answering the cell phone and just riffing with journalists. Yeah. It feels like it all happens after the fact. So he talks. And then the talking points are prepared for everybody else after he gives an interview.

Right. So the reverse of the usual political order. Usually, okay, Senator's going to go on the press box. Oh, we got to prep them up here. Make sure you say this, this, try to avoid that. if you can with Donald Trump it's like you talk and then we will take whatever you said and let it flow from there those that will be the new policy of the administration we are going to take Cuba if in fact you want to take Cuba yeah we haven't had a chance to hear J.D. Vance on

yet I'll be looking for his specific comments to the idea that they're going to take Cuba hopefully he will get asked that question at some point but um you also hear the reporter following up there just like they did with Venezuela. Remember when he said running Venezuela in that initial press conference after Maduro was captured? And he said, wait, excuse me, running Venezuela? What does that entail? So once again, taking Cuba? Taking Cuba.

This is old school. This is the 19th century all over again, you know? Oh, I guess the 20th century, too. Both centuries. Yeah, both centuries. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, again, I mean, it's, it is good that he answers his phone and and talks like this,

the one thing that's missing is just sort of the idea that there are any consequences attached to his sort of, uh, it's not even obliviousness. It's just sort of his, he's just sort of blazé about, you know, reigning this sort of havoc all over the globe. But again, it makes sense because nobody has shown, told him or shown him that he doesn't have to do it. Why do you think he wants to take Cuba? Man. Well, first, I mean, like I said, nobody stopped him. I also think, um, it's, It's a chance to look strong in a time of weakness, right? His own weakness.

His own weakness. I don't, do you think he thinks far enough ahead to like make South Florida Cuban Americans excited? Like, do you think that that's a potential calculation there? Maybe. Maybe. I don't, yeah, I don't know if he's that, that savvy or he's thinking that far ahead if he cares about anybody else's political prospects other than his own.

and I think, you know, I mean, I don't, I mean, he said he's been thinking about it since the 80s. Like, I mean, obviously he's, he's got Cuba on the brain. He must want to put a golf course there, right? Literally put a golf course there. Yeah. Because it's the weakest piece in the New York Times since that he, what was the, what was the wording that they were exploring the idea of a golf course? Oh, oh, that's right. Yeah.

You know what? Shit, I was just saying that, but I guess that had gotten burned into my brain. But yeah, it makes sense. Yeah. Real estate, I mean, what we learn from Gaza is that real estate is often the answer to this. I'm here. Here's a sentence from Nicos. In 2011 and 2012, Trump Organization executives visited Cuba scouting for a golf course.

Bloomberg reported in 2016. So you went on to something. Okay. There is a sort of like generalized legacy building by a foreign policy that's going on. Venezuela with Iran with the Greenland caper I think he's really interested in doing things that other

presidents could not Right So doing in Venezuela what Joe Biden and Barack Obama could not do And also Donald Trump in his first term Could not do Right Doing to Iran what presidents going back to

Jimmy Carter could not do Right Doing in Cuba what president's going back to Dwight Eisenhower could not do. Right. Again. What does Trump think, as you pointed out,

may not be the best way to appoint that, but what is the thought-like object running through Donald Trump's mind? That's probably one of them. Right. I mean, there's been an embargo against Cuba for all this time, but he's really, like, tried to choke them off. I mean, nobody other, I'm assuming, I don't, maybe I shouldn't say that, but I don't think other presidents have wanted to,

kill potentially hundreds, thousands of Cubans via this blockade, right? Like, I mean, because he, again, I'm not trying to, I know people, you know, again, that did I pay attention to comments, Brian. I would never do that. No, not you. Not me. Not me. I'm not sensitive like that.

But I know people will say whatever, but again, I don't think he cares if people die. I don't think he cares if, you know, people live in misery. Like, I think that, like, yeah, he has bottom line. interests and you're right and they're right like the golf course thing Cuba is an island an island nation he looks at it and he's like yeah that's that would be really they'll have some really good resorts there close to Florida close to Florida yeah get on a quick flight there yeah other people I don't the other presidents have probably have not been this nakedly opportunistic and try to enrich themselves through the presidency before so there's a lot working here right and if there are

was, you know, a call that he should explain his motives for trying to change the regime in Iran. Surely there should be a call for him to explain his motives with regards to Cuba. And also to explain what he's trying to do. Is it true regime change or is it Venezuela-style regime change light where someone who in this case is almost certainly the Cuban president, leaves, that is Miguel Diaz-Canel, leaves, and then a more pliant president is put into office that can do deals with the United States. And are we inflicting misery on the Cuban people for choice A or choice B? It's a good argument about whether we should inflict that misery to begin with. But if we are doing that, what is the endgame here? What is he trying to accomplish?

