The Press Box - Ep. 93: McGregor Retirement With Ariel Helwani

Episode Date: April 20, 2016

The Ringer's David Shoemaker talks to six-time MMA Journalist of the Year Ariel Helwani about Conor McGregor's retirement announcement, Jon Jones vs. Ovince Saint Preux, and more. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Welcome to Channel 33. We got huge news in the world of MMA to talk about, but we had to do it over the phone, so the sound quality in this episode is not going to be great. It's weirdly the most important podcast I've ever done. I felt like it's a big day in the MMA world, and I'm here with Ariel Hawani.

How you doing, man? I'm doing it great, David. No way this is the biggest podcast. you've ever done. That's absolutely false. Well, I appreciate that. I am David Schumacher, by the way, to fill that in. I'm here,

I'm here, I have like a pile of notes that I had by, you know, yesterday mid-morning. I have the most controversial MMA journalist in the world as my co-host. We have a fight this weekend with the most controversial fighter in the whole world

of mixed martial arts. And yet, that's not what we're going to start off talking about. not the biggest story. Neither you or John Bones-Jones or the biggest stories in the MMA world by a long shot. Let's just jump right in. Conn McGregor has teased apparently his retirement via Twitter yesterday. What do you make of it, man? Well, first off, in all honesty, I'm a huge fan of yours, so it's great to talk to you and a huge fan of the Ringer and all the podcasts. So thank you really for the time. And I'm happy I'm not part of any kind of story on this on this wednesday morning yeah you're 100% right i tell people all the time

and i'm a huge sports fan i watch them all there is no more interesting sport to cover than mixed martial arts and in essence because of what happened yesterday you think oh this is going to be a great week it's going to be the return of john jones he hasn't fought in 15 months he's been through all this stuff he's coming back to fight for the light heavyweight title demetre's johnson's also fighting yeah that's all great and then as you mentioned conne mcgregor out of nowhere at 2.20 29 p.m. Eastern time sends out this somewhat vague tweet that he has decided to retire young. And this is absolutely stunning for many reasons, A, because he's in the prime of his life, the prime of his career. He's just 27 years old.

He has a fight, you know, coming up at UFC 200, or at least we thought he did. That's July 9th in Las Vegas. It's against Nate Diaz. It's a fight that he asked for. It's a fight that the UFC didn't want a book. and they said, all right, we're going to do you this solid. We're going to put it together once again at 170 pounds. And, oh, by the way, he's in Iceland right now preparing for the fight.

He's been tweeting out pictures as coach. John Kavanaugh has been tweeting out pictures. So what the heck happened along the way? So this has reverberated, not even throughout the MMA world. Oftentimes these stories are very much in our little bubble, but it's been shocking to see the reaction in the general sports world and general news world as well. So we can go into it.

I'd be happy to tell you what I know. But it's just been, I mean, I have no problem saying that. I think it's the biggest story of the last few years in UFC. Well, I mean, let's get into it as much in and much details we can, given the time that we have. But I'm interested in what you said, that this is a story that maybe, you know, you would have heard about behind the scenes. It might not have broken out into the mass market. How frequently does this sort of threat of retirement come up? It's got to be a lot in this sport, right?

Well, you know how it goes in the fight game, and in sports in general, people threaten things. They make these, you know, these veil threats and whatnot. But for someone like Connor who has talked often about, you know, making a lot of money and being around and all that stuff, didn't necessarily see this coming. Now, I should say that for the last few months, there's been a lot of whispers, a lot of talk, a lot of rumors. in fact, after Connor McGregor beat Jose Aldo at UFC 194, I even asked him point blank, is there a rift brewing between you and the UFC? And he sort of smiled and said, no, no, it's all good business. We're having a good time.

But he's been doing little things for the past four months or so that I suggested that, you know, he's getting bigger than the UFC. For example, when he beat Joseoaldo, he was at the day of by himself. He did his own sort of mini press conference. He continues to show up late to me. media workouts, the press conferences, the conference calls. You know, he mentioned, you know, he always likes to talk about Lorenzo Furtita, the UFC CEO, and it doesn't really like to talk a lot about Dana White these days.

