The Press Box - Ep. 236: ‘Bachelor Party’ with Ben Higgins

Episode Date: January 18, 2017

The Ringer’s Juliet Litman is joined by former Bachelor Ben Higgins to discuss returning to his job after being on TV (0:01), how Nick is handling being the current Bachelor (3:00), the biggest overreactions on the show so far (5:15), things Ben would have never done on the show (16:25), Corinne’s questionable decision-making (29:13), and hot takes on hot tubs (48:45). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome to Bachelor Party. I'm Juliet Litman. I'm back again this week for quite a doozy of an episode. We'll be talking about Corinne with my dear friend and former bachelor Ben Higgins. Hi, Ben. I'm sitting in Florida right now. Oh, man. How lovely. And so it's warm. So I'm pumped about it. That's great. Why are you in Florida? So actually today is my first day back to real life job. post bachelor. Oh, whoa. So you're just like, you're back to being Ben Higgins, man of the world. I am. I am back. I have a very supportive fiance that said, hey, what's your career path? And I said, good question. And so I'm going back to work. Wow. You're kind of like a woman after

she has a baby, like going back to work. I kind of, it's a very odd feeling. of now sitting like in an office building and everything just kind of feels like a dream. Wow. Like I don't know what just happened with the last two years of my life, but I feel like it put me out in a good place. So you're a software salesman, right? I am. Yeah.

Cool. That's what Nick is too, I think, or he was. Yeah. Cool. I like how your response to being a software salesman is cool. I don't know if anything about it is cool. I'm just trying to support you, okay? I mean, it'd be like, oh, yeah, what do you do for living?

Well, I sell software that nobody really is that excited about. Oh, that's such a cool job. I'm really proud of you. I do think it's cool. I'm happy you're back to work. I think that actually shows a lot of positive traits about you. Yeah, you know, it was, well, thank you for that. But I was in Los Angeles like two weeks ago with a bunch of people that have produced

a bachelor. and they were all kind of catching up on life and they were talking to me about what I was doing and said well I'm going back to work and they all looked at each other like really I was like yeah and they're like that's interesting and like for a moment I felt very insecure about it

I was like well you know it's just temporary even though it's not like I started to like protect myself and I was like wait why am I feeling bad about going back to work so like we just don't typically have that happen like that just doesn't typically happen where somebody goes back to the job they had before and so I'm still trying to figure out if that's a good thing or bad thing. It's definitely good.

You're a trailblazer of normalcy in The Bachelor Nation. I love it. All right. Well, maybe Nick will be the same. Oh, my God. Nick is not the same. And I, you know that, and I know that. He doesn't live in Chicago.

He does not work for Salesforce. He hasn't for years. Like, it's just ridiculous. We're going to get into this week's episode, but before, what did you think when you watch the premiere? And, like, they show Nick walking down the street. streets of Chicago, like, pretending to go to work? You know, that's, I'm kind of frustrated with that because I think with me, they did a good

job at kind of just highlighting what my life was really like. Like, hey, you know, Ben isn't anything like his life isn't anything like crazy, exciting. And he, you know, is passionate about things that most people probably can get behind. And they highlighted that and just made me normal, which is good because there's not nothing hopefully like too abnormal about me. I wish with Nick they just sort of rocked what he really is. Like he doesn't live in Chicago. We all know that.

And I think Nick would appreciate it just saying, hey, this is who I am. This is where my life has taken me. You know, I'm happy. It's working. And somehow I got fit out as a bachelor. And if somebody wants to join me and kind of we can start living life together, great. But I don't like how they kind of fake that. Yeah, it was really weird, particularly because Nick Hat is pretty open.

Like, I think three episodes in now, we can see that he is definitely very different Bachelor than we're used to. He's certainly very different from you. I know you guys are good friends, right? You get along pretty well. We get along really well. But we're definitely different. Yeah. I think, yeah, I would 100% admit that he has a lot of characteristics that are, you know, that I'm impressed by and that, you know, in a sense I may be envy.

And then I think there are things that when I was kind of talking about with him about, my experience and just life, I think we don't see I'd eye on stuff. Right. If we all did, it would be a boring life anyway. Right. Okay. So this is great. I'm so happy you're on this week. We picked week three so that we would like really have a real body of work for us to dig into having seen him on the show. Now, now we've got six hours. Also, you're at the famous Jade and Tanner wedding. So you've got some Liz insight. We're going to get to that all that. But I want to start for, I want to start just going to get into this episode with a couple of different. proletive. So I want to start by going over the top three overreactions of the week from the different women. I'm going to throw them at you and you can let me know you think. Okay. So we're going to go descending order. So number three was Dominique. And Dominique got sent home in the middle of a date

because she didn't feel like she got enough time with Nick. And what's the best way to handle the girl that you don't really know, but also just aren't interested in getting to know? Like Nick was obviously just like Dominique's out. Like he hadn't given her her date at all. He didn't spend a lot of time with her. Like there was really no reason to keep her around because he didn't know her at all. So like what's the best way to handle that situation? What's their favorite food is?

I don't know. I think like you run into a very sticky situation there because, you know, it is probably pretty obvious to Nick right away who has maybe eight to ten girls are that he's really interested in. And that will continue to narrow down as you go. And so she probably wasn't one of those girls. But yet she was probably there because he was either A, attracted to her or B,

was interested in what her story was. But I always felt weird because I didn't feel comfortable with a woman sharing her stories when I knew she was going to be going home. But you can't say, hey, by the way, you're going home, just keep this light tonight. Most of the women really want to start expressing themselves, which is a healthy thing to do. but you don't want them to share about their deepest and darkest secrets when it's all ending.