I think the thing is that the human misery is politically popular here, right? And I don't mean that there's a lot of people that want to see people suffer, but they care less about that than more about people being free, right? Living in a democracy or whatever. And so there's a lot of people who have,

it's not, for years, a lot of people have been sort of afraid to talk about Cuba, but kind of the same way people were talking about Israel, because the people that came to America, the people who live here have been able to sort of control the narrative about what the government is like, what life is like, you know, what the preferred sort of governance would look like there. And so this is one of those things that I think that, you know, in America,

Castro bad, communism bad, and anything it takes to, you know, dislodge communism from that nation, is the thing. So that might be why he doesn't have to explain it. Also, like, I mean, how much can everybody keep up with, man? There's a lot of shit going on, right? There's a lot of stuff going on. But I would just say if like if, if the end of communism in Cuba is the goal. Yeah. That would be an interesting thing to state. Again, not just a different president. And Castro's heirs also having lots of influence on that president, a different president that makes deals with the United States. like the current regime does not make deal.

The current president does not make deals with the United States. That's the goal. It'd be worth stating that. Yeah. Because then we'd have an idea of what's going on there. Let's talk about the Manosphere. Oh, man.

One of your favorite subjects. No, we are. I don't think so. You don't think so. Okay. Louis Theroux has a new documentary on Netflix called Inside the Manosphere. Louis Theru, a veteran of TV Nation.

Do you ever watch TV Nation? I did not. I'm new to this, Louis Thoreau. Came out when we were in college. And it is in retrospect, one of the craziest ideas you can imagine. NBC said, what if we gave Michael Moore a TV show in prime time?

What if we gave him an hour of liberal muckraking every week? Don't you think a lot of people would want to do that? Who's the dude who did supersize me? Morgan. What is his name? I'm not going to call him Morgan Insberg. who's the who's the third baseman for the Houston Astros more the it is Morgan Spurlock the late the late to Morland's Burlock the late the late Morgan Spurlock because he had a TV show

that was sort of similar to that um and yeah I was just like a lot of people would like to have that kind of a show I just kind of want on network television in the 90s lots of people would like to have the the liberal muckraking hour would you you raised in a different network television environment that I was well you know I mean you know like the John Stombs Maybe, you know, John Stossel was not a little bit. But people like, you know, people want the opportunity to do these kind of funny, you're not funny, but like do these deep dive. That's the whole, that is with Vice.

That seemed like being the whole ethos, the powered Vice once in one. Yes, and Vice was not on NBC after LA Law. I just want to point that out. That's very true. Very important. Anyway, I mentioned that because Threw was one of the correspondents on TV Nation back when. So he ventured into the Manosphere. Yeah.

And met some characters that I was not familiar. with. Did you know Harrison Sullivan, aka H.S. Tiki-Tucky? I was not aware of him, no. Justin Waller, Myron Gaines of the Fresh and Fit podcast. I'm very familiar with Myron Gaines, though. Yeah. And finally, Sneco? Sneco is Kanye affiliated. Um, he's, he'd done some stuff with Kanye. Which favorite Kanye song. Uh, so I'll just get back to you on that one. I've got some Manistphere notes here. I want to get to before we do that. We major as an acceptable guess, but that's fine. What did you think of the documentary? You know, so I, it was electrifying. Like, you know, to see him talk to these guys and watch them give him access and see them sort of also

appraise him, right? Because there was always this sense of unease as he's talking to them. I'm kind of like, what are you, what are they getting out of this, right? And so it was good to see him sort of like parry with them a little bit. as I got to the end of it and I thought about it a little bit more, I wish it had been longer or I wish it, I mean, anybody can do their own documentary, right? I felt like it just came up a little bit short in terms of like getting towards motivation, the impact on young boys around the world. And I'll hold this last thing until I ask you,

Because you and Connor were very excited about this. You guys got me so excited that I waited until the SMU Miami of Ohio game was over and watched it all last night. Is that the sign of excitement you waited into the Miami of Ohio basketball game was over to watch it? Mostly see SMU lose. But yeah, that too. What I like most about it was that it answered at least in part of a very simple question, which is who are these people? Yeah. who are the people that are creating content like this?

Who are the residents of the Manistphere? She's just like a very basic and interesting journalistic question. And he did that very well. As for the big think of it, I'm with you. I could have used a little bit more of that. It's kind of like a lot of thesis type sentences at the end that didn't really add up to all that much. but the moments he spends with these people interviewing them about their lifestyle,

about their relationships, we hear the term one-way monogamy. Yeah, one-way monogamy. That's right. And this doc over and over again, there's a really funny moment where he's with one of the Manosphere guys. This is Louis Theru with his documentary crew. And the Manistair guy is just looking into the camera and addressing it directly. He's like, no, no, no, we're not recording a video here. You actually look at me when I'm talking to you and we record you in profile.

