The Press Box - Ep. 241: ‘Bachelor Party’ With David Jacoby

Episode Date: January 24, 2017

The Ringer's Juliet Litman is joined by ESPN's David Jacoby for an emotional 'Right Reasons' reunion to discuss Corinne's valid argument (02:01), Danielle L.'s one-on-one date (20:45), rollerskating in a museum with Raven (26:58), and Kristina the Russian (39:33). Then they quickly delve into 'Mariah's World' (46:24) and 'Vanderpump Rules' (52:36). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The people have spoken and Jeff Ross has returned for Roast Battle, too. The four-night event features top comedians getting verbally violent until just one is left standing. Featuring a star-studded lineup of judges, including Snoop Dog, Sarah Silverman and Jason Sudecas. This is a battle you don't want to miss. The four-night event begins January 26th, the 10-9 Central on Comedy Central. And don't miss the live finale on Sunday, January 29th, the 10-9 Central to see who gets crowned the king or queen of cruelty. Right reasons. I'm Julietette Litvin. And I'm David Jacoby.

Yes, this is the Bachelor Party feed. But today my special guest is my old friend, David Jacoby, with whom I did The Right Reason's podcast for almost four years. Yeah, almost four years. Almost four years. It was the highlight of my week. It was an oasis amongst a sea of just work. It was, we used to do on Friday afternoons.

I'm actually crying already. Really? It's been 10 seconds. Yeah, I'm really happy to here. So one thing that all of our colleagues, former colleagues, and current colleagues know is my goal was to make you cry during this podcast. And I was going to save it for the end because you didn't want you to start crying. I'm literally already crying.

Kind of like the time I had the hot sauce and I couldn't stop crying as well. I'm just so happy you're here, man. I miss you. What's up? You don't know, Juliet and I had a very, very close friendship that has kind of shriveled and frizzled away. That's actually really not true. I knew you were going to do that. I'm just trying to make you cry.

I just trying to make you cry. That makes me mad, though. It doesn't make me cry. That makes people think we never see each other. I see you at least once a month. More than that. Yeah, definitely more than that. But that's besides the point.

My favorite thing to do with you is talking about The Bachelor. And last time, we watched the show it together to prepare for this podcast. Excellent episode. And we got a really good one. It was an excellent episode. Yeah. There's one place that you just have to start with this show, though. And that's with Corinne.

So we're going to talk about her. We're also just going to talk about who was on the come up this week, who fell off, and who had a really high usage rating. Or not a high usage rating, but an impressive usage rating. But first, Corinne, I want you to talk about it. me into Corinne because you like her and I cannot stand her. I listened to you and Ben Higgins and to answer, yes, I was a little jealous. There was a little chemistry there.

Ben is just a gem. And then at one point about 35 minutes into it, you literally say, I hate Corinne. Yes, I did. You're like, I hate her. I know girls like her. Some girl are my sorority and I hate her. And I was like, pump the brakes on this. Right?

And watching the show last night, all of these women are like, I cannot stand. She knows someone needs to talk to her, whatever. And then when they get face-to-face with her, they don't really have anything negative to say. Okay, so this is what happened last night that really hurts the Corinne haters out there. Corinne was obnoxious and off-putting as usual, but actually completely correct. The main arguments against Corinne, which were coming primarily from Taylor and Sarah, Sarah will be gone in one more episode. Like, they're kind of lucky she was still there.

She is like, I could barely remember her name. But anyway, their whole thing is that Corin is not mature enough or she doesn't have the emotional intelligence to, like, settle down with Nick. And it's just like, women, who cares? You're in competition. You don't get to decide that. That's for Nick to decide. One boxer doesn't go to the other boxer and be like,

I don't know if you're physically prepared for this fight right now. That's good for you if she's not emotionally prepared. Yeah, absolutely. I don't understand how that is even a criticism of her. Right. The thing is that she's just so obnoxious, though. Like, she is like, like, you just don't want to be around her. If she was...

You say obnoxious, I say eloquent. I say funny. She had some lines last night. She's got bars. She has bars. She has bars. The best thing was when she, in the middle of the episode, one note about this season, which is they're clearly playing around the format, which is that they've changed it.

And instead of culminating at the rose ceremony every week, they now culminate with a cliffhanger and then they start with a row ceremony. Well, astute bachelor watches would realize they did that about three seasons ago. Do you like that? Yes. I don't. Because I'm at the thing, Rose and Roney, where's part of the show? It's true. Also, at this point in the season, Rose Ceremony is not dramatic.

No. You can tell, there's at least four girls. They're just fluff. Yeah. You know what I mean? Whoever's been on the show, the episode that week is staying, so it's fine. But I have a hard time differentiating between party, like, cocktail parties and rose ceremonies with this format because it's like instead of going to like bum, bum, bum. It's like, oh, we started with this and then someone went home.

It's just harder to keep it all straight. So as a viewer, I don't like it as much. or maybe as a scholar. I don't like it as much. Maybe as a viewer. It's not so bad. But it was kind of hard to keep track because we ended the episode with Corinne.

Sorry, began the episode with Corinne gave me a weird toast at the rose ceremony. Yep. After she got a rose where she was wearing a red dress that I quite liked, I have to say. Corinne dress as well. She's one of the better dresses, better dressers.

And that just like sort of began her horrible, like, streak of like just being like everyone hating her. And she was like, let's just be here to enjoy this. Like, let's toast to ourselves. and then there's the interview of her saying, like, I know all these girls hate me, so I'm just going to be fake back to them. And so she started off with a lot of bravado.

Like, I'm here, people. Well, there's just so many tropes going on around the villain that just repeat themselves over and over and over. It's kind of like the real world sometimes. Like, do you guys watch this show? Yeah. You know that you're falling into, like, a stereotypical person. And what happens is there's Corinne who starts off

by being like, I'm just going to kill everybody with kindness since no one likes me. And then she completely turns and everything gets in your head. She can't do it because she actually is. mature. That is true. And then there's the Taylor's and the Sarahs, which are just completely focused on the quote-unquote villain and not

Nick. And then whenever they get time with Nick, they're like, oh, Nick, let me tell you about Corinne. And Nick is sitting there and me like, you know what? I don't need to know anything about Corin. You know what I need to do? Grab her ass in a bouncy house. Okay? Okay. That's basically the beginning and end of the relationship, and I'm totally comfortable with that. Nick really likes her, so he just doesn't care. The only

person who successfully knocked her was Vanessa. But ultimately, Corinne just came out on top because she had some crazy lines. like her take on naps, which I'm going to play for you right now. I'm sorry for sleeping, guys. Oh my God. Sorry, guys. I napped.

All they could say is, hey, you took a nap, and that was bad. I didn't mean to offend anyone by taking that nap. Michael Jordan took naps. Abraham Lincoln took naps, and I'm in trouble for napping. I'm sorry. I really am. I'm sorry. I know the reason to nap, guys.

I love it. I'm sorry. She's sorry. Michael Jordan took naps. Abraham Lincoln took naps. Those are facts. Those are facts. I like that she went to Michael Jordan first.

I know. I wonder what file, like, what mental manila folder did she pull up? Was that just great men? She wasn't. She had a poster in her bedroom of, like, great men in history. And those are probably. like two of them or something. I don't know how she got there, but she got there and I love it.

As a person, first of all, as a napper myself. Yeah. It's, and honestly, and now I'm being serious for a second, it is really the only true criticism. They're like, it was disrespectful. And even my new favorite, Christina, was like, it's immature. Now, if you can't handle

standing there for 20 minutes, then how could you possibly handle a relationship? And I just kind of feel like, ladies, why are you worried about her marrying Nick? Yeah, it's just like, it's Isn't this helping you? Yeah, it's not like she's... If it wasn't an intern's test,

Corinne would be well-rested. That's true. She'd be ready to go. She'd be ready to run the marathon, basically. But it doesn't really matter if she gets a week, because the thing is, we disagree about this.