He went out of press conference prior to UFC 196 and blasted the UFC Art Department for putting what he said was this sort of lackluster poster and said that they were all slipping that he might have to get them all fired. So he's been saying a lot of things here and there. It all kind of quieted down. after he lost in APS. And, you know, again, as I said, they gave him this fight. So to me, it suggested, all right, we're giving you this rematch.

All is good right now. We're going to be in business with each other. And he kind of came out and said, okay, let's stop all this talk that we're in a fight right now. But they wanted him to come to Las Vegas this week and do a bunch of video shoots and photo shoots. I'm told they had, you know, they had spent over a million dollars to put this stuff together.

Every fighter that's going to be competing that weekend. in Las Vegas in July is coming to Las Vegas this week prior to 197 to promote the big weekend for the USC. They wanted him there. Nate Diaz is already in Las Vegas. I'm told he got there late last night. And so they wanted him there to film all the stuff that to do press and then go on a tour afterwards.

And he just did not seem too keen on that idea. Like I said, he's in Iceland with his friends, with his training partners. He didn't want to make the trip. And that's where things started to get a little dicey. And they finally pulled the plug on him. competing on that card. Dana White went on television yesterday afternoon and said that they had pulled him from UFC 200. They didn't explain why he hasn't said anything since then, but as of right this second, he is not a part of that main event anymore. So the word that came out right

after, or one of the potential storylines that came out right after he tweeted his retirement was that he was in the front row at the UF card earlier this year when Carvalho died in the ring. Yes. Did what, did you, have you heard anything in that, in that direction? It's a, it's a weird. I mean, he seemed to be very much affected by it, but, you know, I feel like anybody in this place would have been. It's kind of, it's kind of hard to tease that out. Yeah, absolutely.

You know, so, so for those that don't know around 10 days ago, a local show in Ireland took place. And, and Connor McGregor was Caged side for this event because one of his younger teammates, he's a part of this team called SBG Ireland. straight blast gym Ireland, very famous team out of Dublin. And one of his teammates named Charlie Ward, not to be confused with the former Heisman Trophy winner, was competing in a fight against a young Portuguese fighter named Joal Carvalio. And they fought Ward won. McGregor was there cheering him on, shouting instructions, you know, doing what a teammate does. And Carvalho was fine after the fight.

In fact, I was told that, you know, he went backstage. They show, you know, it was just sort of typical. post-fight stuff. Even Connor did a short interview about the fight afterwards for a local website. And then a few days later, Tuesday morning, news comes out that Carvalio has suddenly passed away. This is tragic news. And in particular in Ireland, where the sport has just exploded very much because of Connor McGregor and his team.

And now all of a sudden, all the general, the same thing that would happen here in the United States is something like that happened. and all the general news media, sports media were talking about it, talking about how the sport should be banned. I mean, a lot of stuff came as a result of this tragic passing, and Connor went on Facebook and put together a pretty heartfelt statement about, you know, how much was affected him and how sad and torn up he was because of this. So one theory that has been thrown out now, I should preface it by saying, I have not spoken to Connor McGregor. I'm okay with saying that I know a lot of news media, like to say, I have sources and things like that. Connor hasn't talked to anyone in the media. I know that for a fact.

But one theory that has been thrown out has been that, you know, he just doesn't feel like playing fighter right now. He's fine preparing for a fight. He's fine, you know, going to Iceland and training and being with his teammates. He just doesn't feel like doing all the other stuff, the pomp and circumstances traveling, you know, 16 hours from Iceland to Las Vegas. That's just not where he's at. And this is the guy who's done a lot of media for the UFC.

And it's pretty much done everything that has been out. of him since he's been a part of the organization for the last three years. One theory from people close to him has been that he's just not in that mood. And that's, you know, that's definitely something that I can sympathize with. Yeah, I mean, and I guess you would just be speculating as to what put him in that mood. But this has been, you know, I mean, this has been a kind of roller coaster year for him between, you know, I mean, he's gone from, in a fairly short amount of time, gone from a nobody to a champion to to taking his first big loss to Diaz, which is, you know, I mean, this is something that relates

to John Jones, who will get in more to it later. But it's tough being on top in the UFC, isn't it? It certainly is. But Connor is making more money right now than anyone in the history of the sport. I mean, he's pushing eight figures, which, you know, may not seem like a lot. If you're a boxing fan, when you are used to the numbers that's why they may whether it makes or, you know, even if you're like an NBA fan. But what he is doing is unprecedented.