This is not a video like that, which is just really, really funny. Also, that was interesting is he did get to this sense that what these people are doing is trafficking and all kinds of noxious ideas. But they're also selling stuff. They are leading you to investment. I don't know what investment plans. What do you even call that? They're leading you to the Tate Brothers University? Day trading kind of shit.

Yeah, you know, I was thinking about like, this is very Trump University type stuff, right? It had never occurred to me. I will say that that was a good thing about this documentary. It connected to me. Oh, they are selling stuff to these young, impressionable kids and young men who, you know, that's a cap. that's an audience that all marketers want, right? They want to be able to sell those people's stuff,

and they were really, they have a captive eye. What, I just, this is maybe, this is maybe not something I should say, when I'm just going on hand to say it. What won't gambling casino companies put their brand on? Like, what is, what is they just like? Is this the line that they will not? I can't put it on this.

Yeah, because that seemed to come up a lot. in here and it's like, oh, damn, look at that gambling company right here affiliated with this noxious person. It's part of parcel of their cell to young men and probably even boys in certain cases. I'm living this fabulous life. Here are my ideas about women, noxious ideas about women, to repeat that word one more time. And here's how I'm making money. I'm making crazy kinds of money. You could have all of this. If you follow my teachings if you sign up for this investment plan if you attend this Trump-like university you too could have this lifestyle that I have lots of science scenes you know pool side big

apartment complexes in Miami and elsewhere with big balconies overlooking the city yeah and then but there is this cell at the bottom of it that not only do i want you to you know sign up for my stuff and do whatever you know pay me in whatever way but there's this i got some plans here too. These will help you look my lifestyle. Yeah. Did you, did you feel sorry for those guys at any point? Um, there was part of the doc where Theroux gets into their childhoods. Yeah. He didn't get terribly far on that. And that was something I thought was missing. He sort of gestures at this idea that some of these guys had unhappy childhoods.

Yeah. And that part of what they're doing is, is making up for missing a father figure when they were young. Right. But that part would have been a lot better with more facts to it. And, you know, more reporting. Because I feel like we're kind of hearing a secondhand version of what these guys say about the way they were raised. Yeah. Rather than a reporter's readout, oh, here's what actually happened.

I talked to people that grew up with them. This is what his life was like. like when he was a kid, et cetera, et cetera. Yeah, so I'm glad you said that because that was a big thing that was overlooked in this documentary and maybe this is just because of who I am, race. I looked at Harrison, you know, was this tiki-talkie-h-h-S-tikikki. And I'm like, I was just like, hey, man, he kind of looked like a brother, you know what I'm saying? And then I go to find out that his father is some, you know,

legendary English rugby player from, I can't remember what country. Let's say Nigeria, right? And Myron Gaines, if I'm not mistaken, is he Samalian by ethnicity? Yeah, Sudanese. He's Sudanese, right? And race never comes up at all in this documentary. Like, they talk about how they have racist beliefs or whatever,

but they never talk about how, like, the face of a lot of this stuff or for a lot of these people, they're biracial, multiracial, multiracial, multi-ethnic and how they're the face of a lot of this movement and how they're associating themselves with people

that ordinarily sort of hate them, right? And there's that moment near the end of the documentary when Lewis is interviewing HS Tiki Tiki. And they go, his, H.S. Tiki-Toki's mom is there and his cameraman is there.

And Thoreau says, well, you know, you're anti-Semitic. And he points to his cameraman. He's like, my cameraman's Jewish, you know? And just sort of that how people can sometimes be complicated, right? Like that identity is sometimes not determinative. But I would have, I just would have liked the scene a little bit, just even touching on it for just a second. Like, just like, hey, man, you know that like people look at you and think you're black, right?

Like, what are you doing? But he didn't, he didn't do that. So whatever. I'm free to make my own documentary, I suppose. Another part of this was so fascinating was Theroux was interviewing these guys. And he was also becoming content at the same time. Yeah. So he's like walking around town with them while they interview people.

And they're cutting up clips of him, often looking hapless or funny or doing this, you know, arcade game where you punch a punching bag. And it gives you a score based on how hard you hit it. And his score was really low. So they would just cut that up and distribute clips of that online. I'm like, how many, I don't know how many people watching these guys know who Louis Theroux is. But he just becomes like a weird figure in their universe. Like, oh, look at this, Rando. He was, yeah, just some, he was, I mean, man, he represents everything that those people allegedly don't like.

Beta mainstream media guy. You know what I mean? And so he's a stand. And it didn't make a difference what his name was. but I think that they enjoyed that and I was just kind of I was kind of surprised that

Lewis didn't think about the idea that they were recording like that they were going live while he was interviewing them and I was kind of surprised he wasn't prepared for that well that so that's I think part of an interesting question too is I think there is a documentary pose

that you can trace back certainly to Michael Moore making Roger and me where you are both savvy and hapless at the same time. Right. You don't want to be too savvy because, one, you're going to scare away your subjects. But I think the audience actually likes you more if there's a little bit of a blundering affect to you. Like, oh, what's going on here?