So I would say try to keep it light, keep it fun. I think Nick does a pretty good job. I've actually, we've got into Nick here in a little bit, but I think he does a good job at keeping it light. And at that point, she was pressuring him to pull more out of their relationship. And I think he did the right thing by saying, no, this isn't fair to you. Like, this is no longer going to work. Right. He does seem like he's pretty honest about that.

when he's, that's the thing about all this career in business, who we'll certainly talk about more. It's like, I can tell, and I bet you can too, like who he's into and who he's not. Like,

he's not really good at faking him, which is why he's like a fun bachelor, because like he doesn't, he doesn't really hide how he's feeling or at least is not capable of it, which is probably like not great for TV, but in terms of like the ongoing redemption of Nick, it is kind of great. But,

and Dominique, like, really flipped out. Like, if he's not giving you the time, then like, girl, take a hint.

You know, it's for a reason. Yeah, just be like some of the other girls there and just, you know, ride the way, see how long you can make it. I don't know. At what point do you know, like, who is in your top 10? Like, you start out with, like, 30. You had, like, 28 girls.

I think Nick had 30. Like, when do you know, like, who is your top 10? What week? I think my, I did something during the season just to help me kind of, like, keep my mind focused and figure out where I'm at where, like, every, pretty much every night I would sit down in my, in my room. after the dates were over and go through each girl and what I was interested in and what I wasn't and again kind of too excited me and who didn't and I pretty much think I had my top 10 figured out from about week three oh wow so like right about now with the week from where we are on the show yeah I would say like second to third time spending time with each other like

seeing how the women interacted amongst each other or on a one-on-on-one and obviously like you know some of that I was wrong on a couple um I think like like for, you know, there was always... You don't need to say it, but you were wrong on Leah. She went after your girl, Lauren, so we know that was not cool. Gotta get protective. I got to get... You're right.

Yeah, so, like, that situation was one where I look back and I'm thinking, like, there was, there was obviously something more to Leah than I was seeing, but, you know, at the end of it, like, I would say there was four or five girls that I was very, very interested in, and that probably started at, like, week five or six. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay. Well, Nick is close to there, but I think we could probably guess, like, who he's into. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, someone he is really into, who is my number two overreactor of the week, was Vanessa, who got a great date, which we'll talk about. And the way that she responded to Liz, from Jane Tanner's wedding. We had a video. We posted a video on, like, the ringer, Twitter, and ringer Facebook yesterday of a super cut of every time Jane Tanner's wedding was said. And it was a lot. Like, if I never heard the phrase Jane Tanner's wedding again after this podcast, that was. would be completely fine. It was ridiculous. It's sort of like, it's like a song that everyone knows or something. Jane Tanner's wedding. And then this week's episode started with Nick saying Jane Tanner's wedding when he's telling the girls what happened. It was ridiculous. Yeah. It's a haunting reminder of Jane Tanner's wedding. And I think Tanner had a tweet that said something like, you know, thanks Nick for continuing to keep me relevant. I don't know exactly what it was at some point. But it was hilarious because it's true.

Like, this is, that was such a minor. I think the Bachelor franchise figured that Jane Tainer's wedding would be a really beautiful ceremony for them, but it kind of a minor storyline when it came to like the franchise in general. But instead, like, if you think about it up until now at week two, it is pretty much made their season. Like it has continued to keep at least me intrigued. And I was at the wedding. Like, I know what happened. But it's kept me intrigued.

And I'm sure they're pretty excited about that. It's true. I mean, I'm looking at Tanner's tweet right now, and he tweeted, I'm literally getting more airtime on next season than I did on Caitlin's hashtag Jade and Tanner's wedding. That's very true. I also will say that I did not care at all about Tanner when you guys were on Caitlin's season, but now I love him.

He seems really fun. He's the best. He is. He's like, he's definitely one of the better people to come from Caitlin's season. He's just, he's hilarious. Yeah, he seems like a fun, dude. They seem like a nice couple.

And he's with Jane. Yeah, it's a great couple. Dayton Tanner's wedding was just a really beautiful ceremony. She said it was she called in last week. She said it was really nice. How drunk was everyone? You know, I'll be honest. I was very protected.

I don't know. Interesting. Because that was during the airing of my season. And so like I didn't drink a lot. First off because I had press the next day, but then also because it was just kind of better for me to not, you know, being any shots, like, you know, dancing alone because I was with Lauren at the time. Like, dancing alone on the side of the dance floor is like a very sad thing that nobody wants to show.

So I was protected. I don't really know. That's funny. What does that mean you were protected? Like you had like a producer with you at all times? Yeah, or like the handler who I'm really close with it, kind of just hung out with me the whole time. or we just think you know I think for everybody's good like just made sure that I wasn't like on the dance floor like shake it because I mean I've been known to just dominate the dance floor

if I have the opportunity really well well one might not think so but all I remember is a really sweaty um if I had to take a guess intoxicated crystals coming up and like dancing like next to me and just kind of like soaking me down with his sweat at one point. Gross. So that was, that's my big takeaway. That was, that was my big memory from Jane Tanner's life.

Did you meet Liz, the maid of honor? I'm sure I met her at some point. I remember the night when I went to bed, I walked back up to the room. And at that point, Nick and crystals were having a dance off. Oh my God.