I just think she's drunk, and that's why she's napping. When I get really drunk, I want to nap too. Like, I want to go straight to my bed. And they just, I think they keep showing the same clip of her snoring a few times. I don't think she's actually napping

as much as they make it seem. And so I'm just like, guys, just call her out for drinking too much. Like, fine. I think if you are producing this show and Corinne is drinking a lot, like, why would you hide that? Because it's funnier to make it seem like she's a narcolyptic? I don't think so. I don't know.

I just don't believe that she is sober most of the time. I don't know. I think when she's sober, she retreats from the group. Like, I think on the date, when she, also this week there in Wau, Wisconsin, and her group date was going to the dairy farm because it's relevant to Nick because he had family friends who were dairy farmers. Yes, he once knew somebody that had a dairy farm. So we had a recollection that dairy farms existed, therefore we're all going to do a dairy farm. Right. And so part of it was shoveling shit, manure.

And Corinne didn't want to do it. So she just left the group. I think when she's not drunk, she actually can't really function around other people. This is my theory. And when she is drunk, she naps. Yeah. Which is also not functioning around other people. No, when she is drunk, she gets into fights and she, like, eats a lot like we saw at the end of the episode.

And then she naps. Like, I think that's what she does. And for some reason, I don't know why they're not like talking about it. I think she does not like being around the other women. and it does everything she can to not be around them. Yeah, she probably just doesn't like other women. Exactly. And like, okay, fine.

Some women don't like other women. Some men don't like other women. Like, it's fine. But, like, let me throw this out there. The only other criticism of her, besides napping, right? And Michael Jordan and both Abraham Lincoln nap. Okay. So that's off the table.

I believe Michael Jordan napped. I know that's like part of the NBA schedule. Great point. I don't know if Abraham Lincoln napped. I'm sure he napped at some point. You know what I mean? I don't think he never napped, but I don't think he was a daily napper.

He seemed very busy. was really busy and like a really prolific writer. Yeah, a lot of travel. Very important president. Yeah, yeah. So I think that he has naff true, Corinne, but like he is not a napper. Don't you think people just like went to sleep earlier before technology? Oh, definitely.

There's nothing to do. So it's just like, call on a night. Exactly. You don't need to nap. Up with the sun, down with the sun. I'll give her credit for MJ. I just, I don't know if we can give her a check for Lincoln. That's a really good point.

But like the other criticism of her is that she uses her sexuality. Yes. Okay, ladies. Okay, ladies, now let's get information. That's what it sounded like you're about to say. Let's get information. Listen up, ladies. One way to get a man, especially early on, use your sexuality.

Right. Like, I'm not, like, I don't know what the problem is here. I think the problem is that there are some, I don't think it's necessarily using your sexuality, but I think it's like how she's doing it. Like, for example, when they kept calling her immature, she correct. grabs her boobs and she was like, is this immature? That was in an interview. Okay.

In an interview. All the same, that's like how she behaves. She just is so unrefined. And like, she just seems really unpleasant. Like, just say it. No one likes to hang out with her. She doesn't like hanging out with you. You don't want to hang out with her.

Like, that's fine. She's an attention hog. I think it's more about hogging the attention. If she was, like, secretly slutty, like, the guys didn't, the women didn't know that she was doing stuff. That's obviously. Then, yeah. Then they wouldn't have a bunch of a problem with her.

They probably would just, like, be, mean to her, but they wouldn't, like, need to confront her. But since she's, like, she's, like, putting it out on Front Street for all of them, then it also changes the competition as a thing. Like, if it becomes, like, a, who can be the most sexual, then it changes, like, Vanessa's tactics or whoever. It does, kind of feel, like, all 30 women, like, showed up for a fist fight, and they're like, oh, wait, you brought a knife?

Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, this isn't fair. If I can't use a knife, then you can't use a knife. Because even Vanessa at one point was, like, oh, I could just be shaking my tits at him, but I'm too good for that because I'm Canadian. Sure. She is like distinctly Canadian.

It's not just her accent. There's something about it that's just like, yeah, you're Canadian. I see it. And even though like if she was walking down the street, I would never, never know, obviously. The other thing about Karen is that she's just like, I think that she just is not fun. So that's why. No, she's not fun. I don't want to spend any time with that one.

She also probably knows she's not fun. And that's why she just makes it all sexual. And there is a part of me as a producer that is like, okay, she's being. manipulated. Yeah. She didn't put, when she packed her bag, she didn't pack the inspector gadget trench coat.

You know what I mean? I think she may have put the trench coat on that. No, she did not. Yes, she did. Juliet, she did not. Juliet, limited space. Limited space in the bags. Do not put in the trench coat being like,

at one point, I'm going to get whipped cream. Juliet, look me in the base. You are just doing this. No, I'm not. You think she packed a trench coat. She's from Miami. Okay, she's going to Los Angeles. She's probably like, what will I need around the world?

Oh, a sexy trench coat. Like, I just think this is like part of her moves. obviously the whipped cream she did not bring from Miami. But I think she probably is like, what will I look hot in? Dear pop culture, whipped cream and sex don't mix. I don't know how to say that. It's messy. It's messy.

It's just like, with food and sex don't really mix. You know what I mean? It just doesn't. Unless you're George Costanza. It just doesn't mix. Yeah. Especially whipped cream. Also, it's just not like the way that Nick like licked her chest was not sexy.

However, when I was watching and he got a mouthful of whipped cream, I was like that does sound good. It's like, we've all that sounds good. Sure, but like on your own time. Like, that does need to be a group activity. Not involved with sex. Just like outside of sex, whipped cream good. During sex, not good.

But that in the bouncy house. The bouncy house, it's like, I don't know why I didn't think of this because I'm just dumb. But I was like, oh, they're just making her like a child. Yeah. It's like, oh, okay. The producers are manipulating her. Okay, so Nick is an older bachelor. And there's been a couple of tropes of like kind of honing in on that.

And one of them is calling Karen immature. One is last night twice, people said, I've just been single for so long. and that was like sort of like to accentuate both age and sort of like sadness. Not just people said that. Nick's mom said that. Nick's mom said that. Nick's mom dukes is like you've been single for so long. Which I don't think is true by the way.

It seems like he's dated, I don't know, four girls on camera in the last two years. We've seen it. We've seen it. And also Danielle L who's a little bit older than Crinn. She also's like, I've just been single for so long. It's like, girl, you're 27. Like 27 years itself is not that long. So just deal with it.

Like, they're trying to really play up, like, the age discrepancy, which makes me wonder if, like, down the road, like, they're going to be, like, Corinne's too young or, like, I don't know. Oh, Chris gone. I think that they're just... She's going straight to Paradise. She is Paradise. She's, like, the next four summers. Yes, exactly. There's no way she's weighing.

They're signing her to, like, a three-season deal for Paradise. Absolutely. They probably have, like, another show in the works for her. Like, they should reboot the simple life with Corinne. She's going to be the bartender next season. Oh, my, that's a great idea. I'm telling you. Wait, but I just want to say one thing.

That bartender position is ripe for a switchout, don't you think? Totally. As much as I love that dude, whatever his name is, but couldn't that be like a character that's sort of like a sage advice giver type? Like a sort of an undercover psychiatrist but like is cool and like is way too tan, live by a beach for 20 years? That you bring back Brad Womack psychologist from when he came back on the show and he like needed counsel or whatever. Or Taylor. She's a mental health counselor. Okay.