All right. I was talking one time. Do you remember, you know the documentary and Nick Broomfield made a Biggie and Tupac Doc? Oh, my God. Of course. One about Heidi Fleiss. Like, he's really good. One time he said, like, we were talking, I was interviewing for something, he said, people describe my affect as half Tom Wolfe and half Inspector Cluzzo from the Pink Panther movies.

And I think that's the go-to for most documentarians. You're savvy, but you don't always act like it. There needs to be a little befuddlement in your, in your public posture. You know, and I was, and I will give him credit for this, I was kind of surprised that he was willing to sort of challenge them. camera in their way. And it gets more and more as the doc goes along. I mean, there's a way, there's a lot of people in that mode would just be straight, you know, objective journalist, right? Like don't, you know, just the facts, ma'am, ask questions, make no presumptions, you know, don't, you know, like he's calling him sexist, talking to his, you know, saying,

hey, you may hurt your girlfriend's feelings here when you said that, right? I look at it, you know, doing that kind of stuff. I, I was in. impressed that he did that. And I guess the thing is, is if you're going to be at the center of this sort of thing, and a lot of the vehicle is like whether or not, you kind of got you got to be willing to hang in for the ride with Lewis here, then I don't, it probably would just be tough to sort of sit by and abide by all the things that they're saying and doing, right? You talk about the World Baseball Classic before we go? Oh, yeah, sure. You know, Jill, growing up when we did in the 80s and in the 90s, it was

easy to feel that we had missed the really politically freighted sporting events. We were pretty young for USA versus USSR and hockey. We missed most of the really big Muhammad Ali fights. Well, can I give you the USA versus Venezuela in the final of the World Baseball Classic? Oh, yeah. That was great, man. I mean, that was that was some good shit, man.

You just don't expect to get postseason baseball in March. You don't. And it was a great game. Venezuela's up too nothing for most of the game. Bryce Harper hits a huge home run in the eighth. Then Venezuela gets a run around in the ninth

from a double from Eugenio Suarez. Here is Joe Davis on the call for Fox. A few notes for you. Trump posted on true. social after the game. Statehood, all caps, because he's been musing that Venezuela will become the 51st state.

So it's not going to be Canada now. Not going to be Canada. Not going to be Greenland. We've gone down the list a little bit. I was reading the pieces afterwards, because there's still sports writing that happens in a press box in America, believe it or not. Let me tell you something.

Every sports writer wanted to write Bryce Harper after this game. Yeah. Bryce Harper hit that home of the, oh my God, Harper's going to get his ring. Oh, wait, Venezuela one. Yeah, man. So you read these pieces that were sometimes really, really contorted, like, but,

but Bryce Harper. Yeah. But Bryce Harper, ooh, just really funny when you are, you were just like, you were like three feet away from home plate about ready to slide in. And then the angle changes. You're like, uh-oh. Do I have to rewrite this piece? I know deadlines change, have changed a lot since I had to be in press boxes.

But deep. So when I was at the Associated Press and I had to cover the Astros or do any baseball game, do you know what you had, you had to write the story. Your story had to be done by the top of the ninth inning. Okay. And then you called an editor on the desk and you dictated to them the next three outs. And I can't tell you how many times in the course of dictating like, all right, would first, you know, grounded out to third, here we go.

How many times somebody would, you know, the score would change, somebody to the home, to be some sort of an era. And I mean, that shit, it sucked. Like, it was really horrible. Rally caps on and you're sitting there on the phone be like, please don't. Yeah, please. Yeah, please. Yeah, please, I just want, yeah, please, I want this game to end.

Yeah, but I mean, I kind of assume baseball, baseball writers are sort of used to that. But yeah, I mean, it just seemed like, there was enough drama. I felt like that Bryce Harper did not have to be the stand in here. But, yeah. There was a little bit of a balance because there was some home, you know, there is some USA angle, right? USA's a home team. USA's a home team.

And you could feel writers, you know, straining to be a little bit like NBC in the Olympics, you know, we're, we're even handed butt. God, they were rooting for Bryce Harper. Here's another note. Are you familiar with the way too early genre of sports writing?

Say more about this. All right. The draft is going to happen in April. And as soon as the drafts over, like 30 seconds later, Everyone will post their way too early 2027 NFL draft. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because we don't have any.