So at some point post me going to bed, I forget how Liz explained it last night on the show, but it was, I find myself during a lot of these Liz and Nick moments, like covering my eyes, because I'm just feeling so, like, awkward and overwhelmed with like, you know, it's just weird feelings. And so I forget exactly what she said, but however she explained their night was pretty explicit. it. Yeah, she, yeah, she, uh, she made him look really bad on the heels of Andy writing that her most awkward sexual encounter ever was with Nick in the fantasy suite. Um, Liz through salt in Nick's wounds by saying that, uh, she made it sound like it was really awkward. I think she did, um, like a little robot, robot dance to like make it sound seem like it was very like robotic and not particularly fluid. They're motion together. And she didn't make Liz look good. She did it. I'm sorry. I'm sure Nick knows it. Nick definitely watches all of these. And I'm sure he, knowing Nick, he laughed it off. But yeah, that was not flattering for him. But really funny.

And also I kind of suspected that's what happened. I was just like, well, knowing what Andy wrote, like it had to have bad. Plus, like they were clearly wasted. So, you know, doesn't sound great. But anyway, so what happened on the show this week was last week, Liz gets sent home and Kristen, after telling Kristen, who I think is very funny, unintentionally so, that, you know,

she would have happened at Jay and Tanner's wedding. And then Nick decides, and I want your inside opinion on this, but Nick decides to use the cocktail party to stand in front of all of the women and tell them that he had sex with another woman, which, like, of course, Nick's 35, he's a sexual being,

everyone knows Nick has sex. That's like, that's basically what he's been defined by. But why would he choose that tactic of just standing in front of all the women? Like, is that something the producers encourage him? him to do. Does he make that choice on his own? Like, how does that happen? You and I have to watch the batches together at some point because I really do love talking to you

about this. I actually kind of just like talking to you about like any situation. Thanks, Ben. Your takeaways are just so on point. So Nick, Nick had it probably, I mean, that's his choice. Like, I don't, I don't ever have a situation where the producers would have told me anything to say to the women. That was actually, most of the time, a really good moment to kind of, for me, I like to clean up the week, if anything was missing. And then, um, just pretty much every week just tell them, hey, thanks for still being here. Like, I don't know, this is so weird for me too. And like, the fact that you continue to hang out here and, like, watch me date other women and act like you're still interested at least, like it's pretty big of you.

Um, you know, there's two things I'd say about Nick. And, and like you said, I'm a good friend of Nick. I think Nick's great. I think he's kept me entertained, and I think he actually has stayed very true to himself through this whole thing that I'm watching so far. So I have a lot of positive takeaways, I guess, watching the show for Nick.

I have a couple really negative ones that he now knows about. Please tell me. Okay. One is my biggest pet peeves, and then we'll get back to why he chose to speak there, is I don't love the fact that he decides to kiss the girls in front of the other girl. Yeah, what is that? That's so rude.

I've never seen. It's so rude. And he does know this. And like, you know, like you said, Nick can shake this off. And like, I am not here to give criticism. I know how hard it is to be the bachelor. I know that it's like there's a, there's no winning half the time. But I don't think like, I gave, I was texting the group thread last night.

And I was like, I just gave a lot of really awkward hugs. And so like when the moment hit where it was like, I really want to kiss this girl or I could tell that it was happening and there's other women around. He's just going for a really awkward embrace because you can't start. Like it's rude. It's awkward. And I don't know how those other women can stand there and watch it and like feel okay then about going on a date with him and like having him open up to them. Like that that would be really hard for me if I had to watch, you know, going back to like Caitlin's season.

If I had to watch her doing that, like I don't know how. much longer I could have stuck around. Right. Yeah. It also just seems like a bad strategy. Like, okay, it's rude. It sucks for the girls. But it just seems like he doesn't win him any points with when I guess like he thinks that they should be winning him over. I just feel like he's still in contestant mode and he's not in bachelor mode. And like contestant Nick is like, yeah, make out as much as possible, you know, go for it. You know, go back to her room and you're not supposed to. Like that, we know that's what contestant Nick does. And I just feel like he kind of like can't, He can't shake his sex drive almost.

He's like so beholden to it or something. It makes her an entertaining bachelor, but it seems like it's really bad for his strategy of like winning over viewers and the girls. Exactly. And last night I was watching it with Lauren. And I was like, Lauren, like how long would you be around like, if by any chance, like I was in a pool,

grabbing some other girl's boobs, kissing her like 10, 10 foot from you. And she's like, there's just no shot. Like she had a hard, Lauren had a hard enough time just like seeing me walk out of the house with some other girls. Like, and not that Lauren is,

is jealous or insecure. Lauren's a cool check. I really liked her when you guys came by. She's a cool chick. And she's like, so I feel like she has a pretty, like typical or normal thought processes in the whole thing. She's like,

I just couldn't do it. Like, how could I marry somebody that I've also seen grabbing a girl's naked boobs like 10 foot from me? Yeah. Well, that's how Vanessa felt, too, because Vanessa had the line of the week, in my opinion, and it's hard to do, given that Corin is on the show. But she, you know, so at the end of the episode, so Vanessa, she really freaked out about the listing, which I thought was kind of stupid. Like, I don't know.

He knew her before. He didn't choose to have her on the show. Like, it's not really his fault that she was there. And, like, I don't know. Is he supposed to, like, disclose his entire sexual history at the beginning of the show? Like, no. Like, I don't know. It just, she kind of, she took it the wrong way.