Can we talk about that for a second? No, we're going to get to Taylor in a minute. She was next. But I just want to say, you're wrong. We saw last night that they're allowed to bring. two checked bags and a carry-on, which is a lot, actually. You can get a lot of stuff in there.

If you got to think about, if you got to think about, you're thinking like that's five pair of shoes, right? At least, maybe six. Dresses? Shoes are tricky. You fill up one bag just there. Sure.

Shoes are tricky, but not all the same. No room for a trench coat, Julia. They bring their own clothes. Back off the French coat take. How many times will we get into this? They bring their own clothes. They bring their own clothes. They only get more for warmth.

But they're like, no one has a sweatshirt and if they're in Ireland. False. False. False. False. Yes, it is. Okay, fine. Let's talk about Taylor.

I pissed it to you now. Let's just move on. So the real kind of freedom fighter, Corinne Freedom Fighter here, was Taylor trying to bring her down a notch. And Taylor is taking the exact opposite tactic of Corinne, except for one moment last night when Nick wasn't even around. She was, like, soaking her feet in the bathtub with Danielle M.

And Daniel M was in, like, in, like, gym clothes. She looked normal. And Taylor was in, like, the hottest bikini she could find. That was the most shocking thing that happened on the episode. But they just cut to her and it's like, why are you in a bikini with your feet in the tub? It was really weird. It was like, for the camera? When you're on camera with your stomach out, it forces you to sit with like this posture.

She didn't look good. She didn't look comfortable either. It's like you're at the whole point of putting your feet in the tub. I assume it's just sort of like soak your feet. It's been a long day. Let's like relax. Yeah. Put a robe on, girl.

It was kind of, it was strange. Also, it was kind of like a push-up bra bikini, which I also thought was weird. It was clearly for the camera. I didn't notice because I don't objectify women like that. I don't know what the, I was just thinking about her style. There's nothing that objectifying women. Some people consider how you dress an art form, okay? Okay.

Anyway, Taylor is the freedom fighter against Grin, trying to get her to admit that she's, like, done something wrong. Taylor was the biggest disappointment this episode for me that I've had on this show in a long time. Coming into this episode, I was like, ooh, T-Tay. She's, like, tall, she's completely ethnically ambiguous. She's got, like, a decent job. She's well-spoken.

She's from the Pacific Northwest, A very underrated part of the country. Totally. I love the Pacific Northwest. I was just like, oh, she was my number one coming into this. Now I don't even want to hear her talk anymore. It's time for her to go. I think she's out next episode.

And like when I'm guaranteed to have a Kanye West like Mariah Carey style mental breakdown at some point in my life. It's like a 100% chance. You are? Yeah. And when it happens, I'm not going to a 24 year old like chick. You know what I mean? Like she's a mental health. What is he?

Mental health counselor. I take issue with that. I'm not going to her. I'm not going to her. when I had my breakdown. It sounded like she had memorized a textbook and was just reading it back to Corinne. Like the only thing she could really do

was like use some kind of like summary of emotion of like a mood disorder that she'd read about and like trying to like diagnose Corinne. But it's like girl, you're on The Bachelor and you're 24. Like what do you know? Yeah, seriously. Like you would have just as much fun

in the bouncy house as Corinne. Also like if you really want to start peeling back the layers like you're a mental health counselor and you're going on the Bachelor to find love? Like how good is that going to be for your job? Like where are you at? She was the biggest, like, free faller in the power rankings this week for sure. Yeah.

Also, she kept trying to, like, deliver Zingers and they weren't working. At one point, she was holding up, like, a zero with her hand and pointing to it, and, like, this is how many fucks I give and how little I care. And it's like, that doesn't really work. Yeah. Here's what you need to do. Watch Corinne. All right. Study Corinne's film.

Watch her game tape. She lands. She's talking about Michael Jordan and Abraham Lincoln. She's got bars. Who do you think is, like, a high-profile napper that she should have picked? instead of Michael Jordan. I mean, sorry, Abraham Lincoln. NBA player is a great.

I don't even know if she knows, but it's part of the NBA lifestyle is to nap. Yeah, it's like part of your jobs. Like, be rested. Yes. Carve out the time in the middle of the day. Like, don't know, like, you know, to tell your agent you're napping, no one will call you during those times. Yes, yes.

It's true, Karen, great job. But, like, Lincoln was just a bad choice. Betty White, I'm gonna go with you. Just because she's old? Yeah, old people nap. Interesting. I feel like, probably like Brad Pitt, probably is like, I need to nap now. We'd nap.

Yeah, weed nap. Yeah, yeah. I would have gone with big smoker. Like Woody Harrelson. Great nappers, like Woody Harrelson, Chees and Chong. Yeah, it makes totally big sense. Or maybe like Penelope Cruz because she's Spanish, so, you know, they have siesta. Oh, yeah.

I like, yeah, she's just gone with an entire country. Culturally relevant. She's just been like, look, you know the whole continent of Europe? Yeah. They're napping, and I think they're fine. So I can miss the rose ceremony. That really, it's a tough one for Taylor. She took a lot of bells this week.

I'm completely out on Taylor. Yeah, she's at the bottom of power rankings. Second worst in the free fall, though. Not quite as bad, but also significant drop-off. Miss Danielle L. Oh, yeah. Really bad. Oh, yeah.

So Danielle L got the first hometown in Milwaukee. No, what are we calling it? Waukesha. So I went to college in Chicago at Northwestern, and there was like a train that you could take to Wisconsin, and I now know that I've been thinking of Wauwakashaw wrong for the last 10 years. I always thought I was like Waukeeshah. And now I know I've been wrong this entire time.

I love Native American names. Yeah, me too, sure. So they're in Waukesha. First of all, the women are staying in a lovely home, which I... I love that place. I tried to find on Airbnb this morning, and there's a lot of Airbnb that's available. Put the number on it. Of that house.

Yeah, one night in that house. I mean, it's a big house. It was really big. I would say like $5.50. I bet not that. Oh, you think more? $1,200. That's a huge place.

It also was waterfront. Really nice. Oh, yeah, $1,500. I limited my search to waterfront properties, but it's still challenging. It looks really nice in the greater Milwaukee area. Plenty of great places to stay. Yeah, if you're like and spent some time. Remember when they announced they're going to be a walk in?

It's like, whoa! I do think they were genuinely excited to be seeing Nick's hometown. And like, I think it also, like, yes, if I get to meet his parents, that means I'm in or something like that. Yeah, and when you see someone's hometown, like, real talk, you do sort of like learn a lot about them. Right. So Danielle L probably was like really excited because she got the first hometown date. She thought, I'm going to meet Nick's family, all that. And all she got stuck with was meeting one of Nick's exes.

Which was the most staged, boring thing. Yeah. And here's my thing about Danielle, who also was very high on my list coming into this. Well, she won a dancing competition last week. Yeah. That's cool. And there was chemistry. She looked good dancing.

Like, it seemed like, oh, her and Nick, like, have a thing. Also, she's, like, a legit business owner. She's got three nail salons. She's 27. That's cool. If you have not kissed a man until 17, that's a deal breaker for me. Just a red flag. That's not a red flag.

That is a red parachute landing on top of my head, and I cannot get to. out from underneath it. She's just too long. You mean a 15 to 16? Like, like, Keynesia. Aton, like, you never in school dances. You never once, like, went behind the hockey rink or whatever, like, the bleachers and made out with a dude in, like, junior year?

What if she was religious? Would that be different for you? You know what, you're right. There's never been a religious young lady that made out before 17. I'm sorry. You're right. Yeah, yeah, that's never happened. Never happened in the history of humankind.