25 after the championship game. You don't even have to have a new idea. You just move up whatever it is you were going to do anyway. I got on ESPN's website the next day of the game is the way too early 2029 World Baseball Classic Team USA roster. Okay. We are ready to go ahead and cast. the next

team USA even after this one won. I didn't need the roster. Come on. You don't care. You don't care who's on it. I do. I want to say,

yeah, man. I mean, Mike Trout, you think he's going to pick a wrong? No, I don't think so. No,

probably not. Okay. All right. I also want to talk to you about Team USA manager Mark DeRosa. Oh, man. Former big leaguer,

MLB Network host. Yeah. Did not cover to himself in glory. He did not. He went on TV and said Team USA had made the quarterfinals when they hadn't. And then he backtracked and his MLB network comrades backtracked on his behalf. And I was really, really confused about what the argument even was.

Despite the fact that he was saying a thing on television that he really was not misinformed. I lost track of that completely. Yeah, what do I do? I mean, I know that it's embarrassing to have, you know, giving up a game that you should not have. But, I mean, what else excuses his moves in the game? You know what I mean? Sat players and then lost to Italy?

Yeah, I mean, like, it doesn't anyway, yeah. Yeah, Matt Vas Gersh was still trying to get it on that yesterday. I'm like, I don't know, I don't know what's going on here. Like, I'm sorry, we heard him say something on television. Yeah. And he claimed and everybody else claimed, no, no, no, that wasn't the case. He was looking for some inspiration for the boys. and he brought in the Navy SEAL

who shot Osama bin Laden and had him tell the story to Team USA. If you've been in a locker room and that speech had been given to you before a big game, what would you have thought?

You know, I probably would just tune it out. That's probably because, you know, most locker room speeches are bad. Most people aren't good at it, right? And so you just kind of, if you hear a good one, it's like, oh, okay, that caught my ear. But most of them, you actually just kind of tune out. You're not, you're barely paying. Because he looked like he was just actually having sort of a conversation with them, right?

Like, I don't feel like he had exactly the level of presentation that I would have expected for somebody who's made his living off of this for the last, you know, decade or however many years it's been, right? Here's DeRosa defending his decision making. A lot of people, like Paul Skeen said to me when he signed up for this, I want to do this for every service man and woman that protects our freedom. And that's why we wear USA across our chest. I just thought it would be like a time to kind of redirect and get those guys to understand that although this is an unbelievable event, and you get a chance to share a locker room with the game's great. There's a reason why you're doing it and a reason why people protect our freedom at night. and I just wanted to honor that.

Next time, bring in Kirby Smart. Okay. Like, Kirby Smart is really good at this. Okay. I feel like if Kirby Smart had actually been the manager, they might have won. They might have won. To be honest. Yeah.

So I don't like to do this, but I have to say it because I have the platform too now. Well, first of all, it's just we sound so stupid. Like, we just really sound dumb as a country right now, as we, like, create, havoc all over the globe. And this isn't necessarily the fault of our service members or whatever. They're doing what they're told to do, right? But our military is inflicting havoc, causing chaos and death on lots of people who did not ask for it. But the other thing about it is that, and I just have to say this, and sorry, if this makes people upset and they call me woke, my grandfather served in World War II and the Korean War, still had to pay poll taxes. Okay.

there's not a thing that the American military has ever done that is guaranteed my freedom in this country. Sorry to break it to you. Okay. So first of all, I mean, I guess that's why, you know, there's not a lot of many American black American players on the USA baseball team anyway. But like when I hear that, I'm just like, what the fuck are you talking about? Like, just get somebody out here who can tell a good yarn. Bring it Jose Canseco. Like, can we get, can we?

Bring in Barry Bonds. Like bringing somebody cool. God, what would the Barry Bonds pregame speech be like? Man, I bet he's a motherfucker man. But I bet he's got some credibility in that locker room, don't you think? Absolutely. I mean, shit, bring Roger Clemens in, man. I'm going to bring old Longmore and in.

You seem to be picking a particular type of ex-baseball player. You didn't name like Mike Schmidt or something. Yeah, I didn't. Yeah, you know, Kyle Ripkin. Guys that are still waiting to get in the Hall of Fame. Yeah. You know, yeah, Ozzy Smith, bringing some of the greats of my youth. But yeah, there's a lot that he could have done there and he didn't do it.

And I think it just reflected poorly on USA baseball. I don't know how, will you tell me, how do you think people come out of this feeling about USA baseball? What's funny, I haven't really thought too much about the USA baseball thing other than it was just such a flop. Mm-hmm. But I do think people come out, this thing in the world baseball class was awesome. We're bagging on Team USA here But man, that was like That was some incredibly fun baseball

Didn't that make you want to go? Yes, it really did. I felt like I missed out. Yeah, same. I was just like, oh shit, I didn't know this was a party. Maybe we should go to the next time. It seemed like a party. Do we need more sports like this?