But they made her look really funny at the beginning because they showed a shot of her drinking from her drink through a straw, which is like every woman knows that's what you do to preserve your makeup to make sure it doesn't get messed up. But it just made it made her look petty in a moment where she was kind of like being petty, which I felt bad for her because I actually like Vanessa because she won me over by the end of the episode because she confronted Nick when Corinne brought in the stupid bouncy castle. By the way, what do you call that? What do you call that bouncy castle where you're from in Indiana? a bounce house okay because there's bounce house there's bouncy castle where i'm from in new york that was a moonwalk that's what we called it there's so many different names for that thing anyway i've heard i've word moonwalk i think it's a bounce house at our county fair okay well on the upper west side it was it was a it was a moonwalk anyway Corinne brings in one of those and we're gonna go

in depth on that one but you know and her and nick are like just making out on it and like she's she has straddled him and Vanessa sees and at the end she confronts nick and i fucking loved it It was great. I was just like, this is a strong check. I really like her. And she said to him, I'm not judging Corinne. I'm judging your actions. And I was just like, yeah.

That's awesome. Good for you, Vanessa. Yeah. You know, here's the crazy part about this. It is, I, knowing Nick in that moment, and I really don't know how this season plays out. I don't. I don't want to because I just, I had to hold my whole season in way too long and I don't trust myself again.

but like after watching her say that to him and stand up for herself and challenge him I guarantee you Vanessa will be around a while oh totally Nick likes a strong girl she likes a strong girl and he likes it because Nick knows that he's not perfect and Nick knows that he's going to make mistakes in life and like for her to sit there and say Nick you know what I'm not here to think you're like all that I don't think like yeah I'm into you but like don't act or you know don't try to try to play this off on me I think Nick in that moment probably fell for her harder than he expected. Oh, I like that.

Interesting. Yeah. And she was like, I don't know if you're here looking for a wife or if you're looking to fuck around or what you're looking for. And it was just, it was great. Like she really kind of took the power back from Corinne and from Nick.

And I just thought it was really badass. And I liked it, especially because she was, first of all, I think she's like gorgeous and definitely looks, reminds me of Andy. So I'm sure Nick is into her. And also Nick cried on his date with her.

They had a one-on-one earlier in the episode where they were in a, a low gravity plane and then she got really nauseous and he like you know did the figuratively held her hair back as she was puking it was sweet it was fine whatever very nice and then they have dinner on top of the u.s bank building which is the tallest building in l.a and i used to work right by it i wouldn't really i'm not like dying to go up there like just because it's a tallest building which like okay cool like that's just not like a date hotspot in my opinion but anyway they go there they're connecting they're vibing whatever and for some reason nick is like overcome And he just starts, like, you know, tearing up when he's saying, like, he feels really optimistic about this process around Vanessa. And once again, I'm not judging her actions. I'm judging him. Like, what was he so, so, like, overcome with in that moment? And, you know, I love displays of emotion. I cry all the time.

But it was just kind of like a weird moment from Nick. It didn't, it seemed like sincere. But also, I'm just like, well, what's going on here? Like, is there something caught in your eye or something like that? Yeah. Well, as you know watching my season, I never cry. Never. But never.

You know, there's, okay. So, and I was talking through this last night with one of Lauren's friends. Oh, so you guys have a group watch. Interesting. Well, last night we did. Our goddaughter came down last night. So with the three, Lauren, her friend and I watched The Bachelor. How lovely.

Together. You know, and for all the, and I know you know this, like for all the, the, the, the, hilarity and comedy and entertainment that The Bachelor offers, there are the part that I will continue to watch is there are very real moments. They're real people trying to figure out a very odd situation. I've always said that and I will always say it.

And in that moment, I'm assuming, like, I felt that with Nick, or I felt that during my season, and it happened during Lauren's day. It was our very first day together. And you're sitting there, and this whole thing has kind of been overwhelming, and you've done this press junket, and you've done these photo shoots, and you've gotten press and you've done all these interviews and you show up to the first night and you

let me get out of a limbo and you're nervous and then you get this thing started and you're wondering like where it's going to end or where it's going to take you or if there's even a lot of in the tunnel because like we mentioned earlier there are a lot of dates or time spent with people that you know it's not going to work out with and it is exhausting and it's weird and it's sometimes forced and I think in those moments like I think probably sitting there and I don't want to speak for Nick, but I'm assuming he was thinking, like, I see at least something here. And I can see that, like, somebody of character and somebody of beauty and somebody of, like, convictions showed up to try to date me. And, like, I like what I'm seeing. And it's a breath

of fresh air. And for the first time in probably two months, since Nick was announced the Bachelor, he felt, like, himself again. And he felt like he could actually walk out of this thing and be happy, which isn't a feeling that you feel all. at all. Right. Like particularly on this show. Definitely. Yeah, yeah. I mean, like, you know, like, I know that's what you're like in, you're saying like on the show. It's so rare, but like just kind of in general. Like, I guess that is really nice. We like feel normal like a new person or whatever. I don't know. It was it was funny. Definitely that is not that emotional Nick is not the one we've seen that often and

all of his time on TV. So it definitely, it definitely stood out. I think it's. Is it Juliet, hold up. Is it not weird to you though? No, it is funny. that they like made out right after her puking. Yes. Yes. I was like, that's gross. I hope she had some mouthwash.

Yes. And she doesn't. They're up at, you know, they're up in on some plane with your gravity. Like when they started kissing, I said, there's no shot I would do this with Lauren.

Like she's puking. I would hold her hair. I would, I would be close to her. I'd cuddle or whatever. But if she starts trying to make out with me, like no shot. Yeah.