Yeah, those religious people, they don't make out 14, 15. Yeah, I mean, it's definitely old. It's like almost college. Way old. Yeah. For me, like, that echoes for the rest of your life. Sure. Like, I'm saying, like, it is a deal breaker.

Yeah, because, like, when you tell, like, your first stories and everything, you're like, and it just requires more questions. Nick didn't ask the questions, though. He just sort of, like, moved on from him. Yeah, he doesn't care. Yeah, he doesn't care. And then, but it seems like she just had, like, kind of, like, I don't know, upbringing of some kind.

It seems like it's, like, a raw subject for her in a way that, like, was kind of weirdly presented because she made it like a divorce story about like her parents or whatever. But the story she told about her parents was just kind of weird. It didn't really like, it didn't really like make sense with her analysis. Let's listen to it. Like the whole relationship situation. Okay. My parents, like being divorced.

Sure. How long have they been divorced? Since I was 17. So 10 years. Do you think that's a flaw? Maybe just like a fear of not finding the right person. One of the things that I loved about my. my parents' relationship growing up was I felt like they were so affectionate with each other,

you know, like, I could remember them chasing each other around the kitchen, or like, my mom fell asleep downstairs. Like, I would remember my dad carrying her upstairs. Okay. I don't know, Danielle. Oh, here's the thing. I'm going to say what you want to say. I'm not, look, I don't want to make light of anyone else's family completely falling apart,

but I'm about to make light of her family completely falling apart. Uh-oh. Chasing each other around the kitchen, and then I remember nights where he used to carry her. to bed. She was just like fall asleep elsewhere in the couch. It's just, it sounded like 17 was a rough year for Danielle. It sounds like it was a rough year.

Yeah. And her mom was like drinking lean with Little Wayne. Come on. That's a bridge too far. However, it wasn't a good year for Danielle and I don't know if she had the appropriate interpretation of her parents relationship. Not a good year for Danielle. Not a good

episode for Danielle either. No. She really fell very far. We also learned that she has a like Liz, not quite as large, very, but a very conspicuous upper back tattoo. And you did something while we were watching, which I was just so proud of you because you just show a perspective that I don't have. You said what when we noticed it? That she'd been covering it with her hair?

Yes. It was like, oh, because that's kind of like where she backed her way into this hairstyle, but being like, she went to the hairstyles and was like, look, I've got this really embarrassing tattoo. Like, whatever you have to do to cover that, just go. And she really focuses on her chest. Like she shows off her boobs a lot, which often means a high back. Oh, no, no, no.

Do you know what that means, Julia? Let me take you behind the curtain. That means I paid $10,000 for these, and I'm getting all the $10,000 worth from these. Yeah, the dresses she were wearing were very Mariah Carey style, where, like, you're certain things aren't going to move around because it's not natural. It's 60% boob exposure. Yeah. We were very close to her nipple on her one-on-on-one. Even as, like, a Neanderthal dude, like, that is not attractive to me.

Yeah. It doesn't work. It also is kind of a, also, like, very, like, a sexual innuendo. Very different than Corinz, though. Like her presentation doesn't really match her personality. She actually seems like kind of sad. That's one of the reasons she fell, I think, is because she's not really fun. She's got like a tragic story.

She got the shittiest date. She had to go, she had to meet Nick's, she walking down the street and walk a shot. And Nick's like, oh my God, there's an X. I'm sure it means like someone. And then he's like someone from high school. Nick is 36. So that's 20 years ago. It's not a big deal.

Yeah, yeah. Two decades. Yeah, it's totally fine. And then she had to like have a fake conversation with this X. And then all she got... But when they dated, they didn't text each other or have cell phones. Yeah, exactly. This doesn't matter.

There was no sexting back then. And I'm sure Nick likes sexting. I don't need to know anything about him to be sure he's into it. I know he's in your phone. Let's sext him right now. Maybe later. And then her date was like basically sitting in a hotel lobby, which was not empty even. It wasn't like private.

It seemed like a Tinder date. Yeah. There was like people in the background. It seemed like an awkward Tinder date where like Nick had another one 30 minutes later. Yeah. And then he, and then the culmination of the date was like a private concert. And she just won a concert date last week at the Backsheet Boys. And this was like some random country guy no one's heard of.

But it's not private. No. Because there's 3,000 people watching you awkwardly sway because you're like, don't, neither of you are exactly like professional dancers. And they don't have rhythm together yet. Exactly. So that's awkward. It would just make me feel bad.

Like here, like, I'm not a good dancer. I can get, I can do a wedding or whatever. Sure. But like, I've got 45 seconds of material. Right? For 45 seconds, I will look like, oh, that guy can dance. But then you'll see me doing the same thing over and over, and she'll start getting bored, and they're up there for, and they're up there for.

One song. You think just one song? Like four and a half minutes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It just doesn't seem fine. If you go to a second song, I'm like, I have to use the bathroom. Kind of go. Yeah, I'm just like, I'm out of here.

Yeah, like, this is ridiculous. Nick was not into Daniel. You can tell. You can tell. Nick, Nick, unlike your man, Ben, Benny H., Benny Huggie, he, he, Nick shows. All of his emotions right on his face. He wears his interest on his sleeve with the girls. And if you're an astute watcher like you are, you can just be like, oh, he's out.

Yeah. So Taylor and Danielle are out, big drop-offs. But huge rides from someone I just did not see coming, just the biggest, like a beacon in the sky. Raven. Oh, see, I thought you're going somewhere else. I've got another one. Yours is Raven. Mine's Raven.

Pitch me Raven. Okay. Raven, first of all, had an incredible date. She got the other one-on-one, and she had, like, the best date, like, one could have, particularly on a reality show, which is empty museum, dinner, roller skating. But she had to pay for that. She had to earn that by going to a soccer game. Yes, that sucked.

And then meeting the parents. And going to the roller skating. Yeah, like, roller skating around and then talking to like a 10-year-old. You want to know what? Credit to Raven, it didn't seem that bad to me, probably because she handled it well. I don't know. Yeah, she seemed to be having a good time. But where you started was the highlight this museum.

Yeah, the museum was incredible. So I actually've heard the Milwaukee Art Museum. I've never been there, but I've heard it's a great museum. and it opens up onto the water, kind of like when people have really nice houses, it has like a glass wall that opens out to a deck. That's like the entire museum. It was beautiful.

Yeah, it was amazing. And then that's just really cool. Like being alone in museum for a day is like definitely my dream date. So cool. Shout out to Raven. But she handled it pretty well. And it's another one of those things where it's like, how do I explain? It's like the wizards.

You know what I mean? It's like you're not going to win the championship. Yeah, you're not going to win the championship. But you know what? You can have some good games. Like, Raven is not going to win this. But it's like, hey, you know, like, that doesn't mean the season isn't worth playing. So, like, good for you, Raven.

You had a nice date. You got a little makeout. But, like, you know that Raven's not going to win this. She's not even going to go final four. Last day was really impressive from her. I mean, this is the thing. If she made it through to the end and... Juliet?

Let me just, hold on. She told the craziest story maybe it's ever been told on The Bachelor. Like, ever. Oh, good point. Okay, this is the story. Raven and Nick have something in common. They've both been cheated on. And Nick has actually brought this up pretty much every single time.

This is his fourth season. He's always brought it up, but obviously really scarred him. And Raven was very scarred and then scarred someone because this is what happened. Raven was living her own version of the movie Old School. She comes home. She hears from her from a friend that her man's with another woman. At a bar. At a bar.

She's with her mom at the time. Her mom's hands with the car keys. Of course, when you find out that your man is cuckling you, the first thing you do is tell your parents and then ask for their advice. Raven must be really close to their parents. Yes, you could tell. She's, yes. A little too close for my taste. Another red play.