Absolutely. Because this isn't exactly like a stunt, like a Netflix-style stunt, but it just feels like bonus sports. We're like, okay, we got baseball season coming up. that's that's a thing and i don't know how many of the 162 you're about to about to watch but you're like oh wow single elimination tournament here we go u.s versus venezuela u.s versus the d r i'm in that sounds great i mean first of all international competition is just

amazing like i love the world cup you know i know a lot of people made i think i'm a huge soccer fan but i'm in for like you know international stakes and games and nick wright said this and i can't remember if he said it his own podcast or if he said it on first things first but he said and i agree with it i like the idea of trying different things and when people started the world baseball classic people like this is a joke so many of these teams are stack with americans uh that are just you know using some sort of far off you know the the colonialism uh you know rule to get in and start playing for all these other teams or whatever but um man Now you give it, you wear generation out, and now this is something that is dope and people

know to expect it and people have got enough years and there's enough back history to really get excited about it. And so for the NBA in-season tournament or whatever, I know a lot of people are joking about it, but I can't imagine a scenario 20 years from now that this actually means something to people, right? I'm trying to imagine the end-season tournament meaning something, but okay, yes, it might take a while. But I would, you know what, I would have probably said the same thing about the WBC. I mean, yeah, what were you saying 20 years ago? I was not saying this.

Let's put it that way. Yeah, there you go. I was not saying this. I mean, we said a lot of the kind of stunty things like, you know, the skyscraper live that was on Netflix. That felt like bonus sports in a way, if you can count that as sports. Yeah. Mike Tyson versus Jake Paul. I know you're a big fan of that about any of the any of the Jake Paul fights, man.

I mean, it's a fight. It's a fight. Good idea. We have Mayweather Pachial coming up in September. I hate to say, I'm going to watch that. I can't help myself. Brian, you want to see that. Oh, yes.

I will absolutely watch that. I mean, the thing is, like, if you have Netflix, and you probably do, can't disclose your podcast around Netflix, but I already had Netflix. And if you do, you're like, oh, there's a fight on tonight? I'm sitting in bed. Like, I don't know what's this. I remember my son was just kind of wandering around her in the Tyson fight. I was like, let's just watch this.

This could be terrible, and in fact, it was pretty terrible, but this would be very watchable. I'm like, there's a geek show element of this. Let's go. They tried celebrity fights. I still remember Refrigerator Perry fight in Manute Bowl. That was a fight? They fought?

You don't remember the boxing gloves? Versus Refrigerator Perry fight. Manute Bowl won. You don't remember that? On points? I don't, I feel, well, you know, obviously, refrigerator period wasn't in the greatest in shape. I can't remember if he ran out of gas or what.

But yeah, Mnup Bowl definitely won. Yeah, oh, man, I thought you knew about that, man. The one I was obsessed with as a kid was the NFL's fastest man. Oh, bro. Oh, the super, man, I've been watching clips of that just even here recently, like Rod Wilson, racing Darrell Green and stuff like that. And this is before, like, we had 50 million draft nerds who were like, actually his 40 time, his hand timed 40 was this.

We didn't really have that kind of information handy. No, no. I remember I was a little kid, and the couple of Dallas Cowboys were having an autograph signing at, like, Dillards in Fort Worth or at the mall. So I showed one of the Cowboys was Emmett Smith. This is rookie year. This is 1990.

The other cowboy was Alexander Ace Wright. I don't know if you remember. He was a second round pick who was really fast. His thing was he was a sprinter, and I remember going up to him. It was like, got up to the front. He signed my football card, And I was like, hey, do you think you can beat Daryl Green in the NFL's fastest man?

Yeah. And what did you say? He was assuring me, yeah. Like, he was assuring me, Ace Wright was saying, Brian, I've got a chance. I think I've got a chance. It's good. Well, you know, the way we really knew people were fast back then, because like you said, we didn't have 40 times, is whether or not they ran college track. So there were guys like Ron Brown, even Dion, Dion, Dion, Dionne.

Eric McHaff. Eric McHaff. I was seeing your pictures of the other day. I was like, remember Eric McCaff? how fast he wins. Eric Reckaff was cold, man. That's a bad dude. So, yeah, so that's how you knew they were fast,

but then to actually see them, they're, like, out there, you know, in tank tops and those really short 80 shorts, you know, with a real starter's gun at a track facing off against each other. Man, that was so cool. I mean, they'll never bring it back because I'm sure NFL teams don't want them out there. And that's the thing is I feel like football players, basketball players, these guys make too much money to do anything like this.

Yeah. So you almost need other sports. Yeah. People that you can say, hey, here's a big payday. This is going to be a ton of money. Let's get it together. Let's get a special on Netflix and let's go. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, look, man, isn't that what the White House MMA card is all about? You know what I'm saying? It's just like we just get some guys, man. Trump's birthday. It's going to be a fight on the lawn of the White House. People are going to watch no matter if Kobe Covington's fighting or not. You know what I mean?