And, you know, he started to talk about McGregor promotions, joking about that, about starting his own organization and things of that nature. But no one has had a lot of people think that Ronda Rousey is the biggest star in the UFC. And what I would say to that is she may be the face to the UFC, meaning you go up to some, you know, 16-year-old girl or some soccer mom and talk to them about UFC. They probably know the UFC because of Ronda Rousey. She had opened doors for the promotion, unlike any other, getting them on, you know, Kelly and Michael and the view and things like that.

But Connor McGregor is without a draw, the biggest draw in the history of the UFC. He generates the biggest gate, ticket sales, pay-per-view, all that stuff. And so, you know, is the UFC going to sink as a result of this if he never fights again? No, but they're definitely going to be hurt by it. UFC 200 was very much revolved around him. him. So, yeah, he is the biggest star. That's a tough, you know, that's a tough, you know, title to walk around with. But he seems to have been handling it just fine. I don't think that's the reason why he lost an ADIS. He does recognize, though, that this is a very big rematch. There's a lot

at stake. Going 0-2 in your last two fights is a pretty dangerous thing. And, you know, he just wants to train right now, and he wants to be with his guys and just flying over, you know, making that massive trip from Iceland to Vegas at this juncture just does not seem like the most appealing thing to him. Well, so would you, if you had to stake your professional reputation, and I'm not actually going to ask you to do that, but to the best of your assumption, would you say that this retirement is real, but possibly temporary? I think that's a very good way to put it. So, yeah, as you mentioned, I really always feel uncomfortable making guesses and things like that because people will run with it. You know, they look to me for answers, and I hope to have credibility in the eyes of the public.

So I don't want people to think that a guess is a report. I don't want them to mix those two. However, I do feel comfortable in saying that the multiple sources that I've talked to regarding this story have all said that they don't know when, where, against two, why, how, whatever. but they do believe that at some point he is going to fight again. Like I said, he's 27. He loves to make money. He's in the prime of his life. They do believe that he is going to come back.

But right now, you know, the answer everyone wants to know is when, and that is unclear. Well, I mean, if you're talking about what his next fight is going to be, you know, I got to say as the professional wrestling presence on the ringer, I would say that, you know, in the professional wrestling world, it's him versus Dana White. at like U.S.C. 225 or something like that. You know, there have been some grumblings. I'm remissed. I'd be remiss if I didn't bring it up.

There have been some grumblings that he's headed to WWE. As coach Kavanaugh tweeted their Instagram to picture of Jimmy Hart, and he started, well, it was Connor followed a bunch of wrestling, a bunch of wrestlers. This has got to be them playing with us, right? Yeah, I mean, he can't go to WWE. He has a contract, you know, so that's not going to happen. just because you say I'm out, it doesn't just make you a free agent. He did the same thing prior to the most recent WrestleMania

where he started following people and everyone went crazy and he even tweeted, I'm not a WrestleMania. And then in his next tweet, he said, or am I? But, you know, Connor has talked about in his early days watching the Rock's promos and Stone Cold's promos. And you can even tell, like, there was a time before UFC 178. So this is when he fought Dustin Porre. he was walking down the hotel hallway, and he was doing the Vintzic Man billionaire strut, and even referred to it as the billionaire strut.

So he is definitely cognizant of what goes on in that world, and anyone who doesn't think that, you know, MMA is very much rooted in pro wrestling, is just fooling themselves. So, yeah, that would be a fun, you know, a fun scenario, but it's not happening, him going to WWE, and neither is him versus Dana White. They actually, by the way, a few years back played with that idea. they did do a whole special where Dana White trained to fight Tito Ortiz. And then, I don't know if you've ever seen this, but as a pro wrestling fan, you would love this because it really was, you know, Stone Cold versus Miss McMahon all over again.