So Raven's with her mom. Her mom hands are the car keys and Raven drives home, like immediately. She gets there. No, they're not home. To where he is, to his house. To his house. So presumably he has been at the bar with another nurse, which is even worse because she like knows her.

It's like Kathy from the job. Yeah, I actually think that this guy's a doctor, though. I believe she mentioned that. So it's sort of like, that just sucks. It's just like, it's like a whole power dynamic there. I'm not into it. Anyhow, she gets back to her boyfriend's house. She goes to the bedroom door.

She has the key. So you're close enough, but she has keys. She's good at telling this story. Because she's like, I've got the key, so I've got going in. She gets the data points. Jiggles the handle to the door. And it's locked. But at first I thought, when she said jiggled, I thought she did loudly.

But then when I started thinking about me actually doing it, she just tested it quietly. Right. Yeah, she definitely seems like she had a plan. Because listen, she gets to the door and it's locked. So instead of, like, waiting or, like, banging on. on it or like calling a locksmith, she breaks open the door. She kicks it open. Not easy.

Does she kickbox? How does she have that strength? Not easy. I'm assuming it was probably just not a high quality door. Do you think you could break down a door? Because I don't think I could. I could break down the door. Like maybe I'm like full of rage.

I don't know. I'm just impressed by that feat of strength. So Raven breaks down the door, which is she walks in and she finds her boyfriend. And this is a quote from where she finds her boyfriend. fucking this other woman. And this is a quote from Raven. I know what her vagina looks like. That's what Raven said.

That's the level of nakedness and graphic specificity with what she told this story. Not only that. And then she says he was on top of her thrusting. So one thing they did is they edited out all of like Nick's follow-up questions, which there must have been a lot of because it's inconsequential. Because if you think about it, it's like,

well, you walk in, he's probably on top. But then like the vagina scene must be later. I know. There must have been some, like, move. We know there was movement in the room. Ooh, great question for you, Juliet Littman. Yes. Put yourself in Raven's shoes.

Okay. Ravens shoes that she sells at her boutique in Arkansas. Yeah, exactly. So they're bad shoes, I'm sure. Put yourself in these shoes, sequence, and you're in her position, and you see these two human beings. You are so enraged that you need to physically attack someone. Sure.

Who do you physically attack? I think him. Like Raven, which is what she did, she pulled, she says she pulled. She says she pulls him off and then she starts beating him up with her shoe. I think she beat up both of them. She didn't say that. No, she was beating up the girl and then took the shoe to the guy. Did she say she beat up the girl?

Yes. No, she didn't say that. Juliet. I'm pretty sure she didn't say that. I was, I listened to this. I'll bet you 10 push-ups. Okay, fine. Okay.

Well, Facebook live, one of us doing push-ups at a later date. Great. She told the story, which is honestly assault. When I was, when I don't mean to be like too serious. Oh, I like this. It's assault. I like this. It is when I was listening to.

Arkansas, they don't look at life like that. This is not how Arkansas works. You're from New York. When she told this story, I was like, girl, don't tell the story on national TV. Not only is it embarrassing, but you're committing to a crime. That's assault. So if I was the other woman, I would have press charges. 100%.

You are not some nurse in Arkansas. Stop profiling people in Arkansas. It's making me uncomfortable. I love Arkansas. You're the one who alienated states on this country, on this podcast, that I don't listen to anymore because I'm not on anymore. I used to have a problem alienating people, but now I'm uncomfortable with you profiling Arkansas. I'm profiling you.

I think that in that region, it's a little bit more like we don't need to get police involved. Maybe that's right. But I'm just like, Raven, what's the statute of limitations on this crime? Could you still be sued for it? I would just never admit to a violent assault on television that hadn't been litigated. Although maybe it was litigated. With a weapon. With a weapon.

She used a shoe. Yeah. Excepting murder. And so, Nick, instead of being, like, scared, a horrified. seemed like into this. It seemed like their date only got better after she told this story. I'm glad you brought that up because there was something that went through my head and I was like, would that improve her status in my mind or hurt her status in my mind? For me, I'd just be like, nah. I mean, I just, I don't, that's not cool. Also, that's just like a level,

putting the assault aside. That's a level of drama. You cannot put the assault aside. That's assault and a lot of drama that I don't think is cool. Yeah, bring it. Assault, there's multiple cars, attempted murder with a weapon. Destroying property. She broke the door. Exactly. There's a litany of things that she did here. Like, yeah, that's a fiery woman who also, like, could be sued for one of these crimes at any point. Like, even if it's beyond when they can prosecute criminally, still sue, you know? So here's what I loved about this date.

And, again, she earned it was when they got the roller skates from the roller rink in the empty museum. Yes. That just honestly seemed like it was like, if someone said me, like you can roller skate around a museum that's flat and good for roller skating. in for an hour, or you can go down a 25-story slip and slide. I'd be like, I'm going with the roller skates. Yeah, that seems like so much fun. Also, there's a good opportunity for, like, touching to, like, helping each other. Great point.

And, like, getting physically close without it being awkward. Great point. Two things. One, I was very concerned about the marks the roller skate would make on the floor. Oh, my God. Great point. Right. I was very concerned about that.

Museum walls are always white. Yes, when I first saw it, I was like, wait a second. Like, someone's going to have to, like, buff these floors for hours. And secondly, I'm glad you brought the touching. Nick is an excellent toucher. He is. He is an excellent toucher. This brings us to Vanessa.

Dooms that listen to this podcast that watch this show, just do what Nick does when it comes to kinetic energy. It's true. It's really true. He's really good at this. And best personified by the other person who had a really strong performance given limited screen time this week, which was Vanessa. Vanessa and Nick had the best kiss.

Greg Popovich rested Vanessa this week. She was rested. She didn't do anything this week. Anything. They put her at the beginning of the first. episode and rehashed what she did last episode because at some point the producer was like, oh, we can't have a Vanessa-less show. Right.

So we'll just drop her off at the front. She was part of the group date on the farm. And at the cocktail party of that date, she and Nick had a really passionate kiss where they were making out, but he was also, like, massaging the back of her neck in a very, like, tender way. It was impressive. It was good move by Nick. He was just talking with Rachel, and Rachel had her hand on her knee, and he was just going up and down her arm, her bare arm.

looking her in the eyes, like, actually listening while he was doing that. And it was, like, completely non-sexual, but, like, kind of sexual and also really comforting. Yeah. It was just, like, he's good at it. Yeah, this is the key to being a talented bachelor or a skilled bachelor, which, like, Chris Souls and overly blonde Sean didn't have, even though they may be good guys. But Ben and Nick both do this. They make you feel really important in, like, demonstrative ways. Yes.

Where, like, Sean Lowe, who actually think is probably a good dude, like, has personality. has improved since being on the show, didn't really know how to play the game. He didn't really know what to do to both show the camera and the girl the kid. And I don't think Chris really did either. Yeah, but these two were both good at it. It's a new kind of bachelor.

It's like, you know what Survivor kind of changed at a certain point because they started like knowing how to play the game. Well, Ben obviously watched enough and Nick's been on it his whole life so they know how to do it. And so he's like good at being the Bachelor because he's seen other people do it. He's been on the other side.

And he's just like, he's like manipulating me the viewer who like, we were the most anti-Nic that was possible. We hated him. I did. Yeah, we just used to make fun of him mercilessly. I'm into him now. Yeah, me too. I, like, give him a lot more credit than I did at the beginning.

One thing he did that my wife pointed out, which I thought was really a good move. And again, I'm really just talking to single men and women here. He did a combination make-out massage. Yeah. Like, that's next level. You know what I mean? I don't know if you're listening to this. You might not be ready for this.