I know. That was so gross. And then he made. makes a comment like, I'm sure she felt weird because she said, I just threw up and he goes, it just tastes fine to me. And I'm like, that's the one of the most grotesque things ever hear anybody says. That is so true. I thought that when I was watching too. I was like, that's just kind of gross. And she was like, oftentimes when they put the woman or the man in like a situation they're uncomfortable with, like someone who's like afraid of heights who has to like walk across

a high wire or like someone who's like scared of horses, has to like go on a horse or whatever. like usually it's really like they're like talking to their fears and how nervous they are and it's just like come on like this was this is so contrived but Vanessa talking about how bad she was to throw up on the date was so real like that's like when you're on like a date early in a relationship and like you you just like don't feel well and you don't know how to hide it and it's like that was just it was very real I guess I do like a real thing going on but that was so gross when he kissed her after she puked just the grossest um yeah let's mark that down Yeah, for the record, it was gross.

You know what? I also find Corinne gross, and I want to talk about that. But first, I want to tell you about some sponsors. First, let's talk about Kopari. If you're like me, the shelf space in your bathroom is precious real estate. That's why I'm excited to introduce you to a line of beauty products that says great at multitasking as you are and as I like to hope I could be. It's called Kopari. Made with 100% organic coconut oil, Kopari products, moisturize your skin and hair without any sulfite, silicones,

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who we've not fully discussed named Corinne I just want you to know Ben that I hate Corinne I cannot stand her and like I know that's the point but I don't even like find it like funny how much I hate her way about another human in your life um there's like some people that I actually know who I do really hate like I used to really hate this one girl in college who like once told a story to our sorority and cut me out of it and I was just like What the fuck, you bitch? But other than that, no. Not really.

All right. Let me hear why. I hate her because she just is like so rude. Like aside from the fact that like I think a lot of women, which we're seeing right now, have the reaction of like sort of like that overt sexuality is almost like uncommon on, on women. So like they don't really know how to process it in some in some cases. I just think she's like disrespe.

respectful. And she's also clearly wasted for the entire show. All of these shots of her of sleeping when everyone else is like doing an activity or like at the roast. And it's like, yeah, because she's wasted. When I drink a lot, I need to go to sleep too. And like she's clearly just like pounding drinks and we don't and we don't see it. Which I don't really know why. Because we see a lot of people drinking, but we never see Corona with a drink in her hand, which is strange. And also I don't she's just so contrived. The thing is that Nick is really into her. You can tell he actually is into her and he has said it. But you don't get. whipped cream on your own in the show. You don't bring in a fucking bouncy house on your own. Like everything she's done has been, it's almost like she's like too obviously a stooge of the producers and I just like can't get down with it. Yeah, that's you're exactly right. I said I have, I've asked many times. I said there's there's some things about the show I understand. Most of the fact is it, you know, and I'll stand to this like it is real. And everyone's that's that. My question, I have two thoughts here. My first question that still confused me this day is how over 21 seasons of The Bachelor has the currents of the world not like watch

the show before and said, hey, post show, this could be bad for me. Like I don't want to be the girl to go like interrupt him three times. Like that's a very like obvious like play that happens every a year that never goes well. Like that's never the girl that ends up getting like chosen or makes it far. My second and more serious thought is what this does for the young woman watching the show. I don't like that at all. I don't think it's right. I don't think it's, I don't think it's fair.

I think it's honestly like disgusting that at any level it's being portrayed that a woman needs to express her sexuality or be more sexual to interest a man. Like I don't think that's right. I don't think it's a good message to sin. I know it's not what Nick ultimately wants to marry. I know it's not what I would ever be interested in. Yeah. And I don't like that that's being, yeah, I just don't like that that's how this is looking because it is obvious.

Like everything that's been done in their relationship so far has been at the foundation sex. Right. So that's not right. And my third part is more on the lines of what you're saying is like, like, why doesn't she just like, like, make a decision that doesn't have to be the wrong decision. I feel like every time, every day she's had or every situation she's been in, like, it's been the decision's been the wrong one.

Right. Well, let's just run down everything she did this week. That was annoying. So, um, she begins this week with, uh, at the Rose ceremony or sorry, at the, at the, at the cocktail party, she decides that she's going to like, like, do some like seduction move where she puts on like a trench coat. and she gets and then she grabs Nick brings him to like you know a corner

where no one can see them and she does and she like does a modified version of the whipped cream bikini scene from varsity blues have you seen varsity blues by the way? Oh yeah yeah. Okay. Just making sure it's a foundational movie. So it's you know she does an alley larder except that I noticed a few things about this

so by the time Corinne meets up with Nick it's pretty clear she's not wearing like any underwear at all. When we see her putting on the trench coat and everything she is still wearing a bra and like maybe underwear but I don't know and she like seems like she's taking it off by the time she gets to Nick so it kind of made me wonder like how like from that moment I was like this is just so contrived and then obviously she comes with ready whip and it's not like she's going to the grocery store while she's on the show so they either already had it in the house and she grabbed it from the fridge or she like asked someone to get it for her and it's just it's just so

ridiculous and then then she like puts whipped cream in Nick's mouth and then on her chest and has him like like lick it off or whatever but it's very awkward I don't even think it's It's sexy. She puts it like right above her boob. It's so weird. It's not cute. So, Nick, I mean, you've got to think you're,