But in the end, Ortiz never showed up to the way in for some strange reason. And they put together a whole special on Spike TV, Dana boxing and stuff like that. It was kind of bizarre because it felt like a no-win situation for the UFC. If Dana beat Tito at the time one of their biggest draws, like now your biggest draw just lost to the boss. And, you know, if Tito beats Dana, like, what did he really gain from that? So it was a very weird thing. But they have toyed with this idea in the past. So it's not the craziest idea of all times.

I actually did watch that on Spike TV when it aired the first time. And I remember thinking the whole way through where you just said, like, this is a knowing situation for the UFC and Tied Ortiz. I think that was the reason that Tito finally gave for not showing up. although that was also the moment where I realized, where it occurred to me that the UFC had the ability to be as, as fictional as WWE, because I was watching that whole thing wondering whether Ortiz had any idea that they were making this movie or not.

Like they could have basically just filmed, it could have just been, it could have just been Dana and a really good production crew and that's it. You know, so, you know, the connections between the two sports or endeavors are real. Well, I mean, do you know anything else in the McGregor front that you want to speculate about before we move on? I mean, I feel like I could talk about this all day. Well, it is a fascinating story. And by the way, it reminds me a lot to a degree.

Remember, the infamous, you know, Stone Cold took his ball and went home. Yeah. Brock Leicester. Brock Leicester did the same when he was supposed to, you know, do the jobs at So Cold. I mean, again, people love to compare MMA and particularly the UFC to, say, the NFL. They look to say, oh, Dana White is the Roger Goodell of MMA. And MMA is structured so much more like pro wrestling than any other sport out there, including boxing, in my opinion. The USC is WWE, Bellator, for all intents of purposes, is PNA or WCW back in the day.

And, you know, like I said, this is no different than, you know, promoter and big star budding heads. You know, they may think, okay, yeah, you know, you're affected by this story or, you know, you're training, you're tired. We need you in Las Vegas to do something for us. We need you to sell this. We need you to be a part of these video shoots. And if you don't show up, we can't go ahead with this fight because, you know, who's to say you're not going to show up in June or July when we need you for something else? They've only done this one other time, and it was prior to UFC 137. Nick Diaz, who had just come over from Strike Force as their welterweight champion was supposed to fight GSP.

They put on this press conference in Vegas to announce tickets, all this stuff. And Diaz doesn't show up. And in the middle of the press conference, Dana White is fielding calls on Coach Caesar Gracie. I mean, it was the most surreal thing. He had been posted a video on YouTube of him driving and saying, I'm not going to be a part of your beauty pageant. And they actually pulled him from the car. Now, everyone said, who cares about the press conference?

Like, just get to the fight. The guy's going to show up. Who cares about the damn press conference? And that's what a lot of people are saying now. But from the U.S.C.'s perspective, they're saying, look, we need you to be a part of this stuff. And if you can't commit to this, then we can't commit to you on July 9th. Well, I mean, that's a really interesting way of looking at it. I mean, in a certain sense, you know, they did hype Diaz up at that point in time.

And that was, you know, that was that was set up to be a really big fight. But Diaz was never Connor McGregor in 2016, you know, so I mean, so I mean, and the NFL, I mean, looking at other sports is a good, you know, is a good lens. You know, if, you know, Peyton Manning last year to say you didn't want to show up for a photo shoot, you know, the Broncos had asked him to do. or if the NFL had asked him to do, he wouldn't have been released from his contract. I mean, he wouldn't have been kicked out, you know. He wouldn't have been shown the door. It does sound very, very much like a WWE move

in the sense that like there's just one central, you know, just there's one central spot of power. And everybody has to fall in line behind it. I frankly was surprised when you told me how much money McGregor was making because that seems like a whole lot more to be for, you know, than I expected UFC to be writing out checks for.

Yeah, I mean, there is this sort of, there's this false sense of what, you know, the UFC actually pays its top guys. Now, the reason for this is what they tell the athletic commissions who then go ahead and make it public isn't actually what the fighters make. There's all kinds of stuff involved. They'll pull it out a number, and then there's bonuses on the back end, there's pay-per-view points and all that stuff. So really, unlike the other sports, and I wish it was like this, like it is in other sports where they just come out and say Carmel Anthony is signed for $128 million, and all is well good. Now we know what everyone's making. In MMA, they keep it all secretive. And the fighters are okay with that because they don't want, you know, the other fight.