But, like, he worked in a back-of-the-neck massage during. a makeout. It's impressive. I bet at some point, because you know there's always that second level of consciousness when you're making out, you're like, you want to make sure

you're performing well. Yeah. You're also like, oh man, what's on tonight? And like, I think that she was just like, wait, like, is this dude giving me a massage right now? It's like, whoa.

Yeah, it was impressive and also like indicated a certain level of comfort on his end. Like he didn't do that with Danielle L. We didn't see him like comforting Taylor at all. Like any of the people who kind of had drop-offs this week. But with, well,

with him and Corinne, they obviously have amazing sexual chemistry, as they both would tell you. And with Rachel and with Vanessa, and even with Raven, there's, like, touching that, like, seems really natural, and he's, like, just, like, worked it in. So, I don't know. Those are leads. I'm going to say this. Corinne and Nick do not have amazing sexual chemistry. It's just Corinne, it's just throwing it out of them.

Just carnal. And, like, you just have to catch it. You know what I mean? It's just like, it's like, it's like, the same sexual chemistry that you would have with, like, an erotic dancer. You know what I mean? It's just like, oh, wow. Like, you're naked and in front of me.

like, I'm attracted to you, but it's not, like, true chemistry, like, between two humans that's unique. Right. It's true. And that gets back to why they don't like her, right? Because it's not, like, a connection. Good point. It's like, she's obscuring his, like, his field of vision.

She brought the knife to the fistfight. It's like, if he was looking at radar, she would just be, like, a giant cloud over the whole thing, and it would just be, like, her sexuality. Yes, they'd be shaped like a virgin. A platinum vizene. Just shining in the sun, reflecting prisms. So the word vagina has been on the show twice now, which I think is unusual. Yeah.

And you've cursed, like, seven times. which I still can't get over in this podcast. Vagina's not a curse word. I was just bringing up words. Okay. All right? I'm just saying. Come on.

Because our chemistry needs some work here. No, it doesn't. Debate is the spice of life, Jacoby. Stop trying to make it seem like we don't see each other anymore. I don't like that. I know. I'm doing it just to kind of make you mad. It is being.

It's part of our relationship. Successful. Part of our relationship. Who do you think was another big mover this week? Oh, see, mine? Yeah. Russian Christina. Oh, my God.

I've barely renewed. that Rush and Christine was on the show and now I'm just like, oh, like, let's just give her The Bachelorette. She's the only one who landed a blow on Cray. Exactly. Like, everyone else couldn't, like, go toe to toe with Corinne because, again, like, Corinne is immature,

but immaturity is actually a pretty good argumentative strategy. It is true. You know what I mean? Like, it's hard to beat if someone just, like, really doesn't care or understand. And what Christina did was just sort of like, she was like, oh, okay,

we're not going to have a real discussion about real issues. So I'm just going to kind of, like, be mean to you. you and let you know I don't like you, but not give up too much. And like, and then made her turn away. And like, you're rude. It's like, well, why am I rude? Right.

But again, Christina's ammunition was like, I don't think that you're ready. You know, it's kind of like, why do you care? I don't know why she cares. But Christina's her main thing is she didn't get blustered, you know? It's not what you do. It's how you do it. Yeah. It's like she was down 25 and she stayed in the game.

Yes. You know what I mean? She was impressive. She, like, was very cool. Every argument is kind of like a game of chicken. Like, how is this going to? end and like she was just staring Corinne in the face and being like, I'm going to go toe to toe to with you until you back down. Also, being calm and direct obviously worked with Nick because

it's worked for Vanessa and then Christina was like that and she got the rose. And she used some very sort of like colloquial phrases that led me to believe she has a very strong handle of English language. And during the argument, she's like, I respect you. You walked into the the lion's den. And we were kind of like, oh, okay. Like she's been here for a decade at least, you know? At least. She's got the idioms on lock. Yes, she does. And like at one point, Nick was talking to her and he's like And she was like, ah, I'm going to tell you my story Kind of like over time.

And Nick was like, well, I hope that You know, I hope we do get more time. And without missing a beat, she was like, well, that's up to you. Like, I think she's quick. And look, I would never objectify women sexually, but she's pretty fly. She's pretty fly, yeah. She's pretty fly.

You know what I mean? She also is normal looking. Like, she doesn't look like she's wearing so much makeup. She doesn't look like she got some kind of enhancements. Yeah. She's got a natural flyness to her. Yeah. And can you just like,

as a woman answers this question for me. What is the appeal of all of this fake hair? I feel like every woman on the show has like a foot of fake hair. A lot of extensions, yeah. To me, I just think of the practicality of that. Like if you're working out or like getting sweaty or like swimming, it's just sort of like it's kind of like all over the place. Fake hair doesn't feel like real hair too.

It just doesn't. It's not something I want to run my hand through. I think fake hair photographs well, but it's not good on camera, on video camera. Like I understand why celebrities have it for like award shows or whatever. Yes. And then it's also much more stylized. Like if you were in the hands of a professional doing your extension, that's one thing. Look at Corinne's hair during an interview and then look at her hair like in the wild.

Yeah, I really don't like it. What percentage of the women have fake hair on the show? Like so many, like at least 60. Do they have fake hair in their real lives? I think, you know, if you think about the Jersey Shore and how they used to do it, they would put it in when they're going out. I think that's more normal. It's like, but they're on camera all the time, so they just think they should have it in all the time. And makeup.

It's not like a weave. Yeah. Oh. I think. I don't know stuff. It kind of depends. It sort of depends on what you get. But like the like prototypical extension wearer of reality television is Sammy

sweetheart from Jersey Shore. And she would like, she would put it in and then she'd be ironing it. And it was nasty. I found it gross. Like I thought she was a very pretty girl and like made herself look worse with like this very obviously fake hair. I don't know. People like the volume.

I think it allows you to do hair styles you couldn't necessarily do because you just got more to work with, you know, like shorter hair, more limited. And I don't. I don't know. Does Vanessa have fake hair? I don't think so. I was evaluating it. She had a really good, like,

Bo Derek thing going on early in this episode. I was like, is that good? I don't think she does, but who knows? Maybe it's like her. Can I ruin Vanessa for everybody? Yeah. Who does she look like, Juliet? Marley Matlin, the actress.

Yes. And if you don't know who that is, just Google her, and she looks exactly like Vanessa. I think it's in the nose. That's why they look like. I cannot see her without thinking of Marley Matley. Vanessa kind of looks 90s and, like,

in a cool way. I think that's one of the parts of her appeal. Like the jeans that she wears are not particularly cool, but they look good on her. She's not cool. I think that's why I like her. But she's, like, real. Like, she brought that scrapbook. I love when she said to Nick, she was like, I'll give you the rose back.

Yeah. You know, if you're on this show and you're saying shit like that, like, you know that you are like very comfortable with your relationship. Oh, absolutely. And also, you're comfortable with who you are because you're just like, I don't need this. Yes. You can be like, fine, I'll give it the rose back. We can, like, re-legislate this. Call my bluff.

Go ahead. Exactly. Go ahead. say, and I don't mean to be harping on age all the time, but like, Vanessa is older. Like, she's 31, you know? So, like, there is a level of comfort with yourself that comes of being a little bit older. That's fair. And we've all met exceptions to these age rules. You know what I mean? Like, we all know that 22-year-old that's like, whoa, you know, like, you are the most self-actualest person I've ever met my life. But generally, if you're under

25, like, you're still figuring you out. Right. And, like, one of the reasons reality TV skews young is because it has people on it willing to fuck up. Still trying to figure themselves out. They don't like guess like, you know, when I was 23, I couldn't, like, think through repercussions in the same way I can now. And not to say that, like, I'm, I know everything. But it's just different. You've more life experience. So, like, you, like you are uninhibited to make crazy mistakes or grab your boobs like Corinna does basically every week. Can I ask a question?