It sounds so terrible, but it also sounds like something you would want to watch just because it sounds like such a ludicrous spectacle. Yeah, it's like an out scene from idiocracy. But yeah, no, we should absolutely have more stuff like that. I mean, unrivaled is kind of, you know, WMBA three on three stuff like that. That stuff has some purchase, man. You're seeing people doing different things playing different styles of ball. The one of, man, did you, were you? you familiar with Michael Beasley and Lance Stevenson playing one-on-one in that one-on-one tournament?

Amazing. Oh, yeah. Like, I watched that shit, man. I was really into it. You know, Michael Beasley's cold, man. Lance thought he had him. It didn't work that way. So, yeah, man, all that kind of stuff, I'm into it.

We should always be trying and throwing shit at the wall to see what will stick. I don't mean this is a personal slide at all, but we might have to put some clamps on the phrase, idiocracy just because so much of American life has become idiocracy and I feel like all like 10 times a day we're like this is idiocracy it's like well if it's all idiocracy it's almost not worth pointing out anyway I don't mean to take a shot at you but no you did oh you did that's fine Brian it's okay you know I didn't I could have taken a shot at UT and how Eric McHap never won anything that's fine yeah besides two NCAA

long jump championships boom okay that's right you know you just do Wikipedia that did yeah when I was sending you stuff the other night I did. Yeah, see, man. Look, and I was even a fan. Yeah, and also somebody had mentioned something along the lines, and I haven't seen idiocracy in years, that it wasn't actually a very good movie. And so I need to go back and watch it and see, you know, how it holds up because, you know, it could be that I'm just mainstreaming again. Just a very useful term, though, because it's like, you understand what it means and you understand how American life has become. Yeah. Anything else before we get out of here?

Um, I don't, well, so I just kind of wanted to touch on a couple of things because you and, uh, and Dave talked about building out a new sports section. And I love that idea, man. We should do it. I want, maybe we should have a whole episode where we try to build out, like, see what we could do. What would our new sports section be, right? We kind of did it at the ringer, but you want to do it one more time? Yeah, wasn't that one that kind of the part of the project over here? This kind of is what we're doing. That's right. Yeah. You know what? There's no improving now that you're right. Now that you mention it. But it is interesting, right? And especially if you have, I mean, to me,

you and I could just indulge in like old school sports section. But like if you're like, if I had financial constraints, if we admit that the world has changed a lot and not just like the pay, you know, how many planes you can get on, but just what people actually want. Yeah. I mean, we could almost do a whole episode about that. But I've been like, you know, if you made me the sports editor of fill in the blank newspapers, like, I was, I was like, would I make everybody a columnist? Would I say, like, you cover the baseball team, but really you're the baseball columnist?

You need to have a voice, right? I think I would. You got to have a voice. I think I would say, I think I'd want everybody to be, you know, I would want them to, you know, hit righty and hit lefty. Because I just think that's the way the world works. I was like, I don't want you writing. And I want you to do beat writer stuff. I want you to go to press conference to ask really good questions.

Tell me, you know, this guy got sent down. This guy's coming up. But I was like, I also want you to just have a voice. Like, I think that's what it's required now. Yeah, absolutely. In almost every case. Or just, or what's required to get people's attention if we're at a newspaper and we're asking them to pay us to read our stuff. It's just crazy because I remember there was a time in my life within the span of my career that the idea was that sports drove so much coverage.

and drove so many subscriptions and that did not hold up once, yeah, for newspapers, once we started getting the metrics, right? Like, it just, it didn't hold up. And it really, it's sort of, it's not an epiphany, but I just sort of like had this realization.

I was like, oh, like, the world does not revolve around sports. Like, not as many people enjoy sports and certainly local sports as much as I thought. But there is a way to get that captive audience. And I think you're right, like having voicey people because you know i mean you can the ap the apy write-ups right for you know they can tell you the facts ma'am but like i want to know what you think of the most recent uh texans draft and you know i i want you know what do you think they're going to do i've seen

you know yeah there's all this other content out here going on about the teams that you cover and you're going to have to we're going to need more than one person to weigh you know what's going on locally new or tabloids are always kind of like that yeah a baseball writer and he was also kind of a baseball calmness or she was kind of a baseball calmness. I just, I think that's probably what I do. And of course, I have lots of podcasts. You would do so you do podcasts. Of course. I'm deviating from the Washington Post formula here, but I think we should have podcasts from 2026. I think that's important. Would you pivot to video? Would we have some video on there? Sure. Yeah, little video elements. If it the video has such a bad

connotation from the old, the old bad times. But like this is on this podcast we're doing right now. It's on video. So yeah, I would have it on video. Yes, that would happen. I would either love to know or not love to know how many people watch us when they listen to us. I don't ever watch us. I don't know what I'm rooting for.