You know, something that's been really interesting. One thing that people keep asking me about is, like, do you think this will lead to a union? Because this has been a very hot topic in our sport. And free agency has been a real hot topic this year. fighters are finally fighting out their contract. Very much like what happened in, you know, like the late 90s with WWF and WCW, which led to the guaranteed contracts and things of that nature. But people keep asking me, like, do you think this particular story is going to lead to a union,

to the fighters banding together, which, let's be honest, they could use a little more unity. And this, in my opinion, is exhibit, you know, 8,646 as to why they'll never be a union. because if you go on Twitter and see the reaction to the story, a bunch of fighters went out and commented on it, tweeted about it. None of them said, hey, my brother, Connor, I got your back. You know, good for you. You know, we'll support you forever. All of them were saying, hey, Dana, can I get that shot?

Can I get that main event spot? Can I get that money? I'll take half that money. That's the way it always is. And, you know, you mentioned John Jones, when he refused to fight Shell Sondon on 10 days notice prior to U.S. 151, which led to the UFC canceling UFC 151, all

the fighters did the same. How dare you? You know, they didn't stick up for him. They didn't back him. So I don't think that union is coming anytime soon, and this is just another example of that. Well, yeah, I mean, the other thing that comes up when this has come up in the pro wrestling world is that it takes guys like McGregor and John Jones to be the

lynch pins of starting any sort of move towards unionization. And, you know, they're either suspended or or, you know, taking time off or making too much money to care about it, guys like that. So, you know, I mean, it's, it's a tough, it's a tough switch for any industry to undertake. But the, you know, professional sports is, is one of the, one of the places in, in our culture where I feel like it's really important. Well, you mentioned John Jones, despite, you know, he hasn't threatened to retire in the past 24 hours.

And, you know, he's not as quite as good on the microphone as Carter McGregor. But we do need to touch on the fact that he is coming back into action at you. C-197 this weekend after a year off. And this is, it's sort of a weird fight. You know, it's a weird comeback for him. It's, I'm going to, I'm going to butcher his opponent's name, but do you want to do it for me? It's Ovinst St. Prue, OSP, for sure. I would have gotten it totally right.

I like OSP, but he's, but he's fighting this guy who is either the number eight or the number six guy in the division. He was supposed to fight Daniel Cormiere, who then was taken out, you know, was a foot injury. Rumble Johnson is somewhere saying that they're fighting for this interim belt that they're fighting for is a fake belt. Can you break down all of this madness for for someone who hasn't been paying a lot of attention? How much fun is all of this? I mean, you can't, you can't beat this. So yeah, it's actually been, okay, so this is his first fight, John Jones's first fight since January 2nd of 2015. He beat Daniel Cormier at UFC 182.

Daniel Cormier, his biggest rival, the Joe Frazier to his Muhammad Ali. And then he was preparing to fight Rumble Johnson at UFC 187 Memorial Day weekend of last year. Unfortunately, a month before that fight, he's involved in a hit-and-run accident. He runs away from the scene, and there's a young pregnant woman who's left with a fractured arm. And at this point, his entire future is up in the air. the UFC indefinitely suspends him, strips him of his belt, and he just completely falls off the face of the year. It doesn't tweet, doesn't Instagram, doesn't do any of that. He's pretty active on social media around October or so.

They reach a plea agreement. He's all well and good. He gets, you know, several, I think it's 18 months of probation, so he has to, you know, really play by the rules and do everything right. But he is reinstated by the UFC, and they say, okay, we're going to be. book you in this title fight against Dano Cormiere, who is now the champion, because when they stripped them of the belt, Cormius stepped in and fought Rumble Johnson and UFC 187 last May and ended up winning the belt. So now, Cormier's the champ. Jones is the challenger, and they were going to fight to settle it all with this new added stipulation that, you know, Jones isn't

the champion anymore, which makes it all that more interesting, April 23rd in Las Vegas. Unfortunately, a couple of weeks ago, Cormier pulls out due to a leg injury, which, you know, is devastating for the UFC. But by the way, this all comes back to Connor McGregor, and I'll tell you why in a second. So on short notice, they call upon Ovincente Prue, former University of Tennessee football player, you know, a pretty good light heavyweight, excuse me, but nowhere near as good as Cormier or John Jones, in my opinion, and he gets the opportunity of a lifetime now to fight John Jones, and they make this for the interim light heavyweight title. Now, this is the return of, in my opinion, the greatest fighter of all time. Without a doubt, there's no one