Yes. Jasmine, the former Warriors dancer. Yes. Do you think the Warriors watch the show? Yes. Okay. I don't think they all do. No.

This is who watches. Oh, you've thought of this guy. Yeah, I thought about it. Definitely James Michael McAdoo. He was in the New York Times this weekend, and he's, like, married. So he, like, spent in, like, his way. So they probably watch. As we know, couples love to watch a show together.

Stefan Aisha. Steph and Aisha, maybe, I don't know. I'm not sure. I don't feel like it's really Ayesha's scene. Really? Yeah, I don't think so. But I feel like the McAdoo's, like with the other, like, young warriors. Ian Clark is in there.

Yeah, exactly. Ian Clark is in there. Also, like, probably like Sean Livingston. He's like, what else is he doing? He'll just, like, hang. He's like, yeah, sure, I'll watch that. Sure. Why not?

But it's not a big group. No. They don't have, yeah, on the road, they don't even care. No, like Clay and Jermon. No. No way. He probably doesn't even, like, turn on his TV. Clay takes naps.

Definitely naps. Clay naps. For sure, and that's why he's so good at basketball. I still love you, Clay. Yeah, I feel like it's probably like a talking point, but I'm sure the other girls from the team watch for sure. And that probably, I bet like more like staff, like, I bet like the video. Yeah, yeah, video coordinator, assistant general managers.

Yeah, exactly. action with her. I bet I bet that there is a Warriors faction that gets together, like about 12D, but none of them actually play for the Warriors. Right. It's just like people who work for the team. But that's cool, you know? I support that. I wanted more from Jasmine. She also used to be a Dallas Cowboys dancer.

She's, like, got a lot of great experience that I would love to know more about. I wonder how she moved from the Cowboys is kind of cream with the crop. I know. Also, you know what sucks? She was with the Warriors for one year, and it was the year they did not win the championship last year. So she's like, can't get a ring. She could have found a ring. She's ring chasing. She's rink chasing.

She's on Tony Rovo. She was like, Tony Romo's not going to get it done before Dak and Zieg got there. She moved, National League Warriors, and then next year, who knows? No, she's hoping for Neil Lane's rings now. Oh, exactly. She's rink chasing. I'm so dumb, I didn't even get that pun. That's how dumb I am.

You set me up for it, though. Thanks, man. No problem, buddy. Can we talk about some other reality TV? I just wanted to, we haven't really talked about it in a while. I would love to. Okay, what else are you watching? Hit me with, like, two or three shows.

I have a gem. Of course I'm watching everything, but I have an absolute jam. It's called Mariah's World. Are you familiar with a singer named Mariah Carey? Oh, yes. Okay. I always be my baby is probably my favorite pop song of all time. Ooh.

I love it. It's a good song. I listen to it on repeat. She looks beautiful in the video. It's so, it's like, yeah. It's also a ballad that transitions from being a group song to a slow dance song. Like you can go either way depending on the wedding vibe. It's just a great song.

It's a great song. Yeah, I just love it. Obviously, she's got hits on hits on hits. Yeah. Talk about bars. She's got bars. This show. is like, I can understand why she signed up to do it.

Because she thinks. I think that everyone looks at, like, the Kardashians, like, oh, obviously I'm going to be that. You know what I mean? Like, obviously, this is going to be the biggest reality television show that ever was, and I'm going to steal the Kardashian mantle. Like, that's why she signed up. But, like, I don't think anyone is watching this. Like, does anyone you know watch Mariah's world?

No. No. I would like to, though. You sold me on it. It is excellent. It's a tour, and it's a behind the scenes of the tour. She's got one thing you realize, and, like, look, I respect everybody. You know what I mean? like not too many shots, but like she needs to completely replace the people that are around her.

And like you are only as good as like the people around you and the people that are representing you. And like her management, like she's got this like assistant who's just awful. And like these, like it's just, she needs a new team. I feel like she would be much happier with a new team around her. But it makes for great television. Of course, anyone who's seen Madonna movie that I loved tour movie. I didn't see it. You're too young for this one.

Blonde ambition, I believe. I didn't see it. What? Yeah, sorry. You're so young. I don't like Madonna that much. I like her music, but like as an icon, she's not that interesting to me. Do not disrespect Madge.

I like her music. But what you realize is the backup dancers play this role in these women's lives. Right. It's like those are their best friends and family. Right. Well, also, you know, Katie Perry and Taylor Swift hate each other. And part of their feud was backup dancers jumping from one tour to the other. It is like secretly what's controlling pop music.

music is like this faction of like 50 backup dancers. It's pretty amazing. Yeah, there's been some great moments for backup dancers throughout pop culture history. Like Justin Timberlake's first post-Britney Spears girlfriend was one of his dancers. And it was Jenna Duon, who's now married Channing Tatum. There's a lot of, very important people. Movies called Truth or Dare. And there's their Truth or Dare scene.

That's what I was thinking of. Oh, got it. Backup dancers, Madonna on a bed. Great scene. All right. Maybe I'll see it one day. Mariah's world, though. I cannot recommend it more.

And you get, you get, Mariah's not. not someone that I felt like I knew her personality. You know, and now you get so much, and you're like, oh, okay, I kind of have an idea who Mariah is, and she's kind of funny. I like her. And she's funny. I think she also just, I mean, like, when you are the best at what you do, like, it just gives you a lot of license to kind of, like, be a bitch, and I like that about her.

And it's weird. I like when she's, like, really, like, she's a firm personality. I like it. I can't figure it out. It's like, she does this dance of taking herself so seriously that you're like, oh, my God, this is the most delusional person on the planet. but also having enough of a sense of humor about it that it humanizes her. And you're like, oh, like, that's my home girl, Mariah.

My one wish from Mariah Carey is for her to dress differently. I just don't think that she makes herself look good. She is Danielle L. style icon. Yeah. And she is a great woman who is incredibly talented. I just think she could look better. Like, it's just, I mean, but I guess she likes how she looks because she's been rocking the style for a long time. It's not for me, but I love her.

I ride or die from Mariah Carey. My wife made a good point. She was like, until that Cribs episode, you had no idea how much. much fun Mariah Carey was. And that is when her whole thing sort of like turned a corner. And she came like more of a personality than an actual singer. Also, I think that even the fact that she was with Nick Cannon, just sort of like, he's actually like a total goofball. Like it indicates that she's kind of, she has that goopiness to her too.

Yes. I am watching Ladies of London. And it is the highlight of my week right now. I'm sorry. I just, I love it. I actually make your wife talk to me about it more than pretty much anyone else. And she probably gets annoyed. But it's an incredible show.

It's so entertaining. Caroline Stanfield is like. Stanberry. Stanberry. She is my spirit animal. She is so mean. And then all of a sudden, just does a complete 180 and is like very apologetic in such an earnest way.

She must have a lot going on that they didn't really show on the show because I don't know how else to explain her like rudeness and just like fight thinking. I think it's just English. I think that's how I took it. It was just like, oh, this is just how English people are. Caroline Fleming is my favorite person on TV right now. Really? I love her.

Really? So Caroline Fleming is one of the ladies. She is actually Danish royalty. She's probably the richest of the group because her family's been Danish royalty for 500 years. But she's so rich that she's kind of got this kind of like hippie-dippy-assity vibe to her. Absolutely. It's like she doesn't have to try to be rich. Kind of like everyone else has got this way that they act.

Like she's like she's already there. She's a champion. She's not. There's not. She will never not be rich. Exactly. So she doesn't have to worry about anything. She doesn't have to keep up the decorum of a rich person either.