Nick and her have only known each other for two weeks. Not even. Two weeks? Like, yeah, he's getting, he's getting a lot of Corinne in his face. And it's a very short amount of time. Yeah, it's so much. And so then she gets interrupted by Jasmine,

who is the, Warriors dancer. And then Corinne flips out. Like she's just like, it was ruined. I think you're supposed to assume that because she didn't fully strip, it was ruined or something. Like she leaves her one-on-one time with Nick still wearing her trench coat. And she's, and then at that point, she's like freaking out. She's so upset. And she ends up in bed and she misses the rose ceremony. But she's already gotten a rose. So it doesn't matter. Could he have revoked the rose if he'd wanted to? It would have been a big ordeal. I'd know. I honestly, there are very few. You think that are ever like rules i guess when it comes to the bachelor and here's a little insight

i feel like for both like taking the rose back would be something that probably wouldn't fly just because it would be too confusing like as a it's not it's not the format of the show right like once you get a rose you're safe and like there's very few things in that show that are rules but it's like if you have a rose you're there to the next week and if we started like not we i'm no longer part of this thing i'm in tampa getting right off again. But if the Bachelor, I think, took that back, then it would add too much mystery to every time you get a rose. Like, what does it mean? What does the rose mean then? You know, is it is a, is it definite, you know, concrete ideas. Yeah. Right. So the only thing for sure and the Bachelor is, is the value of

the rose. It's good to know. Glad we established that. Yeah. I think. I don't know. I would assume, like, I just don't, I think that would just change way too much. Like, I don't think that's a, it's not a fair idea. Like once you got a rose, like, hey, you're sick. No matter if you sleep, the rest of the night. Right. It's like immunity. Because like on Top Shapp, if you want immunity, you could like give it up if you want

to. Same thing on Survivor. I guess a girl could probably choose to give her Rose back. She could like opt to leave. But probably the Bachelor can't revoke it, basically. Good to know. So that was like only the first annoying thing she did. Then we also found out this week, or we already knew,

but she told the other women in the house that she had a nanny. And the nanny she loves because she was. wakes her up, she makes her coffee, and she makes her cheese pasta. We had a lot of discussion about what cheese pasta could possibly be. Mac and cheese. Does she mean mac and cheese? And she just doesn't, she's never heard that phrase before. Like, is she confused when she sees mac and cheese on a menu somewhere? It was, that was just ridiculous. It is. You know, like, there's so many things about this. Like, and I've been through it, like, I don't love the the idea of just like ripping on somebody but like this is one that I think people can get

takeaways from and I hope Corinne watches this back and says okay one like I don't need to be as sexual towards a man to get his interest like that's not a good look I don't think that's going to happen that's really like it's really nice of you to like hope for that for her but I really highly doubt this won't change her behavior and then like when it comes to her nanny who looks like a sweetheart like even during the previews when Corinne was like introduced he was like I think her, the like scene was her just going to tell her nanny, go get her food, which to me is just, and it's just like, it hurt to watch because in my mind, like, no matter if you're paying somebody to, you know, be your nanny, like, don't speak to her like she needs to just bend over

backwards for you. Like, that's not fair. She's still a human that has, like, dignity. So treat her like she has dignity, not just box her around. Yeah, yeah. That's the thing about, Corinne, like, ultimately, she doesn't seem like a good person. Like, many other, many other villains of the show, like Courtney Robertson on Ben Flannick's season, or, was there a villain on your season? I can't really, I don't think there was. But, like... I think people would say Olivia, but, like, it wasn't...

Oh, I forgot about her. But Olivia, like, clearly was getting, you know, a little views by the show. Like, Corinne does not seem that way. If anything, she's, like, in cahoots with the show. And she's getting, like, so much screen time. I'm certain we'll see her in. paradise. Like, there's no question about it. So, like, there's just so little redeeming about her. Like, she just is not a classy girl. And I cannot stand her. Oh, she sucks. And then it's just

still got worse. So then we find out about the nanny. She's, like, very unabashedly telling the girls. Then she gets to go on the best date, probably in the history of group dates, which is, and this was, like, pretty shocking to me. The Backstreet Boys were on this week's episode. They're legitimately famous. They're really famous. I agree. Yeah. And so the date is being backup dancers for the backstreet boys, which, and Corinne's a bad dancer. So she's pouting. She, like, leaves a date.

She's not having fun. And I just can't imagine, like, squandering that opportunity. I would definitely be uncomfortable in that kind of situation where I was, like, I had to be a backup dancer for them. But it's the backstew boys. Like, how fun with it. It's ridiculous. And I was pissed at her for not appreciating it. As a backstree boy is super fan.

I'm even planning to go to Vegas to see their residency. I was just like, what is she doing? She's wasting precious time with our great artists, the Baxter Boys. Julia, I'm just going to give a little bit of analysis right now. Please do. I feel like you might hate her in war because she offended your love for the Baxter Boys. I'm just kidding. I mean, I do.

I did feel she didn't appreciate it. Well, I guess. It was a sacred moment for you and she squandered it. I get it. like that's up. The Backstreet Boys, I mean, they're just like,

the thing about the show, we've seen a lot of artists, like you had Amos Leon, who I like, and there's like a talented singer or songwriter. But like usually these quote unquote celebrity guests with a few exceptions, like Amy Schumer and Jimmy Kimmel

are really not that famous. So they had not only the Backstreet Boys on this episode, but also Olympians, Alison Felix and Carl Lewis, like, and Michelle Carter. Like, that's insane.

Those are all very famous people. I agree I don't know how they did it I thought that was pretty legit Oh you did with Lauren right In the hot tub No Kayla Oh with Kayla right

I think Taylor reminds me of Kayla Do you see that Oh oh you know Yeah I was gonna say I think Is it Taylor maybe The girl is like the psychiatrist Yeah that's what I'm saying Taylor

She reminds me of Kayla Oh I thought you said Kayla reminds me of Kayla No Taylor definitely reminds me at Kayla. Like I said it last night. Like very similar. Yeah, I could really see it. I actually think Taylor seems like way too smart for this show and like she just needs to take her talents elsewhere. This is not the right place for her. She's like, I secretly think he's about to write a book because she's analyzing the impact like on each of the contestants. And I think she's super smart.