close in the history of mixed martial arts with John Jones. Even if he retired today, he would be the greatest of all time. And the McGregor story has completely overshadowed it. Now, it's not as big of a fight as the Cormier fight. There's no doubt about that. But, I mean, just John coming back in his own right is a spectacle. I mean, that's a story in itself. I want to see how he looks after the long lap.

I want to see, you know, is he more dedicated? Is he in better shape? How does he fight now that he's sober? I mean, all these things are coming into play. And can he win this fight? and then eventually get the Cormier fight. Now, the talk is if he can win this fight in dominant fashion and in pretty quick fashion, perhaps they can turn them around

and have them be the new main event at UFC 200 to replace the Conner-N-ADS fight. So this is a very important weekend now for the UFC. So it's just a fascinating thing to see the greatest of all time. You know, oh, by the way, after everything that happened, I can't believe I forgot about this, he gets pulled over for driving 75 in a 35 zone. This is after the fight was announced. This is like a month and a half ago.

And then a few weeks later, he's pulled over again, given five tickets, the main one being for drag racing. And he was actually put in jail for 48 hours, shows up in front of a judge. It's on a live stream from a local television channel on Albuquerque. He's wearing the entire orange jumpsuit. He's cuffed, hand cuff, legs cuff, you know, ankles cuff. I mean, this is surreal a month before his return fight. And then a day later, Cormier has to pull out.

I mean, the guys, you know, the last few months, for this guy has just been absolutely bananas. It's been a roller coaster. So given all of that, I'm curious to see how he looks on Saturday. Sorry if I ramble there, but it's all very exciting. No, it is. And that's the most interesting part for me, too. I mean, to see how, I mean, you know, there's, it's, it's, there's a lot of fighters to get injured and take a year off, right?

I mean, but it's very unusual to have this amount of stuff outside of the octagon, outside of the gym go on. I mean, it's, you know, in other sports, you would, I mean, you would write, you would write somebody like, John Jones off. You know, there's no way a running back is taking, well, it's not no way, but it would, it'd be hard to imagine a running back, taking a year off and coming back with the same sort of mobility that made him a star, you know, but prior in his career. So it's, you know, there's, it's, it's going to be really, really cool. I mean, really, really cool to see how it happens. At the same time, that's the most interesting thing in the fight, right? I mean, like, John Jones was the greatest of all time, you know, to a point where it was getting a little

bit monotonous after what 1500 days a champion or whatever. I mean it was so the fights were really great but there came a certain point with like Gustafson and you know Cormier is a great fighter don't get me wrong but where it felt a little bit like as a as a lay fan it started

feeling a little bit like an old Van Dam movie where they were like solving for beating John Bones Jones and not solving I mean not trying to put the best guy in the in the octagon with him every time it was like well maybe this tall skinny guy will work or like maybe this short musselie guy will work you know, just something to, something to get the belt off of him.

I mean, maybe you have too much wrestling on the brain. No, no. I mean, there was that. There definitely was that. And people started to talk about him going up to heavyweight and testing himself there. That's, you know, that's a scenario that you can't really play out in pro wrestling because, you know, someone like Ray Mysterio just becomes the heavyweight champion.

But because there are these divisions and then you meet a whole new crop of opponents, that's interesting. But, yeah, him losing the belt. and getting stripped and going through all this stuff and then Kormeia becoming the champion. Like I said, a lot of people weren't really, you know, campaigning to see the rematch if Jones was the champion just because, you know, he did beat him four rounds to one.

Now it was a closer four rounds to one than, you know, just four rounds to one would suggest. But he did win the fight rather convincingly. So now that Kormeer was the champion, Jones was coming for him as the challenger, that was just, I mean, they had a press conference a few weeks back in Las Vegas prior to 196, and the dynamic between them, it's just so much fun to watch

that they genuinely hate each other. They go back and forth on Twitter all the time. It's just, it's a lot of fun for the fan. So, you know, if he wins, I do suspect that we'll see that fight sooner or have them later. And then if he wins that fight against Cormier, maybe there's one or two more fights left for him at Light Heavyweight, and then he tests the water that heavyweight.