Right. And she does like crazy things. like she goes back to Denmark for like the L, some L awards or whatever. And she accidentally reveals that her father is like really sick. And he's like, that's like, that's Chelsea Clinton accidentally revealed

that Bill Clinton was really sick. And she's just like, oops. And then moves on. That's it. We don't hear about it again. And she also just like dresses so well. And she's also just so daffy. And she's just like straight out of a movie almost.

I don't know. I love her. I want to root for Juliet on that show. but she makes it hard. Yeah. Like, I want to root for her. I want to be on her team, but it's like, ah. I love it.

It's also just sort of like one degree different than the housewives. I don't really know exactly why, maybe because it's English. Foreign. Foreign. And I just love it. Like, I don't know. I just. There is a, like an innate fish out of water thing between the Americans and the ex-patriots.

So that kind of is an added level that's not just like, hey, we all live in the same town. And we were meeting each other on camera. Right. Also, these women really have history together. Many of them know each other for like 20 plus years. Which is truly the fuel to the engine that is the greatest automobile on the planet, Vanderpump Rules. Oh, my God. It is like, it just keeps giving back.

It is my favorite show on television. I rank how much I like a show, not by, like, what I would write down and, like, tell my dad. I rank it by, like, when I see it on my DVR. I watch immediately. I watched last night after you left. I can't believe that. My wife fell asleep. I watched the entire thing.

I can't not watch Fanderpupup. I watch Fanderpup twice a week. It's so good. I watch it early in the week and then later in the week. Because there was not too much great reality later in the week. Joey and I will go back to it to watch it again. Just this background noise. It's just, it's like friends.

It's sort of like friends who you just know we're going to mess up, but then just pick themselves back up and move it right along. And there's this mix in the show of like completely scripted, produced shoots. They're just like any other reality show. It's like, well, obviously this is all fake. This is stupid. there are these dramatic twists that are true tension with real betrayal and like real life problems between these people.

Right. Like this is the best example from this season so far. Last week, Kristen, who's like, I guess aspiring comedian, did a stand-up or some kind of comedy show that involved a picture of Jacks's penis. Yes. Who she once slept with, or many times slept with. Everyone who slept with Jacks. And I guess she had sex from him with Dick Picks.

And then it became like a long segment. It's a longer story that there was some girl that got sex from her dickpicks that posted it online. and then she took that picture. Sorry to know too much about this shit. Okay, so she uses a picture of Jack's dick. And then it becomes a long conversation. And then it becomes Stasi wanging in and Brittany wang in.

And, like, everyone who's seen Jack's penis weighing in. First of all, everyone you mentioned is had sex with Jack. Yeah, I know. And Kristen has slept with Jack's girlfriend, Brittany. Yes. Like, there's a... That's not for TV. Like, that's not fake.

And like the producers are like, hey, you two have a lesbian fling one night. It just happens. Also, Jack's clearly a liar. Like, it's pathological with him. and I don't think you can script like his lies, but they feel the show because it causes so much tension. Who is the one person on that show that comes across just flawless? Lisa Vanderpombe.

Yeah, Lisa Van der Promp. It's a huge come up for her. Executive producer Lisa Vanderpump. It's a huge come up for her. I love Lisa. First of all, it just fuels a never-ending faucet of human beings going to these three restaurants just to get the experience, right? I think that she hired Katie as her assistant,

just so Katie would say nice things about her to the camera. Like, it's almost like she uses Katie as, like, her personal weapon. Because, like, Katie's just been so nice about her this whole season. And what does Katie do for her? Like, awful grunt work. What does she do for anybody? I don't know. I don't know.

I don't know how these people, how their lives sustain themselves. I mean, the thing that's just kind of weird about it at this point is that they obviously have enough money to live a different lifestyle, but they've been living the exact same one. Pump the brakes on that, Juliet. They obviously have enough money to live a different lifestyle. Then the one they had five years ago. If you're Tom Sandibal and your girlfriend is all, Ariana, you cannot live in that apartment anymore.

Yeah. Like, if you're talking about all this money that they're making, like, you would upgrade. I don't know. I actually think it's a judgment on there on their, there's like a decision not to. Because even if their salaries from the show haven't increased that much, there's so many of so much associated revenue of like appearances, like random modeling gigs, you know, it's like rich get rich or whatever. And there's just no way that he can't move.

Like, I just don't buy it. I think they just really like their lives. I think it's one of the reason that show is really good is because it's like, not aspirational. Like they're happy with what they have. Yes. It is. And they're, they're relatable. Their lifestyles are relatable in a way that most reality shows aren't. That brings me to what I think sucks, Summerhouse. Have you watched it? No. It sucks. Do you know why I didn't watch it? Like the thing they did to try to maybe watch it by mixing it with Vanderpump and it was kind of like, you know what? I don't like any of these people. Big problem with Summerhouse. So there's many. But my personal hypothesis,

the biggest problem. Too big of a cast for season one. It's like seven or eight people. And they all look alike, so you can't really tell them apart. Yes. So that's like... Just white people have got too much sun. Yeah, it's just like high barrier. It's like high barrier for entry and I'm just not into it. Another thing about these shows that kind of like, when they're so season specific and I'm watching them six months later, it bothers me.

It's like, that's a summer in the Hampton. It's like I'd almost rather watch that like next summer. Yeah, I know. Save it. So it like feel like I'm sort of living it. It also feels so produced because it's focused only on their time in Montaux. It's only the weekends. So there's just huge gaps where you don't know what's going on with these people.

And the other show is give you the illusion of always knowing what's happening. And this is by necessity, like, a break in the timeline every week. And that's just, like, weird. And, like, who wants that? It's not, I don't know. It's not a good show. I hope it doesn't get a second season. Quick one for me.

Yeah. A million-dollar listing Los Angeles. Oh, yeah. It's, I was not that into it until the last couple seasons. And I have dove in head first. I once saw Josh Flagg in the wild. Oh, you did? In the wild.

And I was just like, do I say something? Like, I was just more star. struck them and I saw LeBron James. I was like, wait a second. Like, that's Josh Blag. Million dollar listing's a great show. I actually didn't watch this season, but I'm going to catch up on it. Oh, it's good. I mean, I loved it in the past. All the million dollar listing stuff is good. And one thing, like, again, like, Van der Prump Rules has real relationships, real tension, real issues between friends. Do you know what this has that is never going to not be boring? What? The houses. Right. Like, there's always that. Like, they put in this fake tension and

they have these constructs of problems between them, but they're all fake. But like, I love looking at homes. Me too. And the people who can't afford. Me too. And the people who can't. Like, that's interesting, too. And also, I think it kind of, like, who chooses which broker is kind of interesting to me as well in, like, a weird way. I mean, Bravo's just, they've got it going on. They've got a lot of good shows right now. They really do.

Summer House not included, but, like, I check Bravo when I'm, like, when I'm, like, Saturday afternoon, just killing time. Like, oh, it's on Bravo right now. I'll rewatch something or catch up on something. I'm into it. It's still going great. Me too. Jacoby, having you here has just been the best. It really has.

I miss you. I miss you. We see lunch every single day. I know. Now I just eat lunch at my desk every day. That's really sad. I know. This has been really fun. You're my only lunch, buddy.

We should do this more. Do you want to plug your job now? I have a job. I have a radio show, television show, and a podcast called Jalen and Jacoby with Jalen Rose. If you like this, it's exactly the same thing. Except there's a next NBA player instead of Juliet. We talk about sports and pop culture instead of Vanderpump Rules. Well, that's pop culture too.

Try to get Jailen to watch it. I've tried. It doesn't work. Okay. Thanks for listening. I'll be back next week. And thanks again, Jacoby. You're my favorite. Thank you. You're my time.