And she's going to walk away from this thing with a whole analysis. Like I want to see her journal for the show because it's going to be brilliant. And then it's a lot of the show. And then We're going to read about it in about two years. Yeah, she, she's just, like, obviously too serious. Like, and not in a bad way, but, like, she just kind of doesn't have the bachelor speed. Like, you know, like, on a bike, you have different gears and you switch it depending on, like, the hill or whatever. She only has one speed, I think, and it's not the right speed for this show. And that's okay, Taylor.

We'll find a place for you. It's just not on reality television. And that's totally fun. No, it's on the New York Times best of their list. Yeah, exactly, exactly. And then, yeah, so Corinne Ruined. she wastes the back shoe boys date which and I just want to say like the theme here has been overreactions and every step along the way she's overreacted she freaked out for no reason when her date was interrupted

when that's like or not even a date like one-on-one time that's standard operating procedure then she gets to go on the raddest date and she doesn't appreciate it and like also pouts during that fortunately she didn't i don't think she got the rose on that date so that's great oh yeah daniel l got it and did that which meant that daniel l had to make out with nick on stage in front of all the other girls and in front of like a crowd of 500 people that speaking of nick making out out the girls in front of the other people. Does he have to, would he have to make out with Danielle on stage?

Like, why did he do that? That's even worse than some of the other ones. Yeah, no, he definitely wouldn't have to. I mean, like, I'm telling you, I never, ever would have been at pressured or anything like that. And almost any situation, like the only, like I said, the only time would have been if I would have said, hey, can I take this rose to the girl?

I'm like, no, that just doesn't work. Like, that's not, that this can't happen. That's totally his choice. most of these things are situations where he's up on stage and he's with a beautiful girl and he's dancing and he's like I don't know why his reaction is to make out but he's getting away with it like I feel like if if I would have done that like I would have had 10 women like pretty much totally against me pitting just to leave but Nick's getting away with it which I don't know if it's a good or bad thing but yeah I don't know why he chooses to do that like I said it's one of the One of my biggest critiques of Nick as a bachelor, even though I think he's doing a great job. I think him kissing girls in front of the other girls is just not healthy. Right. Yeah.

It's bizarre. So, anyway, Corinz Tour de Force. The last stop is instead of having a cocktail party, Nick decides to have a pool party. And so Chris Harrison comes in and Nick knows what he wants. Nick knows what he wants to do. And there'll be no cocktail party. We're having a pool party. Does Nick really decide that?

Like, it's just such a hard time rat in my head around how much agency he has. Yeah, you know, I'm sure he did. I don't know that exact situation, but a little behind the scene scoop for my season is, and granted, like, it was covered up, and I'm glad they did. I had a parasite. I think you and I've talked about this all season during the bachelor's. You did?

I didn't know that. You didn't know that. No. Okay, so I went down to Honduras for a mission strip, like three months before the Bachelor started, And then I went down again the week before the bachelor started for my one of my best friend's wedding. And I came back and I got super sick like stomach illness. And you can even tell during the season, like I lost a ton of weight. And I was sick the whole time.

Oh, God, gross. And we never knew exactly what it was until post show. And Lauren was like, then you're always carrying a fever. You're losing it a ton of weight. And I had this rash on my side. And the parasite was actually like, and I'm done with the parasite after this. This really does nothing first. to see the bachelor's but um it was trying to like eat it eat its way out my out of like my stomach

lining and so it was causing this like massive irritation um so long story short uh if you go back like the bahamas when my season was the bahamas we had a cocktail party and everything was set to go we had this beautiful location this beautiful house and i was carrying a massive fever and i was sick i was just i couldn't like get out of the bathroom like i was throwing up and um finally i said guys I can't talk to these women tonight. Like, I just can't do it. Like, I don't feel good. And so we decided to cancel the cocktail party that night.

And I think we said, like, hey, he knows what he's going to do because I did. And we didn't want to really be like, oh, yeah, by the way, Ben can't get off the toilet. Because that would have been weird. But it was pretty much, like, all of us talking and saying, like, hey, tonight's not a good night for a cocktail party. Let's cancel it. Like, there's no need for it. And so we did. So I'm sure Nick probably was either tired, overall.

well, confused that just like how fast everything was moving and probably went to the people and said, hey, I want to ask to not like have a cocktail party night. I'm tired. I want to get it like, I just want to get this thing over with. And they probably said, yeah, that sounds fine. All right. Cool. All right. Well, I, interesting. And I came with you at a parasite. That's like brutal being, I would not be happy being on TV. So anyway, back to Nick. They have the pool party. and like we were talking about four, there's the bouncy castle, the moon bounce, the moonwalk, call whatever you want. And Corin and Nick are like, they're like having sex but not. Like they're close to it.

She's like straddling him. You know, it's as much as you could show on television in broad daylight without it like being censorship of any kind. And all the other girls see. And Corinne is just like, you know, how do they sneak in a bouncy castle? I do not know. They probably assume like the other girls must have seen it before that. right like they can't just like bring it in surreptitiously it's just impossible but uh the best

moment from that was when alexis she gives the middle finger to the camera and and it's like at corin and and nick almost called him bick um and it was just so funny and it was just like it was just more corin like wreaking havoc and we you know she just gets so much more screen time than i think she deserves i understand she's like the villain but i just hate her Yeah, you know, and he has He has some good characters on a season. Like he has women that I think they could really like show and that aren't like boring and aren't, you know,

that are interested in Nick and willing to like, you know, for example, like we haven't seen much from, I think it's Danielle that got the Rose. We haven't seen much for her. Yeah. We haven't seen much from, I think it's last night we were going through all the ones. Whitney. We really haven't seen much from Taylor.