Yeah. Well, I mean, it'll be an interesting road. And listen, I mean, when you see him on TV, when you read the interviews of John Jones, he seems 100% contrite, but it's really hard to, I mean, it's impossible to speculate. You know, he called himself an addict, although, I mean, the other day, although it was, he kind of weirdly referred to him as a former addict, for himself as a former addict, which is not what,

not what anybody who's gotten help would refer to themselves as. So I don't know, it's a weird thing. I wish the guy all the best. There's nothing better than, I mean, there's nothing better than watching him fight. I mean, there's, I can't think of anyone who's been that good and that exciting every moment in the ring. and all my time watching. So, you know, I'm hoping for the best for this weekend.

What are the odds really quickly that OSP pulls out a win? What do you, is there any chance at all? Look, in this sport, you're wearing those tiny gloves. Really, anything can happen. And there are those variables out there. You know, he hasn't fought in, you know, 15 or so months. There's cage rust. You know, he has been, look, he says all the right things,

but he has been pulled over twice since all this has happened, since, you know, he was cleared and the new fight was announced. And, you know, thankfully he finally relented and said, okay, I'm going to get a full-time driver because every time he's gone in trouble, it has involved driving. So at least for now, he has a full-time driver, and that is tremendous news. I just think that Cormier-N Jones, and in particular Jones,

is on a completely different level than everyone in the light heavyweight division, and that includes OSP. He's a fine fighter, but he's just... I just don't see him being a world leader. Now, you know, I could, I've seen crazy things happen in the Oskine. This, this would probably take the cake. This would probably be the biggest upset of all time, in my opinion. And especially when you consider that OSP only had three weeks to prepare,

I would be absolutely shocked if it happened. That said, if you're ever going to beat John Jones, this would be the match. Yeah, this is the time in his career to do it. 100%. That's why Kormier was so broken up about this because he thought he had him right where he wanted him. He's been healthy. He's been preparing Jones is in and out of jail. Jones has got all this stuff going on.

His life is changing before his eyes. This was the time to get him. And trust me, that kills Daniel Cormeier inside. Well, I wanted to talk about this, you know, just the sort of like how to fix the UFC in this, in this sish period where there's this rash of, like, nonstop injuries that are hijacking title fights and interim title after interim title. And all these weird, like, layoffs and, you know, rematches and stuff.

But I don't think we have time. We'll have to save that for another episode. Because the one big note that I have is why that we were going to talk about is why is everybody ignoring the flyweight match? And we're just about to ignore the flyweight match. So, like, help with the last few seconds that we have, help the world get excited about Mighty Mouse. And by the way, that was a great cliffhanger for future episodes. So I like that you did that. But yes, I am happy that you mentioned Mighty Mouse, Demetrius Johnson, who's the current 125-pound champion.

Mighty Mouse is going to be one of those guys. By the way, one of my favorite nicknames as well, because he actually looks like Mighty Mouse. Like, if you don't know, I'm Googling right now, and you will see there is a striking resemblance to the cartoon character. But Mighty Mouse is definitely one of those athletes who we will appreciate way more when he's gone. Like, we'll look back at his run as champion and who he beat, how he beat him all that stuff, and be like, man, this guy was really good.

Why wasn't anyone ever talking about this guy? Why were we always ignoring him? Over time, slowly but surely, he's gotten a lot more comfortable with the media. He's puffing his chest out a little more. He's being himself. People are starting to latch on to him a little more. I thought it was a great idea to link him up with John Jones so that some of that pressure of carrying the pay-per-view, the main event, all that stuff off his shoulders and onto the big boys.

But he is a phenomenal athlete. He might be 100%. You can make a very strong case that he is the best athlete in the UFC. He's lightning quick. He's good at every facet of the game. He's just a joy to watch. He really is. And I don't understand this idea.