That's the problem. That's what, yeah, I kind of know. As long as you as you can hear us, that's the most important thing. As long as you end up. The other thing, Brian, last thing before. Have you ever been to a rodeo? Yes, sir. Really?

In Fort Worth? Did I grow up in four? Worth and go, oh, for the rodeo? No, I did not, sir. Okay, okay. I was not in the, like, there were families that had, like, tickets to those boxes every year. Yeah. That was not my family, but I would, my mom would take me, you know, once in a while.

Okay. During the stock show. You do some mutton busting? I took off my Carhart jacket and hung it up and jumped on a, I didn't do any of that. You know me. I was not in the Wild West cosplay. part of Texas. That was not my thing.

I do. You have a pair of boots? I do. I have one. I've only owned one in my life, I think. Okay. Maybe two, but I have a nice pair. Oh, I bet you do.

I never get to wear them anymore, though. What would you wear them to? You should wear them when I come out there and man. You have to wear your boots? No, I don't, man. You want a pair? I don't. Of course.

You want a pair for Christmas next year? Yeah. Get you nice. Go down to Lettys in Fort Worth and get you a nice, beautiful pair of booze. I would get into that, man. But, you know, I haven't been to a rodeo in many years. I was telling somebody this the other night, or maybe last night, actually.

The last time I went to the Houston livestock show and rodeo, Bill Cosby was one of the headlines. Oh, my God. Me and my friend Tony went to see him do live comedy in the Astrodome. So I guess it would have been like 90, 91, something like that. Groundbreaking stuff. Well, I don't know if you've been paying attention, Brian, but the Houston livestock show at Rodeo has really captivated the country over the last few days.

Because have you seen the viral videos? Oh, Brian. Oh, man, we got to get you, we got to, let me get a hold of your algorithm, man. Get you following some people. But yeah, no, man. So they actually changed the dress code to Texas. The Houston Rodeo, in part because there have been people there that they think we're showing either a little bit too much ass. There's been a lot of young people there fighting stuff like that.

It was not a problem when I was growing up at the Fort Worth Livestock Show. People showing ass, yeah. I mean, you know, did they have assless chaps back then? I'm sure they did, but I don't believe it was, you know, on display so much. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And it's just been kind of funny because the thing is, I know the Chronicle has written some about it. And it's, the Houston Chronicle has written some about this, but it's also happening in tandem with this larger social media conversation about basically lots of young black people.

I, you know, theoretically college age, but some of them look older than that. They're going to Houston for spring break. And they're flooding into town, hanging out at the gallery, going to house parties, doing all this other stuff. And I just been really, I was like, where do I go to get more information about that? I don't know how real the phenomenon is, and that's kind of the problem with our media ecosystem now, because I know the Houston Chronicle has focused on elements of that and how it has touched the rodeo, but I'm trying to get some sort of sense for how real the problem is about what's going on in Houston Spring Break, right? And so if people can kind of help direct me to whatever the right coverage sources for this,

I mean, again, I don't, I don't, I'm not. saying that I don't trust everybody on Twitter or whatever, and I'm sure that there's some great independent journalists, but like who, who's got their finger on the pulse of what's actually really happening down there in Houston? Because I really can't tell at this point. Spring break Houston. And look, bro. Hey, Brian. Hey. Hey, man. Lots of good places to eat. Great clubs. Yeah. I know. Beautiful people. Houston's changed. I will stipulate all that, but just spring break, Houston.

It's just, I mean, those aren't usually. I mean, there's a lot of great places, but you don't go there for spring break necessarily. I would not have believed it either, but Houston has become like one of those destination places for a certain segment, mostly black folks that want to go down there and, you know, see a book. I don't want to say it.

I was going to say, you know, I'm going to pass on the opportunity to say something that Van would say. I'll say this. I want to read the Joel Anderson piece about that. You do? You think, man, I should. Should you think I should go down there? That sounds pretty fine.

Right. You think I still got time to do it? Maybe. Or we can plan for 2027. 2027, that's right. Look ahead. Let's go. All right.

I got a place to stay. Can I come? Oh, man. Shit. I would love to bring you to Houston's spring break. Come on, man. Let's do it. We go tankertons.

I'd take you, Papacitos, man. We would look. Papacitos. Yeah, man. We'll get it in. A real local Houston spot, Papacitos. I love it. I love Papacetas.

All right, he's Joel Anderson. I'm Brian Curtis. Productions by Isaiah Blakely and Bruce Baldwin. We got a big week next week at the press box. You and I, sir, are recording the March issue subject to be announced at a later date. We're also going to have another politician into the ringer's Los Angeles office. Okay. Yes, sir.

Also to be announced. Yeah. I mean, you were America's foremost interviewer. of politicians right now yeah I gotta say so my wife's man I mean she

they're looking for some people over there CBS Is that who else you had on the podium there? I love it That's all saying All right Joel Can't wait to share

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