It's true. Like Brittany. Kristen, Brittany, Astrid. Yeah, like there's a lot of girls that, like, are interesting and I think are, like, intriguing to, like, figure out where they're at

with Nick, and that, like, we just don't, we honestly haven't seen one conversation. It's true. We kind of only know Alexis because she's the dolphin girl. Corinne, because she's Corinna, because she's called him out. And then Danielle M. got a one-on-one. So we know her a little bit.

But, like, I would love more Rachel, who got the first impression rose. And Rachel should have gotten more time last night, but she messed up the sprint at the very end. Yeah. That was ridiculous. Yeah, I mean, there are so many more girls that I just, it's a great point that I wish we got to see. But we just, we just don't.

It's ridiculous. I hate Corinne. And Karen. Yeah, I hope Corinne. I don't know. I just, I can't deal with her. We got to wrap this up, but I just wanted to run down three extremely uncomfortable situations. And I just, you know, using your expertise, just comments on how you think Nick felt.

Number one, which was the hot tub on the track and field date. So there's a, you know, they're with the track stars, the Olympians. And at the end, there's a sprint. And then the winner of the sprint gets to go to a hot tub with Nick. And it's not like the hot tub is elsewhere. The hot tub is like on the track. And everyone could see. It's not even in the sun.

It's like shaded. It was very, very weird. And Nick is just watching this sprint happening while sitting in a hot tub alone. It was so weird. I still don't get that. I remember, like, when the bachelor started for me, and I was like, you know, there's some things that I'm, like, not down for. There's some very, like, strict guidelines that I want to keep. And they were like, hey, how do you feel the hot tub?

And it's like, yeah, I mean, I like a hot tub. But I like a hot tub after a long day where, like, I can sit and look at the stars and relax and, like, take my feet up. Like, I don't find a hot tub as just something that I chill in midday, like, for no reason. Like there's no reason why I get the hot tub is to rest my like my muscle. Like not just to kick it. Like it's not it's I don't get it. Like I don't understand that part of the bat is why are hot stuff such a prevalent thing. I don't know.

It's almost like they've become like completely unsexy because they're on the show so much. It's really weird. Okay. Second most uncomfortable situation for Nick. At the end of the episode, Raven, who's from Arkansas, who we also have not gotten a ton of. but she decides to try to end Nick and Corinne's interest in each other by telling Nick that that Corinne has a nanny. And Nick is so confused. He's like, wait, what?

Like an adult? Like that's like a real nanny? And Nick was just so confused. I loved it. It was so funny. First off, like, I like that Raven's the one that brings it up. Me too. I think we're going to really like Raven by then because she comes from this like small town.

she has a simple background. She's trying to make the most of this, like, small areas she lived in, and she comes on this crazy show that, like, it's totally out of her comfort zone. And I'm sure when she, like, I think Raven probably works really hard as a very independent, strong, confident woman. And I think when she heard, like, somebody has a nanny, I bet it just completely, like, threw her off.

Like, I remember during Caitlin's season, my worldview changing so much and my eyes being open to this world of people that I never knew existed. you know, especially coming from Indiana and just being like confused half the time. And I'm assuming that Raven was just so. I don't think she comprehended the fact that like people actually have people that like make them food. Right. I don't think that's a common thought in her town or in just her life, which I don't think is a bad thing at all. Yeah, I'm with you.

And finally, we'll just do one more send off to Jaden Tanner's wedding, which we'll now never speak of again by relishing. the weird moment in which Nick had to tell everyone that he had sex with a girl. Not that weird, but under the circumstances, could not have been more strange. Well, here's my first takeaway from this, and it was my final critique of Nick as a bachelor. Why does he say sex? It's such a harsh word. Like, hey, you know, Liz and I slept together. We spent the evening together. Like, we, you know. It's very clinical. We had sex. Yeah, it's very clinical. We had sex. And it's like, it just seems every time. It's like just, it's even for me, like, it's hard for me to like, even like, honestly, Julia, like every time he says, like, Liz and I had sex, my, I have a mental image of them, like, having sex. Like, I don't know if that's good or bad if that's an issue in my own life, but I feel like if he's let stuff stuff together, I'm like, okay, I know what they did.

Yeah. But like, when he says sex, it's just like, has this weird flashback moment for me where I have to like shake my head and clear my life. mind. Like, it's not a good moment any time. I think that probably is representative of the encounter based on Liz's description of it last week. The only person who was slightly more awkward in discussing it was current in fact when she was like, they had intercourse. And that was one of her statements. That was a good word in fifth grade. Yeah. You first learned it. The sinner came to talk to a bus. Yeah, like we're like good touch, bad touch. And the birds the bees and intercourse was the word they used. So I think I think that's her, I think it was

her takeaway. Intercourse is the appropriate use of words. Yeah. Yeah, it's very odd. I'm with you. Like, Jane Tanner's wedding, a beautiful ceremony that is now, unfortunately for Jane Tanner marked by the idea that Nick and Liz had sex. Intercourse. Intercourse, right. All right. That's it for this week. Ben, you're a champ for coming back on here. I wish you well with the software sales. Please keep me posted on how they're going. And next time you're in LA, we will watch the show together since, you know, that would be fun. That sounds awesome. Yeah. Well, thanks, Julia. I hope to talk to you again before this season's over. Oh, yeah, absolutely. It's a standing invitation. Thanks again for listening, everyone,

and I'll be back next week. Bye, Ben. See, Julia.