People say, like, oh, I'm bigger than him. He's just 125 pounds. I can't appreciate his brilliant. I think that's absolutely ludicrous. So this time around, he's fighting a guy by the name of Henry Sehudo, who's undefeated, who's, you know, he's had a pretty good run in the U.S.C. He's by far never fought anyone as good as Demetrius Johnson. But his biggest clink to fame at this point is that he is a former Olympic gold medalist.

He is one of just three Olympic gold medalists from wrestling to come over to the UFC and have a UFC career. So now people are saying, all right, you know, this is a top-level athlete. This isn't just some fighter who's, you know, caught through the rank. This is the guy who won the Olympic gold medal. And, oh, by the way, he was the youngest wrestling champion in U.S. Olympic history to win a gold medal. So, I mean, I mean, this guy is a very, very, very good athlete. He's turning into a great fighter in a perfect world. If I'm being honest, I wish he had a couple more fights under his belt.

I think that they might be rushing him a little bit. But I do feel a little Holly Home Rangorowski action going here where maybe he's been holding back over the last few years, not showing all his cards and waiting for this moment. He's been talking some really good smack about DJ, which I know I've been sort of getting under DJ's skin. So that is a very fun dynamic there and is not a fight to be slept on. This is probably DJ's most interesting title fight in the last couple years

in my opinion, because it's a fresh opponent. It's one with a tremendous resume, and it's one that's been pushing his button. So I'm curious how DJ responds. It's a great co-mead event, a fantastic one for this, you know, whole John Jones come back to her. Yeah, I mean, and even as a viewer, I mean, as a casual viewer, I, the idea of this is the co-main event is incredibly compelling to me in a way that putting it at the main would not have had me zoned in. I was just like looking back at the reading I was doing last night, and the other two, the

The other two Olympic gold medalists in U.S.C. history are the great Kevin Jackson, the great coach Kevin Jackson and Mark Schultz, who I guess we all know from Foxcatcher at this point, if you didn't know him as a UFC fighter back in the day. Well, everybody should get really hyped up about that match. Everybody should get, you know, everybody would be really excited for the main event, but we don't need to tell them to do that. Is there anything else in the car that we should be watching out for? Yeah, there's, there's, I'd say three more.

things that really stick out. Anthony Pettis is back, former UFC lightweight champion. He's fighting and dying Etzen Barbosa. Fantastic styles match up. Both strikers, both very dynamic. Both have a flare for the dramatic. I mean, really, that is a fantastic fight, and Pettison's coming off of a very disappointing performance in January, so I'm curious to see how he rebound. There's a fighter by the name of Yaira Rodriguez, young Mexican fighter who's been looking fantastic as of late, also trains out of Jackson Wink, which is where John Jones trains out of. He's a great young, up-and-coming fighter. He's fighting a guy named Andre Feeley.

His nickname is Touchy-Feeley. So it's Andre Tucci Feeley, another fantastic nickname. And Carlos Sparza is fighting on the prelim. She's the former Strawway champion of the UFC. She hasn't fought since March of last year, had shoulder surgery. So this is her big comeback fight. I'm curious to see how she looks as well. It's a very solid card from UFC.

Yeah, I'm definitely excited to check it out. Well, listen, man, I got to let you go. And I really appreciate how diplomatic you've been so far, but still letting us know everything that's going on. So, UFC, correct me if I get any of this wrong. UFC, correct me if I get any of this Saturday. Yep. We got John Jones.

We got Mighty Mouse Johnson. And the return of Anthony Pettis also, I like that. And more importantly than all, I mean, than anything else, Connor McGregor will sadly not be, joining the WWE anytime soon. But he does seem to be at least temporarily retired and all of his tweets about such are serious. Thank you so much for coming on, man.

Do you have any last words? No, that's it. Honestly, I've been listening to you for a very long time, reading your stuff, admiring. Congratulations on joining the ringer. I love the way you did it, by the way. And I'm really looking forward to work there. So this is an absolute honor for me.

I'd listen to all the podcast, Channel 33, Bill's Podcast, all that stuff. So really thank you for the time and would be happy to do it any other time. Hey, listen, man, we're going to get you on here as much as we possibly can. Have a great trip out to Las Vegas. And let me know if you hear anything new on the McGregor front. We'll do. Thank you, David. Appreciate it.

Thank you, man.